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  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 35,222
    HYUFD said:

    Rupert Lowe has confirmed Restore Britain will stand a candidate in the Makerfield by-election

    I didn't have Rupert down as a Burnham fanboi. But then Andy is going to need all the help he can get to see off Reform.
    Given Survation has Burnham beating Reform by less than 5% in Makerfield, Restore could certainly help him over the line. If Burnham does scrape home he may owe Lowe a rather large pint
    Tories a danger to Reform too. I think if Lowe's lot is seen to have let Burnham in, his party will face a considerable backlash that could harm them.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 22,032
    Celtic celebrating like they haven't won 16 of the last 20 SPL titles
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 91,956

    Congratulations to John Beaton for winning the Scottish Premiership.

    More iffy than a gift to Reform.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 63,525
    viewcode said:

    AnneJGP said:

    The last two Labour leaders have been London based. I like London, it’s awesome.

    But I wonder if a leader not from London will make a positive impact just by the virtue of killing the idea that Labour is a southern party that doesn’t understand the north.

    It might help; but one wonders how the party managed to alienate itself so badly from its origins.
    It's been going for a long time. I've just finished "Making the Weather: Six Politicians Who Changed Modern Britain" by Vernon Bogdanor (thoroughly recommend, btw), and there was a snippet in there about realising as far back as the 1950s that their voters weren't socialist and that nationalisation wasn't supported by even the workers in those industries. There was a frantic search for alternatives (Benn rotated through the alternatives in his writings: full nationalisation, siege economy, guild socialism, syndicalism, etc) but none gained traction. Callaghan realised the game was up but was a solid union man and couldn't make the intellectual leap to the alternative: Thatcher had no such compunction and implemented her version: free markets, deregulation, denationalisation, detaching the economy from the nation. Blair (possibly unthinkingly?) accepted this and slapped a human face on it, using the Cold War dividend to file off the raw edges of Thatcherism and moving the party from the workers to the professional classes and public sector workers, from economic issues to social issues. Its adoption of identity politics was a natural progress from that.

    In short, Labour abandoned its working-class origins decades ago and hid the smell by spraying money everywhere, using Cold War dividend and economic boom money to do it. And it worked. But post-Brexit, post-COVID, and post-boom it can't do that any more and has been running like a coyote suspended in air ever since. Starmer was gravity catching up to it.
    I’m not sure about that

    Blair claimed to be about being European Social Democrats - which is a large and successful political position.

    If Labour (including Blair) had fully embraced that, they wouldn’t be in the current mess.

    The real issue is that for decades, they assumed the core vote. And went off chasing on other groups.

    If you treat the electorate as a collection of special interests, don’t be surprised is those not in a see isl interest group invent their own.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 128,566
    edited May 16

    Congratulations to John Beaton for winning the Scottish Premiership.

    More iffy than a gift to Reform.
    Soon as I saw it live my first comment was 'He's headed that, no way it goes out for a throw in if it has hit his hand.'

    The fact the ref took one view and 10 secs to make his mind up.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 91,956
    edited May 16
    Who at the BBC thought that giving Wayne Rooney £800k for his deeply thought out and insightful comments was a good idea?
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 8,323
    What a tragedy . How many league titles does a club need ?

  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 22,032
    Abandon the game. 3-0 to Hearts
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 58,890

    Scottish football is so tinpot

    Sad but true.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 128,566
    edited May 16
    Mad to think that by next week that three different teams have won the English Premier League in the last three seasons.

    You'd have to go back forty-one years to find the last time three different teams have one Scotland's top flight.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 22,032
    How can the game be finished? This ref is an absolute coward
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 35,222
    edited May 16

    HYUFD said:

    The AfD now have a significant polling lead over the CDU/CSU.

    https://x.com/wahlen_de/status/2055627030457167991

    AfD: 29% (+1)
    Union: 22% (-1)
    GRÜNE: 14% (+1)
    SPD: 12% (-1)
    LINKE: 10% (-1)
    BSW: 3%
    FDP: 3%
    Sonstige: 7% (+1)

    They do but the governing Union and SPD coalition are still on 34% combined to the AfD's 29% and as Germany has PR Merz will remain chancellor
    But still. This is the EU the Remainers want to Rejoin? Germany maybe led by the AfD. Italy already led by Meloni. A good chance Bardella will with the French presidency

    Etc
    Yes. Remainers would have been quite happy to join the Europe of 1936. European right-wingery is glamorously garlic-infused with not a hint of Hartlepool about it. The point about hardcore remainers is their loathing for a British polity they feel no stake in, and their craven adoration of a European elite that once enthroned in Britain, will make them its courtiers. It is not new and it dates back loooonnnnnng before the Brexit, the EU and EEC, before the Cold War, back to the Reformation.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 128,566

    How can the game be finished? This ref is an absolute coward

    This shows why Scotland isn't ready to be an independent country.
  • So Burnham wants to bring more stuff under "public control", note not saying nationalise just yet.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 58,890

    How can the game be finished? This ref is an absolute coward

    This shows why Scotland isn't ready to be an independent country.
    Pedantically, it is reason #746
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,791

    Abandon the game. 3-0 to Hearts

    Didn't Celtic send a spy to Tynecastle the other day?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,783

    Who at the BBC thought that giving Wayne Rooney £800k for his deeply thought out and insightful comments was a good idea?

    FA Cup Final? I thought I was watching Shrek.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 35,222
    There's some political points to be scored by Malcolm Offord going over the top and demanding a public enquiry or something into this sporting stitch up. Not like Reform has any supporters amongst the Celtic supporting fraternity.
  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,833
    Nigelb said:
    The GOP went mental when Obama did that to the Saudi King
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 10,792

    Who at the BBC thought that giving Wayne Rooney £800k for his deeply thought out and insightful comments was a good idea?

    Good old Wayne. I remember his profound and poignant analysis after some England tournament crash out or other: 'Basically we let too many goals in and didn't score enough ourselves.' Impossible to argue against that.
  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,833
    So how many goals are Man City going to win by?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 58,890
    CatMan said:

    So how many goals are Man City going to win by?

    I'll go for 5.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,783

    Who at the BBC thought that giving Wayne Rooney £800k for his deeply thought out and insightful comments was a good idea?

    Good old Wayne. I remember his profound and poignant analysis after some England tournament crash out or other: 'Basically we let too many goals in and didn't score enough ourselves.' Impossible to argue against that.
    Great insight. He's not wrong.
  • TazTaz Posts: 28,124

    Who at the BBC thought that giving Wayne Rooney £800k for his deeply thought out and insightful comments was a good idea?

    Fuck knows, useless GSC, another good reason to scrap the license fee.

    but if it keeps him out of club management then that’s saving some fans from a dire season.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 59,771

    Nigelb said:

    algarkirk said:

    algarkirk said:

    algarkirk said:

    nico67 said:

    How the myth that Labour have done nothing in 2 years became fixed in the minds of voters .

    A relentless anti Labour campaign by the media and poor No 10 communications culminated in where we are today.

    It isn't the task of the media to be a PR company for any government. This government has been terrible at communications, and especially the art of communicating convincingly by answering questions and not being evasive.

    also terrible decision making. Sacking Robbins and then clinging on....

    I think that is largely correct.

    But neither is it the job of Allister Heath and Allison Pearson to represent fiction as fact. The job of the Telegraph ( and GB News and Talk TV) is to report the news objectively not to use smoke and mirrors to roll the pitch for the next Government in 3,4,5 years time. One could argue a competent Government should have the wherewithal to call out and correct inaccuracies, but it seems this one didn't.

    Starmer is wholly to blame for this.
    Largely agree, but there is no such thing as objective news coverage. They could all try harder to separate fact and opinion. So we have to rely on an open free media.

    There are loads of outlets who would reasonably fairly but critically report on Labour doing well. Mirror, Guardian, FT, New Statesman, Economist, Ch4, ITV, BBC, Times to some extent, vast numbers on X and other social media. An infinity of podcasts.

    As to the Right Wing media, in general they gave the Tories a hard time in government IIRC. I find it hard to follow because it's unreadable.

    Whereas I accept there will be a bias when reporting news, any news, it is the out and out lies I was objecting to.

    It's like giving a false equivalent to reporting by Rachel Maddows and. Jesse Watters. Maddows takes a story, reports the story and opines from the left. Jesse Watters ignores any story but just makes stuff up with no basis upon fact, to promote his cause, which is invariably Trump.
    Largely agree. I think in this particular age the prevalence of lies is going to be a reality and unavoidable. I imagine most people just avoid wasting much time on lying outlets. I think everyone knows that in a social media age you have the same sort of duty towards fact checking and lie detection that you do towards locking your front door when you go on holiday.

    In outlets regarded as responsible (there are lots) the principle distortion is done by story selection. Take the BBC, which I greatly admire. They would, I think, never run a series, fully researched, to try to demonstrate all the ways in which people manipulate and abuse the benefits and welfare system. Or do detailed case studies on how particular families spend years and generations doing little at our expense. (The sort of project the odious Matt Goodwin would be fond of). But they are never short of super people who are going to suffer egregiously from any change in the system.
    The BBC are to an extent even more pernicious. Providing false equivalence is unforgivable. Giving equal billing to the Chairman of the World Bank and Andrea Leadsom to determine the economic effects of Brexit was outrageous. The BBC were also great exponents of the Minford Paradigm. Once again providing a disreputable but largely hidden false equivalence. Theyveould take their pick of any one of 1,000 economists who would maintain Brexit was an economic disaster against Patrick Minford, who was the only one who thought Brexit would be great.
    Yet it hasn't been an economic disaster, nor anything resembling one, as has been demonstrated amply by some very good recent thread headers that I must have missed your rebbutal of. So Leadsom was more accurate than the Head of the World Bank, which rather seems to vindicate her being platformed.
    My mistake. It was Pascal Lamy if the WTO.

    Oh and you are wrong about the eloquent @Fishing thread headers

    Beautifully written but fundamentally wildly inaccurate.

    https://www.kcl.ac.uk/news/new-research-finds-uk-investment-up-to-18-per-cent-lower-as-a-result-of-brexit
    Wild innacuracies that I'm sure you'll be happy to list, with sources confirming their innacuracy. Or are they just innacurate because they're prejudicial to your opinion.
    DYOR.
    I'm not alleging innacuracy.
    Inaccuracy.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 35,222

    Nigelb said:

    algarkirk said:

    algarkirk said:

    algarkirk said:

    nico67 said:

    How the myth that Labour have done nothing in 2 years became fixed in the minds of voters .

    A relentless anti Labour campaign by the media and poor No 10 communications culminated in where we are today.

    It isn't the task of the media to be a PR company for any government. This government has been terrible at communications, and especially the art of communicating convincingly by answering questions and not being evasive.

    also terrible decision making. Sacking Robbins and then clinging on....

    I think that is largely correct.

    But neither is it the job of Allister Heath and Allison Pearson to represent fiction as fact. The job of the Telegraph ( and GB News and Talk TV) is to report the news objectively not to use smoke and mirrors to roll the pitch for the next Government in 3,4,5 years time. One could argue a competent Government should have the wherewithal to call out and correct inaccuracies, but it seems this one didn't.

    Starmer is wholly to blame for this.
    Largely agree, but there is no such thing as objective news coverage. They could all try harder to separate fact and opinion. So we have to rely on an open free media.

    There are loads of outlets who would reasonably fairly but critically report on Labour doing well. Mirror, Guardian, FT, New Statesman, Economist, Ch4, ITV, BBC, Times to some extent, vast numbers on X and other social media. An infinity of podcasts.

    As to the Right Wing media, in general they gave the Tories a hard time in government IIRC. I find it hard to follow because it's unreadable.

    Whereas I accept there will be a bias when reporting news, any news, it is the out and out lies I was objecting to.

    It's like giving a false equivalent to reporting by Rachel Maddows and. Jesse Watters. Maddows takes a story, reports the story and opines from the left. Jesse Watters ignores any story but just makes stuff up with no basis upon fact, to promote his cause, which is invariably Trump.
    Largely agree. I think in this particular age the prevalence of lies is going to be a reality and unavoidable. I imagine most people just avoid wasting much time on lying outlets. I think everyone knows that in a social media age you have the same sort of duty towards fact checking and lie detection that you do towards locking your front door when you go on holiday.

    In outlets regarded as responsible (there are lots) the principle distortion is done by story selection. Take the BBC, which I greatly admire. They would, I think, never run a series, fully researched, to try to demonstrate all the ways in which people manipulate and abuse the benefits and welfare system. Or do detailed case studies on how particular families spend years and generations doing little at our expense. (The sort of project the odious Matt Goodwin would be fond of). But they are never short of super people who are going to suffer egregiously from any change in the system.
    The BBC are to an extent even more pernicious. Providing false equivalence is unforgivable. Giving equal billing to the Chairman of the World Bank and Andrea Leadsom to determine the economic effects of Brexit was outrageous. The BBC were also great exponents of the Minford Paradigm. Once again providing a disreputable but largely hidden false equivalence. Theyveould take their pick of any one of 1,000 economists who would maintain Brexit was an economic disaster against Patrick Minford, who was the only one who thought Brexit would be great.
    Yet it hasn't been an economic disaster, nor anything resembling one, as has been demonstrated amply by some very good recent thread headers that I must have missed your rebbutal of. So Leadsom was more accurate than the Head of the World Bank, which rather seems to vindicate her being platformed.
    My mistake. It was Pascal Lamy if the WTO.

    Oh and you are wrong about the eloquent @Fishing thread headers

    Beautifully written but fundamentally wildly inaccurate.

    https://www.kcl.ac.uk/news/new-research-finds-uk-investment-up-to-18-per-cent-lower-as-a-result-of-brexit
    Wild innacuracies that I'm sure you'll be happy to list, with sources confirming their innacuracy. Or are they just innacurate because they're prejudicial to your opinion.
    DYOR.
    I'm not alleging innacuracy.
    Inaccuracy.
    :lol:

    Well corrected. I'm useless on placement of double letters.
  • TazTaz Posts: 28,124

    I agree.

    No British patriot can vote for Reform.

    Reform’s ‘no Ukraine flags’ policy is hardly surprising given their Head of Policy, James Orr, description of Russia’s invasion of Ukraine as:

    A “regional Slavic conflict between Russia and Ukraine”

    And that it is not a “war”, but “a conflict happening in the world that I don’t care very much about.”

    Had Reform been in power in 2022 and taken this position, the whole of Ukraine would likely now be occupied by Russia with Putin plotting his next move.

    They are a danger to our national security.


    https://x.com/kevinhollinrake/status/2055593238484955179

    He’s seriously claiming that if Reform were in govt in 2022 Putin would have taken the whole of Ukraine and be looking to expand further.

    I always thought he was a sensible Tory but that take is radio rental 😂😂😂😂
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,858

    HYUFD said:

    The AfD now have a significant polling lead over the CDU/CSU.

    https://x.com/wahlen_de/status/2055627030457167991

    AfD: 29% (+1)
    Union: 22% (-1)
    GRÜNE: 14% (+1)
    SPD: 12% (-1)
    LINKE: 10% (-1)
    BSW: 3%
    FDP: 3%
    Sonstige: 7% (+1)

    They do but the governing Union and SPD coalition are still on 34% combined to the AfD's 29% and as Germany has PR Merz will remain chancellor
    But still. This is the EU the Remainers want to Rejoin? Germany maybe led by the AfD. Italy already led by Meloni. A good chance Bardella will with the French presidency

    Etc
    Germany won't be led by the AfD as no other party will touch them and Germany has PR. Italy will continue to be led by Meloni but her government includes the centre right Forza Italia while the centre right Union in Germany won't touch the AfD.

    Macron's former PM Philippe who has founded a new centre right party now leads Bardella 51.5% to 48.5% (albeit Bardella easily beats Melenchon, Retailleau, Glucksmann and Attal in a run off)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2027_French_presidential_election#Second_round_2
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 59,849
    Andy Burnham says the by-election isn’t about him.

    https://x.com/misraandrew/status/2055631365190607225
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 59,849
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 55,428
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    The AfD now have a significant polling lead over the CDU/CSU.

    https://x.com/wahlen_de/status/2055627030457167991

    AfD: 29% (+1)
    Union: 22% (-1)
    GRÜNE: 14% (+1)
    SPD: 12% (-1)
    LINKE: 10% (-1)
    BSW: 3%
    FDP: 3%
    Sonstige: 7% (+1)

    They do but the governing Union and SPD coalition are still on 34% combined to the AfD's 29% and as Germany has PR Merz will remain chancellor
    But still. This is the EU the Remainers want to Rejoin? Germany maybe led by the AfD. Italy already led by Meloni. A good chance Bardella will with the French presidency

    Etc
    Germany won't be led by the AfD as no other party will touch them and Germany has PR. Italy will continue to be led by Meloni but her government includes the centre right Forza Italia while the centre right Union in Germany won't touch the AfD.

    Macron's former PM Philippe who has founded a new centre right party now leads Bardella 51.5% to 48.5% (albeit Bardella easily beats Melenchon, Retailleau, Glucksmann and Attal in a run off)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2027_French_presidential_election#Second_round_2
    Leon doesn’t understand nor has any feel for politics; any PB’er who hasn’t worked that out by now hasn’t been paying attention.
  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,833
    Boooo. How dare you spoil our fun.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 59,771

    Who at the BBC thought that giving Wayne Rooney £800k for his deeply thought out and insightful comments was a good idea?

    FA Cup Final? I thought I was watching Shrek.
    Here we go!
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 59,771
    CatMan said:

    So how many goals are Man City going to win by?

    Will it be a Blue Day?
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 36,342
    edited May 16
    viewcode said:

    AnneJGP said:

    The last two Labour leaders have been London based. I like London, it’s awesome.

    But I wonder if a leader not from London will make a positive impact just by the virtue of killing the idea that Labour is a southern party that doesn’t understand the north.

    It might help; but one wonders how the party managed to alienate itself so badly from its origins.
    It's been going for a long time. I've just finished "Making the Weather: Six Politicians Who Changed Modern Britain" by Vernon Bogdanor (thoroughly recommend, btw), and there was a snippet in there about realising as far back as the 1950s that their voters weren't socialist and that nationalisation wasn't supported by even the workers in those industries. There was a frantic search for alternatives (Benn rotated through the alternatives in his writings: full nationalisation, siege economy, guild socialism, syndicalism, etc) but none gained traction. Callaghan realised the game was up but was a solid union man and couldn't make the intellectual leap to the alternative: Thatcher had no such compunction and implemented her version: free markets, deregulation, denationalisation, detaching the economy from the nation. Blair (possibly unthinkingly?) accepted this and slapped a human face on it, using the Cold War dividend to file off the raw edges of Thatcherism and moving the party from the workers to the professional classes and public sector workers, from economic issues to social issues. Its adoption of identity politics was a natural progress from that.

    In short, Labour abandoned its working-class origins decades ago and hid the smell by spraying money everywhere, using Cold War dividend and economic boom money to do it. And it worked. But post-Brexit, post-COVID, and post-boom it can't do that any more and has been running like a coyote suspended in air ever since. Starmer was gravity catching up to it.
    Phone Big Vern and tell him it was the Tories under Thatcher/Major and Cameron who used the peace dividend to cut defence spending. Labour increased spending – even if we complain it was wasted on white elephant carriers and illegal American wars.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 58,890

    Andy Burnham says the by-election isn’t about him.

    https://x.com/misraandrew/status/2055631365190607225

    I mean, I knew he wasn't the sharpest but really?
  • DopermeanDopermean Posts: 3,135

    There's some political points to be scored by Malcolm Offord going over the top and demanding a public enquiry or something into this sporting stitch up. Not like Reform has any supporters amongst the Celtic supporting fraternity.

    Offord should be keeping quiet about sporting matters having publicly outed himself as not having the minimum equipment on his racing yacht, public shunning in the yacht club bar beckons.
  • eekeek Posts: 33,916
    DavidL said:

    Andy Burnham says the by-election isn’t about him.

    https://x.com/misraandrew/status/2055631365190607225

    I mean, I knew he wasn't the sharpest but really?
    Technically he’s correct

    It’s about whether the constituency wants a Labour or Reform Government.

    Granted voting Reform won’t get them a Reform government on June 19 2026 but if Reform win I suspect they will have more of a chance in 2028 than they would otherwise have
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 22,864
    DavidL said:

    Andy Burnham says the by-election isn’t about him.

    https://x.com/misraandrew/status/2055631365190607225

    I mean, I knew he wasn't the sharpest but really?
    On one hand, fully agreed. This by-election wouldn't be happening if it weren't for Andy B's personal Westminster ambitions.

    But he can hardly say that out loud, can he?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,783
    Is it me or this this first 12 minutes particularly dreary?
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 8,323
    DavidL said:

    Andy Burnham says the by-election isn’t about him.

    https://x.com/misraandrew/status/2055631365190607225

    I mean, I knew he wasn't the sharpest but really?
    The best laugh was when talking to Channel 4 News he said wanted this seat as it’s close to his old one . We all know it was the only seat made available as everyone else refused to stand down !
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 37,421

    viewcode said:

    AnneJGP said:

    The last two Labour leaders have been London based. I like London, it’s awesome.

    But I wonder if a leader not from London will make a positive impact just by the virtue of killing the idea that Labour is a southern party that doesn’t understand the north.

    It might help; but one wonders how the party managed to alienate itself so badly from its origins.
    It's been going for a long time. I've just finished "Making the Weather: Six Politicians Who Changed Modern Britain" by Vernon Bogdanor (thoroughly recommend, btw), and there was a snippet in there about realising as far back as the 1950s that their voters weren't socialist and that nationalisation wasn't supported by even the workers in those industries. There was a frantic search for alternatives (Benn rotated through the alternatives in his writings: full nationalisation, siege economy, guild socialism, syndicalism, etc) but none gained traction. Callaghan realised the game was up but was a solid union man and couldn't make the intellectual leap to the alternative: Thatcher had no such compunction and implemented her version: free markets, deregulation, denationalisation, detaching the economy from the nation. Blair (possibly unthinkingly?) accepted this and slapped a human face on it, using the Cold War dividend to file off the raw edges of Thatcherism and moving the party from the workers to the professional classes and public sector workers, from economic issues to social issues. Its adoption of identity politics was a natural progress from that.

    In short, Labour abandoned its working-class origins decades ago and hid the smell by spraying money everywhere, using Cold War dividend and economic boom money to do it. And it worked. But post-Brexit, post-COVID, and post-boom it can't do that any more and has been running like a coyote suspended in air ever since. Starmer was gravity catching up to it.
    Phone Big Vern and tell him it was the Tories under Thatcher/Major and Cameron who used the peace dividend to cut defence spending. Labour increased spending – even if we complain it was wasted on white elephant carriers and illegal American wars.
    If (always!!!) Blair had kept out of Iraq there's a good chance we'd be a great deal better off. Whether the Iraqis would be is a different discussion.

    But of course if if and and were pots and pans we'd have no need for tinkers.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 56,836
    At last @TSE has a photo to rival the Farage one. I suggest a header title "the thigh's the limit for Burnham"


  • Initial impressions


    Palestine march way smaller than expected. Good natured. Much less angry than the huge one I attended a couple of years ago. Mainly cranky old lefties and bored looking Muslims.

    I saw actress Juliet Stephenson looking rather old and a bit weary

    Smallest cheer in history for Diane Abbott denouncing anti Semitism. I confess I laughed

    Onwards to the Fash
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 55,428
    edited May 16
    Andy_JS said:

    Andy Burnham says the by-election isn’t about him.

    https://x.com/misraandrew/status/2055631365190607225

    It literally is 100% about him. Amazing the things politicians say with a straight face.
    Of course it’s about him. He’s going to be elected, become PM, solve all our problems, and we’ll all (ex Leon) live happily ever after. ( ;) )
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 58,890
    Andy_JS said:

    Andy Burnham says the by-election isn’t about him.

    https://x.com/misraandrew/status/2055631365190607225

    It literally is 100% about him. Amazing the things politicians say with a straight face.
    Can Burnham do a straight face? He always seems to have this self satisfied smugness to me. If he was chocolate he would eat himself.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 25,449

    Is it me or this this first 12 minutes particularly dreary?

    So you're at the Progress conference then?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,783
    edited May 16
    It think I had La Cucerella air horns on my Ford Capri.
    Is this just dull or is it dull because I find Citeh and Chelski particularly unwatchable.

    Ooh corner kick.
  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,833
    Wonder if Kemi is happy with this

    Tommy Robinson:

    "We have to get political, we have to get involved. I’m not going to tell you which political party you need to join. We’re a cultural movement. I’m going to tell you that you have to join a political party. I don’t care if it’s Reform, if it’s Advance, or it’s Restore, or it’s the Conservative party. We have to locally get involved in politics."
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 59,771

    Is it me or this this first 12 minutes particularly dreary?

    You're re-watching Keir Starmer's speech?
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 47,892

    Initial impressions


    Palestine march way smaller than expected. Good natured. Much less angry than the huge one I attended a couple of years ago. Mainly cranky old lefties and bored looking Muslims.

    I saw actress Juliet Stephenson looking rather old and a bit weary

    Smallest cheer in history for Diane Abbott denouncing anti Semitism. I confess I laughed

    Onwards to the Fash

    *Life goals*
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,783

    Is it me or this this first 12 minutes particularly dreary?

    You're re-watching Keir Starmer's speech?
    I might be. We are 25 minutes in and still nothing of substance.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 59,771
    Offside - Man City goal disallowed!!
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 10,789
    IanB2 said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    The AfD now have a significant polling lead over the CDU/CSU.

    https://x.com/wahlen_de/status/2055627030457167991

    AfD: 29% (+1)
    Union: 22% (-1)
    GRÜNE: 14% (+1)
    SPD: 12% (-1)
    LINKE: 10% (-1)
    BSW: 3%
    FDP: 3%
    Sonstige: 7% (+1)

    They do but the governing Union and SPD coalition are still on 34% combined to the AfD's 29% and as Germany has PR Merz will remain chancellor
    But still. This is the EU the Remainers want to Rejoin? Germany maybe led by the AfD. Italy already led by Meloni. A good chance Bardella will with the French presidency

    Etc
    Germany won't be led by the AfD as no other party will touch them and Germany has PR. Italy will continue to be led by Meloni but her government includes the centre right Forza Italia while the centre right Union in Germany won't touch the AfD.

    Macron's former PM Philippe who has founded a new centre right party now leads Bardella 51.5% to 48.5% (albeit Bardella easily beats Melenchon, Retailleau, Glucksmann and Attal in a run off)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2027_French_presidential_election#Second_round_2
    Leon doesn’t understand nor has any feel for politics; any PB’er who hasn’t worked that out by now hasn’t been paying attention.
    He is prone to hyperbole but France is a major concern. Traditional social democracy is in terrible trouble.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,783
    Haarland gets his goal. Oh wait...
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 43,515
    @georgeeaton.bsky.social‬

    Wes Streeting calls for the UK to rejoin the EU in his speech to the Progress conference.

    “We need a new special relationship with the EU, because Britain’s future lies with Europe - and one day back in the European Union”.

    https://bsky.app/profile/georgeeaton.bsky.social/post/3mly2i6je3s25
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 91,956
    edited May 16

    Is it me or this this first 12 minutes particularly dreary?

    You're re-watching Keir Starmer's speech?
    I might be. We are 25 minutes in and still nothing of substance.
    Its still better than Wayne Rooney analysis.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 58,890

    IanB2 said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    The AfD now have a significant polling lead over the CDU/CSU.

    https://x.com/wahlen_de/status/2055627030457167991

    AfD: 29% (+1)
    Union: 22% (-1)
    GRÜNE: 14% (+1)
    SPD: 12% (-1)
    LINKE: 10% (-1)
    BSW: 3%
    FDP: 3%
    Sonstige: 7% (+1)

    They do but the governing Union and SPD coalition are still on 34% combined to the AfD's 29% and as Germany has PR Merz will remain chancellor
    But still. This is the EU the Remainers want to Rejoin? Germany maybe led by the AfD. Italy already led by Meloni. A good chance Bardella will with the French presidency

    Etc
    Germany won't be led by the AfD as no other party will touch them and Germany has PR. Italy will continue to be led by Meloni but her government includes the centre right Forza Italia while the centre right Union in Germany won't touch the AfD.

    Macron's former PM Philippe who has founded a new centre right party now leads Bardella 51.5% to 48.5% (albeit Bardella easily beats Melenchon, Retailleau, Glucksmann and Attal in a run off)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2027_French_presidential_election#Second_round_2
    Leon doesn’t understand nor has any feel for politics; any PB’er who hasn’t worked that out by now hasn’t been paying attention.
    He is prone to hyperbole but France is a major concern. Traditional social democracy is in terrible trouble.
    Their financial situation makes ours look good. If they weren't in the Euro their bond rates would be through the roof. If they weren't France the ECB would be reading the Riot Act.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 7,960
    Andy_JS said:

    Andy Burnham says the by-election isn’t about him.

    https://x.com/misraandrew/status/2055631365190607225

    It literally is 100% about him. Amazing the things politicians say with a straight face.
    Andy_JS said:

    Andy Burnham says the by-election isn’t about him.

    https://x.com/misraandrew/status/2055631365190607225

    It literally is 100% about him. Amazing the things politicians say with a straight face.
    Bad start when he's lying before and if he becomes an MP.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 58,890

    Andy_JS said:

    Andy Burnham says the by-election isn’t about him.

    https://x.com/misraandrew/status/2055631365190607225

    It literally is 100% about him. Amazing the things politicians say with a straight face.
    Andy_JS said:

    Andy Burnham says the by-election isn’t about him.

    https://x.com/misraandrew/status/2055631365190607225

    It literally is 100% about him. Amazing the things politicians say with a straight face.
    Bad start when he's lying before and if he becomes an MP.
    I think its called training.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,783
    edited May 16

    Is it me or this this first 12 minutes particularly dreary?

    You're re-watching Keir Starmer's speech?
    I might be. We are 25 minutes in and still nothing of substance.
    Its still better than Wayne Rooney analysis.
    Worth £800,000 of anyone's license fee.
  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,833
    DavidL said:

    IanB2 said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    The AfD now have a significant polling lead over the CDU/CSU.

    https://x.com/wahlen_de/status/2055627030457167991

    AfD: 29% (+1)
    Union: 22% (-1)
    GRÜNE: 14% (+1)
    SPD: 12% (-1)
    LINKE: 10% (-1)
    BSW: 3%
    FDP: 3%
    Sonstige: 7% (+1)

    They do but the governing Union and SPD coalition are still on 34% combined to the AfD's 29% and as Germany has PR Merz will remain chancellor
    But still. This is the EU the Remainers want to Rejoin? Germany maybe led by the AfD. Italy already led by Meloni. A good chance Bardella will with the French presidency

    Etc
    Germany won't be led by the AfD as no other party will touch them and Germany has PR. Italy will continue to be led by Meloni but her government includes the centre right Forza Italia while the centre right Union in Germany won't touch the AfD.

    Macron's former PM Philippe who has founded a new centre right party now leads Bardella 51.5% to 48.5% (albeit Bardella easily beats Melenchon, Retailleau, Glucksmann and Attal in a run off)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2027_French_presidential_election#Second_round_2
    Leon doesn’t understand nor has any feel for politics; any PB’er who hasn’t worked that out by now hasn’t been paying attention.
    He is prone to hyperbole but France is a major concern. Traditional social democracy is in terrible trouble.
    Their financial situation makes ours look good. If they weren't in the Euro their bond rates would be through the roof. If they weren't France the ECB would be reading the Riot Act.
    So what you're saying is...we should join the Euro? :naughty:
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 58,890
    CatMan said:

    DavidL said:

    IanB2 said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    The AfD now have a significant polling lead over the CDU/CSU.

    https://x.com/wahlen_de/status/2055627030457167991

    AfD: 29% (+1)
    Union: 22% (-1)
    GRÜNE: 14% (+1)
    SPD: 12% (-1)
    LINKE: 10% (-1)
    BSW: 3%
    FDP: 3%
    Sonstige: 7% (+1)

    They do but the governing Union and SPD coalition are still on 34% combined to the AfD's 29% and as Germany has PR Merz will remain chancellor
    But still. This is the EU the Remainers want to Rejoin? Germany maybe led by the AfD. Italy already led by Meloni. A good chance Bardella will with the French presidency

    Etc
    Germany won't be led by the AfD as no other party will touch them and Germany has PR. Italy will continue to be led by Meloni but her government includes the centre right Forza Italia while the centre right Union in Germany won't touch the AfD.

    Macron's former PM Philippe who has founded a new centre right party now leads Bardella 51.5% to 48.5% (albeit Bardella easily beats Melenchon, Retailleau, Glucksmann and Attal in a run off)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2027_French_presidential_election#Second_round_2
    Leon doesn’t understand nor has any feel for politics; any PB’er who hasn’t worked that out by now hasn’t been paying attention.
    He is prone to hyperbole but France is a major concern. Traditional social democracy is in terrible trouble.
    Their financial situation makes ours look good. If they weren't in the Euro their bond rates would be through the roof. If they weren't France the ECB would be reading the Riot Act.
    So what you're saying is...we should join the Euro? :naughty:
    I said the other day that if we were to rejoin we would have to join the Euro to show our commitment. It is arguable that the lower gilt rates would be an economic benefit from that but I fear that the lower interest rates would give us a dangerous housing boom (something we are peculiarly prone to) which would bleed into higher inflation.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 91,956
    This match is not exactly Northamton vs Bristol in the rugby last night.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 59,849
    Scott_xP said:

    @georgeeaton.bsky.social‬

    Wes Streeting calls for the UK to rejoin the EU in his speech to the Progress conference.

    “We need a new special relationship with the EU, because Britain’s future lies with Europe - and one day back in the European Union”.

    https://bsky.app/profile/georgeeaton.bsky.social/post/3mly2i6je3s25

    Absolutely appalling that on a day when the far-right are marching in London, Wes chooses to send out a dog whistle about our "European" identity.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,783
    Much better from Chelsea.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 22,098

    Scott_xP said:

    @georgeeaton.bsky.social‬

    Wes Streeting calls for the UK to rejoin the EU in his speech to the Progress conference.

    “We need a new special relationship with the EU, because Britain’s future lies with Europe - and one day back in the European Union”.

    https://bsky.app/profile/georgeeaton.bsky.social/post/3mly2i6je3s25

    Absolutely appalling that on a day when the far-right are marching in London, Wes chooses to send out a dog whistle about our "European" identity.
    You feel he should appease them?
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 63,525

    Scott_xP said:

    @georgeeaton.bsky.social‬

    Wes Streeting calls for the UK to rejoin the EU in his speech to the Progress conference.

    “We need a new special relationship with the EU, because Britain’s future lies with Europe - and one day back in the European Union”.

    https://bsky.app/profile/georgeeaton.bsky.social/post/3mly2i6je3s25

    Absolutely appalling that on a day when the far-right are marching in London, Wes chooses to send out a dog whistle about our "European" identity.
    You come out with some right shite sometimes
    Why is it a dog whistle to propose a change in political policy? That is surely the job of senior politicians - to create a policy platform and promote it.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 58,890

    This match is not exactly Northamton vs Bristol in the rugby last night.

    City have not looked the same since de Bruyne left. They are not nearly as much fun to watch. This is a very dull game.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 59,771
    Greetings from da North Ilford Ghetto!


  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 58,890

    Scott_xP said:

    @georgeeaton.bsky.social‬

    Wes Streeting calls for the UK to rejoin the EU in his speech to the Progress conference.

    “We need a new special relationship with the EU, because Britain’s future lies with Europe - and one day back in the European Union”.

    https://bsky.app/profile/georgeeaton.bsky.social/post/3mly2i6je3s25

    Absolutely appalling that on a day when the far-right are marching in London, Wes chooses to send out a dog whistle about our "European" identity.
    You come out with some right shite sometimes
    Why is it a dog whistle to propose a change in political policy? That is surely the job of senior politicians - to create a policy platform and promote it.
    And the idea that a march or speech by that oaf Robinson should have any impact on how other people behave is positively offensive. Give him all the attention he deserves, none at all.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 37,421
    DavidL said:

    This match is not exactly Northamton vs Bristol in the rugby last night.

    City have not looked the same since de Bruyne left. They are not nearly as much fun to watch. This is a very dull game.
    Give me Rugby League any day!
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 8,323
    This was a very intriguing speech from Streeting .

    Whether he actually stands if Burnham wins is another matter but I suspect this is a warning shot to Burnham not to suddenly start moving away from his previous pro EU stance if he becomes leader .

  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 59,849

    Scott_xP said:

    @georgeeaton.bsky.social‬

    Wes Streeting calls for the UK to rejoin the EU in his speech to the Progress conference.

    “We need a new special relationship with the EU, because Britain’s future lies with Europe - and one day back in the European Union”.

    https://bsky.app/profile/georgeeaton.bsky.social/post/3mly2i6je3s25

    Absolutely appalling that on a day when the far-right are marching in London, Wes chooses to send out a dog whistle about our "European" identity.
    You feel he should appease them?
    That's what he's doing by coming out with this Mosleyite rhetoric about Europe.
  • Lot of love for Ireland
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 9,233
    Foxy said:

    At last @TSE has a photo to rival the Farage one. I suggest a header title "the thigh's the limit for Burnham"


    Shame he's from Manchester not Liverpool. Those hands scream "Calm down! Calm down!".
  • boulayboulay Posts: 8,878

    Is it me or this this first 12 minutes particularly dreary?

    You're re-watching Keir Starmer's speech?
    I might be. We are 25 minutes in and still nothing of substance.
    Its still better than Wayne Rooney analysis.
    Worth £800,000 of anyone's license fee.
    If he had any sense he would get himself signed up to Paddy McGuiness’ agent and he will double that and be able to ruin loads of shows.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 91,956
    I am glad I am in the US when the World Cup is on so I don't have to listen to potato head give his analysis of the games.
  • Surprisingly Christian
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 22,032
    carnforth said:

    Foxy said:

    At last @TSE has a photo to rival the Farage one. I suggest a header title "the thigh's the limit for Burnham"


    Shame he's from Manchester not Liverpool. Those hands scream "Calm down! Calm down!".
    He's a Scouse Mackem really
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 91,956
    edited May 16
    boulay said:

    Is it me or this this first 12 minutes particularly dreary?

    You're re-watching Keir Starmer's speech?
    I might be. We are 25 minutes in and still nothing of substance.
    Its still better than Wayne Rooney analysis.
    Worth £800,000 of anyone's license fee.
    If he had any sense he would get himself signed up to Paddy McGuiness’ agent and he will double that and be able to ruin loads of shows.
    God, Paddy McGuiness agent must have dirt on top people at the BBC, every show he gets the gig for is cancelled within 18 months. I think I read somewhere he is next hosting the reboot of Big Break.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 58,890

    Surprisingly Christian

    What, they are nailing people to crosses?
  • boulayboulay Posts: 8,878
    Foxy said:

    At last @TSE has a photo to rival the Farage one. I suggest a header title "the thigh's the limit for Burnham"


    Major Alan Partridge vibes with those shorts.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 14,284
    Foxy said:

    At last @TSE has a photo to rival the Farage one. I suggest a header title "the thigh's the limit for Burnham"


    Burnham needs a better running route. I sympthasise with those runners in Barrett housing estates who find themselves running alongside the local dual carriageway, but I doubt he's one of them.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 91,956
    boulay said:

    Foxy said:

    At last @TSE has a photo to rival the Farage one. I suggest a header title "the thigh's the limit for Burnham"


    Major Alan Partridge vibes with those shorts.
    Ahhhhhhhhhhhha!
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 50,691
    edited May 16

    Andy_JS said:

    Andy Burnham says the by-election isn’t about him.

    https://x.com/misraandrew/status/2055631365190607225

    It literally is 100% about him. Amazing the things politicians say with a straight face.
    Andy_JS said:

    Andy Burnham says the by-election isn’t about him.

    https://x.com/misraandrew/status/2055631365190607225

    It literally is 100% about him. Amazing the things politicians say with a straight face.
    Bad start when he's lying before and if he becomes an MP.
    He's not lying. He's saying the by-election isn't about him, it's about renewing hope for the future and he just happens to be the embodiment of it.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 15,630
    nico67 said:

    What a tragedy . How many league titles does a club need ?

    They need another 10 trophies to overtake Al Ahly FC of Egypt and become the winningest club of all time.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 47,892
    DavidL said:

    Surprisingly Christian

    What, they are nailing people to crosses?
    Setting the crosses alight more like.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 50,691
    boulay said:

    Foxy said:

    At last @TSE has a photo to rival the Farage one. I suggest a header title "the thigh's the limit for Burnham"


    Major Alan Partridge vibes with those shorts.
    So long as the boys stay in the barracks.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 8,878

    boulay said:

    Is it me or this this first 12 minutes particularly dreary?

    You're re-watching Keir Starmer's speech?
    I might be. We are 25 minutes in and still nothing of substance.
    Its still better than Wayne Rooney analysis.
    Worth £800,000 of anyone's license fee.
    If he had any sense he would get himself signed up to Paddy McGuiness’ agent and he will double that and be able to ruin loads of shows.
    God, Paddy McGuiness agent must have dirt on top people at the BBC, every show he gets the gig for is cancelled within 18 months. I think I read somewhere he is next hosting the reboot of Big Break.
    He’s such a kiss of death that he even managed to turn his wife lesbian.
  • TazTaz Posts: 28,124
    boulay said:

    Foxy said:

    At last @TSE has a photo to rival the Farage one. I suggest a header title "the thigh's the limit for Burnham"


    Major Alan Partridge vibes with those shorts.
    Oooh, mince !!
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 50,691
    Sandpit said:

    kinabalu said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Andy Burnham says the by-election isn’t about him.

    https://x.com/misraandrew/status/2055631365190607225

    It literally is 100% about him. Amazing the things politicians say with a straight face.
    Andy_JS said:

    Andy Burnham says the by-election isn’t about him.

    https://x.com/misraandrew/status/2055631365190607225

    It literally is 100% about him. Amazing the things politicians say with a straight face.
    Bad start when he's lying before and if he becomes an MP.
    He's not lying. He's saying the by-election isn't about him, it's about renewing hope for the future and with the way things have panned out he just happens to be the embodiment of it. I think that's what he means.
    The sitting MP literally took the Chiltern Hundreds to give Burnham a run at a seat. Of course the by-election is about him and his ambitions.
    Actually I'm hoping it is about him. That's the only way the seat will be won in the current climate.
  • DavidL said:

    Surprisingly Christian

    What, they are nailing people to crosses?
    A lot of crosses. No one nailed to them. Our Tommy is talking about Jesus. They just had an evangelical speaker

    Overall impression. It’s impressively big. But almost certainly not as big as the first one? (Tho I wasn’t there)

    A weird crowd. Families out for the day. Drunk football hooligans. Veterans with medals. The pink ladies. More women and more young people and more BMEs than I expected. Lots of people holding (the old) Iranian flags. Quite a few Israeli flags.

    The idea all these people are racist thugs is ridiculous. But so is the idea they are about to sweep the nation. It’s heavily reliant on (the fading?) charisma of Tommy

    There is a quiet but seething anger. It needs to be mollified. But if it is mollified, soon, it will disappear
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 91,956
    edited May 16
    Are all the empty seats at the footy because they are decieded to go to the Tommy rally instead?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 58,890
    There really ought to be a rule by which matches can go to penalties after an hour or so if it looks like neither team will score if they play to midnight.
This discussion has been closed.