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Can Parish tough out watching porn in the Commons? – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 12,162
edited May 2022 in General
imageCan Parish tough out watching porn in the Commons? – politicalbetting.com

After all the speculation over the past few days we now know that the CON MP caught watching porn while in the Commons Chamber was Neil Parish – member for Tiverton and Honiton since GE2010.

Read the full story here

«134

Comments

  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,058
    First!
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,991
    edited April 2022
    With all this working from home, i bet there has been fair bit of tug tv watching during office hours going on. Not good for already poor productivity rates.
  • bigglesbiggles Posts: 6,051

    With all this working from home, i bet there has been fair bit of tug tv watching during office hours going on. Not good for already poor productivity rates.

    Depends which “productivity” you’re measuring…..
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,647
    The whole episode just sums up how most people feel about UK politics at the mo.

    Pathetic.
    Disgusting.
    Out of touch. Imagine repeatedly showing your colleagues at work, ffs. Bunch of dinosaurs.

    At least in Scotland we have proper scandals like ferries - "I signed the document cos the other guy was on holiday", or vicious Salmond v Sturgeon drama.
  • Eabhal said:

    The whole episode just sums up how most people feel about UK politics at the mo.

    Pathetic.
    Disgusting.
    Out of touch. Imagine repeatedly showing your colleagues at work, ffs. Bunch of dinosaurs.

    At least in Scotland we have proper scandals like ferries - "I signed the document cos the other guy was on holiday", or vicious Salmond v Sturgeon drama.

    Really? That’s like the big thing going on in Scotland right now? Plus post links. Yawn.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,647

    Eabhal said:

    The whole episode just sums up how most people feel about UK politics at the mo.

    Pathetic.
    Disgusting.
    Out of touch. Imagine repeatedly showing your colleagues at work, ffs. Bunch of dinosaurs.

    At least in Scotland we have proper scandals like ferries - "I signed the document cos the other guy was on holiday", or vicious Salmond v Sturgeon drama.

    Really? That’s like the big thing going on in Scotland right now? Plus post links. Yawn.
    It's not big, but it is gently entertaining. I'll leave you to Google away, if you can stay up any later.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,639
    Quincel said:

    Certainly a sticky situation for him, he's got quite a mess on his hands. In the event that the member triggered a by-election there could be a very stiff challenge coming right at him.

    Lets hope he pulls off a happy ending.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,553
    One of the most obscure MPs finds himself in the news over this.
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,559

    With all this working from home, i bet there has been fair bit of tug tv watching during office hours going on. Not good for already poor productivity rates.

    Also some tug zoom.
  • Eabhal said:

    Eabhal said:

    The whole episode just sums up how most people feel about UK politics at the mo.

    Pathetic.
    Disgusting.
    Out of touch. Imagine repeatedly showing your colleagues at work, ffs. Bunch of dinosaurs.

    At least in Scotland we have proper scandals like ferries - "I signed the document cos the other guy was on holiday", or vicious Salmond v Sturgeon drama.

    Really? That’s like the big thing going on in Scotland right now? Plus post links. Yawn.
    It's not big, but it is gently entertaining. I'll leave you to Google away, if you can stay up any later.
    So. Not big. I’ll probably pass then.
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,559
    Not sure IF this qualifies as a Great British Sex Scandal?

    But at least someone is trying. And just before (as noted by OGH) the Glorious 5th of May.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,298
    His wife’s comments that “it takes two to tango” are bizarre.

    What’s that got to do with him ogling on the job.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,991

    With all this working from home, i bet there has been fair bit of tug tv watching during office hours going on. Not good for already poor productivity rates.

    Also some tug zoom.
    Wasn't there a CNN presenter who did that during a meeting?
  • CorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorseBattery Posts: 21,436
    edited April 2022
    The Tories are desperate for the police to reopen an investigation despite there being no new evidence.

    Perhaps they should present some.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,921
    He can probably survive as an MP until the next general election, he did not commit a criminal offence nor necessarily something clearly in breach of the Parliamentary Standards rules.

    However his chances of being selected as Conservative Parliamentary candidate for Tiverton and Honiton again at that election are effectively zero
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,559

    His wife’s comments that “it takes two to tango” are bizarre.

    What’s that got to do with him ogling on the job.

    If I'm gonna give anyone a break here, it's gonna be her. Esp. as she (like he) is still in shock.

    He voted against same-sex marriage, so perhaps they are social conservatives? Which does NOT make someone immune to porno, but can make it harder to admit & deal with?
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,148
    What's the financial equation?

    I make it 2 months salary as winding up allowance plus 6 months salary for Loss of Office, which is about 60k if he stays until the next election in say May 2024 if it is then, which I think he does not get if he goes first.

    Plus however much salary it is (£168k if 2 years), plus an extra approx 2 years worth of pension rights.

    Will that weigh heavily in the equation?

  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,921

    With all this working from home, i bet there has been fair bit of tug tv watching during office hours going on. Not good for already poor productivity rates.

    As long as it is not on the work network which is monitored
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,275
    Parish MPs performance on the news was vomit inducing in its desperation to show some humility and contrition ! Both of which looked totally insincere.

    So apparently he was ambushed twice by a file which started playing porn on his phone !

  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,559
    edited April 2022

    With all this working from home, i bet there has been fair bit of tug tv watching during office hours going on. Not good for already poor productivity rates.

    Also some tug zoom.
    Wasn't there a CNN presenter who did that during a meeting?
    Think he was CNN or maybe different network.

    Also memorable case, of female professor whose Zoom background featured some esp. impressive samples of Leon's flint-knappery.

    EDIT - In her case, may have caused some eyebrow raising at the faculty club, but don't think she actually did anything wrong, seeing as how her dildo collection was NOT in active service during her zooming.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,921
    MattW said:

    What's the financial equation?

    I make it 2 months salary as winding up allowance plus 6 months salary for Loss of Office, which is about 60k if he stays until the next election in say May 2024 if it is then, which I think he does not get if he goes first.

    Plus however much salary it is (£168k if 2 years), plus an extra approx 2 years worth of pension rights.

    Will that weigh heavily in the equation?

    I expect so as it did for Jared O'Mara
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,986
    HYUFD said:

    He can probably survive as an MP until the next general election, he did not commit a criminal offence nor necessarily something clearly in breach of the Parliamentary Standards rules.

    However his chances of being selected as Conservative Parliamentary candidate for Tiverton and Honiton again at that election are effectively zero

    I suspect this is right. And conservatives will win that seat at a GE. He’s going into the permanent parliamentary sin bin alongside the likes of Corbyn.

    The film of him earlier saying he would “await the verdict of the enquiry” was pathetic, in both the pejorative and sympathetic sense. A man in the midst of a profound, utter humiliation.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,275

    His wife’s comments that “it takes two to tango” are bizarre.

    What’s that got to do with him ogling on the job.

    If I'm gonna give anyone a break here, it's gonna be her. Esp. as she (like he) is still in shock.

    He voted against same-sex marriage, so perhaps they are social conservatives? Which does NOT make someone immune to porno, but can make it harder to admit & deal with?
    Do you remember that nutjob evangelist in the USA who after making a series of homophobic speeches was later found out to be banged mercilessly by two male escorts on a regular basis .

    It would be perfect if Parish given his voting record suffered the same fate !
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,647

    Eabhal said:

    Eabhal said:

    The whole episode just sums up how most people feel about UK politics at the mo.

    Pathetic.
    Disgusting.
    Out of touch. Imagine repeatedly showing your colleagues at work, ffs. Bunch of dinosaurs.

    At least in Scotland we have proper scandals like ferries - "I signed the document cos the other guy was on holiday", or vicious Salmond v Sturgeon drama.

    Really? That’s like the big thing going on in Scotland right now? Plus post links. Yawn.
    It's not big, but it is gently entertaining. I'll leave you to Google away, if you can stay up any later.
    So. Not big. I’ll probably pass then.
    You may find there are other topics discussed on PB that don't meet your "big" criteria.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,647
    HYUFD said:

    With all this working from home, i bet there has been fair bit of tug tv watching during office hours going on. Not good for already poor productivity rates.

    As long as it is not on the work network which is monitored
    I got stung because I use Twitter at work (for good reasons) but follow Sky Sports and watch a lot of their short highlight clips.

    Awkward trying to explain to my boss that I wasn't streaming Sky through my laptop. Quite frightening how sophisticated the tracker was though. PB on phone only.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,647
    Eabhal said:

    HYUFD said:

    With all this working from home, i bet there has been fair bit of tug tv watching during office hours going on. Not good for already poor productivity rates.

    As long as it is not on the work network which is monitored
    I got stung because I use Twitter at work (for good reasons) but follow Sky Sports and watch a lot of their short highlight clips.

    Awkward trying to explain to my boss that I wasn't streaming Sky through my laptop. Quite frightening how sophisticated the tracker was though. PB on phone only.
    OTOH, I watched the entire 2018 world cup at work on my work phone. Didn't get a single warning.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,991
    edited April 2022
    Eabhal said:

    Eabhal said:

    HYUFD said:

    With all this working from home, i bet there has been fair bit of tug tv watching during office hours going on. Not good for already poor productivity rates.

    As long as it is not on the work network which is monitored
    I got stung because I use Twitter at work (for good reasons) but follow Sky Sports and watch a lot of their short highlight clips.

    Awkward trying to explain to my boss that I wasn't streaming Sky through my laptop. Quite frightening how sophisticated the tracker was though. PB on phone only.
    OTOH, I watched the entire 2018 world cup at work on my work phone. Didn't get a single warning.
    Taps mic....Eabhal....Eahbal....this is your boss speaking, could you report to HR on Monday morning please.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,660
    Andy_JS said:

    One of the most obscure MPs finds himself in the news over this.

    SKS?
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,660
    Foxy said:

    Quincel said:

    Certainly a sticky situation for him, he's got quite a mess on his hands. In the event that the member triggered a by-election there could be a very stiff challenge coming right at him.

    Lets hope he pulls off a happy ending.
    He looks a right tit
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,660
    On Topic surely a TSE thread on this is imminent
  • The @pplsassembly made an exciting announcement today! We are now a membership organisation ☺️! Have a listen why Please become a member of The Peoples Assembly today! thepeoplesassembly.org.uk

    https://twitter.com/LauraPidcock/status/1519744483260346368

    You too can pay Laura Pidcock to teach you how to lose elections.

    @bigjohnowls right up your alley
  • bigglesbiggles Posts: 6,051
    Foxy said:

    Quincel said:

    Certainly a sticky situation for him, he's got quite a mess on his hands. In the event that the member triggered a by-election there could be a very stiff challenge coming right at him.

    Lets hope he pulls off a happy ending.
    You owe me the glass of wine I just snorted out.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,153
    HYUFD said:

    He can probably survive as an MP until the next general election, he did not commit a criminal offence nor necessarily something clearly in breach of the Parliamentary Standards rules.

    However his chances of being selected as Conservative Parliamentary candidate for Tiverton and Honiton again at that election are effectively zero

    I predict the Parliamentary Standards Commission will issue him with a very short ban - like seven days - that will be insufficient for a recall petition.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,908
    HYUFD said:

    He can probably survive as an MP until the next general election, he did not commit a criminal offence nor necessarily something clearly in breach of the Parliamentary Standards rules.

    I agree. It'll never stand up in court

  • Having seen the interview with him, I now he's finished and will go.

    He has indicated he would go if the findings go against him, and that is quite obviously what will happen.

    The "accidentally clicked on a link" thing is transparently false, as it happened twice and for a sustained period on each occasion. Everything about his demeanour and answers screamed guilt, and he has no chance.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,497
    edited April 2022

    The Tories are desperate for the police to reopen an investigation despite there being no new evidence.

    Perhaps they should present some.

    I sense the Daily Mail are fizzling out on this now. “Alleged Covid Breaches” stands out so limply on the front page this evening. Maybe lawyers have been on to them.

    Meanwhile, who conducted the poll Express are referring to? Proper firm done proper, if they did it themselves then what a reek of desperation?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,714
    BeckerGate, PornGate, Beergate...

    Front pages tonight.

    No wonder Vlad thinks the West has collapsed into irrelevant decadence.


    Jeez.

  • SirNorfolkPassmoreSirNorfolkPassmore Posts: 7,149
    edited April 2022
    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    He can probably survive as an MP until the next general election, he did not commit a criminal offence nor necessarily something clearly in breach of the Parliamentary Standards rules.

    However his chances of being selected as Conservative Parliamentary candidate for Tiverton and Honiton again at that election are effectively zero

    I predict the Parliamentary Standards Commission will issue him with a very short ban - like seven days - that will be insufficient for a recall petition.
    No chance. The chamber of the House of Commons has a near holy status amongst MPs. They will absolutely throw the book at him for playing pocket billiards over Naughty College Girls 14 on the third row. It's such a flagrant case of bringing Parliament into disrepute - indeed, it is literally treating it like a seedy adult cinema.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,497

    Having seen the interview with him, I now he's finished and will go.

    He has indicated he would go if the findings go against him, and that is quite obviously what will happen.

    The "accidentally clicked on a link" thing is transparently false, as it happened twice and for a sustained period on each occasion. Everything about his demeanour and answers screamed guilt, and he has no chance.

    I clicked it in error.
    Okay good. And how long was it on your screen in error.
    About fifteen minutes.
  • bigglesbiggles Posts: 6,051

    BeckerGate, PornGate, Beergate...

    Front pages tonight.

    No wonder Vlad thinks the West has collapsed into irrelevant decadence.


    Jeez.

    And yet we can all be proud that the West, when provoked by naked aggression, can still rise above it all and unite.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,991

    Having seen the interview with him, I now he's finished and will go.

    He has indicated he would go if the findings go against him, and that is quite obviously what will happen.

    The "accidentally clicked on a link" thing is transparently false, as it happened twice and for a sustained period on each occasion. Everything about his demeanour and answers screamed guilt, and he has no chance.

    I clicked it in error.
    Okay good. And how long was it on your screen in error.
    About fifteen minutes.
    Sir Norman Fry Compilation
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fcdzZ5zRZgg
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,153

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    He can probably survive as an MP until the next general election, he did not commit a criminal offence nor necessarily something clearly in breach of the Parliamentary Standards rules.

    However his chances of being selected as Conservative Parliamentary candidate for Tiverton and Honiton again at that election are effectively zero

    I predict the Parliamentary Standards Commission will issue him with a very short ban - like seven days - that will be insufficient for a recall petition.
    No chance. The chamber of the House of Commons has a near holy status amongst MPs. They will absolutely throw the book at him for playing pocket billiards over Naughty College Girls 14 on the third row. It's such a flagrant case of bringing Parliament into disrepute - indeed, it is literally treating it like a seedy adult cinema.
    Disagree: the Government does not want a byelection. And Government MPs make up more than half the members of the committee.

    Short suspension. No recall petition.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,368
    edited April 2022
    The Committee that adjudicates on the future of the MP for Tiverton and Honiton, are they the Parish Council?

    Thank you and good night.
  • bigglesbiggles Posts: 6,051

    The Committee that adjudicates on the future of the MP for Tiverton and Honiton, are they the Parish Council?

    Thank you and good night.

    Either way, you and I have no authority. None at all.
  • rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    He can probably survive as an MP until the next general election, he did not commit a criminal offence nor necessarily something clearly in breach of the Parliamentary Standards rules.

    However his chances of being selected as Conservative Parliamentary candidate for Tiverton and Honiton again at that election are effectively zero

    I predict the Parliamentary Standards Commission will issue him with a very short ban - like seven days - that will be insufficient for a recall petition.
    No chance. The chamber of the House of Commons has a near holy status amongst MPs. They will absolutely throw the book at him for playing pocket billiards over Naughty College Girls 14 on the third row. It's such a flagrant case of bringing Parliament into disrepute - indeed, it is literally treating it like a seedy adult cinema.
    Disagree: the Government does not want a byelection. And Government MPs make up more than half the members of the committee.

    Short suspension. No recall petition.
    They also personally don't want anything to do with calling for lenient treatment. They will eviscerate him, if it even gets that far.
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,708
    edited April 2022

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    He can probably survive as an MP until the next general election, he did not commit a criminal offence nor necessarily something clearly in breach of the Parliamentary Standards rules.

    However his chances of being selected as Conservative Parliamentary candidate for Tiverton and Honiton again at that election are effectively zero

    I predict the Parliamentary Standards Commission will issue him with a very short ban - like seven days - that will be insufficient for a recall petition.
    No chance. The chamber of the House of Commons has a near holy status amongst MPs. They will absolutely throw the book at him for playing pocket billiards over Naughty College Girls 14 on the third row. It's such a flagrant case of bringing Parliament into disrepute - indeed, it is literally treating it like a seedy adult cinema.
    Disagree: the Government does not want a byelection. And Government MPs make up more than half the members of the committee.

    Short suspension. No recall petition.
    They also personally don't want anything to do with calling for lenient treatment. They will eviscerate him, if it even gets that far.
    I don't think they need to call for lenient treatment? Just say it's very serious, then recommend a number of days that happens to fall short of the recall threshold.
  • rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    He can probably survive as an MP until the next general election, he did not commit a criminal offence nor necessarily something clearly in breach of the Parliamentary Standards rules.

    However his chances of being selected as Conservative Parliamentary candidate for Tiverton and Honiton again at that election are effectively zero

    I predict the Parliamentary Standards Commission will issue him with a very short ban - like seven days - that will be insufficient for a recall petition.
    No chance. The chamber of the House of Commons has a near holy status amongst MPs. They will absolutely throw the book at him for playing pocket billiards over Naughty College Girls 14 on the third row. It's such a flagrant case of bringing Parliament into disrepute - indeed, it is literally treating it like a seedy adult cinema.
    Disagree: the Government does not want a byelection. And Government MPs make up more than half the members of the committee.

    Short suspension. No recall petition.
    They also personally don't want anything to do with calling for lenient treatment. They will eviscerate him, if it even gets that far.
    I don't think they need to call for lenient treatment? Just say it's very serious, then recommend a number of days that happens to fall short of the recall threshold.
    Just watch the video of him talking to the media. He's halfway out the door, and anyone trying silly games to save him is stained too. He's as good as gone.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,553
    The LDs will fancy their chances at a Tiverton & Honiton by-election.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,892

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    He can probably survive as an MP until the next general election, he did not commit a criminal offence nor necessarily something clearly in breach of the Parliamentary Standards rules.

    However his chances of being selected as Conservative Parliamentary candidate for Tiverton and Honiton again at that election are effectively zero

    I predict the Parliamentary Standards Commission will issue him with a very short ban - like seven days - that will be insufficient for a recall petition.
    No chance. The chamber of the House of Commons has a near holy status amongst MPs. They will absolutely throw the book at him for playing pocket billiards over Naughty College Girls 14 on the third row. It's such a flagrant case of bringing Parliament into disrepute - indeed, it is literally treating it like a seedy adult cinema.
    Disagree: the Government does not want a byelection. And Government MPs make up more than half the members of the committee.

    Short suspension. No recall petition.
    They also personally don't want anything to do with calling for lenient treatment. They will eviscerate him, if it even gets that far.
    I don't think they need to call for lenient treatment? Just say it's very serious, then recommend a number of days that happens to fall short of the recall threshold.
    Just watch the video of him talking to the media. He's halfway out the door, and anyone trying silly games to save him is stained too. He's as good as gone.
    Which might be why Number 10 would prefer Parish to stick around — as a dead cat to distract from Big Dog.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    edited April 2022
    Ukrainians approval rate of foreign leaders:

    🇵🇱 Duda 92%
    🇬🇧 Johnson 87%
    🇺🇸 Biden 86%
    🇹🇷 Erdoğan 76%
    🇱🇹 Nauseda 75%
    🇫🇷 Macron 75%
    🇪🇺 von der Leyen 66%
    🇩🇪 Scholz 30% positive

    🇧🇾 Lukashenko 96% negative
    🇷🇺 Putin 98% negative


    https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1520179628555616257

    When you look as the “strongly” approve ratings the Duda/Johnson leads are even stronger:

    https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1520180075387367424

    For example, Johnson 69, Macron 17.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,070
    MattW said:

    What's the financial equation?

    I make it 2 months salary as winding up allowance plus 6 months salary for Loss of Office, which is about 60k if he stays until the next election in say May 2024 if it is then, which I think he does not get if he goes first.

    Plus however much salary it is (£168k if 2 years), plus an extra approx 2 years worth of pension rights.

    Will that weigh heavily in the equation?

    Reportedly employs his wife as a ‘junior secretary’, so there’s that, too.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,070
    Bizarre, and also very sad.

    The deadly accordion wars of Lesotho
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-61097386
    Rivalry between stars of a unique accordion-based style of music in the southern African kingdom of Lesotho has sparked years of deadly gang warfare that has turned the tiny country into the murder capital of the continent.…
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,070
    Did he really say he “may have opened porn in Commons by mistake” (BBC) ?
    That suggests there were several incidences, some deliberate, some accidental.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 7,084
    Conservative MPs.

    The Gift that keeps on giving.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 7,084
    edited April 2022

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    He can probably survive as an MP until the next general election, he did not commit a criminal offence nor necessarily something clearly in breach of the Parliamentary Standards rules.

    However his chances of being selected as Conservative Parliamentary candidate for Tiverton and Honiton again at that election are effectively zero

    I predict the Parliamentary Standards Commission will issue him with a very short ban - like seven days - that will be insufficient for a recall petition.
    The chamber of the House of Commons has a near holy status amongst MPs.
    That used to be true. But now we have a Prime Minister who lies in it, repeatedly.

    Once upon a time that was a sackable offence.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 7,084
    And good morning everyone. I see that the Daily Mail are continuing their campaign to overtake the Daily Star as Britain's least serious newspaper.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,553
    Nigelb said:

    Bizarre, and also very sad.

    The deadly accordion wars of Lesotho
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-61097386
    Rivalry between stars of a unique accordion-based style of music in the southern African kingdom of Lesotho has sparked years of deadly gang warfare that has turned the tiny country into the murder capital of the continent.…

    You learn something new. I didn't known accordions aroused such passions anywhere in the world.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,153

    Ukrainians approval rate of foreign leaders:

    🇵🇱 Duda 92%
    🇬🇧 Johnson 87%
    🇺🇸 Biden 86%
    🇹🇷 Erdoğan 76%
    🇱🇹 Nauseda 75%
    🇫🇷 Macron 75%
    🇪🇺 von der Leyen 66%
    🇩🇪 Scholz 30% positive

    🇧🇾 Lukashenko 96% negative
    🇷🇺 Putin 98% negative


    https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1520179628555616257

    When you look as the “strongly” approve ratings the Duda/Johnson leads are even stronger:

    https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1520180075387367424

    For example, Johnson 69, Macron 17.

    I'm surprised VdL scores so highly.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,375
    Quincel said:

    Certainly a sticky situation for him, he's got quite a mess on his hands. In the event that the member triggered a by-election there could be a very stiff challenge coming right at him.

    It’s going to go hard with him.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,892
    Heathener said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    He can probably survive as an MP until the next general election, he did not commit a criminal offence nor necessarily something clearly in breach of the Parliamentary Standards rules.

    However his chances of being selected as Conservative Parliamentary candidate for Tiverton and Honiton again at that election are effectively zero

    I predict the Parliamentary Standards Commission will issue him with a very short ban - like seven days - that will be insufficient for a recall petition.
    The chamber of the House of Commons has a near holy status amongst MPs.
    That used to be true. But now we have a Prime Minister who lies in it, repeatedly.

    Once upon a time that was a sackable offence.
    Once upon a time, it would lead an honourable Honourable Member to resign.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 7,084
    edited April 2022
    Neil Parish MP has just issued a statement:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=REpNTi-9oRQ
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,468
    rcs1000 said:

    Ukrainians approval rate of foreign leaders:

    🇵🇱 Duda 92%
    🇬🇧 Johnson 87%
    🇺🇸 Biden 86%
    🇹🇷 Erdoğan 76%
    🇱🇹 Nauseda 75%
    🇫🇷 Macron 75%
    🇪🇺 von der Leyen 66%
    🇩🇪 Scholz 30% positive

    🇧🇾 Lukashenko 96% negative
    🇷🇺 Putin 98% negative


    https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1520179628555616257

    When you look as the “strongly” approve ratings the Duda/Johnson leads are even stronger:

    https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1520180075387367424

    For example, Johnson 69, Macron 17.

    I'm surprised VdL scores so highly.
    She has been seen as the one pushing the fast-tracking of Ukraine's EU application, and she was one of the earliest world leaders to visit Kyiv.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 7,084
    I finished BBC's House of Maxwell yesterday.

    Highly recommend it, although for me personally it was unsettling. It's a disturbing and extraordinary story.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,070
    Andy_JS said:

    Nigelb said:

    Bizarre, and also very sad.

    The deadly accordion wars of Lesotho
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-61097386
    Rivalry between stars of a unique accordion-based style of music in the southern African kingdom of Lesotho has sparked years of deadly gang warfare that has turned the tiny country into the murder capital of the continent.…

    You learn something new. I didn't known accordions aroused such passions anywhere in the world.
    Music does, not infrequently.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,660
    I see the Parliamentary Standards Commisioner charged with investigating the Porn incident is called Ms Stone.

    Parish is fooked if she crosses her legs.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,576
    FPT:
    Dura_Ace said:

    Re feverish F-16 discussion on the previous thread.

    It's not just the crews, there is a vast technical and logistical infrastructure that needs to be established to support F-16 ops. In addition to the aircraft they need spares, tools, manuals, weapons, etc.

    Now Ukraine could get a lot of help from the US and Poland but they aren't (yet) willing to put personnel into Ukraine. It took 7 years to establish the Iraqi Air Force F-16 capability and corners could be cut because there's a war on but it's still a very long road to operating the aircraft.

    If we wanted to enhance Ukraine's combat air capability (which nobody seems inclined to do) then the quickest route is de-NATOed Fulcrums from Poland, Slovakia, etc. Biden could make this happen tomorrow but chooses not to.

    Also, it's just some scrandy on Twitter saying F-16s so why is everybody assuming it's true?

    You make some good points. However, it might be fair to assume that the professionals have a little idea of what they are doing?

    As for your last line; it's a bit rich coming from someone who talks about how the Ukrainians have used far too many anti-tank weapons to destroy the tanks they have destroyed, and refuses to give any source for the assertion...
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,892
    Heathener said:

    I finished BBC's House of Maxwell yesterday.

    Highly recommend it, although for me personally it was unsettling. It's a disturbing and extraordinary story.

    I worked just down the road from the Mirror building at the time. One thing the series did not capture was the sense of collective shock when Maxwell disappeared. He really was a major public figure. And soon after a second shock when it turned out he was a crook, similar perhaps to the reaction to the Savile revelations after his death.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,070

    Heathener said:

    I finished BBC's House of Maxwell yesterday.

    Highly recommend it, although for me personally it was unsettling. It's a disturbing and extraordinary story.

    I worked just down the road from the Mirror building at the time. One thing the series did not capture was the sense of collective shock when Maxwell disappeared. He really was a major public figure. And soon after a second shock when it turned out he was a crook, similar perhaps to the reaction to the Savile revelations after his death.
    Except in Maxwell’s case it was more open knowledge.
    Private Eye had run stories about him for years. It wasn’t a major shock that he was a crook, just that the full extent of his crookery wasn’t clear.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,585
    edited April 2022
    Here for the jokes about the porn-watching MP losing the whip… and the handcuffs, the leather catsuit, and the size 10 stilettos.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,639
    Nigelb said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Nigelb said:

    Bizarre, and also very sad.

    The deadly accordion wars of Lesotho
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-61097386
    Rivalry between stars of a unique accordion-based style of music in the southern African kingdom of Lesotho has sparked years of deadly gang warfare that has turned the tiny country into the murder capital of the continent.…

    You learn something new. I didn't known accordions aroused such passions anywhere in the world.
    Music does, not infrequently.
    We should thank our lucky stars that it is only the banhammer for dissing Radiohead.

  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,639

    Heathener said:

    I finished BBC's House of Maxwell yesterday.

    Highly recommend it, although for me personally it was unsettling. It's a disturbing and extraordinary story.

    I worked just down the road from the Mirror building at the time. One thing the series did not capture was the sense of collective shock when Maxwell disappeared. He really was a major public figure. And soon after a second shock when it turned out he was a crook, similar perhaps to the reaction to the Savile revelations after his death.
    We should give some thought as to how our libel laws protect the rich and criminal. It is a recurring theme of why they take so long to be exposed.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/apr/28/outrageous-libel-laws-protected-jimmy-savile-lawsuits
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,585
    Nigelb said:

    Heathener said:

    I finished BBC's House of Maxwell yesterday.

    Highly recommend it, although for me personally it was unsettling. It's a disturbing and extraordinary story.

    I worked just down the road from the Mirror building at the time. One thing the series did not capture was the sense of collective shock when Maxwell disappeared. He really was a major public figure. And soon after a second shock when it turned out he was a crook, similar perhaps to the reaction to the Savile revelations after his death.
    Except in Maxwell’s case it was more open knowledge.
    Private Eye had run stories about him for years. It wasn’t a major shock that he was a crook, just that the full extent of his crookery wasn’t clear.
    A good radio interview with Hislop, who got sued several times by Maxwell over the years for calling him a crook.
    https://youtube.com/watch?v=Ty1K3XjuEbs
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,070
    Dura_Ace said:

    Re feverish F-16 discussion on the previous thread.

    It's not just the crews, there is a vast technical and logistical infrastructure that needs to be established to support F-16 ops. In addition to the aircraft they need spares, tools, manuals, weapons, etc.

    Now Ukraine could get a lot of help from the US and Poland but they aren't (yet) willing to put personnel into Ukraine. It took 7 years to establish the Iraqi Air Force F-16 capability and corners could be cut because there's a war on but it's still a very long road to operating the aircraft.

    If we wanted to enhance Ukraine's combat air capability (which nobody seems inclined to do) then the quickest route is de-NATOed Fulcrums from Poland, Slovakia, etc. Biden could make this happen tomorrow but chooses not to.

    Also, it's just some scrandy on Twitter saying F-16s so why is everybody assuming it's true?

    In recent times, three years from finalised order to first delivery seems possible (eg Morocco); back in the 80s Venezuela seems to have got theirs in a couple of years. No doubt you’re right that the logistics infrastructure takes some time.

    Having said that, it does seem that NATO intentions have shifted in the last week. I suspect it won’t be very long before they get the Polish aircraft.
    https://www.airforcemag.com/ukraine-wants-f-16s-but-usaf-officials-say-thats-not-a-recipe-for-success/

    F16s will be part of the post war security guarantee.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,908
    edited April 2022
    looks like the Mail are treading a lonely path again.

    Choosing the day when one of the world's great sporting icons gets sent to jail has made their vendetta look a little bit obvious!


  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,576
    Nigelb said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Re feverish F-16 discussion on the previous thread.

    It's not just the crews, there is a vast technical and logistical infrastructure that needs to be established to support F-16 ops. In addition to the aircraft they need spares, tools, manuals, weapons, etc.

    Now Ukraine could get a lot of help from the US and Poland but they aren't (yet) willing to put personnel into Ukraine. It took 7 years to establish the Iraqi Air Force F-16 capability and corners could be cut because there's a war on but it's still a very long road to operating the aircraft.

    If we wanted to enhance Ukraine's combat air capability (which nobody seems inclined to do) then the quickest route is de-NATOed Fulcrums from Poland, Slovakia, etc. Biden could make this happen tomorrow but chooses not to.

    Also, it's just some scrandy on Twitter saying F-16s so why is everybody assuming it's true?

    In recent times, three years from finalised order to first delivery seems possible (eg Morocco); back in the 80s Venezuela seems to have got theirs in a couple of years. No doubt you’re right that the logistics infrastructure takes some time.

    Having said that, it does seem that NATO intentions have shifted in the last week. I suspect it won’t be very long before they get the Polish aircraft.
    https://www.airforcemag.com/ukraine-wants-f-16s-but-usaf-officials-say-thats-not-a-recipe-for-success/

    F16s will be part of the post war security guarantee.
    There might also be another point: if this heats up more, it might be good to get Ukrainians some experience in F16s and with the F16s weapons systems. Even if they have to fly from NATO airbases.

    Hopefully it will not come to that.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    rcs1000 said:

    Ukrainians approval rate of foreign leaders:

    🇵🇱 Duda 92%
    🇬🇧 Johnson 87%
    🇺🇸 Biden 86%
    🇹🇷 Erdoğan 76%
    🇱🇹 Nauseda 75%
    🇫🇷 Macron 75%
    🇪🇺 von der Leyen 66%
    🇩🇪 Scholz 30% positive

    🇧🇾 Lukashenko 96% negative
    🇷🇺 Putin 98% negative


    https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1520179628555616257

    When you look as the “strongly” approve ratings the Duda/Johnson leads are even stronger:

    https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1520180075387367424

    For example, Johnson 69, Macron 17.

    I'm surprised VdL scores so highly.
    Flattered by the “somewhat approve” figures, her “strongly approve” rating is 23 vs Johnson’s 69.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,892
    Foxy said:

    Heathener said:

    I finished BBC's House of Maxwell yesterday.

    Highly recommend it, although for me personally it was unsettling. It's a disturbing and extraordinary story.

    I worked just down the road from the Mirror building at the time. One thing the series did not capture was the sense of collective shock when Maxwell disappeared. He really was a major public figure. And soon after a second shock when it turned out he was a crook, similar perhaps to the reaction to the Savile revelations after his death.
    We should give some thought as to how our libel laws protect the rich and criminal. It is a recurring theme of why they take so long to be exposed.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/apr/28/outrageous-libel-laws-protected-jimmy-savile-lawsuits
    Not really in this case. While it is true Maxwell was known to be dodgy, and had been disqualified as a director in the past, it was a major surprise when the Mirror Group pension fund was found to be empty. And while Savile might have been protected by libel laws, this was really because the Sun could not stand up the evidence against him. There have been several public figures who were wrongly accused and subsequently cleared; do we really want to make it open season for a press who, with the best will in the world, will print as many rumours as they can get away with.

    While I agree our libel laws are outrageous, I'm not convinced of the case for allowing the British press to print any salubrious gossip they think will sell papers.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,779

    His wife’s comments that “it takes two to tango” are bizarre.

    What’s that got to do with him ogling on the job.

    It takes two to tango but only one to wank.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,070
    Roger said:

    looks like the Mail are treading a lonely path again.

    Choosing the day when one of the world's great sporting icons gets sent to jail has made their vendetta look a little bit obvious!

    Online, they have Boris as the lead.
    Though fail lamentably in not using ‘Boom Boom to Bust’ as the headline.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,639

    Foxy said:

    Heathener said:

    I finished BBC's House of Maxwell yesterday.

    Highly recommend it, although for me personally it was unsettling. It's a disturbing and extraordinary story.

    I worked just down the road from the Mirror building at the time. One thing the series did not capture was the sense of collective shock when Maxwell disappeared. He really was a major public figure. And soon after a second shock when it turned out he was a crook, similar perhaps to the reaction to the Savile revelations after his death.
    We should give some thought as to how our libel laws protect the rich and criminal. It is a recurring theme of why they take so long to be exposed.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/apr/28/outrageous-libel-laws-protected-jimmy-savile-lawsuits
    Not really in this case. While it is true Maxwell was known to be dodgy, and had been disqualified as a director in the past, it was a major surprise when the Mirror Group pension fund was found to be empty. And while Savile might have been protected by libel laws, this was really because the Sun could not stand up the evidence against him. There have been several public figures who were wrongly accused and subsequently cleared; do we really want to make it open season for a press who, with the best will in the world, will print as many rumours as they can get away with.

    While I agree our libel laws are outrageous, I'm not convinced of the case for allowing the British press to print any salubrious gossip they think will sell papers.
    It is the scale of the awards (including deliberately inflated costs) that make libel suits so dangerous for journalists.
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 8,243
    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Nigelb said:

    Bizarre, and also very sad.

    The deadly accordion wars of Lesotho
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-61097386
    Rivalry between stars of a unique accordion-based style of music in the southern African kingdom of Lesotho has sparked years of deadly gang warfare that has turned the tiny country into the murder capital of the continent.…

    You learn something new. I didn't known accordions aroused such passions anywhere in the world.
    Music does, not infrequently.
    We should thank our lucky stars that it is only the banhammer for dissing Radiohead.

    Is it actually possible to diss Radiohead? Wouldn’t any negative remarks just be a statement of fact?
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,908

    Ukrainians approval rate of foreign leaders:

    🇵🇱 Duda 92%
    🇬🇧 Johnson 87%
    🇺🇸 Biden 86%
    🇹🇷 Erdoğan 76%
    🇱🇹 Nauseda 75%
    🇫🇷 Macron 75%
    🇪🇺 von der Leyen 66%
    🇩🇪 Scholz 30% positive

    🇧🇾 Lukashenko 96% negative
    🇷🇺 Putin 98% negative


    https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1520179628555616257

    When you look as the “strongly” approve ratings the Duda/Johnson leads are even stronger:

    https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1520180075387367424

    For example, Johnson 69, Macron 17.

    I absolutely loathe him so knowing that a country which has next to nothing to do witth him approves of him doesn't score very highly with me
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,639
    Johnson caught lying in the commons again. Great letter from Hammersmith and Fulham Council, but once again a lie is around the world before the truth has its boots on.

    https://twitter.com/mi6rogue/status/1520012788743213057?t=OFGQvIXO7GKfaquJA_gPhA&s=19
  • JonWCJonWC Posts: 288
    edited April 2022
    Not too sure the LibDems have that great a chance in any by-election. Of course it is possible, but they are extravagantly weak here having dropped out of the top two since 2010. Most of the councillors are gone, there is now no activity to speak of, you never see LibDem comment in the local media.

    T and H and its forerunners have been Tory for 100 years, and the LibDems no longer have anything in common with the kind of traditional Liberals who supported them in places like this.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,553
    edited April 2022

    Heathener said:

    I finished BBC's House of Maxwell yesterday.

    Highly recommend it, although for me personally it was unsettling. It's a disturbing and extraordinary story.

    I worked just down the road from the Mirror building at the time. One thing the series did not capture was the sense of collective shock when Maxwell disappeared. He really was a major public figure. And soon after a second shock when it turned out he was a crook, similar perhaps to the reaction to the Savile revelations after his death.
    I remember it being on the news, it was one of the first stories I followed seriously. 1991.
  • JonWCJonWC Posts: 288
    That said I am sure I am about to get a million leaflets and requests for help..
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,892
    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Heathener said:

    I finished BBC's House of Maxwell yesterday.

    Highly recommend it, although for me personally it was unsettling. It's a disturbing and extraordinary story.

    I worked just down the road from the Mirror building at the time. One thing the series did not capture was the sense of collective shock when Maxwell disappeared. He really was a major public figure. And soon after a second shock when it turned out he was a crook, similar perhaps to the reaction to the Savile revelations after his death.
    We should give some thought as to how our libel laws protect the rich and criminal. It is a recurring theme of why they take so long to be exposed.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/apr/28/outrageous-libel-laws-protected-jimmy-savile-lawsuits
    Not really in this case. While it is true Maxwell was known to be dodgy, and had been disqualified as a director in the past, it was a major surprise when the Mirror Group pension fund was found to be empty. And while Savile might have been protected by libel laws, this was really because the Sun could not stand up the evidence against him. There have been several public figures who were wrongly accused and subsequently cleared; do we really want to make it open season for a press who, with the best will in the world, will print as many rumours as they can get away with.

    While I agree our libel laws are outrageous, I'm not convinced of the case for allowing the British press to print any salubrious gossip they think will sell papers.
    It is the scale of the awards (including deliberately inflated costs) that make libel suits so dangerous for journalists.
    Yes, and certainly for local and specialist journals. But if the Sun had the evidence to convince Rupert Murdoch, they'd not have been afraid of a libel suit. We saw this with the Daily Mail naming the killers of Stephen Lawrence, who'd not been convicted. I do not know where the tipping point should be between protecting rich villains and letting the press destroy the innocent.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,576
    Andy_JS said:

    Heathener said:

    I finished BBC's House of Maxwell yesterday.

    Highly recommend it, although for me personally it was unsettling. It's a disturbing and extraordinary story.

    I worked just down the road from the Mirror building at the time. One thing the series did not capture was the sense of collective shock when Maxwell disappeared. He really was a major public figure. And soon after a second shock when it turned out he was a crook, similar perhaps to the reaction to the Savile revelations after his death.
    I remember it being on the news, it was one of the first stories I followed seriously. 1991.
    I was 18 at the time, and I only really knew Maxwell as owner of a newspaper we did not read, and as owner of Derby County Football Club (also that he had problems owning two clubs?).

    Incidentally, it seems that many rich, dodgy people see owning football clubs as a wise way to invest their lucre. I wonder if they think it gives them respectability, whilst the fandom gives them protection?
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,892
    Scott_xP said:
    Don't replace Boris because there might be an election imminent. Cui bono?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,585
    edited April 2022
    Nigelb said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Re feverish F-16 discussion on the previous thread.

    It's not just the crews, there is a vast technical and logistical infrastructure that needs to be established to support F-16 ops. In addition to the aircraft they need spares, tools, manuals, weapons, etc.

    Now Ukraine could get a lot of help from the US and Poland but they aren't (yet) willing to put personnel into Ukraine. It took 7 years to establish the Iraqi Air Force F-16 capability and corners could be cut because there's a war on but it's still a very long road to operating the aircraft.

    If we wanted to enhance Ukraine's combat air capability (which nobody seems inclined to do) then the quickest route is de-NATOed Fulcrums from Poland, Slovakia, etc. Biden could make this happen tomorrow but chooses not to.

    Also, it's just some scrandy on Twitter saying F-16s so why is everybody assuming it's true?

    In recent times, three years from finalised order to first delivery seems possible (eg Morocco); back in the 80s Venezuela seems to have got theirs in a couple of years. No doubt you’re right that the logistics infrastructure takes some time.

    Having said that, it does seem that NATO intentions have shifted in the last week. I suspect it won’t be very long before they get the Polish aircraft.
    https://www.airforcemag.com/ukraine-wants-f-16s-but-usaf-officials-say-thats-not-a-recipe-for-success/

    F16s will be part of the post war security guarantee.
    The scale of the US intervention, does give the impression of a change of pace with regard to helping Ukraine.

    Many of the more basic weapons such as artillery, which need little training, have been sent already this week. As we discussed previously with the planes, the short term plan might be to mostly find the more complex kit from other nations, of a type which the Ukranians already know, and then to backfill those nations as well as train Ukranians in the medium term.

    As Dura correctly pointed out, the complex equipment such as planes and MBTs needs a whole operation behind each type of it, much more than simply training the few officers that directly operate them. Military fighter jets in particular, even the established types, need constant maintenance to remain serviceable.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,990
    watching porn in the Commons obviously has nothing to do with wanking and everything to do with power. Unlike the entirely blameless Angela Rayner, men who obtrusively watch porn where they know it might make others feel uncomfortable genuinely are engaged in a form of exhibitionism. If it helps the Conservative hierarchy get a grip, maybe they should think of THIS as the gateway drug to indecent exposure.

    And so to the sheer scale of Westminster’s cross-party sexual misconduct problem. Fifty-six accused MPs really is an astonishing statistic, given the arcane Westminster system’s barriers to reporting. It is certainly statistically likely that the overwhelming majority of those 56 are men, meaning that up to one in eight male MPs are currently accused of inappropriate behaviour and worse.

    Women who work in Westminster are beyond fuming that this continues to happen and that nothing ever changes. One female Tory MP told Politico that things had actually got worse under Johnson because of the “culture of rule-breaking”, where nothing happens to dodgy MPs.


    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/apr/29/nsfw-government-ministers-sexual-misconduct-cronyism
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,590

    Andy_JS said:

    Heathener said:

    I finished BBC's House of Maxwell yesterday.

    Highly recommend it, although for me personally it was unsettling. It's a disturbing and extraordinary story.

    I worked just down the road from the Mirror building at the time. One thing the series did not capture was the sense of collective shock when Maxwell disappeared. He really was a major public figure. And soon after a second shock when it turned out he was a crook, similar perhaps to the reaction to the Savile revelations after his death.
    I remember it being on the news, it was one of the first stories I followed seriously. 1991.
    I was 18 at the time, and I only really knew Maxwell as owner of a newspaper we did not read, and as owner of Derby County Football Club (also that he had problems owning two clubs?).

    Incidentally, it seems that many rich, dodgy people see owning football clubs as a wise way to invest their lucre. I wonder if they think it gives them respectability, whilst the fandom gives them protection?
    I was 18 too, and it was certainly the manner of his disappearance rather than the gradual (and eventually terminally slow) unravelling of the pyramid of fraud that stuck in my mind.

    Even at 18 I was not at all surprised about the scale of it. Possibly because I didn't really grasp it - the lack of comparable scandals, perhaps.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,424

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Heathener said:

    I finished BBC's House of Maxwell yesterday.

    Highly recommend it, although for me personally it was unsettling. It's a disturbing and extraordinary story.

    I worked just down the road from the Mirror building at the time. One thing the series did not capture was the sense of collective shock when Maxwell disappeared. He really was a major public figure. And soon after a second shock when it turned out he was a crook, similar perhaps to the reaction to the Savile revelations after his death.
    We should give some thought as to how our libel laws protect the rich and criminal. It is a recurring theme of why they take so long to be exposed.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/apr/28/outrageous-libel-laws-protected-jimmy-savile-lawsuits
    Not really in this case. While it is true Maxwell was known to be dodgy, and had been disqualified as a director in the past, it was a major surprise when the Mirror Group pension fund was found to be empty. And while Savile might have been protected by libel laws, this was really because the Sun could not stand up the evidence against him. There have been several public figures who were wrongly accused and subsequently cleared; do we really want to make it open season for a press who, with the best will in the world, will print as many rumours as they can get away with.

    While I agree our libel laws are outrageous, I'm not convinced of the case for allowing the British press to print any salubrious gossip they think will sell papers.
    It is the scale of the awards (including deliberately inflated costs) that make libel suits so dangerous for journalists.
    Yes, and certainly for local and specialist journals. But if the Sun had the evidence to convince Rupert Murdoch, they'd not have been afraid of a libel suit. We saw this with the Daily Mail naming the killers of Stephen Lawrence, who'd not been convicted. I do not know where the tipping point should be between protecting rich villains and letting the press destroy the innocent.
    Morning everyone! The two accused of the Stephen Lawrence killing were not rich, or well-connected, and I'm not sure that many libel firms would have approached them with a 'no win, no fee' offer.
    It's said that Dacre was initially dismissive of the Lawrence's campaign, but then discovered that the very pleasant man then decorating his house was Neville Lawrence and changed his mind! It's not what, but who you know.

    And as we discussed yesterday, the Sun backed off Savile at least once
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,590

    Jacob Rees Mogg’s admission that actually enacting the brilliant Brexit deal the government negotiated would be an act of immense self-harm pretty much encapsulates how utterly incompetent the lying charlatans who run the country are.

    It doesn't matter which side of the fence you are on, either. It's a face-palm that brings us all together.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,860
    TimS said:

    HYUFD said:

    He can probably survive as an MP until the next general election, he did not commit a criminal offence nor necessarily something clearly in breach of the Parliamentary Standards rules.

    However his chances of being selected as Conservative Parliamentary candidate for Tiverton and Honiton again at that election are effectively zero

    I suspect this is right. And conservatives will win that seat at a GE. He’s going into the permanent parliamentary sin bin alongside the likes of Corbyn.

    The film of him earlier saying he would “await the verdict of the enquiry” was pathetic, in both the pejorative and sympathetic sense. A man in the midst of a profound, utter humiliation.
    So predictions of his ejaculation turned out to be premature.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,786
    JonWC said:

    Not too sure the LibDems have that great a chance in any by-election. Of course it is possible, but they are extravagantly weak here having dropped out of the top two since 2010. Most of the councillors are gone, there is now no activity to speak of, you never see LibDem comment in the local media.

    T and H and its forerunners have been Tory for 100 years, and the LibDems no longer have anything in common with the kind of traditional Liberals who supported them in places like this.

    They may be 3rd now and a long way behind, but they have been under 2000 votes in the past. I think their by election team would walk it provided Labour don't put up a fight.
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 5,747
    This mass mobilisation thing brewing in Russia… how’s that going to work without those conscripts getting more armoured mobility? Isn’t it just going to be feeding meat in to the grinder given the step up in weapons capability coming Ukraine’s way?

    Goodness knows what impact it will have on Russian society by the time it’s done.
This discussion has been closed.