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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » First of the weekend’s polls sees LAB edge up in ICM/Sunday

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  • Options
    SMukeshSMukesh Posts: 1,650
    Tory MP`s are at risk of throwing their toys out of the pram and just when the polls seemed to narrow a bit last week.

    But it`s also clear that Cameron can`t control his backbenchers and there is a real risk that we would be leaving the EU if he returns to power(still unlikely)
  • Options
    AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    edited February 2014
    Carnyx said:


    AveryLP said:

    AveryLP said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    The poster does make clear there are as many "toffs" on the Labour front bench as the Tory one but then again one can only be a toff if a Tory according to most lefties.
    Labour are nouveaux toffs, Easterross.

    The worst kind.

    In a lovely exchange on Twitter with me this early evening, Nick Watt of Guardian/Observer fame has claimed that no real aristocratic titles have been created since the Act of Union. I am sure Jack W will fully agree and approve.
    I do think this is what all the independence fuss is about.

    Eck clealy has his eye on the Thanage of Banff and Buchan.
    He'd be thrown out of the SNP if he took it! One of the elements of the SNP which I find most interesting (though I am not a member myself) is their self-denying ordinance against accepting peerages. It must be one of the most important factors in driving the Labour Party in Scotland to demented fury, as it instantly immunizes the SNP against one of the most powerful weapons of the Establishment, as well as giving them a head start in the anti-corruption stakes, alongside the far superior performance of the Holyrood parliament. (And in case anyone asks, it is civil servants who award honours in Scotland now.)

    And ... er ... which Act of Union, please? I'd assume 1707 but in view of the way in which Irish peerages were downgraded at one time, I should ask ...

    Carnyx

    How sad that those most disposed to assert the independence of their nation should be so dismissive of its history.

    I feel it will change after the September vote. Fifty thousand pounds a week for the Presidential Suite at a Ryder Cup Hotel doesn't appear too self-denying to me.

    As for the various Acts of Union, we really need oldnat, our formerly resident Scots history teacher back, to explain all. I shall pass on this one.

  • Options
    corporealcorporeal Posts: 2,549
    AveryLP said:

    The OMOV discussion on C4 was quite impressive. Tempted me to sign up to EdM's gang.

    OKC

    1. What is today's date?

    2. How are a watch and a ruler similar? Write down how they are alike

    3. Write down the names of 12 different animals

    4. You are buying £13.45 of groceries at a supermarket till. How much change would you receive back from a £20 note?
    1. Jenny

    2. They measure length and time, I receive complaints about both.

    3. I never kiss and tell, and I think they have me fake names.

    4. As much as they are willing to give me.
  • Options
    EasterrossEasterross Posts: 1,915
    Carnyx said:


    AveryLP said:

    AveryLP said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    The poster does make clear there are as many "toffs" on the Labour front bench as the Tory one but then again one can only be a toff if a Tory according to most lefties.
    Labour are nouveaux toffs, Easterross.

    The worst kind.

    In a lovely exchange on Twitter with me this early evening, Nick Watt of Guardian/Observer fame has claimed that no real aristocratic titles have been created since the Act of Union. I am sure Jack W will fully agree and approve.
    I do think this is what all the independence fuss is about.

    Eck clealy has his eye on the Thanage of Banff and Buchan.
    He'd be thrown out of the SNP if he took it! One of the elements of the SNP which I find most interesting (though I am not a member myself) is their self-denying ordinance against accepting peerages. It must be one of the most important factors in driving the Labour Party in Scotland to demented fury, as it instantly immunizes the SNP against one of the most powerful weapons of the Establishment, as well as giving them a head start in the anti-corruption stakes, alongside the far superior performance of the Holyrood parliament. (And in case anyone asks, it is civil servants who award honours in Scotland now.)

    And ... er ... which Act of Union, please? I'd assume 1707 but in view of the way in which Irish peerages were downgraded at one time, I should ask ...

    By refusing to take Peerages the SNP has denied the Upper House the skills and authority of such people as Winnie Ewing, George Reid, Robert McIntyre, William Wolfe and Gordon Wilson. After all Sir George Reid has everything except a Peerage! He is a Privy Counsellor, former Presiding Officer and in the personal gift of the Monarch, former Lord High Commissioner of the General Assembly of the Church of Scotland and current Lord Lieutenant of Clackmannanshire. If that doesn't put him at the very summit of the Scottish Establishment, I have no idea what does.

    Incidentally I personally think George Reid has been one of the most able Scottish politicians in the past 30 years and he deserves every honour he has received. I would hope he lives long enough to be elevated to the Order of the Thistle.
  • Options
    Danny565 said:

    Mick_Pork said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Toby Helm ‏@tobyhelm 3m

    Labour has 7% lead in new Opinium/Obs poll. Lab 36, n/c. Tories 29, -1. Ukip 17,n/c. Lib Dem 8 n/c. After wobbly poll wk, this more normal.

    I think the tide was starting to turn in the Conservatives' favour, but the 50p move by Labour is starting to eek through now and stopped their rot.
    Could be. I doubt more tory splits and chaos will have helped either.

    I still think last years trend and movements for the May locals were not a fluke and we will see a broadly similar pattern before and after the EU elections. With the crucial difference that when you transpose last years VI trend for labour and the tories into this year that gap between labour and the tories gets far narrower and way more likely to crossover when the softer tory kipper waverers come back after May.

    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/96/UK_opinion_polling_2010-2015.png

    It's possible labour have lost all they can to the kippers but there is still a very big pool of disaffected WWC labour voters that little Ed just doesn't seem to be able to reach so I would tend to think not.

    Needless to say we can safely ignore the lib dems 'movement' since they have been flatlining at 10% since late 2010.
    I think you're right. Contrary to the clueless media's predictions with their demented ravings about how Labour need to appeal more to socalled "Middle England", it's white working-class voters, especially men, who are the weakest part of Labour's voting "coalition" - middle-class Labour voters (especially ones who work in the public sector) tend to be quite satisfied with the party and with Ed Miliband, but there's many more "traditional" Labour voters who feel they don't speak up for the poor anymore and are too interested in cosying up to the rich. Those types of voters are definitely vulnerable to UKIP if they continue to transform themselves into a British Front National (leftwing/statist on economics, rightwing on immigration).
    Another one who does not understand UKIP and continues the insults, do these people not realise the more you insult us the more determined we become? Worked well for Cameron did it not?
  • Options
    AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    edited February 2014
    corporeal said:

    AveryLP said:

    The OMOV discussion on C4 was quite impressive. Tempted me to sign up to EdM's gang.

    OKC

    1. What is today's date?

    2. How are a watch and a ruler similar? Write down how they are alike

    3. Write down the names of 12 different animals

    4. You are buying £13.45 of groceries at a supermarket till. How much change would you receive back from a £20 note?
    1. Jenny

    2. They measure length and time, I receive complaints about both.

    3. I never kiss and tell, and I think they have me fake names.

    4. As much as they are willing to give me.
    I shall be making an appointment for you to meet the consultant psychiatrist immediately, corporeal.

  • Options
    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

  • Options
    Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091

    Danny565 said:

    Mick_Pork said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Toby Helm ‏@tobyhelm 3m

    Labour has 7% lead in new Opinium/Obs poll. Lab 36, n/c. Tories 29, -1. Ukip 17,n/c. Lib Dem 8 n/c. After wobbly poll wk, this more normal.

    I think the tide was starting to turn in the Conservatives' favour, but the 50p move by Labour is starting to eek through now and stopped their rot.
    Could be. I doubt more tory splits and chaos will have helped either.

    I still think last years trend and movements for the May locals were not a fluke and we will see a broadly similar pattern before and after the EU elections. With the crucial difference that when you transpose last years VI trend for labour and the tories into this year that gap between labour and the tories gets far narrower and way more likely to crossover when the softer tory kipper waverers come back after May.

    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/96/UK_opinion_polling_2010-2015.png

    It's possible labour have lost all they can to the kippers but there is still a very big pool of disaffected WWC labour voters that little Ed just doesn't seem to be able to reach so I would tend to think not.

    Needless to say we can safely ignore the lib dems 'movement' since they have been flatlining at 10% since late 2010.
    I think you're right. Contrary to the clueless media's predictions with their demented ravings about how Labour need to appeal more to socalled "Middle England", it's white working-class voters, especially men, who are the weakest part of Labour's voting "coalition" - middle-class Labour voters (especially ones who work in the public sector) tend to be quite satisfied with the party and with Ed Miliband, but there's many more "traditional" Labour voters who feel they don't speak up for the poor anymore and are too interested in cosying up to the rich. Those types of voters are definitely vulnerable to UKIP if they continue to transform themselves into a British Front National (leftwing/statist on economics, rightwing on immigration).
    Another one who does not understand UKIP and continues the insults, do these people not realise the more you insult us the more determined we become? Worked well for Cameron did it not?
    I'm not quite sure how my post was insulting towards UKIP (unless you consider any suggestion that they might support some leftwing policies to be insulting!).
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 40,173
    edited February 2014
    AveryLP said:

    Carnyx said:


    AveryLP said:

    AveryLP said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    The poster does make clear there are as many "toffs" on the Labour front bench as the Tory one but then again one can only be a toff if a Tory according to most lefties.
    Labour are nouveaux toffs, Easterross.

    The worst kind.

    In a lovely exchange on Twitter with me this early evening, Nick Watt of Guardian/Observer fame has claimed that no real aristocratic titles have been created since the Act of Union. I am sure Jack W will fully agree and approve.
    I do think this is what all the independence fuss is about.

    Eck clealy has his eye on the Thanage of Banff and Buchan.
    He'd be thrown out of the SNP if he took it! One of the elements of the SNP which I find most interesting (though I am not a member myself) is their self-denying ordinance against accepting peerages. It must be one of the most important factors in driving the Labour Party in Scotland to demented fury, as it instantly immunizes the SNP against one of the most powerful weapons of the Establishment, as well as giving them a head start in the anti-corruption stakes, alongside the far superior performance of the Holyrood parliament. (And in case anyone asks, it is civil servants who award honours in Scotland now.)

    And ... er ... which Act of Union, please? I'd assume 1707 but in view of the way in which Irish peerages were downgraded at one time, I should ask ...

    Carnyx

    How sad that those most disposed to assert the independence of their nation should be so dismissive of its history.

    I feel it will change after the September vote. Fifty thousand pounds a week for the Presidential Suite at a Ryder Cup Hotel doesn't appear too self-denying to me.

    As for the various Acts of Union, we really need oldnat, our formerly resident Scots history teacher back, to explain all. I shall pass on this one.

    Just asking which Act of Union you meant - the Scots or the Irish one, as genuine interest (in case of some new historical info to learn).

    But the indy supporters can't win. If we were to mention B*********n (1314) there are howls of Braveheartery and 'nasty resentful Scot'. In reality, what's done is done, and we are more interested in looking to the future than to the past. Yet if we do this, we are dismissive of our history. Can't win, can we?

    As for the Ryder Cup, it was 51K if you want to be accurate - but not for a Presidential Suite, but for what was effectively a trade delegation as a whole. Rather different.

  • Options
    AveryLP said:


    Avery

    You may be interested to know that you appeared in a dream of mine.

    Cameron was having a phototstunt at an 'all you can eat for £5' restaurant and you, me and RN had been invited.

    While RN and I had an intelligent conversation you were sycophantically fawning over Cameron and even obsequiously agreeing with him that the revolting food was delicious.

    To drink both you and Cameron were having coke, with unlimited free refills, while RN were going to have a £281 bottle of wine. But we were forbidden from doing this as it might have given a posh image. So we had a bottle of Sauvignan Blanc for £17.50 instead.

    If there are any budding Dr Jungs reading am I in need of a £281 bottle of wine or do I have deeper problems?

  • Options
    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362

    Danny565 said:

    Mick_Pork said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Toby Helm ‏@tobyhelm 3m

    Labour has 7% lead in new Opinium/Obs poll. Lab 36, n/c. Tories 29, -1. Ukip 17,n/c. Lib Dem 8 n/c. After wobbly poll wk, this more normal.

    I think the tide was starting to turn in the Conservatives' favour, but the 50p move by Labour is starting to eek through now and stopped their rot.
    Could be. I doubt more tory splits and chaos will have helped either.

    I still think last years trend and movements for the May locals were not a fluke and we will see a broadly similar pattern before and after the EU elections. With the crucial difference that when you transpose last years VI trend for labour and the tories into this year that gap between labour and the tories gets far narrower and way more likely to crossover when the softer tory kipper waverers come back after May.

    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/96/UK_opinion_polling_2010-2015.png

    It's possible labour have lost all they can to the kippers but there is still a very big pool of disaffected WWC labour voters that little Ed just doesn't seem to be able to reach so I would tend to think not.

    Needless to say we can safely ignore the lib dems 'movement' since they have been flatlining at 10% since late 2010.
    I think you're right. Contrary to the clueless media's predictions with their demented ravings about how Labour need to appeal more to socalled "Middle England", it's white working-class voters, especially men, who are the weakest part of Labour's voting "coalition" - middle-class Labour voters (especially ones who work in the public sector) tend to be quite satisfied with the party and with Ed Miliband, but there's many more "traditional" Labour voters who feel they don't speak up for the poor anymore and are too interested in cosying up to the rich. Those types of voters are definitely vulnerable to UKIP if they continue to transform themselves into a British Front National (leftwing/statist on economics, rightwing on immigration).
    Another one who does not understand UKIP and continues the insults, do these people not realise the more you insult us the more determined we become? Worked well for Cameron did it not?
    Agree,at the Euro's election,some of my family members who have never voted,will be voting ukip.

  • Options
    SMukeshSMukesh Posts: 1,650

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,295

    AveryLP said:


    Avery

    You may be interested to know that you appeared in a dream of mine.

    Cameron was having a phototstunt at an 'all you can eat for £5' restaurant and you, me and RN had been invited.

    While RN and I had an intelligent conversation you were sycophantically fawning over Cameron and even obsequiously agreeing with him that the revolting food was delicious.

    To drink both you and Cameron were having coke, with unlimited free refills, while RN were going to have a £281 bottle of wine. But we were forbidden from doing this as it might have given a posh image. So we had a bottle of Sauvignan Blanc for £17.50 instead.

    If there are any budding Dr Jungs reading am I in need of a £281 bottle of wine or do I have deeper problems?

    Was the wine nice?
  • Options
    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
  • Options
    Danny565 said:

    Danny565 said:

    Mick_Pork said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Toby Helm ‏@tobyhelm 3m

    Labour has 7% lead in new Opinium/Obs poll. Lab 36, n/c. Tories 29, -1. Ukip 17,n/c. Lib Dem 8 n/c. After wobbly poll wk, this more normal.

    I think the tide was starting to turn in the Conservatives' favour, but the 50p move by Labour is starting to eek through now and stopped their rot.
    Could be. I doubt more tory splits and chaos will have helped either.

    I still think last years trend and movements for the May locals were not a fluke and we will see a broadly similar pattern before and after the EU elections. With the crucial difference that when you transpose last years VI trend for labour and the tories into this year that gap between labour and the tories gets far narrower and way more likely to crossover when the softer tory kipper waverers come back after May.

    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/96/UK_opinion_polling_2010-2015.png

    It's possible labour have lost all they can to the kippers but there is still a very big pool of disaffected WWC labour voters that little Ed just doesn't seem to be able to reach so I would tend to think not.

    Needless to say we can safely ignore the lib dems 'movement' since they have been flatlining at 10% since late 2010.
    I think you're right. Contrary to the clueless media's predictions with their demented ravings about how Labour need to appeal more to socalled "Middle England", it's white working-class voters, especially men, who are the weakest part of Labour's voting "coalition" - middle-class Labour voters (especially ones who work in the public sector) tend to be quite satisfied with the party and with Ed Miliband, but there's many more "traditional" Labour voters who feel they don't speak up for the poor anymore and are too interested in cosying up to the rich. Those types of voters are definitely vulnerable to UKIP if they continue to transform themselves into a British Front National (leftwing/statist on economics, rightwing on immigration).
    Another one who does not understand UKIP and continues the insults, do these people not realise the more you insult us the more determined we become? Worked well for Cameron did it not?
    I'm not quite sure how my post was insulting towards UKIP (unless you consider any suggestion that they might support some leftwing policies to be insulting!).
    That bit was insulting enough! The British Front National part is just wrong
  • Options
    EasterrossEasterross Posts: 1,915
    AveryLP said:

    Carnyx said:


    AveryLP said:

    AveryLP said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    The poster does make clear there are as many "toffs" on the Labour front bench as the Tory one but then again one can only be a toff if a Tory according to most lefties.
    Labour are nouveaux toffs, Easterross.

    The worst kind.

    In a lovely exchange on Twitter with me this early evening, Nick Watt of Guardian/Observer fame has claimed that no real aristocratic titles have been created since the Act of Union. I am sure Jack W will fully agree and approve.
    I do think this is what all the independence fuss is about.

    Eck clealy has his eye on the Thanage of Banff and Buchan.
    He'd be thrown out of the SNP if he took it! One of the elements of the SNP which I find most interesting (though I am not a member myself) is their self-denying ordinance against accepting peerages. It must be one of the most important factors in driving the Labour Party in Scotland to demented fury, as it instantly immunizes the SNP against one of the most powerful weapons of the Establishment, as well as giving them a head start in the anti-corruption stakes, alongside the far superior performance of the Holyrood parliament. (And in case anyone asks, it is civil servants who award honours in Scotland now.)

    And ... er ... which Act of Union, please? I'd assume 1707 but in view of the way in which Irish peerages were downgraded at one time, I should ask ...

    Carnyx

    How sad that those most disposed to assert the independence of their nation should be so dismissive of its history.

    I feel it will change after the September vote. Fifty thousand pounds a week for the Presidential Suite at a Ryder Cup Hotel doesn't appear too self-denying to me.

    As for the various Acts of Union, we really need oldnat, our formerly resident Scots history teacher back, to explain all. I shall pass on this one.

    The reference was to 1707 when they ceased to grant Scottish or English peerages and started granting Great Britain peerages.
  • Options
    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Isn't Ed?
  • Options
    EasterrossEasterross Posts: 1,915
    SMukesh said:

    Tory MP`s are at risk of throwing their toys out of the pram and just when the polls seemed to narrow a bit last week.

    But it`s also clear that Cameron can`t control his backbenchers and there is a real risk that we would be leaving the EU if he returns to power(still unlikely)

    We would only be leaving the EU IF the British people voted for it in the Referendum Labour and the LibDems are terrified of giving the people.
  • Options
    SMukeshSMukesh Posts: 1,650

    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    I notice the leaflet which has photos of current and retired Labour leaders talks of the rich not caring about the poor.So just wondered whether Farage with his banking background is rich or poor?
  • Options
    SMukeshSMukesh Posts: 1,650

    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Isn't Ed?
    So I guess that just leaves Mother Theresa and Mahatma Gandhi to be Labour leaders then?
  • Options
    rcs1000 said:

    AveryLP said:


    Avery

    You may be interested to know that you appeared in a dream of mine.

    Cameron was having a phototstunt at an 'all you can eat for £5' restaurant and you, me and RN had been invited.

    While RN and I had an intelligent conversation you were sycophantically fawning over Cameron and even obsequiously agreeing with him that the revolting food was delicious.

    To drink both you and Cameron were having coke, with unlimited free refills, while RN were going to have a £281 bottle of wine. But we were forbidden from doing this as it might have given a posh image. So we had a bottle of Sauvignan Blanc for £17.50 instead.

    If there are any budding Dr Jungs reading am I in need of a £281 bottle of wine or do I have deeper problems?

    Was the wine nice?
    It was standard restaurant Sauvignan Blanc.

    Fortunately I don't have a very refined wine tasting palate so I can satisfy my needs on the cheaper varieties. While I appreciated that Australian Shiraz SeanT raved about I didn't think it merited the extra cost over a sub £10 bottle.

    On a wider note are there any others who have had PBers appear in dreams ?
  • Options
    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    Lord Ashcroft ‏@LordAshcroft 35m
    Opinium /Observer poll LAB 36% CON 29% UKIP 17% LDEM 8%
  • Options
    MikeK said:

    Lord Ashcroft ‏@LordAshcroft 35m
    Opinium /Observer poll LAB 36% CON 29% UKIP 17% LDEM 8%

    Con/UKIP 46%
    Progressives 44%
  • Options
    What is the point of the Wisdom Index? Given that the public know almost nothing about politics, it might be better labelled the Haven't a Scooby Index.

  • Options
    Am I the only one still smarting from the rugby? Horrible
  • Options
    EasterrossEasterross Posts: 1,915

    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    Bit rich from a Kipper given that the party is funded by the fat expense accounts and salaries Kipper MEPs draw from Brussels for doing very little given how rarely Farage et al seem to bother turning up and voting etc. Farage, the man who said women are worth less pay than male colleagues is far from in touch with "ordinary" people.
  • Options

    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    Bit rich from a Kipper given that the party is funded by the fat expense accounts and salaries Kipper MEPs draw from Brussels for doing very little given how rarely Farage et al seem to bother turning up and voting etc. Farage, the man who said women are worth less pay than male colleagues is far from in touch with "ordinary" people.
    So is Boris Johnson, so why do the public love them?
  • Options

    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    Bit rich from a Kipper given that the party is funded by the fat expense accounts and salaries Kipper MEPs draw from Brussels for doing very little given how rarely Farage et al seem to bother turning up and voting etc. Farage, the man who said women are worth less pay than male colleagues is far from in touch with "ordinary" people.
    Didn't he actually say that women who take periods out of their careers for maternity leave, and then want to work part-time or term-time-only, are less valuable to their employers? Makes sense to me. What then happens is that society steps in and says: you still have to pay them the same, though.

  • Options

    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    Bit rich from a Kipper given that the party is funded by the fat expense accounts and salaries Kipper MEPs draw from Brussels for doing very little given how rarely Farage et al seem to bother turning up and voting etc. Farage, the man who said women are worth less pay than male colleagues is far from in touch with "ordinary" people.
    Desperate garbage from the Tory lickspittle.

    That must be why your party is drifting towards electoral slaughter whilst UKIP continues to grow.

    The party is funded just like any other party - primarily by donations. Of course in the case of UKIP those donations come from across the spectrum from people rich and poor who want better for their country. In your case they come from those trying to buy influence.
  • Options
    JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,913
    edited February 2014


    So is Boris Johnson, so why do the public love them?

    People love Jedward, but you don't want them in govt.
  • Options
    surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    30% - 32% seems to be the core Tory vote. They are the ones who support the 45% tax break for rich people.

    The vast majority of Tories do not earn £150k but they do believe that for the rich to work, they must be taxed less.

    They also believe that for the less well off to work they must be paid less !

    They are also against subsidies except , guess what, for farmers ! They are also against subsidies for wind, solar energy systems. But they are for subsidies to nuclear power plants even if the Chinese are involved.

    Strange people, these hard core Tory types !
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    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362

    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    Bit rich from a Kipper given that the party is funded by the fat expense accounts and salaries Kipper MEPs draw from Brussels for doing very little given how rarely Farage et al seem to bother turning up and voting etc. Farage, the man who said women are worth less pay than male colleagues is far from in touch with "ordinary" people.
    UKIP want out of the EU,can't be said of the 3 other main parties,so they fat expense accounts and salaries of the con/lib/lab MEP's will carry on.



  • Options
    So far this by election in my part of Manchester i have received 5 leaflets.1 each from labour and the Tories all via the postie. 3 from ukip,1 via the postman and 2 hand delivered, the most recent one the "meet labours millionaires" one.
    Only came across 1 building with window posters and this was the Crown pub Northenden and the posters were vote loony!
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    surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549

    What is the point of the Wisdom Index? Given that the public know almost nothing about politics, it might be better labelled the Haven't a Scooby Index.

    Isn't it the case, the "public" correctly forecast the winner in every general election since the war. I once read an academic paper when at University. I am talking about the late 70's.

    THe public can correctly distinguish who would "win" the election from which party they would vote for.

  • Options
    surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    MikeK said:

    Lord Ashcroft ‏@LordAshcroft 35m
    Opinium /Observer poll LAB 36% CON 29% UKIP 17% LDEM 8%

    Oh dear ! Compouter will have to carry the goal posts for some more time for Avery.

    Avery, typically of a Tory, let's someone else do the work !
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    SMukeshSMukesh Posts: 1,650
    From Wiki

    ` In May 2009, The Guardian reported a Foreign Press Association speech given by Farage in which he had said that over his period as a Member of the European Parliament he had received £2 million of taxpayers' money in staff, travel, and other expenses in addition to his £64,000 annual salary.`

    `
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    EasterrossEasterross Posts: 1,915
    Gosh if the Kippers are getting upset at a little criticism from me, goodness what they will be like when we really turn on them in the coming weeks.

    Kippers in tune with the public. One blames floods on gay marriage, another calls women whores, their leader devalues women in the workplace and of course how many are left of those MEPs elected 5 years ago? 9 out of 13 isn't it. Their Scottish party has collapsed in infighting and at the byelection in Cowdenbeath last month the Tory candidate scored almost double UKIP and the LibDem combined.
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    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362

    Gosh if the Kippers are getting upset at a little criticism from me, goodness what they will be like when we really turn on them in the coming weeks.

    Kippers in tune with the public. One blames floods on gay marriage, another calls women whores, their leader devalues women in the workplace and of course how many are left of those MEPs elected 5 years ago? 9 out of 13 isn't it. Their Scottish party has collapsed in infighting and at the byelection in Cowdenbeath last month the Tory candidate scored almost double UKIP and the LibDem combined.

    It seemed that you were upset with my post,my criticism of labours millionaires.

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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 36,013

    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    Bit rich from a Kipper given that the party is funded by the fat expense accounts and salaries Kipper MEPs draw from Brussels for doing very little given how rarely Farage et al seem to bother turning up and voting etc. Farage, the man who said women are worth less pay than male colleagues is far from in touch with "ordinary" people.
    If our enemies hand us a weapon, we should use it.

    Farage was spot-on in his comments about equal pay.
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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 36,013

    Gosh if the Kippers are getting upset at a little criticism from me, goodness what they will be like when we really turn on them in the coming weeks.

    Kippers in tune with the public. One blames floods on gay marriage, another calls women whores, their leader devalues women in the workplace and of course how many are left of those MEPs elected 5 years ago? 9 out of 13 isn't it. Their Scottish party has collapsed in infighting and at the byelection in Cowdenbeath last month the Tory candidate scored almost double UKIP and the LibDem combined.

    But, no Kipper is about to tried for rape, or get arrested for child molestation

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    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    SMukesh said:

    From Wiki

    ` In May 2009, The Guardian reported a Foreign Press Association speech given by Farage in which he had said that over his period as a Member of the European Parliament he had received £2 million of taxpayers' money in staff, travel, and other expenses in addition to his £64,000 annual salary.`

    `

    Again,ukip want out,so that will stop,your party wants to stay on the EU gravy train and keep the expenses/salaries.

    What don't you get.
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    NinoinozNinoinoz Posts: 1,312

    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    Bit rich from a Kipper given that the party is funded by the fat expense accounts and salaries Kipper MEPs draw from Brussels for doing very little given how rarely Farage et al seem to bother turning up and voting etc.
    This upsets you? Support withdrawal from the EU then.

    Also, it looks like their numbers will increase after May, whereas the Tories' numbers will decrease.

    So, the public doesn't seem to care a jot.
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    surbiton said:


    MikeK said:

    Lord Ashcroft ‏@LordAshcroft 35m
    Opinium /Observer poll LAB 36% CON 29% UKIP 17% LDEM 8%

    Oh dear ! Compouter will have to carry the goal posts for some more time for Avery.

    Avery, typically of a Tory, let's someone else do the work !
    At this rate the crossover will be Tory and UKIP
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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 36,013
    Ninoinoz said:


    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    Bit rich from a Kipper given that the party is funded by the fat expense accounts and salaries Kipper MEPs draw from Brussels for doing very little given how rarely Farage et al seem to bother turning up and voting etc.
    This upsets you? Support withdrawal from the EU then.

    Also, it looks like their numbers will increase after May, whereas the Tories' numbers will decrease.

    So, the public doesn't seem to care a jot.
    The real prize is to get councillors elected at the same time.
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    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    Bit rich from a Kipper given that the party is funded by the fat expense accounts and salaries Kipper MEPs draw from Brussels for doing very little given how rarely Farage et al seem to bother turning up and voting etc. Farage, the man who said women are worth less pay than male colleagues is far from in touch with "ordinary" people.
    Desperate garbage from the Tory lickspittle.

    That must be why your party is drifting towards electoral slaughter whilst UKIP continues to grow.

    The party is funded just like any other party - primarily by donations. Of course in the case of UKIP those donations come from across the spectrum from people rich and poor who want better for their country. In your case they come from those trying to buy influence.
    The irony of a Scottish Tory accusing others of not being in touch with ordinary people is choice.

    If anyone wants a laugh they could dig out Easterross's election predictions from 2010.

    As I remember he had a few bets with tim involving dinners and bottles of wine depending upon the number of Scottish Tory gains.

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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Sean_F said:

    Gosh if the Kippers are getting upset at a little criticism from me, goodness what they will be like when we really turn on them in the coming weeks.

    Kippers in tune with the public. One blames floods on gay marriage, another calls women whores, their leader devalues women in the workplace and of course how many are left of those MEPs elected 5 years ago? 9 out of 13 isn't it. Their Scottish party has collapsed in infighting and at the byelection in Cowdenbeath last month the Tory candidate scored almost double UKIP and the LibDem combined.

    But, no Kipper is about to tried for rape, or get arrested for child molestation

    While that may be factually accurate, it's a bit inappropriate to try and imply that one or other political party is associated with or condones that kind of behaviour any more than any of the others.
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    NinoinozNinoinoz Posts: 1,312
    Sean_F said:

    Ninoinoz said:


    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    Bit rich from a Kipper given that the party is funded by the fat expense accounts and salaries Kipper MEPs draw from Brussels for doing very little given how rarely Farage et al seem to bother turning up and voting etc.
    This upsets you? Support withdrawal from the EU then.

    Also, it looks like their numbers will increase after May, whereas the Tories' numbers will decrease.

    So, the public doesn't seem to care a jot.
    The real prize is to get councillors elected at the same time.
    Yes, I've been waiting for someone to bring that up.

    There have been articles online elsewhere and comments on this site of the if-UKIP-beat-Tories-in-Euros-then-they-will-go-into-meltdown variety. This may well be true, but I doubt it as the European Parliament wields little real power.

    However, there are local elections taking place on the same day.

    Now, if many Tory councillors lose their seats either to UKIP or because of UKIP and worse, lose councils due to UKIP, then the Tories have my express permission to go into meltdown.
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    volcanopetevolcanopete Posts: 2,078
    Although you would not believe it from this thread but Tory activists want to get in bed with UKIP.

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/feb/01/ukip-conservative-nigel-farage-anti-eu
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    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,850
    Baroness Morgan eh!

    The BBC featuring her wailing must mean that she's a pillar of society that somehow I'd failed to encounter before. Checking though it seems not. The wonder of the thing is that she was ever appointed, rather than she was sacked.

    The House of Lords is now the joke that its critics always said it was. It's been turned into that by these ludicrous appointments of token political hangers-on to the chamber.

    Her claims that the Tories are replacing Labour appointees are probably true - the Labour appointees are so ridiculously bad. The Tory ones will be awful too mind you.

    All these dreadful appointees should go. Their jobs should be abolished too. It's pretty hard to see that they actually do anything.

    So please, the next Lord in the street you happen to pass, bump into them, ridicule their ermin, and speak away from their ear-trumpets!

    O
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    corporealcorporeal Posts: 2,549
    surbiton said:

    What is the point of the Wisdom Index? Given that the public know almost nothing about politics, it might be better labelled the Haven't a Scooby Index.

    Isn't it the case, the "public" correctly forecast the winner in every general election since the war. I once read an academic paper when at University. I am talking about the late 70's.

    THe public can correctly distinguish who would "win" the election from which party they would vote for.

    I imagine the logic might be that you get people giving their feeling of the national mood from their social circle and these overlapping glimpses add up to an averaged out accurate picture.

    I think it had enough basis that they decided it was worth an experiment and see if the results come out with anything useful.
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    Charles said:

    Sean_F said:

    Gosh if the Kippers are getting upset at a little criticism from me, goodness what they will be like when we really turn on them in the coming weeks.

    Kippers in tune with the public. One blames floods on gay marriage, another calls women whores, their leader devalues women in the workplace and of course how many are left of those MEPs elected 5 years ago? 9 out of 13 isn't it. Their Scottish party has collapsed in infighting and at the byelection in Cowdenbeath last month the Tory candidate scored almost double UKIP and the LibDem combined.

    But, no Kipper is about to tried for rape, or get arrested for child molestation

    While that may be factually accurate, it's a bit inappropriate to try and imply that one or other political party is associated with or condones that kind of behaviour any more than any of the others.
    Perfectly good defence though.
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    EasterrossEasterross Posts: 1,915

    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    Bit rich from a Kipper given that the party is funded by the fat expense accounts and salaries Kipper MEPs draw from Brussels for doing very little given how rarely Farage et al seem to bother turning up and voting etc. Farage, the man who said women are worth less pay than male colleagues is far from in touch with "ordinary" people.
    Desperate garbage from the Tory lickspittle.

    That must be why your party is drifting towards electoral slaughter whilst UKIP continues to grow.

    The party is funded just like any other party - primarily by donations. Of course in the case of UKIP those donations come from across the spectrum from people rich and poor who want better for their country. In your case they come from those trying to buy influence.
    The irony of a Scottish Tory accusing others of not being in touch with ordinary people is choice.

    If anyone wants a laugh they could dig out Easterross's election predictions from 2010.

    As I remember he had a few bets with tim involving dinners and bottles of wine depending upon the number of Scottish Tory gains.

    I had no bets with anyone in 2010 or at any other time and especially not with the so called wine selling Cheshire farmer. At least I had the guts to predict election results and got the ultimate number of LibDems almost bang on when everyone else was getting carried away with Cleggasms. I would remind you there were 412,000 Tory voters in Scotland in 2010 and in the last year we have been picking up votes in real elections in Scotland and contrary to the expectations of almost all PBers captured a safe LibDem council seat in the Borders in a byelection.
  • Options
    NinoinozNinoinoz Posts: 1,312
    Charles said:

    Sean_F said:

    Gosh if the Kippers are getting upset at a little criticism from me, goodness what they will be like when we really turn on them in the coming weeks.

    Kippers in tune with the public. One blames floods on gay marriage, another calls women whores, their leader devalues women in the workplace and of course how many are left of those MEPs elected 5 years ago? 9 out of 13 isn't it. Their Scottish party has collapsed in infighting and at the byelection in Cowdenbeath last month the Tory candidate scored almost double UKIP and the LibDem combined.

    But, no Kipper is about to tried for rape, or get arrested for child molestation

    While that may be factually accurate, it's a bit inappropriate to try and imply that one or other political party is associated with or condones that kind of behaviour any more than any of the others.
    Why?

    Incidentally, I haven't seen child abuse reported in the comparative way you suggest, except by David Steel when questioned about Cyril Smith.
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    corporealcorporeal Posts: 2,549
    Charles said:

    Sean_F said:

    Gosh if the Kippers are getting upset at a little criticism from me, goodness what they will be like when we really turn on them in the coming weeks.

    Kippers in tune with the public. One blames floods on gay marriage, another calls women whores, their leader devalues women in the workplace and of course how many are left of those MEPs elected 5 years ago? 9 out of 13 isn't it. Their Scottish party has collapsed in infighting and at the byelection in Cowdenbeath last month the Tory candidate scored almost double UKIP and the LibDem combined.

    But, no Kipper is about to tried for rape, or get arrested for child molestation

    While that may be factually accurate, it's a bit inappropriate to try and imply that one or other political party is associated with or condones that kind of behaviour any more than any of the others.
    My personal opinion on the Rennard side of things is that the political world houses a lot more sexual harrassment than anyone wants to acknowledge, on all sides.

    Obviously since Rennard's the case that hit the headlines etc, this may come across as trying to shift focus away from the Lib Dems but it really isn't. I think it goes on a lot and is kept pretty quiet.
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    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    edited February 2014

    Although you would not believe it from this thread but Tory activists want to get in bed with UKIP.

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/feb/01/ukip-conservative-nigel-farage-anti-eu

    If Cameron as another week in the commons as last week with PMQ's,foreign crims and in the lords with his EU referendum,then getting in bed with ukip,alot of the tory activists will be joining ukip ;-)
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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 36,013
    Charles said:

    Sean_F said:

    Gosh if the Kippers are getting upset at a little criticism from me, goodness what they will be like when we really turn on them in the coming weeks.

    Kippers in tune with the public. One blames floods on gay marriage, another calls women whores, their leader devalues women in the workplace and of course how many are left of those MEPs elected 5 years ago? 9 out of 13 isn't it. Their Scottish party has collapsed in infighting and at the byelection in Cowdenbeath last month the Tory candidate scored almost double UKIP and the LibDem combined.

    But, no Kipper is about to tried for rape, or get arrested for child molestation

    While that may be factually accurate, it's a bit inappropriate to try and imply that one or other political party is associated with or condones that kind of behaviour any more than any of the others.
    That is correct, but it's a legitimate response to those who try to argue (from one of the big three) that somehow UKIP is morally reprehensible. Take the beam out of one's own eye before removing the mote from another's.

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    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    More proof that on immigration and it's effects, the Coalition is continuing the sorry story of Labour lies and cover-ups.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/conservative/10597409/Home-Office-hid-dossier-on-EU-migrants.html

    Cammo and co, with all the power of the law in their hands, are looking ever more pathetic.
  • Options

    Gosh if the Kippers are getting upset at a little criticism from me, goodness what they will be like when we really turn on them in the coming weeks.

    Kippers in tune with the public. One blames floods on gay marriage, another calls women whores, their leader devalues women in the workplace and of course how many are left of those MEPs elected 5 years ago? 9 out of 13 isn't it. Their Scottish party has collapsed in infighting and at the byelection in Cowdenbeath last month the Tory candidate scored almost double UKIP and the LibDem combined.

    Hmm. Yes. A UKIP (and until very recently Tory) councillor makes stupid claims about the weather being a punishment from God because of Gay Marriage and UKIP promptly suspend him. I note the Tories didn't suspend him whilst he was making similarly offensive comments about gays as a Tory councillor.

    Another Tory councillor leaves phone messages for a gay opponent hoping that they die of Aids and the Tories do... nothing. He is still a councillor whilst the opponent he so insulted felt compelled to resign.

    Says just about all you need to know about the hypocritical Tories.
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    NinoinozNinoinoz Posts: 1,312

    Although you would not believe it from this thread but Tory activists want to get in bed with UKIP.

    Do you mean literally or figuratively?

    Either way, my answer is no.
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    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    Bit rich from a Kipper given that the party is funded by the fat expense accounts and salaries Kipper MEPs draw from Brussels for doing very little given how rarely Farage et al seem to bother turning up and voting etc. Farage, the man who said women are worth less pay than male colleagues is far from in touch with "ordinary" people.
    Think you are getting mixed up with the Koran
  • Options



    The irony of a Scottish Tory accusing others of not being in touch with ordinary people is choice.

    If anyone wants a laugh they could dig out Easterross's election predictions from 2010.

    As I remember he had a few bets with tim involving dinners and bottles of wine depending upon the number of Scottish Tory gains.

    I had no bets with anyone in 2010 or at any other time and especially not with the so called wine selling Cheshire farmer. At least I had the guts to predict election results and got the ultimate number of LibDems almost bang on when everyone else was getting carried away with Cleggasms. I would remind you there were 412,000 Tory voters in Scotland in 2010 and in the last year we have been picking up votes in real elections in Scotland and contrary to the expectations of almost all PBers captured a safe LibDem council seat in the Borders in a byelection.
    Really ? Perhaps my memory is playing up but I seem to remember you offering tim some betting opportunities - the phrase 'diner with Easterross in Easterross' being in my mind.

    As to the LibDems from 2008 you predicted disaster for them at the next general election and I'll also point out that not everyone got carried away by the Cleggasm, it certainly provided excellent betting opportunities regarding Harrogate, Cambourne, Montgomershire and Newton Abbot.

    And I wouldn't bother attempting to big up Scottish Tory election performances because they're crap, that all you've got to boast about is some local council byelection in a rural area proves it.
  • Options
    saddenedsaddened Posts: 2,245

    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    Bit rich from a Kipper given that the party is funded by the fat expense accounts and salaries Kipper MEPs draw from Brussels for doing very little given how rarely Farage et al seem to bother turning up and voting etc. Farage, the man who said women are worth less pay than male colleagues is far from in touch with "ordinary" people.
    Think you are getting mixed up with the Koran
    Crap like this is why UKIP, despite the best efforts of its brighter members, will remain a laughing stock.
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    NeilNeil Posts: 7,983
    MikeK said:

    More proof that on immigration and it's effects, the Coalition is continuing the sorry story of Labour lies and cover-ups.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/conservative/10597409/Home-Office-hid-dossier-on-EU-migrants.html

    Cammo and co, with all the power of the law in their hands, are looking ever more pathetic.

    You've fallen for the spin someone wanted to put on a document. It's been reported for ages that this report has been delayed for months precisely because it fails to makes the case against immigration that May wanted. Let's wait to see it in full rather than just the bits spoon fed to the Telegraph by people with an agenda.
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    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    saddened said:

    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    Bit rich from a Kipper given that the party is funded by the fat expense accounts and salaries Kipper MEPs draw from Brussels for doing very little given how rarely Farage et al seem to bother turning up and voting etc. Farage, the man who said women are worth less pay than male colleagues is far from in touch with "ordinary" people.
    Think you are getting mixed up with the Koran
    Crap like this is why UKIP, despite the best efforts of its brighter members, will remain a laughing stock.
    Frightened by a perfectly legit leaflet, Saddened?
  • Options
    EasterrossEasterross Posts: 1,915
    The last thing most of us wish for is a pact with UKIP. Some misguided Tories may think it a good idea. A pact with the LibDems makes more sense. We have more in common with them and even that is very little.
  • Options
    MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699

    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    Bit rich from a Kipper given that the party is funded by the fat expense accounts and salaries Kipper MEPs draw from Brussels for doing very little given how rarely Farage et al seem to bother turning up and voting etc. Farage, the man who said women are worth less pay than male colleagues is far from in touch with "ordinary" people.
    Desperate garbage from the Tory lickspittle.

    That must be why your party is drifting towards electoral slaughter whilst UKIP continues to grow.

    The party is funded just like any other party - primarily by donations. Of course in the case of UKIP those donations come from across the spectrum from people rich and poor who want better for their country. In your case they come from those trying to buy influence.
    The irony of a Scottish Tory accusing others of not being in touch with ordinary people is choice.

    If anyone wants a laugh they could dig out Easterross's election predictions from 2010.

    As I remember he had a few bets with tim involving dinners and bottles of wine depending upon the number of Scottish Tory gains.

    I had no bets with anyone in 2010 or at any other time and especially not with the so called wine selling Cheshire farmer. At least I had the guts to predict election results and got the ultimate number of LibDems almost bang on when everyone else was getting carried away with Cleggasms. I would remind you there were 412,000 Tory voters in Scotland in 2010 and in the last year we have been picking up votes in real elections in Scotland and contrary to the expectations of almost all PBers captured a safe LibDem council seat in the Borders in a byelection.
    The seat you "captured" in the Borders was in fact a Conservative hold not a gain .
  • Options
    NinoinozNinoinoz Posts: 1,312
    saddened said:

    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    Bit rich from a Kipper given that the party is funded by the fat expense accounts and salaries Kipper MEPs draw from Brussels for doing very little given how rarely Farage et al seem to bother turning up and voting etc. Farage, the man who said women are worth less pay than male colleagues is far from in touch with "ordinary" people.
    Think you are getting mixed up with the Koran
    Crap like this is why UKIP, despite the best efforts of its brighter members, will remain a laughing stock.
    I presume it's traditional to put this quotation on after such a comment?


    "First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win."

    Mahatma Gandhi
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    MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699
    MikeK said:

    More proof that on immigration and it's effects, the Coalition is continuing the sorry story of Labour lies and cover-ups.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/conservative/10597409/Home-Office-hid-dossier-on-EU-migrants.html

    Cammo and co, with all the power of the law in their hands, are looking ever more pathetic.

    You have a very low definition of the standard of proof .
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    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    Neil said:

    MikeK said:

    More proof that on immigration and it's effects, the Coalition is continuing the sorry story of Labour lies and cover-ups.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/conservative/10597409/Home-Office-hid-dossier-on-EU-migrants.html

    Cammo and co, with all the power of the law in their hands, are looking ever more pathetic.

    You've fallen for the spin someone wanted to put on a document. It's been reported for ages that this report has been delayed for months precisely because it fails to makes the case against immigration that May wanted. Let's wait to see it in full rather than just the bits spoon fed to the Telegraph by people with an agenda.
    What a shame that the Torygraph is no longer following the Cameron line. It's not spin when a document due to be published this week anyway, was hidden from view when it mattered.
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    saddened said:

    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    Bit rich from a Kipper given that the party is funded by the fat expense accounts and salaries Kipper MEPs draw from Brussels for doing very little given how rarely Farage et al seem to bother turning up and voting etc. Farage, the man who said women are worth less pay than male colleagues is far from in touch with "ordinary" people.
    Think you are getting mixed up with the Koran
    Crap like this is why UKIP, despite the best efforts of its brighter members, will remain a laughing stock.
    Really? Pray do tell me what the Koran says about women.
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    saddenedsaddened Posts: 2,245
    MikeK said:

    saddened said:

    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    Bit rich from a Kipper given that the party is funded by the fat expense accounts and salaries Kipper MEPs draw from Brussels for doing very little given how rarely Farage et al seem to bother turning up and voting etc. Farage, the man who said women are worth less pay than male colleagues is far from in touch with "ordinary" people.
    Think you are getting mixed up with the Koran
    Crap like this is why UKIP, despite the best efforts of its brighter members, will remain a laughing stock.
    Frightened by a perfectly legit leaflet, Saddened?
    Not remotely. But I'm concerned about the need to shoehorn in a dig at Muslims.
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    saddened said:

    MikeK said:

    saddened said:

    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    Bit rich from a Kipper given that the party is funded by the fat expense accounts and salaries Kipper MEPs draw from Brussels for doing very little given how rarely Farage et al seem to bother turning up and voting etc. Farage, the man who said women are worth less pay than male colleagues is far from in touch with "ordinary" people.
    Think you are getting mixed up with the Koran
    Crap like this is why UKIP, despite the best efforts of its brighter members, will remain a laughing stock.
    Frightened by a perfectly legit leaflet, Saddened?
    Not remotely. But I'm concerned about the need to shoehorn in a dig at Muslims.
    Actually I agree it was a poor response, however I am just pointing out the hypocrisy of the point made.
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    Very good article by Liam Halligan in the Telegraph:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/comment/10612318/Britains-shaky-growth-is-papering-over-cracks.html

    The Tory economic cheerleaders are no different to Labour's pre 2008, glorying in debt financed consumption and happy for long term damage to be done to the economy as long as they can get a few more votes.
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    Survation polling on Scottish Independence

    Referendum Voting Intention – ‘Should Scotland be an independent country?’

    Yes – 32%, No – 52%, Undecided – 16%

    “No” has lead of 20 points

    Now, imagine you knew the Conservative Party was expected to win a majority at the next UK General Election in 2015 and form the next UK government, would this affect how you would vote, or not, in the Scottish independence referendum this year?

    [these %s show how people would then vote in the referendum]

    NET: Yes – 35%, NET: No – 49%, NET: Undecided – 16%

    “No” lead down to 14 points

    Now, imagine you knew the Conservative Party was expected to win a majority at the next UK General Election in 2015 and be in power in the UK for the next 15 years. Would this affect how you would vote, or not, in the Scottish independence referendum this year?

    NET: Yes – 38%, NET: No – 47%, NET: Undecided – 16%

    “No” lead down to 9 points – less than half of what it was in the original question

    - See more at: http://survation.com/2014/02/new-polling-on-scottish-independence-what-if-conservative-fortunes-improved/#sthash.giGXIz48.dpuf
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    Survation on Scottish Westminster and Holyrood VI

    Westminster Voting Intention

    Conservative – 16%, Labour – 38%, Liberal Democrat – 10%, SNP – 30%, Other – 6%

    Holyrood Voting Intention

    Conservative – 12%, Labour – 36%, Liberal Democrat – 9%, SNP – 38%, Other – 5%

    - See more at: http://survation.com/2014/02/new-polling-on-scottish-independence-what-if-conservative-fortunes-improved/#sthash.giGXIz48.dpuf
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    Ninoinoz said:

    Although you would not believe it from this thread but Tory activists want to get in bed with UKIP.

    Do you mean literally or figuratively?

    Either way, my answer is no.
    Horizontally?
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    Hmmm despite the spin, a majority of Tories are opposed to a pact with UKIP

    When we last asked Conservative members in our monthly survey whether or not the Party should form a pact with UKIP for the next election, they divided a third for, a third against and a third not knowing (34 per cent, 33 per cent and 33 per cent, to be precise).

    The best part of nine month months on, the percentage not knowing has been whittled down to a nugatory five per cent. The proportion wanting a deal is up to 41 per cent – just over two in five Tory activists, as I say. 54 per cent, the majority, are against

    http://www.conservativehome.com/platform/2014/02/two-in-five-tory-members-want-a-pact-with-ukip.html
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    corporeal said:

    Charles said:

    Sean_F said:

    Gosh if the Kippers are getting upset at a little criticism from me, goodness what they will be like when we really turn on them in the coming weeks.

    Kippers in tune with the public. One blames floods on gay marriage, another calls women whores, their leader devalues women in the workplace and of course how many are left of those MEPs elected 5 years ago? 9 out of 13 isn't it. Their Scottish party has collapsed in infighting and at the byelection in Cowdenbeath last month the Tory candidate scored almost double UKIP and the LibDem combined.

    But, no Kipper is about to tried for rape, or get arrested for child molestation

    While that may be factually accurate, it's a bit inappropriate to try and imply that one or other political party is associated with or condones that kind of behaviour any more than any of the others.
    My personal opinion on the Rennard side of things is that the political world houses a lot more sexual harrassment than anyone wants to acknowledge, on all sides.

    Obviously since Rennard's the case that hit the headlines etc, this may come across as trying to shift focus away from the Lib Dems but it really isn't. I think it goes on a lot and is kept pretty quiet.
    On balance, probably yes - although I think the LibDems are more under the spotlight now because no one really cared about them in the past. So there is probably a slightly false impression given as more of their flawed individuals are being uncovered and/ore reported on
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 92,137

    Very good article by Liam Halligan in the Telegraph:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/comment/10612318/Britains-shaky-growth-is-papering-over-cracks.html

    The Tory economic cheerleaders are no different to Labour's pre 2008, glorying in debt financed consumption and happy for long term damage to be done to the economy as long as they can get a few more votes.

    So which set of willfully blind cheerleaders should we vote for? Should we just assume neither side has the will to do anything that will genuinely fix things (I do not know enough about economics to know what that could be, if possible, and given how useless economic predictions are, I am doubtful as to whether anyone else really knows either), and just assume further economic pain is inevitable and vote for the various sides based on other policies like Europe or immigration?
  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Sean_F said:

    Charles said:

    Sean_F said:

    Gosh if the Kippers are getting upset at a little criticism from me, goodness what they will be like when we really turn on them in the coming weeks.

    Kippers in tune with the public. One blames floods on gay marriage, another calls women whores, their leader devalues women in the workplace and of course how many are left of those MEPs elected 5 years ago? 9 out of 13 isn't it. Their Scottish party has collapsed in infighting and at the byelection in Cowdenbeath last month the Tory candidate scored almost double UKIP and the LibDem combined.

    But, no Kipper is about to tried for rape, or get arrested for child molestation

    While that may be factually accurate, it's a bit inappropriate to try and imply that one or other political party is associated with or condones that kind of behaviour any more than any of the others.
    That is correct, but it's a legitimate response to those who try to argue (from one of the big three) that somehow UKIP is morally reprehensible. Take the beam out of one's own eye before removing the mote from another's.

    When UKIP was on 3%, I'm willing to believe that they had a higher proportion of fruitcakes, etc. Now they are on 10-12% there is no reason why it should be a greater or lesser proportion than other parties of a similar size.
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    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,283

    saddened said:

    SMukesh said:

    Scott_P said:

    @FelicityMorse: Ukip's new Anti-Labour leaflet... Because you know rich people can't care about poor people http://t.co/LAohe5zGFd via @DanJukes17

    Good leaflet.

    Isn`t Farage a millionaire?
    Couldn't careless,ukip are more in touch with the ordinary people of this country than the party you support,top people head of your party just want to fatten themselves on the EU gravy train.
    Bit rich from a Kipper given that the party is funded by the fat expense accounts and salaries Kipper MEPs draw from Brussels for doing very little given how rarely Farage et al seem to bother turning up and voting etc. Farage, the man who said women are worth less pay than male colleagues is far from in touch with "ordinary" people.
    Think you are getting mixed up with the Koran
    Crap like this is why UKIP, despite the best efforts of its brighter members, will remain a laughing stock.
    Really? Pray do tell me what the Koran says about women.
    From memory, not much different from what the bible says about women?
    Corinithains 11:5 but every wife who prays or prophesies with her head uncovered dishonors her head, since it is the same as if her head were shaven.

    Tiomothy 2:12 I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet.

    Titus 2:3 Older women likewise are to be reverent in behaviour, not slanderers or slaves to much wine. They are to teach what is good, and so train the young women to love their husbands and children, to be self-controlled, pure, working at home, kind, and submissive to their own husbands, that the word of God may not be reviled.

    ... and many more.

    The text of documents that are well over a thousand years old are not particularly relevant (note in Islam the Hadiths are of massive importance). What matters is the way people interpret those texts. And as can be seen above, the texts - particularly on an individual verse level - are very open to interpretation according to whatever bias the reader has.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 92,137

    Hmmm despite the spin, a majority of Tories are opposed to a pact with UKIP

    When we last asked Conservative members in our monthly survey whether or not the Party should form a pact with UKIP for the next election, they divided a third for, a third against and a third not knowing (34 per cent, 33 per cent and 33 per cent, to be precise).

    The best part of nine month months on, the percentage not knowing has been whittled down to a nugatory five per cent. The proportion wanting a deal is up to 41 per cent – just over two in five Tory activists, as I say. 54 per cent, the majority, are against

    http://www.conservativehome.com/platform/2014/02/two-in-five-tory-members-want-a-pact-with-ukip.html

    They fear that to do a deal with their own errant former supporters - as UKIP by and large are still often seen as such - would grant them power over the Tories, essentially giving in to their own rebels while resigning themselves to being Cameroons forever and letting UKIP steal the 'real Tory' label?
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    For the Sunday Times Messrs Rallings and Thrasher have done an analysis on all the votes in council elections since May, I think their National Equivalent Share of the vote is

    Labour 34%, Tories 28%, UKIP 17%, Lib Dems 13%.

    In places where it stands, UKIP takes an average 22% of the vote compared with 15% for the Lib Dems.
  • Options

    For the Sunday Times Messrs Rallings and Thrasher have done an analysis on all the votes in council elections since May, I think their National Equivalent Share of the vote is

    Labour 34%, Tories 28%, UKIP 17%, Lib Dems 13%.

    In places where it stands, UKIP takes an average 22% of the vote compared with 15% for the Lib Dems.

    They say

    “The Lib Dems, once the master tacticians of by-elections, are fading fast and are being replaced by UKIP.”
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,252
    sunday herald tomorrow , poll confirms gap closing , NO are circling the drain
  • Options
    malcolmg said:

    sunday herald tomorrow , poll confirms gap closing , NO are circling the drain

    Malcolm, see below, there's also a survation poll out for the Mail on Sunday that should cheer you up.
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    fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,279
    Any Conservative Leader that decides to form a pact with UKIP would cross my red line and end my support for the party.

    Hmmm despite the spin, a majority of Tories are opposed to a pact with UKIP

    When we last asked Conservative members in our monthly survey whether or not the Party should form a pact with UKIP for the next election, they divided a third for, a third against and a third not knowing (34 per cent, 33 per cent and 33 per cent, to be precise).

    The best part of nine month months on, the percentage not knowing has been whittled down to a nugatory five per cent. The proportion wanting a deal is up to 41 per cent – just over two in five Tory activists, as I say. 54 per cent, the majority, are against

    http://www.conservativehome.com/platform/2014/02/two-in-five-tory-members-want-a-pact-with-ukip.html

  • Options
    MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699
    malcolmg said:

    sunday herald tomorrow , poll confirms gap closing , NO are circling the drain

    At the rate it is closing in TNS polls , Yes will be ahead in May 2015 .
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    fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,279
    Being introduced as a 'Labour Peer' did tend to neuter the impact of her complaint.
    Omnium said:

    Baroness Morgan eh!

    The BBC featuring her wailing must mean that she's a pillar of society that somehow I'd failed to encounter before. Checking though it seems not. The wonder of the thing is that she was ever appointed, rather than she was sacked.

    The House of Lords is now the joke that its critics always said it was. It's been turned into that by these ludicrous appointments of token political hangers-on to the chamber.

    Her claims that the Tories are replacing Labour appointees are probably true - the Labour appointees are so ridiculously bad. The Tory ones will be awful too mind you.

    All these dreadful appointees should go. Their jobs should be abolished too. It's pretty hard to see that they actually do anything.

    So please, the next Lord in the street you happen to pass, bump into them, ridicule their ermin, and speak away from their ear-trumpets!

    O

  • Options
    fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,279
    Well the Libdems entering Government did leave a vacancy for a protest party.

    For the Sunday Times Messrs Rallings and Thrasher have done an analysis on all the votes in council elections since May, I think their National Equivalent Share of the vote is

    Labour 34%, Tories 28%, UKIP 17%, Lib Dems 13%.

    In places where it stands, UKIP takes an average 22% of the vote compared with 15% for the Lib Dems.

    They say

    “The Lib Dems, once the master tacticians of by-elections, are fading fast and are being replaced by UKIP.”
  • Options
    kle4 said:

    Very good article by Liam Halligan in the Telegraph:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/comment/10612318/Britains-shaky-growth-is-papering-over-cracks.html

    The Tory economic cheerleaders are no different to Labour's pre 2008, glorying in debt financed consumption and happy for long term damage to be done to the economy as long as they can get a few more votes.

    So which set of willfully blind cheerleaders should we vote for? Should we just assume neither side has the will to do anything that will genuinely fix things (I do not know enough about economics to know what that could be, if possible, and given how useless economic predictions are, I am doubtful as to whether anyone else really knows either), and just assume further economic pain is inevitable and vote for the various sides based on other policies like Europe or immigration?
    Yes.

  • Options
    NinoinozNinoinoz Posts: 1,312
    fitalass said:

    Any Conservative Leader that decides to form a pact with UKIP would cross my red line and end my support for the party.

    Hmmm despite the spin, a majority of Tories are opposed to a pact with UKIP

    When we last asked Conservative members in our monthly survey whether or not the Party should form a pact with UKIP for the next election, they divided a third for, a third against and a third not knowing (34 per cent, 33 per cent and 33 per cent, to be precise).

    The best part of nine month months on, the percentage not knowing has been whittled down to a nugatory five per cent. The proportion wanting a deal is up to 41 per cent – just over two in five Tory activists, as I say. 54 per cent, the majority, are against

    http://www.conservativehome.com/platform/2014/02/two-in-five-tory-members-want-a-pact-with-ukip.html

    Really? Why start now?

    Your conservative "principles" must be pretty elastic if you're still in the Conservative Party after all the Cameroons have done and said.
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,426
    edited February 2014

    malcolmg said:

    sunday herald tomorrow , poll confirms gap closing , NO are circling the drain

    At the rate it is closing in TNS polls , Yes will be ahead in May 2015 .
    At the current rate in TNS polls, meaningless as that is, it actually suggests Yes will be over 50% by September 2014.

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    fitalass said:

    Any Conservative Leader that decides to form a pact with UKIP would cross my red line and end my support for the party.

    Hmmm despite the spin, a majority of Tories are opposed to a pact with UKIP

    When we last asked Conservative members in our monthly survey whether or not the Party should form a pact with UKIP for the next election, they divided a third for, a third against and a third not knowing (34 per cent, 33 per cent and 33 per cent, to be precise).

    The best part of nine month months on, the percentage not knowing has been whittled down to a nugatory five per cent. The proportion wanting a deal is up to 41 per cent – just over two in five Tory activists, as I say. 54 per cent, the majority, are against

    http://www.conservativehome.com/platform/2014/02/two-in-five-tory-members-want-a-pact-with-ukip.html

    Can you tell us what your red lines are, should be fun.
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    Ninoinoz said:

    fitalass said:

    Any Conservative Leader that decides to form a pact with UKIP would cross my red line and end my support for the party.

    Hmmm despite the spin, a majority of Tories are opposed to a pact with UKIP

    When we last asked Conservative members in our monthly survey whether or not the Party should form a pact with UKIP for the next election, they divided a third for, a third against and a third not knowing (34 per cent, 33 per cent and 33 per cent, to be precise).

    The best part of nine month months on, the percentage not knowing has been whittled down to a nugatory five per cent. The proportion wanting a deal is up to 41 per cent – just over two in five Tory activists, as I say. 54 per cent, the majority, are against

    http://www.conservativehome.com/platform/2014/02/two-in-five-tory-members-want-a-pact-with-ukip.html

    Really? Why start now?

    Your conservative "principles" must be pretty elastic if you're still in the Conservative Party after all the Cameroons have done and said.
    I think the mistake you are making is in believing that Cameroons have any principles in the first place.
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    There's a story in the Sunday Times that's going to either confuse the Daily Mail or is a Daily Mail dream story

    A MUSLIM family of Somali origin have protested after social services chose a white lesbian couple to adopt their three-year-old daughter.

    They say offers from four members of their extended family to care for the girl were rejected. Relatives want the child to be brought up by a family who share their religious and ethnic background.
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    NinoinozNinoinoz Posts: 1,312

    Ninoinoz said:

    fitalass said:

    Any Conservative Leader that decides to form a pact with UKIP would cross my red line and end my support for the party.

    Hmmm despite the spin, a majority of Tories are opposed to a pact with UKIP

    When we last asked Conservative members in our monthly survey whether or not the Party should form a pact with UKIP for the next election, they divided a third for, a third against and a third not knowing (34 per cent, 33 per cent and 33 per cent, to be precise).

    The best part of nine month months on, the percentage not knowing has been whittled down to a nugatory five per cent. The proportion wanting a deal is up to 41 per cent – just over two in five Tory activists, as I say. 54 per cent, the majority, are against

    http://www.conservativehome.com/platform/2014/02/two-in-five-tory-members-want-a-pact-with-ukip.html

    Really? Why start now?

    Your conservative "principles" must be pretty elastic if you're still in the Conservative Party after all the Cameroons have done and said.
    I think the mistake you are making is in believing that Cameroons have any principles in the first place.
    Oh, I don't know.

    Is discarding anything or anyone who might hinder their pursuit of political power a guiding principle?
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    NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,380
    Quiet here tonight! Everyone in shock after The Bridge ending? Next and final series in 2016 apparently - am just following the author's live blog.
This discussion has been closed.