Ed Miliband’s chances of succeeding Starmer are sizzling like a bacon sarnie – politicalbetting.com

System · 9:12AM

Ed Miliband’s chances of succeeding Starmer are sizzling like a bacon sarnie – politicalbetting.com

?EXCLUSIVE? Wes Streeting’s allies are pressing Angela Rayner to sign up to a “joint ticket” for the Labour leadership, @Telegraph can reveal.The proposal would see Rayner promised a Cabinet role and perhaps a return to being deputy prime minister if she backs a future…

Read the full story here

TimS · 9:14AM

First

Wicket

algarkirk · 9:14AM

First?

No, second.

Predictions: Ed Miliband won't be Labour leader.

England won't win the test.

RochdalePioneers · 9:16AM

"Liz Truss for Labour leader" is less insane than The Liz Truss Show was

noneoftheabove · 9:19AM

Approval rating for current job is not the same as wanting them as leader. I suspect Miliband is approved as of as he is seen (by members not pb righties or even centrists) as naice and harmless, representing better days for the party. My guess is very few see him as the future.

TheScreamingEagles · 9:21AM

RochdalePioneers said:
"Liz Truss for Labour leader" is less insane than The Liz Truss Show was

If you accept Liz Truss is suffering from PTSD then it all makes sense.

We've all had personal and professional disasters but none of us quite so publicly and quite so humiliatingly.

noneoftheabove · 9:24AM

TheScreamingEagles said:

RochdalePioneers said:
"Liz Truss for Labour leader" is less insane than The Liz Truss Show was
If you accept Liz Truss is suffering from PTSD then it all makes sense.

We've all had personal and professional disasters but none of us quite so publicly and quite so humiliatingly.

Thank you for the confirmation that Andrew Windsor is not a poster on here.

Stuartinromford · 9:25AM

TheScreamingEagles said:

RochdalePioneers said:
"Liz Truss for Labour leader" is less insane than The Liz Truss Show was
If you accept Liz Truss is suffering from PTSD then it all makes sense.

We've all had personal and professional disasters but none of us quite so publicly and quite so humiliatingly.

Which comes back to those around Liz. Why is nobody firmly, but lovingly, escorting her towards obscurity? It's not an easy job, but there are people who have a duty of care.

TheScreamingEagles · 9:28AM

Stuartinromford said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

RochdalePioneers said:
"Liz Truss for Labour leader" is less insane than The Liz Truss Show was
If you accept Liz Truss is suffering from PTSD then it all makes sense.

We've all had personal and professional disasters but none of us quite so publicly and quite so humiliatingly.
Which comes back to those around Liz. Why is nobody firmly, but lovingly, escorting her towards obscurity? It's not an easy job, but there are people who have a duty of care.

Apparently they've tried, the complicating factor is that there's a lot of money to be made from the American ~~lecture~~ grifting circuit.

But those who have tried get short shrift, a few people try and point out her mistakes (you sacked Kwasi which made the situation much worse!).

OnlyLivingBoy · 9:28AM

I think it will be Wes. He is just the strongest candidate and I think will win over the membership when he goes up against the rest of the field. I don't think it makes sense to choose someone like Ed Miliband who has already lost an election. The only worry with Wes is over his own seat, but if he can turn Labour's fortunes around then he should be able to save his own seat in the process.

noneoftheabove · 9:33AM

TheScreamingEagles said:

Stuartinromford said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

RochdalePioneers said:
"Liz Truss for Labour leader" is less insane than The Liz Truss Show was
If you accept Liz Truss is suffering from PTSD then it all makes sense.

We've all had personal and professional disasters but none of us quite so publicly and quite so humiliatingly.
Which comes back to those around Liz. Why is nobody firmly, but lovingly, escorting her towards obscurity? It's not an easy job, but there are people who have a duty of care.
Apparently they've tried, the complicating factor is that there's a lot of money to be made from the American ~~lecture~~ grifting circuit.

But those who have tried get short shrift, a few people try and point out her mistakes (you sacked Kwasi which made the situation much worse!).

Has she actually lost the plot or is she just shamelessly chasing the $$$$?

A sizeable chunk of the MAGA adjacent commentariat don't believe their own output, but think it an easy way to earn cash from the broligarchs, whether American or Russian.

Pulpstar · 9:34AM

TheScreamingEagles said:

Stuartinromford said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

RochdalePioneers said:
"Liz Truss for Labour leader" is less insane than The Liz Truss Show was
If you accept Liz Truss is suffering from PTSD then it all makes sense.

We've all had personal and professional disasters but none of us quite so publicly and quite so humiliatingly.
Which comes back to those around Liz. Why is nobody firmly, but lovingly, escorting her towards obscurity? It's not an easy job, but there are people who have a duty of care.
Apparently they've tried, the complicating factor is that there's a lot of money to be made from the American ~~lecture~~ grifting circuit.

But those who have tried get short shrift, a few people try and point out her mistakes (you sacked Kwasi which made the situation much worse!).

It says a lot about the world, and nothing about it good that those with plenty of cash want to spend it to hear so much shit from utter failures.

noneoftheabove · 9:34AM

OnlyLivingBoy said:
I think it will be Wes. He is just the strongest candidate and I think will win over the membership when he goes up against the rest of the field. I don't think it makes sense to choose someone like Ed Miliband who has already lost an election. The only worry with Wes is over his own seat, but if he can turn Labour's fortunes around then he should be able to save his own seat in the process.

He is probably the one who could best sell a Labour message to the wider electorate. But to members won't it be easy for a rival candidate to pitch to his left without going full Corbynite?

Carnyx · 9:35AM

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Carnyx said:

Pro_Rata said:

Fairliered said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

kjh said:

SandyRentool said:
I keep trying to convince my wife that driving on a motorway is safer and much less stressful than driving on a winding country road that isn't always wide enough for two vehicles to pass.

We'll never agree on this.

A few months back I was driving and we ended up taking a ridiculous route to end up at a destination about half a mile from a junction of the M62. I was not pleased!
I often take one route to go somewhere and a different route back. I don't know why.

I prefer winding roads to motorways as I enjoy driving them and hate motorways. If I'm on a long journey I use the motorway but get very bored very quickly. I am not capable of driving long distances on a motorway and don't know how people manage that.
In the past I drove quite often from Llandudno to Lossiemouth in the day using motorways, the infamous A9, and county roads from Aviemore

A distance of 456 miles and I could do all of that and back to Perth on a tank of diesel

It is now way beyond my ability
I think the furthest I've driven in one day is SE London to Campbelltown, about 550 miles.
My dad drove us from Ilford (east London) to Aviemore in a single day, back in 1989.
We used to regularly drive from Ayrshire to Felixstowe in one day. That was before we realised that Yorkshire was too good to drive through without stopping overnight.
It's only Ayrshire though. I mean, about 80% of it is south of the Scottish Border (@ Marshall Meadows)
Even more so if you count Lamberton Toll. (Bet @Sunil_Prasannan has never been on the Marshall Meadows seaweed railway ... in fact I'm sure he has not.)
Marshall Mathers what??

FPT if only to keep @Sunil_Prasannan from more suspense: the seaweed railway (rails taken up alas) goes *under* the East Coast Main Line.

https://co-curate.ncl.ac.uk/tunnel-at-marshall-meadows/

Big_G_NorthWales · 9:35AM

Good morning

The first question is will there be a vacancy and no doubt Reeves will have to go first

Miliband is not the answer, indeed I am not sure anyone is

Mahmood seems the only one will real determination but as with the conservatives how can you trust the members to make the right choice ?

MarqueeMark · 9:37AM

Will Wes need to do a "coronation chicken run" to a safe(r) seat?

noneoftheabove · 9:37AM

Pulpstar said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Stuartinromford said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

RochdalePioneers said:
"Liz Truss for Labour leader" is less insane than The Liz Truss Show was
If you accept Liz Truss is suffering from PTSD then it all makes sense.

We've all had personal and professional disasters but none of us quite so publicly and quite so humiliatingly.
Which comes back to those around Liz. Why is nobody firmly, but lovingly, escorting her towards obscurity? It's not an easy job, but there are people who have a duty of care.
Apparently they've tried, the complicating factor is that there's a lot of money to be made from the American ~~lecture~~ grifting circuit.

But those who have tried get short shrift, a few people try and point out her mistakes (you sacked Kwasi which made the situation much worse!).
It says a lot about the world, and nothing about it good that those with plenty of cash want to spend it to hear so much shit from utter failures.

They are not spending the money to hear them speak, they are promoting those who in turn promote division within nations and the weakening of the nation state. In turn that gives the broligarchs more power. It is all very rational once considered in terms of motivation rather than taking words at face value.

TheScreamingEagles · 9:37AM

noneoftheabove said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Stuartinromford said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

RochdalePioneers said:
"Liz Truss for Labour leader" is less insane than The Liz Truss Show was
If you accept Liz Truss is suffering from PTSD then it all makes sense.

We've all had personal and professional disasters but none of us quite so publicly and quite so humiliatingly.
Which comes back to those around Liz. Why is nobody firmly, but lovingly, escorting her towards obscurity? It's not an easy job, but there are people who have a duty of care.
Apparently they've tried, the complicating factor is that there's a lot of money to be made from the American ~~lecture~~ grifting circuit.

But those who have tried get short shrift, a few people try and point out her mistakes (you sacked Kwasi which made the situation much worse!).
Has she actually lost the plot or is she just shamelessly chasing the $$$$?

A sizeable chunk of the MAGA adjacent commentariat don't believe their own output, but think it an easy way to earn cash from the broligarchs, whether American or Russian.

Both.

She genuinely believes the bond markets are controlled by ultra woke lefties.

The alternative is to accept you were the shittest Prime Minister in history, so shit your party ditched you after a few weeks.

When you factor in the Queen's death/preparation for the funeral, and then her serving out her notice, she was only really Prime Minister for about 30 days.

Carnyx · 9:37AM

OnlyLivingBoy said:
I think it will be Wes. He is just the strongest candidate and I think will win over the membership when he goes up against the rest of the field. I don't think it makes sense to choose someone like Ed Miliband who has already lost an election. The only worry with Wes is over his own seat, but if he can turn Labour's fortunes around then he should be able to save his own seat in the process.

He can make himself a Lord and be PM that way ... or can't he?

TheScreamingEagles · 9:41AM

Carnyx said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:
I think it will be Wes. He is just the strongest candidate and I think will win over the membership when he goes up against the rest of the field. I don't think it makes sense to choose someone like Ed Miliband who has already lost an election. The only worry with Wes is over his own seat, but if he can turn Labour's fortunes around then he should be able to save his own seat in the process.
He can make himself a Lord and be PM that way ... or can't he?

He can but unlike America we have sufficient checks and balances in places without the need to fully codify our constitution.

To bring it back to Liz Truss (and Boris Johnson) both were safe for a year from a leadership contest but once we reach a critical mass then cheerio.

ydoethur · 9:42AM

TheScreamingEagles said:

noneoftheabove said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Stuartinromford said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

RochdalePioneers said:
"Liz Truss for Labour leader" is less insane than The Liz Truss Show was
If you accept Liz Truss is suffering from PTSD then it all makes sense.

We've all had personal and professional disasters but none of us quite so publicly and quite so humiliatingly.
Which comes back to those around Liz. Why is nobody firmly, but lovingly, escorting her towards obscurity? It's not an easy job, but there are people who have a duty of care.
Apparently they've tried, the complicating factor is that there's a lot of money to be made from the American ~~lecture~~ grifting circuit.

But those who have tried get short shrift, a few people try and point out her mistakes (you sacked Kwasi which made the situation much worse!).
Has she actually lost the plot or is she just shamelessly chasing the $$$$?

A sizeable chunk of the MAGA adjacent commentariat don't believe their own output, but think it an easy way to earn cash from the broligarchs, whether American or Russian.
Both.

She genuinely believes the bond markets are controlled by ultra woke lefties.

The alternative is to accept you were the shittest Prime Minister in history, so shit your party ditched you after a few weeks.

When you factor in the Queen's death/preparation for the funeral, and then her serving out her notice, she was only really Prime Minister for about 30 days.

So she is obsessed with Bond villains?

isam · 9:42AM

I don’t dislike EdM, but there seems to be the idea floating around that he has grown into some kind of elder statesman. To me he seems to have got weirder and less relatable with age. I think he’d be a disaster really, but if I were on at 100/1 I’d be happy. He’s a small loser in my book, the big winners would be Lucy Powell, David Lammy, Torsten Bell or Rachel Reeves, although nothing life changing. Worst result is Nigel Farage!

OnlyLivingBoy · 9:43AM

noneoftheabove said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:
I think it will be Wes. He is just the strongest candidate and I think will win over the membership when he goes up against the rest of the field. I don't think it makes sense to choose someone like Ed Miliband who has already lost an election. The only worry with Wes is over his own seat, but if he can turn Labour's fortunes around then he should be able to save his own seat in the process.
He is probably the one who could best sell a Labour message to the wider electorate. But to members won't it be easy for a rival candidate to pitch to his left without going full Corbynite?

Maybe I am projecting, but don't other Labour members also want someone who can appeal to the electorate as a whole and win an election? I just think Wes is so far ahead of the other candidates as a political communicator that it will become obvious that he is the best choice.

OnlyLivingBoy · 9:45AM

TheScreamingEagles said:

Stuartinromford said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

RochdalePioneers said:
"Liz Truss for Labour leader" is less insane than The Liz Truss Show was
If you accept Liz Truss is suffering from PTSD then it all makes sense.

We've all had personal and professional disasters but none of us quite so publicly and quite so humiliatingly.
Which comes back to those around Liz. Why is nobody firmly, but lovingly, escorting her towards obscurity? It's not an easy job, but there are people who have a duty of care.
Apparently they've tried, the complicating factor is that there's a lot of money to be made from the American ~~lecture~~ grifting circuit.

But those who have tried get short shrift, a few people try and point out her mistakes (you sacked Kwasi which made the situation much worse!).

It is genuinely sad how she is behaving.

RochdalePioneers · 9:45AM

I have just gone and looked for the home of The Liz Truss Show. Its on YouTube. It has 1,960 subscribers.

Rewatch the opening credits. Seriously, go do it. Just those, not the show itself. It makes her out to be the coming storm. The person we have all waited for. The revolution itself.

She even uses a clip of herself in 2014 saying "That Is A Disgrace" - a speech so widely ridiculed that even she joked about it having promoted to Chief Secretary.

This is *either* high satire using herself as the stooge or she is really has gone tonto.

isam · 9:46AM

A lot of criticism of TNT’s coverage, but actually I find Steven Finn to be quite an articulate commentator. They’ve gone with the Aussie way of having an non cricketer ancho which works well in the BBL, but not what we are used to in Test matches

isam · 9:50AM

noneoftheabove said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:
I think it will be Wes. He is just the strongest candidate and I think will win over the membership when he goes up against the rest of the field. I don't think it makes sense to choose someone like Ed Miliband who has already lost an election. The only worry with Wes is over his own seat, but if he can turn Labour's fortunes around then he should be able to save his own seat in the process.
He is probably the one who could best sell a Labour message to the wider electorate. But to members won't it be easy for a rival candidate to pitch to his left without going full Corbynite?

Streeting seems like he could host This Morning quite easily, he seems quite a natural on tv rather than a stuffy politician. If it wasn’t for that erroneous tweet about the Downing St parties I don’t think I’d have much bad to say about him

Got him as a small loser though

ydoethur · 9:51AM

TimS said:
First

Wicket

That was my fault, I checked cricinfo.

I have nobly refrained from doing so since.

TheScreamingEagles · 9:52AM

OnlyLivingBoy said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Stuartinromford said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

RochdalePioneers said:
"Liz Truss for Labour leader" is less insane than The Liz Truss Show was
If you accept Liz Truss is suffering from PTSD then it all makes sense.

We've all had personal and professional disasters but none of us quite so publicly and quite so humiliatingly.
Which comes back to those around Liz. Why is nobody firmly, but lovingly, escorting her towards obscurity? It's not an easy job, but there are people who have a duty of care.
Apparently they've tried, the complicating factor is that there's a lot of money to be made from the American ~~lecture~~ grifting circuit.

But those who have tried get short shrift, a few people try and point out her mistakes (you sacked Kwasi which made the situation much worse!).
It is genuinely sad how she is behaving.

It is, but she's not a serious politician, remember a couple of months before she became PM but the polls said she was going to win she yelled at a staffer who said she was misremembering the Thatcher premiership.

Truss wanted to cut taxes like Thatcher but the staffer pointed out Thatcher first increased taxes to stabilise the public finances then cut taxes when the public finances were better.

StillWaters · 9:52AM

noneoftheabove said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

RochdalePioneers said:
"Liz Truss for Labour leader" is less insane than The Liz Truss Show was
If you accept Liz Truss is suffering from PTSD then it all makes sense.

We've all had personal and professional disasters but none of us quite so publicly and quite so humiliatingly.
Thank you for the confirmation that Andrew Windsor is not a poster on here.

Although not much to do in Norfolk, so…

Stuartinromford · 9:54AM

RochdalePioneers said:
I have just gone and looked for the home of The Liz Truss Show. Its on YouTube. It has 1,960 subscribers.

Rewatch the opening credits. Seriously, go do it. Just those, not the show itself. It makes her out to be the coming storm. The person we have all waited for. The revolution itself.

She even uses a clip of herself in 2014 saying "That Is A Disgrace" - a speech so widely ridiculed that even she joked about it having promoted to Chief Secretary.

This is *either* high satire using herself as the stooge or she is really has gone tonto.

There has always been a slightly naff showbiz aspect to politics. Consider Mayoral regalia if nothing else. There has also been a huge taboo on politicians admitting that they got big things wrong. That's the wheel that Uncle Nigel is currently being stretched on.

Put those together with a "be your own publisher" ethos, and you end up where you end up.

noneoftheabove · 9:55AM

isam said:

noneoftheabove said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:
I think it will be Wes. He is just the strongest candidate and I think will win over the membership when he goes up against the rest of the field. I don't think it makes sense to choose someone like Ed Miliband who has already lost an election. The only worry with Wes is over his own seat, but if he can turn Labour's fortunes around then he should be able to save his own seat in the process.
He is probably the one who could best sell a Labour message to the wider electorate. But to members won't it be easy for a rival candidate to pitch to his left without going full Corbynite?
Streeting seems like he could host This Morning quite easily, he seems quite a natural on tv rather than a stuffy politician. If it wasn’t for that erroneous tweet about the Downing St parties I don’t think I’d have much bad to say about him

Got him as a small loser though

There is a weird background story from his youth that he denies. False or true it would get more scrutiny if he were leader.

Stuartinromford · 9:57AM

TheScreamingEagles said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Stuartinromford said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

RochdalePioneers said:
"Liz Truss for Labour leader" is less insane than The Liz Truss Show was
If you accept Liz Truss is suffering from PTSD then it all makes sense.

We've all had personal and professional disasters but none of us quite so publicly and quite so humiliatingly.
Which comes back to those around Liz. Why is nobody firmly, but lovingly, escorting her towards obscurity? It's not an easy job, but there are people who have a duty of care.
Apparently they've tried, the complicating factor is that there's a lot of money to be made from the American ~~lecture~~ grifting circuit.

But those who have tried get short shrift, a few people try and point out her mistakes (you sacked Kwasi which made the situation much worse!).
It is genuinely sad how she is behaving.
It is, but she's not a serious politician, remember a couple of months before she became PM but the polls said she was going to win she yelled at a staffer who said she was misremembering the Thatcher premiership.

Truss wanted to cut taxes like Thatcher but the staffer pointed out Thatcher first increased taxes to stabilise the public finances then cut taxes when the public finances were better.

To be fair, lots of people misremember the Thatcher premiership. If you removed them all from the Conservative party, there would be even less of it left.

(To make it worse, the painful but good stuff has been forgotten more than the painless and popular stuff that continues to cause problems now.)

isam · 9:57AM

England -87 for 2

noneoftheabove · 9:57AM

OnlyLivingBoy said:

noneoftheabove said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:
I think it will be Wes. He is just the strongest candidate and I think will win over the membership when he goes up against the rest of the field. I don't think it makes sense to choose someone like Ed Miliband who has already lost an election. The only worry with Wes is over his own seat, but if he can turn Labour's fortunes around then he should be able to save his own seat in the process.
He is probably the one who could best sell a Labour message to the wider electorate. But to members won't it be easy for a rival candidate to pitch to his left without going full Corbynite?
Maybe I am projecting, but don't other Labour members also want someone who can appeal to the electorate as a whole and win an election? I just think Wes is so far ahead of the other candidates as a political communicator that it will become obvious that he is the best choice.

Looking at the Deputy election, didn't Powell simply win by being outside of cabinet and pitching herself to the left of Phillipson? Had Powell still been in the cabinet and Phillipson outside I strongly suspect the vote would have been reversed.

MarqueeMark · 9:58AM

Pope's gone.

(Cricket, for unduly alarmed Catholics)

Big_G_NorthWales · 9:58AM

RochdalePioneers said:
I have just gone and looked for the home of The Liz Truss Show. Its on YouTube. It has 1,960 subscribers.

Rewatch the opening credits. Seriously, go do it. Just those, not the show itself. It makes her out to be the coming storm. The person we have all waited for. The revolution itself.

She even uses a clip of herself in 2014 saying "That Is A Disgrace" - a speech so widely ridiculed that even she joked about it having promoted to Chief Secretary.

This is *either* high satire using herself as the stooge or she is really has gone tonto.

I think it is sad on many levels that she lacks any awareness of how out of touch she is with public opinion

I simply do not watch, listen, or consider her for one second and that is a lifetime promise

I am not sure she can even get help because to do that you have to recognise your problem and not to be in denial

RochdalePioneers · 9:59AM

Big_G_NorthWales said:
Good morning

The first question is will there be a vacancy and no doubt Reeves will have to go first

Miliband is not the answer, indeed I am not sure anyone is

Mahmood seems the only one will real determination but as with the conservatives how can you trust the members to make the right choice ?

Morning Big_G. You are spot on - Reeves would be ousted first. Well, McSweeney first in the hope he can draw the poison, then Reeves. And finally Starmer.

The scenario is that Labour get routed in May. LibDem, Green, SNP, Reform, Plaid. They're losing to everyone bar the Tories. The slideaway is unmistakable and unavoidable. A change has to happen so that new leadership can turn the ship around.

I am not going to make predictions as to who that would be - my 25 years of Labour party membership tells me that members are capable of making major missteps.

For me Labour have two obvious threats - the Greens, and Reform. Ironically both of these parties speak to the same reality - the country is broken and why won't anyone do SOMETHING to fix it?

Polanski and Farage have the advantage of not thinking they will be the next government. Even Farage - he doesn't want to be PM, he doesn't think he can win hence telling donors a deal with the Tories is needed which he knows he won't get.

Labour? The government? Much harder. They need the Vision Thing. And the only person who has it is Ed Milliband. I know he is divisive, but a Britain refounded as a green industrial titan is something we could do. Become a leading exporter of clean energy and with it the technology that harnesses it.

Big_G_NorthWales · 10:03AM

MarqueeMark said:
Pope's gone.

(Cricket, for unduly alarmed Catholics)

I had to read that twice. !!!

Sandpit · 10:03AM

ydoethur said:

TimS said:
First

Wicket
That was my fault, I checked cricinfo.

I have nobly refrained from doing so since.

Stop doing that, it keeps causing wickets!

ydoethur · 10:04AM

MarqueeMark said:
Pope's gone.

(Cricket, for unduly alarmed Catholics)

Bugger. Knew I shouldn't have checked, but....

TheScreamingEagles · 10:05AM

isam said:

noneoftheabove said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:
I think it will be Wes. He is just the strongest candidate and I think will win over the membership when he goes up against the rest of the field. I don't think it makes sense to choose someone like Ed Miliband who has already lost an election. The only worry with Wes is over his own seat, but if he can turn Labour's fortunes around then he should be able to save his own seat in the process.
He is probably the one who could best sell a Labour message to the wider electorate. But to members won't it be easy for a rival candidate to pitch to his left without going full Corbynite?
Streeting seems like he could host This Morning quite easily, he seems quite a natural on tv rather than a stuffy politician. If it wasn’t for that erroneous tweet about the Downing St parties I don’t think I’d have much bad to say about him

Got him as a small loser though

I've had a look at the timing of that Tweet.

So it was a couple of days before the story broke about Number 10 staffers partying the night before the Duke of Edinburgh's funeral.

The Westminster rumour mill was in overdrive at that moment, both OGH and myself heard independently that there was going to be a new story that would break soon that in the words of my contact 'Boris Johnson's going to get Gough Whitlam'd by the Queen.'

I wouldn't be surprised to learn that Wes Streeting heard the same rumours and it kinda fitted with his timeline, gets diagnosed in March/April 2021.

Starry · 10:10AM

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Mahmood seems the only one will real determination but as with the conservatives how can you trust the members to make the right choice ?

She might be the right choice, but for the Tory Party, in the same way that Rory Stewart was the right choice for leader when he stood...but for the Lib Dems, not for the Conservatives.

isam · 10:10AM

TheScreamingEagles said:

isam said:

noneoftheabove said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:
I think it will be Wes. He is just the strongest candidate and I think will win over the membership when he goes up against the rest of the field. I don't think it makes sense to choose someone like Ed Miliband who has already lost an election. The only worry with Wes is over his own seat, but if he can turn Labour's fortunes around then he should be able to save his own seat in the process.
He is probably the one who could best sell a Labour message to the wider electorate. But to members won't it be easy for a rival candidate to pitch to his left without going full Corbynite?
Streeting seems like he could host This Morning quite easily, he seems quite a natural on tv rather than a stuffy politician. If it wasn’t for that erroneous tweet about the Downing St parties I don’t think I’d have much bad to say about him

Got him as a small loser though

I've had a look at the timing of that Tweet.

So it was a couple of days before the story broke about Number 10 staffers partying the night before the Duke of Edinburgh's funeral.

The Westminster rumour mill was in overdrive at that moment, both OGH and myself heard independently that there was going to be a new story going to break that in the words of my contact 'Boris Johnson's going to get Gough Whitlam'd by the Queen.'

I wouldn't be surprised to learn that Wes Streeting heard the same rumours and it kinda fitted with his timeline, gets diagnosed in March/April 2021.

No, he tweeted the day the news of the Downing St party in May 2020 broke, using the specific date of his surgery to suggest those attending the party would be hungover as he was waiting to be operated on. If the party had been the day before his surgery, it would have been a very effective point. But it was 366 days before. It is madness to suggest he wasn’t referring to the massive breaking news of the day, it couldn’t be clearer

A mistake, it happens, but he should acknowledge it. I’m sure he will if it’s brought up during a leadership campaign

eek · 10:12AM

RochdalePioneers said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:
Good morning

The first question is will there be a vacancy and no doubt Reeves will have to go first

Miliband is not the answer, indeed I am not sure anyone is

Mahmood seems the only one will real determination but as with the conservatives how can you trust the members to make the right choice ?
Morning Big_G. You are spot on - Reeves would be ousted first. Well, McSweeney first in the hope he can draw the poison, then Reeves. And finally Starmer.

The scenario is that Labour get routed in May. LibDem, Green, SNP, Reform, Plaid. They're losing to everyone bar the Tories. The slideaway is unmistakable and unavoidable. A change has to happen so that new leadership can turn the ship around.

I am not going to make predictions as to who that would be - my 25 years of Labour party membership tells me that members are capable of making major missteps.

For me Labour have two obvious threats - the Greens, and Reform. Ironically both of these parties speak to the same reality - the country is broken and why won't anyone do SOMETHING to fix it?

Polanski and Farage have the advantage of not thinking they will be the next government. Even Farage - he doesn't want to be PM, he doesn't think he can win hence telling donors a deal with the Tories is needed which he knows he won't get.

Labour? The government? Much harder. They need the Vision Thing. And the only person who has it is Ed Milliband. I know he is divisive, but a Britain refounded as a green industrial titan is something we could do. Become a leading exporter of clean energy and with it the technology that harnesses it.

That's not a vision it's a industrial strategy....

LostPassword · 10:14AM

TheScreamingEagles said:

noneoftheabove said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Stuartinromford said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

RochdalePioneers said:
"Liz Truss for Labour leader" is less insane than The Liz Truss Show was
If you accept Liz Truss is suffering from PTSD then it all makes sense.

We've all had personal and professional disasters but none of us quite so publicly and quite so humiliatingly.
Which comes back to those around Liz. Why is nobody firmly, but lovingly, escorting her towards obscurity? It's not an easy job, but there are people who have a duty of care.
Apparently they've tried, the complicating factor is that there's a lot of money to be made from the American ~~lecture~~ grifting circuit.

But those who have tried get short shrift, a few people try and point out her mistakes (you sacked Kwasi which made the situation much worse!).
Has she actually lost the plot or is she just shamelessly chasing the $$$$?

A sizeable chunk of the MAGA adjacent commentariat don't believe their own output, but think it an easy way to earn cash from the broligarchs, whether American or Russian.
Both.

She genuinely believes the bond markets are controlled by ultra woke lefties.

The alternative is to accept you were the shittest Prime Minister in history, so shit your party ditched you after a few weeks.

When you factor in the Queen's death/preparation for the funeral, and then her serving out her notice, she was only really Prime Minister for about 30 days.

She became PM on the 6th and announced the energy price guarantee on the 8th, the same day the Queen died. So, count that as two days, or three?

The funeral was on the 19th and she announced her intent to resign on the 20th of the month following. So she probably scrapes 32 or 33 days.

Tres · 10:15AM

OnlyLivingBoy said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Stuartinromford said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

RochdalePioneers said:
"Liz Truss for Labour leader" is less insane than The Liz Truss Show was
If you accept Liz Truss is suffering from PTSD then it all makes sense.

We've all had personal and professional disasters but none of us quite so publicly and quite so humiliatingly.
Which comes back to those around Liz. Why is nobody firmly, but lovingly, escorting her towards obscurity? It's not an easy job, but there are people who have a duty of care.
Apparently they've tried, the complicating factor is that there's a lot of money to be made from the American ~~lecture~~ grifting circuit.

But those who have tried get short shrift, a few people try and point out her mistakes (you sacked Kwasi which made the situation much worse!).
It is genuinely sad how she is behaving.

only if you think she believes it and isn't just on the grift wagon

Andy_JS · 10:16AM

Crawley goes, England heading fo another defeat.

Nigelb · 10:16AM

England's brains, what's left of them, are scrambled.

RochdalePioneers · 10:17AM

eek said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:
Good morning

The first question is will there be a vacancy and no doubt Reeves will have to go first

Miliband is not the answer, indeed I am not sure anyone is

Mahmood seems the only one will real determination but as with the conservatives how can you trust the members to make the right choice ?
Morning Big_G. You are spot on - Reeves would be ousted first. Well, McSweeney first in the hope he can draw the poison, then Reeves. And finally Starmer.

The scenario is that Labour get routed in May. LibDem, Green, SNP, Reform, Plaid. They're losing to everyone bar the Tories. The slideaway is unmistakable and unavoidable. A change has to happen so that new leadership can turn the ship around.

I am not going to make predictions as to who that would be - my 25 years of Labour party membership tells me that members are capable of making major missteps.

For me Labour have two obvious threats - the Greens, and Reform. Ironically both of these parties speak to the same reality - the country is broken and why won't anyone do SOMETHING to fix it?

Polanski and Farage have the advantage of not thinking they will be the next government. Even Farage - he doesn't want to be PM, he doesn't think he can win hence telling donors a deal with the Tories is needed which he knows he won't get.

Labour? The government? Much harder. They need the Vision Thing. And the only person who has it is Ed Milliband. I know he is divisive, but a Britain refounded as a green industrial titan is something we could do. Become a leading exporter of clean energy and with it the technology that harnesses it.
That's not a vision it's a industrial strategy....

Which you then hang everything off. We need money. We have the ability to earn money. We just need to get on with it. What is the alternative strategy?

BartholomewRoberts · 10:17AM

isam said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

isam said:

noneoftheabove said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:
I think it will be Wes. He is just the strongest candidate and I think will win over the membership when he goes up against the rest of the field. I don't think it makes sense to choose someone like Ed Miliband who has already lost an election. The only worry with Wes is over his own seat, but if he can turn Labour's fortunes around then he should be able to save his own seat in the process.
He is probably the one who could best sell a Labour message to the wider electorate. But to members won't it be easy for a rival candidate to pitch to his left without going full Corbynite?
Streeting seems like he could host This Morning quite easily, he seems quite a natural on tv rather than a stuffy politician. If it wasn’t for that erroneous tweet about the Downing St parties I don’t think I’d have much bad to say about him

Got him as a small loser though

I've had a look at the timing of that Tweet.

So it was a couple of days before the story broke about Number 10 staffers partying the night before the Duke of Edinburgh's funeral.

The Westminster rumour mill was in overdrive at that moment, both OGH and myself heard independently that there was going to be a new story going to break that in the words of my contact 'Boris Johnson's going to get Gough Whitlam'd by the Queen.'

I wouldn't be surprised to learn that Wes Streeting heard the same rumours and it kinda fitted with his timeline, gets diagnosed in March/April 2021.
No, he tweeted the day the news of the Downing St party in May 2020 broke, using the specific date of his surgery to suggest those attending the party would be hungover as he was waiting to be operated on. If the party had been the day before his surgery, it would have been a very effective point. But it was 366 days before. It is madness to suggest he wasn’t referring to the massive breaking news of the day, it couldn’t be clearer

A mistake, it happens, but he should acknowledge it. I’m sure he will if it’s brought up during a leadership campaign

Why should he acknowledge it, it was years ago, what does it matter now?

Who exactly is going to bring it up, during a Labour leadership campaign?

You were overly critical of Boris is not going to be harmful to a Labour leadership campaign.

DecrepiterJohnL · 10:18AM

Write a list of Labour ministers. Next to each name, write what they've achieved, regardless of whether you think it's a good idea or not.

That's why Ed Miliband is a frontrunner.

Andy_JS · 10:18AM

Brook almost goes first ball.

ydoethur · 10:19AM

Andy_JS said:
Crawley goes, England heading fo another defeat.

Certainly if Brook plays as stupidly as he did in the first innings. I don't think making him Vice Captain or ODI captain has done him any favours at all.

TheScreamingEagles · 10:19AM

Nigelb said:
England's brains, what's left of them, are scrambled.

I've only found out that on Thursday the commentator on TMS said Harry Brook was fucking stupid for his dismissal.

https://x.com/RWSharples/status/1996545928094961814

Nigelb · 10:21AM

RochdalePioneers said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:
Good morning

The first question is will there be a vacancy and no doubt Reeves will have to go first

Miliband is not the answer, indeed I am not sure anyone is

Mahmood seems the only one will real determination but as with the conservatives how can you trust the members to make the right choice ?
Morning Big_G. You are spot on - Reeves would be ousted first. Well, McSweeney first in the hope he can draw the poison, then Reeves. And finally Starmer.

The scenario is that Labour get routed in May. LibDem, Green, SNP, Reform, Plaid. They're losing to everyone bar the Tories. The slideaway is unmistakable and unavoidable. A change has to happen so that new leadership can turn the ship around.

I am not going to make predictions as to who that would be - my 25 years of Labour party membership tells me that members are capable of making major missteps.

For me Labour have two obvious threats - the Greens, and Reform. Ironically both of these parties speak to the same reality - the country is broken and why won't anyone do SOMETHING to fix it?

Polanski and Farage have the advantage of not thinking they will be the next government. Even Farage - he doesn't want to be PM, he doesn't think he can win hence telling donors a deal with the Tories is needed which he knows he won't get.

Labour? The government? Much harder. They need the Vision Thing. And the only person who has it is Ed Milliband. I know he is divisive, but a Britain refounded as a green industrial titan is something we could do. Become a leading exporter of clean energy and with it the technology that harnesses it.

Seems highly unlikely.
We don't do either solar or batteries now, in terms of technology or mass manufacturing. And that's most of the future.

What we're likely to generate won't be cheap enough to export in quantities enough to underpin being an industrial titan.

What did you have in mind ?

isam · 10:22AM

BartholomewRoberts said:

isam said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

isam said:

noneoftheabove said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:
I think it will be Wes. He is just the strongest candidate and I think will win over the membership when he goes up against the rest of the field. I don't think it makes sense to choose someone like Ed Miliband who has already lost an election. The only worry with Wes is over his own seat, but if he can turn Labour's fortunes around then he should be able to save his own seat in the process.
He is probably the one who could best sell a Labour message to the wider electorate. But to members won't it be easy for a rival candidate to pitch to his left without going full Corbynite?
Streeting seems like he could host This Morning quite easily, he seems quite a natural on tv rather than a stuffy politician. If it wasn’t for that erroneous tweet about the Downing St parties I don’t think I’d have much bad to say about him

Got him as a small loser though

I've had a look at the timing of that Tweet.

So it was a couple of days before the story broke about Number 10 staffers partying the night before the Duke of Edinburgh's funeral.

The Westminster rumour mill was in overdrive at that moment, both OGH and myself heard independently that there was going to be a new story going to break that in the words of my contact 'Boris Johnson's going to get Gough Whitlam'd by the Queen.'

I wouldn't be surprised to learn that Wes Streeting heard the same rumours and it kinda fitted with his timeline, gets diagnosed in March/April 2021.
No, he tweeted the day the news of the Downing St party in May 2020 broke, using the specific date of his surgery to suggest those attending the party would be hungover as he was waiting to be operated on. If the party had been the day before his surgery, it would have been a very effective point. But it was 366 days before. It is madness to suggest he wasn’t referring to the massive breaking news of the day, it couldn’t be clearer

A mistake, it happens, but he should acknowledge it. I’m sure he will if it’s brought up during a leadership campaign
Why should he acknowledge it, it was years ago, what does it matter now?

Who exactly is going to bring it up, during a Labour leadership campaign?

You were overly critical of Boris is not going to be harmful to a Labour leadership campaign.

Politicians are asked all sorts of questions about the veracity of things they’ve previously said or done, look at Rachel Reeves now. She’s getting stories written about chess tournaments from the mid 90s. Farage is being asked about things he said at school in the 70s. So I don’t see why Streeting wouldn’t be asked about an erroneous tweet from 2022

I don’t really care if he becomes Labour leader or not, and I don’t particularly dislike him, I’m just a pedant like many others on here, although some are choosing not to be on this matter!

ydoethur · 10:23AM

Andy_JS said:
Brook almost goes first ball.

Neither of those is my fault this time!

RochdalePioneers · 10:26AM

Nigelb said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:
Good morning

The first question is will there be a vacancy and no doubt Reeves will have to go first

Miliband is not the answer, indeed I am not sure anyone is

Mahmood seems the only one will real determination but as with the conservatives how can you trust the members to make the right choice ?
Morning Big_G. You are spot on - Reeves would be ousted first. Well, McSweeney first in the hope he can draw the poison, then Reeves. And finally Starmer.

The scenario is that Labour get routed in May. LibDem, Green, SNP, Reform, Plaid. They're losing to everyone bar the Tories. The slideaway is unmistakable and unavoidable. A change has to happen so that new leadership can turn the ship around.

I am not going to make predictions as to who that would be - my 25 years of Labour party membership tells me that members are capable of making major missteps.

For me Labour have two obvious threats - the Greens, and Reform. Ironically both of these parties speak to the same reality - the country is broken and why won't anyone do SOMETHING to fix it?

Polanski and Farage have the advantage of not thinking they will be the next government. Even Farage - he doesn't want to be PM, he doesn't think he can win hence telling donors a deal with the Tories is needed which he knows he won't get.

Labour? The government? Much harder. They need the Vision Thing. And the only person who has it is Ed Milliband. I know he is divisive, but a Britain refounded as a green industrial titan is something we could do. Become a leading exporter of clean energy and with it the technology that harnesses it.
Seems highly unlikely.
We don't do either solar or batteries now, in terms of technology or mass manufacturing. And that's most of the future.

What we're likely to generate won't be cheap enough to export in quantities enough to underpin being an industrial titan.

What did you have in mind ?

1. Start building wind turbines in the UK at scale.
2. Install fucktons of wind turbines offshore
3. Chuck research money at Soton uni and others to develop tidal generators
4. Build and deploy tidal generators
5. Buy the Qataris out of Rolls Royce SMR. Fast track for deployment
6. Rinse and repeat. Boundless cheap energy and technology we can sell globally.

MustaphaMondeo · 10:32AM

RochdalePioneers said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:
Good morning

The first question is will there be a vacancy and no doubt Reeves will have to go first

Miliband is not the answer, indeed I am not sure anyone is

Mahmood seems the only one will real determination but as with the conservatives how can you trust the members to make the right choice ?
Morning Big_G. You are spot on - Reeves would be ousted first. Well, McSweeney first in the hope he can draw the poison, then Reeves. And finally Starmer.

The scenario is that Labour get routed in May. LibDem, Green, SNP, Reform, Plaid. They're losing to everyone bar the Tories. The slideaway is unmistakable and unavoidable. A change has to happen so that new leadership can turn the ship around.

I am not going to make predictions as to who that would be - my 25 years of Labour party membership tells me that members are capable of making major missteps.

For me Labour have two obvious threats - the Greens, and Reform. Ironically both of these parties speak to the same reality - the country is broken and why won't anyone do SOMETHING to fix it?

Polanski and Farage have the advantage of not thinking they will be the next government. Even Farage - he doesn't want to be PM, he doesn't think he can win hence telling donors a deal with the Tories is needed which he knows he won't get.

Labour? The government? Much harder. They need the Vision Thing. And the only person who has it is Ed Milliband. I know he is divisive, but a Britain refounded as a green industrial titan is something we could do. Become a leading exporter of clean energy and with it the technology that harnesses it.

I attended a clean and Green-ish energy symposium a few days ago. Gov led.

The above is (imo) absolutely the back-up plan should child poverty turn out to be less influential with Reform voters than they hope.

HYUFD · 10:35AM

Ed Miliband is popular with Labour members, though a September Yougov poll had Streeting narrowly beating Miliband head to head with Labour members. If Streeting united on a joint ticket with Rayner that would also bring together the Blairite and left wings of the party.

Plus given Ed Miliband is the only Labour leader not to win a majority or even get a hung parliament at a general election he is hardly the nirvana of electability for the party

LostPassword · 10:35AM

RochdalePioneers said:

Nigelb said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:
Good morning

The first question is will there be a vacancy and no doubt Reeves will have to go first

Miliband is not the answer, indeed I am not sure anyone is

Mahmood seems the only one will real determination but as with the conservatives how can you trust the members to make the right choice ?
Morning Big_G. You are spot on - Reeves would be ousted first. Well, McSweeney first in the hope he can draw the poison, then Reeves. And finally Starmer.

The scenario is that Labour get routed in May. LibDem, Green, SNP, Reform, Plaid. They're losing to everyone bar the Tories. The slideaway is unmistakable and unavoidable. A change has to happen so that new leadership can turn the ship around.

I am not going to make predictions as to who that would be - my 25 years of Labour party membership tells me that members are capable of making major missteps.

For me Labour have two obvious threats - the Greens, and Reform. Ironically both of these parties speak to the same reality - the country is broken and why won't anyone do SOMETHING to fix it?

Polanski and Farage have the advantage of not thinking they will be the next government. Even Farage - he doesn't want to be PM, he doesn't think he can win hence telling donors a deal with the Tories is needed which he knows he won't get.

Labour? The government? Much harder. They need the Vision Thing. And the only person who has it is Ed Milliband. I know he is divisive, but a Britain refounded as a green industrial titan is something we could do. Become a leading exporter of clean energy and with it the technology that harnesses it.
Seems highly unlikely.
We don't do either solar or batteries now, in terms of technology or mass manufacturing. And that's most of the future.

What we're likely to generate won't be cheap enough to export in quantities enough to underpin being an industrial titan.

What did you have in mind ?

1. Start building wind turbines in the UK at scale.
2. Install fucktons of wind turbines offshore
3. Chuck research money at Soton uni and others to develop tidal generators
4. Build and deploy tidal generators
5. Buy the Qataris out of Rolls Royce SMR. Fast track for deployment
6. Rinse and repeat. Boundless cheap energy and technology we can sell globally.

One of the advantages and disadvantages of Britain's renewable energy choices is that Britain has the best tidal and wind energy resources in the world, and among the least favourable for solar.

This means that, although I think it makes a lot of sense for Britain to develop and install tidal and wind generation the export potential is not as great as you might hope, because most of the rest of the world will be so much better off with solar.

Andy_JS · 10:36AM

Every Aussie batsman scored between 13 and 77 in their innings of 511.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/live/c36k5p2p0ljt#Scorecard

HYUFD · 10:40AM

Andy_JS said:
Crawley goes, England heading fo another defeat.

As is the case for about 90% of England test matches in Ashes series in Australia in my lifetime. You can't even watch them live on Freeview anyway now which is probably just as well

Andy_JS · 10:40AM

Review for LBW. Not out.

OldKingCole · 10:40AM

HYUFD said:
Ed Miliband is popular with Labour members, though a September Yougov poll had Streeting narrowly beating Miliband head to head with Labour members. If Streeting united on a joint ticket with Rayner that would also bring together the Blairite and left wings of the party.

Plus given Ed Miliband is the only Labour leader not to win a majority or even get a hung parliament at a general election he is hardly the nirvana of electability for the party

Good morning everyone.
IIRC, although Ed M didn’t manage an overall majority he did gain seats (?seat) . It was the Conservative’s successful attack on their coalition partners which resulted in the 2015 Cameron government.

And neither Kinnock or Smith won an election.

LostPassword · 10:40AM

Andy_JS said:
Every Aussie batsman scored between 13 and 77 in their innings of 511.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/live/c36k5p2p0ljt#Scorecard

Their number 11 faced the lowest number of balls in their innings - 21. That was more than five players in the England first innings and one so far in England's second innings.

Australia are simply the better team by a wide margin.

Andy_JS · 10:43AM

Review for a catch. Australia confident. And it's out. Root.

MustaphaMondeo · 10:44AM

Nigelb said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:
Good morning

The first question is will there be a vacancy and no doubt Reeves will have to go first

Miliband is not the answer, indeed I am not sure anyone is

Mahmood seems the only one will real determination but as with the conservatives how can you trust the members to make the right choice ?
Morning Big_G. You are spot on - Reeves would be ousted first. Well, McSweeney first in the hope he can draw the poison, then Reeves. And finally Starmer.

The scenario is that Labour get routed in May. LibDem, Green, SNP, Reform, Plaid. They're losing to everyone bar the Tories. The slideaway is unmistakable and unavoidable. A change has to happen so that new leadership can turn the ship around.

I am not going to make predictions as to who that would be - my 25 years of Labour party membership tells me that members are capable of making major missteps.

For me Labour have two obvious threats - the Greens, and Reform. Ironically both of these parties speak to the same reality - the country is broken and why won't anyone do SOMETHING to fix it?

Polanski and Farage have the advantage of not thinking they will be the next government. Even Farage - he doesn't want to be PM, he doesn't think he can win hence telling donors a deal with the Tories is needed which he knows he won't get.

Labour? The government? Much harder. They need the Vision Thing. And the only person who has it is Ed Milliband. I know he is divisive, but a Britain refounded as a green industrial titan is something we could do. Become a leading exporter of clean energy and with it the technology that harnesses it.
Seems highly unlikely.
We don't do either solar or batteries now, in terms of technology or mass manufacturing. And that's most of the future.

What we're likely to generate won't be cheap enough to export in quantities enough to underpin being an industrial titan.

What did you have in mind ?

The story was RR small modular reactors and £2.5bn into Fusion.

Pie in the Sky, very probably, but forward looking and big tech/engineering.

The UK electorate likes to think it’s kind and clever.
So with child poverty, Labour leads us into a hiatus before we land squarely in the sunny uplands.

Hard yards kind of shite, maybe saleable?

What else have they got?

Nigelb · 10:45AM

TheScreamingEagles said:

Nigelb said:
England's brains, what's left of them, are scrambled.
I've only found out that on Thursday the commentator on TMS said Harry Brook was fucking stupid for his dismissal.

https://x.com/RWSharples/status/1996545928094961814

Yes, she was unimpressed.

Anyway, it's all over now.

Andy_JS · 10:45AM

At least England lasted an extra day this time compared to Perth.

FrankBooth · 10:45AM

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/nhs-doctor-arrested-again-after-posting-anti-jewish-tweets/ar-AA1RNbSO?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=693406ebeb714912b27943f8b2d9054c&ei=60

It's important to stand up for the views of people you disagree with. She may be a vile racist and shouldn't be working in the NHS but this looks excessive from the state.

The way to deal with people claiming 'Jewish supremicism' in the UK is to debate them not put them in prison.

DecrepiterJohnL · 10:46AM

OldKingCole said:

HYUFD said:
Ed Miliband is popular with Labour members, though a September Yougov poll had Streeting narrowly beating Miliband head to head with Labour members. If Streeting united on a joint ticket with Rayner that would also bring together the Blairite and left wings of the party.

Plus given Ed Miliband is the only Labour leader not to win a majority or even get a hung parliament at a general election he is hardly the nirvana of electability for the party
Good morning everyone.
IIRC, although Ed M didn’t manage an overall majority he did gain seats (?seat) . It was the Conservative’s successful attack on their coalition partners which resulted in the 2015 Cameron government.

And neither Kinnock or Smith won an election.

The SNP swept Scotland, which cost Labour 40 seats.

Malmesbury · 10:46AM

noneoftheabove said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Stuartinromford said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

RochdalePioneers said:
"Liz Truss for Labour leader" is less insane than The Liz Truss Show was
If you accept Liz Truss is suffering from PTSD then it all makes sense.

We've all had personal and professional disasters but none of us quite so publicly and quite so humiliatingly.
Which comes back to those around Liz. Why is nobody firmly, but lovingly, escorting her towards obscurity? It's not an easy job, but there are people who have a duty of care.
Apparently they've tried, the complicating factor is that there's a lot of money to be made from the American ~~lecture~~ grifting circuit.

But those who have tried get short shrift, a few people try and point out her mistakes (you sacked Kwasi which made the situation much worse!).
Has she actually lost the plot or is she just shamelessly chasing the $$$$?

A sizeable chunk of the MAGA adjacent commentariat don't believe their own output, but think it an easy way to earn cash from the broligarchs, whether American or Russian.

Has she actually lost the plot or is she just shamelessly chasing the $$$$?

Why not both?

For quite a few people, they believe what makes them successful. To a politician, the more people that listen to you, the more successful you are. With social media and the algorithms that promote content according to the activity it provokes, this loop is shorter and faster than ever before.

“It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it.”

might become

"It is easy to get a person to believe something, when they are given immediate attention and wealth for believing it."

It's bit like the experiment where the rat pushes the button and gets some cocaine. Eventually all the rat does...

Something the last few years should have taught us - the High & the Mighty are just as vulnerable to the radicalisation spiral as any.

MustaphaMondeo · 10:48AM

OldKingCole said:

HYUFD said:
Ed Miliband is popular with Labour members, though a September Yougov poll had Streeting narrowly beating Miliband head to head with Labour members. If Streeting united on a joint ticket with Rayner that would also bring together the Blairite and left wings of the party.

Plus given Ed Miliband is the only Labour leader not to win a majority or even get a hung parliament at a general election he is hardly the nirvana of electability for the party
Good morning everyone.
IIRC, although Ed M didn’t manage an overall majority he did gain seats (?seat) . It was the Conservative’s successful attack on their coalition partners which resulted in the 2015 Cameron government.

And neither Kinnock or Smith won an election.

IIRC Gordon Brown sat and waited for the LD to come to him?

eek · 10:48AM

MustaphaMondeo said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:
Good morning

The first question is will there be a vacancy and no doubt Reeves will have to go first

Miliband is not the answer, indeed I am not sure anyone is

Mahmood seems the only one will real determination but as with the conservatives how can you trust the members to make the right choice ?
Morning Big_G. You are spot on - Reeves would be ousted first. Well, McSweeney first in the hope he can draw the poison, then Reeves. And finally Starmer.

The scenario is that Labour get routed in May. LibDem, Green, SNP, Reform, Plaid. They're losing to everyone bar the Tories. The slideaway is unmistakable and unavoidable. A change has to happen so that new leadership can turn the ship around.

I am not going to make predictions as to who that would be - my 25 years of Labour party membership tells me that members are capable of making major missteps.

For me Labour have two obvious threats - the Greens, and Reform. Ironically both of these parties speak to the same reality - the country is broken and why won't anyone do SOMETHING to fix it?

Polanski and Farage have the advantage of not thinking they will be the next government. Even Farage - he doesn't want to be PM, he doesn't think he can win hence telling donors a deal with the Tories is needed which he knows he won't get.

Labour? The government? Much harder. They need the Vision Thing. And the only person who has it is Ed Milliband. I know he is divisive, but a Britain refounded as a green industrial titan is something we could do. Become a leading exporter of clean energy and with it the technology that harnesses it.
I attended a clean and Green-ish energy symposium a few days ago. Gov led.

The above is (imo) absolutely the back-up plan should child poverty turn out to be less influential with Reform voters than they hope.

Child poverty is only going to be a winner for the few Reform voters with 3 or more children who will benefit from it. And even then it's now resolved so no need to vote Labour to fix the issue.

For the Reform voters who don't want any money spent on benefits they don't receive (i.e. most of them) it will make no difference in their voting intent.

So if Labour think reduced Child poverty is going to win back votes they are utterly wasting that money..

Stuartinromford · 10:49AM

LostPassword said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Nigelb said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:
Good morning

The first question is will there be a vacancy and no doubt Reeves will have to go first

Miliband is not the answer, indeed I am not sure anyone is

Mahmood seems the only one will real determination but as with the conservatives how can you trust the members to make the right choice ?
Morning Big_G. You are spot on - Reeves would be ousted first. Well, McSweeney first in the hope he can draw the poison, then Reeves. And finally Starmer.

The scenario is that Labour get routed in May. LibDem, Green, SNP, Reform, Plaid. They're losing to everyone bar the Tories. The slideaway is unmistakable and unavoidable. A change has to happen so that new leadership can turn the ship around.

I am not going to make predictions as to who that would be - my 25 years of Labour party membership tells me that members are capable of making major missteps.

For me Labour have two obvious threats - the Greens, and Reform. Ironically both of these parties speak to the same reality - the country is broken and why won't anyone do SOMETHING to fix it?

Polanski and Farage have the advantage of not thinking they will be the next government. Even Farage - he doesn't want to be PM, he doesn't think he can win hence telling donors a deal with the Tories is needed which he knows he won't get.

Labour? The government? Much harder. They need the Vision Thing. And the only person who has it is Ed Milliband. I know he is divisive, but a Britain refounded as a green industrial titan is something we could do. Become a leading exporter of clean energy and with it the technology that harnesses it.
Seems highly unlikely.
We don't do either solar or batteries now, in terms of technology or mass manufacturing. And that's most of the future.

What we're likely to generate won't be cheap enough to export in quantities enough to underpin being an industrial titan.

What did you have in mind ?

1. Start building wind turbines in the UK at scale.
2. Install fucktons of wind turbines offshore
3. Chuck research money at Soton uni and others to develop tidal generators
4. Build and deploy tidal generators
5. Buy the Qataris out of Rolls Royce SMR. Fast track for deployment
6. Rinse and repeat. Boundless cheap energy and technology we can sell globally.
One of the advantages and disadvantages of Britain's renewable energy choices is that Britain has the best tidal and wind energy resources in the world, and among the least favourable for solar.

This means that, although I think it makes a lot of sense for Britain to develop and install tidal and wind generation the export potential is not as great as you might hope, because most of the rest of the world will be so much better off with solar.

Though given how cheap panels are becoming, that disadvantage is relatively less important.

The UK will need more panels than Spain to generate the same amount of electricity, sure. But once you get to the point that they are cheap building materials that also happen to generate electricity (which is roughly where we are already), that doesn't really matter.

The win from cheap renewable energy isn't so much selling it, or selling the tech to others. It's what you can then do with the energy.

noneoftheabove · 10:50AM

HYUFD said:

Andy_JS said:
Crawley goes, England heading fo another defeat.
As is the case for about 90% of England test matches in Ashes series in Australia in my lifetime. You can't even watch them live on Freeview anyway now which is probably just as well

The Ashes in Australia have hardly ever been available live on UK free TV. There seems to have been some trial in 1983 where the BBC baulked at paying £25k per day, and the coverage was such that they promised "at least the first two hours of play"......

https://www.sportsjournalists.co.uk/other-bodies/cricket-writers/the-changing-face-of-tv-coverage-and-the-ashes/

HYUFD · 10:51AM

RochdalePioneers said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:
Good morning

The first question is will there be a vacancy and no doubt Reeves will have to go first

Miliband is not the answer, indeed I am not sure anyone is

Mahmood seems the only one will real determination but as with the conservatives how can you trust the members to make the right choice ?
Morning Big_G. You are spot on - Reeves would be ousted first. Well, McSweeney first in the hope he can draw the poison, then Reeves. And finally Starmer.

The scenario is that Labour get routed in May. LibDem, Green, SNP, Reform, Plaid. They're losing to everyone bar the Tories. The slideaway is unmistakable and unavoidable. A change has to happen so that new leadership can turn the ship around.

I am not going to make predictions as to who that would be - my 25 years of Labour party membership tells me that members are capable of making major missteps.

For me Labour have two obvious threats - the Greens, and Reform. Ironically both of these parties speak to the same reality - the country is broken and why won't anyone do SOMETHING to fix it?

Polanski and Farage have the advantage of not thinking they will be the next government. Even Farage - he doesn't want to be PM, he doesn't think he can win hence telling donors a deal with the Tories is needed which he knows he won't get.

Labour? The government? Much harder. They need the Vision Thing. And the only person who has it is Ed Milliband. I know he is divisive, but a Britain refounded as a green industrial titan is something we could do. Become a leading exporter of clean energy and with it the technology that harnesses it.

In Scotland polls show a swing from SNP to Labour since 2021 so Labour should make gains there. Combined with Labour winning in London again and going into government with Plaid in Wales even if they come third in Wales that might be enough for Starmer to stay on despite losses to Reform and the Greens

Andy_JS · 10:51AM

noneoftheabove said:

HYUFD said:

Andy_JS said:
Crawley goes, England heading fo another defeat.
As is the case for about 90% of England test matches in Ashes series in Australia in my lifetime. You can't even watch them live on Freeview anyway now which is probably just as well
The Ashes in Australia have hardly ever been available live on UK free TV. There seems to have been some trial in 1983 where the BBC baulked at paying £25k per day, and the coverage was such that they promised "at least the first two hours of play"......

https://www.sportsjournalists.co.uk/other-bodies/cricket-writers/the-changing-face-of-tv-coverage-and-the-ashes/

They used to have a proper highlights programme on BBC in 1990/91 when I watched for the first time.

FrankBooth · 10:54AM

England could take heart from the West Indies' performance.

Quite a bizarre draw in that game.

noneoftheabove · 10:54AM

Andy_JS said:

noneoftheabove said:

HYUFD said:

Andy_JS said:
Crawley goes, England heading fo another defeat.
As is the case for about 90% of England test matches in Ashes series in Australia in my lifetime. You can't even watch them live on Freeview anyway now which is probably just as well
The Ashes in Australia have hardly ever been available live on UK free TV. There seems to have been some trial in 1983 where the BBC baulked at paying £25k per day, and the coverage was such that they promised "at least the first two hours of play"......

https://www.sportsjournalists.co.uk/other-bodies/cricket-writers/the-changing-face-of-tv-coverage-and-the-ashes/
They used to have a proper highlights programme on BBC in 1990/91 when I watched for the first time.

They still have highlights on iplayer.

Malmesbury · 10:54AM

MustaphaMondeo said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:
Good morning

The first question is will there be a vacancy and no doubt Reeves will have to go first

Miliband is not the answer, indeed I am not sure anyone is

Mahmood seems the only one will real determination but as with the conservatives how can you trust the members to make the right choice ?
Morning Big_G. You are spot on - Reeves would be ousted first. Well, McSweeney first in the hope he can draw the poison, then Reeves. And finally Starmer.

The scenario is that Labour get routed in May. LibDem, Green, SNP, Reform, Plaid. They're losing to everyone bar the Tories. The slideaway is unmistakable and unavoidable. A change has to happen so that new leadership can turn the ship around.

I am not going to make predictions as to who that would be - my 25 years of Labour party membership tells me that members are capable of making major missteps.

For me Labour have two obvious threats - the Greens, and Reform. Ironically both of these parties speak to the same reality - the country is broken and why won't anyone do SOMETHING to fix it?

Polanski and Farage have the advantage of not thinking they will be the next government. Even Farage - he doesn't want to be PM, he doesn't think he can win hence telling donors a deal with the Tories is needed which he knows he won't get.

Labour? The government? Much harder. They need the Vision Thing. And the only person who has it is Ed Milliband. I know he is divisive, but a Britain refounded as a green industrial titan is something we could do. Become a leading exporter of clean energy and with it the technology that harnesses it.
I attended a clean and Green-ish energy symposium a few days ago. Gov led.

The above is (imo) absolutely the back-up plan should child poverty turn out to be less influential with Reform voters than they hope.

The problem with "Britain refounded as a green industrial titan" is not the idea itself. But the system within which it will e executed.

This means that

- Winning solutions will be picked. Cars powered by oil from ground nuts...
- Process will ensure that nothing actually gets done
- The costs will be infinite on everything
- The requirements will be insane - see SMRs, Salmon Discos, Bat Tunnels etc. The problem is not the ideas themselves. Protecting fish at power station inlets and outlets is an old, old thing and sensible. The problem is a complete lack of understanding of proportionality and practicality. Or even the law.

What would I do?

Find metrics that are not technology specific. For example - not batteries, not hydrogen, not Shipstones. But "Power storage, in watt hours, with zero emissions, delivered in vehicles that have been sold and passed all safety and regulatory checks".

Then legislate for a subsidy/tax break of Xp per Watt Hour actually delivered. Scaled according to the UK content - made in China with a UK label gets 0%, 100% made in the UK (including all raw materials get 100% (will never happen)

Morris_Dancer · 10:58AM

F1: Norris investigated for impeding, that'll happen after the session.

Andy_JS · 10:59AM

Brook given out, he reviews. Not out.

Same thing next ball, out this time.

NickPalmer · 10:59AM

HYUFD said:
Ed Miliband is popular with Labour members, though a September Yougov poll had Streeting narrowly beating Miliband head to head with Labour members. If Streeting united on a joint ticket with Rayner that would also bring together the Blairite and left wings of the party.

Plus given Ed Miliband is the only Labour leader not to win a majority or even get a hung parliament at a general election he is hardly the nirvana of electability for the party

I'm not all that left-wing (never joined the Campaign Group and can't stand rabble-rousers like Scargill), but Angela Rayner doesn't strike me as at all left-wing, and Wes Streeting picks fights with the left to an embarrassing degree. I've decided to stay on in Labour but a Streeting-Rayner ticket would make me rethink.

EdM? Well, at least he stands for something positive, a reasonably coherent energy narrative.

Andy_JS · 11:03AM

Why not try Reeves as leader for a while?

LostPassword · 11:05AM

NickPalmer said:

HYUFD said:
Ed Miliband is popular with Labour members, though a September Yougov poll had Streeting narrowly beating Miliband head to head with Labour members. If Streeting united on a joint ticket with Rayner that would also bring together the Blairite and left wings of the party.

Plus given Ed Miliband is the only Labour leader not to win a majority or even get a hung parliament at a general election he is hardly the nirvana of electability for the party
I'm not all that left-wing (never joined the Campaign Group and can't stand rabble-rousers like Scargill), but Angela Rayner doesn't strike me as at all left-wing, and Wes Streeting picks fights with the left to an embarrassing degree. I've decided to stay on in Labour but a Streeting-Rayner ticket would make me rethink.

EdM? Well, at least he stands for something positive, a reasonably coherent energy narrative.

Nick, you served as a minister under Blair as PM, were supportive of Corbyn's leadership of the Labour Party, and now you suggest that a Streeting/Rayner leadership combo could be too right-wing for you to remain in the party.

I think it would be fair to conclude that your politics has moved to the left over time.

Tres · 11:06AM

Thrown the ashes away against the weakest aussie batting line-up this century and a team missing their 3 best bowlers

Stuartinromford · 11:09AM

NickPalmer said:

HYUFD said:
Ed Miliband is popular with Labour members, though a September Yougov poll had Streeting narrowly beating Miliband head to head with Labour members. If Streeting united on a joint ticket with Rayner that would also bring together the Blairite and left wings of the party.

Plus given Ed Miliband is the only Labour leader not to win a majority or even get a hung parliament at a general election he is hardly the nirvana of electability for the party
I'm not all that left-wing (never joined the Campaign Group and can't stand rabble-rousers like Scargill), but Angela Rayner doesn't strike me as at all left-wing, and Wes Streeting picks fights with the left to an embarrassing degree. I've decided to stay on in Labour but a Streeting-Rayner ticket would make me rethink.

EdM? Well, at least he stands for something positive, a reasonably coherent energy narrative.

EdM has got the massive advantage over most of the rest of them of having been in government before. So he knows how to get things done. And he's genuinely interested in this stuff, so he knows what he wants done. So it's roughly happening, which is good. (Some people don't like what he's doing but they lost and need to get over it.) It probably doesn't make him the next PM in anything other than a 'Starmer run over by a bus' scenario, but mostly because I'm expecting Starmer to hang around until someone plausible emerges from the middle ranks of the current cabinet.

isam · 11:09AM

Andy_JS said:
Why not try Reeves as leader for a while?

I backed her at 160/1 on the basis that the CotE should never be less than 1% chance to take over from the PM, but her odds are even bigger now

isam · 11:10AM

I woke up this morning at the innings break and first thing I thought was "The Aussies aren't batting again here"

Andy_JS · 11:11AM

This England team don't have the patience to play 5 day matches.

isam · 11:12AM

Stuartinromford said:

NickPalmer said:

HYUFD said:
Ed Miliband is popular with Labour members, though a September Yougov poll had Streeting narrowly beating Miliband head to head with Labour members. If Streeting united on a joint ticket with Rayner that would also bring together the Blairite and left wings of the party.

Plus given Ed Miliband is the only Labour leader not to win a majority or even get a hung parliament at a general election he is hardly the nirvana of electability for the party
I'm not all that left-wing (never joined the Campaign Group and can't stand rabble-rousers like Scargill), but Angela Rayner doesn't strike me as at all left-wing, and Wes Streeting picks fights with the left to an embarrassing degree. I've decided to stay on in Labour but a Streeting-Rayner ticket would make me rethink.

EdM? Well, at least he stands for something positive, a reasonably coherent energy narrative.
EdM has got the massive advantage over most of the rest of them of having been in government before. So he knows how to get things done. And he's genuinely interested in this stuff, so he knows what he wants done. So it's roughly happening, which is good. (Some people don't like what he's doing but they lost and need to get over it.) It probably doesn't make him the next PM in anything other than a 'Starmer run over by a bus' scenario, but mostly because I'm expecting Starmer to hang around until someone plausible emerges from the middle ranks of the current cabinet.

Can't wait for Kemi's impression of him, "Hell yeah!!"

ydoethur · 11:15AM

Andy_JS said:
Why not try Reeves as leader for a while?

Or better yet, try Reeves as England coach.

Andy_JS · 11:17AM

Smith caught behind. Reviews it but out.

FrancisUrquhart · 11:21AM

Good job England bat deep....

FrancisUrquhart · 11:21AM

Andy_JS said:
This England team don't have the patience to play 5 day matches.

They don't appear to have the patience to bat 50 overs....

isam · 11:22AM

ydoethur said:

Andy_JS said:
Why not try Reeves as leader for a while?
Or better yet, try Reeves as England coach.

We need a dull, boring, unflashy batsman who resists any urge to entertain the crowd and doesn't mind just staying there doing nothing.

Does Sir Keir play?

TimS · 11:23AM

What the country needs is a return to the golden era. The days when England were routinely trounced in the Ashes to a humiliating degree, the Cold War was a distant memory and our economy was firing on all cylinders.

Our recent lost decade of cricketing success has a lot to answer for.

NickPalmer · 11:23AM

OnlyLivingBoy said:

noneoftheabove said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:
I think it will be Wes. He is just the strongest candidate and I think will win over the membership when he goes up against the rest of the field. I don't think it makes sense to choose someone like Ed Miliband who has already lost an election. The only worry with Wes is over his own seat, but if he can turn Labour's fortunes around then he should be able to save his own seat in the process.
He is probably the one who could best sell a Labour message to the wider electorate. But to members won't it be easy for a rival candidate to pitch to his left without going full Corbynite?
Maybe I am projecting, but don't other Labour members also want someone who can appeal to the electorate as a whole and win an election? I just think Wes is so far ahead of the other candidates as a political communicator that it will become obvious that he is the best choice.

I think we need to pick a shortllist who we're basically OK with before considering electoral appeal, which is elusive and often transitory, and leads to embarrassment even when it works in electoral terms. Essentially a Labour leader needs to both command at least broad acceptance in the party and in the public, and there's no point in choosing a leader who goes out of his way to pick fights with much of the membership. That's why I would struggle to accept Streeting as leader, whether he won an election or not, whereas I'd accept a moderate centrist even if I often disagreed with them. My basic requirement is a broadly acceptable medium-term strategy, and my main criticism of Starmer, who seems pleasant enough, is that he doesn't seem to have a medium-term strategy at all, evem one I'd personally disagree with.

Ed Miliband’s chances of succeeding Starmer are sizzling like a bacon sarnie – politicalbetting.com

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