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Unhappy Valley – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 11,003
edited March 2023 in General
imageUnhappy Valley – politicalbetting.com

Happy Valley, Line of Duty, The Bay, The Gold, Broadchurch, Inspector Morse, Endeavour, Unforgotten, Life on Mars, Ashes to Ashes, Cracker, Vera, Prime Suspect, Bodyguard, Luther, Criminal, Heartbeat, Inspector George Gently, Between the Lines, Foyle’s War. The view we lap up, given the preponderance of TV police dramas, is of basically good hearted, if understandably grumpy, policemen (and the occasional ballsy policewoman) doing their best for us. If they occasionally stretch or break a rule or two, well it’s all in a good cause. They are the good guys.

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,239
    edited March 2023
    Time to privatise the police.

    Nobody who fails a DBS check can work for the rozzers
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    GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 3,000
    Spot on piece; I was looking forward to getting @Cyclefree's take.

    Underrated point on the mayor's general lack-of-arsedness here too.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,186
    Thing is if you throw out the bad 'uns how the hell do you man the police force? There simply aren't the bodies.
  • Options
    The Met make South Yorkshire Police look competent and of the highest probity.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,239
    edited March 2023
    TOPPING said:

    Thing is if you throw out the bad 'uns how the hell do you man the police force? There simply aren't the bodies.

    Bring in rozzers from other countries. .
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,567

    The Met make South Yorkshire Police look competent and of the highest probity.

    SYP did catch their Ripper, eventually. The Met didn't.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,567

    TOPPING said:

    Thing is if you throw out the bad 'uns how the hell do you man the police force? There simply aren't the bodies.

    Bring in rozzers from other countries. .
    What they used to do in Glasgow (and Edinburgh too). Bring in large, porridge, kale, neep, mince and milk fed countrymen with zero local loyalties.
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    FairlieredFairliered Posts: 3,963
    Excellent thread, @Cyclefree. How do we square the circle of the sort of men attracted to a career in the police being the sort of men who are more likely to be authoritarian, bullies, racist, misogynistic, homophobic, or a combination of all of these?
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,186

    Excellent thread, @Cyclefree. How do we square the circle of the sort of men attracted to a career in the police being the sort of men who are more likely to be authoritarian, bullies, racist, misogynistic, homophobic, or a combination of all of these?

    You exploit those emotions that motivate the rest of the planet - fear and greed.

    Make examples and bribe people to shop their colleagues.
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,095
    Hang on - Line of Duty? That was all about bent coppers....
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,186
    We've got quite a lot of different experience on PB. Firefighters, doctors, teachers, etc.

    Do we have any polis? I would be very interested to get a from the horse's mouth account of what's happening.
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,095

    TOPPING said:

    Thing is if you throw out the bad 'uns how the hell do you man the police force? There simply aren't the bodies.

    Bring in rozzers from other countries. .
    Yeah. Try German police. They aren't nicknamed pigs. Rather, bulls....
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,239
    edited March 2023
    Watch the ERG and Boris Johnson undo all this hard work by Sunak.

    Labour leads by 16% in the Red Wall, down from 28% four weeks ago.

    Red Wall VI (19 March):

    Labour 48% (-3)
    Conservative 32% (+3)
    Reform UK 8% (-1)
    Liberal Democrat 6% (–)
    Green 4% (+2)
    Plaid Cymru 1% (–)
    Other 2% (–)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638223950374117379
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,095

    Labour leads by 16% in the Red Wall, down from 28% four weeks ago.

    Red Wall VI (19 March):

    Labour 48% (-3)
    Conservative 32% (+3)
    Reform UK 8% (-1)
    Liberal Democrat 6% (–)
    Green 4% (+2)
    Plaid Cymru 1% (–)
    Other 2% (–)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638223950374117379

    Sleazy northern whippet-owning coal-in-the-bath Labour on the slide....
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,095

    The Met make South Yorkshire Police look competent and of the highest probity.

    To be fair, the Met do have to police Cockney scum....
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    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,048
    Excellent piece, Cyclefree. I'd be interested on knowing more about the PSNI reforms, and how effective they have been. One thing I would say is that the problems we have with policing in this country are hardly unique. The US police problems seem an order of magnitude worse than ours. French police too - their thuggish and racist behaviour is probably one of the factors driving people to cross the channel. I'm not saying this to minimise or excuse the terrible failings of the Met or other UK forces. But it does seem there is something in the nature of the job that brings out the worst in people, or in some cases attracts the wrong sort of people to the role. It's undoubtedly a stressful and harrowing job that perhaps hardens and desensitises people, or breeds cynicism about human nature. I wonder if there are broader changes we could make to make the context of policing less toxic. I suspect the law around drugs might be a useful place to look.
    The sheer incompetence on display is the other thing that stands out from the report.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,914
    TOPPING said:

    We've got quite a lot of different experience on PB. Firefighters, doctors, teachers, etc.

    Do we have any polis? I would be very interested to get a from the horse's mouth account of what's happening.

    What about criminals, do we have any of those?
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    RobDRobD Posts: 58,955
    rcs1000 said:

    TOPPING said:

    We've got quite a lot of different experience on PB. Firefighters, doctors, teachers, etc.

    Do we have any polis? I would be very interested to get a from the horse's mouth account of what's happening.

    What about criminals, do we have any of those?
    Active or former?
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    eekeek Posts: 24,925
    Love to see how Bozo will explain this explanation away.



    Sadly it's not true but the scary bit is that it reads as plausible.
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    MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 12,415

    Watch the ERG and Boris Johnson undo all this hard work by Sunak.

    Labour leads by 16% in the Red Wall, down from 28% four weeks ago.

    Red Wall VI (19 March):

    Labour 48% (-3)
    Conservative 32% (+3)
    Reform UK 8% (-1)
    Liberal Democrat 6% (–)
    Green 4% (+2)
    Plaid Cymru 1% (–)
    Other 2% (–)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638223950374117379

    Labour are in trouble in the red wall in the coming Council elections. They will never meet expectations, not just on this red wall poll, but others in recent weeks.

    It was another recent redwall poll which first alerted us to the Tory surge, it seems red wall in particular are falling back in love with Tory’s again.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,186
    rcs1000 said:

    TOPPING said:

    We've got quite a lot of different experience on PB. Firefighters, doctors, teachers, etc.

    Do we have any polis? I would be very interested to get a from the horse's mouth account of what's happening.

    What about criminals, do we have any of those?
    Do enemies of the people and running dog capitalists count?
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    rcs1000 said:

    TOPPING said:

    We've got quite a lot of different experience on PB. Firefighters, doctors, teachers, etc.

    Do we have any polis? I would be very interested to get a from the horse's mouth account of what's happening.

    What about criminals, do we have any of those?
    I've spent several nights in a prison.

    Okay, it was the Oxford Malmaison, which is a former prison.
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    FF43FF43 Posts: 15,688

    Watch the ERG and Boris Johnson undo all this hard work by Sunak.

    Labour leads by 16% in the Red Wall, down from 28% four weeks ago.

    Red Wall VI (19 March):

    Labour 48% (-3)
    Conservative 32% (+3)
    Reform UK 8% (-1)
    Liberal Democrat 6% (–)
    Green 4% (+2)
    Plaid Cymru 1% (–)
    Other 2% (–)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638223950374117379

    Labour are in trouble in the red wall in the coming Council elections. They will never meet expectations, not just on this red wall poll, but others in recent weeks.

    It was another recent redwall poll which first alerted us to the Tory surge, it seems red wall in particular are falling back in love with Tory’s again.
    Hmm Labour vote is half again bigger than the Tory one in actual Conservative seats. This is "falling back in love" with Tories?
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,567
    edited March 2023
    TOPPING said:

    rcs1000 said:

    TOPPING said:

    We've got quite a lot of different experience on PB. Firefighters, doctors, teachers, etc.

    Do we have any polis? I would be very interested to get a from the horse's mouth account of what's happening.

    What about criminals, do we have any of those?
    Do enemies of the people and running dog capitalists count?
    Talking about bankers, this is interesting. Edit, and e. of the p. ((C) DM) too.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/mar/21/jeremy-hunt-pensions-tax-break-expected-to-help-nearly-as-many-bankers-as-doctors

    'Alongside doctors, other senior public sector workers – including top civil servants, police officials, and headteachers – could benefit from the change. However, more than half of non-retired people with a pension pot worth more than £1m are in the private sector, according to figures from the Office for National Statistics.

    Judges already had an exemption to the lifetime allowance, under a policy the government said was designed to fix a recruitment problem.'
  • Options
    geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,127
    rcs1000 said:

    TOPPING said:

    We've got quite a lot of different experience on PB. Firefighters, doctors, teachers, etc.

    Do we have any polis? I would be very interested to get a from the horse's mouth account of what's happening.

    What about criminals, do we have any of those?
    At least one has owned up to time behind bars. Let him speak!

  • Options
    FF43 said:

    Watch the ERG and Boris Johnson undo all this hard work by Sunak.

    Labour leads by 16% in the Red Wall, down from 28% four weeks ago.

    Red Wall VI (19 March):

    Labour 48% (-3)
    Conservative 32% (+3)
    Reform UK 8% (-1)
    Liberal Democrat 6% (–)
    Green 4% (+2)
    Plaid Cymru 1% (–)
    Other 2% (–)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638223950374117379

    Labour are in trouble in the red wall in the coming Council elections. They will never meet expectations, not just on this red wall poll, but others in recent weeks.

    It was another recent redwall poll which first alerted us to the Tory surge, it seems red wall in particular are falling back in love with Tory’s again.
    Hmm Labour vote is half again bigger than the Tory one in actual Conservative seats. This is "falling back in love" with Tories?
    That poster never knowingly under ramps a poll for the Tories.
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,419
    edited March 2023
    UKPollingReport seats forecast.

    Today: Lab 357, Con 198

    Yesterday: Lab 359, Con 197

    https://pollingreport.uk/seats

    Also:

    "The Greens Aren't on 13% - Here's One Reason the Polling Might be Wrong
    Callum Jones"

    https://pollingreport.uk/articles/the-greens-arent-on-13-heres-one-reason-the-polling-might-be-wrong
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    StockyStocky Posts: 9,707
    TOPPING said:

    We've got quite a lot of different experience on PB. Firefighters, doctors, teachers, etc.

    Do we have any polis? I would be very interested to get a from the horse's mouth account of what's happening.

    Who is the firefighter?

    (Asking for my wife.)
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    Well now (I fully these changes to unwind once Sunak has failed to stop the boats.)

    First lead for Sunak over Starmer in these seats since March 2022.

    At this moment, which of the following do Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the UK? (19 March)

    Sunak 37% (+3)
    Starmer 35% (-7)
    Don't Know 28% (+4)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638226510950572053
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    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,567
    Stocky said:

    TOPPING said:

    We've got quite a lot of different experience on PB. Firefighters, doctors, teachers, etc.

    Do we have any polis? I would be very interested to get a from the horse's mouth account of what's happening.

    Who is the firefighter?

    (Asking for my wife.)
    TwistedFireStopper (possibly ret., from a recent comment).
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,817

    Watch the ERG and Boris Johnson undo all this hard work by Sunak.

    Labour leads by 16% in the Red Wall, down from 28% four weeks ago.

    Red Wall VI (19 March):

    Labour 48% (-3)
    Conservative 32% (+3)
    Reform UK 8% (-1)
    Liberal Democrat 6% (–)
    Green 4% (+2)
    Plaid Cymru 1% (–)
    Other 2% (–)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638223950374117379

    Labour are in trouble in the red wall in the coming Council elections. They will never meet expectations, not just on this red wall poll, but others in recent weeks.

    It was another recent redwall poll which first alerted us to the Tory surge, it seems red wall in particular are falling back in love with Tory’s again.
    Sunak leading SKS in red wall

    SKS fans please explain
  • Options
    FF43FF43 Posts: 15,688

    FF43 said:

    Watch the ERG and Boris Johnson undo all this hard work by Sunak.

    Labour leads by 16% in the Red Wall, down from 28% four weeks ago.

    Red Wall VI (19 March):

    Labour 48% (-3)
    Conservative 32% (+3)
    Reform UK 8% (-1)
    Liberal Democrat 6% (–)
    Green 4% (+2)
    Plaid Cymru 1% (–)
    Other 2% (–)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638223950374117379

    Labour are in trouble in the red wall in the coming Council elections. They will never meet expectations, not just on this red wall poll, but others in recent weeks.

    It was another recent redwall poll which first alerted us to the Tory surge, it seems red wall in particular are falling back in love with Tory’s again.
    Hmm Labour vote is half again bigger than the Tory one in actual Conservative seats. This is "falling back in love" with Tories?
    That poster never knowingly under ramps a poll for the Tories.
    The trend's your friend, I guess. It's just that your friend will have to do a helluva amount of work ahead of the next election.
  • Options
    MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 12,415

    FF43 said:

    Watch the ERG and Boris Johnson undo all this hard work by Sunak.

    Labour leads by 16% in the Red Wall, down from 28% four weeks ago.

    Red Wall VI (19 March):

    Labour 48% (-3)
    Conservative 32% (+3)
    Reform UK 8% (-1)
    Liberal Democrat 6% (–)
    Green 4% (+2)
    Plaid Cymru 1% (–)
    Other 2% (–)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638223950374117379

    Labour are in trouble in the red wall in the coming Council elections. They will never meet expectations, not just on this red wall poll, but others in recent weeks.

    It was another recent redwall poll which first alerted us to the Tory surge, it seems red wall in particular are falling back in love with Tory’s again.
    Hmm Labour vote is half again bigger than the Tory one in actual Conservative seats. This is "falling back in love" with Tories?
    That poster never knowingly under ramps a poll for the Tories.
    Wait. What? You have just posted lead is 16 was 28 four weeks ago 🥹
  • Options
    Well well well.

    Most Tories/a majority of leavers think Boris Johnson did knowingly mislead parliament




    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1637831081322766338/photo/1
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    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,914
    geoffw said:

    rcs1000 said:

    TOPPING said:

    We've got quite a lot of different experience on PB. Firefighters, doctors, teachers, etc.

    Do we have any polis? I would be very interested to get a from the horse's mouth account of what's happening.

    What about criminals, do we have any of those?
    At least one has owned up to time behind bars. Let him speak!

    Ah, but he wasn't convicted, so I don't think he counts.
  • Options
    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,419

    Watch the ERG and Boris Johnson undo all this hard work by Sunak.

    Labour leads by 16% in the Red Wall, down from 28% four weeks ago.

    Red Wall VI (19 March):

    Labour 48% (-3)
    Conservative 32% (+3)
    Reform UK 8% (-1)
    Liberal Democrat 6% (–)
    Green 4% (+2)
    Plaid Cymru 1% (–)
    Other 2% (–)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638223950374117379

    Labour are in trouble in the red wall in the coming Council elections. They will never meet expectations, not just on this red wall poll, but others in recent weeks.

    It was another recent redwall poll which first alerted us to the Tory surge, it seems red wall in particular are falling back in love with Tory’s again.
    Sunak leading SKS in red wall

    SKS fans please explain
    Probably because red wall voters like the Tories' policies on illegal migration.
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,034

    Watch the ERG and Boris Johnson undo all this hard work by Sunak.

    Labour leads by 16% in the Red Wall, down from 28% four weeks ago.

    Red Wall VI (19 March):

    Labour 48% (-3)
    Conservative 32% (+3)
    Reform UK 8% (-1)
    Liberal Democrat 6% (–)
    Green 4% (+2)
    Plaid Cymru 1% (–)
    Other 2% (–)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638223950374117379

    Labour are in trouble in the red wall in the coming Council elections. They will never meet expectations, not just on this red wall poll, but others in recent weeks.

    It was another recent redwall poll which first alerted us to the Tory surge, it seems red wall in particular are falling back in love with Tory’s again.
    Sunak leading SKS in red wall

    SKS fans please explain
    I like to think of myself as PB's most tiresome poster, but your Starmer drearfest has well and truly knocked me off my perch
  • Options
    RobDRobD Posts: 58,955

    Well now (I fully these changes to unwind once Sunak has failed to stop the boats.)

    First lead for Sunak over Starmer in these seats since March 2022.

    At this moment, which of the following do Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the UK? (19 March)

    Sunak 37% (+3)
    Starmer 35% (-7)
    Don't Know 28% (+4)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638226510950572053

    Strong 'n Stable.
  • Options
    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,048
    rcs1000 said:

    TOPPING said:

    We've got quite a lot of different experience on PB. Firefighters, doctors, teachers, etc.

    Do we have any polis? I would be very interested to get a from the horse's mouth account of what's happening.

    What about criminals, do we have any of those?
    Define criminal. If you simply mean someone who has done something illegal at least once, I guess it's probably most people on here - probably everyone.
  • Options

    The Met make South Yorkshire Police look competent and of the highest probity.

    To be fair, the Met do have to police Cockney scum....
    Oi, wotchit Sunshine. ;)
  • Options
    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,048

    Watch the ERG and Boris Johnson undo all this hard work by Sunak.

    Labour leads by 16% in the Red Wall, down from 28% four weeks ago.

    Red Wall VI (19 March):

    Labour 48% (-3)
    Conservative 32% (+3)
    Reform UK 8% (-1)
    Liberal Democrat 6% (–)
    Green 4% (+2)
    Plaid Cymru 1% (–)
    Other 2% (–)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638223950374117379

    Labour are in trouble in the red wall in the coming Council elections. They will never meet expectations, not just on this red wall poll, but others in recent weeks.

    It was another recent redwall poll which first alerted us to the Tory surge, it seems red wall in particular are falling back in love with Tory’s again.
    Sunak leading SKS in red wall

    SKS fans please explain
    I like to think of myself as PB's most tiresome poster, but your Starmer drearfest has well and truly knocked me off my perch
    You're not even in the top ten.
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,817

    Watch the ERG and Boris Johnson undo all this hard work by Sunak.

    Labour leads by 16% in the Red Wall, down from 28% four weeks ago.

    Red Wall VI (19 March):

    Labour 48% (-3)
    Conservative 32% (+3)
    Reform UK 8% (-1)
    Liberal Democrat 6% (–)
    Green 4% (+2)
    Plaid Cymru 1% (–)
    Other 2% (–)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638223950374117379

    Labour are in trouble in the red wall in the coming Council elections. They will never meet expectations, not just on this red wall poll, but others in recent weeks.

    It was another recent redwall poll which first alerted us to the Tory surge, it seems red wall in particular are falling back in love with Tory’s again.
    Sunak leading SKS in red wall

    SKS fans please explain
    I like to think of myself as PB's most tiresome poster, but your Starmer drearfest has well and truly knocked me off my perch
    It's a betting site Pete.

    SKS trail Sunak in the red wall

    Could be an outlier.

    Could be very significant

    Sorry to bore you 🙂
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,609
    In Police news I see that incompetent police chief Mike Veale, previously of the Wiltshire Police investigation into Ted Heath and then stood down from Cleveland Police due to gross misconduct allegations, has lost his job as CEO of the Leicestershire PCC office.

    He is, inexplicably, yet to face a hearing over the alleged gross misconduct in Cleveland despite it being 4 years later.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leicestershire-64487621
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,609

    Well well well.

    Most Tories/a majority of leavers think Boris Johnson did knowingly mislead parliament




    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1637831081322766338/photo/1

    That's actually a sign of respect for him. They don't buy his own story he's that dumb (and so is everyone else in Downing Street, but don't worry they all worked hard and are brilliant apart from this one blind spot).
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    WillGWillG Posts: 2,063

    Well now (I fully these changes to unwind once Sunak has failed to stop the boats.)

    First lead for Sunak over Starmer in these seats since March 2022.

    At this moment, which of the following do Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the UK? (19 March)

    Sunak 37% (+3)
    Starmer 35% (-7)
    Don't Know 28% (+4)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638226510950572053

    Sounds like the Tories really need to do everything they can to stop the boats then.
  • Options
    WillG said:

    Well now (I fully these changes to unwind once Sunak has failed to stop the boats.)

    First lead for Sunak over Starmer in these seats since March 2022.

    At this moment, which of the following do Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the UK? (19 March)

    Sunak 37% (+3)
    Starmer 35% (-7)
    Don't Know 28% (+4)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638226510950572053

    Sounds like the Tories really need to do everything they can to stop the boats then.
    Nope, it's all about the cost of living.
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    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,817
    Andy_JS said:

    Watch the ERG and Boris Johnson undo all this hard work by Sunak.

    Labour leads by 16% in the Red Wall, down from 28% four weeks ago.

    Red Wall VI (19 March):

    Labour 48% (-3)
    Conservative 32% (+3)
    Reform UK 8% (-1)
    Liberal Democrat 6% (–)
    Green 4% (+2)
    Plaid Cymru 1% (–)
    Other 2% (–)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638223950374117379

    Labour are in trouble in the red wall in the coming Council elections. They will never meet expectations, not just on this red wall poll, but others in recent weeks.

    It was another recent redwall poll which first alerted us to the Tory surge, it seems red wall in particular are falling back in love with Tory’s again.
    Sunak leading SKS in red wall

    SKS fans please explain
    Probably because red wall voters like the Tories' policies on illegal migration.
    I would say so.

    Although SKS more or less agrees with the Tories in fact didn’t hesay they need to be more effective at it and that's why blah blah blah??
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,609

    Hang on - Line of Duty? That was all about bent coppers....

    Even the ones doing the investigating were a little bent/incompetent.
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    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,606

    Watch the ERG and Boris Johnson undo all this hard work by Sunak.

    Labour leads by 16% in the Red Wall, down from 28% four weeks ago.

    Red Wall VI (19 March):

    Labour 48% (-3)
    Conservative 32% (+3)
    Reform UK 8% (-1)
    Liberal Democrat 6% (–)
    Green 4% (+2)
    Plaid Cymru 1% (–)
    Other 2% (–)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638223950374117379

    And if Rishi does manage to fix the boats issue the swingback gets much bigger and the seat loss in te red wall seats will be limited to a handful rather than a wipe out.

    As I've been saying, the route for the Tories to get a 1992 style cling on to power victory exists where it didn't under Boris or Liz Truss. They need everything to go right for them though.
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,095

    Andy_JS said:

    Watch the ERG and Boris Johnson undo all this hard work by Sunak.

    Labour leads by 16% in the Red Wall, down from 28% four weeks ago.

    Red Wall VI (19 March):

    Labour 48% (-3)
    Conservative 32% (+3)
    Reform UK 8% (-1)
    Liberal Democrat 6% (–)
    Green 4% (+2)
    Plaid Cymru 1% (–)
    Other 2% (–)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638223950374117379

    Labour are in trouble in the red wall in the coming Council elections. They will never meet expectations, not just on this red wall poll, but others in recent weeks.

    It was another recent redwall poll which first alerted us to the Tory surge, it seems red wall in particular are falling back in love with Tory’s again.
    Sunak leading SKS in red wall

    SKS fans please explain
    Probably because red wall voters like the Tories' policies on illegal migration.
    I would say so.

    Although SKS more or less agrees with the Tories in fact didn’t hesay they need to be more effective at it and that's why blah blah blah??
    The Red Wall don't believe Labour on immigration though.
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,609

    rcs1000 said:

    TOPPING said:

    We've got quite a lot of different experience on PB. Firefighters, doctors, teachers, etc.

    Do we have any polis? I would be very interested to get a from the horse's mouth account of what's happening.

    What about criminals, do we have any of those?
    Define criminal. If you simply mean someone who has done something illegal at least once, I guess it's probably most people on here - probably everyone.
    We have a few lawyers and bankers. Surely that will do.
    Outrageous. They are in finance, but not bankers, which we are assured makes all the difference.
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,817

    WillG said:

    Well now (I fully these changes to unwind once Sunak has failed to stop the boats.)

    First lead for Sunak over Starmer in these seats since March 2022.

    At this moment, which of the following do Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the UK? (19 March)

    Sunak 37% (+3)
    Starmer 35% (-7)
    Don't Know 28% (+4)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638226510950572053

    Sounds like the Tories really need to do everything they can to stop the boats then.
    Nope, it's all about the cost of living.
    How is that causing a swingback?
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,095

    The Met make South Yorkshire Police look competent and of the highest probity.

    To be fair, the Met do have to police Cockney scum....
    Oi, wotchit Sunshine. ;)
    'e, er, accidentally fell down the apples.....
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,817

    Watch the ERG and Boris Johnson undo all this hard work by Sunak.

    Labour leads by 16% in the Red Wall, down from 28% four weeks ago.

    Red Wall VI (19 March):

    Labour 48% (-3)
    Conservative 32% (+3)
    Reform UK 8% (-1)
    Liberal Democrat 6% (–)
    Green 4% (+2)
    Plaid Cymru 1% (–)
    Other 2% (–)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638223950374117379

    Labour are in trouble in the red wall in the coming Council elections. They will never meet expectations, not just on this red wall poll, but others in recent weeks.

    It was another recent redwall poll which first alerted us to the Tory surge, it seems red wall in particular are falling back in love with Tory’s again.
    Sunak leading SKS in red wall

    SKS fans please explain
    I like to think of myself as PB's most tiresome poster, but your Starmer drearfest has well and truly knocked me off my perch
    It's a betting site Pete.

    SKS trail Sunak in the red wall

    Could be an outlier.

    Could be very significant

    Sorry to bore you 🙂
    Anyway only 1 winner of a drear fest.(SKS)

  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,477
    AP - ‘Winnie the Pooh’ slasher film pulled from Hong Kong cinemas

    HONG KONG (AP) — Public screenings of a slasher film that features Winnie the Pooh were scrapped abruptly in Hong Kong on Tuesday, sparking discussions over increasing censorship in the city.

    Film distributor VII Pillars Entertainment announced on Facebook that the release of “Winnie the Pooh: Blood and Honey” on Thursday had been canceled with “great regret” in Hong Kong and neighboring Macao.

    In an email reply to The Associated Press, the distributor said it was notified by cinemas that they could not show the film as scheduled, but it didn’t know why. The cinema chains involved did not immediately reply to a request for comment.

    For many residents, the Winnie the Pooh character is a playful taunt of China’s President Xi Jinping and Chinese censors in the past had briefly banned social media searches for the bear in the country. In 2018, the film “Christopher Robin,” also featuring Winnie the Pooh, was reportedly denied a release in China.

    https://apnews.com/article/hong-kong-winnie-pooh-censorship-film-613ba02ab3cd453635f851bf1fbb071e

    SSI - so where/how do PBers stand on "Blood and Honey"?
  • Options

    WillG said:

    Well now (I fully these changes to unwind once Sunak has failed to stop the boats.)

    First lead for Sunak over Starmer in these seats since March 2022.

    At this moment, which of the following do Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the UK? (19 March)

    Sunak 37% (+3)
    Starmer 35% (-7)
    Don't Know 28% (+4)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638226510950572053

    Sounds like the Tories really need to do everything they can to stop the boats then.
    Nope, it's all about the cost of living.
    How is that causing a swingback?
    The voters don't like disorder and the boats coming over is disorder.

    Now they are liking the tough talk from the government on it, but when it proves to be all fart and no follow through it will lead to an unwind.

    Even if it a success, the voters will have seen prices go up nearly 20% over the last 2 years and pay hasn't matched that.

    It's the economy, stupid.
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,609
    I'm not sure I can stomach reading yet another official report about the police being crap which will receive strong words and then be mostly ignored yet again.

    One problem is things are clearly so bad that it appears unsolvable, or will be said to take a 'long time', when as cyclefree suggests a tight timetable would be possible, if there is the political and institutional will.

    There won't be. The Police rejected and obstructed previous reports, and they will again, they are already clawing on the sympathy arguments, and will stop at nothing to imply complete chaos if they are not, effectively, given a free pass to only make changes if they want (ie, which won't make much difference).
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,609

    AP - ‘Winnie the Pooh’ slasher film pulled from Hong Kong cinemas

    HONG KONG (AP) — Public screenings of a slasher film that features Winnie the Pooh were scrapped abruptly in Hong Kong on Tuesday, sparking discussions over increasing censorship in the city.

    Film distributor VII Pillars Entertainment announced on Facebook that the release of “Winnie the Pooh: Blood and Honey” on Thursday had been canceled with “great regret” in Hong Kong and neighboring Macao.

    In an email reply to The Associated Press, the distributor said it was notified by cinemas that they could not show the film as scheduled, but it didn’t know why. The cinema chains involved did not immediately reply to a request for comment.

    For many residents, the Winnie the Pooh character is a playful taunt of China’s President Xi Jinping and Chinese censors in the past had briefly banned social media searches for the bear in the country. In 2018, the film “Christopher Robin,” also featuring Winnie the Pooh, was reportedly denied a release in China.

    https://apnews.com/article/hong-kong-winnie-pooh-censorship-film-613ba02ab3cd453635f851bf1fbb071e

    SSI - so where/how do PBers stand on "Blood and Honey"?

    Not seen it, sadly.

    As for HK, they are lucky they still get to have 'discussions' sparked by such things. Won't be long before that is not permitted either.
  • Options
    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,075
    This is a really good article esp the 'suggestions' section.
  • Options

    AP - ‘Winnie the Pooh’ slasher film pulled from Hong Kong cinemas

    HONG KONG (AP) — Public screenings of a slasher film that features Winnie the Pooh were scrapped abruptly in Hong Kong on Tuesday, sparking discussions over increasing censorship in the city.

    Film distributor VII Pillars Entertainment announced on Facebook that the release of “Winnie the Pooh: Blood and Honey” on Thursday had been canceled with “great regret” in Hong Kong and neighboring Macao.

    In an email reply to The Associated Press, the distributor said it was notified by cinemas that they could not show the film as scheduled, but it didn’t know why. The cinema chains involved did not immediately reply to a request for comment.

    For many residents, the Winnie the Pooh character is a playful taunt of China’s President Xi Jinping and Chinese censors in the past had briefly banned social media searches for the bear in the country. In 2018, the film “Christopher Robin,” also featuring Winnie the Pooh, was reportedly denied a release in China.

    https://apnews.com/article/hong-kong-winnie-pooh-censorship-film-613ba02ab3cd453635f851bf1fbb071e

    SSI - so where/how do PBers stand on "Blood and Honey"?

    Terrible.

    Watch Cocaine Bear instead.
  • Options
    Top piece as usual, Cyclefree, but if I do have a criticism it is that it is too Met-oriented. There are four other Forces also under 'special measures'. That doesn't mean to say that those not in SM are necessarily good, they're just not bad enough to need outside help and controls.

    Common sense suggests that far from being exceptional, the Met is the currently very visible tip of the iceberg. The whole Force needs a shake-up, from top to bottom.
  • Options
    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,606

    WillG said:

    Well now (I fully these changes to unwind once Sunak has failed to stop the boats.)

    First lead for Sunak over Starmer in these seats since March 2022.

    At this moment, which of the following do Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the UK? (19 March)

    Sunak 37% (+3)
    Starmer 35% (-7)
    Don't Know 28% (+4)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638226510950572053

    Sounds like the Tories really need to do everything they can to stop the boats then.
    Nope, it's all about the cost of living.
    How is that causing a swingback?
    The voters don't like disorder and the boats coming over is disorder.

    Now they are liking the tough talk from the government on it, but when it proves to be all fart and no follow through it will lead to an unwind.

    Even if it a success, the voters will have seen prices go up nearly 20% over the last 2 years and pay hasn't matched that.

    It's the economy, stupid.
    But by the time the election arrives inflation will be back down to 1-2% and pay will still be rising at 5-7% a year because there is a skills and labour shortage that won't disappear for at least 3-6 years.

    People have short memories.
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,222
    Carnyx said:

    TOPPING said:

    Thing is if you throw out the bad 'uns how the hell do you man the police force? There simply aren't the bodies.

    Bring in rozzers from other countries. .
    What they used to do in Glasgow (and Edinburgh too). Bring in large, porridge, kale, neep, mince and milk fed countrymen with zero local loyalties.
    Lots of Met officers come from outside London. Wayne Couzens, to take one unfortunate example.
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,112
    Excellent piece by @Cyclefree again. The situation with the police is simply beyond endurance.

    To take a simple example how many officers have been disciplined for failing to report concerns about Wayne Couzens or David Carrick? Are we seriously to believe that their disgusting and vile prejudices and attitudes did not manifest themselves to their work colleagues? Are we to believe that they are so stupid, so incompetent, so incapable of drawing a basic inference that they did not notice? What the hell are they employed for if that is the case?

    There frankly should be a presumption of guilt for all officers and commanders who worked alongside those individuals or were responsible for their work. The onus should be on those concerned to prove how they missed this. If they cannot give an adequate explanation they should be gone.

    It is only by breaking through the culture of secrecy, the canteen culture and the tendency to look the other way that the police can be brought to a place where they are capable of policing themselves. Maybe then, just maybe, they might be capable of policing the rest of us.
  • Options
    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,788

    Well now (I fully these changes to unwind once Sunak has failed to stop the boats.)

    First lead for Sunak over Starmer in these seats since March 2022.

    At this moment, which of the following do Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the UK? (19 March)

    Sunak 37% (+3)
    Starmer 35% (-7)
    Don't Know 28% (+4)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638226510950572053

    I've always had my doubts about Keith's ability to appeal to the Red Wall given he did everything he could to cancel Brexit. Not that Rishi Rich appeals that much either but I think between the two a lot of Red Wall voters will probably stick with Con in the end.

    If Labour can win back half the seats they lost in the Red Wall they'll be doing well IMO.
  • Options
    Great to see a header from Cyclefree. And the final line is the absolute essence of it - if not now, when?

    But it won't happen:
    1. Tories/right too busy attacking wokeism. So having the Met full of rancid neandertals doesn't fit their narrative.
    2. Khan and Labour very clear that they would put the Met to the sword. So very likely that Braverman will do the opposite.

    In short - its a political football. And so at least until the next election we get to stand back and watch the Met continue to commit heinous abuses. Sometimes politics is shit. This shouldn't be political but it is.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,290
    edited March 2023
    "If not now, when ?"

    Almost certainly not under this Home Secretary, who sounds almost as much in denial as the chair of the Police Federation.

    Do Labour understand what's needed ?
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,222
    Stocky said:

    TOPPING said:

    We've got quite a lot of different experience on PB. Firefighters, doctors, teachers, etc.

    Do we have any polis? I would be very interested to get a from the horse's mouth account of what's happening.

    Who is the firefighter?

    (Asking for my wife.)
    That's the sort of banter that would have you slung out of the police, or at least be a footnote in the Casey Report.
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,202
    I agree with @Cyclefree - 98%

    We don't want the NI experience here - unless you want a police force that has a strange black hole for certain serious crimes.

    I would suggest that the political parties get together, come up with a non-political candidate for Police Minister. Kick them into the Lords, with the understanding they'll serve a decade.

    Otherwise the police will simply try and wait out a change in government and business as usual.
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,112

    I agree with @Cyclefree - 98%

    We don't want the NI experience here - unless you want a police force that has a strange black hole for certain serious crimes.

    I would suggest that the political parties get together, come up with a non-political candidate for Police Minister. Kick them into the Lords, with the understanding they'll serve a decade.

    Otherwise the police will simply try and wait out a change in government and business as usual.

    I nominate @Cyclefree
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,290

    Top piece as usual, Cyclefree, but if I do have a criticism it is that it is too Met-oriented. There are four other Forces also under 'special measures'. That doesn't mean to say that those not in SM are necessarily good, they're just not bad enough to need outside help and controls.

    Common sense suggests that far from being exceptional, the Met is the currently very visible tip of the iceberg. The whole Force needs a shake-up, from top to bottom.

    It's hardly the tip of the iceberg, since it accounts for about a quarter of policing in the country, but fair point.
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,034
    edited March 2023

    Watch the ERG and Boris Johnson undo all this hard work by Sunak.

    Labour leads by 16% in the Red Wall, down from 28% four weeks ago.

    Red Wall VI (19 March):

    Labour 48% (-3)
    Conservative 32% (+3)
    Reform UK 8% (-1)
    Liberal Democrat 6% (–)
    Green 4% (+2)
    Plaid Cymru 1% (–)
    Other 2% (–)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638223950374117379

    Labour are in trouble in the red wall in the coming Council elections. They will never meet expectations, not just on this red wall poll, but others in recent weeks.

    It was another recent redwall poll which first alerted us to the Tory surge, it seems red wall in particular are falling back in love with Tory’s again.
    Sunak leading SKS in red wall

    SKS fans please explain
    I like to think of myself as PB's most tiresome poster, but your Starmer drearfest has well and truly knocked me off my perch
    It's a betting site Pete.

    SKS trail Sunak in the red wall

    Could be an outlier.

    Could be very significant

    Sorry to bore you 🙂
    I don't believe your analysis of Starmer has been of any help to anyone's book, unless they have piled onto Starmer as next PM, comfortable in the knowledge that on your last outing you were four square behind a Corbyn victory.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,914
    DavidL said:

    I agree with @Cyclefree - 98%

    We don't want the NI experience here - unless you want a police force that has a strange black hole for certain serious crimes.

    I would suggest that the political parties get together, come up with a non-political candidate for Police Minister. Kick them into the Lords, with the understanding they'll serve a decade.

    Otherwise the police will simply try and wait out a change in government and business as usual.

    I nominate @Cyclefree
    I nominate @SeanT
  • Options
    DriverDriver Posts: 4,522

    I agree with @Cyclefree - 98%

    We don't want the NI experience here - unless you want a police force that has a strange black hole for certain serious crimes.

    I would suggest that the political parties get together, come up with a non-political candidate for Police Minister. Kick them into the Lords, with the understanding they'll serve a decade.

    Otherwise the police will simply try and wait out a change in government and business as usual.

    Good idea, but can you actually see the political parties working together?
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,935
    GIN1138 said:

    Well now (I fully these changes to unwind once Sunak has failed to stop the boats.)

    First lead for Sunak over Starmer in these seats since March 2022.

    At this moment, which of the following do Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the UK? (19 March)

    Sunak 37% (+3)
    Starmer 35% (-7)
    Don't Know 28% (+4)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638226510950572053

    I've always had my doubts about Keith's ability to appeal to the Red Wall given he did everything he could to cancel Brexit. Not that Rishi Rich appeals that much either but I think between the two a lot of Red Wall voters will probably stick with Con in the end.

    If Labour can win back half the seats they lost in the Red Wall they'll be doing well IMO.
    If Labour can't win back all the Red Wall seats it will need a lot of Remain and soft Leave seats to make up for that and get largest party
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,609

    I agree with @Cyclefree - 98%

    We don't want the NI experience here - unless you want a police force that has a strange black hole for certain serious crimes.

    I would suggest that the political parties get together, come up with a non-political candidate for Police Minister. Kick them into the Lords, with the understanding they'll serve a decade.

    Otherwise the police will simply try and wait out a change in government and business as usual.

    This is really good point. The Police know they can play for time because the Tories are on the way out and Labour will have enough to be getting on with, and won't want to be accused of not supporting the police.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,290
    kle4 said:

    I'm not sure I can stomach reading yet another official report about the police being crap which will receive strong words and then be mostly ignored yet again.

    One problem is things are clearly so bad that it appears unsolvable, or will be said to take a 'long time', when as cyclefree suggests a tight timetable would be possible, if there is the political and institutional will.

    There won't be. The Police rejected and obstructed previous reports, and they will again, they are already clawing on the sympathy arguments, and will stop at nothing to imply complete chaos if they are not, effectively, given a free pass to only make changes if they want (ie, which won't make much difference).

    It's far from insoluble - as Cyclefree suggests, it just requires absolute determination to address the problems head on.
    So not under this government, who are more concerned with playing politics with migrants.

  • Options
    RogerRoger Posts: 18,891
    Carnyx said:

    The Met make South Yorkshire Police look competent and of the highest probity.

    SYP did catch their Ripper, eventually. The Met didn't.
    Wasn't that after several years looking for someone with a Geordie accent?
  • Options
    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,624
    rcs1000 said:

    DavidL said:

    I agree with @Cyclefree - 98%

    We don't want the NI experience here - unless you want a police force that has a strange black hole for certain serious crimes.

    I would suggest that the political parties get together, come up with a non-political candidate for Police Minister. Kick them into the Lords, with the understanding they'll serve a decade.

    Otherwise the police will simply try and wait out a change in government and business as usual.

    I nominate @Cyclefree
    I nominate @SeanT
    Boris and Conte both likely to be out of a job soon. A job share between them could be ideal.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,929
    Roger said:

    Carnyx said:

    The Met make South Yorkshire Police look competent and of the highest probity.

    SYP did catch their Ripper, eventually. The Met didn't.
    Wasn't that after several years looking for someone with a Geordie accent?
    Wearside.
    But yes.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,290
    "Coming up with best practice is not hard. Rolling it out and embedding it is. "

    Resourcing what's needed is also going to be a problem. Making serious changes, and gaining acceptance for them, is very likely going to require spending more money.
  • Options
    StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 14,346
    MaxPB said:

    Watch the ERG and Boris Johnson undo all this hard work by Sunak.

    Labour leads by 16% in the Red Wall, down from 28% four weeks ago.

    Red Wall VI (19 March):

    Labour 48% (-3)
    Conservative 32% (+3)
    Reform UK 8% (-1)
    Liberal Democrat 6% (–)
    Green 4% (+2)
    Plaid Cymru 1% (–)
    Other 2% (–)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638223950374117379

    And if Rishi does manage to fix the boats issue the swingback gets much bigger and the seat loss in te red wall seats will be limited to a handful rather than a wipe out.

    As I've been saying, the route for the Tories to get a 1992 style cling on to power victory exists where it didn't under Boris or Liz Truss. They need everything to go right for them though.
    1992 is the story all Conservatives tell each other round the campfire, but something else needs to happen this time.

    After Major took over, the polls were pretty much nip'n'tuck until the election- the average never got beyond Labour +4 and the biggest single poll lead I can find was Labour +10.

    But the polls were wrong in a way that we now understand and correct for. There seems a decent chance that the Conservatives were ahead throughout, really. 1992 was a good win, but not a miracle.

    Now, even the most favourable single poll is Labour +10 on the new rules. The average is about Labour +18.

    Of course, there's time for that to change. But it will be one of the greatest political stories ever told.
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,202
    Driver said:

    I agree with @Cyclefree - 98%

    We don't want the NI experience here - unless you want a police force that has a strange black hole for certain serious crimes.

    I would suggest that the political parties get together, come up with a non-political candidate for Police Minister. Kick them into the Lords, with the understanding they'll serve a decade.

    Otherwise the police will simply try and wait out a change in government and business as usual.

    Good idea, but can you actually see the political parties working together?
    I nominate Vladimiro Lenin Ilich Montesinos Torres
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,290
    kle4 said:

    I agree with @Cyclefree - 98%

    We don't want the NI experience here - unless you want a police force that has a strange black hole for certain serious crimes.

    I would suggest that the political parties get together, come up with a non-political candidate for Police Minister. Kick them into the Lords, with the understanding they'll serve a decade.

    Otherwise the police will simply try and wait out a change in government and business as usual.

    This is really good point. The Police know they can play for time because the Tories are on the way out and Labour will have enough to be getting on with, and won't want to be accused of not supporting the police.
    If they had any sense, Labour will make very clear that the Met is a mess they are not going to ignore.
    It might even tempt me to vote for them. Craven triangulation certainly won't.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,929
    Carnyx said:

    The Met make South Yorkshire Police look competent and of the highest probity.

    SYP did catch their Ripper, eventually. The Met didn't.
    SYP weren't even after him.
    That was West Yorkshire Police.
    Two alert and inquisitive officers in South Yorkshire caught him acting suspiciously.
    Then found him tooled up and dressed for the occasion.
    Ironically. The photofit was the very spit of him.
    But WYP were after someone from Sunderland.
  • Options
    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,788
    edited March 2023
    HYUFD said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Well now (I fully these changes to unwind once Sunak has failed to stop the boats.)

    First lead for Sunak over Starmer in these seats since March 2022.

    At this moment, which of the following do Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the UK? (19 March)

    Sunak 37% (+3)
    Starmer 35% (-7)
    Don't Know 28% (+4)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638226510950572053

    I've always had my doubts about Keith's ability to appeal to the Red Wall given he did everything he could to cancel Brexit. Not that Rishi Rich appeals that much either but I think between the two a lot of Red Wall voters will probably stick with Con in the end.

    If Labour can win back half the seats they lost in the Red Wall they'll be doing well IMO.
    If Labour can't win back all the Red Wall seats it will need a lot of Remain and soft Leave seats to make up for that and get largest party
    I can see them winning back maybe half the seats they lost in the Red Wall and they should pick up a few in Scotland. They will also probably do well in the Peoples Republic of Wales.

    Labour will make substantial gains across the country when the election happens but the idea of a Labour landslide has always been fanciful.

    It will be nip and tuck whether they can get a majority or are just the biggest party in a hung parliament.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,567
    dixiedean said:

    Carnyx said:

    The Met make South Yorkshire Police look competent and of the highest probity.

    SYP did catch their Ripper, eventually. The Met didn't.
    SYP weren't even after him.
    That was West Yorkshire Police.
    Two alert and inquisitive officers in South Yorkshire caught him acting suspiciously.
    Then found him tooled up and dressed for the occasion.
    Ironically. The photofit was the very spit of him.
    But WYP were after someone from Sunderland.
    Ah, thanks!
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 47,999

    MaxPB said:

    Watch the ERG and Boris Johnson undo all this hard work by Sunak.

    Labour leads by 16% in the Red Wall, down from 28% four weeks ago.

    Red Wall VI (19 March):

    Labour 48% (-3)
    Conservative 32% (+3)
    Reform UK 8% (-1)
    Liberal Democrat 6% (–)
    Green 4% (+2)
    Plaid Cymru 1% (–)
    Other 2% (–)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638223950374117379

    And if Rishi does manage to fix the boats issue the swingback gets much bigger and the seat loss in te red wall seats will be limited to a handful rather than a wipe out.

    As I've been saying, the route for the Tories to get a 1992 style cling on to power victory exists where it didn't under Boris or Liz Truss. They need everything to go right for them though.
    1992 is the story all Conservatives tell each other round the campfire, but something else needs to happen this time.

    After Major took over, the polls were pretty much nip'n'tuck until the election- the average never got beyond Labour +4 and the biggest single poll lead I can find was Labour +10.

    But the polls were wrong in a way that we now understand and correct for. There seems a decent chance that the Conservatives were ahead throughout, really. 1992 was a good win, but not a miracle.

    Now, even the most favourable single poll is Labour +10 on the new rules. The average is about Labour +18.

    Of course, there's time for that to change. But it will be one of the greatest political stories ever told.
    Despite being Prime Minister, Sunak doesn't yet have the level of fame of a Boris, or a Blair, or a Thatcher. The potential is there for him to shift the polls considerable during a General Election campaign.

    The last two elections had results that didn't reflect anything like the polling a couple of months previously.
  • Options
    RandallFlaggRandallFlagg Posts: 1,155
    GIN1138 said:

    Well now (I fully these changes to unwind once Sunak has failed to stop the boats.)

    First lead for Sunak over Starmer in these seats since March 2022.

    At this moment, which of the following do Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the UK? (19 March)

    Sunak 37% (+3)
    Starmer 35% (-7)
    Don't Know 28% (+4)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638226510950572053

    I've always had my doubts about Keith's ability to appeal to the Red Wall given he did everything he could to cancel Brexit. Not that Rishi Rich appeals that much either but I think between the two a lot of Red Wall voters will probably stick with Con in the end.

    If Labour can win back half the seats they lost in the Red Wall they'll be doing well IMO.
    If Labour only win back half the seats in the Red Wall then Rishi will win the election. If you can't win back Stoke on Trent Central you are not going to win marginals like Nuneaton.
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    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,788
    edited March 2023
    No Change with Survation...

    EDIT: However, it is another poll that has Con at or above 30% rather than in the 20s...
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    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,187
    Happy Valley, Line of Duty, The Bay, The Gold, Broadchurch, Inspector Morse, Endeavour, Unforgotten, Life on Mars, Ashes to Ashes, Cracker, Vera, Prime Suspect, Bodyguard, Luther, Criminal, Heartbeat, Inspector George Gently, Between the Lines, Foyle’s War.

    What does that tell you about regional detective shows?
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    mickydroymickydroy Posts: 233
    GIN1138 said:

    HYUFD said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Well now (I fully these changes to unwind once Sunak has failed to stop the boats.)

    First lead for Sunak over Starmer in these seats since March 2022.

    At this moment, which of the following do Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the UK? (19 March)

    Sunak 37% (+3)
    Starmer 35% (-7)
    Don't Know 28% (+4)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638226510950572053

    I've always had my doubts about Keith's ability to appeal to the Red Wall given he did everything he could to cancel Brexit. Not that Rishi Rich appeals that much either but I think between the two a lot of Red Wall voters will probably stick with Con in the end.

    If Labour can win back half the seats they lost in the Red Wall they'll be doing well IMO.
    If Labour can't win back all the Red Wall seats it will need a lot of Remain and soft Leave seats to make up for that and get largest party
    I can see them winning back maybe half the seats they lost in the Red Wall and they should pick up a few in Scotland. They will also probably do well in the Peoples Republic of Wales.

    Labour will make substantial gains across the country when the election happens but the idea of a Labour landslide has always been fanciful.

    It will be nip and tuck whether they can get a majority or are just the biggest party in a hung parliament.
    Totally agree, Labour are never going to win by a landslide, I think it could be really close, scotland is massive for them, I wouldnt be at all surprised to see MPs like 30p Lee Anderson winning again, which probably says more about the great British electorate, than it does about him
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    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,606

    MaxPB said:

    Watch the ERG and Boris Johnson undo all this hard work by Sunak.

    Labour leads by 16% in the Red Wall, down from 28% four weeks ago.

    Red Wall VI (19 March):

    Labour 48% (-3)
    Conservative 32% (+3)
    Reform UK 8% (-1)
    Liberal Democrat 6% (–)
    Green 4% (+2)
    Plaid Cymru 1% (–)
    Other 2% (–)


    https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1638223950374117379

    And if Rishi does manage to fix the boats issue the swingback gets much bigger and the seat loss in te red wall seats will be limited to a handful rather than a wipe out.

    As I've been saying, the route for the Tories to get a 1992 style cling on to power victory exists where it didn't under Boris or Liz Truss. They need everything to go right for them though.
    1992 is the story all Conservatives tell each other round the campfire, but something else needs to happen this time.

    After Major took over, the polls were pretty much nip'n'tuck until the election- the average never got beyond Labour +4 and the biggest single poll lead I can find was Labour +10.

    But the polls were wrong in a way that we now understand and correct for. There seems a decent chance that the Conservatives were ahead throughout, really. 1992 was a good win, but not a miracle.

    Now, even the most favourable single poll is Labour +10 on the new rules. The average is about Labour +18.

    Of course, there's time for that to change. But it will be one of the greatest political stories ever told.
    Despite being Prime Minister, Sunak doesn't yet have the level of fame of a Boris, or a Blair, or a Thatcher. The potential is there for him to shift the polls considerable during a General Election campaign.

    The last two elections had results that didn't reflect anything like the polling a couple of months previously.
    What's also becoming clear is that the more voters see Rishi the more thet take to him. His ratings go up when he's more visible, that's an asset very few politicians have, Starmer definitely doesn't have it. When people see him they think him a dreary man with no vision or dreams. It's a complete turn off.
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    Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 30,911
    tlg86 said:

    Happy Valley, Line of Duty, The Bay, The Gold, Broadchurch, Inspector Morse, Endeavour, Unforgotten, Life on Mars, Ashes to Ashes, Cracker, Vera, Prime Suspect, Bodyguard, Luther, Criminal, Heartbeat, Inspector George Gently, Between the Lines, Foyle’s War.

    What does that tell you about regional detective shows?

    There are a lot of them?
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    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,929
    edited March 2023
    I can thoroughly recommend "Wicked Beyond Belief" by ST journalist Michael Bilton, if anyone wants to know the full story of the hunt for the Yorkshire Ripper.
    Incompetent Beyond Belief would be another suitable title.
    Even when SYP had him with all the tools he used and some interesting underwear arrangements, being a lorry driver, hanging round a Red Light area, looking identical to the photofit, they still were dubious.
    As he had no religious beliefs (they were convinced this was his motive. It wasn't. He was attacking women, not sex workers). And him not being from Sunderland. And that they'd interviewed him double figures times. So it couldn't be him. (Despite almost every male in Yorkshire having been interviewed.
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    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,187

    tlg86 said:

    Happy Valley, Line of Duty, The Bay, The Gold, Broadchurch, Inspector Morse, Endeavour, Unforgotten, Life on Mars, Ashes to Ashes, Cracker, Vera, Prime Suspect, Bodyguard, Luther, Criminal, Heartbeat, Inspector George Gently, Between the Lines, Foyle’s War.

    What does that tell you about regional detective shows?

    There are a lot of them?
    Nearly! I was hoping someone would say "there's too many of them?"

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VCt1yRMjo0A
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