We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
IIRC Narnia's entire existence, in this world, ran for about 40-50 years total from creation to destruction, so we had very little chance to fight them.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
Weren't you and Bart talking about wars with France and the Anglo-Dutch wars? We've not fought a war against France or the Netherlands (or Spain, Portugal, Belgium, Denmark, Norway, Sweden, Poland, Malta, Cyprus, Greece, Slovenia etc.) since Australia, Canada and New Zealand became independent.
If you're going to look at a narrow time period for wars against Aus, Can and NZ, you need to apply the same time period to European nations.
Our last battle against France was in 1942.
I did wonder about mentioning the battles against Vichy France. I would contest that, at the time, we did not recognise them as the legitimate French government.
However, Vichy WAS recognized as legitimate French government by Canada up until Normandy invasion, while Australia recognized BOTH Vichy and Free French.
I did not know that. Gosh.
Well, I think Canadian recognition of the Vichy government just goes to show how the UK and Canada have very different international relations/views of the world!
Wasn't it Vichy that broke off relations with us over Mers-el-Kebir rather than the other way round?
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
Weren't you and Bart talking about wars with France and the Anglo-Dutch wars? We've not fought a war against France or the Netherlands (or Spain, Portugal, Belgium, Denmark, Norway, Sweden, Poland, Malta, Cyprus, Greece, Slovenia etc.) since Australia, Canada and New Zealand became independent.
If you're going to look at a narrow time period for wars against Aus, Can and NZ, you need to apply the same time period to European nations.
Our last battle against France was in 1942.
I did wonder about mentioning the battles against Vichy France. I would contest that, at the time, we did not recognise them as the legitimate French government.
However, Vichy WAS recognized as legitimate French government by Canada up until Normandy invasion, while Australia recognized BOTH Vichy and Free French.
I did not know that. Gosh.
Well, I think Canadian recognition of the Vichy government just goes to show how the UK and Canada have very different international relations/views of the world!
No it just goes to show the influence of the Francophone lobby in Quebec
But ofd course in your logic the Quebecois aren't real Canadians so Canada is Britisah or something.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Narnia: founded by British people (established in "The Magician's Nephew"), long history of cultural exchange with Britain ("Lion, Witch, Wardrobe" through to "The Last Battle"), speak English, shared Judaeo-Christian faith, shared veneration of lions
Canada is a lot less Anglo/British than a lot of folk on here blithely assume.
Indeed. They do things like using British spellings mainly as a way of being counter-American rather than pro-Britain.
It depends which province you're in. In the western provinces you'll find a lot of Union flags and British names added to things, and a lot of symbols of the monarchy.
But that's more a way of being counter-Ontario and counter-Quebecois than it is pro-British.
Even the Western Provinces vary greatly though. Alberta models itself on Texas. BC on Brighton.
Alberta is weird (my family are there), they basically act like a British Texas.
They're both Texas and Britain, and Canada, all rolled into one.
Its definitely a much more foreign country than Australia is though, relative to here.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
Weren't you and Bart talking about wars with France and the Anglo-Dutch wars? We've not fought a war against France or the Netherlands (or Spain, Portugal, Belgium, Denmark, Norway, Sweden, Poland, Malta, Cyprus, Greece, Slovenia etc.) since Australia, Canada and New Zealand became independent.
If you're going to look at a narrow time period for wars against Aus, Can and NZ, you need to apply the same time period to European nations.
Our last battle against France was in 1942.
I did wonder about mentioning the battles against Vichy France. I would contest that, at the time, we did not recognise them as the legitimate French government.
However, Vichy WAS recognized as legitimate French government by Canada up until Normandy invasion, while Australia recognized BOTH Vichy and Free French.
I did not know that. Gosh.
Well, I think Canadian recognition of the Vichy government just goes to show how the UK and Canada have very different international relations/views of the world!
Wasn't it Vichy that broke off relations with us over Mers-el-Kebir rather than the other way round?
Behaving like the Wehrmacht in 1939, or the Combined Fleet in 1942, does make it a little difficult to complain when that sort of thing happens.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
Weren't you and Bart talking about wars with France and the Anglo-Dutch wars? We've not fought a war against France or the Netherlands (or Spain, Portugal, Belgium, Denmark, Norway, Sweden, Poland, Malta, Cyprus, Greece, Slovenia etc.) since Australia, Canada and New Zealand became independent.
If you're going to look at a narrow time period for wars against Aus, Can and NZ, you need to apply the same time period to European nations.
Our last battle against France was in 1942.
I did wonder about mentioning the battles against Vichy France. I would contest that, at the time, we did not recognise them as the legitimate French government.
However, Vichy WAS recognized as legitimate French government by Canada up until Normandy invasion, while Australia recognized BOTH Vichy and Free French.
I did not know that. Gosh.
Well, I think Canadian recognition of the Vichy government just goes to show how the UK and Canada have very different international relations/views of the world!
No it just goes to show the influence of the Francophone lobby in Quebec
The Francophone lobby in Quebec... who are part of Canada.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Australia, New Zealand and Canada are all pretty new as countries, but we fought plenty of wars with the peoples of those places.
Australia: Tasmanian War; Hawkesbury and Nepean Wars; Bathurst War; wars of the Liverpool Plains; the Mount Cottrell massacre; Eumeralla Wars
New Zealand: Flagstaff War; 1st Taranaki War; 2nd Taranaki War; East Cape War; Titokowaru's War
Canada: Seven Years' War; the Rebellions of 1837–1838; King William's War
So what? Most Australians, Canadians and New Zealanders are now of white British ancestry and we did not fight them (although we did fight the French at Quebec under Wolfe).
We never even fought a War of Independence against Australia, Canada or New Zealand unlike we did against the US colonists and Catholic Irish
My Canadian daughter in law would challenge your statement that most white Canadians are of white British Ancestry not least as her family are Ukrainian and indeed emigration into Canada came from across Europe
She can challenge it, she would still be wrong. Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles
You say, "Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles". I read that as, "Outside of the big portion of the Canadian population that proves me wrong, certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles".
Let's look at the 2021 Canadian census, where people self-reported specific ethnic or cultural origins. Their answers were Canadian (15.6 percent of the population), followed by English (14.7 percent), Irish (12.1 percent), Scottish (12.1 percent), French (11.0 percent), German (8.1 percent), Chinese (4.7 percent), Italian (4.3 percent), Indian (3.7 percent), and Ukrainian (3.5 percent).
So, English + Scottish = 26.8%. Irish + French + German + Chinese + Italian + Indian + Ukrainian = 47.4%
Last time I checked Irish was British Isles (and includes Northern Irish) and most Canadian ethnicity declarers will be British Isles origin too.
Exclude those of French origin in Quebec and even exclude those of Irish origin and you get English and Scottish 27%, German, Chinese, Italian, Indian and Ukranian 25%
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
Weren't you and Bart talking about wars with France and the Anglo-Dutch wars? We've not fought a war against France or the Netherlands (or Spain, Portugal, Belgium, Denmark, Norway, Sweden, Poland, Malta, Cyprus, Greece, Slovenia etc.) since Australia, Canada and New Zealand became independent.
If you're going to look at a narrow time period for wars against Aus, Can and NZ, you need to apply the same time period to European nations.
Our last battle against France was in 1942.
I did wonder about mentioning the battles against Vichy France. I would contest that, at the time, we did not recognise them as the legitimate French government.
However, Vichy WAS recognized as legitimate French government by Canada up until Normandy invasion, while Australia recognized BOTH Vichy and Free French.
I did not know that. Gosh.
Well, I think Canadian recognition of the Vichy government just goes to show how the UK and Canada have very different international relations/views of the world!
USA also recognized Vichy up to June 1944 as did Republic of China.
Even the UK maintained quasi-official contacts with Vichy and entered into semi-agreements.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Narnia: founded by British people (established in "The Magician's Nephew"), long history of cultural exchange with Britain ("Lion, Witch, Wardrobe" through to "The Last Battle"), speak English, shared Judaeo-Christian faith, shared veneration of lions
And created ultimately in an Oxford pub. Fowl and Foetus?
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Australia, New Zealand and Canada are all pretty new as countries, but we fought plenty of wars with the peoples of those places.
Australia: Tasmanian War; Hawkesbury and Nepean Wars; Bathurst War; wars of the Liverpool Plains; the Mount Cottrell massacre; Eumeralla Wars
New Zealand: Flagstaff War; 1st Taranaki War; 2nd Taranaki War; East Cape War; Titokowaru's War
Canada: Seven Years' War; the Rebellions of 1837–1838; King William's War
So what? Most Australians, Canadians and New Zealanders are now of white British ancestry and we did not fight them (although we did fight the French at Quebec under Wolfe).
We never even fought a War of Independence against Australia, Canada or New Zealand unlike we did against the US colonists and Catholic Irish
My Canadian daughter in law would challenge your statement that most white Canadians are of white British Ancestry not least as her family are Ukrainian and indeed emigration into Canada came from across Europe
She can challenge it, she would still be wrong. Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles
You say, "Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles". I read that as, "Outside of the big portion of the Canadian population that proves me wrong, certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles".
Let's look at the 2021 Canadian census, where people self-reported specific ethnic or cultural origins. Their answers were Canadian (15.6 percent of the population), followed by English (14.7 percent), Irish (12.1 percent), Scottish (12.1 percent), French (11.0 percent), German (8.1 percent), Chinese (4.7 percent), Italian (4.3 percent), Indian (3.7 percent), and Ukrainian (3.5 percent).
So, English + Scottish = 26.8%. Irish + French + German + Chinese + Italian + Indian + Ukrainian = 47.4%
Last time I checked Irish was British Isles (and includes Northern Irish) and most Canadian ethnicity declarers will be British Isles origin too
Canada is a lot less Anglo/British than a lot of folk on here blithely assume.
Indeed. They do things like using British spellings mainly as a way of being counter-American rather than pro-Britain.
It depends which province you're in. In the western provinces you'll find a lot of Union flags and British names added to things, and a lot of symbols of the monarchy.
But that's more a way of being counter-Ontario and counter-Quebecois than it is pro-British.
Even the Western Provinces vary greatly though. Alberta models itself on Texas. BC on Brighton.
Alberta is weird (my family are there), they basically act like a British Texas.
They're both Texas and Britain, and Canada, all rolled into one.
Its definitely a much more foreign country than Australia is though, relative to here.
It certainly was a considerable culture shock going to the far north of Alberta from the Pacific coast. Then again. The Maritimes are as different again.
Canada is a lot less Anglo/British than a lot of folk on here blithely assume.
Indeed. They do things like using British spellings mainly as a way of being counter-American rather than pro-Britain.
It depends which province you're in. In the western provinces you'll find a lot of Union flags and British names added to things, and a lot of symbols of the monarchy.
But that's more a way of being counter-Ontario and counter-Quebecois than it is pro-British.
Even the Western Provinces vary greatly though. Alberta models itself on Texas. BC on Brighton.
Alberta is weird (my family are there), they basically act like a British Texas.
They're both Texas and Britain, and Canada, all rolled into one.
Its definitely a much more foreign country than Australia is though, relative to here.
Our daughter in laws family are mainly in Alberta and I agree very much with your description
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
In any case HYUFD's logic is unsound.
*fights a war, conquers a country or group of countries, renames it BritImperland, and claims "no sir, we never fought a war here in BritImperland, no siree"*
I forgot only those of Celtic origin count as true Scots and true Brits in your book
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Australia, New Zealand and Canada are all pretty new as countries, but we fought plenty of wars with the peoples of those places.
Australia: Tasmanian War; Hawkesbury and Nepean Wars; Bathurst War; wars of the Liverpool Plains; the Mount Cottrell massacre; Eumeralla Wars
New Zealand: Flagstaff War; 1st Taranaki War; 2nd Taranaki War; East Cape War; Titokowaru's War
Canada: Seven Years' War; the Rebellions of 1837–1838; King William's War
So what? Most Australians, Canadians and New Zealanders are now of white British ancestry and we did not fight them (although we did fight the French at Quebec under Wolfe).
We never even fought a War of Independence against Australia, Canada or New Zealand unlike we did against the US colonists and Catholic Irish
My Canadian daughter in law would challenge your statement that most white Canadians are of white British Ancestry not least as her family are Ukrainian and indeed emigration into Canada came from across Europe
She can challenge it, she would still be wrong. Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles
You say, "Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles". I read that as, "Outside of the big portion of the Canadian population that proves me wrong, certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles".
Let's look at the 2021 Canadian census, where people self-reported specific ethnic or cultural origins. Their answers were Canadian (15.6 percent of the population), followed by English (14.7 percent), Irish (12.1 percent), Scottish (12.1 percent), French (11.0 percent), German (8.1 percent), Chinese (4.7 percent), Italian (4.3 percent), Indian (3.7 percent), and Ukrainian (3.5 percent).
So, English + Scottish = 26.8%. Irish + French + German + Chinese + Italian + Indian + Ukrainian = 47.4%
This could start terrorist attacks but its surely:
English + Scottish + Irish = 38.9% French + German + Chinese + Italian + Indian + Ukrainian = 35.3%
But yes, the idea that all of Canada or Australia have come from the British isles is a complete myth, though culturally we're similar because of a common ancestor. Australia and Canada have been running immigration rates that absolutely dwarf our own (and our own are pretty high for European standards) which is another reason we're quite like them, in that we're diverse like them now - not they are us, and we're not us anymore either.
Since I left Australia at the turn of the century, their population has gone up by 50%. That's overwhelmingly immigration, and it means that the country is much less demographically British-ancestry than it used to be. So too is Britain too.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
Weren't you and Bart talking about wars with France and the Anglo-Dutch wars? We've not fought a war against France or the Netherlands (or Spain, Portugal, Belgium, Denmark, Norway, Sweden, Poland, Malta, Cyprus, Greece, Slovenia etc.) since Australia, Canada and New Zealand became independent.
If you're going to look at a narrow time period for wars against Aus, Can and NZ, you need to apply the same time period to European nations.
Our last battle against France was in 1942.
I did wonder about mentioning the battles against Vichy France. I would contest that, at the time, we did not recognise them as the legitimate French government.
However, Vichy WAS recognized as legitimate French government by Canada up until Normandy invasion, while Australia recognized BOTH Vichy and Free French.
I did not know that. Gosh.
Well, I think Canadian recognition of the Vichy government just goes to show how the UK and Canada have very different international relations/views of the world!
Wasn't it Vichy that broke off relations with us over Mers-el-Kebir rather than the other way round?
I have to admit that I am not expert at all in such matters! However, yes, you are right. Wikipedia says, yes, the Allies all recognised Vichy France initially. Then France broke off relations with the UK over Mers-el-Kebir. Churchill was a bit iffy about De Gaulle until later in the war, but the British worked with the Free French in the major fights against the Vichy forces in north Africa, Syria and Madagascar.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Australia, New Zealand and Canada are all pretty new as countries, but we fought plenty of wars with the peoples of those places.
Australia: Tasmanian War; Hawkesbury and Nepean Wars; Bathurst War; wars of the Liverpool Plains; the Mount Cottrell massacre; Eumeralla Wars
New Zealand: Flagstaff War; 1st Taranaki War; 2nd Taranaki War; East Cape War; Titokowaru's War
Canada: Seven Years' War; the Rebellions of 1837–1838; King William's War
So what? Most Australians, Canadians and New Zealanders are now of white British ancestry and we did not fight them (although we did fight the French at Quebec under Wolfe).
We never even fought a War of Independence against Australia, Canada or New Zealand unlike we did against the US colonists and Catholic Irish
My Canadian daughter in law would challenge your statement that most white Canadians are of white British Ancestry not least as her family are Ukrainian and indeed emigration into Canada came from across Europe
She can challenge it, she would still be wrong. Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles
You say, "Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles". I read that as, "Outside of the big portion of the Canadian population that proves me wrong, certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles".
Let's look at the 2021 Canadian census, where people self-reported specific ethnic or cultural origins. Their answers were Canadian (15.6 percent of the population), followed by English (14.7 percent), Irish (12.1 percent), Scottish (12.1 percent), French (11.0 percent), German (8.1 percent), Chinese (4.7 percent), Italian (4.3 percent), Indian (3.7 percent), and Ukrainian (3.5 percent).
So, English + Scottish = 26.8%. Irish + French + German + Chinese + Italian + Indian + Ukrainian = 47.4%
Last time I checked Irish was British Isles (and includes Northern Irish) and most Canadian ethnicity declarers will be British Isles origin too.
Exclude those of French origin in Quebec and even exclude those of Irish origin and you get English and Scottish 27%, German, Chinese, Italian, Indian and Ukranian 25%
You do concoct so much nonsense at times you lose credibility
And by the way have you even been to Canada and experienced the peoples there?
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Australia, New Zealand and Canada are all pretty new as countries, but we fought plenty of wars with the peoples of those places.
Australia: Tasmanian War; Hawkesbury and Nepean Wars; Bathurst War; wars of the Liverpool Plains; the Mount Cottrell massacre; Eumeralla Wars
New Zealand: Flagstaff War; 1st Taranaki War; 2nd Taranaki War; East Cape War; Titokowaru's War
Canada: Seven Years' War; the Rebellions of 1837–1838; King William's War
So what? Most Australians, Canadians and New Zealanders are now of white British ancestry and we did not fight them (although we did fight the French at Quebec under Wolfe).
We never even fought a War of Independence against Australia, Canada or New Zealand unlike we did against the US colonists and Catholic Irish
My Canadian daughter in law would challenge your statement that most white Canadians are of white British Ancestry not least as her family are Ukrainian and indeed emigration into Canada came from across Europe
She can challenge it, she would still be wrong. Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles
You say, "Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles". I read that as, "Outside of the big portion of the Canadian population that proves me wrong, certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles".
Let's look at the 2021 Canadian census, where people self-reported specific ethnic or cultural origins. Their answers were Canadian (15.6 percent of the population), followed by English (14.7 percent), Irish (12.1 percent), Scottish (12.1 percent), French (11.0 percent), German (8.1 percent), Chinese (4.7 percent), Italian (4.3 percent), Indian (3.7 percent), and Ukrainian (3.5 percent).
So, English + Scottish = 26.8%. Irish + French + German + Chinese + Italian + Indian + Ukrainian = 47.4%
Last time I checked Irish was British Isles (and includes Northern Irish) and most Canadian ethnicity declarers will be British Isles origin too
Doesn't make the Irish British.
Isles of Britain and Ireland is the correct term.
It might be politically correct but it's not very elegant or accurate as there are a lot more than two islands.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Firstly they are fictional and secondly they did not mainly share the same ethnicity and ancestry as Australia and New Zealand do with the British Isles
"ethnicity" "ancestry"
I believe that our ethnicity and ancestry is German, Scandanavian, French, Roman etc etc
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Australia, New Zealand and Canada are all pretty new as countries, but we fought plenty of wars with the peoples of those places.
Australia: Tasmanian War; Hawkesbury and Nepean Wars; Bathurst War; wars of the Liverpool Plains; the Mount Cottrell massacre; Eumeralla Wars
New Zealand: Flagstaff War; 1st Taranaki War; 2nd Taranaki War; East Cape War; Titokowaru's War
Canada: Seven Years' War; the Rebellions of 1837–1838; King William's War
So what? Most Australians, Canadians and New Zealanders are now of white British ancestry and we did not fight them (although we did fight the French at Quebec under Wolfe).
We never even fought a War of Independence against Australia, Canada or New Zealand unlike we did against the US colonists and Catholic Irish
My Canadian daughter in law would challenge your statement that most white Canadians are of white British Ancestry not least as her family are Ukrainian and indeed emigration into Canada came from across Europe
She can challenge it, she would still be wrong. Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles
You say, "Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles". I read that as, "Outside of the big portion of the Canadian population that proves me wrong, certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles".
Let's look at the 2021 Canadian census, where people self-reported specific ethnic or cultural origins. Their answers were Canadian (15.6 percent of the population), followed by English (14.7 percent), Irish (12.1 percent), Scottish (12.1 percent), French (11.0 percent), German (8.1 percent), Chinese (4.7 percent), Italian (4.3 percent), Indian (3.7 percent), and Ukrainian (3.5 percent).
So, English + Scottish = 26.8%. Irish + French + German + Chinese + Italian + Indian + Ukrainian = 47.4%
Last time I checked Irish was British Isles (and includes Northern Irish) and most Canadian ethnicity declarers will be British Isles origin too.
Exclude those of French origin in Quebec and even exclude those of Irish origin and you get English and Scottish 27%, German, Chinese, Italian, Indian and Ukranian 25%
But we're talking about the UK and its relationship to Canada v Europe, not about the British Isles's.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Narnia: founded by British people (established in "The Magician's Nephew"), long history of cultural exchange with Britain ("Lion, Witch, Wardrobe" through to "The Last Battle"), speak English, shared Judaeo-Christian faith, shared veneration of lions
And created ultimately in an Oxford pub. Fowl and Foetus?
By a sweaty Belfast pork butcher, a veritable intruder to GBland.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Australia, New Zealand and Canada are all pretty new as countries, but we fought plenty of wars with the peoples of those places.
Australia: Tasmanian War; Hawkesbury and Nepean Wars; Bathurst War; wars of the Liverpool Plains; the Mount Cottrell massacre; Eumeralla Wars
New Zealand: Flagstaff War; 1st Taranaki War; 2nd Taranaki War; East Cape War; Titokowaru's War
Canada: Seven Years' War; the Rebellions of 1837–1838; King William's War
So what? Most Australians, Canadians and New Zealanders are now of white British ancestry and we did not fight them (although we did fight the French at Quebec under Wolfe).
We never even fought a War of Independence against Australia, Canada or New Zealand unlike we did against the US colonists and Catholic Irish
My Canadian daughter in law would challenge your statement that most white Canadians are of white British Ancestry not least as her family are Ukrainian and indeed emigration into Canada came from across Europe
She can challenge it, she would still be wrong. Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles
You say, "Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles". I read that as, "Outside of the big portion of the Canadian population that proves me wrong, certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles".
Let's look at the 2021 Canadian census, where people self-reported specific ethnic or cultural origins. Their answers were Canadian (15.6 percent of the population), followed by English (14.7 percent), Irish (12.1 percent), Scottish (12.1 percent), French (11.0 percent), German (8.1 percent), Chinese (4.7 percent), Italian (4.3 percent), Indian (3.7 percent), and Ukrainian (3.5 percent).
So, English + Scottish = 26.8%. Irish + French + German + Chinese + Italian + Indian + Ukrainian = 47.4%
Last time I checked Irish was British Isles (and includes Northern Irish) and most Canadian ethnicity declarers will be British Isles origin too
Doesn't make the Irish British.
Isles of Britain and Ireland is the correct term.
It might be politically correct but it's not very elegant or accurate as there are a lot more than two islands.
Which British isle has the highest population density?
IF you REALLY want to piss off Canucks these days, refer to their country as the "Dominion of Canada" or just "the Dominion".
Then follow up by bad-mouthing Canadian bacon . . . which they call "back bacon" for some reason . . .
What are the chances of them ditching the monarchy in the near future?
Very low. Much, much more likely that Australia will do so.
The Australian Labor Party and the Aussie left have been quite republican since the 1975 constitutional crisis when the Whitlam government was kicked out by the Governor General. Whitlam was quite a prominent campaign for the republic in 1999 (oddly enough so too was the Liberal Party's Malcolm Fraser who replaced him and won the election that followed that crisis).
Monarchy/republicanism is pretty much a non-issue in Canada. Its just a part of their tapestry as to what makes them Canadian, without any heat or fire either way.
If it ever happens, it will be more with a shrug than with anger.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Australia, New Zealand and Canada are all pretty new as countries, but we fought plenty of wars with the peoples of those places.
Australia: Tasmanian War; Hawkesbury and Nepean Wars; Bathurst War; wars of the Liverpool Plains; the Mount Cottrell massacre; Eumeralla Wars
New Zealand: Flagstaff War; 1st Taranaki War; 2nd Taranaki War; East Cape War; Titokowaru's War
Canada: Seven Years' War; the Rebellions of 1837–1838; King William's War
So what? Most Australians, Canadians and New Zealanders are now of white British ancestry and we did not fight them (although we did fight the French at Quebec under Wolfe).
We never even fought a War of Independence against Australia, Canada or New Zealand unlike we did against the US colonists and Catholic Irish
My Canadian daughter in law would challenge your statement that most white Canadians are of white British Ancestry not least as her family are Ukrainian and indeed emigration into Canada came from across Europe
She can challenge it, she would still be wrong. Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles
You say, "Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles". I read that as, "Outside of the big portion of the Canadian population that proves me wrong, certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles".
Let's look at the 2021 Canadian census, where people self-reported specific ethnic or cultural origins. Their answers were Canadian (15.6 percent of the population), followed by English (14.7 percent), Irish (12.1 percent), Scottish (12.1 percent), French (11.0 percent), German (8.1 percent), Chinese (4.7 percent), Italian (4.3 percent), Indian (3.7 percent), and Ukrainian (3.5 percent).
So, English + Scottish = 26.8%. Irish + French + German + Chinese + Italian + Indian + Ukrainian = 47.4%
Last time I checked Irish was British Isles (and includes Northern Irish) and most Canadian ethnicity declarers will be British Isles origin too
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Australia, New Zealand and Canada are all pretty new as countries, but we fought plenty of wars with the peoples of those places.
Australia: Tasmanian War; Hawkesbury and Nepean Wars; Bathurst War; wars of the Liverpool Plains; the Mount Cottrell massacre; Eumeralla Wars
New Zealand: Flagstaff War; 1st Taranaki War; 2nd Taranaki War; East Cape War; Titokowaru's War
Canada: Seven Years' War; the Rebellions of 1837–1838; King William's War
So what? Most Australians, Canadians and New Zealanders are now of white British ancestry and we did not fight them (although we did fight the French at Quebec under Wolfe).
We never even fought a War of Independence against Australia, Canada or New Zealand unlike we did against the US colonists and Catholic Irish
My Canadian daughter in law would challenge your statement that most white Canadians are of white British Ancestry not least as her family are Ukrainian and indeed emigration into Canada came from across Europe
She can challenge it, she would still be wrong. Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles
You say, "Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles". I read that as, "Outside of the big portion of the Canadian population that proves me wrong, certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles".
Let's look at the 2021 Canadian census, where people self-reported specific ethnic or cultural origins. Their answers were Canadian (15.6 percent of the population), followed by English (14.7 percent), Irish (12.1 percent), Scottish (12.1 percent), French (11.0 percent), German (8.1 percent), Chinese (4.7 percent), Italian (4.3 percent), Indian (3.7 percent), and Ukrainian (3.5 percent).
So, English + Scottish = 26.8%. Irish + French + German + Chinese + Italian + Indian + Ukrainian = 47.4%
Last time I checked Irish was British Isles (and includes Northern Irish) and most Canadian ethnicity declarers will be British Isles origin too.
Exclude those of French origin in Quebec and even exclude those of Irish origin and you get English and Scottish 27%, German, Chinese, Italian, Indian and Ukranian 25%
But we're talking about the UK and its relationship to Canada v Europe, not about the British Isles's.
Yes and Ireland is sui generis. I wouldn't count Ireland culturally or historically as Europe, historically they were a part of us, who've now divorced us and gone their separate way.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Firstly they are fictional and secondly they did not mainly share the same ethnicity and ancestry as Australia and New Zealand do with the British Isles
Lol. You don't get the point being made at all do you? I was taking your logic to its absurd conclusion. You were comparing wars that happened with countries when Aus/NZ/Can didn't exist. I was taking this argument to its logical conclusion and including countries that never existed to show how silly that was.
Regarding comparing the ethnicity of Narnia to Australia I am lost for words that this debate might actually happen.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Australia, New Zealand and Canada are all pretty new as countries, but we fought plenty of wars with the peoples of those places.
Australia: Tasmanian War; Hawkesbury and Nepean Wars; Bathurst War; wars of the Liverpool Plains; the Mount Cottrell massacre; Eumeralla Wars
New Zealand: Flagstaff War; 1st Taranaki War; 2nd Taranaki War; East Cape War; Titokowaru's War
Canada: Seven Years' War; the Rebellions of 1837–1838; King William's War
So what? Most Australians, Canadians and New Zealanders are now of white British ancestry and we did not fight them (although we did fight the French at Quebec under Wolfe).
We never even fought a War of Independence against Australia, Canada or New Zealand unlike we did against the US colonists and Catholic Irish
My Canadian daughter in law would challenge your statement that most white Canadians are of white British Ancestry not least as her family are Ukrainian and indeed emigration into Canada came from across Europe
She can challenge it, she would still be wrong. Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles
You say, "Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles". I read that as, "Outside of the big portion of the Canadian population that proves me wrong, certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles".
Let's look at the 2021 Canadian census, where people self-reported specific ethnic or cultural origins. Their answers were Canadian (15.6 percent of the population), followed by English (14.7 percent), Irish (12.1 percent), Scottish (12.1 percent), French (11.0 percent), German (8.1 percent), Chinese (4.7 percent), Italian (4.3 percent), Indian (3.7 percent), and Ukrainian (3.5 percent).
So, English + Scottish = 26.8%. Irish + French + German + Chinese + Italian + Indian + Ukrainian = 47.4%
Last time I checked Irish was British Isles (and includes Northern Irish) and most Canadian ethnicity declarers will be British Isles origin too
Doesn't make the Irish British.
Isles of Britain and Ireland is the correct term.
It might be politically correct but it's not very elegant or accurate as there are a lot more than two islands.
Which British isle has the highest population density?
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Australia, New Zealand and Canada are all pretty new as countries, but we fought plenty of wars with the peoples of those places.
Australia: Tasmanian War; Hawkesbury and Nepean Wars; Bathurst War; wars of the Liverpool Plains; the Mount Cottrell massacre; Eumeralla Wars
New Zealand: Flagstaff War; 1st Taranaki War; 2nd Taranaki War; East Cape War; Titokowaru's War
Canada: Seven Years' War; the Rebellions of 1837–1838; King William's War
So what? Most Australians, Canadians and New Zealanders are now of white British ancestry and we did not fight them (although we did fight the French at Quebec under Wolfe).
We never even fought a War of Independence against Australia, Canada or New Zealand unlike we did against the US colonists and Catholic Irish
My Canadian daughter in law would challenge your statement that most white Canadians are of white British Ancestry not least as her family are Ukrainian and indeed emigration into Canada came from across Europe
She can challenge it, she would still be wrong. Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles
You say, "Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles". I read that as, "Outside of the big portion of the Canadian population that proves me wrong, certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles".
Let's look at the 2021 Canadian census, where people self-reported specific ethnic or cultural origins. Their answers were Canadian (15.6 percent of the population), followed by English (14.7 percent), Irish (12.1 percent), Scottish (12.1 percent), French (11.0 percent), German (8.1 percent), Chinese (4.7 percent), Italian (4.3 percent), Indian (3.7 percent), and Ukrainian (3.5 percent).
So, English + Scottish = 26.8%. Irish + French + German + Chinese + Italian + Indian + Ukrainian = 47.4%
Last time I checked Irish was British Isles (and includes Northern Irish) and most Canadian ethnicity declarers will be British Isles origin too
Doesn't make the Irish British.
Isles of Britain and Ireland is the correct term.
It might be politically correct but it's not very elegant or accurate as there are a lot more than two islands.
Other than talking about 'these islands' I don't think they've ever come up with a widely used variant. A wikipedia page on the subject suggests the Republic try to avoid using it, have not managed it entirely consistently, but generally swerve on the issue.
I've never seen 'Isles of Britain and Ireland' in my life before, though it is not awful compared to many other attempts as I'd say it does acknowledge there are many islands besides Great Britain and Ireland themselves, being isles around the main two islands.
At the end of the day it's not incorrect to say Ireland is in the British Isles, since that is the general term used here without suggesting possession (anymore), nor incorrect for Ireland to use their own term, anymore than the French are wrong to not refer to the 'English' Channel.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Australia, New Zealand and Canada are all pretty new as countries, but we fought plenty of wars with the peoples of those places.
Australia: Tasmanian War; Hawkesbury and Nepean Wars; Bathurst War; wars of the Liverpool Plains; the Mount Cottrell massacre; Eumeralla Wars
New Zealand: Flagstaff War; 1st Taranaki War; 2nd Taranaki War; East Cape War; Titokowaru's War
Canada: Seven Years' War; the Rebellions of 1837–1838; King William's War
So what? Most Australians, Canadians and New Zealanders are now of white British ancestry and we did not fight them (although we did fight the French at Quebec under Wolfe).
We never even fought a War of Independence against Australia, Canada or New Zealand unlike we did against the US colonists and Catholic Irish
My Canadian daughter in law would challenge your statement that most white Canadians are of white British Ancestry not least as her family are Ukrainian and indeed emigration into Canada came from across Europe
She can challenge it, she would still be wrong. Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles
You say, "Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles". I read that as, "Outside of the big portion of the Canadian population that proves me wrong, certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles".
Let's look at the 2021 Canadian census, where people self-reported specific ethnic or cultural origins. Their answers were Canadian (15.6 percent of the population), followed by English (14.7 percent), Irish (12.1 percent), Scottish (12.1 percent), French (11.0 percent), German (8.1 percent), Chinese (4.7 percent), Italian (4.3 percent), Indian (3.7 percent), and Ukrainian (3.5 percent).
So, English + Scottish = 26.8%. Irish + French + German + Chinese + Italian + Indian + Ukrainian = 47.4%
Last time I checked Irish was British Isles (and includes Northern Irish) and most Canadian ethnicity declarers will be British Isles origin too
Doesn't make the Irish British.
Isles of Britain and Ireland is the correct term.
It might be politically correct but it's not very elegant or accurate as there are a lot more than two islands.
Which British isle has the highest population density?
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Australia, New Zealand and Canada are all pretty new as countries, but we fought plenty of wars with the peoples of those places.
Australia: Tasmanian War; Hawkesbury and Nepean Wars; Bathurst War; wars of the Liverpool Plains; the Mount Cottrell massacre; Eumeralla Wars
New Zealand: Flagstaff War; 1st Taranaki War; 2nd Taranaki War; East Cape War; Titokowaru's War
Canada: Seven Years' War; the Rebellions of 1837–1838; King William's War
So what? Most Australians, Canadians and New Zealanders are now of white British ancestry and we did not fight them (although we did fight the French at Quebec under Wolfe).
We never even fought a War of Independence against Australia, Canada or New Zealand unlike we did against the US colonists and Catholic Irish
My Canadian daughter in law would challenge your statement that most white Canadians are of white British Ancestry not least as her family are Ukrainian and indeed emigration into Canada came from across Europe
She can challenge it, she would still be wrong. Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles
You say, "Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles". I read that as, "Outside of the big portion of the Canadian population that proves me wrong, certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles".
Let's look at the 2021 Canadian census, where people self-reported specific ethnic or cultural origins. Their answers were Canadian (15.6 percent of the population), followed by English (14.7 percent), Irish (12.1 percent), Scottish (12.1 percent), French (11.0 percent), German (8.1 percent), Chinese (4.7 percent), Italian (4.3 percent), Indian (3.7 percent), and Ukrainian (3.5 percent).
So, English + Scottish = 26.8%. Irish + French + German + Chinese + Italian + Indian + Ukrainian = 47.4%
Last time I checked Irish was British Isles (and includes Northern Irish) and most Canadian ethnicity declarers will be British Isles origin too.
Exclude those of French origin in Quebec and even exclude those of Irish origin and you get English and Scottish 27%, German, Chinese, Italian, Indian and Ukranian 25%
But we're talking about the UK and its relationship to Canada v Europe, not about the British Isles's.
Yes and even on your figures a plurality of Canadians have British Isles not continental European ancestry (indeed probably a majority adding those who say their ethnicity is Canadian)
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Australia, New Zealand and Canada are all pretty new as countries, but we fought plenty of wars with the peoples of those places.
Australia: Tasmanian War; Hawkesbury and Nepean Wars; Bathurst War; wars of the Liverpool Plains; the Mount Cottrell massacre; Eumeralla Wars
New Zealand: Flagstaff War; 1st Taranaki War; 2nd Taranaki War; East Cape War; Titokowaru's War
Canada: Seven Years' War; the Rebellions of 1837–1838; King William's War
So what? Most Australians, Canadians and New Zealanders are now of white British ancestry and we did not fight them (although we did fight the French at Quebec under Wolfe).
We never even fought a War of Independence against Australia, Canada or New Zealand unlike we did against the US colonists and Catholic Irish
My Canadian daughter in law would challenge your statement that most white Canadians are of white British Ancestry not least as her family are Ukrainian and indeed emigration into Canada came from across Europe
She can challenge it, she would still be wrong. Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles
You say, "Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles". I read that as, "Outside of the big portion of the Canadian population that proves me wrong, certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles".
Let's look at the 2021 Canadian census, where people self-reported specific ethnic or cultural origins. Their answers were Canadian (15.6 percent of the population), followed by English (14.7 percent), Irish (12.1 percent), Scottish (12.1 percent), French (11.0 percent), German (8.1 percent), Chinese (4.7 percent), Italian (4.3 percent), Indian (3.7 percent), and Ukrainian (3.5 percent).
So, English + Scottish = 26.8%. Irish + French + German + Chinese + Italian + Indian + Ukrainian = 47.4%
Last time I checked Irish was British Isles (and includes Northern Irish) and most Canadian ethnicity declarers will be British Isles origin too
Doesn't make the Irish British.
Isles of Britain and Ireland is the correct term.
It might be politically correct but it's not very elegant or accurate as there are a lot more than two islands.
Which British isle has the highest population density?
Must be Portsea.
Makes for a good pub quiz question. I did manage to go 35 years without realising Portsmouth was mostly on an island.
IF you REALLY want to piss off Canucks these days, refer to their country as the "Dominion of Canada" or just "the Dominion".
Then follow up by bad-mouthing Canadian bacon . . . which they call "back bacon" for some reason . . .
What are the chances of them ditching the monarchy in the near future?
Very low. Much, much more likely that Australia will do so.
The Australian Labor Party and the Aussie left have been quite republican since the 1975 constitutional crisis when the Whitlam government was kicked out by the Governor General. Whitlam was quite a prominent campaign for the republic in 1999 (oddly enough so too was the Liberal Party's Malcolm Fraser who replaced him and won the election that followed that crisis).
Monarchy/republicanism is pretty much a non-issue in Canada. Its just a part of their tapestry as to what makes them Canadian, without any heat or fire either way.
If it ever happens, it will be more with a shrug than with anger.
Yes. It's part of what distinguishes them from USA. There isn't much to learn in Canadian history, so 1776 and particularly 1812 is firmly imbued.
IF you REALLY want to piss off Canucks these days, refer to their country as the "Dominion of Canada" or just "the Dominion".
Then follow up by bad-mouthing Canadian bacon . . . which they call "back bacon" for some reason . . .
What are the chances of them ditching the monarchy in the near future?
Very low. Much, much more likely that Australia will do so.
The Australian Labor Party and the Aussie left have been quite republican since the 1975 constitutional crisis when the Whitlam government was kicked out by the Governor General. Whitlam was quite a prominent campaign for the republic in 1999 (oddly enough so too was the Liberal Party's Malcolm Fraser who replaced him and won the election that followed that crisis).
Monarchy/republicanism is pretty much a non-issue in Canada. Its just a part of their tapestry as to what makes them Canadian, without any heat or fire either way.
If it ever happens, it will be more with a shrug than with anger.
Yes and the Australian Labor Party cannot even get a clear majority for an aboriginal voice in Parliament let alone the 2/3 of states for a Republic
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Australia, New Zealand and Canada are all pretty new as countries, but we fought plenty of wars with the peoples of those places.
Australia: Tasmanian War; Hawkesbury and Nepean Wars; Bathurst War; wars of the Liverpool Plains; the Mount Cottrell massacre; Eumeralla Wars
New Zealand: Flagstaff War; 1st Taranaki War; 2nd Taranaki War; East Cape War; Titokowaru's War
Canada: Seven Years' War; the Rebellions of 1837–1838; King William's War
So what? Most Australians, Canadians and New Zealanders are now of white British ancestry and we did not fight them (although we did fight the French at Quebec under Wolfe).
We never even fought a War of Independence against Australia, Canada or New Zealand unlike we did against the US colonists and Catholic Irish
My Canadian daughter in law would challenge your statement that most white Canadians are of white British Ancestry not least as her family are Ukrainian and indeed emigration into Canada came from across Europe
She can challenge it, she would still be wrong. Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles
You say, "Outside Quebec certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles". I read that as, "Outside of the big portion of the Canadian population that proves me wrong, certainly most Canadians' ancestry is from the British Isles".
Let's look at the 2021 Canadian census, where people self-reported specific ethnic or cultural origins. Their answers were Canadian (15.6 percent of the population), followed by English (14.7 percent), Irish (12.1 percent), Scottish (12.1 percent), French (11.0 percent), German (8.1 percent), Chinese (4.7 percent), Italian (4.3 percent), Indian (3.7 percent), and Ukrainian (3.5 percent).
So, English + Scottish = 26.8%. Irish + French + German + Chinese + Italian + Indian + Ukrainian = 47.4%
Last time I checked Irish was British Isles (and includes Northern Irish) and most Canadian ethnicity declarers will be British Isles origin too
Doesn't make the Irish British.
Isles of Britain and Ireland is the correct term.
It might be politically correct but it's not very elegant or accurate as there are a lot more than two islands.
Which British isle has the highest population density?
Must be Portsea.
Well done. The natives have to go to Great Britain to visit Ikea and John Lewis, as neither chain has branches on their own island.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Firstly they are fictional and secondly they did not mainly share the same ethnicity and ancestry as Australia and New Zealand do with the British Isles
Lol. You don't get the point being made at all do you? I was taking your logic to its absurd conclusion. You were comparing wars that happened with countries when Aus/NZ/Can didn't exist. I was taking this argument to its logical conclusion and including countries that never existed to show how silly that was.
Regarding comparing the ethnicity of Narnia to Australia I am lost for words that this debate might actually happen.
Why? The whole point is we share closer ethnicity and ancestry with Australia and New Zealand than any other nation on earth.
Who are the nations we now have trade deals with we didn't when in the EU? Australia and New Zealand and Kenya which rather proves the point
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Narnia: founded by British people (established in "The Magician's Nephew"), long history of cultural exchange with Britain ("Lion, Witch, Wardrobe" through to "The Last Battle"), speak English, shared Judaeo-Christian faith, shared veneration of lions
It's happening isn't it? I'm sorry everyone, but it looks like we are going to have a debate on which is more British, Narnia or Australia.
I do like considering just how densely packed certain areas can be, by virtue of more convenient geography and climate, like that map online showing half the world's population in a rather tiny circle encompassing the major population centres of China and India. Or how you could fit like half a million people onto the Isle of Skye instead of 10,000, if it were able to be as densely packed as the GB mainland average.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
Weren't you and Bart talking about wars with France and the Anglo-Dutch wars? We've not fought a war against France or the Netherlands (or Spain, Portugal, Belgium, Denmark, Norway, Sweden, Poland, Malta, Cyprus, Greece, Slovenia etc.) since Australia, Canada and New Zealand became independent.
If you're going to look at a narrow time period for wars against Aus, Can and NZ, you need to apply the same time period to European nations.
Our last battle against France was in 1942.
I did wonder about mentioning the battles against Vichy France. I would contest that, at the time, we did not recognise them as the legitimate French government.
However, Vichy WAS recognized as legitimate French government by Canada up until Normandy invasion, while Australia recognized BOTH Vichy and Free French.
I did not know that. Gosh.
Well, I think Canadian recognition of the Vichy government just goes to show how the UK and Canada have very different international relations/views of the world!
No it just goes to show the influence of the Francophone lobby in Quebec
The Francophone lobby in Quebec... who are part of Canada.
Indeed, the viewpoint of francophone Quebeckers is that THEY are the REAL Canadians.
Note that in Quebec, the Separatism of late 20th century, has given way to the (in Quebec terms) neo-nationalism of today, which rules the roost in la belle province.
BTW (also FYI) in Canada, classic Quebec "nationalism" aiming at the best possible deal conceivable (or even better than that) for Quebec within Confederation, is in almost all federal elections with federal Conservatives. The nationalists of Quebec rejecting the separatist Parti Québécois, for it's leftism and/or (usually both) because nationalists are dubious as to the practicality AND utility of separating from Canada.
Thus the path to power for Conservatives in Canada from John A. Macdonald to Mackenzie King, John Diefenbaker, Brian Mulroney and Stephen Harper: unofficial electoral alliance between the "Aye Ready Aye!" Tories, and equally (small c) conservative but WAY less anglophile Quebec nationalists.
Look for Paul Poilievre doing HIS part to rekindle this old flame.
Aided, one suspects, by being the FIRST Conservative leader of predominately French heritage, or at least first with actual shot at power from sea to shining sea. Mulroney was a Quebecker, and equally fluent/glib in both official languages, but he was of mostly Irish extraction raised anglophone.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Narnia: founded by British people (established in "The Magician's Nephew"), long history of cultural exchange with Britain ("Lion, Witch, Wardrobe" through to "The Last Battle"), speak English, shared Judaeo-Christian faith, shared veneration of lions
It's happening isn't it? I'm sorry everyone, but it looks like we are going to have a debate on which is more British, Narnia or Australia.
I think I deserve to be banned.
All fantasy environments are populated by British people, I see it on TV all the time.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Narnia: founded by British people (established in "The Magician's Nephew"), long history of cultural exchange with Britain ("Lion, Witch, Wardrobe" through to "The Last Battle"), speak English, shared Judaeo-Christian faith, shared veneration of lions
It's happening isn't it? I'm sorry everyone, but it looks like we are going to have a debate on which is more British, Narnia or Australia.
I think I deserve to be banned.
I think we need a discussion as to which is more fictional, Narnia or Australia.
IF you REALLY want to piss off Canucks these days, refer to their country as the "Dominion of Canada" or just "the Dominion".
Then follow up by bad-mouthing Canadian bacon . . . which they call "back bacon" for some reason . . .
What are the chances of them ditching the monarchy in the near future?
Ah, the monarch... King Charles. A man who has more Danish ancestry than British ancestry.
What rubbish, the King has Stuart and Tudor ancestry
There were some pretty long journeys along the family tree to get from them to the Georgians.
James Ists daughter was Elizabeth Stuart whose grandson was George I
Precisely. You don't think that's a rather long journey? Especially when the initial post saying the King has more Danish ancestry, and you're disputing that by pointing to a King who died in the 1620s?
I don't know man, I've not done a DNA test but the Danish is probably closer - from past remembrance the wiki page for the House of Oldenburg, of which the House Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderberg-Glucksberg, our current royal house, is a junior branch of, is described as German with links to Denmark.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Firstly they are fictional and secondly they did not mainly share the same ethnicity and ancestry as Australia and New Zealand do with the British Isles
Lol. You don't get the point being made at all do you? I was taking your logic to its absurd conclusion. You were comparing wars that happened with countries when Aus/NZ/Can didn't exist. I was taking this argument to its logical conclusion and including countries that never existed to show how silly that was.
Regarding comparing the ethnicity of Narnia to Australia I am lost for words that this debate might actually happen.
Why? The whole point is we share closer ethnicity and ancestry with Australia and New Zealand than any other nation on earth.
Who are the nations we now have trade deals with we didn't when in the EU? Australia and New Zealand and Kenya which rather proves the point
I'm not arguing with you on whom we have closer ancestry with. I agree with you.
I can agree with you and still think your argument is daft.
I am pointing out you came out with a daft argument of comparing European wars with non existent wars with non existent countries, which was the case before Australia existed as an independent country. The point I was making is you might as well have made the comparison with Narnia which also didn't and still doesn't exist. It was a nonsense argument even if you may still be right in the overall point you are making.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Narnia: founded by British people (established in "The Magician's Nephew"), long history of cultural exchange with Britain ("Lion, Witch, Wardrobe" through to "The Last Battle"), speak English, shared Judaeo-Christian faith, shared veneration of lions
It's happening isn't it? I'm sorry everyone, but it looks like we are going to have a debate on which is more British, Narnia or Australia.
I think I deserve to be banned.
All fantasy environments are populated by British people, I see it on TV all the time.
Unless it's the prequel trilogy, when it's Australia. The Matrix is obviously set in Australia but nobody notices
Incidentally, next year the Matrix will be 25 years old.
I worry we won't even get to this one before the election, since it has many co-defendents and is a more complex case apparently, but Trump should love this, the ratings would be huge. Now it is official, Trump's trial in Georgia will be televised.
Fulton County Judge Scott McAfee on Tuesday issued an order allowing media organizations to televise the trial of Donald Trump.
With respect to Vichy France, worth noting that at least through 1942, it was NOT clear that it was a 24/7 German puppet. The break point being the Allied invasion of French North Africa that November.
Which both US and UK were eager to achieve by NOT fighting Vichy forces, but instead in cooperation with them. Which lead to collaboration with Darlan, sanctioned by both Churchill and Roosevelt.
Before then, issues such as status of Martinique, St Pierre et Miquelon and the failed Free French attempt to seize Dakar put a premium on maintaining relationship and contacts with Vichy.
After November 1942, increasing control of Nazi Germany and expanded Vichy collaboration and complicity changed the dynamic. And after the liberation of France, few Brits, Americans, Canadians, etc. wished to recall earlier days before "Here's looking at you, kid" entered our collective consciousness.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Firstly they are fictional and secondly they did not mainly share the same ethnicity and ancestry as Australia and New Zealand do with the British Isles
Lol. You don't get the point being made at all do you? I was taking your logic to its absurd conclusion. You were comparing wars that happened with countries when Aus/NZ/Can didn't exist. I was taking this argument to its logical conclusion and including countries that never existed to show how silly that was.
Regarding comparing the ethnicity of Narnia to Australia I am lost for words that this debate might actually happen.
Why? The whole point is we share closer ethnicity and ancestry with Australia and New Zealand than any other nation on earth.
Who are the nations we now have trade deals with we didn't when in the EU? Australia and New Zealand and Kenya which rather proves the point
What about Ireland, for shared ancestry and ethnicity?
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Firstly they are fictional and secondly they did not mainly share the same ethnicity and ancestry as Australia and New Zealand do with the British Isles
Lol. You don't get the point being made at all do you? I was taking your logic to its absurd conclusion. You were comparing wars that happened with countries when Aus/NZ/Can didn't exist. I was taking this argument to its logical conclusion and including countries that never existed to show how silly that was.
Regarding comparing the ethnicity of Narnia to Australia I am lost for words that this debate might actually happen.
Why? The whole point is we share closer ethnicity and ancestry with Australia and New Zealand than any other nation on earth.
Who are the nations we now have trade deals with we didn't when in the EU? Australia and New Zealand and Kenya which rather proves the point
What about Ireland, for shared ancestry and ethnicity?
Heck, they didn't even stick around in the Commonwealth (the link Aus and NZ utilise) and we still let them vote in all our elections as if they are not even foreign nationals even. If that doesn't demonstrate sharing ancestry etc I don't know what does.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Narnia: founded by British people (established in "The Magician's Nephew"), long history of cultural exchange with Britain ("Lion, Witch, Wardrobe" through to "The Last Battle"), speak English, shared Judaeo-Christian faith, shared veneration of lions
It's happening isn't it? I'm sorry everyone, but it looks like we are going to have a debate on which is more British, Narnia or Australia.
I think I deserve to be banned.
Did Briton also transport the scum of its shores (and innards) to Narnia? If so, why not?
For without the traditional, ubiquitous criminal element famed for investing everywhere from Land's End to John o'Groats (and ditto from Epping to Eglwyswrw) then Narnia simply can NOT be truly British!
I worry we won't even get to this one before the election, since it has many co-defendents and is a more complex case apparently, but Trump should love this, the ratings would be huge. Now it is official, Trump's trial in Georgia will be televised.
Fulton County Judge Scott McAfee on Tuesday issued an order allowing media organizations to televise the trial of Donald Trump.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Narnia: founded by British people (established in "The Magician's Nephew"), long history of cultural exchange with Britain ("Lion, Witch, Wardrobe" through to "The Last Battle"), speak English, shared Judaeo-Christian faith, shared veneration of lions
It's happening isn't it? I'm sorry everyone, but it looks like we are going to have a debate on which is more British, Narnia or Australia.
I think I deserve to be banned.
Did Briton also transport the scum of its shores (and innards) to Narnia? If so, why not?
For without the traditional, ubiquitous criminal element famed for investing everywhere from Land's End to John o'Groats (and ditto from Epping to Eglwyswrw) then Narnia simply can NOT be truly British!
These chaps sounds pretty British given some of the sailors we had out in the pacific.
The Telmarines that conquered Narnia were actually humans from Earth. On Earth, a group of pirates who intermarried with women from islands in the Pacific found an island with a cave that had an entrance to Narnian world. https://narnia.fandom.com/wiki/Telmarine
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Firstly they are fictional and secondly they did not mainly share the same ethnicity and ancestry as Australia and New Zealand do with the British Isles
Lol. You don't get the point being made at all do you? I was taking your logic to its absurd conclusion. You were comparing wars that happened with countries when Aus/NZ/Can didn't exist. I was taking this argument to its logical conclusion and including countries that never existed to show how silly that was.
Regarding comparing the ethnicity of Narnia to Australia I am lost for words that this debate might actually happen.
Why? The whole point is we share closer ethnicity and ancestry with Australia and New Zealand than any other nation on earth.
Who are the nations we now have trade deals with we didn't when in the EU? Australia and New Zealand and Kenya which rather proves the point
What about Ireland, for shared ancestry and ethnicity?
If you consider the Normans to be Norse not French, then isn't it the Norse?
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Narnia: founded by British people (established in "The Magician's Nephew"), long history of cultural exchange with Britain ("Lion, Witch, Wardrobe" through to "The Last Battle"), speak English, shared Judaeo-Christian faith, shared veneration of lions
It's happening isn't it? I'm sorry everyone, but it looks like we are going to have a debate on which is more British, Narnia or Australia.
I think I deserve to be banned.
Did Briton also transport the scum of its shores (and innards) to Narnia? If so, why not?
For without the traditional, ubiquitous criminal element famed for investing everywhere from Land's End to John o'Groats (and ditto from Epping to Eglwyswrw) then Narnia simply can NOT be truly British!
Between Narnia and Australia, one is a fantasy land, invented by a Brit and filled with fantastical creatures and juvenile stories. The other is Narnia.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Narnia: founded by British people (established in "The Magician's Nephew"), long history of cultural exchange with Britain ("Lion, Witch, Wardrobe" through to "The Last Battle"), speak English, shared Judaeo-Christian faith, shared veneration of lions
It's happening isn't it? I'm sorry everyone, but it looks like we are going to have a debate on which is more British, Narnia or Australia.
I think I deserve to be banned.
Did Briton also transport the scum of its shores (and innards) to Narnia? If so, why not?
For without the traditional, ubiquitous criminal element famed for investing everywhere from Land's End to John o'Groats (and ditto from Epping to Eglwyswrw) then Narnia simply can NOT be truly British!
These chaps sounds pretty British given some of the sailors we had out in the pacific.
The Telmarines that conquered Narnia were actually humans from Earth. On Earth, a group of pirates who intermarried with women from islands in the Pacific found an island with a cave that had an entrance to Narnian world. https://narnia.fandom.com/wiki/Telmarine
All of a sudden I feel a lot better for being a Star Trek fan. 😀😀😀
I do like considering just how densely packed certain areas can be, by virtue of more convenient geography and climate, like that map online showing half the world's population in a rather tiny circle encompassing the major population centres of China and India. Or how you could fit like half a million people onto the Isle of Skye instead of 10,000, if it were able to be as densely packed as the GB mainland average.
Before its demolition in 1994, it was home to 35,000 people at a population density of 3.5 million per mile.
That would mean that you could fit the entire population of the UK into the Metropolitan Borough of Barnet, and still have a third of it free for parks.
And at that density, you could fit the entire population of the US into New York City.
Three thoughts: In the continuing wars against Indian tribes as the US frontier moved westward, the US Army almost always had Indian allies. Custer, for example, had Crow scouts -- and should have paid more attention to them.
Some of those inter-tribal conflicts continue. For example, not that long ago, the Arizona Hopi asked not to be in the same House district as the Navajo. Those drawing the district lines obliged them, which resulted in a 2nd district, mostly in northwest Arizona, but with a long skinny piece connecting it to the square Hopi reservation, which is mostly surrounded by the Navajo lands. (One more monument to a conflict that has lasted about a thousand years.)
Second, I sometimes like to tease my fellow Americans by reminding them that our first WW II land conflict in the eastern hemisphere began with a surprise attack on a neutral power -- Vichy France.
Third, I have long believed that Americans should try to be better neighbors to the Canadians than they are to us. (Which is not easy.) PM Trudeau is a pain at times, but most ordinary Canadians are great people.
I do like considering just how densely packed certain areas can be, by virtue of more convenient geography and climate, like that map online showing half the world's population in a rather tiny circle encompassing the major population centres of China and India. Or how you could fit like half a million people onto the Isle of Skye instead of 10,000, if it were able to be as densely packed as the GB mainland average.
Before its demolition in 1994, it was home to 35,000 people at a population density of 3.5 million per mile.
That would mean that you could fit the entire population of the UK into the Metropolitan Borough of Barnet, and still have a third of it free for parks.
And at that density, you could fit the entire population of the US into New York City.
The sewer system it would require doesn't bear thinking about.
I do like considering just how densely packed certain areas can be, by virtue of more convenient geography and climate, like that map online showing half the world's population in a rather tiny circle encompassing the major population centres of China and India. Or how you could fit like half a million people onto the Isle of Skye instead of 10,000, if it were able to be as densely packed as the GB mainland average.
Before its demolition in 1994, it was home to 35,000 people at a population density of 3.5 million per mile.
That would mean that you could fit the entire population of the UK into the Metropolitan Borough of Barnet, and still have a third of it free for parks.
And at that density, you could fit the entire population of the US into New York City.
The sewer system it would require doesn't bear thinking about.
I don't think it's a serious suggestion: but it is a remarkable reminder of how densely humans can choose to live.
So, before we get onto the topic of what we do with the boat people from Narnia and whether we should beef up the passport checks in the wardrobe, I will bid you all goodnight.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Firstly they are fictional and secondly they did not mainly share the same ethnicity and ancestry as Australia and New Zealand do with the British Isles
Lol. You don't get the point being made at all do you? I was taking your logic to its absurd conclusion. You were comparing wars that happened with countries when Aus/NZ/Can didn't exist. I was taking this argument to its logical conclusion and including countries that never existed to show how silly that was.
Regarding comparing the ethnicity of Narnia to Australia I am lost for words that this debate might actually happen.
Why? The whole point is we share closer ethnicity and ancestry with Australia and New Zealand than any other nation on earth.
Who are the nations we now have trade deals with we didn't when in the EU? Australia and New Zealand and Kenya which rather proves the point
What about Ireland, for shared ancestry and ethnicity?
There are more of English or Welsh or Scottish ancestry in Australia and New Zealand than there are in the Republic of Ireland
Three thoughts: In the continuing wars against Indian tribes as the US frontier moved westward, the US Army almost always had Indian allies. Custer, for example, had Crow scouts -- and should have paid more attention to them.
Some of those inter-tribal conflicts continue. For example, not that long ago, the Arizona Hopi asked not to be in the same House district as the Navajo. Those drawing the district lines obliged them, which resulted in a 2nd district, mostly in northwest Arizona, but with a long skinny piece connecting it to the square Hopi reservation, which is mostly surrounded by the Navajo lands. (One more monument to a conflict that has lasted about a thousand years.)
Second, I sometimes like to tease my fellow Americans by reminding them that our first WW II land conflict in the eastern hemisphere began with a surprise attack on a neutral power -- Vichy France.
Third, I have long believed that Americans should try to be better neighbors to the Canadians than they are to us. (Which is not easy.) PM Trudeau is a pain at times, but most ordinary Canadians are great people.
Do you have a list of times when he is not a pain?
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Narnia: founded by British people (established in "The Magician's Nephew"), long history of cultural exchange with Britain ("Lion, Witch, Wardrobe" through to "The Last Battle"), speak English, shared Judaeo-Christian faith, shared veneration of lions
It's happening isn't it? I'm sorry everyone, but it looks like we are going to have a debate on which is more British, Narnia or Australia.
I think I deserve to be banned.
Did Briton also transport the scum of its shores (and innards) to Narnia? If so, why not?
For without the traditional, ubiquitous criminal element famed for investing everywhere from Land's End to John o'Groats (and ditto from Epping to Eglwyswrw) then Narnia simply can NOT be truly British!
I think the workaround is that Narnia is a pocket universe accessed thru a portal installed in a wardrobe in the Home Counties . I think the explanation will involve a pencil pushed thru a folded piece of paper whilst quoting from Event Horizon
I do like considering just how densely packed certain areas can be, by virtue of more convenient geography and climate, like that map online showing half the world's population in a rather tiny circle encompassing the major population centres of China and India. Or how you could fit like half a million people onto the Isle of Skye instead of 10,000, if it were able to be as densely packed as the GB mainland average.
I lived in Yung Ho (Yonghe) Taipei County (now Xintaibei) for six years. At that time the most densely populated settlement on Earth. It was OK. The sewers weren't an issue. The 48 hour Chinese operas at the Temples were.
IF you REALLY want to piss off Canucks these days, refer to their country as the "Dominion of Canada" or just "the Dominion".
Then follow up by bad-mouthing Canadian bacon . . . which they call "back bacon" for some reason . . .
What are the chances of them ditching the monarchy in the near future?
Ah, the monarch... King Charles. A man who has more Danish ancestry than British ancestry.
What rubbish, the King has Stuart and Tudor ancestry
There were some pretty long journeys along the family tree to get from them to the Georgians.
James Ists daughter was Elizabeth Stuart whose grandson was George I
Precisely. You don't think that's a rather long journey? Especially when the initial post saying the King has more Danish ancestry, and you're disputing that by pointing to a King who died in the 1620s?
I don't know man, I've not done a DNA test but the Danish is probably closer - from past remembrance the wiki page for the House of Oldenburg, of which the House Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderberg-Glucksberg, our current royal house, is a junior branch of, is described as German with links to Denmark.
Perhaps worth noting, that wife of James VI & I was Queen Anne of . . . wait for it . . . Denmark.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Narnia: founded by British people (established in "The Magician's Nephew"), long history of cultural exchange with Britain ("Lion, Witch, Wardrobe" through to "The Last Battle"), speak English, shared Judaeo-Christian faith, shared veneration of lions
It's happening isn't it? I'm sorry everyone, but it looks like we are going to have a debate on which is more British, Narnia or Australia.
I think I deserve to be banned.
Did Briton also transport the scum of its shores (and innards) to Narnia? If so, why not?
For without the traditional, ubiquitous criminal element famed for investing everywhere from Land's End to John o'Groats (and ditto from Epping to Eglwyswrw) then Narnia simply can NOT be truly British!
I think the workaround is that Narnia is a pocket universe accessed thru a portal installed in a wardrobe in the Home Counties . I think the explanation will involve a pencil pushed thru a folded piece of paper whilst quoting from Event Horizon
Are not Home Counties rather notoriously well- (or rather ill-) stocked with wide boys, land pirates, etc., etc, who richly deserve transportation elsewhere, by means of being shoved head-first through a small crack in the wardrobe?
IF you REALLY want to piss off Canucks these days, refer to their country as the "Dominion of Canada" or just "the Dominion".
Then follow up by bad-mouthing Canadian bacon . . . which they call "back bacon" for some reason . . .
What are the chances of them ditching the monarchy in the near future?
Ah, the monarch... King Charles. A man who has more Danish ancestry than British ancestry.
What rubbish, the King has Stuart and Tudor ancestry
There were some pretty long journeys along the family tree to get from them to the Georgians.
James Ists daughter was Elizabeth Stuart whose grandson was George I
Precisely. You don't think that's a rather long journey? Especially when the initial post saying the King has more Danish ancestry, and you're disputing that by pointing to a King who died in the 1620s?
I don't know man, I've not done a DNA test but the Danish is probably closer - from past remembrance the wiki page for the House of Oldenburg, of which the House Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderberg-Glucksberg, our current royal house, is a junior branch of, is described as German with links to Denmark.
Perhaps worth noting, that wife of James VI & I was Queen Anne of . . . wait for it . . . Denmark.
And the King's grandmother Elizabeth Bowes Lyon was fully English and Scottish
I do like considering just how densely packed certain areas can be, by virtue of more convenient geography and climate, like that map online showing half the world's population in a rather tiny circle encompassing the major population centres of China and India. Or how you could fit like half a million people onto the Isle of Skye instead of 10,000, if it were able to be as densely packed as the GB mainland average.
Before its demolition in 1994, it was home to 35,000 people at a population density of 3.5 million per mile.
That would mean that you could fit the entire population of the UK into the Metropolitan Borough of Barnet, and still have a third of it free for parks.
And at that density, you could fit the entire population of the US into New York City.
The sewer system it would require doesn't bear thinking about.
I don't think it's a serious suggestion: but it is a remarkable reminder of how densely humans can choose to live.
Thesedays many choose that, but with intellectual denseness instead.
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Narnia: founded by British people (established in "The Magician's Nephew"), long history of cultural exchange with Britain ("Lion, Witch, Wardrobe" through to "The Last Battle"), speak English, shared Judaeo-Christian faith, shared veneration of lions
It's happening isn't it? I'm sorry everyone, but it looks like we are going to have a debate on which is more British, Narnia or Australia.
I think I deserve to be banned.
Did Briton also transport the scum of its shores (and innards) to Narnia? If so, why not?
For without the traditional, ubiquitous criminal element famed for investing everywhere from Land's End to John o'Groats (and ditto from Epping to Eglwyswrw) then Narnia simply can NOT be truly British!
I think the workaround is that Narnia is a pocket universe accessed thru a portal installed in a wardrobe in the Home Counties . I think the explanation will involve a pencil pushed thru a folded piece of paper whilst quoting from Event Horizon
Are not Home Counties rather notoriously well- (or rather ill-) stocked with wide boys, land pirates, etc., etc, who richly deserve transportation elsewhere, by means of being shoved head-first through a small crack in the wardrobe?
We fight in European wars - As do they. ANZAC troops literally fought in European wars too, in Gallipoli etc they were embedded with and led by our troops, on our side, rather than against us. Score another one for CANZUK.
Colonisation - Yes we colonised other nations. Including literally the other nations we're talking about, so we're closer to them as we colonised them, the Netherlands never colonised us or vice-versa. Score another one for CANZUK.
To simplify a long discussion, if I can tackle these two?
French, Polish, Belgian and Norwegian military personnel, among others, were embedded with and led by ours in World War II. Since WWII, the UK and France were together for Suez, without CANZUK, while Australia and New Zealand were together with the US for the Vietnam War without us.
In the 2003 invasion of Iraq, we were joined by Australia, but not by Canada and NZ. We were also joined by Albania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Portugal, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Spain, but not by France, Germany, Norway and others.
In NATO's involvement in the Kosovo War, the UK fought along side the French, Italians, Danish, Belgians, Norwegian and Canadian... but there was no AUSNZ involvement.
I'm not seeing a "win" here for CANZUK.
Colonisation... you say the Netherlands never colonised us, although William and Mary comes close. Of course, the Romans did colonise us, as did the Anglo-Saxons.
Name one war we fought against Australia, New Zealand or Canada?
I can name multiple wars we fought against France, Germany and Spain.
We also fought the Dutch in the Anglo Dutch wars, we fought Russia in the Crimea War and indirectly the Cold War and Italy in WW2. Even the Americans we fought the War of Independence and War of 1812 against.
We also now have the Australia and US defence pact we are part of too
Where did you learn your history?
(a) wars of extermination and conquest against the Aboriginals of Australia and Tasmania (b) New_Zealand_Wars (c) wars against the First Nations, with or without French and Dutch involvement, ditto US involvement (d) Red River War
And that is off the top of my head.
Australia, Canada and New Zealand did not exist as independent nations then
So not surprisingly we fought more wars with countries that did exist than we did with countries that didn't exist. Surely that makes us natural allies with Narnia and Atlantis as we have never fought a war with them either.
Firstly they are fictional and secondly they did not mainly share the same ethnicity and ancestry as Australia and New Zealand do with the British Isles
Lol. You don't get the point being made at all do you? I was taking your logic to its absurd conclusion. You were comparing wars that happened with countries when Aus/NZ/Can didn't exist. I was taking this argument to its logical conclusion and including countries that never existed to show how silly that was.
Regarding comparing the ethnicity of Narnia to Australia I am lost for words that this debate might actually happen.
Why? The whole point is we share closer ethnicity and ancestry with Australia and New Zealand than any other nation on earth.
Who are the nations we now have trade deals with we didn't when in the EU? Australia and New Zealand and Kenya which rather proves the point
What about Ireland, for shared ancestry and ethnicity?
There are more of English or Welsh or Scottish ancestry in Australia and New Zealand than there are in the Republic of Ireland
But many, maybe most, British people have some Irish ancestry. I've got plenty, along with English, Welsh and Scottish. Do you not have any?
Comments
They're both Texas and Britain, and Canada, all rolled into one.
Its definitely a much more foreign country than Australia is though, relative to here.
Exclude those of French origin in Quebec and even exclude those of Irish origin and you get English and Scottish 27%, German, Chinese, Italian, Indian and Ukranian 25%
Even the UK maintained quasi-official contacts with Vichy and entered into semi-agreements.
Isles of Britain and Ireland is the correct term.
Then again. The Maritimes are as different again.
English + Scottish + Irish = 38.9%
French + German + Chinese + Italian + Indian + Ukrainian = 35.3%
But yes, the idea that all of Canada or Australia have come from the British isles is a complete myth, though culturally we're similar because of a common ancestor. Australia and Canada have been running immigration rates that absolutely dwarf our own (and our own are pretty high for European standards) which is another reason we're quite like them, in that we're diverse like them now - not they are us, and we're not us anymore either.
Since I left Australia at the turn of the century, their population has gone up by 50%. That's overwhelmingly immigration, and it means that the country is much less demographically British-ancestry than it used to be. So too is Britain too.
And by the way have you even been to Canada and experienced the peoples there?
The Australian Labor Party and the Aussie left have been quite republican since the 1975 constitutional crisis when the Whitlam government was kicked out by the Governor General. Whitlam was quite a prominent campaign for the republic in 1999 (oddly enough so too was the Liberal Party's Malcolm Fraser who replaced him and won the election that followed that crisis).
Monarchy/republicanism is pretty much a non-issue in Canada. Its just a part of their tapestry as to what makes them Canadian, without any heat or fire either way.
If it ever happens, it will be more with a shrug than with anger.
Same if Scotland ever goes its own way.
Regarding comparing the ethnicity of Narnia to Australia I am lost for words that this debate might actually happen.
I've never seen 'Isles of Britain and Ireland' in my life before, though it is not awful compared to many other attempts as I'd say it does acknowledge there are many islands besides Great Britain and Ireland themselves, being isles around the main two islands.
At the end of the day it's not incorrect to say Ireland is in the British Isles, since that is the general term used here without suggesting possession (anymore), nor incorrect for Ireland to use their own term, anymore than the French are wrong to not refer to the 'English' Channel.
It's part of what distinguishes them from USA.
There isn't much to learn in Canadian history, so 1776 and particularly 1812 is firmly imbued.
Who are the nations we now have trade deals with we didn't when in the EU? Australia and New Zealand and Kenya which rather proves the point
I think I deserve to be banned.
James I was not a Tudor.
Note that in Quebec, the Separatism of late 20th century, has given way to the (in Quebec terms) neo-nationalism of today, which rules the roost in la belle province.
BTW (also FYI) in Canada, classic Quebec "nationalism" aiming at the best possible deal conceivable (or even better than that) for Quebec within Confederation, is in almost all federal elections with federal Conservatives. The nationalists of Quebec rejecting the separatist Parti Québécois, for it's leftism and/or (usually both) because nationalists are dubious as to the practicality AND utility of separating from Canada.
Thus the path to power for Conservatives in Canada from John A. Macdonald to Mackenzie King, John Diefenbaker, Brian Mulroney and Stephen Harper: unofficial electoral alliance between the "Aye Ready Aye!" Tories, and equally (small c) conservative but WAY less anglophile Quebec nationalists.
Look for Paul Poilievre doing HIS part to rekindle this old flame.
Aided, one suspects, by being the FIRST Conservative leader of predominately French heritage, or at least first with actual shot at power from sea to shining sea. Mulroney was a Quebecker, and equally fluent/glib in both official languages, but he was of mostly Irish extraction raised anglophone.
I don't know man, I've not done a DNA test but the Danish is probably closer - from past remembrance the wiki page for the House of Oldenburg, of which the House Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderberg-Glucksberg, our current royal house, is a junior branch of, is described as German with links to Denmark.
I can agree with you and still think your argument is daft.
I am pointing out you came out with a daft argument of comparing European wars with non existent wars with non existent countries, which was the case before Australia existed as an independent country. The point I was making is you might as well have made the comparison with Narnia which also didn't and still doesn't exist. It was a nonsense argument even if you may still be right in the overall point you are making.
Incidentally, next year the Matrix will be 25 years old.
Now it is official, Trump's trial in Georgia will be televised.
Fulton County Judge Scott McAfee on Tuesday issued an order allowing media organizations to televise the trial of Donald Trump.
Now we can only hope that his federal trials will be televised as well.
https://nitter.net/RpsAgainstTrump/status/1694113383585312937#m
Which both US and UK were eager to achieve by NOT fighting Vichy forces, but instead in cooperation with them. Which lead to collaboration with Darlan, sanctioned by both Churchill and Roosevelt.
Before then, issues such as status of Martinique, St Pierre et Miquelon and the failed Free French attempt to seize Dakar put a premium on maintaining relationship and contacts with Vichy.
After November 1942, increasing control of Nazi Germany and expanded Vichy collaboration and complicity changed the dynamic. And after the liberation of France, few Brits, Americans, Canadians, etc. wished to recall earlier days before "Here's looking at you, kid" entered our collective consciousness.
(I assume they reciprocate)
For without the traditional, ubiquitous criminal element famed for investing everywhere from Land's End to John o'Groats (and ditto from Epping to Eglwyswrw) then Narnia simply can NOT be truly British!
I would love to see that televised with Trump as an inmate.
The Telmarines that conquered Narnia were actually humans from Earth. On Earth, a group of pirates who intermarried with women from islands in the Pacific found an island with a cave that had an entrance to Narnian world.
https://narnia.fandom.com/wiki/Telmarine
Before its demolition in 1994, it was home to 35,000 people at a population density of 3.5 million per mile.
That would mean that you could fit the entire population of the UK into the Metropolitan Borough of Barnet, and still have a third of it free for parks.
And at that density, you could fit the entire population of the US into New York City.
Some of those inter-tribal conflicts continue. For example, not that long ago, the Arizona Hopi asked not to be in the same House district as the Navajo. Those drawing the district lines obliged them, which resulted in a 2nd district, mostly in northwest Arizona, but with a long skinny piece connecting it to the square Hopi reservation, which is mostly surrounded by the Navajo lands. (One more monument to a conflict that has lasted about a thousand years.)
Second, I sometimes like to tease my fellow Americans by reminding them that our first WW II land conflict in the eastern hemisphere began with a surprise attack on a neutral power -- Vichy France.
Third, I have long believed that Americans should try to be better neighbors to the Canadians than they are to us. (Which is not easy.) PM Trudeau is a pain at times, but most ordinary Canadians are great people.
At that time the most densely populated settlement on Earth.
It was OK.
The sewers weren't an issue.
The 48 hour Chinese operas at the Temples were.
Hurrah!
https://x.com/kaitlancollins/status/1693798103797645575
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12425021/ANDREW-NEIL-Trump-Biden-RFK-conspiracy-theory-dangerous-man-America.html
https://www.politico.com/news/2023/08/22/trump-witness-reversal-testimony-jack-smith-00112355