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ConHome survey has Truss 32% ahead – politicalbetting.com

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  • MISTYMISTY Posts: 1,594

    MISTY said:

    tlg86 said:

    What's the point of paying for a thumb on the scales if you don't get a thumb on the scales?


    Well, some of us pointed out at the time that using estimated grades was a cheat's charter.

    But curious that sixth-form colleges tended to not fiddle. Perhaps the teachers at those don't have quite the same pressures on them, but not sure.

    Grammars being best of the rest is presumably because they tend to get a lot of As anyway, so less scope to cheat.
    If affluent middle class people can't get their children into top academic institutions they will create their own top academic institutions or send their kids to other countries' top academic institutions.

    They will also start to question paying their taxes into to a system that does not work for them, as many are starting to do with the NHS.

    Hint: 30% of the taxes come from the top 1%.
    Hint: People who suggest 30% of the taxes come from the top 1% are either economically illiterate or deliberately misleading (the combination is possible as well of course).
    https://fullfact.org/economy/do-top-1-earners-pay-28-tax-burden/ for MISTY.
    OK I left out the word income. In that article it suggests that the top 10% per cent probably pay not far short of 30% of all the indirect taxes as well as the direct ones.

    But hey, nitpick. Its better than trying to counter my argument, right?
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    MISTY said:

    MISTY said:

    tlg86 said:

    What's the point of paying for a thumb on the scales if you don't get a thumb on the scales?


    Well, some of us pointed out at the time that using estimated grades was a cheat's charter.

    But curious that sixth-form colleges tended to not fiddle. Perhaps the teachers at those don't have quite the same pressures on them, but not sure.

    Grammars being best of the rest is presumably because they tend to get a lot of As anyway, so less scope to cheat.
    If affluent middle class people can't get their children into top academic institutions they will create their own top academic institutions or send their kids to other countries' top academic institutions.

    They will also start to question paying their taxes into to a system that does not work for them, as many are starting to do with the NHS.

    Hint: 30% of the taxes come from the top 1%.
    Hint: People who suggest 30% of the taxes come from the top 1% are either economically illiterate or deliberately misleading (the combination is possible as well of course).
    https://fullfact.org/economy/do-top-1-earners-pay-28-tax-burden/ for MISTY.
    OK I left out the word income. In that article it suggests that the top 10% per cent probably pay not far short of 30% of all the indirect taxes as well as the direct ones.

    But hey, nitpick. Its better than trying to counter my argument, right?
    But your argument is, what, that it is morally acceptable for private schools to cheat in order to rectify a perceived bias against them?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 18,992
    ...

    DearPB said:

    Following the University Challenge announcement the comments on the Daily Telegraph story are openly explicitly racist. Extraordinary

    Oo I missed that announcement. I hadn't thought of him during the discussions on here the other day but now he is mentioned I think he is a good choice. It needs someone a bit assertive (although Paxman was at times a bit OTT and sneary) and I think Rajan has the right persona for it. Clive Myrie has vastly improved Mastermind and although I don't think UC needs improving hopefully Rajan will have the necessary gravitas.

    Fuck the Telegraph readers.
    But this is the sort of wokery that vexes the likes of Casino and Leon, it doesn't matter that Myrie and Rajan are probably the right candidates for the job.

    Personally I am surprised they didn't give UC to the terminally useless Paddy O'Connell. He seems to get everything else. O'Connell may have been out of his depth, but he'd keep the culture warriors happy.
    I got the impression from his comments that Rajan was the exact opposite of woke. At least in this context. He seems to thoroughly endorse elitism when practiced by means of meritocracy.

    But then I have kind of lost track of what is supposed to be woke and what isn't. I know what things annoy me but I am not sure what the label is for them these days.
    I'm with Rajan all the way. He is very good and I suspect will be an excellent host of UC. Paxman but without the condescension.

    Still, Rajan is going to resign his BBC Media Editor role later in the year. Paddy O'Connell is surely a shoo-in.

    I am sure a couple of posters can put you right on exactly what wokery means in the 2020s. All I know it is very big and very bad.
  • EndillionEndillion Posts: 4,719

    tlg86 said:

    What's the point of paying for a thumb on the scales if you don't get a thumb on the scales?


    Well, some of us pointed out at the time that using estimated grades was a cheat's charter.

    But curious that sixth-form colleges tended to not fiddle. Perhaps the teachers at those don't have quite the same pressures on them, but not sure.

    Grammars being best of the rest is presumably because they tend to get a lot of As anyway, so less scope to cheat.
    There was a technical reason for that.

    To reduce the scale of the inflation, the exam boards tried to moderate each school/college's results for each subject based on what the candidates got at GCSE and how the school had done at A Level recently. (Becuase, despite what others might tell you, attainment on entry affects results a lot more than anything the school does.)

    Trouble was, that only worked for institutions with fairly large cohorts. Everyone recognised that if there are only 2 or 3 candidates at a school doing a subject, you can't apply statistics without massive unfairness. So those results were largely waved through.

    Colleges have big cohorts- that's their point. Indy schools often have tiny cohorts. 11-18 schools are somewhere in between (those middle four blocks aren't that much different to each other).

    I don't know what it tells us about morality vs. opportunity, but the practical effect was a bad one.
    I thought they were forced to get rid of the moderation, after the algorithm that applied it was revealed to have been written by Gavin Williamson?

    The final grades for 2020, and the grades for 2021 (which is presumably the starting point for the graphic), were then based solely on teacher assessment. So, the extent to which grades have declined this year is largely a reflection on how optimistic different cohorts of teachers were last year.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 17,547
    edited August 2022
    2/3 of British families are expected to enter “fuel poverty” by January 23, which is defined as needing to spend more than 10% of income of fuel.

    It’s closer to 90% for single parents of two, and pensioner couples.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 37,019
    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 47,042

    ...

    DearPB said:

    Following the University Challenge announcement the comments on the Daily Telegraph story are openly explicitly racist. Extraordinary

    Oo I missed that announcement. I hadn't thought of him during the discussions on here the other day but now he is mentioned I think he is a good choice. It needs someone a bit assertive (although Paxman was at times a bit OTT and sneary) and I think Rajan has the right persona for it. Clive Myrie has vastly improved Mastermind and although I don't think UC needs improving hopefully Rajan will have the necessary gravitas.

    Fuck the Telegraph readers.
    But this is the sort of wokery that vexes the likes of Casino and Leon, it doesn't matter that Myrie and Rajan are probably the right candidates for the job.

    Personally I am surprised they didn't give UC to the terminally useless Paddy O'Connell. He seems to get everything else. O'Connell may have been out of his depth, but he'd keep the culture warriors happy.
    I got the impression from his comments that Rajan was the exact opposite of woke. At least in this context. He seems to thoroughly endorse elitism when practiced by means of meritocracy.

    But then I have kind of lost track of what is supposed to be woke and what isn't. I know what things annoy me but I am not sure what the label is for them these days.
    ...I am sure a couple of posters can put you right on exactly what wokery means in the 2020s. All I know it is very big and very bad.
    Sounds right up Leon's street.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 30,484
    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    Yes, and to similarly laughable effect
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 37,019
    Selebian said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I guess one thing the Gov't could do is say raise the cap to 2500, pray that wholesale gas and leccy falls long term then just keep the cap there to pay back the operators long after we have the cheaper leccy ?
    Stabilisation mechanism

    Would need to be more than just a cap though. Otherwise you get new entrants without the accumulated debt entering, when wholesale prices fall, outcompeting the existing companies, who go bust.

    Hmm, not entirely unappealing :smile: But without a minimum price guarantee (price 'shoe'?) the banks that would keep the energy companies afloat with a £2.5k cap in the short term but a promise of bein able to efffectively overcharge later would surely not extend credit. And further bankruptcies among the actually more competent suppliers might cause more problems... Would need nationalisation.
    Priti?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 72,853
    edited August 2022
    Selebian said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I guess one thing the Gov't could do is say raise the cap to 2500, pray that wholesale gas and leccy falls long term then just keep the cap there to pay back the operators long after we have the cheaper leccy ?
    Stabilisation mechanism

    Would need to be more than just a cap though. Otherwise you get new entrants without the accumulated debt entering, when wholesale prices fall, outcompeting the existing companies, who go bust.

    Hmm, not entirely unappealing :smile: But without a minimum price guarantee (price 'shoe'?) the banks that would keep the energy companies afloat with a £2.5k cap in the short term but a promise of bein able to efffectively overcharge later would surely not extend credit. And further bankruptcies among the actually more competent suppliers might cause more problems... Would need nationalisation.
    Nationalisation of the middleman sector is only a couple of billion though as everyone has pointed out. The expensive bit is the subsequent subsidy, but we did it for banks and since we're moving to a renewable/nuclear mix it's not err structural...
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 16,258
    MISTY said:

    MISTY said:

    tlg86 said:

    What's the point of paying for a thumb on the scales if you don't get a thumb on the scales?


    Well, some of us pointed out at the time that using estimated grades was a cheat's charter.

    But curious that sixth-form colleges tended to not fiddle. Perhaps the teachers at those don't have quite the same pressures on them, but not sure.

    Grammars being best of the rest is presumably because they tend to get a lot of As anyway, so less scope to cheat.
    If affluent middle class people can't get their children into top academic institutions they will create their own top academic institutions or send their kids to other countries' top academic institutions.

    They will also start to question paying their taxes into to a system that does not work for them, as many are starting to do with the NHS.

    Hint: 30% of the taxes come from the top 1%.
    Hint: People who suggest 30% of the taxes come from the top 1% are either economically illiterate or deliberately misleading (the combination is possible as well of course).
    https://fullfact.org/economy/do-top-1-earners-pay-28-tax-burden/ for MISTY.
    OK I left out the word income. In that article it suggests that the top 10% per cent probably pay not far short of 30% of all the indirect taxes as well as the direct ones.

    But hey, nitpick. Its better than trying to counter my argument, right?
    The top 10% paying 30% sounds quite fair and not extreme at all. The top 1% paying 30% would be a very different scenario. It is not nit picking.
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 5,752
    edited August 2022
    Leon said:

    Why in the fucking name of holy fish-fucking hell am I supposed to fucking care who chairs fucking University fucking Challenge?

    Deleted / repeated.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 17,547
    edited August 2022
    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certainly no - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 17,547

    MISTY said:

    MISTY said:

    tlg86 said:

    What's the point of paying for a thumb on the scales if you don't get a thumb on the scales?


    Well, some of us pointed out at the time that using estimated grades was a cheat's charter.

    But curious that sixth-form colleges tended to not fiddle. Perhaps the teachers at those don't have quite the same pressures on them, but not sure.

    Grammars being best of the rest is presumably because they tend to get a lot of As anyway, so less scope to cheat.
    If affluent middle class people can't get their children into top academic institutions they will create their own top academic institutions or send their kids to other countries' top academic institutions.

    They will also start to question paying their taxes into to a system that does not work for them, as many are starting to do with the NHS.

    Hint: 30% of the taxes come from the top 1%.
    Hint: People who suggest 30% of the taxes come from the top 1% are either economically illiterate or deliberately misleading (the combination is possible as well of course).
    https://fullfact.org/economy/do-top-1-earners-pay-28-tax-burden/ for MISTY.
    OK I left out the word income. In that article it suggests that the top 10% per cent probably pay not far short of 30% of all the indirect taxes as well as the direct ones.

    But hey, nitpick. Its better than trying to counter my argument, right?
    The top 10% paying 30% sounds quite fair and not extreme at all. The top 1% paying 30% would be a very different scenario. It is not nit picking.
    A more interesting question is what the top 10% and 1% of wealth holders are paying in taxes. In many cases it will be literally nothing.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 36,732
    IshmaelZ said:

    MISTY said:

    MISTY said:

    tlg86 said:

    What's the point of paying for a thumb on the scales if you don't get a thumb on the scales?


    Well, some of us pointed out at the time that using estimated grades was a cheat's charter.

    But curious that sixth-form colleges tended to not fiddle. Perhaps the teachers at those don't have quite the same pressures on them, but not sure.

    Grammars being best of the rest is presumably because they tend to get a lot of As anyway, so less scope to cheat.
    If affluent middle class people can't get their children into top academic institutions they will create their own top academic institutions or send their kids to other countries' top academic institutions.

    They will also start to question paying their taxes into to a system that does not work for them, as many are starting to do with the NHS.

    Hint: 30% of the taxes come from the top 1%.
    Hint: People who suggest 30% of the taxes come from the top 1% are either economically illiterate or deliberately misleading (the combination is possible as well of course).
    https://fullfact.org/economy/do-top-1-earners-pay-28-tax-burden/ for MISTY.
    OK I left out the word income. In that article it suggests that the top 10% per cent probably pay not far short of 30% of all the indirect taxes as well as the direct ones.

    But hey, nitpick. Its better than trying to counter my argument, right?
    But your argument is, what, that it is morally acceptable for private schools to cheat in order to rectify a perceived bias against them?
    Isn't it simply that private schools with more affluent pupils and better resources did better than state schools in lockdown, so the estimated grades benefited them more?
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 17,547
    moonshine said:
    I don’t have a sub, but I’ve seen the video.
    Has it been confirmed there were drugs in the actual video?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 18,992

    Leon said:

    Why in the fucking name of holy fish-fucking hell am I supposed to fucking care who chairs fucking University fucking Challenge?

    Deleted / repeated.
    It was such a perfect riposte. So posting the same comment twice was perfectly acceptable.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 16,258

    MISTY said:

    MISTY said:

    tlg86 said:

    What's the point of paying for a thumb on the scales if you don't get a thumb on the scales?


    Well, some of us pointed out at the time that using estimated grades was a cheat's charter.

    But curious that sixth-form colleges tended to not fiddle. Perhaps the teachers at those don't have quite the same pressures on them, but not sure.

    Grammars being best of the rest is presumably because they tend to get a lot of As anyway, so less scope to cheat.
    If affluent middle class people can't get their children into top academic institutions they will create their own top academic institutions or send their kids to other countries' top academic institutions.

    They will also start to question paying their taxes into to a system that does not work for them, as many are starting to do with the NHS.

    Hint: 30% of the taxes come from the top 1%.
    Hint: People who suggest 30% of the taxes come from the top 1% are either economically illiterate or deliberately misleading (the combination is possible as well of course).
    https://fullfact.org/economy/do-top-1-earners-pay-28-tax-burden/ for MISTY.
    OK I left out the word income. In that article it suggests that the top 10% per cent probably pay not far short of 30% of all the indirect taxes as well as the direct ones.

    But hey, nitpick. Its better than trying to counter my argument, right?
    The top 10% paying 30% sounds quite fair and not extreme at all. The top 1% paying 30% would be a very different scenario. It is not nit picking.
    A more interesting question is what the top 10% and 1% of wealth holders are paying in taxes. In many cases it will be literally nothing.
    Pretty unlikely literally. But far from enough for sure.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 30,484

    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certainly no - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
    “ Thirdly, there will be blood. Brexit is going to be painful, like childbirth. It just is. The Leave quacks who promised a brisk and blissful delivery don’t have enough diamorphine to dull the nerves. We might need epidurals from the Treasury. We will swear a lot, and not care. It might be rather embarrassing but again, we probably won’t care, because we’ll be concentrating on the pain. Other countries will look at us and think 'I’m never going through that'. Immediately after Brexit, we will likely appear reduced, saggy, wrinkled.

    Then comes the depression. It’s unavoidable. Overnight, your horizons have shrunk to a nursery room, some cheap Lidl shiraz, and the sound of a fiendishly annoying plastic toy which sings 'Froggy goes a courting he did ride uh-huh' over and over again. The house is a mess, all the time, in every way. You haven’t slept properly for several economic quarters. And so, at one point you will stare at a bowl of mushed baby food, and then you’ll soulfully ask yourself: Why did I ever do this?

    But lastly, cheer up. In the end, no matter how bad the depressions, or how annoying the nappies, very few people regret becoming a parent. It will be the same for Brexit. In ten years’ time we’ll look through the kitchen window of renewed prosperity, watch the laughing Remainers playing football with our smiling Brexit child, and we’ll quietly sip tea from a Union Jack mug, and we’ll think: best thing I ever did.”


    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-brexit-is-just-like-having-a-baby
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 37,019
    edited August 2022

    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certain - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
    I don't mind there being no other reason for an action save its democratic import. The problem that Leavers such as @Leon face is that they cannot define it and hence, like UFOs, god and Santa, they can always say "no we weren't".

    Rishi would not be able to offer to cut VAT on home energy supplies if we were still in the EU. It is a major policy tool and one that would not have been possible within the EU. But we as a sovereign democratic nation decided to be part of an organisation wherein it was not possible and then decided to leave that organisation so it was possible. To say that while we were in, of our own volition and with a democratic mandate, we were not sovereign is to misunderstand democracy and global relations today.

    But as I said, it is @Leon's comfort blanket and I don't expect him to argue the toss.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 36,732

    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certainly no - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
    And since 2016 do the British people feel more enfranchisement? I don't think so, just the same oligarchs fleecing us and featherbedding their cronies.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 47,042
    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    Yes, and to similarly laughable effect
    No more laughable than your claims about Brexit.
    'Pregnancy', etc.

    Fact is that the sane among us have agreed to disagree. You're still at war.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 18,992

    2/3 of British families are expected to enter “fuel poverty” by January 23, which is defined as needing to spend more than 10% of income of fuel.

    It’s closer to 90% for single parents of two, and pensioner couples.

    Government spokesman Meatloaf states "two out of three ain't bad".
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 4,993

    moonshine said:
    I don’t have a sub, but I’ve seen the video.
    Has it been confirmed there were drugs in the actual video?
    It’s not sensible to confirm or deny such a thing on a public forum I would say.

    The missing piece of the Telegraph / BBC story is the apparent link to a British cabinet member

  • LeonLeon Posts: 30,484

    moonshine said:
    I don’t have a sub, but I’ve seen the video.
    Has it been confirmed there were drugs in the actual video?

    Man, you should get a sub. They’re the best
  • MattWMattW Posts: 15,145
    edited August 2022

    Andy_JS said:

    MISTY said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that. If you voted for those reasons - which I did - then you’re happy with Brexit - which I am (and increasingly so)

    So it’s really not hard to defend, indeed I find it a pleasure to do this with Remainers. They simmer with frustrated anger. Twats

    I advise you to use this technique if Scotland ever goes Indy in your lifetime and you need to defend the horrendous economic damage
    The thing about Brexit is it means no hiding place.

    Our Parliament is sovereign and our politicians are accountable. IF we're bankrupt that's your fault. If the boats are still coming that's your fault. If there's a giant f8ck up....ditto. If crime soars.....you get the idea.

    You can see that this accountability is a massive shock to many MPs, whichever side of the divide you are on politically. Confronted with their own horrendous mistakes in interviews they are often reduced to gabbling, spluttering nonsense or silence. Whatever they came into politics for, it clearly wasn't this.

    Good.
    Did British politicians use the EU as a hiding place for their own mistakes until 2020?
    There is a good book on the subject. Called Blaming Europe published in 2014.

    It asserts that overall there was not much overt blaming of the EU - not least because the majority of those in power were concerned about anti-EU sentiment in the general public. But there was a lot of covert shifting of responsibility. Less of the 'This is the fault of the EU' and a lot more of the 'We would like to do this but I am afraid we can't'

    "By analysing over 200 political speeches made by national leaders in Britain, Germany, and Ireland over the course of the financial and economic crisis, it considers how politicians credit and blame the EU. Interestingly it finds that politicians rarely seek to scapegoat the EU and blame it for the economic situation. Rather prime ministers use the EU to diffuse responsibility and to redefine issues in a way that makes them less damaging in the eyes of their domestic electorates."
    On occasions both parties used Brussels as cover as a way to do unpopular anti-civil liberties things, on the basis that Brussels Insists. IIRC there were some things wrapped up in the European Arrest Warrant, for example.

    On the above, that's just a bog standard (sorry) slur from Alex Taylor.

    Compare things that aren't comparable, as long as they give you a reason for a pop at the UK multiple times a day. Never mention anything that the UK did to achieve desirable objectives. Never mention when the same thing is happening in EU countries, if it points up the reality. What a waste of a life.
  • moonshine said:
    Pretty tame stuff but I notice Russia is in the frame again:-

    Petteri Järvinen, a security expert, told the Iltalehti newspaper that Russia could have had a hand in the leaking of the videos.

    Ms Marin angered Vladimir Putin after ending decades of Finnish non-alignment to apply to join Nato after Russia invaded Ukraine.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 20,376
    edited August 2022
    Pulpstar said:

    eek said:



    In which case it's going to die with her because - you wouldn't want to start from here....

    Getting through the next 2 years isn't going to be easy and Truss will be blamed for everything as she will be in charge when the bills go up...

    It's quite likely that inflation will dip at some point next year, though, so I presume Truss will claim that that reflects her splendid policies.
    Unless we get some deflation rather than lower inflation, there will still be a cost of living crisis if people are a few grand short of their annual expenditure.
    Fuel rose so fast and so high at the start of 2022 to close to £2 a litre for diesel and north of £1.80 for petrol. Even if it stays static, it will in and of itself cause a dramatic drop in inflation as that component falls out the system.

    If it is coupled with actual significant falls off those highs, it will be very dramatic. WTI is now down to mid-$80's.

    You could see a dramatic decline in inflation UNLESS the costs of electricity/gas negate that effect. That would surely need to be the need for Govt. to prevent that. Otherwise, wage inflation will replace the falling fuel component.

    I've said before that Government should aim to have partial increases (c4-5%) covering say 9 months, well short of the inflation spike, with a second later top-up if inflation stays in double digits into next spring/summer.
    Just need to find some cheap gas now and we're A-OK :D
    There is a lot other than that that we can do. We have capacity to incinerate 71% of our residual waste at present. Germany has capacity for 91%. Netherlands it's 120% and Sweden it's 160%. These countries import others' waste to burn. The alternative for residual waste is landfill (where the carbon will leach out of it eventually), or exporting it. That remaining 30% could be a vast boost to power generation. Let's fast track all incinerator schemes, and revisit cancelled ones.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 2,644
    MISTY said:

    MISTY said:

    tlg86 said:

    What's the point of paying for a thumb on the scales if you don't get a thumb on the scales?


    Well, some of us pointed out at the time that using estimated grades was a cheat's charter.

    But curious that sixth-form colleges tended to not fiddle. Perhaps the teachers at those don't have quite the same pressures on them, but not sure.

    Grammars being best of the rest is presumably because they tend to get a lot of As anyway, so less scope to cheat.
    If affluent middle class people can't get their children into top academic institutions they will create their own top academic institutions or send their kids to other countries' top academic institutions.

    They will also start to question paying their taxes into to a system that does not work for them, as many are starting to do with the NHS.

    Hint: 30% of the taxes come from the top 1%.
    Hint: People who suggest 30% of the taxes come from the top 1% are either economically illiterate or deliberately misleading (the combination is possible as well of course).
    https://fullfact.org/economy/do-top-1-earners-pay-28-tax-burden/ for MISTY.
    OK I left out the word income. In that article it suggests that the top 10% per cent probably pay not far short of 30% of all the indirect taxes as well as the direct ones.

    But hey, nitpick. Its better than trying to counter my argument, right?
    Your argument appears to be we should bias educational achievement to the benefit of the rich in case they stop paying taxes here…? I don’t think that’s going to be an electorally popular position.

    The reason the top 10% pay that much of the total tax base is because of wealth inequality. If we had an economy that more fairly distributed wealth, this would be less of an issue. I support moves to decrease inequality.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 37,019
    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certainly no - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
    “ Thirdly, there will be blood. Brexit is going to be painful, like childbirth. It just is. The Leave quacks who promised a brisk and blissful delivery don’t have enough diamorphine to dull the nerves. We might need epidurals from the Treasury. We will swear a lot, and not care. It might be rather embarrassing but again, we probably won’t care, because we’ll be concentrating on the pain. Other countries will look at us and think 'I’m never going through that'. Immediately after Brexit, we will likely appear reduced, saggy, wrinkled.

    Then comes the depression. It’s unavoidable. Overnight, your horizons have shrunk to a nursery room, some cheap Lidl shiraz, and the sound of a fiendishly annoying plastic toy which sings 'Froggy goes a courting he did ride uh-huh' over and over again. The house is a mess, all the time, in every way. You haven’t slept properly for several economic quarters. And so, at one point you will stare at a bowl of mushed baby food, and then you’ll soulfully ask yourself: Why did I ever do this?

    But lastly, cheer up. In the end, no matter how bad the depressions, or how annoying the nappies, very few people regret becoming a parent. It will be the same for Brexit. In ten years’ time we’ll look through the kitchen window of renewed prosperity, watch the laughing Remainers playing football with our smiling Brexit child, and we’ll quietly sip tea from a Union Jack mug, and we’ll think: best thing I ever did.”


    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-brexit-is-just-like-having-a-baby
    What a fool that guy is. Brexit is of course like giving your child away for adoption at 8yrs old because it won't tidy its room.

    And you have been trading on that flawed article for years.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 30,484
    MattW said:

    Andy_JS said:

    MISTY said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that. If you voted for those reasons - which I did - then you’re happy with Brexit - which I am (and increasingly so)

    So it’s really not hard to defend, indeed I find it a pleasure to do this with Remainers. They simmer with frustrated anger. Twats

    I advise you to use this technique if Scotland ever goes Indy in your lifetime and you need to defend the horrendous economic damage
    The thing about Brexit is it means no hiding place.

    Our Parliament is sovereign and our politicians are accountable. IF we're bankrupt that's your fault. If the boats are still coming that's your fault. If there's a giant f8ck up....ditto. If crime soars.....you get the idea.

    You can see that this accountability is a massive shock to many MPs, whichever side of the divide you are on politically. Confronted with their own horrendous mistakes in interviews they are often reduced to gabbling, spluttering nonsense or silence. Whatever they came into politics for, it clearly wasn't this.

    Good.
    Did British politicians use the EU as a hiding place for their own mistakes until 2020?
    There is a good book on the subject. Called Blaming Europe published in 2014.

    It asserts that overall there was not much overt blaming of the EU - not least because the majority of those in power were concerned about anti-EU sentiment in the general public. But there was a lot of covert shifting of responsibility. Less of the 'This is the fault of the EU' and a lot more of the 'We would like to do this but I am afraid we can't'

    "By analysing over 200 political speeches made by national leaders in Britain, Germany, and Ireland over the course of the financial and economic crisis, it considers how politicians credit and blame the EU. Interestingly it finds that politicians rarely seek to scapegoat the EU and blame it for the economic situation. Rather prime ministers use the EU to diffuse responsibility and to redefine issues in a way that makes them less damaging in the eyes of their domestic electorates."
    On occasions both parties used Brussels as cover as a way to do unpopular anti-civil liberties things, on the basis that Brussels Insists. IIRC there were some things wrapped up in the European Arrest Warrant, for example.

    On the above, that's just a bog standard (sorry) slur from Alex Taylor.

    Compare things that aren't comparable, as long as they give you a reason for a pop at the UK multiple times a day. Never mention anything that the UK did to achieve desirable objectives. Never mention when the same thing is happening in EU countries, if it points up the reality. What a waste of a life.
    He’s a strange cove. He must be a Remainery Brit in the EU I suspect? He does spend an awful lot of time hating on Britain. It is quite sad
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 17,547
    moonshine said:

    moonshine said:
    I don’t have a sub, but I’ve seen the video.
    Has it been confirmed there were drugs in the actual video?
    It’s not sensible to confirm or deny such a thing on a public forum I would say.

    The missing piece of the Telegraph / BBC story is the apparent link to a British cabinet member

    Don’t be silly.
    There’s no secrecy to the story about the Finnish PM, indeed she has had to come out and deny the use of drugs.

    My question is simply whether there are drugs present in the video, there were some freeze frames on Twitter but not from reliable sources.

  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 18,992
    moonshine said:

    moonshine said:
    I don’t have a sub, but I’ve seen the video.
    Has it been confirmed there were drugs in the actual video?
    It’s not sensible to confirm or deny such a thing on a public forum I would say.

    The missing piece of the Telegraph / BBC story is the apparent link to a British cabinet member

    A British Cabinet member's member getting them into trouble. I have a suspect.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 37,019
    I doubt there is a British person alive who sees that video and doesn't think "how cool is that".
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 2,644
    Foxy said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    MISTY said:

    MISTY said:

    tlg86 said:

    What's the point of paying for a thumb on the scales if you don't get a thumb on the scales?


    Well, some of us pointed out at the time that using estimated grades was a cheat's charter.

    But curious that sixth-form colleges tended to not fiddle. Perhaps the teachers at those don't have quite the same pressures on them, but not sure.

    Grammars being best of the rest is presumably because they tend to get a lot of As anyway, so less scope to cheat.
    If affluent middle class people can't get their children into top academic institutions they will create their own top academic institutions or send their kids to other countries' top academic institutions.

    They will also start to question paying their taxes into to a system that does not work for them, as many are starting to do with the NHS.

    Hint: 30% of the taxes come from the top 1%.
    Hint: People who suggest 30% of the taxes come from the top 1% are either economically illiterate or deliberately misleading (the combination is possible as well of course).
    https://fullfact.org/economy/do-top-1-earners-pay-28-tax-burden/ for MISTY.
    OK I left out the word income. In that article it suggests that the top 10% per cent probably pay not far short of 30% of all the indirect taxes as well as the direct ones.

    But hey, nitpick. Its better than trying to counter my argument, right?
    But your argument is, what, that it is morally acceptable for private schools to cheat in order to rectify a perceived bias against them?
    Isn't it simply that private schools with more affluent pupils and better resources did better than state schools in lockdown, so the estimated grades benefited them more?
    It is difficult to tease apart that effect from the alternate explanation, that private schools were worse at estimating grades.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 47,042

    moonshine said:
    Pretty tame stuff but I notice Russia is in the frame again:-

    Petteri Järvinen, a security expert, told the Iltalehti newspaper that Russia could have had a hand in the leaking of the videos.

    Ms Marin angered Vladimir Putin after ending decades of Finnish non-alignment to apply to join Nato after Russia invaded Ukraine.
    After all the rumours, a nothingburger.

    ...seen dancing exuberantly... horrors.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 30,484
    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certainly no - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
    “ Thirdly, there will be blood. Brexit is going to be painful, like childbirth. It just is. The Leave quacks who promised a brisk and blissful delivery don’t have enough diamorphine to dull the nerves. We might need epidurals from the Treasury. We will swear a lot, and not care. It might be rather embarrassing but again, we probably won’t care, because we’ll be concentrating on the pain. Other countries will look at us and think 'I’m never going through that'. Immediately after Brexit, we will likely appear reduced, saggy, wrinkled.

    Then comes the depression. It’s unavoidable. Overnight, your horizons have shrunk to a nursery room, some cheap Lidl shiraz, and the sound of a fiendishly annoying plastic toy which sings 'Froggy goes a courting he did ride uh-huh' over and over again. The house is a mess, all the time, in every way. You haven’t slept properly for several economic quarters. And so, at one point you will stare at a bowl of mushed baby food, and then you’ll soulfully ask yourself: Why did I ever do this?

    But lastly, cheer up. In the end, no matter how bad the depressions, or how annoying the nappies, very few people regret becoming a parent. It will be the same for Brexit. In ten years’ time we’ll look through the kitchen window of renewed prosperity, watch the laughing Remainers playing football with our smiling Brexit child, and we’ll quietly sip tea from a Union Jack mug, and we’ll think: best thing I ever did.”


    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-brexit-is-just-like-having-a-baby
    What a fool that guy is. Brexit is of course like giving your child away for adoption at 8yrs old because it won't tidy its room.

    And you have been trading on that flawed article for years.
    It’s rare that I agree with a Spectator journalist but that’s a genius piece. Total prescience. Completely right
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 17,547
    Leon said:

    moonshine said:
    I don’t have a sub, but I’ve seen the video.
    Has it been confirmed there were drugs in the actual video?

    Man, you should get a sub. They’re the best
    My wife would likely object.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 20,376
    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    Don't worry, there's very little danger of your Shrodinger's Brexit argument shifting anyone's existing views on the matter, however frequently it gets the fresh air on it.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 30,484
    Nigelb said:

    moonshine said:
    Pretty tame stuff but I notice Russia is in the frame again:-

    Petteri Järvinen, a security expert, told the Iltalehti newspaper that Russia could have had a hand in the leaking of the videos.

    Ms Marin angered Vladimir Putin after ending decades of Finnish non-alignment to apply to join Nato after Russia invaded Ukraine.
    After all the rumours, a nothingburger.

    ...seen dancing exuberantly... horrors.
    I’ve got a weird feeling that is not THE FINLAND RUMOUR as it is known to the cognoscenti
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 17,547
    TOPPING said:

    I doubt there is a British person alive who sees that video and doesn't think "how cool is that".

    What’s amazing is that she is 36 and has a four year old.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 37,019
    Plus - is *that* really what the likes of @Leon have really been blathering on about as though the rumour and video was of BoJo snorting coke off the bare bottom of Vladimir Putin?

    JFC.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 36,732
    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certainly no - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
    “ Thirdly, there will be blood. Brexit is going to be painful, like childbirth. It just is. The Leave quacks who promised a brisk and blissful delivery don’t have enough diamorphine to dull the nerves. We might need epidurals from the Treasury. We will swear a lot, and not care. It might be rather embarrassing but again, we probably won’t care, because we’ll be concentrating on the pain. Other countries will look at us and think 'I’m never going through that'. Immediately after Brexit, we will likely appear reduced, saggy, wrinkled.

    Then comes the depression. It’s unavoidable. Overnight, your horizons have shrunk to a nursery room, some cheap Lidl shiraz, and the sound of a fiendishly annoying plastic toy which sings 'Froggy goes a courting he did ride uh-huh' over and over again. The house is a mess, all the time, in every way. You haven’t slept properly for several economic quarters. And so, at one point you will stare at a bowl of mushed baby food, and then you’ll soulfully ask yourself: Why did I ever do this?

    But lastly, cheer up. In the end, no matter how bad the depressions, or how annoying the nappies, very few people regret becoming a parent. It will be the same for Brexit. In ten years’ time we’ll look through the kitchen window of renewed prosperity, watch the laughing Remainers playing football with our smiling Brexit child, and we’ll quietly sip tea from a Union Jack mug, and we’ll think: best thing I ever did.”


    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-brexit-is-just-like-having-a-baby
    What a fool that guy is. Brexit is of course like giving your child away for adoption at 8yrs old because it won't tidy its room.

    And you have been trading on that flawed article for years.
    Yeah, it always was a crap analogy.

    Brexit as the unflushable turd of British politics is more accurate. Just bobbing there, stinking the place out, and attracting flies.
  • LennonLennon Posts: 1,662
    So with the English batsmen (Pope excepted) having totally forgotten how to bat on a pitch that seams and swings a bit, it seems that our bowlers have totally forgotten how to bowl on such a pitch as well... South Africa to be ahead by tea for only 1 wicket?
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Nigelb said:

    moonshine said:
    Pretty tame stuff but I notice Russia is in the frame again:-

    Petteri Järvinen, a security expert, told the Iltalehti newspaper that Russia could have had a hand in the leaking of the videos.

    Ms Marin angered Vladimir Putin after ending decades of Finnish non-alignment to apply to join Nato after Russia invaded Ukraine.
    After all the rumours, a nothingburger.

    ...seen dancing exuberantly... horrors.
    parturiunt montes, nascetur ridiculus mus.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 82,491
    edited August 2022
    moonshine said:
    I found the story from months back about her going clubbing and forgetting to take along a phone more incredible - young and fun though she may be, she is PM and should have been contactable! Plus who doesn't keep their phone on them, honestly.

    I do wonder if she really is super cool though, or simply more normal seeming than many other young politicians, who we tend to expect to be a bit, er, Rees-Moggy to rise high so young.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    moonshine said:

    moonshine said:
    I don’t have a sub, but I’ve seen the video.
    Has it been confirmed there were drugs in the actual video?
    It’s not sensible to confirm or deny such a thing on a public forum I would say.

    The missing piece of the Telegraph / BBC story is the apparent link to a British cabinet member

    Don’t be silly.
    There’s no secrecy to the story about the Finnish PM, indeed she has had to come out and deny the use of drugs.

    My question is simply whether there are drugs present in the video, there were some freeze frames on Twitter but not from reliable sources.

    Dunno but from the story

    "In the leaked video footage, unidentified people are heard shouting about "flour", which is a slang term for cocaine in Finland."
  • Leon said:

    moonshine said:
    I don’t have a sub, but I’ve seen the video.
    Has it been confirmed there were drugs in the actual video?

    Man, you should get a sub. They’re the best
    My wife would likely object.
    My wife would ask for Southwest and BBQ sauce on her sub.
  • Foxy said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certainly no - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
    “ Thirdly, there will be blood. Brexit is going to be painful, like childbirth. It just is. The Leave quacks who promised a brisk and blissful delivery don’t have enough diamorphine to dull the nerves. We might need epidurals from the Treasury. We will swear a lot, and not care. It might be rather embarrassing but again, we probably won’t care, because we’ll be concentrating on the pain. Other countries will look at us and think 'I’m never going through that'. Immediately after Brexit, we will likely appear reduced, saggy, wrinkled.

    Then comes the depression. It’s unavoidable. Overnight, your horizons have shrunk to a nursery room, some cheap Lidl shiraz, and the sound of a fiendishly annoying plastic toy which sings 'Froggy goes a courting he did ride uh-huh' over and over again. The house is a mess, all the time, in every way. You haven’t slept properly for several economic quarters. And so, at one point you will stare at a bowl of mushed baby food, and then you’ll soulfully ask yourself: Why did I ever do this?

    But lastly, cheer up. In the end, no matter how bad the depressions, or how annoying the nappies, very few people regret becoming a parent. It will be the same for Brexit. In ten years’ time we’ll look through the kitchen window of renewed prosperity, watch the laughing Remainers playing football with our smiling Brexit child, and we’ll quietly sip tea from a Union Jack mug, and we’ll think: best thing I ever did.”


    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-brexit-is-just-like-having-a-baby
    What a fool that guy is. Brexit is of course like giving your child away for adoption at 8yrs old because it won't tidy its room.

    And you have been trading on that flawed article for years.
    Yeah, it always was a crap analogy.

    Brexit as the unflushable turd of British politics is more accurate. Just bobbing there, stinking the place out, and attracting flies.
    I assume that in your analogy (since this seems to be a thing today) the flies are the Remoaners like yourself who just can't let it go.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 32,914
    Taz said:

    Selebian said:

    kinabalu said:

    Not just Zoe Williams in the Guardian today - I am too!

    The big pic of the climate activists protest at Lords has me rather prominent. There I am quite close to the banner, looking not too shabby at all, all things considered.

    Prize for anybody who can spot me.

    This one?
    image

    Well, certainly prominent, but you're younger and blacker and more female than I thought you were. Just goes to show you can't pigeonhole a PB poster.

    Utter clowns.

    We need new oil and gas for the foreseeable future whatever these idiots say.
    Did you spot me?
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 2,644
    kle4 said:

    moonshine said:
    I found the story from months back about her going clubbing and forgetting to take along a phone more incredible - young and fun though she may be, she is PM and should have been contactable! Plus who doesn't keep their phone on them, honestly.

    I do wonder if she really is super cool though, or simply more normal seeming than many other young politicians, who we tend to be a bit, er, Rees-Moggy to rise high so young.
    I thought she had deliberately left her prime ministerial phone at home in order not to be contactable that night?

  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 47,042
    edited August 2022
    kle4 said:

    moonshine said:
    I found the story from months back about her going clubbing and forgetting to take along a phone more incredible - young and fun though she may be, she is PM and should have been contactable! Plus who doesn't keep their phone on them, honestly.

    I do wonder if she really is super cool though, or simply more normal seeming than many other young politicians...
    It is, let's face it, a less unattractive spectacle than Michael Gove in vaguely comparable circumstances.
    ...dancing exuberantly.... *shudders*
  • MattWMattW Posts: 15,145
    edited August 2022

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:
    I don’t have a sub, but I’ve seen the video.
    Has it been confirmed there were drugs in the actual video?

    Man, you should get a sub. They’re the best
    My wife would likely object.
    My wife would ask for Southwest and BBQ sauce on her sub.
    It'll be the cover up...

    What happened to the previous Finland rumour?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 72,853
    kinabalu said:

    Taz said:

    Selebian said:

    kinabalu said:

    Not just Zoe Williams in the Guardian today - I am too!

    The big pic of the climate activists protest at Lords has me rather prominent. There I am quite close to the banner, looking not too shabby at all, all things considered.

    Prize for anybody who can spot me.

    This one?
    image

    Well, certainly prominent, but you're younger and blacker and more female than I thought you were. Just goes to show you can't pigeonhole a PB poster.

    Utter clowns.

    We need new oil and gas for the foreseeable future whatever these idiots say.
    Did you spot me?
    Are you above the g and the a in the white top ?
  • Endillion said:

    tlg86 said:

    What's the point of paying for a thumb on the scales if you don't get a thumb on the scales?


    Well, some of us pointed out at the time that using estimated grades was a cheat's charter.

    But curious that sixth-form colleges tended to not fiddle. Perhaps the teachers at those don't have quite the same pressures on them, but not sure.

    Grammars being best of the rest is presumably because they tend to get a lot of As anyway, so less scope to cheat.
    There was a technical reason for that.

    To reduce the scale of the inflation, the exam boards tried to moderate each school/college's results for each subject based on what the candidates got at GCSE and how the school had done at A Level recently. (Becuase, despite what others might tell you, attainment on entry affects results a lot more than anything the school does.)

    Trouble was, that only worked for institutions with fairly large cohorts. Everyone recognised that if there are only 2 or 3 candidates at a school doing a subject, you can't apply statistics without massive unfairness. So those results were largely waved through.

    Colleges have big cohorts- that's their point. Indy schools often have tiny cohorts. 11-18 schools are somewhere in between (those middle four blocks aren't that much different to each other).

    I don't know what it tells us about morality vs. opportunity, but the practical effect was a bad one.
    I thought they were forced to get rid of the moderation, after the algorithm that applied it was revealed to have been written by Gavin Williamson?

    The final grades for 2020, and the grades for 2021 (which is presumably the starting point for the graphic), were then based solely on teacher assessment. So, the extent to which grades have declined this year is largely a reflection on how optimistic different cohorts of teachers were last year.
    The original plan was to feed those school grades plus secret sauce into another process and award what came out of that.

    However, I believe there had been some QA of the teacher grades, except that only really worked in colleges.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 82,491
    IshmaelZ said:

    moonshine said:

    moonshine said:
    I don’t have a sub, but I’ve seen the video.
    Has it been confirmed there were drugs in the actual video?
    It’s not sensible to confirm or deny such a thing on a public forum I would say.

    The missing piece of the Telegraph / BBC story is the apparent link to a British cabinet member

    Don’t be silly.
    There’s no secrecy to the story about the Finnish PM, indeed she has had to come out and deny the use of drugs.

    My question is simply whether there are drugs present in the video, there were some freeze frames on Twitter but not from reliable sources.

    Dunno but from the story

    "In the leaked video footage, unidentified people are heard shouting about "flour", which is a slang term for cocaine in Finland."
    I suggest aspiring politicians should take courses on how to maintain illegal drug use discreetly if they should be elected. No sense ruining a promising career.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 17,547
    edited August 2022

    kle4 said:

    moonshine said:
    I found the story from months back about her going clubbing and forgetting to take along a phone more incredible - young and fun though she may be, she is PM and should have been contactable! Plus who doesn't keep their phone on them, honestly.

    I do wonder if she really is super cool though, or simply more normal seeming than many other young politicians, who we tend to be a bit, er, Rees-Moggy to rise high so young.
    I thought she had deliberately left her prime ministerial phone at home in order not to be contactable that night?

    Her position on NATO and Russia suggest she is “making all the big calls correctly”.

    It would to hear from Finns whether she is actually up to snuff, or whether - like Jacinda Ardern - she is a PR puff-piece masquerading as a politician.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 47,042
    What are @TheScreamingEagles views on this ?

    https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/3605889-who-is-mary-peltola-the-democrat-outperforming-expectations-in-alaska/
    ...Palin responded to Tuesday’s results by lambasting the new ranked-choice system, calling it “crazy,” “convoluted” and “undesirable.”
    “Voters are confused and angry, and feel disenfranchised by this cockamamie system that makes it impossible to trust that your vote will even be counted the way you intended. We’ll keep fighting to equip Alaskans with the information they need to make sure their voices are heard amidst this Leftist-crafted system – no matter how hard the corrupt political establishment works to silence us,” Palin said in a statement. ...
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 29,279
    Lennon said:

    So with the English batsmen (Pope excepted) having totally forgotten how to bat on a pitch that seams and swings a bit, it seems that our bowlers have totally forgotten how to bowl on such a pitch as well... South Africa to be ahead by tea for only 1 wicket?

    Do you think we'll get a wicket?
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 31,942

    TOPPING said:

    I doubt there is a British person alive who sees that video and doesn't think "how cool is that".

    What’s amazing is that she is 36 and has a four year old.
    When the children are old enough to sleep well and young enough to have an early bedtime, then the parents go out and party like mad. And why not?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 82,491

    kle4 said:

    moonshine said:
    I found the story from months back about her going clubbing and forgetting to take along a phone more incredible - young and fun though she may be, she is PM and should have been contactable! Plus who doesn't keep their phone on them, honestly.

    I do wonder if she really is super cool though, or simply more normal seeming than many other young politicians, who we tend to be a bit, er, Rees-Moggy to rise high so young.
    I thought she had deliberately left her prime ministerial phone at home in order not to be contactable that night?

    Even worse! Thank god Russia didn't choose that night I suppose.
    Nigelb said:

    kle4 said:

    moonshine said:
    I found the story from months back about her going clubbing and forgetting to take along a phone more incredible - young and fun though she may be, she is PM and should have been contactable! Plus who doesn't keep their phone on them, honestly.

    I do wonder if she really is super cool though, or simply more normal seeming than many other young politicians...
    It is, let's face it, a less unattractive spectacle than Michael Gove in vaguely comparable circumstances.
    ...dancing exuberantly.... *shudders*
    Now now, we must treat all equally and make no value judgements. If a 30 something PM and a 50 something Cabinet Member each want to shake it on the dance floor, we must celebrate both.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 82,491
    Lennon said:

    So with the English batsmen (Pope excepted) having totally forgotten how to bat on a pitch that seams and swings a bit, it seems that our bowlers have totally forgotten how to bowl on such a pitch as well... South Africa to be ahead by tea for only 1 wicket?

    Look, in order to wow everyone with heroic second innings performances it is necessary to completely mess up the first innings, this is just part of the new narrative approach.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/boris-johnson-visit-sweden-finland-liz-truss-nato-ukraine-war-b999243.html

    Phatboi seems to have gone to Finland in May which is about right for the party. Truss not, and I can only see this as even vaguely interesting if she or Sunak had been there.

  • MattWMattW Posts: 15,145

    eek said:



    In which case it's going to die with her because - you wouldn't want to start from here....

    Getting through the next 2 years isn't going to be easy and Truss will be blamed for everything as she will be in charge when the bills go up...

    It's quite likely that inflation will dip at some point next year, though, so I presume Truss will claim that that reflects her splendid policies.
    Unless we get some deflation rather than lower inflation, there will still be a cost of living crisis if people are a few grand short of their annual expenditure.
    Fuel rose so fast and so high at the start of 2022 to close to £2 a litre for diesel and north of £1.80 for petrol. Even if it stays static, it will in and of itself cause a dramatic drop in inflation as that component falls out the system.

    If it is coupled with actual significant falls off those highs, it will be very dramatic. WTI is now down to mid-$80's.

    You could see a dramatic decline in inflation UNLESS the costs of electricity/gas negate that effect. That would surely need to be the need for Govt. to prevent that. Otherwise, wage inflation will replace the falling fuel component.

    I've said before that Government should aim to have partial increases (c4-5%) covering say 9 months, well short of the inflation spike, with a second later top-up if inflation stays in double digits into next spring/summer.
    That's a valid, and interesting point.

    The increase in fuel prices from Dec 20 to Dec 21 was £1.20 to £1.50 per litre (ie 25%), and a further increase of £1.50 to £2.00 between Jane 22 and Jun 22 (ie 33%).
    https://heycar.co.uk/blog/latest-fuel-prices

    So how much will that boost a) living cost, and b) the inflation rate?

  • TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certainly no - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
    Can you have a programme not democratic renewal when the demos are saying "hmm, we're not sure about this, and keep that thing away from me, we're not having another baby"?
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 32,914
    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certainly no - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
    “ Thirdly, there will be blood. Brexit is going to be painful, like childbirth. It just is. The Leave quacks who promised a brisk and blissful delivery don’t have enough diamorphine to dull the nerves. We might need epidurals from the Treasury. We will swear a lot, and not care. It might be rather embarrassing but again, we probably won’t care, because we’ll be concentrating on the pain. Other countries will look at us and think 'I’m never going through that'. Immediately after Brexit, we will likely appear reduced, saggy, wrinkled.

    Then comes the depression. It’s unavoidable. Overnight, your horizons have shrunk to a nursery room, some cheap Lidl shiraz, and the sound of a fiendishly annoying plastic toy which sings 'Froggy goes a courting he did ride uh-huh' over and over again. The house is a mess, all the time, in every way. You haven’t slept properly for several economic quarters. And so, at one point you will stare at a bowl of mushed baby food, and then you’ll soulfully ask yourself: Why did I ever do this?

    But lastly, cheer up. In the end, no matter how bad the depressions, or how annoying the nappies, very few people regret becoming a parent. It will be the same for Brexit. In ten years’ time we’ll look through the kitchen window of renewed prosperity, watch the laughing Remainers playing football with our smiling Brexit child, and we’ll quietly sip tea from a Union Jack mug, and we’ll think: best thing I ever did.”

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-brexit-is-just-like-having-a-baby
    Mods.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 10,955
    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certainly no - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
    “ Thirdly, there will be blood. Brexit is going to be painful, like childbirth. It just is. The Leave quacks who promised a brisk and blissful delivery don’t have enough diamorphine to dull the nerves. We might need epidurals from the Treasury. We will swear a lot, and not care. It might be rather embarrassing but again, we probably won’t care, because we’ll be concentrating on the pain. Other countries will look at us and think 'I’m never going through that'. Immediately after Brexit, we will likely appear reduced, saggy, wrinkled.

    Then comes the depression. It’s unavoidable. Overnight, your horizons have shrunk to a nursery room, some cheap Lidl shiraz, and the sound of a fiendishly annoying plastic toy which sings 'Froggy goes a courting he did ride uh-huh' over and over again. The house is a mess, all the time, in every way. You haven’t slept properly for several economic quarters. And so, at one point you will stare at a bowl of mushed baby food, and then you’ll soulfully ask yourself: Why did I ever do this?

    But lastly, cheer up. In the end, no matter how bad the depressions, or how annoying the nappies, very few people regret becoming a parent. It will be the same for Brexit. In ten years’ time we’ll look through the kitchen window of renewed prosperity, watch the laughing Remainers playing football with our smiling Brexit child, and we’ll quietly sip tea from a Union Jack mug, and we’ll think: best thing I ever did.”


    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-brexit-is-just-like-having-a-baby
    The analogy works perfectly as long as the mother in question is Mia Farrow in Rosemary's Baby.
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 4,993
    The leaking of this Finland video seems like great news to me. Shows just how desperate Vlad is getting, with the war now coming to Russian occupied Crimea.

    Not much of a scandal though is it, the grave tones others talked in indicate this is only a small part of the story.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 45,799

    Lennon said:

    So with the English batsmen (Pope excepted) having totally forgotten how to bat on a pitch that seams and swings a bit, it seems that our bowlers have totally forgotten how to bowl on such a pitch as well... South Africa to be ahead by tea for only 1 wicket?

    Do you think we'll get a wicket?
    Good chance that boredom will strike at some point, surely?
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    moonshine said:

    The leaking of this Finland video seems like great news to me. Shows just how desperate Vlad is getting, with the war now coming to Russian occupied Crimea.

    Not much of a scandal though is it, the grave tones others talked in indicate this is only a small part of the story.

    It's pathetic. Even good quality footage of her and Boris doing lines would be pretty meh, because he's gone anyway and who gets excited about a change of Finnish PM?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 47,042
    kle4 said:

    kle4 said:

    moonshine said:
    I found the story from months back about her going clubbing and forgetting to take along a phone more incredible - young and fun though she may be, she is PM and should have been contactable! Plus who doesn't keep their phone on them, honestly.

    I do wonder if she really is super cool though, or simply more normal seeming than many other young politicians, who we tend to be a bit, er, Rees-Moggy to rise high so young.
    I thought she had deliberately left her prime ministerial phone at home in order not to be contactable that night?

    Even worse! Thank god Russia didn't choose that night I suppose.
    Nigelb said:

    kle4 said:

    moonshine said:
    I found the story from months back about her going clubbing and forgetting to take along a phone more incredible - young and fun though she may be, she is PM and should have been contactable! Plus who doesn't keep their phone on them, honestly.

    I do wonder if she really is super cool though, or simply more normal seeming than many other young politicians...
    It is, let's face it, a less unattractive spectacle than Michael Gove in vaguely comparable circumstances.
    ...dancing exuberantly.... *shudders*
    Now now, we must treat all equally and make no value judgements. If a 30 something PM and a 50 something Cabinet Member each want to shake it on the dance floor, we must celebrate both.
    Agreed on the ethics, not so much on the aesthetics.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 17,547

    TOPPING said:

    I doubt there is a British person alive who sees that video and doesn't think "how cool is that".

    What’s amazing is that she is 36 and has a four year old.
    When the children are old enough to sleep well and young enough to have an early bedtime, then the parents go out and party like mad. And why not?
    I didn’t mean it like that.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 15,145
    Leon said:

    MattW said:

    Andy_JS said:

    MISTY said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that. If you voted for those reasons - which I did - then you’re happy with Brexit - which I am (and increasingly so)

    So it’s really not hard to defend, indeed I find it a pleasure to do this with Remainers. They simmer with frustrated anger. Twats

    I advise you to use this technique if Scotland ever goes Indy in your lifetime and you need to defend the horrendous economic damage
    The thing about Brexit is it means no hiding place.

    Our Parliament is sovereign and our politicians are accountable. IF we're bankrupt that's your fault. If the boats are still coming that's your fault. If there's a giant f8ck up....ditto. If crime soars.....you get the idea.

    You can see that this accountability is a massive shock to many MPs, whichever side of the divide you are on politically. Confronted with their own horrendous mistakes in interviews they are often reduced to gabbling, spluttering nonsense or silence. Whatever they came into politics for, it clearly wasn't this.

    Good.
    Did British politicians use the EU as a hiding place for their own mistakes until 2020?
    There is a good book on the subject. Called Blaming Europe published in 2014.

    It asserts that overall there was not much overt blaming of the EU - not least because the majority of those in power were concerned about anti-EU sentiment in the general public. But there was a lot of covert shifting of responsibility. Less of the 'This is the fault of the EU' and a lot more of the 'We would like to do this but I am afraid we can't'

    "By analysing over 200 political speeches made by national leaders in Britain, Germany, and Ireland over the course of the financial and economic crisis, it considers how politicians credit and blame the EU. Interestingly it finds that politicians rarely seek to scapegoat the EU and blame it for the economic situation. Rather prime ministers use the EU to diffuse responsibility and to redefine issues in a way that makes them less damaging in the eyes of their domestic electorates."
    On occasions both parties used Brussels as cover as a way to do unpopular anti-civil liberties things, on the basis that Brussels Insists. IIRC there were some things wrapped up in the European Arrest Warrant, for example.

    On the above, that's just a bog standard (sorry) slur from Alex Taylor.

    Compare things that aren't comparable, as long as they give you a reason for a pop at the UK multiple times a day. Never mention anything that the UK did to achieve desirable objectives. Never mention when the same thing is happening in EU countries, if it points up the reality. What a waste of a life.
    He’s a strange cove. He must be a Remainery Brit in the EU I suspect? He does spend an awful lot of time hating on Britain. It is quite sad
    Sort of ex-Brit media-politics overlap figure revolving around EU-France. Presenting, moderating conferences, newspaper reviews - that sort of thing.

    Alex Taylor
    @AlexTaylorNews
    French TV's Mr Europe 30 yrs
    Host international events (+1 500)
    Write books on languages
    Teach journalism at Sorbonne
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 32,914
    Pulpstar said:

    kinabalu said:

    Taz said:

    Selebian said:

    kinabalu said:

    Not just Zoe Williams in the Guardian today - I am too!

    The big pic of the climate activists protest at Lords has me rather prominent. There I am quite close to the banner, looking not too shabby at all, all things considered.

    Prize for anybody who can spot me.

    This one?
    image

    Well, certainly prominent, but you're younger and blacker and more female than I thought you were. Just goes to show you can't pigeonhole a PB poster.

    Utter clowns.

    We need new oil and gas for the foreseeable future whatever these idiots say.
    Did you spot me?
    Are you above the g and the a in the white top ?
    No but good guess - that could well have been me. I'm sat down and more to the left. Legs crossed, anorak, baseball cap, gazing in the opposite direction, thinking about going to the bar, all alone, my wife having left me momentarily.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    kle4 said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    moonshine said:

    moonshine said:
    I don’t have a sub, but I’ve seen the video.
    Has it been confirmed there were drugs in the actual video?
    It’s not sensible to confirm or deny such a thing on a public forum I would say.

    The missing piece of the Telegraph / BBC story is the apparent link to a British cabinet member

    Don’t be silly.
    There’s no secrecy to the story about the Finnish PM, indeed she has had to come out and deny the use of drugs.

    My question is simply whether there are drugs present in the video, there were some freeze frames on Twitter but not from reliable sources.

    Dunno but from the story

    "In the leaked video footage, unidentified people are heard shouting about "flour", which is a slang term for cocaine in Finland."
    I suggest aspiring politicians should take courses on how to maintain illegal drug use discreetly if they should be elected. No sense ruining a promising career.
    Trouble is if you had to give a one word answer to Cocaine makes you more..., indiscreet would be a strong contender
  • kyf_100kyf_100 Posts: 3,401
    Nigelb said:

    moonshine said:
    Pretty tame stuff but I notice Russia is in the frame again:-

    Petteri Järvinen, a security expert, told the Iltalehti newspaper that Russia could have had a hand in the leaking of the videos.

    Ms Marin angered Vladimir Putin after ending decades of Finnish non-alignment to apply to join Nato after Russia invaded Ukraine.
    After all the rumours, a nothingburger.

    ...seen dancing exuberantly... horrors.
    I am shocked, shocked to discover that drugs may have been present at a party attended by artists and television personalities.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 30,484
    edited August 2022
    TOPPING said:

    Plus - is *that* really what the likes of @Leon have really been blathering on about as though the rumour and video was of BoJo snorting coke off the bare bottom of Vladimir Putin?

    JFC.

    No, this here vid is not THE FINLAND RUMOUR come to life. I can tell you that
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 45,799
    DavidL said:

    Lennon said:

    So with the English batsmen (Pope excepted) having totally forgotten how to bat on a pitch that seams and swings a bit, it seems that our bowlers have totally forgotten how to bowl on such a pitch as well... South Africa to be ahead by tea for only 1 wicket?

    Do you think we'll get a wicket?
    Good chance that boredom will strike at some point, surely?
    Told you, claiming that.
  • Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certainly no - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
    “ Thirdly, there will be blood. Brexit is going to be painful, like childbirth. It just is. The Leave quacks who promised a brisk and blissful delivery don’t have enough diamorphine to dull the nerves. We might need epidurals from the Treasury. We will swear a lot, and not care. It might be rather embarrassing but again, we probably won’t care, because we’ll be concentrating on the pain. Other countries will look at us and think 'I’m never going through that'. Immediately after Brexit, we will likely appear reduced, saggy, wrinkled.

    Then comes the depression. It’s unavoidable. Overnight, your horizons have shrunk to a nursery room, some cheap Lidl shiraz, and the sound of a fiendishly annoying plastic toy which sings 'Froggy goes a courting he did ride uh-huh' over and over again. The house is a mess, all the time, in every way. You haven’t slept properly for several economic quarters. And so, at one point you will stare at a bowl of mushed baby food, and then you’ll soulfully ask yourself: Why did I ever do this?

    But lastly, cheer up. In the end, no matter how bad the depressions, or how annoying the nappies, very few people regret becoming a parent. It will be the same for Brexit. In ten years’ time we’ll look through the kitchen window of renewed prosperity, watch the laughing Remainers playing football with our smiling Brexit child, and we’ll quietly sip tea from a Union Jack mug, and we’ll think: best thing I ever did.”


    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-brexit-is-just-like-having-a-baby
    The analogy works perfectly as long as the mother in question is Mia Farrow in Rosemary's Baby.
    It's where the metaphor breaks down, very few parents regret their newborn like Brits regret Brexit.

    But it does reveal the mad intensity of the would-be grandparent, desperate for offspring because they won't be the ones changing the nappies.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 37,019
    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Plus - is *that* really what the likes of @Leon have really been blathering on about as though the rumour and video was of BoJo snorting coke off the bare bottom of Vladimir Putin?

    JFC.

    No, this here vid is not THE FINLAND RUMOUR come to life. I can tell you that
    Finland rumour, Santa, aliens, god, the Tooth Fairy...it is all getting a bit much to believe tbh.

    UNLESS YOU TELL US WHAT YOU THINK THE FINLAND RUMOUR IS.

    That is.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 43,603
    It cannot be claimed that the people of Belfast awaited with bated breath the arrival of Truss and Sunak, the two squabbling representatives of what is now less a political party than a trade union for affluent pensioners in southeast England.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    There's a guy in the video whose face is blurred out. Too thin to be phatboi.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    I think it was a smart move by Biden to lower petrol prices a lot. But has he lowered them too far?

    https://twitter.com/conorsen/status/1560245698947387392
  • LeonLeon Posts: 30,484

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certainly no - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
    “ Thirdly, there will be blood. Brexit is going to be painful, like childbirth. It just is. The Leave quacks who promised a brisk and blissful delivery don’t have enough diamorphine to dull the nerves. We might need epidurals from the Treasury. We will swear a lot, and not care. It might be rather embarrassing but again, we probably won’t care, because we’ll be concentrating on the pain. Other countries will look at us and think 'I’m never going through that'. Immediately after Brexit, we will likely appear reduced, saggy, wrinkled.

    Then comes the depression. It’s unavoidable. Overnight, your horizons have shrunk to a nursery room, some cheap Lidl shiraz, and the sound of a fiendishly annoying plastic toy which sings 'Froggy goes a courting he did ride uh-huh' over and over again. The house is a mess, all the time, in every way. You haven’t slept properly for several economic quarters. And so, at one point you will stare at a bowl of mushed baby food, and then you’ll soulfully ask yourself: Why did I ever do this?

    But lastly, cheer up. In the end, no matter how bad the depressions, or how annoying the nappies, very few people regret becoming a parent. It will be the same for Brexit. In ten years’ time we’ll look through the kitchen window of renewed prosperity, watch the laughing Remainers playing football with our smiling Brexit child, and we’ll quietly sip tea from a Union Jack mug, and we’ll think: best thing I ever did.”


    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-brexit-is-just-like-having-a-baby
    The analogy works perfectly as long as the mother in question is Mia Farrow in Rosemary's Baby.
    It's where the metaphor breaks down, very few parents regret their newborn like Brits regret Brexit.

    But it does reveal the mad intensity of the would-be grandparent, desperate for offspring because they won't be the ones changing the nappies.
    Lots of parents regret having a baby when, right from the beginning, the father never wanted it. That's just part of the genius that is @SeanT's analogy

    I hate praising him, because - apart from anything else - he was a smug git, but he genuinely nailed it there

    Read the piece. Marvel at the brilliance. The Remainers are a father who gave the Leavers a pity fuck - that's David Cameron granting a referendum - AKA a one night stand with the plebs. Then life goes back to normal, or so the suave Lothario assumed

    Instead, she got pregnant and said "I'm keeping it" and "you'll have to pay for it"

    Cue the incendiary outrage, and the angry questions to the Tory leadership - you said she was on The Pill! Then came the attempt to induce a dangerous late stage abortion by forcing gin on the expectant mother and pushing her downstairs - that's the attempted 2nd referendum

    Nonetheless, the baby was born. In the analogy it's now about 18 months old, squirting poo on @Scott_xP and @foxy, who have fervent daydreams about smothering it

    But the mother? After sleepless months of listening to the baby yowling and @foxy and @topping calling her a stupid slut, she's definitely had her doubts. But then she looks at the baby. And smiles
  • LeonLeon Posts: 30,484
    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Plus - is *that* really what the likes of @Leon have really been blathering on about as though the rumour and video was of BoJo snorting coke off the bare bottom of Vladimir Putin?

    JFC.

    No, this here vid is not THE FINLAND RUMOUR come to life. I can tell you that
    Finland rumour, Santa, aliens, god, the Tooth Fairy...it is all getting a bit much to believe tbh.

    UNLESS YOU TELL US WHAT YOU THINK THE FINLAND RUMOUR IS.

    That is.
    Ahahahaha


    You'll just have to suffer the eternal torment of knowing that I KNOW THE FINLAND RUMOUR and I'm not telling you

    Sorry

    BTW I probably would tell you THE FINLAND RUMOUR but the person who told me expressly instructed me to stay shtoom, and there it is. He was adamant. ADAMANT
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 37,019
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certainly no - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
    “ Thirdly, there will be blood. Brexit is going to be painful, like childbirth. It just is. The Leave quacks who promised a brisk and blissful delivery don’t have enough diamorphine to dull the nerves. We might need epidurals from the Treasury. We will swear a lot, and not care. It might be rather embarrassing but again, we probably won’t care, because we’ll be concentrating on the pain. Other countries will look at us and think 'I’m never going through that'. Immediately after Brexit, we will likely appear reduced, saggy, wrinkled.

    Then comes the depression. It’s unavoidable. Overnight, your horizons have shrunk to a nursery room, some cheap Lidl shiraz, and the sound of a fiendishly annoying plastic toy which sings 'Froggy goes a courting he did ride uh-huh' over and over again. The house is a mess, all the time, in every way. You haven’t slept properly for several economic quarters. And so, at one point you will stare at a bowl of mushed baby food, and then you’ll soulfully ask yourself: Why did I ever do this?

    But lastly, cheer up. In the end, no matter how bad the depressions, or how annoying the nappies, very few people regret becoming a parent. It will be the same for Brexit. In ten years’ time we’ll look through the kitchen window of renewed prosperity, watch the laughing Remainers playing football with our smiling Brexit child, and we’ll quietly sip tea from a Union Jack mug, and we’ll think: best thing I ever did.”


    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-brexit-is-just-like-having-a-baby
    The analogy works perfectly as long as the mother in question is Mia Farrow in Rosemary's Baby.
    It's where the metaphor breaks down, very few parents regret their newborn like Brits regret Brexit.

    But it does reveal the mad intensity of the would-be grandparent, desperate for offspring because they won't be the ones changing the nappies.
    Lots of parents regret having a baby when, right from the beginning, the father never wanted it. That's just part of the genius that is @SeanT's analogy

    I hate praising him, because - apart from anything else - he was a smug git, but he genuinely nailed it there

    Read the piece. Marvel at the brilliance. The Remainers are a father who gave the Leavers a pity fuck - that's David Cameron granting a referendum - AKA a one night stand with the plebs. Then life goes back to normal, or so the suave Lothario assumed

    Instead, she got pregnant and said "I'm keeping it" and "you'll have to pay for it"

    Cue the incendiary outrage, and the angry questions to the Tory leadership - you said she was on The Pill! Then came the attempt to induce a dangerous late stage abortion by forcing gin on the expectant mother and pushing her downstairs - that's the attempted 2nd referendum

    Nonetheless, the baby was born. In the analogy it's now about 18 months old, squirting poo on @Scott_xP and @foxy, who have fervent daydreams about smothering it

    But the mother? After sleepless months of listening to the baby yowling and @foxy and @topping calling her a stupid slut, she's definitely had her doubts. But then she looks at the baby. And smiles
    Then there is the audience it was written for. There is no weak, grasping metaphor which suits their putrid world view, nor casual discriminatory slur that Spectator readers won't lap up.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 47,042
    Alistair said:

    I think it was a smart move by Biden to lower petrol prices a lot. But has he lowered them too far?

    https://twitter.com/conorsen/status/1560245698947387392

    The decoupling of the direction of the US and European economies seems rather pronounced.

    Inadvertently or not, Biden seems to have played economic rope-a-dope with the Republican opposition. If US inflation has already peaked, and there's decent growth this quarter, November's elections could be very interesting.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 32,914

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certainly no - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
    “ Thirdly, there will be blood. Brexit is going to be painful, like childbirth. It just is. The Leave quacks who promised a brisk and blissful delivery don’t have enough diamorphine to dull the nerves. We might need epidurals from the Treasury. We will swear a lot, and not care. It might be rather embarrassing but again, we probably won’t care, because we’ll be concentrating on the pain. Other countries will look at us and think 'I’m never going through that'. Immediately after Brexit, we will likely appear reduced, saggy, wrinkled.

    Then comes the depression. It’s unavoidable. Overnight, your horizons have shrunk to a nursery room, some cheap Lidl shiraz, and the sound of a fiendishly annoying plastic toy which sings 'Froggy goes a courting he did ride uh-huh' over and over again. The house is a mess, all the time, in every way. You haven’t slept properly for several economic quarters. And so, at one point you will stare at a bowl of mushed baby food, and then you’ll soulfully ask yourself: Why did I ever do this?

    But lastly, cheer up. In the end, no matter how bad the depressions, or how annoying the nappies, very few people regret becoming a parent. It will be the same for Brexit. In ten years’ time we’ll look through the kitchen window of renewed prosperity, watch the laughing Remainers playing football with our smiling Brexit child, and we’ll quietly sip tea from a Union Jack mug, and we’ll think: best thing I ever did.”


    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-brexit-is-just-like-having-a-baby
    The analogy works perfectly as long as the mother in question is Mia Farrow in Rosemary's Baby.
    It's where the metaphor breaks down, very few parents regret their newborn like Brits regret Brexit.

    But it does reveal the mad intensity of the would-be grandparent, desperate for offspring because they won't be the ones changing the nappies.
    The main problem for me is that this 'baby' is like the lovechild of Giles Coren and Giles Coren. I put considerable effort into dodging his weekly "lol at woke" tripe in the Saturday Times so it's frustrating to stumble across a facsimile on here. Grrr.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 30,484
    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certainly no - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
    “ Thirdly, there will be blood. Brexit is going to be painful, like childbirth. It just is. The Leave quacks who promised a brisk and blissful delivery don’t have enough diamorphine to dull the nerves. We might need epidurals from the Treasury. We will swear a lot, and not care. It might be rather embarrassing but again, we probably won’t care, because we’ll be concentrating on the pain. Other countries will look at us and think 'I’m never going through that'. Immediately after Brexit, we will likely appear reduced, saggy, wrinkled.

    Then comes the depression. It’s unavoidable. Overnight, your horizons have shrunk to a nursery room, some cheap Lidl shiraz, and the sound of a fiendishly annoying plastic toy which sings 'Froggy goes a courting he did ride uh-huh' over and over again. The house is a mess, all the time, in every way. You haven’t slept properly for several economic quarters. And so, at one point you will stare at a bowl of mushed baby food, and then you’ll soulfully ask yourself: Why did I ever do this?

    But lastly, cheer up. In the end, no matter how bad the depressions, or how annoying the nappies, very few people regret becoming a parent. It will be the same for Brexit. In ten years’ time we’ll look through the kitchen window of renewed prosperity, watch the laughing Remainers playing football with our smiling Brexit child, and we’ll quietly sip tea from a Union Jack mug, and we’ll think: best thing I ever did.”


    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-brexit-is-just-like-having-a-baby
    The analogy works perfectly as long as the mother in question is Mia Farrow in Rosemary's Baby.
    It's where the metaphor breaks down, very few parents regret their newborn like Brits regret Brexit.

    But it does reveal the mad intensity of the would-be grandparent, desperate for offspring because they won't be the ones changing the nappies.
    Lots of parents regret having a baby when, right from the beginning, the father never wanted it. That's just part of the genius that is @SeanT's analogy

    I hate praising him, because - apart from anything else - he was a smug git, but he genuinely nailed it there

    Read the piece. Marvel at the brilliance. The Remainers are a father who gave the Leavers a pity fuck - that's David Cameron granting a referendum - AKA a one night stand with the plebs. Then life goes back to normal, or so the suave Lothario assumed

    Instead, she got pregnant and said "I'm keeping it" and "you'll have to pay for it"

    Cue the incendiary outrage, and the angry questions to the Tory leadership - you said she was on The Pill! Then came the attempt to induce a dangerous late stage abortion by forcing gin on the expectant mother and pushing her downstairs - that's the attempted 2nd referendum

    Nonetheless, the baby was born. In the analogy it's now about 18 months old, squirting poo on @Scott_xP and @foxy, who have fervent daydreams about smothering it

    But the mother? After sleepless months of listening to the baby yowling and @foxy and @topping calling her a stupid slut, she's definitely had her doubts. But then she looks at the baby. And smiles
    Then there is the audience it was written for. There is no weak, grasping metaphor which suits their putrid world view, nor casual discriminatory slur that Spectator readers won't lap up.
    "Their putrid world view"

    You do know I love to provoke this kind of futile anger, don't you? It's caviar to the general
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 72,853
    Alistair said:

    I think it was a smart move by Biden to lower petrol prices a lot. But has he lowered them too far?

    https://twitter.com/conorsen/status/1560245698947387392

    Biden for the nom is still the best odds against bet of the moment.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 36,732

    Foxy said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certainly no - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
    “ Thirdly, there will be blood. Brexit is going to be painful, like childbirth. It just is. The Leave quacks who promised a brisk and blissful delivery don’t have enough diamorphine to dull the nerves. We might need epidurals from the Treasury. We will swear a lot, and not care. It might be rather embarrassing but again, we probably won’t care, because we’ll be concentrating on the pain. Other countries will look at us and think 'I’m never going through that'. Immediately after Brexit, we will likely appear reduced, saggy, wrinkled.

    Then comes the depression. It’s unavoidable. Overnight, your horizons have shrunk to a nursery room, some cheap Lidl shiraz, and the sound of a fiendishly annoying plastic toy which sings 'Froggy goes a courting he did ride uh-huh' over and over again. The house is a mess, all the time, in every way. You haven’t slept properly for several economic quarters. And so, at one point you will stare at a bowl of mushed baby food, and then you’ll soulfully ask yourself: Why did I ever do this?

    But lastly, cheer up. In the end, no matter how bad the depressions, or how annoying the nappies, very few people regret becoming a parent. It will be the same for Brexit. In ten years’ time we’ll look through the kitchen window of renewed prosperity, watch the laughing Remainers playing football with our smiling Brexit child, and we’ll quietly sip tea from a Union Jack mug, and we’ll think: best thing I ever did.”


    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-brexit-is-just-like-having-a-baby
    What a fool that guy is. Brexit is of course like giving your child away for adoption at 8yrs old because it won't tidy its room.

    And you have been trading on that flawed article for years.
    Yeah, it always was a crap analogy.

    Brexit as the unflushable turd of British politics is more accurate. Just bobbing there, stinking the place out, and attracting flies.
    I assume that in your analogy (since this seems to be a thing today) the flies are the Remoaners like yourself who just can't let it go.
    No the flies are the way that Brexit contaminates everything.

    The plumber is the Rejoin movement who will sort out the stinky mess.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certainly no - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
    “ Thirdly, there will be blood. Brexit is going to be painful, like childbirth. It just is. The Leave quacks who promised a brisk and blissful delivery don’t have enough diamorphine to dull the nerves. We might need epidurals from the Treasury. We will swear a lot, and not care. It might be rather embarrassing but again, we probably won’t care, because we’ll be concentrating on the pain. Other countries will look at us and think 'I’m never going through that'. Immediately after Brexit, we will likely appear reduced, saggy, wrinkled.

    Then comes the depression. It’s unavoidable. Overnight, your horizons have shrunk to a nursery room, some cheap Lidl shiraz, and the sound of a fiendishly annoying plastic toy which sings 'Froggy goes a courting he did ride uh-huh' over and over again. The house is a mess, all the time, in every way. You haven’t slept properly for several economic quarters. And so, at one point you will stare at a bowl of mushed baby food, and then you’ll soulfully ask yourself: Why did I ever do this?

    But lastly, cheer up. In the end, no matter how bad the depressions, or how annoying the nappies, very few people regret becoming a parent. It will be the same for Brexit. In ten years’ time we’ll look through the kitchen window of renewed prosperity, watch the laughing Remainers playing football with our smiling Brexit child, and we’ll quietly sip tea from a Union Jack mug, and we’ll think: best thing I ever did.”


    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-brexit-is-just-like-having-a-baby
    The analogy works perfectly as long as the mother in question is Mia Farrow in Rosemary's Baby.
    It's where the metaphor breaks down, very few parents regret their newborn like Brits regret Brexit.

    But it does reveal the mad intensity of the would-be grandparent, desperate for offspring because they won't be the ones changing the nappies.
    Lots of parents regret having a baby when, right from the beginning, the father never wanted it. That's just part of the genius that is @SeanT's analogy

    I hate praising him, because - apart from anything else - he was a smug git, but he genuinely nailed it there

    Read the piece. Marvel at the brilliance. The Remainers are a father who gave the Leavers a pity fuck - that's David Cameron granting a referendum - AKA a one night stand with the plebs. Then life goes back to normal, or so the suave Lothario assumed

    Instead, she got pregnant and said "I'm keeping it" and "you'll have to pay for it"

    Cue the incendiary outrage, and the angry questions to the Tory leadership - you said she was on The Pill! Then came the attempt to induce a dangerous late stage abortion by forcing gin on the expectant mother and pushing her downstairs - that's the attempted 2nd referendum

    Nonetheless, the baby was born. In the analogy it's now about 18 months old, squirting poo on @Scott_xP and @foxy, who have fervent daydreams about smothering it

    But the mother? After sleepless months of listening to the baby yowling and @foxy and @topping calling her a stupid slut, she's definitely had her doubts. But then she looks at the baby. And smiles
    It's one of those babies which American fundamentalists bring to term despite everyone having told them ever since the 12 week scan it would be born with no head and never attain sentience, and then plaster photos of it all over Facebook for the 2 years of its miserable existence as evidence of God's loving ways.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 47,042
    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Plus - is *that* really what the likes of @Leon have really been blathering on about as though the rumour and video was of BoJo snorting coke off the bare bottom of Vladimir Putin?

    JFC.

    No, this here vid is not THE FINLAND RUMOUR come to life. I can tell you that
    Finland rumour, Santa, aliens, god, the Tooth Fairy...it is all getting a bit much to believe tbh.

    UNLESS YOU TELL US WHAT YOU THINK THE FINLAND RUMOUR IS.

    That is.
    Ahahahaha

    You'll just have to suffer the eternal torment...
    Eternal ?
    Seems rather pointless, if it's more than a couple of months.

    Will be as tedious as the Roswell stuff became about four decades back.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 30,484
    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certainly no - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
    “ Thirdly, there will be blood. Brexit is going to be painful, like childbirth. It just is. The Leave quacks who promised a brisk and blissful delivery don’t have enough diamorphine to dull the nerves. We might need epidurals from the Treasury. We will swear a lot, and not care. It might be rather embarrassing but again, we probably won’t care, because we’ll be concentrating on the pain. Other countries will look at us and think 'I’m never going through that'. Immediately after Brexit, we will likely appear reduced, saggy, wrinkled.

    Then comes the depression. It’s unavoidable. Overnight, your horizons have shrunk to a nursery room, some cheap Lidl shiraz, and the sound of a fiendishly annoying plastic toy which sings 'Froggy goes a courting he did ride uh-huh' over and over again. The house is a mess, all the time, in every way. You haven’t slept properly for several economic quarters. And so, at one point you will stare at a bowl of mushed baby food, and then you’ll soulfully ask yourself: Why did I ever do this?

    But lastly, cheer up. In the end, no matter how bad the depressions, or how annoying the nappies, very few people regret becoming a parent. It will be the same for Brexit. In ten years’ time we’ll look through the kitchen window of renewed prosperity, watch the laughing Remainers playing football with our smiling Brexit child, and we’ll quietly sip tea from a Union Jack mug, and we’ll think: best thing I ever did.”


    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-brexit-is-just-like-having-a-baby
    What a fool that guy is. Brexit is of course like giving your child away for adoption at 8yrs old because it won't tidy its room.

    And you have been trading on that flawed article for years.
    Yeah, it always was a crap analogy.

    Brexit as the unflushable turd of British politics is more accurate. Just bobbing there, stinking the place out, and attracting flies.
    I assume that in your analogy (since this seems to be a thing today) the flies are the Remoaners like yourself who just can't let it go.
    No the flies are the way that Brexit contaminates everything.

    The plumber is the Rejoin movement who will sort out the stinky mess.
    And, like any plumber, he won't be able to get to you before the summer of 2053. And then he won't show up
  • MISTYMISTY Posts: 1,594

    MISTY said:

    MISTY said:

    tlg86 said:

    What's the point of paying for a thumb on the scales if you don't get a thumb on the scales?


    Well, some of us pointed out at the time that using estimated grades was a cheat's charter.

    But curious that sixth-form colleges tended to not fiddle. Perhaps the teachers at those don't have quite the same pressures on them, but not sure.

    Grammars being best of the rest is presumably because they tend to get a lot of As anyway, so less scope to cheat.
    If affluent middle class people can't get their children into top academic institutions they will create their own top academic institutions or send their kids to other countries' top academic institutions.

    They will also start to question paying their taxes into to a system that does not work for them, as many are starting to do with the NHS.

    Hint: 30% of the taxes come from the top 1%.
    Hint: People who suggest 30% of the taxes come from the top 1% are either economically illiterate or deliberately misleading (the combination is possible as well of course).
    https://fullfact.org/economy/do-top-1-earners-pay-28-tax-burden/ for MISTY.
    OK I left out the word income. In that article it suggests that the top 10% per cent probably pay not far short of 30% of all the indirect taxes as well as the direct ones.

    But hey, nitpick. Its better than trying to counter my argument, right?
    Your argument appears to be we should bias educational achievement to the benefit of the rich in case they stop paying taxes here…? I don’t think that’s going to be an electorally popular position.

    The reason the top 10% pay that much of the total tax base is because of wealth inequality. If we had an economy that more fairly distributed wealth, this would be less of an issue. I support moves to decrease inequality.
    No my argument is that candidates should be selected for university places based merit and not discriminated against because they have wealthy parents. Almost everybody is on board with that, I would have thought.

    I get it that you don't like middle class people, but the fact is they pay the bills. They always have, they always will. So snort it up.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 56,563
    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certainly no - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
    “ Thirdly, there will be blood. Brexit is going to be painful, like childbirth. It just is. The Leave quacks who promised a brisk and blissful delivery don’t have enough diamorphine to dull the nerves. We might need epidurals from the Treasury. We will swear a lot, and not care. It might be rather embarrassing but again, we probably won’t care, because we’ll be concentrating on the pain. Other countries will look at us and think 'I’m never going through that'. Immediately after Brexit, we will likely appear reduced, saggy, wrinkled.

    Then comes the depression. It’s unavoidable. Overnight, your horizons have shrunk to a nursery room, some cheap Lidl shiraz, and the sound of a fiendishly annoying plastic toy which sings 'Froggy goes a courting he did ride uh-huh' over and over again. The house is a mess, all the time, in every way. You haven’t slept properly for several economic quarters. And so, at one point you will stare at a bowl of mushed baby food, and then you’ll soulfully ask yourself: Why did I ever do this?

    But lastly, cheer up. In the end, no matter how bad the depressions, or how annoying the nappies, very few people regret becoming a parent. It will be the same for Brexit. In ten years’ time we’ll look through the kitchen window of renewed prosperity, watch the laughing Remainers playing football with our smiling Brexit child, and we’ll quietly sip tea from a Union Jack mug, and we’ll think: best thing I ever did.”


    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-brexit-is-just-like-having-a-baby
    What a fool that guy is. Brexit is of course like giving your child away for adoption at 8yrs old because it won't tidy its room.

    And you have been trading on that flawed article for years.
    Yeah, it always was a crap analogy.

    Brexit as the unflushable turd of British politics is more accurate. Just bobbing there, stinking the place out, and attracting flies.
    I assume that in your analogy (since this seems to be a thing today) the flies are the Remoaners like yourself who just can't let it go.
    No the flies are the way that Brexit contaminates everything.

    The plumber is the Rejoin movement who will sort out the stinky mess.
    But we won't have plumbers until we rejoin,so the metaphor fails.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 10,955
    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Shitty Britain.

    FFS - yesterday was as a result of the heavy storms causing overflows, as has happened for a very long time. It doesn't help make arguments to be so disingenuous.
    Why allow facts to get in the way of a good rant though?
    Not only heavy storms but heavy storms landing on bone dry and rock hard surfaces with very rapid run off as a result. Totally unsurprising and, as usual, Brexit is completely and utterly irrelevant to what happened.
    You don't understand.

    Brexit is to blame for current weather conditions, Covid, and the war in Ukraine.
    You don't understand.

    The EU was blamed for everything sub optimal and now the wheel has turned. It's your tiger, ride it.
    I was mildly harangued by a Remoaner friend over wine at the Edinburgh Castle in Camden yesterday. “Well, what about Brexit? It’s terrible isn’t it??”

    I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that...
    @TOPPING regularly contradicts you on that odd claim.
    "I told him I voted because sovereignty and democracy. And he sat there fuming because: there isn’t any comeback to that..."

    is @Leon's safe space. I would hate to wrench him out of it.
    It’s an interesting conclusion for Leon because it’s an admission there is certainly no - and never was - any case on the grounds of economics, social services, geopolitics, or even - it now seems - on immigration.

    In my opinion, Brexit will succeed if it is understood as a project of democratic renewal. If not, it will come to be framed as a great betrayal.
    “ Thirdly, there will be blood. Brexit is going to be painful, like childbirth. It just is. The Leave quacks who promised a brisk and blissful delivery don’t have enough diamorphine to dull the nerves. We might need epidurals from the Treasury. We will swear a lot, and not care. It might be rather embarrassing but again, we probably won’t care, because we’ll be concentrating on the pain. Other countries will look at us and think 'I’m never going through that'. Immediately after Brexit, we will likely appear reduced, saggy, wrinkled.

    Then comes the depression. It’s unavoidable. Overnight, your horizons have shrunk to a nursery room, some cheap Lidl shiraz, and the sound of a fiendishly annoying plastic toy which sings 'Froggy goes a courting he did ride uh-huh' over and over again. The house is a mess, all the time, in every way. You haven’t slept properly for several economic quarters. And so, at one point you will stare at a bowl of mushed baby food, and then you’ll soulfully ask yourself: Why did I ever do this?

    But lastly, cheer up. In the end, no matter how bad the depressions, or how annoying the nappies, very few people regret becoming a parent. It will be the same for Brexit. In ten years’ time we’ll look through the kitchen window of renewed prosperity, watch the laughing Remainers playing football with our smiling Brexit child, and we’ll quietly sip tea from a Union Jack mug, and we’ll think: best thing I ever did.”


    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-brexit-is-just-like-having-a-baby
    What a fool that guy is. Brexit is of course like giving your child away for adoption at 8yrs old because it won't tidy its room.

    And you have been trading on that flawed article for years.
    Yeah, it always was a crap analogy.

    Brexit as the unflushable turd of British politics is more accurate. Just bobbing there, stinking the place out, and attracting flies.
    I assume that in your analogy (since this seems to be a thing today) the flies are the Remoaners like yourself who just can't let it go.
    No the flies are the way that Brexit contaminates everything.

    The plumber is the Rejoin movement who will sort out the stinky mess.
    And, like any plumber, he won't be able to get to you before the summer of 2053. And then he won't show up
    Cos the Polish plumbers have all gone home.
This discussion has been closed.