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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Zac Goldsmith’s odds have eased to the point where he becom

SystemSystem Posts: 12,032
edited March 2016 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Zac Goldsmith’s odds have eased to the point where he becomes a value bet

Like many PBers I’m sitting on bets at 33/1 placed in March 2013 on Sadiq Khan to be next Mayor of London. This was on the basis of a tip from Henry G Manson who argued that EdM’s then appointment of the Tooting MP as Shadow Minister for London would play a big part in him securing the nomination. And so it turned out.

Read the full story here


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Comments

  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,367
    edited March 2016
    Interesting, makes sense if you haven't taken Tissue Price's tip of 22/1 on Zac.
  • I've decided to contribute further to William Hills' profits, by backing A Splash of Ginge as well in the 17.30.

    Gingers have always brought great joy in my life, and also got me into trouble as well.
  • FPT But on topic here

    Have to admire the broad coalition Zac is trying to build to win in May


    https://twitter.com/mikejoslin/status/710227415012921344
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,503
    Mr. Eagles, ha, wish I had 33/1 on one chap and 22/1 on the other. (Backed neither, so no dog in the fight at all).

    On the more important matter of F1, a qualifying tip is unlikely (especially if the Q3 market isn't up) but I'll peruse practice tomorrow. Because it's in Australia and P3 will start around 4am, the pre-qualifying piece will be up tomorrow.
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    FPT
    Whats this I hear, about ginger beer?
  • Mr. Eagles, ha, wish I had 33/1 on one chap and 22/1 on the other. (Backed neither, so no dog in the fight at all).

    On the more important matter of F1, a qualifying tip is unlikely (especially if the Q3 market isn't up) but I'll peruse practice tomorrow. Because it's in Australia and P3 will start around 4am, the pre-qualifying piece will be up tomorrow.

    There's going to be a lot of pissed off PBers when Winston McKenzie wins on his pro Heathrow platform.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,411

    I've decided to contribute further to William Hills' profits, by backing A Splash of Ginge as well in the 17.30.

    Gingers have always brought great joy in my life, and also got me into trouble as well.

    You've backed the wrong horse I'm afraid then.

    http://i1.getsurrey.co.uk/incoming/article8544750.ece/ALTERNATES/s615/Splash-of-Ginge.jpg

    Not exactly ginger & male. -> Sex: Bay Gelding <-

    http://images.racingpost.com/2012/Nov/50968.jpg <- Chestnut mare
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 61,335
    Evening all,

    Looks like George has pulled another stunner with PIP payment changes. Tory MPs already getting restive on this one. Budget only just 24 hours old.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,503
    Mr. Borough, it may well be the problem for Osborne is not his Budget measures, but that the Budget is a means for backbenchers to sharpen their knives in response to Osborne's behaviour over the EU vote.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,139

    Mr. Eagles, ha, wish I had 33/1 on one chap and 22/1 on the other. (Backed neither, so no dog in the fight at all).

    On the more important matter of F1, a qualifying tip is unlikely (especially if the Q3 market isn't up) but I'll peruse practice tomorrow. Because it's in Australia and P3 will start around 4am, the pre-qualifying piece will be up tomorrow.

    There's going to be a lot of pissed off PBers when Winston McKenzie wins on his pro Heathrow platform.
    I must admit to being sorely tempted to vote for him.
  • rcs1000 said:

    Mr. Eagles, ha, wish I had 33/1 on one chap and 22/1 on the other. (Backed neither, so no dog in the fight at all).

    On the more important matter of F1, a qualifying tip is unlikely (especially if the Q3 market isn't up) but I'll peruse practice tomorrow. Because it's in Australia and P3 will start around 4am, the pre-qualifying piece will be up tomorrow.

    There's going to be a lot of pissed off PBers when Winston McKenzie wins on his pro Heathrow platform.
    I must admit to being sorely tempted to vote for him.
    If I lived in London, I'd give Winston my first vote, and Zac my second vote.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,411

    rcs1000 said:

    Mr. Eagles, ha, wish I had 33/1 on one chap and 22/1 on the other. (Backed neither, so no dog in the fight at all).

    On the more important matter of F1, a qualifying tip is unlikely (especially if the Q3 market isn't up) but I'll peruse practice tomorrow. Because it's in Australia and P3 will start around 4am, the pre-qualifying piece will be up tomorrow.

    There's going to be a lot of pissed off PBers when Winston McKenzie wins on his pro Heathrow platform.
    I must admit to being sorely tempted to vote for him.
    If I lived in London, I'd give Winston my first vote, and Zac my second vote.
    A Winston victory would be errm... expensive :p
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,139

    rcs1000 said:

    Mr. Eagles, ha, wish I had 33/1 on one chap and 22/1 on the other. (Backed neither, so no dog in the fight at all).

    On the more important matter of F1, a qualifying tip is unlikely (especially if the Q3 market isn't up) but I'll peruse practice tomorrow. Because it's in Australia and P3 will start around 4am, the pre-qualifying piece will be up tomorrow.

    There's going to be a lot of pissed off PBers when Winston McKenzie wins on his pro Heathrow platform.
    I must admit to being sorely tempted to vote for him.
    If I lived in London, I'd give Winston my first vote, and Zac my second vote.
    Does the former UKIP, LibDem, Veritas, etc. member have any particularly firm views on anything other than Heathrow?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,367
    edited March 2016
    Pulpstar said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Mr. Eagles, ha, wish I had 33/1 on one chap and 22/1 on the other. (Backed neither, so no dog in the fight at all).

    On the more important matter of F1, a qualifying tip is unlikely (especially if the Q3 market isn't up) but I'll peruse practice tomorrow. Because it's in Australia and P3 will start around 4am, the pre-qualifying piece will be up tomorrow.

    There's going to be a lot of pissed off PBers when Winston McKenzie wins on his pro Heathrow platform.
    I must admit to being sorely tempted to vote for him.
    If I lived in London, I'd give Winston my first vote, and Zac my second vote.
    A Winston victory would be errm... expensive :p
    It would improve the gaiety of the nation, worth the losses
  • rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Mr. Eagles, ha, wish I had 33/1 on one chap and 22/1 on the other. (Backed neither, so no dog in the fight at all).

    On the more important matter of F1, a qualifying tip is unlikely (especially if the Q3 market isn't up) but I'll peruse practice tomorrow. Because it's in Australia and P3 will start around 4am, the pre-qualifying piece will be up tomorrow.

    There's going to be a lot of pissed off PBers when Winston McKenzie wins on his pro Heathrow platform.
    I must admit to being sorely tempted to vote for him.
    If I lived in London, I'd give Winston my first vote, and Zac my second vote.
    Does the former UKIP, LibDem, Veritas, etc. member have any particularly firm views on anything other than Heathrow?
    He's not keen on the gays, and he is of the firm view, the parties he was forced out was because of racism
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,411

    Pulpstar said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Mr. Eagles, ha, wish I had 33/1 on one chap and 22/1 on the other. (Backed neither, so no dog in the fight at all).

    On the more important matter of F1, a qualifying tip is unlikely (especially if the Q3 market isn't up) but I'll peruse practice tomorrow. Because it's in Australia and P3 will start around 4am, the pre-qualifying piece will be up tomorrow.

    There's going to be a lot of pissed off PBers when Winston McKenzie wins on his pro Heathrow platform.
    I must admit to being sorely tempted to vote for him.
    If I lived in London, I'd give Winston my first vote, and Zac my second vote.
    A Winston victory would be errm... expensive :p
    It would improve the gaiety of the nation, worth the losses
    Donald Trump might just about pay for his win, I guess :p
  • Jeez, what a finish by Cause of Causes.

    A typical ginge, teased me at the start, but no happy finish
  • John_NJohn_N Posts: 389
    Torygraph header (or Google's, if those tax dodgers write their own link text):

    "George Osborne warned he only has a '50/50 shot' at hitting Budget surplus target"

    Wow! I read "warned" as active rather than passive, and thought "What a shambles! Is he the Kaiser with the crowd outside, who knows he's got nowhere to run? No government minister in their right mind sets a big economic 'target' and then says he's only got a half-chance of meeting it."

    "Don't they teach leadership at St Paul's?" I thought.

    But no, "warned" was meant to be passive, and the guy doing the action is some "expert" character from the Institute of Fiscal Studies. State school, but senior ex-Whitehall. He ain't going to be acting off his own bat - that's obvious.

    So Osborne is being kicked around the floor. By the Torygraph.

    Could the government be in trouble? You kind of realise now why they wanted the leading Tory Brexiteers to stay in the cabinet.

    Remain have a bad hand. What are they going to do? Digging the dirt on leading Leavers sounds good. Or ask for some terrorist or other military event to be organised so that it supports EU membership, but that seems very difficult.

    Leave? Weaken the government. Take steam out of all of its cylinders. Make it back down on the tampon tax. Cause trouble for Cameron, Osborne, May and all the other jokers. Go, go, go!

    I'm seriously considering trebling my investment in Leave. The price is still lower than when I piled in. It won't be for long.








  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    6/1 winner to finish the day :)
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,411
    Scott_P said:

    6/1 winner to finish the day :)

    How is Peter the Punter doing :) ?
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    Pulpstar said:

    How is Peter the Punter doing :) ?

    He said day 1 was not very good, but not a disaster. I haven't heard from him since
  • ArtistArtist Posts: 1,892
    edited March 2016
    Labour are never confident of winning anything ever, yet they seem quite bullish about Khan's chances of winning this time round. I think Labour could be sweeping inner London to such an extent that it only needs its vote to hold up from last time in the outer parts.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,459
    Scott_P said:

    Pulpstar said:

    How is Peter the Punter doing :) ?

    He said day 1 was not very good, but not a disaster. I haven't heard from him since
    What happened to Zabana? One minute he was about to line up, the next he had got rid of his jock..??!!
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    TOPPING said:

    What happened to Zabana? One minute he was about to line up, the next he had got rid of his jock..??!!

    Apparently he was expecting to turn, was facing the wrong way, and when the starter called he tangled with another horse.

    Hills have refunded all bets (as a free bet)
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,459
    Scott_P said:

    TOPPING said:

    What happened to Zabana? One minute he was about to line up, the next he had got rid of his jock..??!!

    Apparently he was expecting to turn, was facing the wrong way, and when the starter called he tangled with another horse.

    Hills have refunded all bets (as a free bet)
    Thanks there was a bit of that this week. One facing the wrong way, they all take a turn and lo and behold the wrong way guy jumps off in front...echoes of Mr Pipe Snr...
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,503
    F1: not sure if I'll watch this, but there's a programme on Channel 4 tonight with Coulthard and Guy Martin.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,249
    When does a losing bet become a value bet? Surely only as insurance or when you are confident that you are going to be able to trade it at a better price.

    I have no vote in this so my views don't matter a damn but Zac has underwhelmed from the start. Is it really going to get better for him? I have my doubts.
  • MetatronMetatron Posts: 193
    Surely any bet on Goldsmith at 9/4 is a value trap bet? Who exactly is a trust fund multi millionaire Tory green fanatic with no real CV appealing to?There is more value in Galloway at 66/1 or Lib Dem/UKIP/Independent at 3 figures digit odds
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    DavidL said:

    When does a losing bet become a value bet?

    When the implied odds are greater then the actual odds.

    If I could continually back 50-1 shots at 100-1 I'd be rich.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,503
    Indeed, Mr. Alistair. It's very counter-intuitive to back something you think won't happen, but it does make sense.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,459
    Metatron said:

    Who exactly is a trust fund multi millionaire Tory green fanatic with no real CV appealing to

    Is the critical question
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    Indeed, Mr. Alistair. It's very counter-intuitive to back something you think won't happen, but it does make sense.

    The punishing thing about value betting is
    A) having to be right in your true odds estimation
    B) the stream of losers
    C) having to keep doing it in the face of that stream of losers.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,503
    Mr. Alistair, aye. Been doing the F1 for a while now, but it's still a bit difficult when there's a bad patch.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,139
    DavidL said:

    When does a losing bet become a value bet? Surely only as insurance or when you are confident that you are going to be able to trade it at a better price.

    I have no vote in this so my views don't matter a damn but Zac has underwhelmed from the start. Is it really going to get better for him? I have my doubts.

    I'm in full agreement. Getting a Tory mayor of London - a left wing city - is never easy in the best of times. With an uninspiring candidate, they will struggle.

    3-1 on Goldsmith doesn't tempt me at all.

    Now, tell me what odds I can get on Winston?
  • rcs1000 said:

    DavidL said:

    When does a losing bet become a value bet? Surely only as insurance or when you are confident that you are going to be able to trade it at a better price.

    I have no vote in this so my views don't matter a damn but Zac has underwhelmed from the start. Is it really going to get better for him? I have my doubts.

    I'm in full agreement. Getting a Tory mayor of London - a left wing city - is never easy in the best of times. With an uninspiring candidate, they will struggle.

    3-1 on Goldsmith doesn't tempt me at all.

    Now, tell me what odds I can get on Winston?
    500/1

    https://sports.ladbrokes.com/en-gb/betting/politics/british/next-mayor/2016-london-mayoral-election/220800275/
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,139
    Metatron said:

    Surely any bet on Goldsmith at 9/4 is a value trap bet? Who exactly is a trust fund multi millionaire Tory green fanatic with no real CV appealing to?There is more value in Galloway at 66/1 or Lib Dem/UKIP/Independent at 3 figures digit odds

    Except for the LibDem bit, I agree with you.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,139

    rcs1000 said:

    DavidL said:

    When does a losing bet become a value bet? Surely only as insurance or when you are confident that you are going to be able to trade it at a better price.

    I have no vote in this so my views don't matter a damn but Zac has underwhelmed from the start. Is it really going to get better for him? I have my doubts.

    I'm in full agreement. Getting a Tory mayor of London - a left wing city - is never easy in the best of times. With an uninspiring candidate, they will struggle.

    3-1 on Goldsmith doesn't tempt me at all.

    Now, tell me what odds I can get on Winston?
    500/1

    https://sports.ladbrokes.com/en-gb/betting/politics/british/next-mayor/2016-london-mayoral-election/220800275/
    Bargain!
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @Reuters: House Speaker Ryan says it's increasingly likely the Republican convention will be contested https://t.co/Eo0pET5xeM https://t.co/okZJWYIdBh
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,160

    Lovely photo of Cameron

    I think this is the bit where he thinks "shit, should have backed leave"
    http://www.faz.net/
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @scotleaveeu: "Independence as a political objective had seemingly been lost" #VoteLeave #brexit #snp https://t.co/1HK7GfnBUK
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    edited March 2016
    There is rather a lot of poetic justice in Zac's chances being ruined by his race-baiting campaign. Lest we forget, he was comfortably ahead of Sadiq in the polls when they were first picked last September -- unsurprisingly since Zac, whether you agree with him or not, atleast showed in the past he had some personality and had the balls to think for himself on issues, whereas Sadiq seemed like the dictionary definition of "dull career politician".

    My strong suspicion is that the "are you thinking what we're thinking" campaign is making Muslims (who usually give mid-term elections a miss) more determined to vote, and swinging young "right-on" voters who might initially have been attracted to Zac more firmly over to Sadiq.
  • MP_SEMP_SE Posts: 3,642


    Lovely photo of Cameron

    I think this is the bit where he thinks "shit, should have backed leave"
    http://www.faz.net/

    Cameron looks in his element hanging out with EU bureaucrats and leaders.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    edited March 2016
    @TheEconomist: How the Republicans can stop someone like Trump getting this close again https://t.co/ye5AHcHG5T https://t.co/9JBxhyft0o

    Yes, AV is the answer...
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 59,026
    Khan will win. Hands down.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 59,026
    Scott_P said:

    @TheEconomist: How the Republicans can stop someone like Trump getting this close again https://t.co/ye5AHcHG5T https://t.co/9JBxhyft0o

    Yes, AV is the answer...

    AV is like 42 - the answer to the meaning of life, the universe and everything.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @bbclaurak: PM has got exemption from other EU countries to get rid of VAT on tampons - #tampontax rebellion averted?
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,160
    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: PM has got exemption from other EU countries to get rid of VAT on tampons - #tampontax rebellion averted?

    It's like an episode of Yes Minister

    if it was that easy why didn't he do it in 2010. ? Stupid.
  • MP_SEMP_SE Posts: 3,642
    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: PM has got exemption from other EU countries to get rid of VAT on tampons - #tampontax rebellion averted?

    Cameron's most substantial concession yet.
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    Scott_P said:

    @TheEconomist: How the Republicans can stop someone like Trump getting this close again https://t.co/ye5AHcHG5T https://t.co/9JBxhyft0o

    Yes, AV is the answer...

    What's Trump done to the Economist to get them so riled up. Has the editor lost a packet on Rubio?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 59,026
    MP_SE said:

    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: PM has got exemption from other EU countries to get rid of VAT on tampons - #tampontax rebellion averted?

    Cameron's most substantial concession yet.
    What a fanny.
  • PolruanPolruan Posts: 2,083
    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: PM has got exemption from other EU countries to get rid of VAT on tampons - #tampontax rebellion averted?

    Are there any strings attached?
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @EdConwaySky: Before No10 starts spinning the "Tampon Tax" thing as a UK "victory", my understanding is the EC was on the brink of announcing this anyway
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 59,026
    Polruan said:

    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: PM has got exemption from other EU countries to get rid of VAT on tampons - #tampontax rebellion averted?

    Are there any strings attached?
    Lol!!!!
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @rosschawkins: So did Osborne raise tampon tax compromise at Budget speech to rouse Euroscep anger so PM cd unveil even bigger win tonight? surely not...
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 27,525
    Polruan said:

    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: PM has got exemption from other EU countries to get rid of VAT on tampons - #tampontax rebellion averted?

    Are there any strings attached?
    Post of the WEEK!
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 27,525
    Scott_P said:

    @rosschawkins: So did Osborne raise tampon tax compromise at Budget speech to rouse Euroscep anger so PM cd unveil even bigger win tonight? surely not...

    Even bigger win? Persuading the EU to exempt us from a luxury tax on tampons? Is this the key to inspiring the Remain hordes?
  • richardDoddrichardDodd Posts: 5,472
    A Brooke..why didn't Labour do it during their 13 years in power...
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,160

    A Brooke..why didn't Labour do it during their 13 years in power...

    No idea, best ask Tony Blair.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 59,026

    Scott_P said:

    @rosschawkins: So did Osborne raise tampon tax compromise at Budget speech to rouse Euroscep anger so PM cd unveil even bigger win tonight? surely not...

    Even bigger win? Persuading the EU to exempt us from a luxury tax on tampons? Is this the key to inspiring the Remain hordes?
    It's a great deal.

    Period.
  • richardDoddrichardDodd Posts: 5,472
    A BROOKE..Blair was busy killing people and Brown was busy killing the economy..
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,139

    Scott_P said:

    @rosschawkins: So did Osborne raise tampon tax compromise at Budget speech to rouse Euroscep anger so PM cd unveil even bigger win tonight? surely not...

    Even bigger win? Persuading the EU to exempt us from a luxury tax on tampons? Is this the key to inspiring the Remain hordes?
    It's a great deal.

    Period.
    Ooooowwwwww
  • MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 7,382
    MikeK said:

    Scott_P said:

    @TheEconomist: How the Republicans can stop someone like Trump getting this close again https://t.co/ye5AHcHG5T https://t.co/9JBxhyft0o

    Yes, AV is the answer...

    What's Trump done to the Economist to get them so riled up. Has the editor lost a packet on Rubio?
    No. He's a racist demagogue.
  • MP_SEMP_SE Posts: 3,642

    Scott_P said:

    @rosschawkins: So did Osborne raise tampon tax compromise at Budget speech to rouse Euroscep anger so PM cd unveil even bigger win tonight? surely not...

    Even bigger win? Persuading the EU to exempt us from a luxury tax on tampons? Is this the key to inspiring the Remain hordes?
    It's a great deal.

    Period.
    What an ovary reaction.
  • A Brooke..why didn't Labour do it during their 13 years in power...

    Why didn't the Tories remove it in the 90's.
    I remember my boss at the place I worked at between 1989-95 complaining about VAT on sanitary products.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,139

    MikeK said:

    Scott_P said:

    @TheEconomist: How the Republicans can stop someone like Trump getting this close again https://t.co/ye5AHcHG5T https://t.co/9JBxhyft0o

    Yes, AV is the answer...

    What's Trump done to the Economist to get them so riled up. Has the editor lost a packet on Rubio?
    No. He's a racist demagogue.
    Yes, but what other than that?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,411

    MikeK said:

    Scott_P said:

    @TheEconomist: How the Republicans can stop someone like Trump getting this close again https://t.co/ye5AHcHG5T https://t.co/9JBxhyft0o

    Yes, AV is the answer...

    What's Trump done to the Economist to get them so riled up. Has the editor lost a packet on Rubio?
    No. He's a racist demagogue.
    Great for spicing up the GOP race from a betting point of view, probably deserved a few more threads than he has got :p
  • Mr. Borough, it may well be the problem for Osborne is not his Budget measures, but that the Budget is a means for backbenchers to sharpen their knives in response to Osborne's behaviour over the EU vote.

    He just could not resist twisting the OBR's bland statement into one giving the impression they are warning about LEAVE. Then he wonders why people are plotting to give him a black eye on his budget.
  • Agreed.
    Tim Montgomerie ن Verified account @montie
    It does appear that with his disability cuts + middle class tax relief, Osborne has learnt absolutely nothing from the tax credits fiasco.
  • dyingswandyingswan Posts: 189
    I always look forward to Budget Day plus 1 when the Left tells us how the national finances could be planned fairly. This year bang on time the Guardian has set out its own business model as to how to do these things.They will balance the books over 3 years. Really? With their collapse of circulation. They will make 250 people redundant in what can only be described as brutal or savage cuts. They will abandon the Midlands Goods Shed. Why cant they borrow to invest? You know, just for infrastructure so that the business grows. It is not yet clear whether the P45 recipients include Mr Milne. There surely cant be 250 vacancies on Newsnight to soak up the resultant pool of unemployed.
  • PolruanPolruan Posts: 2,083
    dyingswan said:

    I always look forward to Budget Day plus 1 when the Left tells us how the national finances could be planned fairly. This year bang on time the Guardian has set out its own business model as to how to do these things.They will balance the books over 3 years. Really? With their collapse of circulation. They will make 250 people redundant in what can only be described as brutal or savage cuts. They will abandon the Midlands Goods Shed. Why cant they borrow to invest? You know, just for infrastructure so that the business grows. It is not yet clear whether the P45 recipients include Mr Milne. There surely cant be 250 vacancies on Newsnight to soak up the resultant pool of unemployed.

    You do understand that the Guardian doesn't have its own currency in which it can issue debt and levy taxes, I assume?
  • Let us consider how these changes to disability rules could have been handled.

    1. The DWP (not Osborne) prepares the ground by tabling a few options and the implications, but runs effective win/lose so that the number of existing clients that are losers is a small number e.g. under 200,000 and the number of winners is also clear (expect that to be many times bigger). Make the biggest hits fall on new clients.
    2. The DWP invite comments.
    3. The DWP finese it and then implement.

    Problem is that Osborne seems to have preferred to be the "Big I Am" deciding it at a time of his choosing, so the preparation of the ground in a communication plan was pretty useless.

    He deserves for this to unravel and may be he might learn to stop controlling all announcements? But judging by his past behaviour, I doubt it.
  • NorfolkTilIDieNorfolkTilIDie Posts: 1,268
    Are the Cameroons really trying to celebrate getting the EU to allow us to reduce VAT on tampons when they are enforcing raising taxes on home insulation, the best lever to prevent carbon emissions in the UK??
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053

    MikeK said:

    Scott_P said:

    @TheEconomist: How the Republicans can stop someone like Trump getting this close again https://t.co/ye5AHcHG5T https://t.co/9JBxhyft0o

    Yes, AV is the answer...

    What's Trump done to the Economist to get them so riled up. Has the editor lost a packet on Rubio?
    No. He's a racist demagogue.
    Who, Trump or the Editor?
  • rcs1000 said:

    Metatron said:

    Surely any bet on Goldsmith at 9/4 is a value trap bet? Who exactly is a trust fund multi millionaire Tory green fanatic with no real CV appealing to?There is more value in Galloway at 66/1 or Lib Dem/UKIP/Independent at 3 figures digit odds

    Except for the LibDem bit, I agree with you.
    Not nice, in a family way.
  • OchEyeOchEye Posts: 1,469
    One wonders why there aren't so many bankers hanging from lamp posts, oops, so sorry I'm being premature. Unlike PBtories, I don't have problems with ejaculation and too many Viagra tablets
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,139

    Are the Cameroons really trying to celebrate getting the EU to allow us to reduce VAT on tampons when they are enforcing raising taxes on home insulation, the best lever to prevent carbon emissions in the UK??

    Yes
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,098
    MP_SE said:

    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: PM has got exemption from other EU countries to get rid of VAT on tampons - #tampontax rebellion averted?

    Cameron's most substantial concession yet.
    If this is a proper repatriation of VAT levels, I would be seriously impressed.

    If it it just a tampon fad, I'm not.

    We should be able to zero rate whatever we want, as a sovereign nation.
  • Polruan said:

    dyingswan said:

    I always look forward to Budget Day plus 1 when the Left tells us how the national finances could be planned fairly. This year bang on time the Guardian has set out its own business model as to how to do these things.They will balance the books over 3 years. Really? With their collapse of circulation. They will make 250 people redundant in what can only be described as brutal or savage cuts. They will abandon the Midlands Goods Shed. Why cant they borrow to invest? You know, just for infrastructure so that the business grows. It is not yet clear whether the P45 recipients include Mr Milne. There surely cant be 250 vacancies on Newsnight to soak up the resultant pool of unemployed.

    You do understand that the Guardian doesn't have its own currency in which it can issue debt and levy taxes, I assume?
    I thought that is what the Scott Trust money tree does for the Guardian?
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,442
    Mortimer said:

    MP_SE said:

    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: PM has got exemption from other EU countries to get rid of VAT on tampons - #tampontax rebellion averted?

    Cameron's most substantial concession yet.
    If this is a proper repatriation of VAT levels, I would be seriously impressed.

    If it it just a tampon fad, I'm not.

    We should be able to zero rate whatever we want, as a sovereign nation.
    I doubt it's zero rated, probably just exempt.
  • Are the comments from the IFS the most scathing that they have made of any Osborne budget?

    “Mr Osborne had three fiscal rules – the welfare cap; the rule which said debt should fall as a fraction of national income every year; and the rule to get to budget surplus by 2019-20. He broke his welfare cap in November, and it is now broken by a bigger margin. He told us yesterday he is on course to break his debt rule by the end of this month. The surplus rule is the last rule standing.”
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,098
    One for Mr S. Thomas:

    http://www.theguardian.com/books/2016/mar/17/harry-potters-female-readers-now-driving-the-boom-in-grip-lit

    Not heard the 'grip lit' epithet before. I like it!
  • NorfolkTilIDieNorfolkTilIDie Posts: 1,268
    Nice thing about a Trump nomination is that it nicely demonstrates which right wingers are actual conservatives, and which just side with conservative movement because of the demonisation of Mexicans, African Americans, Muslims, Chinese etc.
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,442
    Pulpstar said:

    MikeK said:

    Scott_P said:

    @TheEconomist: How the Republicans can stop someone like Trump getting this close again https://t.co/ye5AHcHG5T https://t.co/9JBxhyft0o

    Yes, AV is the answer...

    What's Trump done to the Economist to get them so riled up. Has the editor lost a packet on Rubio?
    No. He's a racist demagogue.
    Great for spicing up the GOP race from a betting point of view, probably deserved a few more threads than he has got :p
    What's world threatening about any of that?

    The US will be fine.
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,098

    Mortimer said:

    MP_SE said:

    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: PM has got exemption from other EU countries to get rid of VAT on tampons - #tampontax rebellion averted?

    Cameron's most substantial concession yet.
    If this is a proper repatriation of VAT levels, I would be seriously impressed.

    If it it just a tampon fad, I'm not.

    We should be able to zero rate whatever we want, as a sovereign nation.
    I doubt it's zero rated, probably just exempt.
    Really?

    Are there any other exempt goods?
  • PolruanPolruan Posts: 2,083

    Polruan said:

    dyingswan said:

    I always look forward to Budget Day plus 1 when the Left tells us how the national finances could be planned fairly. This year bang on time the Guardian has set out its own business model as to how to do these things.They will balance the books over 3 years. Really? With their collapse of circulation. They will make 250 people redundant in what can only be described as brutal or savage cuts. They will abandon the Midlands Goods Shed. Why cant they borrow to invest? You know, just for infrastructure so that the business grows. It is not yet clear whether the P45 recipients include Mr Milne. There surely cant be 250 vacancies on Newsnight to soak up the resultant pool of unemployed.

    You do understand that the Guardian doesn't have its own currency in which it can issue debt and levy taxes, I assume?
    I thought that is what the Scott Trust money tree does for the Guardian?
    I think increasingly it's a bit like the Guardian is Greece and the Scott Trust is the Troika.
  • Time to re-look at bets on the referendum? The Lib Dem GE2015 chief is now guiding Vote REMAIN!

    Julia Hartley-Brewer ‎@JuliaHB1
    This man @RyanCoetzee is director of strategy for the Britain Stronger In campaign. Facts aren't their thing. https://twitter.com/ryancoetzee/status/709295647455891456
  • NorfolkTilIDieNorfolkTilIDie Posts: 1,268
    Does EU have minimum taxes for services or just goods??
  • EPGEPG Posts: 6,637
    The comparison of a business in a declining sector, to the national economy, to disprove Keynesian stimulus, is the most ill-informed and dispiriting rant I've read on PB. At least SeanT is well-informed and amusing when wrong
  • PolruanPolruan Posts: 2,083
    Mortimer said:

    Mortimer said:

    MP_SE said:

    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: PM has got exemption from other EU countries to get rid of VAT on tampons - #tampontax rebellion averted?

    Cameron's most substantial concession yet.
    If this is a proper repatriation of VAT levels, I would be seriously impressed.

    If it it just a tampon fad, I'm not.

    We should be able to zero rate whatever we want, as a sovereign nation.
    I doubt it's zero rated, probably just exempt.
    Really?

    Are there any other exempt goods?
    Schedule 9 of the VAT Act 1984 is your friend here.

    Your instinct is right, it's mostly services but the key exceptions (Group 6&7) are various goods relating to the provision of education, health and welfare.
  • PolruanPolruan Posts: 2,083
    Mortimer said:

    MP_SE said:

    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: PM has got exemption from other EU countries to get rid of VAT on tampons - #tampontax rebellion averted?

    Cameron's most substantial concession yet.
    If this is a proper repatriation of VAT levels, I would be seriously impressed.

    If it it just a tampon fad, I'm not.

    We should be able to zero rate whatever we want, as a sovereign nation.
    Surely "a sanitary fad"?
  • EPGEPG Posts: 6,637
    What do the odds imply about Trump? They must be some combination of an outright delegate victory in which he wins the nomination with probability 1, and a convention with no overall majority which he wins with probability substantially less than 1.
    Exluding Trump at a hung convention would be an outrage to a lot of voters. Might he run anyway? It would look odd to appoint the runner-up as candidate, but maybe excluding both Trump and Cruz would be even more of an outrage to the voters - though highly desirable to the party elites if they could get away with it
    Ironically Kasich might be more likely to win the nomination if he dropped out now, giving Cruz a chance in several winner-take-all remaining states, and sought to win the goodwill of delegates for stopping both Cruz and Trump, rather than continuing to the convention on his own steam!
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 59,026

    Time to re-look at bets on the referendum? The Lib Dem GE2015 chief is now guiding Vote REMAIN!

    Julia Hartley-Brewer ‎@JuliaHB1
    This man @RyanCoetzee is director of strategy for the Britain Stronger In campaign. Facts aren't their thing. https://twitter.com/ryancoetzee/status/709295647455891456

    Oh, the "I'm offended" line.

    It's also rubbish. Most Commonwealth nations have English as their first or second language, and none would be offended by it - from the Charter of the Commonwealth:

    "Affirming that the special strength of the Commonwealth lies in the
    combination of our diversity and our shared inheritance in language, culture
    and the rule of law; and bound together by shared history and tradition;
    by respect for all states and peoples; by shared values and principles and
    by concern for the vulnerable"

    http://thecommonwealth.org/sites/default/files/page/documents/CharteroftheCommonwealth.pdf

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_in_the_Commonwealth_of_Nations
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    edited March 2016
    EPG said:

    What do the odds imply about Trump? They must be some combination of an outright delegate victory in which he wins the nomination with probability 1, and a convention with no overall majority which he wins with probability substantially less than 1.
    Exluding Trump at a hung convention would be an outrage to a lot of voters. Might he run anyway? It would look odd to appoint the runner-up as candidate, but maybe excluding both Trump and Cruz would be even more of an outrage to the voters - though highly desirable to the party elites if they could get away with it
    Ironically Kasich might be more likely to win the nomination if he dropped out now, giving Cruz a chance in several winner-take-all remaining states, and sought to win the goodwill of delegates for stopping both Cruz and Trump, rather than continuing to the convention on his own steam!

    Well I will give Trump a 60% chance to have a majority of delegates + a 10% chance for him to be the nominee if it goes to a convention = 64%.

    It's nice for Trump to see such publications as the Economist go such strongly against him, with enemies like these Trump doesn't need friends.

    Attacks by discredited enemies is what fuels Trump's campaign from it's start.
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,442
    Polruan said:

    Mortimer said:

    Mortimer said:

    MP_SE said:

    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: PM has got exemption from other EU countries to get rid of VAT on tampons - #tampontax rebellion averted?

    Cameron's most substantial concession yet.
    If this is a proper repatriation of VAT levels, I would be seriously impressed.

    If it it just a tampon fad, I'm not.

    We should be able to zero rate whatever we want, as a sovereign nation.
    I doubt it's zero rated, probably just exempt.
    Really?

    Are there any other exempt goods?
    Schedule 9 of the VAT Act 1984 is your friend here.

    Your instinct is right, it's mostly services but the key exceptions (Group 6&7) are various goods relating to the provision of education, health and welfare.

    I accept that more goods are 0 rated than exempt, but I think the EU would look more favourably on an exemption from the system; plus I doubt the government wants to hand a tax windfall to big pharma, particularly.
  • NorfolkTilIDieNorfolkTilIDie Posts: 1,268
    EPG said:

    The comparison of a business in a declining sector, to the national economy, to disprove Keynesian stimulus, is the most ill-informed and dispiriting rant I've read on PB. At least SeanT is well-informed and amusing when wrong

    While I agree that its a silly comparison, I don't think we can continue to argue for stimulus seven years after the recession.
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100

    Time to re-look at bets on the referendum? The Lib Dem GE2015 chief is now guiding Vote REMAIN!

    Julia Hartley-Brewer ‎@JuliaHB1
    This man @RyanCoetzee is director of strategy for the Britain Stronger In campaign. Facts aren't their thing. https://twitter.com/ryancoetzee/status/709295647455891456

    Why is a man who made a career in S.African politics being considered an electoral strategist by the LD and Remain ?

    His job in S.Africa was to mainly help the white minority party D.A. to navigate the treacherous waters of african identity politics, not exactly a prescription for your average western country.
  • PolruanPolruan Posts: 2,083

    Polruan said:

    Mortimer said:

    Mortimer said:

    MP_SE said:

    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: PM has got exemption from other EU countries to get rid of VAT on tampons - #tampontax rebellion averted?

    Cameron's most substantial concession yet.
    If this is a proper repatriation of VAT levels, I would be seriously impressed.

    If it it just a tampon fad, I'm not.

    We should be able to zero rate whatever we want, as a sovereign nation.
    I doubt it's zero rated, probably just exempt.
    Really?

    Are there any other exempt goods?
    Schedule 9 of the VAT Act 1984 is your friend here.

    Your instinct is right, it's mostly services but the key exceptions (Group 6&7) are various goods relating to the provision of education, health and welfare.

    I accept that more goods are 0 rated than exempt, but I think the EU would look more favourably on an exemption from the system; plus I doubt the government wants to hand a tax windfall to big pharma, particularly.
    I'm sure that it'll be a modification to the directive (or whatever - European law isn't my thing) that sets out exempt goods and is brought into UK law in Group 7, and it'll be harmonised across the EU.
  • Speedy said:

    Time to re-look at bets on the referendum? The Lib Dem GE2015 chief is now guiding Vote REMAIN!

    Julia Hartley-Brewer ‎@JuliaHB1
    This man @RyanCoetzee is director of strategy for the Britain Stronger In campaign. Facts aren't their thing. https://twitter.com/ryancoetzee/status/709295647455891456

    Why is a man who made a career in S.African politics being considered an electoral strategist by the LD and Remain ?

    His job in S.Africa was to mainly help the white minority party D.A. to navigate the treacherous waters of african identity politics, not exactly a prescription for your average western country.
    Hush, I am very very happy with the choice. If he can help deliver one of the worst electoral defeats for the Liberal/Lib Dems in 100+ years, just think what this genius can do for REMAIN?

    The puzzle is why anyone would hire him for anything above a shelf stacking role?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 59,026
    Speedy said:

    EPG said:

    What do the odds imply about Trump? They must be some combination of an outright delegate victory in which he wins the nomination with probability 1, and a convention with no overall majority which he wins with probability substantially less than 1.
    Exluding Trump at a hung convention would be an outrage to a lot of voters. Might he run anyway? It would look odd to appoint the runner-up as candidate, but maybe excluding both Trump and Cruz would be even more of an outrage to the voters - though highly desirable to the party elites if they could get away with it
    Ironically Kasich might be more likely to win the nomination if he dropped out now, giving Cruz a chance in several winner-take-all remaining states, and sought to win the goodwill of delegates for stopping both Cruz and Trump, rather than continuing to the convention on his own steam!

    Well I will give Trump a 60% chance to have a majority of delegates + a 10% chance for him to be the nominee if it goes to a convention = 64%.

    It's nice for Trump to see such publications as the Economist go such strongly against him, with enemies like these Trump doesn't need friends.

    Attacks by discredited enemies is what fuels Trump's campaign from it's start.
    I'd see being opposed by The Economist as a badge of honour.
This discussion has been closed.