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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Big swings to the SNP in the latest local by-elections: Ful

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  • Options
    TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,388
    From LabourList

    "Tessa Jowell is still ahead of the pack by a rather large margin – she has 36% of the vote. However this has narrowed since the start of July. When we last asked this question Jowell had 35% of the vote but a 17 point lead over Khan her closest rival on 18%.

    Now 13 points behind her are Sadiq Khan and Diane Abbott who are both on 23%. This is a shift from last time we asked this question; although Khan was in second place, Abbott was 6 points behind him on 11%. Now she’s 0.2% behind – 6 votes fewer than him (Abbott is on 22.8%, Khan is on 23.0%).

    There’s then another big gap between these two and the next contender. Transport expert Christian Wolmar is in fourth place with 9% of the vote (he was on 12% last time) and David Lammy is close behind him on 7% (down from 9%). Gareth Thomas is on 1%."

    That's all a bit confusingly presented I know.

    The long and the short of it is Jowell is still out in front, and Khan has seemingly missed an opportunity to reel her in with six weeks to go.
  • Options
    JEOJEO Posts: 3,656
    calum said:

    In the private sector I think heads would be rolling left, right and centre - hopefully the FOIs are flying into the Cabinet Office - brutal analysis here:

    http://www.capx.co/why-camila-batmanghelidjh-had-access-to-a-prime-ministerial-slush-fund/

    " There are many lessons that need to be absorbed in the aftermath of this Kids Company debacle. One surely is that the essential services, provided to our most vulnerable kids in the country should not become dependent on charismatic charity founders seeking support from Prime Ministerial slush funds. Secondly, it is preposterous to have a dedicated department making grant payments to individual charities delivering services that cut right across the work of other government departments. "

    The main lesson should be that the Prime Minister should not overrule the work of civil servants because he likes doing photo ops with the charity's owner.
  • Options
    dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,288
    edited August 2015
    Bristol Labour still trying to work out who to put forward for Mayor.

    http://www.bristol247.com/channel/news-comment/daily/politics/labour-mayor-candidates-battle-for-support

    Rees failed last time round, Bradshaw was working with current Independent Mayor George Ferguson on transport until he was fired 6 weeks ago. I'm unimpressed with both of them.
  • Options
    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    FPPT re GOP candidates

    There is a pb tradition of 50/1 guesses, so it is Kasich for me: 50/1 to reach the White House with Bet 365. Nick Palmer worries on the thread before last that he might be too liberal to be selected but what passes for my reasoning is that he seems to be the most impressive of the candidates who are (or have been) state governors, and that I'd never heard of. I'm thousands of miles away from the action, so if I know Scott Walker, Rand Paul, Jeb Bush or Donald Trump, then so does every American, implying there is not much upside from their current polling positions: everyone already knows whether they want to vote for them or not. As ever, DYOR and remember to save your bus fare home.
  • Options
    TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,388
    JEO said:

    calum said:

    In the private sector I think heads would be rolling left, right and centre - hopefully the FOIs are flying into the Cabinet Office - brutal analysis here:

    http://www.capx.co/why-camila-batmanghelidjh-had-access-to-a-prime-ministerial-slush-fund/

    " There are many lessons that need to be absorbed in the aftermath of this Kids Company debacle. One surely is that the essential services, provided to our most vulnerable kids in the country should not become dependent on charismatic charity founders seeking support from Prime Ministerial slush funds. Secondly, it is preposterous to have a dedicated department making grant payments to individual charities delivering services that cut right across the work of other government departments. "

    The main lesson should be that the Prime Minister should not overrule the work of civil servants because he likes doing photo ops with the charity's owner.
    I think the two points are a little bit contradictory.

    Having say the DfE responsible for educational charity grants will tend to lead to them seeing charities as a provider of services. If they give say £10m to a charity one week and £10m to a public initiative the next, they're going to start grading using the same criteria and treating them similarly.
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    dugarbandierdugarbandier Posts: 2,596
    watford30 said:

    Plato said:

    Howzat

    Amazon 'wooed Clarkson, Hammond and May for new 'Top Gear' show with promise of £160MILLION budget'

    Numerous broadcasters including Netflix had hoped to secure the team
    Former Top Gear producer revealed it was budget that sealed the deal
    It is Amazon’s biggest single investment in original content to date

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3187911/Amazon-wooed-Clarkson-Hammond-new-Gear-promise-160MILLION-budget.html#ixzz3i8HI5JVG

    For all the bleating about the BBC, this is a reminder that cash is king. The networks with the deepest pockets can buy more rights to sports and films, and pay more to writers, producers and directors, as well as the onscreen talent.
    The BBC have plenty of money. They simply choose to prioritise spending on pointless building moves, ill fated technical projects, executive salaries and part time Creative Directors rather than actual programming.

    dom't think top gear suffered from lack of budget, did it? presumably the extra money will go towards hot food.

    it'll still be rubbish tho :) (I've never watched it)
  • Options
    watford30watford30 Posts: 3,474
    JEO said:

    calum said:

    In the private sector I think heads would be rolling left, right and centre - hopefully the FOIs are flying into the Cabinet Office - brutal analysis here:

    http://www.capx.co/why-camila-batmanghelidjh-had-access-to-a-prime-ministerial-slush-fund/

    " There are many lessons that need to be absorbed in the aftermath of this Kids Company debacle. One surely is that the essential services, provided to our most vulnerable kids in the country should not become dependent on charismatic charity founders seeking support from Prime Ministerial slush funds. Secondly, it is preposterous to have a dedicated department making grant payments to individual charities delivering services that cut right across the work of other government departments. "

    The main lesson should be that the Prime Minister should not overrule the work of civil servants because he likes doing photo ops with the charity's owner.
    Where's the Opposition? If Labour weren't so busy self destructing, they'd be all over this.

    Cameron should be sweating buckets at the despatch box, answering awkward and probing questions.
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    SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    About the GOP debate, now that things have cleared indeed Trump won the first debate.

    Looking at the reaction today and replaying the video it sounds much better for Trump than immediately after the debate.
    However there were other people on the debate stage, some of them actually spoke like Huckabee, Carson and Paul, the others simply were stage props.

    From the prop candidates the only thing I can remember is that God spoke to Cruz, Kasich's father was a mailman, Walker beat the unions, Bush loves immigration and Christie trying to convince me that New Jersey's bankruptcy was someone else's fault, also I completely forgot about Rubio's existence after the debate finished.

    Also Fox News really hates Trump and loves Fiorina.

    In conclusion I think Trump passed the first hurdle and can keep going until Christmas, his main rival (if he has any at this point) is probably one of Huckabee or Carson.
  • Options
    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    DavidL said:

    I think that there is an outside chance that the Tories may have more seats than Labour in 2016. Labour are on target to lose almost all their constituency seats and the Greens are indeed nibbling away at the List opportunities for Labour (where the SNP will get almost none given their constituency results).

    If the Tories can consolidate the ex Lib Dem vote in the borders and possibly in north east Scotland they have a chance of doing better. The Scottish Lib Dems have 5 seats at the moment, Orkney, Shetland and 3 list MSPs. Don't see them holding onto most of them.

    The Greens will probably come 4th, albeit closer to both Labour and the Tories than they are at the moment.

    But your Scottish Lib Dem is as much an anti-tory voter as a Scottish Labourite. I don't think there is any consolidating of ex-Lib Dem vote they can do. They can try and look for anti-SNP votes in the South of Scotland but none of them will be permanent Conservative voters.
  • Options
    watford30watford30 Posts: 3,474
    edited August 2015

    watford30 said:

    Plato said:

    Howzat

    Amazon 'wooed Clarkson, Hammond and May for new 'Top Gear' show with promise of £160MILLION budget'

    Numerous broadcasters including Netflix had hoped to secure the team
    Former Top Gear producer revealed it was budget that sealed the deal
    It is Amazon’s biggest single investment in original content to date

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3187911/Amazon-wooed-Clarkson-Hammond-new-Gear-promise-160MILLION-budget.html#ixzz3i8HI5JVG

    For all the bleating about the BBC, this is a reminder that cash is king. The networks with the deepest pockets can buy more rights to sports and films, and pay more to writers, producers and directors, as well as the onscreen talent.
    The BBC have plenty of money. They simply choose to prioritise spending on pointless building moves, ill fated technical projects, executive salaries and part time Creative Directors rather than actual programming.
    dom't think top gear suffered from lack of budget, did it? presumably the extra money will go towards hot food.

    it'll still be rubbish tho :) (I've never watched it)

    It was made on a shoestring budget. Portakabins and an old hangar at Dunsfold.
  • Options
    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820
    JEO said:

    The main lesson should be that the Prime Minister should not overrule the work of civil servants because he likes doing photo ops with the charity's owner.

    The whole idea of using charities (and also 'business partnerships') is to overrule the work of the civil servants, which is why since 2000 the Labour, coalition and this Conservative governments have gone down that route. On a small scale, I actually think it's a good idea: by their nature, government departments and local authorities necessarily act in a bureaucratic and cumbersome way. Small-scale, locally-based, and non-government initiatives, such as Kids Company was originally, can be very useful in getting impetus behind new ideas.

    I think the real problem here was that the approach doesn't scale up. Once it becomes a substitute for mainstream provision of services, it's no longer an appropriate model.
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    watford30 said:

    If Labour weren't so busy self destructing, they'd be all over this.

    No, they wouldn't. If you read the piece linked earlier, the office was set up by Tony Blair, formalised by Brown, and the first minister appointed was Ed Miliband.

    Labour, ALL OVER IT...
  • Options
    TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,388

    JEO said:

    The main lesson should be that the Prime Minister should not overrule the work of civil servants because he likes doing photo ops with the charity's owner.

    The whole idea of using charities (and also 'business partnerships') is to overrule the work of the civil servants, which is why since 2000 the Labour, coalition and this Conservative governments have gone down that route. On a small scale, I actually think it's a good idea: by their nature, government departments and local authorities necessarily act in a bureaucratic and cumbersome way. Small-scale, locally-based, and non-government initiatives, such as Kids Company was originally, can be very useful in getting impetus behind new ideas.

    I think the real problem here was that the approach doesn't scale up. Once it becomes a substitute for mainstream provision of services, it's no longer an appropriate model.
    I agree entirely with Richard.
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @jonwalker121: Being portrayed as too soft towards a well meaning but perhaps badly-run charity won't harm Cameron - and deflects criticism over closure
  • Options
    HurstLlamaHurstLlama Posts: 9,098
    watford30 said:

    JEO said:

    calum said:

    In the private sector I think heads would be rolling left, right and centre - hopefully the FOIs are flying into the Cabinet Office - brutal analysis here:

    http://www.capx.co/why-camila-batmanghelidjh-had-access-to-a-prime-ministerial-slush-fund/

    " There are many lessons that need to be absorbed in the aftermath of this Kids Company debacle. One surely is that the essential services, provided to our most vulnerable kids in the country should not become dependent on charismatic charity founders seeking support from Prime Ministerial slush funds. Secondly, it is preposterous to have a dedicated department making grant payments to individual charities delivering services that cut right across the work of other government departments. "

    The main lesson should be that the Prime Minister should not overrule the work of civil servants because he likes doing photo ops with the charity's owner.
    Where's the Opposition? If Labour weren't so busy self destructing, they'd be all over this.

    Cameron should be sweating buckets at the despatch box, answering awkward and probing questions.
    Someone should certainly be asking the difficult questions and Cameron should certainly have cause to be nervous. However, how can that be Labour? Cameron has merely continued the policy that Labour set in place.
  • Options
    TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,388
    So Austrilia would need to set a world record second innings performance to overhaul a 330 run deficit after a 60 all out start. Unparalleled in was it 138 occasions?

    And yet someone out there wants to back them at just 8.4.
  • Options
    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820

    The long and the short of it is Jowell is still out in front, and Khan has seemingly missed an opportunity to reel her in with six weeks to go.

    That might not be the right conclusion. Jowell may well be out in front on first preferences, but the latest move towards Diane Abbott (assuming it's real and is representative of the wider electorate in this contest) could mean that Khan will win this on second prefs.
  • Options
    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Diane is apparently a direct beneficiary of the Corbyn Effect? How interesting.

    The long and the short of it is Jowell is still out in front, and Khan has seemingly missed an opportunity to reel her in with six weeks to go.

    That might not be the right conclusion. Jowell may well be out in front on first preferences, but the latest move towards Diane Abbott (assuming it's real and is representative of the wider electorate in this contest) could mean that Khan will win this on second prefs.
  • Options
    saddenedsaddened Posts: 2,245

    Plato said:

    Howzat

    Amazon 'wooed Clarkson, Hammond and May for new 'Top Gear' show with promise of £160MILLION budget'

    Numerous broadcasters including Netflix had hoped to secure the team
    Former Top Gear producer revealed it was budget that sealed the deal
    It is Amazon’s biggest single investment in original content to date

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3187911/Amazon-wooed-Clarkson-Hammond-new-Gear-promise-160MILLION-budget.html#ixzz3i8HI5JVG

    For all the bleating about the BBC, this is a reminder that cash is king. The networks with the deepest pockets can buy more rights to sports and films, and pay more to writers, producers and directors, as well as the onscreen talent.
    how much do you think is the correct amount they should receive? They currently get 5bn a year.
  • Options
    watford30watford30 Posts: 3,474

    watford30 said:

    JEO said:

    calum said:

    In the private sector I think heads would be rolling left, right and centre - hopefully the FOIs are flying into the Cabinet Office - brutal analysis here:

    http://www.capx.co/why-camila-batmanghelidjh-had-access-to-a-prime-ministerial-slush-fund/

    " There are many lessons that need to be absorbed in the aftermath of this Kids Company debacle. One surely is that the essential services, provided to our most vulnerable kids in the country should not become dependent on charismatic charity founders seeking support from Prime Ministerial slush funds. Secondly, it is preposterous to have a dedicated department making grant payments to individual charities delivering services that cut right across the work of other government departments. "

    The main lesson should be that the Prime Minister should not overrule the work of civil servants because he likes doing photo ops with the charity's owner.
    Where's the Opposition? If Labour weren't so busy self destructing, they'd be all over this.

    Cameron should be sweating buckets at the despatch box, answering awkward and probing questions.
    Someone should certainly be asking the difficult questions and Cameron should certainly have cause to be nervous. However, how can that be Labour? Cameron has merely continued the policy that Labour set in place.
    Time for the SNP to put down those chip sandwiches and step up to the plate.
  • Options
    JEOJEO Posts: 3,656

    The long and the short of it is Jowell is still out in front, and Khan has seemingly missed an opportunity to reel her in with six weeks to go.

    That might not be the right conclusion. Jowell may well be out in front on first preferences, but the latest move towards Diane Abbott (assuming it's real and is representative of the wider electorate in this contest) could mean that Khan will win this on second prefs.
    The thought of the divisive Sadiq Khan running our great capital is thoroughly depressing.
  • Options
    JEOJEO Posts: 3,656

    JEO said:

    The main lesson should be that the Prime Minister should not overrule the work of civil servants because he likes doing photo ops with the charity's owner.

    The whole idea of using charities (and also 'business partnerships') is to overrule the work of the civil servants, which is why since 2000 the Labour, coalition and this Conservative governments have gone down that route. On a small scale, I actually think it's a good idea: by their nature, government departments and local authorities necessarily act in a bureaucratic and cumbersome way. Small-scale, locally-based, and non-government initiatives, such as Kids Company was originally, can be very useful in getting impetus behind new ideas.

    I think the real problem here was that the approach doesn't scale up. Once it becomes a substitute for mainstream provision of services, it's no longer an appropriate model.
    I'm not talking about using charities rather than civil servants. I'm talking about the civil servants assessing the grants, after doing detailed analysis, being overruled by David Cameron on a whim.
  • Options
    david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,419

    FPPT re GOP candidates

    There is a pb tradition of 50/1 guesses, so it is Kasich for me: 50/1 to reach the White House with Bet 365. Nick Palmer worries on the thread before last that he might be too liberal to be selected but what passes for my reasoning is that he seems to be the most impressive of the candidates who are (or have been) state governors, and that I'd never heard of. I'm thousands of miles away from the action, so if I know Scott Walker, Rand Paul, Jeb Bush or Donald Trump, then so does every American, implying there is not much upside from their current polling positions: everyone already knows whether they want to vote for them or not. As ever, DYOR and remember to save your bus fare home.

    The upside comes once candidates start to drop out.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,044

    Plato said:

    Howzat

    Amazon 'wooed Clarkson, Hammond and May for new 'Top Gear' show with promise of £160MILLION budget'

    Numerous broadcasters including Netflix had hoped to secure the team
    Former Top Gear producer revealed it was budget that sealed the deal
    It is Amazon’s biggest single investment in original content to date

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3187911/Amazon-wooed-Clarkson-Hammond-new-Gear-promise-160MILLION-budget.html#ixzz3i8HI5JVG

    For all the bleating about the BBC, this is a reminder that cash is king. The networks with the deepest pockets can buy more rights to sports and films, and pay more to writers, producers and directors, as well as the onscreen talent.

    The problems for the BBC are that there are too many sports and other events people will pay to watch. They no longer are the only channel, or one of two or three channels.

    It would be good if the lefties stopped bleating about this. What would their alternative be? In the case of sports, extend the list of designated events to cover everything? What would that do to our sports? And the BBC hounded Clarkson out - whilst the last incident was bad, the previous ones (including where he was given a last chance) were rather pathetic on the part of the offence-takers.

    The BBC has had its finger in its areas and gone la-la-la as the world has changed. Its supporters would be best realising this. If, that is, they love have the BBC's best intersts at heart rather than playing silly political points with it.

    If the BBC were any other organisation, given the child abuse that has occurred within its organisations (ref. the status of Prospero and Ariel that stand above its entrance), it would be in serious trouble with the likes of you. But as you see them as 'on your side', you defend them.
  • Options
    rullkorullko Posts: 161

    Dair said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Amazingly enough, Labour have control of Glasgow City Council at the moment.

    Doubt that'll last !

    Saving Glasgow City Council in 2012 was probably the worst thing that ever happened to SLAB. They genuinely felt it was a sign that they had turned a corner in their fight against the SNP surge and normalty would be restored by 2015.

    This was despite a slew of other councils falling to the SNP. None so blind as a SLABber praying for a future.
    Does anyone know which of the Scottish local elections next year are for full councils? I imagine that on the back of these by-election results, local Govt. will follow Holyrood into becoming a one-party state?
    I don't think there are local elections next year. The Scotland-wide council elections are in 2017.

    Ever since the SNP took over at Holyrood, SLAB have argued for power to be devolved from the Scottish Parliament to councils, their last remaining powerbase. Two years is a long time in politics and so on, but unless Nicola is caught in bed with a goat or something they're going to lose that too. I wonder where they'll want the power to go after that.
  • Options
    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    From what I've seen online - there's a very small % of blaming Cameron, bar those who hate him anyway. The vast majority of ire is aimed squarely at Batman/trustees.

    That she duped so many kind hearted celebs seems to be absorbing a lot of it.

    watford30 said:

    JEO said:

    calum said:

    In the private sector I think heads would be rolling left, right and centre - hopefully the FOIs are flying into the Cabinet Office - brutal analysis here:

    http://www.capx.co/why-camila-batmanghelidjh-had-access-to-a-prime-ministerial-slush-fund/

    " There are many lessons that need to be absorbed in the aftermath of this Kids Company debacle. One surely is that the essential services, provided to our most vulnerable kids in the country should not become dependent on charismatic charity founders seeking support from Prime Ministerial slush funds. Secondly, it is preposterous to have a dedicated department making grant payments to individual charities delivering services that cut right across the work of other government departments. "

    The main lesson should be that the Prime Minister should not overrule the work of civil servants because he likes doing photo ops with the charity's owner.
    Where's the Opposition? If Labour weren't so busy self destructing, they'd be all over this.

    Cameron should be sweating buckets at the despatch box, answering awkward and probing questions.
    Someone should certainly be asking the difficult questions and Cameron should certainly have cause to be nervous. However, how can that be Labour? Cameron has merely continued the policy that Labour set in place.
  • Options
    TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,388
    edited August 2015

    The long and the short of it is Jowell is still out in front, and Khan has seemingly missed an opportunity to reel her in with six weeks to go.

    That might not be the right conclusion. Jowell may well be out in front on first preferences, but the latest move towards Diane Abbott (assuming it's real and is representative of the wider electorate in this contest) could mean that Khan will win this on second prefs.
    It's an interesting thought Richard.

    I have to say the figures have caught me out.

    They've put a squeeze on it where they didn't before.

    So Jowell's 1% gain is in fact a loss.

    Khan+Abbott have gone from 5% behind to 10% ahead of Jowell.
  • Options
    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Aus storming this. Piling on them to win now.
  • Options
    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820
    Plato said:

    Diane is apparently a direct beneficiary of the Corbyn Effect? How interesting.

    It would certainly seem a reasonable supposition that she will be a beneficiary of the party's leftwards shift and the influx of new affiliates, or at least that Tessa Jowell's chances of diminished. The LabourList polling is likely to underestimate this effect, I think.
  • Options
    flightpath01flightpath01 Posts: 4,903

    watford30 said:

    JEO said:

    calum said:

    In the private sector I think heads would be rolling left, right and centre - hopefully the FOIs are flying into the Cabinet Office - brutal analysis here:

    http://www.capx.co/why-camila-batmanghelidjh-had-access-to-a-prime-ministerial-slush-fund/

    " There are many lessons that need to be absorbed in the aftermath of this Kids Company debacle. One surely is that the essential services, provided to our most vulnerable kids in the country should not become dependent on charismatic charity founders seeking support from Prime Ministerial slush funds. Secondly, it is preposterous to have a dedicated department making grant payments to individual charities delivering services that cut right across the work of other government departments. "

    The main lesson should be that the Prime Minister should not overrule the work of civil servants because he likes doing photo ops with the charity's owner.
    Where's the Opposition? If Labour weren't so busy self destructing, they'd be all over this.

    Cameron should be sweating buckets at the despatch box, answering awkward and probing questions.
    Someone should certainly be asking the difficult questions and Cameron should certainly have cause to be nervous. However, how can that be Labour? Cameron has merely continued the policy that Labour set in place.
    Perhaps our local government children's departments should be asked for advice on how to look after vulnerable children.
  • Options
    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Cripes. What a pair. Glad I don't live in London.

    The long and the short of it is Jowell is still out in front, and Khan has seemingly missed an opportunity to reel her in with six weeks to go.

    That might not be the right conclusion. Jowell may well be out in front on first preferences, but the latest move towards Diane Abbott (assuming it's real and is representative of the wider electorate in this contest) could mean that Khan will win this on second prefs.
    It's an interesting thought Richard.

    I have to say the figures have caught me out.

    They've put a squeeze on it where they didn't before.

    So Jowell's 1% gain is in fact a loss.

    Khan+Abbott have gone from 5% behind to 10% ahead of Jowell.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,907
    edited August 2015
    Ironic cheers from the crowd as Australia pass their first innings total...
  • Options
    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Sandpit said:

    Ironic cheers from the crowd as Australia pass their first innings total...

    England in trouble.
  • Options
    DairDair Posts: 6,108
    edited August 2015
    rullko said:

    Dair said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Amazingly enough, Labour have control of Glasgow City Council at the moment.

    Doubt that'll last !

    Saving Glasgow City Council in 2012 was probably the worst thing that ever happened to SLAB. They genuinely felt it was a sign that they had turned a corner in their fight against the SNP surge and normalty would be restored by 2015.

    This was despite a slew of other councils falling to the SNP. None so blind as a SLABber praying for a future.
    Does anyone know which of the Scottish local elections next year are for full councils? I imagine that on the back of these by-election results, local Govt. will follow Holyrood into becoming a one-party state?
    I don't think there are local elections next year. The Scotland-wide council elections are in 2017.

    Ever since the SNP took over at Holyrood, SLAB have argued for power to be devolved from the Scottish Parliament to councils, their last remaining powerbase. Two years is a long time in politics and so on, but unless Nicola is caught in bed with a goat or something they're going to lose that too. I wonder where they'll want the power to go after that.
    Charities and Quangos where their placepeople will continue to dominate until they've all retired. Although that may not be too long given the prevalence of these scrotes to retire at 50 off the backs of taxpayers.
  • Options
    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820
    JEO said:

    I'm not talking about using charities rather than civil servants. I'm talking about the civil servants assessing the grants, after doing detailed analysis, being overruled by David Cameron on a whim.

    Fair enough, although I'd quibble with the phrase 'on a whim'.

    I've seen a very similar effect in local politics, where councillors (in this case Tories and LibDems) got terribly excited about a project which a charity put forward and spent a lot of money on it over a period of years, despite it being obviously a no-hoper right from the start. These things take on a momentum of their own.
  • Options
    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035
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    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,044
    Plato said:

    From what I've seen online - there's a very small % of blaming Cameron, bar those who hate him anyway. The vast majority of ire is aimed squarely at Batman/trustees.

    That she duped so many kind hearted celebs seems to be absorbing a lot of it.

    watford30 said:

    JEO said:

    calum said:

    In the private sector I think heads would be rolling left, right and centre - hopefully the FOIs are flying into the Cabinet Office - brutal analysis here:

    http://www.capx.co/why-camila-batmanghelidjh-had-access-to-a-prime-ministerial-slush-fund/

    " There are many lessons that need to be absorbed in the aftermath of this Kids Company debacle. One surely is that the essential services, provided to our most vulnerable kids in the country should not become dependent on charismatic charity founders seeking support from Prime Ministerial slush funds. Secondly, it is preposterous to have a dedicated department making grant payments to individual charities delivering services that cut right across the work of other government departments. "

    The main lesson should be that the Prime Minister should not overrule the work of civil servants because he likes doing photo ops with the charity's owner.
    Where's the Opposition? If Labour weren't so busy self destructing, they'd be all over this.

    Cameron should be sweating buckets at the despatch box, answering awkward and probing questions.
    Someone should certainly be asking the difficult questions and Cameron should certainly have cause to be nervous. However, how can that be Labour? Cameron has merely continued the policy that Labour set in place.
    To be fair, in the past (say, before 2013), I've heard her talk a lot of sense - more so than many social commentators. It could be that she's well-meaning but a hopeless organiser.

    (dons flameproof coat)

    Often, the people best set to found an organisation are not those best set to run them in the long term.
  • Options
    rullkorullko Posts: 161
    What about that Cruz guy, eh? He literally hears Jesus' voice every day. I don't think even Tim Farron goes that far.
  • Options
    Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Alistair said:

    Aus storming this. Piling on them to win now.

    It's one of the worst prices I've ever seen.
  • Options
    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited August 2015

    JEO said:

    I'm not talking about using charities rather than civil servants. I'm talking about the civil servants assessing the grants, after doing detailed analysis, being overruled by David Cameron on a whim.

    Fair enough, although I'd quibble with the phrase 'on a whim'.

    I've seen a very similar effect in local politics, where councillors (in this case Tories and LibDems) got terribly excited about a project which a charity put forward and spent a lot of money on it over a period of years, despite it being obviously a no-hoper right from the start. These things take on a momentum of their own.
    If they were spending their own money they'd be a lot more careful of course. Spending other people's money is always a lot easier.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,907

    JEO said:

    The main lesson should be that the Prime Minister should not overrule the work of civil servants because he likes doing photo ops with the charity's owner.

    The whole idea of using charities (and also 'business partnerships') is to overrule the work of the civil servants, which is why since 2000 the Labour, coalition and this Conservative governments have gone down that route. On a small scale, I actually think it's a good idea: by their nature, government departments and local authorities necessarily act in a bureaucratic and cumbersome way. Small-scale, locally-based, and non-government initiatives, such as Kids Company was originally, can be very useful in getting impetus behind new ideas.

    I think the real problem here was that the approach doesn't scale up. Once it becomes a substitute for mainstream provision of services, it's no longer an appropriate model.
    Well said. Charities have their place in helping the vulnerable, but when they get too big they act just like a department of bureaucratic civil servants but without the accountability.
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    watford30watford30 Posts: 3,474
    AndyJS said:

    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035

    'Right thing to do' - hosing another £3 million of our money up the wall.

    Twunt.
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    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,907

    Alistair said:

    Aus storming this. Piling on them to win now.

    It's one of the worst prices I've ever seen.
    England at 1/6 must be close to free money. Even though I'm a hopeless pessimist when it comes to following England in any sport, we surely can't lose from here.
  • Options
    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    @dr_spyn Did you get to see this?
    Penguins, pirates and even a minion: Spectacular show as more than 100 balloons take off at start of international fiesta

    A total of 103 balloons were in the sky for the launch of the 37th International Balloon Fiesta in Bristol
    One of the largest Tibetan flags, caused a stir after an email claiming to be from the Chinese Embassy asked the organisers not to ban the balloon
    Pilot Heaven Crawley said the balloon, named Tashi, meaning good fortune for Tibet, was met with a good reception
    The first solar-powered hybrid hot air balloon is taking part to mark Bristol's status as European Green Capital

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3187785/Hundreds-balloons-start-international-festival.html#ixzz3i8VaP1Xu

  • Options
    SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    AndyJS said:

    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035

    BBC being rather ambiguous in their reporting, no doubt hoping readers join the dots provided – I just wish they’d spell out clearly that KC went bankrupt when worried backers pulled £6m in funding due to child abuse allegations and stop these silly games.
  • Options
    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Songs of Praise from The Jungle is another one. What could be more political?

    AndyJS said:

    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035

    BBC being rather ambiguous in their reporting, no doubt hoping readers join the dots provided – I just wish they’d spell out clearly that KC went bankrupt when worried backers pulled £6m in funding due to child abuse allegations and stop these silly games.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,907

    AndyJS said:

    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035

    BBC being rather ambiguous in their reporting, no doubt hoping readers join the dots provided – I just wish they’d spell out clearly that KC went bankrupt when worried backers pulled £6m in funding due to child abuse allegations and stop these silly games.
    Are declaring the interest that a senior manager at the BBC is also chairman of the charity? If not, why not?
  • Options
    rullkorullko Posts: 161
    I know nothing about cricket except what the bat looks like, but on the strength of the consensus on this thread I've put £150 on England at 1.18. I hope folk saying they can't lose weren't being sarcastic.
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    JEOJEO Posts: 3,656
    Sandpit said:

    AndyJS said:

    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035

    BBC being rather ambiguous in their reporting, no doubt hoping readers join the dots provided – I just wish they’d spell out clearly that KC went bankrupt when worried backers pulled £6m in funding due to child abuse allegations and stop these silly games.
    Are declaring the interest that a senior manager at the BBC is also chairman of the charity? If not, why not?
    I saw an entire news bulletin the other day on angry mothers and children about how the charity was like a family and it was wrong for government to close them down. Literally no context at all. The BBC seems to be getting more biased in the last twelve months.
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    justin124justin124 Posts: 11,527
    edited August 2015
    Today we have reached the 5% point of this Parliament! It seems to have arrived rather quickly.So just 4.75 years remain now!
  • Options
    SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    edited August 2015
    Sandpit said:

    AndyJS said:

    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035

    BBC being rather ambiguous in their reporting, no doubt hoping readers join the dots provided – I just wish they’d spell out clearly that KC went bankrupt when worried backers pulled £6m in funding due to child abuse allegations and stop these silly games.
    Are declaring the interest that a senior manager at the BBC is also chairman of the charity? If not, why not?
    D of I? - Alan Yentob should be sacked, his intervention over Newsnight was a disgraceful.
  • Options
    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,190
    JEO said:

    Sandpit said:

    AndyJS said:

    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035

    BBC being rather ambiguous in their reporting, no doubt hoping readers join the dots provided – I just wish they’d spell out clearly that KC went bankrupt when worried backers pulled £6m in funding due to child abuse allegations and stop these silly games.
    Are declaring the interest that a senior manager at the BBC is also chairman of the charity? If not, why not?
    I saw an entire news bulletin the other day on angry mothers and children about how the charity was like a family and it was wrong for government to close them down. Literally no context at all. The BBC seems to be getting more biased in the last twelve months.
    It's as though they've stopped giving a ****. They're almost goading the government into closing them down.
  • Options
    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Have there been any BBC intvs with Yentob about this? The other trustees are AWOL.

    Sandpit said:

    AndyJS said:

    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035

    BBC being rather ambiguous in their reporting, no doubt hoping readers join the dots provided – I just wish they’d spell out clearly that KC went bankrupt when worried backers pulled £6m in funding due to child abuse allegations and stop these silly games.
    Are declaring the interest that a senior manager at the BBC is also chairman of the charity? If not, why not?
    D of I? - Alan Yentob should be sacked, his intervention over Newsnight was a disgraceful.
  • Options
    watford30watford30 Posts: 3,474
    tlg86 said:

    JEO said:

    Sandpit said:

    AndyJS said:

    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035

    BBC being rather ambiguous in their reporting, no doubt hoping readers join the dots provided – I just wish they’d spell out clearly that KC went bankrupt when worried backers pulled £6m in funding due to child abuse allegations and stop these silly games.
    Are declaring the interest that a senior manager at the BBC is also chairman of the charity? If not, why not?
    I saw an entire news bulletin the other day on angry mothers and children about how the charity was like a family and it was wrong for government to close them down. Literally no context at all. The BBC seems to be getting more biased in the last twelve months.
    It's as though they've stopped giving a ****. They're almost goading the government into closing them down.
    Phasing out the Licence Fee in favour of a voluntary subscription model will sort things out pretty smartish.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,907
    More good economics news, not that it will get reported over kids, cricket and Calais.
    Exports up 6.6% last quarter.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/11789142/UK-exports-enjoy-biggest-rise-in-nearly-a-decade.html
  • Options
    JEOJEO Posts: 3,656
    watford30 said:

    tlg86 said:

    JEO said:

    Sandpit said:

    AndyJS said:

    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035

    BBC being rather ambiguous in their reporting, no doubt hoping readers join the dots provided – I just wish they’d spell out clearly that KC went bankrupt when worried backers pulled £6m in funding due to child abuse allegations and stop these silly games.
    Are declaring the interest that a senior manager at the BBC is also chairman of the charity? If not, why not?
    I saw an entire news bulletin the other day on angry mothers and children about how the charity was like a family and it was wrong for government to close them down. Literally no context at all. The BBC seems to be getting more biased in the last twelve months.
    It's as though they've stopped giving a ****. They're almost goading the government into closing them down.
    Phasing out the Licence Fee in favour of a voluntary subscription model will sort things out pretty smartish.
    They should just name the date for the end of a compulsory licence fee for people that don't watch the BBC. It can then be left to the BBC to decide how to introduce the technology to enforce it.
  • Options
    watford30watford30 Posts: 3,474
    edited August 2015
    Plato said:

    Have there been any BBC intvs with Yentob about this? The other trustees are AWOL.

    Sandpit said:

    AndyJS said:

    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035

    BBC being rather ambiguous in their reporting, no doubt hoping readers join the dots provided – I just wish they’d spell out clearly that KC went bankrupt when worried backers pulled £6m in funding due to child abuse allegations and stop these silly games.
    Are declaring the interest that a senior manager at the BBC is also chairman of the charity? If not, why not?
    D of I? - Alan Yentob should be sacked, his intervention over Newsnight was a disgraceful.
    The Sunday papers should be sweating them out.
  • Options
    SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    @Plato - Have there been any BBC intvs with Yentob about this? The other trustees are AWOL.

    I don't think so - they just keep repeating "Alan Yentob, chairman of Kids Company, told Channel 4 News that suggestions of financial mismanagement were "complete rubbish"."

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33800751
  • Options
    JEOJEO Posts: 3,656
    edited August 2015

    @Plato - Have there been any BBC intvs with Yentob about this? The other trustees are AWOL.

    I don't think so - they just keep repeating "Alan Yentob, chairman of Kids Company, told Channel 4 News that suggestions of financial mismanagement were "complete rubbish"."

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33800751

    That is jaw-dropping to report that quote without clarifying the BBC's conflict of interest in Yentob. It goes against basic journalistic practice.
  • Options
    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    I hope so - its a scandal.
    watford30 said:

    Plato said:

    Have there been any BBC intvs with Yentob about this? The other trustees are AWOL.

    Sandpit said:

    AndyJS said:

    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035

    BBC being rather ambiguous in their reporting, no doubt hoping readers join the dots provided – I just wish they’d spell out clearly that KC went bankrupt when worried backers pulled £6m in funding due to child abuse allegations and stop these silly games.
    Are declaring the interest that a senior manager at the BBC is also chairman of the charity? If not, why not?
    D of I? - Alan Yentob should be sacked, his intervention over Newsnight was a disgraceful.
    The Sunday papers should be sweating them out.
  • Options
    Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091

    Plato said:

    Diane is apparently a direct beneficiary of the Corbyn Effect? How interesting.

    It would certainly seem a reasonable supposition that she will be a beneficiary of the party's leftwards shift and the influx of new affiliates, or at least that Tessa Jowell's chances of diminished. The LabourList polling is likely to underestimate this effect, I think.
    I've seen people on Twitter who are simultaneously supporting Corbyn and Jowell, as counter-intuitive as it seems.
  • Options
    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    They'll be the wrong sort of exports, I suspect...
    Sandpit said:

    More good economics news, not that it will get reported over kids, cricket and Calais.
    Exports up 6.6% last quarter.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/11789142/UK-exports-enjoy-biggest-rise-in-nearly-a-decade.html

  • Options
    TCPoliticalBettingTCPoliticalBetting Posts: 10,819
    edited August 2015
    Plato said:

    Have there been any BBC intvs with Yentob about this? The other trustees are AWOL.

    Sandpit said:

    AndyJS said:

    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035

    BBC being rather ambiguous in their reporting, no doubt hoping readers join the dots provided – I just wish they’d spell out clearly that KC went bankrupt when worried backers pulled £6m in funding due to child abuse allegations and stop these silly games.
    Are declaring the interest that a senior manager at the BBC is also chairman of the charity? If not, why not?
    D of I? - Alan Yentob should be sacked, his intervention over Newsnight was a disgraceful.
    If Yentob was working for a FTSE company the size of the BBC, Yentob would already be under investigation and be suspended pending a full report into:-
    1. The allegation of meddling in the work of another department related to an outside interest of his.
    2. whether his outside interest was in breach of, or incompatible with, his work at the BBC.

    Neither of these things seem to be happening. Quite extraordinary.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,907
    edited August 2015
    Finally got him!!
    Another bloody no-ball...
  • Options
    justin124justin124 Posts: 11,527
    Sandpit said:

    More good economics news, not that it will get reported over kids, cricket and Calais.
    Exports up 6.6% last quarter.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/11789142/UK-exports-enjoy-biggest-rise-in-nearly-a-decade.html

    Poor Balance of Payments figures today though.
  • Options
    JEO said:

    @Plato - Have there been any BBC intvs with Yentob about this? The other trustees are AWOL.

    I don't think so - they just keep repeating "Alan Yentob, chairman of Kids Company, told Channel 4 News that suggestions of financial mismanagement were "complete rubbish"."

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33800751

    That is jaw-dropping to report that quote without clarifying the BBC's conflict of interest in Yentob. It goes against basic journalistic practice.
    It is ok. The BBC have 8,000 journalists but none are really brave enough to go after Yentob.
    Last night on Newsnight I do not recall Newsnight saying anything about the allegations in newspapers that Yentob had tried to interefere with KC investigations. Clearly watching 7pm C4 News is not a requirement for any Newsnight people.
  • Options
    BannedInParisBannedInParis Posts: 2,191
    Plato said:

    They'll be the wrong sort of exports, I suspect...

    Sandpit said:

    More good economics news, not that it will get reported over kids, cricket and Calais.
    Exports up 6.6% last quarter.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/11789142/UK-exports-enjoy-biggest-rise-in-nearly-a-decade.html

    Something about the Olympics?
  • Options
    Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    £66 looking to back Burnham at 2.64 then nothing until 2.92. About to blow?
  • Options
    3 wickets we've let aussie off, how fair minded can you get...
  • Options
    TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,388

    JEO said:

    @Plato - Have there been any BBC intvs with Yentob about this? The other trustees are AWOL.

    I don't think so - they just keep repeating "Alan Yentob, chairman of Kids Company, told Channel 4 News that suggestions of financial mismanagement were "complete rubbish"."

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33800751

    That is jaw-dropping to report that quote without clarifying the BBC's conflict of interest in Yentob. It goes against basic journalistic practice.
    It is ok. The BBC have 8,000 journalists but none are really brave enough to go after Yentob.
    Last night on Newsnight I do not recall Newsnight saying anything about the allegations in newspapers that Yentob had tried to interefere with KC investigations. Clearly watching 7pm C4 News is not a requirement for any Newsnight people.
    They have some brave enough. But others who don't want to rock the boat.

    So we have Lucy Manning being critical and few other parts of the BBC reporting it...
  • Options
    watford30watford30 Posts: 3,474

    Plato said:

    Have there been any BBC intvs with Yentob about this? The other trustees are AWOL.

    Sandpit said:

    AndyJS said:

    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035

    BBC being rather ambiguous in their reporting, no doubt hoping readers join the dots provided – I just wish they’d spell out clearly that KC went bankrupt when worried backers pulled £6m in funding due to child abuse allegations and stop these silly games.
    Are declaring the interest that a senior manager at the BBC is also chairman of the charity? If not, why not?
    D of I? - Alan Yentob should be sacked, his intervention over Newsnight was a disgraceful.
    If Yentob was working for a FTSE company the size of the BBC, Yentob would already be under investigation and be suspended pending a full report into:-
    1. The allegation of meddling in the work of another department related to an outside interest of his.
    2. whether his outside interest was in breach of, or incompatible with, his work at the BBC.

    Neither of these things seem to be happening. Quite extraordinary.
    Nothing will happen. Patten went native a long time ago, and everyone else will close ranks to protect one of their own.
  • Options
    Plato said:

    Songs of Praise from The Jungle is another one. What could be more political?

    AndyJS said:

    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035

    BBC being rather ambiguous in their reporting, no doubt hoping readers join the dots provided – I just wish they’d spell out clearly that KC went bankrupt when worried backers pulled £6m in funding due to child abuse allegations and stop these silly games.
    They are even going to involve that socialist priest ex St Pauls ..... Rev Giles Fraser,
  • Options
    watford30 said:

    Plato said:

    Have there been any BBC intvs with Yentob about this? The other trustees are AWOL.

    Sandpit said:

    AndyJS said:

    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035

    BBC being rather ambiguous in their reporting, no doubt hoping readers join the dots provided – I just wish they’d spell out clearly that KC went bankrupt when worried backers pulled £6m in funding due to child abuse allegations and stop these silly games.
    Are declaring the interest that a senior manager at the BBC is also chairman of the charity? If not, why not?
    D of I? - Alan Yentob should be sacked, his intervention over Newsnight was a disgraceful.
    If Yentob was working for a FTSE company the size of the BBC, Yentob would already be under investigation and be suspended pending a full report into:-
    1. The allegation of meddling in the work of another department related to an outside interest of his.
    2. whether his outside interest was in breach of, or incompatible with, his work at the BBC.

    Neither of these things seem to be happening. Quite extraordinary.
    Nothing will happen. Patten went native a long time ago, and everyone else will close ranks to protect one of their own.
    Sad but true. Patten stopped being a Conservative in the 1980s. RHINO.
  • Options
    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    According to the overnights, last night's Republican debate was the most watched political debate in history.

    The clear consensus winner, going away, was Carly Fiorina. Afterwards she went on lefty MsNBC with lefty Chris Matthews and took him apart when he attempted to tangle with her over Hillary.

    Trump decided to get into it with moderator Megyn Kelly, never a good idea, and was on NBC this morning saying he felt the questions last night were unfair and mean.

    In pre-debate meetings, Kelly told her male co-moderators that if Trump went for her when she asked the question, not to jump in and let her handle it.

    I don't think Trump helped himself at all last night.
  • Options
    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    watford30 said:

    Plato said:

    Have there been any BBC intvs with Yentob about this? The other trustees are AWOL.

    Sandpit said:

    AndyJS said:

    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035

    BBC being rather ambiguous in their reporting, no doubt hoping readers join the dots provided – I just wish they’d spell out clearly that KC went bankrupt when worried backers pulled £6m in funding due to child abuse allegations and stop these silly games.
    Are declaring the interest that a senior manager at the BBC is also chairman of the charity? If not, why not?
    D of I? - Alan Yentob should be sacked, his intervention over Newsnight was a disgraceful.
    If Yentob was working for a FTSE company the size of the BBC, Yentob would already be under investigation and be suspended pending a full report into:-
    1. The allegation of meddling in the work of another department related to an outside interest of his.
    2. whether his outside interest was in breach of, or incompatible with, his work at the BBC.

    Neither of these things seem to be happening. Quite extraordinary.
    Nothing will happen. Patten went native a long time ago, and everyone else will close ranks to protect one of their own.
    Hasn't Patten gone? In any case, there seems once more to be an awful lot of "look squirrel" about how it is all the BBC's fault the Prime Minister gave KC some money.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,907
    Got him this time!
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,930
    WE'RE INTO THE TAIL
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,125
    Brilliant - I walked a wicket!
  • Options

    JEO said:

    @Plato - Have there been any BBC intvs with Yentob about this? The other trustees are AWOL.

    I don't think so - they just keep repeating "Alan Yentob, chairman of Kids Company, told Channel 4 News that suggestions of financial mismanagement were "complete rubbish"."

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33800751

    That is jaw-dropping to report that quote without clarifying the BBC's conflict of interest in Yentob. It goes against basic journalistic practice.
    It is ok. The BBC have 8,000 journalists but none are really brave enough to go after Yentob.
    Last night on Newsnight I do not recall Newsnight saying anything about the allegations in newspapers that Yentob had tried to interefere with KC investigations. Clearly watching 7pm C4 News is not a requirement for any Newsnight people.
    They have some brave enough. But others who don't want to rock the boat.

    So we have Lucy Manning being critical and few other parts of the BBC reporting it...
    There are reports of Yentob verbally attacking her but I have not seen , heard or read any direct quotes from her.

    Mind you it is odd that Yentob is accused of "bullying" a female trying to do their job and the feministas at the Guardian/beeb/indie seem to be very very quiet. Did R4 Womens Hour cover it?
  • Options
    rullkorullko Posts: 161
    Looks like we're heading for re-crossover with Burnham and Corbyn.

    I can't fathom why any Labour supporter would want Burnham to win. If you want someone completely bland, why not just go for Cooper, who at least isn't associated with a major hospital scandal?
  • Options
    Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    edited August 2015
    rullko said:

    Looks like we're heading for re-crossover with Burnham and Corbyn.

    I can't fathom why any Labour supporter would want Burnham to win. If you want someone completely bland, why not just go for Cooper, who at least isn't associated with a major hospital scandal?

    The polls have consistently shown Burnham is more popular than Cooper with the general public.

    (Plus, I'm still not convinced anyone in the real world really knows/cares about Mid-Staffs -- in my experience, Burnham is best known for campaigning on Hillsborough, although that might just be with scousers admittedly.)
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,044

    watford30 said:

    Plato said:

    Have there been any BBC intvs with Yentob about this? The other trustees are AWOL.

    Sandpit said:

    AndyJS said:

    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035

    BBC being rather ambiguous in their reporting, no doubt hoping readers join the dots provided – I just wish they’d spell out clearly that KC went bankrupt when worried backers pulled £6m in funding due to child abuse allegations and stop these silly games.
    Are declaring the interest that a senior manager at the BBC is also chairman of the charity? If not, why not?
    D of I? - Alan Yentob should be sacked, his intervention over Newsnight was a disgraceful.
    If Yentob was working for a FTSE company the size of the BBC, Yentob would already be under investigation and be suspended pending a full report into:-
    1. The allegation of meddling in the work of another department related to an outside interest of his.
    2. whether his outside interest was in breach of, or incompatible with, his work at the BBC.

    Neither of these things seem to be happening. Quite extraordinary.
    Nothing will happen. Patten went native a long time ago, and everyone else will close ranks to protect one of their own.
    Hasn't Patten gone? In any case, there seems once more to be an awful lot of "look squirrel" about how it is all the BBC's fault the Prime Minister gave KC some money.
    Oi! "Look, Squirrel!" was my import onto here! Please put (c) Josias Jessop after it if you choose to use it. Or at least link to the video. ;)

    You seem to be ignoring the fact the BBC might have been slightly biased when one of their own is involved. Can we call that a 'reverse squirrel', or perhaps a 'look! Dodo!"
  • Options
    Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    edited August 2015
    Danny565 said:

    rullko said:

    Looks like we're heading for re-crossover with Burnham and Corbyn.

    I can't fathom why any Labour supporter would want Burnham to win. If you want someone completely bland, why not just go for Cooper, who at least isn't associated with a major hospital scandal?

    The polls have consistently shown Burnham is more popular than Cooper with the general public.
    I think that's a very foolish way to decide one's vote. As far as the general public are concerned, Cooper, Burnham & Kendall are all pretty equally blank canvasses. The question is - how will they be painted post-election? And do they have the nous to paint themselves?
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    How come Australia aren't so crap today???
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    How come Australia aren't so crap today???

    The early finishes in the tests are costing the counties and the ECB lots of money.

    So England are doing their best to ensure we have a five day test
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    Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039

    How come Australia aren't so crap today???

    Nice timing, Sunil.
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    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,907

    How come Australia aren't so crap today???

    The early finishes in the tests are costing the counties and the ECB lots of money.

    So England are doing their best to ensure we have a five day test
    Keep saying that, please! ;-)
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,125
    They Aussies are upping the crap quotient....
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    TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,388
    I'm launching a new bond.

    It's called the "BetFair English Cricket bond".

    It has a price of £100, a yield of 1.07, and matures either today or tomorrow.

    You can get it from BetFair, I'm just a PR person.

    I'm not FCA regulated though.
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    Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091

    Danny565 said:

    rullko said:

    Looks like we're heading for re-crossover with Burnham and Corbyn.

    I can't fathom why any Labour supporter would want Burnham to win. If you want someone completely bland, why not just go for Cooper, who at least isn't associated with a major hospital scandal?

    The polls have consistently shown Burnham is more popular than Cooper with the general public.
    I think that's a very foolish way to decide one's vote. As far as the general public are concerned, Cooper, Burnham & Kendall are all pretty equally blank canvasses. The question is - how will they be painted post-election? And do they have the nous to paint themselves?
    I would agree if it was just one or two polls. But there's been a whole host of polls now which have consistently shown Burnham a fair bit ahead - that has to mean something.

    You're right that both will be blank canvasses to most of the public, but even so, the people who are aware of them surely make up a decent sample size, and there's no reason to think that sample wouldn't be representative of what the whole public would think if/when they become more known.
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    How come Australia aren't so crap today???

    Nice timing, Sunil.
    You are aware of my "U-turn" yesterday wrt. Test Cricket? :)
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    JEOJEO Posts: 3,656

    watford30 said:

    Plato said:

    Have there been any BBC intvs with Yentob about this? The other trustees are AWOL.

    Sandpit said:

    AndyJS said:

    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035

    BBC being rather ambiguous in their reporting, no doubt hoping readers join the dots provided – I just wish they’d spell out clearly that KC went bankrupt when worried backers pulled £6m in funding due to child abuse allegations and stop these silly games.
    Are declaring the interest that a senior manager at the BBC is also chairman of the charity? If not, why not?
    D of I? - Alan Yentob should be sacked, his intervention over Newsnight was a disgraceful.
    If Yentob was working for a FTSE company the size of the BBC, Yentob would already be under investigation and be suspended pending a full report into:-
    1. The allegation of meddling in the work of another department related to an outside interest of his.
    2. whether his outside interest was in breach of, or incompatible with, his work at the BBC.

    Neither of these things seem to be happening. Quite extraordinary.
    Nothing will happen. Patten went native a long time ago, and everyone else will close ranks to protect one of their own.
    Hasn't Patten gone? In any case, there seems once more to be an awful lot of "look squirrel" about how it is all the BBC's fault the Prime Minister gave KC some money.
    Not really, seeing as I criticised both the BBC and David Cameron in this very thread.
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    They Aussies are upping the crap quotient....

    They only scored 60 yesterday! How come they doubled that already today?!
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    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300

    watford30 said:

    Plato said:

    Have there been any BBC intvs with Yentob about this? The other trustees are AWOL.

    Sandpit said:

    AndyJS said:

    "Kids Company closure: David Cameron defends £3m grant to closed charity"

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33822035

    BBC being rather ambiguous in their reporting, no doubt hoping readers join the dots provided – I just wish they’d spell out clearly that KC went bankrupt when worried backers pulled £6m in funding due to child abuse allegations and stop these silly games.
    Are declaring the interest that a senior manager at the BBC is also chairman of the charity? If not, why not?
    D of I? - Alan Yentob should be sacked, his intervention over Newsnight was a disgraceful.
    If Yentob was working for a FTSE company the size of the BBC, Yentob would already be under investigation and be suspended pending a full report into:-
    1. The allegation of meddling in the work of another department related to an outside interest of his.
    2. whether his outside interest was in breach of, or incompatible with, his work at the BBC.

    Neither of these things seem to be happening. Quite extraordinary.
    Nothing will happen. Patten went native a long time ago, and everyone else will close ranks to protect one of their own.
    Hasn't Patten gone? In any case, there seems once more to be an awful lot of "look squirrel" about how it is all the BBC's fault the Prime Minister gave KC some money.
    Oi! "Look, Squirrel!" was my import onto here! Please put (c) Josias Jessop after it if you choose to use it. Or at least link to the video. ;)

    You seem to be ignoring the fact the BBC might have been slightly biased when one of their own is involved. Can we call that a 'reverse squirrel', or perhaps a 'look! Dodo!"
    Tbh I think the whole thing is a bit of a non-story in itself. There are a lot of background issues about the role and governance of charities and voluntary sector involvement in public policy, right down to child safety concerns, but hard cases make bad law. Perhaps Sir John Chilcot could look into it.
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    TomsToms Posts: 2,478
    Tim_B said "The clear consensus winner, going away, was Carly Fiorina. Afterwards she went on lefty MsNBC with lefty Chris Matthews and took him apart when he attempted to tangle with her over Hillary."

    Wow. From what I can see she is formidable. Trump may be richer than she, but only in money.
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    rullkorullko Posts: 161
    edited August 2015
    Danny565 said:

    rullko said:

    Looks like we're heading for re-crossover with Burnham and Corbyn.

    I can't fathom why any Labour supporter would want Burnham to win. If you want someone completely bland, why not just go for Cooper, who at least isn't associated with a major hospital scandal?

    The polls have consistently shown Burnham is more popular than Cooper with the general public.

    (Plus, I'm still not convinced anyone in the real world really knows/cares about Mid-Staffs -- in my experience, Burnham is best known for campaigning on Hillsborough, although that might just be with scousers admittedly.)
    If folk don't know much about it, that could partly explain Burnham's poll lead. It'll certainly become much wider knowledge if he wins the leadership.

    He's the worst of all worlds: both boring and risky.
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,296
    Danny565 said:

    rullko said:

    Looks like we're heading for re-crossover with Burnham and Corbyn.

    I can't fathom why any Labour supporter would want Burnham to win. If you want someone completely bland, why not just go for Cooper, who at least isn't associated with a major hospital scandal?

    The polls have consistently shown Burnham is more popular than Cooper with the general public.

    (Plus, I'm still not convinced anyone in the real world really knows/cares about Mid-Staffs -- in my experience, Burnham is best known for campaigning on Hillsborough, although that might just be with scousers admittedly.)
    I think Cooper is, however unfairly, seen as Ed Miliband Mark II among those who have only a passing interest in politics. Posh, rather arrogant, not charismatic, not decisive, not terribly self-aware and not exactly a high-powered figure in government. She is also of course best know to the public as Mrs Balls, which whatever Nick Robinson's suggestions 'we will come to love him' is hardly a boost for her at the moment.

    Burnham, on the other hand, is seen as more ordinary and therefore the man who has a back story to compete with Osborne. Speaking as someone who lives in the Mid Staffs area, I think the episode raised questions about his judgement, but it's also six years ago and if the Tories are tempted into going on that all the time, they might well simply not be listened to if he has anything to say people want to hear. Also, as Danny notes, his Hillsborough campaign went across pretty well.

    The key point is of course that neither have articulated a decent policy platform, neither are charismatic and neither have taken any risks or tried to inspire anybody. Meanwhile Corbyn, who has a clear if wildly inaccurate message, has simply been showing both of them up.

    If I were a member of the Labour party - not forgetting I voted for Labour in the local elections this year - I would be panicking about this leadership campaign. Not one of the candidates has given any sign of being the answers to Labour's problems, and none have even given any sign they can unite the party. Troubling times.
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    Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Danny565 said:

    Danny565 said:

    rullko said:

    Looks like we're heading for re-crossover with Burnham and Corbyn.

    I can't fathom why any Labour supporter would want Burnham to win. If you want someone completely bland, why not just go for Cooper, who at least isn't associated with a major hospital scandal?

    The polls have consistently shown Burnham is more popular than Cooper with the general public.
    I think that's a very foolish way to decide one's vote. As far as the general public are concerned, Cooper, Burnham & Kendall are all pretty equally blank canvasses. The question is - how will they be painted post-election? And do they have the nous to paint themselves?
    I would agree if it was just one or two polls. But there's been a whole host of polls now which have consistently shown Burnham a fair bit ahead - that has to mean something.

    You're right that both will be blank canvasses to most of the public, but even so, the people who are aware of them surely make up a decent sample size, and there's no reason to think that sample wouldn't be representative of what the whole public would think if/when they become more known.
    I completely disagree with your final conclusion. Burnham will be painted into the continuity-Ed corner (only with added NHS deaths!) without much trouble at all. Not sure how Cooper will be painted - continuity Balls, perhaps, but at least that's a change of direction.

    As the election showed us, we should stop simply accepting polls as a substitute for political thought.

    Corbyn / Kendall = won't be able to hold the party together. Doesn't mean Corbyn can't win, of course.

    Burnham / Cooper = will both be able to hold the party together. But Burnham has been busy (desperately?) offering hostages to fortune during this campaign and has shown poor judgment in the past (threatening to sue Hunt, for example). Whereas Cooper has been extremely noncommittal and dull - not exciting, but surely the most intelligent approach to leave herself some freedom of manoeuvre if she wins.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,930

    I'm launching a new bond.

    It's called the "BetFair English Cricket bond".

    It has a price of £100, a yield of 1.07, and matures either today or tomorrow.

    You can get it from BetFair, I'm just a PR person.

    I'm not FCA regulated though.

    From your posts I think we have remarkably similiar thought processes when it comes to betting and cricket ^^;
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    Aussies collapsing like Starfleet at Wolf359
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