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Betting YES on a CON MP defecting to LAB might be value – politicalbetting.com

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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,609

    Alistair said:

    Be wary of the Seth Abramson feed. Whilst in this case it looks solid and factual recounting of the testimony he does have a habit of wild editorialising at time with massive speculative anti-Trump stuff.

    I haven't followed all of the testimony, but one thing that doesn't fit with the planned coup narrative is the number of people close to Trump who were obviously shocked and were warning him to tell people to go home. It suggests something more like a lone ego trip.
    Ah, if it was not well planned and some people were not on board with it when it got a bit out of hand, then it cannot have been a coup.

    Fine, let's stick with insurrection.
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    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,900

    Politico.com - Ghislaine Maxwell sentenced to 20 years in prison
    The sentence was the punctuation mark on a trial that explored the sordid rituals of a predator power couple who courted the rich and famous as they lured vulnerable girls and then exploited them.

    https://www.politico.com/news/2022/06/28/ghislaine-maxwell-prison-jeffrey-epstein-00042874

    Bloody annoying it happened today as it may bump the Trump coup news off some papers and cable news channels.
    Not in USA methinks. La Ghislaine is old news here.

    Fact that she got book thrown at her NOT a surprise; opposite would have been.
    Suicide watch for rest of her days?
    The security cameras are being switched to 'malfunction' aa we speak
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    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,477
    Cyclefree said:

    Meanwhile, Maxwell gets 20 years, which will be the tabloid news tonight.

    Will any of the abusers of those girls get dragged to court? Those in the US for instance?
    Depends on quality of evidence, esp. willingness of victims to come forward.

    Personally think the person in most legal jeopardy, as practical matter, is ALEXANDER ACOSTA, former federal prosecutor - and subsequent Trump cabinet secretary - who gave Epstein & Maxwell their original sweet-heart "get & stay out of jail" deal.

    As I recall, many of the members of the team that brought La Maxwell down, are attached to section of fed prosecutor's office in SDNY that focuses on cases of corruption and subversion of justice within law enforcement.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Acosta#:~:text=Rene Alexander Acosta (born January,Senate on April 27, 2017.

    "According to an internal review conducted by the Department of Justice's Office of Professional Responsibility, which was released in November 2020, Acosta showed "poor judgment" in granting Epstein a non-prosecution agreement and failing to notify Epstein's alleged victims about this agreement."

    Doubt that is the final word for DOJ. Am guardedly optimistic that Acosta may yet end up a guest at Club Fed.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,137

    Seems to me it is a race against time now to save the republic by blocking Trump from running.

    "A republic sits on a razor's edge!"
    Franklin: "You have a republic ma'am, if you can keep it"
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,422

    Leon said:

    Best summary from the hearing that I can find is here:

    https://twitter.com/SethAbramson/status/1541830738210967552

    Ming-boggling thread

    I can see one easy and desolating way this pans out. They try to arrest Trump so as to slam him in jail

    Armed strife follows

    Sometimes I think America WANTS this, They WANT the fight, it’s all going too far for talking
    Some of the testimony tonight is mind-blowing. America was a great place. Was. Past-tense.
    It's been a bad place lots of times in the past and has always recovered.
  • Options
    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    Alistair said:

    Be wary of the Seth Abramson feed. Whilst in this case it looks solid and factual recounting of the testimony he does have a habit of wild editorialising at time with massive speculative anti-Trump stuff.

    I haven't followed all of the testimony, but one thing that doesn't fit with the planned coup narrative is the number of people close to Trump who were obviously shocked and were warning him to tell people to go home. It suggests something more like a lone ego trip.
    The comittee covered some stuff in earlier sessions where security cam images were shown of coup leaders touring the capital building, taking lots of photos of doors and service stairways.

    Some of these people were invited in by GOP congressmen.
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    LeonLeon Posts: 46,684

    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Best summary from the hearing that I can find is here:

    https://twitter.com/SethAbramson/status/1541830738210967552

    Ming-boggling thread

    I can see one easy and desolating way this pans out. They try to arrest Trump so as to slam him in jail

    Armed strife follows

    Sometimes I think America WANTS this, They WANT the fight, it’s all going too far for talking
    The caps suggest that’s you, as much as America “wanting this”.

    They won’t slam him in jail; they will drag him through the courts for a long, long time first.
    Don’t be an arse. America is the last best guarantor of western freedom. It is bad enough it is in such perilous decline, I don’t want it convulsed in actual civil strife, turning away from its allies

    Imagine the Ukraine war without America firmly behind us, supporting Europe. Putin would be in Riga by Friday and Warsaw by the weekend

    I absolutely despise the American Left but right now, right this minute, the best thing that can happen and the first thing that must happen is this: the monstrous Trump should be dragged away and silenced, forever, but in a manner that somehow does not provoke his followers

    How?

    When you consider the bonkers nonsense that the American right have come up with and the fluency with which DJT lies, how is he brought down without his followers being provoked?

    And the good right, who have sat on their hands for the last six years or so... what do they do? "I wasn't shocked before but now I am" is going to have to work awfully hard to cut it.
    I’m TRYING to be optimistic
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,241
    Dame Deborah James has died.
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,303
    Seeing a retired 3-star general & former U.S. National Security Advisor take the 5th when asked about whether he supported the peaceful transfer of power must surely be the epitome of just how low the #Trump camp has fallen.

    Truly extraordinary.

    https://twitter.com/Charles_Lister/status/1541865672954757129
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    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,900

    Cyclefree said:

    Meanwhile, Maxwell gets 20 years, which will be the tabloid news tonight.

    Will any of the abusers of those girls get dragged to court? Those in the US for instance?
    Depends on quality of evidence, esp. willingness of victims to come forward.

    Personally think the person in most legal jeopardy, as practical matter, is ALEXANDER ACOSTA, former federal prosecutor - and subsequent Trump cabinet secretary - who gave Epstein & Maxwell their original sweet-heart "get & stay out of jail" deal.

    As I recall, many of the members of the team that brought La Maxwell down, are attached to section of fed prosecutor's office in SDNY that focuses on cases of corruption and subversion of justice within law enforcement.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Acosta#:~:text=Rene Alexander Acosta (born January,Senate on April 27, 2017.

    "According to an internal review conducted by the Department of Justice's Office of Professional Responsibility, which was released in November 2020, Acosta showed "poor judgment" in granting Epstein a non-prosecution agreement and failing to notify Epstein's alleged victims about this agreement."

    Doubt that is the final word for DOJ. Am guardedly optimistic that Acosta may yet end up a guest at Club Fed.
    Who cares sbout him? Lock up the ones who raped trafficked children.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,137
    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    Best summary from the hearing that I can find is here:

    https://twitter.com/SethAbramson/status/1541830738210967552

    Ming-boggling thread

    I can see one easy and desolating way this pans out. They try to arrest Trump so as to slam him in jail

    Armed strife follows

    Sometimes I think America WANTS this, They WANT the fight, it’s all going too far for talking
    Some of the testimony tonight is mind-blowing. America was a great place. Was. Past-tense.
    It's been a bad place lots of times in the past and has always recovered.
    This. Absolutely right and we have to hope that this current crisis is not the exception.

    If Trump is re-elected and he pushes it all as far as he can go towards Hungarian-style non-liberal democracy then we will see states like CA threatening to leave and then republic collapse.

    Will it all be peaceful, relatively? Or will the vast ocean of gun ownership tip things over the edge?

    Better to bar him from running imho.
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,095
    Just finished The Offer (about the making of The Godfather).

    Watch it. Everything about it is sublime.
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    LeonLeon Posts: 46,684
    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Best summary from the hearing that I can find is here:

    https://twitter.com/SethAbramson/status/1541830738210967552

    Ming-boggling thread

    I can see one easy and desolating way this pans out. They try to arrest Trump so as to slam him in jail

    Armed strife follows

    Sometimes I think America WANTS this, They WANT the fight, it’s all going too far for talking
    The caps suggest that’s you, as much as America “wanting this”.

    They won’t slam him in jail; they will drag him through the courts for a long, long time first.
    Don’t be an arse. America is the last best guarantor of western freedom. It is bad enough it is in such perilous decline, I don’t want it convulsed in actual civil strife, turning away from its allies

    Imagine the Ukraine war without America firmly behind us, supporting Europe. Putin would be in Riga by Friday and Warsaw by the weekend

    I absolutely despise the American Left but right now, right this minute, the best thing that can happen and the first thing that must happen is this: the monstrous Trump should be dragged away and silenced, forever, but in a manner that somehow does not provoke his followers

    If I’ve misinterpreted you, then I’m glad to be corrected.

    But I think you misunderstand how this is likely to play out. One thing the US system is still really good at is dragging out these processes in a way that allows tempers to cool.
    Expect this to lead to a load more confirmatory witnesses.

    By the end, Watergate bored the pants off half of America, but it did for Nixon.
    Unfortunately, I think the last 5-10 years have proved that this is not the case, not any more

    America is feverish and roiled, and angry, and so many social ills seem to be surging to a singularity. Both sides are spoiling for a fight, which was my earlier point. When both sides are convinced of their righteousness and have no intention of backing down, how do you defuse THAT?

    Watergate was utterly trivial compared to this
  • Options
    turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 15,102
    edited June 2022

    Dame Deborah James has died.

    Very sad. She so want to live. I hope her story has helped others. I’m not sure if I misconstrued this, but I recall her implying she ignored symptoms for quite a while at the start.
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,477

    Cyclefree said:

    Meanwhile, Maxwell gets 20 years, which will be the tabloid news tonight.

    Will any of the abusers of those girls get dragged to court? Those in the US for instance?
    Depends on quality of evidence, esp. willingness of victims to come forward.

    Personally think the person in most legal jeopardy, as practical matter, is ALEXANDER ACOSTA, former federal prosecutor - and subsequent Trump cabinet secretary - who gave Epstein & Maxwell their original sweet-heart "get & stay out of jail" deal.

    As I recall, many of the members of the team that brought La Maxwell down, are attached to section of fed prosecutor's office in SDNY that focuses on cases of corruption and subversion of justice within law enforcement.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Acosta#:~:text=Rene Alexander Acosta (born January,Senate on April 27, 2017.

    "According to an internal review conducted by the Department of Justice's Office of Professional Responsibility, which was released in November 2020, Acosta showed "poor judgment" in granting Epstein a non-prosecution agreement and failing to notify Epstein's alleged victims about this agreement."

    Doubt that is the final word for DOJ. Am guardedly optimistic that Acosta may yet end up a guest at Club Fed.
    Who cares sbout him? Lock up the ones who raped trafficked children.
    Consider possibility, one way to achieve that MIGHT be putting Acosta on the griddle & turning up the heat?
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    LeonLeon Posts: 46,684

    Nigelb said:

    Cheney's closing is stunning: they think they have evidence of witness tampering and obstruction of justice.
    There is an old maxim: it's never the crime, it's always the coverup.
    Things went very badly for the former President today. My guess is that it will get worse from here

    https://twitter.com/MickMulvaney/status/1541858206720434179

    Not some rando’s opinion - acting White House chief of staff 2019-2020.

    Clearly guilty but good luck getting a jury to convict......nothing has changed imo.
    Do you mean, a federal jury in Southern District of New York?
    BTW thankyou for letting me read the Njegos book - and for turning me on to it

    Great fun. I love the description of the Montenegrin capital in the early 19th century. One monastery and a few low huts. And the government was a warrior priest and some shepherds

    Meanwhile due to the lack of bells, the locals would announce a church service by firing their rifles
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,879
    Oryx now shows over 800 Russian tanks having been destroyed.

    https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/attack-on-europe-documenting-equipment.html
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,303
    Cheney ends today's hearing by saying that a number of witnesses have been contacted by people trying to influence their testimony and pressure them to protect the former Trump admin.
    https://twitter.com/KimZetter/status/1541858408772431872

    That witnesses are now sharing those messages shows the intimidation failed.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,303
    Alistair said:

    Me (an idiot) : he knowingly directed an armed mob to try and overthrow the elction.
    You (a genius) : That's not a coup.

    Stable genius ?
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,879

    Dame Deborah James has died.

    Very sad. She so want to live. I hope her story has helped others. I’m not sure if I misconstrued this, but I recall her implying she ignored symptoms for quite a while at the start.
    Utterly agree. RIP.

    Thankfully I've had only a little experience in my family of cancer. But it does seem as though some people outwardly look and act relatively fine towards the end, whilst others look like utter wrecks. Type of cancer, pure luck, fitness... it does seem somewhat of a lottery.
  • Options
    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,146

    Cyclefree said:

    Meanwhile, Maxwell gets 20 years, which will be the tabloid news tonight.

    Will any of the abusers of those girls get dragged to court? Those in the US for instance?
    Depends on quality of evidence, esp. willingness of victims to come forward.

    Personally think the person in most legal jeopardy, as practical matter, is ALEXANDER ACOSTA, former federal prosecutor - and subsequent Trump cabinet secretary - who gave Epstein & Maxwell their original sweet-heart "get & stay out of jail" deal.

    As I recall, many of the members of the team that brought La Maxwell down, are attached to section of fed prosecutor's office in SDNY that focuses on cases of corruption and subversion of justice within law enforcement.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Acosta#:~:text=Rene Alexander Acosta (born January,Senate on April 27, 2017.

    "According to an internal review conducted by the Department of Justice's Office of Professional Responsibility, which was released in November 2020, Acosta showed "poor judgment" in granting Epstein a non-prosecution agreement and failing to notify Epstein's alleged victims about this agreement."

    Doubt that is the final word for DOJ. Am guardedly optimistic that Acosta may yet end up a guest at Club Fed.
    Interesting, thanks.
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,241
    Alistair said:

    Me (an idiot) : he knowingly directed an armed mob to try and overthrow the elction.
    You (a genius) : That's not a coup.

    Biting.
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,900

    Cyclefree said:

    Meanwhile, Maxwell gets 20 years, which will be the tabloid news tonight.

    Will any of the abusers of those girls get dragged to court? Those in the US for instance?
    Depends on quality of evidence, esp. willingness of victims to come forward.

    Personally think the person in most legal jeopardy, as practical matter, is ALEXANDER ACOSTA, former federal prosecutor - and subsequent Trump cabinet secretary - who gave Epstein & Maxwell their original sweet-heart "get & stay out of jail" deal.

    As I recall, many of the members of the team that brought La Maxwell down, are attached to section of fed prosecutor's office in SDNY that focuses on cases of corruption and subversion of justice within law enforcement.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Acosta#:~:text=Rene Alexander Acosta (born January,Senate on April 27, 2017.

    "According to an internal review conducted by the Department of Justice's Office of Professional Responsibility, which was released in November 2020, Acosta showed "poor judgment" in granting Epstein a non-prosecution agreement and failing to notify Epstein's alleged victims about this agreement."

    Doubt that is the final word for DOJ. Am guardedly optimistic that Acosta may yet end up a guest at Club Fed.
    Who cares sbout him? Lock up the ones who raped trafficked children.
    Consider possibility, one way to achieve that MIGHT be putting Acosta on the griddle & turning up the heat?
    Or just release the details of Maxwells client list and set the DoJ and Feds loose.
  • Options
    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,079

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Best summary from the hearing that I can find is here:

    https://twitter.com/SethAbramson/status/1541830738210967552

    Ming-boggling thread

    I can see one easy and desolating way this pans out. They try to arrest Trump so as to slam him in jail

    Armed strife follows

    Sometimes I think America WANTS this, They WANT the fight, it’s all going too far for talking
    The caps suggest that’s you, as much as America “wanting this”.

    They won’t slam him in jail; they will drag him through the courts for a long, long time first.
    Don’t be an arse. America is the last best guarantor of western freedom. It is bad enough it is in such perilous decline, I don’t want it convulsed in actual civil strife, turning away from its allies

    Imagine the Ukraine war without America firmly behind us, supporting Europe. Putin would be in Riga by Friday and Warsaw by the weekend

    I absolutely despise the American Left but right now, right this minute, the best thing that can happen and the first thing that must happen is this: the monstrous Trump should be dragged away and silenced, forever, but in a manner that somehow does not provoke his followers
    They'll find a way. I don't know exactly who the 'they' are. Or exactly what the way is that they'll find. But they will find a way. Of that I am sure. Well almost.
    One of Trump's claims was that there was a shadowy Deep State in America secretly running things.

    Let's hope he was right and they are about to lock him up to save democracy.
    I more think of it as a Coalition of the Willing.
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,477

    Nigelb said:

    Cheney's closing is stunning: they think they have evidence of witness tampering and obstruction of justice.
    There is an old maxim: it's never the crime, it's always the coverup.
    Things went very badly for the former President today. My guess is that it will get worse from here

    https://twitter.com/MickMulvaney/status/1541858206720434179

    Not some rando’s opinion - acting White House chief of staff 2019-2020.

    Clearly guilty but good luck getting a jury to convict......nothing has changed imo.
    Do you mean, a federal jury in Southern District of New York?
    No idea where it would be tried, but wouldn't even questions like that be passed up to the supreme court? Both taking ages and favouring Trump. Also, if the Republicans take control of the House as expected, can they use a further inquiry to hold up any court actions?
    "but wouldn't even questions like that be passed up to the supreme court?"

    Possibly, but not necessarily.

    "if the Republicans take control of the House as expected, can they use a further inquiry to hold up any court actions?"

    Not sure how THAT would work, my guess is, no, as legal & congressional would be two separate tracks.

    My basic point is that you are making very general assumptions about matters where seemingly petty details - and pesky laws and regulations - may be HIGHLY significant.

    As well as the individual courage - and self respect - of people like Cassidy Hutchinson.
  • Options
    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Dame Deborah James has died.

    Very sad. She so want to live. I hope her story has helped others. I’m not sure if I misconstrued this, but I recall her implying she ignored symptoms for quite a while at the start.
    Utterly agree. RIP.

    Thankfully I've had only a little experience in my family of cancer. But it does seem as though some people outwardly look and act relatively fine towards the end, whilst others look like utter wrecks. Type of cancer, pure luck, fitness... it does seem somewhat of a lottery.
    Profound.
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,241

    Dame Deborah James has died.

    What an inspirational lady - may she rest in peace and sympathy to all her loved ones
  • Options
    TomsToms Posts: 2,478
    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Best summary from the hearing that I can find is here:

    https://twitter.com/SethAbramson/status/1541830738210967552

    Ming-boggling thread

    I can see one easy and desolating way this pans out. They try to arrest Trump so as to slam him in jail

    Armed strife follows

    Sometimes I think America WANTS this, They WANT the fight, it’s all going too far for talking
    The caps suggest that’s you, as much as America “wanting this”.

    They won’t slam him in jail; they will drag him through the courts for a long, long time first.
    Don’t be an arse. America is the last best guarantor of western freedom. It is bad enough it is in such perilous decline, I don’t want it convulsed in actual civil strife, turning away from its allies

    Imagine the Ukraine war without America firmly behind us, supporting Europe. Putin would be in Riga by Friday and Warsaw by the weekend

    I absolutely despise the American Left but right now, right this minute, the best thing that can happen and the first thing that must happen is this: the monstrous Trump should be dragged away and silenced, forever, but in a manner that somehow does not provoke his followers
    They'll find a way. I don't know exactly who the 'they' are. Or exactly what the way is that they'll find. But they will find a way. Of that I am sure. Well almost.
    Now why does Marlowe's Edward the second play spring to mind? Or Dante? Or the inquisition?

    I'm thinking that it is WE who should be known as "homo habilis" (inventive man) and Neanderthal man as "homo sapiens".
  • Options
    turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 15,102

    Dame Deborah James has died.

    Very sad. She so want to live. I hope her story has helped others. I’m not sure if I misconstrued this, but I recall her implying she ignored symptoms for quite a while at the start.
    Utterly agree. RIP.

    Thankfully I've had only a little experience in my family of cancer. But it does seem as though some people outwardly look and act relatively fine towards the end, whilst others look like utter wrecks. Type of cancer, pure luck, fitness... it does seem somewhat of a lottery.
    Having had a diagnosis of cancer (leukaemia) when 39, pretty fit, decent diet, non smoker you wonder “why me?”. But then despite what some try to tell you, most cancer is just bad luck. You can help yourself for sure by doing the right things, but ultimately a few chance mutations and bang. Then you need luck on your side. Is it detected early enough? What type is it? Is it treatable?
    Mine was very treatable, thankfully. But not everyone is so lucky.
    But still, the average 10 year survival is now around 50% of newly diagnosed cancer patients.
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,477
    edited June 2022

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    Best summary from the hearing that I can find is here:

    https://twitter.com/SethAbramson/status/1541830738210967552

    Ming-boggling thread

    I can see one easy and desolating way this pans out. They try to arrest Trump so as to slam him in jail

    Armed strife follows

    Sometimes I think America WANTS this, They WANT the fight, it’s all going too far for talking
    Some of the testimony tonight is mind-blowing. America was a great place. Was. Past-tense.
    It's been a bad place lots of times in the past and has always recovered.
    Not sure we have ever been in quite such a bad place as a US President endorsing and encouraging a coup against his successor. The testimony is genuinely staggering.
    And efforts at pooh-poohing standard PB-style are staggeringly pathetic.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,303
    Turkey’s price.

    https://twitter.com/ragipsoylu/status/1541853998138986497
    Here are the things Turkey got:
    • Sweden/Finland will lift its arms embargo
    • Both will support Turkey on PKK, stop support to YPG
    • They will amend their laws on terrorism
    • They will share Intel with each other
    • They will extradite terror suspects 1/
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,241
    edited June 2022
    I predict he'll end up on GB News.

    Former England captain Michael Vaughan has said he is stepping back from his work at the BBC.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/61975267



    https://twitter.com/MichaelVaughan/status/1541875228246155267
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    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,477
    NEW THREAD
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    turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 15,102

    I predict he'll end up on GB News.

    Former England captain Michael Vaughan has said he is stepping back from his work at the BBC.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/61975267

    I do love how people get found guilty by media. What’s his crime? To have had an allegation made against him by someone also known to use racist terms. Ridiculous.
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    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,002
    Alistair said:

    Me (an idiot) : he knowingly directed an armed mob to try and overthrow the elction.
    You (a genius) : That's not a coup.

    "Do we have any Italian Americans here tonight? I love my Italian Americans. You know what they call me? Il Duce! Now that guy could organise a coup. A lot of people are saying I could probably do even better. I don't know... I don't know..."
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,095
    Leon said:

    Still, another slow news week, huh

    I remember when PB was properly exciting. One day a council by election in Newent, three days later, ANOTHER council by election in Newent, one after the other. Then at the weekend we’d talk about rugby league

    Leon, you, I and @Mexicanpete are literally the only people on here* who ever talk about Newent.

    Given he and I both lived in or near it for decades, that's understandable.

    Your obsession with it because your grandmother spent her later years in Highfields is rather less so.

    Is it just because you know, in your heart of hearts, you made a bad bargain swapping the delights and beauties of Newent for London?

    *That may be an unnecessary qualification!
  • Options
    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,845
    edited June 2022
    There seems little point trying not to upset Trump supporters when their man is a fraudulent traitor.

    Try him - and his accomplices - for treason, and quickly; he needs taking out of circulation.

    I see Ginni Thompson is wrapped up in this somehow too. With some effort, there is probably some crime Clarence can be found guilty of too so he be removed from his duties, and a vacancy opened up on the Supreme Court.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,491
    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    Best summary from the hearing that I can find is here:

    https://twitter.com/SethAbramson/status/1541830738210967552

    Ming-boggling thread

    I can see one easy and desolating way this pans out. They try to arrest Trump so as to slam him in jail

    Armed strife follows

    Sometimes I think America WANTS this, They WANT the fight, it’s all going too far for talking
    Some of the testimony tonight is mind-blowing. America was a great place. Was. Past-tense.
    It's been a bad place lots of times in the past and has always recovered.
    Past performance is no guarantee of future performance.

    America is in a very bad place.
  • Options
    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,079
    edited June 2022

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    Best summary from the hearing that I can find is here:

    https://twitter.com/SethAbramson/status/1541830738210967552

    Ming-boggling thread

    I can see one easy and desolating way this pans out. They try to arrest Trump so as to slam him in jail

    Armed strife follows

    Sometimes I think America WANTS this, They WANT the fight, it’s all going too far for talking
    Some of the testimony tonight is mind-blowing. America was a great place. Was. Past-tense.
    It's been a bad place lots of times in the past and has always recovered.
    Not sure we have ever been in quite such a bad place as a US President endorsing and encouraging a coup against his successor. The testimony is genuinely staggering.
    Yep. There's an iron rule emerging, one you can live by. However bad you think Donald Trump is, you'll be short. And even as you ratchet it up in line with events you'll be short, you'll still be just that little bit off the pace, because there's stuff you won't find out until you find out. The only way to break out of this is to take a leap ahead of what's so far in the public domain. Get yourself in the correct place and then wait. Won't take long.
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    madmacsmadmacs Posts: 75
    Related to the story wonder if Dominic Raab is considering defecting to the Lib Dems?
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    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,079
    Toms said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Best summary from the hearing that I can find is here:

    https://twitter.com/SethAbramson/status/1541830738210967552

    Ming-boggling thread

    I can see one easy and desolating way this pans out. They try to arrest Trump so as to slam him in jail

    Armed strife follows

    Sometimes I think America WANTS this, They WANT the fight, it’s all going too far for talking
    The caps suggest that’s you, as much as America “wanting this”.

    They won’t slam him in jail; they will drag him through the courts for a long, long time first.
    Don’t be an arse. America is the last best guarantor of western freedom. It is bad enough it is in such perilous decline, I don’t want it convulsed in actual civil strife, turning away from its allies

    Imagine the Ukraine war without America firmly behind us, supporting Europe. Putin would be in Riga by Friday and Warsaw by the weekend

    I absolutely despise the American Left but right now, right this minute, the best thing that can happen and the first thing that must happen is this: the monstrous Trump should be dragged away and silenced, forever, but in a manner that somehow does not provoke his followers
    They'll find a way. I don't know exactly who the 'they' are. Or exactly what the way is that they'll find. But they will find a way. Of that I am sure. Well almost.
    Now why does Marlowe's Edward the second play spring to mind? Or Dante? Or the inquisition?

    I'm thinking that it is WE who should be known as "homo habilis" (inventive man) and Neanderthal man as "homo sapiens".
    Are you disagreeing with my superintuition on this one? 🙂
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    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,625

    Nigelb said:

    Cheney's closing is stunning: they think they have evidence of witness tampering and obstruction of justice.
    There is an old maxim: it's never the crime, it's always the coverup.
    Things went very badly for the former President today. My guess is that it will get worse from here

    https://twitter.com/MickMulvaney/status/1541858206720434179

    Not some rando’s opinion - acting White House chief of staff 2019-2020.

    Clearly guilty but good luck getting a jury to convict......nothing has changed imo.
    Do you mean, a federal jury in Southern District of New York?
    No idea where it would be tried, but wouldn't even questions like that be passed up to the supreme court? Both taking ages and favouring Trump. Also, if the Republicans take control of the House as expected, can they use a further inquiry to hold up any court actions?
    "but wouldn't even questions like that be passed up to the supreme court?"

    Possibly, but not necessarily.

    "if the Republicans take control of the House as expected, can they use a further inquiry to hold up any court actions?"

    Not sure how THAT would work, my guess is, no, as legal & congressional would be two separate tracks.

    My basic point is that you are making very general assumptions about matters where seemingly petty details - and pesky laws and regulations - may be HIGHLY significant.

    As well as the individual courage - and self respect - of people like Cassidy Hutchinson.
    Sure, I accept those posts are making sweeping and perhaps simplistic assumptions. I am still pretty confident that the path to a successful prosecution is too slow to get him barred for 2024 even if a conviction was ultimately possible. And politically it plays into the Republicans and Trump as victims of the evil liberals, which is ideal for Trump to exploit.

    I think Trump is most likely to win in 2024, with Biden second most likely.
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    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,879

    There seems little point trying not to upset Trump supporters when their man is a fraudulent traitor.

    Try him - and his accomplices - for treason, and quickly; he needs taking out of circulation.

    I see Ginni Thompson is wrapped up in this somehow too. With some effort, there is probably some crime Clarence can be found guilty of too so he be removed from his duties, and a vacancy opened up on the Supreme Court.

    Have any supreme court justices ever be found guilty of crimes whilst serving? Have any ever been removed?

    (I have zero idea about any of this, so the question may be ridiculous...)
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    Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 30,917

    I predict he'll end up on GB News.

    Former England captain Michael Vaughan has said he is stepping back from his work at the BBC.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/61975267

    I do love how people get found guilty by media. What’s his crime? To have had an allegation made against him by someone also known to use racist terms. Ridiculous.
    Agreed. This is a witch hunt and of course the BBC is the last place you want to be if you are hoping for any sort of balance or consideration in these circumstances.
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    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,625

    There seems little point trying not to upset Trump supporters when their man is a fraudulent traitor.

    Try him - and his accomplices - for treason, and quickly; he needs taking out of circulation.

    I see Ginni Thompson is wrapped up in this somehow too. With some effort, there is probably some crime Clarence can be found guilty of too so he be removed from his duties, and a vacancy opened up on the Supreme Court.

    Have any supreme court justices ever be found guilty of crimes whilst serving? Have any ever been removed?

    (I have zero idea about any of this, so the question may be ridiculous...)
    Abe Fortas resigned under threat of impeachment.

    https://www.history.com/news/has-a-u-s-supreme-court-justice-ever-been-impeached
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    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,845
    madmacs said:

    Related to the story wonder if Dominic Raab is considering defecting to the Lib Dems?

    Knowing him, he will shortly announce his defection to the “Literal Democrats”.
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    swing_voterswing_voter Posts: 1,435
    the 2019 intake of Tory MPs are in no position to bleat.... BJ had a clear platform of hostility to EU, vague words about levelling up and not much else - so they can hardly claim to be led off from the electoral ticket. I would have thought a longer-standing MP (from say Cameron years) would have grounds to jump ship to the LDs although the 2019 election was pretty ruthless to the last lot. (remember Independent Group for Change and its varoius spin offs) in sum I think there's little value in Labour poaching the MPs if they think the seat is winnable except for a bit of discomfort in the short term to NO.10
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