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The high point of the Sir Olly Robbins testimony – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 13,173
edited April 21 in General
The high point of the Sir Olly Robbins testimony – politicalbetting.com

"Just fucking approve it."Emily Thornberry recites Morgan McSweeney's call for the Foreign Office to approve Peter Mandelson's appointment as US Ambassador. pic.twitter.com/i4hzCUEXFd

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  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 17,430
    First like Arsenal until they aren't
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 15,649
    edited April 21
    Just fucking second.
  • isamisam Posts: 44,230
    Sir Keir Starmer has told his Cabinet that Olly Robbins was a 'man or integrity and professionalism' who made an 'error of judgement'

    “(He) concluded by saying that Sir Oliver Robbins made an error of judgment, but that he is a man of integrity and professionalism.

    “He said it is wrong that the current Cabinet Secretary and permanent secretary at the Cabinet Office had been attacked despite doing exactly the right thing and sharing the information with the Prime Minister once they had gone through the correct processes to do so.

    “He said that there are thousands of hard-working civil servants across the country who are full of integrity, doing excellent work every day.”

    https://x.com/steven_swinford/status/2046565360074125340?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 60,398
    FPT:

    Trump has - apparently, according to reports - been denied access to the nuclear codes by his generals... Yuuuuge if true.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEMEE6d7nHQ
  • FossFoss Posts: 2,726
    MarqueeMark said:

    FPT:

    Trump has - apparently, according to reports - been denied access to the nuclear codes by his generals... Yuuuuge if true.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEMEE6d7nHQ

    Is that not technically a coup? Not that I'm sad he can't throw a Grade A tantrum but...
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 60,398
    Foss said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    FPT:

    Trump has - apparently, according to reports - been denied access to the nuclear codes by his generals... Yuuuuge if true.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEMEE6d7nHQ

    Is that not technically a coup? Not that I'm sad he can't throw a Grade A tantrum but...
    Apparently exercised a right that exists.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,380
    isam said:

    Sir Keir Starmer has told his Cabinet that Olly Robbins was a 'man or integrity and professionalism' who made an 'error of judgement'

    “(He) concluded by saying that Sir Oliver Robbins made an error of judgment, but that he is a man of integrity and professionalism.

    “He said it is wrong that the current Cabinet Secretary and permanent secretary at the Cabinet Office had been attacked despite doing exactly the right thing and sharing the information with the Prime Minister once they had gone through the correct processes to do so.

    “He said that there are thousands of hard-working civil servants across the country who are full of integrity, doing excellent work every day.”

    https://x.com/steven_swinford/status/2046565360074125340?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q

    Sick bucket inducing.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 17,376
    isam said:

    Sir Keir Starmer has told his Cabinet that Olly Robbins was a 'man or integrity and professionalism' who made an 'error of judgement'

    “(He) concluded by saying that Sir Oliver Robbins made an error of judgment, but that he is a man of integrity and professionalism.

    “He said it is wrong that the current Cabinet Secretary and permanent secretary at the Cabinet Office had been attacked despite doing exactly the right thing and sharing the information with the Prime Minister once they had gone through the correct processes to do so.

    “He said that there are thousands of hard-working civil servants across the country who are full of integrity, doing excellent work every day.”

    https://x.com/steven_swinford/status/2046565360074125340?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q

    Thousands of potential under the bussers for Mr Takes Responsibility
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 79,490
    edited April 21
    MarqueeMark said:

    Foss said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    FPT:

    Trump has - apparently, according to reports - been denied access to the nuclear codes by his generals... Yuuuuge if true.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEMEE6d7nHQ

    Is that not technically a coup? Not that I'm sad he can't throw a Grade A tantrum but...
    Apparently exercised a right that exists.
    It has been done twice before.

    However, on both occasions it was with Presidents in the last days in office who were so tonto that there was a real fear they would take the planet with them.*

    If true, is this perhaps a sign we are in the end game with Trump?

    *One of the two was Trump 1 after his attempted coup on Jan 6th. The other was Nixon in 1974.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 91,959
    edited April 21
    Must be about time for "procedural failures, weakness in the system, lessons will be learned" stage of the scandal...
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 36,352
    MarqueeMark said:

    FPT:

    Trump has - apparently, according to reports - been denied access to the nuclear codes by his generals... Yuuuuge if true.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEMEE6d7nHQ

    Video credits source as the Daily Mirror. Huzzah for Fleet Street!!

    Except the Mirror credits YouTube channel Judging Freedom and I do not have time to look further.
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 15,649
    MarqueeMark said:

    FPT:

    Trump has - apparently, according to reports - been denied access to the nuclear codes by his generals... Yuuuuge if true.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEMEE6d7nHQ

    If true, would suggest rumours about his mental health may be true. It is of course Youtube - not quite as degenerate as X but hardly gospel - so file under 'interesting'.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 17,430
    isam said:

    Sir Keir Starmer has told his Cabinet that Olly Robbins was a 'man or integrity and professionalism' who made an 'error of judgement'

    “(He) concluded by saying that Sir Oliver Robbins made an error of judgment, but that he is a man of integrity and professionalism.

    “He said it is wrong that the current Cabinet Secretary and permanent secretary at the Cabinet Office had been attacked despite doing exactly the right thing and sharing the information with the Prime Minister once they had gone through the correct processes to do so.

    “He said that there are thousands of hard-working civil servants across the country who are full of integrity, doing excellent work every day.”

    https://x.com/steven_swinford/status/2046565360074125340?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q

    Smoking gun:

    Starmer makes drastically wrong decision in appointing PeterM.

    Months later he learns that it is possible, though unlikely, that he could have been saved from making the wrong decision if he had taken the advice at the time and/or the FCO had blocked the decision for him.

    As a result the FCO bloke making at worst an 'error of judgment' but in fact trying to follow rules and to save Starmer from himself and his own folly gets the sack.

    Starmer still in his job with gun smoking.

  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 128,580
    We have gone from "it's Biden's economy" to "the mere confirmation of me getting elected got prices down."

    KERNEN: By the time Biden left, inflation was down to about 3%--

    TRUMP: No it wasn't. It was down to 5%. And the reason it was down was because I had won the election and it started falling after I won the election and I started getting prices down from right after November 5

    https://x.com/TahraHoops/status/2046588261708255418
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,380
    Front pages are going to be a blood bath for Starmer tonight.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 64,491
    FrancisUrquhart said:

    The prime minister concluded by saying that Sir Olly Robbins made an error of judgment, but that he is a man of integrity and professionalism. He said it is wrong that the current cabinet secretary and permanent secretary at the Cabinet Office have been attacked despite doing exactly the right thing in sharing the information with the prime minister once they had gone through the correct process to do so. He said that there are thousands of hard-working civil servants across the country who are full of integrity, doing excellent work every day with a profound sense of public duty.

    And that is why I immediately sacked him....

    So, is he saying there are hundreds of thousands who are lazy liars?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 64,491
    Sandpit said:

    bondegezou said:

    Sandpit said:

    Stuartinromford said:

    Sandpit said:

    rkrkrk said:

    DavidL said:

    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Northern_Al said:

    So, on my (long) morning walk I listened to the entirety of Robbins' testimony, and I confess it's changed my mind somewhat. A few points:

    1. Robbins was deeply impressive, and don't let anybody tell you otherwise. His sacking is egregious, and he'd have a strong claim for unfair dismissal in normal circumstances. Notable that the head of the SCS Union (FDA) was perched behind him.

    2. Starmer made not one, but two, disastrous appointments: Mandelson and Morgan McSweeney. Many of Robbins' references to No.10 were, I think, more about McSweeney than Starmer. For example, it wouldn't surprise me if McSweeney was behind the (failed) push to find a job for Doyle.

    3. I now think Starmer is finished - not immediately, but in due course. He didn't have a grip, and allowed McSweeney far too much power, which he abused.

    And finally - the highlight for me was Robbins, when thanked yet again for giving up so much of his time, replying, not quite verbatim, 'not a problem at all, I've lots of time on my hands now'.

    Genuinely what was so impressive about him? Its all smacked of process, process, process, not my job to take responsbility, 1000 words not to ever answer a question directly. It was Yes Minister Live giving huge credence to Big Dom's criticisms of senior civil service mindset and tactics.
    The purpose of the hearing was technically to establish whether there were any other documents that fell within the Loyal Address that had not been disclosed which is why the chair ( also very impressive I thought) kept going back to that.

    Maybe I spend too much time with lawyers but I found his answers clear, concise and extremely informative. As I hinted the other day the question of whether M had clearance was much more nuanced than it was being presented.

    Having heard him I found myself persuaded that politicians, even the PM, should not know the details of the disclosures or concerns. That wasn’t my thinking at 8.45.
    I think its fair enough not to know the details, but to withold from the decisionmakers that the security services said "don't give this guy a security clearance" is absurd.
    That’s the sort of thing where you would expect the head of MI6 to turn up at No.10 with a personal briefing file for the PM.
    Though that rather feels like the "there's a secret door and the government ninjas are behind there" expectation.

    Consider the stuff that only came out in the Epstain email dump. Either MI6 knew about that and did nothing, or (more likely) they didn't know.

    (ETA: I considered altering the Epstein typo, but it felt so apposite that I left it in.)
    It would also be useful to know if, anywhere in the process of appointing Mandy, the Americans had been asked what they had on him?

    The revelations that led to his firing came from the US, so what else did they have?
    It isn’t usual, is it, to ask the country you’re sending an ambassador to if they have any dirt on him.
    Good question. I wouldn’t phrase it quite like that, but would expect a friendly nation to mention if they thought him unsuitable because of his links to unfriendly nations.
    It's worth noting that the Trump administration -pretty unusually- pushed back hard on Mandelson, because of his perceived closeness to the EU.

    Or at least, that was what we thought was the reason at the time...
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 79,490
    rcs1000 said:

    FrancisUrquhart said:

    The prime minister concluded by saying that Sir Olly Robbins made an error of judgment, but that he is a man of integrity and professionalism. He said it is wrong that the current cabinet secretary and permanent secretary at the Cabinet Office have been attacked despite doing exactly the right thing in sharing the information with the prime minister once they had gone through the correct process to do so. He said that there are thousands of hard-working civil servants across the country who are full of integrity, doing excellent work every day with a profound sense of public duty.

    And that is why I immediately sacked him....

    So, is he saying there are hundreds of thousands who are lazy liars?
    To be fair, I might agree with him on that.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 59,879
    I’m surprised more isn’t being made of Robbins point that Mandelson’s STRAP clearance was given independently. Who approved that?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,380
    ydoethur said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Foss said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    FPT:

    Trump has - apparently, according to reports - been denied access to the nuclear codes by his generals... Yuuuuge if true.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEMEE6d7nHQ

    Is that not technically a coup? Not that I'm sad he can't throw a Grade A tantrum but...
    Apparently exercised a right that exists.
    It has been done twice before.

    However, on both occasions it was with Presidents in the last days in office who were so tonto that there was a real fear they would take the planet with them.*

    If true, is this perhaps a sign we are in the end game with Trump?

    *One of the two was Trump 1 after his attempted coup on Jan 6th. The other was Nixon in 1974.
    NIxon's case was worry over his periods of intoxication iirc?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 61,689
    Peter_the_Punter said:

    Does anybody else here have the impression that some of the Government's advisers have watched The Thick Of It thinking it was an instruction video?

    Well they managed to get an F-bomb on lunchtime TV today!
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 15,649
    rcs1000 said:

    Sandpit said:

    bondegezou said:

    Sandpit said:

    Stuartinromford said:

    Sandpit said:

    rkrkrk said:

    DavidL said:

    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Northern_Al said:

    So, on my (long) morning walk I listened to the entirety of Robbins' testimony, and I confess it's changed my mind somewhat. A few points:

    1. Robbins was deeply impressive, and don't let anybody tell you otherwise. His sacking is egregious, and he'd have a strong claim for unfair dismissal in normal circumstances. Notable that the head of the SCS Union (FDA) was perched behind him.

    2. Starmer made not one, but two, disastrous appointments: Mandelson and Morgan McSweeney. Many of Robbins' references to No.10 were, I think, more about McSweeney than Starmer. For example, it wouldn't surprise me if McSweeney was behind the (failed) push to find a job for Doyle.

    3. I now think Starmer is finished - not immediately, but in due course. He didn't have a grip, and allowed McSweeney far too much power, which he abused.

    And finally - the highlight for me was Robbins, when thanked yet again for giving up so much of his time, replying, not quite verbatim, 'not a problem at all, I've lots of time on my hands now'.

    Genuinely what was so impressive about him? Its all smacked of process, process, process, not my job to take responsbility, 1000 words not to ever answer a question directly. It was Yes Minister Live giving huge credence to Big Dom's criticisms of senior civil service mindset and tactics.
    The purpose of the hearing was technically to establish whether there were any other documents that fell within the Loyal Address that had not been disclosed which is why the chair ( also very impressive I thought) kept going back to that.

    Maybe I spend too much time with lawyers but I found his answers clear, concise and extremely informative. As I hinted the other day the question of whether M had clearance was much more nuanced than it was being presented.

    Having heard him I found myself persuaded that politicians, even the PM, should not know the details of the disclosures or concerns. That wasn’t my thinking at 8.45.
    I think its fair enough not to know the details, but to withold from the decisionmakers that the security services said "don't give this guy a security clearance" is absurd.
    That’s the sort of thing where you would expect the head of MI6 to turn up at No.10 with a personal briefing file for the PM.
    Though that rather feels like the "there's a secret door and the government ninjas are behind there" expectation.

    Consider the stuff that only came out in the Epstain email dump. Either MI6 knew about that and did nothing, or (more likely) they didn't know.

    (ETA: I considered altering the Epstein typo, but it felt so apposite that I left it in.)
    It would also be useful to know if, anywhere in the process of appointing Mandy, the Americans had been asked what they had on him?

    The revelations that led to his firing came from the US, so what else did they have?
    It isn’t usual, is it, to ask the country you’re sending an ambassador to if they have any dirt on him.
    Good question. I wouldn’t phrase it quite like that, but would expect a friendly nation to mention if they thought him unsuitable because of his links to unfriendly nations.
    It's worth noting that the Trump administration -pretty unusually- pushed back hard on Mandelson, because of his perceived closeness to the EU.

    Or at least, that was what we thought was the reason at the time...
    So far we've heard a lot about the pressure No 10 was applying to the FO, but nothing of any pressure being applied to No 10. If the White House was leaning on it, things would make a lot more sense but there's been not a peep about it - if indeed it was the case.

    Just exactly why was Mandelson so important?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 79,490
    rottenborough said:

    ydoethur said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Foss said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    FPT:

    Trump has - apparently, according to reports - been denied access to the nuclear codes by his generals... Yuuuuge if true.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEMEE6d7nHQ

    Is that not technically a coup? Not that I'm sad he can't throw a Grade A tantrum but...
    Apparently exercised a right that exists.
    It has been done twice before.

    However, on both occasions it was with Presidents in the last days in office who were so tonto that there was a real fear they would take the planet with them.*

    If true, is this perhaps a sign we are in the end game with Trump?

    *One of the two was Trump 1 after his attempted coup on Jan 6th. The other was Nixon in 1974.
    NIxon's case was worry over his periods of intoxication iirc?
    That probably didn't help, but apparently the trigger (no pun intended) was when after a particularly difficult hearing he said 'I can walk into my office, pick up the phone and in 10 minutes 70 million people will be dead.'
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 7,961
    isam said:

    Sir Keir Starmer has told his Cabinet that Olly Robbins was a 'man or integrity and professionalism' who made an 'error of judgement'

    “(He) concluded by saying that Sir Oliver Robbins made an error of judgment, but that he is a man of integrity and professionalism.

    “He said it is wrong that the current Cabinet Secretary and permanent secretary at the Cabinet Office had been attacked despite doing exactly the right thing and sharing the information with the Prime Minister once they had gone through the correct processes to do so.

    “He said that there are thousands of hard-working civil servants across the country who are full of integrity, doing excellent work every day.”

    https://x.com/steven_swinford/status/2046565360074125340?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q

    Intersting Starmer sacks Sir Olly Robbins for what he describes as an error of judgement.. but won't go when his massive error of judgement in appointing Mandelson is in the Public spotlight.. vetting or no vetting.. he should never have been appointed.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 91,959
    edited April 21
    williamglenn said:

    Peter_the_Punter said:

    Does anybody else here have the impression that some of the Government's advisers have watched The Thick Of It thinking it was an instruction video?

    The decline in standards can be traced to the transition from using Yes, Minister as an instruction video to using The Thick Of It.
    All the media guff about having the grow ups back in the room isn't looking so clever these days.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 25,463
    williamglenn said:

    I’m surprised more isn’t being made of Robbins point that Mandelson’s STRAP clearance was given independently. Who approved that?

    There must be a strap-on joke in there somewhere, but I'm too lethargic to think of one.
  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,835
    ydoethur said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Foss said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    FPT:

    Trump has - apparently, according to reports - been denied access to the nuclear codes by his generals... Yuuuuge if true.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEMEE6d7nHQ

    Is that not technically a coup? Not that I'm sad he can't throw a Grade A tantrum but...
    Apparently exercised a right that exists.
    It has been done twice before.

    However, on both occasions it was with Presidents in the last days in office who were so tonto that there was a real fear they would take the planet with them.*

    If true, is this perhaps a sign we are in the end game with Trump?

    *One of the two was Trump 1 after his attempted coup on Jan 6th. The other was Nixon in 1974.
    The only good thing Henry Kissinger ever did.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 91,959
    edited April 21
    williamglenn said:

    I’m surprised more isn’t being made of Robbins point that Mandelson’s STRAP clearance was given independently. Who approved that?

    Another mysterious decision made due to full following of a process which nobody seems to be able to agree what exactly it is...Eating the onion bhaji.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 79,490
    CatMan said:

    ydoethur said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Foss said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    FPT:

    Trump has - apparently, according to reports - been denied access to the nuclear codes by his generals... Yuuuuge if true.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEMEE6d7nHQ

    Is that not technically a coup? Not that I'm sad he can't throw a Grade A tantrum but...
    Apparently exercised a right that exists.
    It has been done twice before.

    However, on both occasions it was with Presidents in the last days in office who were so tonto that there was a real fear they would take the planet with them.*

    If true, is this perhaps a sign we are in the end game with Trump?

    *One of the two was Trump 1 after his attempted coup on Jan 6th. The other was Nixon in 1974.
    The only good thing Henry Kissinger ever did.
    Sorry, it was James Schlesinger.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 63,547
    rottenborough said:

    ydoethur said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Foss said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    FPT:

    Trump has - apparently, according to reports - been denied access to the nuclear codes by his generals... Yuuuuge if true.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEMEE6d7nHQ

    Is that not technically a coup? Not that I'm sad he can't throw a Grade A tantrum but...
    Apparently exercised a right that exists.
    It has been done twice before.

    However, on both occasions it was with Presidents in the last days in office who were so tonto that there was a real fear they would take the planet with them.*

    If true, is this perhaps a sign we are in the end game with Trump?

    *One of the two was Trump 1 after his attempted coup on Jan 6th. The other was Nixon in 1974.
    NIxon's case was worry over his periods of intoxication iirc?
    And it was someone saying “If he asks, call me”. Nixon never asked for anything relating to nukes.

    He was, incidentally, committed to the policy of negotiated and monitored disarmament and was a proponent of complete disarmament with respect to biological and chemical weapons. He unilaterally committed the US to full biological weapons disarmament.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 22,873
    Peter_the_Punter said:

    Does anybody else here have the impression that some of the Government's advisers have watched The Thick Of It thinking it was an instruction video?

    We may have reached the point where the Tuckerverse would be an improvement on this.

    I'm bored of this. I'm going for a Twix.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 128,580
    SandyRentool said:

    williamglenn said:

    I’m surprised more isn’t being made of Robbins point that Mandelson’s STRAP clearance was given independently. Who approved that?

    There must be a strap-on joke in there somewhere, but I'm too lethargic to think of one.
    It has always amused me that the an anagram of 'strap-on' is 'no parts'.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 79,490
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    SandyRentool said:

    williamglenn said:

    I’m surprised more isn’t being made of Robbins point that Mandelson’s STRAP clearance was given independently. Who approved that?

    There must be a strap-on joke in there somewhere, but I'm too lethargic to think of one.
    It has always amused me that the an anagram of 'strap-on' is 'no parts'.
    Well, that doesn't work here. Lots of cockups and ample bollocks.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 128,580
    Anyhoo, I am now busy until circa 9pm.

    I am sure it will be a quiet period, I just know it.
  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,835
    ydoethur said:

    CatMan said:

    ydoethur said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Foss said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    FPT:

    Trump has - apparently, according to reports - been denied access to the nuclear codes by his generals... Yuuuuge if true.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEMEE6d7nHQ

    Is that not technically a coup? Not that I'm sad he can't throw a Grade A tantrum but...
    Apparently exercised a right that exists.
    It has been done twice before.

    However, on both occasions it was with Presidents in the last days in office who were so tonto that there was a real fear they would take the planet with them.*

    If true, is this perhaps a sign we are in the end game with Trump?

    *One of the two was Trump 1 after his attempted coup on Jan 6th. The other was Nixon in 1974.
    The only good thing Henry Kissinger ever did.
    Sorry, it was James Schlesinger.
    Oh really? So Kissinger doesn't even have *one* redeeming feature? Oh well.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 64,491
    SandyRentool said:

    williamglenn said:

    I’m surprised more isn’t being made of Robbins point that Mandelson’s STRAP clearance was given independently. Who approved that?

    There must be a strap-on joke in there somewhere, but I'm too lethargic to think of one.
    I was going to go with a Dominatrix one, but hey ho.
  • A_View_From_Cumbria5A_View_From_Cumbria5 Posts: 883
    The fact remains, as Fact Zero that all this is based upon that the desire to appoint Mandelson to any government sinecure fails the Wednesbury Reasonableness test. It was an unreasonable desire.

    All I see in what happened after that was rational people wondering how they could change the PM's mind. A sane person with the well-being of the UK at heart did not need vetting to see he should not be appointed.

    It will also be argued that Rachel Reeves was unfit to be Chancellor, true; that Lammy was unfit to be Foreign Secretary, true; that Rayner was unfit to head up local goverment etc etc.

    But to Starmer these are just name places and he needed to put these twanks somewhere. To that extent it was the same with Mandelson.

    I suspect it is related to his inability to see meaning in numbers.

    If I were PM I would make Truss DG of the BBC, what could possibly go wrong ?

  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 17,430
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    SandyRentool said:

    williamglenn said:

    I’m surprised more isn’t being made of Robbins point that Mandelson’s STRAP clearance was given independently. Who approved that?

    There must be a strap-on joke in there somewhere, but I'm too lethargic to think of one.
    It has always amused me that the an anagram of 'strap-on' is 'no parts'.
    A pedant notes that not only is it an anagram but it is also a multiple word anadrome.

  • Sweeney74Sweeney74 Posts: 635
    SandyRentool said:

    williamglenn said:

    I’m surprised more isn’t being made of Robbins point that Mandelson’s STRAP clearance was given independently. Who approved that?

    There must be a strap-on joke in there somewhere, but I'm too lethargic to think of one.
    As I said yesterday, the dildo of consequence rarely comes lubed.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 61,689
    Reports of a major incident on Moscow’s underground metro. Possibly a tunnel collapse.

    https://x.com/albafella1/status/2046572560649691200

    Keeping up with the maintenance I see…
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 13,450
    rottenborough said:

    (((Dan Hodges)))
    @DPJHodges
    ·
    20m
    Still trying get my head round the fact Keir Starmer has spent a week telling us all how furious he was to learn Mandelson failed vetting, when No.10 was actually trying to pack him off to Washington without any vetting at all.

    https://x.com/DPJHodges/status/2046585468095963257

    It was very simple.

    He didn’t want him vetted because he knew he would fail

    And the fact that he was vetted and failed created a problem for Sir Keir. So he was furious
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 36,352
    No-one posting updates from the Commons debate? No sign of the Labour front bench on the Labour front bench.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 17,376
    DecrepiterJohnL said:

    No-one posting updates from the Commons debate? No sign of the Labour front bench on the Labour front bench.

    A political photo journalist on X says all 4 big wigs are currently congregated in Number 10
  • Sweeney74Sweeney74 Posts: 635
    DecrepiterJohnL said:

    No-one posting updates from the Commons debate? No sign of the Labour front bench on the Labour front bench.

    we've not learned anything new
    should that change, I'm sure I won't be the only one to post it...
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,380
    Sweeney74 said:

    chortle

    I seem to recall that a cleaner gets verbally abused in an episode of The Thick of It and it is the one time Tucker is actually genuinely contrite or appalled - I forget exactly what happens.
  • isamisam Posts: 44,230
    squareroot2 said:

    isam said:

    Sir Keir Starmer has told his Cabinet that Olly Robbins was a 'man or integrity and professionalism' who made an 'error of judgement'

    “(He) concluded by saying that Sir Oliver Robbins made an error of judgment, but that he is a man of integrity and professionalism.

    “He said it is wrong that the current Cabinet Secretary and permanent secretary at the Cabinet Office had been attacked despite doing exactly the right thing and sharing the information with the Prime Minister once they had gone through the correct processes to do so.

    “He said that there are thousands of hard-working civil servants across the country who are full of integrity, doing excellent work every day.”

    https://x.com/steven_swinford/status/2046565360074125340?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q

    Intersting Starmer sacks Sir Olly Robbins for what he describes as an error of judgement.. but won't go when his massive error of judgement in appointing Mandelson is in the Public spotlight.. vetting or no vetting.. he should never have been appointed.
    Maybe he’s setting us up for the resignation of someone he wants to be thought of as a man of integrity
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 61,689
    Sweeney74 said:

    chortle

    Ouch! That one’s up there with Matt’s effort posted earlier.

    Horrific optics for the PM.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,380
    DecrepiterJohnL said:

    No-one posting updates from the Commons debate? No sign of the Labour front bench on the Labour front bench.

    Nic from Newsnight says no sign of whips.
  • scampi25scampi25 Posts: 581
    Maybe Starmer needs a bigger bus if he stays.....


    It's marvellous the way he drones on and on about responsibility, integrity and doing the right thing and is able to apply it to absolutely everything and everyone except himself. Of course it's pretty standard for the Labour party but he's taking it to a whole new level.
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 9,630
    rottenborough said:

    DecrepiterJohnL said:

    No-one posting updates from the Commons debate? No sign of the Labour front bench on the Labour front bench.

    Nic from Newsnight says no sign of whips.
    Well, that's something, I guess. The PLP wouldn't take kindly to that sort of violent intimidation.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 61,689
    rcs1000 said:

    Sandpit said:

    bondegezou said:

    Sandpit said:

    Stuartinromford said:

    Sandpit said:

    rkrkrk said:

    DavidL said:

    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Northern_Al said:

    So, on my (long) morning walk I listened to the entirety of Robbins' testimony, and I confess it's changed my mind somewhat. A few points:

    1. Robbins was deeply impressive, and don't let anybody tell you otherwise. His sacking is egregious, and he'd have a strong claim for unfair dismissal in normal circumstances. Notable that the head of the SCS Union (FDA) was perched behind him.

    2. Starmer made not one, but two, disastrous appointments: Mandelson and Morgan McSweeney. Many of Robbins' references to No.10 were, I think, more about McSweeney than Starmer. For example, it wouldn't surprise me if McSweeney was behind the (failed) push to find a job for Doyle.

    3. I now think Starmer is finished - not immediately, but in due course. He didn't have a grip, and allowed McSweeney far too much power, which he abused.

    And finally - the highlight for me was Robbins, when thanked yet again for giving up so much of his time, replying, not quite verbatim, 'not a problem at all, I've lots of time on my hands now'.

    Genuinely what was so impressive about him? Its all smacked of process, process, process, not my job to take responsbility, 1000 words not to ever answer a question directly. It was Yes Minister Live giving huge credence to Big Dom's criticisms of senior civil service mindset and tactics.
    The purpose of the hearing was technically to establish whether there were any other documents that fell within the Loyal Address that had not been disclosed which is why the chair ( also very impressive I thought) kept going back to that.

    Maybe I spend too much time with lawyers but I found his answers clear, concise and extremely informative. As I hinted the other day the question of whether M had clearance was much more nuanced than it was being presented.

    Having heard him I found myself persuaded that politicians, even the PM, should not know the details of the disclosures or concerns. That wasn’t my thinking at 8.45.
    I think its fair enough not to know the details, but to withold from the decisionmakers that the security services said "don't give this guy a security clearance" is absurd.
    That’s the sort of thing where you would expect the head of MI6 to turn up at No.10 with a personal briefing file for the PM.
    Though that rather feels like the "there's a secret door and the government ninjas are behind there" expectation.

    Consider the stuff that only came out in the Epstain email dump. Either MI6 knew about that and did nothing, or (more likely) they didn't know.

    (ETA: I considered altering the Epstein typo, but it felt so apposite that I left it in.)
    It would also be useful to know if, anywhere in the process of appointing Mandy, the Americans had been asked what they had on him?

    The revelations that led to his firing came from the US, so what else did they have?
    It isn’t usual, is it, to ask the country you’re sending an ambassador to if they have any dirt on him.
    Good question. I wouldn’t phrase it quite like that, but would expect a friendly nation to mention if they thought him unsuitable because of his links to unfriendly nations.
    It's worth noting that the Trump administration -pretty unusually- pushed back hard on Mandelson, because of his perceived closeness to the EU.

    Or at least, that was what we thought was the reason at the time...
    Well it’s true that the EU are paying him a pension from his time as an MEP.

    But that was the least of his problems!
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 27,862
    rottenborough said:

    Sweeney74 said:

    chortle

    I seem to recall that a cleaner gets verbally abused in an episode of The Thick of It and it is the one time Tucker is actually genuinely contrite or appalled - I forget exactly what happens.
    Ben Swain has a meltdown and calls her Mrs Mop. And yes, Tucker is very contrite.
  • eekeek Posts: 33,922
    edited April 21
    Mexicanpete said:

    There is an argument that suggests Starmer really should do an Amber Rudd and resign on principle.

    Starmer cocked up, Starmer should resign. I think I am more enraged by the knee -jerk sacking of Robbins than by the original appointment of Mandelson.

    Was it knee jerk or was Robbins the last remaining passenger on SKS's life raft.. SKS seems to have gone through more senior civil servants than any other PM..
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 59,879
    Sweeney74 said:

    chortle

    "The electorate sent me to Downing Street without giving me a plan, so I've taken the decision to update the process and for that error of judgement, the people must be held to account."
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 91,959
    eek said:

    Mexicanpete said:

    There is an argument that suggests Starmer really should do an Amber Rudd and resign on principle.

    Starmer cocked up, Starmer should resign. I think I am more enraged by the knee -jerk sacking of Robbins than by the original appointment of Mandelson.

    Was it knee jerk or was Robbins the last remaining passenger on SKS's life raft.. SKS seems to have gone through more senior civil servants than any other PM..
    Not just civil servants, comms people, really experienced ones like James Lyons, he was there 7 months I think.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 59,789
    rottenborough said:

    DecrepiterJohnL said:

    No-one posting updates from the Commons debate? No sign of the Labour front bench on the Labour front bench.

    Nic from Newsnight says no sign of whips.
    Isn't having to listen to SKS droning on punishment enough?
  • BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 10,060
    edited April 21
    I don't have the patience to continue watching this afternoon's performance in the HOC. It's boring.
    I doubt many people will watch and it will have little impact.
    The BBC are not picking any headlines out of it as far as I can see.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 91,959
    edited April 21
    Even Pie has had enough of Starmer.

    https://x.com/JonathanPieNews/status/2046600335641170053
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,815
    eek said:

    Mexicanpete said:

    There is an argument that suggests Starmer really should do an Amber Rudd and resign on principle.

    Starmer cocked up, Starmer should resign. I think I am more enraged by the knee -jerk sacking of Robbins than by the original appointment of Mandelson.

    Was it knee jerk or was Robbins the last remaining passenger on SKS's life raft.. SKS seems to have gone through more senior civil servants than any other PM..
    It certainly looks that way.

    Either way it's a damn poor look. Once again the cover up (the firing of Robbins) is worse than the original issue.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 23,257
    Not been following developments closely.

    Are we on lectern watch yet? :D
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 27,862
    GIN1138 said:

    Not been following developments closely.

    Are we on lectern watch yet? :D

    Starmer calling an election would be an interesting development.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 23,257
    tlg86 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Not been following developments closely.

    Are we on lectern watch yet? :D

    Starmer calling an election would be an interesting development.
    He might have a lectern to resign?
  • RobDRobD Posts: 61,134
    tlg86 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Not been following developments closely.

    Are we on lectern watch yet? :D

    Starmer calling an election would be an interesting development.
    Lectern watch followed by crest watch.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 8,323
    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Even Pie has had enough of Starmer.

    https://x.com/JonathanPieNews/status/2046600335641170053

    If he’s lost Pie he’s really screwed !
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,815
    tlg86 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Not been following developments closely.

    Are we on lectern watch yet? :D

    Starmer calling an election would be an interesting development.
    PB Tories getting well ahead of themselves here.

    Even Starmer isn't that useless, err...
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 23,704
    Northern_Al said:

    rottenborough said:

    DecrepiterJohnL said:

    No-one posting updates from the Commons debate? No sign of the Labour front bench on the Labour front bench.

    Nic from Newsnight says no sign of whips.
    Well, that's something, I guess. The PLP wouldn't take kindly to that sort of violent intimidation.
    Unless it was the IDF carrying it out

    LFVI is a splinter group of LFI!
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 23,704
    From Twitter

    Projected result for local elections:

    LE2026

    ➡️ Ref: 1,515 (+1,437)
    🟢 Grn: 1,096 (+926)
    🟠 Lib: 990 (+327)
    🔵 Con: 507 (-627)
    🔴 Lab: 458 (-1,738)
    ⚪️ Oth: 448 (-325)

    Median estimate via @Moreincommon_, April '26
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 91,959
    nico67 said:

    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Even Pie has had enough of Starmer.

    https://x.com/JonathanPieNews/status/2046600335641170053

    If he’s lost Pie he’s really screwed !
    Its quite an epic rant.....
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 59,879
    tlg86 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Not been following developments closely.

    Are we on lectern watch yet? :D

    Starmer calling an election would be an interesting development.
    He needs to change the narrative:

    "The issue of assisted dying has come to an impasse in Westminster so it is right that it be put to the people in a referendum."
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 91,959
    edited April 21
    Matthew Doyle says he never asked for a job in the Foreign Office

    “I have never sought any head of mission [or] ambassador posting. I was never aware of anyone speaking to the FCDO about such a role for me. My desire after leaving No 10 was to stay in UK politics”

    Another person who knew nothing...
  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,835
    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Matthew Doyle says he never asked for a job in the Foreign Office

    “I have never sought any head of mission [or] ambassador posting. I was never aware of anyone speaking to the FCDO about such a role for me. My desire after leaving No 10 was to stay in UK politics”

    Well there you are, Starmer is in the clear. Now we can all concentrate on the Strait of Hormuz 👺
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 24,225
    Sandpit said:

    Reports of a major incident on Moscow’s underground metro. Possibly a tunnel collapse.

    https://x.com/albafella1/status/2046572560649691200

    Keeping up with the maintenance I see…

    Blame it on Ukraine/NATO to justify a full mobilisation?
  • Wulfrun_PhilWulfrun_Phil Posts: 5,215
    edited April 21
    williamglenn said:

    Mexicanpete said:

    There is an argument that suggests Starmer really should do an Amber Rudd and resign on principle.

    Starmer cocked up, Starmer should resign. I think I am more enraged by the knee -jerk sacking of Robbins than by the original appointment of Mandelson.

    Having dug himself into a massive political hole, Starmer is taking out his anger on the person he thinks should have refused to give him a spade.
    Robbins comes out of this terribly.

    He claims that his decision to overrule UK Security Vetting to clear Mandelson had absolutely nothing to do with pressure from "No 10" (i.e. McSweeney), which no-one in their right mind would believe.

    It's bad enough that it's now established he failed to report through his decision to overrule the vetting through to anyone at No 10, but his brazen claim that that was for anything other than the obvious explanation is risible.

    He chose to do everything by private conversation and claims to have never actually read anything, which is also conveniently self serving because there is nothing there to prove he's lying.

    He claims to be confused as to whether or not Mandelson had actually been rejected, as opposed to approved subject to mitigation, when the reports we had previously were all pointing definitively to the former, so he's unconvincingly trying to muddy the waters to save his skin.

    Even worse, months later when the whole vetting process was subject to investigation by the Cabinet Secretary in the wake of Mandelson's sacking, he covered up his actions by still keeping everything under wraps.

    None of that means that Starmer comes out of things much better, even though his initial version of events has been vindicated. Starmer's judgement in wanting to appoint Mandelson was of course suspect. But much worse was his judgement in appointing McSweeney and allowing him to so dominate the political activity at No 10, to such an extent that you wonder whether Starmer was only PM in name.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 23,704
    Toast SKS is

    Rearrange


    https://x.com/casual_sadism/status/2046607558790578489/photo/1
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 56,857
    bigjohnowls said:

    From Twitter

    Projected result for local elections:

    LE2026

    ➡️ Ref: 1,515 (+1,437)
    🟢 Grn: 1,096 (+926)
    🟠 Lib: 990 (+327)
    🔵 Con: 507 (-627)
    🔴 Lab: 458 (-1,738)
    ⚪️ Oth: 448 (-325)

    Median estimate via @Moreincommon_, April '26

    An epic night for the Greens if true!

    I expect quite a lot of Independents too, of the Gaza variety.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 59,879
    https://x.com/thetimes/status/2046520608461115470

    Shabana Mahmood tells heckler to ‘f*** right off’ over Reform UK comments
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 23,704
    nico67 said:

    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Even Pie has had enough of Starmer.

    https://x.com/JonathanPieNews/status/2046600335641170053

    If he’s lost Pie he’s really screwed !
    3.1427% of PBers are still SKS Fans
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 23,704
    edited April 21
    bigjohnowls said:

    nico67 said:

    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Even Pie has had enough of Starmer.

    https://x.com/JonathanPieNews/status/2046600335641170053

    If he’s lost Pie he’s really screwed !
    3.1416% of PBers are still SKS Fans
    3.1416 ffs
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 25,463
    Foxy said:

    bigjohnowls said:

    From Twitter

    Projected result for local elections:

    LE2026

    ➡️ Ref: 1,515 (+1,437)
    🟢 Grn: 1,096 (+926)
    🟠 Lib: 990 (+327)
    🔵 Con: 507 (-627)
    🔴 Lab: 458 (-1,738)
    ⚪️ Oth: 448 (-325)

    Median estimate via @Moreincommon_, April '26

    An epic night for the Greens if true!

    I expect quite a lot of Independents too, of the Gaza variety.
    Plenty of those lads will be elected in Bradford.

    Could be a bun fight between them and Reform as to who runs the council.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,380
    Foxy said:

    bigjohnowls said:

    From Twitter

    Projected result for local elections:

    LE2026

    ➡️ Ref: 1,515 (+1,437)
    🟢 Grn: 1,096 (+926)
    🟠 Lib: 990 (+327)
    🔵 Con: 507 (-627)
    🔴 Lab: 458 (-1,738)
    ⚪️ Oth: 448 (-325)

    Median estimate via @Moreincommon_, April '26

    An epic night for the Greens if true!

    I expect quite a lot of Independents too, of the Gaza variety.
    Gonna be a hell of a lot of Green paper candidate winners if that is accurate.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 59,879
    https://x.com/danbloom1/status/2046608643735306751

    NEW: Morgan McSweeney has told POLITICO he did not call former Foreign Office chief Philip Barton directly, or swear at him, over the appointment of Peter Mandelson

    It comes after Emily Thornberry asked Olly Robbins if McSweeney had rung Barton to say "just fucking approve it"
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 61,689
    edited April 21
    FrancisUrquhart said:

    nico67 said:

    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Even Pie has had enough of Starmer.

    https://x.com/JonathanPieNews/status/2046600335641170053

    If he’s lost Pie he’s really screwed !
    Its quite an epic rant.....
    That’s Mark Kermode watching a crappy movie level of rant! “Slippery, disingenuous solicitor…”.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 23,704
    Foxy said:

    bigjohnowls said:

    From Twitter

    Projected result for local elections:

    LE2026

    ➡️ Ref: 1,515 (+1,437)
    🟢 Grn: 1,096 (+926)
    🟠 Lib: 990 (+327)
    🔵 Con: 507 (-627)
    🔴 Lab: 458 (-1,738)
    ⚪️ Oth: 448 (-325)

    Median estimate via @Moreincommon_, April '26

    An epic night for the Greens if true!

    I expect quite a lot of Independents too, of the Gaza variety.
    Yes I think they may get pipped by LDs personally but definitely see them getting more councillors than Con & Lab.

    On those numbers SKS could lead Lab to a respectable 6th!
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 79,490
    williamglenn said:

    https://x.com/danbloom1/status/2046608643735306751

    NEW: Morgan McSweeney has told POLITICO he did not call former Foreign Office chief Philip Barton directly, or swear at him, over the appointment of Peter Mandelson

    It comes after Emily Thornberry asked Olly Robbins if McSweeney had rung Barton to say "just fucking approve it"

    Is he a lying little fucker?

    Unlike Jenrick, who is a lying little Fukker?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 58,896
    algarkirk said:

    isam said:

    Sir Keir Starmer has told his Cabinet that Olly Robbins was a 'man or integrity and professionalism' who made an 'error of judgement'

    “(He) concluded by saying that Sir Oliver Robbins made an error of judgment, but that he is a man of integrity and professionalism.

    “He said it is wrong that the current Cabinet Secretary and permanent secretary at the Cabinet Office had been attacked despite doing exactly the right thing and sharing the information with the Prime Minister once they had gone through the correct processes to do so.

    “He said that there are thousands of hard-working civil servants across the country who are full of integrity, doing excellent work every day.”

    https://x.com/steven_swinford/status/2046565360074125340?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q

    Smoking gun:

    Starmer makes drastically wrong decision in appointing PeterM.

    Months later he learns that it is possible, though unlikely, that he could have been saved from making the wrong decision if he had taken the advice at the time and/or the FCO had blocked the decision for him.

    As a result the FCO bloke making at worst an 'error of judgment' but in fact trying to follow rules and to save Starmer from himself and his own folly gets the sack.

    Starmer still in his job with gun smoking.

    Starmer of course accepts responsibility. As the person responsible it is, as in several cases in the past, for him to take responsibility and select the person who is to be sacked for the error. Which is not himself. Of course.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 24,225
    Foxy said:

    bigjohnowls said:

    From Twitter

    Projected result for local elections:

    LE2026

    ➡️ Ref: 1,515 (+1,437)
    🟢 Grn: 1,096 (+926)
    🟠 Lib: 990 (+327)
    🔵 Con: 507 (-627)
    🔴 Lab: 458 (-1,738)
    ⚪️ Oth: 448 (-325)

    Median estimate via @Moreincommon_, April '26

    An epic night for the Greens if true!

    I expect quite a lot of Independents too, of the Gaza variety.
    I think that's the most optimistic for the Greens/pessimistic for Reform prediction that has been made. Perhaps due to the changes in the polls for both parties recently.

    Rounds to some nice easy to remember numbers. 1,500 for Reform, 1,000 each for Greens/Lib Dems, Tories and Labour battling for fourth on around 500.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 36,352
    Sandpit said:

    Reports of a major incident on Moscow’s underground metro. Possibly a tunnel collapse.

    https://x.com/albafella1/status/2046572560649691200

    Keeping up with the maintenance I see…

    Sokolnicheskaya metro line restored in Moscow
    https://iz.ru/en/node/2082824

    Train malfunction caused a lot of smoke, or something.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 61,689
    LostPassword said:

    Sandpit said:

    Reports of a major incident on Moscow’s underground metro. Possibly a tunnel collapse.

    https://x.com/albafella1/status/2046572560649691200

    Keeping up with the maintenance I see…

    Blame it on Ukraine/NATO to justify a full mobilisation?
    That has to be a worry.
  • eekeek Posts: 33,922
    Sandpit said:

    LostPassword said:

    Sandpit said:

    Reports of a major incident on Moscow’s underground metro. Possibly a tunnel collapse.

    https://x.com/albafella1/status/2046572560649691200

    Keeping up with the maintenance I see…

    Blame it on Ukraine/NATO to justify a full mobilisation?
    That has to be a worry.
    Except reports are it was a train derailment and everything is back to normal
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 9,239
    Foxy said:

    bigjohnowls said:

    From Twitter

    Projected result for local elections:

    LE2026

    ➡️ Ref: 1,515 (+1,437)
    🟢 Grn: 1,096 (+926)
    🟠 Lib: 990 (+327)
    🔵 Con: 507 (-627)
    🔴 Lab: 458 (-1,738)
    ⚪️ Oth: 448 (-325)

    Median estimate via @Moreincommon_, April '26

    An epic night for the Greens if true!

    I expect quite a lot of Independents too, of the Gaza variety.
    Me too. Which is why those "other" changes look a bit dodgy.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 37,433
    edited April 21
    carnforth said:

    Foxy said:

    bigjohnowls said:

    From Twitter

    Projected result for local elections:

    LE2026

    ➡️ Ref: 1,515 (+1,437)
    🟢 Grn: 1,096 (+926)
    🟠 Lib: 990 (+327)
    🔵 Con: 507 (-627)
    🔴 Lab: 458 (-1,738)
    ⚪️ Oth: 448 (-325)

    Median estimate via @Moreincommon_, April '26

    An epic night for the Greens if true!

    I expect quite a lot of Independents too, of the Gaza variety.
    Me too. Which is why those "other" changes look a bit dodgy.
    I fail to understand how being supportive of the poor people of Gaza qualifies one to deal with rubbish collection in an English city. Being Green yes, I quite understand, and indeed will almost certainly vote for them, the LibDems being invisible here.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 59,789
    bigjohnowls said:

    Toast SKS is

    Rearrange


    https://x.com/casual_sadism/status/2046607558790578489/photo/1

    SKSITIPM.
This discussion has been closed.

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