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We could soon see crossover on the most seats markets – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 13,256
edited May 22 in General
We could soon see crossover on the most seats markets – politicalbetting.com

Last week I advised betting on Labour winning the most sats when they were just a 26% implied chance, my reasoning was an expected Burnham bounce which depending on the Makerfield by-election result might see Labour soar even more.

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 55,807
    Proper first
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 60,936
    It would take a massively disastrous performance for Labour not to be largest party. To be fair, they've given it a go under Starmer...
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 55,807
    I’ve mainly been laying Reform most seats for some time. Either Labour or Tory could easily come top next time
  • DopermeanDopermean Posts: 3,419
    Today programme talking about "real world work experience" for children at 16. Broadcasting their ignorance of the reality of trying to get real world work experience at 16, which is very difficult due to the unwillingness of companies to offer it and the administration burden.
    If companies and the government want 16 year olds to do work experience, then they have to offer it.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 32,422
    Morning all! Back from a mega successful business trip to Amsterdam. Have caught toothache there, face has now started to swell overnight so off to the dentist a little later for treatment with a hammer.
  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 8,319
    Dopermean said:

    Today programme talking about "real world work experience" for children at 16. Broadcasting their ignorance of the reality of trying to get real world work experience at 16, which is very difficult due to the unwillingness of companies to offer it and the administration burden.
    If companies and the government want 16 year olds to do work experience, then they have to offer it.

    I thought it was arranged by secondary schools. Is that no longer the case?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332
    The ONS also says: “The current budget deficit – borrowing to fund day-to-day public sector activities – was £17.4 billion in April 2026; this was £3.4 billion (24.6%) more than in April 2025, and £2.6 billion more than the £14.8 billion forecast by the OBR.”

    The ONS’ chief economist said this was down partly to spending on benefits: “Borrowing this month was substantially higher than in April last year and although receipts increased compared to with April 2025, this was more than offset by higher spending on benefits and other costs
  • Thanks OP, have stuck £100 on Labour most seats
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 137,632
    edited May 22
    If Burnham wins the Makerfield by election, the MiC and Deltapoll polls both suggest a Burnham led Labour would still see a hung parliament at a general election. Crucially though with Labour winning most votes and seats rather than Reform as now with Starmer and with Davey and the LDs likely having the balance of power rather than Kemi and the Conservatives.
    Burnham needs to win the by election first though which is not a given
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 32,422
    I expect Burnham to walk it in Makerfield. Especially considering who Reform have chosen as their candidate. If he wins then its a coronation and politics changes. Labour winning is perfectly possible.

    If he loses? Well then it gets very funny very quickly. If Labour can't win in the red wall with Burnham then they can't win there at all. It would take endless Kirklees council shenanigans to get the voters up to speed with why vote for these useless wankers to stop Reform winning the election.
  • eekeek Posts: 34,568

    Dopermean said:

    Today programme talking about "real world work experience" for children at 16. Broadcasting their ignorance of the reality of trying to get real world work experience at 16, which is very difficult due to the unwillingness of companies to offer it and the administration burden.
    If companies and the government want 16 year olds to do work experience, then they have to offer it.

    I thought it was arranged by secondary schools. Is that no longer the case?
    Nope - it would require working on and maintaining a relationship with local businesses and schools don’t need to do that anymore as the next step after secondary school is 6th form or college

    College is now the place where industrial relationships are kept
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 26,335
    edited May 22
    Deleted - duplicate post.

    So on compost prizes, I only came second last year hence getting a guide to better composting. If I come top this year I will let you know what the prize is.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332
    Telegraph Sport understands that Real Madrid first-choice right-back Trent Alexander-Arnold, who has only played 25 minutes for England in the Thomas Tuchel reign, has been left out of the World Cup squad. Our understanding is that Tottenham defender Djed Spence will fill that full-back slot, as he is capable of playing on both flanks.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 137,632
    edited May 22
    If we do get a Labour and LD government and that introduces PR ironically that might save the Tories. With PR even now the Tories would get about 95 to 130 MPs on their current voteshare or projected voteshare against Burnham. Whereas with FPTP they are heading for about 50 to 65 MPs and losing around half of even the 121 MPs they won in 2024
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332
    Alberta will hold a referendum on whether the province should remain in Canada or move ahead with a second binding vote on separation, marking the first significant test of the country's unity in decades.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvgze8n5dxko
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 90,923
    edited May 22

    I expect Burnham to walk it in Makerfield. Especially considering who Reform have chosen as their candidate. If he wins then its a coronation and politics changes. Labour winning is perfectly possible.

    If he loses? Well then it gets very funny very quickly. If Labour can't win in the red wall with Burnham then they can't win there at all. It would take endless Kirklees council shenanigans to get the voters up to speed with why vote for these useless wankers to stop Reform winning the election.

    Burnham will be helped by the Greens shooting themselves in the foot with their candidate selection.
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2026/may/22/green-party-candidate-makerfield-byelection-chris-kennedy-quits
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 81,344
    edited May 22
    Dopermean said:

    Today programme talking about "real world work experience" for children at 16. Broadcasting their ignorance of the reality of trying to get real world work experience at 16, which is very difficult due to the unwillingness of companies to offer it and the administration burden.
    If companies and the government want 16 year olds to do work experience, then they have to offer it.

    We've had a 14 yr old doing some work experience here. Scanned over 700 (multipage) documents in 2 days for us. Like lightning !
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 26,335

    I expect Burnham to walk it in Makerfield. Especially considering who Reform have chosen as their candidate. If he wins then its a coronation and politics changes. Labour winning is perfectly possible.

    If he loses? Well then it gets very funny very quickly. If Labour can't win in the red wall with Burnham then they can't win there at all. It would take endless Kirklees council shenanigans to get the voters up to speed with why vote for these useless wankers to stop Reform winning the election.

    It's not just whether he wins or not, though. It's the size of the win. If he barely scrapes it, then a lot of Labour MPs will still worry about losing their seats at the next GE so they may be less inclined to be loyal and less willing to support any unpopular measures.

    Someone should work out how many Labour MPs had Reform candidate second in their constituency and how big their majority was and then see what happens to those seats at a GE if the Makerfield outcome is repeated.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 17,798

    Alberta will hold a referendum on whether the province should remain in Canada or move ahead with a second binding vote on separation, marking the first significant test of the country's unity in decades.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvgze8n5dxko

    A referendum on a referendum?
    It will be interesting to see how many people want a referendum but do not want separation.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 90,923
    edited May 22
    Cyclefree said:

    Re the non-custodial sentence for rape being discussed on the previous thread, the authorities can appeal a too lenient sentence. And the public can also ask for a review of a sentence they believe to be too low. See here - https://www.gov.uk/ask-crown-court-sentence-review.

    The judge's comments were plain embarrassing and insulting.

    Taliban ‘legitimising child marriage’ with new law, activists warn
    https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2026/may/22/taliban-legitimising-child-forced-early-marriage-law-women-rights
    Child marriage appears to have been legally recognised for the first time by the Taliban in Afghanistan, as activists say “shameful” new laws make it almost impossible for girls and young women to seek divorce against their husbands’ will.

    There are no official statistics on forced and underage marriages in Afghanistan, but activists say it has risen at an alarming rate in recent years, driven by the ban on girls being in education after the age of 11.

    One informal estimate suggested that since the Taliban had barred them from education about 70% had been pushed into early or forced marriage and that 66% of these marriages involved girls under the age of 18.

    There is no ban on child marriage in Afghanistan under the Taliban, but a new law on divorce approved last week appears to suggest that a girl who later says she was married against her will would not be permitted a divorce if her husband disagrees.

    The new law also appears to suggest that a woman cannot divorce her husband solely on the grounds of his absence or failure to provide financial support.

    There have been reported demonstrations against the new law in Afghanistan’s capital, Kabul, this week, with several women’s rights movements condemning the law as a form of systemic violence against women and children.

    One activist, Fatima, said: “After issuing hundreds of anti-women decrees, the Taliban are now attempting to institutionalise child marriage within the formal legal structure...


  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 137,632
    edited May 22

    Alberta will hold a referendum on whether the province should remain in Canada or move ahead with a second binding vote on separation, marking the first significant test of the country's unity in decades.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvgze8n5dxko

    After two defeated Quebec independence referendums now Alberta wants a shot. A bit like Essex now wanting an independence referendum after Scotland had its independence vote.

    Though the premier of Alberta says she will vote to keep Alberta in Canada, as will the Liberal and Conservative parties
  • pm215pm215 Posts: 1,453
    edited May 22

    Dopermean said:

    Today programme talking about "real world work experience" for children at 16. Broadcasting their ignorance of the reality of trying to get real world work experience at 16, which is very difficult due to the unwillingness of companies to offer it and the administration burden.
    If companies and the government want 16 year olds to do work experience, then they have to offer it.

    I thought it was arranged by secondary schools. Is that no longer the case?
    That only works to the extent that the schools can find willing companies to arrange it with, surely? My impression was that it was a matter of connections the school has with local businesses, parents who can persuade or connect with their employer to sort something out, and so on.

    My old employer does "work experience" for 16 year olds (or 18? IDK) but honestly it's not actually work, it's more like a week of some kind of group project in a meeting room in the office doing some programming or hardware related task under somebody's supervision, AIUI. It's not til you get to university student age and a whole summer placement that it even starts to get to "students do something approximately work shaped and a good student might even produce something useful" and even that is more "we offer paid internships so we have an opportunity to find and offer jobs to the good ones".

    Back thirty years ago my "work experience" week at 16 was clearly nothing like actually working, and it's kind of hard to see how it could be unless it's on a job you could reasonably start doing immediately out of high school, which then isn't very representative of what most people will end up doing.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 64,439
    Cookie said:

    Alberta will hold a referendum on whether the province should remain in Canada or move ahead with a second binding vote on separation, marking the first significant test of the country's unity in decades.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvgze8n5dxko

    A referendum on a referendum?
    It will be interesting to see how many people want a referendum but do not want separation.
    https://www.ipsos.com/en-ca/support-independence-alberta-reaches-levels-similar-quebec

    Speaks exactly to that.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 23,858

    Telegraph Sport understands that Real Madrid first-choice right-back Trent Alexander-Arnold, who has only played 25 minutes for England in the Thomas Tuchel reign, has been left out of the World Cup squad. Our understanding is that Tottenham defender Djed Spence will fill that full-back slot, as he is capable of playing on both flanks.

    And in his case if the mask fits...
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 81,344
    Cyclefree said:

    Re the non-custodial sentence for rape being discussed on the previous thread, the authorities can appeal a too lenient sentence. And the public can also ask for a review of a sentence they believe to be too low. See here - https://www.gov.uk/ask-crown-court-sentence-review.

    The judge's comments were plain embarrassing and insulting.

    Thanks Cyclefree, I have submitted the form. I hope others will too.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 25,829

    Morning all! Back from a mega successful business trip to Amsterdam. Have caught toothache there, face has now started to swell overnight so off to the dentist a little later for treatment with a hammer.

    Plenty of people require medical intervention following a "successful business trip to Amsterdam".
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 60,936

    Cookie said:

    Alberta will hold a referendum on whether the province should remain in Canada or move ahead with a second binding vote on separation, marking the first significant test of the country's unity in decades.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvgze8n5dxko

    A referendum on a referendum?
    It will be interesting to see how many people want a referendum but do not want separation.
    https://www.ipsos.com/en-ca/support-independence-alberta-reaches-levels-similar-quebec

    Speaks exactly to that.
    There has been a lot of Trump-supporting money from south of the border trying to make mischief in Alberta.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 57,533

    Cookie said:

    Alberta will hold a referendum on whether the province should remain in Canada or move ahead with a second binding vote on separation, marking the first significant test of the country's unity in decades.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvgze8n5dxko

    A referendum on a referendum?
    It will be interesting to see how many people want a referendum but do not want separation.
    https://www.ipsos.com/en-ca/support-independence-alberta-reaches-levels-similar-quebec

    Speaks exactly to that.
    From that article:

    "However, new Ipsos research which "stress-tested" these sentiments by introducing real-world consequences reveals that actual committed support for separation is roughly half these levels in both provinces, with only 15 to 16% of Albertans and Quebecers maintaining their support after considering possible costs. This means that for roughly half of separatist supporters in both provinces, independence is more a political message than a plan they are prepared to endure costs to achieve."

    Wise of Canada to have a national formula on how seccession would work. Other countries might want to do the same.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 18,695

    Dopermean said:

    Today programme talking about "real world work experience" for children at 16. Broadcasting their ignorance of the reality of trying to get real world work experience at 16, which is very difficult due to the unwillingness of companies to offer it and the administration burden.
    If companies and the government want 16 year olds to do work experience, then they have to offer it.

    I thought it was arranged by secondary schools. Is that no longer the case?
    The schools lean very heavily on parents as the first port of call, in my experience.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 64,114

    Cookie said:

    Alberta will hold a referendum on whether the province should remain in Canada or move ahead with a second binding vote on separation, marking the first significant test of the country's unity in decades.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvgze8n5dxko

    A referendum on a referendum?
    It will be interesting to see how many people want a referendum but do not want separation.
    https://www.ipsos.com/en-ca/support-independence-alberta-reaches-levels-similar-quebec

    Speaks exactly to that.
    There has been a lot of Trump-supporting money from south of the border trying to make mischief in Alberta.
    The Sudetenland just really belongs, culturally to the USA.

    Ahem.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 90,923
    Cyclefree said:

    I expect Burnham to walk it in Makerfield. Especially considering who Reform have chosen as their candidate. If he wins then its a coronation and politics changes. Labour winning is perfectly possible.

    If he loses? Well then it gets very funny very quickly. If Labour can't win in the red wall with Burnham then they can't win there at all. It would take endless Kirklees council shenanigans to get the voters up to speed with why vote for these useless wankers to stop Reform winning the election.

    It's not just whether he wins or not, though. It's the size of the win. If he barely scrapes it, then a lot of Labour MPs will still worry about losing their seats at the next GE so they may be less inclined to be loyal and less willing to support any unpopular measures.

    Someone should work out how many Labour MPs had Reform candidate second in their constituency and how big their majority was and then see what happens to those seats at a GE if the Makerfield outcome is repeated.
    That's most relevant to the prospects for a snap election, surely ?

    He would have three years, if he so chose, to turn things around. That timescale is a constraint on which unpopular, but potentially successful policies might find backing, but it doesn't rule them all out.

    There's also the point that if there's a settlement in the Gulf, and if Russia finally gives up its abortive invasion of Ukraine, then there's a likelihood of a strong global economic recovery.

    You can't just read across a by election result to a GE three years hence. Even some of the dimmer Labour backbenchers can be persuaded of that, I think ?
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 64,114
    Pause on $14bn arms sale to Taiwan:
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c232z4yk437o
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 90,923
    HYUFD said:

    Alberta will hold a referendum on whether the province should remain in Canada or move ahead with a second binding vote on separation, marking the first significant test of the country's unity in decades.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvgze8n5dxko

    After two defeated Quebec independence referendums now Alberta wants a shot. A bit like Essex now wanting an independence referendum after Scotland had its independence vote.

    Though the premier of Alberta says she will vote to keep Alberta in Canada, as will the Liberal and Conservative parties
    Maple MAGA.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 64,439
    Cyclefree said:

    I expect Burnham to walk it in Makerfield. Especially considering who Reform have chosen as their candidate. If he wins then its a coronation and politics changes. Labour winning is perfectly possible.

    If he loses? Well then it gets very funny very quickly. If Labour can't win in the red wall with Burnham then they can't win there at all. It would take endless Kirklees council shenanigans to get the voters up to speed with why vote for these useless wankers to stop Reform winning the election.

    It's not just whether he wins or not, though. It's the size of the win. If he barely scrapes it, then a lot of Labour MPs will still worry about losing their seats at the next GE so they may be less inclined to be loyal and less willing to support any unpopular measures.

    Someone should work out how many Labour MPs had Reform candidate second in their constituency and how big their majority was and then see what happens to those seats at a GE if the Makerfield outcome is repeated.
    https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/orderedseats.html

    Not exactly that, but helpful.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 57,533

    Cookie said:

    Alberta will hold a referendum on whether the province should remain in Canada or move ahead with a second binding vote on separation, marking the first significant test of the country's unity in decades.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvgze8n5dxko

    A referendum on a referendum?
    It will be interesting to see how many people want a referendum but do not want separation.
    https://www.ipsos.com/en-ca/support-independence-alberta-reaches-levels-similar-quebec

    Speaks exactly to that.
    There has been a lot of Trump-supporting money from south of the border trying to make mischief in Alberta.
    Who doesn't look to Trumpistan and think "we ought to do that"?
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 48,230

    Cookie said:

    Alberta will hold a referendum on whether the province should remain in Canada or move ahead with a second binding vote on separation, marking the first significant test of the country's unity in decades.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvgze8n5dxko

    A referendum on a referendum?
    It will be interesting to see how many people want a referendum but do not want separation.
    https://www.ipsos.com/en-ca/support-independence-alberta-reaches-levels-similar-quebec

    Speaks exactly to that.
    People in a country/region/provence deciding if they want to ask themselves a question about their future? It'll never catch on.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 137,632
    edited May 22
    Cyclefree said:

    I expect Burnham to walk it in Makerfield. Especially considering who Reform have chosen as their candidate. If he wins then its a coronation and politics changes. Labour winning is perfectly possible.

    If he loses? Well then it gets very funny very quickly. If Labour can't win in the red wall with Burnham then they can't win there at all. It would take endless Kirklees council shenanigans to get the voters up to speed with why vote for these useless wankers to stop Reform winning the election.

    It's not just whether he wins or not, though. It's the size of the win. If he barely scrapes it, then a lot of Labour MPs will still worry about losing their seats at the next GE so they may be less inclined to be loyal and less willing to support any unpopular measures.

    Someone should work out how many Labour MPs had Reform candidate second in their constituency and how big their majority was and then see what happens to those seats at a GE if the Makerfield outcome is repeated.
    Makerfield is only the 29th Reform target seat, so if Burnham holds it, even after a recount, barely any Labour MPs would lose their seats on the same swing
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 40,616
    Cyclefree said:

    I expect Burnham to walk it in Makerfield. Especially considering who Reform have chosen as their candidate. If he wins then its a coronation and politics changes. Labour winning is perfectly possible.

    If he loses? Well then it gets very funny very quickly. If Labour can't win in the red wall with Burnham then they can't win there at all. It would take endless Kirklees council shenanigans to get the voters up to speed with why vote for these useless wankers to stop Reform winning the election.

    It's not just whether he wins or not, though. It's the size of the win. If he barely scrapes it, then a lot of Labour MPs will still worry about losing their seats at the next GE so they may be less inclined to be loyal and less willing to support any unpopular measures.

    Someone should work out how many Labour MPs had Reform candidate second in their constituency and how big their majority was and then see what happens to those seats at a GE if the Makerfield outcome is repeated.
    A win is a win. If Burnham gets the win he usurps Starmer.

    The whole thing has looked like amateur hour, and with Reform selecting local lad with some iffy X posts which the voter will agree with, Rob the Plumber and the spectre of Leyton 1965 looming large, Team Nigel could take this, and as Rochdale suggests we can contentedly celebrate the death of the Labour Party.

    One hundred years was a decent run, even if most of it was in opposition. Over to you Zack for the next hundred years of mainly opposition.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 137,632

    Cyclefree said:

    I expect Burnham to walk it in Makerfield. Especially considering who Reform have chosen as their candidate. If he wins then its a coronation and politics changes. Labour winning is perfectly possible.

    If he loses? Well then it gets very funny very quickly. If Labour can't win in the red wall with Burnham then they can't win there at all. It would take endless Kirklees council shenanigans to get the voters up to speed with why vote for these useless wankers to stop Reform winning the election.

    It's not just whether he wins or not, though. It's the size of the win. If he barely scrapes it, then a lot of Labour MPs will still worry about losing their seats at the next GE so they may be less inclined to be loyal and less willing to support any unpopular measures.

    Someone should work out how many Labour MPs had Reform candidate second in their constituency and how big their majority was and then see what happens to those seats at a GE if the Makerfield outcome is repeated.
    A win is a win. If Burnham gets the win he usurps Starmer.

    The whole thing has looked like amateur hour, and with Reform selecting local lad with some iffy X posts which the voter will agree with, Rob the Plumber and the spectre of Leyton 1965 looming large, Team Nigel could take this, and as Rochdale suggests we can contentedly celebrate the death of the Labour Party.

    One hundred years was a decent run, even if most of it was in opposition. Over to you Zack for the next hundred years of mainly opposition.
    The Greens are now polling a poor fifth and even lower on voteshare against Burnham
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 90,923

    Pause on $14bn arms sale to Taiwan:
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c232z4yk437o

    Not the most convincing of explanations.

    .."Right now we're doing a pause in order to make sure we have the munitions we need for Epic Fury - which we have plenty," Cao said at the hearing on Thursday, using the code name for the US-Israel joint military operation in Iran.
    "We're just making sure we have everything, but then the foreign military sales will continue when the administration deems necessary."
    When asked what he had heard from the Taiwanese about a pause in the weapons sale, Cao said he had "not spoken to the Taiwanese"..
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 51,556
    edited May 22
    HYUFD said:

    If we do get a Labour and LD government and that introduces PR ironically that might save the Tories. With PR even now the Tories would get about 95 to 130 MPs on their current voteshare or projected voteshare against Burnham. Whereas with FPTP they are heading for about 50 to 65 MPs and losing around half of even the 121 MPs they won in 2024

    If this new multiparty politics becomes the norm some sort of electoral reform for Westminster is almost inevitable, I'd have thought.
  • eekeek Posts: 34,568
    pm215 said:

    Dopermean said:

    Today programme talking about "real world work experience" for children at 16. Broadcasting their ignorance of the reality of trying to get real world work experience at 16, which is very difficult due to the unwillingness of companies to offer it and the administration burden.
    If companies and the government want 16 year olds to do work experience, then they have to offer it.

    I thought it was arranged by secondary schools. Is that no longer the case?
    That only works to the extent that the schools can find willing companies to arrange it with, surely? My impression was that it was a matter of connections the school has with local businesses, parents who can persuade or connect with their employer to sort something out, and so on.

    My old employer does "work experience" for 16 year olds (or 18? IDK) but honestly it's not actually work, it's more like a week of some kind of group project in a meeting room in the office doing some programming or hardware related task under somebody's supervision, AIUI. It's not til you get to university student age and a whole summer placement that it even starts to get to "students do something approximately work shaped and a good student might even produce something useful" and even that is more "we offer paid internships so we have an opportunity to find and offer jobs to the good ones".

    Back thirty years ago my "work experience" week at 16 was clearly nothing like actually working, and it's kind of hard to see how it could be unless it's on a job you could reasonably start doing immediately out of high school, which then isn't very representative of what most people will end up doing.
    Ironically I spent 2 weeks doing actually (basic) accountancy work aged 16 - I feel sorry for the 2 firms I did the accounts for but they were correct (and checked by someone else(.

    It told me to go into tax if I was going to became an accountant and then the internet appeared so I went into IT.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 29,254
    "'Monitoring the situation': Why young men are drawn to prediction markets"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c93xv27kpwxo
  • eekeek Posts: 34,568
    Nigelb said:

    Pause on $14bn arms sale to Taiwan:
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c232z4yk437o

    Not the most convincing of explanations.

    .."Right now we're doing a pause in order to make sure we have the munitions we need for Epic Fury - which we have plenty," Cao said at the hearing on Thursday, using the code name for the US-Israel joint military operation in Iran.
    "We're just making sure we have everything, but then the foreign military sales will continue when the administration deems necessary."
    When asked what he had heard from the Taiwanese about a pause in the weapons sale, Cao said he had "not spoken to the Taiwanese"..
    Trump can’t say he’s quietly sold Taiwan out in his meeting with Xi so some other story is required no matter how implausible
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 51,556
    Nigelb said:

    Pause on $14bn arms sale to Taiwan:
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c232z4yk437o

    Not the most convincing of explanations.

    .."Right now we're doing a pause in order to make sure we have the munitions we need for Epic Fury - which we have plenty," Cao said at the hearing on Thursday, using the code name for the US-Israel joint military operation in Iran.
    "We're just making sure we have everything, but then the foreign military sales will continue when the administration deems necessary."
    When asked what he had heard from the Taiwanese about a pause in the weapons sale, Cao said he had "not spoken to the Taiwanese"..
    And straight after his sleepover with that thrillingly powerful man Xi he told Taiwan to forget about being independent or about the US defending them, didn't he. So it's clear enough.

    Again, the question: Does all this stop with the end of Trump or is it the new USA for the foreseeable.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 57,533
    eek said:

    Nigelb said:

    Pause on $14bn arms sale to Taiwan:
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c232z4yk437o

    Not the most convincing of explanations.

    .."Right now we're doing a pause in order to make sure we have the munitions we need for Epic Fury - which we have plenty," Cao said at the hearing on Thursday, using the code name for the US-Israel joint military operation in Iran.
    "We're just making sure we have everything, but then the foreign military sales will continue when the administration deems necessary."
    When asked what he had heard from the Taiwanese about a pause in the weapons sale, Cao said he had "not spoken to the Taiwanese"..
    Trump can’t say he’s quietly sold Taiwan out in his meeting with Xi so some other story is required no matter how implausible
    Xi knows "The Art of the Deal".

    Trump will shaft Taiwan simply because he can. He has no ideology of morality.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 64,439
    Foxy said:

    Cookie said:

    Alberta will hold a referendum on whether the province should remain in Canada or move ahead with a second binding vote on separation, marking the first significant test of the country's unity in decades.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvgze8n5dxko

    A referendum on a referendum?
    It will be interesting to see how many people want a referendum but do not want separation.
    https://www.ipsos.com/en-ca/support-independence-alberta-reaches-levels-similar-quebec

    Speaks exactly to that.
    There has been a lot of Trump-supporting money from south of the border trying to make mischief in Alberta.
    Who doesn't look to Trumpistan and think "we ought to do that"?
    To be accurate, there has been a minority for independence in Alberta for a long time.

    Mostly about the oil wealth - the classic “If we were a small country with all this oil, income tax would be negative” stuff.

    Alberta would be the largest amount of oil that a government is proposing to leave in the ground, that I know of. Makes the North Sea look small.

    That support for independence is so low says something about Albertans, and their view/relationship with the oil industry.

    Note that this is about getting enough signature on a petition to start the process for the first referendum.

    After the Quebec referendum, Canada wrote law carefully defining the process* for such referenda

    *the Canadian independence referendum process is actually quite clear and to the point.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 64,439
    eek said:

    Nigelb said:

    Pause on $14bn arms sale to Taiwan:
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c232z4yk437o

    Not the most convincing of explanations.

    .."Right now we're doing a pause in order to make sure we have the munitions we need for Epic Fury - which we have plenty," Cao said at the hearing on Thursday, using the code name for the US-Israel joint military operation in Iran.
    "We're just making sure we have everything, but then the foreign military sales will continue when the administration deems necessary."
    When asked what he had heard from the Taiwanese about a pause in the weapons sale, Cao said he had "not spoken to the Taiwanese"..
    Trump can’t say he’s quietly sold Taiwan out in his meeting with Xi so some other story is required no matter how implausible
    The enormous investments in chip production in the US are a long running sign to both the Taiwanese and China.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 40,616
    Foxy said:

    eek said:

    Nigelb said:

    Pause on $14bn arms sale to Taiwan:
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c232z4yk437o

    Not the most convincing of explanations.

    .."Right now we're doing a pause in order to make sure we have the munitions we need for Epic Fury - which we have plenty," Cao said at the hearing on Thursday, using the code name for the US-Israel joint military operation in Iran.
    "We're just making sure we have everything, but then the foreign military sales will continue when the administration deems necessary."
    When asked what he had heard from the Taiwanese about a pause in the weapons sale, Cao said he had "not spoken to the Taiwanese"..
    Trump can’t say he’s quietly sold Taiwan out in his meeting with Xi so some other story is required no matter how implausible
    Xi knows "The Art of the Deal".

    Trump will shaft Taiwan simply because he can. He has no ideology of morality.
    Trump like any worthy New York hood most likely arranged some kind of secret side hustle with the Chinatown mafia boss over Taiwan at their meeting.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332
    England WC squad

    Goalkeepers: Jordan Pickford (Everton), Dean Henderson (Crystal Palace), James Trafford (Manchester City)

    Defenders: Reece James (Chelsea), Tino Livramento (Newcastle), Marc Guehi (Manchester City), Ezri Konsa (Aston Villa), John Stones (Manchester City), Jarell Quansah (Bayer Leverkusen), Nico O'Reilly (Manchester City), Dan Burn (Newcastle), Djed Spence (Tottenham Hotspur)

    Midfielders: Declan Rice (Arsenal), Elliot Anderson (Nottingham Forest), Jude Bellingham (Real Madrid), Jordan Henderson (Brentford), Morgan Rogers (Aston Villa), Kobbie Mainoo (Manchester United)

    Forwards: Harry Kane (Bayern Munich), Ivan Toney (Al-Ahli), Ollie Watkins (Aston Villa), Bukayo Saka (Arsenal), Noni Madueke (Arsenal), Marcus Rashford (Barcelona), Anthony Gordon (Newcastle), Eberechi Eze (Arsenal)
  • DopermeanDopermean Posts: 3,419

    Dopermean said:

    Today programme talking about "real world work experience" for children at 16. Broadcasting their ignorance of the reality of trying to get real world work experience at 16, which is very difficult due to the unwillingness of companies to offer it and the administration burden.
    If companies and the government want 16 year olds to do work experience, then they have to offer it.

    I thought it was arranged by secondary schools. Is that no longer the case?
    The schools lean very heavily on parents as the first port of call, in my experience.
    Yep, some schools do seem to have links but that doesn't seem to be the majority by any means, the others tell the students to sort it out themselves, then put barriers in place such as not engaging with the potential provider / replying to emails or a huge admin overhead (probably legally required to be fair).
    Unless there's a parent with a willing employer it is very difficult if the school hasn't cultivated links with employers.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 72,715
    Good morning

    Burnham winning will change the narrative especially if Starmer is gone soon after and the country needs something dramatic to wake it up from the slide to the far right [reform] and far left [greens]

    I would expect Burnham to get a honeymoon and crossover with reform quite quickly, possibly even before the 18th June if the polls indicate a Burnham win
  • FeersumEnjineeyaFeersumEnjineeya Posts: 5,386
    edited May 22
    eek said:

    pm215 said:

    Dopermean said:

    Today programme talking about "real world work experience" for children at 16. Broadcasting their ignorance of the reality of trying to get real world work experience at 16, which is very difficult due to the unwillingness of companies to offer it and the administration burden.
    If companies and the government want 16 year olds to do work experience, then they have to offer it.

    I thought it was arranged by secondary schools. Is that no longer the case?
    That only works to the extent that the schools can find willing companies to arrange it with, surely? My impression was that it was a matter of connections the school has with local businesses, parents who can persuade or connect with their employer to sort something out, and so on.

    My old employer does "work experience" for 16 year olds (or 18? IDK) but honestly it's not actually work, it's more like a week of some kind of group project in a meeting room in the office doing some programming or hardware related task under somebody's supervision, AIUI. It's not til you get to university student age and a whole summer placement that it even starts to get to "students do something approximately work shaped and a good student might even produce something useful" and even that is more "we offer paid internships so we have an opportunity to find and offer jobs to the good ones".

    Back thirty years ago my "work experience" week at 16 was clearly nothing like actually working, and it's kind of hard to see how it could be unless it's on a job you could reasonably start doing immediately out of high school, which then isn't very representative of what most people will end up doing.
    Ironically I spent 2 weeks doing actually (basic) accountancy work aged 16 - I feel sorry for the 2 firms I did the accounts for but they were correct (and checked by someone else(.

    It told me to go into tax if I was going to became an accountant and then the internet appeared so I went into IT.
    Duplicate post.
  • FeersumEnjineeyaFeersumEnjineeya Posts: 5,386
    edited May 22
    eek said:

    pm215 said:

    Dopermean said:

    Today programme talking about "real world work experience" for children at 16. Broadcasting their ignorance of the reality of trying to get real world work experience at 16, which is very difficult due to the unwillingness of companies to offer it and the administration burden.
    If companies and the government want 16 year olds to do work experience, then they have to offer it.

    I thought it was arranged by secondary schools. Is that no longer the case?
    That only works to the extent that the schools can find willing companies to arrange it with, surely? My impression was that it was a matter of connections the school has with local businesses, parents who can persuade or connect with their employer to sort something out, and so on.

    My old employer does "work experience" for 16 year olds (or 18? IDK) but honestly it's not actually work, it's more like a week of some kind of group project in a meeting room in the office doing some programming or hardware related task under somebody's supervision, AIUI. It's not til you get to university student age and a whole summer placement that it even starts to get to "students do something approximately work shaped and a good student might even produce something useful" and even that is more "we offer paid internships so we have an opportunity to find and offer jobs to the good ones".

    Back thirty years ago my "work experience" week at 16 was clearly nothing like actually working, and it's kind of hard to see how it could be unless it's on a job you could reasonably start doing immediately out of high school, which then isn't very representative of what most people will end up doing.
    Ironically I spent 2 weeks doing actually (basic) accountancy work aged 16 - I feel sorry for the 2 firms I did the accounts for but they were correct (and checked by someone else(.

    It told me to go into tax if I was going to became an accountant and then the internet appeared so I went into IT.
    My lad was getting into computing when he was 16, and was pleased to bag himself two weeks of work experience with a digital marketing company, where he hoped to be able to do some coding. Unfortunately, he ended up spending the entire time having to write and post tweets extolling the virtues of various corporate clients. This was enough to put him right off IT, and he ended up going into finance instead. Rather the opposite of your good self!
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 18,695
    Dopermean said:

    Dopermean said:

    Today programme talking about "real world work experience" for children at 16. Broadcasting their ignorance of the reality of trying to get real world work experience at 16, which is very difficult due to the unwillingness of companies to offer it and the administration burden.
    If companies and the government want 16 year olds to do work experience, then they have to offer it.

    I thought it was arranged by secondary schools. Is that no longer the case?
    The schools lean very heavily on parents as the first port of call, in my experience.
    Yep, some schools do seem to have links but that doesn't seem to be the majority by any means, the others tell the students to sort it out themselves, then put barriers in place such as not engaging with the potential provider / replying to emails or a huge admin overhead (probably legally required to be fair).
    Unless there's a parent with a willing employer it is very difficult if the school hasn't cultivated links with employers.
    Yeah, it is far from ideal as it basically relies on parental contacts and so entrenches privilege.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 57,533

    Dopermean said:

    Dopermean said:

    Today programme talking about "real world work experience" for children at 16. Broadcasting their ignorance of the reality of trying to get real world work experience at 16, which is very difficult due to the unwillingness of companies to offer it and the administration burden.
    If companies and the government want 16 year olds to do work experience, then they have to offer it.

    I thought it was arranged by secondary schools. Is that no longer the case?
    The schools lean very heavily on parents as the first port of call, in my experience.
    Yep, some schools do seem to have links but that doesn't seem to be the majority by any means, the others tell the students to sort it out themselves, then put barriers in place such as not engaging with the potential provider / replying to emails or a huge admin overhead (probably legally required to be fair).
    Unless there's a parent with a willing employer it is very difficult if the school hasn't cultivated links with employers.
    Yeah, it is far from ideal as it basically relies on parental contacts and so entrenches privilege.
    Yes that is very much how it works in medicine sadly.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 15,801

    Foxy said:

    eek said:

    Nigelb said:

    Pause on $14bn arms sale to Taiwan:
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c232z4yk437o

    Not the most convincing of explanations.

    .."Right now we're doing a pause in order to make sure we have the munitions we need for Epic Fury - which we have plenty," Cao said at the hearing on Thursday, using the code name for the US-Israel joint military operation in Iran.
    "We're just making sure we have everything, but then the foreign military sales will continue when the administration deems necessary."
    When asked what he had heard from the Taiwanese about a pause in the weapons sale, Cao said he had "not spoken to the Taiwanese"..
    Trump can’t say he’s quietly sold Taiwan out in his meeting with Xi so some other story is required no matter how implausible
    Xi knows "The Art of the Deal".

    Trump will shaft Taiwan simply because he can. He has no ideology of morality.
    Trump like any worthy New York hood most likely arranged some kind of secret side hustle with the Chinatown mafia boss over Taiwan at their meeting.
    The PRC are going to get the renegade province back eventually anyway, so DJT probably thinks he might as well make a quid off the inevitable.

    It's not like his Persian misadventure where he has to do what the Zionist Entity tells him to great detriment of just about everything.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 51,556
    edited May 22
    Foxy said:

    eek said:

    Nigelb said:

    Pause on $14bn arms sale to Taiwan:
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c232z4yk437o

    Not the most convincing of explanations.

    .."Right now we're doing a pause in order to make sure we have the munitions we need for Epic Fury - which we have plenty," Cao said at the hearing on Thursday, using the code name for the US-Israel joint military operation in Iran.
    "We're just making sure we have everything, but then the foreign military sales will continue when the administration deems necessary."
    When asked what he had heard from the Taiwanese about a pause in the weapons sale, Cao said he had "not spoken to the Taiwanese"..
    Trump can’t say he’s quietly sold Taiwan out in his meeting with Xi so some other story is required no matter how implausible
    Xi knows "The Art of the Deal".

    Trump will shaft Taiwan simply because he can. He has no ideology of morality.
    That's right. I understand why people (inc and in fact esp the more serious pundits) try hard to detect something other than personal gratification and enrichment going on with the Trump presidency. It's surreal and absurd, as well as immensely dispiriting, to assess the leader of the richest and most powerful country in the world in that way. But I'm afraid it's true. There's nothing else there. The evidence is overwhelming. IMO it was there when he was re-elected and before but it's beyond question now.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 17,798
    Dura_Ace said:

    Foxy said:

    eek said:

    Nigelb said:

    Pause on $14bn arms sale to Taiwan:
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c232z4yk437o

    Not the most convincing of explanations.

    .."Right now we're doing a pause in order to make sure we have the munitions we need for Epic Fury - which we have plenty," Cao said at the hearing on Thursday, using the code name for the US-Israel joint military operation in Iran.
    "We're just making sure we have everything, but then the foreign military sales will continue when the administration deems necessary."
    When asked what he had heard from the Taiwanese about a pause in the weapons sale, Cao said he had "not spoken to the Taiwanese"..
    Trump can’t say he’s quietly sold Taiwan out in his meeting with Xi so some other story is required no matter how implausible
    Xi knows "The Art of the Deal".

    Trump will shaft Taiwan simply because he can. He has no ideology of morality.
    Trump like any worthy New York hood most likely arranged some kind of secret side hustle with the Chinatown mafia boss over Taiwan at their meeting.
    The PRC are going to get the renegade province back eventually anyway, so DJT probably thinks he might as well make a quid off the inevitable.

    It's not like his Persian misadventure where he has to do what the Zionist Entity tells him to great detriment of just about everything.
    Arguably it's mainland China that is the renegade province.
  • PeterCairnsPeterCairns Posts: 282

    eek said:

    pm215 said:

    Dopermean said:

    Today programme talking about "real world work experience" for children at 16. Broadcasting their ignorance of the reality of trying to get real world work experience at 16, which is very difficult due to the unwillingness of companies to offer it and the administration burden.
    If companies and the government want 16 year olds to do work experience, then they have to offer it.

    I thought it was arranged by secondary schools. Is that no longer the case?
    That only works to the extent that the schools can find willing companies to arrange it with, surely? My impression was that it was a matter of connections the school has with local businesses, parents who can persuade or connect with their employer to sort something out, and so on.

    My old employer does "work experience" for 16 year olds (or 18? IDK) but honestly it's not actually work, it's more like a week of some kind of group project in a meeting room in the office doing some programming or hardware related task under somebody's supervision, AIUI. It's not til you get to university student age and a whole summer placement that it even starts to get to "students do something approximately work shaped and a good student might even produce something useful" and even that is more "we offer paid internships so we have an opportunity to find and offer jobs to the good ones".

    Back thirty years ago my "work experience" week at 16 was clearly nothing like actually working, and it's kind of hard to see how it could be unless it's on a job you could reasonably start doing immediately out of high school, which then isn't very representative of what most people will end up doing.
    Ironically I spent 2 weeks doing actually (basic) accountancy work aged 16 - I feel sorry for the 2 firms I did the accounts for but they were correct (and checked by someone else(.

    It told me to go into tax if I was going to became an accountant and then the internet appeared so I went into IT.
    Duplicate post.
    That's IT for you!

    Peter.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 51,556
    On the Labour: They've lost more votes to the Greens than to Reform but because of the current FPTP landscape it's the latter that's projected to cost them more seats. Is this a broadly accurate statement in the opinion of PB psephologists?
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 9,401
    kinabalu said:

    On the Labour: They've lost more votes to the Greens than to Reform but because of the current FPTP landscape it's the latter that's projected to cost them more seats. Is this a broadly accurate statement in the opinion of PB psephologists?

    They've lost votes to Greens which results in losing seats to Reform. I think the loss of voters to Reform is smaller and probably harder to win back.

    Imo Labour win the next election by making it Farage vs Labour leader - who do you want leading the country. Similar to how Macron has kept power in France.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 40,952
    edited May 22
    There are some reports on Twitter that a charity may possibly have been campaigning for Andy Burnham, which apparently is illegal.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 40,616
    Dura_Ace said:

    Foxy said:

    eek said:

    Nigelb said:

    Pause on $14bn arms sale to Taiwan:
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c232z4yk437o

    Not the most convincing of explanations.

    .."Right now we're doing a pause in order to make sure we have the munitions we need for Epic Fury - which we have plenty," Cao said at the hearing on Thursday, using the code name for the US-Israel joint military operation in Iran.
    "We're just making sure we have everything, but then the foreign military sales will continue when the administration deems necessary."
    When asked what he had heard from the Taiwanese about a pause in the weapons sale, Cao said he had "not spoken to the Taiwanese"..
    Trump can’t say he’s quietly sold Taiwan out in his meeting with Xi so some other story is required no matter how implausible
    Xi knows "The Art of the Deal".

    Trump will shaft Taiwan simply because he can. He has no ideology of morality.
    Trump like any worthy New York hood most likely arranged some kind of secret side hustle with the Chinatown mafia boss over Taiwan at their meeting.
    The PRC are going to get the renegade province back eventually anyway, so DJT probably thinks he might as well make a quid off the inevitable.

    It's not like his Persian misadventure where he has to do what the Zionist Entity tells him to great detriment of just about everything.
    Cuba next. This explains Lil' Marco taking so much shite from Trump. The ink on Raul Castro's arrest warrant is dry so we will have to go in Maduro-like to get him back. Boots on the ground will be inevitable. We can't really complain about China invading Taiwan under such circumstances.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 60,314
    "Out of order" klaxon

    https://x.com/AndyBurnhamGM/status/2057751999429361863

    Mr @christiancalgie has been busy putting out a partial version of events these last few days, amplified by yourselves.

    I think it’s time all your readers had the whole story. They were all out of order and, if they had any decency, would now hold their hands up and apologise.
  • DriverDriver Posts: 5,735
    Morning all. Been away for quite some time and was very surprised to be greeted by a message from TSE entitling me to be rather smug and perhaps opine on things with some confidence. The proceeds are going towards a new phone for Mrs Driver.

    [I was lucky.]

    Labour, starting from over 400, should always have been favourite for most seats and it says a lot about the incumbent PM that they ever weren't. A Burnham win in Makerfield probably flips the favourite instantly on declaration (if it doesn't happen during the campaign if he looks certain to win) - if he loses it might take a little while and would depend on who actually challenges Starmer.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 40,616
    Andy_JS said:

    There are some reports on Twitter that a charity may possibly have been campaigning for Andy Burnham, which apparently is illegal.

    That would be hilarious if Burnham is chucked out before the vote.

    #labourcorruption-reformpropriety*

    * That £5m was merely resting in my account.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 60,314
    https://x.com/alexwickham/status/2057758983109083195

    The UK-EU summit pencilled in for next month may be postponed until July because of the UK leadership crisis

    Starmer had held high hopes for the summit, framing it as a big moment to push for closer ties

    But the Burnham/Streeting move to defenestrate him has hampered officials’ work to prepare

    Planning has proved difficult to negotiate because Brussels doesn’t believe Starmer’s government will be in place in the coming months, sources said

    In any case, French and German officials say Britain has to change its red lines on the single market and customs union if it wants a meaningful reset
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 60,314
    Andy_JS said:

    There are some reports on Twitter that a charity may possibly have been campaigning for Andy Burnham, which apparently is illegal.

    It will be interesting if there are legal issues with it as the same organisation has been active in many election campaigns.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 37,212

    Dura_Ace said:

    Foxy said:

    eek said:

    Nigelb said:

    Pause on $14bn arms sale to Taiwan:
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c232z4yk437o

    Not the most convincing of explanations.

    .."Right now we're doing a pause in order to make sure we have the munitions we need for Epic Fury - which we have plenty," Cao said at the hearing on Thursday, using the code name for the US-Israel joint military operation in Iran.
    "We're just making sure we have everything, but then the foreign military sales will continue when the administration deems necessary."
    When asked what he had heard from the Taiwanese about a pause in the weapons sale, Cao said he had "not spoken to the Taiwanese"..
    Trump can’t say he’s quietly sold Taiwan out in his meeting with Xi so some other story is required no matter how implausible
    Xi knows "The Art of the Deal".

    Trump will shaft Taiwan simply because he can. He has no ideology of morality.
    Trump like any worthy New York hood most likely arranged some kind of secret side hustle with the Chinatown mafia boss over Taiwan at their meeting.
    The PRC are going to get the renegade province back eventually anyway, so DJT probably thinks he might as well make a quid off the inevitable.

    It's not like his Persian misadventure where he has to do what the Zionist Entity tells him to great detriment of just about everything.
    Cuba next. This explains Lil' Marco taking so much shite from Trump. The ink on Raul Castro's arrest warrant is dry so we will have to go in Maduro-like to get him back. Boots on the ground will be inevitable. We can't really complain about China invading Taiwan under such circumstances.
    Vance might object though because toppling Cuba is Rubio's path to the White House.

    On Taiwan, probably this is Don's quid pro quo for China leaning on Iran to reopen the Strait, which itself benefits China.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 22,196

    Andy_JS said:

    There are some reports on Twitter that a charity may possibly have been campaigning for Andy Burnham, which apparently is illegal.

    It will be interesting if there are legal issues with it as the same organisation has been active in many election campaigns.
    Which charity?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332
    edited May 22
    Morrisons is planning to close 100 stores over the coming months, as it blamed government policy choices for rising costs. The supermarket chain said the affected convenience stores had been loss-making for some time and were acquired through its McColls acquisition in 2022.

    It said the difficulties had been exacerbated in more recent years by "significant cost increases resulting from government policy choices", but did not give any further detail.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3623ny298xo

    The American PE company are going to bust what was a good British company* as their model was the thought they could sell and lease back all the stores at the top of the market while interest rates were super low. And they weren't able to do do that for more than a small proportion of the stores.

    * and one that used to pride themselves in good fresh produce, particularly British produce, for the price.
  • Wulfrun_PhilWulfrun_Phil Posts: 5,327
    I remain reasonably confident of the prospects of a Burnham win in Makerfield.

    The recent More in Common polling at national level showed Labour 6% behind Reform, but 3% ahead with Burnham as leader, a net 9% boost. However, the subbreaks in the North West show more of an effect - Labour currently 1% ahead of Reform but 14% ahead with Burnham as leader, a net 13% boost. So Burnham would have a greater positive effect on Labour's fortunes in the North West compared to the rest of the country. Possibly even more so in Makerfield given that it's very much his patch.

    Other things seem also to be going in Burnham's favour:
    - the Reform candidate's far right links are out there and will be exposed in the campaign
    - Restore seem lined up to energetically split the Reform vote
    - the Greens are in a total mess
    - Burnham's commitment to electoral reform should appeal to Lib Dems and (if they have any sense*) Greens too. No point in moaning about FPTP if you try and scupper hopes of ending up with a PM who favours reform

    Polling using the 2024 result as a baseline overlooks the artificial erosion of Labour's vote as a result of parachuting in a Westminster spad to replace a long standing local MP with a personal vote.

    *Admittedly, a significant caveat, Caroline Lucas excepted.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 60,314

    Andy_JS said:

    There are some reports on Twitter that a charity may possibly have been campaigning for Andy Burnham, which apparently is illegal.

    It will be interesting if there are legal issues with it as the same organisation has been active in many election campaigns.
    Which charity?
    Hope not Hate.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 37,212
    edited May 22

    England WC squad

    Goalkeepers: Jordan Pickford (Everton), Dean Henderson (Crystal Palace), James Trafford (Manchester City)

    Defenders: Reece James (Chelsea), Tino Livramento (Newcastle), Marc Guehi (Manchester City), Ezri Konsa (Aston Villa), John Stones (Manchester City), Jarell Quansah (Bayer Leverkusen), Nico O'Reilly (Manchester City), Dan Burn (Newcastle), Djed Spence (Tottenham Hotspur)

    Midfielders: Declan Rice (Arsenal), Elliot Anderson (Nottingham Forest), Jude Bellingham (Real Madrid), Jordan Henderson (Brentford), Morgan Rogers (Aston Villa), Kobbie Mainoo (Manchester United)

    Forwards: Harry Kane (Bayern Munich), Ivan Toney (Al-Ahli), Ollie Watkins (Aston Villa), Bukayo Saka (Arsenal), Noni Madueke (Arsenal), Marcus Rashford (Barcelona), Anthony Gordon (Newcastle), Eberechi Eze (Arsenal)

    Rearranging the squad by club to see how many players from each shows we are below our traditional winning quota from West Ham (ETA although there are three Villa players who also wear claret and blue so maybe it is not just David Cameron who is confused):-

    Al-Ahli 1: Ivan Toney
    Arsenal 4: Bukayo Saka, Declan Rice, Eberechi Eze, Noni Madueke
    Aston Villa 3: Ezri Konsa, Morgan Rogers, Ollie Watkins

    Barcelona 1: Marcus Rashford
    Bayer Leverkusen 1: Jarell Quansah
    Bayern Munich 1: Harry Kane
    Brentford 1: Jordan Henderson

    Chelsea 1: Reece James
    Crystal Palace 1: Dean Henderson

    Everton 1: Jordan Pickford

    Manchester City 4: James Trafford, John Stones, Marc Guehi, Nico O'Reilly
    Manchester United 1: Kobbie Mainoo

    Newcastle 3: Anthony Gordon, Dan Burn, Tino Livramento
    Nottingham Forest 1: Elliot Anderson

    Real Madrid 1: Jude Bellingham
  • Wulfrun_PhilWulfrun_Phil Posts: 5,327

    England WC squad

    Goalkeepers: Jordan Pickford (Everton), Dean Henderson (Crystal Palace), James Trafford (Manchester City)

    Defenders: Reece James (Chelsea), Tino Livramento (Newcastle), Marc Guehi (Manchester City), Ezri Konsa (Aston Villa), John Stones (Manchester City), Jarell Quansah (Bayer Leverkusen), Nico O'Reilly (Manchester City), Dan Burn (Newcastle), Djed Spence (Tottenham Hotspur)

    Midfielders: Declan Rice (Arsenal), Elliot Anderson (Nottingham Forest), Jude Bellingham (Real Madrid), Jordan Henderson (Brentford), Morgan Rogers (Aston Villa), Kobbie Mainoo (Manchester United)

    Forwards: Harry Kane (Bayern Munich), Ivan Toney (Al-Ahli), Ollie Watkins (Aston Villa), Bukayo Saka (Arsenal), Noni Madueke (Arsenal), Marcus Rashford (Barcelona), Anthony Gordon (Newcastle), Eberechi Eze (Arsenal)

    I'm struggling with the idea that the likes of Henderson and Gordon are worth a place ahead of the in-form Gibbs-White.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 29,254

    https://x.com/alexwickham/status/2057758983109083195

    The UK-EU summit pencilled in for next month may be postponed until July because of the UK leadership crisis

    Starmer had held high hopes for the summit, framing it as a big moment to push for closer ties

    But the Burnham/Streeting move to defenestrate him has hampered officials’ work to prepare

    Planning has proved difficult to negotiate because Brussels doesn’t believe Starmer’s government will be in place in the coming months, sources said

    In any case, French and German officials say Britain has to change its red lines on the single market and customs union if it wants a meaningful reset

    We handled the handover from Churchill to Attlee whilst the war with Japan was still going on. A Scouser stands in Makerfield and we start cancelling summits? Bad us.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 40,616
    edited May 22

    Morrisons is planning to close 100 stores over the coming months, as it blamed government policy choices for rising costs. The supermarket chain said the affected convenience stores had been loss-making for some time and were acquired through its McColls acquisition in 2022.

    It said the difficulties had been exacerbated in more recent years by "significant cost increases resulting from government policy choices", but did not give any further detail.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3623ny298xo

    The PE company are going to bust Morrisons as their model was the thought they could sell and lease back all the stores at the top of the market while interest rates were super low. And they weren't able to do do that for more than a small proportion of the stores.

    Have you been in Morrisons superstore recently? They are awful. Whether Government policy is a key factor is by the by. Since the US equity outfit C,D and R took them over Morrisons the stores look like branches of 1980s Kwik Save.

    After the McColls stores fold the bigger stores will follow.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 28,318

    Morrisons is planning to close 100 stores over the coming months, as it blamed government policy choices for rising costs. The supermarket chain said the affected convenience stores had been loss-making for some time and were acquired through its McColls acquisition in 2022.

    It said the difficulties had been exacerbated in more recent years by "significant cost increases resulting from government policy choices", but did not give any further detail.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3623ny298xo

    The American PE company are going to bust what was a good British company* as their model was the thought they could sell and lease back all the stores at the top of the market while interest rates were super low. And they weren't able to do do that for more than a small proportion of the stores.

    * and one that used to pride themselves in good fresh produce, particularly British produce, for the price.

    Why not try the standard route for convenience stores and expand into contraband and laundry?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 90,923
    viewcode said:

    https://x.com/alexwickham/status/2057758983109083195

    The UK-EU summit pencilled in for next month may be postponed until July because of the UK leadership crisis

    Starmer had held high hopes for the summit, framing it as a big moment to push for closer ties

    But the Burnham/Streeting move to defenestrate him has hampered officials’ work to prepare

    Planning has proved difficult to negotiate because Brussels doesn’t believe Starmer’s government will be in place in the coming months, sources said

    In any case, French and German officials say Britain has to change its red lines on the single market and customs union if it wants a meaningful reset

    We handled the handover from Churchill to Attlee whilst the war with Japan was still going on. A Scouser stands in Makerfield and we start cancelling summits? Bad us.
    We didn't really have the option of pausing the war with Japan.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 40,616
    I still don't like him, but Scouse Andy is a better orator than any PM since Cameron, possibly Blair.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332
    edited May 22

    Morrisons is planning to close 100 stores over the coming months, as it blamed government policy choices for rising costs. The supermarket chain said the affected convenience stores had been loss-making for some time and were acquired through its McColls acquisition in 2022.

    It said the difficulties had been exacerbated in more recent years by "significant cost increases resulting from government policy choices", but did not give any further detail.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3623ny298xo

    The PE company are going to bust Morrisons as their model was the thought they could sell and lease back all the stores at the top of the market while interest rates were super low. And they weren't able to do do that for more than a small proportion of the stores.

    Have you been in Morrisons superstore recently? They are awful. Whether Government policy is a key factor by the by. Since the US equity outfit C,D and R took them over Morrisons the stores look like branches of 1980s Kwik Save.

    After the McColls stores told the bigger ones will follow.
    I am not a regular Morrison shopper, my only recent experience was I went to see the Cardiff Devils Ice Hockey team play last year and the car park was rammed getting out so popped with my mate to the Morrisons over the road to get some snacks and thought I had entered a supermarket from some war torn African country with the terrible quality of produce, loads of totally empty shelves and really shabby appearance of the shop. I put it down to perhaps late in the evening / older store. However, my elderly parents were regulars, but said since the PE firm what I saw was normal in their local store as well.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 40,616

    Morrisons is planning to close 100 stores over the coming months, as it blamed government policy choices for rising costs. The supermarket chain said the affected convenience stores had been loss-making for some time and were acquired through its McColls acquisition in 2022.

    It said the difficulties had been exacerbated in more recent years by "significant cost increases resulting from government policy choices", but did not give any further detail.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3623ny298xo

    The American PE company are going to bust what was a good British company* as their model was the thought they could sell and lease back all the stores at the top of the market while interest rates were super low. And they weren't able to do do that for more than a small proportion of the stores.

    * and one that used to pride themselves in good fresh produce, particularly British produce, for the price.

    Why not try the standard route for convenience stores and expand into contraband and laundry?
    A quid per fag and the profits will come rolling in.
  • DriverDriver Posts: 5,735

    I remain reasonably confident of the prospects of a Burnham win in Makerfield.

    The recent More in Common polling at national level showed Labour 6% behind Reform, but 3% ahead with Burnham as leader, a net 9% boost. However, the subbreaks in the North West show more of an effect - Labour currently 1% ahead of Reform but 14% ahead with Burnham as leader, a net 13% boost. So Burnham would have a greater positive effect on Labour's fortunes in the North West compared to the rest of the country. Possibly even more so in Makerfield given that it's very much his patch.

    Other things seem also to be going in Burnham's favour:
    - the Reform candidate's far right links are out there and will be exposed in the campaign
    - Restore seem lined up to energetically split the Reform vote
    - the Greens are in a total mess
    - Burnham's commitment to electoral reform should appeal to Lib Dems and (if they have any sense*) Greens too. No point in moaning about FPTP if you try and scupper hopes of ending up with a PM who favours reform

    Polling using the 2024 result as a baseline overlooks the artificial erosion of Labour's vote as a result of parachuting in a Westminster spad to replace a long standing local MP with a personal vote.

    *Admittedly, a significant caveat, Caroline Lucas excepted.

    A result of something like

    Burnham 40
    Reform 30
    Restore 20

    would provoke some interesting reactions.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 51,556
    Andy_JS said:

    There are some reports on Twitter that a charity may possibly have been campaigning for Andy Burnham, which apparently is illegal.

    Surely not illegal - charities are meant to promote good causes.
  • DriverDriver Posts: 5,735
    edited May 22

    England WC squad

    Goalkeepers: Jordan Pickford (Everton), Dean Henderson (Crystal Palace), James Trafford (Manchester City)

    Defenders: Reece James (Chelsea), Tino Livramento (Newcastle), Marc Guehi (Manchester City), Ezri Konsa (Aston Villa), John Stones (Manchester City), Jarell Quansah (Bayer Leverkusen), Nico O'Reilly (Manchester City), Dan Burn (Newcastle), Djed Spence (Tottenham Hotspur)

    Midfielders: Declan Rice (Arsenal), Elliot Anderson (Nottingham Forest), Jude Bellingham (Real Madrid), Jordan Henderson (Brentford), Morgan Rogers (Aston Villa), Kobbie Mainoo (Manchester United)

    Forwards: Harry Kane (Bayern Munich), Ivan Toney (Al-Ahli), Ollie Watkins (Aston Villa), Bukayo Saka (Arsenal), Noni Madueke (Arsenal), Marcus Rashford (Barcelona), Anthony Gordon (Newcastle), Eberechi Eze (Arsenal)

    I'm struggling with the idea that the likes of Henderson and Gordon are worth a place ahead of the in-form Gibbs-White.
    Different positions - Henderson a DM, Gordon a left winger, Gibbs white an attacking midfielder.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 40,616

    Morrisons is planning to close 100 stores over the coming months, as it blamed government policy choices for rising costs. The supermarket chain said the affected convenience stores had been loss-making for some time and were acquired through its McColls acquisition in 2022.

    It said the difficulties had been exacerbated in more recent years by "significant cost increases resulting from government policy choices", but did not give any further detail.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3623ny298xo

    The PE company are going to bust Morrisons as their model was the thought they could sell and lease back all the stores at the top of the market while interest rates were super low. And they weren't able to do do that for more than a small proportion of the stores.

    Have you been in Morrisons superstore recently? They are awful. Whether Government policy is a key factor by the by. Since the US equity outfit C,D and R took them over Morrisons the stores look like branches of 1980s Kwik Save.

    After the McColls stores told the bigger ones will follow.
    I am not a regular Morrison shopper, my only recent experience was I went to see the Cardiff Devils Ice Hockey team play last year and the car park was rammed getting out so popped with my mate to the Morrisons over the road to get some snacks and thought I had entered a supermarket from some war torn African country with the terrible quality of produce, loads of totally empty shelves and really shabby appearance of the shop. I put it down to perhaps late in the evening / older store. However, my elderly parents were regulars, but said since the PE firm what I saw was normal in their local store as well.
    No, that Morrisons down the bay is a particular nasty example. There is an annex room on the left hand side of the entrance which is full of horrid tat making it look a bit like a Spanish holiday market, only without the quality.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 60,536
    edited May 22
    Yeah...but no...but....

    Was in Bristol yesterday.



    Back in Bath now, then back home this evening
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 51,556

    I still don't like him, but Scouse Andy is a better orator than any PM since Cameron, possibly Blair.

    He's good. But I'd say it's more the natural way he has of speaking in public (so you get the impression he isn't faking anything because he's always like that) rather than 'oratory' as such. I think of oratory as something a bit more grand.

    Streeting is also good imo. So that contest if it happens should be easy on the ear.
  • DriverDriver Posts: 5,735

    Morrisons is planning to close 100 stores over the coming months, as it blamed government policy choices for rising costs. The supermarket chain said the affected convenience stores had been loss-making for some time and were acquired through its McColls acquisition in 2022.

    It said the difficulties had been exacerbated in more recent years by "significant cost increases resulting from government policy choices", but did not give any further detail.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3623ny298xo

    The PE company are going to bust Morrisons as their model was the thought they could sell and lease back all the stores at the top of the market while interest rates were super low. And they weren't able to do do that for more than a small proportion of the stores.

    Have you been in Morrisons superstore recently? They are awful. Whether Government policy is a key factor is by the by. Since the US equity outfit C,D and R took them over Morrisons the stores look like branches of 1980s Kwik Save.

    After the McColls stores fold the bigger stores will follow.
    I rarely go to Morrisons because the nearest one to me is more than half an hour away but I was in one a couple of weeks ago and it was unrecognisable. Their USP of top quality fresh food with instore butchers, fishmongers etc seems to have completely vanished.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332
    edited May 22
    Driver said:

    Morrisons is planning to close 100 stores over the coming months, as it blamed government policy choices for rising costs. The supermarket chain said the affected convenience stores had been loss-making for some time and were acquired through its McColls acquisition in 2022.

    It said the difficulties had been exacerbated in more recent years by "significant cost increases resulting from government policy choices", but did not give any further detail.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3623ny298xo

    The PE company are going to bust Morrisons as their model was the thought they could sell and lease back all the stores at the top of the market while interest rates were super low. And they weren't able to do do that for more than a small proportion of the stores.

    Have you been in Morrisons superstore recently? They are awful. Whether Government policy is a key factor is by the by. Since the US equity outfit C,D and R took them over Morrisons the stores look like branches of 1980s Kwik Save.

    After the McColls stores fold the bigger stores will follow.
    I rarely go to Morrisons because the nearest one to me is more than half an hour away but I was in one a couple of weeks ago and it was unrecognisable. Their USP of top quality fresh food with instore butchers, fishmongers etc seems to have completely vanished.
    Old Man Morrison (William Morrison) and particularly his son (Ken Morrison) will be turning in their graves about what the PE company have done to their baby.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 23,858

    Morrisons is planning to close 100 stores over the coming months, as it blamed government policy choices for rising costs. The supermarket chain said the affected convenience stores had been loss-making for some time and were acquired through its McColls acquisition in 2022.

    It said the difficulties had been exacerbated in more recent years by "significant cost increases resulting from government policy choices", but did not give any further detail.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3623ny298xo

    The PE company are going to bust Morrisons as their model was the thought they could sell and lease back all the stores at the top of the market while interest rates were super low. And they weren't able to do do that for more than a small proportion of the stores.

    Have you been in Morrisons superstore recently? They are awful. Whether Government policy is a key factor by the by. Since the US equity outfit C,D and R took them over Morrisons the stores look like branches of 1980s Kwik Save.

    After the McColls stores told the bigger ones will follow.
    I am not a regular Morrison shopper, my only recent experience was I went to see the Cardiff Devils Ice Hockey team play last year and the car park was rammed getting out so popped with my mate to the Morrisons over the road to get some snacks and thought I had entered a supermarket from some war torn African country with the terrible quality of produce, loads of totally empty shelves and really shabby appearance of the shop. I put it down to perhaps late in the evening / older store. However, my elderly parents were regulars, but said since the PE firm what I saw was normal in their local store as well.
    I don't think its every store - our local medium sized Morrisons is ok. No empty shelves, decent range of some things, less in others.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 40,952
    Driver said:

    Morrisons is planning to close 100 stores over the coming months, as it blamed government policy choices for rising costs. The supermarket chain said the affected convenience stores had been loss-making for some time and were acquired through its McColls acquisition in 2022.

    It said the difficulties had been exacerbated in more recent years by "significant cost increases resulting from government policy choices", but did not give any further detail.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3623ny298xo

    The PE company are going to bust Morrisons as their model was the thought they could sell and lease back all the stores at the top of the market while interest rates were super low. And they weren't able to do do that for more than a small proportion of the stores.

    Have you been in Morrisons superstore recently? They are awful. Whether Government policy is a key factor is by the by. Since the US equity outfit C,D and R took them over Morrisons the stores look like branches of 1980s Kwik Save.

    After the McColls stores fold the bigger stores will follow.
    I rarely go to Morrisons because the nearest one to me is more than half an hour away but I was in one a couple of weeks ago and it was unrecognisable. Their USP of top quality fresh food with instore butchers, fishmongers etc seems to have completely vanished.
    Best to stick to Waitrose, even though it's gone downmarket recently.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 51,556

    Andy_JS said:

    There are some reports on Twitter that a charity may possibly have been campaigning for Andy Burnham, which apparently is illegal.

    It will be interesting if there are legal issues with it as the same organisation has been active in many election campaigns.
    Which charity?
    Hope not Hate.
    Well there you go. That's on-mission and intra-vires.
  • FossFoss Posts: 2,927

    Morrisons is planning to close 100 stores over the coming months, as it blamed government policy choices for rising costs. The supermarket chain said the affected convenience stores had been loss-making for some time and were acquired through its McColls acquisition in 2022.

    It said the difficulties had been exacerbated in more recent years by "significant cost increases resulting from government policy choices", but did not give any further detail.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3623ny298xo

    The PE company are going to bust Morrisons as their model was the thought they could sell and lease back all the stores at the top of the market while interest rates were super low. And they weren't able to do do that for more than a small proportion of the stores.

    Have you been in Morrisons superstore recently? They are awful. Whether Government policy is a key factor by the by. Since the US equity outfit C,D and R took them over Morrisons the stores look like branches of 1980s Kwik Save.

    After the McColls stores told the bigger ones will follow.
    I am not a regular Morrison shopper, my only recent experience was I went to see the Cardiff Devils Ice Hockey team play last year and the car park was rammed getting out so popped with my mate to the Morrisons over the road to get some snacks and thought I had entered a supermarket from some war torn African country with the terrible quality of produce, loads of totally empty shelves and really shabby appearance of the shop. I put it down to perhaps late in the evening / older store. However, my elderly parents were regulars, but said since the PE firm what I saw was normal in their local store as well.
    I don't think its every store - our local medium sized Morrisons is ok. No empty shelves, decent range of some things, less in others.
    Pretty much the same here. Was a bit threadbare on the 27th December, but that's not entirely unexpected.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 40,616
    kinabalu said:

    I still don't like him, but Scouse Andy is a better orator than any PM since Cameron, possibly Blair.

    He's good. But I'd say it's more the natural way he has of speaking in public (so you get the impression he isn't faking anything because he's always like that) rather than 'oratory' as such. I think of oratory as something a bit more grand.

    Streeting is also good imo. So that contest if it happens should be easy on the ear.
    If you think of a great British orator who do you think of? No, no, not Johnson! I think of that chap who stands on a plinth on Queen Street in Cardiff with a traffic cone on his head, Aneurin Bevan.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 64,439

    Andy_JS said:

    There are some reports on Twitter that a charity may possibly have been campaigning for Andy Burnham, which apparently is illegal.

    That would be hilarious if Burnham is chucked out before the vote.

    #labourcorruption-reformpropriety*

    * That £5m was merely resting in my account.
    The £5m is pining for the fjords.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332
    edited May 22

    Morrisons is planning to close 100 stores over the coming months, as it blamed government policy choices for rising costs. The supermarket chain said the affected convenience stores had been loss-making for some time and were acquired through its McColls acquisition in 2022.

    It said the difficulties had been exacerbated in more recent years by "significant cost increases resulting from government policy choices", but did not give any further detail.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3623ny298xo

    The PE company are going to bust Morrisons as their model was the thought they could sell and lease back all the stores at the top of the market while interest rates were super low. And they weren't able to do do that for more than a small proportion of the stores.

    Have you been in Morrisons superstore recently? They are awful. Whether Government policy is a key factor by the by. Since the US equity outfit C,D and R took them over Morrisons the stores look like branches of 1980s Kwik Save.

    After the McColls stores told the bigger ones will follow.
    I am not a regular Morrison shopper, my only recent experience was I went to see the Cardiff Devils Ice Hockey team play last year and the car park was rammed getting out so popped with my mate to the Morrisons over the road to get some snacks and thought I had entered a supermarket from some war torn African country with the terrible quality of produce, loads of totally empty shelves and really shabby appearance of the shop. I put it down to perhaps late in the evening / older store. However, my elderly parents were regulars, but said since the PE firm what I saw was normal in their local store as well.
    I don't think its every store - our local medium sized Morrisons is ok. No empty shelves, decent range of some things, less in others.
    They leveraged Morrisons up to the eye balls in debt and then all the current is against them, it will only be a matter of time before it goes downhill. I think you will find they are basically not investing in the buildings at all and cutting costs all over the place e.g. closing cafes, closing the "Market Street" i.e. fishmongers / butcher counters in most of the stores.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 64,439

    Morrisons is planning to close 100 stores over the coming months, as it blamed government policy choices for rising costs. The supermarket chain said the affected convenience stores had been loss-making for some time and were acquired through its McColls acquisition in 2022.

    It said the difficulties had been exacerbated in more recent years by "significant cost increases resulting from government policy choices", but did not give any further detail.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3623ny298xo

    The PE company are going to bust Morrisons as their model was the thought they could sell and lease back all the stores at the top of the market while interest rates were super low. And they weren't able to do do that for more than a small proportion of the stores.

    Have you been in Morrisons superstore recently? They are awful. Whether Government policy is a key factor by the by. Since the US equity outfit C,D and R took them over Morrisons the stores look like branches of 1980s Kwik Save.

    After the McColls stores told the bigger ones will follow.
    I am not a regular Morrison shopper, my only recent experience was I went to see the Cardiff Devils Ice Hockey team play last year and the car park was rammed getting out so popped with my mate to the Morrisons over the road to get some snacks and thought I had entered a supermarket from some war torn African country with the terrible quality of produce, loads of totally empty shelves and really shabby appearance of the shop. I put it down to perhaps late in the evening / older store. However, my elderly parents were regulars, but said since the PE firm what I saw was normal in their local store as well.
    I don't think its every store - our local medium sized Morrisons is ok. No empty shelves, decent range of some things, less in others.
    They leveraged up to th eye balls in debt and then all the current is against them, it will only be a matter of time before it goes downhill. I think you will find they are basically not investing in the buildings at all.
    It’s the “convenience” stores that are under threat. Not the aircraft hanger sized stuff.

    The quality of Morrisons stores was alway extremely variable, on a store by store basis.
This discussion has been closed.