So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Isn't that, err, Tory policy as well?
No. That is PRECISELY the point, the Tories are not proposing to deport immigrants with indefinite leave to remain Badenoch and Philp have confirmed, while Reform still are. Hence Farage's 'Never Trust a Tory' line
They better make their mind up and get some consistency if that is true and they want that message to be heard. This is from 9 days ago. if you receive benefits you lose ILR. Not sure how that is different to Reforms you need a job to keep ILR and won't get benefits.
Asked about Lam’s comments, Badenoch’s spokesperson said some had been “pulled out of context”. He said: “She said there are a large number of people who came to this country legally but shouldn’t have been able to do so. The leader of the opposition agrees with that.”
Highlighting the party’s plan to strip ILR from people who receive benefits, who commit a crime or whose income falls below £38,700 for six months or longer, he said: “I think that’s broadly in line with what Katie said and that is the Conservative party policy.”
"Kemi Badenoch said that the rising Tory star Katie Lam “imprecisely” explained Conservative immigration policy, but admitted that the position needed to be more “coherent”.
The Conservative leader denied that the party would deport migrants who have already been granted indefinite leave to remain (ILR), which allows foreign nationals to live, work and study in the UK permanently. She insisted that the party “doesn’t believe in making things retrospective”.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Ok so what is your plan to solve the Tory immigrant crisis ? “ Whoops we ‘accidentally’ let 3 million people in can’t do anything now lol” is not an answer
This country is sick of soft open borders pro immigration wets
The target should be negative net migrants vs 2010 numbers
Net migration is already falling due to the tighter visa wage requirements Sunak and Cleverly brought in.
It doesn't mean you need to go full BNP as well
So there are fewer migrants in the uk than in 2010 ? Or are UK migrant numbers still increasing ?
What is the alternative plan to reduce the number of migrants in the UK ? Not reduce the RATE of increase but reduce them full stop. No one else seems to have one
Kick them all out? As I presume you back? Hence you are voting for Farage
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Isn't that, err, Tory policy as well?
No. That is PRECISELY the point, the Tories are not proposing to deport immigrants with indefinite leave to remain Badenoch and Philp have confirmed, while Reform still are. Hence Farage's 'Never Trust a Tory' line
They better make their mind up and get some consistency if that is true and they want that message to be heard. This is from 9 days ago. if you receive benefits you lose ILR. Not sure how that is different to Reforms you need a job to keep ILR and won't get benefits.
Asked about Lam’s comments, Badenoch’s spokesperson said some had been “pulled out of context”. He said: “She said there are a large number of people who came to this country legally but shouldn’t have been able to do so. The leader of the opposition agrees with that.”
Highlighting the party’s plan to strip ILR from people who receive benefits, who commit a crime or whose income falls below £38,700 for six months or longer, he said: “I think that’s broadly in line with what Katie said and that is the Conservative party policy.”
"Kemi Badenoch said that the rising Tory star Katie Lam “imprecisely” explained Conservative immigration policy, but admitted that the position needed to be more “coherent”.
The Conservative leader denied that the party would deport migrants who have already been granted indefinite leave to remain (ILR), which allows foreign nationals to live, work and study in the UK permanently. She insisted that the party “doesn’t believe in making things retrospective”.
Firewalled so I can't read it. Regardless it is different to what her spokesman said 9 days ago and what others in the shadow cabinet have been saying.
It is good if Badenoch has changed the policy and recognises the need to be more coherent. Part of that is sacking Lam.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Isn't that, err, Tory policy as well?
No. That is PRECISELY the point, the Tories are not proposing to deport immigrants with indefinite leave to remain Badenoch and Philp have confirmed, while Reform still are. Hence Farage's 'Never Trust a Tory' line
They better make their mind up and get some consistency if that is true and they want that message to be heard. This is from 9 days ago. if you receive benefits you lose ILR. Not sure how that is different to Reforms you need a job to keep ILR and won't get benefits.
Asked about Lam’s comments, Badenoch’s spokesperson said some had been “pulled out of context”. He said: “She said there are a large number of people who came to this country legally but shouldn’t have been able to do so. The leader of the opposition agrees with that.”
Highlighting the party’s plan to strip ILR from people who receive benefits, who commit a crime or whose income falls below £38,700 for six months or longer, he said: “I think that’s broadly in line with what Katie said and that is the Conservative party policy.”
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Ok so what is your plan to solve the Tory immigrant crisis ? “ Whoops we ‘accidentally’ let 3 million people in can’t do anything now lol” is not an answer
This country is sick of soft open borders pro immigration wets
The target should be negative net migrants vs 2010 numbers
Net migration is already falling due to the tighter visa wage requirements Sunak and Cleverly brought in.
It doesn't mean you need to go full BNP as well
If you want to know why the Conservative party are at their lowest point ever, this is it.
You are divided between people who think immigration is the root of all our problems and those that are broadly content with most of it, bar the boats and hotels. So your policies vary week to week, your messaging is unclear and confusing, and you lose the trust and respect of both groups.
Make your mind up and stick with it. Don't flirt with the other group whichever path you take.
I think the main problem is that they said one thing - "net migration in the tens of thousands" - and did another.
It hardly matters what they say on the subject for at least a decade. Who is going to take them seriously again?
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Ok so what is your plan to solve the Tory immigrant crisis ? “ Whoops we ‘accidentally’ let 3 million people in can’t do anything now lol” is not an answer
This country is sick of soft open borders pro immigration wets
The target should be negative net migrants vs 2010 numbers
Net migration is already falling due to the tighter visa wage requirements Sunak and Cleverly brought in.
It doesn't mean you need to go full BNP as well
So there are fewer migrants in the uk than in 2010 ? Or are UK migrant numbers still increasing ?
What is the alternative plan to reduce the number of migrants in the UK ? Not reduce the RATE of increase but reduce them full stop. No one else seems to have one
Kick them all out? As I presume you back? Hence you are voting for Farage
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Isn't that, err, Tory policy as well?
No. That is PRECISELY the point, the Tories are not proposing to deport immigrants with indefinite leave to remain Badenoch and Philp have confirmed, while Reform still are. Hence Farage's 'Never Trust a Tory' line
They better make their mind up and get some consistency if that is true and they want that message to be heard. This is from 9 days ago. if you receive benefits you lose ILR. Not sure how that is different to Reforms you need a job to keep ILR and won't get benefits.
Asked about Lam’s comments, Badenoch’s spokesperson said some had been “pulled out of context”. He said: “She said there are a large number of people who came to this country legally but shouldn’t have been able to do so. The leader of the opposition agrees with that.”
Highlighting the party’s plan to strip ILR from people who receive benefits, who commit a crime or whose income falls below £38,700 for six months or longer, he said: “I think that’s broadly in line with what Katie said and that is the Conservative party policy.”
"Kemi Badenoch said that the rising Tory star Katie Lam “imprecisely” explained Conservative immigration policy, but admitted that the position needed to be more “coherent”.
The Conservative leader denied that the party would deport migrants who have already been granted indefinite leave to remain (ILR), which allows foreign nationals to live, work and study in the UK permanently. She insisted that the party “doesn’t believe in making things retrospective”.
Firewalled so I can't read it. Regardless it is different to what her spokesman said 9 days ago and what others in the shadow cabinet have been saying.
It is good if Badenoch has changed the policy and recognises the need to be more coherent. Part of that is sacking Lam.
One problem the Tories have is that their policy is whatever the leader says it is. So if the leader is inconsistent, or unclear, or Boris Johnson, it's very difficult for spokesmen to know what today's policy is.
One of many reasons why I would never vote for the Tories - in a democracy, how much faith can you have in a party that doesn't even decide its own policy democratically within its membership?
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Isn't that, err, Tory policy as well?
No. That is PRECISELY the point, the Tories are not proposing to deport immigrants with indefinite leave to remain Badenoch and Philp have confirmed, while Reform still are. Hence Farage's 'Never Trust a Tory' line
They better make their mind up and get some consistency if that is true and they want that message to be heard. This is from 9 days ago. if you receive benefits you lose ILR. Not sure how that is different to Reforms you need a job to keep ILR and won't get benefits.
Asked about Lam’s comments, Badenoch’s spokesperson said some had been “pulled out of context”. He said: “She said there are a large number of people who came to this country legally but shouldn’t have been able to do so. The leader of the opposition agrees with that.”
Highlighting the party’s plan to strip ILR from people who receive benefits, who commit a crime or whose income falls below £38,700 for six months or longer, he said: “I think that’s broadly in line with what Katie said and that is the Conservative party policy.”
"Kemi Badenoch said that the rising Tory star Katie Lam “imprecisely” explained Conservative immigration policy, but admitted that the position needed to be more “coherent”.
The Conservative leader denied that the party would deport migrants who have already been granted indefinite leave to remain (ILR), which allows foreign nationals to live, work and study in the UK permanently. She insisted that the party “doesn’t believe in making things retrospective”.
Firewalled so I can't read it. Regardless it is different to what her spokesman said 9 days ago and what others in the shadow cabinet have been saying.
It is good if Badenoch has changed the policy and recognises the need to be more coherent. Part of that is sacking Lam.
One problem the Tories have is that their policy is whatever the leader says it is. So if the leader is inconsistent, or unclear, or Boris Johnson, it's very difficult for spokesmen to know what today's policy is.
One of many reasons why I would never vote for the Tories - in a democracy, how much faith can you have in a party that doesn't even decide its own policy democratically within its membership?
It's a tiered democracy - at every level its democratic. Just at the top level there's an electorate of one.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Isn't that, err, Tory policy as well?
No. That is PRECISELY the point, the Tories are not proposing to deport immigrants with indefinite leave to remain Badenoch and Philp have confirmed, while Reform still are. Hence Farage's 'Never Trust a Tory' line
They better make their mind up and get some consistency if that is true and they want that message to be heard. This is from 9 days ago. if you receive benefits you lose ILR. Not sure how that is different to Reforms you need a job to keep ILR and won't get benefits.
Asked about Lam’s comments, Badenoch’s spokesperson said some had been “pulled out of context”. He said: “She said there are a large number of people who came to this country legally but shouldn’t have been able to do so. The leader of the opposition agrees with that.”
Highlighting the party’s plan to strip ILR from people who receive benefits, who commit a crime or whose income falls below £38,700 for six months or longer, he said: “I think that’s broadly in line with what Katie said and that is the Conservative party policy.”
"Kemi Badenoch said that the rising Tory star Katie Lam “imprecisely” explained Conservative immigration policy, but admitted that the position needed to be more “coherent”.
The Conservative leader denied that the party would deport migrants who have already been granted indefinite leave to remain (ILR), which allows foreign nationals to live, work and study in the UK permanently. She insisted that the party “doesn’t believe in making things retrospective”.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Ok so what is your plan to solve the Tory immigrant crisis ? “ Whoops we ‘accidentally’ let 3 million people in can’t do anything now lol” is not an answer
This country is sick of soft open borders pro immigration wets
The target should be negative net migrants vs 2010 numbers
Net migration is already falling due to the tighter visa wage requirements Sunak and Cleverly brought in.
It doesn't mean you need to go full BNP as well
If you want to know why the Conservative party are at their lowest point ever, this is it.
You are divided between people who think immigration is the root of all our problems and those that are broadly content with most of it, bar the boats and hotels. So your policies vary week to week, your messaging is unclear and confusing, and you lose the trust and respect of both groups.
Make your mind up and stick with it. Don't flirt with the other group whichever path you take.
I think the main problem is that they said one thing - "net migration in the tens of thousands" - and did another.
It hardly matters what they say on the subject for at least a decade. Who is going to take them seriously again?
Who is going to take Labour seriously after their Ming Vase strategy of no rises in Income Tax?
They are more likely to forget the Tories failings 5+ years on - whereas Labour's will be far more fresh in the mind.
The Tories will come back. As the natural choice to replace Labour in Government. Maybe. Particualarly if Farage has a health/legal issue that kills Brand Reform.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Ok so what is your plan to solve the Tory immigrant crisis ? “ Whoops we ‘accidentally’ let 3 million people in can’t do anything now lol” is not an answer
This country is sick of soft open borders pro immigration wets
The target should be negative net migrants vs 2010 numbers
Net migration is already falling due to the tighter visa wage requirements Sunak and Cleverly brought in.
It doesn't mean you need to go full BNP as well
If you want to know why the Conservative party are at their lowest point ever, this is it.
You are divided between people who think immigration is the root of all our problems and those that are broadly content with most of it, bar the boats and hotels. So your policies vary week to week, your messaging is unclear and confusing, and you lose the trust and respect of both groups.
Make your mind up and stick with it. Don't flirt with the other group whichever path you take.
I think the main problem is that they said one thing - "net migration in the tens of thousands" - and did another.
It hardly matters what they say on the subject for at least a decade. Who is going to take them seriously again?
It is not like we have a great bunch of options elsewhere so despite their lunacy over the last decade I would like to be able to take them seriously sometime in the 2030s, and would be willing to if they sharpen up and choose a clearly distinctive path to Reform. If they want to be both a respectable establishment party and an insurgent nationalist one, then of course they will simply disappear.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Ok so what is your plan to solve the Tory immigrant crisis ? “ Whoops we ‘accidentally’ let 3 million people in can’t do anything now lol” is not an answer
This country is sick of soft open borders pro immigration wets
The target should be negative net migrants vs 2010 numbers
Net migration is already falling due to the tighter visa wage requirements Sunak and Cleverly brought in.
It doesn't mean you need to go full BNP as well
So there are fewer migrants in the uk than in 2010 ? Or are UK migrant numbers still increasing ?
What is the alternative plan to reduce the number of migrants in the UK ? Not reduce the RATE of increase but reduce them full stop. No one else seems to have one
Kick them all out? As I presume you back? Hence you are voting for Farage
Open to other options. Extra taxes on migrants is the only other option I’ve seen suggested
We need a one off migrant policy reset back to sanity
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Isn't that, err, Tory policy as well?
No. That is PRECISELY the point, the Tories are not proposing to deport immigrants with indefinite leave to remain Badenoch and Philp have confirmed, while Reform still are. Hence Farage's 'Never Trust a Tory' line
They better make their mind up and get some consistency if that is true and they want that message to be heard. This is from 9 days ago. if you receive benefits you lose ILR. Not sure how that is different to Reforms you need a job to keep ILR and won't get benefits.
Asked about Lam’s comments, Badenoch’s spokesperson said some had been “pulled out of context”. He said: “She said there are a large number of people who came to this country legally but shouldn’t have been able to do so. The leader of the opposition agrees with that.”
Highlighting the party’s plan to strip ILR from people who receive benefits, who commit a crime or whose income falls below £38,700 for six months or longer, he said: “I think that’s broadly in line with what Katie said and that is the Conservative party policy.”
"Kemi Badenoch said that the rising Tory star Katie Lam “imprecisely” explained Conservative immigration policy, but admitted that the position needed to be more “coherent”.
The Conservative leader denied that the party would deport migrants who have already been granted indefinite leave to remain (ILR), which allows foreign nationals to live, work and study in the UK permanently. She insisted that the party “doesn’t believe in making things retrospective”.
If you are a Conservative holding down one of the seats up for election in May 2026, you must be wondering what can be done to stop the headlong rush to Reform. Some are arguing you have to wait until the debacle hits before Kemi is toast but why wait? A new leader 6 months out would give their local councillors something to talk about positively and take the battle to Reform.
Kemi's time is up in November so let's see if she can make it to Xmas.
From previous thread....I speak reasonably good french - but not fluent. A few years ago i moved to Paris for two years and thought that it would be a great opportunity to achieve fluency. No chance - either everyone wanted to speak English - or spoke eith such a thick Parissiene accent as to be unintellligible. If you want to practice French, forget France - go to Francophone Africa.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Isn't that, err, Tory policy as well?
No. That is PRECISELY the point, the Tories are not proposing to deport immigrants with indefinite leave to remain Badenoch and Philp have confirmed, while Reform still are. Hence Farage's 'Never Trust a Tory' line
They better make their mind up and get some consistency if that is true and they want that message to be heard. This is from 9 days ago. if you receive benefits you lose ILR. Not sure how that is different to Reforms you need a job to keep ILR and won't get benefits.
Asked about Lam’s comments, Badenoch’s spokesperson said some had been “pulled out of context”. He said: “She said there are a large number of people who came to this country legally but shouldn’t have been able to do so. The leader of the opposition agrees with that.”
Highlighting the party’s plan to strip ILR from people who receive benefits, who commit a crime or whose income falls below £38,700 for six months or longer, he said: “I think that’s broadly in line with what Katie said and that is the Conservative party policy.”
"Kemi Badenoch said that the rising Tory star Katie Lam “imprecisely” explained Conservative immigration policy, but admitted that the position needed to be more “coherent”.
The Conservative leader denied that the party would deport migrants who have already been granted indefinite leave to remain (ILR), which allows foreign nationals to live, work and study in the UK permanently. She insisted that the party “doesn’t believe in making things retrospective”.
Firewalled so I can't read it. Regardless it is different to what her spokesman said 9 days ago and what others in the shadow cabinet have been saying.
It is good if Badenoch has changed the policy and recognises the need to be more coherent. Part of that is sacking Lam.
One problem the Tories have is that their policy is whatever the leader says it is. So if the leader is inconsistent, or unclear, or Boris Johnson, it's very difficult for spokesmen to know what today's policy is.
One of many reasons why I would never vote for the Tories - in a democracy, how much faith can you have in a party that doesn't even decide its own policy democratically within its membership?
That's not important to me and probably actually prefer members being at arms length on policy. If you think the MPs (in all our parties) are a bit weird and useless, wait til you hear from the members. That especially applies in government, where the cabinet have far more information than your average party member and have to (at least try to) operate in a coherent manner where one policy has knock on consequences and costs on others.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Ok so what is your plan to solve the Tory immigrant crisis ? “ Whoops we ‘accidentally’ let 3 million people in can’t do anything now lol” is not an answer
This country is sick of soft open borders pro immigration wets
The target should be negative net migrants vs 2010 numbers
Net migration is already falling due to the tighter visa wage requirements Sunak and Cleverly brought in.
It doesn't mean you need to go full BNP as well
So there are fewer migrants in the uk than in 2010 ? Or are UK migrant numbers still increasing ?
What is the alternative plan to reduce the number of migrants in the UK ? Not reduce the RATE of increase but reduce them full stop. No one else seems to have one
Kick them all out? As I presume you back? Hence you are voting for Farage
Open to other options. Extra taxes on migrants is the only other option I’ve seen suggested
We need a one off migrant policy reset back to sanity
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Isn't that, err, Tory policy as well?
No. That is PRECISELY the point, the Tories are not proposing to deport immigrants with indefinite leave to remain Badenoch and Philp have confirmed, while Reform still are. Hence Farage's 'Never Trust a Tory' line
They better make their mind up and get some consistency if that is true and they want that message to be heard. This is from 9 days ago. if you receive benefits you lose ILR. Not sure how that is different to Reforms you need a job to keep ILR and won't get benefits.
Asked about Lam’s comments, Badenoch’s spokesperson said some had been “pulled out of context”. He said: “She said there are a large number of people who came to this country legally but shouldn’t have been able to do so. The leader of the opposition agrees with that.”
Highlighting the party’s plan to strip ILR from people who receive benefits, who commit a crime or whose income falls below £38,700 for six months or longer, he said: “I think that’s broadly in line with what Katie said and that is the Conservative party policy.”
"Kemi Badenoch said that the rising Tory star Katie Lam “imprecisely” explained Conservative immigration policy, but admitted that the position needed to be more “coherent”.
The Conservative leader denied that the party would deport migrants who have already been granted indefinite leave to remain (ILR), which allows foreign nationals to live, work and study in the UK permanently. She insisted that the party “doesn’t believe in making things retrospective”.
Firewalled so I can't read it. Regardless it is different to what her spokesman said 9 days ago and what others in the shadow cabinet have been saying.
It is good if Badenoch has changed the policy and recognises the need to be more coherent. Part of that is sacking Lam.
One problem the Tories have is that their policy is whatever the leader says it is. So if the leader is inconsistent, or unclear, or Boris Johnson, it's very difficult for spokesmen to know what today's policy is.
One of many reasons why I would never vote for the Tories - in a democracy, how much faith can you have in a party that doesn't even decide its own policy democratically within its membership?
Not a position that hstorically has had a much success in any party. Generally the membership come up with the most stupid, election losing, policies.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Isn't that, err, Tory policy as well?
No. That is PRECISELY the point, the Tories are not proposing to deport immigrants with indefinite leave to remain Badenoch and Philp have confirmed, while Reform still are. Hence Farage's 'Never Trust a Tory' line
They better make their mind up and get some consistency if that is true and they want that message to be heard. This is from 9 days ago. if you receive benefits you lose ILR. Not sure how that is different to Reforms you need a job to keep ILR and won't get benefits.
Asked about Lam’s comments, Badenoch’s spokesperson said some had been “pulled out of context”. He said: “She said there are a large number of people who came to this country legally but shouldn’t have been able to do so. The leader of the opposition agrees with that.”
Highlighting the party’s plan to strip ILR from people who receive benefits, who commit a crime or whose income falls below £38,700 for six months or longer, he said: “I think that’s broadly in line with what Katie said and that is the Conservative party policy.”
"Kemi Badenoch said that the rising Tory star Katie Lam “imprecisely” explained Conservative immigration policy, but admitted that the position needed to be more “coherent”.
The Conservative leader denied that the party would deport migrants who have already been granted indefinite leave to remain (ILR), which allows foreign nationals to live, work and study in the UK permanently. She insisted that the party “doesn’t believe in making things retrospective”.
Firewalled so I can't read it. Regardless it is different to what her spokesman said 9 days ago and what others in the shadow cabinet have been saying.
It is good if Badenoch has changed the policy and recognises the need to be more coherent. Part of that is sacking Lam.
One problem the Tories have is that their policy is whatever the leader says it is. So if the leader is inconsistent, or unclear, or Boris Johnson, it's very difficult for spokesmen to know what today's policy is.
One of many reasons why I would never vote for the Tories - in a democracy, how much faith can you have in a party that doesn't even decide its own policy democratically within its membership?
Not a position that hstorically has had a much success in any party. Generally the membership come up with the most stupid, election losing, policies.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Ok so what is your plan to solve the Tory immigrant crisis ? “ Whoops we ‘accidentally’ let 3 million people in can’t do anything now lol” is not an answer
This country is sick of soft open borders pro immigration wets
The target should be negative net migrants vs 2010 numbers
Net migration is already falling due to the tighter visa wage requirements Sunak and Cleverly brought in.
It doesn't mean you need to go full BNP as well
If you want to know why the Conservative party are at their lowest point ever, this is it.
You are divided between people who think immigration is the root of all our problems and those that are broadly content with most of it, bar the boats and hotels. So your policies vary week to week, your messaging is unclear and confusing, and you lose the trust and respect of both groups.
Make your mind up and stick with it. Don't flirt with the other group whichever path you take.
I think the main problem is that they said one thing - "net migration in the tens of thousands" - and did another.
It hardly matters what they say on the subject for at least a decade. Who is going to take them seriously again?
Who is going to take Labour seriously after their Ming Vase strategy of no rises in Income Tax?
They are more likely to forget the Tories failings 5+ years on - whereas Labour's will be far more fresh in the mind.
The Tories will come back. As the natural choice to replace Labour in Government. Maybe. Particualarly if Farage has a health/legal issue that kills Brand Reform.
It does look like we are going to go through political parties at increasing speed.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Isn't that, err, Tory policy as well?
No. That is PRECISELY the point, the Tories are not proposing to deport immigrants with indefinite leave to remain Badenoch and Philp have confirmed, while Reform still are. Hence Farage's 'Never Trust a Tory' line
They better make their mind up and get some consistency if that is true and they want that message to be heard. This is from 9 days ago. if you receive benefits you lose ILR. Not sure how that is different to Reforms you need a job to keep ILR and won't get benefits.
Asked about Lam’s comments, Badenoch’s spokesperson said some had been “pulled out of context”. He said: “She said there are a large number of people who came to this country legally but shouldn’t have been able to do so. The leader of the opposition agrees with that.”
Highlighting the party’s plan to strip ILR from people who receive benefits, who commit a crime or whose income falls below £38,700 for six months or longer, he said: “I think that’s broadly in line with what Katie said and that is the Conservative party policy.”
"Kemi Badenoch said that the rising Tory star Katie Lam “imprecisely” explained Conservative immigration policy, but admitted that the position needed to be more “coherent”.
The Conservative leader denied that the party would deport migrants who have already been granted indefinite leave to remain (ILR), which allows foreign nationals to live, work and study in the UK permanently. She insisted that the party “doesn’t believe in making things retrospective”.
If you are a Conservative holding down one of the seats up for election in May 2026, you must be wondering what can be done to stop the headlong rush to Reform. Some are arguing you have to wait until the debacle hits before Kemi is toast but why wait? A new leader 6 months out would give their local councillors something to talk about positively and take the battle to Reform.
Kemi's time is up in November so let's see if she can make it to Xmas.
Badenoch is the only choice for the conservatives going forward and certainly she will be leader in May 26
Jenrick and Lam are not remotely the answer, and I agree with @HYUFD that Cleverly may succeed her next Summer, though that is not certain by any means
I would suggest Starmer is likely to be under even more pressure next Spring
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Isn't that, err, Tory policy as well?
No. That is PRECISELY the point, the Tories are not proposing to deport immigrants with indefinite leave to remain Badenoch and Philp have confirmed, while Reform still are. Hence Farage's 'Never Trust a Tory' line
They better make their mind up and get some consistency if that is true and they want that message to be heard. This is from 9 days ago. if you receive benefits you lose ILR. Not sure how that is different to Reforms you need a job to keep ILR and won't get benefits.
Asked about Lam’s comments, Badenoch’s spokesperson said some had been “pulled out of context”. He said: “She said there are a large number of people who came to this country legally but shouldn’t have been able to do so. The leader of the opposition agrees with that.”
Highlighting the party’s plan to strip ILR from people who receive benefits, who commit a crime or whose income falls below £38,700 for six months or longer, he said: “I think that’s broadly in line with what Katie said and that is the Conservative party policy.”
"Kemi Badenoch said that the rising Tory star Katie Lam “imprecisely” explained Conservative immigration policy, but admitted that the position needed to be more “coherent”.
The Conservative leader denied that the party would deport migrants who have already been granted indefinite leave to remain (ILR), which allows foreign nationals to live, work and study in the UK permanently. She insisted that the party “doesn’t believe in making things retrospective”.
If you are a Conservative holding down one of the seats up for election in May 2026, you must be wondering what can be done to stop the headlong rush to Reform. Some are arguing you have to wait until the debacle hits before Kemi is toast but why wait? A new leader 6 months out would give their local councillors something to talk about positively and take the battle to Reform.
Kemi's time is up in November so let's see if she can make it to Xmas.
She will make it to Christmas, she had a good enough conference performance for that.
Whether she lasts beyond May depends on how the Conservatives do in next year's local elections. If she wins back voters from Reform and makes some gains she will survive, if not she will likely lose a VONC and be replaced by Cleverly.
Cleverly probably most likely to win swing voters and tactical votes in Conservative held seats to beat Reform
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Ok so what is your plan to solve the Tory immigrant crisis ? “ Whoops we ‘accidentally’ let 3 million people in can’t do anything now lol” is not an answer
This country is sick of soft open borders pro immigration wets
The target should be negative net migrants vs 2010 numbers
Net migration is already falling due to the tighter visa wage requirements Sunak and Cleverly brought in.
It doesn't mean you need to go full BNP as well
So there are fewer migrants in the uk than in 2010 ? Or are UK migrant numbers still increasing ?
What is the alternative plan to reduce the number of migrants in the UK ? Not reduce the RATE of increase but reduce them full stop. No one else seems to have one
Kick them all out? As I presume you back? Hence you are voting for Farage
Open to other options. Extra taxes on migrants is the only other option I’ve seen suggested
We need a one off migrant policy reset back to sanity
Interesting to see applause on QT for the comment we spend so much time debating fewer than 40,000 people arriving on small boats versus children in poverty.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Ok so what is your plan to solve the Tory immigrant crisis ? “ Whoops we ‘accidentally’ let 3 million people in can’t do anything now lol” is not an answer
This country is sick of soft open borders pro immigration wets
The target should be negative net migrants vs 2010 numbers
Net migration is already falling due to the tighter visa wage requirements Sunak and Cleverly brought in.
It doesn't mean you need to go full BNP as well
So there are fewer migrants in the uk than in 2010 ? Or are UK migrant numbers still increasing ?
What is the alternative plan to reduce the number of migrants in the UK ? Not reduce the RATE of increase but reduce them full stop. No one else seems to have one
Kick them all out? As I presume you back? Hence you are voting for Farage
Open to other options. Extra taxes on migrants is the only other option I’ve seen suggested
We need a one off migrant policy reset back to sanity
Interesting to see applause on QT for the comment we spend so much time debating fewer than 40,000 people arriving on small boats versus children in poverty.
31 October 1973. 1st episode of the 26-part classic ITV documentary series World at War was broadcast. It was narrated by Laurence Olivier with music by Carl Davies. It cost £900,000 (worth £11 million today).
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Ok so what is your plan to solve the Tory immigrant crisis ? “ Whoops we ‘accidentally’ let 3 million people in can’t do anything now lol” is not an answer
This country is sick of soft open borders pro immigration wets
The target should be negative net migrants vs 2010 numbers
Net migration is already falling due to the tighter visa wage requirements Sunak and Cleverly brought in.
It doesn't mean you need to go full BNP as well
So there are fewer migrants in the uk than in 2010 ? Or are UK migrant numbers still increasing ?
What is the alternative plan to reduce the number of migrants in the UK ? Not reduce the RATE of increase but reduce them full stop. No one else seems to have one
Kick them all out? As I presume you back? Hence you are voting for Farage
Open to other options. Extra taxes on migrants is the only other option I’ve seen suggested
We need a one off migrant policy reset back to sanity
Interesting to see applause on QT for the comment we spend so much time debating fewer than 40,000 people arriving on small boats versus children in poverty.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Isn't that, err, Tory policy as well?
No. That is PRECISELY the point, the Tories are not proposing to deport immigrants with indefinite leave to remain Badenoch and Philp have confirmed, while Reform still are. Hence Farage's 'Never Trust a Tory' line
They better make their mind up and get some consistency if that is true and they want that message to be heard. This is from 9 days ago. if you receive benefits you lose ILR. Not sure how that is different to Reforms you need a job to keep ILR and won't get benefits.
Asked about Lam’s comments, Badenoch’s spokesperson said some had been “pulled out of context”. He said: “She said there are a large number of people who came to this country legally but shouldn’t have been able to do so. The leader of the opposition agrees with that.”
Highlighting the party’s plan to strip ILR from people who receive benefits, who commit a crime or whose income falls below £38,700 for six months or longer, he said: “I think that’s broadly in line with what Katie said and that is the Conservative party policy.”
"Kemi Badenoch said that the rising Tory star Katie Lam “imprecisely” explained Conservative immigration policy, but admitted that the position needed to be more “coherent”.
The Conservative leader denied that the party would deport migrants who have already been granted indefinite leave to remain (ILR), which allows foreign nationals to live, work and study in the UK permanently. She insisted that the party “doesn’t believe in making things retrospective”.
If you are a Conservative holding down one of the seats up for election in May 2026, you must be wondering what can be done to stop the headlong rush to Reform. Some are arguing you have to wait until the debacle hits before Kemi is toast but why wait? A new leader 6 months out would give their local councillors something to talk about positively and take the battle to Reform.
Kemi's time is up in November so let's see if she can make it to Xmas.
Badenoch is the only choice for the conservatives going forward and certainly she will be leader in May 26
Jenrick and Lam are not remotely the answer, and I agree with @HYUFD that Cleverly may succeed her next Summer, though that is not certain by any means
I would suggest Starmer is likely to be under even more pressure next Spring
Tim Shipman has piece in this weekend's Speccie looking at Badenoch leadership.
General tone: she has learnt a lot in recent months and the sinking ship is beginning to turn. Lot of backroom stuff that has been changed that is just starting to bear fruit. Quite a few Aussie election strategists and gurus have quietly been brought on board.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Ok so what is your plan to solve the Tory immigrant crisis ? “ Whoops we ‘accidentally’ let 3 million people in can’t do anything now lol” is not an answer
This country is sick of soft open borders pro immigration wets
The target should be negative net migrants vs 2010 numbers
Net migration is already falling due to the tighter visa wage requirements Sunak and Cleverly brought in.
It doesn't mean you need to go full BNP as well
So there are fewer migrants in the uk than in 2010 ? Or are UK migrant numbers still increasing ?
What is the alternative plan to reduce the number of migrants in the UK ? Not reduce the RATE of increase but reduce them full stop. No one else seems to have one
Kick them all out? As I presume you back? Hence you are voting for Farage
Open to other options. Extra taxes on migrants is the only other option I’ve seen suggested
We need a one off migrant policy reset back to sanity
Interesting to see applause on QT for the comment we spend so much time debating fewer than 40,000 people arriving on small boats versus children in poverty.
If you’re watching QT then you aren’t getting your priorities right !
But yes small boats is nothing compared with total net migration from 2021 to 2024 which 2 million plus. Like 5% or something ? Too much time focusing on the wrong thing imo
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Ok so what is your plan to solve the Tory immigrant crisis ? “ Whoops we ‘accidentally’ let 3 million people in can’t do anything now lol” is not an answer
This country is sick of soft open borders pro immigration wets
The target should be negative net migrants vs 2010 numbers
Net migration is already falling due to the tighter visa wage requirements Sunak and Cleverly brought in.
It doesn't mean you need to go full BNP as well
So there are fewer migrants in the uk than in 2010 ? Or are UK migrant numbers still increasing ?
What is the alternative plan to reduce the number of migrants in the UK ? Not reduce the RATE of increase but reduce them full stop. No one else seems to have one
Kick them all out? As I presume you back? Hence you are voting for Farage
Open to other options. Extra taxes on migrants is the only other option I’ve seen suggested
We need a one off migrant policy reset back to sanity
Interesting to see applause on QT for the comment we spend so much time debating fewer than 40,000 people arriving on small boats versus children in poverty.
There really aren't 'children in poverty' in the UK.
When the measure is relative poverty (i.e. wrt median income or some such) then the poor are always with us as the Good Book say
Of course, quite right. There are lots of people that could do with some help in the UK. Some of those are children. Put a sticker on it and earn a good commission? - not for me.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Isn't that, err, Tory policy as well?
No. That is PRECISELY the point, the Tories are not proposing to deport immigrants with indefinite leave to remain Badenoch and Philp have confirmed, while Reform still are. Hence Farage's 'Never Trust a Tory' line
They better make their mind up and get some consistency if that is true and they want that message to be heard. This is from 9 days ago. if you receive benefits you lose ILR. Not sure how that is different to Reforms you need a job to keep ILR and won't get benefits.
Asked about Lam’s comments, Badenoch’s spokesperson said some had been “pulled out of context”. He said: “She said there are a large number of people who came to this country legally but shouldn’t have been able to do so. The leader of the opposition agrees with that.”
Highlighting the party’s plan to strip ILR from people who receive benefits, who commit a crime or whose income falls below £38,700 for six months or longer, he said: “I think that’s broadly in line with what Katie said and that is the Conservative party policy.”
"Kemi Badenoch said that the rising Tory star Katie Lam “imprecisely” explained Conservative immigration policy, but admitted that the position needed to be more “coherent”.
The Conservative leader denied that the party would deport migrants who have already been granted indefinite leave to remain (ILR), which allows foreign nationals to live, work and study in the UK permanently. She insisted that the party “doesn’t believe in making things retrospective”.
Firewalled so I can't read it. Regardless it is different to what her spokesman said 9 days ago and what others in the shadow cabinet have been saying.
It is good if Badenoch has changed the policy and recognises the need to be more coherent. Part of that is sacking Lam.
One problem the Tories have is that their policy is whatever the leader says it is. So if the leader is inconsistent, or unclear, or Boris Johnson, it's very difficult for spokesmen to know what today's policy is.
One of many reasons why I would never vote for the Tories - in a democracy, how much faith can you have in a party that doesn't even decide its own policy democratically within its membership?
Not a position that hstorically has had a much success in any party. Generally the membership come up with the most stupid, election losing, policies.
I don't know - Labour has sometimes shot off to the left in response to losing, and some of the Labour members a bit too sure of their ideology to take seriously. Certainly a lot of the Tory members I've met have been bonkers, borderline nazi or both. But when parties succeed they usually seem to have a broad base of moderate support behind them, and a leadership that is able to take the members with them. If parties believe in democracy they ought to show that confidence in how they run their own internal affairs.
And ultimately if members keep wanting to vote for bonkers policies and never win, surely that's up to them? Another party will present a sensible set of policies and prevail. (At least, that used to be the case... Reform will test that theory).
I can't see the point of being a member of a party without a having a way to influence policy directly.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Isn't that, err, Tory policy as well?
No. That is PRECISELY the point, the Tories are not proposing to deport immigrants with indefinite leave to remain Badenoch and Philp have confirmed, while Reform still are. Hence Farage's 'Never Trust a Tory' line
They better make their mind up and get some consistency if that is true and they want that message to be heard. This is from 9 days ago. if you receive benefits you lose ILR. Not sure how that is different to Reforms you need a job to keep ILR and won't get benefits.
Asked about Lam’s comments, Badenoch’s spokesperson said some had been “pulled out of context”. He said: “She said there are a large number of people who came to this country legally but shouldn’t have been able to do so. The leader of the opposition agrees with that.”
Highlighting the party’s plan to strip ILR from people who receive benefits, who commit a crime or whose income falls below £38,700 for six months or longer, he said: “I think that’s broadly in line with what Katie said and that is the Conservative party policy.”
"Kemi Badenoch said that the rising Tory star Katie Lam “imprecisely” explained Conservative immigration policy, but admitted that the position needed to be more “coherent”.
The Conservative leader denied that the party would deport migrants who have already been granted indefinite leave to remain (ILR), which allows foreign nationals to live, work and study in the UK permanently. She insisted that the party “doesn’t believe in making things retrospective”.
If you are a Conservative holding down one of the seats up for election in May 2026, you must be wondering what can be done to stop the headlong rush to Reform. Some are arguing you have to wait until the debacle hits before Kemi is toast but why wait? A new leader 6 months out would give their local councillors something to talk about positively and take the battle to Reform.
Kemi's time is up in November so let's see if she can make it to Xmas.
Badenoch is the only choice for the conservatives going forward and certainly she will be leader in May 26
Jenrick and Lam are not remotely the answer, and I agree with @HYUFD that Cleverly may succeed her next Summer, though that is not certain by any means
I would suggest Starmer is likely to be under even more pressure next Spring
Tim Shipman has piece in this weekend's Speccie looking at Badenoch leadership.
General tone: she has learnt a lot in recent months and the sinking ship is beginning to turn. Lot of backroom stuff that has been changed that is just starting to bear fruit. Quite a few Aussie election strategists and gurus have quietly been brought on board.
They do things differently there...
Albeit the Australian conservatives have themselves also just had a landslide defeat they are recovering from
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Isn't that, err, Tory policy as well?
No. That is PRECISELY the point, the Tories are not proposing to deport immigrants with indefinite leave to remain Badenoch and Philp have confirmed, while Reform still are. Hence Farage's 'Never Trust a Tory' line
They better make their mind up and get some consistency if that is true and they want that message to be heard. This is from 9 days ago. if you receive benefits you lose ILR. Not sure how that is different to Reforms you need a job to keep ILR and won't get benefits.
Asked about Lam’s comments, Badenoch’s spokesperson said some had been “pulled out of context”. He said: “She said there are a large number of people who came to this country legally but shouldn’t have been able to do so. The leader of the opposition agrees with that.”
Highlighting the party’s plan to strip ILR from people who receive benefits, who commit a crime or whose income falls below £38,700 for six months or longer, he said: “I think that’s broadly in line with what Katie said and that is the Conservative party policy.”
"Kemi Badenoch said that the rising Tory star Katie Lam “imprecisely” explained Conservative immigration policy, but admitted that the position needed to be more “coherent”.
The Conservative leader denied that the party would deport migrants who have already been granted indefinite leave to remain (ILR), which allows foreign nationals to live, work and study in the UK permanently. She insisted that the party “doesn’t believe in making things retrospective”.
If you are a Conservative holding down one of the seats up for election in May 2026, you must be wondering what can be done to stop the headlong rush to Reform. Some are arguing you have to wait until the debacle hits before Kemi is toast but why wait? A new leader 6 months out would give their local councillors something to talk about positively and take the battle to Reform.
Kemi's time is up in November so let's see if she can make it to Xmas.
Badenoch is the only choice for the conservatives going forward and certainly she will be leader in May 26
Jenrick and Lam are not remotely the answer, and I agree with @HYUFD that Cleverly may succeed her next Summer, though that is not certain by any means
I would suggest Starmer is likely to be under even more pressure next Spring
Tim Shipman has piece in this weekend's Speccie looking at Badenoch leadership.
General tone: she has learnt a lot in recent months and the sinking ship is beginning to turn. Lot of backroom stuff that has been changed that is just starting to bear fruit. Quite a few Aussie election strategists and gurus have quietly been brought on board.
They do things differently there...
I get the impression that both Labour and the Tories, or specifically Badenoch and the Labour Party excluding Starmer, are starting to realise the difference between party ideology and reality. I think Badenoch will continue to improve and will lead her party into the next GE. If they start attacking Reform and isolating the Jenrick Reform adjacent wing of their party, they could even be the largest party after the next GE. Starmer is too meh to help his party recover. They need Lisa Nandy, David Lammy or someone similar, to avoid being the biggest losers ever. There’s no way I would bet on the next election yet, unless to lay Reform if the odds were good enough.
The Eve of All Souls Best listen to Schubert's Litanei (sung by Dorothee Jansen) for the occasion than join the trick or treaters or get spooked with Danny Robins on BBC R4 (edit for singer)
Reform, Tory and LD vote shares look to have stabilised. Labour is still losing share to the Greens.
Sultana party will take a chunk of that Green vertical line shortly.
Why? The Fruit & Nuts have managed multiple splits *before* going online as a party and choosing a name.
The Greens are now fishing in the same pool and seem to have put the line in the water, with bait on the end. Rather than wrapping the fishing line round their throats, getting a hook in the eye and fighting each other.
Reform, Tory and LD vote shares look to have stabilised. Labour is still losing share to the Greens.
Sultana party will take a chunk of that Green vertical line shortly.
I think not. They will still be arguing about resolutions and party procedures when Polanski is sweeping up to the Palace on his electric bike to collect the keys to Downing st.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Isn't that, err, Tory policy as well?
No. That is PRECISELY the point, the Tories are not proposing to deport immigrants with indefinite leave to remain Badenoch and Philp have confirmed, while Reform still are. Hence Farage's 'Never Trust a Tory' line
They better make their mind up and get some consistency if that is true and they want that message to be heard. This is from 9 days ago. if you receive benefits you lose ILR. Not sure how that is different to Reforms you need a job to keep ILR and won't get benefits.
Asked about Lam’s comments, Badenoch’s spokesperson said some had been “pulled out of context”. He said: “She said there are a large number of people who came to this country legally but shouldn’t have been able to do so. The leader of the opposition agrees with that.”
Highlighting the party’s plan to strip ILR from people who receive benefits, who commit a crime or whose income falls below £38,700 for six months or longer, he said: “I think that’s broadly in line with what Katie said and that is the Conservative party policy.”
"Kemi Badenoch said that the rising Tory star Katie Lam “imprecisely” explained Conservative immigration policy, but admitted that the position needed to be more “coherent”.
The Conservative leader denied that the party would deport migrants who have already been granted indefinite leave to remain (ILR), which allows foreign nationals to live, work and study in the UK permanently. She insisted that the party “doesn’t believe in making things retrospective”.
Firewalled so I can't read it. Regardless it is different to what her spokesman said 9 days ago and what others in the shadow cabinet have been saying.
It is good if Badenoch has changed the policy and recognises the need to be more coherent. Part of that is sacking Lam.
One problem the Tories have is that their policy is whatever the leader says it is. So if the leader is inconsistent, or unclear, or Boris Johnson, it's very difficult for spokesmen to know what today's policy is.
One of many reasons why I would never vote for the Tories - in a democracy, how much faith can you have in a party that doesn't even decide its own policy democratically within its membership?
Not a position that hstorically has had a much success in any party. Generally the membership come up with the most stupid, election losing, policies.
I don't know - Labour has sometimes shot off to the left in response to losing, and some of the Labour members a bit too sure of their ideology to take seriously. Certainly a lot of the Tory members I've met have been bonkers, borderline nazi or both. But when parties succeed they usually seem to have a broad base of moderate support behind them, and a leadership that is able to take the members with them. If parties believe in democracy they ought to show that confidence in how they run their own internal affairs.
And ultimately if members keep wanting to vote for bonkers policies and never win, surely that's up to them? Another party will present a sensible set of policies and prevail. (At least, that used to be the case... Reform will test that theory).
I can't see the point of being a member of a party without a having a way to influence policy directly.
Good points. I think where membership power becomes a democratic bug rather than a feature is when it leads to radical changes in direction and leadership during government. Such changes lack democratic legitimacy. The Truss episode was an example of this.
31 October 1973. 1st episode of the 26-part classic ITV documentary series World at War was broadcast. It was narrated by Laurence Olivier with music by Carl Davies. It cost £900,000 (worth £11 million today).
It really is a work of art, substantially assisted by many of the people involve having lived through the war and including the recorded interviews of the participants. Arguably one of Oliviers greatest performances.
Reform, Tory and LD vote shares look to have stabilised. Labour is still losing share to the Greens.
Sultana party will take a chunk of that Green vertical line shortly.
I think not. They will still be arguing about resolutions and party procedures when Polanski is sweeping up to the Palace on his electric bike to collect the keys to Downing st.
It depends on how strong the Corbyn brand still is. My sense is it isn't, but I'm not sure. We'll soon see, assuming YP does launch and he leads it.
From previous thread....I speak reasonably good french - but not fluent. A few years ago i moved to Paris for two years and thought that it would be a great opportunity to achieve fluency. No chance - either everyone wanted to speak English - or spoke eith such a thick Parissiene accent as to be unintellligible. If you want to practice French, forget France - go to Francophone Africa.
Bit like learning English in Inverness, come to think of it.
Reform, Tory and LD vote shares look to have stabilised. Labour is still losing share to the Greens.
Sultana party will take a chunk of that Green vertical line shortly.
I think not. They will still be arguing about resolutions and party procedures when Polanski is sweeping up to the Palace on his electric bike to collect the keys to Downing st.
It depends on how strong the Corbyn brand still is. My sense is it isn't, but I'm not sure. We'll soon see, assuming YP does launch and He leads it.
If Trump strikes Venezuela it will give Corbyn some publicity because of his past support for Maduro.
Reform, Tory and LD vote shares look to have stabilised. Labour is still losing share to the Greens.
Sultana party will take a chunk of that Green vertical line shortly.
I think not. They will still be arguing about resolutions and party procedures when Polanski is sweeping up to the Palace on his electric bike to collect the keys to Downing st.
It depends on how strong the Corbyn brand still is. My sense is it isn't, but I'm not sure. We'll soon see, assuming YP does launch and He leads it.
If Trump strikes Venezuela it will give Corbyn some publicity because of his past support for Maduro.
I very much doubt a regime change removing a vile Communist Dictator will move the dial. If Trump can kill enough Venezuelan women and children you may have a point.
Reform, Tory and LD vote shares look to have stabilised. Labour is still losing share to the Greens.
Sultana party will take a chunk of that Green vertical line shortly.
I think not. They will still be arguing about resolutions and party procedures when Polanski is sweeping up to the Palace on his electric bike to collect the keys to Downing st.
It depends on how strong the Corbyn brand still is. My sense is it isn't, but I'm not sure. We'll soon see, assuming YP does launch and He leads it.
If Trump strikes Venezuela it will give Corbyn some publicity because of his past support for Maduro.
I very much doubt a regime change removing a vile Communist Dictator will move the dial. If Trump can kill enough Venezuelan women and children you may have a point.
Maduro is a Peronist Dictator - I always found it funny that the Western Ultra Left fell in love with Chavez & his ilk - army guy takes over the country and talks redistribution. And redistributes to himself and family.
31 October 1973. 1st episode of the 26-part classic ITV documentary series World at War was broadcast. It was narrated by Laurence Olivier with music by Carl Davies. It cost £900,000 (worth £11 million today).
Reform, Tory and LD vote shares look to have stabilised. Labour is still losing share to the Greens.
Sultana party will take a chunk of that Green vertical line shortly.
I think not. They will still be arguing about resolutions and party procedures when Polanski is sweeping up to the Palace on his electric bike to collect the keys to Downing st.
It depends on how strong the Corbyn brand still is. My sense is it isn't, but I'm not sure. We'll soon see, assuming YP does launch and He leads it.
If Trump strikes Venezuela it will give Corbyn some publicity because of his past support for Maduro.
Reform, Tory and LD vote shares look to have stabilised. Labour is still losing share to the Greens.
Sultana party will take a chunk of that Green vertical line shortly.
I think not. They will still be arguing about resolutions and party procedures when Polanski is sweeping up to the Palace on his electric bike to collect the keys to Downing st.
It depends on how strong the Corbyn brand still is. My sense is it isn't, but I'm not sure. We'll soon see, assuming YP does launch and He leads it.
If Trump strikes Venezuela it will give Corbyn some publicity because of his past support for Maduro.
I very much doubt a regime change removing a vile Communist Dictator will move the dial. If Trump can kill enough Venezuelan women and children you may have a point.
Maduro is a Peronist Dictator - I always found it funny that the Western Ultra Left fell in love with Chavez & his ilk - army guy takes over the country and talks redistribution. And redistributes to himself and family.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Isn't that, err, Tory policy as well?
No. That is PRECISELY the point, the Tories are not proposing to deport immigrants with indefinite leave to remain Badenoch and Philp have confirmed, while Reform still are. Hence Farage's 'Never Trust a Tory' line
They better make their mind up and get some consistency if that is true and they want that message to be heard. This is from 9 days ago. if you receive benefits you lose ILR. Not sure how that is different to Reforms you need a job to keep ILR and won't get benefits.
Asked about Lam’s comments, Badenoch’s spokesperson said some had been “pulled out of context”. He said: “She said there are a large number of people who came to this country legally but shouldn’t have been able to do so. The leader of the opposition agrees with that.”
Highlighting the party’s plan to strip ILR from people who receive benefits, who commit a crime or whose income falls below £38,700 for six months or longer, he said: “I think that’s broadly in line with what Katie said and that is the Conservative party policy.”
"Kemi Badenoch said that the rising Tory star Katie Lam “imprecisely” explained Conservative immigration policy, but admitted that the position needed to be more “coherent”.
The Conservative leader denied that the party would deport migrants who have already been granted indefinite leave to remain (ILR), which allows foreign nationals to live, work and study in the UK permanently. She insisted that the party “doesn’t believe in making things retrospective”.
If you are a Conservative holding down one of the seats up for election in May 2026, you must be wondering what can be done to stop the headlong rush to Reform. Some are arguing you have to wait until the debacle hits before Kemi is toast but why wait? A new leader 6 months out would give their local councillors something to talk about positively and take the battle to Reform.
Kemi's time is up in November so let's see if she can make it to Xmas.
Badenoch is the only choice for the conservatives going forward and certainly she will be leader in May 26
Jenrick and Lam are not remotely the answer, and I agree with @HYUFD that Cleverly may succeed her next Summer, though that is not certain by any means
I would suggest Starmer is likely to be under even more pressure next Spring
Tim Shipman has piece in this weekend's Speccie looking at Badenoch leadership.
General tone: she has learnt a lot in recent months and the sinking ship is beginning to turn. Lot of backroom stuff that has been changed that is just starting to bear fruit. Quite a few Aussie election strategists and gurus have quietly been brought on board.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Ok so what is your plan to solve the Tory immigrant crisis ? “ Whoops we ‘accidentally’ let 3 million people in can’t do anything now lol” is not an answer
This country is sick of soft open borders pro immigration wets
The target should be negative net migrants vs 2010 numbers
Net migration is already falling due to the tighter visa wage requirements Sunak and Cleverly brought in.
It doesn't mean you need to go full BNP as well
If you want to know why the Conservative party are at their lowest point ever, this is it.
You are divided between people who think immigration is the root of all our problems and those that are broadly content with most of it, bar the boats and hotels. So your policies vary week to week, your messaging is unclear and confusing, and you lose the trust and respect of both groups.
Make your mind up and stick with it. Don't flirt with the other group whichever path you take.
I think the main problem is that they said one thing - "net migration in the tens of thousands" - and did another.
It hardly matters what they say on the subject for at least a decade. Who is going to take them seriously again?
Who is going to take Labour seriously after their Ming Vase strategy of no rises in Income Tax?
They are more likely to forget the Tories failings 5+ years on - whereas Labour's will be far more fresh in the mind.
The Tories will come back. As the natural choice to replace Labour in Government. Maybe. Particualarly if Farage has a health/legal issue that kills Brand Reform.
You are right about Labour, but I admire your optimism on the Tory revival. Perhaps next week, or at the earliest when Lam or Jenrick take hold of the reins. Jenrick, and particularly Lam will damage Reform substantially. They are singing Reform songs, but with a cheerier tune.
Reform, Tory and LD vote shares look to have stabilised. Labour is still losing share to the Greens.
Sultana party will take a chunk of that Green vertical line shortly.
I think not. They will still be arguing about resolutions and party procedures when Polanski is sweeping up to the Palace on his electric bike to collect the keys to Downing st.
It depends on how strong the Corbyn brand still is. My sense is it isn't, but I'm not sure. We'll soon see, assuming YP does launch and He leads it.
If Trump strikes Venezuela it will give Corbyn some publicity because of his past support for Maduro.
I very much doubt a regime change removing a vile Communist Dictator will move the dial. If Trump can kill enough Venezuelan women and children you may have a point.
Maduro is a Peronist Dictator - I always found it funny that the Western Ultra Left fell in love with Chavez & his ilk - army guy takes over the country and talks redistribution. And redistributes to himself and family.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Isn't that, err, Tory policy as well?
No. That is PRECISELY the point, the Tories are not proposing to deport immigrants with indefinite leave to remain Badenoch and Philp have confirmed, while Reform still are. Hence Farage's 'Never Trust a Tory' line
They better make their mind up and get some consistency if that is true and they want that message to be heard. This is from 9 days ago. if you receive benefits you lose ILR. Not sure how that is different to Reforms you need a job to keep ILR and won't get benefits.
Asked about Lam’s comments, Badenoch’s spokesperson said some had been “pulled out of context”. He said: “She said there are a large number of people who came to this country legally but shouldn’t have been able to do so. The leader of the opposition agrees with that.”
Highlighting the party’s plan to strip ILR from people who receive benefits, who commit a crime or whose income falls below £38,700 for six months or longer, he said: “I think that’s broadly in line with what Katie said and that is the Conservative party policy.”
"Kemi Badenoch said that the rising Tory star Katie Lam “imprecisely” explained Conservative immigration policy, but admitted that the position needed to be more “coherent”.
The Conservative leader denied that the party would deport migrants who have already been granted indefinite leave to remain (ILR), which allows foreign nationals to live, work and study in the UK permanently. She insisted that the party “doesn’t believe in making things retrospective”.
If you are a Conservative holding down one of the seats up for election in May 2026, you must be wondering what can be done to stop the headlong rush to Reform. Some are arguing you have to wait until the debacle hits before Kemi is toast but why wait? A new leader 6 months out would give their local councillors something to talk about positively and take the battle to Reform.
Kemi's time is up in November so let's see if she can make it to Xmas.
Badenoch is the only choice for the conservatives going forward and certainly she will be leader in May 26
Jenrick and Lam are not remotely the answer, and I agree with @HYUFD that Cleverly may succeed her next Summer, though that is not certain by any means
I would suggest Starmer is likely to be under even more pressure next Spring
Tim Shipman has piece in this weekend's Speccie looking at Badenoch leadership.
General tone: she has learnt a lot in recent months and the sinking ship is beginning to turn. Lot of backroom stuff that has been changed that is just starting to bear fruit. Quite a few Aussie election strategists and gurus have quietly been brought on board.
They do things differently there...
If they are relying on Australians I assume it's because there is a complete lack of native talent willing to work for them. We also underestimate how hard it is to become an expert on another country's politics.
Reform, Tory and LD vote shares look to have stabilised. Labour is still losing share to the Greens.
Sultana party will take a chunk of that Green vertical line shortly.
I think not. They will still be arguing about resolutions and party procedures when Polanski is sweeping up to the Palace on his electric bike to collect the keys to Downing st.
It depends on how strong the Corbyn brand still is. My sense is it isn't, but I'm not sure. We'll soon see, assuming YP does launch and he leads it.
A few Green Party councillors here in Glasgow have jumped ship to them already. Mostly the kind you would expect - but still. Possibly a sign of a bit of too-and-fro in the Greens <-> Sultana Party.
Several hundred feared dead as Tanzania election protests continue https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cz0x8vdvkjgo.amp ...The BBC understands that ambassadors from several foreign embassies have also engaged the Tanzanian government to urge restraint from security forces in policing the protests. By late afternoon on Friday, the electoral commission had announced results from about 80 of the country's 272 regions, according to the state broadcaster TBC. The BBC understands that international observers have reported an incredibly low turnout during polling on Wednesday. President Samia is expected to win the vote under the ruling Chama Cha Mapinduzi (CCM) party, which has governed the country since independence in 1961..
..The protesters accuse the government of undermining democracy, as the main opposition leader, Tundu Lissu, is in jail and another opposition figure was disqualified from the election, bolstering Samia's chances of winning. Lissu is being held on treason charges, which he denies, and his party boycotted the vote. The only other serious contender, Luhaga Mpina of the ACT-Wazalendo party, was excluded on legal technicalities. Sixteen fringe parties, none of whom have historically had significant public support, were cleared to contest the elections..
Reform, Tory and LD vote shares look to have stabilised. Labour is still losing share to the Greens.
Sultana party will take a chunk of that Green vertical line shortly.
I think not. They will still be arguing about resolutions and party procedures when Polanski is sweeping up to the Palace on his electric bike to collect the keys to Downing st.
It depends on how strong the Corbyn brand still is. My sense is it isn't, but I'm not sure. We'll soon see, assuming YP does launch and he leads it.
A few Green Party councillors here in Glasgow have jumped ship to them already. Mostly the kind you would expect - but still. Possibly a sign of a bit of too-and-fro in the Greens <-> Sultana Party.
Five Lab councillors defected in Nottingham to 'Your Local Alliance' or words to that effect yesterday.
Seems likely they are on their way to the Marx-4-Gaza Party.
Had a great time Trick or Treating with our little Eleven and Enid.
Lovely community spirit, everyone out and about was well dressed and mannered.
Now observing our traditional annual way of saying goodbye to Halloween and welcoming Christmas by watching Nightmare Before Christmas.
Pause
You have a child called "Eleven"?
There are stranger things to call a child than Eleven surely?
Is that the benchmark - not quite the strangest name we could call our child?
Should we turn that benchmark upside down?
I've never watched Stranger Things so your witty comment was lost on me, I'm afraid.
I quite like the name tbh. Beats Ben any day.
When we lived in Paris in the 1970s our daughter aged 2½ went to the école maternelle and started talking about her new imaginary friend there, "Onzedouzeterka"
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Ok so what is your plan to solve the Tory immigrant crisis ? “ Whoops we ‘accidentally’ let 3 million people in can’t do anything now lol” is not an answer
This country is sick of soft open borders pro immigration wets
The target should be negative net migrants vs 2010 numbers
Net migration is already falling due to the tighter visa wage requirements Sunak and Cleverly brought in.
It doesn't mean you need to go full BNP as well
So there are fewer migrants in the uk than in 2010 ? Or are UK migrant numbers still increasing ?
What is the alternative plan to reduce the number of migrants in the UK ? Not reduce the RATE of increase but reduce them full stop. No one else seems to have one
Kick them all out? As I presume you back? Hence you are voting for Farage
Open to other options. Extra taxes on migrants is the only other option I’ve seen suggested
We need a one off migrant policy reset back to sanity
Interesting to see applause on QT for the comment we spend so much time debating fewer than 40,000 people arriving on small boats versus children in poverty.
Given that this seems to be motivated purely to prevent sitting the new Representative from Arizona, who would force a vote on the release of the Epstein files, you would think that this would be creating more of a stink.
Breaking: Customers at Isle of Wight Sainsbury's were left concerned this afternoon (Friday, October 31) after the A from the shop's sign fell onto the car park.
Given that this seems to be motivated purely to prevent sitting the new Representative from Arizona, who would force a vote on the release of the Epstein files, you would think that this would be creating more of a stink.
Several hundred feared dead as Tanzania election protests continue https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cz0x8vdvkjgo.amp ...The BBC understands that ambassadors from several foreign embassies have also engaged the Tanzanian government to urge restraint from security forces in policing the protests. By late afternoon on Friday, the electoral commission had announced results from about 80 of the country's 272 regions, according to the state broadcaster TBC. The BBC understands that international observers have reported an incredibly low turnout during polling on Wednesday. President Samia is expected to win the vote under the ruling Chama Cha Mapinduzi (CCM) party, which has governed the country since independence in 1961..
..The protesters accuse the government of undermining democracy, as the main opposition leader, Tundu Lissu, is in jail and another opposition figure was disqualified from the election, bolstering Samia's chances of winning. Lissu is being held on treason charges, which he denies, and his party boycotted the vote. The only other serious contender, Luhaga Mpina of the ACT-Wazalendo party, was excluded on legal technicalities. Sixteen fringe parties, none of whom have historically had significant public support, were cleared to contest the elections..
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Ok so what is your plan to solve the Tory immigrant crisis ? “ Whoops we ‘accidentally’ let 3 million people in can’t do anything now lol” is not an answer
This country is sick of soft open borders pro immigration wets
The target should be negative net migrants vs 2010 numbers
Net migration is already falling due to the tighter visa wage requirements Sunak and Cleverly brought in.
It doesn't mean you need to go full BNP as well
So there are fewer migrants in the uk than in 2010 ? Or are UK migrant numbers still increasing ?
What is the alternative plan to reduce the number of migrants in the UK ? Not reduce the RATE of increase but reduce them full stop. No one else seems to have one
Kick them all out? As I presume you back? Hence you are voting for Farage
Open to other options. Extra taxes on migrants is the only other option I’ve seen suggested
We need a one off migrant policy reset back to sanity
Interesting to see applause on QT for the comment we spend so much time debating fewer than 40,000 people arriving on small boats versus children in poverty.
Given that this seems to be motivated purely to prevent sitting the new Representative from Arizona, who would force a vote on the release of the Epstein files, you would think that this would be creating more of a stink.
Breaking: Customers at Isle of Wight Sainsbury's were left concerned this afternoon (Friday, October 31) after the A from the shop's sign fell onto the car park.
Breaking: Customers at Isle of Wight Sainsbury's were left concerned this afternoon (Friday, October 31) after the A from the shop's sign fell onto the car park.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Ok so what is your plan to solve the Tory immigrant crisis ? “ Whoops we ‘accidentally’ let 3 million people in can’t do anything now lol” is not an answer
This country is sick of soft open borders pro immigration wets
The target should be negative net migrants vs 2010 numbers
Net migration is already falling due to the tighter visa wage requirements Sunak and Cleverly brought in.
It doesn't mean you need to go full BNP as well
So there are fewer migrants in the uk than in 2010 ? Or are UK migrant numbers still increasing ?
What is the alternative plan to reduce the number of migrants in the UK ? Not reduce the RATE of increase but reduce them full stop. No one else seems to have one
Kick them all out? As I presume you back? Hence you are voting for Farage
Open to other options. Extra taxes on migrants is the only other option I’ve seen suggested
We need a one off migrant policy reset back to sanity
Interesting to see applause on QT for the comment we spend so much time debating fewer than 40,000 people arriving on small boats versus children in poverty.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Ok so what is your plan to solve the Tory immigrant crisis ? “ Whoops we ‘accidentally’ let 3 million people in can’t do anything now lol” is not an answer
This country is sick of soft open borders pro immigration wets
The target should be negative net migrants vs 2010 numbers
Net migration is already falling due to the tighter visa wage requirements Sunak and Cleverly brought in.
It doesn't mean you need to go full BNP as well
So there are fewer migrants in the uk than in 2010 ? Or are UK migrant numbers still increasing ?
What is the alternative plan to reduce the number of migrants in the UK ? Not reduce the RATE of increase but reduce them full stop. No one else seems to have one
Kick them all out? As I presume you back? Hence you are voting for Farage
Open to other options. Extra taxes on migrants is the only other option I’ve seen suggested
We need a one off migrant policy reset back to sanity
Interesting to see applause on QT for the comment we spend so much time debating fewer than 40,000 people arriving on small boats versus children in poverty.
So Reform confirm they would deport even immigrants with indefinite leave to remain, a pretty vile policy.
Given most of their voters and MPs are ex Tories not a great tactic from Farage to dismiss them either
Ok so what is your plan to solve the Tory immigrant crisis ? “ Whoops we ‘accidentally’ let 3 million people in can’t do anything now lol” is not an answer
This country is sick of soft open borders pro immigration wets
The target should be negative net migrants vs 2010 numbers
Net migration is already falling due to the tighter visa wage requirements Sunak and Cleverly brought in.
It doesn't mean you need to go full BNP as well
So there are fewer migrants in the uk than in 2010 ? Or are UK migrant numbers still increasing ?
What is the alternative plan to reduce the number of migrants in the UK ? Not reduce the RATE of increase but reduce them full stop. No one else seems to have one
Kick them all out? As I presume you back? Hence you are voting for Farage
Open to other options. Extra taxes on migrants is the only other option I’ve seen suggested
We need a one off migrant policy reset back to sanity
Interesting to see applause on QT for the comment we spend so much time debating fewer than 40,000 people arriving on small boats versus children in poverty.
QT audiences are like election hustings. The local great and good from political parties, local ngos and councils attend en masse.
Went to hustings in 2019 in a constituency that overwhelmingly voted brexit, the Tory mp (who didn’t vote to leave) got booed when he insisted that it was important that the vote be respected. The audience was hostile to everything he said. By the measure of the hustings you would think he was going to lose his seat. He won with an 8,000 majority.
Question (with apologies if this has already been discussed)
Why is Starmer refusing to instigate the removal of Andrew Windsor from the Succession? Does anyone really think it would be a bad idea? In purely political terms this seems like a clear win for Starmer and he would almost certainly even have the support of the King. But he apparently is resisting doing it. I find that surprising.
Breaking: Customers at Isle of Wight Sainsbury's were left concerned this afternoon (Friday, October 31) after the A from the shop's sign fell onto the car park.
Question (with apologies if this has already been discussed)
Why is Starmer refusing to instigate the removal of Andrew Windsor from the Succession? Does anyone really think it would be a bad idea? In purely political terms this seems like a clear win for Starmer and he would almost certainly even have the support of the King. But he apparently is resisting doing it. I find that surprising.
He's 8th in line. He's never going to become King. It's a completely academic point.
Had a great time Trick or Treating with our little Eleven and Enid.
Lovely community spirit, everyone out and about was well dressed and mannered.
Now observing our traditional annual way of saying goodbye to Halloween and welcoming Christmas by watching Nightmare Before Christmas.
Pause
You have a child called "Eleven"?
Rees-Mogg named his 6th child Sixtus, so I think Bart can name a child Eleven.
Is everyone missing the point, or just playing this straight ?
I am aware that there is a character in "Stranger Things" that is called "Eleven". However her clothing is not such that would constitute a Halloween costume. So unless Barty had shaved her head, there was no reason to call his child "Eleven" unless that was actually their name. Hence my question.
Comments
The Conservative leader denied that the party would deport migrants who have already been granted indefinite leave to remain (ILR), which allows foreign nationals to live, work and study in the UK permanently. She insisted that the party “doesn’t believe in making things retrospective”.
https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/kemi-badenoch-tory-katie-lam-settled-status-immigration-f2568gwsr?msockid=2d4ff4e9b7de61532b13e0ecb6e66004
It is good if Badenoch has changed the policy and recognises the need to be more coherent. Part of that is sacking Lam.
It hardly matters what they say on the subject for at least a decade. Who is going to take them seriously again?
One of many reasons why I would never vote for the Tories - in a democracy, how much faith can you have in a party that doesn't even decide its own policy democratically within its membership?
This is of course true for the UK too.
They are more likely to forget the Tories failings 5+ years on - whereas Labour's will be far more fresh in the mind.
The Tories will come back. As the natural choice to replace Labour in Government. Maybe. Particualarly if Farage has a health/legal issue that kills Brand Reform.
We need a one off migrant policy reset back to sanity
Kemi's time is up in November so let's see if she can make it to Xmas.
Jenrick and Lam are not remotely the answer, and I agree with @HYUFD that Cleverly may succeed her next Summer, though that is not certain by any means
I would suggest Starmer is likely to be under even more pressure next Spring
Whether she lasts beyond May depends on how the Conservatives do in next year's local elections. If she wins back voters from Reform and makes some gains she will survive, if not she will likely lose a VONC and be replaced by Cleverly.
Cleverly probably most likely to win swing voters and tactical votes in Conservative held seats to beat Reform
Perhaps finally we're getting our priorities right.
Prof. Frank McDonough
@FXMC1957
31 October 1973. 1st episode of the 26-part classic ITV documentary series World at War was broadcast. It was narrated by Laurence Olivier with music by Carl Davies. It cost £900,000 (worth £11 million today).
https://x.com/FXMC1957/status/1984189646788788330
General tone: she has learnt a lot in recent months and the sinking ship is beginning to turn. Lot of backroom stuff that has been changed that is just starting to bear fruit. Quite a few Aussie election strategists and gurus have quietly been brought on board.
They do things differently there...
But yes small boats is nothing compared with total net migration from 2021 to 2024 which 2 million plus. Like 5% or something ? Too much time focusing on the wrong thing imo
@chadbourn.bsky.social
Massive Ukraine drone strike across multiple Russian regions - more than 200 so far.
Halloween #explodey
And ultimately if members keep wanting to vote for bonkers policies and never win, surely that's up to them? Another party will present a sensible set of policies and prevail. (At least, that used to be the case... Reform will test that theory).
I can't see the point of being a member of a party without a having a way to influence policy directly.
Reform, Tory and LD vote shares look to have stabilised.
Labour is still losing share to the Greens.
Best listen to Schubert's Litanei (sung by Dorothee Jansen) for the occasion than join the trick or treaters or get spooked with Danny Robins on BBC R4
(edit for singer)
https://www.forbes.com/sites/alisondurkee/2025/10/31/trump-administration-could-strike-venezuela-at-any-moment-report-says/
The Greens are now fishing in the same pool and seem to have put the line in the water, with bait on the end. Rather than wrapping the fishing line round their throats, getting a hook in the eye and fighting each other.
As I remember the film, Average Joes strategy did see off GloboGym.
In part down to dubious betting.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_aFOkwaK4c
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ascent_of_Man
Highly recommended and available on iPlayer for anyone who hasn't seen it.
https://morningstaronline.co.uk/node/47183
Had a great time Trick or Treating with our little Eleven and Enid.
Lovely community spirit, everyone out and about was well dressed and mannered.
Now observing our traditional annual way of saying goodbye to Halloween and welcoming Christmas by watching Nightmare Before Christmas.
You have a child called "Eleven"?
Of Culloden and The War Game.
(Doesn’t look much, but check out under ‘Early Life’)
I quite like the name tbh. Beats Ben any day.
Several hundred feared dead as Tanzania election protests continue
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cz0x8vdvkjgo.amp
...The BBC understands that ambassadors from several foreign embassies have also engaged the Tanzanian government to urge restraint from security forces in policing the protests.
By late afternoon on Friday, the electoral commission had announced results from about 80 of the country's 272 regions, according to the state broadcaster TBC.
The BBC understands that international observers have reported an incredibly low turnout during polling on Wednesday.
President Samia is expected to win the vote under the ruling Chama Cha Mapinduzi (CCM) party, which has governed the country since independence in 1961..
..The protesters accuse the government of undermining democracy, as the main opposition leader, Tundu Lissu, is in jail and another opposition figure was disqualified from the election, bolstering Samia's chances of winning.
Lissu is being held on treason charges, which he denies, and his party boycotted the vote.
The only other serious contender, Luhaga Mpina of the ACT-Wazalendo party, was excluded on legal technicalities.
Sixteen fringe parties, none of whom have historically had significant public support, were cleared to contest the elections..
Announcement is made that the US House will be out of session again next week
They haven't voted since mid-September
https://x.com/MacFarlaneNews/status/1984309152999465122
Seems likely they are on their way to the Marx-4-Gaza Party.
@RpsAgainstTrump
·
6h
Erika Kirk: “No one will ever replace my husband, but I do see some similarities of my husband in JD”
=====
Is there a market on Vance's veep running mate?
Does it make me a bad person, that my reaction to this is to giggle?
The real understanding of poverty is what is defined as destitute, a dramatically lower number.
Went to hustings in 2019 in a constituency that overwhelmingly voted brexit, the Tory mp (who didn’t vote to leave) got booed when he insisted that it was important that the vote be respected. The audience was hostile to everything he said. By the measure of the hustings you would think he was going to lose his seat. He won with an 8,000 majority.
Why is Starmer refusing to instigate the removal of Andrew Windsor from the Succession? Does anyone really think it would be a bad idea? In purely political terms this seems like a clear win for Starmer and he would almost certainly even have the support of the King. But he apparently is resisting doing it. I find that surprising.