Punters still make a 2022 exit favourite for The Liar King – politicalbetting.com

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Punters still make a 2022 exit favourite for The Liar King – politicalbetting.com

Although the Liar King survived last month’s confidence vote amongst Tory MPs the danger is not over for the PM. Next on the agenda is the election of the 1922 Committee executive committee and if anti-Johnson MPs do well in the MP election then it could prove to be troublesome.

Read the full story here

eek

First - and first to say Bozo won't be leaving No 10 in 2022.

Pulpstar

Don't hold back Mike, why don't you tell us what you really think.

HYUFD

Safe to say based on today's Conhome runoff surveys if Johnson does lose a VONC later this year, Hunt or Sunak will not be replacing him

Rishi Sunak: 31 per cent.

Nadhim Zahawi: 43 per cent.

Don’t know: 25 per cent.

(771 votes cast)

–

Rishi Sunak: 35 per cent.

Liz Truss: 50 per cent.

Don’t know: 18 per cent.

(771 votes cast)

–

Rishi Sunak: 33 per cent.

Penny Mordaunt: 58 per cent.

Don’t know: 19 per cent.

(773 votes cast)

–

Rishi Sunak: 25 per cent.

Ben Wallace: 59 per cent.

Don’t know: 16 per cent.

(774 votes cast)


https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/04/next-tory-leader-play-offs-sixth-rishi-sunak/

Jeremy Hunt: 27 per cent.

Steve Baker: 48 per cent.

Don’t know: 25 per cent.

(777 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 24 per cent.

Kemi Badenoch: 52 per cent.

Don’t know: 24 per cent.

(785 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 24 per cent.

Liz Truss: 59 per cent.

Don’t know: 17 per cent.

(777 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 21 per cent.

Tom Tugendhat: 42 per cent.

Don’t know: 37 per cent.

(769 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 20 per cent.

Rishi Sunak 55 per cent.

Don’t know 26 per cent.

(772 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 18 per cent

Nadhim Zahawi: 60 per cent

Don’t know: 21 per cent.

(773 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 18 per cent.

Mordaunt: Penny Mordaunt 63 per cent.

Don’t Know: 19 per cent.

(777 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 14 per cent.

Ben Wallace: 72 per cent.

Don’t know: 13 per cent

(773 votes cast)

https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/04/next-tory-leader-play-offs-ninth-jeremy-hunt/

dixiedean

How can there be a reshuffle?

NorthofStoke

Resurrecting the discussion about the voting on the two British Europe referenda. I was on the losing side in both (voting and campaigning). To understand the voting on the first referendum it is essential to remember that the left of the Labour party and Labour movement were against. That included the Bennites, Militant, Labour Party Young Socialists, Tribune Group etc. The EEC was seen as a "rich man's club" that would embed capitalism. The Yes vote was seen as centre right or perhaps social democrat/centre right. Of course, there was also nationalistic opposition but I'd be confident that the large youth vote against was motivated by a misplaced socialist outlook.

BartholomewRoberts

Christian Eriksen to join Manchester United on a free transfer.

In normal circumstances I'd be loathe to welcome a transfer to Manchester United, or wish them all the best, but this isn't normal circumstances. It is great to see Eriksen pull through enough to sign for a big club again, and hopefully he'll have a bright career ahead of him. 👍

Andy_JS

"Chinese AI ‘can check loyalty of party members’" (£)

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/chinese-ai-can-check-loyalty-of-party-members-92d97hgwv

Leon

HYUFD said:

Safe to say based on today's Conhome runoff surveys if Johnson does lose a VONC later this year, Hunt or Sunak will not be replacing him

Rishi Sunak: 31 per cent.

Nadhim Zahawi: 43 per cent.

Don’t know: 25 per cent.

(771 votes cast)

–

Rishi Sunak: 35 per cent.

Liz Truss: 50 per cent.

Don’t know: 18 per cent.

(771 votes cast)

–

Rishi Sunak: 33 per cent.

Penny Mordaunt: 58 per cent.

Don’t know: 19 per cent.

(773 votes cast)

–

Rishi Sunak: 25 per cent.

Ben Wallace: 59 per cent.

Don’t know: 16 per cent.

(774 votes cast)


https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/04/next-tory-leader-play-offs-sixth-rishi-sunak/

Jeremy Hunt: 27 per cent.

Steve Baker: 48 per cent.

Don’t know: 25 per cent.

(777 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 24 per cent.

Kemi Badenoch: 52 per cent.

Don’t know: 24 per cent.

(785 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 24 per cent.

Liz Truss: 59 per cent.

Don’t know: 17 per cent.

(777 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 21 per cent.

Tom Tugendhat: 42 per cent.

Don’t know: 37 per cent.

(769 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 20 per cent.

Rishi Sunak 55 per cent.

Don’t know 26 per cent.

(772 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 18 per cent

Nadhim Zahawi: 60 per cent

Don’t know: 21 per cent.

(773 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 18 per cent.

Mordaunt: Penny Mordaunt 63 per cent.

Don’t Know: 19 per cent.

(777 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 14 per cent.

Ben Wallace: 72 per cent.

Don’t know: 13 per cent

(773 votes cast)

https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/04/next-tory-leader-play-offs-ninth-jeremy-hunt/

Zahawi would be interesting. Looks competent, plausible, good backstory, managed The Vax well when in charge

Very rich, but then he made it himself unlike Sunak

dixiedean

Leon said:

HYUFD said:

Safe to say based on today's Conhome runoff surveys if Johnson does lose a VONC later this year, Hunt or Sunak will not be replacing him

Rishi Sunak: 31 per cent.

Nadhim Zahawi: 43 per cent.

Don’t know: 25 per cent.

(771 votes cast)

–

Rishi Sunak: 35 per cent.

Liz Truss: 50 per cent.

Don’t know: 18 per cent.

(771 votes cast)

–

Rishi Sunak: 33 per cent.

Penny Mordaunt: 58 per cent.

Don’t know: 19 per cent.

(773 votes cast)

–

Rishi Sunak: 25 per cent.

Ben Wallace: 59 per cent.

Don’t know: 16 per cent.

(774 votes cast)


https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/04/next-tory-leader-play-offs-sixth-rishi-sunak/

Jeremy Hunt: 27 per cent.

Steve Baker: 48 per cent.

Don’t know: 25 per cent.

(777 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 24 per cent.

Kemi Badenoch: 52 per cent.

Don’t know: 24 per cent.

(785 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 24 per cent.

Liz Truss: 59 per cent.

Don’t know: 17 per cent.

(777 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 21 per cent.

Tom Tugendhat: 42 per cent.

Don’t know: 37 per cent.

(769 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 20 per cent.

Rishi Sunak 55 per cent.

Don’t know 26 per cent.

(772 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 18 per cent

Nadhim Zahawi: 60 per cent

Don’t know: 21 per cent.

(773 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 18 per cent.

Mordaunt: Penny Mordaunt 63 per cent.

Don’t Know: 19 per cent.

(777 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 14 per cent.

Ben Wallace: 72 per cent.

Don’t know: 13 per cent

(773 votes cast)

https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/04/next-tory-leader-play-offs-ninth-jeremy-hunt/

Zahawi would be interesting. Looks competent, plausible, good backstory, managed The Vax well when in charge

Very rich, but then he made it himself unlike Sunak

Made a poor start at Education, mind.

Leon

Andy_JS said:

"Chinese AI ‘can check loyalty of party members’" (£)

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/chinese-ai-can-check-loyalty-of-party-members-92d97hgwv

The only reason the internet isn’t flooded with deepfake celebrity porn or photos of Trump tupping a tapir are thanks to quite responsible western tech giants putting inbuilt restraints in their neural networks, like DALL-E 2

The Chinese will have no such scruples. AI is about to be militarised on social media

Nigel_Foremain

Leon said:

HYUFD said:

Safe to say based on today's Conhome runoff surveys if Johnson does lose a VONC later this year, Hunt or Sunak will not be replacing him

Rishi Sunak: 31 per cent.

Nadhim Zahawi: 43 per cent.

Don’t know: 25 per cent.

(771 votes cast)

–

Rishi Sunak: 35 per cent.

Liz Truss: 50 per cent.

Don’t know: 18 per cent.

(771 votes cast)

–

Rishi Sunak: 33 per cent.

Penny Mordaunt: 58 per cent.

Don’t know: 19 per cent.

(773 votes cast)

–

Rishi Sunak: 25 per cent.

Ben Wallace: 59 per cent.

Don’t know: 16 per cent.

(774 votes cast)


https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/04/next-tory-leader-play-offs-sixth-rishi-sunak/

Jeremy Hunt: 27 per cent.

Steve Baker: 48 per cent.

Don’t know: 25 per cent.

(777 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 24 per cent.

Kemi Badenoch: 52 per cent.

Don’t know: 24 per cent.

(785 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 24 per cent.

Liz Truss: 59 per cent.

Don’t know: 17 per cent.

(777 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 21 per cent.

Tom Tugendhat: 42 per cent.

Don’t know: 37 per cent.

(769 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 20 per cent.

Rishi Sunak 55 per cent.

Don’t know 26 per cent.

(772 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 18 per cent

Nadhim Zahawi: 60 per cent

Don’t know: 21 per cent.

(773 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 18 per cent.

Mordaunt: Penny Mordaunt 63 per cent.

Don’t Know: 19 per cent.

(777 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 14 per cent.

Ben Wallace: 72 per cent.

Don’t know: 13 per cent

(773 votes cast)

https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/04/next-tory-leader-play-offs-ninth-jeremy-hunt/

Zahawi would be interesting. Looks competent, plausible, good backstory, managed The Vax well when in charge

Very rich, but then he made it himself unlike Sunak

Agree, he would be a huge improvement on the current incumbent (or should I say encumbrance)

DougSeal

BartholomewRoberts said:

Christian Eriksen to join Manchester United on a free transfer.

In normal circumstances I'd be loathe to welcome a transfer to Manchester United, or wish them all the best, but this isn't normal circumstances. It is great to see Eriksen pull through enough to sign for a big club again, and hopefully he'll have a bright career ahead of him. 👍

“Big Club”?

dixiedean

BartholomewRoberts said:

Christian Eriksen to join Manchester United on a free transfer.

In normal circumstances I'd be loathe to welcome a transfer to Manchester United, or wish them all the best, but this isn't normal circumstances. It is great to see Eriksen pull through enough to sign for a big club again, and hopefully he'll have a bright career ahead of him. 👍

Could be a great signing. No doubt about his ability.

Nigel_Foremain

Andy_JS said:

"Chinese AI ‘can check loyalty of party members’" (£)

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/chinese-ai-can-check-loyalty-of-party-members-92d97hgwv

Boris Johnson just ordered a set

Roger

Well lets hope Johnson stays on.

After Labour's capitulation on Brexit NOT having Boris Johnson is Labour's only remaining USP.

kjh

HYUFD said:

Safe to say based on today's Conhome runoff surveys if Johnson does lose a VONC later this year, Hunt or Sunak will not be replacing him

Rishi Sunak: 31 per cent.

Nadhim Zahawi: 43 per cent.

Don’t know: 25 per cent.

(771 votes cast)

–

Rishi Sunak: 35 per cent.

Liz Truss: 50 per cent.

Don’t know: 18 per cent.

(771 votes cast)

–

Rishi Sunak: 33 per cent.

Penny Mordaunt: 58 per cent.

Don’t know: 19 per cent.

(773 votes cast)

–

Rishi Sunak: 25 per cent.

Ben Wallace: 59 per cent.

Don’t know: 16 per cent.

(774 votes cast)


https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/04/next-tory-leader-play-offs-sixth-rishi-sunak/

Jeremy Hunt: 27 per cent.

Steve Baker: 48 per cent.

Don’t know: 25 per cent.

(777 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 24 per cent.

Kemi Badenoch: 52 per cent.

Don’t know: 24 per cent.

(785 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 24 per cent.

Liz Truss: 59 per cent.

Don’t know: 17 per cent.

(777 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 21 per cent.

Tom Tugendhat: 42 per cent.

Don’t know: 37 per cent.

(769 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 20 per cent.

Rishi Sunak 55 per cent.

Don’t know 26 per cent.

(772 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 18 per cent

Nadhim Zahawi: 60 per cent

Don’t know: 21 per cent.

(773 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 18 per cent.

Mordaunt: Penny Mordaunt 63 per cent.

Don’t Know: 19 per cent.

(777 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 14 per cent.

Ben Wallace: 72 per cent.

Don’t know: 13 per cent

(773 votes cast)

https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/04/next-tory-leader-play-offs-ninth-jeremy-hunt/

Thanks for that @HYUFD . Very interesting. I know very little about Kemi Badenoch and was surprised to see her name in the list of runners. What is the inside info on her?

Nigel_Foremain

Leon said:

Andy_JS said:

"Chinese AI ‘can check loyalty of party members’" (£)

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/chinese-ai-can-check-loyalty-of-party-members-92d97hgwv

The only reason the internet isn’t flooded with deepfake celebrity porn or photos of Trump tupping a tapir are thanks to quite responsible western tech giants putting inbuilt restraints in their neural networks, like DALL-E 2

The Chinese will have no such scruples. AI is about to be militarised on social media

The Russians, on the other hand, had absolutely no influence on the beloved 2016 referendum though did they? Or any other aspect of British political or commercial life. There is no way they would have had access to the type of algorithms used by Cambridge Analytica. This has to be believed because this was the suggestion in the Russia Report.

DougSeal

Roger said:

Well lets hope Johnson stays on.

After Labour's capitulation on Brexit NOT having Boris Johnson is Labour's only remaining USP.

It’s not a capitulation, Roger, it’s reality. The EU are not letting us back. Labour can only repair relations. Johnson reinforced the pre-existing Anglophobia in the EU and turned it into a loathing that can never heal. It’s over. We can’t go back after pissing on the doormat on the way out. It’s sad but it’s the reality.

Scott_xP

exc @theipaper today

Only 17% of voters say Boris Johnson's leadership makes them more likely to vote Tory, @BMGResearch poll reveals.

More evidence PM has lost his 'Heineken' touch...

Story @janemerrick23: https://inews.co.uk/news/politics/boris-johnsons-leadership-is-turning-nearly-half-of-voters-off-the-conservatives-poll-shows-1720891

Scott_xP

Boris Johnson was aware of claims about Tory Chris Pincher, No10 admits https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/breaking-boris-johnson-aware-claims-27392813?utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=sharebar

JosiasJessop

The biggest threat from AI comes not from AI, but from gullible people who believe AI has more power and ability than it really has.

"Computer says no, and it's an AI!"

Andy_JS

Has anyone placed a bet on Penny Mordaunt as next PM

Scott_xP

So long and short of it.... was aware of widespread reputation as a wrong un' and appointed him anyway...
https://twitter.com/MrHarryCole/status/1543919737721311235

IshmaelZ

dixiedean said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

Christian Eriksen to join Manchester United on a free transfer.

In normal circumstances I'd be loathe to welcome a transfer to Manchester United, or wish them all the best, but this isn't normal circumstances. It is great to see Eriksen pull through enough to sign for a big club again, and hopefully he'll have a bright career ahead of him. 👍

Could be a great signing. No doubt about his ability.

What we he cost with a clean medical record?

Leon

The Montenegrins might be, on average, the best looking people I have ever seen

Mad bad drivers, mind

HYUFD

kjh said:

HYUFD said:

Safe to say based on today's Conhome runoff surveys if Johnson does lose a VONC later this year, Hunt or Sunak will not be replacing him

Rishi Sunak: 31 per cent.

Nadhim Zahawi: 43 per cent.

Don’t know: 25 per cent.

(771 votes cast)

–

Rishi Sunak: 35 per cent.

Liz Truss: 50 per cent.

Don’t know: 18 per cent.

(771 votes cast)

–

Rishi Sunak: 33 per cent.

Penny Mordaunt: 58 per cent.

Don’t know: 19 per cent.

(773 votes cast)

–

Rishi Sunak: 25 per cent.

Ben Wallace: 59 per cent.

Don’t know: 16 per cent.

(774 votes cast)


https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/04/next-tory-leader-play-offs-sixth-rishi-sunak/

Jeremy Hunt: 27 per cent.

Steve Baker: 48 per cent.

Don’t know: 25 per cent.

(777 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 24 per cent.

Kemi Badenoch: 52 per cent.

Don’t know: 24 per cent.

(785 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 24 per cent.

Liz Truss: 59 per cent.

Don’t know: 17 per cent.

(777 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 21 per cent.

Tom Tugendhat: 42 per cent.

Don’t know: 37 per cent.

(769 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 20 per cent.

Rishi Sunak 55 per cent.

Don’t know 26 per cent.

(772 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 18 per cent

Nadhim Zahawi: 60 per cent

Don’t know: 21 per cent.

(773 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 18 per cent.

Mordaunt: Penny Mordaunt 63 per cent.

Don’t Know: 19 per cent.

(777 votes cast)

–

Jeremy Hunt: 14 per cent.

Ben Wallace: 72 per cent.

Don’t know: 13 per cent

(773 votes cast)

https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/04/next-tory-leader-play-offs-ninth-jeremy-hunt/

Thanks for that @HYUFD . Very interesting. I know very little about Kemi Badenoch and was surprised to see her name in the list of runners. What is the inside info on her?

She is Minister for Levelling Up and Equalities but I suspect has zero chance of MPs putting her in the final 2

Mexicanpete

Roger said:

Well lets hope Johnson stays on.

After Labour's capitulation on Brexit NOT having Boris Johnson is Labour's only remaining USP.

Hopefully when Starmer gets his FPN someone sensible gets the gig.

We've all been desperate for some Labour policy, but if this is Starmer's flagship, the sooner he goes, the better. What a dick!

ping

Bloody hell

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-62037078

Surely more than 2 people hurt? Looking at the pictures…

Scott_xP

How ministers are trying to survive broadcast rounds without actually defending Boris Johnson https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-challenge-of-getting-ministers-to-defend-boris-on-the-airwaves

Gardenwalker

Scott_xP said:

So long and short of it.... was aware of widespread reputation as a wrong un' and appointed him anyway...
https://twitter.com/MrHarryCole/status/1543919737721311235

Things must be tough if the “First Cuck” is turning.

Nigel_Foremain

Andy_JS said:

Has anyone placed a bet on Penny Mordaunt as next PM

If she increased public spending on public conveniences, would she become known as "Spend a Penny Mordaunt"?

Or perhaps she could be opposed in her ambition by Jeffery Archer: Not a Penny Mordaunt, not a penny less"

Andy_JS

India 1.37
England 4.2
Draw 48

https://www.betfair.com/exchange/plus/cricket/market/1.200563796

IanB2

So Labour has decided that even joining the CU or SM needs another referendum - an entirely new position and one without much logic - and is then using that to try and persuade us that therefore they won’t bother.

Andy_JS

Penny Mordaunt has moved into the lead over Jeremy Hunt on Betfair for the first time.

https://www.betfair.com/exchange/plus/politics/market/1.160663234

dixiedean

ping said:

Bloody hell

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-62037078

Looks like a relatively modern block of flats, too.

Second one in a few days.
Tampering? Cutting back on safety checks? Or coincidence?

ThomasNashe

dixiedean said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

Christian Eriksen to join Manchester United on a free transfer.

In normal circumstances I'd be loathe to welcome a transfer to Manchester United, or wish them all the best, but this isn't normal circumstances. It is great to see Eriksen pull through enough to sign for a big club again, and hopefully he'll have a bright career ahead of him. 👍

Could be a great signing. No doubt about his ability.

Shame for Brentford, though. I enjoyed seeing him play for them, and doubt he’ll have the same impact at Man Utd. It’s the kind of thing I hate about modern football.

Gardenwalker

Sir Keir is doing all the necessary barnacle scraping.

No to SNP
No to returning to the EU (or even the SM).

I think he’s pretty much sorted the trans issue too.

Rachael Reeves has even made noises about tax cuts.

Not sure there’s much left.

Pulpstar

Andy_JS said:

India 1.37
England 4.2
Draw 48

https://www.betfair.com/exchange/plus/cricket/market/1.200563796

Implied correct prices from winviz are

India 1.3
Draw 25
England 5.6

Mexicanpete

DougSeal said:

Roger said:

Well lets hope Johnson stays on.

After Labour's capitulation on Brexit NOT having Boris Johnson is Labour's only remaining USP.

It’s not a capitulation, Roger, it’s reality. The EU are not letting us back. Labour can only repair relations. Johnson reinforced the pre-existing Anglophobia in the EU and turned it into a loathing that can never heal. It’s over. We can’t go back after pissing on the doormat on the way out. It’s sad but it’s the reality.

FOM and a single market on the other should be an imperative.

Labour are all over the place. Useless!

MarqueeMark

Andy_JS said:

Has anyone placed a bet on Penny Mordaunt as next PM

Several, I think.

DougSeal

IanB2 said:

So Labour has decided that even joining the CU or SM needs another referendum - an entirely new position and one without much logic - and is then using that to try and persuade us that therefore they won’t bother.

They, the EU, won’t let us in either the SM or CU

TOPPING

Yes a bit bonkers about Lab. Why not just build in all Cons policies to their manifesto as it was what the electorate voted for at the last election.

rottenborough

Andy_JS said:

Has anyone placed a bet on Penny Mordaunt as next PM

Yes. At 18. Back in February.

I'm still a bit red on her though because of other bets for PM.

I do win a significant sum, by my standards, if she becomes leader though.

IanB2

Gardenwalker said:

Sir Keir is doing all the necessary barnacle scraping.

No to SNP
No to returning to the EU (or even the SM).

I think he’s pretty much sorted the trans issue too.

Rachael Reeves has even made noises about tax cuts.

Not sure there’s much left.

If they win it’s going to be like Blair’s first term all over again.

dixiedean

Andy_JS said:

India 1.37
England 4.2
Draw 48

https://www.betfair.com/exchange/plus/cricket/market/1.200563796

Walked past a Betfred and saw India 12/5 the night before it started. Considered lumping on, but my bus came.
Gutted. Were nonsense odds then.

carnforth

Germany has a trade deficit (one presumes temporarily) due to energy import costs and manufacturing weakness. Image from Holger Zschaepitz at Welt.de.

Andy_JS

Leon said:

Andy_JS said:

"Chinese AI ‘can check loyalty of party members’" (£)

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/chinese-ai-can-check-loyalty-of-party-members-92d97hgwv

The only reason the internet isn’t flooded with deepfake celebrity porn or photos of Trump tupping a tapir are thanks to quite responsible western tech giants putting inbuilt restraints in their neural networks, like DALL-E 2

The Chinese will have no such scruples. AI is about to be militarised on social media

I know it's not the same as AI, but it wasn't very reassuring that the British Army's twitter and youtube feeds were hacked into yesterday.

Nigel_Foremain

Gardenwalker said:

Sir Keir is doing all the necessary barnacle scraping.

No to SNP
No to returning to the EU (or even the SM).

I think he’s pretty much sorted the trans issue too.

Rachael Reeves has even made noises about tax cuts.

Not sure there’s much left.

I think this is pretty clever politics form Starmer. I suspect the hand of Mandelson in here. Neutralise the negatives and remove all ammo that the Tories have. Accept that first term will be largely not massively different for the Tories while allowing Tories to tear themselves apart. then second term becomes more radical.

Not what I want, but it is sensible politics. How long before a campaign to make his boring reputation a positive?

Leon

IanB2 said:

Gardenwalker said:

Sir Keir is doing all the necessary barnacle scraping.

No to SNP
No to returning to the EU (or even the SM).

I think he’s pretty much sorted the trans issue too.

Rachael Reeves has even made noises about tax cuts.

Not sure there’s much left.

If they win it’s going to be like Blair’s first term all over again.

I really really wish the UK in 2022 was in the same state as the UK in 1995, a growing economy, a shrinking deficit, no looming constitutional crises, no global plague, no European war, no impending recession, a planet largely at peace…

Sadly, whatever he does, Prime Minister Korma will not be able to repeat Blair 1997-2002

IanB2

NorthofStoke said:

Resurrecting the discussion about the voting on the two British Europe referenda. I was on the losing side in both (voting and campaigning). To understand the voting on the first referendum it is essential to remember that the left of the Labour party and Labour movement were against. That included the Bennites, Militant, Labour Party Young Socialists, Tribune Group etc. The EEC was seen as a "rich man's club" that would embed capitalism. The Yes vote was seen as centre right or perhaps social democrat/centre right. Of course, there was also nationalistic opposition but I'd be confident that the large youth vote against was motivated by a misplaced socialist outlook.

I’ve still got the leaflets from that campaign somewhere in a box. The surprise is how pro-European the Conservatives were back then.

Gardenwalker

IanB2 said:

Gardenwalker said:

Sir Keir is doing all the necessary barnacle scraping.

No to SNP
No to returning to the EU (or even the SM).

I think he’s pretty much sorted the trans issue too.

Rachael Reeves has even made noises about tax cuts.

Not sure there’s much left.

If they win it’s going to be like Blair’s first term all over again.

Just without the overweening majority.

JosiasJessop

TOPPING said:

Yes a bit bonkers about Lab. Why not just build in all Cons policies to their manifesto as it was what the electorate voted for at the last election.

There's a real opportunity for a pro-EU party. Perhaps not a we'll-rejoin-immediately-and-bare-our-bottoms-for-Brussels-to-spank-us sort of pro-EU party, but a let's-rebuild-trust-and-see-how-we-can-move-closer-together party.

I'm slightly surprised Starmer isn't trying the latter approach. I fear the Lib Dems are already loosening their belts ready for the spanking.

Starmer's probably thinking that there will be enough to differentiate between Lab and Con at the next GE, and a more pro-EU stance isn't worth the price.

dixiedean

IanB2 said:

NorthofStoke said:

Resurrecting the discussion about the voting on the two British Europe referenda. I was on the losing side in both (voting and campaigning). To understand the voting on the first referendum it is essential to remember that the left of the Labour party and Labour movement were against. That included the Bennites, Militant, Labour Party Young Socialists, Tribune Group etc. The EEC was seen as a "rich man's club" that would embed capitalism. The Yes vote was seen as centre right or perhaps social democrat/centre right. Of course, there was also nationalistic opposition but I'd be confident that the large youth vote against was motivated by a misplaced socialist outlook.

I’ve still got the leaflets from that campaign somewhere in a box. The surprise is how pro-European the Conservatives were back then.

Very PB.

Andy_JS

I was lucky enough to be in the crowd when England easily got 299 at Trent Bridge. 390 against the Indians will be difficult though. It'll be fun to watch them go for it, assuming they can get these last two wickets fairly soon.

IanB2

JosiasJessop said:

The biggest threat from AI comes not from AI, but from gullible people who believe AI has more power and ability than it really has.

"Computer says no, and it's an AI!"

We will know when the AI has reached human equivalent levels of intelligence, when the AI computers start fighting amongst themselves.

Scott_xP

In just 72 hours, Downing Street has gone from insisting that Boris Johnson was unaware of ‘any allegation’, to saying he was unaware of any ‘specific allegation’, to saying he was unaware of any ‘serious specific allegation’, to admitting that he ‘was aware of some allegations.’ https://twitter.com/NicholasPegg/status/1543931448838733825/photo/1

need to repost this...

TheScreamingEagles

England are shit at reviews and Boris Johnson is a liar, somethings never change.

Andy_JS

Kyrgios due on centre court shortly.

Nigel_Foremain

IanB2 said:

NorthofStoke said:

Resurrecting the discussion about the voting on the two British Europe referenda. I was on the losing side in both (voting and campaigning). To understand the voting on the first referendum it is essential to remember that the left of the Labour party and Labour movement were against. That included the Bennites, Militant, Labour Party Young Socialists, Tribune Group etc. The EEC was seen as a "rich man's club" that would embed capitalism. The Yes vote was seen as centre right or perhaps social democrat/centre right. Of course, there was also nationalistic opposition but I'd be confident that the large youth vote against was motivated by a misplaced socialist outlook.

I’ve still got the leaflets from that campaign somewhere in a box. The surprise is how pro-European the Conservatives were back then.

That was back when they were still Conservatives and had not been infiltrated by a bunch of right wing populist nutjobs.

eek

Gardenwalker said:

IanB2 said:

Gardenwalker said:

Sir Keir is doing all the necessary barnacle scraping.

No to SNP
No to returning to the EU (or even the SM).

I think he’s pretty much sorted the trans issue too.

Rachael Reeves has even made noises about tax cuts.

Not sure there’s much left.

If they win it’s going to be like Blair’s first term all over again.

Just without the overweening majority.

The battle Labour has is getting a majority at all.

The worst result for Labour would be needing the SNP to do things - although the SNP's attempt to make the next general election a referendum would work to Labour's advantage if the SNP / Greens fell well short of 50% of the votes.

Nigel_Foremain

IanB2 said:

JosiasJessop said:

The biggest threat from AI comes not from AI, but from gullible people who believe AI has more power and ability than it really has.

"Computer says no, and it's an AI!"

We will know when the AI has reached human equivalent levels of intelligence, when the AI computers start fighting amongst themselves.

Or when one of them becomes a regular poster on PB?

Malmesbury

Mexicanpete said:

DougSeal said:

Roger said:

Well lets hope Johnson stays on.

After Labour's capitulation on Brexit NOT having Boris Johnson is Labour's only remaining USP.

It’s not a capitulation, Roger, it’s reality. The EU are not letting us back. Labour can only repair relations. Johnson reinforced the pre-existing Anglophobia in the EU and turned it into a loathing that can never heal. It’s over. We can’t go back after pissing on the doormat on the way out. It’s sad but it’s the reality.

FOM and a single market on the other should be an imperative.

Labour are all over the place. Useless!

FOM would be a hostage to fortune - the squeeze on low end employee availability will eventually ease, as business adapt. If that coincides with an FOM deal, then the two will be linked inextricably.

dixiedean

Andy_JS said:

I was lucky enough to be in the crowd when England easily got 299 at Trent Bridge. 390 against the Indians will be difficult though. It'll be fun to watch them go for it, assuming they can get these last two wickets fairly soon.

Just not reviewed an lbw which was out.
That hasn't helped.

IshmaelZ

Scott_xP said:

In just 72 hours, Downing Street has gone from insisting that Boris Johnson was unaware of ‘any allegation’, to saying he was unaware of any ‘specific allegation’, to saying he was unaware of any ‘serious specific allegation’, to admitting that he ‘was aware of some allegations.’ https://twitter.com/NicholasPegg/status/1543931448838733825/photo/1

need to repost this...

Source, date, context would be incredibly helpful

logical_song

Gardenwalker said:

Sir Keir is doing all the necessary barnacle scraping.

No to SNP
No to returning to the EU (or even the SM).

I think he’s pretty much sorted the trans issue too.

Rachael Reeves has even made noises about tax cuts.

Not sure there’s much left.

Proportional Representation.

IanB2

rottenborough said:

Andy_JS said:

Has anyone placed a bet on Penny Mordaunt as next PM

Yes. At 18. Back in February.

I'm still a bit red on her though because of other bets for PM.

I do win a significant sum, by my standards, if she becomes leader though.

I’m quite green on her, but saw it as a trading position since I think she’s quite flaky underneath - she’s moving up the field without saying or doing anything, and am not convinced she would stand up to scrutiny.

IanB2

logical_song said:

Gardenwalker said:

Sir Keir is doing all the necessary barnacle scraping.

No to SNP
No to returning to the EU (or even the SM).

I think he’s pretty much sorted the trans issue too.

Rachael Reeves has even made noises about tax cuts.

Not sure there’s much left.

Proportional Representation.

Adopting the radical Burnham position on political reform is just about the only thing they could do now to salvage the diminishing prospect of my voting tactically.

eek

logical_song said:

Gardenwalker said:

Sir Keir is doing all the necessary barnacle scraping.

No to SNP
No to returning to the EU (or even the SM).

I think he’s pretty much sorted the trans issue too.

Rachael Reeves has even made noises about tax cuts.

Not sure there’s much left.

Proportional Representation.

That will be the Lib Dem requirement for joining a minority Labour Government and a requirement that Labour will accept because they should have done that back in 97.

Scott_xP

To sum up: Number 10 admits PM knew of reports around the predatory behaviour of a Tory MP - but he promoted him to the role of deputy chief whip anyway, a key pastoral role https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-07-04/johnson-knew-of-pincher-reports-but-promoted-tory-mp-to-key-role

IanB2

Scott_xP said:

In just 72 hours, Downing Street has gone from insisting that Boris Johnson was unaware of ‘any allegation’, to saying he was unaware of any ‘specific allegation’, to saying he was unaware of any ‘serious specific allegation’, to admitting that he ‘was aware of some allegations.’ https://twitter.com/NicholasPegg/status/1543931448838733825/photo/1

need to repost this...

‘Clown’ is way too small in that pictogram. Perhaps because people no longer find him funny?

I remember when calling him that in the thread discussions got regular criticism. Now he’s promoted to being the ‘liar king’ in the actual lead….

148grss

IanB2 said:

logical_song said:

Gardenwalker said:

Sir Keir is doing all the necessary barnacle scraping.

No to SNP
No to returning to the EU (or even the SM).

I think he’s pretty much sorted the trans issue too.

Rachael Reeves has even made noises about tax cuts.

Not sure there’s much left.

Proportional Representation.

Adopting the radical Burnham position on political reform is just about the only thing they could do now to salvage the diminishing prospect of my voting tactically.

I think expecting anything radical out of Starmer is unlikely, even proportional representation.

IanB2

Nigel_Foremain said:

IanB2 said:

JosiasJessop said:

The biggest threat from AI comes not from AI, but from gullible people who believe AI has more power and ability than it really has.

"Computer says no, and it's an AI!"

We will know when the AI has reached human equivalent levels of intelligence, when the AI computers start fighting amongst themselves.

Or when one of them becomes a regular poster on PB?

Leon’s account is the lowest bar - perhaps we should give them that one first?

Mexicanpete

Malmesbury said:

Mexicanpete said:

DougSeal said:

Roger said:

Well lets hope Johnson stays on.

After Labour's capitulation on Brexit NOT having Boris Johnson is Labour's only remaining USP.

It’s not a capitulation, Roger, it’s reality. The EU are not letting us back. Labour can only repair relations. Johnson reinforced the pre-existing Anglophobia in the EU and turned it into a loathing that can never heal. It’s over. We can’t go back after pissing on the doormat on the way out. It’s sad but it’s the reality.

FOM and a single market on the other should be an imperative.

Labour are all over the place. Useless!

FOM would be a hostage to fortune - the squeeze on low end employee availability will eventually ease, as business adapt. If that coincides with an FOM deal, then the two will be linked inextricably.

The removal of FOM is why we have no HGV drivers, not enough educated blue collar workers, and shortages in care and health services, let alone the fact that we can't up-sticks and live unfettered in Spain or the South of France like we could before we lost that right.

I am not demanding re-join, but this policy is absurd. It is pandering to the terminally stupid.

TOPPING

JosiasJessop said:

TOPPING said:

Yes a bit bonkers about Lab. Why not just build in all Cons policies to their manifesto as it was what the electorate voted for at the last election.

There's a real opportunity for a pro-EU party. Perhaps not a we'll-rejoin-immediately-and-bare-our-bottoms-for-Brussels-to-spank-us sort of pro-EU party, but a let's-rebuild-trust-and-see-how-we-can-move-closer-together party.

I'm slightly surprised Starmer isn't trying the latter approach. I fear the Lib Dems are already loosening their belts ready for the spanking.

Starmer's probably thinking that there will be enough to differentiate between Lab and Con at the next GE, and a more pro-EU stance isn't worth the price.

I suppose the voters will make their preferences known. But, cf Farage, any rejoining will need dedication and perseverance. Not sure if there is such a party as that to be able to build up a large enough following that whatever major party is in power can no longer afford to ignore them.

MarqueeMark

IanB2 said:

Gardenwalker said:

Sir Keir is doing all the necessary barnacle scraping.

No to SNP
No to returning to the EU (or even the SM).

I think he’s pretty much sorted the trans issue too.

Rachael Reeves has even made noises about tax cuts.

Not sure there’s much left.

If they win it’s going to be like Blair’s first term all over again.

What, Labour getting a million from Bernie "I'd take a bullet for Putin" Ecclestone?

Carnyx

Nigel_Foremain said:

IanB2 said:

JosiasJessop said:

The biggest threat from AI comes not from AI, but from gullible people who believe AI has more power and ability than it really has.

"Computer says no, and it's an AI!"

We will know when the AI has reached human equivalent levels of intelligence, when the AI computers start fighting amongst themselves.

Or when one of them becomes a regular poster on PB?

How do we know there aren't two or three already?

DougSeal

Mexicanpete said:

Malmesbury said:

Mexicanpete said:

DougSeal said:

Roger said:

Well lets hope Johnson stays on.

After Labour's capitulation on Brexit NOT having Boris Johnson is Labour's only remaining USP.

It’s not a capitulation, Roger, it’s reality. The EU are not letting us back. Labour can only repair relations. Johnson reinforced the pre-existing Anglophobia in the EU and turned it into a loathing that can never heal. It’s over. We can’t go back after pissing on the doormat on the way out. It’s sad but it’s the reality.

FOM and a single market on the other should be an imperative.

Labour are all over the place. Useless!

FOM would be a hostage to fortune - the squeeze on low end employee availability will eventually ease, as business adapt. If that coincides with an FOM deal, then the two will be linked inextricably.

The removal of FOM is why we have no HGV drivers, not enough educated blue collar workers, and shortages in care and health services, let alone the fact that we can't up-sticks and live unfettered in Spain or the South of France like we could before we lost that right.


I am not demanding re-join, but this policy is absurd. It is pandering to the terminally stupid.

It takes two to tango. Why do you think an SM option is open to us? We are not rejoining the SM - we can’t. We are too hated, too despised elsewhere in Europe. We are not trusted is an understatement. It’s over. I’m sad about it but we’re not going to be allowed back.

LostPassword

Pulpstar said:

Andy_JS said:

India 1.37
England 4.2
Draw 48

https://www.betfair.com/exchange/plus/cricket/market/1.200563796

Implied correct prices from winviz are

India 1.3
Draw 25
England 5.6

Winviz were overdoing the draw during the NZ series. Test cricket has sped up, but their model is built from historical data, so they will give too much probability to the draw until the model adjusts.

IanB2

Carnyx said:

Nigel_Foremain said:

IanB2 said:

JosiasJessop said:

The biggest threat from AI comes not from AI, but from gullible people who believe AI has more power and ability than it really has.

"Computer says no, and it's an AI!"

We will know when the AI has reached human equivalent levels of intelligence, when the AI computers start fighting amongst themselves.

Or when one of them becomes a regular poster on PB?

How do we know there aren't two or three already?

We’d know if AI took over HY’s account from the sudden breakthrough into logical argumentation.

148grss

eek said:

Gardenwalker said:

IanB2 said:

Gardenwalker said:

Sir Keir is doing all the necessary barnacle scraping.

No to SNP
No to returning to the EU (or even the SM).

I think he’s pretty much sorted the trans issue too.

Rachael Reeves has even made noises about tax cuts.

Not sure there’s much left.

If they win it’s going to be like Blair’s first term all over again.

Just without the overweening majority.

The battle Labour has is getting a majority at all.

The worst result for Labour would be needing the SNP to do things - although the SNP's attempt to make the next general election a referendum would work to Labour's advantage if the SNP / Greens fell well short of 50% of the votes.

Yeah, I do not see a pathway for Labour to a majority.

They have a few options:

1) if the numbers work a full coalition with the LDs. This would probably be the most "stable" government and allow minor reform away from austerity and culture wars of a decade of Tory rule.

2) if numbers don't work a minority Lab gov that relies on votes of everyone but the Nats. This probably relies on Labour thinking the threat of a Tory government / continuous GEs will whip Greens / LDs/ Independents etc. into just voting for government policy to keep the Tories out.

3) Labour needs the Nats to vote as a block - no other party provide enough stability. That either means going back on his recent pledge, or just knocking the issue back to Holyrood (which is what I think he should do anyway).

4) Grand coalition. This is currently unthinkable, and would likely destroy both the Labour party and the Conservative party, but if we're in a situation where Labour can't form a majority government at the same time the likes of Johnson and Raab actively lose their seats, Labour could expel their Corbynites to appease the Cameroons, and the Tories could expel their Nadine Dorries' of the party and just hope neither can coalesce into actual parties. I think this is highly unlikely, but the Tories like being in government, and this looks like their only chance to be in government after the next GE, plus Starmer is showing himself to be open to working with "moderate" Conservatives who may want to cross the floor.

Andy_JS

England 378 to win.

OnlyLivingBoy

DougSeal said:

Mexicanpete said:

Malmesbury said:

Mexicanpete said:

DougSeal said:

Roger said:

Well lets hope Johnson stays on.

After Labour's capitulation on Brexit NOT having Boris Johnson is Labour's only remaining USP.

It’s not a capitulation, Roger, it’s reality. The EU are not letting us back. Labour can only repair relations. Johnson reinforced the pre-existing Anglophobia in the EU and turned it into a loathing that can never heal. It’s over. We can’t go back after pissing on the doormat on the way out. It’s sad but it’s the reality.

FOM and a single market on the other should be an imperative.

Labour are all over the place. Useless!

FOM would be a hostage to fortune - the squeeze on low end employee availability will eventually ease, as business adapt. If that coincides with an FOM deal, then the two will be linked inextricably.

The removal of FOM is why we have no HGV drivers, not enough educated blue collar workers, and shortages in care and health services, let alone the fact that we can't up-sticks and live unfettered in Spain or the South of France like we could before we lost that right.


I am not demanding re-join, but this policy is absurd. It is pandering to the terminally stupid.

It takes two to tango. Why do you think an SM option is open to us? We are not rejoining the SM - we can’t. We are too hated, too despised elsewhere in Europe. We are not trusted is an understatement. It’s over. I’m sad about it but we’re not going to be allowed back.

The EU don't trust Johnson, with good reason, but I think would be much more open to negotiating a closer relationship with a different PM who approached the negotiations in a cooperative and honest spirit.
I think they would be overjoyed if we rejoined, what better way to demonstrate the attractiveness of EU membership than to welcome us back into the fold, but they would want to see a stable pro-EU majority in place first as there is no appetite to go through this time-wasting shitshow again.

Scott_xP

‘As one senior minister puts it, the Johnson team is acting increasingly like a mafia family that has gone to the mattresses.

“They treat Pincher like one of their own, like a ‘made guy’ out of Goodfellas. The line is: fuck you, he’s an untouchable.”’

✍️ @MatthewdAncona
https://twitter.com/tortoise/status/1543938886317006848

Carnyx

IanB2 said:

Scott_xP said:

In just 72 hours, Downing Street has gone from insisting that Boris Johnson was unaware of ‘any allegation’, to saying he was unaware of any ‘specific allegation’, to saying he was unaware of any ‘serious specific allegation’, to admitting that he ‘was aware of some allegations.’ https://twitter.com/NicholasPegg/status/1543931448838733825/photo/1

need to repost this...

‘Clown’ is way too small in that pictogram. Perhaps because people no longer find him funny?

I remember when calling him that in the thread discussions got regular criticism. Now he’s promoted to being the ‘liar king’ in the actual lead….

'Buffoon' is, however, sort of second grade term for Mr J. Not sure it is any better than clown. Though much less toxic than liar.

DougSeal

OnlyLivingBoy said:

DougSeal said:

Mexicanpete said:

Malmesbury said:

Mexicanpete said:

DougSeal said:

Roger said:

Well lets hope Johnson stays on.

After Labour's capitulation on Brexit NOT having Boris Johnson is Labour's only remaining USP.

It’s not a capitulation, Roger, it’s reality. The EU are not letting us back. Labour can only repair relations. Johnson reinforced the pre-existing Anglophobia in the EU and turned it into a loathing that can never heal. It’s over. We can’t go back after pissing on the doormat on the way out. It’s sad but it’s the reality.

FOM and a single market on the other should be an imperative.

Labour are all over the place. Useless!

FOM would be a hostage to fortune - the squeeze on low end employee availability will eventually ease, as business adapt. If that coincides with an FOM deal, then the two will be linked inextricably.

The removal of FOM is why we have no HGV drivers, not enough educated blue collar workers, and shortages in care and health services, let alone the fact that we can't up-sticks and live unfettered in Spain or the South of France like we could before we lost that right.


I am not demanding re-join, but this policy is absurd. It is pandering to the terminally stupid.

It takes two to tango. Why do you think an SM option is open to us? We are not rejoining the SM - we can’t. We are too hated, too despised elsewhere in Europe. We are not trusted is an understatement. It’s over. I’m sad about it but we’re not going to be allowed back.

The EU don't trust Johnson, with good reason, but I think would be much more open to negotiating a closer relationship with a different PM who approached the negotiations in a cooperative and honest spirit.
I think they would be overjoyed if we rejoined
, what better way to demonstrate the attractiveness of EU membership than to welcome us back into the fold, but they would want to see a stable pro-EU majority in place first as there is no appetite to go through this time-wasting shitshow again.

He’s made it worse deeper than Johnson. It’s a dislike and distrust of the English nation. They hate us with a passion. That’s why they’re so keen on getting the Scots in. Always have to an extent but Johnson’s given them the opportunity to express it openly.

Carnyx

IanB2 said:

Carnyx said:

Nigel_Foremain said:

IanB2 said:

JosiasJessop said:

The biggest threat from AI comes not from AI, but from gullible people who believe AI has more power and ability than it really has.

"Computer says no, and it's an AI!"

We will know when the AI has reached human equivalent levels of intelligence, when the AI computers start fighting amongst themselves.

Or when one of them becomes a regular poster on PB?

How do we know there aren't two or three already?

We’d know if AI took over HY’s account from the sudden breakthrough into logical argumentation.

But then it would fail the Turing Test and not be an AI at all.

Mexicanpete

DougSeal said:

Mexicanpete said:

Malmesbury said:

Mexicanpete said:

DougSeal said:

Roger said:

Well lets hope Johnson stays on.

After Labour's capitulation on Brexit NOT having Boris Johnson is Labour's only remaining USP.

It’s not a capitulation, Roger, it’s reality. The EU are not letting us back. Labour can only repair relations. Johnson reinforced the pre-existing Anglophobia in the EU and turned it into a loathing that can never heal. It’s over. We can’t go back after pissing on the doormat on the way out. It’s sad but it’s the reality.

FOM and a single market on the other should be an imperative.

Labour are all over the place. Useless!

FOM would be a hostage to fortune - the squeeze on low end employee availability will eventually ease, as business adapt. If that coincides with an FOM deal, then the two will be linked inextricably.

The removal of FOM is why we have no HGV drivers, not enough educated blue collar workers, and shortages in care and health services, let alone the fact that we can't up-sticks and live unfettered in Spain or the South of France like we could before we lost that right.


I am not demanding re-join, but this policy is absurd. It is pandering to the terminally stupid.

It takes two to tango. Why do you think an SM option is open to us? We are not rejoining the SM - we can’t. We are too hated, too despised elsewhere in Europe. We are not trusted is an understatement. It’s over. I’m sad about it but we’re not going to be allowed back.

I agree we are never going back, but the EU would be insane if they didn't welcome us back into a friction free trading area that includes FOM. When the alternative is Johnsonian chaos, breaching international treaties and subduing our own and EU reciprocal trade I believe they would bite our hand off.

If this capitulation to RedWall morons is the best Labour can do we might as well continue voting Johnson just for the giggles.

DecrepiterJohnL

Andy_JS said:

Leon said:

Andy_JS said:

"Chinese AI ‘can check loyalty of party members’" (£)

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/chinese-ai-can-check-loyalty-of-party-members-92d97hgwv

The only reason the internet isn’t flooded with deepfake celebrity porn or photos of Trump tupping a tapir are thanks to quite responsible western tech giants putting inbuilt restraints in their neural networks, like DALL-E 2

The Chinese will have no such scruples. AI is about to be militarised on social media

I know it's not the same as AI, but it wasn't very reassuring that the British Army's twitter and youtube feeds were hacked into yesterday.

The hacked army social media news does make you wonder what is the point of our much-vaunted National Cyber Security Centre (NCSC) offshoot of GCHQ.

DougSeal

Mexicanpete said:

DougSeal said:

Mexicanpete said:

Malmesbury said:

Mexicanpete said:

DougSeal said:

Roger said:

Well lets hope Johnson stays on.

After Labour's capitulation on Brexit NOT having Boris Johnson is Labour's only remaining USP.

It’s not a capitulation, Roger, it’s reality. The EU are not letting us back. Labour can only repair relations. Johnson reinforced the pre-existing Anglophobia in the EU and turned it into a loathing that can never heal. It’s over. We can’t go back after pissing on the doormat on the way out. It’s sad but it’s the reality.

FOM and a single market on the other should be an imperative.

Labour are all over the place. Useless!

FOM would be a hostage to fortune - the squeeze on low end employee availability will eventually ease, as business adapt. If that coincides with an FOM deal, then the two will be linked inextricably.

The removal of FOM is why we have no HGV drivers, not enough educated blue collar workers, and shortages in care and health services, let alone the fact that we can't up-sticks and live unfettered in Spain or the South of France like we could before we lost that right.


I am not demanding re-join, but this policy is absurd. It is pandering to the terminally stupid.

It takes two to tango. Why do you think an SM option is open to us? We are not rejoining the SM - we can’t. We are too hated, too despised elsewhere in Europe. We are not trusted is an understatement. It’s over. I’m sad about it but we’re not going to be allowed back.

I agree we are never going back, but the EU would be insane if they didn't welcome us back into a friction free trading area that includes FOM. When the alternative is Johnsonian chaos, breaching international treaties and subduing our own and EU
reciprocal trade I believe they would bite our hand off.

If this capitulation to RedWall morons is the best Labour can do we might as well continue voting Johnson just for the giggles.

Why? Why would they want us in the SM? There’s no benefit in having England in it. Better to get the Scots in and the Welsh and choke England economically and strategically until it’s an unviable entity. No more England, no more English = no more Johnson’s. Everyone’s happy.

OnlyLivingBoy

DougSeal said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

DougSeal said:

Mexicanpete said:

Malmesbury said:

Mexicanpete said:

DougSeal said:

Roger said:

Well lets hope Johnson stays on.

After Labour's capitulation on Brexit NOT having Boris Johnson is Labour's only remaining USP.

It’s not a capitulation, Roger, it’s reality. The EU are not letting us back. Labour can only repair relations. Johnson reinforced the pre-existing Anglophobia in the EU and turned it into a loathing that can never heal. It’s over. We can’t go back after pissing on the doormat on the way out. It’s sad but it’s the reality.

FOM and a single market on the other should be an imperative.

Labour are all over the place. Useless!

FOM would be a hostage to fortune - the squeeze on low end employee availability will eventually ease, as business adapt. If that coincides with an FOM deal, then the two will be linked inextricably.

The removal of FOM is why we have no HGV drivers, not enough educated blue collar workers, and shortages in care and health services, let alone the fact that we can't up-sticks and live unfettered in Spain or the South of France like we could before we lost that right.


I am not demanding re-join, but this policy is absurd. It is pandering to the terminally stupid.

It takes two to tango. Why do you think an SM option is open to us? We are not rejoining the SM - we can’t. We are too hated, too despised elsewhere in Europe. We are not trusted is an understatement. It’s over. I’m sad about it but we’re not going to be allowed back.

The EU don't trust Johnson, with good reason, but I think would be much more open to negotiating a closer relationship with a different PM who approached the negotiations in a cooperative and honest spirit.
I think they would be overjoyed if we rejoined
, what better way to demonstrate the attractiveness of EU membership than to welcome us back into the fold, but they would want to see a stable pro-EU majority in place first as there is no appetite to go through this time-wasting shitshow again.

He’s made it worse deeper than Johnson. It’s a dislike and distrust of the English nation. They hate us with a passion. That’s why they’re so keen on getting the Scots in. Always have to an extent but Johnson’s given them the opportunity to express it openly.

What is your evidence for this assertion? I interact fairly regularly with current and former EU officials and most are Anglophiles, whose overwhelming emotional response to Brexit has been sadness, coupled with irritation that the UK government is trying to renegotiate its own deal and is once again using up bandwidth when there are more serious things to focus on. They do have a genuine loathing for Johnson for being so dishonest, but then that has also become the settled view on this side of the channel too.

Carnyx

Hmm, there was a rather obvious snag in SKS's speech:

Mr Blackford (quoted in Graun feed):

'The Labour Party are now indistinguishable from the Tories on Brexit. By running scared of the Tories and mutating into a pale imitation of Boris Johnson, Starmer is offering no real change at all.

With this hard Brexit U-turn Keir Starmer has perfectly encapsulated why Scotland needs to escape from Westminster control. Regaining Scotland’s place in Europe will be at the heart of the independence referendum.'

(and, of course, this recalls the broken promises of 2014, from *both* Unionist parties in chorus)

DougSeal

OnlyLivingBoy said:

DougSeal said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

DougSeal said:

Mexicanpete said:

Malmesbury said:

Mexicanpete said:

DougSeal said:

Roger said:

Well lets hope Johnson stays on.

After Labour's capitulation on Brexit NOT having Boris Johnson is Labour's only remaining USP.

It’s not a capitulation, Roger, it’s reality. The EU are not letting us back. Labour can only repair relations. Johnson reinforced the pre-existing Anglophobia in the EU and turned it into a loathing that can never heal. It’s over. We can’t go back after pissing on the doormat on the way out. It’s sad but it’s the reality.

FOM and a single market on the other should be an imperative.

Labour are all over the place. Useless!

FOM would be a hostage to fortune - the squeeze on low end employee availability will eventually ease, as business adapt. If that coincides with an FOM deal, then the two will be linked inextricably.

The removal of FOM is why we have no HGV drivers, not enough educated blue collar workers, and shortages in care and health services, let alone the fact that we can't up-sticks and live unfettered in Spain or the South of France like we could before we lost that right.


I am not demanding re-join, but this policy is absurd. It is pandering to the terminally stupid.

It takes two to tango. Why do you think an SM option is open to us? We are not rejoining the SM - we can’t. We are too hated, too despised elsewhere in Europe. We are not trusted is an understatement. It’s over. I’m sad about it but we’re not going to be allowed back.

The EU don't trust Johnson, with good reason, but I think would be much more open to negotiating a closer relationship with a different PM who approached the negotiations in a cooperative and honest spirit.
I think they would be overjoyed if we rejoined
, what better way to demonstrate the attractiveness of EU membership than to welcome us back into the fold, but they would want to see a stable pro-EU majority in place first as there is no appetite to go through this time-wasting shitshow again.

He’s made it worse deeper than Johnson. It’s a dislike and distrust of the English nation. They hate us with a passion. That’s why they’re so keen on getting the Scots in. Always have to an extent but Johnson’s given them the opportunity to express it openly.

What is your evidence for this assertion? I interact fairly regularly with current and former EU officials and most are Anglophiles,
whose overwhelming emotional response to Brexit has been sadness, coupled with irritation that the UK government is trying to renegotiate its own deal and is once again using up bandwidth when there are more serious things to focus on. They do have a genuine loathing for Johnson for being so dishonest, but then that has also become the settled view on this side of the channel too.

Interaction with current and former EU officials, current politicians and EU citizens. There is a visceral shiver when an English person enters the room. Largely due to Johnson bringing it to the fore

DecrepiterJohnL

OT more puzzling judge news.

Kelloggs has lost its court case over banned sugary cereal offers in supermarkets. Its defence was that if you took milk into account, there was less sugar per rod, pole or perch. Kelloggs lost because:-

Judge Mr Justice Linden said Kellogg's cereals "do not come with instructions for preparation which say that they should be consumed with milk".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-62034220

148grss

OnlyLivingBoy said:

DougSeal said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

DougSeal said:

Mexicanpete said:

Malmesbury said:

Mexicanpete said:

DougSeal said:

Roger said:

Well lets hope Johnson stays on.

After Labour's capitulation on Brexit NOT having Boris Johnson is Labour's only remaining USP.

It’s not a capitulation, Roger, it’s reality. The EU are not letting us back. Labour can only repair relations. Johnson reinforced the pre-existing Anglophobia in the EU and turned it into a loathing that can never heal. It’s over. We can’t go back after pissing on the doormat on the way out. It’s sad but it’s the reality.

FOM and a single market on the other should be an imperative.

Labour are all over the place. Useless!

FOM would be a hostage to fortune - the squeeze on low end employee availability will eventually ease, as business adapt. If that coincides with an FOM deal, then the two will be linked inextricably.

The removal of FOM is why we have no HGV drivers, not enough educated blue collar workers, and shortages in care and health services, let alone the fact that we can't up-sticks and live unfettered in Spain or the South of France like we could before we lost that right.


I am not demanding re-join, but this policy is absurd. It is pandering to the terminally stupid.

It takes two to tango. Why do you think an SM option is open to us? We are not rejoining the SM - we can’t. We are too hated, too despised elsewhere in Europe. We are not trusted is an understatement. It’s over. I’m sad about it but we’re not going to be allowed back.

The EU don't trust Johnson, with good reason, but I think would be much more open to negotiating a closer relationship with a different PM who approached the negotiations in a cooperative and honest spirit.
I think they would be overjoyed if we rejoined
, what better way to demonstrate the attractiveness of EU membership than to welcome us back into the fold, but they would want to see a stable pro-EU majority in place first as there is no appetite to go through this time-wasting shitshow again.

He’s made it worse deeper than Johnson. It’s a dislike and distrust of the English nation. They hate us with a passion. That’s why they’re so keen on getting the Scots in. Always have to an extent but Johnson’s given them the opportunity to express it openly.

What is your evidence for this assertion? I interact fairly regularly with current and former EU officials and most are Anglophiles, whose overwhelming emotional response to Brexit has been sadness, coupled with irritation that the UK government is trying to renegotiate its own deal and is once again using up bandwidth when there are more serious things to focus on. They do have a genuine loathing for Johnson for being so dishonest, but then that has also become the settled view on this side of the channel too.

I think there is a big difference between their view of the English and the government of the UK. Perfidious Albion is back in the historical mind because successive governments have been shown to refuse to negotiate in good faith and keep their word on agreements made. I'm certain they have no issue with the people or, more importantly, the businesses based in the UK. It is the inability to trust the government: partly because of this Conservative party, but also partly because the constitutional demand our parliament has to rip up any agreement it makes at any time it wants without recourse.

RochdalePioneers

IanB2 said:

Scott_xP said:

In just 72 hours, Downing Street has gone from insisting that Boris Johnson was unaware of ‘any allegation’, to saying he was unaware of any ‘specific allegation’, to saying he was unaware of any ‘serious specific allegation’, to admitting that he ‘was aware of some allegations.’ https://twitter.com/NicholasPegg/status/1543931448838733825/photo/1

need to repost this...

‘Clown’ is way too small in that pictogram. Perhaps because people no longer find him funny?

I remember when calling him that in the thread discussions got regular criticism. Now he’s promoted to being the ‘liar king’ in the actual lead….

There used to be debate on the subject. Those posters like myself who used derogatory names against the lying crook were told we were "biased" against him.

In reality BloJo is biased against himself. These are not partisan attacks from people trying to make an FPN out of nothing. These are unfuckingbelieveably stupid errors from the PM himself.

OnlyLivingBoy

DougSeal said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

DougSeal said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

DougSeal said:

Mexicanpete said:

Malmesbury said:

Mexicanpete said:

DougSeal said:

Roger said:

Well lets hope Johnson stays on.

After Labour's capitulation on Brexit NOT having Boris Johnson is Labour's only remaining USP.

It’s not a capitulation, Roger, it’s reality. The EU are not letting us back. Labour can only repair relations. Johnson reinforced the pre-existing Anglophobia in the EU and turned it into a loathing that can never heal. It’s over. We can’t go back after pissing on the doormat on the way out. It’s sad but it’s the reality.

FOM and a single market on the other should be an imperative.

Labour are all over the place. Useless!

FOM would be a hostage to fortune - the squeeze on low end employee availability will eventually ease, as business adapt. If that coincides with an FOM deal, then the two will be linked inextricably.

The removal of FOM is why we have no HGV drivers, not enough educated blue collar workers, and shortages in care and health services, let alone the fact that we can't up-sticks and live unfettered in Spain or the South of France like we could before we lost that right.


I am not demanding re-join, but this policy is absurd. It is pandering to the terminally stupid.

It takes two to tango. Why do you think an SM option is open to us? We are not rejoining the SM - we can’t. We are too hated, too despised elsewhere in Europe. We are not trusted is an understatement. It’s over. I’m sad about it but we’re not going to be allowed back.

The EU don't trust Johnson, with good reason, but I think would be much more open to negotiating a closer relationship with a different PM who approached the negotiations in a cooperative and honest spirit.
I think they would be overjoyed if we rejoined
, what better way to demonstrate the attractiveness of EU membership than to welcome us back into the fold, but they would want to see a stable pro-EU majority in place first as there is no appetite to go through this time-wasting shitshow again.

He’s made it worse deeper than Johnson. It’s a dislike and distrust of the English nation. They hate us with a passion. That’s why they’re so keen on getting the Scots in. Always have to an extent but Johnson’s given them the opportunity to express it openly.

What is your evidence for this assertion? I interact fairly regularly with current and former EU officials and most are Anglophiles,
whose overwhelming emotional response to Brexit has been sadness, coupled with irritation that the UK government is trying to renegotiate its own deal and is once again using up bandwidth when there are more serious things to focus on. They do have a genuine loathing for Johnson for being so dishonest, but then that has also become the settled view on this side of the channel too.

Interaction with current and former EU officials, current politicians and EU citizens. There is a visceral shiver when an English person enters the room. Largely due to Johnson bringing it to the fore

Is there anyone in your view who doesn't harbour a visceral hatred of the English? Or have you become the Millwall of Europe?

DougSeal

Carnyx said:

Hmm, there was a rather obvious snag in SKS's speech:

Mr Blackford (quoted in Graun feed):

'The Labour Party are now indistinguishable from the Tories on Brexit. By running scared of the Tories and mutating into a pale imitation of Boris Johnson, Starmer is offering no real change at all.

With this hard Brexit U-turn Keir Starmer has perfectly encapsulated why Scotland needs to escape from Westminster control. Regaining Scotland’s place in Europe will be at the heart of the independence referendum.'

(and, of course, this recalls the broken promises of 2014, from *both* Unionist parties in chorus)

This is why Scotland would oppose England rejoining the EU. There would be an element of English control with MEPs and Commissioners - and English voters - having an (albeit diluted) say in Scots affairs. The Scots don’t want to leave one Union with England to join another. Then there would be the inability to stop the English flooding Scotland. That’s why there would be a veto. You can’t divorce the English and then move into a shared house with them. Blackford has said, basically, an Indie Scotland is would veto the application of the rUK.

DougSeal

OnlyLivingBoy said:

DougSeal said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

DougSeal said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

DougSeal said:

Mexicanpete said:

Malmesbury said:

Mexicanpete said:

DougSeal said:

Roger said:

Well lets hope Johnson stays on.

After Labour's capitulation on Brexit NOT having Boris Johnson is Labour's only remaining USP.

It’s not a capitulation, Roger, it’s reality. The EU are not letting us back. Labour can only repair relations. Johnson reinforced the pre-existing Anglophobia in the EU and turned it into a loathing that can never heal. It’s over. We can’t go back after pissing on the doormat on the way out. It’s sad but it’s the reality.

FOM and a single market on the other should be an imperative.

Labour are all over the place. Useless!

FOM would be a hostage to fortune - the squeeze on low end employee availability will eventually ease, as business adapt. If that coincides with an FOM deal, then the two will be linked inextricably.

The removal of FOM is why we have no HGV drivers, not enough educated blue collar workers, and shortages in care and health services, let alone the fact that we can't up-sticks and live unfettered in Spain or the South of France like we could before we lost that right.


I am not demanding re-join, but this policy is absurd. It is pandering to the terminally stupid.

It takes two to tango. Why do you think an SM option is open to us? We are not rejoining the SM - we can’t. We are too hated, too despised elsewhere in Europe. We are not trusted is an understatement. It’s over. I’m sad about it but we’re not going to be allowed back.

The EU don't trust Johnson, with good reason, but I think would be much more open to negotiating a closer relationship with a different PM who approached the negotiations in a cooperative and honest spirit.
I think they would be overjoyed if we rejoined
, what better way to demonstrate the attractiveness of EU membership than to welcome us back into the fold, but they would want to see a stable pro-EU majority in place first as there is no appetite to go through this time-wasting shitshow again.

He’s made it worse deeper than Johnson. It’s a dislike and distrust of the English nation. They hate us with a passion. That’s why they’re so keen on getting the Scots in. Always have to an extent but Johnson’s given them the opportunity to express it openly.

What is your evidence for this assertion? I interact fairly regularly with current and former EU officials and most are Anglophiles,
whose overwhelming emotional response to Brexit has been sadness, coupled with irritation that the UK government is trying to renegotiate its own deal and is once again using up bandwidth when there are more serious things to focus on. They do have a genuine loathing for Johnson for being so dishonest, but then that has also become the settled view on this side of the channel too.

Interaction with current and former EU officials, current politicians and EU citizens. There is a visceral shiver when an English person enters the room. Largely due to Johnson bringing it to the fore

Is there anyone in your view who doesn't harbour a visceral hatred of the English? Or have you become the Millwall of Europe?

Most countries hate us. Al Murray did a series on it.

IshmaelZ

DecrepiterJohnL said:

OT more puzzling judge news.

Kelloggs has lost its court case over banned sugary cereal offers in supermarkets. Its defence was that if you took milk into account, there was less sugar per rod, pole or perch. Kelloggs lost because:-

Judge Mr Justice Linden said Kellogg's cereals "do not come with instructions for preparation which say that they should be consumed with milk".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-62034220

Tea does not come with an instruction to infuse it in boiling water rather than eating it.

RochdalePioneers

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/jul/04/fuel-price-protests-uk-motorways-today-latest

FINALLY people start to protest. I assume things will rumble along through the summer until the days start drawing in and the weather gets cooler.

Then the riots start.