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Opinium has Starmer with an 8% “Best PM” lead over Truss – politicalbetting.com

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Comments

  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 29,264
    FF43 said:

    Is this the first negative honeymoon in political history? Where a ruling party decides it can't go on like this, get a new broom and its vote share falls even further?

    BoZo is counting on it for his great comeback...
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 20,506
    IshmaelZ said:

    https://twitter.com/kateferguson4/status/1561077534871228417

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    "Their doctor would chat to the patient and verify they needed help - either because they were sick, elderly or just in need.

    The GP would then effectively write a prescription saying the person should get money off their bills."

    It takes a GP to establish that you are old, or poor?
    The idea is grotesque. I suppose it's the internet age that's to blame. In the past, you could have a ludicrous brain fart of an idea and the minutes would never see the light of day.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 28,836

    “Solidarity with Sanna”

    Women in Finland are posting videos of themselves partying while tagging Prime Minister Sanna Marin.

    https://twitter.com/meghamohan/status/1560999055769030656?s=21&t=2ogukd59y8MvcVWC-7GTQg

    Will women in the UK be showing solidarity with Liz by making dim pronouncements and immediately recanting?

    And wearing the Ratners equivalent of pampas grass (allegedly: IANAE).
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    A question for those in the know on the law following on from the last thread.

    Is it illegal for a British citizen to join the regular armed forces of a foreign country? I am thinking of people like Rick Rescorla, the heroic Cornishman who served with the British Parachute Regiment but then joined the US 7th Cavalry and fought at Ia Drang under Hal Moore (who described as the best platoon leader he ever saw)

    Was he technically breaking the law? Or does it not apply to regular forces of allies - which would make sense?

    This is not meant to reignite the discussion from previously, just a matter of genuine interest.

    Incidentally, for anyone who has not heard of Rescorla and his life do read up about it. It ever there was a heroic figure it was him. He died on 911 but was responsible for saving over 2,500 Morgan Stanley employees in the South Tower.

    Pretty sure a few Brits have joined the French Foreign Legion over the years, would be very surprised if it was illegal.

    Edit: on checking, lol.


    It's only illegal to sign up when there's a war on and UK is not at war with the other side. You are fine to sign up with FFL atm and I can't see that you subsequently become illegal if the French go to war.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 25,298
    IshmaelZ said:

    https://twitter.com/kateferguson4/status/1561077534871228417

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    "Their doctor would chat to the patient and verify they needed help - either because they were sick, elderly or just in need.

    The GP would then effectively write a prescription saying the person should get money off their bills."

    It takes a GP to establish that you are old, or poor?
    At the risk of stating the obvious.
    Don't GP's have better things to do?
    Also. Who wouldn't go see their GP. I haven't been to one in five years. But for free money...
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 56,756

    IshmaelZ said:

    https://twitter.com/kateferguson4/status/1561077534871228417

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    "Their doctor would chat to the patient and verify they needed help - either because they were sick, elderly or just in need.

    The GP would then effectively write a prescription saying the person should get money off their bills."

    It takes a GP to establish that you are old, or poor?
    The idea is grotesque. I suppose it's the internet age that's to blame. In the past, you could have a ludicrous brain fart of an idea and the minutes would never see the light of day.
    Not necessarily. Ground nuts in Tanganyika spring to mind.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,650
    edited August 2022

    dixiedean said:

    Tory strategy to combat rising energy bills - increase the Winter Fuel Payment so only pensioners get to benefit.

    As I understand it everyone receives £400 in 6 equal installments from October and £650 is to be paid in two equal installments between July and in the autumn to all those on UC and benefits, and upto £600 winter fuel allowance to pensioners

    37 billion has been spent to date and as I said earlier the emergency budget is needed to increase these payments

    I understand the government is in discussion with the energy suppliers to cancel the rise for 2 years in energy costs and this is one to look out for in the emergency budget
    "Receives" isn't quite correct. Your leccy bill is credited with £60 each month AIUI.
    Fair comment and quite right to take it directly of the energy bill

    The main issue here is will this be extended and increased and will the price cap be cancelled for 2 years by Truss
    Er... cancelling the price cap would see prices go up even further surely?
    Labour have already proposed a 6 month freeze but this scheme is 2 years and is on the table apparently

    This seems to be the scheme in discussion

    https://www.energylivenews.com/2022/08/15/fresh-calls-for-price-cap-freeze/
    Here's the key phrase;

    The fund could be underwritten by the government, or a willing financial institution, and repaid over a 10-15 year period to smooth out the costs.
    They should probably look at adopting that but incorporating a business cap too and outflanking Labour by retaining the direct support already pledged which labour would scrap plus a small business support package to go alongside a business cap.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 23,356
    Carnyx said:

    Cyclefree said:

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    What the fuck

    Try getting a GP appointment before the end of winter.
    Feature not bug.

    Or am I being a tad too cynical?
    Not cynical. But bloody worrying. See my post before yours.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,650
    dixiedean said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    https://twitter.com/kateferguson4/status/1561077534871228417

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    "Their doctor would chat to the patient and verify they needed help - either because they were sick, elderly or just in need.

    The GP would then effectively write a prescription saying the person should get money off their bills."

    It takes a GP to establish that you are old, or poor?
    At the risk of stating the obvious.
    Don't GP's have better things to do?
    Also. Who wouldn't go see their GP. I haven't been to one in five years. But for free money...
    Yeah theyll ditch this. Its a 'we are considering EVERYTHING' throwaway i reckon
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 28,836
    ydoethur said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    https://twitter.com/kateferguson4/status/1561077534871228417

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    "Their doctor would chat to the patient and verify they needed help - either because they were sick, elderly or just in need.

    The GP would then effectively write a prescription saying the person should get money off their bills."

    It takes a GP to establish that you are old, or poor?
    The idea is grotesque. I suppose it's the internet age that's to blame. In the past, you could have a ludicrous brain fart of an idea and the minutes would never see the light of day.
    Not necessarily. Ground nuts in Tanganyika spring to mind.
    Complete with tractors made from old Sherman tanks.

    Very reminiscent of recent Conservative MPs, come to think of it.

    https://www.environmentandsociety.org/arcadia/enemy-nature-military-machines-and-technological-bricolage-britains-great-agricultural
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 28,836
    Cyclefree said:

    Carnyx said:

    Cyclefree said:

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    What the fuck

    Try getting a GP appointment before the end of winter.
    Feature not bug.

    Or am I being a tad too cynical?
    Not cynical. But bloody worrying. See my post before yours.
    Oh dear: so it is.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,650

    dixiedean said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    https://twitter.com/kateferguson4/status/1561077534871228417

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    "Their doctor would chat to the patient and verify they needed help - either because they were sick, elderly or just in need.

    The GP would then effectively write a prescription saying the person should get money off their bills."

    It takes a GP to establish that you are old, or poor?
    At the risk of stating the obvious.
    Don't GP's have better things to do?
    Also. Who wouldn't go see their GP. I haven't been to one in five years. But for free money...
    Yeah theyll ditch this. Its a 'we are considering EVERYTHING' throwaway i reckon
    In fact if they adopt this policy i pledge to vote Labour until i'm 60
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 14,025

    dixiedean said:

    Tory strategy to combat rising energy bills - increase the Winter Fuel Payment so only pensioners get to benefit.

    As I understand it everyone receives £400 in 6 equal installments from October and £650 is to be paid in two equal installments between July and in the autumn to all those on UC and benefits, and upto £600 winter fuel allowance to pensioners

    37 billion has been spent to date and as I said earlier the emergency budget is needed to increase these payments

    I understand the government is in discussion with the energy suppliers to cancel the rise for 2 years in energy costs and this is one to look out for in the emergency budget
    "Receives" isn't quite correct. Your leccy bill is credited with £60 each month AIUI.
    Fair comment and quite right to take it directly of the energy bill

    The main issue here is will this be extended and increased and will the price cap be cancelled for 2 years by Truss
    Er... cancelling the price cap would see prices go up even further surely?
    Labour have already proposed a 6 month freeze but this scheme is 2 years and is on the table apparently

    This seems to be the scheme in discussion

    https://www.energylivenews.com/2022/08/15/fresh-calls-for-price-cap-freeze/
    Essentially it's the Gordon Brown/Lib Dem and now Labour policy. Think more likely than not the govt will go for a version of this. Energy companies accepting the more or less inevitable, but don't want to be nationalised and do want to protect their profits. Hence proactively getting their version out, rather than fighting a rearguard action.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 28,836

    dixiedean said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    https://twitter.com/kateferguson4/status/1561077534871228417

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    "Their doctor would chat to the patient and verify they needed help - either because they were sick, elderly or just in need.

    The GP would then effectively write a prescription saying the person should get money off their bills."

    It takes a GP to establish that you are old, or poor?
    At the risk of stating the obvious.
    Don't GP's have better things to do?
    Also. Who wouldn't go see their GP. I haven't been to one in five years. But for free money...
    Yeah theyll ditch this. Its a 'we are considering EVERYTHING' throwaway i reckon
    In fact if they adopt this policy i pledge to vote Labour until i'm 60
    67 surely ...
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 25,298
    edited August 2022

    dixiedean said:

    Tory strategy to combat rising energy bills - increase the Winter Fuel Payment so only pensioners get to benefit.

    As I understand it everyone receives £400 in 6 equal installments from October and £650 is to be paid in two equal installments between July and in the autumn to all those on UC and benefits, and upto £600 winter fuel allowance to pensioners

    37 billion has been spent to date and as I said earlier the emergency budget is needed to increase these payments

    I understand the government is in discussion with the energy suppliers to cancel the rise for 2 years in energy costs and this is one to look out for in the emergency budget
    "Receives" isn't quite correct. Your leccy bill is credited with £60 each month AIUI.
    Fair comment and quite right to take it directly of the energy bill

    The main issue here is will this be extended and increased and will the price cap be cancelled for 2 years by Truss
    Er... cancelling the price cap would see prices go up even further surely?
    Labour have already proposed a 6 month freeze but this scheme is 2 years and is on the table apparently

    This seems to be the scheme in discussion

    https://www.energylivenews.com/2022/08/15/fresh-calls-for-price-cap-freeze/
    Here's the key phrase;

    The fund could be underwritten by the government, or a willing financial institution, and repaid over a 10-15 year period to smooth out the costs.
    They should probably look at adopting that but incorporating a business cap too and outflanking Labour by retaining the direct support already pledged which labour would scrap plus a small business support package to go alongside a business cap.
    The point is, however, Labour has a plan.
    There is another month when the Tories won't have one.
    If the new PM is September 5th, they ought to be presenting it September 6th.
    Then they can deal with the kids being sent home for lack of teachers with the necessary credentials.
  • dixiedean said:

    Tory strategy to combat rising energy bills - increase the Winter Fuel Payment so only pensioners get to benefit.

    As I understand it everyone receives £400 in 6 equal installments from October and £650 is to be paid in two equal installments between July and in the autumn to all those on UC and benefits, and upto £600 winter fuel allowance to pensioners

    37 billion has been spent to date and as I said earlier the emergency budget is needed to increase these payments

    I understand the government is in discussion with the energy suppliers to cancel the rise for 2 years in energy costs and this is one to look out for in the emergency budget
    "Receives" isn't quite correct. Your leccy bill is credited with £60 each month AIUI.
    Fair comment and quite right to take it directly of the energy bill

    The main issue here is will this be extended and increased and will the price cap be cancelled for 2 years by Truss
    Er... cancelling the price cap would see prices go up even further surely?
    Labour have already proposed a 6 month freeze but this scheme is 2 years and is on the table apparently

    This seems to be the scheme in discussion

    https://www.energylivenews.com/2022/08/15/fresh-calls-for-price-cap-freeze/
    Here's the key phrase;

    The fund could be underwritten by the government, or a willing financial institution, and repaid over a 10-15 year period to smooth out the costs.
    They should probably look at adopting that but incorporating a business cap too and outflanking Labour by retaining the direct support already pledged which labour would scrap plus a small business support package to go alongside a business cap.
    For me it all depends on the emergency budget whether Truss receives a bounce or doesn’t
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 2,930
    ydoethur said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    I see a Dad's Army of retired doctors and nurses will solve the NHS.

    Corporal Jones will be performing colonoscopies, no doubt. "They don't like it up 'em".
    Private Fraser can break the news of a terminal diagnosis.
    Private Walker will provide the PPE at a good price.
    And Sergeant Wilson will always offer a second opinion.
    Private Sponge will provide the...errr.. sponges.
  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 3,232
    Cyclefree said:

    Cyclefree said:

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    What the fuck

    Try getting a GP appointment before the end of winter.
    My new GP is great. Registered with them earlier this year, haven't needed to see a GP in years before now, but needed to twice in recent months and both times got a same-day appointment and second time got a referral to see a physio the next week too. They've been really friendly, the receptionists even are friendly and helpful, its like going into a parallel universe from all the normal stereotypes.
    Good for you.

    Daughter currently has a painful internal infection. On antibiotics. They are not making it better. As this has happened repeatedly in recent months, the GP wants to do some tests and asked for a sample - provided.

    But no joy in getting a time to speak to the GP. The only times are when Daughter is working (she's doing a new job organising & running weddings and cannot simply drop everything to wait for the GP to call). So now the next phone appointment just to get the result of one test is 3 weeks away. Meanwhile she's in pain and God knows what's happening inside: a kidney infection? Appendicitis? Something else? Blood in urine is not a good sign.

    If we can't get to a GP it will have to be A&E.

    It is no use the NHS advising people to stay away from A&E if primary care can't do its job. The GPsare fine when you get to talk to them. But the whole administration seems not to realise that working patients can't drop everything to wait by the phone. It seems designed to make it as hard as possible to see a bloody doctor.

    By contrast seeing a vet is dead easy, quick & convenient.

    It's notable that on the 4 recent occasions when Husband and I have needed medical help we had to go to A&E because the GP simply was not available. No wonder A&E departments are under stress. But lecturing patients isn't the answer either.

    I am seriously considering finding a private GP.
    Tory think: if you can afford a private GP then you are worth saving in the first place. If you can't, you aren't. Or am I being too cynical as well?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 72,863

    https://twitter.com/kateferguson4/status/1561077534871228417

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    Hah
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 20,423

    https://twitter.com/kateferguson4/status/1561077534871228417

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    What do GPs have to do with energy bills?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 72,863
    IshmaelZ said:

    https://twitter.com/kateferguson4/status/1561077534871228417

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    "Their doctor would chat to the patient and verify they needed help - either because they were sick, elderly or just in need.

    The GP would then effectively write a prescription saying the person should get money off their bills."

    It takes a GP to establish that you are old, or poor?
    I can feel energy bill induced depression coming on already
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 23,356
    Carnyx said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Carnyx said:

    Cyclefree said:

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    What the fuck

    Try getting a GP appointment before the end of winter.
    Feature not bug.

    Or am I being a tad too cynical?
    Not cynical. But bloody worrying. See my post before yours.
    Oh dear: so it is.
    And then this bloody woman has the fucking nerve to say that people here don't work hard. When I look at how hard my Daughter, my Sons work, how much I still work and my Husband too - but we cannot now rely on any of the basic services of the state to work competently.

    Nor - if there have to be cut backs and sacrifices this winter - can we trust MPs to make the same sacrifices as the rest of us, the one and only lesson I have learnt from Covid.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 14,025
    Scott_xP said:

    FF43 said:

    Is this the first negative honeymoon in political history? Where a ruling party decides it can't go on like this, get a new broom and its vote share falls even further?

    BoZo is counting on it for his great comeback...
    Possible. Johnson clearly thinks he will return.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 20,423

    nico679 said:

    Whilst this Tory leadership campaign continues many people will be reducing their spending as they don’t know what sort of help might be on offer in the autumn .

    So by the time the Maggie clone moves into no 10 the economy will be nose diving . This really wasn’t the time for this length of leadership campaign and Brady should have decided on a short one or better still not give the final decision to the members .

    In effect by the time Truss gets her likely bottom of the barrel cabinet team together and they have decided on a course of action re the energy costs the ship will be taking on water and about to sink .

    I largely agree and Brady together with the 1922 committee must shoulder responsibility for the abdication of the government through an unnecessary long contest

    The polls are reflecting the reality for the conservative party that the electorate have lost all patience with them

    As a conservative supporter I acknowledge Strarmer has put the ball in the net, (for the first time) and he must be favourite for next PM

    I do understand things are going on in the a background and I agree that Truss is best not revealing anything at this stage, as really things are as much near rock bottom as they could be

    The critical moment will be the emergency budget on the 21st September, and unless a serious package of help is announced the conservatives are heading into deserved opposition

    I would comment I have not rejoined yet but no matter I do remain a conservative but a very disillusioned and annoyed one
    Does anyone particularly remember the 2019 contest between Johnson and Hunt? Not especially. It went on for roughly the same length of time IIRC.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    pigeon said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Cyclefree said:

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    What the fuck

    Try getting a GP appointment before the end of winter.
    My new GP is great. Registered with them earlier this year, haven't needed to see a GP in years before now, but needed to twice in recent months and both times got a same-day appointment and second time got a referral to see a physio the next week too. They've been really friendly, the receptionists even are friendly and helpful, its like going into a parallel universe from all the normal stereotypes.
    Good for you.

    Daughter currently has a painful internal infection. On antibiotics. They are not making it better. As this has happened repeatedly in recent months, the GP wants to do some tests and asked for a sample - provided.

    But no joy in getting a time to speak to the GP. The only times are when Daughter is working (she's doing a new job organising & running weddings and cannot simply drop everything to wait for the GP to call). So now the next phone appointment just to get the result of one test is 3 weeks away. Meanwhile she's in pain and God knows what's happening inside: a kidney infection? Appendicitis? Something else? Blood in urine is not a good sign.

    If we can't get to a GP it will have to be A&E.

    It is no use the NHS advising people to stay away from A&E if primary care can't do its job. The GPsare fine when you get to talk to them. But the whole administration seems not to realise that working patients can't drop everything to wait by the phone. It seems designed to make it as hard as possible to see a bloody doctor.

    By contrast seeing a vet is dead easy, quick & convenient.

    It's notable that on the 4 recent occasions when Husband and I have needed medical help we had to go to A&E because the GP simply was not available. No wonder A&E departments are under stress. But lecturing patients isn't the answer either.

    I am seriously considering finding a private GP.
    Tory think: if you can afford a private GP then you are worth saving in the first place. If you can't, you aren't. Or am I being too cynical as well?
    Just doesn't work like that. Private GPs are not a thing outside Harley Street. In the provinces, you go NHS gp and private dentist.
  • FF43 said:

    Is this the first negative honeymoon in political history? Where a ruling party decides it can't go on like this, get a new broom and its vote share falls even further?

    Any bounce usually doesnt transpire until the new PM is in place. Not that im expecting one!
    Is that the case?

    It definitely wasn't for Thatcher-to-Major; the Conservative uptick was sudden, huge and happened after Maggie announced her resignation and before Major's victory.

    For Blair-to-Brown, Labour's ratings started improving in May (when Blair announced he was going) and continued going up through Brown's win.

    For Cameron-to-May, there was a much bigger uptick in Conservative ratings when May took over than when Cameron went.

    Johnson did get a big gain when he took over, but that was in the odd circumstances of having a huge pool of Brexit Party voters waiting to come back.

    So it's a mixed picture. But the first opportunity to gain voters back (yay! Boris won't be PM any more) has passed and that hasn't worked for the Conservatives.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 47,316

    ydoethur said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    I see a Dad's Army of retired doctors and nurses will solve the NHS.

    Corporal Jones will be performing colonoscopies, no doubt. "They don't like it up 'em".
    Private Fraser can break the news of a terminal diagnosis.
    Private Walker will provide the PPE at a good price.
    And Sergeant Wilson will always offer a second opinion.
    Private Sponge will provide the...errr.. sponges.
    Private Godfrey will block a bed.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 29,264
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,650
    Carnyx said:

    dixiedean said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    https://twitter.com/kateferguson4/status/1561077534871228417

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    "Their doctor would chat to the patient and verify they needed help - either because they were sick, elderly or just in need.

    The GP would then effectively write a prescription saying the person should get money off their bills."

    It takes a GP to establish that you are old, or poor?
    At the risk of stating the obvious.
    Don't GP's have better things to do?
    Also. Who wouldn't go see their GP. I haven't been to one in five years. But for free money...
    Yeah theyll ditch this. Its a 'we are considering EVERYTHING' throwaway i reckon
    In fact if they adopt this policy i pledge to vote Labour until i'm 60
    67 surely ...
    Christ no, i can't debase myself for that long
  • dixiedean said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    https://twitter.com/kateferguson4/status/1561077534871228417

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    "Their doctor would chat to the patient and verify they needed help - either because they were sick, elderly or just in need.

    The GP would then effectively write a prescription saying the person should get money off their bills."

    It takes a GP to establish that you are old, or poor?
    At the risk of stating the obvious.
    Don't GP's have better things to do?
    Also. Who wouldn't go see their GP. I haven't been to one in five years. But for free money...
    Yeah theyll ditch this. Its a 'we are considering EVERYTHING' throwaway i reckon
    In fact if they adopt this policy i pledge to vote Labour until i'm 60
    This policy shows the dangers of leaking any ideas
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 23,356
    IshmaelZ said:

    pigeon said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Cyclefree said:

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    What the fuck

    Try getting a GP appointment before the end of winter.
    My new GP is great. Registered with them earlier this year, haven't needed to see a GP in years before now, but needed to twice in recent months and both times got a same-day appointment and second time got a referral to see a physio the next week too. They've been really friendly, the receptionists even are friendly and helpful, its like going into a parallel universe from all the normal stereotypes.
    Good for you.

    Daughter currently has a painful internal infection. On antibiotics. They are not making it better. As this has happened repeatedly in recent months, the GP wants to do some tests and asked for a sample - provided.

    But no joy in getting a time to speak to the GP. The only times are when Daughter is working (she's doing a new job organising & running weddings and cannot simply drop everything to wait for the GP to call). So now the next phone appointment just to get the result of one test is 3 weeks away. Meanwhile she's in pain and God knows what's happening inside: a kidney infection? Appendicitis? Something else? Blood in urine is not a good sign.

    If we can't get to a GP it will have to be A&E.

    It is no use the NHS advising people to stay away from A&E if primary care can't do its job. The GPsare fine when you get to talk to them. But the whole administration seems not to realise that working patients can't drop everything to wait by the phone. It seems designed to make it as hard as possible to see a bloody doctor.

    By contrast seeing a vet is dead easy, quick & convenient.

    It's notable that on the 4 recent occasions when Husband and I have needed medical help we had to go to A&E because the GP simply was not available. No wonder A&E departments are under stress. But lecturing patients isn't the answer either.

    I am seriously considering finding a private GP.
    Tory think: if you can afford a private GP then you are worth saving in the first place. If you can't, you aren't. Or am I being too cynical as well?
    Just doesn't work like that. Private GPs are not a thing outside Harley Street. In the provinces, you go NHS gp and private dentist.
    Apparently there is a private GP locally and BUPA is available too. No idea if any good mind.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 56,756
    Andy_JS said:

    nico679 said:

    Whilst this Tory leadership campaign continues many people will be reducing their spending as they don’t know what sort of help might be on offer in the autumn .

    So by the time the Maggie clone moves into no 10 the economy will be nose diving . This really wasn’t the time for this length of leadership campaign and Brady should have decided on a short one or better still not give the final decision to the members .

    In effect by the time Truss gets her likely bottom of the barrel cabinet team together and they have decided on a course of action re the energy costs the ship will be taking on water and about to sink .

    I largely agree and Brady together with the 1922 committee must shoulder responsibility for the abdication of the government through an unnecessary long contest

    The polls are reflecting the reality for the conservative party that the electorate have lost all patience with them

    As a conservative supporter I acknowledge Strarmer has put the ball in the net, (for the first time) and he must be favourite for next PM

    I do understand things are going on in the a background and I agree that Truss is best not revealing anything at this stage, as really things are as much near rock bottom as they could be

    The critical moment will be the emergency budget on the 21st September, and unless a serious package of help is announced the conservatives are heading into deserved opposition

    I would comment I have not rejoined yet but no matter I do remain a conservative but a very disillusioned and annoyed one
    Does anyone particularly remember the 2019 contest between Johnson and Hunt? Not especially. It went on for roughly the same length of time IIRC.
    Theresa May continued governing. Also, it didn't happen in August.
  • Andy_JS said:

    nico679 said:

    Whilst this Tory leadership campaign continues many people will be reducing their spending as they don’t know what sort of help might be on offer in the autumn .

    So by the time the Maggie clone moves into no 10 the economy will be nose diving . This really wasn’t the time for this length of leadership campaign and Brady should have decided on a short one or better still not give the final decision to the members .

    In effect by the time Truss gets her likely bottom of the barrel cabinet team together and they have decided on a course of action re the energy costs the ship will be taking on water and about to sink .

    I largely agree and Brady together with the 1922 committee must shoulder responsibility for the abdication of the government through an unnecessary long contest

    The polls are reflecting the reality for the conservative party that the electorate have lost all patience with them

    As a conservative supporter I acknowledge Strarmer has put the ball in the net, (for the first time) and he must be favourite for next PM

    I do understand things are going on in the a background and I agree that Truss is best not revealing anything at this stage, as really things are as much near rock bottom as they could be

    The critical moment will be the emergency budget on the 21st September, and unless a serious package of help is announced the conservatives are heading into deserved opposition

    I would comment I have not rejoined yet but no matter I do remain a conservative but a very disillusioned and annoyed one
    Does anyone particularly remember the 2019 contest between Johnson and Hunt? Not especially. It went on for roughly the same length of time IIRC.
    It was not at a time of crisis as of now
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 55,103
    Andy_JS said:

    https://twitter.com/kateferguson4/status/1561077534871228417

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    What do GPs have to do with energy bills?
    If they write a prescription the energy costs saved come from their budget?
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,650
    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    Tory strategy to combat rising energy bills - increase the Winter Fuel Payment so only pensioners get to benefit.

    As I understand it everyone receives £400 in 6 equal installments from October and £650 is to be paid in two equal installments between July and in the autumn to all those on UC and benefits, and upto £600 winter fuel allowance to pensioners

    37 billion has been spent to date and as I said earlier the emergency budget is needed to increase these payments

    I understand the government is in discussion with the energy suppliers to cancel the rise for 2 years in energy costs and this is one to look out for in the emergency budget
    "Receives" isn't quite correct. Your leccy bill is credited with £60 each month AIUI.
    Fair comment and quite right to take it directly of the energy bill

    The main issue here is will this be extended and increased and will the price cap be cancelled for 2 years by Truss
    Er... cancelling the price cap would see prices go up even further surely?
    Labour have already proposed a 6 month freeze but this scheme is 2 years and is on the table apparently

    This seems to be the scheme in discussion

    https://www.energylivenews.com/2022/08/15/fresh-calls-for-price-cap-freeze/
    Here's the key phrase;

    The fund could be underwritten by the government, or a willing financial institution, and repaid over a 10-15 year period to smooth out the costs.
    They should probably look at adopting that but incorporating a business cap too and outflanking Labour by retaining the direct support already pledged which labour would scrap plus a small business support package to go alongside a business cap.
    The point is, however, Labour has a plan.
    There is another month when the Tories won't have one.
    If the new PM is September 5th, they ought to be presenting it September 6th.
    Then they can deal with the kids being sent home for lack of teachers with the necessary credentials.
    I agree, immediately announce what they will do, not dick about until sept 21
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,650

    dixiedean said:

    Tory strategy to combat rising energy bills - increase the Winter Fuel Payment so only pensioners get to benefit.

    As I understand it everyone receives £400 in 6 equal installments from October and £650 is to be paid in two equal installments between July and in the autumn to all those on UC and benefits, and upto £600 winter fuel allowance to pensioners

    37 billion has been spent to date and as I said earlier the emergency budget is needed to increase these payments

    I understand the government is in discussion with the energy suppliers to cancel the rise for 2 years in energy costs and this is one to look out for in the emergency budget
    "Receives" isn't quite correct. Your leccy bill is credited with £60 each month AIUI.
    Fair comment and quite right to take it directly of the energy bill

    The main issue here is will this be extended and increased and will the price cap be cancelled for 2 years by Truss
    Er... cancelling the price cap would see prices go up even further surely?
    Labour have already proposed a 6 month freeze but this scheme is 2 years and is on the table apparently

    This seems to be the scheme in discussion

    https://www.energylivenews.com/2022/08/15/fresh-calls-for-price-cap-freeze/
    Here's the key phrase;

    The fund could be underwritten by the government, or a willing financial institution, and repaid over a 10-15 year period to smooth out the costs.
    They should probably look at adopting that but incorporating a business cap too and outflanking Labour by retaining the direct support already pledged which labour would scrap plus a small business support package to go alongside a business cap.
    For me it all depends on the emergency budget whether Truss receives a bounce or doesn’t
    Yeah, probably so
  • Andy_JS said:

    https://twitter.com/kateferguson4/status/1561077534871228417

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    What do GPs have to do with energy bills?
    Some people are going to need shedloads of money to survive the winter. Think of a large number and double it. The only way that will be affordable for the government is to have some really heavy gatekeeping on the money, to keep the number of recipients as low as humanly possible. Which is where GPs will come in.

    I mean, it looks like a terrible plan, but I can see the logic that ends up here. Hopefully, this is just something on a postit note from a "there are no bad ideas" brainstorming session. Either that, or it's Truss seeking to discredit the Treasury.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 24,682
    Surely, a war on woke, tax cuts for pensioners and the reintroduction of fox-hunting will sort this mid-term polling blip out for the Tories?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 36,825

    Andy_JS said:

    nico679 said:

    Whilst this Tory leadership campaign continues many people will be reducing their spending as they don’t know what sort of help might be on offer in the autumn .

    So by the time the Maggie clone moves into no 10 the economy will be nose diving . This really wasn’t the time for this length of leadership campaign and Brady should have decided on a short one or better still not give the final decision to the members .

    In effect by the time Truss gets her likely bottom of the barrel cabinet team together and they have decided on a course of action re the energy costs the ship will be taking on water and about to sink .

    I largely agree and Brady together with the 1922 committee must shoulder responsibility for the abdication of the government through an unnecessary long contest

    The polls are reflecting the reality for the conservative party that the electorate have lost all patience with them

    As a conservative supporter I acknowledge Strarmer has put the ball in the net, (for the first time) and he must be favourite for next PM

    I do understand things are going on in the a background and I agree that Truss is best not revealing anything at this stage, as really things are as much near rock bottom as they could be

    The critical moment will be the emergency budget on the 21st September, and unless a serious package of help is announced the conservatives are heading into deserved opposition

    I would comment I have not rejoined yet but no matter I do remain a conservative but a very disillusioned and annoyed one
    Does anyone particularly remember the 2019 contest between Johnson and Hunt? Not especially. It went on for roughly the same length of time IIRC.
    It was not at a time of crisis as of now
    There was a Brexit crisis then. There's usually something.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 72,863

    nico679 said:

    Whilst this Tory leadership campaign continues many people will be reducing their spending as they don’t know what sort of help might be on offer in the autumn .

    So by the time the Maggie clone moves into no 10 the economy will be nose diving . This really wasn’t the time for this length of leadership campaign and Brady should have decided on a short one or better still not give the final decision to the members .

    In effect by the time Truss gets her likely bottom of the barrel cabinet team together and they have decided on a course of action re the energy costs the ship will be taking on water and about to sink .

    I largely agree and Brady together with the 1922 committee must shoulder responsibility for the abdication of the government through an unnecessary long contest

    The polls are reflecting the reality for the conservative party that the electorate have lost all patience with them

    As a conservative supporter I acknowledge Strarmer has put the ball in the net, (for the first time) and he must be favourite for next PM

    I do understand things are going on in the a background and I agree that Truss is best not revealing anything at this stage, as really things are as much near rock bottom as they could be

    The critical moment will be the emergency budget on the 21st September, and unless a serious package of help is announced the conservatives are heading into deserved opposition

    I would comment I have not rejoined yet but no matter I do remain a conservative but a very disillusioned and annoyed one
    21st September?? It surely has to be before that? Thats after the LD conference isnt it??
    The energy price cap rise is scheduled for 1 October. Cutting it tight to handle it having announcements on 21 September.
    "The October 2022 price cap will be announced next Friday (26 August)."

    https://inews.co.uk/news/consumer/energy-price-cap-when-announced-ofgem-announcement-date-how-much-prices-rise-october-1803963

    Given both Truss and Sunak have said freezing the cap is not an option they would consider, they are going to have to do a very rapid u-turn next week to stave off a shitstorm of bad publicity.
    Alternatively freezing the cap is a bad idea, removing the price signal so people aren't encouraged to save energy making blackouts as we run out of energy more likely.

    The cap is going up because there's a shortage of energy. Freezing the cap doesn't fix that.

    Having the cap rise, but providing whatever support is deemed appropriate post-cap rise is far more logical.
    Freezing the energy price cap will reduce inflation, which saves HMG some costs by limiting the amount benefits increase (the September CPI is used, I believe).

    Of course, freezing the cap will cost more than is saved, but it would be interesting to try to work through the calculation.

    The costs of freezing the cap at the current £1,971 average, rather than allowing it to go to the suggested £3,582 (according to MSE) is what?... £1,600 * 28m households = £45bn pa. approx.?
    We're in 2 trillion of debt, what's another few hundred billion between friends ?
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 29,264
    The crash landing as reality intrudes may be even more brutal than I had thought for a government which thinks an idea like this is a good one to hand the nation’s largest newspaper to splash with on the weekend https://twitter.com/robfordmancs/status/1560960097983004673
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 56,756
    Scott_xP said:

    Andy_JS said:

    What do GPs have to do with energy bills?

    Maybe they could combine two terrible policies: If you miss your appointment another £10 gets added to your energy bill.
    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1561088498811244544
    A silly suggestion, as it implies you can get an appointment.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 25,298
    Nigelb said:

    ydoethur said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    I see a Dad's Army of retired doctors and nurses will solve the NHS.

    Corporal Jones will be performing colonoscopies, no doubt. "They don't like it up 'em".
    Private Fraser can break the news of a terminal diagnosis.
    Private Walker will provide the PPE at a good price.
    And Sergeant Wilson will always offer a second opinion.
    Private Sponge will provide the...errr.. sponges.
    Private Godfrey will block a bed.
    Warden Hodges will be responsible for cost controls.
    "Turn that blooming light off!"
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 55,103
    edited August 2022
    IshmaelZ said:

    pigeon said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Cyclefree said:

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    What the fuck

    Try getting a GP appointment before the end of winter.
    My new GP is great. Registered with them earlier this year, haven't needed to see a GP in years before now, but needed to twice in recent months and both times got a same-day appointment and second time got a referral to see a physio the next week too. They've been really friendly, the receptionists even are friendly and helpful, its like going into a parallel universe from all the normal stereotypes.
    Good for you.

    Daughter currently has a painful internal infection. On antibiotics. They are not making it better. As this has happened repeatedly in recent months, the GP wants to do some tests and asked for a sample - provided.

    But no joy in getting a time to speak to the GP. The only times are when Daughter is working (she's doing a new job organising & running weddings and cannot simply drop everything to wait for the GP to call). So now the next phone appointment just to get the result of one test is 3 weeks away. Meanwhile she's in pain and God knows what's happening inside: a kidney infection? Appendicitis? Something else? Blood in urine is not a good sign.

    If we can't get to a GP it will have to be A&E.

    It is no use the NHS advising people to stay away from A&E if primary care can't do its job. The GPsare fine when you get to talk to them. But the whole administration seems not to realise that working patients can't drop everything to wait by the phone. It seems designed to make it as hard as possible to see a bloody doctor.

    By contrast seeing a vet is dead easy, quick & convenient.

    It's notable that on the 4 recent occasions when Husband and I have needed medical help we had to go to A&E because the GP simply was not available. No wonder A&E departments are under stress. But lecturing patients isn't the answer either.

    I am seriously considering finding a private GP.
    Tory think: if you can afford a private GP then you are worth saving in the first place. If you can't, you aren't. Or am I being too cynical as well?
    Just doesn't work like that. Private GPs are not a thing outside Harley Street. In the provinces, you go NHS gp and private dentist.
    My grandmother had a private GP, out in the boondocks of East Yorks back in the day. He didn't sign up when the NHS was formed and just carried on and she remained on his books.

    I have never heard of anyone else doing this, although there are new private GP companies I believe springing up in the big cities.

  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 3,232
    Cyclefree said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    pigeon said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Cyclefree said:

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    What the fuck

    Try getting a GP appointment before the end of winter.
    My new GP is great. Registered with them earlier this year, haven't needed to see a GP in years before now, but needed to twice in recent months and both times got a same-day appointment and second time got a referral to see a physio the next week too. They've been really friendly, the receptionists even are friendly and helpful, its like going into a parallel universe from all the normal stereotypes.
    Good for you.

    Daughter currently has a painful internal infection. On antibiotics. They are not making it better. As this has happened repeatedly in recent months, the GP wants to do some tests and asked for a sample - provided.

    But no joy in getting a time to speak to the GP. The only times are when Daughter is working (she's doing a new job organising & running weddings and cannot simply drop everything to wait for the GP to call). So now the next phone appointment just to get the result of one test is 3 weeks away. Meanwhile she's in pain and God knows what's happening inside: a kidney infection? Appendicitis? Something else? Blood in urine is not a good sign.

    If we can't get to a GP it will have to be A&E.

    It is no use the NHS advising people to stay away from A&E if primary care can't do its job. The GPsare fine when you get to talk to them. But the whole administration seems not to realise that working patients can't drop everything to wait by the phone. It seems designed to make it as hard as possible to see a bloody doctor.

    By contrast seeing a vet is dead easy, quick & convenient.

    It's notable that on the 4 recent occasions when Husband and I have needed medical help we had to go to A&E because the GP simply was not available. No wonder A&E departments are under stress. But lecturing patients isn't the answer either.

    I am seriously considering finding a private GP.
    Tory think: if you can afford a private GP then you are worth saving in the first place. If you can't, you aren't. Or am I being too cynical as well?
    Just doesn't work like that. Private GPs are not a thing outside Harley Street. In the provinces, you go NHS gp and private dentist.
    Apparently there is a private GP locally and BUPA is available too. No idea if any good mind.
    Could book an appointment Monday morning over in Cambridge if I emptied the piggy bank to pay for it...
  • Focus groups conducted by the Labour head of strategy, Deborah Mattinson, suggest that the policy has already hit home. In a leaked memo to Starmer, Mattinson wrote: “In focus groups held in a Tory seat on Tuesday night, no voters said they would vote Conservative if an election was held tomorrow, despite all having backed the Tories in 2019.”

    Mattinson also hailed how even voters who “try to avoid the news” had registered the plan. The memo says: “Keir Starmer ‘has been trying to help with the cost of living, hasn’t he’ said one. ‘I think people will start to vote for him.’ When shown a news article of the policy, views grew even more positive. ‘It sounds amazing. You see that and you think ‘that’s who I want to run the country’.”
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 29,264

    I mean, it looks like a terrible plan, but I can see the logic that ends up here. Hopefully, this is just something on a postit note from a "there are no bad ideas" brainstorming session. Either that, or it's Truss seeking to discredit the Treasury.

    Major "Yes, and Ho" energy to this one.

    See also The Hollowmen, offiste brainstorming session. Who had the "thought ball" for this one...
  • Cyclefree said:

    Carnyx said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Carnyx said:

    Cyclefree said:

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    What the fuck

    Try getting a GP appointment before the end of winter.
    Feature not bug.

    Or am I being a tad too cynical?
    Not cynical. But bloody worrying. See my post before yours.
    Oh dear: so it is.
    And then this bloody woman has the fucking nerve to say that people here don't work hard. When I look at how hard my Daughter, my Sons work, how much I still work and my Husband too - but we cannot now rely on any of the basic services of the state to work competently.

    Nor - if there have to be cut backs and sacrifices this winter - can we trust MPs to make the same sacrifices as the rest of us, the one and only lesson I have learnt from Covid.
    Truss = Pound-shop Theresa May.
  • “She’s saying that she’s going to make the cost of living better but without saying what she’ll do or how she’ll pay for it,” one of those in Mattinson’s focus groups said. “I find it hard to take what she’s saying seriously.”

    Her memo concluded: “These swing voters were also affronted by the suggestion that only the poor need support — many citing needing to take on extra work/overtime, cut back on holidays, treats, any luxuries to make ends meet. Truss response seems tin-eared to that need, ignoring middle England.”
  • Cyclefree said:

    Carnyx said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Carnyx said:

    Cyclefree said:

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    What the fuck

    Try getting a GP appointment before the end of winter.
    Feature not bug.

    Or am I being a tad too cynical?
    Not cynical. But bloody worrying. See my post before yours.
    Oh dear: so it is.
    And then this bloody woman has the fucking nerve to say that people here don't work hard. When I look at how hard my Daughter, my Sons work, how much I still work and my Husband too - but we cannot now rely on any of the basic services of the state to work competently.

    Nor - if there have to be cut backs and sacrifices this winter - can we trust MPs to make the same sacrifices as the rest of us, the one and only lesson I have learnt from Covid.
    Truss = Pound-shop Theresa May.
    Bad news. Stuff in the pound shop now costs £1.50.
  • dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    Tory strategy to combat rising energy bills - increase the Winter Fuel Payment so only pensioners get to benefit.

    As I understand it everyone receives £400 in 6 equal installments from October and £650 is to be paid in two equal installments between July and in the autumn to all those on UC and benefits, and upto £600 winter fuel allowance to pensioners

    37 billion has been spent to date and as I said earlier the emergency budget is needed to increase these payments

    I understand the government is in discussion with the energy suppliers to cancel the rise for 2 years in energy costs and this is one to look out for in the emergency budget
    "Receives" isn't quite correct. Your leccy bill is credited with £60 each month AIUI.
    Fair comment and quite right to take it directly of the energy bill

    The main issue here is will this be extended and increased and will the price cap be cancelled for 2 years by Truss
    Er... cancelling the price cap would see prices go up even further surely?
    Labour have already proposed a 6 month freeze but this scheme is 2 years and is on the table apparently

    This seems to be the scheme in discussion

    https://www.energylivenews.com/2022/08/15/fresh-calls-for-price-cap-freeze/
    Here's the key phrase;

    The fund could be underwritten by the government, or a willing financial institution, and repaid over a 10-15 year period to smooth out the costs.
    They should probably look at adopting that but incorporating a business cap too and outflanking Labour by retaining the direct support already pledged which labour would scrap plus a small business support package to go alongside a business cap.
    The point is, however, Labour has a plan.
    There is another month when the Tories won't have one.
    If the new PM is September 5th, they ought to be presenting it September 6th.
    Then they can deal with the kids being sent home for lack of teachers with the necessary credentials.
    I agree, immediately announce what they will do, not dick about until sept 21
    It cannot work that way as much as it would be wise

    Truss will go to the Queen on Tuesday 6th September and then start appointing her Cabinet before PMQ's on the Wednesday

    The rest of the week will be appointing her government and then formal discussion with the new COE to agree the emergency budget so the 21st is not unrealistic but of course she may bring if forward
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 14,025
    edited August 2022
    Question. Do people think Truss will go ahead with her immediate tax cuts on NI and corporation tax, bearing in mind the huge additional borrowing requirement for energy bill support, social welfare/care and increasing interest payments, not to mention the ongoing crisis in emergency services that is leading directly to higher deathrates?

    She is very invested in those tax cuts but they don't look realistic.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 2,643
    Bozo gets his face back onto the papers with the Daily Express printing more delusional nonsense about lower bills because the UK will allegedly be joining the Trans Pacific Partnership at some point in the future !



  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 29,264
    nico679 said:

    Bozo gets his face back onto the papers with the Daily Express printing more delusional nonsense about lower bills because the UK will allegedly be joining the Trans Pacific Partnership at some point in the future !

    But we would have to give up Sovereignty to do that...
  • FF43 said:

    Question. Do people think Truss will go ahead with her immediate tax cuts on NI and corporation tax, bearing in mind the huge additional borrowing requirement for energy bill support, social welfare/care and increasing interest payments, not to mention the ongoing crisis in emergency services that is leading directly to higher deathrates?

    She is very invested in those tax cuts but they don't look realistic.

    Yes
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 28,836
    Talking about the point made earlier about energy costs and charities ...

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/aug/20/libraries-and-museums-to-be-warm-havens-for-people-struggling-with-energy-bills

    'Britain’s libraries and museums are preparing to act as warm havens for people unable to afford to heat their homes in the winter months.

    Ministers are being called on to provide urgent new funding so public buildings can cope with a surge in visitors during the coldest months.

    The buildings will be part of a network across the country which will provide warm shelter to help reduce excess winter deaths linked to freezing conditions.

    [...]
    Catalyst Science Discovery Centre and Museum in Widnes, Cheshire, said last week that the quote for renewing its annual gas contract had risen from £9,700 to £54,362.'
  • If I can't get a GP appointment, do I get my gas and eleccy discount from A&E instead?
  • OldBasing said:

    If I can't get a GP appointment, do I get my gas and eleccy discount from A&E instead?

    Nah you made the wrong choices in life and you can live on the streets and die
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 19,093
    Roger said:

    Carnyx said:

    For goodness sake. Better of two. Neither of these.

    Does nobody learn grammar any more?

    The ghost of A. B. de P. Johnson grimaces at the inaugural feast.
    Possible explanations:

    The public like Starmer's plan, even if it came from the Lib Dems and undoubtedly has holes in it. (Getting away with plans with holes is one of the few perks of opposition.)

    The public don't like the government's lack of a plan. Possibly fixable, but the public demand and Truss's instincts go in opposite directions.

    The public have made their mind up about Truss, in which case it's going to be damn hard to persuade them otherwise.
    The 'vote switch' phenomena in Opinium is new, theyve not been finding this level of switch before. Its a reaction to plan vs no plan. Brady is a fucking idiot going for this interminably long shitshow.
    Choosing her over Sunak is a very odd choice. She's brings all the negative qualities to the Tory Party we thought we'd seen the back of when Thatcher went. I can't see a saving grace in her.

    The longer she's been on display the more crumpled the image has looked. Matthew Parris's description of "a planet-sized mass of overconfidence and ambition teetering upon a pinhead of a political brain" can't really be bettered

    She has nonetheless comfortably despatched the previously well regarded Sunak.

    She could do the same to Labour with her foolish populist prospectus.

    She scares the hell out of me, and she should scare the Labour Party.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 28,836
    OldBasing said:

    If I can't get a GP appointment, do I get my gas and eleccy discount from A&E instead?

    That's actually an excellent question. Or would a practice nurse do? Or a homoeopath, given the thinking of certain Tories?
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 43,344
    edited August 2022
    Disturbing from @Nato member country Albania. Russian suspected agents arrested, while two soldiers are injured, one in critical condition w/ “chemical agent” local media report. Ministry of Defense confirmed three foreign tried to enter weapons factory

    2 Russian men and one women arrested inside the grounds of weapons factory after attacking guards. Two soldiers injured. Anti-terror and Intel service of Albania now on the ground. Local media claim they came in as tourists.


    https://twitter.com/petrit/status/1561088846179500032
  • Scott_xP said:

    nico679 said:

    Bozo gets his face back onto the papers with the Daily Express printing more delusional nonsense about lower bills because the UK will allegedly be joining the Trans Pacific Partnership at some point in the future !

    But we would have to give up Sovereignty to do that...
    Membership of TPP would be your worst nightmare
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 25,298

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    Tory strategy to combat rising energy bills - increase the Winter Fuel Payment so only pensioners get to benefit.

    As I understand it everyone receives £400 in 6 equal installments from October and £650 is to be paid in two equal installments between July and in the autumn to all those on UC and benefits, and upto £600 winter fuel allowance to pensioners

    37 billion has been spent to date and as I said earlier the emergency budget is needed to increase these payments

    I understand the government is in discussion with the energy suppliers to cancel the rise for 2 years in energy costs and this is one to look out for in the emergency budget
    "Receives" isn't quite correct. Your leccy bill is credited with £60 each month AIUI.
    Fair comment and quite right to take it directly of the energy bill

    The main issue here is will this be extended and increased and will the price cap be cancelled for 2 years by Truss
    Er... cancelling the price cap would see prices go up even further surely?
    Labour have already proposed a 6 month freeze but this scheme is 2 years and is on the table apparently

    This seems to be the scheme in discussion

    https://www.energylivenews.com/2022/08/15/fresh-calls-for-price-cap-freeze/
    Here's the key phrase;

    The fund could be underwritten by the government, or a willing financial institution, and repaid over a 10-15 year period to smooth out the costs.
    They should probably look at adopting that but incorporating a business cap too and outflanking Labour by retaining the direct support already pledged which labour would scrap plus a small business support package to go alongside a business cap.
    The point is, however, Labour has a plan.
    There is another month when the Tories won't have one.
    If the new PM is September 5th, they ought to be presenting it September 6th.
    Then they can deal with the kids being sent home for lack of teachers with the necessary credentials.
    I agree, immediately announce what they will do, not dick about until sept 21
    It cannot work that way as much as it would be wise

    Truss will go to the Queen on Tuesday 6th September and then start appointing her Cabinet before PMQ's on the Wednesday

    The rest of the week will be appointing her government and then formal discussion with the new COE to agree the emergency budget so the 21st is not unrealistic but of course she may bring if forward
    She will need to meet with her COE to agree it after she's been appointed?
    I would thoroughly hope she and they know what it is right now. And if not, that they are working with Zahawi and the Treasury around the clock.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 56,756

    OldBasing said:

    If I can't get a GP appointment, do I get my gas and eleccy discount from A&E instead?

    Nah you made the wrong choices in life and you can live on the streets and die
    Point of order - if you live on the streets, you're not actually dying.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 24,682

    Roger said:

    Carnyx said:

    For goodness sake. Better of two. Neither of these.

    Does nobody learn grammar any more?

    The ghost of A. B. de P. Johnson grimaces at the inaugural feast.
    Possible explanations:

    The public like Starmer's plan, even if it came from the Lib Dems and undoubtedly has holes in it. (Getting away with plans with holes is one of the few perks of opposition.)

    The public don't like the government's lack of a plan. Possibly fixable, but the public demand and Truss's instincts go in opposite directions.

    The public have made their mind up about Truss, in which case it's going to be damn hard to persuade them otherwise.
    The 'vote switch' phenomena in Opinium is new, theyve not been finding this level of switch before. Its a reaction to plan vs no plan. Brady is a fucking idiot going for this interminably long shitshow.
    Choosing her over Sunak is a very odd choice. She's brings all the negative qualities to the Tory Party we thought we'd seen the back of when Thatcher went. I can't see a saving grace in her.

    The longer she's been on display the more crumpled the image has looked. Matthew Parris's description of "a planet-sized mass of overconfidence and ambition teetering upon a pinhead of a political brain" can't really be bettered

    She has nonetheless comfortably despatched the previously well regarded Sunak.

    She could do the same to Labour with her foolish populist prospectus.

    She scares the hell out of me, and she should scare the Labour Party.
    She scares the hell out of me, but because of the threat she poses to the country, not to Labour.
  • dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    Tory strategy to combat rising energy bills - increase the Winter Fuel Payment so only pensioners get to benefit.

    As I understand it everyone receives £400 in 6 equal installments from October and £650 is to be paid in two equal installments between July and in the autumn to all those on UC and benefits, and upto £600 winter fuel allowance to pensioners

    37 billion has been spent to date and as I said earlier the emergency budget is needed to increase these payments

    I understand the government is in discussion with the energy suppliers to cancel the rise for 2 years in energy costs and this is one to look out for in the emergency budget
    "Receives" isn't quite correct. Your leccy bill is credited with £60 each month AIUI.
    Fair comment and quite right to take it directly of the energy bill

    The main issue here is will this be extended and increased and will the price cap be cancelled for 2 years by Truss
    Er... cancelling the price cap would see prices go up even further surely?
    Labour have already proposed a 6 month freeze but this scheme is 2 years and is on the table apparently

    This seems to be the scheme in discussion

    https://www.energylivenews.com/2022/08/15/fresh-calls-for-price-cap-freeze/
    Here's the key phrase;

    The fund could be underwritten by the government, or a willing financial institution, and repaid over a 10-15 year period to smooth out the costs.
    They should probably look at adopting that but incorporating a business cap too and outflanking Labour by retaining the direct support already pledged which labour would scrap plus a small business support package to go alongside a business cap.
    The point is, however, Labour has a plan.
    There is another month when the Tories won't have one.
    If the new PM is September 5th, they ought to be presenting it September 6th.
    Then they can deal with the kids being sent home for lack of teachers with the necessary credentials.
    I agree, immediately announce what they will do, not dick about until sept 21
    It cannot work that way as much as it would be wise

    Truss will go to the Queen on Tuesday 6th September and then start appointing her Cabinet before PMQ's on the Wednesday

    The rest of the week will be appointing her government and then formal discussion with the new COE to agree the emergency budget so the 21st is not unrealistic but of course she may bring if forward
    She will need to meet with her COE to agree it after she's been appointed?
    I would thoroughly hope she and they know what it is right now. And if not, that they are working with Zahawi and the Treasury around the clock.
    I am sure they are and indeed Zahawi has said as much
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 29,264

    She has nonetheless comfortably despatched the previously well regarded Sunak.

    Only amongst voters who still pine for BoZo
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 14,025

    Cyclefree said:

    Carnyx said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Carnyx said:

    Cyclefree said:

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    What the fuck

    Try getting a GP appointment before the end of winter.
    Feature not bug.

    Or am I being a tad too cynical?
    Not cynical. But bloody worrying. See my post before yours.
    Oh dear: so it is.
    And then this bloody woman has the fucking nerve to say that people here don't work hard. When I look at how hard my Daughter, my Sons work, how much I still work and my Husband too - but we cannot now rely on any of the basic services of the state to work competently.

    Nor - if there have to be cut backs and sacrifices this winter - can we trust MPs to make the same sacrifices as the rest of us, the one and only lesson I have learnt from Covid.
    Truss = Pound-shop Theresa May.
    Bad news. Stuff in the pound shop now costs £1.50.
    Weird thing. I always thought everything £1 a ridiculous business model. But going into Poundland recently with prices varying between £1, £2.50, £3 etc - I found it very disorientating.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,650

    FF43 said:

    Is this the first negative honeymoon in political history? Where a ruling party decides it can't go on like this, get a new broom and its vote share falls even further?

    Any bounce usually doesnt transpire until the new PM is in place. Not that im expecting one!
    Is that the case?

    It definitely wasn't for Thatcher-to-Major; the Conservative uptick was sudden, huge and happened after Maggie announced her resignation and before Major's victory.

    For Blair-to-Brown, Labour's ratings started improving in May (when Blair announced he was going) and continued going up through Brown's win.

    For Cameron-to-May, there was a much bigger uptick in Conservative ratings when May took over than when Cameron went.

    Johnson did get a big gain when he took over, but that was in the odd circumstances of having a huge pool of Brexit Party voters waiting to come back.

    So it's a mixed picture. But the first opportunity to gain voters back (yay! Boris won't be PM any more) has passed and that hasn't worked for the Conservatives.
    Hmmmmm ill give you Thatcher, but Labours position was pretty flat after Blair announced he was going until just before Brown took over but Briwn was the sole candidate by then so it was a handover, not a contest.
    May and Johnsons both came after taking over and increasingly over a period of about 3 months, brown too but iver a shorter period
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 25,298
    Carnyx said:

    OldBasing said:

    If I can't get a GP appointment, do I get my gas and eleccy discount from A&E instead?

    That's actually an excellent question. Or would a practice nurse do? Or a homoeopath, given the thinking of certain Tories?
    The less of your bill you are able to pay, the more effective it will be.
  • Here is the under the bonnet number that matters.

    13% of those who voted Tory at the last election say they will now vote Labour. This is *almost* 1997 levels of switching.

    https://twitter.com/chriscurtis94/status/1561067520932675584
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 29,264
    Impressive effort to get an even stupider idea on the front page of another paper on the same evening…what should we do in the face of a massive energy price spike? Raise taxes on the forms of energy easiest to produce locally! https://twitter.com/psythor/status/1561094976913776641
  • FF43 said:

    Question. Do people think Truss will go ahead with her immediate tax cuts on NI and corporation tax, bearing in mind the huge additional borrowing requirement for energy bill support, social welfare/care and increasing interest payments, not to mention the ongoing crisis in emergency services that is leading directly to higher deathrates?

    She is very invested in those tax cuts but they don't look realistic.

    Yes
    Truss has got two really big decisions to make very early on.

    One is what to do about Boris and the StandardsCommittee. She could throw him to the wolves, or get him out of trouble. Whatever she does will annoy someone.

    The other is who she helps with her limited fiscal firepower. She clearly wants the tax cuts, believes in the tax cuts. But they do cost money and they do benefit the better-off. Not necessarily the rich (though they benefit the most), but they do nothing to help those right at the bottom of the pile. Again, she has a choice to make, and she can't please everyone.

    Who she chooses to please, and who she chooses to annoy, will be very revealing of what happens next.
  • dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    Tory strategy to combat rising energy bills - increase the Winter Fuel Payment so only pensioners get to benefit.

    As I understand it everyone receives £400 in 6 equal installments from October and £650 is to be paid in two equal installments between July and in the autumn to all those on UC and benefits, and upto £600 winter fuel allowance to pensioners

    37 billion has been spent to date and as I said earlier the emergency budget is needed to increase these payments

    I understand the government is in discussion with the energy suppliers to cancel the rise for 2 years in energy costs and this is one to look out for in the emergency budget
    "Receives" isn't quite correct. Your leccy bill is credited with £60 each month AIUI.
    Fair comment and quite right to take it directly of the energy bill

    The main issue here is will this be extended and increased and will the price cap be cancelled for 2 years by Truss
    Er... cancelling the price cap would see prices go up even further surely?
    Labour have already proposed a 6 month freeze but this scheme is 2 years and is on the table apparently

    This seems to be the scheme in discussion

    https://www.energylivenews.com/2022/08/15/fresh-calls-for-price-cap-freeze/
    Here's the key phrase;

    The fund could be underwritten by the government, or a willing financial institution, and repaid over a 10-15 year period to smooth out the costs.
    They should probably look at adopting that but incorporating a business cap too and outflanking Labour by retaining the direct support already pledged which labour would scrap plus a small business support package to go alongside a business cap.
    The point is, however, Labour has a plan.
    There is another month when the Tories won't have one.
    If the new PM is September 5th, they ought to be presenting it September 6th.
    Then they can deal with the kids being sent home for lack of teachers with the necessary credentials.
    I agree, immediately announce what they will do, not dick about until sept 21
    It cannot work that way as much as it would be wise

    Truss will go to the Queen on Tuesday 6th September and then start appointing her Cabinet before PMQ's on the Wednesday

    The rest of the week will be appointing her government and then formal discussion with the new COE to agree the emergency budget so the 21st is not unrealistic but of course she may bring if forward
    She will need to meet with her COE to agree it after she's been appointed?
    I would thoroughly hope she and they know what it is right now. And if not, that they are working with Zahawi and the Treasury around the clock.
    The cabinet will have to agree it as well
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 24,682

    FF43 said:

    Question. Do people think Truss will go ahead with her immediate tax cuts on NI and corporation tax, bearing in mind the huge additional borrowing requirement for energy bill support, social welfare/care and increasing interest payments, not to mention the ongoing crisis in emergency services that is leading directly to higher deathrates?

    She is very invested in those tax cuts but they don't look realistic.

    Yes
    Truss has got two really big decisions to make very early on.

    One is what to do about Boris and the StandardsCommittee. She could throw him to the wolves, or get him out of trouble. Whatever she does will annoy someone.

    The other is who she helps with her limited fiscal firepower. She clearly wants the tax cuts, believes in the tax cuts. But they do cost money and they do benefit the better-off. Not necessarily the rich (though they benefit the most), but they do nothing to help those right at the bottom of the pile. Again, she has a choice to make, and she can't please everyone.

    Who she chooses to please, and who she chooses to annoy, will be very revealing of what happens next.
    Surely bigger than those two decisions is what to do about the energy price cap?

    Given it's Truss we're talking about, I expect the answer will be: send more immigrants to Rwanda.
  • Opinium under old methodology I think is 20 points
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 25,298
    ...
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 107,357
    Boost for Starmer in that he now clearly leads Truss as preferred PM with Opinium in contrast to RedfieldWilton. Also Starmer now has a bigger lead over Truss than Sunak as preferred PM
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 25,298

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    Tory strategy to combat rising energy bills - increase the Winter Fuel Payment so only pensioners get to benefit.

    As I understand it everyone receives £400 in 6 equal installments from October and £650 is to be paid in two equal installments between July and in the autumn to all those on UC and benefits, and upto £600 winter fuel allowance to pensioners

    37 billion has been spent to date and as I said earlier the emergency budget is needed to increase these payments

    I understand the government is in discussion with the energy suppliers to cancel the rise for 2 years in energy costs and this is one to look out for in the emergency budget
    "Receives" isn't quite correct. Your leccy bill is credited with £60 each month AIUI.
    Fair comment and quite right to take it directly of the energy bill

    The main issue here is will this be extended and increased and will the price cap be cancelled for 2 years by Truss
    Er... cancelling the price cap would see prices go up even further surely?
    Labour have already proposed a 6 month freeze but this scheme is 2 years and is on the table apparently

    This seems to be the scheme in discussion

    https://www.energylivenews.com/2022/08/15/fresh-calls-for-price-cap-freeze/
    Here's the key phrase;

    The fund could be underwritten by the government, or a willing financial institution, and repaid over a 10-15 year period to smooth out the costs.
    They should probably look at adopting that but incorporating a business cap too and outflanking Labour by retaining the direct support already pledged which labour would scrap plus a small business support package to go alongside a business cap.
    The point is, however, Labour has a plan.
    There is another month when the Tories won't have one.
    If the new PM is September 5th, they ought to be presenting it September 6th.
    Then they can deal with the kids being sent home for lack of teachers with the necessary credentials.
    I agree, immediately announce what they will do, not dick about until sept 21
    It cannot work that way as much as it would be wise

    Truss will go to the Queen on Tuesday 6th September and then start appointing her Cabinet before PMQ's on the Wednesday

    The rest of the week will be appointing her government and then formal discussion with the new COE to agree the emergency budget so the 21st is not unrealistic but of course she may bring if forward
    She will need to meet with her COE to agree it after she's been appointed?
    I would thoroughly hope she and they know what it is right now. And if not, that they are working with Zahawi and the Treasury around the clock.
    The cabinet will have to agree it as well
    Nope. It's an emergency. You agree to it as a pre-condition of a Cabinet place.
    We can't afford yet another two weeks of Tory Party internal self-indulgence.
    Nor can the Tories.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 55,103

    FF43 said:

    Question. Do people think Truss will go ahead with her immediate tax cuts on NI and corporation tax, bearing in mind the huge additional borrowing requirement for energy bill support, social welfare/care and increasing interest payments, not to mention the ongoing crisis in emergency services that is leading directly to higher deathrates?

    She is very invested in those tax cuts but they don't look realistic.

    Yes
    Truss has got two really big decisions to make very early on.

    One is what to do about Boris and the StandardsCommittee. She could throw him to the wolves, or get him out of trouble. Whatever she does will annoy someone.

    The other is who she helps with her limited fiscal firepower. She clearly wants the tax cuts, believes in the tax cuts. But they do cost money and they do benefit the better-off. Not necessarily the rich (though they benefit the most), but they do nothing to help those right at the bottom of the pile. Again, she has a choice to make, and she can't please everyone.

    Who she chooses to please, and who she chooses to annoy, will be very revealing of what happens next.
    Surely bigger than those two decisions is what to do about the energy price cap?

    Given it's Truss we're talking about, I expect the answer will be: send more immigrants to Rwanda.
    How does Truss have control of the standards committee?
  • kyf_100kyf_100 Posts: 3,415

    Here is the under the bonnet number that matters.

    13% of those who voted Tory at the last election say they will now vote Labour. This is *almost* 1997 levels of switching.

    https://twitter.com/chriscurtis94/status/1561067520932675584

    I do wonder at what point the odds on a Labour majority are going to drop quite dramatically.

    Baxtered that Opinium poll puts Labour just 7 short of a majority, and those energy bills haven't even started landing yet. Add a bit of tactical voting and a Labour majority starts to look nailed on to me.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 20,506
    1. If desired behaviour from the energy companies can be summarised as 'diversify supply', 'increase efficiency', 'accept a share of pain'
    2. If desired behaviour from the consumer is 'conserve gas', and 'continue to spend money in the economy'
    3. And if the Government needs to 'save money', 'protect the vulnerable', and 'avoid recession'

    Then the solution looks something like:

    1. 'cap energy and gas prices based on the real wholesale price of gas; consider capping below the real wholesale price and offering direct support to energy companies if gas prices escalate wildly.
    2. Give cash support directly to consumers, not to power companies. If they want to spend it on woolly blankets, beer, meals out, let them.
    3. Focus the cash support on lower earners.
  • The site is having issues @TSE
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 107,357
    Opinium also finds 25% prefer Boris as best PM to Starmer compared to 23% for Sunak and Truss. Boris only 6% behind Starmer as preferred PM while Truss is 8% behind Starmer.

    So what a complete waste of time those Tory MPs removing Boris was!!!

    https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1561085536353361923?s=20&t=jKUOvr1NuQWFTw-Y8h3JTw

  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,650

    Opinium under old methodology I think is 20 points

    Nah, its only 9 points on the raw figures, its nowhere near 20
  • HYUFD said:

    Opinium also finds 25% prefer Boris as best PM to Starmer compared to 23% for Sunak and Truss. Boris only 6% behind Starmer as preferred PM while Truss is 8% behind Starmer.

    So what a complete waste of time those Tory MPs removing Boris was!!!

    https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1561085536353361923?s=20&t=jKUOvr1NuQWFTw-Y8h3JTw

    You just do not get it do you
  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 3,232

    Roger said:

    Carnyx said:

    For goodness sake. Better of two. Neither of these.

    Does nobody learn grammar any more?

    The ghost of A. B. de P. Johnson grimaces at the inaugural feast.
    Possible explanations:

    The public like Starmer's plan, even if it came from the Lib Dems and undoubtedly has holes in it. (Getting away with plans with holes is one of the few perks of opposition.)

    The public don't like the government's lack of a plan. Possibly fixable, but the public demand and Truss's instincts go in opposite directions.

    The public have made their mind up about Truss, in which case it's going to be damn hard to persuade them otherwise.
    The 'vote switch' phenomena in Opinium is new, theyve not been finding this level of switch before. Its a reaction to plan vs no plan. Brady is a fucking idiot going for this interminably long shitshow.
    Choosing her over Sunak is a very odd choice. She's brings all the negative qualities to the Tory Party we thought we'd seen the back of when Thatcher went. I can't see a saving grace in her.

    The longer she's been on display the more crumpled the image has looked. Matthew Parris's description of "a planet-sized mass of overconfidence and ambition teetering upon a pinhead of a political brain" can't really be bettered

    She has nonetheless comfortably despatched the previously well regarded Sunak.

    She could do the same to Labour with her foolish populist prospectus.

    She scares the hell out of me, and she should scare the Labour Party.
    There is only so far even the Conservative Party can get with populism when the great mass of the people is getting noticeably poorer. Proposing, for arguments' sake, to solve the Channel migrant crisis by getting the navy to exterminate the boat people with machine guns mid-crossing would cause quite a lot of the ex-Kippers to spaff their kecks, but Truss has to keep the bulk of the 2019 voter coalition together to hold onto power.

    Telling middle-class pensioners facing heat or eat dilemmas this Winter that everything's actually wonderful because look, we rounded up a load of paedophiles and asylum seekers, shot them and burned their bodies to generate extra electricity, simply ain't going to cut it.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 14,025

    FF43 said:

    Question. Do people think Truss will go ahead with her immediate tax cuts on NI and corporation tax, bearing in mind the huge additional borrowing requirement for energy bill support, social welfare/care and increasing interest payments, not to mention the ongoing crisis in emergency services that is leading directly to higher deathrates?

    She is very invested in those tax cuts but they don't look realistic.

    Yes
    Truss has got two really big decisions to make very early on.

    One is what to do about Boris and the StandardsCommittee. She could throw him to the wolves, or get him out of trouble. Whatever she does will annoy someone.

    The other is who she helps with her limited fiscal firepower. She clearly wants the tax cuts, believes in the tax cuts. But they do cost money and they do benefit the better-off. Not necessarily the rich (though they benefit the most), but they do nothing to help those right at the bottom of the pile. Again, she has a choice to make, and she can't please everyone.

    Who she chooses to please, and who she chooses to annoy, will be very revealing of what happens next.
    Surely bigger than those two decisions is what to do about the energy price cap?

    Given it's Truss we're talking about, I expect the answer will be: send more immigrants to Rwanda.
    Exactly. Given the government will have to make a big intervention on fuel bills running to tens of billions even if it's not the full cap, given increasing interest payments, given the government will have to be seen to do something about emergency services where people literally can't wait for treatment - they die first - how do those tax cuts fit in?
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 25,298
    HYUFD said:

    Opinium also finds 25% prefer Boris as best PM to Starmer compared to 23% for Sunak and Truss. Boris only 6% behind Starmer as preferred PM while Truss is 8% behind Starmer.

    So what a complete waste of time those Tory MPs removing Boris was!!!

    https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1561085536353361923?s=20&t=jKUOvr1NuQWFTw-Y8h3JTw

    Boris removed himself.
    He was given a final written warning. Then pulled the same trick weeks later. Suggesting either.
    He's a sociopath incapable of learning.
    Or. He knew he wasn't up to what the winter would bring.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 25,298
    kyf_100 said:

    Here is the under the bonnet number that matters.

    13% of those who voted Tory at the last election say they will now vote Labour. This is *almost* 1997 levels of switching.

    https://twitter.com/chriscurtis94/status/1561067520932675584

    I do wonder at what point the odds on a Labour majority are going to drop quite dramatically.

    Baxtered that Opinium poll puts Labour just 7 short of a majority, and those energy bills haven't even started landing yet. Add a bit of tactical voting and a Labour majority starts to look nailed on to me.
    It's still a huge mountain to climb.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 43,344
    Reports that the daughter of Alexander Dugin has been assassinated in Moscow.

    https://www.twitter.com/kamilkazani/status/1561098120506769410
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 5,759

    Cyclefree said:

    Carnyx said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Carnyx said:

    Cyclefree said:

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    What the fuck

    Try getting a GP appointment before the end of winter.
    Feature not bug.

    Or am I being a tad too cynical?
    Not cynical. But bloody worrying. See my post before yours.
    Oh dear: so it is.
    And then this bloody woman has the fucking nerve to say that people here don't work hard. When I look at how hard my Daughter, my Sons work, how much I still work and my Husband too - but we cannot now rely on any of the basic services of the state to work competently.

    Nor - if there have to be cut backs and sacrifices this winter - can we trust MPs to make the same sacrifices as the rest of us, the one and only lesson I have learnt from Covid.
    Truss = Pound-shop Theresa May.
    Bad news. Stuff in the pound shop now costs £1.50.
    Onepoundfiftyland doesn't quite have the same ring about it though, does it?
  • HYUFD said:

    Opinium also finds 25% prefer Boris as best PM to Starmer compared to 23% for Sunak and Truss. Boris only 6% behind Starmer as preferred PM while Truss is 8% behind Starmer.

    So what a complete waste of time those Tory MPs removing Boris was!!!

    https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1561085536353361923?s=20&t=jKUOvr1NuQWFTw-Y8h3JTw

    You just do not get it do you
    No, from a purely populist point of view, he's right.

    Boris, revolting as he is, has a magic connection with a slice of the British public. I don't like it, I don't think you like it, but that doesn't stop it being the case.

    Sunak definitely doesn't have it. Truss doesn't really have it, the best she can be said to be is a low-budget Boris Johnson tribute act.

    Replacing Johnson should win back some voters who were appalled by his personal behaviour. Choosing Truss over Sunak (let alone Mordaunt or Tugnedhat) limits that gain, but hey ho. But getting rid of "Boris" will cut the connection that the Conservatives built up with some of the electorate.

    Johnson had to go (but I'm of the view he should never have been let near No 10 in the first place). But he was put there to win votes, and ditching him will likely cost votes.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 14,025
    kyf_100 said:

    Here is the under the bonnet number that matters.

    13% of those who voted Tory at the last election say they will now vote Labour. This is *almost* 1997 levels of switching.

    https://twitter.com/chriscurtis94/status/1561067520932675584

    I do wonder at what point the odds on a Labour majority are going to drop quite dramatically.

    Baxtered that Opinium poll puts Labour just 7 short of a majority, and those energy bills haven't even started landing yet. Add a bit of tactical voting and a Labour majority starts to look nailed on to me.
    Not fully appreciated is that tactical voting helps Labour a lot more than the Lib Dems. But the Labour vote share does need to be at least close to the Tory one. The effect diminishes rapidly as Tory vote share climbs above 35%.
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 7,317

    Here is the under the bonnet number that matters.

    13% of those who voted Tory at the last election say they will now vote Labour. This is *almost* 1997 levels of switching.

    https://twitter.com/chriscurtis94/status/1561067520932675584

    I'm struggling to understand how the Conservatives are down to 31% if only 13% of their voters are going to Labour. That poll would suggest they are losing 25% in total.
  • Cyclefree said:

    EXCL - Latest on Treasury plans to ease the cost of living crisis.

    GPs would be able to write prescriptions to give needy Brits money off their energy bills under proposals.

    The blueprint is one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around.

    What the fuck

    Try getting a GP appointment before the end of winter.
    My new GP is great. Registered with them earlier this year, haven't needed to see a GP in years before now, but needed to twice in recent months and both times got a same-day appointment and second time got a referral to see a physio the next week too. They've been really friendly, the receptionists even are friendly and helpful, its like going into a parallel universe from all the normal stereotypes.
    Do you honestly think this policy is a good idea
    I know nothing about the policy only seeing a few lines, unsourced, that you've quoted.

    Having said that "one of a bunch of options No11 boffins are kicking around" sounds like Treasury mandarins have been told to have an array of proposals that can be delivered ready for when the new PM and new Chancellor is in place. That's standing operating procedure and one would hope the new Chancellor would read the options are and go for the sane one rather than just picking one out of a hat.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s99ZeamF7J0
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 107,357
    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    Opinium also finds 25% prefer Boris as best PM to Starmer compared to 23% for Sunak and Truss. Boris only 6% behind Starmer as preferred PM while Truss is 8% behind Starmer.

    So what a complete waste of time those Tory MPs removing Boris was!!!

    https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1561085536353361923?s=20&t=jKUOvr1NuQWFTw-Y8h3JTw

    Boris removed himself.
    He was given a final written warning. Then pulled the same trick weeks later. Suggesting either.
    He's a sociopath incapable of learning.
    Or. He knew he wasn't up to what the winter would bring.
    Boris was the best and most charismatic election winning leader
    the Tories had. That is why non Tories like you wanted him gone. And the Tory MPs made the fatal error of giving into you and as a consequence more of them may now lose their seats
  • Worrying times for so many and very complex and difficult solutions if indeed there are any

    Good night folks
This discussion has been closed.