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Is it time for the Redwall Tory MPs to panic? – politicalbetting.com

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  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 46,684
    rcs1000 said:

    Hey all: I just messed up a database upgrade and have had to roll it back and about 15 or 20 minutes of comments have been lost.

    Sorry.

    FFS

    I put mouthfeel, weltanschauung and gesamtkunstwerk all in the same paragraph

    An entire era is passing. Though few realise it
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 46,684
    edited August 2022
    If I had to unite the threads, I’d say I prefer the “political mouthfeel” of Liz Truss over rishi Sunak. He’s like a rich yet bland dal. Expensively spiced lentils are still lentils, he has the “political mouthfeel” of posh nursery food

    She’s fresher, spikier. A hint of the acerbic. Like berries from a Finnish forest
  • Options
    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,776
    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
  • Options
    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,624

    Scott_xP said:

    British energy bills forecast to soar above £5,000 next year https://on.ft.com/3QEMKPg

    Surely there comes a point where this is scaremongering though?

    I'm not saying it's not 'possibly' true, and clearly something needs to be done but a lot of this could be doomcasting.
    Assuming the govt does not intervene, then the October price cap is almost known already, only one more week of relevant data, and should be around £3600. The ones beyond that are estimates but on track to be further significant increases again.
  • Options
    bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 7,520

    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
    I can think of a second living former Tory leader who’s backing Truss: namely Johnson. He hasn’t explicitly said it, but we all know.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,929
    Another bloody hustings?
    How many do they need? Has anyone on here who's eligible not voted because they are undecided? Get on with it FFS!
  • Options
    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    rcs1000 said:

    Hey all: I just messed up a database upgrade and have had to roll it back and about 15 or 20 minutes of comments have been lost.

    Sorry.

    Probably for the best, my "What sort of wanker spells Tom with an h anyway?" post could fairly be described as intemperate.
  • Options
    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,624

    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
    I can think of a second living former Tory leader who’s backing Truss: namely Johnson. He hasn’t explicitly said it, but we all know.
    I doubt he cares much either way.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,935

    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
    I expect all the dead ones post war would be backing Sunak, though Thatcher would have a soft spot for Truss
  • Options
    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,776

    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
    I have always thought Sunak overrated. However, I judge Lightweight Lizzy by the company she keeps. If she surprises us and genuinely unites the party, I will make a U-turn on her of such magnitude that you will all be calling me @williamglenn
  • Options
    eekeek Posts: 24,925
    Scott_xP said:

    Scott_xP said:

    British energy bills forecast to soar above £5,000 next year https://on.ft.com/3QEMKPg

    Surely there comes a point where this is scaremongering though?

    I'm not saying it's not 'possibly' true, and clearly something needs to be done but a lot of this could be doomcasting.
    Arrived at work tonight to be told “we might have to shut the shop” last week the electric bill came in 10 x dearer today the gas came in, from £900 to £10,058.59 it’s a small family run business here since 1982 this would be tragic! 😢

    #fuelcrisis #Aberdeen https://twitter.com/NatalieAHood/status/1555946745774866440/photo/1
    business bills are not capped and boy suppliers are making the most of it...
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,929
    R4 vox popping folk out enjoying the Sun.
    Surprisingly, they enjoy it.
  • Options
    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
    I expect all the dead ones post war would be backing Sunak, though Thatcher would have a soft spot for Truss
    Maggie would have spotted Truss as a featherweight phoney in about 3 microseconds. How little you know about her.
  • Options
    kyf_100kyf_100 Posts: 3,927
    Leon said:

    If I had to unite the threads, I’d say I prefer the “political mouthfeel” of Liz Truss over rishi Sunak. He’s like a rich yet bland dal. Expensively spiced lentils are still lentils, he has the “political mouthfeel” of posh nursery food

    She’s fresher, spikier. A hint of the acerbic. Like berries from a Finnish forest

    He's certainly rich, though I've no desire to enjoy Liz Truss's mouthfeel.
  • Options
    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,776
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
    I expect all the dead ones post war would be backing Sunak, though Thatcher would have a soft spot for Truss
    Apparently imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, though sincerity doesn't strike me as Lizzy's strongest suit.
  • Options
    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,624
    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
    I expect all the dead ones post war would be backing Sunak, though Thatcher would have a soft spot for Truss
    Maggie would have spotted Truss as a featherweight phoney in about 3 microseconds. How little you know about her.
    Early and middle Maggie = Sunak. Late crankier Maggie = Truss.
  • Options
    BurgessianBurgessian Posts: 2,420
    Leon said:

    If I had to unite the threads, I’d say I prefer the “political mouthfeel” of Liz Truss over rishi Sunak. He’s like a rich yet bland dal. Expensively spiced lentils are still lentils, he has the “political mouthfeel” of posh nursery food

    She’s fresher, spikier. A hint of the acerbic. Like berries from a Finnish forest

    Hmm. My instinct has always been that Truss is an IDS-type dud. However, I have been slightly reassured by her performance so far, and she is more flavoursome than the quiet man - a bit of northern couthiness about her.

    Even so, Rishi outclasses her by a country mile.

    I recall a political sage explaining FDR's greatness. A second-class intellect allied to a first-class temperament. That's Rishi albeit on a lesser scale.
  • Options
    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,776

    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
    I can think of a second living former Tory leader who’s backing Truss: namely Johnson. He hasn’t explicitly said it, but we all know.
    I think the word "leader" needs to be applied with some caution.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,095
    dixiedean said:

    Another bloody hustings?
    How many do they need? Has anyone on here who's eligible not voted because they are undecided? Get on with it FFS!

    I had lunch with several former colleagues today. One thing they talked about was politics, and I was very surprised indeed to find that they all assumed that Rishi Sunak (whom they called 'Big Ears') was a certainty to win the Tory leadership election.

    Either we are getting this completely wrong, or the population as a whole including the intelligent, well-informed section of it, is paying precisely zero attention to what is going on.
  • Options
    SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,704
    eek said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Scott_xP said:

    British energy bills forecast to soar above £5,000 next year https://on.ft.com/3QEMKPg

    Surely there comes a point where this is scaremongering though?

    I'm not saying it's not 'possibly' true, and clearly something needs to be done but a lot of this could be doomcasting.
    Arrived at work tonight to be told “we might have to shut the shop” last week the electric bill came in 10 x dearer today the gas came in, from £900 to £10,058.59 it’s a small family run business here since 1982 this would be tragic! 😢

    #fuelcrisis #Aberdeen https://twitter.com/NatalieAHood/status/1555946745774866440/photo/1
    business bills are not capped and boy suppliers are making the most of it...
    Home working + this will kill offices.
  • Options
    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,776
    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    If I had to unite the threads, I’d say I prefer the “political mouthfeel” of Liz Truss over rishi Sunak. He’s like a rich yet bland dal. Expensively spiced lentils are still lentils, he has the “political mouthfeel” of posh nursery food

    She’s fresher, spikier. A hint of the acerbic. Like berries from a Finnish forest

    He's certainly rich, though I've no desire to enjoy Liz Truss's mouthfeel.
    I imagine Bill Clinton enjoyed Monica's mouthfeel
  • Options

    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    If I had to unite the threads, I’d say I prefer the “political mouthfeel” of Liz Truss over rishi Sunak. He’s like a rich yet bland dal. Expensively spiced lentils are still lentils, he has the “political mouthfeel” of posh nursery food

    She’s fresher, spikier. A hint of the acerbic. Like berries from a Finnish forest

    He's certainly rich, though I've no desire to enjoy Liz Truss's mouthfeel.
    I imagine Bill Clinton enjoyed Monica's mouthfeel
    Didn't she get the mouthfeel?
  • Options
    kyf_100kyf_100 Posts: 3,927

    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    If I had to unite the threads, I’d say I prefer the “political mouthfeel” of Liz Truss over rishi Sunak. He’s like a rich yet bland dal. Expensively spiced lentils are still lentils, he has the “political mouthfeel” of posh nursery food

    She’s fresher, spikier. A hint of the acerbic. Like berries from a Finnish forest

    He's certainly rich, though I've no desire to enjoy Liz Truss's mouthfeel.
    I imagine Bill Clinton enjoyed Monica's mouthfeel
    Oh god

    Can we all just go back to talking about what.three.words please?
  • Options
    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,776

    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    If I had to unite the threads, I’d say I prefer the “political mouthfeel” of Liz Truss over rishi Sunak. He’s like a rich yet bland dal. Expensively spiced lentils are still lentils, he has the “political mouthfeel” of posh nursery food

    She’s fresher, spikier. A hint of the acerbic. Like berries from a Finnish forest

    He's certainly rich, though I've no desire to enjoy Liz Truss's mouthfeel.
    I imagine Bill Clinton enjoyed Monica's mouthfeel
    Didn't she get the mouthfeel?
    I did not, have mouthfeel relations with that woman, Miss Lewinsky
  • Options
    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,776

    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    If I had to unite the threads, I’d say I prefer the “political mouthfeel” of Liz Truss over rishi Sunak. He’s like a rich yet bland dal. Expensively spiced lentils are still lentils, he has the “political mouthfeel” of posh nursery food

    She’s fresher, spikier. A hint of the acerbic. Like berries from a Finnish forest

    He's certainly rich, though I've no desire to enjoy Liz Truss's mouthfeel.
    I imagine Bill Clinton enjoyed Monica's mouthfeel
    Didn't she get the mouthfeel?
    Possibly a mouthfull. Sorry!
  • Options
    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,075
    ydoethur said:

    dixiedean said:

    Another bloody hustings?
    How many do they need? Has anyone on here who's eligible not voted because they are undecided? Get on with it FFS!

    I had lunch with several former colleagues today. One thing they talked about was politics, and I was very surprised indeed to find that they all assumed that Rishi Sunak (whom they called 'Big Ears') was a certainty to win the Tory leadership election.

    Either we are getting this completely wrong, or the population as a whole including the intelligent, well-informed section of it, is paying precisely zero attention to what is going on.
    I think that's a common misconception amongst those inexplicable oddballs who don't follow the betting markets.
  • Options
    TOPPING said:

    Did some fucker on here earlier, when discussing food, use the word "mouthfeel"?

    Jesus H Christ.

    Yeah, "mouthfeel". What of it. You want food that feels like puke? No?
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,929
    ydoethur said:

    dixiedean said:

    Another bloody hustings?
    How many do they need? Has anyone on here who's eligible not voted because they are undecided? Get on with it FFS!

    I had lunch with several former colleagues today. One thing they talked about was politics, and I was very surprised indeed to find that they all assumed that Rishi Sunak (whom they called 'Big Ears') was a certainty to win the Tory leadership election.

    Either we are getting this completely wrong, or the population as a whole including the intelligent, well-informed section of it, is paying precisely zero attention to what is going on.
    Yeah. I've had that experience with family.
    I think Truss remains largely unknown. Even to folk who follow the news.
    Why should anyone when they have precisely zero influence?
  • Options
    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,776
    kyf_100 said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    If I had to unite the threads, I’d say I prefer the “political mouthfeel” of Liz Truss over rishi Sunak. He’s like a rich yet bland dal. Expensively spiced lentils are still lentils, he has the “political mouthfeel” of posh nursery food

    She’s fresher, spikier. A hint of the acerbic. Like berries from a Finnish forest

    He's certainly rich, though I've no desire to enjoy Liz Truss's mouthfeel.
    I imagine Bill Clinton enjoyed Monica's mouthfeel
    Oh god

    Can we all just go back to talking about what.three.words please?
    Mouth.feel.Monica. It gives a precise square under a desk in the Oval Office
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,609

    Nigelb said:

    MAGA conspiracists...

    Just had someone explain to me that the FBI brought a “taint team” with them to MAL and that their job is to plant evidence. Um no. A taint team -aka a filter team- does not plant evidence. This person genuinely believes the FBI has an entire division
    https://twitter.com/NatSecJD/status/1557749211390689281

    For those unfamiliar with the term:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taint_(legal)

    MAGA are even more bonkers than Nadine Dorries and people that believe Boris Johnson is the "victim" (lol) of a witch hunt.
    It's incredibly transparent, and yet sadly effective, to first dismiss any investigation as a witchhunt, and also set up a conpiracy defence in the event it is proven not to be a witchhunt, but to be substantiated.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,095
    kyf_100 said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    If I had to unite the threads, I’d say I prefer the “political mouthfeel” of Liz Truss over rishi Sunak. He’s like a rich yet bland dal. Expensively spiced lentils are still lentils, he has the “political mouthfeel” of posh nursery food

    She’s fresher, spikier. A hint of the acerbic. Like berries from a Finnish forest

    He's certainly rich, though I've no desire to enjoy Liz Truss's mouthfeel.
    I imagine Bill Clinton enjoyed Monica's mouthfeel
    Oh god

    Can we all just go back to talking about what.three.words please?
    What location is 'Blow Is Impeach?'
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,609
    Nigelb said:

    Nigelb said:

    MAGA conspiracists...

    Just had someone explain to me that the FBI brought a “taint team” with them to MAL and that their job is to plant evidence. Um no. A taint team -aka a filter team- does not plant evidence. This person genuinely believes the FBI has an entire division
    https://twitter.com/NatSecJD/status/1557749211390689281

    For those unfamiliar with the term:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taint_(legal)

    MAGA are even more bonkers than Nadine Dorries and people that believe Boris Johnson is the "victim" (lol) of a witch hunt.
    We just have a dilute version.
    Nadine, for example, is a pallid facsimile of MTG.
    It is something to still be thankful for that she and JRM, amongst MPs (Cruddas seems to be in their corner too) appear to be mostly alone in that tendency.

    It will be an important test for Truss to see if she retains them or indeed promotes those two. She has no need to, plenty of others to choose from, but she may well.
  • Options
    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,776
    kle4 said:

    Nigelb said:

    MAGA conspiracists...

    Just had someone explain to me that the FBI brought a “taint team” with them to MAL and that their job is to plant evidence. Um no. A taint team -aka a filter team- does not plant evidence. This person genuinely believes the FBI has an entire division
    https://twitter.com/NatSecJD/status/1557749211390689281

    For those unfamiliar with the term:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taint_(legal)

    MAGA are even more bonkers than Nadine Dorries and people that believe Boris Johnson is the "victim" (lol) of a witch hunt.
    It's incredibly transparent, and yet sadly effective, to first dismiss any investigation as a witchhunt, and also set up a conpiracy defence in the event it is proven not to be a witchhunt, but to be substantiated.
    It is what populists do.
  • Options
    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    This is superb. all of it.

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-crisis-at-the-heart-of-the-modern-conservative-party

    Many on the left would be shocked by how apolitical most of the Conservative party is. There is currently no theory in conservative politics. I suspect no more than a handful of Tory MPs have ever read Burke or Hayek, unless they cropped up on a PPE reading list. They will be far more familiar with Isabel Oakeshott than Michael.

    ...

    Rather than principles or goals, the Tory party today lives for day-to-day reactions to the things that catch its eye. Most MPs have no understanding of economics, but instead repeat half-remembered maxims about lower taxes (we are, it seems, forever to the right of the Laffer curve), whilst at the same time celebrating the latest boondoggle that happens to land in their constituency. In the same vein, you see the Tory MPs who have started to get their head around the housing crisis call for more housebuilding everywhere except where it threatens some historic carpark or ‘sacred’ waste site on their patch. They will tweet almost back-to-back about the unaffordability of homes and their objection to any new development.

    ...

    It is not that the Conservative party is deliberately and mindfully pursuing ends inimical to British interests. Tory MPs do, mostly, want a prosperous and safe country. They’ve just lost any sense of what that means beyond platitudes, or how to engage with the challenges that stand in our way. The party would rather hide behind the curtain, pulling at levers that aren’t attached to anything.
  • Options
    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
    I expect all the dead ones post war would be backing Sunak, though Thatcher would have a soft spot for Truss
    Maggie would have spotted Truss as a featherweight phoney in about 3 microseconds. How little you know about her.
    Mrs Thatcher rarely appointed female ministers.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,914
    You know: the simplest way to get the price of energy down is to defeat Russia. And the simplest way to defeat Russia is for us to simply come in on the side of the Ukrainians.

    Furthermore, if we were to do this, it would send a very clear message to all the Russians (who aren't Putin) that the best way out of the mess would be for Putin to have an accident.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,914
    IshmaelZ said:

    This is superb. all of it.

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-crisis-at-the-heart-of-the-modern-conservative-party

    Many on the left would be shocked by how apolitical most of the Conservative party is. There is currently no theory in conservative politics. I suspect no more than a handful of Tory MPs have ever read Burke or Hayek, unless they cropped up on a PPE reading list. They will be far more familiar with Isabel Oakeshott than Michael.

    ...

    Rather than principles or goals, the Tory party today lives for day-to-day reactions to the things that catch its eye. Most MPs have no understanding of economics, but instead repeat half-remembered maxims about lower taxes (we are, it seems, forever to the right of the Laffer curve), whilst at the same time celebrating the latest boondoggle that happens to land in their constituency. In the same vein, you see the Tory MPs who have started to get their head around the housing crisis call for more housebuilding everywhere except where it threatens some historic carpark or ‘sacred’ waste site on their patch. They will tweet almost back-to-back about the unaffordability of homes and their objection to any new development.

    ...

    It is not that the Conservative party is deliberately and mindfully pursuing ends inimical to British interests. Tory MPs do, mostly, want a prosperous and safe country. They’ve just lost any sense of what that means beyond platitudes, or how to engage with the challenges that stand in our way. The party would rather hide behind the curtain, pulling at levers that aren’t attached to anything.

    Ummmm... I doubt many Conservative members studied PPE.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,567
    edited August 2022
    ohnotnow said:

    Carnyx said:

    TOPPING said:

    Did some fucker on here earlier, when discussing food, use the word "mouthfeel"?

    Jesus H Christ.

    Yep (not me). Texture, but more than that: interaction with flavour too.

    It's why I cut up my potatoes for stovies* irregularly to get a range of sizes which vary from completely cooked and moistly pasty to al dente.

    *potatoes, onions, and a little fat and water cooked in one pan - aka pommes de terre estovees, lobscouse, Labskaus (Danish), etc.
    Don't your stovies have meat?

    I once had 'deconstructed stovies' in a restaurant. It was as bad as it sounds.
    Not in it - but I have it served with slices of cold roast meat, ideally the slightly fatty kind such as lamb, and pickled beetroot as noted elsewhere on this thread.

    Edit: the Danes have it that wat too. But with salad as well. AKA a sprinkle of chopped chives.
  • Options
    ChrisChris Posts: 11,088
    edited August 2022
    rcs1000 said:

    You know: the simplest way to get the price of energy down is to defeat Russia. And the simplest way to defeat Russia is for us to simply come in on the side of the Ukrainians.

    Furthermore, if we were to do this, it would send a very clear message to all the Russians (who aren't Putin) that the best way out of the mess would be for Putin to have an accident.

    Yes, let's start World War Three. That's bound to get the cost of energy down.
  • Options
    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,776
    Leon said:

    Well, someone had to


    https://what3words.com/political.mouth.feel


    It's in Alaska

    That is what Bill Clinton's said to one of his mates when his mate asked him if Monica "goes down"
  • Options
    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,048
    IshmaelZ said:

    This is superb. all of it.

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-crisis-at-the-heart-of-the-modern-conservative-party

    Many on the left would be shocked by how apolitical most of the Conservative party is. There is currently no theory in conservative politics. I suspect no more than a handful of Tory MPs have ever read Burke or Hayek, unless they cropped up on a PPE reading list. They will be far more familiar with Isabel Oakeshott than Michael.

    ...

    Rather than principles or goals, the Tory party today lives for day-to-day reactions to the things that catch its eye. Most MPs have no understanding of economics, but instead repeat half-remembered maxims about lower taxes (we are, it seems, forever to the right of the Laffer curve), whilst at the same time celebrating the latest boondoggle that happens to land in their constituency. In the same vein, you see the Tory MPs who have started to get their head around the housing crisis call for more housebuilding everywhere except where it threatens some historic carpark or ‘sacred’ waste site on their patch. They will tweet almost back-to-back about the unaffordability of homes and their objection to any new development.

    ...

    It is not that the Conservative party is deliberately and mindfully pursuing ends inimical to British interests. Tory MPs do, mostly, want a prosperous and safe country. They’ve just lost any sense of what that means beyond platitudes, or how to engage with the challenges that stand in our way. The party would rather hide behind the curtain, pulling at levers that aren’t attached to anything.

    They're out of energy and ideas. They should do the country a favour and resign en masse. Labour may or may not be equally clueless but it's worth at least testing the proposition.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,567
    Scott_xP said:

    Carnyx said:

    You do realise they are all in one mass with the onion? This provides an interesting texture, er, mouthfeel.

    Stovies vary in size (potatoes are wider in the middle than the end) but they should all be the same thickness.

    Like my Gran used to make...
    That is certainly one way to do it, depending on the size of the spud.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,914
    edited August 2022
    Chris said:

    rcs1000 said:

    You know: the simplest way to get the price of energy down is to defeat Russia. And the simplest way to defeat Russia is for us to simply come in on the side of the Ukrainians.

    Furthermore, if we were to do this, it would send a very clear message to all the Russians (who aren't Putin) that the best way out of the mess would be for Putin to have an accident.

    Yes, let's start World War Three. That's bound to get the cost of energy down.
    Every day we don't stick up to Putin, he gets his claws into another autocrat (or would be autocrat), and the entire Western order is put at risk.
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,900
    Lammy puts Starmer to shame, hes guilty of breaching code of conduct 16 times.
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,609
    edited August 2022

    kle4 said:

    Nigelb said:

    MAGA conspiracists...

    Just had someone explain to me that the FBI brought a “taint team” with them to MAL and that their job is to plant evidence. Um no. A taint team -aka a filter team- does not plant evidence. This person genuinely believes the FBI has an entire division
    https://twitter.com/NatSecJD/status/1557749211390689281

    For those unfamiliar with the term:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taint_(legal)

    MAGA are even more bonkers than Nadine Dorries and people that believe Boris Johnson is the "victim" (lol) of a witch hunt.
    It's incredibly transparent, and yet sadly effective, to first dismiss any investigation as a witchhunt, and also set up a conpiracy defence in the event it is proven not to be a witchhunt, but to be substantiated.
    It is what populists do.
    Don't forget the three point strategy

    1) It's a witchhunt - nothing will be found
    2) It's a fix - anything found is fake
    3) Even if it is neither 1 or 2, my being investigated for and theoretically convicted of crimes is unfair politically as only the ballot box matters.
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 47,999

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
    I expect all the dead ones post war would be backing Sunak, though Thatcher would have a soft spot for Truss
    Maggie would have spotted Truss as a featherweight phoney in about 3 microseconds. How little you know about her.
    Mrs Thatcher rarely appointed female ministers.
    She appointed Edwina Currie as a junior minister after this speech:

    image
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,567

    TOPPING said:

    Did some fucker on here earlier, when discussing food, use the word "mouthfeel"?

    Jesus H Christ.

    Yeah, "mouthfeel". What of it. You want food that feels like puke? No?
    Depends. I have a dim memory opf being told of a fellow student who chundered, then picked out the chunks of frankfurter and reused them. Plenty of mouthfeel there.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,914
    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
    I expect all the dead ones post war would be backing Sunak, though Thatcher would have a soft spot for Truss
    Maggie would have spotted Truss as a featherweight phoney in about 3 microseconds. How little you know about her.
    Two words:

    Cecil Parkinson
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,567
    rcs1000 said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
    I expect all the dead ones post war would be backing Sunak, though Thatcher would have a soft spot for Truss
    Maggie would have spotted Truss as a featherweight phoney in about 3 microseconds. How little you know about her.
    Two words:

    Cecil Parkinson
    Sudden memories there. Makes an interesting contrast with the modern Tory party.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,929
    IshmaelZ said:

    This is superb. all of it.

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-crisis-at-the-heart-of-the-modern-conservative-party

    Many on the left would be shocked by how apolitical most of the Conservative party is. There is currently no theory in conservative politics. I suspect no more than a handful of Tory MPs have ever read Burke or Hayek, unless they cropped up on a PPE reading list. They will be far more familiar with Isabel Oakeshott than Michael.

    ...

    Rather than principles or goals, the Tory party today lives for day-to-day reactions to the things that catch its eye. Most MPs have no understanding of economics, but instead repeat half-remembered maxims about lower taxes (we are, it seems, forever to the right of the Laffer curve), whilst at the same time celebrating the latest boondoggle that happens to land in their constituency. In the same vein, you see the Tory MPs who have started to get their head around the housing crisis call for more housebuilding everywhere except where it threatens some historic carpark or ‘sacred’ waste site on their patch. They will tweet almost back-to-back about the unaffordability of homes and their objection to any new development.

    ...

    It is not that the Conservative party is deliberately and mindfully pursuing ends inimical to British interests. Tory MPs do, mostly, want a prosperous and safe country. They’ve just lost any sense of what that means beyond platitudes, or how to engage with the challenges that stand in our way. The party would rather hide behind the curtain, pulling at levers that aren’t attached to anything.

    "Sunak looks like he will run the country like a private equity project, cutting any expense he can and damn the consequences, whilst Truss will run it like a village fete, with boundless enthusiasm and harking back to the old hits."
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,914

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
    I expect all the dead ones post war would be backing Sunak, though Thatcher would have a soft spot for Truss
    Maggie would have spotted Truss as a featherweight phoney in about 3 microseconds. How little you know about her.
    Mrs Thatcher rarely appointed female ministers.
    She appointed Edwina Currie as a junior minister after this speech:

    image
    There were also surprisingly few female Conservative MPs in the 1980s, so she didn't have an abundance of options.
  • Options
    JohnOJohnO Posts: 4,214

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
    I expect all the dead ones post war would be backing Sunak, though Thatcher would have a soft spot for Truss
    Maggie would have spotted Truss as a featherweight phoney in about 3 microseconds. How little you know about her.
    Mrs Thatcher rarely appointed female ministers.
    In her entire Premiership, Mrs T only appointed one female Cabinet Minister (Janet Young) who was sacked after only 14 months.
  • Options
    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,624

    IshmaelZ said:

    This is superb. all of it.

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-crisis-at-the-heart-of-the-modern-conservative-party

    Many on the left would be shocked by how apolitical most of the Conservative party is. There is currently no theory in conservative politics. I suspect no more than a handful of Tory MPs have ever read Burke or Hayek, unless they cropped up on a PPE reading list. They will be far more familiar with Isabel Oakeshott than Michael.

    ...

    Rather than principles or goals, the Tory party today lives for day-to-day reactions to the things that catch its eye. Most MPs have no understanding of economics, but instead repeat half-remembered maxims about lower taxes (we are, it seems, forever to the right of the Laffer curve), whilst at the same time celebrating the latest boondoggle that happens to land in their constituency. In the same vein, you see the Tory MPs who have started to get their head around the housing crisis call for more housebuilding everywhere except where it threatens some historic carpark or ‘sacred’ waste site on their patch. They will tweet almost back-to-back about the unaffordability of homes and their objection to any new development.

    ...

    It is not that the Conservative party is deliberately and mindfully pursuing ends inimical to British interests. Tory MPs do, mostly, want a prosperous and safe country. They’ve just lost any sense of what that means beyond platitudes, or how to engage with the challenges that stand in our way. The party would rather hide behind the curtain, pulling at levers that aren’t attached to anything.

    They're out of energy and ideas. They should do the country a favour and resign en masse. Labour may or may not be equally clueless but it's worth at least testing the proposition.
    Labour and the LDs are equally clueless, but perhaps it is not their fault but the electorates. We choose to put in place whoever sells us the most optimistic short term answers and ignore those who want to invest and say it will be tough. Essentially we choose like toddlers.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 46,684
    Waitrose online have almost sold out of mineral water

    EVERYONE IS THIRSTY
  • Options
    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,624
    JohnO said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
    I expect all the dead ones post war would be backing Sunak, though Thatcher would have a soft spot for Truss
    Maggie would have spotted Truss as a featherweight phoney in about 3 microseconds. How little you know about her.
    Mrs Thatcher rarely appointed female ministers.
    In her entire Premiership, Mrs T only appointed one female Cabinet Minister (Janet Young) who was sacked after only 14 months.
    Wow!
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,056
    edited August 2022
    rcs1000 said:

    You know: the simplest way to get the price of energy down is to defeat Russia. And the simplest way to defeat Russia is for us to simply come in on the side of the Ukrainians.

    Furthermore, if we were to do this, it would send a very clear message to all the Russians (who aren't Putin) that the best way out of the mess would be for Putin to have an accident.

    Yes. I think we'd have to be clear that our war aims were only to eject Russian forces from Ukraine, as per the agreements we made when Ukraine gave up its nukes, and not regime change though.
  • Options
    ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 2,905
    Carnyx said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Carnyx said:

    TOPPING said:

    Did some fucker on here earlier, when discussing food, use the word "mouthfeel"?

    Jesus H Christ.

    Yep (not me). Texture, but more than that: interaction with flavour too.

    It's why I cut up my potatoes for stovies* irregularly to get a range of sizes which vary from completely cooked and moistly pasty to al dente.

    *potatoes, onions, and a little fat and water cooked in one pan - aka pommes de terre estovees, lobscouse, Labskaus (Danish), etc.
    Don't your stovies have meat?

    I once had 'deconstructed stovies' in a restaurant. It was as bad as it sounds.
    Not in it - but I have it served with slices of cold roast meat, ideally the slightly fatty kind such as lamb, and pickled beetroot as noted elsewhere on this thread.

    Edit: the Danes have it that wat too. But with salad as well. AKA a sprinkle of chopped chives.
    One side of my family made it almost like corn beef hash (but with slightly chunky corn beef). I imagine if you stirred that in with some beetroot that would be the Labskaus version. The other side it was somewhat more like an Irish Stew.

    I think there's some Danish on the Labskaus-esque side of the family somewhere in the distant past so that might explain it.
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,609
    Am I cycnical for thinking police services seem to not sack plenty of officers for gross incompetence of misconduct (granted they seem not to find some obvious candidates guilty of such in the first place), and it is very easy for them to claim they would have sacked those who have already resigned? Points for creativity though.

    A police officer made up a story he had a girlfriend then claimed she had died of cancer in order to get time off.

    PC Harry Sarkar would have been sacked had he not resigned and his actions were a "significant abuse of trust", West Midlands Police said.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-birmingham-62506363
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,137
    rcs1000 said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
    I expect all the dead ones post war would be backing Sunak, though Thatcher would have a soft spot for Truss
    Maggie would have spotted Truss as a featherweight phoney in about 3 microseconds. How little you know about her.
    Mrs Thatcher rarely appointed female ministers.
    She appointed Edwina Currie as a junior minister after this speech:

    image
    There were also surprisingly few female Conservative MPs in the 1980s, so she didn't have an abundance of options.
    Is that an EU flag at the back?
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,189
    Leon said:

    Waitrose online have almost sold out of mineral water

    EVERYONE IS THIRSTY

    I also saw they had a whole section of zero alcohol drinks. The world is a changin'.

    For the better in this case, I think, and Peroni's zero lager does it for me.
  • Options
    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,419

    IshmaelZ said:

    This is superb. all of it.

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-crisis-at-the-heart-of-the-modern-conservative-party

    Many on the left would be shocked by how apolitical most of the Conservative party is. There is currently no theory in conservative politics. I suspect no more than a handful of Tory MPs have ever read Burke or Hayek, unless they cropped up on a PPE reading list. They will be far more familiar with Isabel Oakeshott than Michael.

    ...

    Rather than principles or goals, the Tory party today lives for day-to-day reactions to the things that catch its eye. Most MPs have no understanding of economics, but instead repeat half-remembered maxims about lower taxes (we are, it seems, forever to the right of the Laffer curve), whilst at the same time celebrating the latest boondoggle that happens to land in their constituency. In the same vein, you see the Tory MPs who have started to get their head around the housing crisis call for more housebuilding everywhere except where it threatens some historic carpark or ‘sacred’ waste site on their patch. They will tweet almost back-to-back about the unaffordability of homes and their objection to any new development.

    ...

    It is not that the Conservative party is deliberately and mindfully pursuing ends inimical to British interests. Tory MPs do, mostly, want a prosperous and safe country. They’ve just lost any sense of what that means beyond platitudes, or how to engage with the challenges that stand in our way. The party would rather hide behind the curtain, pulling at levers that aren’t attached to anything.

    They're out of energy and ideas. They should do the country a favour and resign en masse. Labour may or may not be equally clueless but it's worth at least testing the proposition.
    Labour and the LDs are equally clueless, but perhaps it is not their fault but the electorates. We choose to put in place whoever sells us the most optimistic short term answers and ignore those who want to invest and say it will be tough. Essentially we choose like toddlers.
    All the Tories have to do to stay in power is oppose all the Woke nonsense.
  • Options
    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,624
    Leon said:

    Waitrose online have almost sold out of mineral water

    EVERYONE IS THIRSTY

    Let them drink Veuve.
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,609
    edited August 2022
    JohnO said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
    I expect all the dead ones post war would be backing Sunak, though Thatcher would have a soft spot for Truss
    Maggie would have spotted Truss as a featherweight phoney in about 3 microseconds. How little you know about her.
    Mrs Thatcher rarely appointed female ministers.
    In her entire Premiership, Mrs T only appointed one female Cabinet Minister (Janet Young) who was sacked after only 14 months.
    I don't know if the increase in female Cabinet Ministers has been quite as dramatic in such a short space of time as ethnic minority Cabinet Ministers, but it has certainly been significant.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,189
    Meanwhile, the country does feel slightly rudderless, in the midst of a crisis, and I wonder if that will also be weaponised (as it should be) by the opposition. Who of course are also away but sending Cleverley and whatnot around the studios promising something or other doesn't really seem to cut it in terms of addressing the problem.

    Of course Johnson should be somewhere visible as PM but the Cons party should have wrapped up this contest a month ago.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,929
    ohnotnow said:

    Carnyx said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Carnyx said:

    TOPPING said:

    Did some fucker on here earlier, when discussing food, use the word "mouthfeel"?

    Jesus H Christ.

    Yep (not me). Texture, but more than that: interaction with flavour too.

    It's why I cut up my potatoes for stovies* irregularly to get a range of sizes which vary from completely cooked and moistly pasty to al dente.

    *potatoes, onions, and a little fat and water cooked in one pan - aka pommes de terre estovees, lobscouse, Labskaus (Danish), etc.
    Don't your stovies have meat?

    I once had 'deconstructed stovies' in a restaurant. It was as bad as it sounds.
    Not in it - but I have it served with slices of cold roast meat, ideally the slightly fatty kind such as lamb, and pickled beetroot as noted elsewhere on this thread.

    Edit: the Danes have it that wat too. But with salad as well. AKA a sprinkle of chopped chives.
    One side of my family made it almost like corn beef hash (but with slightly chunky corn beef). I imagine if you stirred that in with some beetroot that would be the Labskaus version. The other side it was somewhat more like an Irish Stew.

    I think there's some Danish on the Labskaus-esque side of the family somewhere in the distant past so that might explain it.
    Corned beef hash is called lobbies in Lancashire. Served with pickled red cabbage.
    Yum.
  • Options
    JohnOJohnO Posts: 4,214

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
    I expect all the dead ones post war would be backing Sunak, though Thatcher would have a soft spot for Truss
    Maggie would have spotted Truss as a featherweight phoney in about 3 microseconds. How little you know about her.
    Mrs Thatcher rarely appointed female ministers.
    She appointed Edwina Currie as a junior minister after this speech:

    image
    Five years actually. Currie made that speech at the 1981 Conference (she was a PPC) and was appointed a Minister in 1986, having been elected for South Derbyshire in 1983.
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,609
    edited August 2022
    Andy_JS said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    This is superb. all of it.

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-crisis-at-the-heart-of-the-modern-conservative-party

    Many on the left would be shocked by how apolitical most of the Conservative party is. There is currently no theory in conservative politics. I suspect no more than a handful of Tory MPs have ever read Burke or Hayek, unless they cropped up on a PPE reading list. They will be far more familiar with Isabel Oakeshott than Michael.

    ...

    Rather than principles or goals, the Tory party today lives for day-to-day reactions to the things that catch its eye. Most MPs have no understanding of economics, but instead repeat half-remembered maxims about lower taxes (we are, it seems, forever to the right of the Laffer curve), whilst at the same time celebrating the latest boondoggle that happens to land in their constituency. In the same vein, you see the Tory MPs who have started to get their head around the housing crisis call for more housebuilding everywhere except where it threatens some historic carpark or ‘sacred’ waste site on their patch. They will tweet almost back-to-back about the unaffordability of homes and their objection to any new development.

    ...

    It is not that the Conservative party is deliberately and mindfully pursuing ends inimical to British interests. Tory MPs do, mostly, want a prosperous and safe country. They’ve just lost any sense of what that means beyond platitudes, or how to engage with the challenges that stand in our way. The party would rather hide behind the curtain, pulling at levers that aren’t attached to anything.

    They're out of energy and ideas. They should do the country a favour and resign en masse. Labour may or may not be equally clueless but it's worth at least testing the proposition.
    Labour and the LDs are equally clueless, but perhaps it is not their fault but the electorates. We choose to put in place whoever sells us the most optimistic short term answers and ignore those who want to invest and say it will be tough. Essentially we choose like toddlers.
    All the Tories have to do to stay in power is oppose all the Woke nonsense.
    Eh, I doubt that. There's a market for it, definitely, but 1) they can go too far on it (many people oppose sillier stories, but do not regard everything they dislike as woke, as some Tory MPs do), and 2) people really do care more about significant economic issues and general government conduct, and 14 years in power has a significant 'time for a change' threat to them staying in power.

    'Woke' opposition might work adding flavour to a campaign, but if that is all that it is it will fail, just as you might like coriander but wouldn't be advised to eat it by the spoonful. If they think that is all they need to do it will be extremely complacent of them.
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,900
    edited August 2022
  • Options
    Carrie and Boris Johnson’s Camberwell townhouse listed for sale for £1.6 million
    The Johnsons have put their Camberwell townhouse up for sale — for £400,000 more than they paid for it.

    Outgoing Prime Minister Boris Johnson and his wife Carrie Johnson have put their Camberwell townhouse up for sale for £1.6 million.

    The couple paid £1.2 million for their four-bedroom, red-brick Victorian terrace home on 19 July 2019.

    Should it sell for the asking price, the Johnsons stand to make a profit of £400,000.

    The Johnsons have never lived at the property, and are thought to have rented out both the Camberwell townhouse and an Oxfordshire farmhouse to pay for costly renovations to their home at 11 Downing Street.

    https://www.standard.co.uk/homesandproperty/celebrity-homes/boris-carrie-johnson-camberwell-townhouse-for-sale-b1017759.html
  • Options
    TimTTimT Posts: 6,328
    Leon said:

    If I had to unite the threads, I’d say I prefer the “political mouthfeel” of Liz Truss over rishi Sunak. He’s like a rich yet bland dal. Expensively spiced lentils are still lentils, he has the “political mouthfeel” of posh nursery food

    She’s fresher, spikier. A hint of the acerbic. Like berries from a Finnish forest

    My Weltanschauung gives me a mouthfeel that it's time for a Leon panic: https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-022-02175-z

    A new plague from China ...
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,189

    rcs1000 said:

    You know: the simplest way to get the price of energy down is to defeat Russia. And the simplest way to defeat Russia is for us to simply come in on the side of the Ukrainians.

    Furthermore, if we were to do this, it would send a very clear message to all the Russians (who aren't Putin) that the best way out of the mess would be for Putin to have an accident.

    Yes. I think we'd have to be clear that our war aims were only to eject Russian forces from Ukraine, as per the agreements we made when Ukraine gave up its nukes, and not regime change though.
    Our war aims would need to be to defeat the Russian army.

    And this is supposed to be a sensible discussion board.

    I mean go for it if you want, and I noted @rcs1000's commitment to the cause but are we thinking this through.
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,056

    rcs1000 said:

    You know: the simplest way to get the price of energy down is to defeat Russia. And the simplest way to defeat Russia is for us to simply come in on the side of the Ukrainians.

    Furthermore, if we were to do this, it would send a very clear message to all the Russians (who aren't Putin) that the best way out of the mess would be for Putin to have an accident.

    Yes. I think we'd have to be clear that our war aims were only to eject Russian forces from Ukraine, as per the agreements we made when Ukraine gave up its nukes, and not regime change though.
    If the EU was really interested in becoming a country then they would have been trying to organise a coalition of willing EU members to join the war on Ukraine's side. Instead Germany can't agree to ban Russian tourists.

    I wonder if a coalition of the non-nuclear EU states joining the war would be seen as less threatening to Russia than if France/UK/US were involved, but there's not much sign of it happening.
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,609
    16 times being late to register is a pretty significant number to be believably regarded as inadvertent, without use of 'I'm an idiot' defence.

    Similar to parties get fined for not registering electoral expenses properly and whinge about it being confusing, when even if it is the mainstream parties easily have the resources to make it very clear for their officials, so it is not believable they did not understand.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,137
    Eric Schmitt
    @EricSchmittNYT
    ·
    5h
    U.S. Navy is planning to sail warships through the Taiwan Strait in the coming weeks, ignoring China’s recent claim that it controls the entire waterway. w/
    @SangerNYT
    ,
    @BenjaminDooley
    https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/10/us/politics/taiwan-china-us.html?smid=tw-share
  • Options
    ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 2,905
    dixiedean said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Carnyx said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Carnyx said:

    TOPPING said:

    Did some fucker on here earlier, when discussing food, use the word "mouthfeel"?

    Jesus H Christ.

    Yep (not me). Texture, but more than that: interaction with flavour too.

    It's why I cut up my potatoes for stovies* irregularly to get a range of sizes which vary from completely cooked and moistly pasty to al dente.

    *potatoes, onions, and a little fat and water cooked in one pan - aka pommes de terre estovees, lobscouse, Labskaus (Danish), etc.
    Don't your stovies have meat?

    I once had 'deconstructed stovies' in a restaurant. It was as bad as it sounds.
    Not in it - but I have it served with slices of cold roast meat, ideally the slightly fatty kind such as lamb, and pickled beetroot as noted elsewhere on this thread.

    Edit: the Danes have it that wat too. But with salad as well. AKA a sprinkle of chopped chives.
    One side of my family made it almost like corn beef hash (but with slightly chunky corn beef). I imagine if you stirred that in with some beetroot that would be the Labskaus version. The other side it was somewhat more like an Irish Stew.

    I think there's some Danish on the Labskaus-esque side of the family somewhere in the distant past so that might explain it.
    Corned beef hash is called lobbies in Lancashire. Served with pickled red cabbage.
    Yum.
    I've got some 'artisan' pickled red cabbage (yes, I know). So might give that a go once this head sods off.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,875
    TOPPING said:

    rcs1000 said:

    You know: the simplest way to get the price of energy down is to defeat Russia. And the simplest way to defeat Russia is for us to simply come in on the side of the Ukrainians.

    Furthermore, if we were to do this, it would send a very clear message to all the Russians (who aren't Putin) that the best way out of the mess would be for Putin to have an accident.

    Yes. I think we'd have to be clear that our war aims were only to eject Russian forces from Ukraine, as per the agreements we made when Ukraine gave up its nukes, and not regime change though.
    Our war aims would need to be to defeat the Russian army.

    And this is supposed to be a sensible discussion board.

    I mean go for it if you want, and I noted @rcs1000's commitment to the cause but are we thinking this through.
    The way things are going, we will not need to defeat the Russian army.

    It seems the Russian army (and wider military) are perfectly capable of defeating themselves.
  • Options
    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,776
    JohnO said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
    I expect all the dead ones post war would be backing Sunak, though Thatcher would have a soft spot for Truss
    Maggie would have spotted Truss as a featherweight phoney in about 3 microseconds. How little you know about her.
    Mrs Thatcher rarely appointed female ministers.
    She appointed Edwina Currie as a junior minister after this speech:

    image
    Five years actually. Currie made that speech at the 1981 Conference (she was a PPC) and was appointed a Minister in 1986, having been elected for South Derbyshire in 1983.

    I wonder what Mrs T is praying for?
  • Options
    TimTTimT Posts: 6,328

    Eric Schmitt
    @EricSchmittNYT
    ·
    5h
    U.S. Navy is planning to sail warships through the Taiwan Strait in the coming weeks, ignoring China’s recent claim that it controls the entire waterway. w/
    @SangerNYT
    ,
    @BenjaminDooley
    https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/10/us/politics/taiwan-china-us.html?smid=tw-share

    For some reason this brought to mind USN sailships.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,875
    "Legoland: Rollercoaster crash at Germany resort injures 34"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-62512359

    Like the one at Alton Towers a few years back? Hope everyone's going to be okay...
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,609

    Eric Schmitt
    @EricSchmittNYT
    ·
    5h
    U.S. Navy is planning to sail warships through the Taiwan Strait in the coming weeks, ignoring China’s recent claim that it controls the entire waterway. w/
    @SangerNYT
    ,
    @BenjaminDooley
    https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/10/us/politics/taiwan-china-us.html?smid=tw-share

    The problem with China's bullish attitude to anyone doing things they dislike is they are so over the top about even the most minor of things - like forcing moviestars to grovel if they say Taiwan is a country - that it makes it hard to figure out how serious they could possibly be about genuinely being angry (officially anyway) at actions of others.

    Obviously this action is deliberately more provocative, but when their rhetoric is the same whether you sail through the Taiwan straight or comment idly that maybe they've been ignoring rules in Hong Kong, they cannot escalate their language.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,929

    rcs1000 said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Lord Howard is 'Ready for Rishi'

    https://twitter.com/Mark_J_Harper/status/1557319197159481345?s=20&t=LLfCQvyTHcNVAYaqaJ3-Cg

    In fact the only living former Tory leader backing Truss is IDS (though am sure Boris is too)

    Are all the dead ones backing Sunak? I would also argue as to whether IDS is actually living> he makes SKS sound like the embodiment of political charisma.
    I expect all the dead ones post war would be backing Sunak, though Thatcher would have a soft spot for Truss
    Maggie would have spotted Truss as a featherweight phoney in about 3 microseconds. How little you know about her.
    Mrs Thatcher rarely appointed female ministers.
    She appointed Edwina Currie as a junior minister after this speech:

    image
    There were also surprisingly few female Conservative MPs in the 1980s, so she didn't have an abundance of options.
    Is that an EU flag at the back?
    It's 1981.
    The Tories were weaponising the EU flag to emphasise Labour was likely to take us out.
    O tempora!
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,609

    TOPPING said:

    rcs1000 said:

    You know: the simplest way to get the price of energy down is to defeat Russia. And the simplest way to defeat Russia is for us to simply come in on the side of the Ukrainians.

    Furthermore, if we were to do this, it would send a very clear message to all the Russians (who aren't Putin) that the best way out of the mess would be for Putin to have an accident.

    Yes. I think we'd have to be clear that our war aims were only to eject Russian forces from Ukraine, as per the agreements we made when Ukraine gave up its nukes, and not regime change though.
    Our war aims would need to be to defeat the Russian army.

    And this is supposed to be a sensible discussion board.

    I mean go for it if you want, and I noted @rcs1000's commitment to the cause but are we thinking this through.
    The way things are going, we will not need to defeat the Russian army.

    It seems the Russian army (and wider military) are perfectly capable of defeating themselves.
    Some positive news aside, I remain wary of being too optimistic, But here's hoping.
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,900
    edited August 2022
    kle4 said:

    16 times being late to register is a pretty significant number to be believably regarded as inadvertent, without use of 'I'm an idiot' defence.

    Similar to parties get fined for not registering electoral expenses properly and whinge about it being confusing, when even if it is the mainstream parties easily have the resources to make it very clear for their officials, so it is not believable they did not understand.
    I mean he is an idiot, but idiots can grift too
  • Options
    UK energy industry told to help with cost of living or risk windfall tax

    Energy companies have been told to use “huge” profits to help households with the rising cost of living or risk further windfall taxes.

    Boris Johnson unexpectedly joined a meeting of big energy producers this morning to emphasise that they had to do more to help people with bills.

    Nadhim Zahawi, the chancellor, told electricity giants that the cost of living crisis was “not just the government’s problem” and challenged them to come up with ways to ease the impact of rising bills, urging a “spirit of national unity”. The possibility of extending a windfall tax currently levied on oil and gas companies to electricity generation was “implied” if action was not sufficient.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/energy-bills-could-top-5-000-by-april-as-ministers-hold-crisis-talks-with-energy-bosses-m8tcmmlqw (£££)

  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,875
    kle4 said:

    TOPPING said:

    rcs1000 said:

    You know: the simplest way to get the price of energy down is to defeat Russia. And the simplest way to defeat Russia is for us to simply come in on the side of the Ukrainians.

    Furthermore, if we were to do this, it would send a very clear message to all the Russians (who aren't Putin) that the best way out of the mess would be for Putin to have an accident.

    Yes. I think we'd have to be clear that our war aims were only to eject Russian forces from Ukraine, as per the agreements we made when Ukraine gave up its nukes, and not regime change though.
    Our war aims would need to be to defeat the Russian army.

    And this is supposed to be a sensible discussion board.

    I mean go for it if you want, and I noted @rcs1000's commitment to the cause but are we thinking this through.
    The way things are going, we will not need to defeat the Russian army.

    It seems the Russian army (and wider military) are perfectly capable of defeating themselves.
    Some positive news aside, I remain wary of being too optimistic, But here's hoping.
    My view is that it is now impossible for Russia to end up in a better position than it was in February. It has been debased politically, economically and militarily. The stronk Russian military has been shown to be a myth.

    That means any 'win' for Russia will be pyrrhic in the extreme, if they get any 'win' at all.

    That does not mean Ukraine wins either, but it does mean Russians are in for a sh*t time over the next five to ten years.
  • Options
    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,048

    Carrie and Boris Johnson’s Camberwell townhouse listed for sale for £1.6 million
    The Johnsons have put their Camberwell townhouse up for sale — for £400,000 more than they paid for it.

    Outgoing Prime Minister Boris Johnson and his wife Carrie Johnson have put their Camberwell townhouse up for sale for £1.6 million.

    The couple paid £1.2 million for their four-bedroom, red-brick Victorian terrace home on 19 July 2019.

    Should it sell for the asking price, the Johnsons stand to make a profit of £400,000.

    The Johnsons have never lived at the property, and are thought to have rented out both the Camberwell townhouse and an Oxfordshire farmhouse to pay for costly renovations to their home at 11 Downing Street.

    https://www.standard.co.uk/homesandproperty/celebrity-homes/boris-carrie-johnson-camberwell-townhouse-for-sale-b1017759.html

    That's not a "townhouse" , it's just a bog standard South London Victoria terraced house. I live in one not wholly dissimilar and it's definitely not a townhouse, whatever that even is.
  • Options
    dixiedean said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Carnyx said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Carnyx said:

    TOPPING said:

    Did some fucker on here earlier, when discussing food, use the word "mouthfeel"?

    Jesus H Christ.

    Yep (not me). Texture, but more than that: interaction with flavour too.

    It's why I cut up my potatoes for stovies* irregularly to get a range of sizes which vary from completely cooked and moistly pasty to al dente.

    *potatoes, onions, and a little fat and water cooked in one pan - aka pommes de terre estovees, lobscouse, Labskaus (Danish), etc.
    Don't your stovies have meat?

    I once had 'deconstructed stovies' in a restaurant. It was as bad as it sounds.
    Not in it - but I have it served with slices of cold roast meat, ideally the slightly fatty kind such as lamb, and pickled beetroot as noted elsewhere on this thread.

    Edit: the Danes have it that wat too. But with salad as well. AKA a sprinkle of chopped chives.
    One side of my family made it almost like corn beef hash (but with slightly chunky corn beef). I imagine if you stirred that in with some beetroot that would be the Labskaus version. The other side it was somewhat more like an Irish Stew.

    I think there's some Danish on the Labskaus-esque side of the family somewhere in the distant past so that might explain it.
    Corned beef hash is called lobbies in Lancashire. Served with pickled red cabbage.
    Yum.
    Not in my part of Lancashire it wasn't. Just called 'ash. With pickled red cabbage yes.
  • Options
    kle4 said:

    16 times being late to register is a pretty significant number to be believably regarded as inadvertent, without use of 'I'm an idiot' defence.

    Similar to parties get fined for not registering electoral expenses properly and whinge about it being confusing, when even if it is the mainstream parties easily have the resources to make it very clear for their officials, so it is not believable they did not understand.
    As I said the other day, this is too common, and there is no obvious gain for not registering, that one must suspect the process is not straightforward enough.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 46,684
    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    Waitrose online have almost sold out of mineral water

    EVERYONE IS THIRSTY

    I also saw they had a whole section of zero alcohol drinks. The world is a changin'.

    For the better in this case, I think, and Peroni's zero lager does it for me.

    It's an interesting philosophical point. Kingsley Amis famously asked it, Would we drink booze if it wasn't boozy? If it did not get us drunk?

    Personally, no, I doubt it very much

    I enjoy the taste of a few forms of alcohol - red wine, maybe a beer on a cold day - but I can't see myself drinking it if it did not have booze. It would be like smoking zero-heroin heroin

    And of course some alcohols are positively unpleasant - eg vodka

    I saw a zero alcohol gin, the other day, in Marks and Sparks. What is the fucking point in that? The only fucking point in that is to try and fool your brain into believing you are drinking alcohol
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,929

    dixiedean said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Carnyx said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Carnyx said:

    TOPPING said:

    Did some fucker on here earlier, when discussing food, use the word "mouthfeel"?

    Jesus H Christ.

    Yep (not me). Texture, but more than that: interaction with flavour too.

    It's why I cut up my potatoes for stovies* irregularly to get a range of sizes which vary from completely cooked and moistly pasty to al dente.

    *potatoes, onions, and a little fat and water cooked in one pan - aka pommes de terre estovees, lobscouse, Labskaus (Danish), etc.
    Don't your stovies have meat?

    I once had 'deconstructed stovies' in a restaurant. It was as bad as it sounds.
    Not in it - but I have it served with slices of cold roast meat, ideally the slightly fatty kind such as lamb, and pickled beetroot as noted elsewhere on this thread.

    Edit: the Danes have it that wat too. But with salad as well. AKA a sprinkle of chopped chives.
    One side of my family made it almost like corn beef hash (but with slightly chunky corn beef). I imagine if you stirred that in with some beetroot that would be the Labskaus version. The other side it was somewhat more like an Irish Stew.

    I think there's some Danish on the Labskaus-esque side of the family somewhere in the distant past so that might explain it.
    Corned beef hash is called lobbies in Lancashire. Served with pickled red cabbage.
    Yum.
    Not in my part of Lancashire it wasn't. Just called 'ash. With pickled red cabbage yes.
    Maybe that's proximity to Liverpool?
    The denizens of Leigh are known as lobbygobblers.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,095

    Carrie and Boris Johnson’s Camberwell townhouse listed for sale for £1.6 million
    The Johnsons have put their Camberwell townhouse up for sale — for £400,000 more than they paid for it.

    Outgoing Prime Minister Boris Johnson and his wife Carrie Johnson have put their Camberwell townhouse up for sale for £1.6 million.

    The couple paid £1.2 million for their four-bedroom, red-brick Victorian terrace home on 19 July 2019.

    Should it sell for the asking price, the Johnsons stand to make a profit of £400,000.

    The Johnsons have never lived at the property, and are thought to have rented out both the Camberwell townhouse and an Oxfordshire farmhouse to pay for costly renovations to their home at 11 Downing Street.

    https://www.standard.co.uk/homesandproperty/celebrity-homes/boris-carrie-johnson-camberwell-townhouse-for-sale-b1017759.html

    Now that is interesting. What does he plan to live in on leaving office if he sells?

    Has he been promised a job by Truss?

    Or is he in such dire financial straits he has no choice?
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,095

    UK energy industry told to help with cost of living or risk windfall tax

    Energy companies have been told to use “huge” profits to help households with the rising cost of living or risk further windfall taxes.

    Boris Johnson unexpectedly joined a meeting of big energy producers this morning to emphasise that they had to do more to help people with bills.

    As the country's biggest producer of hot air, surely he was invited anyway?
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 46,684
    ydoethur said:

    Carrie and Boris Johnson’s Camberwell townhouse listed for sale for £1.6 million
    The Johnsons have put their Camberwell townhouse up for sale — for £400,000 more than they paid for it.

    Outgoing Prime Minister Boris Johnson and his wife Carrie Johnson have put their Camberwell townhouse up for sale for £1.6 million.

    The couple paid £1.2 million for their four-bedroom, red-brick Victorian terrace home on 19 July 2019.

    Should it sell for the asking price, the Johnsons stand to make a profit of £400,000.

    The Johnsons have never lived at the property, and are thought to have rented out both the Camberwell townhouse and an Oxfordshire farmhouse to pay for costly renovations to their home at 11 Downing Street.

    https://www.standard.co.uk/homesandproperty/celebrity-homes/boris-carrie-johnson-camberwell-townhouse-for-sale-b1017759.html

    Now that is interesting. What does he plan to live in on leaving office if he sells?

    Has he been promised a job by Truss?

    Or is he in such dire financial straits he has no choice?
    He will already be negotiating the squillion dollar advance for his memoirs. He is not going to be skint
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,900

    kle4 said:

    16 times being late to register is a pretty significant number to be believably regarded as inadvertent, without use of 'I'm an idiot' defence.

    Similar to parties get fined for not registering electoral expenses properly and whinge about it being confusing, when even if it is the mainstream parties easily have the resources to make it very clear for their officials, so it is not believable they did not understand.
    As I said the other day, this is too common, and there is no obvious gain for not registering, that one must suspect the process is not straightforward enough.
    Or they know they can just say ooopsie, my bad and get off with no consequences like SKS snd Lammy
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,189
    edited August 2022
    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    Waitrose online have almost sold out of mineral water

    EVERYONE IS THIRSTY

    I also saw they had a whole section of zero alcohol drinks. The world is a changin'.

    For the better in this case, I think, and Peroni's zero lager does it for me.

    It's an interesting philosophical point. Kingsley Amis famously asked it, Would we drink booze if it wasn't boozy? If it did not get us drunk?

    Personally, no, I doubt it very much

    I enjoy the taste of a few forms of alcohol - red wine, maybe a beer on a cold day - but I can't see myself drinking it if it did not have booze. It would be like smoking zero-heroin heroin

    And of course some alcohols are positively unpleasant - eg vodka

    I saw a zero alcohol gin, the other day, in Marks and Sparks. What is the fucking point in that? The only fucking point in that is to try and fool your brain into believing you are drinking alcohol
    Bingo.

    (Much like smoking I believe) it is the ritual that is important as much as anything. Gordon's zero gin is the best of the bunch imo and stick it in a cut crystal glass, tonic, ice and a slice, and some anchovy olives and you feel you are having a gin.

    If you think about the first drink of the evening, it gives you a very pleasant hit such that you think: "more of that please" and before you know it it's midnight and you are posting about aliens at the bottom of the garden.

    Why not stick at that one first drink and then have something which fools your brain into thinking it is continuing the process without the unwelcome effects.

    Same with a zero lager. Stick some lemonade in the top and sit down on a day such as today with that and a pack of Walkers Chicken Crisps and you are having a lazy beer. Plus that beer, er, ah, um, texture is unique and the zero ones have it.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 46,684
    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    Waitrose online have almost sold out of mineral water

    EVERYONE IS THIRSTY

    I also saw they had a whole section of zero alcohol drinks. The world is a changin'.

    For the better in this case, I think, and Peroni's zero lager does it for me.

    It's an interesting philosophical point. Kingsley Amis famously asked it, Would we drink booze if it wasn't boozy? If it did not get us drunk?

    Personally, no, I doubt it very much

    I enjoy the taste of a few forms of alcohol - red wine, maybe a beer on a cold day - but I can't see myself drinking it if it did not have booze. It would be like smoking zero-heroin heroin

    And of course some alcohols are positively unpleasant - eg vodka

    I saw a zero alcohol gin, the other day, in Marks and Sparks. What is the fucking point in that? The only fucking point in that is to try and fool your brain into believing you are drinking alcohol
    Bingo.

    Much like smoking I believe it is the ritual that is important as much as anything. Gordon's zero gin is the best of the bunch imo and stick it in a cut crystal glass, tonic, ice and a slice, and some anchovy olives and you feel you are having a gin.

    If you think about the first drink of the evening, it gives you a very pleasant hit such that you think: "more of that please" and before you know it it's midnight and you are posting about aliens at the bottom of the garden.

    Why not stick at that one first drink and then have something which fools your brain into thinking it is continuing the process without the unwelcome effects.

    Same with a zero lager. Stick some lemonade in the top and sit down on a day such as today with that and a pack of Walkers Chicken Crisps and you are having a lazy beer. Plus that beer, er, ah, um, texture is unique and the zero ones have it.
    Aaaaaand no. Just no
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,095
    IshmaelZ said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Clare Grogan on Radio 2 has chosen Mmm-bop as one of the tracks of her years.

    Where PB leads...

    Odd how much good music is from Glasgow.
    Dunno, it’s profile isn’t that different from Liverpool’s*. And there is the musical marching tradition of course..

    *not necessarily a recommendation in your view istr 🙂

    Well, no. Compare, say, Twist and Shout with, say, Twist and Shout. No contest, and the winning city also has fratellis, del Amitri, Amy, Franz Ferdinand, aztec Camera, ultravox....
    And not to mention Orange Juice, Simple Minds (before U2ification), Donovan, Primal Scream, Frankie Miller, Belle and Sebastian and the guvnor, Alex Harvey.
    Sadly I missed Donovan a couple of years ago at our local festival, but apparently an object lesson in not overdoing the LSD for too many decades. Belle and Sebastian for sure.
    Got taken along to see Donovan in Reading maybe 15 years back and was somewhat surprised to discover that his drummer was Rat Scabies....
This discussion has been closed.