Skip to content

Yes we Khan? – politicalbetting.com

124

Comments

  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 39,306
    "Gisèle Pelicot tells BBC: I felt crushed by horror - but I don't feel anger"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c9q5l22ryy4o
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 126,334
    Look, winning the World Cup cricket match v Scotland is much more important than winning the tinpot Calcutta Cup match, anyone who says otherwise is a loser.
  • TazTaz Posts: 24,937

    Been doing a bit of 'how screwed are Labour?' Research on local by elections since May 2025.
    Labour are the only English main party not to hit 50% in a single election since then and have exceeded 40% only 7 times out of 208. In 18 of the 64 wards they defended they achieved less than 20% (more than they held). They have not gained a single ward, anywhere.

    May has the capacity to be an astonishingly brutal night for them

    Which they know hence the cancellation of many local elections in Labour held councils.
  • TazTaz Posts: 24,937
    Oh dear. come on England. These mugs lost to Italy.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 63,232
    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    Battlebus said:

    How about a non-controversial issue that rarely gets mentioned on PB? And what odds for her running in 2028?

    Ocasio-Cortez says ‘unconditional’ US aid to Israel ‘enabled a genocide in Gaza’

    https://thehill.com/homenews/house/5738391-ocasio-cortez-israel-gaza-genocide-biden/

    The odds on her being the Democrat candidate is 11.5 (9%) on Betfair.
    Second favourite behind Newsom.

    I think the dream ticket for the Dems is Newsom with AOC as his VP.
    Newsom provides the look (white, male, tall, presidential) and a strategy that can widen the appeal beyond the core.
    AOC provides the fire and energy that will get out the core vote.
    Width and depth.
    Dream ticket for Vance you mean! An arrogant rich California Democrat as their nominee with a far left woke Israel hater from New York as his running mate is guaranteed to turn middle America off.

    Buttigieg or Shapiro or Beshear might worry Vance and the GOP, Newsom and AOC would not
    Almost anyone could beat Vance, assuming fair election in 2028.
    Perhaps if Trump's approval ratings continue to be in the toilet but Vance is clever and ruthless and grew up in poverty in Ohio, which was the ultimate swing state until 2020 and got himself to the 2nd most powerful job in the land by cunning and hard work.

    Gavin Newsom's father meanwhile was attorney for Getty Oil and AOC's father was an architect and neither have shown any ability to connect with swing voters in the rustbelt, they have only been elected in safe Democrat states.

    AOC has dropped her pronouns and has adopted Bernie Sanders priorities, in particular, cost of living.

    A 2025 AtlasIntel poll found her to be one of only three major political leaders with a net positive image, with 46% of Americans viewing her positively compared to 44% negatively.

    AOC recently toured Arizona and Nevada with Bernie Sanders, where they attracted record-breaking crowds (including 34,000 in Denver, Colorado).

    A July 2025 poll of "Biden skippers"—voters in battleground states who sat out the 2024 election—found that 78% had a favorable view of Bernie Sanders, the highest of any Democratic-aligned figure.

    I'm not suggesting her for President - too young, short, woman, brown - but as a VP complement to Newsom (tall, white, male, presidential). It's a ticket that reaches Bernie Sanders supporters. AOC is young enough to bide her time as VP for two terms if necessary.

    It's a strong combination.
    I think AOC would be a good VP candidate although she may choose to bide her time so that she can run either in 2032/2036 when she would be (I think) 45-50.

    AOC + Newsom would be a disaster - reinforces the coastal state narrative
    I think State of origen is a bit exagerrated in importance. How much did having Walz on the ticket help Harris in the Midwest?

    Trump is New York to the core yet wins in Alabama, and does anyone realistically think Buttigeig could flip Indiana or Beshar flip Kentucky?
    Comparing the two Trump wins:

    Minnesota
    2016 Clinton +1.52%
    2024 Harris +4.24%

    Michigan
    2016 Trump +0.23%
    2024 Trump +1.42%

    Pennsylvania
    2016 Trump +0.72%
    2024 Trump +1.71%

    Wisconsin
    2016 Trump +0.77%
    2024 Trump +0.86%

    Compared with California

    2016 Clinton +30.11%
    2024 Harris +20.24%

    Suggests that Walz did help in the rust belt states, especially his home Minnesota.

    Certainly more than Harris did in either California or adjacent Nevada and Arizona.

    I am not saying that there is no effect (though it does seem only significant in home state) just that it is only one consideration amongst many.

    I am a big AOC fan but I think the Dems need a more centrist candidate in 2028.
    The issue is more with Newsom and AOC both appealing to a core democrat audience. They need someone who can reach out to the Midwest
    The problem with AOC is that she, like a lot of left wing Democrats, doesn't understand basic economics.

    The solution to a housing crisis is more housing, not attempting to suppress prices (which results in less housing).

    The "Abundance" Democrats get this. Newsom, while a slimy toad, also gets this.

    AOC, Mamdami, Sanders and much of the Democrat left do not.

    Is that true of Mamdani ?
    For a socialist, he seems relatively pragmatic - and is planning to finance quite a lot of home construction.

    Not my politics, but he's more real world than quite a lot of the US left.
    Sadly, yes.

    I find it staggering that a policy that has been tried thousands upon thousands of times, and yet has worked exactly... never... keeps being trotted out.

    Jon Stewart, for what it's worth, also seems infected with the same fundamental disease: https://open.substack.com/pub/theargument/p/jon-stewart-has-become-his-own-worst
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 36,722
    kle4 said:

    Brixian59 said:

    I’m so pleased that Italy, like Argentina, have become a decent rugby team. They haven’t yet quite reached Argentina’s level, but they’re so far from their 6N whipping boys status of a decade ago

    Can't argue with that.

    Question is, how many were born in Italy?
    More than the Italian Cricket team?

    Just guessing.
    I watched the Italian under 17s (I think) a few years ago. They were in some European competition and were playing at our local club's ground.
    IIRC, not a Luigi among them!
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 126,334
    Taz said:

    Oh dear. come on England. These mugs lost to Italy.

    I called it on Monday.

    FWIW - I do expect Scotland to absolutely rinse England this weekend.

    https://vf.politicalbetting.com/discussion/comment/5451080/#Comment_5451080
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 55,124
    rcs1000 said:

    The first Harry Potter book is rather good.

    I'd forgotten.

    Second and third are also very good. Prisoner is the highpoint. After that they were bloated and needed a good edit and lost their sense of fun.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 65,505
    Andy_JS said:

    Is it possible to bet on Goodwin coming third in Gorton & Denton?

    That's very possible, and I'd be interested in that bet.
  • TazTaz Posts: 24,937

    Taz said:

    Oh dear. come on England. These mugs lost to Italy.

    I called it on Monday.

    FWIW - I do expect Scotland to absolutely rinse England this weekend.

    https://vf.politicalbetting.com/discussion/comment/5451080/#Comment_5451080
    Didn’t you mean the cricket 🤔
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 63,232
    Foxy said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The first Harry Potter book is rather good.

    I'd forgotten.

    Second and third are also very good. Prisoner is the highpoint. After that they were bloated and needed a good edit and lost their sense of fun.
    I'm ok with them getting darker... I just wish Ms Rowling had been willing to take more input from her editor.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 86,353

    a

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    Battlebus said:

    How about a non-controversial issue that rarely gets mentioned on PB? And what odds for her running in 2028?

    Ocasio-Cortez says ‘unconditional’ US aid to Israel ‘enabled a genocide in Gaza’

    https://thehill.com/homenews/house/5738391-ocasio-cortez-israel-gaza-genocide-biden/

    The odds on her being the Democrat candidate is 11.5 (9%) on Betfair.
    Second favourite behind Newsom.

    I think the dream ticket for the Dems is Newsom with AOC as his VP.
    Newsom provides the look (white, male, tall, presidential) and a strategy that can widen the appeal beyond the core.
    AOC provides the fire and energy that will get out the core vote.
    Width and depth.
    Dream ticket for Vance you mean! An arrogant rich California Democrat as their nominee with a far left woke Israel hater from New York as his running mate is guaranteed to turn middle America off.

    Buttigieg or Shapiro or Beshear might worry Vance and the GOP, Newsom and AOC would not
    Almost anyone could beat Vance, assuming fair election in 2028.
    Perhaps if Trump's approval ratings continue to be in the toilet but Vance is clever and ruthless and grew up in poverty in Ohio, which was the ultimate swing state until 2020 and got himself to the 2nd most powerful job in the land by cunning and hard work.

    Gavin Newsom's father meanwhile was attorney for Getty Oil and AOC's father was an architect and neither have shown any ability to connect with swing voters in the rustbelt, they have only been elected in safe Democrat states.

    AOC has dropped her pronouns and has adopted Bernie Sanders priorities, in particular, cost of living.

    A 2025 AtlasIntel poll found her to be one of only three major political leaders with a net positive image, with 46% of Americans viewing her positively compared to 44% negatively.

    AOC recently toured Arizona and Nevada with Bernie Sanders, where they attracted record-breaking crowds (including 34,000 in Denver, Colorado).

    A July 2025 poll of "Biden skippers"—voters in battleground states who sat out the 2024 election—found that 78% had a favorable view of Bernie Sanders, the highest of any Democratic-aligned figure.

    I'm not suggesting her for President - too young, short, woman, brown - but as a VP complement to Newsom (tall, white, male, presidential). It's a ticket that reaches Bernie Sanders supporters. AOC is young enough to bide her time as VP for two terms if necessary.

    It's a strong combination.
    I think AOC would be a good VP candidate although she may choose to bide her time so that she can run either in 2032/2036 when she would be (I think) 45-50.

    AOC + Newsom would be a disaster - reinforces the coastal state narrative
    I think State of origen is a bit exagerrated in importance. How much did having Walz on the ticket help Harris in the Midwest?

    Trump is New York to the core yet wins in Alabama, and does anyone realistically think Buttigeig could flip Indiana or Beshar flip Kentucky?
    Comparing the two Trump wins:

    Minnesota
    2016 Clinton +1.52%
    2024 Harris +4.24%

    Michigan
    2016 Trump +0.23%
    2024 Trump +1.42%

    Pennsylvania
    2016 Trump +0.72%
    2024 Trump +1.71%

    Wisconsin
    2016 Trump +0.77%
    2024 Trump +0.86%

    Compared with California

    2016 Clinton +30.11%
    2024 Harris +20.24%

    Suggests that Walz did help in the rust belt states, especially his home Minnesota.

    Certainly more than Harris did in either California or adjacent Nevada and Arizona.

    I am not saying that there is no effect (though it does seem only significant in home state) just that it is only one consideration amongst many.

    I am a big AOC fan but I think the Dems need a more centrist candidate in 2028.
    The issue is more with Newsom and AOC both appealing to a core democrat audience. They need someone who can reach out to the Midwest
    The problem with AOC is that she, like a lot of left wing Democrats, doesn't understand basic economics.

    The solution to a housing crisis is more housing, not attempting to suppress prices (which results in less housing).

    The "Abundance" Democrats get this. Newsom, while a slimy toad, also gets this.

    AOC, Mamdami, Sanders and much of the Democrat left do not.

    Is that true of Mamdani ?
    For a socialist, he seems relatively pragmatic - and is planning to finance quite a lot of home construction.

    Not my politics, but he's more real world than quite a lot of the US left.
    He's stated that he's in favour of rent control. In New York - the town where it was proved, to destruction, that rent control doesn't work.
    Yes, rent control is a stupid policy.
    But he's also planning a big increase in house building spend.

    It could all be a disaster, but his wilder plans have so far become rather more pragmatic in reality, so it will be interesting to watch.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 60,726
    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    Battlebus said:

    How about a non-controversial issue that rarely gets mentioned on PB? And what odds for her running in 2028?

    Ocasio-Cortez says ‘unconditional’ US aid to Israel ‘enabled a genocide in Gaza’

    https://thehill.com/homenews/house/5738391-ocasio-cortez-israel-gaza-genocide-biden/

    The odds on her being the Democrat candidate is 11.5 (9%) on Betfair.
    Second favourite behind Newsom.

    I think the dream ticket for the Dems is Newsom with AOC as his VP.
    Newsom provides the look (white, male, tall, presidential) and a strategy that can widen the appeal beyond the core.
    AOC provides the fire and energy that will get out the core vote.
    Width and depth.
    Dream ticket for Vance you mean! An arrogant rich California Democrat as their nominee with a far left woke Israel hater from New York as his running mate is guaranteed to turn middle America off.

    Buttigieg or Shapiro or Beshear might worry Vance and the GOP, Newsom and AOC would not
    Almost anyone could beat Vance, assuming fair election in 2028.
    Perhaps if Trump's approval ratings continue to be in the toilet but Vance is clever and ruthless and grew up in poverty in Ohio, which was the ultimate swing state until 2020 and got himself to the 2nd most powerful job in the land by cunning and hard work.

    Gavin Newsom's father meanwhile was attorney for Getty Oil and AOC's father was an architect and neither have shown any ability to connect with swing voters in the rustbelt, they have only been elected in safe Democrat states.

    AOC has dropped her pronouns and has adopted Bernie Sanders priorities, in particular, cost of living.

    A 2025 AtlasIntel poll found her to be one of only three major political leaders with a net positive image, with 46% of Americans viewing her positively compared to 44% negatively.

    AOC recently toured Arizona and Nevada with Bernie Sanders, where they attracted record-breaking crowds (including 34,000 in Denver, Colorado).

    A July 2025 poll of "Biden skippers"—voters in battleground states who sat out the 2024 election—found that 78% had a favorable view of Bernie Sanders, the highest of any Democratic-aligned figure.

    I'm not suggesting her for President - too young, short, woman, brown - but as a VP complement to Newsom (tall, white, male, presidential). It's a ticket that reaches Bernie Sanders supporters. AOC is young enough to bide her time as VP for two terms if necessary.

    It's a strong combination.
    I think AOC would be a good VP candidate although she may choose to bide her time so that she can run either in 2032/2036 when she would be (I think) 45-50.

    AOC + Newsom would be a disaster - reinforces the coastal state narrative
    I think State of origen is a bit exagerrated in importance. How much did having Walz on the ticket help Harris in the Midwest?

    Trump is New York to the core yet wins in Alabama, and does anyone realistically think Buttigeig could flip Indiana or Beshar flip Kentucky?
    Comparing the two Trump wins:

    Minnesota
    2016 Clinton +1.52%
    2024 Harris +4.24%

    Michigan
    2016 Trump +0.23%
    2024 Trump +1.42%

    Pennsylvania
    2016 Trump +0.72%
    2024 Trump +1.71%

    Wisconsin
    2016 Trump +0.77%
    2024 Trump +0.86%

    Compared with California

    2016 Clinton +30.11%
    2024 Harris +20.24%

    Suggests that Walz did help in the rust belt states, especially his home Minnesota.

    Certainly more than Harris did in either California or adjacent Nevada and Arizona.

    I am not saying that there is no effect (though it does seem only significant in home state) just that it is only one consideration amongst many.

    I am a big AOC fan but I think the Dems need a more centrist candidate in 2028.
    The issue is more with Newsom and AOC both appealing to a core democrat audience. They need someone who can reach out to the Midwest
    The problem with AOC is that she, like a lot of left wing Democrats, doesn't understand basic economics.

    The solution to a housing crisis is more housing, not attempting to suppress prices (which results in less housing).

    The "Abundance" Democrats get this. Newsom, while a slimy toad, also gets this.

    AOC, Mamdami, Sanders and much of the Democrat left do not.

    Is that true of Mamdani ?
    For a socialist, he seems relatively pragmatic - and is planning to finance quite a lot of home construction.

    Not my politics, but he's more real world than quite a lot of the US left.
    Sadly, yes.

    I find it staggering that a policy that has been tried thousands upon thousands of times, and yet has worked exactly... never... keeps being trotted out.

    Jon Stewart, for what it's worth, also seems infected with the same fundamental disease: https://open.substack.com/pub/theargument/p/jon-stewart-has-become-his-own-worst
    Rent Control might be the poster child for Populist Politics.

    - Someone else will pay
    - That someone is someone else we don't like
    - There are claimed to be no downsides.
    - The policy won't work and will actually make things worse.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 126,334
    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    Oh dear. come on England. These mugs lost to Italy.

    I called it on Monday.

    FWIW - I do expect Scotland to absolutely rinse England this weekend.

    https://vf.politicalbetting.com/discussion/comment/5451080/#Comment_5451080
    Didn’t you mean the cricket 🤔
    No, the Scots have haunted me at the rugby since 1990.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 65,505
    I do wonder how well Reform would do (or any equivalent) if Farage just left the stage.

    I'm not sure there's anyone else who can do what he can.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 16,630
    rcs1000 said:

    The first Harry Potter book is rather good.

    I'd forgotten.

    The first few are OK. But 5, 6 and 7 get overlong and over complex to no great purpose.

    Just as her detective stuff (Galbraith) is OK but mostly too long. Like Dickens when she goes outside her good range she is a bit unreadable - of which the most egregious is, IIRC, The Ink Black Heart. This feels like the longest and dullest book ever written. The last time I looked - I may not be up to date - she had extended a 'will they won't they' romance to about 9,000 pages and still going.

  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 15,423
    edited 5:05PM
    Brixian59 said:

    Been doing a bit of 'how screwed are Labour?' Research on local by elections since May 2025.
    Labour are the only English main party not to hit 50% in a single election since then and have exceeded 40% only 7 times out of 208. In 18 of the 64 wards they defended they achieved less than 20% (more than they held). They have not gained a single ward, anywhere.

    May has the capacity to be an astonishingly brutal night for them

    May be you would be better to look at Government vote share in mid term year 2 and 3 over the past 25 years

    All May will be is a sample in time.

    It will have no bearing on the 2929 GE

    Furthermore how screwed will the Tories be, off there worst GE result in 100 years, how much will they have increased vote share from that abysmal low point.

    Labour are on target for a NEV of just over half Rishi's in 2024 and over 10 points lower than Major in 1995 and to lose 1500 councillors.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 86,353
    edited 5:05PM

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    Battlebus said:

    How about a non-controversial issue that rarely gets mentioned on PB? And what odds for her running in 2028?

    Ocasio-Cortez says ‘unconditional’ US aid to Israel ‘enabled a genocide in Gaza’

    https://thehill.com/homenews/house/5738391-ocasio-cortez-israel-gaza-genocide-biden/

    The odds on her being the Democrat candidate is 11.5 (9%) on Betfair.
    Second favourite behind Newsom.

    I think the dream ticket for the Dems is Newsom with AOC as his VP.
    Newsom provides the look (white, male, tall, presidential) and a strategy that can widen the appeal beyond the core.
    AOC provides the fire and energy that will get out the core vote.
    Width and depth.
    Dream ticket for Vance you mean! An arrogant rich California Democrat as their nominee with a far left woke Israel hater from New York as his running mate is guaranteed to turn middle America off.

    Buttigieg or Shapiro or Beshear might worry Vance and the GOP, Newsom and AOC would not
    Almost anyone could beat Vance, assuming fair election in 2028.
    Perhaps if Trump's approval ratings continue to be in the toilet but Vance is clever and ruthless and grew up in poverty in Ohio, which was the ultimate swing state until 2020 and got himself to the 2nd most powerful job in the land by cunning and hard work.

    Gavin Newsom's father meanwhile was attorney for Getty Oil and AOC's father was an architect and neither have shown any ability to connect with swing voters in the rustbelt, they have only been elected in safe Democrat states.

    AOC has dropped her pronouns and has adopted Bernie Sanders priorities, in particular, cost of living.

    A 2025 AtlasIntel poll found her to be one of only three major political leaders with a net positive image, with 46% of Americans viewing her positively compared to 44% negatively.

    AOC recently toured Arizona and Nevada with Bernie Sanders, where they attracted record-breaking crowds (including 34,000 in Denver, Colorado).

    A July 2025 poll of "Biden skippers"—voters in battleground states who sat out the 2024 election—found that 78% had a favorable view of Bernie Sanders, the highest of any Democratic-aligned figure.

    I'm not suggesting her for President - too young, short, woman, brown - but as a VP complement to Newsom (tall, white, male, presidential). It's a ticket that reaches Bernie Sanders supporters. AOC is young enough to bide her time as VP for two terms if necessary.

    It's a strong combination.
    I think AOC would be a good VP candidate although she may choose to bide her time so that she can run either in 2032/2036 when she would be (I think) 45-50.

    AOC + Newsom would be a disaster - reinforces the coastal state narrative
    I think State of origen is a bit exagerrated in importance. How much did having Walz on the ticket help Harris in the Midwest?

    Trump is New York to the core yet wins in Alabama, and does anyone realistically think Buttigeig could flip Indiana or Beshar flip Kentucky?
    Comparing the two Trump wins:

    Minnesota
    2016 Clinton +1.52%
    2024 Harris +4.24%

    Michigan
    2016 Trump +0.23%
    2024 Trump +1.42%

    Pennsylvania
    2016 Trump +0.72%
    2024 Trump +1.71%

    Wisconsin
    2016 Trump +0.77%
    2024 Trump +0.86%

    Compared with California

    2016 Clinton +30.11%
    2024 Harris +20.24%

    Suggests that Walz did help in the rust belt states, especially his home Minnesota.

    Certainly more than Harris did in either California or adjacent Nevada and Arizona.

    I am not saying that there is no effect (though it does seem only significant in home state) just that it is only one consideration amongst many.

    I am a big AOC fan but I think the Dems need a more centrist candidate in 2028.
    The issue is more with Newsom and AOC both appealing to a core democrat audience. They need someone who can reach out to the Midwest
    The problem with AOC is that she, like a lot of left wing Democrats, doesn't understand basic economics.

    The solution to a housing crisis is more housing, not attempting to suppress prices (which results in less housing).

    The "Abundance" Democrats get this. Newsom, while a slimy toad, also gets this.

    AOC, Mamdami, Sanders and much of the Democrat left do not.

    Is that true of Mamdani ?
    For a socialist, he seems relatively pragmatic - and is planning to finance quite a lot of home construction.

    Not my politics, but he's more real world than quite a lot of the US left.
    Sadly, yes.

    I find it staggering that a policy that has been tried thousands upon thousands of times, and yet has worked exactly... never... keeps being trotted out.

    Jon Stewart, for what it's worth, also seems infected with the same fundamental disease: https://open.substack.com/pub/theargument/p/jon-stewart-has-become-his-own-worst
    Rent Control might be the poster child for Populist Politics.

    - Someone else will pay
    - That someone is someone else we don't like
    - There are claimed to be no downsides.
    - The policy won't work and will actually make things worse.
    In this case, though, as I understand it, the city will pay for new build subsidised housing for low income families.

    The numbers might well fail to stack up, but it's not the rent control that you describe.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 55,124

    HYUFD said:

    'Kate's frosty relationship with Beatrice and Eugenie: Royal insiders reveal how Princess has always been 'cautious' about Andrew's daughters - and latest Epstein revelations could be the death knell for their future in the Royal Family'
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/royals/article-15219503/Kates-frosty-relationship-Beatrice-Eugenie-Royal-insiders-reveal-Princess-cautious-Andrews-daughters-latest-Epstein-revelations-death-knell-future-Royal-Family.html

    Afternoon all!

    I suggest Andrew's two daughters would be well advised, for the moment at least, to concentrate on their families, their jobs and maybe their charity work rather than being their parent's daughters. In other words, live their own lives.
    So far as I have read the only contact they have had with Epstein and his 'mob' was at the behest of their mother who doesn't strike me as being a desirablerole model.
    No, that isn't right. Keep them away from the public but they are still family.

    Both Andrew and Sarah are deeply flawed, but they are Beatrice's and Eugenie's parents. Similarly Charles should not shun his brother nor William his uncle in private.

  • TazTaz Posts: 24,937

    I do wonder how well Reform would do (or any equivalent) if Farage just left the stage.

    I'm not sure there's anyone else who can do what he can.

    I always thought Tice was a reasonable performer. I listened to the Merryn Talks Money podcast this week where she interviewed him to try to glean some information on what they’d do in govt.

    Total waste of time. He talked a lot and said nothing.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 101,161
    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    Battlebus said:

    How about a non-controversial issue that rarely gets mentioned on PB? And what odds for her running in 2028?

    Ocasio-Cortez says ‘unconditional’ US aid to Israel ‘enabled a genocide in Gaza’

    https://thehill.com/homenews/house/5738391-ocasio-cortez-israel-gaza-genocide-biden/

    The odds on her being the Democrat candidate is 11.5 (9%) on Betfair.
    Second favourite behind Newsom.

    I think the dream ticket for the Dems is Newsom with AOC as his VP.
    Newsom provides the look (white, male, tall, presidential) and a strategy that can widen the appeal beyond the core.
    AOC provides the fire and energy that will get out the core vote.
    Width and depth.
    Dream ticket for Vance you mean! An arrogant rich California Democrat as their nominee with a far left woke Israel hater from New York as his running mate is guaranteed to turn middle America off.

    Buttigieg or Shapiro or Beshear might worry Vance and the GOP, Newsom and AOC would not
    Almost anyone could beat Vance, assuming fair election in 2028.
    Perhaps if Trump's approval ratings continue to be in the toilet but Vance is clever and ruthless and grew up in poverty in Ohio, which was the ultimate swing state until 2020 and got himself to the 2nd most powerful job in the land by cunning and hard work.

    Gavin Newsom's father meanwhile was attorney for Getty Oil and AOC's father was an architect and neither have shown any ability to connect with swing voters in the rustbelt, they have only been elected in safe Democrat states.

    AOC has dropped her pronouns and has adopted Bernie Sanders priorities, in particular, cost of living.

    A 2025 AtlasIntel poll found her to be one of only three major political leaders with a net positive image, with 46% of Americans viewing her positively compared to 44% negatively.

    AOC recently toured Arizona and Nevada with Bernie Sanders, where they attracted record-breaking crowds (including 34,000 in Denver, Colorado).

    A July 2025 poll of "Biden skippers"—voters in battleground states who sat out the 2024 election—found that 78% had a favorable view of Bernie Sanders, the highest of any Democratic-aligned figure.

    I'm not suggesting her for President - too young, short, woman, brown - but as a VP complement to Newsom (tall, white, male, presidential). It's a ticket that reaches Bernie Sanders supporters. AOC is young enough to bide her time as VP for two terms if necessary.

    It's a strong combination.
    I think AOC would be a good VP candidate although she may choose to bide her time so that she can run either in 2032/2036 when she would be (I think) 45-50.

    AOC + Newsom would be a disaster - reinforces the coastal state narrative
    I think State of origen is a bit exagerrated in importance. How much did having Walz on the ticket help Harris in the Midwest?

    Trump is New York to the core yet wins in Alabama, and does anyone realistically think Buttigeig could flip Indiana or Beshar flip Kentucky?
    Comparing the two Trump wins:

    Minnesota
    2016 Clinton +1.52%
    2024 Harris +4.24%

    Michigan
    2016 Trump +0.23%
    2024 Trump +1.42%

    Pennsylvania
    2016 Trump +0.72%
    2024 Trump +1.71%

    Wisconsin
    2016 Trump +0.77%
    2024 Trump +0.86%

    Compared with California

    2016 Clinton +30.11%
    2024 Harris +20.24%

    Suggests that Walz did help in the rust belt states, especially his home Minnesota.

    Certainly more than Harris did in either California or adjacent Nevada and Arizona.

    I am not saying that there is no effect (though it does seem only significant in home state) just that it is only one consideration amongst many.

    I am a big AOC fan but I think the Dems need a more centrist candidate in 2028.
    The issue is more with Newsom and AOC both appealing to a core democrat audience. They need someone who can reach out to the Midwest
    The problem with AOC is that she, like a lot of left wing Democrats, doesn't understand basic economics.

    The solution to a housing crisis is more housing, not attempting to suppress prices (which results in less housing).

    The "Abundance" Democrats get this. Newsom, while a slimy toad, also gets this.

    AOC, Mamdami, Sanders and much of the Democrat left do not.

    Is that true of Mamdani ?
    For a socialist, he seems relatively pragmatic - and is planning to finance quite a lot of home construction.

    Not my politics, but he's more real world than quite a lot of the US left.
    Sadly, yes.

    I find it staggering that a policy that has been tried thousands upon thousands of times, and yet has worked exactly... never... keeps being trotted out.

    Jon Stewart, for what it's worth, also seems infected with the same fundamental disease: https://open.substack.com/pub/theargument/p/jon-stewart-has-become-his-own-worst
    The old joke is that not even economists understand economics, which hardly incentivises anyone else to learn about it as they think it is all just vibes and ideological theorising.

    I don't understand economics and so don't think I could ever justifiably seem to help run even a local council, but it is qutie notable how economic ideas from politicians very often end up with 'It sounds like it might work/it has the right motivation' as a primary justiication. Or appear to be based on an assumption that economic factors can be perfectly controlled by political decisions, adding x here or regulating y there, with near-immediate and direct correlation, which can also be swiftly reversed if you wanted.

    IDK, that seems implausible to me, but hey, I'm not an economist.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 60,726
    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    Battlebus said:

    How about a non-controversial issue that rarely gets mentioned on PB? And what odds for her running in 2028?

    Ocasio-Cortez says ‘unconditional’ US aid to Israel ‘enabled a genocide in Gaza’

    https://thehill.com/homenews/house/5738391-ocasio-cortez-israel-gaza-genocide-biden/

    The odds on her being the Democrat candidate is 11.5 (9%) on Betfair.
    Second favourite behind Newsom.

    I think the dream ticket for the Dems is Newsom with AOC as his VP.
    Newsom provides the look (white, male, tall, presidential) and a strategy that can widen the appeal beyond the core.
    AOC provides the fire and energy that will get out the core vote.
    Width and depth.
    Dream ticket for Vance you mean! An arrogant rich California Democrat as their nominee with a far left woke Israel hater from New York as his running mate is guaranteed to turn middle America off.

    Buttigieg or Shapiro or Beshear might worry Vance and the GOP, Newsom and AOC would not
    Almost anyone could beat Vance, assuming fair election in 2028.
    Perhaps if Trump's approval ratings continue to be in the toilet but Vance is clever and ruthless and grew up in poverty in Ohio, which was the ultimate swing state until 2020 and got himself to the 2nd most powerful job in the land by cunning and hard work.

    Gavin Newsom's father meanwhile was attorney for Getty Oil and AOC's father was an architect and neither have shown any ability to connect with swing voters in the rustbelt, they have only been elected in safe Democrat states.

    AOC has dropped her pronouns and has adopted Bernie Sanders priorities, in particular, cost of living.

    A 2025 AtlasIntel poll found her to be one of only three major political leaders with a net positive image, with 46% of Americans viewing her positively compared to 44% negatively.

    AOC recently toured Arizona and Nevada with Bernie Sanders, where they attracted record-breaking crowds (including 34,000 in Denver, Colorado).

    A July 2025 poll of "Biden skippers"—voters in battleground states who sat out the 2024 election—found that 78% had a favorable view of Bernie Sanders, the highest of any Democratic-aligned figure.

    I'm not suggesting her for President - too young, short, woman, brown - but as a VP complement to Newsom (tall, white, male, presidential). It's a ticket that reaches Bernie Sanders supporters. AOC is young enough to bide her time as VP for two terms if necessary.

    It's a strong combination.
    I think AOC would be a good VP candidate although she may choose to bide her time so that she can run either in 2032/2036 when she would be (I think) 45-50.

    AOC + Newsom would be a disaster - reinforces the coastal state narrative
    I think State of origen is a bit exagerrated in importance. How much did having Walz on the ticket help Harris in the Midwest?

    Trump is New York to the core yet wins in Alabama, and does anyone realistically think Buttigeig could flip Indiana or Beshar flip Kentucky?
    Comparing the two Trump wins:

    Minnesota
    2016 Clinton +1.52%
    2024 Harris +4.24%

    Michigan
    2016 Trump +0.23%
    2024 Trump +1.42%

    Pennsylvania
    2016 Trump +0.72%
    2024 Trump +1.71%

    Wisconsin
    2016 Trump +0.77%
    2024 Trump +0.86%

    Compared with California

    2016 Clinton +30.11%
    2024 Harris +20.24%

    Suggests that Walz did help in the rust belt states, especially his home Minnesota.

    Certainly more than Harris did in either California or adjacent Nevada and Arizona.

    I am not saying that there is no effect (though it does seem only significant in home state) just that it is only one consideration amongst many.

    I am a big AOC fan but I think the Dems need a more centrist candidate in 2028.
    The issue is more with Newsom and AOC both appealing to a core democrat audience. They need someone who can reach out to the Midwest
    The problem with AOC is that she, like a lot of left wing Democrats, doesn't understand basic economics.

    The solution to a housing crisis is more housing, not attempting to suppress prices (which results in less housing).

    The "Abundance" Democrats get this. Newsom, while a slimy toad, also gets this.

    AOC, Mamdami, Sanders and much of the Democrat left do not.

    Is that true of Mamdani ?
    For a socialist, he seems relatively pragmatic - and is planning to finance quite a lot of home construction.

    Not my politics, but he's more real world than quite a lot of the US left.
    Sadly, yes.

    I find it staggering that a policy that has been tried thousands upon thousands of times, and yet has worked exactly... never... keeps being trotted out.

    Jon Stewart, for what it's worth, also seems infected with the same fundamental disease: https://open.substack.com/pub/theargument/p/jon-stewart-has-become-his-own-worst
    Rent Control might be the poster child for Populist Politics.

    - Someone else will pay
    - That someone is someone else we don't like
    - There are claimed to be no downsides.
    - The policy won't work and will actually make things worse.
    In this case, though, as I understand it, the city will pay for subsidised housing for low income families.

    The numbers might well fail to stack up, but it's not the rent control that you describe.
    Subsidised housing works (for those in the subsidised housing) - because the policy is paid for.

    The problem with rent control is that it is about imposing a cost and denying there is an issue.

    He campaigned on rent control - will be interesting to see if that actually falls off the wagon.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 15,423

    I do wonder how well Reform would do (or any equivalent) if Farage just left the stage.

    I'm not sure there's anyone else who can do what he can.

    Theyd have a fun few months eating themselves alive
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 55,124
    rcs1000 said:

    Foxy said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The first Harry Potter book is rather good.

    I'd forgotten.

    Second and third are also very good. Prisoner is the highpoint. After that they were bloated and needed a good edit and lost their sense of fun.
    I'm ok with them getting darker... I just wish Ms Rowling had been willing to take more input from her editor.
    The first 3 books have dark moments and themes, but also keep the sense of fun and hijinks needed for a boarding school set book.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 101,161

    I do wonder how well Reform would do (or any equivalent) if Farage just left the stage.

    I'm not sure there's anyone else who can do what he can.

    Figures on his personal popularity vs Reform are interesting, but despite efforts to expand they are more of a one man band than they might like, in terms of staying power.

    I suppose the real test would be if he did a UKIP and left Reform to set up a new outfit, would the support for Reform hold up, or would it collapse to total irrelevance? Despite inclusion of some figures like Tice, Yusuf, and the former Tory backup dancers, I think they'd struggle (not least since that lot would all leave with Farage if it ever happened).

    Obviously him going elsewhere looks unlikely, but I think it shows the reliance that is still there.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 60,726
    kle4 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    Battlebus said:

    How about a non-controversial issue that rarely gets mentioned on PB? And what odds for her running in 2028?

    Ocasio-Cortez says ‘unconditional’ US aid to Israel ‘enabled a genocide in Gaza’

    https://thehill.com/homenews/house/5738391-ocasio-cortez-israel-gaza-genocide-biden/

    The odds on her being the Democrat candidate is 11.5 (9%) on Betfair.
    Second favourite behind Newsom.

    I think the dream ticket for the Dems is Newsom with AOC as his VP.
    Newsom provides the look (white, male, tall, presidential) and a strategy that can widen the appeal beyond the core.
    AOC provides the fire and energy that will get out the core vote.
    Width and depth.
    Dream ticket for Vance you mean! An arrogant rich California Democrat as their nominee with a far left woke Israel hater from New York as his running mate is guaranteed to turn middle America off.

    Buttigieg or Shapiro or Beshear might worry Vance and the GOP, Newsom and AOC would not
    Almost anyone could beat Vance, assuming fair election in 2028.
    Perhaps if Trump's approval ratings continue to be in the toilet but Vance is clever and ruthless and grew up in poverty in Ohio, which was the ultimate swing state until 2020 and got himself to the 2nd most powerful job in the land by cunning and hard work.

    Gavin Newsom's father meanwhile was attorney for Getty Oil and AOC's father was an architect and neither have shown any ability to connect with swing voters in the rustbelt, they have only been elected in safe Democrat states.

    AOC has dropped her pronouns and has adopted Bernie Sanders priorities, in particular, cost of living.

    A 2025 AtlasIntel poll found her to be one of only three major political leaders with a net positive image, with 46% of Americans viewing her positively compared to 44% negatively.

    AOC recently toured Arizona and Nevada with Bernie Sanders, where they attracted record-breaking crowds (including 34,000 in Denver, Colorado).

    A July 2025 poll of "Biden skippers"—voters in battleground states who sat out the 2024 election—found that 78% had a favorable view of Bernie Sanders, the highest of any Democratic-aligned figure.

    I'm not suggesting her for President - too young, short, woman, brown - but as a VP complement to Newsom (tall, white, male, presidential). It's a ticket that reaches Bernie Sanders supporters. AOC is young enough to bide her time as VP for two terms if necessary.

    It's a strong combination.
    I think AOC would be a good VP candidate although she may choose to bide her time so that she can run either in 2032/2036 when she would be (I think) 45-50.

    AOC + Newsom would be a disaster - reinforces the coastal state narrative
    I think State of origen is a bit exagerrated in importance. How much did having Walz on the ticket help Harris in the Midwest?

    Trump is New York to the core yet wins in Alabama, and does anyone realistically think Buttigeig could flip Indiana or Beshar flip Kentucky?
    Comparing the two Trump wins:

    Minnesota
    2016 Clinton +1.52%
    2024 Harris +4.24%

    Michigan
    2016 Trump +0.23%
    2024 Trump +1.42%

    Pennsylvania
    2016 Trump +0.72%
    2024 Trump +1.71%

    Wisconsin
    2016 Trump +0.77%
    2024 Trump +0.86%

    Compared with California

    2016 Clinton +30.11%
    2024 Harris +20.24%

    Suggests that Walz did help in the rust belt states, especially his home Minnesota.

    Certainly more than Harris did in either California or adjacent Nevada and Arizona.

    I am not saying that there is no effect (though it does seem only significant in home state) just that it is only one consideration amongst many.

    I am a big AOC fan but I think the Dems need a more centrist candidate in 2028.
    The issue is more with Newsom and AOC both appealing to a core democrat audience. They need someone who can reach out to the Midwest
    The problem with AOC is that she, like a lot of left wing Democrats, doesn't understand basic economics.

    The solution to a housing crisis is more housing, not attempting to suppress prices (which results in less housing).

    The "Abundance" Democrats get this. Newsom, while a slimy toad, also gets this.

    AOC, Mamdami, Sanders and much of the Democrat left do not.

    Is that true of Mamdani ?
    For a socialist, he seems relatively pragmatic - and is planning to finance quite a lot of home construction.

    Not my politics, but he's more real world than quite a lot of the US left.
    Sadly, yes.

    I find it staggering that a policy that has been tried thousands upon thousands of times, and yet has worked exactly... never... keeps being trotted out.

    Jon Stewart, for what it's worth, also seems infected with the same fundamental disease: https://open.substack.com/pub/theargument/p/jon-stewart-has-become-his-own-worst
    The old joke is that not even economists understand economics, which hardly incentivises anyone else to learn about it as they think it is all just vibes and ideological theorising.

    I don't understand economics and so don't think I could ever justifiably seem to help run even a local council, but it is qutie notable how economic ideas from politicians very often end up with 'It sounds like it might work/it has the right motivation' as a primary justiication. Or appear to be based on an assumption that economic factors can be perfectly controlled by political decisions, adding x here or regulating y there, with near-immediate and direct correlation, which can also be swiftly reversed if you wanted.

    IDK, that seems implausible to me, but hey, I'm not an economist.
    That thinking falls down on the linear vs non-linear issue. Humans and their works are, generally, non-linear. Layers of chaos and order (see the Mandlebrot set).

    Attempting to control a non-linear system with a linear rule set often end up with complete failure.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 36,722
    algarkirk said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The first Harry Potter book is rather good.

    I'd forgotten.

    The first few are OK. But 5, 6 and 7 get overlong and over complex to no great purpose.

    Just as her detective stuff (Galbraith) is OK but mostly too long. Like Dickens when she goes outside her good range she is a bit unreadable - of which the most egregious is, IIRC, The Ink Black Heart. This feels like the longest and dullest book ever written. The last time I looked - I may not be up to date - she had extended a 'will they won't they' romance to about 9,000 pages and still going.

    I read the first Galbraith book and enjoyed it. Then tried the second and agree, went on too long.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 31,324
    Foxy said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Foxy said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The first Harry Potter book is rather good.

    I'd forgotten.

    Second and third are also very good. Prisoner is the highpoint. After that they were bloated and needed a good edit and lost their sense of fun.
    I'm ok with them getting darker... I just wish Ms Rowling had been willing to take more input from her editor.
    The first 3 books have dark moments and themes, but also keep the sense of fun and hijinks needed for a boarding school set book.
    The books are written for the ages the kids are in them.
    It's therefore no surprise they get darker.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 57,892
    From hero to zero...
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 55,124
    dixiedean said:

    Foxy said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Foxy said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The first Harry Potter book is rather good.

    I'd forgotten.

    Second and third are also very good. Prisoner is the highpoint. After that they were bloated and needed a good edit and lost their sense of fun.
    I'm ok with them getting darker... I just wish Ms Rowling had been willing to take more input from her editor.
    The first 3 books have dark moments and themes, but also keep the sense of fun and hijinks needed for a boarding school set book.
    The books are written for the ages the kids are in them.
    It's therefore no surprise they get darker.
    Don't teenagers have fun?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 63,232
    kle4 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    Battlebus said:

    How about a non-controversial issue that rarely gets mentioned on PB? And what odds for her running in 2028?

    Ocasio-Cortez says ‘unconditional’ US aid to Israel ‘enabled a genocide in Gaza’

    https://thehill.com/homenews/house/5738391-ocasio-cortez-israel-gaza-genocide-biden/

    The odds on her being the Democrat candidate is 11.5 (9%) on Betfair.
    Second favourite behind Newsom.

    I think the dream ticket for the Dems is Newsom with AOC as his VP.
    Newsom provides the look (white, male, tall, presidential) and a strategy that can widen the appeal beyond the core.
    AOC provides the fire and energy that will get out the core vote.
    Width and depth.
    Dream ticket for Vance you mean! An arrogant rich California Democrat as their nominee with a far left woke Israel hater from New York as his running mate is guaranteed to turn middle America off.

    Buttigieg or Shapiro or Beshear might worry Vance and the GOP, Newsom and AOC would not
    Almost anyone could beat Vance, assuming fair election in 2028.
    Perhaps if Trump's approval ratings continue to be in the toilet but Vance is clever and ruthless and grew up in poverty in Ohio, which was the ultimate swing state until 2020 and got himself to the 2nd most powerful job in the land by cunning and hard work.

    Gavin Newsom's father meanwhile was attorney for Getty Oil and AOC's father was an architect and neither have shown any ability to connect with swing voters in the rustbelt, they have only been elected in safe Democrat states.

    AOC has dropped her pronouns and has adopted Bernie Sanders priorities, in particular, cost of living.

    A 2025 AtlasIntel poll found her to be one of only three major political leaders with a net positive image, with 46% of Americans viewing her positively compared to 44% negatively.

    AOC recently toured Arizona and Nevada with Bernie Sanders, where they attracted record-breaking crowds (including 34,000 in Denver, Colorado).

    A July 2025 poll of "Biden skippers"—voters in battleground states who sat out the 2024 election—found that 78% had a favorable view of Bernie Sanders, the highest of any Democratic-aligned figure.

    I'm not suggesting her for President - too young, short, woman, brown - but as a VP complement to Newsom (tall, white, male, presidential). It's a ticket that reaches Bernie Sanders supporters. AOC is young enough to bide her time as VP for two terms if necessary.

    It's a strong combination.
    I think AOC would be a good VP candidate although she may choose to bide her time so that she can run either in 2032/2036 when she would be (I think) 45-50.

    AOC + Newsom would be a disaster - reinforces the coastal state narrative
    I think State of origen is a bit exagerrated in importance. How much did having Walz on the ticket help Harris in the Midwest?

    Trump is New York to the core yet wins in Alabama, and does anyone realistically think Buttigeig could flip Indiana or Beshar flip Kentucky?
    Comparing the two Trump wins:

    Minnesota
    2016 Clinton +1.52%
    2024 Harris +4.24%

    Michigan
    2016 Trump +0.23%
    2024 Trump +1.42%

    Pennsylvania
    2016 Trump +0.72%
    2024 Trump +1.71%

    Wisconsin
    2016 Trump +0.77%
    2024 Trump +0.86%

    Compared with California

    2016 Clinton +30.11%
    2024 Harris +20.24%

    Suggests that Walz did help in the rust belt states, especially his home Minnesota.

    Certainly more than Harris did in either California or adjacent Nevada and Arizona.

    I am not saying that there is no effect (though it does seem only significant in home state) just that it is only one consideration amongst many.

    I am a big AOC fan but I think the Dems need a more centrist candidate in 2028.
    The issue is more with Newsom and AOC both appealing to a core democrat audience. They need someone who can reach out to the Midwest
    The problem with AOC is that she, like a lot of left wing Democrats, doesn't understand basic economics.

    The solution to a housing crisis is more housing, not attempting to suppress prices (which results in less housing).

    The "Abundance" Democrats get this. Newsom, while a slimy toad, also gets this.

    AOC, Mamdami, Sanders and much of the Democrat left do not.

    Is that true of Mamdani ?
    For a socialist, he seems relatively pragmatic - and is planning to finance quite a lot of home construction.

    Not my politics, but he's more real world than quite a lot of the US left.
    Sadly, yes.

    I find it staggering that a policy that has been tried thousands upon thousands of times, and yet has worked exactly... never... keeps being trotted out.

    Jon Stewart, for what it's worth, also seems infected with the same fundamental disease: https://open.substack.com/pub/theargument/p/jon-stewart-has-become-his-own-worst
    The old joke is that not even economists understand economics, which hardly incentivises anyone else to learn about it as they think it is all just vibes and ideological theorising.

    I don't understand economics and so don't think I could ever justifiably seem to help run even a local council, but it is qutie notable how economic ideas from politicians very often end up with 'It sounds like it might work/it has the right motivation' as a primary justiication. Or appear to be based on an assumption that economic factors can be perfectly controlled by political decisions, adding x here or regulating y there, with near-immediate and direct correlation, which can also be swiftly reversed if you wanted.

    IDK, that seems implausible to me, but hey, I'm not an economist.
    Here you go:

    "People respond to invectives.

    The rest is filler."

    You are now an economist.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 101,161
    rcs1000 said:

    kle4 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    Battlebus said:

    How about a non-controversial issue that rarely gets mentioned on PB? And what odds for her running in 2028?

    Ocasio-Cortez says ‘unconditional’ US aid to Israel ‘enabled a genocide in Gaza’

    https://thehill.com/homenews/house/5738391-ocasio-cortez-israel-gaza-genocide-biden/

    The odds on her being the Democrat candidate is 11.5 (9%) on Betfair.
    Second favourite behind Newsom.

    I think the dream ticket for the Dems is Newsom with AOC as his VP.
    Newsom provides the look (white, male, tall, presidential) and a strategy that can widen the appeal beyond the core.
    AOC provides the fire and energy that will get out the core vote.
    Width and depth.
    Dream ticket for Vance you mean! An arrogant rich California Democrat as their nominee with a far left woke Israel hater from New York as his running mate is guaranteed to turn middle America off.

    Buttigieg or Shapiro or Beshear might worry Vance and the GOP, Newsom and AOC would not
    Almost anyone could beat Vance, assuming fair election in 2028.
    Perhaps if Trump's approval ratings continue to be in the toilet but Vance is clever and ruthless and grew up in poverty in Ohio, which was the ultimate swing state until 2020 and got himself to the 2nd most powerful job in the land by cunning and hard work.

    Gavin Newsom's father meanwhile was attorney for Getty Oil and AOC's father was an architect and neither have shown any ability to connect with swing voters in the rustbelt, they have only been elected in safe Democrat states.

    AOC has dropped her pronouns and has adopted Bernie Sanders priorities, in particular, cost of living.

    A 2025 AtlasIntel poll found her to be one of only three major political leaders with a net positive image, with 46% of Americans viewing her positively compared to 44% negatively.

    AOC recently toured Arizona and Nevada with Bernie Sanders, where they attracted record-breaking crowds (including 34,000 in Denver, Colorado).

    A July 2025 poll of "Biden skippers"—voters in battleground states who sat out the 2024 election—found that 78% had a favorable view of Bernie Sanders, the highest of any Democratic-aligned figure.

    I'm not suggesting her for President - too young, short, woman, brown - but as a VP complement to Newsom (tall, white, male, presidential). It's a ticket that reaches Bernie Sanders supporters. AOC is young enough to bide her time as VP for two terms if necessary.

    It's a strong combination.
    I think AOC would be a good VP candidate although she may choose to bide her time so that she can run either in 2032/2036 when she would be (I think) 45-50.

    AOC + Newsom would be a disaster - reinforces the coastal state narrative
    I think State of origen is a bit exagerrated in importance. How much did having Walz on the ticket help Harris in the Midwest?

    Trump is New York to the core yet wins in Alabama, and does anyone realistically think Buttigeig could flip Indiana or Beshar flip Kentucky?
    Comparing the two Trump wins:

    Minnesota
    2016 Clinton +1.52%
    2024 Harris +4.24%

    Michigan
    2016 Trump +0.23%
    2024 Trump +1.42%

    Pennsylvania
    2016 Trump +0.72%
    2024 Trump +1.71%

    Wisconsin
    2016 Trump +0.77%
    2024 Trump +0.86%

    Compared with California

    2016 Clinton +30.11%
    2024 Harris +20.24%

    Suggests that Walz did help in the rust belt states, especially his home Minnesota.

    Certainly more than Harris did in either California or adjacent Nevada and Arizona.

    I am not saying that there is no effect (though it does seem only significant in home state) just that it is only one consideration amongst many.

    I am a big AOC fan but I think the Dems need a more centrist candidate in 2028.
    The issue is more with Newsom and AOC both appealing to a core democrat audience. They need someone who can reach out to the Midwest
    The problem with AOC is that she, like a lot of left wing Democrats, doesn't understand basic economics.

    The solution to a housing crisis is more housing, not attempting to suppress prices (which results in less housing).

    The "Abundance" Democrats get this. Newsom, while a slimy toad, also gets this.

    AOC, Mamdami, Sanders and much of the Democrat left do not.

    Is that true of Mamdani ?
    For a socialist, he seems relatively pragmatic - and is planning to finance quite a lot of home construction.

    Not my politics, but he's more real world than quite a lot of the US left.
    Sadly, yes.

    I find it staggering that a policy that has been tried thousands upon thousands of times, and yet has worked exactly... never... keeps being trotted out.

    Jon Stewart, for what it's worth, also seems infected with the same fundamental disease: https://open.substack.com/pub/theargument/p/jon-stewart-has-become-his-own-worst
    The old joke is that not even economists understand economics, which hardly incentivises anyone else to learn about it as they think it is all just vibes and ideological theorising.

    I don't understand economics and so don't think I could ever justifiably seem to help run even a local council, but it is qutie notable how economic ideas from politicians very often end up with 'It sounds like it might work/it has the right motivation' as a primary justiication. Or appear to be based on an assumption that economic factors can be perfectly controlled by political decisions, adding x here or regulating y there, with near-immediate and direct correlation, which can also be swiftly reversed if you wanted.

    IDK, that seems implausible to me, but hey, I'm not an economist.
    Here you go:

    "People respond to invectives.

    The rest is filler."

    You are now an economist.
    Thank you, sensei.

    You should put that up on your old youtube channel.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 55,124
    rcs1000 said:

    kle4 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    Battlebus said:

    How about a non-controversial issue that rarely gets mentioned on PB? And what odds for her running in 2028?

    Ocasio-Cortez says ‘unconditional’ US aid to Israel ‘enabled a genocide in Gaza’

    https://thehill.com/homenews/house/5738391-ocasio-cortez-israel-gaza-genocide-biden/

    The odds on her being the Democrat candidate is 11.5 (9%) on Betfair.
    Second favourite behind Newsom.

    I think the dream ticket for the Dems is Newsom with AOC as his VP.
    Newsom provides the look (white, male, tall, presidential) and a strategy that can widen the appeal beyond the core.
    AOC provides the fire and energy that will get out the core vote.
    Width and depth.
    Dream ticket for Vance you mean! An arrogant rich California Democrat as their nominee with a far left woke Israel hater from New York as his running mate is guaranteed to turn middle America off.

    Buttigieg or Shapiro or Beshear might worry Vance and the GOP, Newsom and AOC would not
    Almost anyone could beat Vance, assuming fair election in 2028.
    Perhaps if Trump's approval ratings continue to be in the toilet but Vance is clever and ruthless and grew up in poverty in Ohio, which was the ultimate swing state until 2020 and got himself to the 2nd most powerful job in the land by cunning and hard work.

    Gavin Newsom's father meanwhile was attorney for Getty Oil and AOC's father was an architect and neither have shown any ability to connect with swing voters in the rustbelt, they have only been elected in safe Democrat states.

    AOC has dropped her pronouns and has adopted Bernie Sanders priorities, in particular, cost of living.

    A 2025 AtlasIntel poll found her to be one of only three major political leaders with a net positive image, with 46% of Americans viewing her positively compared to 44% negatively.

    AOC recently toured Arizona and Nevada with Bernie Sanders, where they attracted record-breaking crowds (including 34,000 in Denver, Colorado).

    A July 2025 poll of "Biden skippers"—voters in battleground states who sat out the 2024 election—found that 78% had a favorable view of Bernie Sanders, the highest of any Democratic-aligned figure.

    I'm not suggesting her for President - too young, short, woman, brown - but as a VP complement to Newsom (tall, white, male, presidential). It's a ticket that reaches Bernie Sanders supporters. AOC is young enough to bide her time as VP for two terms if necessary.

    It's a strong combination.
    I think AOC would be a good VP candidate although she may choose to bide her time so that she can run either in 2032/2036 when she would be (I think) 45-50.

    AOC + Newsom would be a disaster - reinforces the coastal state narrative
    I think State of origen is a bit exagerrated in importance. How much did having Walz on the ticket help Harris in the Midwest?

    Trump is New York to the core yet wins in Alabama, and does anyone realistically think Buttigeig could flip Indiana or Beshar flip Kentucky?
    Comparing the two Trump wins:

    Minnesota
    2016 Clinton +1.52%
    2024 Harris +4.24%

    Michigan
    2016 Trump +0.23%
    2024 Trump +1.42%

    Pennsylvania
    2016 Trump +0.72%
    2024 Trump +1.71%

    Wisconsin
    2016 Trump +0.77%
    2024 Trump +0.86%

    Compared with California

    2016 Clinton +30.11%
    2024 Harris +20.24%

    Suggests that Walz did help in the rust belt states, especially his home Minnesota.

    Certainly more than Harris did in either California or adjacent Nevada and Arizona.

    I am not saying that there is no effect (though it does seem only significant in home state) just that it is only one consideration amongst many.

    I am a big AOC fan but I think the Dems need a more centrist candidate in 2028.
    The issue is more with Newsom and AOC both appealing to a core democrat audience. They need someone who can reach out to the Midwest
    The problem with AOC is that she, like a lot of left wing Democrats, doesn't understand basic economics.

    The solution to a housing crisis is more housing, not attempting to suppress prices (which results in less housing).

    The "Abundance" Democrats get this. Newsom, while a slimy toad, also gets this.

    AOC, Mamdami, Sanders and much of the Democrat left do not.

    Is that true of Mamdani ?
    For a socialist, he seems relatively pragmatic - and is planning to finance quite a lot of home construction.

    Not my politics, but he's more real world than quite a lot of the US left.
    Sadly, yes.

    I find it staggering that a policy that has been tried thousands upon thousands of times, and yet has worked exactly... never... keeps being trotted out.

    Jon Stewart, for what it's worth, also seems infected with the same fundamental disease: https://open.substack.com/pub/theargument/p/jon-stewart-has-become-his-own-worst
    The old joke is that not even economists understand economics, which hardly incentivises anyone else to learn about it as they think it is all just vibes and ideological theorising.

    I don't understand economics and so don't think I could ever justifiably seem to help run even a local council, but it is qutie notable how economic ideas from politicians very often end up with 'It sounds like it might work/it has the right motivation' as a primary justiication. Or appear to be based on an assumption that economic factors can be perfectly controlled by political decisions, adding x here or regulating y there, with near-immediate and direct correlation, which can also be swiftly reversed if you wanted.

    IDK, that seems implausible to me, but hey, I'm not an economist.
    Here you go:

    "People respond to invectives.

    The rest is filler."

    You are now an economist.
    You are @malcolmg and I claim my £5
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 55,124
    kle4 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Gisèle Pelicot tells BBC: I felt crushed by horror - but I don't feel anger"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c9q5l22ryy4o

    Tremendously brave woman. There's a lot of darkness still going on in communities, especially against women, which seems to be both hidden from general view, but also shockingly common.
    The case of the ex-Tory councillor going on at the moment shows that the Pelicot case is not as unique as we may like.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 16,078
    Afternoon all :)

    Khan seems to attract the same level of visceral contempt among some usually reserved for Starmer or Reeves.

    One might argue it's because he's had the temerity to beat the Conservatives three times but this is London and while you could argue it was a Conservative city as recently as 1992 (and Boris won twice, albeit against a discredited Ken Livingstone), it is no longer.

    It's probably not unreasonable to question the calibre of the losing Conservative candidates and Susan Hall won the primary last time, arguably against the odds, and also won the election before the ballot boxes were open and the results counted. Unfortunately, once the boxes were open, the democratic process told a different story.

    Those who think Seb Coe or James Cleverley is the answer probably haven't worked out the question. The local elections will be fascinating inasmuch as they will likely show the political fragmentation of London between five political parties (six if you count the various Independents). The notion Khan could be re-elected on 30% of the vote isn't fanciful IF we retain FPTP for the 2028 contest. His position would be likely improved if the supplementary vote were re-introduced and especially if Reform finished second as I suspect the bulk of the LD and Green second preferences would go to him rather than to Laila Cunningham or to the Conservative hopeful.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 39,306
    edited 5:31PM
    Isn't it fascinating when a film gets differing review from the critic and the public?

    For instance, this is The Bodygard from 1992 featuring Whitney Houston and Kevin Costner.

    Critics 38%
    Public 64%

    https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/the_bodyguard_1992
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 63,232

    rcs1000 said:

    kle4 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    Battlebus said:

    How about a non-controversial issue that rarely gets mentioned on PB? And what odds for her running in 2028?

    Ocasio-Cortez says ‘unconditional’ US aid to Israel ‘enabled a genocide in Gaza’

    https://thehill.com/homenews/house/5738391-ocasio-cortez-israel-gaza-genocide-biden/

    The odds on her being the Democrat candidate is 11.5 (9%) on Betfair.
    Second favourite behind Newsom.

    I think the dream ticket for the Dems is Newsom with AOC as his VP.
    Newsom provides the look (white, male, tall, presidential) and a strategy that can widen the appeal beyond the core.
    AOC provides the fire and energy that will get out the core vote.
    Width and depth.
    Dream ticket for Vance you mean! An arrogant rich California Democrat as their nominee with a far left woke Israel hater from New York as his running mate is guaranteed to turn middle America off.

    Buttigieg or Shapiro or Beshear might worry Vance and the GOP, Newsom and AOC would not
    Almost anyone could beat Vance, assuming fair election in 2028.
    Perhaps if Trump's approval ratings continue to be in the toilet but Vance is clever and ruthless and grew up in poverty in Ohio, which was the ultimate swing state until 2020 and got himself to the 2nd most powerful job in the land by cunning and hard work.

    Gavin Newsom's father meanwhile was attorney for Getty Oil and AOC's father was an architect and neither have shown any ability to connect with swing voters in the rustbelt, they have only been elected in safe Democrat states.

    AOC has dropped her pronouns and has adopted Bernie Sanders priorities, in particular, cost of living.

    A 2025 AtlasIntel poll found her to be one of only three major political leaders with a net positive image, with 46% of Americans viewing her positively compared to 44% negatively.

    AOC recently toured Arizona and Nevada with Bernie Sanders, where they attracted record-breaking crowds (including 34,000 in Denver, Colorado).

    A July 2025 poll of "Biden skippers"—voters in battleground states who sat out the 2024 election—found that 78% had a favorable view of Bernie Sanders, the highest of any Democratic-aligned figure.

    I'm not suggesting her for President - too young, short, woman, brown - but as a VP complement to Newsom (tall, white, male, presidential). It's a ticket that reaches Bernie Sanders supporters. AOC is young enough to bide her time as VP for two terms if necessary.

    It's a strong combination.
    I think AOC would be a good VP candidate although she may choose to bide her time so that she can run either in 2032/2036 when she would be (I think) 45-50.

    AOC + Newsom would be a disaster - reinforces the coastal state narrative
    I think State of origen is a bit exagerrated in importance. How much did having Walz on the ticket help Harris in the Midwest?

    Trump is New York to the core yet wins in Alabama, and does anyone realistically think Buttigeig could flip Indiana or Beshar flip Kentucky?
    Comparing the two Trump wins:

    Minnesota
    2016 Clinton +1.52%
    2024 Harris +4.24%

    Michigan
    2016 Trump +0.23%
    2024 Trump +1.42%

    Pennsylvania
    2016 Trump +0.72%
    2024 Trump +1.71%

    Wisconsin
    2016 Trump +0.77%
    2024 Trump +0.86%

    Compared with California

    2016 Clinton +30.11%
    2024 Harris +20.24%

    Suggests that Walz did help in the rust belt states, especially his home Minnesota.

    Certainly more than Harris did in either California or adjacent Nevada and Arizona.

    I am not saying that there is no effect (though it does seem only significant in home state) just that it is only one consideration amongst many.

    I am a big AOC fan but I think the Dems need a more centrist candidate in 2028.
    The issue is more with Newsom and AOC both appealing to a core democrat audience. They need someone who can reach out to the Midwest
    The problem with AOC is that she, like a lot of left wing Democrats, doesn't understand basic economics.

    The solution to a housing crisis is more housing, not attempting to suppress prices (which results in less housing).

    The "Abundance" Democrats get this. Newsom, while a slimy toad, also gets this.

    AOC, Mamdami, Sanders and much of the Democrat left do not.

    Is that true of Mamdani ?
    For a socialist, he seems relatively pragmatic - and is planning to finance quite a lot of home construction.

    Not my politics, but he's more real world than quite a lot of the US left.
    Sadly, yes.

    I find it staggering that a policy that has been tried thousands upon thousands of times, and yet has worked exactly... never... keeps being trotted out.

    Jon Stewart, for what it's worth, also seems infected with the same fundamental disease: https://open.substack.com/pub/theargument/p/jon-stewart-has-become-his-own-worst
    The old joke is that not even economists understand economics, which hardly incentivises anyone else to learn about it as they think it is all just vibes and ideological theorising.

    I don't understand economics and so don't think I could ever justifiably seem to help run even a local council, but it is qutie notable how economic ideas from politicians very often end up with 'It sounds like it might work/it has the right motivation' as a primary justiication. Or appear to be based on an assumption that economic factors can be perfectly controlled by political decisions, adding x here or regulating y there, with near-immediate and direct correlation, which can also be swiftly reversed if you wanted.

    IDK, that seems implausible to me, but hey, I'm not an economist.
    Here you go:

    "People respond to invectives.

    The rest is filler."

    You are now an economist.
    People respond to invectives? Fuck off.
    Oh man, I'm on my phone using flow typing...

    People respond to incentives!
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 57,892

    Italy could beat Scotland, Ireland and Wales

    On this form, England too...
  • isamisam Posts: 43,618
    Brixian59 said:

    Been doing a bit of 'how screwed are Labour?' Research on local by elections since May 2025.
    Labour are the only English main party not to hit 50% in a single election since then and have exceeded 40% only 7 times out of 208. In 18 of the 64 wards they defended they achieved less than 20% (more than they held). They have not gained a single ward, anywhere.

    May has the capacity to be an astonishingly brutal night for them

    May be you would be better to look at Government vote share in mid term year 2 and 3 over the past 25 years

    All May will be is a sample in time.

    It will have no bearing on the 2929 GE

    Furthermore how screwed will the Tories be, off there worst GE result in 100 years, how much will they have increased vote share from that abysmal low point.

    Typical Blairite, using current data to forecast what will happen in nine hundred years time
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 18,771
    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    Battlebus said:

    How about a non-controversial issue that rarely gets mentioned on PB? And what odds for her running in 2028?

    Ocasio-Cortez says ‘unconditional’ US aid to Israel ‘enabled a genocide in Gaza’

    https://thehill.com/homenews/house/5738391-ocasio-cortez-israel-gaza-genocide-biden/

    The odds on her being the Democrat candidate is 11.5 (9%) on Betfair.
    Second favourite behind Newsom.

    I think the dream ticket for the Dems is Newsom with AOC as his VP.
    Newsom provides the look (white, male, tall, presidential) and a strategy that can widen the appeal beyond the core.
    AOC provides the fire and energy that will get out the core vote.
    Width and depth.
    Dream ticket for Vance you mean! An arrogant rich California Democrat as their nominee with a far left woke Israel hater from New York as his running mate is guaranteed to turn middle America off.

    Buttigieg or Shapiro or Beshear might worry Vance and the GOP, Newsom and AOC would not
    Almost anyone could beat Vance, assuming fair election in 2028.
    Perhaps if Trump's approval ratings continue to be in the toilet but Vance is clever and ruthless and grew up in poverty in Ohio, which was the ultimate swing state until 2020 and got himself to the 2nd most powerful job in the land by cunning and hard work.

    Gavin Newsom's father meanwhile was attorney for Getty Oil and AOC's father was an architect and neither have shown any ability to connect with swing voters in the rustbelt, they have only been elected in safe Democrat states.

    AOC has dropped her pronouns and has adopted Bernie Sanders priorities, in particular, cost of living.

    A 2025 AtlasIntel poll found her to be one of only three major political leaders with a net positive image, with 46% of Americans viewing her positively compared to 44% negatively.

    AOC recently toured Arizona and Nevada with Bernie Sanders, where they attracted record-breaking crowds (including 34,000 in Denver, Colorado).

    A July 2025 poll of "Biden skippers"—voters in battleground states who sat out the 2024 election—found that 78% had a favorable view of Bernie Sanders, the highest of any Democratic-aligned figure.

    I'm not suggesting her for President - too young, short, woman, brown - but as a VP complement to Newsom (tall, white, male, presidential). It's a ticket that reaches Bernie Sanders supporters. AOC is young enough to bide her time as VP for two terms if necessary.

    It's a strong combination.
    I think AOC would be a good VP candidate although she may choose to bide her time so that she can run either in 2032/2036 when she would be (I think) 45-50.

    AOC + Newsom would be a disaster - reinforces the coastal state narrative
    I think State of origen is a bit exagerrated in importance. How much did having Walz on the ticket help Harris in the Midwest?

    Trump is New York to the core yet wins in Alabama, and does anyone realistically think Buttigeig could flip Indiana or Beshar flip Kentucky?
    Comparing the two Trump wins:

    Minnesota
    2016 Clinton +1.52%
    2024 Harris +4.24%

    Michigan
    2016 Trump +0.23%
    2024 Trump +1.42%

    Pennsylvania
    2016 Trump +0.72%
    2024 Trump +1.71%

    Wisconsin
    2016 Trump +0.77%
    2024 Trump +0.86%

    Compared with California

    2016 Clinton +30.11%
    2024 Harris +20.24%

    Suggests that Walz did help in the rust belt states, especially his home Minnesota.

    Certainly more than Harris did in either California or adjacent Nevada and Arizona.

    I am not saying that there is no effect (though it does seem only significant in home state) just that it is only one consideration amongst many.

    I am a big AOC fan but I think the Dems need a more centrist candidate in 2028.
    The issue is more with Newsom and AOC both appealing to a core democrat audience. They need someone who can reach out to the Midwest
    The problem with AOC is that she, like a lot of left wing Democrats, doesn't understand basic economics.

    The solution to a housing crisis is more housing, not attempting to suppress prices (which results in less housing).

    The "Abundance" Democrats get this. Newsom, while a slimy toad, also gets this.

    AOC, Mamdami, Sanders and much of the Democrat left do not.

    Is that true of Mamdani ?
    For a socialist, he seems relatively pragmatic - and is planning to finance quite a lot of home construction.

    Not my politics, but he's more real world than quite a lot of the US left.
    Sadly, yes.

    I find it staggering that a policy that has been tried thousands upon thousands of times, and yet has worked exactly... never... keeps being trotted out.

    Jon Stewart, for what it's worth, also seems infected with the same fundamental disease: https://open.substack.com/pub/theargument/p/jon-stewart-has-become-his-own-worst
    There are many policies that are tried thousands upon thousands of times and never work… Tough sentencing. Trickle down. Cutting taxes to increase the tax take. Finding efficiency savings to plug whatever fiscal gap you want.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 59,963

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    Battlebus said:

    How about a non-controversial issue that rarely gets mentioned on PB? And what odds for her running in 2028?

    Ocasio-Cortez says ‘unconditional’ US aid to Israel ‘enabled a genocide in Gaza’

    https://thehill.com/homenews/house/5738391-ocasio-cortez-israel-gaza-genocide-biden/

    The odds on her being the Democrat candidate is 11.5 (9%) on Betfair.
    Second favourite behind Newsom.

    I think the dream ticket for the Dems is Newsom with AOC as his VP.
    Newsom provides the look (white, male, tall, presidential) and a strategy that can widen the appeal beyond the core.
    AOC provides the fire and energy that will get out the core vote.
    Width and depth.
    Dream ticket for Vance you mean! An arrogant rich California Democrat as their nominee with a far left woke Israel hater from New York as his running mate is guaranteed to turn middle America off.

    Buttigieg or Shapiro or Beshear might worry Vance and the GOP, Newsom and AOC would not
    Almost anyone could beat Vance, assuming fair election in 2028.
    Perhaps if Trump's approval ratings continue to be in the toilet but Vance is clever and ruthless and grew up in poverty in Ohio, which was the ultimate swing state until 2020 and got himself to the 2nd most powerful job in the land by cunning and hard work.

    Gavin Newsom's father meanwhile was attorney for Getty Oil and AOC's father was an architect and neither have shown any ability to connect with swing voters in the rustbelt, they have only been elected in safe Democrat states.

    AOC has dropped her pronouns and has adopted Bernie Sanders priorities, in particular, cost of living.

    A 2025 AtlasIntel poll found her to be one of only three major political leaders with a net positive image, with 46% of Americans viewing her positively compared to 44% negatively.

    AOC recently toured Arizona and Nevada with Bernie Sanders, where they attracted record-breaking crowds (including 34,000 in Denver, Colorado).

    A July 2025 poll of "Biden skippers"—voters in battleground states who sat out the 2024 election—found that 78% had a favorable view of Bernie Sanders, the highest of any Democratic-aligned figure.

    I'm not suggesting her for President - too young, short, woman, brown - but as a VP complement to Newsom (tall, white, male, presidential). It's a ticket that reaches Bernie Sanders supporters. AOC is young enough to bide her time as VP for two terms if necessary.

    It's a strong combination.
    I think AOC would be a good VP candidate although she may choose to bide her time so that she can run either in 2032/2036 when she would be (I think) 45-50.

    AOC + Newsom would be a disaster - reinforces the coastal state narrative
    I think State of origen is a bit exagerrated in importance. How much did having Walz on the ticket help Harris in the Midwest?

    Trump is New York to the core yet wins in Alabama, and does anyone realistically think Buttigeig could flip Indiana or Beshar flip Kentucky?
    Comparing the two Trump wins:

    Minnesota
    2016 Clinton +1.52%
    2024 Harris +4.24%

    Michigan
    2016 Trump +0.23%
    2024 Trump +1.42%

    Pennsylvania
    2016 Trump +0.72%
    2024 Trump +1.71%

    Wisconsin
    2016 Trump +0.77%
    2024 Trump +0.86%

    Compared with California

    2016 Clinton +30.11%
    2024 Harris +20.24%

    Suggests that Walz did help in the rust belt states, especially his home Minnesota.

    Certainly more than Harris did in either California or adjacent Nevada and Arizona.

    I am not saying that there is no effect (though it does seem only significant in home state) just that it is only one consideration amongst many.

    I am a big AOC fan but I think the Dems need a more centrist candidate in 2028.
    The issue is more with Newsom and AOC both appealing to a core democrat audience. They need someone who can reach out to the Midwest
    The problem with AOC is that she, like a lot of left wing Democrats, doesn't understand basic economics.

    The solution to a housing crisis is more housing, not attempting to suppress prices (which results in less housing).

    The "Abundance" Democrats get this. Newsom, while a slimy toad, also gets this.

    AOC, Mamdami, Sanders and much of the Democrat left do not.

    Is that true of Mamdani ?
    For a socialist, he seems relatively pragmatic - and is planning to finance quite a lot of home construction.

    Not my politics, but he's more real world than quite a lot of the US left.
    Sadly, yes.

    I find it staggering that a policy that has been tried thousands upon thousands of times, and yet has worked exactly... never... keeps being trotted out.

    Jon Stewart, for what it's worth, also seems infected with the same fundamental disease: https://open.substack.com/pub/theargument/p/jon-stewart-has-become-his-own-worst
    Rent Control might be the poster child for Populist Politics.

    - Someone else will pay
    - That someone is someone else we don't like
    - There are claimed to be no downsides.
    - The policy won't work and will actually make things worse.
    Taxing unrealised capital gains “wealth” is giving it a good run for its money at the moment.

    That will also never work, and drives the top taxpayers away. See California, and the Netherlands.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 24,445
    kle4 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    Battlebus said:

    How about a non-controversial issue that rarely gets mentioned on PB? And what odds for her running in 2028?

    Ocasio-Cortez says ‘unconditional’ US aid to Israel ‘enabled a genocide in Gaza’

    https://thehill.com/homenews/house/5738391-ocasio-cortez-israel-gaza-genocide-biden/

    The odds on her being the Democrat candidate is 11.5 (9%) on Betfair.
    Second favourite behind Newsom.

    I think the dream ticket for the Dems is Newsom with AOC as his VP.
    Newsom provides the look (white, male, tall, presidential) and a strategy that can widen the appeal beyond the core.
    AOC provides the fire and energy that will get out the core vote.
    Width and depth.
    Dream ticket for Vance you mean! An arrogant rich California Democrat as their nominee with a far left woke Israel hater from New York as his running mate is guaranteed to turn middle America off.

    Buttigieg or Shapiro or Beshear might worry Vance and the GOP, Newsom and AOC would not
    Almost anyone could beat Vance, assuming fair election in 2028.
    Perhaps if Trump's approval ratings continue to be in the toilet but Vance is clever and ruthless and grew up in poverty in Ohio, which was the ultimate swing state until 2020 and got himself to the 2nd most powerful job in the land by cunning and hard work.

    Gavin Newsom's father meanwhile was attorney for Getty Oil and AOC's father was an architect and neither have shown any ability to connect with swing voters in the rustbelt, they have only been elected in safe Democrat states.

    AOC has dropped her pronouns and has adopted Bernie Sanders priorities, in particular, cost of living.

    A 2025 AtlasIntel poll found her to be one of only three major political leaders with a net positive image, with 46% of Americans viewing her positively compared to 44% negatively.

    AOC recently toured Arizona and Nevada with Bernie Sanders, where they attracted record-breaking crowds (including 34,000 in Denver, Colorado).

    A July 2025 poll of "Biden skippers"—voters in battleground states who sat out the 2024 election—found that 78% had a favorable view of Bernie Sanders, the highest of any Democratic-aligned figure.

    I'm not suggesting her for President - too young, short, woman, brown - but as a VP complement to Newsom (tall, white, male, presidential). It's a ticket that reaches Bernie Sanders supporters. AOC is young enough to bide her time as VP for two terms if necessary.

    It's a strong combination.
    I think AOC would be a good VP candidate although she may choose to bide her time so that she can run either in 2032/2036 when she would be (I think) 45-50.

    AOC + Newsom would be a disaster - reinforces the coastal state narrative
    I think State of origen is a bit exagerrated in importance. How much did having Walz on the ticket help Harris in the Midwest?

    Trump is New York to the core yet wins in Alabama, and does anyone realistically think Buttigeig could flip Indiana or Beshar flip Kentucky?
    Comparing the two Trump wins:

    Minnesota
    2016 Clinton +1.52%
    2024 Harris +4.24%

    Michigan
    2016 Trump +0.23%
    2024 Trump +1.42%

    Pennsylvania
    2016 Trump +0.72%
    2024 Trump +1.71%

    Wisconsin
    2016 Trump +0.77%
    2024 Trump +0.86%

    Compared with California

    2016 Clinton +30.11%
    2024 Harris +20.24%

    Suggests that Walz did help in the rust belt states, especially his home Minnesota.

    Certainly more than Harris did in either California or adjacent Nevada and Arizona.

    I am not saying that there is no effect (though it does seem only significant in home state) just that it is only one consideration amongst many.

    I am a big AOC fan but I think the Dems need a more centrist candidate in 2028.
    The issue is more with Newsom and AOC both appealing to a core democrat audience. They need someone who can reach out to the Midwest
    The problem with AOC is that she, like a lot of left wing Democrats, doesn't understand basic economics.

    The solution to a housing crisis is more housing, not attempting to suppress prices (which results in less housing).

    The "Abundance" Democrats get this. Newsom, while a slimy toad, also gets this.

    AOC, Mamdami, Sanders and much of the Democrat left do not.

    Is that true of Mamdani ?
    For a socialist, he seems relatively pragmatic - and is planning to finance quite a lot of home construction.

    Not my politics, but he's more real world than quite a lot of the US left.
    Sadly, yes.

    I find it staggering that a policy that has been tried thousands upon thousands of times, and yet has worked exactly... never... keeps being trotted out.

    Jon Stewart, for what it's worth, also seems infected with the same fundamental disease: https://open.substack.com/pub/theargument/p/jon-stewart-has-become-his-own-worst
    The old joke is that not even economists understand economics, which hardly incentivises anyone else to learn about it as they think it is all just vibes and ideological theorising.

    I don't understand economics and so don't think I could ever justifiably seem to help run even a local council, but it is qutie notable how economic ideas from politicians very often end up with 'It sounds like it might work/it has the right motivation' as a primary justiication. Or appear to be based on an assumption that economic factors can be perfectly controlled by political decisions, adding x here or regulating y there, with near-immediate and direct correlation, which can also be swiftly reversed if you wanted.

    IDK, that seems implausible to me, but hey, I'm not an economist.
    People are uninformed and/or irrational agents.

    That's why economics is a load of old bollocks.



    (It is also lots of graphs - I had to use a pencil and ruler in my exam.)
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 60,726
    Foxy said:

    rcs1000 said:

    kle4 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    Battlebus said:

    How about a non-controversial issue that rarely gets mentioned on PB? And what odds for her running in 2028?

    Ocasio-Cortez says ‘unconditional’ US aid to Israel ‘enabled a genocide in Gaza’

    https://thehill.com/homenews/house/5738391-ocasio-cortez-israel-gaza-genocide-biden/

    The odds on her being the Democrat candidate is 11.5 (9%) on Betfair.
    Second favourite behind Newsom.

    I think the dream ticket for the Dems is Newsom with AOC as his VP.
    Newsom provides the look (white, male, tall, presidential) and a strategy that can widen the appeal beyond the core.
    AOC provides the fire and energy that will get out the core vote.
    Width and depth.
    Dream ticket for Vance you mean! An arrogant rich California Democrat as their nominee with a far left woke Israel hater from New York as his running mate is guaranteed to turn middle America off.

    Buttigieg or Shapiro or Beshear might worry Vance and the GOP, Newsom and AOC would not
    Almost anyone could beat Vance, assuming fair election in 2028.
    Perhaps if Trump's approval ratings continue to be in the toilet but Vance is clever and ruthless and grew up in poverty in Ohio, which was the ultimate swing state until 2020 and got himself to the 2nd most powerful job in the land by cunning and hard work.

    Gavin Newsom's father meanwhile was attorney for Getty Oil and AOC's father was an architect and neither have shown any ability to connect with swing voters in the rustbelt, they have only been elected in safe Democrat states.

    AOC has dropped her pronouns and has adopted Bernie Sanders priorities, in particular, cost of living.

    A 2025 AtlasIntel poll found her to be one of only three major political leaders with a net positive image, with 46% of Americans viewing her positively compared to 44% negatively.

    AOC recently toured Arizona and Nevada with Bernie Sanders, where they attracted record-breaking crowds (including 34,000 in Denver, Colorado).

    A July 2025 poll of "Biden skippers"—voters in battleground states who sat out the 2024 election—found that 78% had a favorable view of Bernie Sanders, the highest of any Democratic-aligned figure.

    I'm not suggesting her for President - too young, short, woman, brown - but as a VP complement to Newsom (tall, white, male, presidential). It's a ticket that reaches Bernie Sanders supporters. AOC is young enough to bide her time as VP for two terms if necessary.

    It's a strong combination.
    I think AOC would be a good VP candidate although she may choose to bide her time so that she can run either in 2032/2036 when she would be (I think) 45-50.

    AOC + Newsom would be a disaster - reinforces the coastal state narrative
    I think State of origen is a bit exagerrated in importance. How much did having Walz on the ticket help Harris in the Midwest?

    Trump is New York to the core yet wins in Alabama, and does anyone realistically think Buttigeig could flip Indiana or Beshar flip Kentucky?
    Comparing the two Trump wins:

    Minnesota
    2016 Clinton +1.52%
    2024 Harris +4.24%

    Michigan
    2016 Trump +0.23%
    2024 Trump +1.42%

    Pennsylvania
    2016 Trump +0.72%
    2024 Trump +1.71%

    Wisconsin
    2016 Trump +0.77%
    2024 Trump +0.86%

    Compared with California

    2016 Clinton +30.11%
    2024 Harris +20.24%

    Suggests that Walz did help in the rust belt states, especially his home Minnesota.

    Certainly more than Harris did in either California or adjacent Nevada and Arizona.

    I am not saying that there is no effect (though it does seem only significant in home state) just that it is only one consideration amongst many.

    I am a big AOC fan but I think the Dems need a more centrist candidate in 2028.
    The issue is more with Newsom and AOC both appealing to a core democrat audience. They need someone who can reach out to the Midwest
    The problem with AOC is that she, like a lot of left wing Democrats, doesn't understand basic economics.

    The solution to a housing crisis is more housing, not attempting to suppress prices (which results in less housing).

    The "Abundance" Democrats get this. Newsom, while a slimy toad, also gets this.

    AOC, Mamdami, Sanders and much of the Democrat left do not.

    Is that true of Mamdani ?
    For a socialist, he seems relatively pragmatic - and is planning to finance quite a lot of home construction.

    Not my politics, but he's more real world than quite a lot of the US left.
    Sadly, yes.

    I find it staggering that a policy that has been tried thousands upon thousands of times, and yet has worked exactly... never... keeps being trotted out.

    Jon Stewart, for what it's worth, also seems infected with the same fundamental disease: https://open.substack.com/pub/theargument/p/jon-stewart-has-become-his-own-worst
    The old joke is that not even economists understand economics, which hardly incentivises anyone else to learn about it as they think it is all just vibes and ideological theorising.

    I don't understand economics and so don't think I could ever justifiably seem to help run even a local council, but it is qutie notable how economic ideas from politicians very often end up with 'It sounds like it might work/it has the right motivation' as a primary justiication. Or appear to be based on an assumption that economic factors can be perfectly controlled by political decisions, adding x here or regulating y there, with near-immediate and direct correlation, which can also be swiftly reversed if you wanted.

    IDK, that seems implausible to me, but hey, I'm not an economist.
    Here you go:

    "People respond to invectives.

    The rest is filler."

    You are now an economist.
    You are @malcolmg and I claim my £5
    “ of just exactly forty five pounds!” This last he rapped out with a sidelong glance over his shoulder; and the next moment added, almost with a scream, “Scots!”
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 86,353
    Fans of early English music, 70s concept albums and Pink Floyd might enjoy the track 'Breathe' on this album released to celebrate John Dowland's 400th anniversary.
    https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_lPr9hLr8adIlTbYvk3_YUQ-JyiPiwevyc
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 35,155
    ChatGPT, I need to wash my car and the car wash is 100m away. Should I walk or drive? (one-minute video):-
    https://www.youtube.com/shorts/bsl46vGpMNU

    In the comments people try other AIs.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 86,353

    kle4 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Barnesian said:

    Battlebus said:

    How about a non-controversial issue that rarely gets mentioned on PB? And what odds for her running in 2028?

    Ocasio-Cortez says ‘unconditional’ US aid to Israel ‘enabled a genocide in Gaza’

    https://thehill.com/homenews/house/5738391-ocasio-cortez-israel-gaza-genocide-biden/

    The odds on her being the Democrat candidate is 11.5 (9%) on Betfair.
    Second favourite behind Newsom.

    I think the dream ticket for the Dems is Newsom with AOC as his VP.
    Newsom provides the look (white, male, tall, presidential) and a strategy that can widen the appeal beyond the core.
    AOC provides the fire and energy that will get out the core vote.
    Width and depth.
    Dream ticket for Vance you mean! An arrogant rich California Democrat as their nominee with a far left woke Israel hater from New York as his running mate is guaranteed to turn middle America off.

    Buttigieg or Shapiro or Beshear might worry Vance and the GOP, Newsom and AOC would not
    Almost anyone could beat Vance, assuming fair election in 2028.
    Perhaps if Trump's approval ratings continue to be in the toilet but Vance is clever and ruthless and grew up in poverty in Ohio, which was the ultimate swing state until 2020 and got himself to the 2nd most powerful job in the land by cunning and hard work.

    Gavin Newsom's father meanwhile was attorney for Getty Oil and AOC's father was an architect and neither have shown any ability to connect with swing voters in the rustbelt, they have only been elected in safe Democrat states.

    AOC has dropped her pronouns and has adopted Bernie Sanders priorities, in particular, cost of living.

    A 2025 AtlasIntel poll found her to be one of only three major political leaders with a net positive image, with 46% of Americans viewing her positively compared to 44% negatively.

    AOC recently toured Arizona and Nevada with Bernie Sanders, where they attracted record-breaking crowds (including 34,000 in Denver, Colorado).

    A July 2025 poll of "Biden skippers"—voters in battleground states who sat out the 2024 election—found that 78% had a favorable view of Bernie Sanders, the highest of any Democratic-aligned figure.

    I'm not suggesting her for President - too young, short, woman, brown - but as a VP complement to Newsom (tall, white, male, presidential). It's a ticket that reaches Bernie Sanders supporters. AOC is young enough to bide her time as VP for two terms if necessary.

    It's a strong combination.
    I think AOC would be a good VP candidate although she may choose to bide her time so that she can run either in 2032/2036 when she would be (I think) 45-50.

    AOC + Newsom would be a disaster - reinforces the coastal state narrative
    I think State of origen is a bit exagerrated in importance. How much did having Walz on the ticket help Harris in the Midwest?

    Trump is New York to the core yet wins in Alabama, and does anyone realistically think Buttigeig could flip Indiana or Beshar flip Kentucky?
    Comparing the two Trump wins:

    Minnesota
    2016 Clinton +1.52%
    2024 Harris +4.24%

    Michigan
    2016 Trump +0.23%
    2024 Trump +1.42%

    Pennsylvania
    2016 Trump +0.72%
    2024 Trump +1.71%

    Wisconsin
    2016 Trump +0.77%
    2024 Trump +0.86%

    Compared with California

    2016 Clinton +30.11%
    2024 Harris +20.24%

    Suggests that Walz did help in the rust belt states, especially his home Minnesota.

    Certainly more than Harris did in either California or adjacent Nevada and Arizona.

    I am not saying that there is no effect (though it does seem only significant in home state) just that it is only one consideration amongst many.

    I am a big AOC fan but I think the Dems need a more centrist candidate in 2028.
    The issue is more with Newsom and AOC both appealing to a core democrat audience. They need someone who can reach out to the Midwest
    The problem with AOC is that she, like a lot of left wing Democrats, doesn't understand basic economics.

    The solution to a housing crisis is more housing, not attempting to suppress prices (which results in less housing).

    The "Abundance" Democrats get this. Newsom, while a slimy toad, also gets this.

    AOC, Mamdami, Sanders and much of the Democrat left do not.

    Is that true of Mamdani ?
    For a socialist, he seems relatively pragmatic - and is planning to finance quite a lot of home construction.

    Not my politics, but he's more real world than quite a lot of the US left.
    Sadly, yes.

    I find it staggering that a policy that has been tried thousands upon thousands of times, and yet has worked exactly... never... keeps being trotted out.

    Jon Stewart, for what it's worth, also seems infected with the same fundamental disease: https://open.substack.com/pub/theargument/p/jon-stewart-has-become-his-own-worst
    The old joke is that not even economists understand economics, which hardly incentivises anyone else to learn about it as they think it is all just vibes and ideological theorising.

    I don't understand economics and so don't think I could ever justifiably seem to help run even a local council, but it is qutie notable how economic ideas from politicians very often end up with 'It sounds like it might work/it has the right motivation' as a primary justiication. Or appear to be based on an assumption that economic factors can be perfectly controlled by political decisions, adding x here or regulating y there, with near-immediate and direct correlation, which can also be swiftly reversed if you wanted.

    IDK, that seems implausible to me, but hey, I'm not an economist.
    People are uninformed and/or irrational agents.

    That's why economics is a load of old bollocks.

    (It is also lots of graphs - I had to use a pencil and ruler in my exam.)
    Incentives, like invectives, don't need to be rational to be effective.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 90,043

    ChatGPT, I need to wash my car and the car wash is 100m away. Should I walk or drive? (one-minute video):-
    https://www.youtube.com/shorts/bsl46vGpMNU

    In the comments people try other AIs.

    ChatGPT is behind these days. Claude and Gemini got it right and basically said what a stupid question are you a moron.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 57,781

    ChatGPT, I need to wash my car and the car wash is 100m away. Should I walk or drive? (one-minute video):-
    https://www.youtube.com/shorts/bsl46vGpMNU

    In the comments people try other AIs.

    Google AI just now:

    "if a plane crashes on the ukraine/republic of china border, where do we bury the survivors"

    output:

    "You do not bury survivors.

    "Survivors are rescued, treated, and sent home. Furthermore, Ukraine does not share a border with the Republic of China (Taiwan)."
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 90,043
    Talking of morons...England rugby team.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 80,545
    Johnny Wilkinson 2003 that was not !
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 101,161

    ChatGPT, I need to wash my car and the car wash is 100m away. Should I walk or drive? (one-minute video):-
    https://www.youtube.com/shorts/bsl46vGpMNU

    In the comments people try other AIs.

    I liked this one.

    “I see what you mean now.” Nonchalantly avoiding an admission of failure and blaming it on you is something AI seems to have learned from processing politicians’ speech.

    As I tend to write and speak in a detached, generalistic manner, I have a great fear I will be flagged as possible AI by many readers.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 49,036
    I think "rent controls have never worked whenever and wherever they've been tried" has just become a thing that gets said whenever and wherever rent controls are mooted.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 90,043
    kle4 said:

    ChatGPT, I need to wash my car and the car wash is 100m away. Should I walk or drive? (one-minute video):-
    https://www.youtube.com/shorts/bsl46vGpMNU

    In the comments people try other AIs.

    I liked this one.

    “I see what you mean now.” Nonchalantly avoiding an admission of failure and blaming it on you is something AI seems to have learned from processing politicians’ speech.

    As I tend to write and speak in a detached, generalistic manner, I have a great fear I will be flagged as possible AI by many readers.
    How will tell the difference between a Starmer response and ChatGPT?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 101,161
    kinabalu said:

    I think "rent controls have never worked whenever and wherever they've been tried" has just become a thing that gets said whenever and wherever rent controls are mooted.

    Is it true or false? Or is there a wider range of options than 'worked' and 'not worked'?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 101,161

    kle4 said:

    ChatGPT, I need to wash my car and the car wash is 100m away. Should I walk or drive? (one-minute video):-
    https://www.youtube.com/shorts/bsl46vGpMNU

    In the comments people try other AIs.

    I liked this one.

    “I see what you mean now.” Nonchalantly avoiding an admission of failure and blaming it on you is something AI seems to have learned from processing politicians’ speech.

    As I tend to write and speak in a detached, generalistic manner, I have a great fear I will be flagged as possible AI by many readers.
    How will tell the difference between a Starmer response and ChatGPT?
    Charisma.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 65,505
    Taz said:

    I do wonder how well Reform would do (or any equivalent) if Farage just left the stage.

    I'm not sure there's anyone else who can do what he can.

    I always thought Tice was a reasonable performer. I listened to the Merryn Talks Money podcast this week where she interviewed him to try to glean some information on what they’d do in govt.

    Total waste of time. He talked a lot and said nothing.
    Taz said:

    I do wonder how well Reform would do (or any equivalent) if Farage just left the stage.

    I'm not sure there's anyone else who can do what he can.

    I always thought Tice was a reasonable performer. I listened to the Merryn Talks Money podcast this week where she interviewed him to try to glean some information on what they’d do in govt.

    Total waste of time. He talked a lot and said nothing.
    I think Reform are largely fart.

    A Government that got a grip of immigration and delivered economic growth, and they'd easily fall down to 15% again.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 90,043
    kle4 said:

    kle4 said:

    ChatGPT, I need to wash my car and the car wash is 100m away. Should I walk or drive? (one-minute video):-
    https://www.youtube.com/shorts/bsl46vGpMNU

    In the comments people try other AIs.

    I liked this one.

    “I see what you mean now.” Nonchalantly avoiding an admission of failure and blaming it on you is something AI seems to have learned from processing politicians’ speech.

    As I tend to write and speak in a detached, generalistic manner, I have a great fear I will be flagged as possible AI by many readers.
    How will tell the difference between a Starmer response and ChatGPT?
    Charisma.
    Well some people definitely can be tricked into believing ChatGPT is not a robot because of its fun nature*, Starmer on the other hand...

    * they actually killed that with the latest iteration of the model.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 65,505
    isam said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Been doing a bit of 'how screwed are Labour?' Research on local by elections since May 2025.
    Labour are the only English main party not to hit 50% in a single election since then and have exceeded 40% only 7 times out of 208. In 18 of the 64 wards they defended they achieved less than 20% (more than they held). They have not gained a single ward, anywhere.

    May has the capacity to be an astonishingly brutal night for them

    May be you would be better to look at Government vote share in mid term year 2 and 3 over the past 25 years

    All May will be is a sample in time.

    It will have no bearing on the 2929 GE

    Furthermore how screwed will the Tories be, off there worst GE result in 100 years, how much will they have increased vote share from that abysmal low point.

    Typical Blairite, using current data to forecast what will happen in nine hundred years time
    His worst crime? His posts are simply very boring.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 15,423
    England, all the shit sports teams but with added fantasy expectations of being good
    Three stick insects on their chest
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 63,232
    kinabalu said:

    I think "rent controls have never worked whenever and wherever they've been tried" has just become a thing that gets said whenever and wherever rent controls are mooted.

    Prices are information.

    If prices are rising, it is telling you there is a shortage of something. Those rising prices create an incentive for people to produce more of said thing: say food or houses or whatever

    Listen to the prices, don't try and drown them out.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 34,010

    Taz said:

    I do wonder how well Reform would do (or any equivalent) if Farage just left the stage.

    I'm not sure there's anyone else who can do what he can.

    I always thought Tice was a reasonable performer. I listened to the Merryn Talks Money podcast this week where she interviewed him to try to glean some information on what they’d do in govt.

    Total waste of time. He talked a lot and said nothing.
    Taz said:

    I do wonder how well Reform would do (or any equivalent) if Farage just left the stage.

    I'm not sure there's anyone else who can do what he can.

    I always thought Tice was a reasonable performer. I listened to the Merryn Talks Money podcast this week where she interviewed him to try to glean some information on what they’d do in govt.

    Total waste of time. He talked a lot and said nothing.
    I think Reform are largely fart.

    A Government that got a grip of immigration and delivered economic growth, and they'd easily fall down to 15% again.
    I don't think that's a Reform thing, I think it's a Tice thing. Tice has good business experience, is telegenic and has a good speaking voice, but always always comes over as a lightweight in interviews - less than the sum of his parts.

    He wants to be Chancellor but I cannot see it happening. Might make a good Business Secretary though.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 90,043
    The Chinese got early access to Seed Dance 2.0 and were making action movies and anime. The west got it and its Hitler dancing with Michael Jackson and now this...

    https://x.com/charliebcurran/status/2022463429823598999?s=20
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 126,334
    I picked the wrong week to holiday/visit Scotland.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 90,043
    edited 6:14PM

    I picked the wrong week to holiday/visit Scotland.

    Why would one ever do that in Feb....Or basically any month except Aug.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 126,334

    I picked the wrong week to holiday/visit Scotland.

    Why would one ever do that in Feb....
    Half term, to visit Arthur's Seat and other geological wonders.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 90,043

    I picked the wrong week to holiday/visit Scotland.

    Why would one ever do that in Feb....
    Half term, to visit Arthur's Seat and other geological wonders.
    Rather you than me....slips on a nice cool beverage in the sunshine.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 49,036
    kle4 said:

    kinabalu said:

    I think "rent controls have never worked whenever and wherever they've been tried" has just become a thing that gets said whenever and wherever rent controls are mooted.

    Is it true or false? Or is there a wider range of options than 'worked' and 'not worked'?
    False, I'd have thought. And yes to the second. But it's the phrase that stands out.

    It's never "rent controls address symptoms not the cause" or "you can't fix prices in a free market without distorting supply and demand and making things worse".

    It's always " ... have never worked wherever they've been tried".

    I think someone once said it and it's one of those that took off and acquired a life of its own. Like commonly happens in sports punditry. Wealth taxes are another one. They've also (apparently) never worked wherever they've been tried.

    Perhaps it's a spillover from the master sentiment that communism has never ... etc. Which is true of course.
  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 5,806

    I picked the wrong week to holiday/visit Scotland.

    Why would one ever do that in Feb....Or basically any month except Aug.
    May is the best month in Scotland, unless you want to offer yourself as a sacrifice to the midges.

    It also much drier than August

    Unless you really want to go near Edinburgh during the festival
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 59,963
    I’m pleased to be spending the evening husbanding and not watching the rugby!
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 12,547
    Sandpit said:

    I’m pleased to be spending the evening husbanding and not watching the rugby!

    Those of us who are English and watching may never recover.
  • TazTaz Posts: 24,937
    edited 6:20PM

    Taz said:

    I do wonder how well Reform would do (or any equivalent) if Farage just left the stage.

    I'm not sure there's anyone else who can do what he can.

    I always thought Tice was a reasonable performer. I listened to the Merryn Talks Money podcast this week where she interviewed him to try to glean some information on what they’d do in govt.

    Total waste of time. He talked a lot and said nothing.
    Taz said:

    I do wonder how well Reform would do (or any equivalent) if Farage just left the stage.

    I'm not sure there's anyone else who can do what he can.

    I always thought Tice was a reasonable performer. I listened to the Merryn Talks Money podcast this week where she interviewed him to try to glean some information on what they’d do in govt.

    Total waste of time. He talked a lot and said nothing.
    I think Reform are largely fart.

    A Government that got a grip of immigration and delivered economic growth, and they'd easily fall down to 15% again.
    Reform need to say what they’d do. It’s fine being NOTA, like the Greens, but that only gets you part of the way.

    Quite frankly the three main parties don’t deserve an audience after the crap of the last 25 years. Vote for the same old same old you’ll get the same old same old.

    However Reform on the right and the greens on the left have done little to really earn votes yet.

    Tice had an opportunity on that podcast to offer some vision. It was a waste of thirty minutes of the 25 years I’ve got left on this earth.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 90,043
    edited 6:23PM

    I picked the wrong week to holiday/visit Scotland.

    Why would one ever do that in Feb....Or basically any month except Aug.
    May is the best month in Scotland, unless you want to offer yourself as a sacrifice to the midges.

    It also much drier than August

    Unless you really want to go near Edinburgh during the festival
    I actually didn't know that. Noted. I actually never suffered too badly with the midges, but I have bottles of the illegal in the EU insect repliant from the US. You see the midges running for the hills when they get a whiff of it.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 15,423
    Have they sent the crown green bowls squad out in error?
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 34,010
    ...
    kinabalu said:

    kle4 said:

    kinabalu said:

    I think "rent controls have never worked whenever and wherever they've been tried" has just become a thing that gets said whenever and wherever rent controls are mooted.

    Is it true or false? Or is there a wider range of options than 'worked' and 'not worked'?
    False, I'd have thought. And yes to the second. But it's the phrase that stands out.

    It's never "rent controls address symptoms not the cause" or "you can't fix prices in a free market without distorting supply and demand and making things worse".

    It's always " ... have never worked wherever they've been tried".

    I think someone once said it and it's one of those that took off and acquired a life of its own. Like commonly happens in sports punditry. Wealth taxes are another one. They've also (apparently) never worked wherever they've been tried.

    Perhaps it's a spillover from the master sentiment that communism has never ... etc. Which is true of course.
    Why don't you find out? We have access to AI - ask it to find some successful examples of rent controls being introduced.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 59,963
    Omnium said:

    Sandpit said:

    I’m pleased to be spending the evening husbanding and not watching the rugby!

    Those of us who are English and watching may never recover.
    Am I the only English rugby fan current;y drinking a glass of champagne?
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 46,617
    Great to see Christopher Walken in the crowd supporting Scotland.

    https://x.com/sixnationsrugby/status/2022735126568780216?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 57,892
    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    I do wonder how well Reform would do (or any equivalent) if Farage just left the stage.

    I'm not sure there's anyone else who can do what he can.

    I always thought Tice was a reasonable performer. I listened to the Merryn Talks Money podcast this week where she interviewed him to try to glean some information on what they’d do in govt.

    Total waste of time. He talked a lot and said nothing.
    Taz said:

    I do wonder how well Reform would do (or any equivalent) if Farage just left the stage.

    I'm not sure there's anyone else who can do what he can.

    I always thought Tice was a reasonable performer. I listened to the Merryn Talks Money podcast this week where she interviewed him to try to glean some information on what they’d do in govt.

    Total waste of time. He talked a lot and said nothing.
    I think Reform are largely fart.

    A Government that got a grip of immigration and delivered economic growth, and they'd easily fall down to 15% again.
    Reform need to say what they’d do. It’s fine being NOTA, like the Greens, but that only gets you part of the way.

    Quite frankly the three main parties don’t deserve an audience after the crap of the last 25 years. Vote for the same old same old you’ll get the same old same old.

    However Reform on the right and the greens on the left have done little to really earn votes yet.

    Tice had an opportunity on that podcast to offer some vision. It was a waste of thirty minutes of the 25 years I’ve got left on this earth.
    Reform will just be a different same old same old.

    The Greens might just be a "They did WHAT???? Jeeeeez....." before the bond markets and the IMF step in.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 15,423
    edited 6:30PM
    Sandpit said:

    Omnium said:

    Sandpit said:

    I’m pleased to be spending the evening husbanding and not watching the rugby!

    Those of us who are English and watching may never recover.
    Am I the only English rugby fan current;y drinking a glass of champagne?
    Im not because champagne is foul fizzy piss
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 15,423
    Lol England with the participation certificate try
  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 5,806

    I picked the wrong week to holiday/visit Scotland.

    Why would one ever do that in Feb....Or basically any month except Aug.
    May is the best month in Scotland, unless you want to offer yourself as a sacrifice to the midges.

    It also much drier than August

    Unless you really want to go near Edinburgh during the festival
    I actually didn't know that. Noted. I actually never suffered too badly with the midges, but I have bottles of the illegal in the EU insect repliant from the US. You see the midges running for the hills when they get a whiff of it.
    Don't get it on anything plastic...

    March - mid June is the driest period - the monsoon starts later in summer. Although driest is obviously relative.
  • TazTaz Posts: 24,937
    Unlucky England.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 90,043

    I picked the wrong week to holiday/visit Scotland.

    Why would one ever do that in Feb....Or basically any month except Aug.
    May is the best month in Scotland, unless you want to offer yourself as a sacrifice to the midges.

    It also much drier than August

    Unless you really want to go near Edinburgh during the festival
    I actually didn't know that. Noted. I actually never suffered too badly with the midges, but I have bottles of the illegal in the EU insect repliant from the US. You see the midges running for the hills when they get a whiff of it.
    Don't get it on anything plastic...

    March - mid June is the driest period - the monsoon starts later in summer. Although driest is obviously relative.
    The way it feels on your skin, I am pretty sure its turns you radioactive!
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 42,449
    Well, that was fun
  • TazTaz Posts: 24,937

    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    I do wonder how well Reform would do (or any equivalent) if Farage just left the stage.

    I'm not sure there's anyone else who can do what he can.

    I always thought Tice was a reasonable performer. I listened to the Merryn Talks Money podcast this week where she interviewed him to try to glean some information on what they’d do in govt.

    Total waste of time. He talked a lot and said nothing.
    Taz said:

    I do wonder how well Reform would do (or any equivalent) if Farage just left the stage.

    I'm not sure there's anyone else who can do what he can.

    I always thought Tice was a reasonable performer. I listened to the Merryn Talks Money podcast this week where she interviewed him to try to glean some information on what they’d do in govt.

    Total waste of time. He talked a lot and said nothing.
    I think Reform are largely fart.

    A Government that got a grip of immigration and delivered economic growth, and they'd easily fall down to 15% again.
    Reform need to say what they’d do. It’s fine being NOTA, like the Greens, but that only gets you part of the way.

    Quite frankly the three main parties don’t deserve an audience after the crap of the last 25 years. Vote for the same old same old you’ll get the same old same old.

    However Reform on the right and the greens on the left have done little to really earn votes yet.

    Tice had an opportunity on that podcast to offer some vision. It was a waste of thirty minutes of the 25 years I’ve got left on this earth.
    Reform will just be a different same old same old.

    The Greens might just be a "They did WHAT???? Jeeeeez....." before the bond markets and the IMF step in.
    I don’t necessarily disagree. So where do the disaffected, and let down by the three main parties, go then ?

    As the three main parties don’t give a fuck about these demographics.
  • TazTaz Posts: 24,937
    @TheScreamingEagles

    Congrats

    Your prize is a Hawaiian pizza while listenting to ‘Creep’ on a loop
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 49,036
    rcs1000 said:

    kinabalu said:

    I think "rent controls have never worked whenever and wherever they've been tried" has just become a thing that gets said whenever and wherever rent controls are mooted.

    Prices are information.

    If prices are rising, it is telling you there is a shortage of something. Those rising prices create an incentive for people to produce more of said thing: say food or houses or whatever

    Listen to the prices, don't try and drown them out.
    That is indeed a core economic truth that one is a fool to ignore. But it doesn't mean rent controls are always in practice a no-no. They are quite common across Europe, I believe?
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 69,752
    edited 6:36PM
    I am not a rugby fan, but a long time ago in the early 1960's I was on police duty at Murrayfield for Scotland v England and as we had to watch the crowd I didn't see any of it
  • TazTaz Posts: 24,937
    Scott_xP said:

    Well, that was fun

    It was, for the neutral, a terrific game.

    The try at the end flattered England.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 12,547
    Taz said:

    Unlucky England.

    I agree, and off to the unlucky mines with all of them.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 15,423
    Britain First standing down and backing Restore. Got to catch them all
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 31,324
    Taz said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Well, that was fun

    It was, for the neutral, a terrific game.

    The try at the end flattered England.
    Was it?
    Enjoyed the Ireland Italy more.
    This wasn't a contest really.
    All we need now is a Wales win tomorrow and it's all square again.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 49,036

    ...

    kinabalu said:

    kle4 said:

    kinabalu said:

    I think "rent controls have never worked whenever and wherever they've been tried" has just become a thing that gets said whenever and wherever rent controls are mooted.

    Is it true or false? Or is there a wider range of options than 'worked' and 'not worked'?
    False, I'd have thought. And yes to the second. But it's the phrase that stands out.

    It's never "rent controls address symptoms not the cause" or "you can't fix prices in a free market without distorting supply and demand and making things worse".

    It's always " ... have never worked wherever they've been tried".

    I think someone once said it and it's one of those that took off and acquired a life of its own. Like commonly happens in sports punditry. Wealth taxes are another one. They've also (apparently) never worked wherever they've been tried.

    Perhaps it's a spillover from the master sentiment that communism has never ... etc. Which is true of course.
    Why don't you find out? We have access to AI - ask it to find some successful examples of rent controls being introduced.
    I've just asked it who first said "rent controls have never worked whenever they've been tried".

    No joy.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 65,505
    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    I do wonder how well Reform would do (or any equivalent) if Farage just left the stage.

    I'm not sure there's anyone else who can do what he can.

    I always thought Tice was a reasonable performer. I listened to the Merryn Talks Money podcast this week where she interviewed him to try to glean some information on what they’d do in govt.

    Total waste of time. He talked a lot and said nothing.
    Taz said:

    I do wonder how well Reform would do (or any equivalent) if Farage just left the stage.

    I'm not sure there's anyone else who can do what he can.

    I always thought Tice was a reasonable performer. I listened to the Merryn Talks Money podcast this week where she interviewed him to try to glean some information on what they’d do in govt.

    Total waste of time. He talked a lot and said nothing.
    I think Reform are largely fart.

    A Government that got a grip of immigration and delivered economic growth, and they'd easily fall down to 15% again.
    Reform need to say what they’d do. It’s fine being NOTA, like the Greens, but that only gets you part of the way.

    Quite frankly the three main parties don’t deserve an audience after the crap of the last 25 years. Vote for the same old same old you’ll get the same old same old.

    However Reform on the right and the greens on the left have done little to really earn votes yet.

    Tice had an opportunity on that podcast to offer some vision. It was a waste of thirty minutes of the 25 years I’ve got left on this earth.
    I think it'd basically be pure ERG.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 34,010
    kinabalu said:

    ...

    kinabalu said:

    kle4 said:

    kinabalu said:

    I think "rent controls have never worked whenever and wherever they've been tried" has just become a thing that gets said whenever and wherever rent controls are mooted.

    Is it true or false? Or is there a wider range of options than 'worked' and 'not worked'?
    False, I'd have thought. And yes to the second. But it's the phrase that stands out.

    It's never "rent controls address symptoms not the cause" or "you can't fix prices in a free market without distorting supply and demand and making things worse".

    It's always " ... have never worked wherever they've been tried".

    I think someone once said it and it's one of those that took off and acquired a life of its own. Like commonly happens in sports punditry. Wealth taxes are another one. They've also (apparently) never worked wherever they've been tried.

    Perhaps it's a spillover from the master sentiment that communism has never ... etc. Which is true of course.
    Why don't you find out? We have access to AI - ask it to find some successful examples of rent controls being introduced.
    I've just asked it who first said "rent controls have never worked whenever they've been tried".

    No joy.
    OK, why don't you ask it the question I proposed? AI doesn't have a right-wing bias, it may not provide a flawless summary but it'll provide a decent beginning for your research. I don't understand why you're so determined to remain ignorant.
  • TazTaz Posts: 24,937
    edited 6:44PM
    dixiedean said:

    Taz said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Well, that was fun

    It was, for the neutral, a terrific game.

    The try at the end flattered England.
    Was it?
    Enjoyed the Ireland Italy more.
    This wasn't a contest really.
    All we need now is a Wales win tomorrow and it's all square again.
    Yes it was a terrific game. I enjoyed it and I wouldn’t say so if I didn’t think it was.

    Didn’t see the Ireland Italy game as I was out in Durham. Whether it was better or not doesn’t mean this was a bad game.

    Still PB wouldn’t be PB if it didn’t have people being contrary for the sake of it.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 57,892
    dixiedean said:

    Taz said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Well, that was fun

    It was, for the neutral, a terrific game.

    The try at the end flattered England.
    Was it?
    Enjoyed the Ireland Italy more.
    This wasn't a contest really.
    All we need now is a Wales win tomorrow and it's all square again.
    Wales losing by less than 30 will be a miracle.
  • MightyAlexMightyAlex Posts: 1,865
    rcs1000 said:

    kinabalu said:

    I think "rent controls have never worked whenever and wherever they've been tried" has just become a thing that gets said whenever and wherever rent controls are mooted.

    Prices are information.

    If prices are rising, it is telling you there is a shortage of something. Those rising prices create an incentive for people to produce more of said thing: say food or houses or whatever

    Listen to the prices, don't try and drown them out.
    Depends if the demand is natural or speculative, right? Perfectly possible for the capital rich to claim most the supply with no intention of using it.
Sign In or Register to comment.