Another interesting podcast - many thanks to Keiran Pedley for what must be a lot of work putting these together.
I enjoyed it. Interesting conclusion that the result may be more like the AV referendum that the indyref, and that Cameron's intervention may be decisive (pulling Labour and LD voters closer to his PoV *as well as* Tories)
I paid particular notice to Matthew Godwin's point (who I respect a lot) that the Paris Attack didn't move the polls at all, and the big issue for undecided voters of the middle class and middle aged voters is less likely to be immigration and more about a credible alternative model.
The last point has been my view for some time. While voters think Leave is the bigger risk, Leave campaigners need to address that concern. It may be unfair but life isn't fair.
So far as I can see, the Paris attacks simply confirmed everyone's prejudices, whatever their pre-existing prejudices happened to be.
Re Paris, it may reflect an understanding that we don't need to import jihadis from Belgium. A UK attack will almost certainly use local staff. BJ4BJ.
Mr. Eagles, hope that number ticks up, and interesting to hear your current thinking.
I'd probably put myself at 9/10 for Leave. I'd probably be nearer your score if it were on how things stand now, but taking the longer view, I can't see us being in being in our interests.
Mr. B, I think the last fish restaurant I went to was Nash's [sp] in Leeds, which was very nice.
Two of my friends who are Eurosceptics are now convinced Leave are going to win because of me.
In their words they thought that it was more likely that Ken Clarke and Michael Heseltine would vote to leave than I ever would.
Britain has been dragged into the eurozone’s efforts to rescue Greece through a Brussels legal manoeuvre that has angered London and complicated David Cameron’s efforts to renegotiate UK membership terms in the EU.
Disregarding strong objections from British ministers, the European Commission on Wednesday proposed using a mothballed EU-wide rescue fund — the European Financial Stability Mechanism — to give Greece the €7bn it needs to cover debt repayments on Monday.
'Incidentally, if a third strike goes ahead, junior doctors will, apparently, walk out of A&E as well.'
And yet the junior doctors keep banging on that their strike is not about money but patient safety !
The Feb 10th date is during daytime only, so plenty of senior doctors to cover at this level of notice.
Understaffed A and E is something that we will have to get used to. Hunts proposed contract cuts pay most for existing staff working unsocial hours such as Emergency departments, and they already struggle to recruit and retain.
Mr. Eagles, hope that number ticks up, and interesting to hear your current thinking.
I'd probably put myself at 9/10 for Leave. I'd probably be nearer your score if it were on how things stand now, but taking the longer view, I can't see us being in being in our interests.
Mr. B, I think the last fish restaurant I went to was Nash's [sp] in Leeds, which was very nice.
Two of my friends who are Eurosceptics are now convinced Leave are going to win because of me.
In their words they thought that it was more likely that Ken Clarke and Michael Heseltine would vote to leave than I ever would.
That's because you come across as fairly sensible most of the time. What is the sensible Eurosceptic answer to a Leave vote triggering a new Sindy Referendum which then goes the other way. Would you be happy with that outcome, which seems quite plausible.
Mr. B, not far wrong (I am in Yorkshire, but not Harrogate).
Give the Wetherby Whaler a try if you like Fish and chips.
The Wetherby Whaler is achain - there's one on the old Harry Ramsden's site in Guiseley
I just looked at the Harry Ramsden web site. What a travesty of the original concept.
The original Harry Ramsden's (in Guiseley) closed down a while ago. To be honest, it was overpriced for what you got. Any number of independent fish and chip shops will produce fare just as good.
When I was doing A-level economics (2001) the advice was not to buy the Halifax as their management was too conservative and profit margins would therefore be too small.
Their solution was to hire Andy Hornby with a brief to be radical and change the view that Halifax made small profits. By the time he had finished in 2008 he had indeed successfully got rid of those small profit margins. Unfortunately his radicalism had done this by turning them into thumping losses.
At this point I realised that economists are idiots.
I always liked Churchill's comment:
"If you put two economists in a room, you get two opinions, unless one of them is Lord Keynes, in which case you get three opinions."
Although in the case of Keynes, all three would probably be right.
Keynes has been undermined over the years by a rigid application of his theories (or worse, parts of his theories), in a way he would never have done. He didn't help himself by calling his masterpiece a General Theory but all the same, he was a very dynamic economist, continually working to the data and the circumstances at hand. I find it highly unlikely that he would have prescribed the solutions of the 1930s to the problems of the 2010s.
He was a genius and General Theory is right up there with The Origin of Species and the Principia as the finest book ever written by a Brit.
I agree that people taking bits out of the whole have distorted the perception of "Keynesianism" . When you read General Theory the whole bedrock of monetarism is in there too.
Britain has been dragged into the eurozone’s efforts to rescue Greece through a Brussels legal manoeuvre that has angered London and complicated David Cameron’s efforts to renegotiate UK membership terms in the EU.
Disregarding strong objections from British ministers, the European Commission on Wednesday proposed using a mothballed EU-wide rescue fund — the European Financial Stability Mechanism — to give Greece the €7bn it needs to cover debt repayments on Monday.
Agree. The best strategy for Leave is to treat this as a vote of confidence in the EU.
I like the "we can trust the PM to be negotiating in good faith, but not the EU" line. If people ask why then point to Blair giving away our rebate for absolutely nothing. "If we vote remain then the EU will consider the matter settled and would have no incentive to deliver the PM's reforms".
Immigration should not be central to the campaign, people who are voting leave because of that issue are 10/10 leavers anyway. We need to convince the 4-5/10 leavers to switch and the 6-8/10 leavers to turn out to vote. They will not be swayed by immigration as an argument.
Another interesting podcast - many thanks to Keiran Pedley for what must be a lot of work putting these together.
I enjoyed it. Interesting conclusion that the result may be more like the AV referendum that the indyref, and that Cameron's intervention may be decisive (pulling Labour and LD voters closer to his PoV *as well as* Tories)
I paid particular notice to Matthew Godwin's point (who I respect a lot) that the Paris Attack didn't move the polls at all, and the big issue for undecided voters of the middle class and middle aged voters is less likely to be immigration and more about a credible alternative model.
The last point has been my view for some time. While voters think Leave is the bigger risk, Leave campaigners need to address that concern. It may be unfair but life isn't fair.
So far as I can see, the Paris attacks simply confirmed everyone's prejudices, whatever their pre-existing prejudices happened to be.
Re Paris, it may reflect an understanding that we don't need to import jihadis from Belgium. A UK attack will almost certainly use local staff. BJ4BJ.
British Jihadis for British jobs? British jobs for British Jihadis? Blowjobs for British Jihadis? Was ist BJ4BJ?
Mr. Eagles, hope that number ticks up, and interesting to hear your current thinking.
I'd probably put myself at 9/10 for Leave. I'd probably be nearer your score if it were on how things stand now, but taking the longer view, I can't see us being in being in our interests.
Mr. B, I think the last fish restaurant I went to was Nash's [sp] in Leeds, which was very nice.
Two of my friends who are Eurosceptics are now convinced Leave are going to win because of me.
In their words they thought that it was more likely that Ken Clarke and Michael Heseltine would vote to leave than I ever would.
That's because you come across as fairly sensible most of the time. What is the sensible Eurosceptic answer to a Leave vote triggering a new Sindy Referendum which then goes the other way. Would you be happy with that outcome, which seems quite plausible.
Some of the Scottish Nationalists are a bunch of numpties, the Union is safe if this is the best the Nationalists can come up with
Scottish Nationalists Staged A Bizarre Protest Against “Traitorous” Tunnock’s Tea Cakes
“Some people say what we do is a waste of time,” said the leader of the Scottish Resistance during his protest against the manufacturer of the caramel wafer.
Britain has been dragged into the eurozone’s efforts to rescue Greece through a Brussels legal manoeuvre that has angered London and complicated David Cameron’s efforts to renegotiate UK membership terms in the EU.
Disregarding strong objections from British ministers, the European Commission on Wednesday proposed using a mothballed EU-wide rescue fund — the European Financial Stability Mechanism — to give Greece the €7bn it needs to cover debt repayments on Monday.
If the NHS is truly 24/7 - as the doctors were recently arguing - why is there such a concept as 'out of hours'?
Unless you expect dermatology outpatients to run at 3am, there will always be out of hours periods. The local McDonalds is 24x7 but you can't buy a double bacon and egg McMuffin after 10.30am. (One of the doctors' complaints about Hunt is that he appears to have given no real thought to what he actually wants.)
Britain has been dragged into the eurozone’s efforts to rescue Greece through a Brussels legal manoeuvre that has angered London and complicated David Cameron’s efforts to renegotiate UK membership terms in the EU.
Disregarding strong objections from British ministers, the European Commission on Wednesday proposed using a mothballed EU-wide rescue fund — the European Financial Stability Mechanism — to give Greece the €7bn it needs to cover debt repayments on Monday.
Agree. The best strategy for Leave is to treat this as a vote of confidence in the EU.
I like the "we can trust the PM to be negotiating in good faith, but not the EU" line. If people ask why then point to Blair giving away our rebate for absolutely nothing. "If we vote remain then the EU will consider the matter settled and would have no incentive to deliver the PM's reforms".
Immigration should not be central to the campaign, people who are voting leave because of that issue are 10/10 leavers anyway. We need to convince the 4-5/10 leavers to switch and the 6-8/10 leavers to turn out to vote. They will not be swayed by immigration as an argument.
That's a good line, and I agree with the rest of what you say.
I also think it's not just what Leave says but how it says it too.
Mr. Eagles, hope that number ticks up, and interesting to hear your current thinking.
I'd probably put myself at 9/10 for Leave. I'd probably be nearer your score if it were on how things stand now, but taking the longer view, I can't see us being in being in our interests.
Mr. B, I think the last fish restaurant I went to was Nash's [sp] in Leeds, which was very nice.
Two of my friends who are Eurosceptics are now convinced Leave are going to win because of me.
In their words they thought that it was more likely that Ken Clarke and Michael Heseltine would vote to leave than I ever would.
That's because you come across as fairly sensible most of the time. What is the sensible Eurosceptic answer to a Leave vote triggering a new Sindy Referendum which then goes the other way. Would you be happy with that outcome, which seems quite plausible.
Some of the Scottish Nationalists are a bunch of numpties, the Union is safe if this is the best the Nationalists can come up with
Scottish Nationalists Staged A Bizarre Protest Against “Traitorous” Tunnock’s Tea Cakes
“Some people say what we do is a waste of time,” said the leader of the Scottish Resistance during his protest against the manufacturer of the caramel wafer.
As for Scotland, I think Sturgeon and Salmond are severely overestimating the popularity of the EU there, even among their own supporters. If the vote is anything like 55-45 in favour of leaving the Scotland as a whole will have voted to leave as well.
I wouldn't say they are promoting them but that is a fairly awesome poll for the SNP. I find the idea that the Lib Dems are going to increase their numbers of MSPs very hard to believe but other than that it looks a fairly realistic outcome.
Morning David, not often you ever see a Record story with SNP and they don't have a negative bias on it though, they would normally find issue no matter how good. I agree that it is hard to believe that the LibDems can even hold what they have, they are almost extinct , no talent and Willie Rennie is woeful. Their only hope is that some ex Labour will not go for SNP or Tories so they may get a few sympathy votes by default.
Morning Malcolm. I agree that it is not exactly a call to arms for the remaining Labour faithful. If anything there are hints that they kinda agree that Ruth Davidson is providing the closest thing to an opposition.
As in Westminster, governments without credible or critical oppositions make a lot more mistakes and I am in the apparently small minority in believing this administration has made plenty with the Police, education, the FRB and the Health Service. It would do the SNP good to have someone challenging what their thinking is and whether something is really a good idea. I just can't see SLAB performing that role. They are stunningly talentless.
Scottish Nationalists Staged A Bizarre Protest Against “Traitorous” Tunnock’s Tea Cakes
“Some people say what we do is a waste of time,” said the leader of the Scottish Resistance during his protest against the manufacturer of the caramel wafer.
Mr. Eagles, hope that number ticks up, and interesting to hear your current thinking.
I'd probably put myself at 9/10 for Leave. I'd probably be nearer your score if it were on how things stand now, but taking the longer view, I can't see us being in being in our interests.
Mr. B, I think the last fish restaurant I went to was Nash's [sp] in Leeds, which was very nice.
Two of my friends who are Eurosceptics are now convinced Leave are going to win because of me.
In their words they thought that it was more likely that Ken Clarke and Michael Heseltine would vote to leave than I ever would.
Which is fantastic news and I'm delighted you are seriously considering it.
But you are very politically engaged and have carefully considered the balance of arguments. Most people (who are undecided) won't give it the same level of thought nor test their conclusions.
Mr. Eagles, hope that number ticks up, and interesting to hear your current thinking.
I'd probably put myself at 9/10 for Leave. I'd probably be nearer your score if it were on how things stand now, but taking the longer view, I can't see us being in being in our interests.
Mr. B, I think the last fish restaurant I went to was Nash's [sp] in Leeds, which was very nice.
Two of my friends who are Eurosceptics are now convinced Leave are going to win because of me.
In their words they thought that it was more likely that Ken Clarke and Michael Heseltine would vote to leave than I ever would.
That's because you come across as fairly sensible most of the time. What is the sensible Eurosceptic answer to a Leave vote triggering a new Sindy Referendum which then goes the other way. Would you be happy with that outcome, which seems quite plausible.
Some of the Scottish Nationalists are a bunch of numpties, the Union is safe if this is the best the Nationalists can come up with
Scottish Nationalists Staged A Bizarre Protest Against “Traitorous” Tunnock’s Tea Cakes
“Some people say what we do is a waste of time,” said the leader of the Scottish Resistance during his protest against the manufacturer of the caramel wafer.
Can I remove my 'fairly sensible' description of you ;-)
I'm sorely tempted to do one of Sunday's threads on the Battle of Tunnock's Cakes, which might end up rivalling the Battle of Bannockburn in terms of epochal battles between England and Scotland.
With predictions of many many hundreds of losses for Labour on one side (which apparently given the ones being contested is unlikely even in a bad result) to be used as expectations management by one side, and now a prediction of how they should be making hundreds of gains, seems like both sides will have back up for their expectation management game.
Really though, if Corbyn makes a single net gain his doubters will be thrown into a panic, whether it is reasonable for the main opposition party, however badly they are doing, to make gains or not.
Mr. B, not far wrong (I am in Yorkshire, but not Harrogate).
Give the Wetherby Whaler a try if you like Fish and chips.
The Wetherby Whaler is achain - there's one on the old Harry Ramsden's site in Guiseley
I just looked at the Harry Ramsden web site. What a travesty of the original concept.
The original Harry Ramsden's (in Guiseley) closed down a while ago. To be honest, it was overpriced for what you got. Any number of independent fish and chip shops will produce fare just as good.
In the 60s it was fantastic. It was almost a cathedral of fish and chips. You could get a huge portion of fish and chips, bread and butter for 12/6. Not many chippies had stained glass windows and chandeliers. They would have anywhere from 5 to 20 bus tours there, meaning you had to line up to get in.
When I was back in England in the early 2000's it was still good though a bit jaded, but we used to go to the original Wetherby Whaler (we lived near Wetherby) and it was much better value and tasted fantastic.
Childhood memories make a difference. At least my daughter got to experience it.
I'm sorely tempted to do one of Sunday's threads on the Battle of Tunnock's Cakes, which might end up rivalling the Battle of Bannockburn in terms of epochal battles between England and Scotland.
@JamieRoss7: A man on Scottish Resistance Facebook page has posted a video of himself smashing a packet of teacakes with a hammer https://t.co/bm9jQmg3YJ
As for Scotland, I think Sturgeon and Salmond are severely overestimating the popularity of the EU there, even among their own supporters. If the vote is anything like 55-45 in favour of leaving the Scotland as a whole will have voted to leave as well.
The mistake they are making is to think that Scots will value the EU more than the UK, and that will win over existing No voters to their cause.
Britain has been dragged into the eurozone’s efforts to rescue Greece through a Brussels legal manoeuvre that has angered London and complicated David Cameron’s efforts to renegotiate UK membership terms in the EU.
Disregarding strong objections from British ministers, the European Commission on Wednesday proposed using a mothballed EU-wide rescue fund — the European Financial Stability Mechanism — to give Greece the €7bn it needs to cover debt repayments on Monday.
Agree. The best strategy for Leave is to treat this as a vote of confidence in the EU.
It's the economy not immigration stupid should be Leave's mantra for this referendum.
I think Vote Leave semi get this as they're focussing on the cost of membership. My understanding is that this was focus-grouped.
Leave.EU are running very much on immigration.
I also have this bad feeling that Leave.EU/Farage will try and make it about Cameron's future.
If the referendum ends up about Cameron's future, it will get some Tories backing Remain even if they are Leavers because they don't want Cameron to be toppled.
I can't trust Farage not to make it about Dave's future.
Last 4 wickets went for 101 runs - it's not folding, it's doing its job, but it's not wagging that hard either, even if the very last wicket once again proved stubborn.
Mr. Eagles, hope that number ticks up, and interesting to hear your current thinking.
I'd probably put myself at 9/10 for Leave. I'd probably be nearer your score if it were on how things stand now, but taking the longer view, I can't see us being in being in our interests.
Mr. B, I think the last fish restaurant I went to was Nash's [sp] in Leeds, which was very nice.
Two of my friends who are Eurosceptics are now convinced Leave are going to win because of me.
In their words they thought that it was more likely that Ken Clarke and Michael Heseltine would vote to leave than I ever would.
That's because you come across as fairly sensible most of the time. What is the sensible Eurosceptic answer to a Leave vote triggering a new Sindy Referendum which then goes the other way. Would you be happy with that outcome, which seems quite plausible.
Some of the Scottish Nationalists are a bunch of numpties, the Union is safe if this is the best the Nationalists can come up with
Scottish Nationalists Staged A Bizarre Protest Against “Traitorous” Tunnock’s Tea Cakes
“Some people say what we do is a waste of time,” said the leader of the Scottish Resistance during his protest against the manufacturer of the caramel wafer.
Can I remove my 'fairly sensible' description of you ;-)
I'm sorely tempted to do one of Sunday's threads on the Battle of Tunnock's Cakes, which might end up rivalling the Battle of Bannockburn in terms of epochal battles between England and Scotland.
As for Scotland, I think Sturgeon and Salmond are severely overestimating the popularity of the EU there, even among their own supporters. If the vote is anything like 55-45 in favour of leaving the Scotland as a whole will have voted to leave as well.
Any evidence for your opinion? Genuinely interested.
If the NHS is truly 24/7 - as the doctors were recently arguing - why is there such a concept as 'out of hours'?
Unless you expect dermatology outpatients to run at 3am, there will always be out of hours periods. The local McDonalds is 24x7 but you can't buy a double bacon and egg McMuffin after 10.30am. (One of the doctors' complaints about Hunt is that he appears to have given no real thought to what he actually wants.)
If I need to go in for a scan or a blood test, I expect to be able to schedule an appointment at a time convenient to me rather than to the provider. I am their customer. If I have a job, that means either 7am or 8pm, such that I don't have to waste a day's productivity because of the appointment. Even better would be if I could go for the test at the hospital near my office at 8am or 6pm and they could send the results to my local GP. This is what a joined up NHS looks like.
As for Scotland, I think Sturgeon and Salmond are severely overestimating the popularity of the EU there, even among their own supporters. If the vote is anything like 55-45 in favour of leaving the Scotland as a whole will have voted to leave as well.
The mistake they are making is to think that Scots will value the EU more than the UK, and that will win over existing No voters to their cause.
I think it's lunacy.
Indeed. I think Scottish people hold the EU in the same general contempt as the English and don't see as much economic benefit from it as England and Wales.
What surprises me is that Wales is pretty disillusioned with the EU despite being a net beneficiary region. Scotland is a net contributor on the regional level AIUI.
As for Scotland, I think Sturgeon and Salmond are severely overestimating the popularity of the EU there, even among their own supporters. If the vote is anything like 55-45 in favour of leaving the Scotland as a whole will have voted to leave as well.
Whilst I agree that fundamentally Scotland is not that much more pro-EU than England, I wouldn't be surprised if Queen Nicola's endorsement itself swings quite a few Scottish voters over to Remain.
If the UK votes to leave the EU, Scotland might well vote to leave the UK in reaction. However, given that some in Ireland are seriously pondering whether Ireland could stay in the EU if Britain leaves the EU, it would be odd for Scotland to go in the reverse direction given that its economy is even more closely tied to the UK's.
Mr. Eagles, hope that number ticks up, and interesting to hear your current thinking.
I'd probably put myself at 9/10 for Leave. I'd probably be nearer your score if it were on how things stand now, but taking the longer view, I can't see us being in being in our interests.
Mr. B, I think the last fish restaurant I went to was Nash's [sp] in Leeds, which was very nice.
Two of my friends who are Eurosceptics are now convinced Leave are going to win because of me.
In their words they thought that it was more likely that Ken Clarke and Michael Heseltine would vote to leave than I ever would.
That's because you come across as fairly sensible most of the time. What is the sensible Eurosceptic answer to a Leave vote triggering a new Sindy Referendum which then goes the other way. Would you be happy with that outcome, which seems quite plausible.
Some of the Scottish Nationalists are a bunch of numpties, the Union is safe if this is the best the Nationalists can come up with
Scottish Nationalists Staged A Bizarre Protest Against “Traitorous” Tunnock’s Tea Cakes
“Some people say what we do is a waste of time,” said the leader of the Scottish Resistance during his protest against the manufacturer of the caramel wafer.
Can I remove my 'fairly sensible' description of you ;-)
I'm sorely tempted to do one of Sunday's threads on the Battle of Tunnock's Cakes, which might end up rivalling the Battle of Bannockburn in terms of epochal battles between England and Scotland.
Nowhere is the nationalist reflex more apparent than in the SNP’s attitude to the impending EU referendum. Take Nicola Sturgeon’s view that Scotland should have a veto over Brexit. This assumes that the rest of the UK will vote to leave the EU, and Scotland (with a tenth of the UK population) will vote to stay.
Look at this, for a moment, from the point of view of an English person. Scotland cannot be dragged out of the EU against its wishes, but England can be forced to stay in against its wishes? England cannot thwart the Scottish popular will, but Scotland can thwart the English popular will? How is that right? How does that make any sense? It only makes sense if you see an English vote as having less legitimacy than a Scottish vote. That’s nationalism for you.
@matt_dathan: Jess Phillips, asked what the shadow cabinet makes of #EUreferendum: 'It's hard to keep up at the moment to know who's in it' @bbcthisweek
"Think Labour looks out of touch now? Wait until the EU referendum campaign starts... In arguing against Brexit, Labour will alienate precisely the same Eurosceptic working class voters it desperately needs to win back"
Good piece. The EU debate is of course only one of many issues where there is a disconnect between the WWC in Labour's heartlands and the university-educated middle class Islington party leadership.
Of course the Conservative party is holding hands and whistling a happy tune over the EU.
There are times that you seem bitterly anti-Conservative rather than pro-UKIP. Is there some backstory that we are not aware of?
I'm not anti conservative per se, I was a conservative voter for years, I just happen to think the Cameron administration is vacuous and lacking principle. I pass the time by poking pb Tories, every time one replies by playing the man not the ball I get a little glow inside, knowing I've hit a nerve.
Grayling has come in for some stick on here since he broke ranks, being obsequious is an essential part of being a Cameroon.
As for Scotland, I think Sturgeon and Salmond are severely overestimating the popularity of the EU there, even among their own supporters. If the vote is anything like 55-45 in favour of leaving the Scotland as a whole will have voted to leave as well.
Any evidence for your opinion? Genuinely interested.
Nothing specific, just from talking to Scottish people both here in London and those who live in Scotland. The general feeling I have seen doesn't match Sturgeon and Salmond's sentiment that "there isn't a single Eurosceptic bone in Scotland's body" or whatever it is they said. UKIP might not be very popular in Scotland, but they seem to think this means the anti-EU movement is not very large.
Mr. Eagles, hope that number ticks up, and interesting to hear your current thinking.
I'd probably put myself at 9/10 for Leave. I'd probably be nearer your score if it were on how things stand now, but taking the longer view, I can't see us being in being in our interests.
Mr. B, I think the last fish restaurant I went to was Nash's [sp] in Leeds, which was very nice.
Two of my friends who are Eurosceptics are now convinced Leave are going to win because of me.
In their words they thought that it was more likely that Ken Clarke and Michael Heseltine would vote to leave than I ever would.
That's because you come across as fairly sensible most of the time. What is the sensible Eurosceptic answer to a Leave vote triggering a new Sindy Referendum which then goes the other way. Would you be happy with that outcome, which seems quite plausible.
Some of the Scottish Nationalists are a bunch of numpties, the Union is safe if this is the best the Nationalists can come up with
Scottish Nationalists Staged A Bizarre Protest Against “Traitorous” Tunnock’s Tea Cakes
“Some people say what we do is a waste of time,” said the leader of the Scottish Resistance during his protest against the manufacturer of the caramel wafer.
Can I remove my 'fairly sensible' description of you ;-)
I'm sorely tempted to do one of Sunday's threads on the Battle of Tunnock's Cakes, which might end up rivalling the Battle of Bannockburn in terms of epochal battles between England and Scotland.
When I was doing A-level economics (2001) the advice was not to buy the Halifax as their management was too conservative and profit margins would therefore be too small.
Their solution was to hire Andy Hornby with a brief to be radical and change the view that Halifax made small profits. By the time he had finished in 2008 he had indeed successfully got rid of those small profit margins. Unfortunately his radicalism had done this by turning them into thumping losses.
At this point I realised that economists are idiots.
Ain't that the truth, any economist that didn't foresee and predict the crash of 2008 must be particularly idiotic. The same applies to politicians, but then we already knew most of them are stupid.
Britain has been dragged into the eurozone’s efforts to rescue Greece through a Brussels legal manoeuvre that has angered London and complicated David Cameron’s efforts to renegotiate UK membership terms in the EU.
Disregarding strong objections from British ministers, the European Commission on Wednesday proposed using a mothballed EU-wide rescue fund — the European Financial Stability Mechanism — to give Greece the €7bn it needs to cover debt repayments on Monday.
Agree. The best strategy for Leave is to treat this as a vote of confidence in the EU.
I like the "we can trust the PM to be negotiating in good faith, but not the EU" line. If people ask why then point to Blair giving away our rebate for absolutely nothing. "If we vote remain then the EU will consider the matter settled and would have no incentive to deliver the PM's reforms".
Immigration should not be central to the campaign, people who are voting leave because of that issue are 10/10 leavers anyway. We need to convince the 4-5/10 leavers to switch and the 6-8/10 leavers to turn out to vote. They will not be swayed by immigration as an argument.
I think to a large extent, immigration makes the case for itself. People can see the migrant crisis and Cologne and internalize these things on their own. Last Summer, Remain was building a big lead. Migration has made it a good deal closer.
I am a great fan of Hales and he can be a match winner but so far this isn't working. Just as well we have another pinch hitter like Cook (current strike rate 83) to offset Compton at the top of the order.
Maybe Hales has to stop pretending that he is a conventional opener and just hit the ball in the same way Heyden or Sewag used to do. I think he is trying to play something other than his natural game at the moment.
If the UK votes to leave the EU, Scotland might well vote to leave the UK in reaction. However, given that some in Ireland are seriously pondering whether Ireland could stay in the EU if Britain leaves the EU, it would be odd for Scotland to go in the reverse direction given that its economy is even more closely tied to the UK's.
Nah. It'd mean seceding from the UK and then reapplying as a new member state and that'd mean the Euro.
The Scots might not be natural Leavers. They might be cross that England pulled them out. That doesn't mean they'd prioritise the EU over the UK common travel area and the pound.
All the polling shows a very low number of people really care about the EU.
I have been watching BBC World News and they had 4 people sitting round a table doing - of all things - reviewing the newspapers. Why would a 24 hour news network review the press, by definition a news vehicle way behind 24/7 news channels? Truly bizarre.
- and why can't these people wear ties? They just look scruffy.
Ties are thankfully (albeit slowly) becoming a thing of the past.
If the UK votes to leave the EU, Scotland might well vote to leave the UK in reaction. However, given that some in Ireland are seriously pondering whether Ireland could stay in the EU if Britain leaves the EU, it would be odd for Scotland to go in the reverse direction given that its economy is even more closely tied to the UK's.
I think it really depends on how the vote breaks down in each region. If the UK vote as a whole is 55-45 in favour of leaving, Scotland will be about 53-47 in favour of leaving. If that is the case then there wouldn't be any mandate to call another referendum based on Brexit. Only in the case where it is a very narrow leave vote UK wide Scotland has a very narrow vote for remain would there be a mandate to rerun the independence referendum as it would be a significant change to the UK's global position.
If the NHS is truly 24/7 - as the doctors were recently arguing - why is there such a concept as 'out of hours'?
Unless you expect dermatology outpatients to run at 3am, there will always be out of hours periods. The local McDonalds is 24x7 but you can't buy a double bacon and egg McMuffin after 10.30am. (One of the doctors' complaints about Hunt is that he appears to have given no real thought to what he actually wants.)
If I need to go in for a scan or a blood test, I expect to be able to schedule an appointment at a time convenient to me rather than to the provider. I am their customer. If I have a job, that means either 7am or 8pm, such that I don't have to waste a day's productivity because of the appointment. Even better would be if I could go for the test at the hospital near my office at 8am or 6pm and they could send the results to my local GP. This is what a joined up NHS looks like.
McDonald's here sells breakfast all day.
If I need blood work my doctors office can schedule an appointment with a nurse there at my convenience. If I need an MRI or CAT scan they can schedule it within 24 hours at my convenience.
They know here that I have a choice of where I take my business. They let me know they appreciate it.
With the NHS you have no choice, are at their mercy and they love it. The NHS isn't designed for you, but for the folks who work for it. There's nothing wrong with that, so long as you understand it.
As for Scotland, I think Sturgeon and Salmond are severely overestimating the popularity of the EU there, even among their own supporters. If the vote is anything like 55-45 in favour of leaving the Scotland as a whole will have voted to leave as well.
The mistake they are making is to think that Scots will value the EU more than the UK, and that will win over existing No voters to their cause.
I think it's lunacy.
Indeed. I think Scottish people hold the EU in the same general contempt as the English and don't see as much economic benefit from it as England and Wales.
What surprises me is that Wales is pretty disillusioned with the EU despite being a net beneficiary region. Scotland is a net contributor on the regional level AIUI.
There was a time in the 70s/80s when the Scots were more EUsceptic due to the Common Fisheries Policy, and I seem to recall their farmers weren't that keen either.
Today I imagine it's got to do with the fact that applying and existing as an EU member state in their own right is the most obvious immediate way to 'validate' their independence internationally with a (very small) level of influence in broader foreign and supranational policy.
I am a great fan of Hales and he can be a match winner but so far this isn't working. Just as well we have another pinch hitter like Cook (current strike rate 83) to offset Compton at the top of the order.
Maybe Hales has to stop pretending that he is a conventional opener and just hit the ball in the same way Heyden or Sewag used to do. I think he is trying to play something other than his natural game at the moment.
Quite. He's just not settling down to an innings and feels restrained. It's not his normal game so he's making silly mistakes. Much better that he plays his own game and leaves it to the selectors where to fit him in the side.
As for Scotland, I think Sturgeon and Salmond are severely overestimating the popularity of the EU there, even among their own supporters. If the vote is anything like 55-45 in favour of leaving the Scotland as a whole will have voted to leave as well.
The mistake they are making is to think that Scots will value the EU more than the UK, and that will win over existing No voters to their cause.
I think it's lunacy.
Indeed. I think Scottish people hold the EU in the same general contempt as the English and don't see as much economic benefit from it as England and Wales.
What surprises me is that Wales is pretty disillusioned with the EU despite being a net beneficiary region. Scotland is a net contributor on the regional level AIUI.
There was a time in the 70s/80s when the Scots were more EUsceptic due to the Common Fisheries Policy, and I seem to recall their farmers weren't that keen either.
Today I imagine it's got to do with the fact that applying and existing as an EU member state in their own right is the most obvious immediate way to 'validate' their independence internationally with a (very small) level of influence in broader foreign and supranational policy.
It's partly that, and it's partly that the EU makes being a small state easier. No need to go around the world forging trade deals and the like, just rely on the EU.
I think the existence of the EU tends to encourage cessionist movements.
Watching snippets of Ted Cruz from last night.. am I the only one who thinks he suffers a bit from Milibanditis? He looks/sounds a bit nerdy and weedy, and seems very lacking in the indefinable "gravitas" that even Trump has to some extent. In some ways, despite his policy stances, he seems an odd fit for the Republicans in their current mood
If the UK votes to leave the EU, Scotland might well vote to leave the UK in reaction. However, given that some in Ireland are seriously pondering whether Ireland could stay in the EU if Britain leaves the EU, it would be odd for Scotland to go in the reverse direction given that its economy is even more closely tied to the UK's.
I think it is inevitable that Eire would follow a Brexit unless the EEA terms negotiated made no practical difference to them (so we stay in the VAT arrangements, for example). The same applies to Scotland. They could only afford to be in the EU when rUK wasn't if this made no difference at all to their access to the English market.
After all, we already have an obesity problem up here and we need to shift those teacakes!
If the UK votes to leave the EU, Scotland might well vote to leave the UK in reaction. However, given that some in Ireland are seriously pondering whether Ireland could stay in the EU if Britain leaves the EU, it would be odd for Scotland to go in the reverse direction given that its economy is even more closely tied to the UK's.
I think it really depends on how the vote breaks down in each region. If the UK vote as a whole is 55-45 in favour of leaving, Scotland will be about 53-47 in favour of leaving. If that is the case then there wouldn't be any mandate to call another referendum based on Brexit. Only in the case where it is a very narrow leave vote UK wide Scotland has a very narrow vote for remain would there be a mandate to rerun the independence referendum as it would be a significant change to the UK's global position.
The Survation poll of Scotland released last night shows Scotland breaking 65:35 for remain.
Britain has been dragged into the eurozone’s efforts to rescue Greece through a Brussels legal manoeuvre that has angered London and complicated David Cameron’s efforts to renegotiate UK membership terms in the EU.
Disregarding strong objections from British ministers, the European Commission on Wednesday proposed using a mothballed EU-wide rescue fund — the European Financial Stability Mechanism — to give Greece the €7bn it needs to cover debt repayments on Monday.
Agree. The best strategy for Leave is to treat this as a vote of confidence in the EU.
It's the economy not immigration stupid should be Leave's mantra for this referendum.
I think Vote Leave semi get this as they're focussing on the cost of membership. My understanding is that this was focus-grouped.
Leave.EU are running very much on immigration.
I also have this bad feeling that Leave.EU/Farage will try and make it about Cameron's future.
If the referendum ends up about Cameron's future, it will get some Tories backing Remain even if they are Leavers because they don't want Cameron to be toppled.
I can't trust Farage not to make it about Dave's future.
He's only got himself to blame, labour voters will be queueing up to boot him out.
In the same way you'll vote whatever way Dave tells you to. Of course the likelihood is that he'll "win" and you lot will be even more unbearable, but if I were you I'd tighten your seat belts, you've been telling us for ages how good Dave is at politics, we'll find out soon enough.
So far he's managed to turn a certain Remain into a very sticky situation for both him and the Conservative party, that wasn't easy.
If the NHS is truly 24/7 - as the doctors were recently arguing - why is there such a concept as 'out of hours'?
Unless you expect dermatology outpatients to run at 3am, there will always be out of hours periods. The local McDonalds is 24x7 but you can't buy a double bacon and egg McMuffin after 10.30am. (One of the doctors' complaints about Hunt is that he appears to have given no real thought to what he actually wants.)
If I need to go in for a scan or a blood test, I expect to be able to schedule an appointment at a time convenient to me rather than to the provider. I am their customer. If I have a job, that means either 7am or 8pm, such that I don't have to waste a day's productivity because of the appointment. Even better would be if I could go for the test at the hospital near my office at 8am or 6pm and they could send the results to my local GP. This is what a joined up NHS looks like.
McDonald's here sells breakfast all day.
If I need blood work my doctors office can schedule an appointment with a nurse there at my convenience. If I need an MRI or CAT scan they can schedule it within 24 hours at my convenience.
They know here that I have a choice of where I take my business. They let me know they appreciate it.
With the NHS you have no choice, are at their mercy and they love it. The NHS isn't designed for you, but for the folks who work for it. There's nothing wrong with that, so long as you understand it.
Quite. Pretty much everyone with experience of other health systems can see this. No-one else in the world has an NHS like the UK does. As you say the key is that those providing the service are competing for the custom of the patient. Appointments happen in hours rather than weeks and the medical and non-medical staff make sure to fit you in and treat you like you're paying their wages.
The NHS that gives you an appointment for four weeks in Wednesday at 12:30 is really not fit for purpose.
My father recently had a small operation under BUPA in the UK. On a Saturday morning. Saturday is their busiest day because their patients want to be back at work on Monday.
I suspect that Sturgeon/Salmond have their fingers on the pulse of Scottish opinion rather more securely than both of you. And the polls do back them up on this (and on much else).
Current on line UK polls are neck and neck on Europe. This Record/Survation on line poll for Scotland is 65-35 for in. There is good reason for doubting the accuracy of polls but no reason for doubting the relative accuracy between the Scotland and UK ones.
It is also worth noting that if the Record believe their own poll then their obsessive anti-SNP tirades are a death wish. They are basically on a daily basis insulting the intelligence of the bulk of their readership. In every respect their own readers are at odds with the Record's clumsy and obvious bias. Newspapers can get away with this if politics is of no real consequence to their readers (The Sun at various times in the past) or their political line is occasional and unexpected (Indy at last election). However neither is true for The Record. They are in real death wish territory.
Sir Humphrey would have called this a "courageous" editorial line. In Glasgow they would term it "mental".
If the NHS is truly 24/7 - as the doctors were recently arguing - why is there such a concept as 'out of hours'?
Unless you expect dermatology outpatients to run at 3am, there will always be out of hours periods. The local McDonalds is 24x7 but you can't buy a double bacon and egg McMuffin after 10.30am. (One of the doctors' complaints about Hunt is that he appears to have given no real thought to what he actually wants.)
If I need to go in for a scan or a blood test, I expect to be able to schedule an appointment at a time convenient to me rather than to the provider. I am their customer. If I have a job, that means either 7am or 8pm, such that I don't have to waste a day's productivity because of the appointment. Even better would be if I could go for the test at the hospital near my office at 8am or 6pm and they could send the results to my local GP. This is what a joined up NHS looks like.
Yes, that would be cool. No-one is saying the NHS (and medicine generally) cannot be improved but it needs planning not sloganising. It will also need more money to have phlebotomists in at 7am and 8pm (and even more for 3am). Politicians must decide whether we want to pay for it.
If the NHS is truly 24/7 - as the doctors were recently arguing - why is there such a concept as 'out of hours'?
Unless you expect dermatology outpatients to run at 3am, there will always be out of hours periods. The local McDonalds is 24x7 but you can't buy a double bacon and egg McMuffin after 10.30am. (One of the doctors' complaints about Hunt is that he appears to have given no real thought to what he actually wants.)
If I need to go in for a scan or a blood test, I expect to be able to schedule an appointment at a time convenient to me rather than to the provider. I am their customer. If I have a job, that means either 7am or 8pm, such that I don't have to waste a day's productivity because of the appointment. Even better would be if I could go for the test at the hospital near my office at 8am or 6pm and they could send the results to my local GP. This is what a joined up NHS looks like.
McDonald's here sells breakfast all day.
If I need blood work my doctors office can schedule an appointment with a nurse there at my convenience. If I need an MRI or CAT scan they can schedule it within 24 hours at my convenience.
They know here that I have a choice of where I take my business. They let me know they appreciate it.
With the NHS you have no choice, are at their mercy and they love it. The NHS isn't designed for you, but for the folks who work for it. There's nothing wrong with that, so long as you understand it.
Quite. Pretty much everyone with experience of other health systems can see this. No-one else in the world has an NHS like the UK does. As you say the key is that those providing the service are competing for the custom of the patient. Appointments happen in hours rather than weeks and the medical and non-medical staff make sure to fit you in and treat you like you're paying their wages.
The NHS that gives you an appointment for four weeks in Wednesday at 12:30 is really not fit for purpose.
My father recently had a small operation under BUPA in the UK. On a Saturday morning. Saturday is their busiest day because their patients want to be back at work on Monday.
I would much rather the NHS focussed their money on providing the best-quality services even at the price of elective procedures only being available on certain days, rather than focussing on "24/7" availability for lower-quality services.
If the NHS is truly 24/7 - as the doctors were recently arguing - why is there such a concept as 'out of hours'?
Unless you expect dermatology outpatients to run at 3am, there will always be out of hours periods. The local McDonalds is 24x7 but you can't buy a double bacon and egg McMuffin after 10.30am. (One of the doctors' complaints about Hunt is that he appears to have given no real thought to what he actually wants.)
If I need to go in for a scan or a blood test, I expect to be able to schedule an appointment at a time convenient to me rather than to the provider. I am their customer. If I have a job, that means either 7am or 8pm, such that I don't have to waste a day's productivity because of the appointment. Even better would be if I could go for the test at the hospital near my office at 8am or 6pm and they could send the results to my local GP. This is what a joined up NHS looks like.
McDonald's here sells breakfast all day.
If I need blood work my doctors office can schedule an appointment with a nurse there at my convenience. If I need an MRI or CAT scan they can schedule it within 24 hours at my convenience.
They know here that I have a choice of where I take my business. They let me know they appreciate it.
With the NHS you have no choice, are at their mercy and they love it. The NHS isn't designed for you, but for the folks who work for it. There's nothing wrong with that, so long as you understand it.
Quite. Pretty much everyone with experience of other health systems can see this. No-one else in the world has an NHS like the UK does. As you say the key is that those providing the service are competing for the custom of the patient. Appointments happen in hours rather than weeks and the medical and non-medical staff make sure to fit you in and treat you like you're paying their wages.
The NHS that gives you an appointment for four weeks in Wednesday at 12:30 is really not fit for purpose.
My father recently had a small operation under BUPA in the UK. On a Saturday morning. Saturday is their busiest day because their patients want to be back at work on Monday.
And because the surgeons and anaesthetists are working for the NHS during the week.
Britain has been dragged into the eurozone’s efforts to rescue Greece through a Brussels legal manoeuvre that has angered London and complicated David Cameron’s efforts to renegotiate UK membership terms in the EU.
Disregarding strong objections from British ministers, the European Commission on Wednesday proposed using a mothballed EU-wide rescue fund — the European Financial Stability Mechanism — to give Greece the €7bn it needs to cover debt repayments on Monday.
Agree. The best strategy for Leave is to treat this as a vote of confidence in the EU.
It's the economy not immigration stupid should be Leave's mantra for this referendum.
I think Vote Leave semi get this as they're focussing on the cost of membership. My understanding is that this was focus-grouped.
Leave.EU are running very much on immigration.
I also have this bad feeling that Leave.EU/Farage will try and make it about Cameron's future.
If the referendum ends up about Cameron's future, it will get some Tories backing Remain even if they are Leavers because they don't want Cameron to be toppled.
I can't trust Farage not to make it about Dave's future.
He's only got himself to blame, labour voters will be queueing up to boot him out.
In the same way you'll vote whatever way Dave tells you to. Of course the likelihood is that he'll "win" and you lot will be even more unbearable, but if I were you I'd tighten your seat belts, you've been telling us for ages how good Dave is at politics, we'll find out soon enough.
So far he's managed to turn a certain Remain into a very sticky situation for both him and the Conservative party, that wasn't easy.
Lol - Cameron the clear loser having overturned a massive Labour majority before 2010, led a successful coalition while Farage.....has yet to make it to the H/C and whose one MP can't stand him. Of course you may have Grayling to turn it all around for you - mustn't forget that
As for Scotland, I think Sturgeon and Salmond are severely overestimating the popularity of the EU there, even among their own supporters. If the vote is anything like 55-45 in favour of leaving the Scotland as a whole will have voted to leave as well.
The mistake they are making is to think that Scots will value the EU more than the UK, and that will win over existing No voters to their cause.
I think it's lunacy.
Indeed. I think Scottish people hold the EU in the same general contempt as the English and don't see as much economic benefit from it as England and Wales.
What surprises me is that Wales is pretty disillusioned with the EU despite being a net beneficiary region. Scotland is a net contributor on the regional level AIUI.
There was a time in the 70s/80s when the Scots were more EUsceptic due to the Common Fisheries Policy, and I seem to recall their farmers weren't that keen either.
Today I imagine it's got to do with the fact that applying and existing as an EU member state in their own right is the most obvious immediate way to 'validate' their independence internationally with a (very small) level of influence in broader foreign and supranational policy.
Sure, but given that only 45% voted for independence the people open to that argument of self-determination or whatever the SNP leadership want to call it. It seems to me that the SNP leadership are projecting their love of the EU on to their voters. The Tories seem to be doing the same, but Dave has at least recognised that many (most) of us will be voting to leave and has made sure the different sides of the party can campaign for what they believe to be the way forwards.
Moving the argument on to the CFP and CAP would be a good idea from either Vote.Leave or Leave.EU, generally getting away from immigration and Dave's leadership is something that needs to happen. Dave is the most popular politician in the UK, making it about him is a poor idea. If leave makes it about him, then they are definitely going to lose given that the alternatives to being PM are not as popular or downright unpopular (Osborne, Corbyn, even Boris).
I suspect that Sturgeon/Salmond have their fingers on the pulse of Scottish opinion rather more securely than both of you. And the polls do back them up on this (and on much else).
Current on line UK polls are neck and neck on Europe. This Record/Survation on line poll for Scotland is 65-35 for in. There is good reason for doubting the accuracy of polls but no reason for doubting the relative accuracy between the Scotland and UK ones.
It is also worth noting that if the Record believe their own poll then their obsessive anti-SNP tirades are a death wish. They are basically on a daily basis insulting the intelligence of the bulk of their readership. In every respect their own readers are at odds with the Record's clumsy and obvious bias. Newspapers can get away with this if politics is of no real consequence to their readers (The Sun at various times in the past) or their political line is occasional and unexpected (Indy at last election). However neither is true for The Record. They are in real death wish territory.
Sir Humphrey would have called this a "courageous" editorial line. In Glasgow they would term it "mental".
Sorry, I forgot that unless I'm both Scottish and an SNP supporter I'm totally unqualified to comment on Scottish politics.
I apologise. You are quite right to point out I should deservedly incur your wrath.
Britain has been dragged into the eurozone’s efforts to rescue Greece through a Brussels legal manoeuvre that has angered London and complicated David Cameron’s efforts to renegotiate UK membership terms in the EU.
Disregarding strong objections from British ministers, the European Commission on Wednesday proposed using a mothballed EU-wide rescue fund — the European Financial Stability Mechanism — to give Greece the €7bn it needs to cover debt repayments on Monday.
Agree. The best strategy for Leave is to treat this as a vote of confidence in the EU.
It's the economy not immigration stupid should be Leave's mantra for this referendum.
I think Vote Leave semi get this as they're focussing on the cost of membership. My understanding is that this was focus-grouped.
Leave.EU are running very much on immigration.
I also have this bad feeling that Leave.EU/Farage will try and make it about Cameron's future.
If the referendum ends up about Cameron's future, it will get some Tories backing Remain even if they are Leavers because they don't want Cameron to be toppled.
I can't trust Farage not to make it about Dave's future.
He's only got himself to blame, labour voters will be queueing up to boot him out.
In the same way you'll vote whatever way Dave tells you to. Of course the likelihood is that he'll "win" and you lot will be even more unbearable, but if I were you I'd tighten your seat belts, you've been telling us for ages how good Dave is at politics, we'll find out soon enough.
So far he's managed to turn a certain Remain into a very sticky situation for both him and the Conservative party, that wasn't easy.
Lol - Cameron the clear loser having overturned a massive Labour majority before 2010, led a successful coalition while Farage.....has yet to make it to the H/C and whose one MP can't stand him. Of course you may have Grayling to turn it all around for you - mustn't forget that
Question for Cameron (pb Tories can reply on his behalf)
Do you regret promising a referendum on the EU?
Incidentally Mr Felix, I don't recall calling him a loser, but nice try nonetheless.
If the UK votes to leave the EU, Scotland might well vote to leave the UK in reaction. However, given that some in Ireland are seriously pondering whether Ireland could stay in the EU if Britain leaves the EU, it would be odd for Scotland to go in the reverse direction given that its economy is even more closely tied to the UK's.
I think it really depends on how the vote breaks down in each region. If the UK vote as a whole is 55-45 in favour of leaving, Scotland will be about 53-47 in favour of leaving. If that is the case then there wouldn't be any mandate to call another referendum based on Brexit. Only in the case where it is a very narrow leave vote UK wide Scotland has a very narrow vote for remain would there be a mandate to rerun the independence referendum as it would be a significant change to the UK's global position.
The Survation poll of Scotland released last night shows Scotland breaking 65:35 for remain.
I know, but I think we'll have to wait and see, I think it is a currently a case of one side shouting louder than the other.
As for Scotland, I think Sturgeon and Salmond are severely overestimating the popularity of the EU there, even among their own supporters. If the vote is anything like 55-45 in favour of leaving the Scotland as a whole will have voted to leave as well.
The mistake they are making is to think that Scots will value the EU more than the UK, and that will win over existing No voters to their cause.
I think it's lunacy.
Indeed. I think Scottish people hold the EU in the same general contempt as the English and don't see as much economic benefit from it as England and Wales.
What surprises me is that Wales is pretty disillusioned with the EU despite being a net beneficiary region. Scotland is a net contributor on the regional level AIUI.
There was a time in the 70s/80s when the Scots were more EUsceptic due to the Common Fisheries Policy, and I seem to recall their farmers weren't that keen either.
Today I imagine it's got to do with the fact that applying and existing as an EU member state in their own right is the most obvious immediate way to 'validate' their independence internationally with a (very small) level of influence in broader foreign and supranational policy.
It's partly that, and it's partly that the EU makes being a small state easier. No need to go around the world forging trade deals and the like, just rely on the EU.
I think the existence of the EU tends to encourage cessionist movements.
Britain has been dragged into the eurozone’s efforts to rescue Greece through a Brussels legal manoeuvre that has angered London and complicated David Cameron’s efforts to renegotiate UK membership terms in the EU.
Disregarding strong objections from British ministers, the European Commission on Wednesday proposed using a mothballed EU-wide rescue fund — the European Financial Stability Mechanism — to give Greece the €7bn it needs to cover debt repayments on Monday.
Agree. The best strategy for Leave is to treat this as a vote of confidence in the EU.
It's the economy not immigration stupid should be Leave's mantra for this referendum.
I think Vote Leave semi get this as they're focussing on the cost of membership. My understanding is that this was focus-grouped.
Leave.EU are running very much on immigration.
I also have this bad feeling that Leave.EU/Farage will try and make it about Cameron's future.
If the referendum ends up about Cameron's future, it will get some Tories backing Remain even if they are Leavers because they don't want Cameron to be toppled.
I can't trust Farage not to make it about Dave's future.
He's only got himself to blame, labour voters will be queueing up to boot him out.
In the same way you'll vote whatever way Dave tells you to. Of course the likelihood is that he'll "win" and you lot will be even more unbearable, but if I were you I'd tighten your seat belts, you've been telling us for ages how good Dave is at politics, we'll find out soon enough.
So far he's managed to turn a certain Remain into a very sticky situation for both him and the Conservative party, that wasn't easy.
Lol - Cameron the clear loser having overturned a massive Labour majority before 2010, led a successful coalition while Farage.....has yet to make it to the H/C and whose one MP can't stand him. Of course you may have Grayling to turn it all around for you - mustn't forget that
Question for Cameron (pb Tories can reply on his behalf)
Do you regret promising a referendum on the EU?
Incidentally Mr Felix, I don't recall calling him a loser, but nice try nonetheless.
I didn't sat you did but your hatred for the man colours all of your posts. I don't believe Cameron or any other Tories regret the referendum promise any more than i expect Leave to win - although I do keep forgetting the surge which the Leave campaign will receive when Grayling takes charge will be something to behold.
If the NHS is truly 24/7 - as the doctors were recently arguing - why is there such a concept as 'out of hours'?
Unless you expect dermatology outpatients to run at 3am, t he actually wants.)
If I need to go in for a scan or a blood test, I expect to be able to schedule an appointment at a time convenient to me rather than to the provider. I am their customer. If I have a job, that means either 7am or 8pm, such that I don't have to waste a day's productivity because of the appointment. Even better would be if I could go for the test at the hospital near my office at 8am or 6pm and they could send the results to my local GP. This is what a joined up NHS looks like.
McDonald's here sells breakfast all day.
If I need blood work my doctors office can schedule an appointment with a nurse there at my convenience. If I need an MRI or CAT scan they can schedule it within 24 hours at my convenience.
They know here that I have a choice of where I take my business. They let me know they appreciate it.
With the NHS you have no choice, are at their mercy and they love it. The NHS isn't designed for you, but for the folks who work for it. There's nothing wrong with that, so long as you understand it.
Quite. Pretty much everyone with experience of other health systems can see this. No-one else in the world has an NHS like the UK does. As you say the key is that those providing the service are competing for the custom of the patient. Appointments happen in hours rather than weeks and the medical and non-medical staff make sure to fit you in and treat you like you're paying their wages.
The NHS that gives you an appointment for four weeks in Wednesday at 12:30 is really not fit for purpose.
My father recently had a small operation under BUPA in the UK. On a Saturday morning. Saturday is their busiest day because their patients want to be back at work on Monday.
And because the surgeons and anaesthetists are working for the NHS during the week.
I'm sure that's some of it yes. Also a big part of what's not being said in relation to the doctors' dispute. They don't want to work weekends because they have other work to do somewhere else.
Under the current system only the rich get to have treatment at their convenience. Wouldn't it be better if everyone had the choice?
I do think it is possible that Scotland will vote much more strongly for remain than the rUK. The Record poll which Malcolm linked to below has the SNP at 52%. If Nicola tells the faithful to vote for Remain many of them will do so and the Survation poll is consistent with that effect.
Given the relative size of the countries this is only likely to have an effect if the result is very close but it does look like yet another hurdle for leave to overcome.
Britain has been dragged into the eurozone’s efforts to rescue Greece through a Brussels legal manoeuvre that has angered London and complicated David Cameron’s efforts to renegotiate UK membership terms in the EU.
Disregarding strong objections from British ministers, the European Commission on Wednesday proposed using a mothballed EU-wide rescue fund — the European Financial Stability Mechanism — to give Greece the €7bn it needs to cover debt repayments on Monday.
Agree. The best strategy for Leave is to treat this as a vote of confidence in the EU.
It's the economy not immigration stupid should be Leave's mantra for this referendum.
I think Vote Leave semi get this as they're focussing on the cost of membership. My understanding is that this was focus-grouped.
Leave.EU are running very much on immigration.
I also have this bad feeling that Leave.EU/Farage will try and make it about Cameron's future.
If the referendum ends up about Cameron's future, it will get some Tories backing Remain even if they are Leavers because they don't want Cameron to be toppled.
I can't trust Farage not to make it about Dave's future.
He's only got himself to blame, labour voters will be queueing up to boot him out.
In the same way you'll vote whatever way Dave tells you to. Of course the likelihood is that he'll "win" and you lot will be even more unbearable, but if I were you I'd tighten your seat belts, you've been telling us for ages how good Dave is at politics, we'll find out soon enough.
So far he's managed to turn a certain Remain into a very sticky situation for both him and the Conservative party, that wasn't easy.
Remain has never been certain - if it had been, there wouldn't have been pressure for a referendum...
Watching snippets of Ted Cruz from last night.. am I the only one who thinks he suffers a bit from Milibanditis? He looks/sounds a bit nerdy and weedy, and seems very lacking in the indefinable "gravitas" that even Trump has to some extent. In some ways, despite his policy stances, he seems an odd fit for the Republicans in their current mood
There is something about his look and voice that I find a little off putting, cannot put my finger on it
After a very good 2015, back to form, a very poor series from Cook, this.
Interesting to see general agreement this morning even among the Leave ranks that Leave should move on from immigration. Is isam around any more? I know he felt the opposite.
If the NHS is truly 24/7 - as the doctors were recently arguing - why is there such a concept as 'out of hours'?
Unless you expect dermatology outpatients to run at 3am, there will always be out of hours periods. The local McDonalds is 24x7 but you can't buy a double bacon and egg McMuffin after 10.30am. (One of the doctors' complaints about Hunt is that he appears to have given no real thought to what he actually wants.)
If I need to go in for a scan or a blood test, I expect to be able to schedule an appointment at a time convenient to me rather than to the provider. I am their customer. If I have a job, that means either 7am or 8pm, such that I don't have to waste a day's productivity because of the appointment. Even better would be if I could go for the test at the hospital near my office at 8am or 6pm and they could send the results to my local GP. This is what a joined up NHS looks like.
Yes, that would be cool. No-one is saying the NHS (and medicine generally) cannot be improved but it needs planning not sloganising. It will also need more money to have phlebotomists in at 7am and 8pm (and even more for 3am). Politicians must decide whether we want to pay for it.
A good starting point might be to vary outpatient surgery times. So let's assume a single doctor conducting outpatient appointments currently works 9-5 M-F. Change his days off to Sun and Mon, have his Tuesday surgery from 6am-2pm and his Thursday from 2pm-9pm. Same number of hours worked but way more convenient for most of his patients, who could specify their preferred time when they book their appointment. It needs innovative thinking more than it needs extra money.
As for Scotland, I think Sturgeon and Salmond are severely overestimating the popularity of the EU there, even among their own supporters. If the vote is anything like 55-45 in favour of leaving the Scotland as a whole will have voted to leave as well.
The mistake they are making is to think that Scots will value the EU more than the UK, and that will win over existing No voters to their cause.
I think it's lunacy.
Indeed. I think Scottish people hold the EU in the same general contempt as the English and don't see as much economic benefit from it as England and Wales.
What surprises me is that Wales is pretty disillusioned with the EU despite being a net beneficiary region. Scotland is a net contributor on the regional level AIUI.
There was a time in the 70s/80s when the Scots were more EUsceptic due to the Common Fisheries Policy, and I seem to recall their farmers weren't that keen either.
Today I imagine it's got to do with the fact that applying and existing as an EU member state in their own right is the most obvious immediate way to 'validate' their independence internationally with a (very small) level of influence in broader foreign and supranational policy.
It's partly that, and it's partly that the EU makes being a small state easier. No need to go around the world forging trade deals and the like, just rely on the EU.
I think the existence of the EU tends to encourage cessionist movements.
That's a good point, but Scotland would still be in the UK which is the 5th largest economy in the world and (proabably) in the EEA. Obviously the whole part about being in the UK is controversial.
If I need blood work my doctors office can schedule an appointment with a nurse there at my convenience. If I need an MRI or CAT scan they can schedule it within 24 hours at my convenience.
They know here that I have a choice of where I take my business. They let me know they appreciate it.
With the NHS you have no choice, are at their mercy and they love it. The NHS isn't designed for you, but for the folks who work for it. There's nothing wrong with that, so long as you understand it.
Quite. Pretty much everyone with experience of other health systems can see this. No-one else in the world has an NHS like the UK does. As you say the key is that those providing the service are competing for the custom of the patient. Appointments happen in hours rather than weeks and the medical and non-medical staff make sure to fit you in and treat you like you're paying their wages.
The NHS that gives you an appointment for four weeks in Wednesday at 12:30 is really not fit for purpose.
My father recently had a small operation under BUPA in the UK. On a Saturday morning. Saturday is their busiest day because their patients want to be back at work on Monday.
And because the surgeons and anaesthetists are working for the NHS during the week.
I'm sure that's some of it yes. Also a big part of what's not being said in relation to the doctors' dispute. They don't want to work weekends because they have other work to do somewhere else.
Under the current system only the rich get to have treatment at their convenience. Wouldn't it be better if everyone had the choice?
We'll see. What we have seen in SA so far is that wickets can fall to a new ball but after 20 overs or so batsmen need to get themselves out. Yesterday the Saffers did and England may well follow in kind given the number of "stroke" players in the line up but I think it is still a little premature to be pessimistic.
If I need blood work my doctors office can schedule an appointment with a nurse there at my convenience. If I need an MRI or CAT scan they can schedule it within 24 hours at my convenience.
They know here that I have a choice of where I take my business. They let me know they appreciate it.
With the NHS you have no choice, are at their mercy and they love it. The NHS isn't designed for you, but for the folks who work for it. There's nothing wrong with that, so long as you understand it.
Quite. Pretty much everyone with experience of other health systems can see this. No-one else in the world has an NHS like the UK does. As you say the key is that those providing the service are competing for the custom of the patient. Appointments happen in hours rather than weeks and the medical and non-medical staff make sure to fit you in and treat you like you're paying their wages.
The NHS that gives you an appointment for four weeks in Wednesday at 12:30 is really not fit for purpose.
My father recently had a small operation under BUPA in the UK. On a Saturday morning. Saturday is their busiest day because their patients want to be back at work on Monday.
And because the surgeons and anaesthetists are working for the NHS during the week.
I'm sure that's some of it yes. Also a big part of what's not being said in relation to the doctors' dispute. They don't want to work weekends because they have other work to do somewhere else.
Under the current system only the rich get to have treatment at their convenience. Wouldn't it be better if everyone had the choice?
They do - it's called insurance.
In the UK only something like 10% have private insurance. The rest rely totally on the NHS. That 10% is also skewed towards the middle aged and generally well.
Interesting to see general agreement this morning even among the Leave ranks that Leave should move on from immigration. Is isam around any more? I know he felt the opposite.
I think it's the same issue as the two different leave campaigns are having. Leave.EU (UKIP) are really pushing the immigration angle while Vote.Leave (everyone else) want to move on from immigration and "securing our borders" to "best of both worlds" on the economy.
Comments
In their words they thought that it was more likely that Ken Clarke and Michael Heseltine would vote to leave than I ever would.
'Incidentally, if a third strike goes ahead, junior doctors will, apparently, walk out of A&E as well.'
And yet the junior doctors keep banging on that their strike is not about money but patient safety !
Understaffed A and E is something that we will have to get used to. Hunts proposed contract cuts pay most for existing staff working unsocial hours such as Emergency departments, and they already struggle to recruit and retain.
Still the minister knows best of course...
What is the sensible Eurosceptic answer to a Leave vote triggering a new Sindy Referendum which then goes the other way. Would you be happy with that outcome, which seems quite plausible.
Mainland Europe is far behind us, and it's an area of expertise that probably could and should be exploited.
I agree that people taking bits out of the whole have distorted the perception of "Keynesianism" . When you read General Theory the whole bedrock of monetarism is in there too.
Immigration should not be central to the campaign, people who are voting leave because of that issue are 10/10 leavers anyway. We need to convince the 4-5/10 leavers to switch and the 6-8/10 leavers to turn out to vote. They will not be swayed by immigration as an argument.
British jobs for British Jihadis?
Blowjobs for British Jihadis?
Was ist BJ4BJ?
Scottish Nationalists Staged A Bizarre Protest Against “Traitorous” Tunnock’s Tea Cakes
“Some people say what we do is a waste of time,” said the leader of the Scottish Resistance during his protest against the manufacturer of the caramel wafer.
http://www.buzzfeed.com/jamieross/fifty-five-percent-of-scots-prefer-tunnocks#.ndlYwOzP9
In the mid 60s my parents knew the couple who owned the only Harry Ramsden's - Guiseley - and we were frequent visitors.
In the late 60s they sold the place. A few years later the franchising began.
What a shame. At least my daughter got to experience the original location as I knew it a decade ago.
Leave.EU are running very much on immigration.
I also think it's not just what Leave says but how it says it too.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3400234/Fears-EU-deal-offer-Merkel-curb-migrant-benefits-Nonsense-plans-poorest-Britons-banned-receiving-tax-credits.html
As in Westminster, governments without credible or critical oppositions make a lot more mistakes and I am in the apparently small minority in believing this administration has made plenty with the Police, education, the FRB and the Health Service. It would do the SNP good to have someone challenging what their thinking is and whether something is really a good idea. I just can't see SLAB performing that role. They are stunningly talentless.
But you are very politically engaged and have carefully considered the balance of arguments. Most people (who are undecided) won't give it the same level of thought nor test their conclusions.
Really though, if Corbyn makes a single net gain his doubters will be thrown into a panic, whether it is reasonable for the main opposition party, however badly they are doing, to make gains or not.
When I was back in England in the early 2000's it was still good though a bit jaded, but we used to go to the original Wetherby Whaler (we lived near Wetherby) and it was much better value and tasted fantastic.
Childhood memories make a difference. At least my daughter got to experience it.
I think it's lunacy.
If the referendum ends up about Cameron's future, it will get some Tories backing Remain even if they are Leavers because they don't want Cameron to be toppled.
I can't trust Farage not to make it about Dave's future.
What surprises me is that Wales is pretty disillusioned with the EU despite being a net beneficiary region. Scotland is a net contributor on the regional level AIUI.
Grayling has come in for some stick on here since he broke ranks, being obsequious is an essential part of being a Cameroon.
Maybe Hales has to stop pretending that he is a conventional opener and just hit the ball in the same way Heyden or Sewag used to do. I think he is trying to play something other than his natural game at the moment.
The Scots might not be natural Leavers. They might be cross that England pulled them out. That doesn't mean they'd prioritise the EU over the UK common travel area and the pound.
All the polling shows a very low number of people really care about the EU.
If I need blood work my doctors office can schedule an appointment with a nurse there at my convenience. If I need an MRI or CAT scan they can schedule it within 24 hours at my convenience.
They know here that I have a choice of where I take my business. They let me know they appreciate it.
With the NHS you have no choice, are at their mercy and they love it. The NHS isn't designed for you, but for the folks who work for it. There's nothing wrong with that, so long as you understand it.
Today I imagine it's got to do with the fact that applying and existing as an EU member state in their own right is the most obvious immediate way to 'validate' their independence internationally with a (very small) level of influence in broader foreign and supranational policy.
I think the existence of the EU tends to encourage cessionist movements.
After all, we already have an obesity problem up here and we need to shift those teacakes!
In the same way you'll vote whatever way Dave tells you to. Of course the likelihood is that he'll "win" and you lot will be even more unbearable, but if I were you I'd tighten your seat belts, you've been telling us for ages how good Dave is at politics, we'll find out soon enough.
So far he's managed to turn a certain Remain into a very sticky situation for both him and the Conservative party, that wasn't easy.
http://labourlist.org/2016/01/a-beginners-guide-to-the-boundary-review/
The NHS that gives you an appointment for four weeks in Wednesday at 12:30 is really not fit for purpose.
My father recently had a small operation under BUPA in the UK. On a Saturday morning. Saturday is their busiest day because their patients want to be back at work on Monday.
More LABOUR voters have 'strongly unfavourable' view of Corbyn than 'very favourable' in new @Survation Scottish poll (p.48 of tabs).
A RECORD DEATH WISH
I suspect that Sturgeon/Salmond have their fingers on the pulse of Scottish opinion rather more securely than both of you. And the polls do back them up on this (and on much else).
Current on line UK polls are neck and neck on Europe. This Record/Survation on line poll for Scotland is 65-35 for in. There is good reason for doubting the accuracy of polls but no reason for doubting the relative accuracy between the Scotland and UK ones.
It is also worth noting that if the Record believe their own poll then their obsessive anti-SNP tirades are a death wish. They are basically on a daily basis insulting the intelligence of the bulk of their readership. In every respect their own readers are at odds with the Record's clumsy and obvious bias. Newspapers can get away with this if politics is of no real consequence to their readers (The Sun at various times in the past) or their political line is occasional and unexpected (Indy at last election). However neither is true for The Record. They are in real death wish territory.
Sir Humphrey would have called this a "courageous" editorial line. In Glasgow they would term it "mental".
Moving the argument on to the CFP and CAP would be a good idea from either Vote.Leave or Leave.EU, generally getting away from immigration and Dave's leadership is something that needs to happen. Dave is the most popular politician in the UK, making it about him is a poor idea. If leave makes it about him, then they are definitely going to lose given that the alternatives to being PM are not as popular or downright unpopular (Osborne, Corbyn, even Boris).
What a start in test cricket for Viljoen.
I apologise. You are quite right to point out I should deservedly incur your wrath.
Nice to see Matt Goodwin agreeing with me.
How do you think Leave can propose an alternative model without it dividing the movement and being shot to pieces?
Say the existing model is flawed.
Say Cameron said we wouldn't partake in the Greek bailout
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/8588350/David-Cameron-We-wont-bail-out-Greece.html
Britain has been dragged into the eurozone’s efforts to rescue Greece through a Brussels legal manoeuvre that has angered London and complicated David Cameron’s efforts to renegotiate UK membership terms in the EU.
Disregarding strong objections from British ministers, the European Commission on Wednesday proposed using a mothballed EU-wide rescue fund — the European Financial Stability Mechanism — to give Greece the €7bn it needs to cover debt repayments on Monday.
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/6d92bbe2-2b04-11e5-8613-e7aedbb7bdb7.html#axzz3xInEGPvH
Agree. The best strategy for Leave is to treat this as a vote of confidence in the EU.
It's the economy not immigration stupid should be Leave's mantra for this referendum.
I think Vote Leave semi get this as they're focussing on the cost of membership. My understanding is that this was focus-grouped.
Leave.EU are running very much on immigration.
I also have this bad feeling that Leave.EU/Farage will try and make it about Cameron's future.
If the referendum ends up about Cameron's future, it will get some Tories backing Remain even if they are Leavers because they don't want Cameron to be toppled.
I can't trust Farage not to make it about Dave's future.
He's only got himself to blame, labour voters will be queueing up to boot him out.
In the same way you'll vote whatever way Dave tells you to. Of course the likelihood is that he'll "win" and you lot will be even more unbearable, but if I were you I'd tighten your seat belts, you've been telling us for ages how good Dave is at politics, we'll find out soon enough.
So far he's managed to turn a certain Remain into a very sticky situation for both him and the Conservative party, that wasn't easy.
Lol - Cameron the clear loser having overturned a massive Labour majority before 2010, led a successful coalition while Farage.....has yet to make it to the H/C and whose one MP can't stand him. Of course you may have Grayling to turn it all around for you - mustn't forget that
Question for Cameron (pb Tories can reply on his behalf)
Do you regret promising a referendum on the EU?
Incidentally Mr Felix, I don't recall calling him a loser, but nice try nonetheless.
Government administrative operations cannot innovate. They're not designed for that.
That's the problem in a nutshell.
It's the economy not immigration stupid should be Leave's mantra for this referendum.
I think Vote Leave semi get this as they're focussing on the cost of membership. My understanding is that this was focus-grouped.
Leave.EU are running very much on immigration.
I also have this bad feeling that Leave.EU/Farage will try and make it about Cameron's future.
If the referendum ends up about Cameron's future, it will get some Tories backing Remain even if they are Leavers because they don't want Cameron to be toppled.
I can't trust Farage not to make it about Dave's future.
He's only got himself to blame, labour voters will be queueing up to boot him out.
In the same way you'll vote whatever way Dave tells you to. Of course the likelihood is that he'll "win" and you lot will be even more unbearable, but if I were you I'd tighten your seat belts, you've been telling us for ages how good Dave is at politics, we'll find out soon enough.
So far he's managed to turn a certain Remain into a very sticky situation for both him and the Conservative party, that wasn't easy.
Lol - Cameron the clear loser having overturned a massive Labour majority before 2010, led a successful coalition while Farage.....has yet to make it to the H/C and whose one MP can't stand him. Of course you may have Grayling to turn it all around for you - mustn't forget that
Question for Cameron (pb Tories can reply on his behalf)
Do you regret promising a referendum on the EU?
Incidentally Mr Felix, I don't recall calling him a loser, but nice try nonetheless.
I didn't sat you did but your hatred for the man colours all of your posts. I don't believe Cameron or any other Tories regret the referendum promise any more than i expect Leave to win - although I do keep forgetting the surge which the Leave campaign will receive when Grayling takes charge will be something to behold.
Under the current system only the rich get to have treatment at their convenience. Wouldn't it be better if everyone had the choice?
Given the relative size of the countries this is only likely to have an effect if the result is very close but it does look like yet another hurdle for leave to overcome.
After a very good 2015, back to form, a very poor series from Cook, this.