It's likely gonna end in a muddy, bloody armistice. The only question is how much territory Ukraine will be forced to yield to get that truce. To my pessimistic mind. There are more upbeat opinions to be had
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
It's likely gonna end in a muddy, bloody armistice. The only question is how much territory Ukraine will be forced to yield to get that truce. To my pessimistic mind. There are more upbeat opinions to be had
Anyhoo, pimping Tucker Carlson, repeatedly regurgitating stuff we'd expect from Russian trolls, predicting the downfall of the West because of Wokeism.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
I have been saying for at least the last fortnight that whilst everybody was focussing on the Ukrainian counter-attack south of Orikhiv in the Zaporhizia Oblast, the Russians were making advances in the North East, which is where we find the ... Kharkiv Oblast. Given that they have in the past week slowed their advance towards Lyman, I am not as despairing as I was, but the point remains
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
They are far from getting beaten that is for sure. Russians are getting humped in the south.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
I have been saying for at least the last fortnight that whilst everybody was focussing on the Ukrainian counter-attack south of Orikhiv in the Zaporhizia Oblast, the Russians were making advances in the North East, which is where we find the ... Kharkiv Oblast. Given that they have in the past week slowed their advance towards Lyman, I am not as despairing as I was, but the point remains
It's likely gonna end in a muddy, bloody armistice. The only question is how much territory Ukraine will be forced to yield to get that truce. To my pessimistic mind. There are more upbeat opinions to be had
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
The Cold War tanks that the Russians have demothballed are perfectly adequate. The area is wooded, wet and muddy. Lines of sight are not from horizon to horizon. Given this, and the reliability of the vintage, they suffice. Provided they don't drive thru a minefield in full view of artillery, they'll be fine.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
It's likely gonna end in a muddy, bloody armistice. The only question is how much territory Ukraine will be forced to yield to get that truce. To my pessimistic mind. There are more upbeat opinions to be had
It's likely gonna end in a muddy, bloody armistice. The only question is how much territory Ukraine will be forced to yield to get that truce. To my pessimistic mind. There are more upbeat opinions to be had
Surely you need a straight poll of first preferences for a particular contest - e.g. Khan versus Corbyn versus Hall - rather than trying to draw conclusions from a list of favourability ratings of a lot of potential candidates?
Next greater London mayoral race is FPTP.
That's why you need a straight poll of first preferences for a particular contest!
I just asked the train ticket seller for a return ticket to Arrogate via That London. He refused, saying that due to government upfuckery the machine would only dispense a single. The single is 60% the price of a double.
The Government is full of Bad People who do Bad Things, and I hope their genitals rot. From Plague. On Acid. In Space. Grrr.
They are encouraging you to stay in Harrogate. That’s levelling up in action…
David Smith is good in the Times today. Wages, in real terms, are still lower than in 2008. Productivity remains well behind global peers.
“Most of the debate about how to lift productivity, by boosting investment, the quality of the infrastructure, innovation and skills has taken place outside government, and outside parliament”.
The spending growth forecasts for the NHS are shocking, even in the medium scenario, af over £250bn per annum by 2035 at a time when the tax burden is already at its highest level for 70 years.
That simply isn’t sustainable. Starmer may have to go to China.
A lot of these problems are international. All advanced western nations suffer from some or all of them. The UK's is a toxic mix, but a different cocktail of toxicity can be found elsewhere
The combo of an ageing society with the insane and temporary solution of mass immigration is peculiarly stupid, and you can find this in France, Germany, USA, Spain, Holland, Sweden, and more, along with all the ills that spring from it
It is tempting to look at the list of problems and yield to blank despair. There's no fixing it. However there is one potential and significant reason for hope: AI. If it fulfils its promise it will make humans vastly more productive, and Britain's productiviy issues - as an example - will disppear overnight
Let us pray to the God of the bots
France is one of the few countries that doesn't have the problem in the same way
In WW1, France fought like lions but the loss of life was large. Not enough men were left to father children As a result the Armee was quite small in the 30s to fight WW2 So they fought badly and lost Having learned the demographic lesson post WW2 they gave families help to have babies and babies they had So that, combined with immigration, mean they have enough young people to look after the old
Except France still isn’t at replacement level for fertility rate AND it probably has the worst race relations in Europe, after Sweden
France is not a solution. They did well with nukes tho
It's likely gonna end in a muddy, bloody armistice. The only question is how much territory Ukraine will be forced to yield to get that truce. To my pessimistic mind. There are more upbeat opinions to be had
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
It's likely gonna end in a muddy, bloody armistice. The only question is how much territory Ukraine will be forced to yield to get that truce. To my pessimistic mind. There are more upbeat opinions to be had
It's likely gonna end in a muddy, bloody armistice. The only question is how much territory Ukraine will be forced to yield to get that truce. To my pessimistic mind. There are more upbeat opinions to be had
David Smith is good in the Times today. Wages, in real terms, are still lower than in 2008. Productivity remains well behind global peers.
“Most of the debate about how to lift productivity, by boosting investment, the quality of the infrastructure, innovation and skills has taken place outside government, and outside parliament”.
The spending growth forecasts for the NHS are shocking, even in the medium scenario, af over £250bn per annum by 2035 at a time when the tax burden is already at its highest level for 70 years.
That simply isn’t sustainable. Starmer may have to go to China.
A lot of these problems are international. All advanced western nations suffer from some or all of them. The UK's is a toxic mix, but a different cocktail of toxicity can be found elsewhere
The combo of an ageing society with the insane and temporary solution of mass immigration is peculiarly stupid, and you can find this in France, Germany, USA, Spain, Holland, Sweden, and more, along with all the ills that spring from it
It is tempting to look at the list of problems and yield to blank despair. There's no fixing it. However there is one potential and significant reason for hope: AI. If it fulfils its promise it will make humans vastly more productive, and Britain's productiviy issues - as an example - will disppear overnight
Let us pray to the God of the bots
France is one of the few countries that doesn't have the problem in the same way
In WW1, France fought like lions but the loss of life was large. Not enough men were left to father children As a result the Armee was quite small in the 30s to fight WW2 So they fought badly and lost Having learned the demographic lesson post WW2 they gave families help to have babies and babies they had So that, combined with immigration, mean they have enough young people to look after the old
No, they don’t. Hence the pension age rises and the riots.
Fair point. Although I should have said "less of a deficit" instead of "enough"
It's likely gonna end in a muddy, bloody armistice. The only question is how much territory Ukraine will be forced to yield to get that truce. To my pessimistic mind. There are more upbeat opinions to be had
That might be so, especially if Trump is elected. But they are clearly going to fight even in very grinding fashion to eliminate as much of that territory as they can, and Western backing if sustained can achieve that. They clearly have much more will and ability for a slow, terrible fight than was possible 9 years ago.
The Russians gave up the capital of one of the regions they ostensibly now regard as part of the Russian Federation, they'll pull back if forced to without it escalating beyond Ukraine's borders.
The appeal to raw numbers would suggest no smaller nation has ever beaten a larger one, yet they have. So constantly pointing to Ukraine being smaller is not persuasive in itself.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
David Smith is good in the Times today. Wages, in real terms, are still lower than in 2008. Productivity remains well behind global peers.
“Most of the debate about how to lift productivity, by boosting investment, the quality of the infrastructure, innovation and skills has taken place outside government, and outside parliament”.
The spending growth forecasts for the NHS are shocking, even in the medium scenario, af over £250bn per annum by 2035 at a time when the tax burden is already at its highest level for 70 years.
That simply isn’t sustainable. Starmer may have to go to China.
A lot of these problems are international. All advanced western nations suffer from some or all of them. The UK's is a toxic mix, but a different cocktail of toxicity can be found elsewhere
The combo of an ageing society with the insane and temporary solution of mass immigration is peculiarly stupid, and you can find this in France, Germany, USA, Spain, Holland, Sweden, and more, along with all the ills that spring from it
It is tempting to look at the list of problems and yield to blank despair. There's no fixing it. However there is one potential and significant reason for hope: AI. If it fulfils its promise it will make humans vastly more productive, and Britain's productiviy issues - as an example - will disppear overnight
Let us pray to the God of the bots
France is one of the few countries that doesn't have the problem in the same way
In WW1, France fought like lions but the loss of life was large. Not enough men were left to father children As a result the Armee was quite small in the 30s to fight WW2 So they fought badly and lost Having learned the demographic lesson post WW2 they gave families help to have babies and babies they had So that, combined with immigration, mean they have enough young people to look after the old
France had the largest army in Europe at the start of the Second World War.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
It's likely gonna end in a muddy, bloody armistice. The only question is how much territory Ukraine will be forced to yield to get that truce. To my pessimistic mind. There are more upbeat opinions to be had
That might be so, especially if Trump is elected. But they are clearly going to fight even in very grinding fashion to eliminate as much of that territory as they can, and Western backing if sustained can achieve that. They clearly have much more will and ability for a slow, terrible fight than was possible 9 years ago.
The Russians gave up the capital of one of the regions they ostensibly now regard as part of the Russian Federation, they'll pull back if forced to without it escalating beyond Ukraine's borders.
The appeal to raw numbers would suggest no smaller nation has ever beaten a larger one, yet they have. So constantly pointing to Ukraine being smaller is not persuasive in itself.
Yes Vietnam beat the USA. Afghanistan defeated the USSR
At best Iraq was a score draw for the west
But Ukraine is unlike any of these conflicts. Russia surrounds Ukraine on 2/3 sides (Inc Belarus), there are plenty of pro Russian people in Ukraine - esp Donbas and Crimea. Russian is widely spoken in Ukraine. And so on
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Oh please, you know exactly what was meant by it and are clearly in one of your contrarian moods where you want to provoke people whilst taking a 'sympathetic statesman' tone instead your alternative 'shocking provocateur' mode. It never works becuase it's not genuine to your consistent persona.
Anyone who genuinely thinks people supporting weapons for Ukraine as 'value' means they are uncaring about the deaths of thousands is a moron and I don't think that needs sugarcoating. No one buys you believe that because you're not stupid.
It simply means that supporting a nation in an existential defence of its people and territory against unprovoked invasion by giving them, say, £1bn of weapons, is a very worthwhile spend of £1bn.
Do you think it is not a worthwhile cause to spend money on? Because if you do, and you appear sympathetic to the Ukrainian cause, then why get all snowflakey about use of the word value? Why have an attack of vapours as if people are treating the death of others as nothing, when it is pretty obviously just noting £1bn of UK money will have tangible, positive results for a friendly nation?
It's not even armchair generalling or being gung ho, I'm someone who thinks it will probably end in a horrible, grinding ceasefire and settlement.
If you want to make these kind of points you need a consistent position about it, like Dura Ace - people like or don't like his stance, but it makes sense with his stated positions.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
It is up to them, of course
They certainly don't look like surrendering now, and who can blame them. But:are we being the best ally if we encourage them to fight to the last man? It is morally questionable
And phrases that describe mass battlefield slaughter as "damn good value for money" are simply offensive. However this is not @kle4's usual style, so I will presume he didn't really think through how his words might come across
If anyone was thinking of seeing The Equaliser 3 at the cinema, don't. The movie seems to be missing an entire third act, and just...ends.
I saw it and although I know what you mean, I quite liked it on exactly those grounds. I kept expecting that her fellow agent was a traitor and for the third act to be he takes her hostage and Denzel re-educates him with a nail gun, but that didn't happen. Instead he kills the bad guys and has a cup of tea. No muss, no fuss, 109 mins, in and out, I enjoyed it and I had natchos. Not like Oppenheimer, which is three centuries long and has a flaccid explosion.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Oh please, you know exactly what was meant by it and are clearly in one of your contrarian moods where you want to provoke people whilst taking a 'sympathetic statesman' tone instead your alternative 'shocking provocateur' mode. It never works becuase it's not genuine to your consistent persona.
Anyone who genuinely thinks people supporting weapons for Ukraine as 'value' means they are uncaring about the deaths of thousands is a moron and I don't think that needs sugarcoating. No one buys you believe that because you're not stupid.
It simply means that supporting a nation in an existential defence of its people and territory against unprovoked invasion by giving them, say, £1bn of weapons, is a very worthwhile spend of £1bn.
Do you think it is not a worthwhile cause to spend money on? Because if you do, and you appear sympathetic to the Ukrainian cause, then why get all snowflakey about use of the word value? Why have an attack of vapours as if people are treating the death of others as nothing, when it is pretty obviously just noting £1bn of UK money will have tangible, positive results for a friendly nation?
It's not even armchair generalling or being gung ho, I'm someone who thinks it will probably end in a horrible, grinding ceasefire and settlement.
It was a grotesque statement. I am fairly sure you meant well, but it was grotesque
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
The suggestion is that an equitable settlement would be for Ukraine to give Russia several hundred thousand square km of land and a few million people - who will then be systematically raped, tortured and pillaged by the occupiers.
It’s not an equitable settlement. An equitable settlement is withdrawal at least to the 2014 boundaries, and rock solid security guarantees so this menace of an evil empire can never threaten another of its neighbours. And if we were actually supplying meaningful weapons rather than leftovers from the shed they could do it more quickly and with less bloodshed.
If anyone was thinking of seeing The Equaliser 3 at the cinema, don't. The movie seems to be missing an entire third act, and just...ends.
I saw it and although I know what you mean, I quite liked it on exactly those grounds. I kept expecting that her fellow agent was a traitor and for the third act to be he takes her hostage and Denzel re-educates him with a nail gun, but that didn't happen. Instead he kills the bad guys and has a cup of tea. No muss, no fuss, 109 mins, in and out, I enjoyed it and I had natchos. Not like Oppenheimer, which is three centuries long and has a flaccid explosion.
The issue is one of set up and payoff. It kind of makes sense for a smart person to not wait for the bad guy to come at them, but just take care of business in 3 minutes while the villain sleeps, but it's not very narratively satisfying to set up a climax and then have it not happen.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Because you are an apologist for Putin and in the 1930s/1940s would have been a blackshirt.
The UK lost more than a million lives across the two world wars, but I don't know anyone in the UK who regrets the UK standing up to Hitler, and I don't know any Ukrainians who oppose standing up to a comparable evil in Putin.
And step away from your Putinist bubble and Ukraine are making solid progress on the front. They're expanding the breach around Robotyne and preparing the ground for moving towards Tokmak which will sever Russia's land bridge and ability to reinforce its troops in the west.
Which is why its no wonder that Russia's apologists are panicking and spouting this end the war gibberish. If you want the war over, then get Russian troops back into Russia, and the war ends.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
I hope everyone is ready for the new and improved Leon, who is against intemperate, emotive expression about matters. It's a worrying example of western sentiment to use colourful and/or blunt language you see, these things require nuance, even though we're all just shooting the breeze online.
The reasonable save their passionate outbursts for dogs, litter, and other matters of less concern.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
Since Elon bought Twitter there’s been a huge increase in pro-Russian accounts posting. Stats published yesterday. And yes it’s working a treat.
US sentiment seems to have changed markedly, swifter than one would think from mere apathy as thing drag on. Of course, they take their cue from their political leaders - which is another reason I am very grateful this is not a partisan issue in this country.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Because you are an apologist for Putin and in the 1930s/1940s would have been a blackshirt.
The UK lost more than a million lives across the two world wars, but I don't know anyone in the UK who regrets the UK standing up to Hitler, and I don't know any Ukrainians who oppose standing up to a comparable evil in Putin.
And step away from your Putinist bubble and Ukraine are making solid progress on the front. They're expanding the breach around Robotyne and preparing the ground for moving towards Tokmak which will sever Russia's land bridge and ability to reinforce its troops in the west.
Which is why its no wonder that Russia's apologists are panicking and spouting this end the war gibberish. If you want the war over, then get Russian troops back into Russia, and the war ends.
This is the ensemble of upper air runs for London from this evening’s GFS, up to the 10th so far.
This is completely unprecedented for September, and pretty unusual if it were July. It translates to temperatures of 30C+ on the ground for at least 3, probably 6 days in a row, and nocturnal minima in the high teens or above 20C. The hottest period in a summer that is already unusual as having June hotter than July or August.
The European model ECMWF is almost identical. Hot weather until at least next weekend.
The rest of the month is still uncertain but it’s not impossible we could end up with September being 2023’s warmest month.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
If @Leon wanted to try and call himself a journalist, or perhaps have spent time recently in Ukraine, he’d be well aware of the desire of the Ukranians to fight for their existence as a nation, and the notion of those who wish for ‘peace’ to see peace exclusively on Russia’s terms, with the Ukranians forfeiting land against their will.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
Ukraine does have problems, but it is also making solid progress in the South. And, if the Crimean land bridge is severed, then Russia is in real trouble. How does it supply the troops in Crimea or the West of the country?
Personally, I think this is very simple:
It's not our job to tell Ukraine not to fight the aggressor. If the Ukrainian people want to keep standing up to Putin, then it is moral duty to give them as much help as we can. And if they wish to make peace, then we must support them in that too.
Too many people think that our support is somehow unethical because it might prolong the war. That is a morally repugnant view.
Ukraine has three basic choices, I think. It can (1) try to settle as best it can with Russia; (2) try to hold the current line of control - defensive position; (3) try to take back territory from Russia - attack position.
(1) Would be carte blanche for Russia to take more and more of Ukraine. It hasn't respected a single agreement it has make with Ukraine and it is anyway committed to taking more territory.
(2) Might result in Ukraine losing soldiers slower than (3) and also using equipment more slowly, but Ukraine still needs to keep fighting and see its men being killed at a slightly slower rate. The problem of (1) still applies. Russia won't be satisfied with the current LoC.
(3) Sees the highest casualty rates but it does potentially create facts on the ground, or at least avoid facts on the ground that are detrimental to Ukraine,and may eventually force Russia to a settlement.
My question to @Leon and @CorrectHorseBat is why would (1) or (2) be better than (3) for Ukraine, and why wouldn't we as outsiders support Ukraine if they choose (3) ?
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
Since Elon bought Twitter there’s been a huge increase in pro-Russian accounts posting. Stats published yesterday. And yes it’s working a treat.
I'm not sure how convincing you think anyone should find your avowed disapproval of propaganda given your thoughts that Russia will 'systemically rape' its way through any territories it will gain in any putative peace settlement. Why would they do this exactly?
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
Since Elon bought Twitter there’s been a huge increase in pro-Russian accounts posting. Stats published yesterday. And yes it’s working a treat.
I'm not sure how convincing you think anyone should find your avowed disapproval of propaganda given your thoughts that Russia will 'systemically rape' its way through any territories it will gain in any putative peace settlement. Why would they do this exactly?
How many women in occupied Ukraine do you think haven't been raped by the orcs?
If anyone was thinking of seeing The Equaliser 3 at the cinema, don't. The movie seems to be missing an entire third act, and just...ends.
I saw it and although I know what you mean, I quite liked it on exactly those grounds. I kept expecting that her fellow agent was a traitor and for the third act to be he takes her hostage and Denzel re-educates him with a nail gun, but that didn't happen. Instead he kills the bad guys and has a cup of tea. No muss, no fuss, 109 mins, in and out, I enjoyed it and I had natchos. Not like Oppenheimer, which is three centuries long and has a flaccid explosion.
The issue is one of set up and payoff. It kind of makes sense for a smart person to not wait for the bad guy to come at them, but just take care of business in 3 minutes while the villain sleeps, but it's not very narratively satisfying to set up a climax and then have it not happen.
Well yes, but I think the climax was not expected and everted big showdown, it was the nice quiet ending as he achieves what he set out to do and settles down. Caps off the film and trilogy nicely. Job done.
Wasn't Sir Keir supposed to have tried removing responsibilities from Rayner last time, and she ended up being given more stuff? But this is trailed as though he wants to neuter his deputy a bit. Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer is expected to reshuffle his shadow cabinet on Monday.
The long-awaited change of Labour's top team coincides with MPs returning to Westminster from their summer break.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
OK try this then. This is also from the Kyiv Independent. A pro-Ukraine source in Ukraine. Funded by Canada, praised by the UK and EU, and so on
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
OK try this then. This is also from the Kyiv Independent. A pro-Ukraine source in Ukraine. Funded by Canada, praised by the UK and EU, and so on
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
Here is the comment from the journalist himself, at the end
"Hi, this is Francis Farrell, cheers for reading this article. It's been a while since I've done a field report from around Bakhmut, but this time was definitely different. For those of us who are dedicated to the victory of Ukraine, there is no point living with rose-tinted goggles on, this is what it will look like for a long time. As long as it goes on, we will be here, reporting on it as it is"
Leon isn't a Putin apologist, fash sympathiser or anything else.
He's just a luvvie and a professional bedwetter.
He'd have been taken to the rear in a strait jacket, had he been in the trenches during WW1. And during WW2 he'd have no doubt been hanging onto the coattails of Halifax urging us to make peace in June 1940.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
OK try this then. This is also from the Kyiv Independent. A pro-Ukraine source in Ukraine. Funded by Canada, praised by the UK and EU, and so on
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
OK try this then. This is also from the Kyiv Independent. A pro-Ukraine source in Ukraine. Funded by Canada, praised by the UK and EU, and so on
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
OK try this then. This is also from the Kyiv Independent. A pro-Ukraine source in Ukraine. Funded by Canada, praised by the UK and EU, and so on
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
Man, if you think that's negative, you should try reading some Russian Telegraph channels.
The journalist himself says this:
"Hi, this is Francis Farrell, cheers for reading this article. It's been a while since I've done a field report from around Bakhmut, but this time was definitely different. For those of us who are dedicated to the victory of Ukraine, there is no point living with rose-tinted goggles on, this is what it will look like for a long time. As long as it goes on, we will be here, reporting on it as it is"
I'm hazarding a guess he knows more than you, even though he has more motivation to be positive than you
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
OK try this then. This is also from the Kyiv Independent. A pro-Ukraine source in Ukraine. Funded by Canada, praised by the UK and EU, and so on
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
The issue is not that the Ukrainians are pointing out problems, that is a given.
The issue is your 2 + 2 = 5 logic.
The Ukrainians don't want to surrender. They want more ammunition, more supplies, more assistance, not less.
You take the fact there are issues and then extrapolate that to saying that Ukraine is losing the war, which is not true.
Heck as the report you quoted says, the war could last years more. The Ukrainians aren't gearing up for surrender, they're up for the fight, and they're prepared to fight for years if that is what it takes - and we can and should support them for as long as they're willing and able to fight.
Leon isn't a Putin apologist, fash sympathiser or anything else.
He's just a luvvie and a professional bedwetter.
He'd have been taken to the rear in a strait jacket, had he been in the trenches during WW1. And during WW2 he'd have no doubt been hanging onto the coattails of Halifax urging us to make peace in June 1940.
Had Germany have invaded you know Leon would have been a collaborator.
Leon isn't a Putin apologist, fash sympathiser or anything else.
He's just a luvvie and a professional bedwetter.
He'd have been taken to the rear in a strait jacket, had he been in the trenches during WW1. And during WW2 he'd have no doubt been hanging onto the coattails of Halifax urging us to make peace in June 1940.
He's also leaning on the Dura thing of pretending if anyone doesn't agree with the most gloomy analysis possible then they simply must swallow every bit of optimistic Ukrainian propaganda whole. No middle ground baby, it's not like plenty of people are pessimistic in the short to medium term at the least. Funny, as he made some good points about nuance yesterday.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
OK try this then. This is also from the Kyiv Independent. A pro-Ukraine source in Ukraine. Funded by Canada, praised by the UK and EU, and so on
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
Man, if you think that's negative, you should try reading some Russian Telegraph channels.
The journalist himself says this:
"Hi, this is Francis Farrell, cheers for reading this article. It's been a while since I've done a field report from around Bakhmut, but this time was definitely different. For those of us who are dedicated to the victory of Ukraine, there is no point living with rose-tinted goggles on, this is what it will look like for a long time. As long as it goes on, we will be here, reporting on it as it is"
I'm hazarding a guess he knows more than you, even though he has more motivation to be positive than you
Is there any chance that this is a supporting document for the application for more weapons?
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
OK try this then. This is also from the Kyiv Independent. A pro-Ukraine source in Ukraine. Funded by Canada, praised by the UK and EU, and so on
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
Leon isn't a Putin apologist, fash sympathiser or anything else.
He's just a luvvie and a professional bedwetter.
He'd have been taken to the rear in a strait jacket, had he been in the trenches during WW1. And during WW2 he'd have no doubt been hanging onto the coattails of Halifax urging us to make peace in June 1940.
Had Germany have invaded you know Leon would have been a collaborator.
So would I in fairness, far too cowardly to stand up to oppressors, me.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
OK try this then. This is also from the Kyiv Independent. A pro-Ukraine source in Ukraine. Funded by Canada, praised by the UK and EU, and so on
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
Man, if you think that's negative, you should try reading some Russian Telegraph channels.
The journalist himself says this:
"Hi, this is Francis Farrell, cheers for reading this article. It's been a while since I've done a field report from around Bakhmut, but this time was definitely different. For those of us who are dedicated to the victory of Ukraine, there is no point living with rose-tinted goggles on, this is what it will look like for a long time. As long as it goes on, we will be here, reporting on it as it is"
I'm hazarding a guess he knows more than you, even though he has more motivation to be positive than you
I'm sure he does.
But that doesn't take anything away from my comment: the Russians are also having a shit time.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
OK try this then. This is also from the Kyiv Independent. A pro-Ukraine source in Ukraine. Funded by Canada, praised by the UK and EU, and so on
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
Man, if you think that's negative, you should try reading some Russian Telegraph channels.
The journalist himself says this:
"Hi, this is Francis Farrell, cheers for reading this article. It's been a while since I've done a field report from around Bakhmut, but this time was definitely different. For those of us who are dedicated to the victory of Ukraine, there is no point living with rose-tinted goggles on, this is what it will look like for a long time. As long as it goes on, we will be here, reporting on it as it is"
I'm hazarding a guess he knows more than you, even though he has more motivation to be positive than you
Yes, what he's saying is honest reporting.
It is not what you're saying.
He's not saying that Ukraine are "running out of men" or that the "Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated" or that Ukraine is "slowly losing this war" that is your supposition and was not his conclusion.
What he's saying is that fighting could last a long time, yes that can be what happens in warfare. Its brutal, and bloody, and its not a Hollywood action movie where some conquering hero comes in and clears all the enemy singlehandedly and rapidly.
All the more reason for us to support Ukraine for the long term. The opposite of the conclusion you seem to be drawing.
Leon isn't a Putin apologist, fash sympathiser or anything else.
He's just a luvvie and a professional bedwetter.
He'd have been taken to the rear in a strait jacket, had he been in the trenches during WW1. And during WW2 he'd have no doubt been hanging onto the coattails of Halifax urging us to make peace in June 1940.
Had Germany have invaded you know Leon would have been a collaborator.
So would I in fairness, far too cowardly to stand up to oppressors, me.
Bah, I would have foreseen the successful German invasion and would have collaborated BEFORE the invasion, to secure the best outcome for me and my family.
The section on the Post office as "We're trusted. We're relatable. We're reliable." is vomit inducing. The multiple spelling mistakes and atrocious grammar don't help either. A whole paragraph on EDI but nothing about ethics and compliance with the law.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
OK try this then. This is also from the Kyiv Independent. A pro-Ukraine source in Ukraine. Funded by Canada, praised by the UK and EU, and so on
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
The issue is not that the Ukrainians are pointing out problems, that is a given.
The issue is your 2 + 2 = 5 logic.
The Ukrainians don't want to surrender. They want more ammunition, more supplies, more assistance, not less.
You take the fact there are issues and then extrapolate that to saying that Ukraine is losing the war, which is not true.
Heck as the report you quoted says, the war could last years more. The Ukrainians aren't gearing up for surrender, they're up for the fight, and they're prepared to fight for years if that is what it takes - and we can and should support them for as long as they're willing and able to fight.
The fastest way this war finishes, is for the western world to give the Ukranians every weapons system we have spare.
Just because a bunch of right and left Americans want to see ‘peace’, doesn’t mean that the Ukranians don’t want as many weapons as they can get their hands on.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
OK try this then. This is also from the Kyiv Independent. A pro-Ukraine source in Ukraine. Funded by Canada, praised by the UK and EU, and so on
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
Man, if you think that's negative, you should try reading some Russian Telegraph channels.
The journalist himself says this:
"Hi, this is Francis Farrell, cheers for reading this article. It's been a while since I've done a field report from around Bakhmut, but this time was definitely different. For those of us who are dedicated to the victory of Ukraine, there is no point living with rose-tinted goggles on, this is what it will look like for a long time. As long as it goes on, we will be here, reporting on it as it is"
I'm hazarding a guess he knows more than you, even though he has more motivation to be positive than you
Is there any chance that this is a supporting document for the application for more weapons?
That possibility occurred to me, but this is really detailed lying, if that is what it is: a pack of lies designed to get more F-16s or whatever
I don't believe it is. I think this is the truth - or one version of the battlefield truth as seen by one Canadian-Ukrainian (I think) journalist
A perusal of the entire Kyiv Independen website is, in truth, a rather sobering exercise if you are eager for Ukraine to win, and win quick (so as to save lives on all sides)
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
OK try this then. This is also from the Kyiv Independent. A pro-Ukraine source in Ukraine. Funded by Canada, praised by the UK and EU, and so on
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
The issue is not that the Ukrainians are pointing out problems, that is a given.
The issue is your 2 + 2 = 5 logic.
The Ukrainians don't want to surrender. They want more ammunition, more supplies, more assistance, not less.
You take the fact there are issues and then extrapolate that to saying that Ukraine is losing the war, which is not true.
Heck as the report you quoted says, the war could last years more. The Ukrainians aren't gearing up for surrender, they're up for the fight, and they're prepared to fight for years if that is what it takes - and we can and should support them for as long as they're willing and able to fight.
The fastest way this war finishes, is for the western world to give the Ukranians every weapons system we have spare.
Just because a bunch of right and left Americans want to see ‘peace’, doesn’t mean that the Ukranians don’t want as many weapons as they can get their hands on.
"Peace" is overrated.
Security is what is needed.
If that can be achieved peacefully, great.
But if it can't, it needs to be achieved militarily.
First secure victory, then there can be a lasting peace. Surrendering to dictators just causes them to come back for more, it does not secure peace.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
OK try this then. This is also from the Kyiv Independent. A pro-Ukraine source in Ukraine. Funded by Canada, praised by the UK and EU, and so on
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
The issue is not that the Ukrainians are pointing out problems, that is a given.
The issue is your 2 + 2 = 5 logic.
The Ukrainians don't want to surrender. They want more ammunition, more supplies, more assistance, not less.
You take the fact there are issues and then extrapolate that to saying that Ukraine is losing the war, which is not true.
Heck as the report you quoted says, the war could last years more. The Ukrainians aren't gearing up for surrender, they're up for the fight, and they're prepared to fight for years if that is what it takes - and we can and should support them for as long as they're willing and able to fight.
The fastest way this war finishes, is for the western world to give the Ukranians every weapons system we have spare.
Just because a bunch of right and left Americans want to see ‘peace’, doesn’t mean that the Ukranians don’t want as many weapons as they can get their hands on.
The fastest way this war ends is us telling putin give up all that land or we turn moscow into glass and drop nukes he would run away like a little girl because he knows most of his wont even get out the silo
The section on the Post office as "We're trusted. We're relatable. We're reliable." is vomit inducing. The multiple spelling mistakes and atrocious grammar don't help either. A whole paragraph on EDI but nothing about ethics and compliance with the law.
Leon isn't a Putin apologist, fash sympathiser or anything else.
He's just a luvvie and a professional bedwetter.
He'd have been taken to the rear in a strait jacket, had he been in the trenches during WW1. And during WW2 he'd have no doubt been hanging onto the coattails of Halifax urging us to make peace in June 1940.
Why are you all obsessed with discussing Leon? I struggle to think of a duller subject (the words about him rather than he himself)
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
OK try this then. This is also from the Kyiv Independent. A pro-Ukraine source in Ukraine. Funded by Canada, praised by the UK and EU, and so on
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
Man, if you think that's negative, you should try reading some Russian Telegraph channels.
The journalist himself says this:
"Hi, this is Francis Farrell, cheers for reading this article. It's been a while since I've done a field report from around Bakhmut, but this time was definitely different. For those of us who are dedicated to the victory of Ukraine, there is no point living with rose-tinted goggles on, this is what it will look like for a long time. As long as it goes on, we will be here, reporting on it as it is"
I'm hazarding a guess he knows more than you, even though he has more motivation to be positive than you
Yes, what he's saying is honest reporting.
It is not what you're saying.
He's not saying that Ukraine are "running out of men" or that the "Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated" or that Ukraine is "slowly losing this war" that is your supposition and was not his conclusion.
What he's saying is that fighting could last a long time, yes that can be what happens in warfare. Its brutal, and bloody, and its not a Hollywood action movie where some conquering hero comes in and clears all the enemy singlehandedly and rapidly.
All the more reason for us to support Ukraine for the long term. The opposite of the conclusion you seem to be drawing.
You are, as ever, confused
The article (from the Kyiv Independent) which refers to the Russians being "better trained", etc, was from the Kharkiv front. Go look down the thread. It was published Sept 1
This even more pessimistic article from the southern from - same media source - dates from August 27
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
OK try this then. This is also from the Kyiv Independent. A pro-Ukraine source in Ukraine. Funded by Canada, praised by the UK and EU, and so on
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
Man, if you think that's negative, you should try reading some Russian Telegraph channels.
The journalist himself says this:
"Hi, this is Francis Farrell, cheers for reading this article. It's been a while since I've done a field report from around Bakhmut, but this time was definitely different. For those of us who are dedicated to the victory of Ukraine, there is no point living with rose-tinted goggles on, this is what it will look like for a long time. As long as it goes on, we will be here, reporting on it as it is"
I'm hazarding a guess he knows more than you, even though he has more motivation to be positive than you
I'm sure he does.
But that doesn't take anything away from my comment: the Russians are also having a shit time.
Tho war is shit for almost everyone, it is easier to defend than attack. Ask the Germans at the Somme. The Ukrainians probably have it worse at the moment
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
OK try this then. This is also from the Kyiv Independent. A pro-Ukraine source in Ukraine. Funded by Canada, praised by the UK and EU, and so on
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
Man, if you think that's negative, you should try reading some Russian Telegraph channels.
The journalist himself says this:
"Hi, this is Francis Farrell, cheers for reading this article. It's been a while since I've done a field report from around Bakhmut, but this time was definitely different. For those of us who are dedicated to the victory of Ukraine, there is no point living with rose-tinted goggles on, this is what it will look like for a long time. As long as it goes on, we will be here, reporting on it as it is"
I'm hazarding a guess he knows more than you, even though he has more motivation to be positive than you
Is there any chance that this is a supporting document for the application for more weapons?
That possibility occurred to me, but this is really detailed lying, if that is what it is: a pack of lies designed to get more F-16s or whatever
I don't believe it is. I think this is the truth - or one version of the battlefield truth as seen by one Canadian-Ukrainian (I think) journalist
A perusal of the entire Kyiv Independen website is, in truth, a rather sobering exercise if you are eager for Ukraine to win, and win quick (so as to save lives on all sides)
Who on here is saying Ukraine will win quick.
The ambition is to see Ukraine win. A quick end to the war is in Russia's interests, not Ukraine's.
Russia is on the backfoot and wants to cling on to the landbridge it has seized. Hence the desperation of its western pundits to see an end to the war.
Ukraine are in this for the long haul. We should support them in that.
The way I see it, the ideal plausible scenario this year is they can sever the land bridge, getting Tokmak and the Rails and the Motorway under HIMARS range (super ideal would be to retake Tokmak and sever it completely) and then they can sever Russia's ability to reinforce its troops that would then be trapped in the west and further isolate Crimea. Next year then Ukraine should be able to push on again having weakened the isolated troops.
There is no artificial deadline to do this by.
Isolating troops and weakening them that way, which Ukraine did to great success to liberate Kherson for instance, is something that can take months not days.
Leon isn't a Putin apologist, fash sympathiser or anything else.
He's just a luvvie and a professional bedwetter.
He'd have been taken to the rear in a strait jacket, had he been in the trenches during WW1. And during WW2 he'd have no doubt been hanging onto the coattails of Halifax urging us to make peace in June 1940.
Why are you all obsessed with discussing Leon? I struggle to think of a duller subject (the words about him rather than he himself)
I entirely agree, I don't want this to be "about me". It's fucking ludicrous
I am simply offering a different, less hopeful perspective on the war (than some). and I am carefully backing up my claims with actual evidence (either from Ukrainian sources, or the BBC)
On the other side there are people just hurling juvenile abuse - "collaborator", "blackshirt", "Putinist", "bedwetter", "fucking appeaser" - and offering no evidence at all
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
OK try this then. This is also from the Kyiv Independent. A pro-Ukraine source in Ukraine. Funded by Canada, praised by the UK and EU, and so on
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
The issue is not that the Ukrainians are pointing out problems, that is a given.
The issue is your 2 + 2 = 5 logic.
The Ukrainians don't want to surrender. They want more ammunition, more supplies, more assistance, not less.
You take the fact there are issues and then extrapolate that to saying that Ukraine is losing the war, which is not true.
Heck as the report you quoted says, the war could last years more. The Ukrainians aren't gearing up for surrender, they're up for the fight, and they're prepared to fight for years if that is what it takes - and we can and should support them for as long as they're willing and able to fight.
The fastest way this war finishes, is for the western world to give the Ukranians every weapons system we have spare.
Just because a bunch of right and left Americans want to see ‘peace’, doesn’t mean that the Ukranians don’t want as many weapons as they can get their hands on.
Much more with "right" than "left" Americans, based on polling I've seen as well as views of my numerous leftie friends & acquaintances.
Seems to be different in UK. But in USA, leftwingers who wanna pimp for Putin, are mostly getting nowhere fast with their bullshit.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
Settling just gives Russians time to regroup and rearm , Ukraine have to keep going , shit or bust. If they lose then NATO will be in it next time for sure.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
OK try this then. This is also from the Kyiv Independent. A pro-Ukraine source in Ukraine. Funded by Canada, praised by the UK and EU, and so on
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
Man, if you think that's negative, you should try reading some Russian Telegraph channels.
The journalist himself says this:
"Hi, this is Francis Farrell, cheers for reading this article. It's been a while since I've done a field report from around Bakhmut, but this time was definitely different. For those of us who are dedicated to the victory of Ukraine, there is no point living with rose-tinted goggles on, this is what it will look like for a long time. As long as it goes on, we will be here, reporting on it as it is"
I'm hazarding a guess he knows more than you, even though he has more motivation to be positive than you
Yes, what he's saying is honest reporting.
It is not what you're saying.
He's not saying that Ukraine are "running out of men" or that the "Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated" or that Ukraine is "slowly losing this war" that is your supposition and was not his conclusion.
What he's saying is that fighting could last a long time, yes that can be what happens in warfare. Its brutal, and bloody, and its not a Hollywood action movie where some conquering hero comes in and clears all the enemy singlehandedly and rapidly.
All the more reason for us to support Ukraine for the long term. The opposite of the conclusion you seem to be drawing.
You are, as ever, confused
The article (from the Kyiv Independent) which refers to the Russians being "better trained", etc, was from the Kharkiv front. Go look down the thread. It was published Sept 1
This even more pessimistic article from the southern from - same media source - dates from August 27
It still said it was talking about beginning of August.
This isn't good. Ukraine struggling - badly - on the Kharkiv front
Many of us have said it before, they are simply running out of men. Meanwhile the Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated. NB this is a usually pro-Kyiv source
"It also lacks battlefield experience, from low ranks to commanding officers. Nor do they have many options to draw on somebody else's. The year 2022 ground down Ukraine's supply of experienced warfighters to the point where there can be said to be a shortage."
Ukraine, I fear, is slowly losing this war. Or at least: not winning
You are having a laugh saying Russians are better trained, they are mainly just out of prisons or back of beyond, stuck in a WWII tank or with an old pitchfork etc and sent to the front. They have lots of people but not so many real soldiers.
It's not me saying it, it is the Ukrainian soldiers in that report from a highly pro-Ukrainian source
It also makes sense. The Ukrainians are absolutely gallant and determined, no doubt, but it is a small country compared to Russia, and the Ukes have lost 200,000 or more to death and injury. They've already lost many (most?) of their properly trained troops, and they are now relying on conscripts who get 3 weeks training in NATO then in they go
What are you smoking? The actual reports from Ukraine are nothing like that.
The troops now being deployed to push the Robotyne win down towards Tokmak, are the elite units held back earlier in the year, and working with the new NATO tanks and rockets.
Can you not read?
I am referring to this report - I linked it, go see - on the Kharkiv front
Give them more and better weapons. It’s existential.
And damn good value for money, from a Western perspective.
It is very hard to see the deaths of 100,000s of men and women as “damn good value for money” - whatever your perspective on the war
I really question some of these western sentiments
Do you want the Ukrainians to surrender right away?
All Leon is doing is questioning whether the Ukrainians should settle at some point or move back quite a long way.
He's also intimating that the Ukes are definitely going to lose, so should cut their losses
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
This is where PB loses its mind. I am pointing out that Ukraine has significant problems on its eastern front - coz their resources are stretched - and I did that citing a pro-Ukraine source! The Kyiv Independent
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The piece you linked to earlier was highlighting issues for the Ukrainians away from where their counter-assault is concentrated - where all the best men and kit currently are
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
OK try this then. This is also from the Kyiv Independent. A pro-Ukraine source in Ukraine. Funded by Canada, praised by the UK and EU, and so on
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
Man, if you think that's negative, you should try reading some Russian Telegraph channels.
The journalist himself says this:
"Hi, this is Francis Farrell, cheers for reading this article. It's been a while since I've done a field report from around Bakhmut, but this time was definitely different. For those of us who are dedicated to the victory of Ukraine, there is no point living with rose-tinted goggles on, this is what it will look like for a long time. As long as it goes on, we will be here, reporting on it as it is"
I'm hazarding a guess he knows more than you, even though he has more motivation to be positive than you
I'm sure he does.
But that doesn't take anything away from my comment: the Russians are also having a shit time.
Tho war is shit for almost everyone, it is easier to defend than attack. Ask the Germans at the Somme. The Ukrainians probably have it worse at the moment
Did you really not talk to any actual Ukranians, having being paid thousands to go there?
Stop being a contrarian idiot, understand just how much the defenders want to defend, and get behind them putting the bear back in its cage.
Comments
Events have moved on.
Robert can you check Leon's IP address.
Lol
Russia is currently illegally occupying/annexed:
Ukrainian territory
Four eastern Oblasts of Ukraine: 108,845 sq. km
Crimea/Sevastopol: 26,945 sq. km
Moldovan territory
Transnistria: 4,163 sq. km
Georgian territory
South Ossetia: 3,900 sq. km
Abkhazia: 8,665 sq. km
Japanese territory
South Kurils: 5,030 sq. km
Total: 157,548 sq. km
The Russians gave up the capital of one of the regions they ostensibly now regard as part of the Russian Federation, they'll pull back if forced to without it escalating beyond Ukraine's borders.
The appeal to raw numbers would suggest no smaller nation has ever beaten a larger one, yet they have. So constantly pointing to Ukraine being smaller is not persuasive in itself.
I really question some of these western sentiments
At best Iraq was a score draw for the west
But Ukraine is unlike any of these conflicts. Russia surrounds Ukraine on 2/3 sides (Inc Belarus), there are plenty of pro Russian people in Ukraine - esp Donbas and Crimea. Russian is widely spoken in Ukraine. And so on
Anyone who genuinely thinks people supporting weapons for Ukraine as 'value' means they are uncaring about the deaths of thousands is a moron and I don't think that needs sugarcoating. No one buys you believe that because you're not stupid.
It simply means that supporting a nation in an existential defence of its people and territory against unprovoked invasion by giving them, say, £1bn of weapons, is a very worthwhile spend of £1bn.
Do you think it is not a worthwhile cause to spend money on? Because if you do, and you appear sympathetic to the Ukrainian cause, then why get all snowflakey about use of the word value? Why have an attack of vapours as if people are treating the death of others as nothing, when it is pretty obviously just noting £1bn of UK money will have tangible, positive results for a friendly nation?
It's not even armchair generalling or being gung ho, I'm someone who thinks it will probably end in a horrible, grinding ceasefire and settlement.
If you want to make these kind of points you need a consistent position about it, like Dura Ace - people like or don't like his stance, but it makes sense with his stated positions.
https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/horror-police-marksmen-shoot-dog-27644407
Horror as police marksmen 'shoot dog dead' following attack on woman in Oldham
They certainly don't look like surrendering now, and who can blame them. But:are we being the best ally if we encourage them to fight to the last man? It is morally questionable
And phrases that describe mass battlefield slaughter as "damn good value for money" are simply offensive. However this is not @kle4's usual style, so I will presume he didn't really think through how his words might come across
And he's talking up the hundred billion views of the Carson Orban interview that's basically Putin approved propaganda
He'd been veering too close to the dark side for my liking since his return
It’s not an equitable settlement. An equitable settlement is withdrawal at least to the 2014 boundaries, and rock solid security guarantees so this menace of an evil empire can never threaten another of its neighbours. And if we were actually supplying meaningful weapons rather than leftovers from the shed they could do it more quickly and with less bloodshed.
The UK lost more than a million lives across the two world wars, but I don't know anyone in the UK who regrets the UK standing up to Hitler, and I don't know any Ukrainians who oppose standing up to a comparable evil in Putin.
And step away from your Putinist bubble and Ukraine are making solid progress on the front. They're expanding the breach around Robotyne and preparing the ground for moving towards Tokmak which will sever Russia's land bridge and ability to reinforce its troops in the west.
Which is why its no wonder that Russia's apologists are panicking and spouting this end the war gibberish. If you want the war over, then get Russian troops back into Russia, and the war ends.
Meanwhile I wondered if we are really seeing a breakthrough in the south. TBH the situation on the ground is hard to discern, and there are conflicting accounts, some of the more pessimistic appraisals come, again, from Ukrainians. The evidence I provided for this came from that well known Putnist apologiser-media, the BBC
And becuause of this I am "veering to the dark side" like I have signed up for The Wagner Group
Honestly, get a grip
The reasonable save their passionate outbursts for dogs, litter, and other matters of less concern.
God bless him, never change.
You tell em, Brigadier Behind-the-Sofa
This is completely unprecedented for September, and pretty unusual if it were July. It translates to temperatures of 30C+ on the ground for at least 3, probably 6 days in a row, and nocturnal minima in the high teens or above 20C. The hottest period in a summer that is already unusual as having June hotter than July or August.
The European model ECMWF is almost identical. Hot weather until at least next weekend.
The rest of the month is still uncertain but it’s not impossible we could end up with September being 2023’s warmest month.
You made it sound like that’s the situation everywhere; I hope you did that ignorantly
You’re also caught up in a weird sensationalism of twitX views of a video of an interview that is offensively wrong from its first sentence
Personally, I think this is very simple:
It's not our job to tell Ukraine not to fight the aggressor. If the Ukrainian people want to keep standing up to Putin, then it is moral duty to give them as much help as we can. And if they wish to make peace, then we must support them in that too.
Too many people think that our support is somehow unethical because it might prolong the war. That is a morally repugnant view.
(1) Would be carte blanche for Russia to take more and more of Ukraine. It hasn't respected a single agreement it has make with Ukraine and it is anyway committed to taking more territory.
(2) Might result in Ukraine losing soldiers slower than (3) and also using equipment more slowly, but Ukraine still needs to keep fighting and see its men being killed at a slightly slower rate. The problem of (1) still applies. Russia won't be satisfied with the current LoC.
(3) Sees the highest casualty rates but it does potentially create facts on the ground, or at least avoid facts on the ground that are detrimental to Ukraine,and may eventually force Russia to a settlement.
My question to @Leon and @CorrectHorseBat is why would (1) or (2) be better than (3) for Ukraine, and why wouldn't we as outsiders support Ukraine if they choose (3) ?
...The Witness, Russia’s first feature-length film about its invasion of Ukraine that premiered across the country on 17 August...
But The Witness is a box-office flop. Set to a budget of 200 million roubles (£1.5m), it has grossed less than 14 million roubles (£110,000) in its first two weeks, with viewers across the country reporting empty cinema halls.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/sep/02/kremlins-propaganda-film-ukraine-war-plays-to-empty-cinemas
Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer is expected to reshuffle his shadow cabinet on Monday.
The long-awaited change of Labour's top team coincides with MPs returning to Westminster from their summer break.
There is much speculation over what role Sir Keir may give his deputy leader Angela Rayner.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-66702016
It's a report from the southern front. And it is way more negative than anything we generally read in the West
Sample paragraphs:
"Eighteen months into the full-scale war however, the formation, with units fighting on all three axes of the counteroffensive, is now beginning to pay a high price for its makeup of volunteers, rather than mobilized soldiers.
“It's hard to go forward, we don't have new weapons and equipment, and these days our personnel aren't being replaced,” said Ilnytskyi."
"Since Ukrainian forces first regained the initiative around Bakhmut in May, Ground Forces Commander Oleksandr Syrskyi has repeatedly claimed that the occupied city was in the process of being “encircled.” On the ground, that still looks like a distant dream.
“Everyone has their own job, their own mission,” said Lavryniuk dryly. “If they (Syrskyi) say things like that then maybe they know something we don't"
"Whatever gains the southern counteroffensive makes before culmination, both sides look set for a gruelling struggle that could last for years more.
Eighteen months in, concern is mounting among soldiers, from commanders to the rank and file, that for much of the country’s civilian population, the war is increasingly fading into the distance, even as the fighting shows no signs of dying down."
Tell me, why are the UKRAINIANS being so negative? Perhaps they, like me, have "veered to the dark side"
https://kyivindependent.com/inching-forward-in-bakhmut-counteroffensive-ukraines-hardened-units-look-ahead-to-long-grim-war/
https://kyivindependent.com/inching-forward-in-bakhmut-counteroffensive-ukraines-hardened-units-look-ahead-to-long-grim-war/
Here is the comment from the journalist himself, at the end
"Hi, this is Francis Farrell, cheers for reading this article. It's been a while since I've done a field report from around Bakhmut, but this time was definitely different. For those of us who are dedicated to the victory of Ukraine, there is no point living with rose-tinted goggles on, this is what it will look like for a long time. As long as it goes on, we will be here, reporting on it as it is"
He's just a luvvie and a professional bedwetter.
He'd have been taken to the rear in a strait jacket, had he been in the trenches during WW1. And during WW2 he'd have no doubt been hanging onto the coattails of Halifax urging us to make peace in June 1940.
You waffle on about Tucker Carlson's TwiXing, and then imply that Ukraine needs to surrender to save lives
You'd do the same if he'd paid you to post here
You've always been one of my favourite posters here, and I find your recent shift to Putidiocy rather depressing
"Hi, this is Francis Farrell, cheers for reading this article. It's been a while since I've done a field report from around Bakhmut, but this time was definitely different. For those of us who are dedicated to the victory of Ukraine, there is no point living with rose-tinted goggles on, this is what it will look like for a long time. As long as it goes on, we will be here, reporting on it as it is"
I'm hazarding a guess he knows more than you, even though he has more motivation to be positive than you
The issue is not that the Ukrainians are pointing out problems, that is a given.
The issue is your 2 + 2 = 5 logic.
The Ukrainians don't want to surrender. They want more ammunition, more supplies, more assistance, not less.
You take the fact there are issues and then extrapolate that to saying that Ukraine is losing the war, which is not true.
Heck as the report you quoted says, the war could last years more. The Ukrainians aren't gearing up for surrender, they're up for the fight, and they're prepared to fight for years if that is what it takes - and we can and should support them for as long as they're willing and able to fight.
But that doesn't take anything away from my comment: the Russians are also having a shit time.
It is not what you're saying.
He's not saying that Ukraine are "running out of men" or that the "Russians seem better equipped, better trained, and even better motivated" or that Ukraine is "slowly losing this war" that is your supposition and was not his conclusion.
What he's saying is that fighting could last a long time, yes that can be what happens in warfare. Its brutal, and bloody, and its not a Hollywood action movie where some conquering hero comes in and clears all the enemy singlehandedly and rapidly.
All the more reason for us to support Ukraine for the long term. The opposite of the conclusion you seem to be drawing.
https://gb.bebee.com/job/20230901-de01d58d210a441dcc2be97237d38377
The section on the Post office as "We're trusted. We're relatable. We're reliable." is vomit inducing. The multiple spelling mistakes and atrocious grammar don't help either. A whole paragraph on EDI but nothing about ethics and compliance with the law.
Just because a bunch of right and left Americans want to see ‘peace’, doesn’t mean that the Ukranians don’t want as many weapons as they can get their hands on.
I don't believe it is. I think this is the truth - or one version of the battlefield truth as seen by one Canadian-Ukrainian (I think) journalist
A perusal of the entire Kyiv Independen website is, in truth, a rather sobering exercise if you are eager for Ukraine to win, and win quick (so as to save lives on all sides)
Security is what is needed.
If that can be achieved peacefully, great.
But if it can't, it needs to be achieved militarily.
First secure victory, then there can be a lasting peace. Surrendering to dictators just causes them to come back for more, it does not secure peace.
Granted, in most organizations, the job of suchlike is boosting morale, NOT deflating it?
Guess that means we're VERY special!
The article (from the Kyiv Independent) which refers to the Russians being "better trained", etc, was from the Kharkiv front. Go look down the thread. It was published Sept 1
This even more pessimistic article from the southern from - same media source - dates from August 27
😀😀😀😀
The ambition is to see Ukraine win. A quick end to the war is in Russia's interests, not Ukraine's.
Russia is on the backfoot and wants to cling on to the landbridge it has seized. Hence the desperation of its western pundits to see an end to the war.
Ukraine are in this for the long haul. We should support them in that.
The way I see it, the ideal plausible scenario this year is they can sever the land bridge, getting Tokmak and the Rails and the Motorway under HIMARS range (super ideal would be to retake Tokmak and sever it completely) and then they can sever Russia's ability to reinforce its troops that would then be trapped in the west and further isolate Crimea. Next year then Ukraine should be able to push on again having weakened the isolated troops.
There is no artificial deadline to do this by.
Isolating troops and weakening them that way, which Ukraine did to great success to liberate Kherson for instance, is something that can take months not days.
I am simply offering a different, less hopeful perspective on the war (than some). and I am carefully backing up my claims with actual evidence (either from Ukrainian sources, or the BBC)
On the other side there are people just hurling juvenile abuse - "collaborator", "blackshirt", "Putinist", "bedwetter", "fucking appeaser" - and offering no evidence at all
It's truly boring, and also childish
Seems to be different in UK. But in USA, leftwingers who wanna pimp for Putin, are mostly getting nowhere fast with their bullshit.
Stop being a contrarian idiot, understand just how much the defenders want to defend, and get behind them putting the bear back in its cage.