Luke Tryl @LukeTryl · 13m The big challenge imo [for Reform] will be listening too much to the online right, which appears to be making mistake of thinking X, formerly Twitter, is the same as Britain that others made in the past or that Britain is America. Online right figures are unpopular with Reform’s new voters
With a Reform government now distinctly possible, PBers of all stripes may find themselves regretting “at will” proscription under terror laws, and the criminalisation of protesting about it.
On the other hand, the details on the ID cards will be very handy for one of the first actions of the Malmesbury UnDicatorship.
The detention without trial of all those involved in the ID card project, at the Home Office.
With a Reform government now distinctly possible, PBers of all stripes may find themselves regretting “at will” proscription under terror laws, and the criminalisation of protesting about it.
But you can protest about it! You just cannot protest for PA. A banner protesting government overreach is fine. Writing to your MP is fine. It's not difficult.
With a Reform government now distinctly possible, PBers of all stripes may find themselves regretting “at will” proscription under terror laws, and the criminalisation of protesting about it.
Maybe Tony Blair and Labour voters should have considered that before they changed the law then?
I oppose Tony Blair's illiberal laws and want them repealing.
Thanks to whomever linked that Aseem Malhotra speech above. I thought it was very good - I think it's very hard to disagree with his core message. It is not entirely right and proper for a medical regulator to be funded by the organisations that it's supposed to regulate, nor should we consider the advice of the WHO to be impartial when it is supported to the extent that it appears to be by Bill Gates, who is deeply financially invested in many of the things that it promotes. Most people here are appalled at the idea of tame regulators doing industry's bidding - this is the same.
I have no way of evaluating his message from Dr Angus Dalgliesh that vaccines may have been responsible for the Royal family's health issues. AI tells me Dr Dalgliesh is indeed an eminent oncologist, so that at least is true.
I was grateful for the vaccine. I had my two Astra Zeneca and made the decision to stop there. I have never regretted my decision to take the vaccine, or to stop taking them.
Oncologists aren't necessarily epidemiologists or statisticians. Has Dr Dalgliesh published a study, if need be in collaboration with the relevant other specialists?
AI says he published a study on it in 'Frontiers in Immunology' but I can't find the piece.
There were 890 people arrested at a demonstration against the ban on the group Palestine Action in London on Saturday, the Metropolitan Police say.
The majority of the arrests were for supporting a proscribed group under the Terrorism Act, while police said 17 were also arrested for assaults on police officers "after the protest turned violent".
I think there is some talk of the accused refusing the bail conditions and therefore clogging up remand with thousands of pensioners.
The excuse Government ministers are now giving for the arrests that there is something that they are unable to disclose to us something that makes supporting Palestine Action a genuinely awful terrorist activity. Now, there might be something some members of the core group have planned to do, like killing a soldier or burning a synagogue, but how the hell are these protestors supposed to know that?
There are going to be loads of pensioners coming up in front of a judge who - for the first time - finally find out the nature of the group they are supporting as the CPS/Crown Office makes a case behind closed doors. Surely there is something for the defence there? Or worse - ministers have simply made this up and there is no real underlying reason for it, and they are just trying to scare people into not protesting with these vague allusions.
I don't actually get what they are protesting about. It's not Palestine/Gaza per se, because you can protest about that just fine, every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Is it free speech? I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly. Is it government overstepping the mark? I can understand if people don't trust the government. The Southport case had huge issues with that. I also sense that even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care, just as many reformers are in love with Connolly.
The perception is the government is using the Terrorism Act to suppress peaceful protest for Gaza. There is nothing special about Palestine Action themselves - there are n+1 pro-Palestine action groups in the UK, so the whole point is to protest the gross mischaracterisation of peaceful protest as terrorism.
The Connolly case is a silly comparison. She incited people to kill - read the tweet - something that has been an offence in E&W for centuries. The PA protestors are wearing t-shirts with the name of a group that the government has banned but has refused to explain why.
To say that the government is suppressing peaceful protest on Gaza is just weird. Is that what it's about? Connolly did a stupid thing and has been punished. My point was that some free speech means different things. Is what she posted fine and dandy? No, of course not. But neither are millions of other tweets that don't get persued by the police.
Frankly I think anyone deliberately getting arrested for supporting PA is guilty of wasting police time.
I'm sure we are all curious as to government reasons. It must come out at some point. But if people are required not to know facts in criminal trials as it may endanger the process then we must wait, no matter how frustrating it is.
I do not know why the government prescribed PA, but I assume it was intelligence led and decided at the highest levels
I understand it is being challenged in the courts which is the right place to take the argument to
For nearly 900 people to deliberately defy the ban in an attempt to overwhelm the police and courts is a very serious thing to do, and the police have no choice to arrest them and place them before the law as anything else leads to anarchy
Police should be going after shoplifters.
Of course they should, but they are also required to keep law and order
The appeal against the prescribing of PA is in the courts and a legal response will be forthcomng
However, nearly 900 people trying to overwhelm the law and the police is simply not correct irrespective of who they were
Once we become a nation where large groups of people, for whatever cause, can successfully overwhelm the police, courts and the law we are in a very dangerous place
What if the police forces become Nigel's personal Stasi?
If there is a reason that this group have been proscribed then let us know what it is. Their dark hints of sinister activity doesn't cut it.
There were 890 people arrested at a demonstration against the ban on the group Palestine Action in London on Saturday, the Metropolitan Police say.
The majority of the arrests were for supporting a proscribed group under the Terrorism Act, while police said 17 were also arrested for assaults on police officers "after the protest turned violent".
I think there is some talk of the accused refusing the bail conditions and therefore clogging up remand with thousands of pensioners.
The excuse Government ministers are now giving for the arrests that there is something that they are unable to disclose to us something that makes supporting Palestine Action a genuinely awful terrorist activity. Now, there might be something some members of the core group have planned to do, like killing a soldier or burning a synagogue, but how the hell are these protestors supposed to know that?
There are going to be loads of pensioners coming up in front of a judge who - for the first time - finally find out the nature of the group they are supporting as the CPS/Crown Office makes a case behind closed doors. Surely there is something for the defence there? Or worse - ministers have simply made this up and there is no real underlying reason for it, and they are just trying to scare people into not protesting with these vague allusions.
I don't actually get what they are protesting about. It's not Palestine/Gaza per se, because you can protest about that just fine, every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Is it free speech? I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly. Is it government overstepping the mark? I can understand if people don't trust the government. The Southport case had huge issues with that. I also sense that even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care, just as many reformers are in love with Connolly.
The perception is the government is using the Terrorism Act to suppress peaceful protest for Gaza. There is nothing special about Palestine Action themselves - there are n+1 pro-Palestine action groups in the UK, so the whole point is to protest the gross mischaracterisation of peaceful protest as terrorism.
The Connolly case is a silly comparison. She incited people to kill - read the tweet - something that has been an offence in E&W for centuries. The PA protestors are wearing t-shirts with the name of a group that the government has banned but has refused to explain why.
To say that the government is suppressing peaceful protest on Gaza is just weird. Is that what it's about? Connolly did a stupid thing and has been punished. My point was that some free speech means different things. Is what she posted fine and dandy? No, of course not. But neither are millions of other tweets that don't get persued by the police.
Frankly I think anyone deliberately getting arrested for supporting PA is guilty of wasting police time.
I'm sure we are all curious as to government reasons. It must come out at some point. But if people are required not to know facts in criminal trials as it may endanger the process then we must wait, no matter how frustrating it is.
I do not know why the government prescribed PA, but I assume it was intelligence led and decided at the highest levels
I understand it is being challenged in the courts which is the right place to take the argument to
For nearly 900 people to deliberately defy the ban in an attempt to overwhelm the police and courts is a very serious thing to do, and the police have no choice to arrest them and place them before the law as anything else leads to anarchy
Police should be going after shoplifters.
Of course they should, but they are also required to keep law and order
The appeal against the prescribing of PA is in the courts and a legal response will be forthcomng
However, nearly 900 people trying to overwhelm the law and the police is simply not correct irrespective of who they were
Once we become a nation where large groups of people, for whatever cause, can successfully overwhelm the police, courts and the law we are in a very dangerous place
What if the police forces become Nigel's personal Stasi?
Simple question - do you support trying to overwhelm the police, courts, and the law in this country by any group of people to any law you disagree with ?
Do you support the right to protest? Because it sounds like you don’t.
What a silly comment
Of course I support the right to protest, but to deliberately defy the law to overwhelm the police and the courts is mob rule and dangerous
And maybe answer my question
You do know this is currently in front of the courts don't you
The law is an ass. It seems perfectly reasonable and conscionable to defy it.
I think 20 mile an hour speed limits in bits of Bath are stupid. Can I use the same defence and count on your support?
There were 890 people arrested at a demonstration against the ban on the group Palestine Action in London on Saturday, the Metropolitan Police say.
The majority of the arrests were for supporting a proscribed group under the Terrorism Act, while police said 17 were also arrested for assaults on police officers "after the protest turned violent".
I think there is some talk of the accused refusing the bail conditions and therefore clogging up remand with thousands of pensioners.
The excuse Government ministers are now giving for the arrests that there is something that they are unable to disclose to us something that makes supporting Palestine Action a genuinely awful terrorist activity. Now, there might be something some members of the core group have planned to do, like killing a soldier or burning a synagogue, but how the hell are these protestors supposed to know that?
There are going to be loads of pensioners coming up in front of a judge who - for the first time - finally find out the nature of the group they are supporting as the CPS/Crown Office makes a case behind closed doors. Surely there is something for the defence there? Or worse - ministers have simply made this up and there is no real underlying reason for it, and they are just trying to scare people into not protesting with these vague allusions.
I don't actually get what they are protesting about. It's not Palestine/Gaza per se, because you can protest about that just fine, every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Is it free speech? I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly. Is it government overstepping the mark? I can understand if people don't trust the government. The Southport case had huge issues with that. I also sense that even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care, just as many reformers are in love with Connolly.
The perception is the government is using the Terrorism Act to suppress peaceful protest for Gaza. There is nothing special about Palestine Action themselves - there are n+1 pro-Palestine action groups in the UK, so the whole point is to protest the gross mischaracterisation of peaceful protest as terrorism.
The Connolly case is a silly comparison. She incited people to kill - read the tweet - something that has been an offence in E&W for centuries. The PA protestors are wearing t-shirts with the name of a group that the government has banned but has refused to explain why.
To say that the government is suppressing peaceful protest on Gaza is just weird. Is that what it's about? Connolly did a stupid thing and has been punished. My point was that some free speech means different things. Is what she posted fine and dandy? No, of course not. But neither are millions of other tweets that don't get persued by the police.
Frankly I think anyone deliberately getting arrested for supporting PA is guilty of wasting police time.
I'm sure we are all curious as to government reasons. It must come out at some point. But if people are required not to know facts in criminal trials as it may endanger the process then we must wait, no matter how frustrating it is.
I do not know why the government prescribed PA, but I assume it was intelligence led and decided at the highest levels
I understand it is being challenged in the courts which is the right place to take the argument to
For nearly 900 people to deliberately defy the ban in an attempt to overwhelm the police and courts is a very serious thing to do, and the police have no choice to arrest them and place them before the law as anything else leads to anarchy
Police should be going after shoplifters.
Of course they should, but they are also required to keep law and order
The appeal against the prescribing of PA is in the courts and a legal response will be forthcomng
However, nearly 900 people trying to overwhelm the law and the police is simply not correct irrespective of who they were
Once we become a nation where large groups of people, for whatever cause, can successfully overwhelm the police, courts and the law we are in a very dangerous place
What if the police forces become Nigel's personal Stasi?
Simple question - do you support trying to overwhelm the police, courts, and the law in this country by any group of people to any law you disagree with ?
Do you support the right to protest? Because it sounds like you don’t.
What a silly comment
Of course I support the right to protest, but to deliberately defy the law to overwhelm the police and the courts is mob rule and dangerous
And maybe answer my question
You do know this is currently in front of the courts don't you
The law is an ass. It seems perfectly reasonable and conscionable to defy it.
Isn't that what is happening in the US at the moment ?
With a Reform government now distinctly possible, PBers of all stripes may find themselves regretting “at will” proscription under terror laws, and the criminalisation of protesting about it.
Maybe Tony Blair and Labour voters should have considered that before they changed the law then?
I oppose Tony Blair's illiberal laws and want them repealing.
The issue is the law, not its application.
It’s both.
No, its the law.
Under the law what PA did is terrorism, not "only" criminal damage.
Under the law terrorists can be proscribed.
Under the law supporting proscribed terrorists is itself an offence.
If you're upset about how the law is being applied, what the hell did you expect when the law was passed? Don't give the state powers if you don't want theme exercising.
Luke Tryl @LukeTryl · 13m The big challenge imo [for Reform] will be listening too much to the online right, which appears to be making mistake of thinking X, formerly Twitter, is the same as Britain that others made in the past or that Britain is America. Online right figures are unpopular with Reform’s new voters
There were 890 people arrested at a demonstration against the ban on the group Palestine Action in London on Saturday, the Metropolitan Police say.
The majority of the arrests were for supporting a proscribed group under the Terrorism Act, while police said 17 were also arrested for assaults on police officers "after the protest turned violent".
I think there is some talk of the accused refusing the bail conditions and therefore clogging up remand with thousands of pensioners.
The excuse Government ministers are now giving for the arrests that there is something that they are unable to disclose to us something that makes supporting Palestine Action a genuinely awful terrorist activity. Now, there might be something some members of the core group have planned to do, like killing a soldier or burning a synagogue, but how the hell are these protestors supposed to know that?
There are going to be loads of pensioners coming up in front of a judge who - for the first time - finally find out the nature of the group they are supporting as the CPS/Crown Office makes a case behind closed doors. Surely there is something for the defence there? Or worse - ministers have simply made this up and there is no real underlying reason for it, and they are just trying to scare people into not protesting with these vague allusions.
I don't actually get what they are protesting about. It's not Palestine/Gaza per se, because you can protest about that just fine, every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Is it free speech? I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly. Is it government overstepping the mark? I can understand if people don't trust the government. The Southport case had huge issues with that. I also sense that even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care, just as many reformers are in love with Connolly.
The perception is the government is using the Terrorism Act to suppress peaceful protest for Gaza. There is nothing special about Palestine Action themselves - there are n+1 pro-Palestine action groups in the UK, so the whole point is to protest the gross mischaracterisation of peaceful protest as terrorism.
The Connolly case is a silly comparison. She incited people to kill - read the tweet - something that has been an offence in E&W for centuries. The PA protestors are wearing t-shirts with the name of a group that the government has banned but has refused to explain why.
To say that the government is suppressing peaceful protest on Gaza is just weird. Is that what it's about? Connolly did a stupid thing and has been punished. My point was that some free speech means different things. Is what she posted fine and dandy? No, of course not. But neither are millions of other tweets that don't get persued by the police.
Frankly I think anyone deliberately getting arrested for supporting PA is guilty of wasting police time.
I'm sure we are all curious as to government reasons. It must come out at some point. But if people are required not to know facts in criminal trials as it may endanger the process then we must wait, no matter how frustrating it is.
I do not know why the government prescribed PA, but I assume it was intelligence led and decided at the highest levels
I understand it is being challenged in the courts which is the right place to take the argument to
For nearly 900 people to deliberately defy the ban in an attempt to overwhelm the police and courts is a very serious thing to do, and the police have no choice to arrest them and place them before the law as anything else leads to anarchy
Police should be going after shoplifters.
Of course they should, but they are also required to keep law and order
The appeal against the prescribing of PA is in the courts and a legal response will be forthcomng
However, nearly 900 people trying to overwhelm the law and the police is simply not correct irrespective of who they were
Once we become a nation where large groups of people, for whatever cause, can successfully overwhelm the police, courts and the law we are in a very dangerous place
What if the police forces become Nigel's personal Stasi?
If there is a reason that this group have been proscribed then let us know what it is. Their dark hints of sinister activity doesn't cut it.
There were 890 people arrested at a demonstration against the ban on the group Palestine Action in London on Saturday, the Metropolitan Police say.
The majority of the arrests were for supporting a proscribed group under the Terrorism Act, while police said 17 were also arrested for assaults on police officers "after the protest turned violent".
I think there is some talk of the accused refusing the bail conditions and therefore clogging up remand with thousands of pensioners.
The excuse Government ministers are now giving for the arrests that there is something that they are unable to disclose to us something that makes supporting Palestine Action a genuinely awful terrorist activity. Now, there might be something some members of the core group have planned to do, like killing a soldier or burning a synagogue, but how the hell are these protestors supposed to know that?
There are going to be loads of pensioners coming up in front of a judge who - for the first time - finally find out the nature of the group they are supporting as the CPS/Crown Office makes a case behind closed doors. Surely there is something for the defence there? Or worse - ministers have simply made this up and there is no real underlying reason for it, and they are just trying to scare people into not protesting with these vague allusions.
I don't actually get what they are protesting about. It's not Palestine/Gaza per se, because you can protest about that just fine, every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Is it free speech? I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly. Is it government overstepping the mark? I can understand if people don't trust the government. The Southport case had huge issues with that. I also sense that even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care, just as many reformers are in love with Connolly.
The perception is the government is using the Terrorism Act to suppress peaceful protest for Gaza. There is nothing special about Palestine Action themselves - there are n+1 pro-Palestine action groups in the UK, so the whole point is to protest the gross mischaracterisation of peaceful protest as terrorism.
The Connolly case is a silly comparison. She incited people to kill - read the tweet - something that has been an offence in E&W for centuries. The PA protestors are wearing t-shirts with the name of a group that the government has banned but has refused to explain why.
To say that the government is suppressing peaceful protest on Gaza is just weird. Is that what it's about? Connolly did a stupid thing and has been punished. My point was that some free speech means different things. Is what she posted fine and dandy? No, of course not. But neither are millions of other tweets that don't get persued by the police.
Frankly I think anyone deliberately getting arrested for supporting PA is guilty of wasting police time.
I'm sure we are all curious as to government reasons. It must come out at some point. But if people are required not to know facts in criminal trials as it may endanger the process then we must wait, no matter how frustrating it is.
I do not know why the government prescribed PA, but I assume it was intelligence led and decided at the highest levels
I understand it is being challenged in the courts which is the right place to take the argument to
For nearly 900 people to deliberately defy the ban in an attempt to overwhelm the police and courts is a very serious thing to do, and the police have no choice to arrest them and place them before the law as anything else leads to anarchy
Police should be going after shoplifters.
Of course they should, but they are also required to keep law and order
The appeal against the prescribing of PA is in the courts and a legal response will be forthcomng
However, nearly 900 people trying to overwhelm the law and the police is simply not correct irrespective of who they were
Once we become a nation where large groups of people, for whatever cause, can successfully overwhelm the police, courts and the law we are in a very dangerous place
What if the police forces become Nigel's personal Stasi?
If there is a reason that this group have been proscribed then let us know what it is. Their dark hints of sinister activity doesn't cut it.
They engaged in terrorism at RAF Brize Norton.
There should, I think, be a separate offence of Damaging National Infrastructure (or something like that).
There were 890 people arrested at a demonstration against the ban on the group Palestine Action in London on Saturday, the Metropolitan Police say.
The majority of the arrests were for supporting a proscribed group under the Terrorism Act, while police said 17 were also arrested for assaults on police officers "after the protest turned violent".
I think there is some talk of the accused refusing the bail conditions and therefore clogging up remand with thousands of pensioners.
The excuse Government ministers are now giving for the arrests that there is something that they are unable to disclose to us something that makes supporting Palestine Action a genuinely awful terrorist activity. Now, there might be something some members of the core group have planned to do, like killing a soldier or burning a synagogue, but how the hell are these protestors supposed to know that?
There are going to be loads of pensioners coming up in front of a judge who - for the first time - finally find out the nature of the group they are supporting as the CPS/Crown Office makes a case behind closed doors. Surely there is something for the defence there? Or worse - ministers have simply made this up and there is no real underlying reason for it, and they are just trying to scare people into not protesting with these vague allusions.
I don't actually get what they are protesting about. It's not Palestine/Gaza per se, because you can protest about that just fine, every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Is it free speech? I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly. Is it government overstepping the mark? I can understand if people don't trust the government. The Southport case had huge issues with that. I also sense that even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care, just as many reformers are in love with Connolly.
The perception is the government is using the Terrorism Act to suppress peaceful protest for Gaza. There is nothing special about Palestine Action themselves - there are n+1 pro-Palestine action groups in the UK, so the whole point is to protest the gross mischaracterisation of peaceful protest as terrorism.
The Connolly case is a silly comparison. She incited people to kill - read the tweet - something that has been an offence in E&W for centuries. The PA protestors are wearing t-shirts with the name of a group that the government has banned but has refused to explain why.
To say that the government is suppressing peaceful protest on Gaza is just weird. Is that what it's about? Connolly did a stupid thing and has been punished. My point was that some free speech means different things. Is what she posted fine and dandy? No, of course not. But neither are millions of other tweets that don't get persued by the police.
Frankly I think anyone deliberately getting arrested for supporting PA is guilty of wasting police time.
I'm sure we are all curious as to government reasons. It must come out at some point. But if people are required not to know facts in criminal trials as it may endanger the process then we must wait, no matter how frustrating it is.
I do not know why the government prescribed PA, but I assume it was intelligence led and decided at the highest levels
I understand it is being challenged in the courts which is the right place to take the argument to
For nearly 900 people to deliberately defy the ban in an attempt to overwhelm the police and courts is a very serious thing to do, and the police have no choice to arrest them and place them before the law as anything else leads to anarchy
Police should be going after shoplifters.
Of course they should, but they are also required to keep law and order
The appeal against the prescribing of PA is in the courts and a legal response will be forthcomng
However, nearly 900 people trying to overwhelm the law and the police is simply not correct irrespective of who they were
Once we become a nation where large groups of people, for whatever cause, can successfully overwhelm the police, courts and the law we are in a very dangerous place
What if the police forces become Nigel's personal Stasi?
If there is a reason that this group have been proscribed then let us know what it is. Their dark hints of sinister activity doesn't cut it.
They engaged in terrorism at RAF Brize Norton.
There should, I think, be a separate offence of Damaging National Infrastructure (or something like that).
Perhaps there should be, but under the terms of the Terrorism Act 2000 what they did absolutely was terrorism.
There were 890 people arrested at a demonstration against the ban on the group Palestine Action in London on Saturday, the Metropolitan Police say.
The majority of the arrests were for supporting a proscribed group under the Terrorism Act, while police said 17 were also arrested for assaults on police officers "after the protest turned violent".
I think there is some talk of the accused refusing the bail conditions and therefore clogging up remand with thousands of pensioners.
The excuse Government ministers are now giving for the arrests that there is something that they are unable to disclose to us something that makes supporting Palestine Action a genuinely awful terrorist activity. Now, there might be something some members of the core group have planned to do, like killing a soldier or burning a synagogue, but how the hell are these protestors supposed to know that?
There are going to be loads of pensioners coming up in front of a judge who - for the first time - finally find out the nature of the group they are supporting as the CPS/Crown Office makes a case behind closed doors. Surely there is something for the defence there? Or worse - ministers have simply made this up and there is no real underlying reason for it, and they are just trying to scare people into not protesting with these vague allusions.
I don't actually get what they are protesting about. It's not Palestine/Gaza per se, because you can protest about that just fine, every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Is it free speech? I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly. Is it government overstepping the mark? I can understand if people don't trust the government. The Southport case had huge issues with that. I also sense that even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care, just as many reformers are in love with Connolly.
The perception is the government is using the Terrorism Act to suppress peaceful protest for Gaza. There is nothing special about Palestine Action themselves - there are n+1 pro-Palestine action groups in the UK, so the whole point is to protest the gross mischaracterisation of peaceful protest as terrorism.
The Connolly case is a silly comparison. She incited people to kill - read the tweet - something that has been an offence in E&W for centuries. The PA protestors are wearing t-shirts with the name of a group that the government has banned but has refused to explain why.
To say that the government is suppressing peaceful protest on Gaza is just weird. Is that what it's about? Connolly did a stupid thing and has been punished. My point was that some free speech means different things. Is what she posted fine and dandy? No, of course not. But neither are millions of other tweets that don't get persued by the police.
Frankly I think anyone deliberately getting arrested for supporting PA is guilty of wasting police time.
I'm sure we are all curious as to government reasons. It must come out at some point. But if people are required not to know facts in criminal trials as it may endanger the process then we must wait, no matter how frustrating it is.
I do not know why the government prescribed PA, but I assume it was intelligence led and decided at the highest levels
I understand it is being challenged in the courts which is the right place to take the argument to
For nearly 900 people to deliberately defy the ban in an attempt to overwhelm the police and courts is a very serious thing to do, and the police have no choice to arrest them and place them before the law as anything else leads to anarchy
Police should be going after shoplifters.
Of course they should, but they are also required to keep law and order
The appeal against the prescribing of PA is in the courts and a legal response will be forthcomng
However, nearly 900 people trying to overwhelm the law and the police is simply not correct irrespective of who they were
Once we become a nation where large groups of people, for whatever cause, can successfully overwhelm the police, courts and the law we are in a very dangerous place
What if the police forces become Nigel's personal Stasi?
If there is a reason that this group have been proscribed then let us know what it is. Their dark hints of sinister activity doesn't cut it.
They engaged in terrorism at RAF Brize Norton.
There should, I think, be a separate offence of Damaging National Infrastructure (or something like that).
Where it concerns sabotaging our ability to defend ourselves, surely it's pretty classic treason? These were not ammunition boxes bound for the IDF, they were British planes.
Thanks to whomever linked that Aseem Malhotra speech above. I thought it was very good - I think it's very hard to disagree with his core message. It is not entirely right and proper for a medical regulator to be funded by the organisations that it's supposed to regulate, nor should we consider the advice of the WHO to be impartial when it is supported to the extent that it appears to be by Bill Gates, who is deeply financially invested in many of the things that it promotes. Most people here are appalled at the idea of tame regulators doing industry's bidding - this is the same.
I have no way of evaluating his message from Dr Angus Dalgliesh that vaccines may have been responsible for the Royal family's health issues. AI tells me Dr Dalgliesh is indeed an eminent oncologist, so that at least is true.
I was grateful for the vaccine. I had my two Astra Zeneca and made the decision to stop there. I have never regretted my decision to take the vaccine, or to stop taking them.
Oncologists aren't necessarily epidemiologists or statisticians. Has Dr Dalgliesh published a study, if need be in collaboration with the relevant other specialists?
Not only that I would be very surprised if Dr Dalgleish had access to the Royal Medical records. The doctor almost certainly doesn't even know the diagnosis, so how can he be so certain of the cause?
With a Reform government now distinctly possible, PBers of all stripes may find themselves regretting “at will” proscription under terror laws, and the criminalisation of protesting about it.
Maybe Tony Blair and Labour voters should have considered that before they changed the law then?
I oppose Tony Blair's illiberal laws and want them repealing.
The issue is the law, not its application.
It’s both.
Control Orders were brought in by the Blair Government but repealed by the Coalition in 2011. However, after London Bridge, we had the usual suspects on the Conservative side wanting sweeping new powers "in response" to what had happened and that's been the truth of the legislation - generally reactive and often driven by the need to provide a political response to a terror attack.
We have the security state we do largely as a result of emotion-driven responses to act of terror. I have no doubt a future Reform Government will be happy to sacrifice civil liberties and free speech even further on the twin altars of "security" and "public safety".
I do find it perplexing how some posters rage at Trump, Farage and others about their alleged illegal acts and attack those who may want to leave the ECHR, but are supporting acts in our country by large groups of people who want to overwhelm our police and courts because they do not like a particular law
It may be the courts will overturn precribing PA, but until then the law needs to be respected otherwise we are no better than those on the right who want to disapply laws they do not like
Luke Tryl @LukeTryl · 13m The big challenge imo [for Reform] will be listening too much to the online right, which appears to be making mistake of thinking X, formerly Twitter, is the same as Britain that others made in the past or that Britain is America. Online right figures are unpopular with Reform’s new voters
Whether or not this is good advice, the fact remains (US) social media has enshittified our political discourse.
It started with very online lefties deciding that online was the place to exercise ideological purity and hone the art of the pile on, and then the very online right - who’d already been spewing nastiness on fringe sites - decided the best way to tackle this was by exercising their own ideological purity in the mainstream, helped by an army of bots from all corners of the world.
We get the worst of US discourse. In the first wave we laugh it off. But slowly it penetrates. Eventually we start speaking the same language, and start hating each other.
There were 890 people arrested at a demonstration against the ban on the group Palestine Action in London on Saturday, the Metropolitan Police say.
The majority of the arrests were for supporting a proscribed group under the Terrorism Act, while police said 17 were also arrested for assaults on police officers "after the protest turned violent".
I think there is some talk of the accused refusing the bail conditions and therefore clogging up remand with thousands of pensioners.
The excuse Government ministers are now giving for the arrests that there is something that they are unable to disclose to us something that makes supporting Palestine Action a genuinely awful terrorist activity. Now, there might be something some members of the core group have planned to do, like killing a soldier or burning a synagogue, but how the hell are these protestors supposed to know that?
There are going to be loads of pensioners coming up in front of a judge who - for the first time - finally find out the nature of the group they are supporting as the CPS/Crown Office makes a case behind closed doors. Surely there is something for the defence there? Or worse - ministers have simply made this up and there is no real underlying reason for it, and they are just trying to scare people into not protesting with these vague allusions.
I don't actually get what they are protesting about. It's not Palestine/Gaza per se, because you can protest about that just fine, every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Is it free speech? I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly. Is it government overstepping the mark? I can understand if people don't trust the government. The Southport case had huge issues with that. I also sense that even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care, just as many reformers are in love with Connolly.
The perception is the government is using the Terrorism Act to suppress peaceful protest for Gaza. There is nothing special about Palestine Action themselves - there are n+1 pro-Palestine action groups in the UK, so the whole point is to protest the gross mischaracterisation of peaceful protest as terrorism.
The Connolly case is a silly comparison. She incited people to kill - read the tweet - something that has been an offence in E&W for centuries. The PA protestors are wearing t-shirts with the name of a group that the government has banned but has refused to explain why.
To say that the government is suppressing peaceful protest on Gaza is just weird. Is that what it's about? Connolly did a stupid thing and has been punished. My point was that some free speech means different things. Is what she posted fine and dandy? No, of course not. But neither are millions of other tweets that don't get persued by the police.
Frankly I think anyone deliberately getting arrested for supporting PA is guilty of wasting police time.
I'm sure we are all curious as to government reasons. It must come out at some point. But if people are required not to know facts in criminal trials as it may endanger the process then we must wait, no matter how frustrating it is.
I do not know why the government prescribed PA, but I assume it was intelligence led and decided at the highest levels
I understand it is being challenged in the courts which is the right place to take the argument to
For nearly 900 people to deliberately defy the ban in an attempt to overwhelm the police and courts is a very serious thing to do, and the police have no choice to arrest them and place them before the law as anything else leads to anarchy
Police should be going after shoplifters.
Of course they should, but they are also required to keep law and order
The appeal against the prescribing of PA is in the courts and a legal response will be forthcomng
However, nearly 900 people trying to overwhelm the law and the police is simply not correct irrespective of who they were
Once we become a nation where large groups of people, for whatever cause, can successfully overwhelm the police, courts and the law we are in a very dangerous place
What if the police forces become Nigel's personal Stasi?
Simple question - do you support trying to overwhelm the police, courts, and the law in this country by any group of people to any law you disagree with ?
Do you support the right to protest? Because it sounds like you don’t.
What a silly comment
Of course I support the right to protest, but to deliberately defy the law to overwhelm the police and the courts is mob rule and dangerous
And maybe answer my question
You do know this is currently in front of the courts don't you
The law is an ass. It seems perfectly reasonable and conscionable to defy it.
I think 20 mile an hour speed limits in bits of Bath are stupid. Can I use the same defence and count on your support?
You ought to be able wear t-shirts protesting the speed limits, yes.
With a Reform government now distinctly possible, PBers of all stripes may find themselves regretting “at will” proscription under terror laws, and the criminalisation of protesting about it.
I would just like to take this opportunity to declare that I love Nigel Farage and welcome our new Reform overlords. If they need a list of names of traitors to look at then PM me here.
There were 890 people arrested at a demonstration against the ban on the group Palestine Action in London on Saturday, the Metropolitan Police say.
The majority of the arrests were for supporting a proscribed group under the Terrorism Act, while police said 17 were also arrested for assaults on police officers "after the protest turned violent".
I think there is some talk of the accused refusing the bail conditions and therefore clogging up remand with thousands of pensioners.
The excuse Government ministers are now giving for the arrests that there is something that they are unable to disclose to us something that makes supporting Palestine Action a genuinely awful terrorist activity. Now, there might be something some members of the core group have planned to do, like killing a soldier or burning a synagogue, but how the hell are these protestors supposed to know that?
There are going to be loads of pensioners coming up in front of a judge who - for the first time - finally find out the nature of the group they are supporting as the CPS/Crown Office makes a case behind closed doors. Surely there is something for the defence there? Or worse - ministers have simply made this up and there is no real underlying reason for it, and they are just trying to scare people into not protesting with these vague allusions.
I don't actually get what they are protesting about. It's not Palestine/Gaza per se, because you can protest about that just fine, every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Is it free speech? I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly. Is it government overstepping the mark? I can understand if people don't trust the government. The Southport case had huge issues with that. I also sense that even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care, just as many reformers are in love with Connolly.
The perception is the government is using the Terrorism Act to suppress peaceful protest for Gaza. There is nothing special about Palestine Action themselves - there are n+1 pro-Palestine action groups in the UK, so the whole point is to protest the gross mischaracterisation of peaceful protest as terrorism.
The Connolly case is a silly comparison. She incited people to kill - read the tweet - something that has been an offence in E&W for centuries. The PA protestors are wearing t-shirts with the name of a group that the government has banned but has refused to explain why.
To say that the government is suppressing peaceful protest on Gaza is just weird. Is that what it's about? Connolly did a stupid thing and has been punished. My point was that some free speech means different things. Is what she posted fine and dandy? No, of course not. But neither are millions of other tweets that don't get persued by the police.
Frankly I think anyone deliberately getting arrested for supporting PA is guilty of wasting police time.
I'm sure we are all curious as to government reasons. It must come out at some point. But if people are required not to know facts in criminal trials as it may endanger the process then we must wait, no matter how frustrating it is.
I do not know why the government prescribed PA, but I assume it was intelligence led and decided at the highest levels
I understand it is being challenged in the courts which is the right place to take the argument to
For nearly 900 people to deliberately defy the ban in an attempt to overwhelm the police and courts is a very serious thing to do, and the police have no choice to arrest them and place them before the law as anything else leads to anarchy
Police should be going after shoplifters.
Of course they should, but they are also required to keep law and order
The appeal against the prescribing of PA is in the courts and a legal response will be forthcomng
However, nearly 900 people trying to overwhelm the law and the police is simply not correct irrespective of who they were
Once we become a nation where large groups of people, for whatever cause, can successfully overwhelm the police, courts and the law we are in a very dangerous place
What if the police forces become Nigel's personal Stasi?
Simple question - do you support trying to overwhelm the police, courts, and the law in this country by any group of people to any law you disagree with ?
Do you support the right to protest? Because it sounds like you don’t.
What a silly comment
Of course I support the right to protest, but to deliberately defy the law to overwhelm the police and the courts is mob rule and dangerous
And maybe answer my question
You do know this is currently in front of the courts don't you
The law is an ass. It seems perfectly reasonable and conscionable to defy it.
I think 20 mile an hour speed limits in bits of Bath are stupid. Can I use the same defence and count on your support?
You ought to be able wear t-shirts protesting the speed limits, yes.
You able to wear a t-shirt protesting what is going on in Palestine without an issue at all.
With a Reform government now distinctly possible, PBers of all stripes may find themselves regretting “at will” proscription under terror laws, and the criminalisation of protesting about it.
I would just like to take this opportunity to declare that I love Nigel Farage and welcome our new Reform overlords. If they need a list of names of traitors to look at then PM me here.
All hail the dear leader! Prepare the bunting. Bring out our freshest cakes and somebody play Andrea Jenkyns album on loop
I suspect people playing stupid games will win some stupid prizes. Maybe not the first time or second time, but eventually somebody will run into a very grumpy judge who is sick of seeing the same people. Just like with JSO.
There were 890 people arrested at a demonstration against the ban on the group Palestine Action in London on Saturday, the Metropolitan Police say.
The majority of the arrests were for supporting a proscribed group under the Terrorism Act, while police said 17 were also arrested for assaults on police officers "after the protest turned violent".
I think there is some talk of the accused refusing the bail conditions and therefore clogging up remand with thousands of pensioners.
The excuse Government ministers are now giving for the arrests that there is something that they are unable to disclose to us something that makes supporting Palestine Action a genuinely awful terrorist activity. Now, there might be something some members of the core group have planned to do, like killing a soldier or burning a synagogue, but how the hell are these protestors supposed to know that?
There are going to be loads of pensioners coming up in front of a judge who - for the first time - finally find out the nature of the group they are supporting as the CPS/Crown Office makes a case behind closed doors. Surely there is something for the defence there? Or worse - ministers have simply made this up and there is no real underlying reason for it, and they are just trying to scare people into not protesting with these vague allusions.
I don't actually get what they are protesting about. It's not Palestine/Gaza per se, because you can protest about that just fine, every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Is it free speech? I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly. Is it government overstepping the mark? I can understand if people don't trust the government. The Southport case had huge issues with that. I also sense that even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care, just as many reformers are in love with Connolly.
The perception is the government is using the Terrorism Act to suppress peaceful protest for Gaza. There is nothing special about Palestine Action themselves - there are n+1 pro-Palestine action groups in the UK, so the whole point is to protest the gross mischaracterisation of peaceful protest as terrorism.
The Connolly case is a silly comparison. She incited people to kill - read the tweet - something that has been an offence in E&W for centuries. The PA protestors are wearing t-shirts with the name of a group that the government has banned but has refused to explain why.
To say that the government is suppressing peaceful protest on Gaza is just weird. Is that what it's about? Connolly did a stupid thing and has been punished. My point was that some free speech means different things. Is what she posted fine and dandy? No, of course not. But neither are millions of other tweets that don't get persued by the police.
Frankly I think anyone deliberately getting arrested for supporting PA is guilty of wasting police time.
I'm sure we are all curious as to government reasons. It must come out at some point. But if people are required not to know facts in criminal trials as it may endanger the process then we must wait, no matter how frustrating it is.
I do not know why the government prescribed PA, but I assume it was intelligence led and decided at the highest levels
I understand it is being challenged in the courts which is the right place to take the argument to
For nearly 900 people to deliberately defy the ban in an attempt to overwhelm the police and courts is a very serious thing to do, and the police have no choice to arrest them and place them before the law as anything else leads to anarchy
Police should be going after shoplifters.
Of course they should, but they are also required to keep law and order
The appeal against the prescribing of PA is in the courts and a legal response will be forthcomng
However, nearly 900 people trying to overwhelm the law and the police is simply not correct irrespective of who they were
Once we become a nation where large groups of people, for whatever cause, can successfully overwhelm the police, courts and the law we are in a very dangerous place
What if the police forces become Nigel's personal Stasi?
Simple question - do you support trying to overwhelm the police, courts, and the law in this country by any group of people to any law you disagree with ?
Do you support the right to protest? Because it sounds like you don’t.
What a silly comment
Of course I support the right to protest, but to deliberately defy the law to overwhelm the police and the courts is mob rule and dangerous
And maybe answer my question
You do know this is currently in front of the courts don't you
The law is an ass. It seems perfectly reasonable and conscionable to defy it.
I do find it perplexing how some posters rage at Trump, Farage and others about their alleged illegal acts and attack those who may want to leave the ECHR, but are supporting acts in our country by large groups of people who want to overwhelm our police and courts because they do not like a particular law
It may be the courts will overturn precribing PA, but until then the law needs to be respected otherwise we are no better than those on the right who want to disapply laws they do not like
Agreed.
Some people take leave of their senses when the word “Palestine” is mentioned. To me, the protection of UK military bases and defence assets is of paramount importance.
The UK’s new business secretary, Peter Kyle, is expected to fly to Beijing this week as part of Keir Starmer’s continuing efforts to revitalise the UK’s trade relationship with China and provide growth to the British economy.
Kyle will first travel to Washington as part of the preparations for Donald Trump’s state visit to the UK and has then lined up a meeting in Beijing with the Chinese minister of commerce, Wang Wentao, at the first gathering of the UK China joint economic and trade commission (Jetco) for seven years.
Jetco summits were paused by Boris Johnson in response to Beijing’s crackdown on pro-democracy protests in Hong Kong in 2019, with Covid stalling dialogue in subsequent years.
How to win friends and influence people in the Trump White House – send the guy who claimed only paedophiles like free speech, and then go on to China.
Evening all. Been with Pa Woolie this afternoon. You'll be pleased to know he has proclaimed we have passed peak Reform. Pa Woolie for the win.
We are always passing peak Reform. We've passed it here at least 5 times.
You’re feeling, shall we say, bullish? Enjoy it. Reform will end either with a squib-like polling slump, or electoral success and the destruction of our nation.
Show me an example of a populist right wing movement in history bringing about national renewal and happiness in a developed country and I might change my mind, but I’m struggling for good creds.
There were 890 people arrested at a demonstration against the ban on the group Palestine Action in London on Saturday, the Metropolitan Police say.
The majority of the arrests were for supporting a proscribed group under the Terrorism Act, while police said 17 were also arrested for assaults on police officers "after the protest turned violent".
I think there is some talk of the accused refusing the bail conditions and therefore clogging up remand with thousands of pensioners.
The excuse Government ministers are now giving for the arrests that there is something that they are unable to disclose to us something that makes supporting Palestine Action a genuinely awful terrorist activity. Now, there might be something some members of the core group have planned to do, like killing a soldier or burning a synagogue, but how the hell are these protestors supposed to know that?
There are going to be loads of pensioners coming up in front of a judge who - for the first time - finally find out the nature of the group they are supporting as the CPS/Crown Office makes a case behind closed doors. Surely there is something for the defence there? Or worse - ministers have simply made this up and there is no real underlying reason for it, and they are just trying to scare people into not protesting with these vague allusions.
I don't actually get what they are protesting about. It's not Palestine/Gaza per se, because you can protest about that just fine, every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Is it free speech? I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly. Is it government overstepping the mark? I can understand if people don't trust the government. The Southport case had huge issues with that. I also sense that even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care, just as many reformers are in love with Connolly.
The perception is the government is using the Terrorism Act to suppress peaceful protest for Gaza. There is nothing special about Palestine Action themselves - there are n+1 pro-Palestine action groups in the UK, so the whole point is to protest the gross mischaracterisation of peaceful protest as terrorism.
The Connolly case is a silly comparison. She incited people to kill - read the tweet - something that has been an offence in E&W for centuries. The PA protestors are wearing t-shirts with the name of a group that the government has banned but has refused to explain why.
To say that the government is suppressing peaceful protest on Gaza is just weird. Is that what it's about? Connolly did a stupid thing and has been punished. My point was that some free speech means different things. Is what she posted fine and dandy? No, of course not. But neither are millions of other tweets that don't get persued by the police.
Frankly I think anyone deliberately getting arrested for supporting PA is guilty of wasting police time.
I'm sure we are all curious as to government reasons. It must come out at some point. But if people are required not to know facts in criminal trials as it may endanger the process then we must wait, no matter how frustrating it is.
I do not know why the government prescribed PA, but I assume it was intelligence led and decided at the highest levels
I understand it is being challenged in the courts which is the right place to take the argument to
For nearly 900 people to deliberately defy the ban in an attempt to overwhelm the police and courts is a very serious thing to do, and the police have no choice to arrest them and place them before the law as anything else leads to anarchy
Police should be going after shoplifters.
Of course they should, but they are also required to keep law and order
The appeal against the prescribing of PA is in the courts and a legal response will be forthcomng
However, nearly 900 people trying to overwhelm the law and the police is simply not correct irrespective of who they were
Once we become a nation where large groups of people, for whatever cause, can successfully overwhelm the police, courts and the law we are in a very dangerous place
What if the police forces become Nigel's personal Stasi?
If there is a reason that this group have been proscribed then let us know what it is. Their dark hints of sinister activity doesn't cut it.
They engaged in terrorism at RAF Brize Norton.
There should, I think, be a separate offence of Damaging National Infrastructure (or something like that).
Perhaps there should be, but under the terms of the Terrorism Act 2000 what they did absolutely was terrorism.
Worth hearing the opinions of the original 2000 act. Even Jack Sraw would have bauked at this nonsense
Evening all. Been with Pa Woolie this afternoon. You'll be pleased to know he has proclaimed we have passed peak Reform. Pa Woolie for the win.
Nigel certainly appears to be losing his political touch - Reform's sponsoring the career of the anti-vaxxer is a case in point. Reform's enemies should now be asking that guy's opinion on absolutely everything and then forcing Nigel to issue a statement clarifying whether that particular pronouncement does or does not concur with Reform policy. Ditto the arsonist woman.
There were 890 people arrested at a demonstration against the ban on the group Palestine Action in London on Saturday, the Metropolitan Police say.
The majority of the arrests were for supporting a proscribed group under the Terrorism Act, while police said 17 were also arrested for assaults on police officers "after the protest turned violent".
I think there is some talk of the accused refusing the bail conditions and therefore clogging up remand with thousands of pensioners.
The excuse Government ministers are now giving for the arrests that there is something that they are unable to disclose to us something that makes supporting Palestine Action a genuinely awful terrorist activity. Now, there might be something some members of the core group have planned to do, like killing a soldier or burning a synagogue, but how the hell are these protestors supposed to know that?
There are going to be loads of pensioners coming up in front of a judge who - for the first time - finally find out the nature of the group they are supporting as the CPS/Crown Office makes a case behind closed doors. Surely there is something for the defence there? Or worse - ministers have simply made this up and there is no real underlying reason for it, and they are just trying to scare people into not protesting with these vague allusions.
I don't actually get what they are protesting about. It's not Palestine/Gaza per se, because you can protest about that just fine, every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Is it free speech? I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly. Is it government overstepping the mark? I can understand if people don't trust the government. The Southport case had huge issues with that. I also sense that even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care, just as many reformers are in love with Connolly.
The perception is the government is using the Terrorism Act to suppress peaceful protest for Gaza. There is nothing special about Palestine Action themselves - there are n+1 pro-Palestine action groups in the UK, so the whole point is to protest the gross mischaracterisation of peaceful protest as terrorism.
The Connolly case is a silly comparison. She incited people to kill - read the tweet - something that has been an offence in E&W for centuries. The PA protestors are wearing t-shirts with the name of a group that the government has banned but has refused to explain why.
To say that the government is suppressing peaceful protest on Gaza is just weird. Is that what it's about? Connolly did a stupid thing and has been punished. My point was that some free speech means different things. Is what she posted fine and dandy? No, of course not. But neither are millions of other tweets that don't get persued by the police.
Frankly I think anyone deliberately getting arrested for supporting PA is guilty of wasting police time.
I'm sure we are all curious as to government reasons. It must come out at some point. But if people are required not to know facts in criminal trials as it may endanger the process then we must wait, no matter how frustrating it is.
I do not know why the government prescribed PA, but I assume it was intelligence led and decided at the highest levels
I understand it is being challenged in the courts which is the right place to take the argument to
For nearly 900 people to deliberately defy the ban in an attempt to overwhelm the police and courts is a very serious thing to do, and the police have no choice to arrest them and place them before the law as anything else leads to anarchy
Police should be going after shoplifters.
Of course they should, but they are also required to keep law and order
The appeal against the prescribing of PA is in the courts and a legal response will be forthcomng
However, nearly 900 people trying to overwhelm the law and the police is simply not correct irrespective of who they were
Once we become a nation where large groups of people, for whatever cause, can successfully overwhelm the police, courts and the law we are in a very dangerous place
What if the police forces become Nigel's personal Stasi?
Simple question - do you support trying to overwhelm the police, courts, and the law in this country by any group of people to any law you disagree with ?
Do you support the right to protest? Because it sounds like you don’t.
What a silly comment
Of course I support the right to protest, but to deliberately defy the law to overwhelm the police and the courts is mob rule and dangerous
And maybe answer my question
You do know this is currently in front of the courts don't you
The law is an ass. It seems perfectly reasonable and conscionable to defy it.
I think 20 mile an hour speed limits in bits of Bath are stupid. Can I use the same defence and count on your support?
You ought to be able wear t-shirts protesting the speed limits, yes.
You able to wear a t-shirt protesting what is going on in Palestine without an issue at all.
Those seeking to be arrested know full well that it is specific words in support of PA that are illegal, protesting what is going on in Gaza is absolutely the right thing to do
The UK’s new business secretary, Peter Kyle, is expected to fly to Beijing this week as part of Keir Starmer’s continuing efforts to revitalise the UK’s trade relationship with China and provide growth to the British economy.
Kyle will first travel to Washington as part of the preparations for Donald Trump’s state visit to the UK and has then lined up a meeting in Beijing with the Chinese minister of commerce, Wang Wentao, at the first gathering of the UK China joint economic and trade commission (Jetco) for seven years.
Jetco summits were paused by Boris Johnson in response to Beijing’s crackdown on pro-democracy protests in Hong Kong in 2019, with Covid stalling dialogue in subsequent years.
How to win friends and influence people in the Trump White House – send the guy who claimed only paedophiles like free speech, and then go on to China.
Why are we so obsessed with being besties with the Americans? Same national cringe we had to live through in 2003.
Evening all. Been with Pa Woolie this afternoon. You'll be pleased to know he has proclaimed we have passed peak Reform. Pa Woolie for the win.
We are always passing peak Reform. We've passed it here at least 5 times.
You’re feeling, shall we say, bullish? Enjoy it. Reform will end either with a squib-like polling slump, or electoral success and the destruction of our nation.
Show me an example of a populist right wing movement in history bringing about national renewal and happiness in a developed country and I might change my mind, but I’m struggling for good creds.
I don’t think that Reform are in any way fit (at present), to form a government. But, that was once true of the Labour Party.
Thanks to whomever linked that Aseem Malhotra speech above. I thought it was very good - I think it's very hard to disagree with his core message. It is not entirely right and proper for a medical regulator to be funded by the organisations that it's supposed to regulate, nor should we consider the advice of the WHO to be impartial when it is supported to the extent that it appears to be by Bill Gates, who is deeply financially invested in many of the things that it promotes. Most people here are appalled at the idea of tame regulators doing industry's bidding - this is the same.
I have no way of evaluating his message from Dr Angus Dalgliesh that vaccines may have been responsible for the Royal family's health issues. AI tells me Dr Dalgliesh is indeed an eminent oncologist, so that at least is true.
I was grateful for the vaccine. I had my two Astra Zeneca and made the decision to stop there. I have never regretted my decision to take the vaccine, or to stop taking them.
Oncologists aren't necessarily epidemiologists or statisticians. Has Dr Dalgliesh published a study, if need be in collaboration with the relevant other specialists?
Dunno, oncologist Karol Sikorsky and bacteriologist Hugh Pennington had no end of opinions to give over the COVID pandemic. Perhaps we can expect them to appear on a Reform platform sometime soon.
With a Reform government now distinctly possible, PBers of all stripes may find themselves regretting “at will” proscription under terror laws, and the criminalisation of protesting about it.
I would just like to take this opportunity to declare that I love Nigel Farage and welcome our new Reform overlords. If they need a list of names of traitors to look at then PM me here.
The stain on humanity decided he wants to watch the tennis and the USTA haven’t done enough preparation because of the increased security so thousands are still outside the stadium .
There were 890 people arrested at a demonstration against the ban on the group Palestine Action in London on Saturday, the Metropolitan Police say.
The majority of the arrests were for supporting a proscribed group under the Terrorism Act, while police said 17 were also arrested for assaults on police officers "after the protest turned violent".
I think there is some talk of the accused refusing the bail conditions and therefore clogging up remand with thousands of pensioners.
The excuse Government ministers are now giving for the arrests that there is something that they are unable to disclose to us something that makes supporting Palestine Action a genuinely awful terrorist activity. Now, there might be something some members of the core group have planned to do, like killing a soldier or burning a synagogue, but how the hell are these protestors supposed to know that?
There are going to be loads of pensioners coming up in front of a judge who - for the first time - finally find out the nature of the group they are supporting as the CPS/Crown Office makes a case behind closed doors. Surely there is something for the defence there? Or worse - ministers have simply made this up and there is no real underlying reason for it, and they are just trying to scare people into not protesting with these vague allusions.
I don't actually get what they are protesting about. It's not Palestine/Gaza per se, because you can protest about that just fine, every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Is it free speech? I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly. Is it government overstepping the mark? I can understand if people don't trust the government. The Southport case had huge issues with that. I also sense that even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care, just as many reformers are in love with Connolly.
The perception is the government is using the Terrorism Act to suppress peaceful protest for Gaza. There is nothing special about Palestine Action themselves - there are n+1 pro-Palestine action groups in the UK, so the whole point is to protest the gross mischaracterisation of peaceful protest as terrorism.
The Connolly case is a silly comparison. She incited people to kill - read the tweet - something that has been an offence in E&W for centuries. The PA protestors are wearing t-shirts with the name of a group that the government has banned but has refused to explain why.
To say that the government is suppressing peaceful protest on Gaza is just weird. Is that what it's about? Connolly did a stupid thing and has been punished. My point was that some free speech means different things. Is what she posted fine and dandy? No, of course not. But neither are millions of other tweets that don't get persued by the police.
Frankly I think anyone deliberately getting arrested for supporting PA is guilty of wasting police time.
I'm sure we are all curious as to government reasons. It must come out at some point. But if people are required not to know facts in criminal trials as it may endanger the process then we must wait, no matter how frustrating it is.
I do not know why the government prescribed PA, but I assume it was intelligence led and decided at the highest levels
I understand it is being challenged in the courts which is the right place to take the argument to
For nearly 900 people to deliberately defy the ban in an attempt to overwhelm the police and courts is a very serious thing to do, and the police have no choice to arrest them and place them before the law as anything else leads to anarchy
Police should be going after shoplifters.
Of course they should, but they are also required to keep law and order
The appeal against the prescribing of PA is in the courts and a legal response will be forthcomng
However, nearly 900 people trying to overwhelm the law and the police is simply not correct irrespective of who they were
Once we become a nation where large groups of people, for whatever cause, can successfully overwhelm the police, courts and the law we are in a very dangerous place
What if the police forces become Nigel's personal Stasi?
If there is a reason that this group have been proscribed then let us know what it is. Their dark hints of sinister activity doesn't cut it.
They engaged in terrorism at RAF Brize Norton.
There should, I think, be a separate offence of Damaging National Infrastructure (or something like that).
Where it concerns sabotaging our ability to defend ourselves, surely it's pretty classic treason? These were not ammunition boxes bound for the IDF, they were British planes.
Good luck getting a conviction for treason from a jury, in this case. Which is why it wasn't (and won't be) prosecuted as treason.
Evening all. Been with Pa Woolie this afternoon. You'll be pleased to know he has proclaimed we have passed peak Reform. Pa Woolie for the win.
We are always passing peak Reform. We've passed it here at least 5 times.
You’re feeling, shall we say, bullish? Enjoy it. Reform will end either with a squib-like polling slump, or electoral success and the destruction of our nation.
Show me an example of a populist right wing movement in history bringing about national renewal and happiness in a developed country and I might change my mind, but I’m struggling for good creds.
I don’t think that Reform are in any way fit (at present), to form a government. But, that was once true of the Labour Party.
Of course they should, but they are also required to keep law and order
The appeal against the prescribing of PA is in the courts and a legal response will be forthcomng
However, nearly 900 people trying to overwhelm the law and the police is simply not correct irrespective of who they were
Once we become a nation where large groups of people, for whatever cause, can successfully overwhelm the police, courts and the law we are in a very dangerous place
What if the police forces become Nigel's personal Stasi?
Simple question - do you support trying to overwhelm the police, courts, and the law in this country by any group of people to any law you disagree with ?
Do you support the right to protest? Because it sounds like you don’t.
What a silly comment
Of course I support the right to protest, but to deliberately defy the law to overwhelm the police and the courts is mob rule and dangerous
And maybe answer my question
You do know this is currently in front of the courts don't you
The law is an ass. It seems perfectly reasonable and conscionable to defy it.
I think 20 mile an hour speed limits in bits of Bath are stupid. Can I use the same defence and count on your support?
Only if you are driving towards an asylum hotel with a boot full of flegs.
Evening all. Been with Pa Woolie this afternoon. You'll be pleased to know he has proclaimed we have passed peak Reform. Pa Woolie for the win.
Just as you were seriously considering Reform, your Dad tries to convince you you’re too late. Is he a centrist Pa Woolie?
Pa Woolie is the worlds only Trotskyist Thatcherite! Nan and Grandad were very old school Labour. Dad still has flashes of that but he is centre right i guess . He had high hopes for Cameron (i think his last GE vote was 2010, since then he just votes locally). Cameron now, however, is referred to as the pudding faced let down
There were 890 people arrested at a demonstration against the ban on the group Palestine Action in London on Saturday, the Metropolitan Police say.
The majority of the arrests were for supporting a proscribed group under the Terrorism Act, while police said 17 were also arrested for assaults on police officers "after the protest turned violent".
I think there is some talk of the accused refusing the bail conditions and therefore clogging up remand with thousands of pensioners.
The excuse Government ministers are now giving for the arrests that there is something that they are unable to disclose to us something that makes supporting Palestine Action a genuinely awful terrorist activity. Now, there might be something some members of the core group have planned to do, like killing a soldier or burning a synagogue, but how the hell are these protestors supposed to know that?
There are going to be loads of pensioners coming up in front of a judge who - for the first time - finally find out the nature of the group they are supporting as the CPS/Crown Office makes a case behind closed doors. Surely there is something for the defence there? Or worse - ministers have simply made this up and there is no real underlying reason for it, and they are just trying to scare people into not protesting with these vague allusions.
I don't actually get what they are protesting about. It's not Palestine/Gaza per se, because you can protest about that just fine, every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Is it free speech? I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly. Is it government overstepping the mark? I can understand if people don't trust the government. The Southport case had huge issues with that. I also sense that even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care, just as many reformers are in love with Connolly.
The perception is the government is using the Terrorism Act to suppress peaceful protest for Gaza. There is nothing special about Palestine Action themselves - there are n+1 pro-Palestine action groups in the UK, so the whole point is to protest the gross mischaracterisation of peaceful protest as terrorism.
The Connolly case is a silly comparison. She incited people to kill - read the tweet - something that has been an offence in E&W for centuries. The PA protestors are wearing t-shirts with the name of a group that the government has banned but has refused to explain why.
To say that the government is suppressing peaceful protest on Gaza is just weird. Is that what it's about? Connolly did a stupid thing and has been punished. My point was that some free speech means different things. Is what she posted fine and dandy? No, of course not. But neither are millions of other tweets that don't get persued by the police.
Frankly I think anyone deliberately getting arrested for supporting PA is guilty of wasting police time.
I'm sure we are all curious as to government reasons. It must come out at some point. But if people are required not to know facts in criminal trials as it may endanger the process then we must wait, no matter how frustrating it is.
I do not know why the government prescribed PA, but I assume it was intelligence led and decided at the highest levels
I understand it is being challenged in the courts which is the right place to take the argument to
For nearly 900 people to deliberately defy the ban in an attempt to overwhelm the police and courts is a very serious thing to do, and the police have no choice to arrest them and place them before the law as anything else leads to anarchy
Police should be going after shoplifters.
Of course they should, but they are also required to keep law and order
The appeal against the prescribing of PA is in the courts and a legal response will be forthcomng
However, nearly 900 people trying to overwhelm the law and the police is simply not correct irrespective of who they were
Once we become a nation where large groups of people, for whatever cause, can successfully overwhelm the police, courts and the law we are in a very dangerous place
What if the police forces become Nigel's personal Stasi?
Simple question - do you support trying to overwhelm the police, courts, and the law in this country by any group of people to any law you disagree with ?
Do you support the right to protest? Because it sounds like you don’t.
What a silly comment
Of course I support the right to protest, but to deliberately defy the law to overwhelm the police and the courts is mob rule and dangerous
And maybe answer my question
You do know this is currently in front of the courts don't you
The law is an ass. It seems perfectly reasonable and conscionable to defy it.
I think 20 mile an hour speed limits in bits of Bath are stupid. Can I use the same defence and count on your support?
You ought to be able wear t-shirts protesting the speed limits, yes.
You able to wear a t-shirt protesting what is going on in Palestine without an issue at all.
Those seeking to be arrested know full well that it is specific words in support of PA that are illegal, protesting what is going on in Gaza is absolutely the right thing to do
No different to protesting in support of a United ireland but not supporting the Provos.
Yesterday Palestine Action supporters reportedly violently attacked the Police. I’m sure these doddery old bible bashers being arrested would not support that.
Evening all. Been with Pa Woolie this afternoon. You'll be pleased to know he has proclaimed we have passed peak Reform. Pa Woolie for the win.
Nigel certainly appears to be losing his political touch - Reform's sponsoring the career of the anti-vaxxer is a case in point. Reform's enemies should now be asking that guy's opinion on absolutely everything and then forcing Nigel to issue a statement clarifying whether that particular pronouncement does or does not concur with Reform policy. Ditto the arsonist woman.
Theres certainly things to work with if you're of a reform suck bent that were not there last week
Evening all. Been with Pa Woolie this afternoon. You'll be pleased to know he has proclaimed we have passed peak Reform. Pa Woolie for the win.
Just as you were seriously considering Reform, your Dad tries to convince you you’re too late. Is he a centrist Pa Woolie?
Pa Woolie is the worlds only Trotskyist Thatcherite! Nan and Grandad were very old school Labour. Dad still has flashes of that but he is centre right i guess . He had high hopes for Cameron (i think his last GE vote was 2010, since then he just votes locally). Cameron now, however, is referred to as the pudding faced let down
He sounds a fascinating character. Is he a traditional East Anglian nonconformist? My mum’s family were Suffolk working class Methodists. Church or Chapel? had a different meaning in Middleton than it had to Mrs. F’s family in Glasgow.
I do find it perplexing how some posters rage at Trump, Farage and others about their alleged illegal acts and attack those who may want to leave the ECHR, but are supporting acts in our country by large groups of people who want to overwhelm our police and courts because they do not like a particular law
It may be the courts will overturn precribing PA, but until then the law needs to be respected otherwise we are no better than those on the right who want to disapply laws they do not like
Agreed.
Some people take leave of their senses when the word “Palestine” is mentioned. To me, the protection of UK military bases and defence assets is of paramount importance.
And some people can't distinguish between the right to peaceful protest and actually carrying out treasonable acts.
Let's cut all the crap. People are being charged with terrorism for wearing a t-shirt.
Evening all. Been with Pa Woolie this afternoon. You'll be pleased to know he has proclaimed we have passed peak Reform. Pa Woolie for the win.
We are always passing peak Reform. We've passed it here at least 5 times.
You’re feeling, shall we say, bullish? Enjoy it. Reform will end either with a squib-like polling slump, or electoral success and the destruction of our nation.
Show me an example of a populist right wing movement in history bringing about national renewal and happiness in a developed country and I might change my mind, but I’m struggling for good creds.
I don’t think that Reform are in any way fit (at present), to form a government. But, that was once true of the Labour Party.
Evening all. Been with Pa Woolie this afternoon. You'll be pleased to know he has proclaimed we have passed peak Reform. Pa Woolie for the win.
Just as you were seriously considering Reform, your Dad tries to convince you you’re too late. Is he a centrist Pa Woolie?
Pa Woolie is the worlds only Trotskyist Thatcherite! Nan and Grandad were very old school Labour. Dad still has flashes of that but he is centre right i guess . He had high hopes for Cameron (i think his last GE vote was 2010, since then he just votes locally). Cameron now, however, is referred to as the pudding faced let down
He sounds a fascinating character. Is he a traditional East Anglian nonconformist? My mum’s family were Suffolk working class Methodists. Church or Chapel? had a different meaning in Middleton than it had to Mrs. F’s family in Glasgow.
Baptist on that side of the family And yep, hes a character alright
I do find it perplexing how some posters rage at Trump, Farage and others about their alleged illegal acts and attack those who may want to leave the ECHR, but are supporting acts in our country by large groups of people who want to overwhelm our police and courts because they do not like a particular law
It may be the courts will overturn precribing PA, but until then the law needs to be respected otherwise we are no better than those on the right who want to disapply laws they do not like
Agreed.
Some people take leave of their senses when the word “Palestine” is mentioned. To me, the protection of UK military bases and defence assets is of paramount importance.
And some people can't distinguish between the right to peaceful protest and actually carrying out treasonable acts.
Let's cut all the crap. People are being charged with terrorism for wearing a t-shirt.
The law is very clear, you can't show support for a proscribed organisation. These numpties are all following orders of a faceless twitter account to support a really nasty organisation and know exactly what they are doing. Protest the law that is being used, protest against Israel's action in Gaza, its really not hard, nor restricting your freedom of speech.
If the government were banning people from protesting the Gaza war, then there maybe a point. But they aren't. You can go every weekend and protest. The authorities are extremely accommodating, much more than for other causes.
And the courts will force the government to justify their actions shortly.
Thanks to whomever linked that Aseem Malhotra speech above. I thought it was very good - I think it's very hard to disagree with his core message. It is not entirely right and proper for a medical regulator to be funded by the organisations that it's supposed to regulate, nor should we consider the advice of the WHO to be impartial when it is supported to the extent that it appears to be by Bill Gates, who is deeply financially invested in many of the things that it promotes. Most people here are appalled at the idea of tame regulators doing industry's bidding - this is the same.
I have no way of evaluating his message from Dr Angus Dalgliesh that vaccines may have been responsible for the Royal family's health issues. AI tells me Dr Dalgliesh is indeed an eminent oncologist, so that at least is true.
I was grateful for the vaccine. I had my two Astra Zeneca and made the decision to stop there. I have never regretted my decision to take the vaccine, or to stop taking them.
Candidly, the Bill Gates thing is absurd.
Bill Gates is richer than Croesus. What this means is that he has holdings in almost every company on earth. I wouldn't be surprised one of my VCs has Bill Gates as a client. Bill does not, I'm sure, have any idea that he's an investor in Just. But he might very well be.
The thing that has the biggest determinant of his wealth is going to be the overall direction of stockmarkets and the world economy.
Evening all. Been with Pa Woolie this afternoon. You'll be pleased to know he has proclaimed we have passed peak Reform. Pa Woolie for the win.
We are always passing peak Reform. We've passed it here at least 5 times.
You’re feeling, shall we say, bullish? Enjoy it. Reform will end either with a squib-like polling slump, or electoral success and the destruction of our nation.
Show me an example of a populist right wing movement in history bringing about national renewal and happiness in a developed country and I might change my mind, but I’m struggling for good creds.
I don’t think that Reform are in any way fit (at present), to form a government. But, that was once true of the Labour Party.
On cancer, royal or not. Several on pb have had brushes with one or more of the myriad forms of cancer.* My reaction, and I suspect this is common was to ask why did I get cancer? In my case, at 39 and pretty healthy in general (one of the reasons I thought I was ill was not being able to train as normal). I know a fair bit about cancer as I teach it to pharmacy students. It's unbelievably complex. Some cancers are caused by viruses (such as HPV). Others by environmental factors over time (smoking and lung cancer etc). Some of us have genetic risk factirs But many have, as yet, no none cause other than being alive long enough and being unlucky. Could mRNA vaccines cause cancer? I wouldn't rule it out but I don't know if a mechanism yet. Simple association of a man in his later years getting cancer (unknown but rumoured to be prostate cancer) and a woman in her middle years with COVID vaccines is as rubbish a bit of science as you can go. As @bondegezou we have huge databases of anonymised data that will show up any links between vaccination and cancer. I've seen nothing yet.
*I question the idea of cancer as one disease. It's a collection of diseases with features in common. It's confusing for the lay person to think about as to often they can assume that all cancer is the same, and treatment will be the same. Very difficult to shift this, though.
Evening all. Been with Pa Woolie this afternoon. You'll be pleased to know he has proclaimed we have passed peak Reform. Pa Woolie for the win.
We are always passing peak Reform. We've passed it here at least 5 times.
You’re feeling, shall we say, bullish? Enjoy it. Reform will end either with a squib-like polling slump, or electoral success and the destruction of our nation.
Show me an example of a populist right wing movement in history bringing about national renewal and happiness in a developed country and I might change my mind, but I’m struggling for good creds.
I don’t think that Reform are in any way fit (at present), to form a government. But, that was once true of the Labour Party.
I do find it perplexing how some posters rage at Trump, Farage and others about their alleged illegal acts and attack those who may want to leave the ECHR, but are supporting acts in our country by large groups of people who want to overwhelm our police and courts because they do not like a particular law
It may be the courts will overturn precribing PA, but until then the law needs to be respected otherwise we are no better than those on the right who want to disapply laws they do not like
Agreed.
Some people take leave of their senses when the word “Palestine” is mentioned. To me, the protection of UK military bases and defence assets is of paramount importance.
And some people can't distinguish between the right to peaceful protest and actually carrying out treasonable acts.
Let's cut all the crap. People are being charged with terrorism for wearing a t-shirt.
But they deliberately provoked the law in full knowledge of the consquences
You know as well as I do it was not for wearing a t-shirt, but the provocative writing on it and indeed many just holding cardboard notices with the same law defying words
Yes, I dread to think what will happen if Nigel doesn't make it to Number Ten. We'll probably have a mass outbreak of seppuku up and down the land as with the Japanese in 1945.
Thanks to whomever linked that Aseem Malhotra speech above. I thought it was very good - I think it's very hard to disagree with his core message. It is not entirely right and proper for a medical regulator to be funded by the organisations that it's supposed to regulate, nor should we consider the advice of the WHO to be impartial when it is supported to the extent that it appears to be by Bill Gates, who is deeply financially invested in many of the things that it promotes. Most people here are appalled at the idea of tame regulators doing industry's bidding - this is the same.
I have no way of evaluating his message from Dr Angus Dalgliesh that vaccines may have been responsible for the Royal family's health issues. AI tells me Dr Dalgliesh is indeed an eminent oncologist, so that at least is true.
I was grateful for the vaccine. I had my two Astra Zeneca and made the decision to stop there. I have never regretted my decision to take the vaccine, or to stop taking them.
Candidly, the Bill Gates thing is absurd.
Bill Gates is richer than Croesus. What this means is that he has holdings in almost every company on earth. I wouldn't be surprised one of my VCs has Bill Gates as a client. Bill does not, I'm sure, have any idea that he's an investor in Just. But he might very well be.
The thing that has the biggest determinant of his wealth is going to be the overall direction of stockmarkets and the world economy.
Lucky is a decent practical example of how conspiracy theories work.
As for Gates having a financial interest in vaccines, the reality is that he's given away billions to make them available. I'm not his greatest fan, but it's simply absurd to question his motives like that.
And there is simply no excuse for Malhotra's crap.
The stain on humanity decided he wants to watch the tennis and the USTA haven’t done enough preparation because of the increased security so thousands are still outside the stadium .
They're definitely doing their best to ensure the crowd won't be doing any booing.
There were 890 people arrested at a demonstration against the ban on the group Palestine Action in London on Saturday, the Metropolitan Police say.
The majority of the arrests were for supporting a proscribed group under the Terrorism Act, while police said 17 were also arrested for assaults on police officers "after the protest turned violent".
I think there is some talk of the accused refusing the bail conditions and therefore clogging up remand with thousands of pensioners.
The excuse Government ministers are now giving for the arrests that there is something that they are unable to disclose to us something that makes supporting Palestine Action a genuinely awful terrorist activity. Now, there might be something some members of the core group have planned to do, like killing a soldier or burning a synagogue, but how the hell are these protestors supposed to know that?
There are going to be loads of pensioners coming up in front of a judge who - for the first time - finally find out the nature of the group they are supporting as the CPS/Crown Office makes a case behind closed doors. Surely there is something for the defence there? Or worse - ministers have simply made this up and there is no real underlying reason for it, and they are just trying to scare people into not protesting with these vague allusions.
I don't actually get what they are protesting about. It's not Palestine/Gaza per se, because you can protest about that just fine, every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Is it free speech? I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly. Is it government overstepping the mark? I can understand if people don't trust the government. The Southport case had huge issues with that. I also sense that even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care, just as many reformers are in love with Connolly.
You don’t know if anyone “cared a fig” about Connolly because, as you admit yourself, you don’t “get it”.
What's your point? I genuinely don't understand if it's the Gaza angle, and this just misplaced or the free speech. No, I have no idea of their opinion about Connolly but I am drawing an inference.
My point is simply that you don’t like these people and are simply setting up various straw men that you have “inferred” they are guilty of.
Why are you suggesting I don't like them? I think them foolish, and I'm not sure what they are trying to achieve.
Quoting you,
“ I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly... even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care”
Yes, it's a guess. May be wrong. What's your point?
Do you honestly believe that the nearly 900 people arrested yesterday would excuse “genuine” acts of terror?
Labour (Yvette Cooper, who ought to have been sacked rather than promoted), have brought the anti-terror laws into disrepute.
Don't know. Do you think they all think the government is lying?
you think our intelligence has improved since the 45 minutes WMD claim days?
There were 890 people arrested at a demonstration against the ban on the group Palestine Action in London on Saturday, the Metropolitan Police say.
The majority of the arrests were for supporting a proscribed group under the Terrorism Act, while police said 17 were also arrested for assaults on police officers "after the protest turned violent".
I think there is some talk of the accused refusing the bail conditions and therefore clogging up remand with thousands of pensioners.
The excuse Government ministers are now giving for the arrests that there is something that they are unable to disclose to us something that makes supporting Palestine Action a genuinely awful terrorist activity. Now, there might be something some members of the core group have planned to do, like killing a soldier or burning a synagogue, but how the hell are these protestors supposed to know that?
There are going to be loads of pensioners coming up in front of a judge who - for the first time - finally find out the nature of the group they are supporting as the CPS/Crown Office makes a case behind closed doors. Surely there is something for the defence there? Or worse - ministers have simply made this up and there is no real underlying reason for it, and they are just trying to scare people into not protesting with these vague allusions.
I don't actually get what they are protesting about. It's not Palestine/Gaza per se, because you can protest about that just fine, every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Is it free speech? I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly. Is it government overstepping the mark? I can understand if people don't trust the government. The Southport case had huge issues with that. I also sense that even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care, just as many reformers are in love with Connolly.
You don’t know if anyone “cared a fig” about Connolly because, as you admit yourself, you don’t “get it”.
What's your point? I genuinely don't understand if it's the Gaza angle, and this just misplaced or the free speech. No, I have no idea of their opinion about Connolly but I am drawing an inference.
My point is simply that you don’t like these people and are simply setting up various straw men that you have “inferred” they are guilty of.
Why are you suggesting I don't like them? I think them foolish, and I'm not sure what they are trying to achieve.
Quoting you,
“ I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly... even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care”
Yes, it's a guess. May be wrong. What's your point?
Do you honestly believe that the nearly 900 people arrested yesterday would excuse “genuine” acts of terror?
Labour (Yvette Cooper, who ought to have been sacked rather than promoted), have brought the anti-terror laws into disrepute.
Don't know. Do you think they all think the government is lying?
you think our intelligence has improved since the 45 minutes WMD claim days?
Well it's a very different government, but that's a fair point
On cancer, royal or not. Several on pb have had brushes with one or more of the myriad forms of cancer.* My reaction, and I suspect this is common was to ask why did I get cancer? In my case, at 39 and pretty healthy in general (one of the reasons I thought I was ill was not being able to train as normal). I know a fair bit about cancer as I teach it to pharmacy students. It's unbelievably complex. Some cancers are caused by viruses (such as HPV). Others by environmental factors over time (smoking and lung cancer etc). Some of us have genetic risk factirs But many have, as yet, no none cause other than being alive long enough and being unlucky. Could mRNA vaccines cause cancer? I wouldn't rule it out but I don't know if a mechanism yet. Simple association of a man in his later years getting cancer (unknown but rumoured to be prostate cancer) and a woman in her middle years with COVID vaccines is as rubbish a bit of science as you can go. As @bondegezou we have huge databases of anonymised data that will show up any links between vaccination and cancer. I've seen nothing yet.
*I question the idea of cancer as one disease. It's a collection of diseases with features in common. It's confusing for the lay person to think about as to often they can assume that all cancer is the same, and treatment will be the same. Very difficult to shift this, though.
One also has to ask if Covid itself causes cancer.
Thanks to whomever linked that Aseem Malhotra speech above. I thought it was very good - I think it's very hard to disagree with his core message. It is not entirely right and proper for a medical regulator to be funded by the organisations that it's supposed to regulate, nor should we consider the advice of the WHO to be impartial when it is supported to the extent that it appears to be by Bill Gates, who is deeply financially invested in many of the things that it promotes. Most people here are appalled at the idea of tame regulators doing industry's bidding - this is the same.
I have no way of evaluating his message from Dr Angus Dalgliesh that vaccines may have been responsible for the Royal family's health issues. AI tells me Dr Dalgliesh is indeed an eminent oncologist, so that at least is true.
I was grateful for the vaccine. I had my two Astra Zeneca and made the decision to stop there. I have never regretted my decision to take the vaccine, or to stop taking them.
Candidly, the Bill Gates thing is absurd.
Bill Gates is richer than Croesus. What this means is that he has holdings in almost every company on earth. I wouldn't be surprised one of my VCs has Bill Gates as a client. Bill does not, I'm sure, have any idea that he's an investor in Just. But he might very well be.
The thing that has the biggest determinant of his wealth is going to be the overall direction of stockmarkets and the world economy.
I’m assuming my tracker funds have holdings in a wide variety of companies. I may not be as rich as Bill Gates.
There were 890 people arrested at a demonstration against the ban on the group Palestine Action in London on Saturday, the Metropolitan Police say.
The majority of the arrests were for supporting a proscribed group under the Terrorism Act, while police said 17 were also arrested for assaults on police officers "after the protest turned violent".
I think there is some talk of the accused refusing the bail conditions and therefore clogging up remand with thousands of pensioners.
The excuse Government ministers are now giving for the arrests that there is something that they are unable to disclose to us something that makes supporting Palestine Action a genuinely awful terrorist activity. Now, there might be something some members of the core group have planned to do, like killing a soldier or burning a synagogue, but how the hell are these protestors supposed to know that?
There are going to be loads of pensioners coming up in front of a judge who - for the first time - finally find out the nature of the group they are supporting as the CPS/Crown Office makes a case behind closed doors. Surely there is something for the defence there? Or worse - ministers have simply made this up and there is no real underlying reason for it, and they are just trying to scare people into not protesting with these vague allusions.
I don't actually get what they are protesting about. It's not Palestine/Gaza per se, because you can protest about that just fine, every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Is it free speech? I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly. Is it government overstepping the mark? I can understand if people don't trust the government. The Southport case had huge issues with that. I also sense that even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care, just as many reformers are in love with Connolly.
You don’t know if anyone “cared a fig” about Connolly because, as you admit yourself, you don’t “get it”.
What's your point? I genuinely don't understand if it's the Gaza angle, and this just misplaced or the free speech. No, I have no idea of their opinion about Connolly but I am drawing an inference.
My point is simply that you don’t like these people and are simply setting up various straw men that you have “inferred” they are guilty of.
Why are you suggesting I don't like them? I think them foolish, and I'm not sure what they are trying to achieve.
Quoting you,
“ I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly... even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care”
Yes, it's a guess. May be wrong. What's your point?
Do you honestly believe that the nearly 900 people arrested yesterday would excuse “genuine” acts of terror?
Labour (Yvette Cooper, who ought to have been sacked rather than promoted), have brought the anti-terror laws into disrepute.
Don't know. Do you think they all think the government is lying?
you think our intelligence has improved since the 45 minutes WMD claim days?
Righties are still as gullible as ever. Can’t comment on their intelligence.
On cancer, royal or not. Several on pb have had brushes with one or more of the myriad forms of cancer.* My reaction, and I suspect this is common was to ask why did I get cancer? In my case, at 39 and pretty healthy in general (one of the reasons I thought I was ill was not being able to train as normal). I know a fair bit about cancer as I teach it to pharmacy students. It's unbelievably complex. Some cancers are caused by viruses (such as HPV). Others by environmental factors over time (smoking and lung cancer etc). Some of us have genetic risk factirs But many have, as yet, no none cause other than being alive long enough and being unlucky. Could mRNA vaccines cause cancer? I wouldn't rule it out but I don't know if a mechanism yet. Simple association of a man in his later years getting cancer (unknown but rumoured to be prostate cancer) and a woman in her middle years with COVID vaccines is as rubbish a bit of science as you can go. As @bondegezou we have huge databases of anonymised data that will show up any links between vaccination and cancer. I've seen nothing yet.
*I question the idea of cancer as one disease. It's a collection of diseases with features in common. It's confusing for the lay person to think about as to often they can assume that all cancer is the same, and treatment will be the same. Very difficult to shift this, though.
One also has to ask if Covid itself causes cancer.
Well yes, but I'd assume we've all had it by now. Crucial period was probably before vaccination. I have a colleague who thinks inflammation is at the heart of all ill health. It's probably a stretch, but there is a lot we dont kow about a lot of diseases.
I do find it perplexing how some posters rage at Trump, Farage and others about their alleged illegal acts and attack those who may want to leave the ECHR, but are supporting acts in our country by large groups of people who want to overwhelm our police and courts because they do not like a particular law
It may be the courts will overturn precribing PA, but until then the law needs to be respected otherwise we are no better than those on the right who want to disapply laws they do not like
Agreed.
Some people take leave of their senses when the word “Palestine” is mentioned. To me, the protection of UK military bases and defence assets is of paramount importance.
And some people can't distinguish between the right to peaceful protest and actually carrying out treasonable acts.
Let's cut all the crap. People are being charged with terrorism for wearing a t-shirt.
Just be grateful it's not the US. Vance would be saying it's justification to drone strike them.
Yes, I dread to think what will happen if Nigel doesn't make it to Number Ten. We'll probably have a mass outbreak of seppuku up and down the land as with the Japanese in 1945.
If mass suicide follows Nigel not winning the next election, the national IQ will rise so much it will even overtake Leon’s.
The stain on humanity decided he wants to watch the tennis and the USTA haven’t done enough preparation because of the increased security so thousands are still outside the stadium .
They're definitely doing their best to ensure the crowd won't be doing any booing.
According to data from the FBI, Chicago and Boston have lower crime rates than cities in red states, including Memphis and Tennessee. The data shows that Chicago has 17.5 murders per 100K people and Boston has 3.6, while Memphis and St. Louis have crime rates of 40.6 and 54.1, respectively, per 100K people.
Yes, I dread to think what will happen if Nigel doesn't make it to Number Ten. We'll probably have a mass outbreak of seppuku up and down the land as with the Japanese in 1945.
If mass suicide follows Nigel not winning the next election, the national IQ will rise so much it will even overtake Leon’s.
I do find it perplexing how some posters rage at Trump, Farage and others about their alleged illegal acts and attack those who may want to leave the ECHR, but are supporting acts in our country by large groups of people who want to overwhelm our police and courts because they do not like a particular law
It may be the courts will overturn precribing PA, but until then the law needs to be respected otherwise we are no better than those on the right who want to disapply laws they do not like
Agreed.
Some people take leave of their senses when the word “Palestine” is mentioned. To me, the protection of UK military bases and defence assets is of paramount importance.
And some people can't distinguish between the right to peaceful protest and actually carrying out treasonable acts.
Let's cut all the crap. People are being charged with terrorism for wearing a t-shirt.
But they deliberately provoked the law in full knowledge of the consquences
You know as well as I do it was not for wearing a t-shirt, but the provocative writing on it and indeed many just holding cardboard notices with the same law defying words
Yeah, I know. I'm not suggesting they have been falsely arrested.
But it's completely indefensible in a liberal democracy so we've got people desperately clinging to "but it's the law" because they can't abide defending loony lefties.
Masked Farage agents pulling centrist dads off the street for non conformist PB posts condemning Lucy Connolly and Andrew Tate's race baiting X posts. Evil bastards like Mexicanpete and Roger thrown into the back of a Transit van, never to be seen again. Well not Roger, as he lives in France.
Evening all. Been with Pa Woolie this afternoon. You'll be pleased to know he has proclaimed we have passed peak Reform. Pa Woolie for the win.
We are always passing peak Reform. We've passed it here at least 5 times.
You’re feeling, shall we say, bullish? Enjoy it. Reform will end either with a squib-like polling slump, or electoral success and the destruction of our nation.
Show me an example of a populist right wing movement in history bringing about national renewal and happiness in a developed country and I might change my mind, but I’m struggling for good creds.
Bullish, no. Genuinely optimistic about the country for the first time for ages, yes.
Reform are old school Tories - their policies are simply what worked in the UK before the country became enshittified by the Blairite consensus. It will be a huge relief to get sensible Government in the national interest again.
Inexperience is an issue, and I hope they will need Tory support, as that will be a Government with a real democratic mandate as well as a hopefully a significant parliamentary majority.
Don't be fooled by Andrea Jenkins singing and Jeremy Kyle hyping the crowds - they are serious about governing. Last week they had a press conference about billions of waste in Local Government pensions for goodness sake. Sometimes their tries are outside the line and they course correct. This is the mistake Kemi is making, possibly out of necessity. She wants a policy that is absolutely bullet proof from every angle, but sometimes you have to put a policy out and it gets tested and then develops in public.
The stain on humanity decided he wants to watch the tennis and the USTA haven’t done enough preparation because of the increased security so thousands are still outside the stadium .
They're definitely doing their best to ensure the crowd won't be doing any booing.
Are they expecting the tennis to be that bad?
Summary execution for first spectator to stop clapping the prez.
Masked Farage agents pulling centrist dads off the street for non conformist PB posts condemning Lucy Connolly and Andrew Tate's race baiting X posts. Evil bastards like Mexicanpete and Roger thrown into the back of a Transit van, never to be seen again. Well not Roger, as he lives in France.
The Woolie underground railroad will come to the rescue. Woolie is good, Woolie is wise
According to data from the FBI, Chicago and Boston have lower crime rates than cities in red states, including Memphis and Tennessee. The data shows that Chicago has 17.5 murders per 100K people and Boston has 3.6, while Memphis and St. Louis have crime rates of 40.6 and 54.1, respectively, per 100K people.
The worst states by murder rate - except New Mexico - are all Republican Strongholds. And, in reverse, the safest States are (Utah excepted) all Democrat.
Some of that is presumably population age, though. Dermocrat states tend to be older, and older people commit fewer murders.
Is it because everyone relentlessly treated Rayner herself like some special-needs child, a young, underprivileged woman who they secretly suspected couldn’t read or write? If you look at the way Starmer spoke about her, it was constantly in these terms: she was a woman, and working class.
Of her actual record, of course: no hint. She was the perfect deputy prime minister for him: a politician allowed to rise to the top on personality alone. And that personality was: middle-class person’s idea of what a working-class person should be. Slobby, ribald, partying in ’Beefa — isn’t vaping on inflatables what working-class people all do? Spoiler alert: it isn’t. Most working-class people are insulted to be compared to her.
Rayner was someone from the bottom 10% who moved into the top 10% through the Labour party.
Its no wonder that Labour politicians, people who are obsessed about the top 10% and bottom 10% and very little in between, turned Rayner into their living icon.
Put the "scum" back in her box where she belongs? We need proper working class heroes like Boris Johnson, Nigel Farage and Lucy Connolly.
Poshos at the top is the standard order of things, which is why nobody was bothered about the likes of Blair and Darling.
Whereas Rayner is disconcerting, having gone from bottom 10% to top 10%, entirely through the medium of the Labour party.
That appears great to Labour politicians who are obsessed about those at the top and those at the bottom.
But less so to the 80% who get the impression that Labour isn't interested in them.
There are, of course, other people who have gone from bottom 10% to top 10% - in sport, in entertainment, even in business. But these people leave a trail of visible achievement whereas Rayner was a pretty rubbish housing minister for a year.
Like I said.
She called you "scum" so you don't like her. Nonetheless I don't believe you can dismiss her achievement in becoming Deputy Prime Minister.
And don't forget, Boris got all the big calls right.
Johnson certainly got Ukraine and covid right but he was responsible, much like Rayner, for his own fall from grace
Such is politics
Johnson got Covid right for everyone else but not for himself. Having had it, you'd have thought he'd have been more careful.
He got the PPE fast lane right for the friends and family of Ministers, and Dido Harding was deservedly rewarded for her contribution.
And you might want to look at the 'companies' that Labour MPs were calling about them not using. Some of which were (ahem) interesting.
We needed PPE. We could either get PPE quickly or efficiently. There was zero chance of quickly *and* efficiently.
One reason for the panic was the oft-lauded Jeremy Hunt had failed to stockpile PPE as recommended.
IIRC the 'stockpile' that was recommended was a tiny fraction of the actual need. It would have helped a little, but the same problems would have persisted.
(Is there data for this somewhere?)
TBF the figure that got through to the final draft of the report. For all we know, it might have been watered down from the prima facie sums to stop shocking the horses even more.
Edit: but another way of doing it would be to consider how long the shelf life is vs consumption rate, and at least hold enough to be consumed within the shelf life. I seem to recall that even that sort of cycling was not implemented in normal times - can't recall why.
The problem with stockpiling PPE is that “modern practises” is to use biodegradable plastics in disposable gowns etc.
The French tried using slightly time expired stuff - it literally fell apart.
So you have fairly short life spans - which means that rotating a stockpile for a COVID like event is impractical. You won’t be normally using enough from the stockpile to stop most of it rotting.
So you have 3 choices
1) small stockpile 2) large stockpile and bin vast quantities every day. 3) move to reusable materials.
In addition, many of these “biodegradable” plastics leave a residue of microscopic plastic in the environment which is a big issue.
The answer, it seems to me, is (3). The objection are
1) We don’t do that 2) it’s uncomfortable 3) cleaning is an issue
1) is farcical.
2) is answered by the huge improvements in recent years - I’ve use welding stuff (some welding gives off extremely toxic fumes) that is a *pleasure* to wear in hot weather. It includes belt mounted forced air which goes through a filter - you have personal air conditioning. The visors have built in anti fogging, and the dams/seals can be 3D printed to fit various face structures. Some units include microphone/speaker systems to aid communication - no muffled voices.
3) is answered by jumps in materials technology - stuff that can resist powerful cleaning chemicals - just drop it in a garbage bin full of stuff, let it soak for a few minutes, then wash it off with a pressure washer (or similar)
It’s worth wondering what will happen if we hit a real airborne disease. The existing patchwork of masks, visors and plastic gowns is full of gaps….
Cross infections massively reduced as a result of the shift to single use hospital products, your suggestion is a massive backwards step
We are not talking about devices such a syringes that are hard to clean. Immersion in a vat of chemicals will destroy everything - even prions, with the right chemicals. It should be noted that many items in hospitals are not one use - consider surgeons tools. Which go inside the patient.
The alternative is not to enough PPE, for the next worldwide infection.
Sure you can use steam based autoclaves to sterilise surgical steel.
But laundry is a lot more work. I’m not sure what your experience of infection management is, but there’s very good reasons why hospitals have shifted away from reusable drapes and gowns over the last 25 years or so.
Evening all. Been with Pa Woolie this afternoon. You'll be pleased to know he has proclaimed we have passed peak Reform. Pa Woolie for the win.
We are always passing peak Reform. We've passed it here at least 5 times.
You’re feeling, shall we say, bullish? Enjoy it. Reform will end either with a squib-like polling slump, or electoral success and the destruction of our nation.
Show me an example of a populist right wing movement in history bringing about national renewal and happiness in a developed country and I might change my mind, but I’m struggling for good creds.
Bullish, no. Genuinely optimistic about the country for the first time for ages, yes.
Reform are old school Tories - their policies are simply what worked in the UK before the country became enshittified by the Blairite consensus. It will be a huge relief to get sensible Government in the national interest again.
Inexperience is an issue, and I hope they will need Tory support, as that will be a Government with a real democratic mandate as well as a hopefully a significant parliamentary majority.
Don't be fooled by Andrea Jenkins singing and Jeremy Kyle hyping the crowds - they are serious about governing. Last week they had a press conference about billions of waste in Local Government pensions for goodness sake. Sometimes their tries are outside the line and they course correct. This is the mistake Kemi is making, possibly out of necessity. She wants a policy that is absolutely bullet proof from every angle, but sometimes you have to put a policy out and it gets tested and then develops in public.
I don't think the party of scientist Margaret Thatcher would have had a vaccine conspiracy theorist headline a Conservative Party conference.
Masked Farage agents pulling centrist dads off the street for non conformist PB posts condemning Lucy Connolly and Andrew Tate's race baiting X posts. Evil bastards like Mexicanpete and Roger thrown into the back of a Transit van, never to be seen again. Well not Roger, as he lives in France.
There were 890 people arrested at a demonstration against the ban on the group Palestine Action in London on Saturday, the Metropolitan Police say.
The majority of the arrests were for supporting a proscribed group under the Terrorism Act, while police said 17 were also arrested for assaults on police officers "after the protest turned violent".
I think there is some talk of the accused refusing the bail conditions and therefore clogging up remand with thousands of pensioners.
The excuse Government ministers are now giving for the arrests that there is something that they are unable to disclose to us something that makes supporting Palestine Action a genuinely awful terrorist activity. Now, there might be something some members of the core group have planned to do, like killing a soldier or burning a synagogue, but how the hell are these protestors supposed to know that?
There are going to be loads of pensioners coming up in front of a judge who - for the first time - finally find out the nature of the group they are supporting as the CPS/Crown Office makes a case behind closed doors. Surely there is something for the defence there? Or worse - ministers have simply made this up and there is no real underlying reason for it, and they are just trying to scare people into not protesting with these vague allusions.
I don't actually get what they are protesting about. It's not Palestine/Gaza per se, because you can protest about that just fine, every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Is it free speech? I bet none of them cared a fig for Connolly. Is it government overstepping the mark? I can understand if people don't trust the government. The Southport case had huge issues with that. I also sense that even if it does come out that P A were planning a 'genuine' act a lot of this mob wouldn't care, just as many reformers are in love with Connolly.
The perception is the government is using the Terrorism Act to suppress peaceful protest for Gaza. There is nothing special about Palestine Action themselves - there are n+1 pro-Palestine action groups in the UK, so the whole point is to protest the gross mischaracterisation of peaceful protest as terrorism.
The Connolly case is a silly comparison. She incited people to kill - read the tweet - something that has been an offence in E&W for centuries. The PA protestors are wearing t-shirts with the name of a group that the government has banned but has refused to explain why.
Destroying military equipment at a time of grave national threats?
On cancer, royal or not. Several on pb have had brushes with one or more of the myriad forms of cancer.* My reaction, and I suspect this is common was to ask why did I get cancer? In my case, at 39 and pretty healthy in general (one of the reasons I thought I was ill was not being able to train as normal). I know a fair bit about cancer as I teach it to pharmacy students. It's unbelievably complex. Some cancers are caused by viruses (such as HPV). Others by environmental factors over time (smoking and lung cancer etc). Some of us have genetic risk factirs But many have, as yet, no none cause other than being alive long enough and being unlucky. Could mRNA vaccines cause cancer? I wouldn't rule it out but I don't know if a mechanism yet. Simple association of a man in his later years getting cancer (unknown but rumoured to be prostate cancer) and a woman in her middle years with COVID vaccines is as rubbish a bit of science as you can go. As @bondegezou we have huge databases of anonymised data that will show up any links between vaccination and cancer. I've seen nothing yet.
*I question the idea of cancer as one disease. It's a collection of diseases with features in common. It's confusing for the lay person to think about as to often they can assume that all cancer is the same, and treatment will be the same. Very difficult to shift this, though.
One also has to ask if Covid itself causes cancer.
Well yes, but I'd assume we've all had it by now. Crucial period was probably before vaccination. I have a colleague who thinks inflammation is at the heart of all ill health. It's probably a stretch, but there is a lot we dont kow about a lot of diseases.
There's a lot of evidence that inflammation causes lots of bad things: that semiglutide is such a powerful antiiflamatory may well be a part of why it is so successful in treating so many things.
According to data from the FBI, Chicago and Boston have lower crime rates than cities in red states, including Memphis and Tennessee. The data shows that Chicago has 17.5 murders per 100K people and Boston has 3.6, while Memphis and St. Louis have crime rates of 40.6 and 54.1, respectively, per 100K people.
The worst states by murder rate - except New Mexico - are all Republican Strongholds. And, in reverse, the safest States are (Utah excepted) all Democrat.
Some of that is presumably population age, though. Dermocrat states tend to be older, and older people commit fewer murders.
On cancer, royal or not. Several on pb have had brushes with one or more of the myriad forms of cancer.* My reaction, and I suspect this is common was to ask why did I get cancer? In my case, at 39 and pretty healthy in general (one of the reasons I thought I was ill was not being able to train as normal). I know a fair bit about cancer as I teach it to pharmacy students. It's unbelievably complex. Some cancers are caused by viruses (such as HPV). Others by environmental factors over time (smoking and lung cancer etc). Some of us have genetic risk factirs But many have, as yet, no none cause other than being alive long enough and being unlucky. Could mRNA vaccines cause cancer? I wouldn't rule it out but I don't know if a mechanism yet. Simple association of a man in his later years getting cancer (unknown but rumoured to be prostate cancer) and a woman in her middle years with COVID vaccines is as rubbish a bit of science as you can go. As @bondegezou we have huge databases of anonymised data that will show up any links between vaccination and cancer. I've seen nothing yet.
*I question the idea of cancer as one disease. It's a collection of diseases with features in common. It's confusing for the lay person to think about as to often they can assume that all cancer is the same, and treatment will be the same. Very difficult to shift this, though.
One also has to ask if Covid itself causes cancer.
Well yes, but I'd assume we've all had it by now. Crucial period was probably before vaccination. I have a colleague who thinks inflammation is at the heart of all ill health. It's probably a stretch, but there is a lot we dont kow about a lot of diseases.
There's a lot of evidence that inflammation causes lots of bad things: that semiglutide is such a powerful antiiflamatory may well be a part of why it is so successful in treating so many things.
It also really winds up some naturally thin types who think fatties are lazy and losing weight with semaglutide is cheating...
Comments
@LukeTryl
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13m
The big challenge imo [for Reform] will be listening too much to the online right, which appears to be making mistake of thinking X, formerly Twitter, is the same as Britain that others made in the past or that Britain is America. Online right figures are unpopular with Reform’s new voters
https://x.com/LukeTryl/status/1964749200199127431
The detention without trial of all those involved in the ID card project, at the Home Office.
It's not difficult.
Under the law what PA did is terrorism, not "only" criminal damage.
Under the law terrorists can be proscribed.
Under the law supporting proscribed terrorists is itself an offence.
If you're upset about how the law is being applied, what the hell did you expect when the law was passed? Don't give the state powers if you don't want theme exercising.
Liberalise the law.
@atrupar
“We’re coming up with the answers for autism” — Trump
https://x.com/atrupar/status/1964731296795492859
Pa Woolie for the win.
We have the security state we do largely as a result of emotion-driven responses to act of terror. I have no doubt a future Reform Government will be happy to sacrifice civil liberties and free speech even further on the twin altars of "security" and "public safety".
It may be the courts will overturn precribing PA, but until then the law needs to be respected otherwise we are no better than those on the right who want to disapply laws they do not like
After that, it’s too far ahead to say.
It started with very online lefties deciding that online was the place to exercise ideological purity and hone the art of the pile on, and then the very online right - who’d already been spewing nastiness on fringe sites - decided the best way to tackle this was by exercising their own ideological purity in the mainstream, helped by an army of bots from all corners of the world.
We get the worst of US discourse. In the first wave we laugh it off. But slowly it penetrates. Eventually we start speaking the same language, and start hating each other.
Some people take leave of their senses when the word “Palestine” is mentioned. To me, the protection of UK military bases and defence assets is of paramount importance.
Reform will end either with a squib-like polling slump, or electoral success and the destruction of our nation.
Show me an example of a populist right wing movement in history bringing about national renewal and happiness in a developed country and I might change my mind, but I’m struggling for good creds.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQ7zdnZSxoQ
The stain on humanity decided he wants to watch the tennis and the USTA haven’t done enough preparation because of the increased security so thousands are still outside the stadium .
Of course they should, but they are also required to keep law and order
The appeal against the prescribing of PA is in the courts and a legal response will be forthcomng
However, nearly 900 people trying to overwhelm the law and the police is simply not correct irrespective of who they were
Once we become a nation where large groups of people, for whatever cause, can successfully overwhelm the police, courts and the law we are in a very dangerous place
What if the police forces become Nigel's personal Stasi?
Simple question - do you support trying to overwhelm the police, courts, and the law in this country by any group of people to any law you disagree with ?
Do you support the right to protest?
Because it sounds like you don’t.
What a silly comment
Of course I support the right to protest, but to deliberately defy the law to overwhelm the police and the courts is mob rule and dangerous
And maybe answer my question
You do know this is currently in front of the courts don't you
The law is an ass. It seems perfectly reasonable and conscionable to defy it.
I think 20 mile an hour speed limits in bits of Bath are stupid. Can I use the same defence and count on your support?
Only if you are driving towards an asylum hotel with a boot full of flegs.
Nan and Grandad were very old school Labour. Dad still has flashes of that but he is centre right i guess . He had high hopes for Cameron (i think his last GE vote was 2010, since then he just votes locally). Cameron now, however, is referred to as the pudding faced let down
Yesterday Palestine Action supporters reportedly violently attacked the Police. I’m sure these doddery old bible bashers being arrested would not support that.
John Rentoul
@JohnRentoul
Last instalment of the reshuffle
https://x.com/JohnRentoul/status/1964760272465465722
Is he a traditional East Anglian nonconformist? My mum’s family were Suffolk working class Methodists. Church or Chapel? had a different meaning in Middleton than it had to Mrs. F’s family in Glasgow.
Let's cut all the crap. People are being charged with terrorism for wearing a t-shirt.
And yep, hes a character alright
If the government were banning people from protesting the Gaza war, then there maybe a point. But they aren't. You can go every weekend and protest. The authorities are extremely accommodating, much more than for other causes.
And the courts will force the government to justify their actions shortly.
As I say, play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
Allison Pearson
@AllisonPearson
We already have a national emergency.
It’s your government.
https://x.com/AllisonPearson/status/1964724303498465654
Bill Gates is richer than Croesus. What this means is that he has holdings in almost every company on earth. I wouldn't be surprised one of my VCs has Bill Gates as a client. Bill does not, I'm sure, have any idea that he's an investor in Just. But he might very well be.
The thing that has the biggest determinant of his wealth is going to be the overall direction of stockmarkets and the world economy.
Could mRNA vaccines cause cancer? I wouldn't rule it out but I don't know if a mechanism yet.
Simple association of a man in his later years getting cancer (unknown but rumoured to be prostate cancer) and a woman in her middle years with COVID vaccines is as rubbish a bit of science as you can go. As @bondegezou we have huge databases of anonymised data that will show up any links between vaccination and cancer. I've seen nothing yet.
*I question the idea of cancer as one disease. It's a collection of diseases with features in common. It's confusing for the lay person to think about as to often they can assume that all cancer is the same, and treatment will be the same. Very difficult to shift this, though.
You know as well as I do it was not for wearing a t-shirt, but the provocative writing on it and indeed many just holding cardboard notices with the same law defying words
As for Gates having a financial interest in vaccines, the reality is that he's given away billions to make them available.
I'm not his greatest fan, but it's simply absurd to question his motives like that.
And there is simply no excuse for Malhotra's crap.
This isn’t Moscow or Beijing. It’s Chicago. Masked federal agents grabbed U.S. citizens protesting ICE and threw them into an unmarked van.
“Who are you? Where are you taking them?” people shouted. “You are kidnapping them!”
What has America become?
https://x.com/RpsAgainstTrump/status/1964733543122395496
And there's evidence that infection affects pancreatic tissues: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-021-92068-4
A massive warning to the UK.
I have a colleague who thinks inflammation is at the heart of all ill health. It's probably a stretch, but there is a lot we dont kow about a lot of diseases.
Vance would be saying it's justification to drone strike them.
Selina Wang
@selinawangtv
According to data from the FBI, Chicago and Boston have lower crime rates than cities in red states, including Memphis and Tennessee. The data shows that Chicago has 17.5 murders per 100K people and Boston has 3.6, while Memphis and St. Louis have crime rates of 40.6 and 54.1, respectively, per 100K people.
https://x.com/selinawangtv/status/1964734250638520684
But it's completely indefensible in a liberal democracy so we've got people desperately clinging to "but it's the law" because they can't abide defending loony lefties.
Reform are old school Tories - their policies are simply what worked in the UK before the country became enshittified by the Blairite consensus. It will be a huge relief to get sensible Government in the national interest again.
Inexperience is an issue, and I hope they will need Tory support, as that will be a Government with a real democratic mandate as well as a hopefully a significant parliamentary majority.
Don't be fooled by Andrea Jenkins singing and Jeremy Kyle hyping the crowds - they are serious about governing. Last week they had a press conference about billions of waste in Local Government pensions for goodness sake. Sometimes their tries are outside the line and they course correct. This is the mistake Kemi is making, possibly out of necessity. She wants a policy that is absolutely bullet proof from every angle, but sometimes you have to put a policy out and it gets tested and then develops in public.
https://x.com/rjohdomingo/status/1964478834075718073?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q
Woolie is good, Woolie is wise
Some of that is presumably population age, though. Dermocrat states tend to be older, and older people commit fewer murders.
But laundry is a lot more work. I’m not sure what your experience of infection management is, but there’s very good reasons why hospitals have shifted away from reusable drapes and gowns over the last 25 years or so.
https://us.v-cdn.net/5020679/uploads/editor/ei/ojx3kamvek54.jpeg
So unwelcome in Trump's America.