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The nihilism of the Greens and Reform voters – politicalbetting.com

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  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 38,312
    edited 1:02PM

    Reeves explaining why she will not do universal energy bail-out

    The irony is Starmer demanded it from the conservatives so utter hypocrisy
    Where are we supposed to find all this magic money?

    One of the reasons we are up the creek without a paddle is Johnson "spaffed money (we didn't have) up the wall".
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 28,294

    Can somebody explain how if you plug a solar panel into your plug socket energy goes back into the grid? Does that just work somehow?

    Is anyone saying it does?

    Seems to me this is small-scale, so would reduce your demand, but would not necessarily go back to the grid.

    Simply based on MattW's description of it.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 60,703

    Selebian said:

    carnforth said:

    Selebian said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "An episode of the BBC’s The Repair Shop was pulled after a TV production worker objected to a “sexist” Bob Monkhouse joke.

    The late comedian and presenter’s famous joke books had been brought into the studio for repair by Colin Edmonds, his former comedy partner, and Abigail Williams, his adopted daughter.

    The restoration of the books was to be filmed at the show’s barn in Singleton, West Sussex, for a special tribute programme, to be aired this year.

    However, a member of Ricochet, the production company that makes Repair Shop, complained about one of Monkhouse’s jokes, claiming it was sexist. Corporation bosses then decided to pull the segment."

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2026/03/24/bob-monkhouse-repair-shop-bbc-axed-episode/

    Hard to judge without more (I've skimmed the article). What was the joke? Could the joke be pulled and still keep the show (or did the family/partner object to that?). Were there so many jokes that can't be broadcast now (perhaps could never have been broadcast if this was live material) that it wasn't viable to do the show at all?
    Article implies the employee simply found the joke looking through the books... no suggestion it was to be broadcast.

    "A production employee stumbled across a joke – no doubt written in the 1960s – and took offence, believing it to be sexist.

    They flagged the problem, and a ‘collective decision’ was made to cull the whole thing."
    I didn't read it that way. Seems crazy if if that's the case.
    When the original ammunition buying team in the MOD was disbanded, one of the reasons was that a young civil servant, seconded to the team, had been grossly offended.

    By the images of the effects of projectiles.

    Which made it a hostile workplace.
    To be replaced by a bunch of the junior CS who couldn’t tell the difference between a 120mm and a 155mm round. Oh, and that big guns kill people by design.
  • Wulfrun_PhilWulfrun_Phil Posts: 4,966

    Reeves explaining why she will not do universal energy bail-out

    The irony is Starmer demanded it from the conservatives so utter hypocrisy
    No it's not. At that point, the Conservatives hadn't quite completed their entirely successful mission to bankrupt the UK economy, and while they were well on the way to that goal they were very successful in hiding the extent of their achievement until they left office. The consequence is that there's nothing left now for a further universal bail out.

    I agree with Reeves that what support can be given now should now be targeted.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 70,835

    Can somebody explain how if you plug a solar panel into your plug socket energy goes back into the grid? Does that just work somehow?

    As I understand it it doesn't - it supports your own consumption
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 22,870

    Can somebody explain how if you plug a solar panel into your plug socket energy goes back into the grid? Does that just work somehow?

    Electrical flow is reversible.
    So if I got a generator right now and plugged it into the wall, electricity would just go into the grid?
    One of the issues with, for example, using a battery at home as a back-up in case of the grid going down is that you can send electricity back into the grid, and so make the wires that have come down live, even if it's been isolated form the rest of the grid. This can make it very dangerous for people to fix the grid, and so a home battery installation will either be made not to work in the case that the grid goes down, or you will have an island switch, to isolate your house from the grid when you're using the battery.

    Generally speaking I think generators are built so that you plug things into them, rather than plugging them into the sockets, perhaps for this reason, so that you can't put power directly into the grid and electrocute people trying to fix it. I know my father-in-law has a generator rigged up that can power the whole house if the grid connection fails, but he did all the wiring on the house when it was built, so he knows enough to have a switch to isolate it from the grid when it's running off the generator.

    I don't know how these plug-in solar panel systems prevent the electricity generated from travelling onto the grid in the same scenario, though I guess you could have some chip that was capable of detecting when the grid was down and turning it off in that circumstance.
  • BattlebusBattlebus Posts: 2,766

    Can somebody explain how if you plug a solar panel into your plug socket energy goes back into the grid? Does that just work somehow?

    Electrical flow is reversible.
    The key there is 'flow' (alongside electrical pressure). All that happens is the co-mingling of different power sources e.g. panels, batteries and grid with the grid topping up what the other sources don't provide for the total load you are using.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 60,703

    Can somebody explain how if you plug a solar panel into your plug socket energy goes back into the grid? Does that just work somehow?

    As I understand it it doesn't - it supports your own consumption
    Actually feeding back into the grid requires a complex and expensive switching mechanism - which needs the grid to be there. The vast majority of these systems can’t supply the house when there’s no grid connection because of frequency clashes. Anything that can feed the grid needs to fail with the grid, otherwise line workers might have power to the wires when it’s supposed to be down.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 13,778
    Rejecting nodal/regional pricing then doing this trial is ridiculous. Wtf are they up to.

    JUST DO IT.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 22,361
    algarkirk said:

    carnforth said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "An episode of the BBC’s The Repair Shop was pulled after a TV production worker objected to a “sexist” Bob Monkhouse joke.

    The late comedian and presenter’s famous joke books had been brought into the studio for repair by Colin Edmonds, his former comedy partner, and Abigail Williams, his adopted daughter.

    The restoration of the books was to be filmed at the show’s barn in Singleton, West Sussex, for a special tribute programme, to be aired this year.

    However, a member of Ricochet, the production company that makes Repair Shop, complained about one of Monkhouse’s jokes, claiming it was sexist. Corporation bosses then decided to pull the segment."

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2026/03/24/bob-monkhouse-repair-shop-bbc-axed-episode/

    We have forgotten how to say No.
    What was the joke? ISTR he did a fair number of mother-in-law jokes...
    Has Oedipus been cancelled yet?

    We're becoming more prudish than the Victorians.
    Does anyone among the censors actually look carefully at the text of Romeo and Juliet and what is actually going on, and at what age?

    See, for instance, Family Guy for this!
  • LeonLeon Posts: 67,269
    kinabalu said:

    My mother in law is so fat that 6 smaller mothers in law orbit her

    Wouldn't hear that sort of gag at a Stewart Lee show (unless delivered ironically as a joke on the joke itself). I went to see him recently (first time) and he is very skillful. You get plenty of laughs but - key point - all the time you are laughing up not down and you know everyone else is too because they share the same sensibility. Nothing smug about it, it's just an uplifting communal experience that you feel better for being intelligent and enlightened enough to be a part of.
    I just vomited
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 21,959

    Can somebody explain how if you plug a solar panel into your plug socket energy goes back into the grid? Does that just work somehow?

    Is anyone saying it does?

    Seems to me this is small-scale, so would reduce your demand, but would not necessarily go back to the grid.

    Simply based on MattW's description of it.
    It's all part of one big circuit, so I think that if you generated more than you consumed, that would just spill out to feed your neighbours.

    However, once you have panels, you tend to get good at aligning the times you use electricity with when you are generating your own, and the amounts produced by balcony panels won't be huge. So it's unlikely to be much of an issue.

    I suspect that one of the things that keeps the cost down is not worrying about managing generation payments. "Too cheap to meter", as optimists used to say of nuclear.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 70,835

    Reeves explaining why she will not do universal energy bail-out

    The irony is Starmer demanded it from the conservatives so utter hypocrisy
    Where are we supposed to find all this magic money?

    One of the reasons we are up the creek without a paddle is Johnson "spaffed money (we didn't have) up the wall".
    I am not saying it shouldn't be targeted and there has just been a grown up debate between Jeremy Hunt and Reeves over this and it is clear it has to be targeted

    The hypocrisy is Starmer demanding universal benefits as well as Reeves previously but now in facing the reality
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 38,312
    edited 1:15PM
    algarkirk said:

    algarkirk said:

    algarkirk said:

    Roger said:

    Putting as much distance as possible between himself and Trump/Netanyahu is the gift that will keep on giving.

    Badenoch had her chance but backed the wrong horse and Farage will always be seen as Trumps best buddy

    Zack and Davey too but the market leader always benefits disproportionately and that can only be Starmer. Is it possible Labour could take the lead? I wouldn't rule it out. Trump is way beyond insane and Netanyahu is genuinely evil.

    https://x.com/joecguinan/status/2036248591111438748

    The British media have entirely invented a stand-his-ground Keir Starmer that bears zero relation to reality. He tried to give Trump access to the bases, the cabinet blocked him, then he invented a legal fig leaf and access was granted. This stuff is professional malpractice.
    Is this the same British media that have propelled Farage to the brink of government with absolutely no scrutiny whatsoever?

    You are right they are a bunch of Charlatans.
    The 'British media' reference seems to me flawed in two ways. Firstly, whatever this media are doing only about a quarter of voters plan to support them. The other 75% seem immune to this media thingy. Secondly, I am a consumer of British media, including: BBC, ITV, Ch 4, LBC, Times Radio, Guardian, Economist, New Statesman, Private Eye, and use PB to link to a multitude of stuff.

    I almost never see/hear anything at all giving reasoned, or even unreasoned, support to Reform. If you take out the Express, Mail, GB News, which most people don't read/see, who are these people bringing Farage to the dizzy heights of 27%?

    You may not have come across this organisation and their Political Editor. This chap is very enthusiastic after the Reform Conference.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c62zdpke8kko
    Strongly disagree with what you imply.

    Mason is giving neither reasoned nor unreasoned support for Reform. He is reflecting a particular moment of heightened Reform mania, telling it how the vibes feel in September 2025 at a point, now over, when they were getting double digit leads quite often. He correctly identifies how this phenomenon may be hard to sustain, draws attention to the problems they have associating with loonies and draws attention to the professional populism of the whole thing. Not a single word is in favour of any Reform policy or politics.

    The thought that in any general sense the BBC is lending sustenance to Reform is completely bizarre. They are properly giving this ghastly collection of chancers the coverage due to their polling lead and place in the political realm.

    On issues central to Reform like Islamification, the BBC, if anything, underplays the nature of the societal and cultural difficulties Reform are trying to play on.

    You are starting from the perspective that the BBC are a bunch of sandal wearing Zack Polanski groupies. Thirty years ago that may have been almost true. It certainly isn't now.

    Farage is currently boycotting the BBC (an odd kind of a boycott because he is still never off the BBC) because he has cried foul, in much the same way he is critical of YouGov because they aren't fully on board with his narrative and every whim. There was a point when he was on QT almost every as often as Fiona Bruce. And that is just the BBC. They are not deliberately promoting Farage but they are promoting the idea of a future story, namely Farage is PM in waiting.

    Now GB News on the other hand do nothing more than blow smoke up Farage's fundament.
    Thanks. The bit I have italicised is simply 100% evidence free and incorrect.

    The BBC is a public service broadcaster. Farage and Reform really might overturn a century of political assumptions and take over the country in the name of populist grubby chancers. Farage truly is a PM in waiting, as you suggest. This is news box office. The BBC does news.

    To cover this neutrally when they are the most popular party in the UK and at the same time full of chancers and bogus impossible and inconsistent policies is hard. Like trying to be 'fair' when covering Trump, when the idea of 'fair' or 'neutral' feels a category error.

    On the whole the BBC does well. It is a lot more boring than other outlets, which loses it market share. That is because of its remit. Facts are often boring. Opinions are interesting. The BBC doesn't do opinion.

    "Farage is PM in waiting" is not fact it is conjecture. It becomes a self fulfilling prophesy when you can't move for the gurning twat popping up in TV and Radio studios across the country.

    Some people at the BBC avoid opinion. As many again don't.

    https://metro.co.uk/2024/02/05/laura-kuenssbergs-bias-finally-addressed-bbc-huge-backlash-20227929/

    https://youtu.be/boBVtiUxgLE?si=06hJ3I4AEF7TQXmY
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 22,361

    Migration is as far as I can see now going to be about illegal only as Labour will likely announce they’ve reduced it a lot by the end of their term.

    Have the boats stopped? No. Are the gangs smashed? No evidence. I'm not saying that there was no plan on how to achieve this before government, but there weren't any plans for anything else, so you can make your own deductions.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 22,870
    Battlebus said:

    Can somebody explain how if you plug a solar panel into your plug socket energy goes back into the grid? Does that just work somehow?

    Electrical flow is reversible.
    The key there is 'flow' (alongside electrical pressure). All that happens is the co-mingling of different power sources e.g. panels, batteries and grid with the grid topping up what the other sources don't provide for the total load you are using.
    So MattW states that in Germany these are limited to 800W. That's not much energy when you have the kettle on, but if you are out for the day and the only electricity being used in the house is for appliances on standby, and the fridge, then I'd have thought there would be an excess that would find its way onto the local grid.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 49,657
    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    My mother in law is so fat that 6 smaller mothers in law orbit her

    Wouldn't hear that sort of gag at a Stewart Lee show (unless delivered ironically as a joke on the joke itself). I went to see him recently (first time) and he is very skillful. You get plenty of laughs but - key point - all the time you are laughing up not down and you know everyone else is too because they share the same sensibility. Nothing smug about it, it's just an uplifting communal experience that you feel better for being intelligent and enlightened enough to be a part of.
    I just vomited
    But did you vomit up or down?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 67,269
    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    My mother in law is so fat that 6 smaller mothers in law orbit her

    Wouldn't hear that sort of gag at a Stewart Lee show (unless delivered ironically as a joke on the joke itself). I went to see him recently (first time) and he is very skillful. You get plenty of laughs but - key point - all the time you are laughing up not down and you know everyone else is too because they share the same sensibility. Nothing smug about it, it's just an uplifting communal experience that you feel better for being intelligent and enlightened enough to be a part of.
    I just vomited
    But did you vomit up or down?
    I was going through Gillingham at the time, so I’m not sure it matters
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 35,461
    Why Skilled Trade Jobs Go Unfilled
    https://www.youtube.com/shorts/DfD9AHwG4_M

    70 seconds clip c/o Wall Street Journal; strangely relevant to this thread.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 58,423
    Matt Goodwin vs Tim Montgomerie:

    https://x.com/GoodwinMJ/status/2036420501522763839

    What Reform should do is stop taking Tory Wets like you. I've responded to my critics here (https://x.com/GoodwinMJ/status/2036048564258779341). All you do is criticise Reform & our campaigns. I have no idea why you are even in Reform unless it is to try and weaken it?
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 16,897
    Sean_F said:

    algarkirk said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    The Greens and Reform are underrepresented on PB. The header explains why. Greens and Reform are the parties for people with few assets and little chance of obtaining them. Most on here have plenty of assets and are happy to keep them, if necessary at the expense of those without. The term that used to be used for us was boomers. A few, such as @OldKingCole, @Foxy and @NickPalmer think of the wider population, and are those at least considering the Greens. Probably not coincidentally, they are posters that seem to take more interest in the views of their families.

    The data in the header doesn't indicate that Reform voters are unusually poor. 41% of them are financially comfortable compared to the 43% in the general population who are. That's not very different. But point taken re PBers. We are mainly top quartile (at least) in wealth. Least that's my impression.

    I wonder how they assessed 'financially comfortable' btw. I wouldn't totally trust a self-select on that. People tend to shy away from saying that about themselves.
    Nicking a line from Steven J Gould, The Median is not The Message. That's especially true for Farage Followers. Some are the properly Left Behind, and it's a blot on the records of all governments in my lifetime how much that was just allowed to happen. But very many are extremely comfortable materially, and their discontent is more cultural. Some of that is just that they're getting old, and the cultural caravan is moving on without them. Some of it is not liking the conseqences of their votes and personal spending decisions. (Yes, your High Street is crumbling, but that's mostly because you have spent years not buying things there.)

    The first group were often historically non-voters, and who can blame them? The second tend to cluster in the posher bits of unposh areas. How you analyse those is a problem for analysts. How you simultaneously please them both is a problem for all the Reform councillors about to be elected.
    That's an interesting analysis. The core sentiment fuelling the Populist Right is anti-immigration imo. Farage has to own that 'want our country back' vote. He can't have them drifting off to the likes of Rupert Lowe. If that happens he can't win. But neither can he win with just those votes - so he has to try and appeal wider whilst not diluting his USP. All the while getting older and more scrutinised/exposed. It's a massive ask and I don't think he'll manage it. But if he does, like you say, he'll have a virtually impossible task meeting the aspirations of the peculiar voter coalition he'll have managed to assemble.
    Agree. Anti migration may well be the core sentiment of the populist right, but it hits the difficulty that the migration they are anti has already occurred, and cannot without full fat fascism be undone. Dim people have not spotted this. (Like people think that getting to net zero CO2 somehow solves a problem.) The fascist tendency spotted it ages ago. The great majority of people would find it unacceptable to the millionth degree.

    The populist right has sentiments, it also has unexpressed assumptions. Right at the top of these is the assumption of continuation, for oneself and therefore for all, of the social democratic post WWII welfare state. My guess is that Reform voters are more than averagely reliant on free NHS, state pensions, welfare safety nets, free education etc. which means of course that Reform's voters are deeply committed to high spend, therefore high tax, government.

    So Reform's aspirations cannot possibly be met.

    Under First Past the Post, Reform only have to beat the Conservatives once, in a general election, to consign them to the same fate as the Liberals, after 1924. And, what we're going to see in May, is big headline losses for the Conservatives, as well as Labour, and big headline gains for Reform. That reinforces the notion that a Conservative vote is a wasted vote, for Right of Centre voters.

    Achieve that, and in subsequent elections, the Right of Centre vote goes Reform by default.
    This is quite possible, but looking beyond May is problematic, and I feel uncertain about how May is going to go for Reform anyway. Could they slightly underperform? Anyway, in May there won't be a vast tactical voting exercise on a national scale.

    But in 2029, unless something changes, there will. And 2029 will be Reform's one chance to win under Farage. Never again. I agree that in 2029 a Tory vote will be seen as usually a wasted vote. But like Labour they have a baseline they won't go below. That does not mean Reform will win.

    There is a high chance that the biggest single issue in 2029 will be 'Stop Reform'. The lower the Tory vote goes, the more the Left Of Centre vote goes tactically to beat Reform. As long as 'Stop Reform' beats 'Anyone But Labour' as the voters' slogan then Reform can't win. As the Tories can't win, the Left Of Centre will win. They hold 50% of the votes and will use them to stop Reform.

    As to after 2029 and the Tories, no idea. Reform might collapse in a heap.

    For young political people willing to gamble, the Tories would be a long shot to join but could have a decent payoff.

    The actual results, seats or votes, in May will tell us almost nothing about 2029, except telling us a bit more about the state of Reform. But we know most of it already.

  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 39,612
    Dura_Ace said:

    kinabalu said:

    The Greens and Reform are underrepresented on PB. The header explains why. Greens and Reform are the parties for people with few assets and little chance of obtaining them. Most on here have plenty of assets and are happy to keep them, if necessary at the expense of those without. The term that used to be used for us was boomers. A few, such as @OldKingCole, @Foxy and @NickPalmer think of the wider population, and are those at least considering the Greens. Probably not coincidentally, they are posters that seem to take more interest in the views of their families.

    The data in the header doesn't indicate that Reform voters are unusually poor. 41% of them are financially comfortable compared to the 43% in the general population who are. That's not very different. But point taken re PBers. We are mainly top quartile (at least) in wealth. Least that's my impression.

    I wonder how they assessed 'financially comfortable' btw. I wouldn't totally trust a self-select on that. People tend to shy away from saying that about themselves.
    Nicking a line from Steven J Gould, The Median is not The Message. That's especially true for Farage Followers. Some are the properly Left Behind, and it's a blot on the records of all governments in my lifetime how much that was just allowed to happen. But very many are extremely comfortable materially, and their discontent is more cultural. Some of that is just that they're getting old, and the cultural caravan is moving on without them. Some of it is not liking the conseqences of their votes and personal spending decisions. (Yes, your High Street is crumbling, but that's mostly because you have spent years not buying things there.)

    The first group were often historically non-voters, and who can blame them? The second tend to cluster in the posher bits of unposh areas. How you analyse those is a problem for analysts. How you simultaneously please them both is a problem for all the Reform councillors about to be elected.
    Farage-ism like the Zhadovshchina it apes in many ways, is an intellectual dead end.

    Even if they fluke an election win, which would be funny, then what? We've seen the Fukkers in action in local government now and have an idea how it will go when reality is more complicated and intractable than a Facebook post.
    In local government they haven't been able to put their policies into action because of national policies.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 49,657
    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    My mother in law is so fat that 6 smaller mothers in law orbit her

    Wouldn't hear that sort of gag at a Stewart Lee show (unless delivered ironically as a joke on the joke itself). I went to see him recently (first time) and he is very skillful. You get plenty of laughs but - key point - all the time you are laughing up not down and you know everyone else is too because they share the same sensibility. Nothing smug about it, it's just an uplifting communal experience that you feel better for being intelligent and enlightened enough to be a part of.
    I just vomited
    But did you vomit up or down?
    I was going through Gillingham at the time, so I’m not sure it matters
    Ah ok. Enough said.

    Anyway that was me sending up myself and ilk so it ought to have got an appreciative 'lol' not a 'just vomited' from you and ilk.

    I am wasted on a reactionary right wing audience.
  • MelonBMelonB Posts: 16,929

    Battlebus said:

    Can somebody explain how if you plug a solar panel into your plug socket energy goes back into the grid? Does that just work somehow?

    Electrical flow is reversible.
    The key there is 'flow' (alongside electrical pressure). All that happens is the co-mingling of different power sources e.g. panels, batteries and grid with the grid topping up what the other sources don't provide for the total load you are using.
    So MattW states that in Germany these are limited to 800W. That's not much energy when you have the kettle on, but if you are out for the day and the only electricity being used in the house is for appliances on standby, and the fridge, then I'd have thought there would be an excess that would find its way onto the local grid.
    I’m wondering about using plug-in to supplement an installed solar array. We’re getting solar put in this month at home, and we had it in France last year. Chucking up a couple more plug and play panels on the patio seems like a good idea.

    Other thing I’m looking at is a cheap solar-thermal water heater for a swimming pool, if we get one fitted in France. Heating a pool is ruinously expensive but having a trickle of warm water on sunny days should raise the temperature a few degrees, for virtually free.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 67,269
    The Telegraph is reporting that HMG wants to reintroduce 76 EU laws. Normally I’d be outraged at this suggestion but on the list I notice

    “47. TSE prevention and control “

    This seems like a thoroughly good idea so I am now all in favour

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/03/24/keir-starmer-to-bring-back-76-eu-laws-kings-speech/
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 47,195

    Matt Goodwin vs Tim Montgomerie:

    https://x.com/GoodwinMJ/status/2036420501522763839

    What Reform should do is stop taking Tory Wets like you. I've responded to my critics here (https://x.com/GoodwinMJ/status/2036048564258779341). All you do is criticise Reform & our campaigns. I have no idea why you are even in Reform unless it is to try and weaken it?

    Matt is in his comfort zone, bickering on twitter. Much nicer than trying to persuade people to vote for him.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 67,269
    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    My mother in law is so fat that 6 smaller mothers in law orbit her

    Wouldn't hear that sort of gag at a Stewart Lee show (unless delivered ironically as a joke on the joke itself). I went to see him recently (first time) and he is very skillful. You get plenty of laughs but - key point - all the time you are laughing up not down and you know everyone else is too because they share the same sensibility. Nothing smug about it, it's just an uplifting communal experience that you feel better for being intelligent and enlightened enough to be a part of.
    I just vomited
    But did you vomit up or down?
    I was going through Gillingham at the time, so I’m not sure it matters
    Ah ok. Enough said.

    Anyway that was me sending up myself and ilk so it ought to have got an appreciative 'lol' not a 'just vomited' from you and ilk.

    I am wasted on a reactionary right wing audience.
    I did detect the self deprecation but nonetheless also an element of truth telling. Hence the nausea
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 70,835
    edited 1:38PM
    Listening to the Reeves debate and scanning the news media across politics about what is really going on in the war, looking at the markets and bond rates today, I am not sure anybody wants to take on board how badly this may play out
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 16,857
    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    My mother in law is so fat that 6 smaller mothers in law orbit her

    Wouldn't hear that sort of gag at a Stewart Lee show (unless delivered ironically as a joke on the joke itself). I went to see him recently (first time) and he is very skillful. You get plenty of laughs but - key point - all the time you are laughing up not down and you know everyone else is too because they share the same sensibility. Nothing smug about it, it's just an uplifting communal experience that you feel better for being intelligent and enlightened enough to be a part of.
    I just vomited
    But did you vomit up or down?
    I was going through Gillingham at the time, so I’m not sure it matters
    Ah ok. Enough said.

    Anyway that was me sending up myself and ilk so it ought to have got an appreciative 'lol' not a 'just vomited' from you and ilk.

    I am wasted on a reactionary right wing audience.
    Paul Nuttall of the UKIPs would be horrified
  • Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 6,094
    Leon said:

    The Telegraph is reporting that HMG wants to reintroduce 76 EU laws. Normally I’d be outraged at this suggestion but on the list I notice

    “47. TSE prevention and control “

    This seems like a thoroughly good idea so I am now all in favour

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/03/24/keir-starmer-to-bring-back-76-eu-laws-kings-speech/

    First, they come for the shoes.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 58,423
    https://x.com/FT/status/2036430960598598009

    Hedge fund Millennium explores shifting Dubai staff to Jersey
  • TazTaz Posts: 26,227
    Andy_JS said:

    "An episode of the BBC’s The Repair Shop was pulled after a TV production worker objected to a “sexist” Bob Monkhouse joke.

    The late comedian and presenter’s famous joke books had been brought into the studio for repair by Colin Edmonds, his former comedy partner, and Abigail Williams, his adopted daughter.

    The restoration of the books was to be filmed at the show’s barn in Singleton, West Sussex, for a special tribute programme, to be aired this year.

    However, a member of Ricochet, the production company that makes Repair Shop, complained about one of Monkhouse’s jokes, claiming it was sexist. Corporation bosses then decided to pull the segment."

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2026/03/24/bob-monkhouse-repair-shop-bbc-axed-episode/

    Utterly pathetic.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 16,857
    Pro_Rata said:

    Leon said:

    The Telegraph is reporting that HMG wants to reintroduce 76 EU laws. Normally I’d be outraged at this suggestion but on the list I notice

    “47. TSE prevention and control “

    This seems like a thoroughly good idea so I am now all in favour

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/03/24/keir-starmer-to-bring-back-76-eu-laws-kings-speech/

    First, they come for the shoes.
    They took all of his Hi Techs and the high end Gola.
    Hes nothing now
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 8,538
    I reserve the vomit for when Roger says 'urbane' - sorry Kinabalu, but no dice.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 87,495

    Battlebus said:

    Can somebody explain how if you plug a solar panel into your plug socket energy goes back into the grid? Does that just work somehow?

    Electrical flow is reversible.
    The key there is 'flow' (alongside electrical pressure). All that happens is the co-mingling of different power sources e.g. panels, batteries and grid with the grid topping up what the other sources don't provide for the total load you are using.
    So MattW states that in Germany these are limited to 800W. That's not much energy when you have the kettle on, but if you are out for the day and the only electricity being used in the house is for appliances on standby, and the fridge, then I'd have thought there would be an excess that would find its way onto the local grid.
    Potential problems start to crop up as the amount generated by home solar systems increases.
    A single panel is fairly immune from any of that.

    As the amount you can generate increases (unless it's completely off grid), the procedures needed to connect into the supply become more complicated (under 3.68kW doesn't trouble anyone much).
    Details are here, I think:
    https://www.energynetworks.org/assets/images/Resource library/G99 Type A Final 2020.pdf
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 16,897

    algarkirk said:

    algarkirk said:

    algarkirk said:

    Roger said:

    Putting as much distance as possible between himself and Trump/Netanyahu is the gift that will keep on giving.

    Badenoch had her chance but backed the wrong horse and Farage will always be seen as Trumps best buddy

    Zack and Davey too but the market leader always benefits disproportionately and that can only be Starmer. Is it possible Labour could take the lead? I wouldn't rule it out. Trump is way beyond insane and Netanyahu is genuinely evil.

    https://x.com/joecguinan/status/2036248591111438748

    The British media have entirely invented a stand-his-ground Keir Starmer that bears zero relation to reality. He tried to give Trump access to the bases, the cabinet blocked him, then he invented a legal fig leaf and access was granted. This stuff is professional malpractice.
    Is this the same British media that have propelled Farage to the brink of government with absolutely no scrutiny whatsoever?

    You are right they are a bunch of Charlatans.
    The 'British media' reference seems to me flawed in two ways. Firstly, whatever this media are doing only about a quarter of voters plan to support them. The other 75% seem immune to this media thingy. Secondly, I am a consumer of British media, including: BBC, ITV, Ch 4, LBC, Times Radio, Guardian, Economist, New Statesman, Private Eye, and use PB to link to a multitude of stuff.

    I almost never see/hear anything at all giving reasoned, or even unreasoned, support to Reform. If you take out the Express, Mail, GB News, which most people don't read/see, who are these people bringing Farage to the dizzy heights of 27%?

    You may not have come across this organisation and their Political Editor. This chap is very enthusiastic after the Reform Conference.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c62zdpke8kko
    Strongly disagree with what you imply.

    Mason is giving neither reasoned nor unreasoned support for Reform. He is reflecting a particular moment of heightened Reform mania, telling it how the vibes feel in September 2025 at a point, now over, when they were getting double digit leads quite often. He correctly identifies how this phenomenon may be hard to sustain, draws attention to the problems they have associating with loonies and draws attention to the professional populism of the whole thing. Not a single word is in favour of any Reform policy or politics.

    The thought that in any general sense the BBC is lending sustenance to Reform is completely bizarre. They are properly giving this ghastly collection of chancers the coverage due to their polling lead and place in the political realm.

    On issues central to Reform like Islamification, the BBC, if anything, underplays the nature of the societal and cultural difficulties Reform are trying to play on.

    You are starting from the perspective that the BBC are a bunch of sandal wearing Zack Polanski groupies. Thirty years ago that may have been almost true. It certainly isn't now.

    Farage is currently boycotting the BBC (an odd kind of a boycott because he is still never off the BBC) because he has cried foul, in much the same way he is critical of YouGov because they aren't fully on board with his narrative and every whim. There was a point when he was on QT almost every as often as Fiona Bruce. And that is just the BBC. They are not deliberately promoting Farage but they are promoting the idea of a future story, namely Farage is PM in waiting.

    Now GB News on the other hand do nothing more than blow smoke up Farage's fundament.
    Thanks. The bit I have italicised is simply 100% evidence free and incorrect.

    The BBC is a public service broadcaster. Farage and Reform really might overturn a century of political assumptions and take over the country in the name of populist grubby chancers. Farage truly is a PM in waiting, as you suggest. This is news box office. The BBC does news.

    To cover this neutrally when they are the most popular party in the UK and at the same time full of chancers and bogus impossible and inconsistent policies is hard. Like trying to be 'fair' when covering Trump, when the idea of 'fair' or 'neutral' feels a category error.

    On the whole the BBC does well. It is a lot more boring than other outlets, which loses it market share. That is because of its remit. Facts are often boring. Opinions are interesting. The BBC doesn't do opinion.

    "Farage is PM in waiting" is not fact it is conjecture. It becomes a self fulfilling prophesy when you can't move for the gurning twat popping up in TV and Radio studios across the country.

    Some people at the BBC avoid opinion. As many again don't.

    https://metro.co.uk/2024/02/05/laura-kuenssbergs-bias-finally-addressed-bbc-huge-backlash-20227929/

    https://youtu.be/boBVtiUxgLE?si=06hJ3I4AEF7TQXmY
    'PM in waiting'. Ie, Farage is one of the tiny handful of people who have a reasonable chance of being PM after the next election. Leaving out the Labour candidates who may be PM before the next election, the top three in the next PM betting are the absurd Farage, the absurd Lowe, and the equally absurd Polanski. Badenoch is way back. It is a fact, not conjecture, that Farage is a top credible candidate for next PM after 2029. 'PM in waiting' is a popular but correct description. (Full disclosure: I personally feel sure he won't be but I am not in line with most people.)

    In other words, apart from a Labour figure, Farage is most strongly backed to be the most likely next PM. This is highly newsworthy. Any coverage of any politician can be accused of having a self fulfilling element. All successful politicians master the media process. This is not a surprise.

  • LeonLeon Posts: 67,269
    The high speed train across north Kent is brilliant. It’s clean and sleek and gets you to places really fast - sometimes it’s so fast you can’t quite see what’s outside - this is especially useful around Rainham, and also Ebbsfleet

    So here’s an idea. Why don’t we just build a network of these trains around the whole UK? It’s a no brainer. Start with london to the north. Via Birmingham

    I really should be in government with ideas like this

  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 7,759
    edited 1:49PM
    Sandpit said:

    Selebian said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "An episode of the BBC’s The Repair Shop was pulled after a TV production worker objected to a “sexist” Bob Monkhouse joke.

    The late comedian and presenter’s famous joke books had been brought into the studio for repair by Colin Edmonds, his former comedy partner, and Abigail Williams, his adopted daughter.

    The restoration of the books was to be filmed at the show’s barn in Singleton, West Sussex, for a special tribute programme, to be aired this year.

    However, a member of Ricochet, the production company that makes Repair Shop, complained about one of Monkhouse’s jokes, claiming it was sexist. Corporation bosses then decided to pull the segment."

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2026/03/24/bob-monkhouse-repair-shop-bbc-axed-episode/

    Hard to judge without more (I've skimmed the article). What was the joke? Could the joke be pulled and still keep the show (or did the family/partner object to that?). Were there so many jokes that can't be broadcast now (perhaps could never have been broadcast if this was live material) that it wasn't viable to do the show at all?
    Monkhouse wasn’t exactly Bernard Manning, anything considered sexist today would have been relatively tame at the time.

    Don’t know if it’s online anywhere, but his “An Audience With” show was absolutely brilliant. The last act of which is doing a word association game for a good 10 minutes, working his way around the names of the “celebrities” in the audience.
    He did a couple of hrs in a club shortly before he died. He was superb. It was actually only an hour but it was superb

    https://youtu.be/koFrPs_80gQ?si=-3Y47c6fdwSsL5nH
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 58,001
    eek said:

    algarkirk said:

    In this sublime Court of Appeal judgment there is something for everyone, apart from lawyers with starving wives and children to feed, to hate. Will GB News etc find the stamina to read, mark, learn and inwardly digest it?


    https://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWCA/Civ/2026/349.html


    Rozenberg's excellent commentary

    https://rozenberg.substack.com/p/one-murder-is-enough?utm_source=post-email-title&publication_id=79530&post_id=191888841&utm_campaign=email-post-title&isFreemail=true&r=1mnpci&triedRedirect=true&utm_medium=email

    skims but lightly over the overwhelming nature of how process and the rule of law works in extreme cases. A tale for our times. PBers collectively will be paying for all the lawyers.

    I skim read that but have to ask Wtf wasn’t he deported while in prison or at least kept in prison until he was returned to Turkey
    Exactly. He arrived here illegally in 2001 and in 2026 despite losing various appeals and having his claim for asylum rejected and a deportation order sought in relation to his sentence for the murder of his wife he is still here. This is the problem with our asylum system in a nutshell: its decisions are not particularly outrageous when examined but the failure to act upon those decisions brings the whole system into disrepute.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 21,959
    Meanwhile, an update on Sunday's story:

    Transgender girls have been given until 6 September to leave the Guides.

    The deadline set by Girlguiding follows the organisation's announcement in December that membership would be "restricted to girls and young women".

    The intervening six months give affected members and their families "time to plan, prepare, access support, and decide when - between now and September - they feel ready to leave.


    https://news.sky.com/story/transgender-girls-given-until-september-to-leave-guides-13523781

    And the only way I can join the dots that makes sense is that they are terrified of being dragged through the courts to extinction.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 87,495
    edited 1:49PM

    Matt Goodwin vs Tim Montgomerie:

    https://x.com/GoodwinMJ/status/2036420501522763839

    What Reform should do is stop taking Tory Wets like you. I've responded to my critics here (https://x.com/GoodwinMJ/status/2036048564258779341). All you do is criticise Reform & our campaigns. I have no idea why you are even in Reform unless it is to try and weaken it?

    Hi @GoodwinMJ - I’ve read your response in full.

    You haven’t explained why you or MattGPT has made up multiple quotes attributed to figures like Cicero, Hayek, Burnham, Scruton, and Walker Connor, and why they cannot be verified in any primary texts or reliable secondary sources.

    You haven’t addressed the specific claims about schools, e.g. the Bradford classroom example, the supposed BBC West Midlands report, or the Ofsted quote, all of which appear to be either untraceable or misrepresented.

    Simply citing general EAL statistics doesn’t validate your specific anecdotal claims that don’t exist.

    You also haven’t engaged with the core issue around EAL itself. “English as an Additional Language” does not mean pupils cannot speak English or are unable to learn, and all the Ofsted reports of the schools you vaguely referenced consistently show strong progress by Year 6. Presenting this as evidence of systemic breakdown is objectively misleading and wrong.

    On migration figures, polling, and even basic political facts (e.g. Boris being in opposition in 2019), there are clear falsehoods that you haven’t corrected or clarified.

    I'd be really keen to have this discussion live with you, either on your show on @GBNEWS, the
    @PoliticsJOE_UK podcast, or a third broadcaster - or are you too afraid to have an open debate?

    Your response is embarrassing.

    https://x.com/andytwelves/status/2036051272390910451

    (Naomi Wolf scale embarrassing.)
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 60,703
    edited 1:53PM

    Sandpit said:

    Selebian said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "An episode of the BBC’s The Repair Shop was pulled after a TV production worker objected to a “sexist” Bob Monkhouse joke.

    The late comedian and presenter’s famous joke books had been brought into the studio for repair by Colin Edmonds, his former comedy partner, and Abigail Williams, his adopted daughter.

    The restoration of the books was to be filmed at the show’s barn in Singleton, West Sussex, for a special tribute programme, to be aired this year.

    However, a member of Ricochet, the production company that makes Repair Shop, complained about one of Monkhouse’s jokes, claiming it was sexist. Corporation bosses then decided to pull the segment."

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2026/03/24/bob-monkhouse-repair-shop-bbc-axed-episode/

    Hard to judge without more (I've skimmed the article). What was the joke? Could the joke be pulled and still keep the show (or did the family/partner object to that?). Were there so many jokes that can't be broadcast now (perhaps could never have been broadcast if this was live material) that it wasn't viable to do the show at all?
    Monkhouse wasn’t exactly Bernard Manning, anything considered sexist today would have been relatively tame at the time.

    Don’t know if it’s online anywhere, but his “An Audience With” show was absolutely brilliant. The last act of which is doing a word association game for a good 10 minutes, working his way around the names of the “celebrities” in the audience.
    He did a couple of hrs in a club shortly before he died. He was superb. It was actually only an hour but it was superb

    https://youtu.be/koFrPs_80gQ?si=-3Y47c6fdwSsL5nH
    That one is easy to find, BBC recorded it for a documentary.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=koFrPs_80gQ

    Edit: LOL your edit has the same link!

    Here goes the next hour…
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 22,361
    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    My mother in law is so fat that 6 smaller mothers in law orbit her

    Wouldn't hear that sort of gag at a Stewart Lee show (unless delivered ironically as a joke on the joke itself). I went to see him recently (first time) and he is very skillful. You get plenty of laughs but - key point - all the time you are laughing up not down and you know everyone else is too because they share the same sensibility. Nothing smug about it, it's just an uplifting communal experience that you feel better for being intelligent and enlightened enough to be a part of.
    I just vomited
    But did you vomit up or down?
    I was going through Gillingham at the time, so I’m not sure it matters
    Gillingham (to rhyme with gills of a fish) or Gillingham (to rhyme with Jill)? Its an important difference. One has a Waitrose, and probably a Gails...
  • MattWMattW Posts: 32,726
    edited 1:51PM

    Can somebody explain how if you plug a solar panel into your plug socket energy goes back into the grid? Does that just work somehow?

    Yes. It's just like a traditional fixed panel system.

    The solar panels create DC, and attach to an inverter to make AC. The voltage output from the AC is a little higher than the grid voltage, so when there is no load using up the power and causing import from the grid it flows the other way and electricity is exported.

    One analogy is the voltage being the height at which each end of a hosepipe is held, and the electricity flows "down the voltage hill".
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 34,225

    Meanwhile, an update on Sunday's story:

    Transgender girls have been given until 6 September to leave the Guides.

    The deadline set by Girlguiding follows the organisation's announcement in December that membership would be "restricted to girls and young women".

    The intervening six months give affected members and their families "time to plan, prepare, access support, and decide when - between now and September - they feel ready to leave.


    https://news.sky.com/story/transgender-girls-given-until-september-to-leave-guides-13523781

    And the only way I can join the dots that makes sense is that they are terrified of being dragged through the courts to extinction.

    As I said yesterday it's ridiculous when they simply have to say the Guides are open to all young people. Follow the example of the Scouts who made the change more than 3 decades ago.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 49,657
    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    My mother in law is so fat that 6 smaller mothers in law orbit her

    Wouldn't hear that sort of gag at a Stewart Lee show (unless delivered ironically as a joke on the joke itself). I went to see him recently (first time) and he is very skillful. You get plenty of laughs but - key point - all the time you are laughing up not down and you know everyone else is too because they share the same sensibility. Nothing smug about it, it's just an uplifting communal experience that you feel better for being intelligent and enlightened enough to be a part of.
    I just vomited
    But did you vomit up or down?
    I was going through Gillingham at the time, so I’m not sure it matters
    Ah ok. Enough said.

    Anyway that was me sending up myself and ilk so it ought to have got an appreciative 'lol' not a 'just vomited' from you and ilk.

    I am wasted on a reactionary right wing audience.
    I did detect the self deprecation but nonetheless also an element of truth telling. Hence the nausea
    Bit like with comics who dole out laughing-down hate material. The 'just to provoke' vibe is usually prominent but you can sometimes detect a real nastiness there. All depends. Can't generalise. Case by case on its merits - that's my motto.
  • TazTaz Posts: 26,227
    Selebian said:

    carnforth said:

    Selebian said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "An episode of the BBC’s The Repair Shop was pulled after a TV production worker objected to a “sexist” Bob Monkhouse joke.

    The late comedian and presenter’s famous joke books had been brought into the studio for repair by Colin Edmonds, his former comedy partner, and Abigail Williams, his adopted daughter.

    The restoration of the books was to be filmed at the show’s barn in Singleton, West Sussex, for a special tribute programme, to be aired this year.

    However, a member of Ricochet, the production company that makes Repair Shop, complained about one of Monkhouse’s jokes, claiming it was sexist. Corporation bosses then decided to pull the segment."

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2026/03/24/bob-monkhouse-repair-shop-bbc-axed-episode/

    Hard to judge without more (I've skimmed the article). What was the joke? Could the joke be pulled and still keep the show (or did the family/partner object to that?). Were there so many jokes that can't be broadcast now (perhaps could never have been broadcast if this was live material) that it wasn't viable to do the show at all?
    Article implies the employee simply found the joke looking through the books... no suggestion it was to be broadcast.

    "A production employee stumbled across a joke – no doubt written in the 1960s – and took offence, believing it to be sexist.

    They flagged the problem, and a ‘collective decision’ was made to cull the whole thing."
    I didn't read it that way. Seems crazy if if that's the case.
    It was a joke about the Mother In Law, using the smoke alarm as a timer (if you believe reports).
  • Brixian59Brixian59 Posts: 1,654

    Sandpit said:

    Selebian said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "An episode of the BBC’s The Repair Shop was pulled after a TV production worker objected to a “sexist” Bob Monkhouse joke.

    The late comedian and presenter’s famous joke books had been brought into the studio for repair by Colin Edmonds, his former comedy partner, and Abigail Williams, his adopted daughter.

    The restoration of the books was to be filmed at the show’s barn in Singleton, West Sussex, for a special tribute programme, to be aired this year.

    However, a member of Ricochet, the production company that makes Repair Shop, complained about one of Monkhouse’s jokes, claiming it was sexist. Corporation bosses then decided to pull the segment."

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2026/03/24/bob-monkhouse-repair-shop-bbc-axed-episode/

    Hard to judge without more (I've skimmed the article). What was the joke? Could the joke be pulled and still keep the show (or did the family/partner object to that?). Were there so many jokes that can't be broadcast now (perhaps could never have been broadcast if this was live material) that it wasn't viable to do the show at all?
    Monkhouse wasn’t exactly Bernard Manning, anything considered sexist today would have been relatively tame at the time.

    Don’t know if it’s online anywhere, but his “An Audience With” show was absolutely brilliant. The last act of which is doing a word association game for a good 10 minutes, working his way around the names of the “celebrities” in the audience.
    He did a couple of hrs in a club shortly before he died. He was superb.
    Saw Monkhouse at a charity event at Ronnie Scott's in Broad Street Birmingham.

    He did a 90 minute stand up, no scripts.

    Every table had a dozen cards and marker pens.

    Before started each table was invited to write a word or topic on a card.

    The 90 mins consisted of random people holding card up and Monkhouse would do a joke on topic

    He went round twice.

    One a Tom Vine quick one liner then a 2 minute type joke.

    Instant recall, phenomenal

    No one like him
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 16,857

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    My mother in law is so fat that 6 smaller mothers in law orbit her

    Wouldn't hear that sort of gag at a Stewart Lee show (unless delivered ironically as a joke on the joke itself). I went to see him recently (first time) and he is very skillful. You get plenty of laughs but - key point - all the time you are laughing up not down and you know everyone else is too because they share the same sensibility. Nothing smug about it, it's just an uplifting communal experience that you feel better for being intelligent and enlightened enough to be a part of.
    I just vomited
    But did you vomit up or down?
    I was going through Gillingham at the time, so I’m not sure it matters
    Gillingham (to rhyme with gills of a fish) or Gillingham (to rhyme with Jill)? Its an important difference. One has a Waitrose, and probably a Gails...
    The one in Dorset, the one in Kent or the one in Norfolk?
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 8,538

    Meanwhile, an update on Sunday's story:

    Transgender girls have been given until 6 September to leave the Guides.

    The deadline set by Girlguiding follows the organisation's announcement in December that membership would be "restricted to girls and young women".

    The intervening six months give affected members and their families "time to plan, prepare, access support, and decide when - between now and September - they feel ready to leave.


    https://news.sky.com/story/transgender-girls-given-until-september-to-leave-guides-13523781

    And the only way I can join the dots that makes sense is that they are terrified of being dragged through the courts to extinction.

    If they believe the law compels them already - on existing decisions by the Supreme Court, perhaps their insurance makes the decision for them. Or perhaps they just believe in following the law come what may. You can hardly teach young people to be good citizens if you're breaking the law yourself.
  • TazTaz Posts: 26,227

    Taz said:

    algarkirk said:

    Brixian59 said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Have we done the Tories in fourth place with YouGov?

    Ref 23 (-2)

    Lab 19 (+2)

    GRN 18 (-1)

    Con 17 (=)

    LD 13 (-1)

    I reckon it is the war that is behind a lot of this.

    Hearing the focus groups are sympathetic to Starmer re Trump & the war.

    Albeit Tories only 1% behind the Greens and only 6% separates them from top placed Reform with Yougov now.

    If those are the voteshares in the NEV after the local and devolved elections in May and the Tories are 4th behind Reform, Labour and even the Greens though Kemi will be gone, there will be a VONC in her leadership from Tory MPs and she will then be replaced by Cleverly. So Kemi needs to get a better result than that, on the plus side for her Yougov have the Greens higher than most pollsters do
    A £50 charity bet that Kemi either does not face a VONC by 1st September - or if she does, she survives it.

    Interested?
    Yes, if the Tories are 4th in May Kemi will certainly face a VONC in my view, so I will take a bet on those terms, the Tories coming third or worse in May will have a VONC. If the Tories are second or better she won't so the bet is then void
    You're in the party am I'm not. But I would have thought the pressure on her was past:
    Tories have cleared out the mad, insane and stupid to Reform. You are a Better Party without those morons.
    Reform are on the slide. Plot the trendline, look at the hurdles they face.
    Kemi has found her rhythm - previous government a bit crap, I'm new, I'm punchy, life vs Starmer's inertia

    And you want to replace her with Shithole Cleverley?
    If the Tories are second to Reform in May then yes Kemi will be safe.

    If Yougov is right though and the Conservatives are behind not only Reform but Labour too and even maybe the Greens I am afraid Kemi is gone and will be removed. Not only will she have failed to win back rightwing voters from Reform she will also have lost centrist swing voters to Labour, the latter the type of voters Cleverly appeals more to
    What do you think Cleverly would do any different to Kemi other than take the party lower in the polls ?
    Well he polls better with all voters as shown at the time of the 2024 leadership election and if the Tories are fourth as Yougov says this morning there really isn't much lower they can go Kemi hasn't already taken them
    If you are using a 2024 poll then you have no case
    Kemi is a gnats bollock away from losing 33% of the Tory vote in a GE that was their worst result in 100 years

    She tries to out Reform as Reform lose 20% of their headline vote.

    One Nation Toryism of the likes of Heseltine and Cameron would comfortably polling low to mid 20s

    She has no
    Brand
    Identity
    Policy
    Vision
    Plan

    Everything is an argument
    She is surrounded by busted flushes

    The more people see of her the less they like.

    She is irrelevant to the right, the left and in the centre.

    Usual tripe from you

    Kemi tops leaders approval and is on 84% approval with members

    Kemi is not the problem, the brand is still suffering from Johnson Truss years but she has 3 years to recover the brand

    Anyway you and @HYUFD seem to agree and like each other posts so that is the strangest of alliances on here

    This is over optimistic. With Reform trending down, the Tories should be, but are not, the big gainers. The Greens' upward curve mirrors Reform's exactly.

    Kemi is not addressing the central questions of Tory voters (I was one for nearly 50 years): Who do I vote for is I want a sane centre right party that that can actually form a coherent government with 326 seats?

    Why should I vote Tory instead of Reform if I am one of their more right wing voters voters?

    Who do I vote for tactically if I certainly want to stop Reform but I think the Tories can't form a government and might keep Reform in power?

    Kemi has announced the end of stamp duty and farmers IT, will address student loans and wants to help the young, will address the boats and fair immigration, drill in the north sea, and above all prioritise defence

    Of course the conservative brand is a problem but changing the leader who is popular amongst her mps and the membership would be an act of self harm and you do have to wonder why some lefties concentrate on attacking her if they do not see her as a threat and would like her gone

    I would exclude @HYUFD because he seems fairly unique in conservatives who would prefer Cleverly for reasons beter known to himself
    Thing is, she's not likely to do any of those things, is she? Becuase as things stand, she's nowhere near being on track to be PM after the next election.

    That's probably for the best, given that her shopping list seems to consist of tax cuts and spending increases.
    You mean spending decreasing and tax reduction generating growth
    Then you have to spell out what spending, because the ideas on student fees and defence (in as much as they are ideas) are going to cost. And if you want economic activity, cutting taxes on inheritance and property are almost certainly not where to start. (A shiny sixpence, based on experience, says that any cuts in stamp duty will feed through to higher house prices in about 47 minutes.)
    Stamp duty is the one tax that affects mobility and growth

    Binning it is one of the ways to growth
    Also bin it on Share transactions.
    But make people hold shares bought for a minimum length of time.
    Why ?

    Why should anyone hold a stock where the story changes.

    Ideally you buy for the long term but that is not always practical or desirable,
  • eekeek Posts: 33,006

    Meanwhile, an update on Sunday's story:

    Transgender girls have been given until 6 September to leave the Guides.

    The deadline set by Girlguiding follows the organisation's announcement in December that membership would be "restricted to girls and young women".

    The intervening six months give affected members and their families "time to plan, prepare, access support, and decide when - between now and September - they feel ready to leave.


    https://news.sky.com/story/transgender-girls-given-until-september-to-leave-guides-13523781

    And the only way I can join the dots that makes sense is that they are terrified of being dragged through the courts to extinction.

    Yep Girl guiding has zero money and few friends even before this.

    Expect guiding to have 20-30,000 less children come September there are a lot of young very annoyed leaders
  • FeersumEnjineeyaFeersumEnjineeya Posts: 5,198

    Battlebus said:

    Can somebody explain how if you plug a solar panel into your plug socket energy goes back into the grid? Does that just work somehow?

    Electrical flow is reversible.
    The key there is 'flow' (alongside electrical pressure). All that happens is the co-mingling of different power sources e.g. panels, batteries and grid with the grid topping up what the other sources don't provide for the total load you are using.
    So MattW states that in Germany these are limited to 800W. That's not much energy when you have the kettle on, but if you are out for the day and the only electricity being used in the house is for appliances on standby, and the fridge, then I'd have thought there would be an excess that would find its way onto the local grid.
    I think the excess would be fed back to the grid, but you'd only get paid for it if you had a meter and contract that allowed for that.

    It's also worth noting that these panels won't work in the event of a power cut because the inverter needs a main supply waveform to latch on to. Their main purpose is to reduce the amount of electricity that you draw from the grid, not to provide an alternative source of power.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 60,703

    Meanwhile, an update on Sunday's story:

    Transgender girls have been given until 6 September to leave the Guides.

    The deadline set by Girlguiding follows the organisation's announcement in December that membership would be "restricted to girls and young women".

    The intervening six months give affected members and their families "time to plan, prepare, access support, and decide when - between now and September - they feel ready to leave.


    https://news.sky.com/story/transgender-girls-given-until-september-to-leave-guides-13523781

    And the only way I can join the dots that makes sense is that they are terrified of being dragged through the courts to extinction.

    As with women’s prisons and shelters, the question is simply how many rapes are acceptable, and how many is too many?
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 22,361

    Meanwhile, an update on Sunday's story:

    Transgender girls have been given until 6 September to leave the Guides.

    The deadline set by Girlguiding follows the organisation's announcement in December that membership would be "restricted to girls and young women".

    The intervening six months give affected members and their families "time to plan, prepare, access support, and decide when - between now and September - they feel ready to leave.


    https://news.sky.com/story/transgender-girls-given-until-september-to-leave-guides-13523781

    And the only way I can join the dots that makes sense is that they are terrified of being dragged through the courts to extinction.

    This is about the clash of having single sex clubs and societies in a world where people believe that they can change sex (and present as different from their biology). If a young boy wants to present as a girl does that then exclude them from both guides and scouts? That cannot be right.
  • DopermeanDopermean Posts: 2,565
    Nigelb said:

    Matt Goodwin vs Tim Montgomerie:

    https://x.com/GoodwinMJ/status/2036420501522763839

    What Reform should do is stop taking Tory Wets like you. I've responded to my critics here (https://x.com/GoodwinMJ/status/2036048564258779341). All you do is criticise Reform & our campaigns. I have no idea why you are even in Reform unless it is to try and weaken it?

    Hi @GoodwinMJ - I’ve read your response in full.

    You haven’t explained why you or MattGPT has made up multiple quotes attributed to figures like Cicero, Hayek, Burnham, Scruton, and Walker Connor, and why they cannot be verified in any primary texts or reliable secondary sources.

    You haven’t addressed the specific claims about schools, e.g. the Bradford classroom example, the supposed BBC West Midlands report, or the Ofsted quote, all of which appear to be either untraceable or misrepresented.

    Simply citing general EAL statistics doesn’t validate your specific anecdotal claims that don’t exist.

    You also haven’t engaged with the core issue around EAL itself. “English as an Additional Language” does not mean pupils cannot speak English or are unable to learn, and all the Ofsted reports of the schools you vaguely referenced consistently show strong progress by Year 6. Presenting this as evidence of systemic breakdown is objectively misleading and wrong.

    On migration figures, polling, and even basic political facts (e.g. Boris being in opposition in 2019), there are clear falsehoods that you haven’t corrected or clarified.

    I'd be really keen to have this discussion live with you, either on your show on @GBNEWS, the
    @PoliticsJOE_UK podcast, or a third broadcaster - or are you too afraid to have an open debate?

    Your response is embarrassing.

    https://x.com/andytwelves/status/2036051272390910451

    (Naomi Wolf scale embarrassing.)
    A considerable proportion of selective school pupils will be classed as EAL
  • DopermeanDopermean Posts: 2,565
    MattW said:

    Can somebody explain how if you plug a solar panel into your plug socket energy goes back into the grid? Does that just work somehow?

    Yes. It's just like a traditional fixed panel system.

    The solar panels create DC, and attach to an inverter to make AC. The voltage output from the AC is a little higher than the grid voltage, so when there is no load using up the power and causing import from the grid it flows the other way and electricity is exported.

    One analogy is the voltage being the height at which each end of a hosepipe is held, and the electricity flows "down the voltage hill".
    Does that require a smart meter?
  • MattWMattW Posts: 32,726
    edited 2:00PM

    Can somebody explain how if you plug a solar panel into your plug socket energy goes back into the grid? Does that just work somehow?

    Electrical flow is reversible.
    So if I got a generator right now and plugged it into the wall, electricity would just go into the grid?
    The output from a genny would be a socket not a plug, for one thing, but with appropriate wiring connections it could potentially work. One issue that they will have to resolve is possible impact on the internals of some protective devices (RCBOs) in your fuse box which use old technology, of current flowing the other way.

    Those are the type of thing that the Govt will need to have a report on.

    Back in the day (15-20 years) you could get a wind turbine that plugged into a socket.

    Here's a video of someone who did it with equipment from Germany, discussing the topic:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Na4LTD1M6nw
  • eekeek Posts: 33,006
    edited 2:02PM

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    My mother in law is so fat that 6 smaller mothers in law orbit her

    Wouldn't hear that sort of gag at a Stewart Lee show (unless delivered ironically as a joke on the joke itself). I went to see him recently (first time) and he is very skillful. You get plenty of laughs but - key point - all the time you are laughing up not down and you know everyone else is too because they share the same sensibility. Nothing smug about it, it's just an uplifting communal experience that you feel better for being intelligent and enlightened enough to be a part of.
    I just vomited
    But did you vomit up or down?
    I was going through Gillingham at the time, so I’m not sure it matters
    Gillingham (to rhyme with gills of a fish) or Gillingham (to rhyme with Jill)? Its an important difference. One has a Waitrose, and probably a Gails...
    He was off to Whistable so it’s the one that rhymes with Jill.

    I don’t think there is even a co-op in the town centre anymore - actual the old co-op is now a Londis franchise and the Safeway is a co-op

    Actually that’s unfair - there is an Aldi at the old TV studios where they filmed Fraggle Rock
  • Clutch_BromptonClutch_Brompton Posts: 849
    OT - Just remember the above next time someone talks about Reform UK voters as conservatives. They are anything but...
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 46,049

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Yes the Polanski Greens are basically Corbyn lite attracting the same type of voters, mainly under 40 burdened by student debt and not owning a house and feeling capitalism does not work for them and willing to give tax and spend socialism a go. They are no longer the party of posh middle class environmentalists like Jonathan Porritt.

    Green voters do though have some similarity with Reform voters though in that they are less likely to be financially comfortable than average

    Isn't the reason that Green voters don't feel like capitalism is working for them that, in many cases, it isn't particularly? Not exclusively because it's so hard to escape the rental trap, but that being a very large factor. And that, in turn being linked to a change in small-c-conservatism from "pass a better life on to the next generation/enough evolution to prevent revolution" to "après moi le déluge".

    And that's just another form of nihlism- that of the powerful, rather than the powerless.
    Yes they are socialist as they don't have any capital mainly
    Which raises the question: why did the Tories (2010-2024) shaft the young, rather than make little capitalists out of them?
    Osborne.
    And it was obvious at the time - see also triple lock pensions.

    So why did so many PB Tories wave the pompoms and declare Osborne a genius when I pointed out the consequences would be disastrous.

    The three posh boys, Cameron, Osborne, Johnson, really trashed this country between them.
    Why bring class into this?
    Because all of them were rich twats with no idea how most people have to live , and made decisions accordingly with no concern or idea how your average joe was impacted. We see the results , rich are richer and the rest are in the grubber
  • DopermeanDopermean Posts: 2,565
    Andy_JS said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    kinabalu said:

    The Greens and Reform are underrepresented on PB. The header explains why. Greens and Reform are the parties for people with few assets and little chance of obtaining them. Most on here have plenty of assets and are happy to keep them, if necessary at the expense of those without. The term that used to be used for us was boomers. A few, such as @OldKingCole, @Foxy and @NickPalmer think of the wider population, and are those at least considering the Greens. Probably not coincidentally, they are posters that seem to take more interest in the views of their families.

    The data in the header doesn't indicate that Reform voters are unusually poor. 41% of them are financially comfortable compared to the 43% in the general population who are. That's not very different. But point taken re PBers. We are mainly top quartile (at least) in wealth. Least that's my impression.

    I wonder how they assessed 'financially comfortable' btw. I wouldn't totally trust a self-select on that. People tend to shy away from saying that about themselves.
    Nicking a line from Steven J Gould, The Median is not The Message. That's especially true for Farage Followers. Some are the properly Left Behind, and it's a blot on the records of all governments in my lifetime how much that was just allowed to happen. But very many are extremely comfortable materially, and their discontent is more cultural. Some of that is just that they're getting old, and the cultural caravan is moving on without them. Some of it is not liking the conseqences of their votes and personal spending decisions. (Yes, your High Street is crumbling, but that's mostly because you have spent years not buying things there.)

    The first group were often historically non-voters, and who can blame them? The second tend to cluster in the posher bits of unposh areas. How you analyse those is a problem for analysts. How you simultaneously please them both is a problem for all the Reform councillors about to be elected.
    Farage-ism like the Zhadovshchina it apes in many ways, is an intellectual dead end.

    Even if they fluke an election win, which would be funny, then what? We've seen the Fukkers in action in local government now and have an idea how it will go when reality is more complicated and intractable than a Facebook post.
    In local government they haven't been able to put their policies into action because of national policies.
    I loved the post-council budget interview with the Reform leader, but I'm not sure which national policy dictated that he should be pissed?
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 16,897

    Meanwhile, an update on Sunday's story:

    Transgender girls have been given until 6 September to leave the Guides.

    The deadline set by Girlguiding follows the organisation's announcement in December that membership would be "restricted to girls and young women".

    The intervening six months give affected members and their families "time to plan, prepare, access support, and decide when - between now and September - they feel ready to leave.


    https://news.sky.com/story/transgender-girls-given-until-september-to-leave-guides-13523781

    And the only way I can join the dots that makes sense is that they are terrified of being dragged through the courts to extinction.

    As I said yesterday it's ridiculous when they simply have to say the Guides are open to all young people. Follow the example of the Scouts who made the change more than 3 decades ago.
    Sadly not quite. I think nature may build in a certain sort of asymmetry. Cubs/Scouts will welcome girls of a certain disposition with open arms
    - I see it all the time around here and the girls involved are great. But Brownies/Guides sense of 'girls only, not that we don't like boys but if a boy wanted to join this particular outfit he would be a bit of a creep and/or loser' is quite strong. Fair? No. Nature isn't fair. That's one thing trans people may have worked out.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 21,959
    Sandpit said:

    Meanwhile, an update on Sunday's story:

    Transgender girls have been given until 6 September to leave the Guides.

    The deadline set by Girlguiding follows the organisation's announcement in December that membership would be "restricted to girls and young women".

    The intervening six months give affected members and their families "time to plan, prepare, access support, and decide when - between now and September - they feel ready to leave.


    https://news.sky.com/story/transgender-girls-given-until-september-to-leave-guides-13523781

    And the only way I can join the dots that makes sense is that they are terrified of being dragged through the courts to extinction.

    As with women’s prisons and shelters, the question is simply how many rapes are acceptable, and how many is too many?
    In... a Girlguiding group?

    (Declaration of interest: both my daughters continue to benefit massively from the opportunities they get via Girlguiding. Thing 2 is probably a bit young for gender issues to be on her radar, but Thing 1 is pretty chilled with the gender complexities of her friends.)
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 16,857
    https://x.com/i/status/2036212531107181043
    Not sure if this came up at the weekend but some 'private polling' push for Big Seb Coe for London
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 22,361
    eek said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    My mother in law is so fat that 6 smaller mothers in law orbit her

    Wouldn't hear that sort of gag at a Stewart Lee show (unless delivered ironically as a joke on the joke itself). I went to see him recently (first time) and he is very skillful. You get plenty of laughs but - key point - all the time you are laughing up not down and you know everyone else is too because they share the same sensibility. Nothing smug about it, it's just an uplifting communal experience that you feel better for being intelligent and enlightened enough to be a part of.
    I just vomited
    But did you vomit up or down?
    I was going through Gillingham at the time, so I’m not sure it matters
    Gillingham (to rhyme with gills of a fish) or Gillingham (to rhyme with Jill)? Its an important difference. One has a Waitrose, and probably a Gails...
    He was off to Whistable so it’s the one that rhymes with Jill.

    I don’t think there is even a co-op in the town centre anymore - actual the old co-op is now a Londis franchise and the Safeway is a co-op

    Actually that’s unfair - there is an Aldi at the old TV studios where they filmed Fraggle Rock
    Ah - Fraggle Rock. A much under-rated gem of the 80's.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 49,657
    edited 2:16PM
    Sandpit said:

    Meanwhile, an update on Sunday's story:

    Transgender girls have been given until 6 September to leave the Guides.

    The deadline set by Girlguiding follows the organisation's announcement in December that membership would be "restricted to girls and young women".

    The intervening six months give affected members and their families "time to plan, prepare, access support, and decide when - between now and September - they feel ready to leave.


    https://news.sky.com/story/transgender-girls-given-until-september-to-leave-guides-13523781

    And the only way I can join the dots that makes sense is that they are terrified of being dragged through the courts to extinction.

    As with women’s prisons and shelters, the question is simply how many rapes are acceptable, and how many is too many?
    That's a very dubious rhetorical device in argument.

    Eg, me, if I followed suit:

    Assisted Dying: The question is simply how many protracted agonising deaths of terminally ill people is acceptable.

    Trans Inclusion: The question is simply how many desperately unhappy transgender people forced to live a lie is acceptable.

    Air Quality: The question is simply how much serious ill health due to pollution is acceptable.

    Etc.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 39,612
    Time to get out the violins.

    "Middle classes set to miss out on Reeves energy bill support"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/03/24/rachel-reeves-commons-statement-surging-energy-bills-iran/
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 16,897
    Dopermean said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    kinabalu said:

    The Greens and Reform are underrepresented on PB. The header explains why. Greens and Reform are the parties for people with few assets and little chance of obtaining them. Most on here have plenty of assets and are happy to keep them, if necessary at the expense of those without. The term that used to be used for us was boomers. A few, such as @OldKingCole, @Foxy and @NickPalmer think of the wider population, and are those at least considering the Greens. Probably not coincidentally, they are posters that seem to take more interest in the views of their families.

    The data in the header doesn't indicate that Reform voters are unusually poor. 41% of them are financially comfortable compared to the 43% in the general population who are. That's not very different. But point taken re PBers. We are mainly top quartile (at least) in wealth. Least that's my impression.

    I wonder how they assessed 'financially comfortable' btw. I wouldn't totally trust a self-select on that. People tend to shy away from saying that about themselves.
    Nicking a line from Steven J Gould, The Median is not The Message. That's especially true for Farage Followers. Some are the properly Left Behind, and it's a blot on the records of all governments in my lifetime how much that was just allowed to happen. But very many are extremely comfortable materially, and their discontent is more cultural. Some of that is just that they're getting old, and the cultural caravan is moving on without them. Some of it is not liking the conseqences of their votes and personal spending decisions. (Yes, your High Street is crumbling, but that's mostly because you have spent years not buying things there.)

    The first group were often historically non-voters, and who can blame them? The second tend to cluster in the posher bits of unposh areas. How you analyse those is a problem for analysts. How you simultaneously please them both is a problem for all the Reform councillors about to be elected.
    Farage-ism like the Zhadovshchina it apes in many ways, is an intellectual dead end.

    Even if they fluke an election win, which would be funny, then what? We've seen the Fukkers in action in local government now and have an idea how it will go when reality is more complicated and intractable than a Facebook post.
    In local government they haven't been able to put their policies into action because of national policies.
    I loved the post-council budget interview with the Reform leader, but I'm not sure which national policy dictated that he should be pissed?
    Going back to Fairliered's starting point upthread, I suggest Greens and Reform are under represented on PB because it isn't possible to give a coherent and real world account of what they stand for without either too many trailing loose ends, or contradiction or impossibility. PBers tend to be attracted to defensible and possible positions because of the nature of politics and government. All populist positions will fail on one or more of these elements otherwise they would not be populist.

  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 21,959

    https://x.com/i/status/2036212531107181043
    Not sure if this came up at the weekend but some 'private polling' push for Big Seb Coe for London

    Is there any evidence at all that Coe wants the job?
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 47,195

    Meanwhile, an update on Sunday's story:

    Transgender girls have been given until 6 September to leave the Guides.

    The deadline set by Girlguiding follows the organisation's announcement in December that membership would be "restricted to girls and young women".

    The intervening six months give affected members and their families "time to plan, prepare, access support, and decide when - between now and September - they feel ready to leave.


    https://news.sky.com/story/transgender-girls-given-until-september-to-leave-guides-13523781

    And the only way I can join the dots that makes sense is that they are terrified of being dragged through the courts to extinction.

    As I said yesterday it's ridiculous when they simply have to say the Guides are open to all young people. Follow the example of the Scouts who made the change more than 3 decades ago.
    Am I wrong in thinking girls in the Scouts call themselves Girl Scouts? If so I imagine a trans person might be unhappy being called a Boy Guide if that was not what they considered themselves to be.
    I guess both organisations could just call themselves The Guides and The Scouts.
  • theProletheProle Posts: 1,760
    algarkirk said:

    Starry said:

    algarkirk said:

    FF43 said:

    It's hard to imagine the Conservatives being in power after 2029 except as the willing junior partner in a Farage government. Badenoch and Farage don't seem miles apart in their political outlooks, so that fits too.

    Which is precisely their dilemma. If you support Reform, you vote Reform, if you don't then you don't vote for a party who would be the junior partner. The Tories have two routes out of this, which could be worked together:

    1) Be so brilliant that the polling shifts so that by the end of 2027 the question is reversed. Not 'Will the Tories support Reform' (Kemi's dilemma) but 'Will Reform support the Tories' (Farage's dilemma).

    2) Make it clear that the Tories are One Nation Centre Right and won't touch Reform with a bargepole.

    The only other option, inconsistent with (1) and (2) is an electoral pact with Reform. IMO that is the only way the Right of Centre might possibly actually win in 2029. Hopefully it won't happen. Scorpions in a cage and all that.

    I'm not sure the Tory Party could survive a pact. It would be the centre right equivalent of the SDP (or the old Liberal Party) evolving (I know there were centre-rights in the SDP but it would not have happened without the longest suicide note in history)
    Their best chance of survival, a state by no means guaranteed, is to be brilliantly effective in opposition, and to have brilliantly coherent, honest and comprehensible policies, well communicated, to resolve the biggest elephant in the room problems such as debt, borrowing, inflation, NEETS, benefits culture, sickness culture, social cohesion, housing, defence, equality of opportunity (but not outcomes!), the process state, unfairness in taxation, student loans and a long list more.

    Since no-one else is doing it they have the field to themselves, and since this is what parliament and government exist to do really well, they might as well have a go.

    The problem with all this is simple. They had 14 years in government, during which they were at liberty to tackle any or all of those issues, in pretty much whatever way they saw fit.

    They chose to zigzag between doing nothing and making the problem worse, interspersed with some fine sounding speaches about how they were going to fix all the issues, but which always turned out to be hot air.

    They can make all the right noises in opposition, just like they used to make all the right noises in government. But how can they convince anyone that they've changed, and will actually *do* the stuff they keep talking about?

    I've very little time for Starmer, but when he stands at the dispatch box and bellows "14 years" to every question at PMQs, he does have half a point.

    And this isn't a problem that can be solved by changing leader - bin Kemi and replace her with who you like, and the same central charge is still the same: "Why should we believe this time it will be different?"
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 47,195

    https://x.com/i/status/2036212531107181043
    Not sure if this came up at the weekend but some 'private polling' push for Big Seb Coe for London

    Is there any evidence at all that Coe wants the job?
    Wouldn’t be surprised if the private polling was connected to him wanting the job.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 16,857

    https://x.com/i/status/2036212531107181043
    Not sure if this came up at the weekend but some 'private polling' push for Big Seb Coe for London

    Is there any evidence at all that Coe wants the job?
    I've not seen any. He pretty much hung up his political boots to get back into sports/IoC affairs, but maybe they are geeing him up behind the scenes.
    Cleverly seems the option otherwise.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 16,897
    theProle said:

    algarkirk said:

    Starry said:

    algarkirk said:

    FF43 said:

    It's hard to imagine the Conservatives being in power after 2029 except as the willing junior partner in a Farage government. Badenoch and Farage don't seem miles apart in their political outlooks, so that fits too.

    Which is precisely their dilemma. If you support Reform, you vote Reform, if you don't then you don't vote for a party who would be the junior partner. The Tories have two routes out of this, which could be worked together:

    1) Be so brilliant that the polling shifts so that by the end of 2027 the question is reversed. Not 'Will the Tories support Reform' (Kemi's dilemma) but 'Will Reform support the Tories' (Farage's dilemma).

    2) Make it clear that the Tories are One Nation Centre Right and won't touch Reform with a bargepole.

    The only other option, inconsistent with (1) and (2) is an electoral pact with Reform. IMO that is the only way the Right of Centre might possibly actually win in 2029. Hopefully it won't happen. Scorpions in a cage and all that.

    I'm not sure the Tory Party could survive a pact. It would be the centre right equivalent of the SDP (or the old Liberal Party) evolving (I know there were centre-rights in the SDP but it would not have happened without the longest suicide note in history)
    Their best chance of survival, a state by no means guaranteed, is to be brilliantly effective in opposition, and to have brilliantly coherent, honest and comprehensible policies, well communicated, to resolve the biggest elephant in the room problems such as debt, borrowing, inflation, NEETS, benefits culture, sickness culture, social cohesion, housing, defence, equality of opportunity (but not outcomes!), the process state, unfairness in taxation, student loans and a long list more.

    Since no-one else is doing it they have the field to themselves, and since this is what parliament and government exist to do really well, they might as well have a go.

    The problem with all this is simple. They had 14 years in government, during which they were at liberty to tackle any or all of those issues, in pretty much whatever way they saw fit.

    They chose to zigzag between doing nothing and making the problem worse, interspersed with some fine sounding speaches about how they were going to fix all the issues, but which always turned out to be hot air.

    They can make all the right noises in opposition, just like they used to make all the right noises in government. But how can they convince anyone that they've changed, and will actually *do* the stuff they keep talking about?

    I've very little time for Starmer, but when he stands at the dispatch box and bellows "14 years" to every question at PMQs, he does have half a point.

    And this isn't a problem that can be solved by changing leader - bin Kemi and replace her with who you like, and the same central charge is still the same: "Why should we believe this time it will be different?"
    It's impossible to disagree with you. That's why after nearly 50 years I won't vote for them. all the more reason why they should try to win their long suffering ex supporters back. They have little to lose.

  • TazTaz Posts: 26,227
    Andy_JS said:

    Time to get out the violins.

    "Middle classes set to miss out on Reeves energy bill support"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/03/24/rachel-reeves-commons-statement-surging-energy-bills-iran/

    Are they asking for support then ?
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 16,857

    eek said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    My mother in law is so fat that 6 smaller mothers in law orbit her

    Wouldn't hear that sort of gag at a Stewart Lee show (unless delivered ironically as a joke on the joke itself). I went to see him recently (first time) and he is very skillful. You get plenty of laughs but - key point - all the time you are laughing up not down and you know everyone else is too because they share the same sensibility. Nothing smug about it, it's just an uplifting communal experience that you feel better for being intelligent and enlightened enough to be a part of.
    I just vomited
    But did you vomit up or down?
    I was going through Gillingham at the time, so I’m not sure it matters
    Gillingham (to rhyme with gills of a fish) or Gillingham (to rhyme with Jill)? Its an important difference. One has a Waitrose, and probably a Gails...
    He was off to Whistable so it’s the one that rhymes with Jill.

    I don’t think there is even a co-op in the town centre anymore - actual the old co-op is now a Londis franchise and the Safeway is a co-op

    Actually that’s unfair - there is an Aldi at the old TV studios where they filmed Fraggle Rock
    Ah - Fraggle Rock. A much under-rated gem of the 80's.
    Gobo, Moki, Boomer, Wembly and Red iirc were the Fraggles
  • MightyAlexMightyAlex Posts: 1,902
    Taz said:

    Well this morning I picked up my electric bike, not the one the balaclava/cheeky smile/love his nan brigade ride, and it is a joy.

    I’m not getting any younger and have started to struggle on the convention bike over long distances. I think this will be a game changer.

    I can see me cycling to Tynemouth or N Shields again. Not done that in years and used to love it.

    I’ll certainly cycle to the local shops now not drive, for a quick shop.

    Make sure you've got a dllock for the shops, ebikes are the stolen bike round here.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 60,703

    https://x.com/i/status/2036212531107181043
    Not sure if this came up at the weekend but some 'private polling' push for Big Seb Coe for London

    Is there any evidence at all that Coe wants the job?
    He’ll be 72 at the next election, almost American in political longevity.

    He’d have been an awesome choice for Tories a decade ago though, off the back of the Olympics.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 16,897

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    My mother in law is so fat that 6 smaller mothers in law orbit her

    Wouldn't hear that sort of gag at a Stewart Lee show (unless delivered ironically as a joke on the joke itself). I went to see him recently (first time) and he is very skillful. You get plenty of laughs but - key point - all the time you are laughing up not down and you know everyone else is too because they share the same sensibility. Nothing smug about it, it's just an uplifting communal experience that you feel better for being intelligent and enlightened enough to be a part of.
    I just vomited
    But did you vomit up or down?
    I was going through Gillingham at the time, so I’m not sure it matters
    Gillingham (to rhyme with gills of a fish) or Gillingham (to rhyme with Jill)? Its an important difference. One has a Waitrose, and probably a Gails...
    The one in Dorset, the one in Kent or the one in Norfolk?
    Or the one in Wisconsin?

  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 60,703

    eek said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    My mother in law is so fat that 6 smaller mothers in law orbit her

    Wouldn't hear that sort of gag at a Stewart Lee show (unless delivered ironically as a joke on the joke itself). I went to see him recently (first time) and he is very skillful. You get plenty of laughs but - key point - all the time you are laughing up not down and you know everyone else is too because they share the same sensibility. Nothing smug about it, it's just an uplifting communal experience that you feel better for being intelligent and enlightened enough to be a part of.
    I just vomited
    But did you vomit up or down?
    I was going through Gillingham at the time, so I’m not sure it matters
    Gillingham (to rhyme with gills of a fish) or Gillingham (to rhyme with Jill)? Its an important difference. One has a Waitrose, and probably a Gails...
    He was off to Whistable so it’s the one that rhymes with Jill.

    I don’t think there is even a co-op in the town centre anymore - actual the old co-op is now a Londis franchise and the Safeway is a co-op

    Actually that’s unfair - there is an Aldi at the old TV studios where they filmed Fraggle Rock
    Ah - Fraggle Rock. A much under-rated gem of the 80's.
    Let the music play, worries for another day…
  • TazTaz Posts: 26,227

    Taz said:

    Well this morning I picked up my electric bike, not the one the balaclava/cheeky smile/love his nan brigade ride, and it is a joy.

    I’m not getting any younger and have started to struggle on the convention bike over long distances. I think this will be a game changer.

    I can see me cycling to Tynemouth or N Shields again. Not done that in years and used to love it.

    I’ll certainly cycle to the local shops now not drive, for a quick shop.

    Make sure you've got a dllock for the shops, ebikes are the stolen bike round here.
    Good point. I probably need a better lock than the one I have.
  • BlancheLivermoreBlancheLivermore Posts: 7,739

    Brixian59 said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Have we done the Tories in fourth place with YouGov?

    Ref 23 (-2)

    Lab 19 (+2)

    GRN 18 (-1)

    Con 17 (=)

    LD 13 (-1)

    I reckon it is the war that is behind a lot of this.

    Hearing the focus groups are sympathetic to Starmer re Trump & the war.

    Albeit Tories only 1% behind the Greens and only 6% separates them from top placed Reform with Yougov now.

    If those are the voteshares in the NEV after the local and devolved elections in May and the Tories are 4th behind Reform, Labour and even the Greens though Kemi will be gone, there will be a VONC in her leadership from Tory MPs and she will then be replaced by Cleverly. So Kemi needs to get a better result than that, on the plus side for her Yougov have the Greens higher than most pollsters do
    A £50 charity bet that Kemi either does not face a VONC by 1st September - or if she does, she survives it.

    Interested?
    Yes, if the Tories are 4th in May Kemi will certainly face a VONC in my view, so I will take a bet on those terms, the Tories coming third or worse in May will have a VONC. If the Tories are second or better she won't so the bet is then void
    You're in the party am I'm not. But I would have thought the pressure on her was past:
    Tories have cleared out the mad, insane and stupid to Reform. You are a Better Party without those morons.
    Reform are on the slide. Plot the trendline, look at the hurdles they face.
    Kemi has found her rhythm - previous government a bit crap, I'm new, I'm punchy, life vs Starmer's inertia

    And you want to replace her with Shithole Cleverley?
    If the Tories are second to Reform in May then yes Kemi will be safe.

    If Yougov is right though and the Conservatives are behind not only Reform but Labour too and even maybe the Greens I am afraid Kemi is gone and will be removed. Not only will she have failed to win back rightwing voters from Reform she will also have lost centrist swing voters to Labour, the latter the type of voters Cleverly appeals more to
    What do you think Cleverly would do any different to Kemi other than take the party lower in the polls ?
    Well he polls better with all voters as shown at the time of the 2024 leadership election and if the Tories are fourth as Yougov says this morning there really isn't much lower they can go Kemi hasn't already taken them
    If you are using a 2024 poll then you have no case
    Kemi is a gnats bollock away from losing 33% of the Tory vote in a GE that was their worst result in 100 years

    She tries to out Reform as Reform lose 20% of their headline vote.

    One Nation Toryism of the likes of Heseltine and Cameron would comfortably polling low to mid 20s

    She has no
    Brand
    Identity
    Policy
    Vision
    Plan

    Everything is an argument
    She is surrounded by busted flushes

    The more people see of her the less they like.

    She is irrelevant to the right, the left and in the centre.

    Usual tripe from you

    Kemi tops leaders approval and is on 84% approval with members

    Kemi is not the problem, the brand is still suffering from Johnson Truss years but she has 3 years to recover the brand

    Anyway you and @HYUFD seem to agree and like each other posts so that is the strangest of alliances on here

    Club BriHypnol
  • MelonBMelonB Posts: 16,929
    Taz said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Time to get out the violins.

    "Middle classes set to miss out on Reeves energy bill support"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/03/24/rachel-reeves-commons-statement-surging-energy-bills-iran/

    Are they asking for support then ?
    “Middle class” is Telegraph euphemism for pensioners.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 16,857
    algarkirk said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    My mother in law is so fat that 6 smaller mothers in law orbit her

    Wouldn't hear that sort of gag at a Stewart Lee show (unless delivered ironically as a joke on the joke itself). I went to see him recently (first time) and he is very skillful. You get plenty of laughs but - key point - all the time you are laughing up not down and you know everyone else is too because they share the same sensibility. Nothing smug about it, it's just an uplifting communal experience that you feel better for being intelligent and enlightened enough to be a part of.
    I just vomited
    But did you vomit up or down?
    I was going through Gillingham at the time, so I’m not sure it matters
    Gillingham (to rhyme with gills of a fish) or Gillingham (to rhyme with Jill)? Its an important difference. One has a Waitrose, and probably a Gails...
    The one in Dorset, the one in Kent or the one in Norfolk?
    Or the one in Wisconsin?

    That one will be pronounced utterly absurdly
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 63,620

    Can somebody explain how if you plug a solar panel into your plug socket energy goes back into the grid? Does that just work somehow?

    Yes,
  • TazTaz Posts: 26,227
    MelonB said:

    Taz said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Time to get out the violins.

    "Middle classes set to miss out on Reeves energy bill support"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/03/24/rachel-reeves-commons-statement-surging-energy-bills-iran/

    Are they asking for support then ?
    “Middle class” is Telegraph euphemism for pensioners.
    They get the WFA already !
  • Brixian59Brixian59 Posts: 1,654

    Brixian59 said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Have we done the Tories in fourth place with YouGov?

    Ref 23 (-2)

    Lab 19 (+2)

    GRN 18 (-1)

    Con 17 (=)

    LD 13 (-1)

    I reckon it is the war that is behind a lot of this.

    Hearing the focus groups are sympathetic to Starmer re Trump & the war.

    Albeit Tories only 1% behind the Greens and only 6% separates them from top placed Reform with Yougov now.

    If those are the voteshares in the NEV after the local and devolved elections in May and the Tories are 4th behind Reform, Labour and even the Greens though Kemi will be gone, there will be a VONC in her leadership from Tory MPs and she will then be replaced by Cleverly. So Kemi needs to get a better result than that, on the plus side for her Yougov have the Greens higher than most pollsters do
    A £50 charity bet that Kemi either does not face a VONC by 1st September - or if she does, she survives it.

    Interested?
    Yes, if the Tories are 4th in May Kemi will certainly face a VONC in my view, so I will take a bet on those terms, the Tories coming third or worse in May will have a VONC. If the Tories are second or better she won't so the bet is then void
    You're in the party am I'm not. But I would have thought the pressure on her was past:
    Tories have cleared out the mad, insane and stupid to Reform. You are a Better Party without those morons.
    Reform are on the slide. Plot the trendline, look at the hurdles they face.
    Kemi has found her rhythm - previous government a bit crap, I'm new, I'm punchy, life vs Starmer's inertia

    And you want to replace her with Shithole Cleverley?
    If the Tories are second to Reform in May then yes Kemi will be safe.

    If Yougov is right though and the Conservatives are behind not only Reform but Labour too and even maybe the Greens I am afraid Kemi is gone and will be removed. Not only will she have failed to win back rightwing voters from Reform she will also have lost centrist swing voters to Labour, the latter the type of voters Cleverly appeals more to
    What do you think Cleverly would do any different to Kemi other than take the party lower in the polls ?
    Well he polls better with all voters as shown at the time of the 2024 leadership election and if the Tories are fourth as Yougov says this morning there really isn't much lower they can go Kemi hasn't already taken them
    If you are using a 2024 poll then you have no case
    Kemi is a gnats bollock away from losing 33% of the Tory vote in a GE that was their worst result in 100 years

    She tries to out Reform as Reform lose 20% of their headline vote.

    One Nation Toryism of the likes of Heseltine and Cameron would comfortably polling low to mid 20s

    She has no
    Brand
    Identity
    Policy
    Vision
    Plan

    Everything is an argument
    She is surrounded by busted flushes

    The more people see of her the less they like.

    She is irrelevant to the right, the left and in the centre.

    Usual tripe from you

    Kemi tops leaders approval and is on 84% approval with members

    Kemi is not the problem, the brand is still suffering from Johnson Truss years but she has 3 years to recover the brand

    Anyway you and @HYUFD seem to agree and like each other posts so that is the strangest of alliances on here

    Club BriHypnol
    She tops approval because she's irrelevant

    People say Kemi Badenoch

    Answer

    "Who
    Who are you
    Who are you"

  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,992



    I like @NickPalmer and enjoy his contributions. But, unfortunately, the kind of sentiment expressed here ("I'm tempted by the Greens not because I think their policies add up but because they've taken the necessary first step of recognising the failure of existing policies to offer much hope to people struggling") is why we are facing such dangerous times.

    The grim truth is that there are no easy answers, and snake-oil salesmen on the populist right and left, taking full advantage of people's dissatisfaction risk making matters much worse, by destabilising the country, undermining its institutions, and crashing its economy. Culture wars of the type offered by Farage and Polanski are the politics of despair. While there is a lot of ruin in a country like the UK, you could also say the same about the USA, and look where that is now.

    Thank you for the kind preface, which I reciprocate!

    Don't you think that politics needs a balance between ends and means? The traditional parties seem to me to be preoccupied with day-to-day swings and roundabouts, with little thought to what they trying to achieve in the longer term. I agree that the new parties are frankly sketchy about the short term, but they tend to have a reason why they were created.
  • Brixian59Brixian59 Posts: 1,654

    https://x.com/i/status/2036212531107181043
    Not sure if this came up at the weekend but some 'private polling' push for Big Seb Coe for London

    Is there any evidence at all that Coe wants the job?
    Wouldn’t be surprised if the private polling was connected to him wanting the job.
    Cie has a corruption charge sheet with IOC and other Bodies that is mafiaesque
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 22,870
    Taz said:

    MelonB said:

    Taz said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Time to get out the violins.

    "Middle classes set to miss out on Reeves energy bill support"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/03/24/rachel-reeves-commons-statement-surging-energy-bills-iran/

    Are they asking for support then ?
    “Middle class” is Telegraph euphemism for pensioners.
    They get the WFA already !
    That's first pensioner subsidy for energy, what about second pensioner subsidy for energy?
  • Brixian59Brixian59 Posts: 1,654
    Taz said:

    MelonB said:

    Taz said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Time to get out the violins.

    "Middle classes set to miss out on Reeves energy bill support"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/03/24/rachel-reeves-commons-statement-surging-energy-bills-iran/

    Are they asking for support then ?
    “Middle class” is Telegraph euphemism for pensioners.
    They get the WFA already !
    Yep

    They spaff that up by spending 2 or 3 weeks in nudwintrr in holiday lets, paying a hundred quid a week for some if the mug second home absent landlords who spend more than the rent they earn to keep the bluerinses warm with the rental Central heating on full blast.

    Town car park full of 10 to 15 year old jags, mercs and bmws that was company car they kept at retirement all in mint condition
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 16,857
    Brixian59 said:

    Taz said:

    MelonB said:

    Taz said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Time to get out the violins.

    "Middle classes set to miss out on Reeves energy bill support"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/03/24/rachel-reeves-commons-statement-surging-energy-bills-iran/

    Are they asking for support then ?
    “Middle class” is Telegraph euphemism for pensioners.
    They get the WFA already !
    Yep

    They spaff that up by spending 2 or 3 weeks in nudwintrr in holiday lets, paying a hundred quid a week for some if the mug second home absent landlords who spend more than the rent they earn to keep the bluerinses warm with the rental Central heating on full blast.

    Town car park full of 10 to 15 year old jags, mercs and bmws that was company car they kept at retirement all in mint condition
    Every single one of them
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 10,035


    Just been to see the first core ever cut in the UK North Sea. Well spudded on Boxing Day 1964 by American Overseas Petroleum.

    Have you ever been to BOSCORF? Spent a good chunk of my PhD in there.

    The oiliest core I ever encountered was at UCL, where they were running some analyses as part of a pollution case (to the casual observer, i.e. me, it seemed an open and shut case, definitely would have been unwise to smoke in the lab!).
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 63,620
    Nigelb said:

    Battlebus said:

    Can somebody explain how if you plug a solar panel into your plug socket energy goes back into the grid? Does that just work somehow?

    Electrical flow is reversible.
    The key there is 'flow' (alongside electrical pressure). All that happens is the co-mingling of different power sources e.g. panels, batteries and grid with the grid topping up what the other sources don't provide for the total load you are using.
    So MattW states that in Germany these are limited to 800W. That's not much energy when you have the kettle on, but if you are out for the day and the only electricity being used in the house is for appliances on standby, and the fridge, then I'd have thought there would be an excess that would find its way onto the local grid.
    Potential problems start to crop up as the amount generated by home solar systems increases.
    A single panel is fairly immune from any of that.

    As the amount you can generate increases (unless it's completely off grid), the procedures needed to connect into the supply become more complicated (under 3.68kW doesn't trouble anyone much).
    Details are here, I think:
    https://www.energynetworks.org/assets/images/Resource library/G99 Type A Final 2020.pdf
    It's only really a problem if there are a lot of panels on a lot of rooves, such that (during peak insolation) an area is 'exporting' power. Home batteries solve a lot of these problems.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 16,857
    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Battlebus said:

    Can somebody explain how if you plug a solar panel into your plug socket energy goes back into the grid? Does that just work somehow?

    Electrical flow is reversible.
    The key there is 'flow' (alongside electrical pressure). All that happens is the co-mingling of different power sources e.g. panels, batteries and grid with the grid topping up what the other sources don't provide for the total load you are using.
    So MattW states that in Germany these are limited to 800W. That's not much energy when you have the kettle on, but if you are out for the day and the only electricity being used in the house is for appliances on standby, and the fridge, then I'd have thought there would be an excess that would find its way onto the local grid.
    Potential problems start to crop up as the amount generated by home solar systems increases.
    A single panel is fairly immune from any of that.

    As the amount you can generate increases (unless it's completely off grid), the procedures needed to connect into the supply become more complicated (under 3.68kW doesn't trouble anyone much).
    Details are here, I think:
    https://www.energynetworks.org/assets/images/Resource library/G99 Type A Final 2020.pdf
    It's only really a problem if there are a lot of panels on a lot of rooves, such that (during peak insolation) an area is 'exporting' power. Home batteries solve a lot of these problems.
    Roofs
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 58,630
    Taz said:

    MelonB said:

    Taz said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Time to get out the violins.

    "Middle classes set to miss out on Reeves energy bill support"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/03/24/rachel-reeves-commons-statement-surging-energy-bills-iran/

    Are they asking for support then ?
    “Middle class” is Telegraph euphemism for pensioners.
    They get the WFA already !
    My mum doesn't!
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 58,630
    Brixian59 said:

    Taz said:

    MelonB said:

    Taz said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Time to get out the violins.

    "Middle classes set to miss out on Reeves energy bill support"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/03/24/rachel-reeves-commons-statement-surging-energy-bills-iran/

    Are they asking for support then ?
    “Middle class” is Telegraph euphemism for pensioners.
    They get the WFA already !
    Yep

    They spaff that up by spending 2 or 3 weeks in nudwintrr in holiday lets, paying a hundred quid a week for some if the mug second home absent landlords who spend more than the rent they earn to keep the bluerinses warm with the rental Central heating on full blast.

    Town car park full of 10 to 15 year old jags, mercs and bmws that was company car they kept at retirement all in mint condition
    WFA is means tested.
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