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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » By-Election Preview : January 23rd 2014

SystemSystem Posts: 12,214
edited January 2014 in General

politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » By-Election Preview : January 23rd 2014

Motherwell North on North Lanarkshire (Lab Defence)
Result of last election to council (2012): Labour 41, SNP 26, Independents 2, Cumbernauld Independents 1 (Labour overall majority of 12)
Result of ward at last election (2012):

Read the full story here


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Comments

  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,410
    Test of tartan fortunes here.
  • Are we watching BBC or ITV though?
  • RodCrosbyRodCrosby Posts: 7,737
    I guess my challenge scared everyone away...
    ;-)
  • taffystaffys Posts: 9,753
    Telly running a story about alleged Labour attempts to scupper the referendum Bill.

    should the tories be making more of this? 'denying you a say'
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    taffys said:

    Telly running a story about alleged Labour attempts to scupper the referendum Bill.

    should the tories be making more of this? 'denying you a say'

    Cammo would love to say that the labour Lords killed the referendum bill. He would be chuckling all the way to No 10. He could then - tongue in cheek - say to his backbenchers; "well I did promise, but you know how these things are?"
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,514
    MikeK said:

    taffys said:

    Telly running a story about alleged Labour attempts to scupper the referendum Bill.

    should the tories be making more of this? 'denying you a say'

    Cammo would love to say that the labour Lords killed the referendum bill. He would be chuckling all the way to No 10. He could then - tongue in cheek - say to his backbenchers; "well I did promise, but you know how these things are?"
    Zzzzzzzz
  • FregglesFreggles Posts: 3,486
    Just got round to watching the latest Sherlock. Ludicrous yet enjoyable.
    The shark will be well and truly jumped if Moriarty is alive, though. I suspect Sherlock may have been behind the video
  • taffystaffys Posts: 9,753
    "well I did promise, but you know how these things are?"

    UKIP could use it as well. You could have a poster of a blue collar worker with a gag and a likeness of Ed standing behind him, pulling it tight and grinning.

    Incredibly, I don;t charge for this stuff...
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,410
    ALERT - The Diplomacy game has just gone down for me -
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,016
    Freggles said:

    Just got round to watching the latest Sherlock. Ludicrous yet enjoyable.
    The shark will be well and truly jumped if Moriarty is alive, though. I suspect Sherlock may have been behind the video

    I finally watched the last episode of the latest series last night. Slightly underwhelmed to be honest. The really clever solution to a complicated blackmailer was to shoot him? A man with Sherlock's observational skills never noticed that someone he had a lot of contact with was a trained killer? The video on the house? The drug stuff that didn't go anywhere. All a bit silly I thought.

    I have been catching up with some of the second series. Much, much better.

  • GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    Pulpstar said:

    ALERT - The Diplomacy game has just gone down for me -

    Down and back up faster than a Thai hooker.

  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,341
    edited January 2014
    AveryLP Posts: 5,138
    8:08PM edited 8:10PM
    MonikerDiCanio said:
    The madness of Alex Salmond;
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/10593197/Alex-Salmond-rejects-luxury-hotel-spending-criticism-as-ridiculous-frippery.html

    Mrs Lamont continued to press him how the money was spent and a stay for him and his wife in the luxury Peninsula Hotel, which is popular with stars such as Brad Pitt and Justin Bieber and charges more than £1,200 per night for a suite.

    Perhaps Eck will be adopting Justin Bieber's most recent form of accommodation.

    Hmm, we'll see what the details turn out to be, but the DT and Ms L are not well known for telling the whole truth if it relates in any way to the SNP. (If most Tories on this website read the DT, then that would certainly explain a few things that have been puzzling me.)

    The other media outlets do not seem to be jumping on this. Even Ms Davidson (who is as any fule kno leader of the Tory Party in the Scottish Pmt) did not pick up on this at First Mins Questions, acc to the BBC website for the Scottish news (Brian Taylor) who is more interested in reporting Ms L than the supposed story. I see Ms L or the DT (whichver it is) carefully does not say that Mr S DID take a suite at that price (presumably the highest brochure price) while gleefully implying that he did. Like the Gleneagles Hotel story of a few months ago, which was started on the same basis that Salmond MIGHT have taken the bridal suite or whatever it was called ....

    And back to Dunfermline - there seems rather little media coverage here, which if true presumably reflects everyone's expectation that it will be a Lab hold.
  • FregglesFreggles Posts: 3,486
    DavidL said:

    Freggles said:

    Just got round to watching the latest Sherlock. Ludicrous yet enjoyable.
    The shark will be well and truly jumped if Moriarty is alive, though. I suspect Sherlock may have been behind the video

    I finally watched the last episode of the latest series last night. Slightly underwhelmed to be honest. The really clever solution to a complicated blackmailer was to shoot him? A man with Sherlock's observational skills never noticed that someone he had a lot of contact with was a trained killer? The video on the house? The drug stuff that didn't go anywhere. All a bit silly I thought.

    I have been catching up with some of the second series. Much, much better.

    I'll be the first (or second after Mrs Freggles) to admit I don't view TV critically and stuff like this generally passes me by until it's pointed out.
    There are a few episodes I haven't seen so will go back and view them.
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    edited January 2014
    Freggles said:

    DavidL said:

    Freggles said:

    Just got round to watching the latest Sherlock. Ludicrous yet enjoyable.
    The shark will be well and truly jumped if Moriarty is alive, though. I suspect Sherlock may have been behind the video

    I finally watched the last episode of the latest series last night. Slightly underwhelmed to be honest. The really clever solution to a complicated blackmailer was to shoot him? A man with Sherlock's observational skills never noticed that someone he had a lot of contact with was a trained killer? The video on the house? The drug stuff that didn't go anywhere. All a bit silly I thought.

    I have been catching up with some of the second series. Much, much better.

    I'll be the first (or second after Mrs Freggles) to admit I don't view TV critically and stuff like this generally passes me by until it's pointed out.
    There are a few episodes I haven't seen so will go back and view them.
    There was only one film actor for me, that could play Sherlock Holmes and that was Basil Rathbone in the 1940's. None measure up to him.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,469
    Freggles said:

    Just got round to watching the latest Sherlock. Ludicrous yet enjoyable.
    The shark will be well and truly jumped if Moriarty is alive, though. I suspect Sherlock may have been behind the video

    Is this my cue to say: Sherlock's cr@p?
  • Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530
    edited January 2014
    taffys said:

    Telly running a story about alleged Labour attempts to scupper the referendum Bill.

    should the tories be making more of this? 'denying you a say'

    You do realise labour are in opposition and the tories are in power?

    If the referendum Bill fails tory backbenchers will know exactly why. It's the same reason they've believed all the ludicrous Cast Iron Pledges and posturing before from Cameron on Europe. Tory Eurosceptics and backbenchers are just very, very gullible.
  • Carynx - You have failed to make that post confusing enough, please try again.
  • anotherDaveanotherDave Posts: 6,746
    MikeK said:

    Freggles said:

    DavidL said:

    Freggles said:

    Just got round to watching the latest Sherlock. Ludicrous yet enjoyable.
    The shark will be well and truly jumped if Moriarty is alive, though. I suspect Sherlock may have been behind the video

    I finally watched the last episode of the latest series last night. Slightly underwhelmed to be honest. The really clever solution to a complicated blackmailer was to shoot him? A man with Sherlock's observational skills never noticed that someone he had a lot of contact with was a trained killer? The video on the house? The drug stuff that didn't go anywhere. All a bit silly I thought.

    I have been catching up with some of the second series. Much, much better.

    I'll be the first (or second after Mrs Freggles) to admit I don't view TV critically and stuff like this generally passes me by until it's pointed out.
    There are a few episodes I haven't seen so will go back and view them.
    There was only one film actor for me, that could play Sherlock Holmes and that was Basil Rathbone in the 1940's. None measure up to him.
    Watson was the star of the Basil Rathbone ones. :-)
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,341
    edited January 2014

    Carynx - You have failed to make that post confusing enough, please try again.

    Sorry. Fouled up the little arrows. Thanks for telling me. Trying again ...
    AveryLP said:

    Mrs Lamont continued to press him how the money was spent and a stay for him and his wife in the luxury Peninsula Hotel, which is popular with stars such as Brad Pitt and Justin Bieber and charges more than £1,200 per night for a suite.

    Perhaps Eck will be adopting Justin Bieber's most recent form of accommodation.

    Hmm, we'll see what the details turn out to be, but the DT and Ms Lamont (whose attack on the First Minister at FM's Questions was the source) are not well known for telling the whole truth if it relates in any way to the SNP. (If most Tories on this website read the DT, then that would certainly explain a few things that have been puzzling me.)

    The other media outlets do not seem to be jumping on this. Even Ms Davidson (who is as any fule kno leader of the Tory Party in the Scottish Pmt) did not pick up on this at First Mins Questions, acc to the BBC website for the Scottish news (Brian Taylor) who is more interested in reporting Ms L than the supposed story. I see Ms L or the DT (whichver it is) carefully does not say that Mr S DID take a suite at that price (presumably the highest brochure price) while gleefully implying that he did. Like the Gleneagles Hotel story of a few months ago, which was started on the same basis that Salmond MIGHT have taken the bridal suite or whatever it was called ....

    And back to Dunfermline - there seems rather little media coverage here, which if true presumably reflects everyone's expectation that it will be a Lab hold.

  • Carnyx said:

    AveryLP Posts: 5,138
    8:08PM edited 8:10PM
    MonikerDiCanio said:
    The madness of Alex Salmond;
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/10593197/Alex-Salmond-rejects-luxury-hotel-spending-criticism-as-ridiculous-frippery.html

    Mrs Lamont continued to press him how the money was spent and a stay for him and his wife in the luxury Peninsula Hotel, which is popular with stars such as Brad Pitt and Justin Bieber and charges more than £1,200 per night for a suite.

    Perhaps Eck will be adopting Justin Bieber's most recent form of accommodation.

    Hmm, we'll see what the details turn out to be, but the DT and Ms L are not well known for telling the whole truth if it relates in any way to the SNP. (If most Tories on this website read the DT, then that would certainly explain a few things that have been puzzling me.)

    The other media outlets do not seem to be jumping on this. Even Ms Davidson (who is as any fule kno leader of the Tory Party in the Scottish Pmt) did not pick up on this at First Mins Questions, acc to the BBC website for the Scottish news (Brian Taylor) who is more interested in reporting Ms L than the supposed story. I see Ms L or the DT (whichver it is) carefully does not say that Mr S DID take a suite at that price (presumably the highest brochure price) while gleefully implying that he did. Like the Gleneagles Hotel story of a few months ago, which was started on the same basis that Salmond MIGHT have taken the bridal suite or whatever it was called ....

    And back to Dunfermline - there seems rather little media coverage here, which if true presumably reflects everyone's expectation that it will be a Lab hold.

    The First Minister is quite right not to apologize. He deserves every last penny out of the stooges who vote for him.

    http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/alex-salmond-under-fire-staying-3054570
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead falls to three points: CON 35%, LAB 38%, LDEM 8%, UKIP 12%
  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815

    Carynx - You have failed to make that post confusing enough, please try again.

    It is confusing.

    I think Carnyx is saying Eck booked the Presidential Suite but the hotel got the year of booking wrong.

  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    edited January 2014
    Scott_P said:

    Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead falls to three points: CON 35%, LAB 38%, LDEM 8%, UKIP 12%

    Compouter will be relieved of his burden soon.

    3%. A Marmite Dropper.

  • Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530
    edited January 2014
    john_zims said:

    @MonikerDiCanio

    'The madness of Alex Salmond;'

    The greed & arrogance is staggering.

    ROFL

    PB tories fall over themselves to believe the same old labour spin on a story that nobody took seriously months ago and aren't about to just because Lamont and the Torygraph are shrieking about it yet again.

    The PB tory gullibility and ignorance is staggering.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @chrisshipitv: The full version of today's events on Mike Hancock MP will only be found on @itvnews Next.
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053

    MikeK said:

    Freggles said:

    DavidL said:

    Freggles said:

    Just got round to watching the latest Sherlock. Ludicrous yet enjoyable.
    The shark will be well and truly jumped if Moriarty is alive, though. I suspect Sherlock may have been behind the video

    I finally watched the last episode of the latest series last night. Slightly underwhelmed to be honest. The really clever solution to a complicated blackmailer was to shoot him? A man with Sherlock's observational skills never noticed that someone he had a lot of contact with was a trained killer? The video on the house? The drug stuff that didn't go anywhere. All a bit silly I thought.

    I have been catching up with some of the second series. Much, much better.

    I'll be the first (or second after Mrs Freggles) to admit I don't view TV critically and stuff like this generally passes me by until it's pointed out.
    There are a few episodes I haven't seen so will go back and view them.
    There was only one film actor for me, that could play Sherlock Holmes and that was Basil Rathbone in the 1940's. None measure up to him.
    Watson was the star of the Basil Rathbone ones. :-)
    Watson was played for laughs by Nigel Bruce. However that doesn't detract from Rathbones superb performances.

  • HurstLlamaHurstLlama Posts: 9,098
    Pulpstar said:

    ALERT - The Diplomacy game has just gone down for me -

    Probably a mercy. Sit quietly and take deep breaths, not to mention a stiff whisky or two, before you look at it again. And I am sorry.

  • GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    AveryLP said:

    Scott_P said:

    Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead falls to three points: CON 35%, LAB 38%, LDEM 8%, UKIP 12%

    Compouter will be relieved of his burden soon.

    3%. A Marmite Dropper.

    Is there any Marmite-related advertising with racial overtones we need to carefully avoid?

    Just asking for a friend.

  • AveryLP said:



    Good evening Avery.

    I notice you failed to take up my bet on government borrowing instead preferring some spinning about car sales.

    Perhaps we could frame a bet on whether industrial ouput or retail sales will rise most during this government ?


  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    GeoffM said:

    AveryLP said:

    Scott_P said:

    Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead falls to three points: CON 35%, LAB 38%, LDEM 8%, UKIP 12%

    Compouter will be relieved of his burden soon.

    3%. A Marmite Dropper.

    Is there any Marmite-related advertising with racial overtones we need to carefully avoid?

    Just asking for a friend.

    You are quite right to warn me, Geoff.

    I assume this is the story to which you are alluding.

    http://bit.ly/1ffRJhq

    Are all our preserves and toast spreads tainted?
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Given the ageing population, you'd expect crime to be falling. Whether it's dropping once you control for that factor would be interesting to know.
  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    edited January 2014

    AveryLP said:



    Good evening Avery.

    I notice you failed to take up my bet on government borrowing instead preferring some spinning about car sales.

    Perhaps we could frame a bet on whether industrial ouput or retail sales will rise most during this government ?


    Good Evening, ar.

    You didn't read my post to Little Cub Scout.

    Therein I revealed that Public Sector Net Debt had risen by the full amount of £7 million between the end of f/y 2009/10 and end December 2013.

    Betting with you that it increases by more than £497 million within fifteen months would be the equivalent of robbing a food bank.

    I simply don't have the moral courage to contemplate it.

  • DavidL said:

    Freggles said:

    Just got round to watching the latest Sherlock. Ludicrous yet enjoyable.
    The shark will be well and truly jumped if Moriarty is alive, though. I suspect Sherlock may have been behind the video

    I finally watched the last episode of the latest series last night. Slightly underwhelmed to be honest. The really clever solution to a complicated blackmailer was to shoot him? A man with Sherlock's observational skills never noticed that someone he had a lot of contact with was a trained killer? The video on the house? The drug stuff that didn't go anywhere. All a bit silly I thought.

    I have been catching up with some of the second series. Much, much better.

    I agree with every word David - the final part was massively overrated. It was the worst of the three this series.

    YouGov: Labour share solid - Tory numbers keep going up and down. Don't know what to make of it all to be honest.
  • GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    AveryLP said:

    GeoffM said:

    AveryLP said:

    Scott_P said:

    Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead falls to three points: CON 35%, LAB 38%, LDEM 8%, UKIP 12%

    Compouter will be relieved of his burden soon.

    3%. A Marmite Dropper.

    Is there any Marmite-related advertising with racial overtones we need to carefully avoid?

    Just asking for a friend.

    You are quite right to warn me, Geoff.

    I assume this is the story to which you are alluding.

    http://bit.ly/1ffRJhq

    Are all our preserves and toast spreads tainted?
    Indeed. Tread lightly and cautiously, Mr LP.

  • compouter2compouter2 Posts: 2,371
    AveryLP said:

    Scott_P said:

    Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead falls to three points: CON 35%, LAB 38%, LDEM 8%, UKIP 12%

    Compouter will be relieved of his burden soon.

    3%. A Marmite Dropper.

    .....moves on yet again.

    And yet again the polling crossover Jonah makes his statement.

    Avery LP, you are the Man United of polling predictions.
  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815

    AveryLP said:

    Scott_P said:

    Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead falls to three points: CON 35%, LAB 38%, LDEM 8%, UKIP 12%

    Compouter will be relieved of his burden soon.

    3%. A Marmite Dropper.

    .....moves on yet again.

    And yet again the polling crossover Jonah makes his statement.

    Avery LP, you are the Man United of polling predictions.
    Very kind of you to say so, compouter.

    It is always best in times of uncertainty to place faith in one's past record.

  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,889
    edited January 2014
    Some Tory MPs say Ed Miliband much nicer than Cameron and he speaks to them in the corridors of Westminster and even sends them congratulatory notes after a good speech!
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/politics/article3983387.ece
  • AveryLP said:

    AveryLP said:



    Good evening Avery.

    I notice you failed to take up my bet on government borrowing instead preferring some spinning about car sales.

    Perhaps we could frame a bet on whether industrial ouput or retail sales will rise most during this government ?


    Good Evening, ar.

    You didn't read my post to Little Cub Scout.

    Therein I revealed that Public Sector Net Debt had risen by the full amount of £7 million between the end of f/y 2009/10 and end December 2013.

    Betting with you that it increases by more than £497 million within fifteen months would be the equivalent of robbing a food bank.

    I simply don't have the moral courage to contemplate it.

    I was amused (and noticed myself yesturday from the ONS publication) that you can't even peddle that crap about the government paying down the debt on a measure nobody else pays any attention to.

    But surely you're not willing to concede that the economy will have become more unbalanced under Osborne's stewardship.

    I can imagine what our Field Marshal friend will say.

    And here's another bet you may be interested in:

    That there be a single month's trade surplus before May 2015.

    After all every previous government has managed at least one, surely Osborne isn't going to preside over 60 months of trade deficit after all that speechifying he has done ?
  • compouter2compouter2 Posts: 2,371
    AveryLP said:

    AveryLP said:

    Scott_P said:

    Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead falls to three points: CON 35%, LAB 38%, LDEM 8%, UKIP 12%

    Compouter will be relieved of his burden soon.

    3%. A Marmite Dropper.

    .....moves on yet again.

    And yet again the polling crossover Jonah makes his statement.

    Avery LP, you are the Man United of polling predictions.
    Very kind of you to say so, compouter.

    It is always best in times of uncertainty to place faith in one's past record.

    I am sure you will give it the your usual squirrel treatment when it goes back up again tomorrow.

    Err....poll....what poll?
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    UKIP have a chance of beating the LDs tonight in the Cowdenbeath by-election despite it being one of the worst parts of the country for Farage's party. They might even get close to the Tories.
  • HYUFD said:

    Some Tory MPs say Ed Miliband much nicer than Cameron and he speaks to them in the corridors of Westminster and even sends them congratulatory notes after a good speech!
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/politics/article3983387.ece

    Ed "Nice Guy" Miliband, just ask his brother.
  • LennonLennon Posts: 1,782
    AndyJS said:

    UKIP have a chance of beating the LDs tonight in the Cowdenbeath by-election despite it being one of the worst parts of the country for Farage's party. They might even get close to the Tories.

    When are we expecting a result? Later this evening, or are they delaying counting till tomorrow do you know?

  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    edited January 2014

    AveryLP said:

    AveryLP said:



    Good evening Avery.

    I notice you failed to take up my bet on government borrowing instead preferring some spinning about car sales.

    Perhaps we could frame a bet on whether industrial ouput or retail sales will rise most during this government ?


    Good Evening, ar.

    You didn't read my post to Little Cub Scout.

    Therein I revealed that Public Sector Net Debt had risen by the full amount of £7 million between the end of f/y 2009/10 and end December 2013.

    Betting with you that it increases by more than £497 million within fifteen months would be the equivalent of robbing a food bank.

    I simply don't have the moral courage to contemplate it.

    I was amused (and noticed myself yesturday from the ONS publication) that you can't even peddle that crap about the government paying down the debt on a measure nobody else pays any attention to.

    But surely you're not willing to concede that the economy will have become more unbalanced under Osborne's stewardship.

    I can imagine what our Field Marshal friend will say.

    And here's another bet you may be interested in:

    That there be a single month's trade surplus before May 2015.

    After all every previous government has managed at least one, surely Osborne isn't going to preside over 60 months of trade deficit after all that speechifying he has done ?
    Nah, we won't get a trade surplus before the election, ar. The trade deficit will though narrow on, say, a twelve month average trend.

    Oil and gas extraction has fallen and is continuing to fall too rapidly and the positive balance in services needs another year or two of City recovery to compensate. Manufacturing exports will though start to reverse its falling trend.

    Still, I do expect a trade surplus in the 2015-2020 period, provided the electorate are not idiots in May 2015.

  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    HYUFD said:

    Some Tory MPs say Ed Miliband much nicer than Cameron and he speaks to them in the corridors of Westminster and even sends them congratulatory notes after a good speech!
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/politics/article3983387.ece

    Oily little creep is our Ed.

  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Lennon said:

    AndyJS said:

    UKIP have a chance of beating the LDs tonight in the Cowdenbeath by-election despite it being one of the worst parts of the country for Farage's party. They might even get close to the Tories.

    When are we expecting a result? Later this evening, or are they delaying counting till tomorrow do you know?

    Tonight. Live blog:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-25872510
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited January 2014
    HYUFD said:

    Some Tory MPs say Ed Miliband much nicer than Cameron and he speaks to them in the corridors of Westminster and even sends them congratulatory notes after a good speech!
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/politics/article3983387.ece

    I think he probably is nicer on a personal level.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Cock-up at the start of tonight's Newsnight from Davos with Paxman and guests not realising the show had started.
  • Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530
    edited January 2014
    HYUFD said:

    Some Tory MPs say Ed Miliband much nicer than Cameron and he speaks to them in the corridors of Westminster and even sends them congratulatory notes after a good speech!
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/politics/article3983387.ece

    Not hard to work out why, is it?
    Eurosceptics treated Cameron like a foul smell

    Betrayed by their hero, Cameron's eurosceptics are quickly returning to their bitter, angry roots.

    The last time David Cameron updated the Commons on his return from Brussels he was treated like a hero. The acclaim appeared to have no limits; the prodigal son, had he seen this display of lionising, must have felt like a big disappointment upon his own return. What a difference a follow-up summit makes. Today the Tory eurosceptics edged away from the PM, collectively wrinkling their noses as if he had made a bad smell.

    http://www.politics.co.uk/comment-analysis/2012/01/31/sketch-eurosceptics-treated-cameron-like-a-foul-smell

    Tom McTague ‏@MirrorMcTague

    Michael Gove turned around and shouted at his fellow Tory MPs: "Disgrace, disgrace, disgrace."

    Sam Coates Times ‏@SamCoatesTimes

    William Hague stresses he & Cameron will not seek unilateral repatriation of powers from EU as part of renegotiation http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/politics/article3818130.ece

    James Wonnacott ‏@JamesWonnacott

    Another big name says #no2eu Michael Portillo: Cameron's EU referendum is an 'insincere ploy' via @Telegraph http://soa.li/OlB5ajl
  • AveryLP said:



    Still, I do expect a trade surplus in the 2015-2020 period, provided the electorate are not idiots in May 2015.

    The trade surplus will only come when there is a reduction in comsumption of imports.

    Our economic problems stem from our consumption addiction, whether that be the trade deficit, the level of debt, collapsing pension provision or lack of investment.

    It even has non-economic drawbacks such as the increase in obesity.

    But no government will now pull the plug on overconsumption because there are too many voters addicted to it.

    The most malign phrases of the past decade were "Don't put if off, put it on" and "Because I'm worth it".
  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815

    AveryLP said:



    Still, I do expect a trade surplus in the 2015-2020 period, provided the electorate are not idiots in May 2015.

    The trade surplus will only come when there is a reduction in comsumption of imports.

    Our economic problems stem from our consumption addiction, whether that be the trade deficit, the level of debt, collapsing pension provision or lack of investment.

    It even has non-economic drawbacks such as the increase in obesity.

    But no government will now pull the plug on overconsumption because there are too many voters addicted to it.

    The most malign phrases of the past decade were "Don't put if off, put it on" and "Because I'm worth it".
    I would have been readier to agree if you had inserted the qualifier "relative" before the word consumption on your first line.

    Osborne is a chancellor who charts a course around storms rather than through them. Balance is all.

    Give him time he will reach his destination. The risk of being sunk is too high to recommend the brave but foolhardy alternate.

  • AndyJS said:

    HYUFD said:

    Some Tory MPs say Ed Miliband much nicer than Cameron and he speaks to them in the corridors of Westminster and even sends them congratulatory notes after a good speech!
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/politics/article3983387.ece

    I think he probably is nicer on a personal level.
    I can't remember any equivalent anecdotes such as the two Charles tells about Cameron.
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    Trying to watch QT from Scotland and have given up in exasperation. For the simple reason that Scotland is a foreign country, I can't understand the language and we (the rest of England and Wales) would be better off without them.

    Now before you jump on me; this is my own personal opinion, and has nothing to do with UKIP policy on Scotland.
  • Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530
    Gareth Baines ‏@GABaines

    Evidence has emerged supporting UKIP Councillor David Silvester's claims that gays cause bad weather... pic.twitter.com/OLWTQhjlGY
    *chortle*
  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    Mick_Pork said:

    Gareth Baines ‏@GABaines

    Evidence has emerged supporting UKIP Councillor David Silvester's claims that gays cause bad weather... pic.twitter.com/OLWTQhjlGY
    *chortle*

    Pigs can fly, Pork!

  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,889
    Moniker Indeed, he is the smiling assassin! Avery Well some Tory MPs seem to have fallen for it. Andy JS Probably, but we are voting for a party and a PM not a best friend.

    MickPork Cameron is probably the most presidential PM in some ways we have had, even more than Blair, because he is governing in a Coalition and can basically ignore most of his backbenchers
  • GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    edited January 2014
    AndyJS said:

    Lennon said:

    AndyJS said:

    UKIP have a chance of beating the LDs tonight in the Cowdenbeath by-election despite it being one of the worst parts of the country for Farage's party. They might even get close to the Tories.

    When are we expecting a result? Later this evening, or are they delaying counting till tomorrow do you know?

    Tonight. Live blog:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-25872510
    Thanks for the link. It's a bit rubbish though, with entries like:
    Paul Hutcheon, Sunday Herald tweets: How would Robert Burns have voted in #Cowdenbeath?

    The same way as other people did - through a combination of using a ballot paper and not being dead.

    The second point isn't necessarily a show-stopper, though, as the dead have quite a long standing tradition of casting votes for Labour and Sinn Féin.

  • MrJonesMrJones Posts: 3,523
    BBC did a whole segment on crime falling without mentioning the children's commissioner's report on youth gang related violence in the inner cities. The gang-culture not existing in the BBC's version of reality but very much existing in the true version of reality is relevant to the Ukip vote btw.
  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,320
    I could say the same thing about you and your views on this forum, but I wouldn't dream of telling you to sling your hook because I don't understand or agree with your views! I think that the UK has been all the richer for having such a diverse mix of the English, Welsh, Irish and Scots, just as this forum is all the richer for such a diversity of opinions and knowledge on a whole range of subjects such as politics, betting and even cats!
    MikeK said:

    Trying to watch QT from Scotland and have given up in exasperation. For the simple reason that Scotland is a foreign country, I can't understand the language and we (the rest of England and Wales) would be better off without them.

    Now before you jump on me; this is my own personal opinion, and has nothing to do with UKIP policy on Scotland.

  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,149
    edited January 2014
    MikeK said:


    Now before you jump on me; this is my own personal opinion, and has nothing to do with UKIP policy on Scotland.

    Your leader seems to be able to slough off his previous manifesto commitments at the drop of a trilby, so maybe this will be UKIP policy by tomorrow (unless of course they make the great leap forward of finally retaining a Scottish deposit tonight).
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    edited January 2014

    MikeK said:


    Now before you jump on me; this is my own personal opinion, and has nothing to do with UKIP policy on Scotland.

    Your leader seems to be able to slough off his previous manifesto commitments at the drop of a trilby, so maybe this will be UKIP policy by tomorrow (unless of course they make the great leap forward of finally retaining a Scottish deposit tonight).
    I would think the Lab/Lib/Con parties should keep quiet about their manifesto promises.
  • anotherDaveanotherDave Posts: 6,746

    MikeK said:


    Now before you jump on me; this is my own personal opinion, and has nothing to do with UKIP policy on Scotland.

    Your leader seems to be able to slough off his previous manifesto commitments at the drop of a trilby, so maybe this will be UKIP policy by tomorrow (unless of course they make the great leap forward of finally retaining a Scottish deposit tonight).
    The last Labour gov't went to court to establish that their manifesto commitments were meaningless.

  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    fitalass said:

    I could say the same thing about you and your views on this forum, but I wouldn't dream of telling you to sling your hook because I don't understand or agree with your views! I think that the UK has been all the richer for having such a diverse mix of the English, Welsh, Irish and Scots, just as this forum is all the richer for such a diversity of opinions and knowledge on a whole range of subjects such as politics, betting and even cats!

    MikeK said:

    Trying to watch QT from Scotland and have given up in exasperation. For the simple reason that Scotland is a foreign country, I can't understand the language and we (the rest of England and Wales) would be better off without them.

    Now before you jump on me; this is my own personal opinion, and has nothing to do with UKIP policy on Scotland.

    I'm 100% with you on cats.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    Really?

    It seems to be one of the better argued and more intelligent QTs for some time. Probably because of the absence of some half wit celebrity going for cheap laughs.

    And its from that glorious British Imperial city of Dundee, the home of the jute and marmalade.

    ( I mentioned it once, but I think I got away with it!)
    MikeK said:

    Trying to watch QT from Scotland and have given up in exasperation. For the simple reason that Scotland is a foreign country, I can't understand the language and we (the rest of England and Wales) would be better off without them.

    Now before you jump on me; this is my own personal opinion, and has nothing to do with UKIP policy on Scotland.

    MikeK said:

    Trying to watch QT from Scotland and have given up in exasperation. For the simple reason that Scotland is a foreign country, I can't understand the language and we (the rest of England and Wales) would be better off without them.

    Now before you jump on me; this is my own personal opinion, and has nothing to do with UKIP policy on Scotland.

  • EasterrossEasterross Posts: 1,915
    Why on earth have we in Scotland got Paxo and 3 females talking about obscure world economics? We are supposed to have had Newsnight Scotland on for the past 10 minutes giving us a vote by vote update on Cowdenbeath!
  • AveryLP said:

    AveryLP said:



    Still, I do expect a trade surplus in the 2015-2020 period, provided the electorate are not idiots in May 2015.

    The trade surplus will only come when there is a reduction in comsumption of imports.

    Our economic problems stem from our consumption addiction, whether that be the trade deficit, the level of debt, collapsing pension provision or lack of investment.

    It even has non-economic drawbacks such as the increase in obesity.

    But no government will now pull the plug on overconsumption because there are too many voters addicted to it.

    The most malign phrases of the past decade were "Don't put if off, put it on" and "Because I'm worth it".
    I would have been readier to agree if you had inserted the qualifier "relative" before the word consumption on your first line.

    Osborne is a chancellor who charts a course around storms rather than through them. Balance is all.

    Give him time he will reach his destination. The risk of being sunk is too high to recommend the brave but foolhardy alternate.

    We don't have the time.

    The hurricane of the next recession will arrive while Osborne is still going nowhere on his pleasure yacht.

    The sensible people would have already reached safety even if that meant some inconvenience of the way.

    We don't need a relative decrease in wealth consumption we need an absolute decrease. Our position has become too extreme and long term for any more pretence.

  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    malcolmg on QT!
  • EasterrossEasterross Posts: 1,915
    Michael McMahon @M_McMahon_MSP
    Labour wins Motherwell Nth by-election with 67% (yes sixty-seven) of 1st preference votes!
  • EasterrossEasterross Posts: 1,915
    A Tory colleague is suggesting Labour has easily 50% of vote in Cowdenbeath and he expects Tory share of vote to be up.
  • MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699
    Southend result Con hold Con 743 LD 688 UKIP 418 Lab 149

    Swing to Rennards Lib Dems
  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815

    AveryLP said:

    AveryLP said:



    Still, I do expect a trade surplus in the 2015-2020 period, provided the electorate are not idiots in May 2015.

    The trade surplus will only come when there is a reduction in comsumption of imports.

    Our economic problems stem from our consumption addiction, whether that be the trade deficit, the level of debt, collapsing pension provision or lack of investment.

    It even has non-economic drawbacks such as the increase in obesity.

    But no government will now pull the plug on overconsumption because there are too many voters addicted to it.

    The most malign phrases of the past decade were "Don't put if off, put it on" and "Because I'm worth it".
    I would have been readier to agree if you had inserted the qualifier "relative" before the word consumption on your first line.

    Osborne is a chancellor who charts a course around storms rather than through them. Balance is all.

    Give him time he will reach his destination. The risk of being sunk is too high to recommend the brave but foolhardy alternate.

    We don't have the time.

    The hurricane of the next recession will arrive while Osborne is still going nowhere on his pleasure yacht.

    The sensible people would have already reached safety even if that meant some inconvenience of the way.

    We don't need a relative decrease in wealth consumption we need an absolute decrease. Our position has become too extreme and long term for any more pretence.

    Provided you remain ahead of your competitors and continue to make progress towards your destination, there is always time, ar.

  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815

    Southend result Con hold Con 743 LD 688 UKIP 418 Lab 149

    Swing to Rennards Lib Dems

    So no 'touch and go', Mark?

  • EasterrossEasterross Posts: 1,915
    The SNP candidate in Cowdenbeath happens to be the partner of the only Tory councillor in Glasgow. Who says we Scots don't go in for "mixed marriages"
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,889
    Allegation made about Rennard on QT by Labour spokesman which seems to go a bit further than what has been publically disclosed
  • Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530
    HYUFD said:

    Moniker Indeed, he is the smiling assassin! Avery Well some Tory MPs seem to have fallen for it. Andy JS Probably, but we are voting for a party and a PM not a best friend.

    MickPork Cameron is probably the most presidential PM in some ways we have had, even more than Blair, because he is governing in a Coalition and can basically ignore most of his backbenchers

    The curious thing is that, although Cameron is a second rate Blair impersonator and has made no secret of his admiration of Blair and wish to try and follow in his footsteps, he never understood how Blair operated. From day 1 Blair made it a priority to court his own own MPs in the commons and keep them onside because he knew that eventually he would need their support even though he got in with a landslide. So it turned out with Iraq and other votes where he personally had to cajole a fractious party in favour of what most of them probably knew were bad ideas even at the time.

    Cameron on the other hand has relied on the coalition and the lib dems as the goto excuse for all his many rebellions and vote failures when it's perfectly clear that he has mishandled and ignored tory backbench opinion at every turn. Doesn't matter if the Cameroons think the tory backbenchers are spoiled or self-destructive. What matters is they are his responsibility as leader. So it's a bit much for the Cameroons to throw their hands in the air and wonder why the tory party are so obsessed with Europe after all the posturing by the Cameroon on the EU. Or for the likes of Gove to rant furiously at those same backbenchers even though they had made it crystal clear what they would do if a Syria vote came up in the commons. If party discipline is a problem then the buck stops with those in charge of it. John Major lost no time in blaming the "b****rds" too, but his legacy as a PM who simply couldn't control his own party is repeating itself with Cameron.

  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    HYUFD said:

    Allegation made about Rennard on QT by Labour spokesman which seems to go a bit further than what has been publically disclosed

    Certainly it has been made public by Guido.

    And some time ago too.

  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,320
    Ironically, I suspect the Tories in Scotland are definitely benefiting from the dip in the Libdem's popularity.

    A Tory colleague is suggesting Labour has easily 50% of vote in Cowdenbeath and he expects Tory share of vote to be up.

  • weejonnieweejonnie Posts: 3,820
    Southend result Con hold Con 743 LD 688 UKIP 418 Lab 149

    Swing to Rennards Lib Dems
    ---

    More likely swing from Conservative to UKIP with LD vote holding up.
  • fitalass said:

    Ironically, I suspect the Tories in Scotland are definitely benefiting from the dip in the Libdem's popularity.

    A Tory colleague is suggesting Labour has easily 50% of vote in Cowdenbeath and he expects Tory share of vote to be up.


    I think the Scottish Tories are also benefiting from a marked drop in SNP popularity.
  • The SNP candidate in Cowdenbeath happens to be the partner of the only Tory councillor in Glasgow. Who says we Scots don't go in for "mixed marriages"

    Actually, it appears we do.

    Ed Conway ‏@EdConwaySky 14 hrs
    Interesting ONS figs on diversity. In England 4.6% of couples are of different ethnicities. Wales: 2.4%. N Ireland: 0.6%. Scotland: 7.5%

  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815

    The SNP candidate in Cowdenbeath happens to be the partner of the only Tory councillor in Glasgow. Who says we Scots don't go in for "mixed marriages"

    Actually, it appears we do.

    Ed Conway ‏@EdConwaySky 14 hrs
    Interesting ONS figs on diversity. In England 4.6% of couples are of different ethnicities. Wales: 2.4%. N Ireland: 0.6%. Scotland: 7.5%

    Picts marrying Celts?

  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,320
    edited January 2014
    I agree, we definitely have a few Tartan Tories drifting back to the party from the SNP as well as the Libdems. I wonder if we will get a PB thread on Libdem/Tory switchers in Scotland any time soon. :)

    fitalass said:

    Ironically, I suspect the Tories in Scotland are definitely benefiting from the dip in the Libdem's popularity.

    A Tory colleague is suggesting Labour has easily 50% of vote in Cowdenbeath and he expects Tory share of vote to be up.


    I think the Scottish Tories are also benefiting from a marked drop in SNP popularity.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,889
    AveryLP But Guido is a blogger, it has not been repeated extensively in the wider press reporting of the Rennard case
  • anotherDaveanotherDave Posts: 6,746
    "Mike Hancock’s son, Dean, is charged with assault causing actual bodily harm…"

    http://order-order.com/2014/01/23/hancock-charged/
  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    edited January 2014
    HYUFD said:

    AveryLP But Guido is a blogger, it has not been repeated extensively in the wider press reporting of the Rennard case

    I haven't fully checked Cathy Newman's reports.

    I was surprised by the allegation being made on QT. It does mean though that its been through the BBC legal filter.

  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,889
    MickPork Indeed, which is why a repeat of the Coalition may actually be the best bet for Cameron, a small majority at the mercy of his backbenchers would leave him with the same problems as Major (though Major was never personally disliked by most of his backbenchers, and indeed the 'Bastards' were all in the Cabinet on the frontbench not behind him)
  • AveryLP said:

    The SNP candidate in Cowdenbeath happens to be the partner of the only Tory councillor in Glasgow. Who says we Scots don't go in for "mixed marriages"

    Actually, it appears we do.

    Ed Conway ‏@EdConwaySky 14 hrs
    Interesting ONS figs on diversity. In England 4.6% of couples are of different ethnicities. Wales: 2.4%. N Ireland: 0.6%. Scotland: 7.5%

    Picts marrying Celts?

    SLabs & SCons, a marriage made in heaven.
  • MrJonesMrJones Posts: 3,523
    edited January 2014
    edit: actually prob best not to be making any jokes at the mo
  • MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699
    Motherwell North Lab 1719 SNP 520 Con 173 UKIP 107
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    According to the Scottish Governments figures 4% of Scots are from non-white ethnic minorities, and only 0.4% of mixed ethnicity.

    http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Topics/People/Equality/Equalities/DataGrid/Ethnicity/EthPopMig

    7.5% of Scottish couples being mixed ethnicity seems rather high, if one means white/non-white. Do the Scottish figures include mixed Scottish/English or Scottish/Irish?

    The SNP candidate in Cowdenbeath happens to be the partner of the only Tory councillor in Glasgow. Who says we Scots don't go in for "mixed marriages"

    Actually, it appears we do.

    Ed Conway ‏@EdConwaySky 14 hrs
    Interesting ONS figs on diversity. In England 4.6% of couples are of different ethnicities. Wales: 2.4%. N Ireland: 0.6%. Scotland: 7.5%

  • MrJonesMrJones Posts: 3,523

    Motherwell North Lab 1719 SNP 520 Con 173 UKIP 107

    Con splitters.
  • AveryLP said:

    AveryLP said:

    AveryLP said:



    Still, I do expect a trade surplus in the 2015-2020 period, provided the electorate are not idiots in May 2015.

    The trade surplus will only come when there is a reduction in comsumption of imports.

    Our economic problems stem from our consumption addiction, whether that be the trade deficit, the level of debt, collapsing pension provision or lack of investment.

    It even has non-economic drawbacks such as the increase in obesity.

    But no government will now pull the plug on overconsumption because there are too many voters addicted to it.

    The most malign phrases of the past decade were "Don't put if off, put it on" and "Because I'm worth it".
    I would have been readier to agree if you had inserted the qualifier "relative" before the word consumption on your first line.

    Osborne is a chancellor who charts a course around storms rather than through them. Balance is all.

    Give him time he will reach his destination. The risk of being sunk is too high to recommend the brave but foolhardy alternate.

    We don't have the time.

    The hurricane of the next recession will arrive while Osborne is still going nowhere on his pleasure yacht.

    The sensible people would have already reached safety even if that meant some inconvenience of the way.

    We don't need a relative decrease in wealth consumption we need an absolute decrease. Our position has become too extreme and long term for any more pretence.

    Provided you remain ahead of your competitors and continue to make progress towards your destination, there is always time, ar.

    We're not remaining ahead and we're not making progress.

    Take a look at the productivity and unit labour cost stats to see all you need to know.

    But you and most people prefer the pretence.
  • According to the Scottish Governments figures 4% of Scots are from non-white ethnic minorities, and only 0.4% of mixed ethnicity.

    http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Topics/People/Equality/Equalities/DataGrid/Ethnicity/EthPopMig

    7.5% of Scottish couples being mixed ethnicity seems rather high, if one means white/non-white. Do the Scottish figures include mixed Scottish/English or Scottish/Irish?

    I don't know, but I doubt it. I'm pretty sure the English & Welsh figs wouldn't define each other as separate ethnicities.
  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    edited January 2014

    AveryLP said:

    AveryLP said:

    AveryLP said:



    Still, I do expect a trade surplus in the 2015-2020 period, provided the electorate are not idiots in May 2015.

    The trade surplus will only come when there is a reduction in comsumption of imports.

    Our economic problems stem from our consumption addiction, whether that be the trade deficit, the level of debt, collapsing pension provision or lack of investment.

    It even has non-economic drawbacks such as the increase in obesity.

    But no government will now pull the plug on overconsumption because there are too many voters addicted to it.

    The most malign phrases of the past decade were "Don't put if off, put it on" and "Because I'm worth it".
    I would have been readier to agree if you had inserted the qualifier "relative" before the word consumption on your first line.

    Osborne is a chancellor who charts a course around storms rather than through them. Balance is all.

    Give him time he will reach his destination. The risk of being sunk is too high to recommend the brave but foolhardy alternate.

    We don't have the time.

    The hurricane of the next recession will arrive while Osborne is still going nowhere on his pleasure yacht.

    The sensible people would have already reached safety even if that meant some inconvenience of the way.

    We don't need a relative decrease in wealth consumption we need an absolute decrease. Our position has become too extreme and long term for any more pretence.

    Provided you remain ahead of your competitors and continue to make progress towards your destination, there is always time, ar.

    We're not remaining ahead and we're not making progress.

    Take a look at the productivity and unit labour cost stats to see all you need to know.

    But you and most people prefer the pretence.
    There are as many theories about the causes of the falls in productivity as there are economists willing to espouse them.

    Sorting out the real causes - and there are likely to be many rather than few - and acting to reverse the trends is one of the urgent tasks of this government.

    At least George and Mark have identified the problem.

  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,889
    Avery LP Has it? QT is recorded live and the BBC has no control over what its panellists say until after they have said it, maybe it missed the censors before it was aired? Dimbleby did read out Rennard's statement but did not reference the Labour spokeswoman's specific allegation which may be telling
  • MonikerDiCanioMonikerDiCanio Posts: 5,792
    edited January 2014

    According to the Scottish Governments figures 4% of Scots are from non-white ethnic minorities, and only 0.4% of mixed ethnicity.

    http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Topics/People/Equality/Equalities/DataGrid/Ethnicity/EthPopMig

    7.5% of Scottish couples being mixed ethnicity seems rather high, if one means white/non-white. Do the Scottish figures include mixed Scottish/English or Scottish/Irish?

    The SNP candidate in Cowdenbeath happens to be the partner of the only Tory councillor in Glasgow. Who says we Scots don't go in for "mixed marriages"

    Actually, it appears we do.

    Ed Conway ‏@EdConwaySky 14 hrs
    Interesting ONS figs on diversity. In England 4.6% of couples are of different ethnicities. Wales: 2.4%. N Ireland: 0.6%. Scotland: 7.5%

    I suspect the real percentage is closer to 0.75 than 7.5.
  • Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530
    edited January 2014
    HYUFD Cameron is at the mercy of his backbenchers with those same problems as Major right now. So god only knows just how bad things would be with a small majority. Balancing that of course is that one of the reasons the backbenchers are so very unhappy with Cameron is that he failed to win a majority in the first place. I take you back to immediately after the election when knives were well and truly being sharpened for both Cammie and Clegg as the results came in. The coalition was primarily motivated by self-interest from both of them since a failure to form any kind of administration (be it minority, confidence and supply or, as we got, full coalition) would have almost certainly have caused maximum blowback on themselves from their parties and that would not have ended well for either of them.

    Sure, Major seemed to have a bit more respect than Cameron from his backbenchers, but Major's backbenchers still happily stuck the knife in on Europe which enabled and supported the b*****ds in the cabinet who were plotting away. Being ignored by your backbenchers or being held in contempt by them amounts to the same thing, it's still a failure of party discipline.
  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    edited January 2014
    HYUFD said:

    Avery LP Has it? QT is recorded live and the BBC has no control over what its panellists say until after they have said it, maybe it missed the censors before it was aired? Dimbleby did read out Rennard's statement but did not reference the Labour spokeswoman's specific allegation which may be telling

    QT is recorded at 8:00 pm on the day of its broadcast and is vetted by BBC lawyers. If a statement needs to be removed there is enough time to edit before it goes to air.

    That doesn't mean of course that all potential libels are weeded out but that one was so obvious it must have been subject to an editorial and legal decision.

  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,320
    edited January 2014
    I disagree, and if you were around a few years ago on PB, you might have followed MikeL's stellar reporting on the very same Labour Lords trying to scupper the boundary changes for purely partisan reasons. As it happened, the minute the AV Referendum was lost Clegg then desperately looked around for an excuse to scupper those same boundary changes. And that is why his House of Lords reforms then were made to fall on their sword as a means to renege on this Coalition deal. If Conservatives win the next GE, there will be an EU Referendum on the back of our renegotiation of our membership of the EU.

    That neither the EU, the Labour party or UKIP want to see a successful renegotiation of that membership or an EU Referendum any time soon is no surprise. And UKIP certainly don't want a referendum without a Conservative Leader backing our exit, and that speaks volumes about their own weakness on the issue. Hence the constant need to try to undermine Cameron's integrity or the chances of that Tory majority that would deliver the very EU Referendum that UKIPpers on here claim to want. The UKIPpers remind me of Salmond in his first term in Office in Holyrood and how he neatly avoided ever bringing that Indy Referendum to the floor of the Parliament. I hope that the media start doing some real digging around at the EU Parliament to see just what our UKIP MEP's actually get up in pursuit of their EU exit, I suspect its a damn sight less than the current Conservative party in Coalition with the Libdems have managed to achieve.
    MikeK said:

    taffys said:

    Telly running a story about alleged Labour attempts to scupper the referendum Bill.

    should the tories be making more of this? 'denying you a say'

    Cammo would love to say that the labour Lords killed the referendum bill. He would be chuckling all the way to No 10. He could then - tongue in cheek - say to his backbenchers; "well I did promise, but you know how these things are?"
This discussion has been closed.