I saw the 10 o'clock news. I thought Ed Davey's comments very kind and statesmanlike and Kemi Badenoch's a bit mean. I think the criticism by the gutter press is rather unfair and have sympathy for the poor woman.
It’s a bad headline, but also, a mendacious one. The trust got an asset equivalent in value to the sum that it paid.
Yep.
I'm with Davey on this one.
That's where I am leaning too.
Is this just centrist Dads or is it possible that out there beyond Tory rant media and X there is some understanding and sympathy?
Well ordinarily, yes. But given Angela's a) hectoring on the subject of tax evoision, and b) Angela's keenness to stick the boot in when it is on the other foot, she's almost uniquely difficult to feel sorry for.
I saw the 10 o'clock news. I thought Ed Davey's comments very kind and statesmanlike and Kemi Badenoch's a bit mean. I think the criticism by the gutter press is rather unfair and have sympathy for the poor woman.
Have you not seen tonight's front pages
Universal criticism of her across the political spectrum
I saw the 10 o'clock news. I thought Ed Davey's comments very kind and statesmanlike and Kemi Badenoch's a bit mean. I think the criticism by the gutter press is rather unfair and have sympathy for the poor woman.
Have you not seen tonight's front pages
Universal criticism of her across the political spectrum
No advertisement, promotion, entreatment, inducement or related commercial activity in relation to the 25th December shall take place before the 6th November.
Merry Christmas. My tree will be up on Nov 1st as always
Well, you win the prize as first person to wish me a merry christmas.
I saw the 10 o'clock news. I thought Ed Davey's comments very kind and statesmanlike and Kemi Badenoch's a bit mean. I think the criticism by the gutter press is rather unfair and have sympathy for the poor woman.
I’d have far more sympathy if she hadn’t attacked others so relentlessly over the years for the same thing.
I saw the 10 o'clock news. I thought Ed Davey's comments very kind and statesmanlike and Kemi Badenoch's a bit mean. I think the criticism by the gutter press is rather unfair and have sympathy for the poor woman.
Have you not seen tonight's front pages
Universal criticism of her across the political spectrum
No advertisement, promotion, entreatment, inducement or related commercial activity in relation to the 25th December shall take place before the 6th November.
Merry Christmas. My tree will be up on Nov 1st as always
Well, you win the prize as first person to wish me a merry christmas.
You need to hide from me on Jan 7th as its my Whamageddon wrecking day
It’s a bad headline, but also, a mendacious one. The trust got an asset equivalent in value to the sum that it paid.
Yep.
I'm with Davey on this one.
That's where I am leaning too.
Im not
The problem here is that the transaction was clearly in the interests of Angela Rayner as it allowed her to buy a new property in Hove. Was it in the interests of the son though?
It seems to me there is a clear conflict of interest here between Angela Rayner's role as trustee and the fact she was also selling her portion of the house to the trust. It would be interesting to know if the trust took independent financial advice before making the purchase.
Shoosmiths were also trustees - they’re listed on the land registry deeds. It seems very unlikely that they would allow the Raynor’s to do anything that would be detrimental to the trust set up for the benefit of their son, given that they would have to sign off on every transaction surely?
I saw the 10 o'clock news. I thought Ed Davey's comments very kind and statesmanlike and Kemi Badenoch's a bit mean. I think the criticism by the gutter press is rather unfair and have sympathy for the poor woman.
Have you not seen tonight's front pages
Universal criticism of her across the political spectrum
I saw the 10 o'clock news. I thought Ed Davey's comments very kind and statesmanlike and Kemi Badenoch's a bit mean. I think the criticism by the gutter press is rather unfair and have sympathy for the poor woman.
Have you not seen tonight's front pages
Universal criticism of her across the political spectrum
She wont survive tomorrow Big G. Im expecting the resignation letter in the morning
Not sure but time will tell
Im obviously batshit crazy and ever bullish on Labour agony but on this im quietly optimistic I might have scored When im wrong i'll be seething all day
I saw the 10 o'clock news. I thought Ed Davey's comments very kind and statesmanlike and Kemi Badenoch's a bit mean. I think the criticism by the gutter press is rather unfair and have sympathy for the poor woman.
Have you not seen tonight's front pages
Universal criticism of her across the political spectrum
I saw the 10 o'clock news. I thought Ed Davey's comments very kind and statesmanlike and Kemi Badenoch's a bit mean. I think the criticism by the gutter press is rather unfair and have sympathy for the poor woman.
Have you not seen tonight's front pages
Universal criticism of her across the political spectrum
Fecking hell, Ocado have sent me a Xmas shopping email:
"If you’re already dreaming of your first mince pie, you’ve come to the right place. We’ve opened our Christmas Shop so you can start stocking up on all the things that make the festive season magical for everyone..."
These people need stopping.
When is the law going to be changed to outlaw this?
One of my local pubs has just installed both Christmas and Halloween adverts, including those ridiculous Christmas trolls with the long white beards.
Perfectly logical.
Christmas Parties can make a significant chunk of business for a pub - and many of them will be booked by early November. Planning takes time, for all concerned, and you want to advertise in advance of plans being made not miss the boat.
Have you never had a lead time in your work? Its just the same in hospitality, leave it to the last minute and that could drive you out of business.
No advertisement, promotion, entreatment, inducement or related commercial activity in relation to the 25th December shall take place before the 6th November.
Well, it's more succinct than the Ordnance which banned Christmas outright at least. And what the heck is Whitsuntide?
All Festivals and Holy Days abolished,; Time allotted for Recreation.
Forasmuch as the Feasts of the Nativity of Christ, Easter and Whitsuntide, and other Festivals commonly called Holy-Dayes, have been heretofore superstitiously used and observed Be it Ordained, by the Lords and Commons in Parliament assembled, That the said Feast of the Nativity of Christ, Easter and Whitsuntide, and all other Festival dayes, commonly called Holy-dayes, be no longer observed as Festivals or Holy-dayes within this Kingdome of England and Dominion of Wales, any Law, Statute, Custome, Constitution, or Cannon to the contrary in any wise notwithstanding: And to the end that there may be a convenient time allotted to Scholars, Apprentices, and other Servants for their Recreation: Be it Ordained by the authority aforesaid, That all Scholars, Apprentices, and other Servants shall, with the leave and approbation of their Masters respectively first had and obtained, have such convenient reasonable Recreation and Relaxation from their constant and ordinary Labours on every second Tuesday in the moneth throughout the year, as formerly they have used to have on such aforesaid Festivals, commonly called Holy-dayes. And that Masters of all Scholars, Apprentices, and Servants, shall grant unto them respectively such time for their Recreations on the aforesaid second Tuesdaies in every moneth, as they may conveniently spare from their extraordinary and necessary Services and Occasions. And it is further Ordained by the said Lords and Commons, That if any difference shall arise between any Master and Servant concerning the Liberty hereby granted, the next Justice of the Peace shall have power to hear and determine the same.
I saw the 10 o'clock news. I thought Ed Davey's comments very kind and statesmanlike and Kemi Badenoch's a bit mean. I think the criticism by the gutter press is rather unfair and have sympathy for the poor woman.
I’d have far more sympathy if she hadn’t attacked others so relentlessly over the years for the same thing.
Hypocrisy of the highest order.
Standard fare for the Labour party and shovel loads of it from their apologists on here.
No advertisement, promotion, entreatment, inducement or related commercial activity in relation to the 25th December shall take place before the 6th November.
Well, it's more succinct than the Ordnance which banned Christmas outright at least. And what the heck is Whitsuntide?
All Festivals and Holy Days abolished,; Time allotted for Recreation.
Forasmuch as the Feasts of the Nativity of Christ, Easter and Whitsuntide, and other Festivals commonly called Holy-Dayes, have been heretofore superstitiously used and observed Be it Ordained, by the Lords and Commons in Parliament assembled, That the said Feast of the Nativity of Christ, Easter and Whitsuntide, and all other Festival dayes, commonly called Holy-dayes, be no longer observed as Festivals or Holy-dayes within this Kingdome of England and Dominion of Wales, any Law, Statute, Custome, Constitution, or Cannon to the contrary in any wise notwithstanding: And to the end that there may be a convenient time allotted to Scholars, Apprentices, and other Servants for their Recreation: Be it Ordained by the authority aforesaid, That all Scholars, Apprentices, and other Servants shall, with the leave and approbation of their Masters respectively first had and obtained, have such convenient reasonable Recreation and Relaxation from their constant and ordinary Labours on every second Tuesday in the moneth throughout the year, as formerly they have used to have on such aforesaid Festivals, commonly called Holy-dayes. And that Masters of all Scholars, Apprentices, and Servants, shall grant unto them respectively such time for their Recreations on the aforesaid second Tuesdaies in every moneth, as they may conveniently spare from their extraordinary and necessary Services and Occasions. And it is further Ordained by the said Lords and Commons, That if any difference shall arise between any Master and Servant concerning the Liberty hereby granted, the next Justice of the Peace shall have power to hear and determine the same.
No advertisement, promotion, entreatment, inducement or related commercial activity in relation to the 25th December shall take place before the 6th November.
Well, it's more succinct than the Ordnance which banned Christmas outright at least. And what the heck is Whitsuntide?
All Festivals and Holy Days abolished,; Time allotted for Recreation.
Forasmuch as the Feasts of the Nativity of Christ, Easter and Whitsuntide, and other Festivals commonly called Holy-Dayes, have been heretofore superstitiously used and observed Be it Ordained, by the Lords and Commons in Parliament assembled, That the said Feast of the Nativity of Christ, Easter and Whitsuntide, and all other Festival dayes, commonly called Holy-dayes, be no longer observed as Festivals or Holy-dayes within this Kingdome of England and Dominion of Wales, any Law, Statute, Custome, Constitution, or Cannon to the contrary in any wise notwithstanding: And to the end that there may be a convenient time allotted to Scholars, Apprentices, and other Servants for their Recreation: Be it Ordained by the authority aforesaid, That all Scholars, Apprentices, and other Servants shall, with the leave and approbation of their Masters respectively first had and obtained, have such convenient reasonable Recreation and Relaxation from their constant and ordinary Labours on every second Tuesday in the moneth throughout the year, as formerly they have used to have on such aforesaid Festivals, commonly called Holy-dayes. And that Masters of all Scholars, Apprentices, and Servants, shall grant unto them respectively such time for their Recreations on the aforesaid second Tuesdaies in every moneth, as they may conveniently spare from their extraordinary and necessary Services and Occasions. And it is further Ordained by the said Lords and Commons, That if any difference shall arise between any Master and Servant concerning the Liberty hereby granted, the next Justice of the Peace shall have power to hear and determine the same.
Forget Whitsuntide, what does it have to say about Holibobs?
I saw the 10 o'clock news. I thought Ed Davey's comments very kind and statesmanlike and Kemi Badenoch's a bit mean. I think the criticism by the gutter press is rather unfair and have sympathy for the poor woman.
Have you not seen tonight's front pages
Universal criticism of her across the political spectrum
No advertisement, promotion, entreatment, inducement or related commercial activity in relation to the 25th December shall take place before the 6th November.
Can I make a small amendment? Can we push it back to after the Wednesday after Rememberance Sunday?
No advertisement, promotion, entreatment, inducement or related commercial activity in relation to the 25th December shall take place before the 6th November.
I'd put it back until after the 11th/Remembrance Sunday. Rather incongruous to have Xmas decorations out during the poppy season.
It’s a bad headline, but also, a mendacious one. The trust got an asset equivalent in value to the sum that it paid.
Yep.
I'm with Davey on this one.
That's where I am leaning too.
Im not
The problem here is that the transaction was clearly in the interests of Angela Rayner as it allowed her to buy a new property in Hove. Was it in the interests of the son though?
It seems to me there is a clear conflict of interest here between Angela Rayner's role as trustee and the fact she was also selling her portion of the house to the trust. It would be interesting to know if the trust took independent financial advice before making the purchase.
Shoosmiths were also trustees - they’re listed on the land registry deeds. It seems very unlikely that they would allow the Raynor’s to do anything that would be detrimental to the trust set up for the benefit of their son, given that they would have to sign off on every transaction surely?
The house was almost certainly adapted, too, and familiar to the child. Important to avoid any change.
Fecking hell, Ocado have sent me a Xmas shopping email:
"If you’re already dreaming of your first mince pie, you’ve come to the right place. We’ve opened our Christmas Shop so you can start stocking up on all the things that make the festive season magical for everyone..."
These people need stopping.
When is the law going to be changed to outlaw this?
One of my local pubs has just installed both Christmas and Halloween adverts, including those ridiculous Christmas trolls with the long white beards.
Got sent my Shipwrecked Mariners' Society Christmas cards catalogue about 20 days ago. Some nice ones, it must be said.
I saw the 10 o'clock news. I thought Ed Davey's comments very kind and statesmanlike and Kemi Badenoch's a bit mean. I think the criticism by the gutter press is rather unfair and have sympathy for the poor woman.
I’d have far more sympathy if she hadn’t attacked others so relentlessly over the years for the same thing.
Hypocrisy of the highest order.
Standard fare for the Labour party and shovel loads of it from their apologists on here.
"But we're the good guys!"
Once you convince yourself of that, you can justify any behaviour.
A Gazette editor just texted me to say he's run into a TV personality in NYC, in a studio
She's not very well known now, but she was once really quite famous. Older PB-ers, ie 87% of us, will definitely know her
Anyway the subject moved on to ME, because she said she'd read my stuff, and did the editor know that she and me went on a date? The editor said No, so she explained how the date went (not very well, I seemed "troubled"). She told my editor how she'd researched me before, so she knew what to expect, but still found me "unexpected"
Here is the kicker. I don't remember this date. It clearly happened (why would she make this up??) but I do not remember a date. With a fairly famous TV presenter. I must have been so off my tits on drugs it goet erased in the mess
Was it Judith Chalmers?
I was infatuated with Anna Ford (in a fairly pure way) when an adolescent. It sort of intensified when I learned she was the wife/widow of Mark Boxer.
Yeah, but did you go on a date with Anna Ford, when you were so fucked up on heroin you didn't even realise it was a date, and then you forgot it anyway?
No, nor with Judith. I did catch a glimpse of the fragrant Anna in Chelsea in the mid 80s but by then the fire had died down.
To unite two strands when I was just out of uni and drifting I worked as a security person on a big Picasso exhibition at the Hayward, just STEM me plus a load of art students were the team, fish out of water, and one evening there was a private viewing for the incredibly crushable Francesca Annis, and she smiled at me, straight at me.
Good one, Francesca was a stunner. Diana Quick was another one of that generation.
Welcome to the old farts’ nostalgic letching club.
Francesca unwittingly provided one of the funniest moment of my schooldays, in a screening of Polanski’s Macbeth to 1500 15/16 year old boys. In the infamous nude sleepwalking scene 99% misheard “Oh, what a sigh is there” as “Oh what a size they are”. PMSL and found a new found respect for literature.
No advertisement, promotion, entreatment, inducement or related commercial activity in relation to the 25th December shall take place before the 6th November.
Well, it's more succinct than the Ordnance which banned Christmas outright at least. And what the heck is Whitsuntide?
All Festivals and Holy Days abolished,; Time allotted for Recreation.
Forasmuch as the Feasts of the Nativity of Christ, Easter and Whitsuntide, and other Festivals commonly called Holy-Dayes, have been heretofore superstitiously used and observed Be it Ordained, by the Lords and Commons in Parliament assembled, That the said Feast of the Nativity of Christ, Easter and Whitsuntide, and all other Festival dayes, commonly called Holy-dayes, be no longer observed as Festivals or Holy-dayes within this Kingdome of England and Dominion of Wales, any Law, Statute, Custome, Constitution, or Cannon to the contrary in any wise notwithstanding: And to the end that there may be a convenient time allotted to Scholars, Apprentices, and other Servants for their Recreation: Be it Ordained by the authority aforesaid, That all Scholars, Apprentices, and other Servants shall, with the leave and approbation of their Masters respectively first had and obtained, have such convenient reasonable Recreation and Relaxation from their constant and ordinary Labours on every second Tuesday in the moneth throughout the year, as formerly they have used to have on such aforesaid Festivals, commonly called Holy-dayes. And that Masters of all Scholars, Apprentices, and Servants, shall grant unto them respectively such time for their Recreations on the aforesaid second Tuesdaies in every moneth, as they may conveniently spare from their extraordinary and necessary Services and Occasions. And it is further Ordained by the said Lords and Commons, That if any difference shall arise between any Master and Servant concerning the Liberty hereby granted, the next Justice of the Peace shall have power to hear and determine the same.
No advertisement, promotion, entreatment, inducement or related commercial activity in relation to the 25th December shall take place before the 6th November.
Well, it's more succinct than the Ordnance which banned Christmas outright at least. And what the heck is Whitsuntide?
All Festivals and Holy Days abolished,; Time allotted for Recreation.
Forasmuch as the Feasts of the Nativity of Christ, Easter and Whitsuntide, and other Festivals commonly called Holy-Dayes, have been heretofore superstitiously used and observed Be it Ordained, by the Lords and Commons in Parliament assembled, That the said Feast of the Nativity of Christ, Easter and Whitsuntide, and all other Festival dayes, commonly called Holy-dayes, be no longer observed as Festivals or Holy-dayes within this Kingdome of England and Dominion of Wales, any Law, Statute, Custome, Constitution, or Cannon to the contrary in any wise notwithstanding: And to the end that there may be a convenient time allotted to Scholars, Apprentices, and other Servants for their Recreation: Be it Ordained by the authority aforesaid, That all Scholars, Apprentices, and other Servants shall, with the leave and approbation of their Masters respectively first had and obtained, have such convenient reasonable Recreation and Relaxation from their constant and ordinary Labours on every second Tuesday in the moneth throughout the year, as formerly they have used to have on such aforesaid Festivals, commonly called Holy-dayes. And that Masters of all Scholars, Apprentices, and Servants, shall grant unto them respectively such time for their Recreations on the aforesaid second Tuesdaies in every moneth, as they may conveniently spare from their extraordinary and necessary Services and Occasions. And it is further Ordained by the said Lords and Commons, That if any difference shall arise between any Master and Servant concerning the Liberty hereby granted, the next Justice of the Peace shall have power to hear and determine the same.
Whitsuntide is the week of Whit Sunday/Pentecost
And of weddings.
Used to be a tax reason for that in the old days, though I forget what it was.
Fecking hell, Ocado have sent me a Xmas shopping email:
"If you’re already dreaming of your first mince pie, you’ve come to the right place. We’ve opened our Christmas Shop so you can start stocking up on all the things that make the festive season magical for everyone..."
These people need stopping.
When is the law going to be changed to outlaw this?
One of my local pubs has just installed both Christmas and Halloween adverts, including those ridiculous Christmas trolls with the long white beards.
Got sent my Shipwrecked Mariners' Society Christmas cards catalogue about 20 days ago. Some nice ones, it must be said.
Fecking hell, Ocado have sent me a Xmas shopping email:
"If you’re already dreaming of your first mince pie, you’ve come to the right place. We’ve opened our Christmas Shop so you can start stocking up on all the things that make the festive season magical for everyone..."
These people need stopping.
When is the law going to be changed to outlaw this?
One of my local pubs has just installed both Christmas and Halloween adverts, including those ridiculous Christmas trolls with the long white beards.
Got sent my Shipwrecked Mariners' Society Christmas cards catalogue about 20 days ago. Some nice ones, it must be said.
Is there no end to it.
That will happen when we get the bumf and ads earlier and earlier and finally a year in advance ...
No advertisement, promotion, entreatment, inducement or related commercial activity in relation to the 25th December shall take place before the 6th November.
Well, it's more succinct than the Ordnance which banned Christmas outright at least. And what the heck is Whitsuntide?
All Festivals and Holy Days abolished,; Time allotted for Recreation.
Forasmuch as the Feasts of the Nativity of Christ, Easter and Whitsuntide, and other Festivals commonly called Holy-Dayes, have been heretofore superstitiously used and observed Be it Ordained, by the Lords and Commons in Parliament assembled, That the said Feast of the Nativity of Christ, Easter and Whitsuntide, and all other Festival dayes, commonly called Holy-dayes, be no longer observed as Festivals or Holy-dayes within this Kingdome of England and Dominion of Wales, any Law, Statute, Custome, Constitution, or Cannon to the contrary in any wise notwithstanding: And to the end that there may be a convenient time allotted to Scholars, Apprentices, and other Servants for their Recreation: Be it Ordained by the authority aforesaid, That all Scholars, Apprentices, and other Servants shall, with the leave and approbation of their Masters respectively first had and obtained, have such convenient reasonable Recreation and Relaxation from their constant and ordinary Labours on every second Tuesday in the moneth throughout the year, as formerly they have used to have on such aforesaid Festivals, commonly called Holy-dayes. And that Masters of all Scholars, Apprentices, and Servants, shall grant unto them respectively such time for their Recreations on the aforesaid second Tuesdaies in every moneth, as they may conveniently spare from their extraordinary and necessary Services and Occasions. And it is further Ordained by the said Lords and Commons, That if any difference shall arise between any Master and Servant concerning the Liberty hereby granted, the next Justice of the Peace shall have power to hear and determine the same.
Whitsuntide is the week of Whit Sunday/Pentecost
And of weddings.
Used to be a tax reason for that in the old days, though I forget what it was.
It was more because it was one of the holiday weeks when you were free from working the Lords fields wasn't it?
I saw the 10 o'clock news. I thought Ed Davey's comments very kind and statesmanlike and Kemi Badenoch's a bit mean. I think the criticism by the gutter press is rather unfair and have sympathy for the poor woman.
Have you not seen tonight's front pages
Universal criticism of her across the political spectrum
I saw the 10 o'clock news. I thought Ed Davey's comments very kind and statesmanlike and Kemi Badenoch's a bit mean. I think the criticism by the gutter press is rather unfair and have sympathy for the poor woman.
Have you not seen tonight's front pages
Universal criticism of her across the political spectrum
I saw the 10 o'clock news. I thought Ed Davey's comments very kind and statesmanlike and Kemi Badenoch's a bit mean. I think the criticism by the gutter press is rather unfair and have sympathy for the poor woman.
I’d have far more sympathy if she hadn’t attacked others so relentlessly over the years for the same thing.
Hypocrisy of the highest order.
Standard fare for the Labour party and shovel loads of it from their apologists on here.
"But we're the good guys!"
Once you convince yourself of that, you can justify any behaviour.
Sadly, an all too common attitude. (And not one confined to any particular colour.)
I saw the 10 o'clock news. I thought Ed Davey's comments very kind and statesmanlike and Kemi Badenoch's a bit mean. I think the criticism by the gutter press is rather unfair and have sympathy for the poor woman.
Have you not seen tonight's front pages
Universal criticism of her across the political spectrum
I saw the 10 o'clock news. I thought Ed Davey's comments very kind and statesmanlike and Kemi Badenoch's a bit mean. I think the criticism by the gutter press is rather unfair and have sympathy for the poor woman.
Have you not seen tonight's front pages
Universal criticism of her across the political spectrum
I saw the 10 o'clock news. I thought Ed Davey's comments very kind and statesmanlike and Kemi Badenoch's a bit mean. I think the criticism by the gutter press is rather unfair and have sympathy for the poor woman.
Have you not seen tonight's front pages
Universal criticism of her across the political spectrum
She wont survive tomorrow Big G. Im expecting the resignation letter in the morning
Not sure but time will tell
She's not resigning tomorrow.
If not tomorrow, I think she eventually will. I suspect when the commissioners investigation hits Starmer’s desk, the salient point is it was not the trust who gave her that advice. And that would be the trigger for the resignation.
It smells a bit fishy to me. She is claiming when she sold up her bit of the trust she thought it meant she could buy a first home (lower tax) rather than it being classed as second home (extra tax). But has subsequently after taxes paid found out that understanding was wrong.
The people who advised her how much tax she should pay, had she informed them clear enough of her circumstances? for example did the tax advice come from those who set her trust up, in which case yes, they knew all the details, there’s an argument those advisors should have known better - which the Lib Dem’s seemed to have swallowed - in which case she gets off safe as houses and largely unscathed.
But if the advice was from someone else, a solicitor involved with the flat purchase, who when they gave advice didn’t know details of the trust arrangement, or there was bits of info she should have given them but failed to, then resign as an MP and off to jail she goes, because Ang hasn’t got where she is today, that close to being a British Prime Minister, without being smart rather than that stupid.
I am suddenly getting endless targeted messages from the British Embassy in Cairo. Started approximately around my 5th pint and has escalated from there.
No advertisement, promotion, entreatment, inducement or related commercial activity in relation to the 25th December shall take place before the 6th November.
Well, it's more succinct than the Ordnance which banned Christmas outright at least. And what the heck is Whitsuntide?
All Festivals and Holy Days abolished,; Time allotted for Recreation.
Forasmuch as the Feasts of the Nativity of Christ, Easter and Whitsuntide, and other Festivals commonly called Holy-Dayes, have been heretofore superstitiously used and observed Be it Ordained, by the Lords and Commons in Parliament assembled, That the said Feast of the Nativity of Christ, Easter and Whitsuntide, and all other Festival dayes, commonly called Holy-dayes, be no longer observed as Festivals or Holy-dayes within this Kingdome of England and Dominion of Wales, any Law, Statute, Custome, Constitution, or Cannon to the contrary in any wise notwithstanding: And to the end that there may be a convenient time allotted to Scholars, Apprentices, and other Servants for their Recreation: Be it Ordained by the authority aforesaid, That all Scholars, Apprentices, and other Servants shall, with the leave and approbation of their Masters respectively first had and obtained, have such convenient reasonable Recreation and Relaxation from their constant and ordinary Labours on every second Tuesday in the moneth throughout the year, as formerly they have used to have on such aforesaid Festivals, commonly called Holy-dayes. And that Masters of all Scholars, Apprentices, and Servants, shall grant unto them respectively such time for their Recreations on the aforesaid second Tuesdaies in every moneth, as they may conveniently spare from their extraordinary and necessary Services and Occasions. And it is further Ordained by the said Lords and Commons, That if any difference shall arise between any Master and Servant concerning the Liberty hereby granted, the next Justice of the Peace shall have power to hear and determine the same.
Whitsuntide is the week of Whit Sunday/Pentecost
And of weddings.
Used to be a tax reason for that in the old days, though I forget what it was.
Something to do with married women's tax allowance.
I guess whitsun was the first long weekend for a nice marriage with a bit of decent weather after the start of tax year?
Whitsun was quite big when I was a young child in the North.
I remember the local town had a parade and as a child I was roped in to walk through the town with other kids holding some kind of banner. We got a smart new shirt for the day. There were treats. In the afternoon there was a fete at the local school with all sorts of games and stalls and more treats.
I am suddenly getting endless targeted messages from the British Embassy in Cairo. Started approximately around my 5th pint and has escalated from there.
OT but I actually got charged £8 for a pint this evening and have retreated to my local in disgust for my £4.50 pale ale. This pub also comes with an obese beagle called Nigel and three people I recognise, so feeling much better.
No advertisement, promotion, entreatment, inducement or related commercial activity in relation to the 25th December shall take place before the 6th November.
Can I make a small amendment? Can we push it back to after the Wednesday after Rememberance Sunday?
In Edinburgh’s Princes Street, there is usually only two or three days from Remembrance Sunday before the crosses and the Garden of Remembrance is cleared away to make way for the Christmas Village and ferris wheel. Always seemed to be in a disrespectful rush to bow down to Mammon.
This is ridiculous - you can find the official gov.uk guidance on higher rate stamp duty for second home purchases in two clicks from googling 'stamp duty rules' where it says
If any of you will own, or part own more than one residential property worth £40,000 or more, you will have to pay the higher rates on your new purchase (unless there is another reason why the higher rates do not apply).
Include any residential property that:
is owned on behalf of children under the age of 18 (parents are treated as the owners even if the property is held through a trust and they are not the trustees) you have an interest in as the beneficiary of a trust Include your current home, if you still own it at the end of the day you buy your new home.
This is ridiculous - you can find the official gov.uk guidance on higher rate stamp duty for second home purchases in two clicks from googling 'stamp duty rules' where it says
If any of you will own, or part own more than one residential property worth £40,000 or more, you will have to pay the higher rates on your new purchase (unless there is another reason why the higher rates do not apply).
Include any residential property that:
is owned on behalf of children under the age of 18 (parents are treated as the owners even if the property is held through a trust and they are not the trustees) you have an interest in as the beneficiary of a trust Include your current home, if you still own it at the end of the day you buy your new home.
'Expert opinion, complicated tax blah blah blah'
She can fuck right off
Based on what you know, is it clear to you it was a second home? What other home did she own?
The trust thing that was set up, that she thought she had completely withdrawn from and no longer counted for her (or that’s what she’s claiming she understood it based on advice.) is it still a crime if it happened based on someone else’s guidance from whom you sought how to do such things right, and whose answers you trusted? If the bad advice was from the trust who already had all the details of her particular position so she couldn’t have misled them in anyway.
But reading her body language, it tells me I completely agree with you - she knew she was on the make, and that she has to resign from government when the fast track investigation concludes. Do we have eta for the commissioners report?
But after resigning from Government, perhaps for the first time, what standard should she then be held to? Will you call for her to resign as an MP as well over this? when others have made strong political comebacks after very similar things, after time on back benches. Because if she doesn’t stand down as MP, and survives the election in May 2029, we know she will be back on the front bench because it’s what always happens. Ultimately can those who set themselves up as White Knights really be held to sterner punishments than everybody else? 🤷♀️
This is ridiculous - you can find the official gov.uk guidance on higher rate stamp duty for second home purchases in two clicks from googling 'stamp duty rules' where it says
If any of you will own, or part own more than one residential property worth £40,000 or more, you will have to pay the higher rates on your new purchase (unless there is another reason why the higher rates do not apply).
Include any residential property that:
is owned on behalf of children under the age of 18 (parents are treated as the owners even if the property is held through a trust and they are not the trustees) you have an interest in as the beneficiary of a trust Include your current home, if you still own it at the end of the day you buy your new home.
'Expert opinion, complicated tax blah blah blah'
She can fuck right off
Based on what you know, is it clear to you it was a second home? What other home did she own?
*Include any residential property that:
is owned on behalf of children under the age of 18 (parents are treated as the owners even if the property is held through a trust and they are not the trustees)*
She knows she is her sons parent and that the property is held by a trust
Less than one minutes googling. Its not remotely complicated.
This is ridiculous - you can find the official gov.uk guidance on higher rate stamp duty for second home purchases in two clicks from googling 'stamp duty rules' where it says
If any of you will own, or part own more than one residential property worth £40,000 or more, you will have to pay the higher rates on your new purchase (unless there is another reason why the higher rates do not apply).
Include any residential property that:
is owned on behalf of children under the age of 18 (parents are treated as the owners even if the property is held through a trust and they are not the trustees) you have an interest in as the beneficiary of a trust Include your current home, if you still own it at the end of the day you buy your new home.
'Expert opinion, complicated tax blah blah blah'
She can fuck right off
Based on what you know, is it clear to you it was a second home? What other home did she own?
*Include any residential property that:
is owned on behalf of children under the age of 18 (parents are treated as the owners even if the property is held through a trust and they are not the trustees)*
She knows she is her sons parent and that the property is held by a trust
Less than one minutes googling. Its not remotely complicated.
Commission report early next week
Errr.
"unless there is another reason why the higher rates do not apply"
How do you know that doesn't include the reason "is Angela Rayner"?
Front pages across the board look terrible for Angela Rayner. The Daily Express and Daily Mail are also criticising Keir Starmer for not sacking her which will definitely pile on the pressure for her to go sooner rather than later because her political difficulties are now becoming a political crisis for the PM and the Labour Government ahead of their party conference and a very difficult Autumn budget.
This is ridiculous - you can find the official gov.uk guidance on higher rate stamp duty for second home purchases in two clicks from googling 'stamp duty rules' where it says
If any of you will own, or part own more than one residential property worth £40,000 or more, you will have to pay the higher rates on your new purchase (unless there is another reason why the higher rates do not apply).
Include any residential property that:
is owned on behalf of children under the age of 18 (parents are treated as the owners even if the property is held through a trust and they are not the trustees) you have an interest in as the beneficiary of a trust Include your current home, if you still own it at the end of the day you buy your new home.
'Expert opinion, complicated tax blah blah blah'
She can fuck right off
One thing she immediately needs to do is ask her solicitors to pay the penalty interest on its way from HMRC
This is ridiculous - you can find the official gov.uk guidance on higher rate stamp duty for second home purchases in two clicks from googling 'stamp duty rules' where it says
If any of you will own, or part own more than one residential property worth £40,000 or more, you will have to pay the higher rates on your new purchase (unless there is another reason why the higher rates do not apply).
Include any residential property that:
is owned on behalf of children under the age of 18 (parents are treated as the owners even if the property is held through a trust and they are not the trustees) you have an interest in as the beneficiary of a trust Include your current home, if you still own it at the end of the day you buy your new home.
'Expert opinion, complicated tax blah blah blah'
She can fuck right off
Based on what you know, is it clear to you it was a second home? What other home did she own?
The trust thing that was set up, that she thought she had completely withdrawn from and no longer counted for her (or that’s what she’s claiming she understood it based on advice.) is it still a crime if it happened based on someone else’s guidance from whom you sought how to do such things right, and whose answers you trusted? If the bad advice was from the trust who already had all the details of her particular position so she couldn’t have misled them in anyway.
But reading her body language, it tells me I completely agree with you - she knew she was on the make, and that she has to resign from government when the fast track investigation concludes. Do we have eta for the commissioners report?
But after resigning from Government, perhaps for the first time, what standard should she then be held to? Will you call for her to resign as an MP as well over this? when others have made strong political comebacks after very similar things, after time on back benches. Because if she doesn’t stand down as MP, and survives the election in May 2029, we know she will be back on the front bench because it’s what always happens. Ultimately can those who set themselves up as White Knights really be held to sterner punishments than everybody else? 🤷♀️
I think losing Rayner would be a major blow to a Starmer government that is already dead in the water. For all her faults she is one of the most dynamic and charismatic of Labour's front benches, very much her own person and not cut from the identi-cut PPE/SPAD/MP cloth. She may well have to go, and has certainly blotted her copy book very badly.
A couple of thoughts though:
Of our 650 MPs a great number have 2 or more homes, including Farage, Sunak, Jenrick etc etc, and even more notably the King and other members of the Royal family.. There may well be further casualties to this sort of scrutiny over property affairs. Rayner's came to light because of her visibility as a politician and role in charge of housing, but I bet there are a number of others looking anxiously over their property assets and tax affairs. There are some professions and domestic situations that multiple properties are a requirement rather than an extravagance.
Secondly, this entire mess has arisen from the differential treatment of second properties, and the anomalies arising from that. Stamp Duty used to be a transaction tax, but now is being used to punish second home owners, landlords etc as a way of distorting the market in favour of a perceived policy goal. Council tax replaced the Poll Tax (and that in turn replaced the Rates) and was originally designed to fund local services. At one time Council Tax had a discount for second homes (I think on the grounds that as part time residents, owners were light users of local services) but now are charged 2 or more times the rate as a way of punishing owners. If properties were merely taxed on the capital value rather than as a way of punishing second home owners then none of these issues would have arisen.
Front pages across the board look terrible for Angela Rayner. The Daily Express and Daily Mail are also criticising Keir Starmer for not sacking her which will definitely pile on the pressure for her to go sooner rather than later because her political difficulties are now becoming a political crisis for the PM and the Labour Government ahead of their party conference and a very difficult Autumn budget.
Well, when you accuse your opponents of being scum for doing less...
This is ridiculous - you can find the official gov.uk guidance on higher rate stamp duty for second home purchases in two clicks from googling 'stamp duty rules' where it says
If any of you will own, or part own more than one residential property worth £40,000 or more, you will have to pay the higher rates on your new purchase (unless there is another reason why the higher rates do not apply).
Include any residential property that:
is owned on behalf of children under the age of 18 (parents are treated as the owners even if the property is held through a trust and they are not the trustees) you have an interest in as the beneficiary of a trust Include your current home, if you still own it at the end of the day you buy your new home.
'Expert opinion, complicated tax blah blah blah'
She can fuck right off
Based on what you know, is it clear to you it was a second home? What other home did she own?
The trust thing that was set up, that she thought she had completely withdrawn from and no longer counted for her (or that’s what she’s claiming she understood it based on advice.) is it still a crime if it happened based on someone else’s guidance from whom you sought how to do such things right, and whose answers you trusted? If the bad advice was from the trust who already had all the details of her particular position so she couldn’t have misled them in anyway.
But reading her body language, it tells me I completely agree with you - she knew she was on the make, and that she has to resign from government when the fast track investigation concludes. Do we have eta for the commissioners report?
But after resigning from Government, perhaps for the first time, what standard should she then be held to? Will you call for her to resign as an MP as well over this? when others have made strong political comebacks after very similar things, after time on back benches. Because if she doesn’t stand down as MP, and survives the election in May 2029, we know she will be back on the front bench because it’s what always happens. Ultimately can those who set themselves up as White Knights really be held to sterner punishments than everybody else? 🤷♀️
I think losing Rayner would be a major blow to a Starmer government that is already dead in the water. For all her faults she is one of the most dynamic and charismatic of Labour's front benches, very much her own person and not cut from the identi-cut PPE/SPAD/MP cloth. She may well have to go, and has certainly blotted her copy book very badly.
A couple of thoughts though:
Of our 650 MPs a great number have 2 or more homes, including Farage, Sunak, Jenrick etc etc, and even more notably the King and other members of the Royal family.. There may well be further casualties to this sort of scrutiny over property affairs. Rayner's came to light because of her visibility as a politician and role in charge of housing, but I bet there are a number of others looking anxiously over their property assets and tax affairs. There are some professions and domestic situations that multiple properties are a requirement rather than an extravagance.
Secondly, this entire mess has arisen from the differential treatment of second properties, and the anomalies arising from that. Stamp Duty used to be a transaction tax, but now is being used to punish second home owners, landlords etc as a way of distorting the market in favour of a perceived policy goal. Council tax replaced the Poll Tax (and that in turn replaced the Rates) and was originally designed to fund local services. At one time Council Tax had a discount for second homes (I think on the grounds that as part time residents, owners were light users of local services) but now are charged 2 or more times the rate as a way of punishing owners. If properties were merely taxed on the capital value rather than as a way of punishing second home owners then none of these issues would have arisen.
"Of our 650 MPs a great number have 2 or more homes, including Farage, Sunak, Jenrick etc etc, and even more notably the King and other members of the Royal family"
That's going to be the case, as being an MP is an unusual job as it has two separate work locations, often very far apart: their constituency and London. An MP having a home in both locations makes sense, and buying a second home even more sense if you expect to be MP for more than one term.
"There may well be further casualties to this sort of scrutiny over property affairs."
There may well be; but that's a rather silly defence of Rayner. It's also been Labour MPs who have had property-related issues over the recent period, especially as poor (at best) landlords.
Rayner did wrong, and has (eventually) admitted it. That's either incompetence on her part, which does not reflect well on her, or deliberate. The fact she is a woman and has kids is irrelevant.
Has she even decided from which of her three roles she’s going to resign?
As a minister is probably the most likely, as an MP is unlikely unless convicted of fraud.
The difficult one is as the elected deputy leader of the party. Does she resign from that and force Labour Conference to deal with an election?
As it says on his Wiki page:
"Mandelson initially thought he could weather the press storm, but had to resign when it became clear that the Prime Minister thought nothing else would clear the air..."
This is ridiculous - you can find the official gov.uk guidance on higher rate stamp duty for second home purchases in two clicks from googling 'stamp duty rules' where it says
If any of you will own, or part own more than one residential property worth £40,000 or more, you will have to pay the higher rates on your new purchase (unless there is another reason why the higher rates do not apply).
Include any residential property that:
is owned on behalf of children under the age of 18 (parents are treated as the owners even if the property is held through a trust and they are not the trustees) you have an interest in as the beneficiary of a trust Include your current home, if you still own it at the end of the day you buy your new home.
'Expert opinion, complicated tax blah blah blah'
She can fuck right off
Based on what you know, is it clear to you it was a second home? What other home did she own?
The trust thing that was set up, that she thought she had completely withdrawn from and no longer counted for her (or that’s what she’s claiming she understood it based on advice.) is it still a crime if it happened based on someone else’s guidance from whom you sought how to do such things right, and whose answers you trusted? If the bad advice was from the trust who already had all the details of her particular position so she couldn’t have misled them in anyway.
But reading her body language, it tells me I completely agree with you - she knew she was on the make, and that she has to resign from government when the fast track investigation concludes. Do we have eta for the commissioners report?
But after resigning from Government, perhaps for the first time, what standard should she then be held to? Will you call for her to resign as an MP as well over this? when others have made strong political comebacks after very similar things, after time on back benches. Because if she doesn’t stand down as MP, and survives the election in May 2029, we know she will be back on the front bench because it’s what always happens. Ultimately can those who set themselves up as White Knights really be held to sterner punishments than everybody else? 🤷♀️
I think losing Rayner would be a major blow to a Starmer government that is already dead in the water. For all her faults she is one of the most dynamic and charismatic of Labour's front benches, very much her own person and not cut from the identi-cut PPE/SPAD/MP cloth. She may well have to go, and has certainly blotted her copy book very badly.
A couple of thoughts though:
Of our 650 MPs a great number have 2 or more homes, including Farage, Sunak, Jenrick etc etc, and even more notably the King and other members of the Royal family.. There may well be further casualties to this sort of scrutiny over property affairs. Rayner's came to light because of her visibility as a politician and role in charge of housing, but I bet there are a number of others looking anxiously over their property assets and tax affairs. There are some professions and domestic situations that multiple properties are a requirement rather than an extravagance.
Secondly, this entire mess has arisen from the differential treatment of second properties, and the anomalies arising from that. Stamp Duty used to be a transaction tax, but now is being used to punish second home owners, landlords etc as a way of distorting the market in favour of a perceived policy goal. Council tax replaced the Poll Tax (and that in turn replaced the Rates) and was originally designed to fund local services. At one time Council Tax had a discount for second homes (I think on the grounds that as part time residents, owners were light users of local services) but now are charged 2 or more times the rate as a way of punishing owners. If properties were merely taxed on the capital value rather than as a way of punishing second home owners then none of these issues would have arisen.
"Of our 650 MPs a great number have 2 or more homes, including Farage, Sunak, Jenrick etc etc, and even more notably the King and other members of the Royal family"
That's going to be the case, as being an MP is an unusual job as it has two separate work locations, often very far apart: their constituency and London. An MP having a home in both locations makes sense, and buying a second home even more sense if you expect to be MP for more than one term.
"There may well be further casualties to this sort of scrutiny over property affairs."
There may well be; but that's a rather silly defence of Rayner. It's also been Labour MPs who have had property-related issues over the recent period, especially as poor (at best) landlords.
Rayner did wrong, and has (eventually) admitted it. That's either incompetence on her part, which does not reflect well on her, or deliberate. The fact she is a woman and has kids is irrelevant.
Sure, but there are a number of other jobs than MPs that require people to be in 2 places, with a family home in one city and a work address in another. Royals, Newspaper editors, business leaders, Mayors, actors, media performers, journalists all may well have reasonable need for multiple properties. We saw some years ago that many MPs flipped houses for expense purposes. How likely is it that they have done so for tax purposes too?
When the dogs get released in such a case they don't just bite the intended target, and there's nothing more British than getting hot under the collar about hypocrisy. Rayner won't be the only casualty of this.
Has she even decided from which of her three roles she’s going to resign?
As a minister is probably the most likely, as an MP is unlikely unless convicted of fraud.
The difficult one is as the elected deputy leader of the party. Does she resign from that and force Labour Conference to deal with an election?
As it says on his Wiki page:
"Mandelson initially thought he could weather the press storm, but had to resign when it became clear that the Prime Minister thought nothing else would clear the air..."
And he had done nothing wrong.
He had done nothing *illegal.* Securing a private loan from a friend against a property with a mortgage on it already was a bit stupid.
On topic, although Rayner may survive given her position isn't in Starmer's gift, she's now out of the running for the top job. All Labour supporters will hear is 'trust fund' 'failed to pay tax' and that is an absolute killer.
This is ridiculous - you can find the official gov.uk guidance on higher rate stamp duty for second home purchases in two clicks from googling 'stamp duty rules' where it says
If any of you will own, or part own more than one residential property worth £40,000 or more, you will have to pay the higher rates on your new purchase (unless there is another reason why the higher rates do not apply).
Include any residential property that:
is owned on behalf of children under the age of 18 (parents are treated as the owners even if the property is held through a trust and they are not the trustees) you have an interest in as the beneficiary of a trust Include your current home, if you still own it at the end of the day you buy your new home.
'Expert opinion, complicated tax blah blah blah'
She can fuck right off
Based on what you know, is it clear to you it was a second home? What other home did she own?
The trust thing that was set up, that she thought she had completely withdrawn from and no longer counted for her (or that’s what she’s claiming she understood it based on advice.) is it still a crime if it happened based on someone else’s guidance from whom you sought how to do such things right, and whose answers you trusted? If the bad advice was from the trust who already had all the details of her particular position so she couldn’t have misled them in anyway.
But reading her body language, it tells me I completely agree with you - she knew she was on the make, and that she has to resign from government when the fast track investigation concludes. Do we have eta for the commissioners report?
But after resigning from Government, perhaps for the first time, what standard should she then be held to? Will you call for her to resign as an MP as well over this? when others have made strong political comebacks after very similar things, after time on back benches. Because if she doesn’t stand down as MP, and survives the election in May 2029, we know she will be back on the front bench because it’s what always happens. Ultimately can those who set themselves up as White Knights really be held to sterner punishments than everybody else? 🤷♀️
I think losing Rayner would be a major blow to a Starmer government that is already dead in the water. For all her faults she is one of the most dynamic and charismatic of Labour's front benches, very much her own person and not cut from the identi-cut PPE/SPAD/MP cloth. She may well have to go, and has certainly blotted her copy book very badly.
A couple of thoughts though:
Of our 650 MPs a great number have 2 or more homes, including Farage, Sunak, Jenrick etc etc, and even more notably the King and other members of the Royal family.. There may well be further casualties to this sort of scrutiny over property affairs. Rayner's came to light because of her visibility as a politician and role in charge of housing, but I bet there are a number of others looking anxiously over their property assets and tax affairs. There are some professions and domestic situations that multiple properties are a requirement rather than an extravagance.
Secondly, this entire mess has arisen from the differential treatment of second properties, and the anomalies arising from that. Stamp Duty used to be a transaction tax, but now is being used to punish second home owners, landlords etc as a way of distorting the market in favour of a perceived policy goal. Council tax replaced the Poll Tax (and that in turn replaced the Rates) and was originally designed to fund local services. At one time Council Tax had a discount for second homes (I think on the grounds that as part time residents, owners were light users of local services) but now are charged 2 or more times the rate as a way of punishing owners. If properties were merely taxed on the capital value rather than as a way of punishing second home owners then none of these issues would have arisen.
"Of our 650 MPs a great number have 2 or more homes, including Farage, Sunak, Jenrick etc etc, and even more notably the King and other members of the Royal family"
That's going to be the case, as being an MP is an unusual job as it has two separate work locations, often very far apart: their constituency and London. An MP having a home in both locations makes sense, and buying a second home even more sense if you expect to be MP for more than one term.
"There may well be further casualties to this sort of scrutiny over property affairs."
There may well be; but that's a rather silly defence of Rayner. It's also been Labour MPs who have had property-related issues over the recent period, especially as poor (at best) landlords.
Rayner did wrong, and has (eventually) admitted it. That's either incompetence on her part, which does not reflect well on her, or deliberate. The fact she is a woman and has kids is irrelevant.
Sure, but there are a number of other jobs than MPs that require people to be in 2 places, with a family home in one city and a work address in another. Royals, Newspaper editors, business leaders, Mayors, actors, media performers, journalists all may well have reasonable need for multiple properties. We saw some years ago that many MPs flipped houses for expense purposes. How likely is it that they have done so for tax purposes too?
When the dogs get released in such a case they don't just bite the intended target, and there's nothing more British than getting hot under the collar about hypocrisy. Rayner won't be the only casualty of this.
That line would be much easier to justify if the property in question were not in Brighton.
Again, there may be logical reasons for it, but it's not her constituency or her workplace, and nothing says 'tough working class northerner' like a flat in Brighton.
On topic, although Rayner may survive given her position isn't in Starmer's gift, she's now out of the running for the top job. All Labour supporters will hear is 'trust fund' 'failed to pay tax' and that is an absolute killer.
Certainly her chances are much diminished.
Labour's prospects of electoral survival just got a lot worse, and all because of their punitive approach to second homes.
This is ridiculous - you can find the official gov.uk guidance on higher rate stamp duty for second home purchases in two clicks from googling 'stamp duty rules' where it says
If any of you will own, or part own more than one residential property worth £40,000 or more, you will have to pay the higher rates on your new purchase (unless there is another reason why the higher rates do not apply).
Include any residential property that:
is owned on behalf of children under the age of 18 (parents are treated as the owners even if the property is held through a trust and they are not the trustees) you have an interest in as the beneficiary of a trust Include your current home, if you still own it at the end of the day you buy your new home.
'Expert opinion, complicated tax blah blah blah'
She can fuck right off
Based on what you know, is it clear to you it was a second home? What other home did she own?
The trust thing that was set up, that she thought she had completely withdrawn from and no longer counted for her (or that’s what she’s claiming she understood it based on advice.) is it still a crime if it happened based on someone else’s guidance from whom you sought how to do such things right, and whose answers you trusted? If the bad advice was from the trust who already had all the details of her particular position so she couldn’t have misled them in anyway.
But reading her body language, it tells me I completely agree with you - she knew she was on the make, and that she has to resign from government when the fast track investigation concludes. Do we have eta for the commissioners report?
But after resigning from Government, perhaps for the first time, what standard should she then be held to? Will you call for her to resign as an MP as well over this? when others have made strong political comebacks after very similar things, after time on back benches. Because if she doesn’t stand down as MP, and survives the election in May 2029, we know she will be back on the front bench because it’s what always happens. Ultimately can those who set themselves up as White Knights really be held to sterner punishments than everybody else? 🤷♀️
I think losing Rayner would be a major blow to a Starmer government that is already dead in the water. For all her faults she is one of the most dynamic and charismatic of Labour's front benches, very much her own person and not cut from the identi-cut PPE/SPAD/MP cloth. She may well have to go, and has certainly blotted her copy book very badly.
A couple of thoughts though:
Of our 650 MPs a great number have 2 or more homes, including Farage, Sunak, Jenrick etc etc, and even more notably the King and other members of the Royal family.. There may well be further casualties to this sort of scrutiny over property affairs. Rayner's came to light because of her visibility as a politician and role in charge of housing, but I bet there are a number of others looking anxiously over their property assets and tax affairs. There are some professions and domestic situations that multiple properties are a requirement rather than an extravagance.
Secondly, this entire mess has arisen from the differential treatment of second properties, and the anomalies arising from that. Stamp Duty used to be a transaction tax, but now is being used to punish second home owners, landlords etc as a way of distorting the market in favour of a perceived policy goal. Council tax replaced the Poll Tax (and that in turn replaced the Rates) and was originally designed to fund local services. At one time Council Tax had a discount for second homes (I think on the grounds that as part time residents, owners were light users of local services) but now are charged 2 or more times the rate as a way of punishing owners. If properties were merely taxed on the capital value rather than as a way of punishing second home owners then none of these issues would have arisen.
"Of our 650 MPs a great number have 2 or more homes, including Farage, Sunak, Jenrick etc etc, and even more notably the King and other members of the Royal family"
That's going to be the case, as being an MP is an unusual job as it has two separate work locations, often very far apart: their constituency and London. An MP having a home in both locations makes sense, and buying a second home even more sense if you expect to be MP for more than one term.
"There may well be further casualties to this sort of scrutiny over property affairs."
There may well be; but that's a rather silly defence of Rayner. It's also been Labour MPs who have had property-related issues over the recent period, especially as poor (at best) landlords.
Rayner did wrong, and has (eventually) admitted it. That's either incompetence on her part, which does not reflect well on her, or deliberate. The fact she is a woman and has kids is irrelevant.
Sure, but there are a number of other jobs than MPs that require people to be in 2 places, with a family home in one city and a work address in another. Royals, Newspaper editors, business leaders, Mayors, actors, media performers, journalists all may well have reasonable need for multiple properties. We saw some years ago that many MPs flipped houses for expense purposes. How likely is it that they have done so for tax purposes too?
When the dogs get released in such a case they don't just bite the intended target, and there's nothing more British than getting hot under the collar about hypocrisy. Rayner won't be the only casualty of this.
That line would be much easier to justify if the property in question were not in Brighton.
Again, there may be logical reasons for it, but it's not her constituency or her workplace, and nothing says 'tough working class northerner' like a flat in Brighton.
Her new partner lives there doesn't he? Hence her spending weekends there when her ex-husband is in the Ashton house with the kids.
This is ridiculous - you can find the official gov.uk guidance on higher rate stamp duty for second home purchases in two clicks from googling 'stamp duty rules' where it says
If any of you will own, or part own more than one residential property worth £40,000 or more, you will have to pay the higher rates on your new purchase (unless there is another reason why the higher rates do not apply).
Include any residential property that:
is owned on behalf of children under the age of 18 (parents are treated as the owners even if the property is held through a trust and they are not the trustees) you have an interest in as the beneficiary of a trust Include your current home, if you still own it at the end of the day you buy your new home.
'Expert opinion, complicated tax blah blah blah'
She can fuck right off
Based on what you know, is it clear to you it was a second home? What other home did she own?
The trust thing that was set up, that she thought she had completely withdrawn from and no longer counted for her (or that’s what she’s claiming she understood it based on advice.) is it still a crime if it happened based on someone else’s guidance from whom you sought how to do such things right, and whose answers you trusted? If the bad advice was from the trust who already had all the details of her particular position so she couldn’t have misled them in anyway.
But reading her body language, it tells me I completely agree with you - she knew she was on the make, and that she has to resign from government when the fast track investigation concludes. Do we have eta for the commissioners report?
But after resigning from Government, perhaps for the first time, what standard should she then be held to? Will you call for her to resign as an MP as well over this? when others have made strong political comebacks after very similar things, after time on back benches. Because if she doesn’t stand down as MP, and survives the election in May 2029, we know she will be back on the front bench because it’s what always happens. Ultimately can those who set themselves up as White Knights really be held to sterner punishments than everybody else? 🤷♀️
I think losing Rayner would be a major blow to a Starmer government that is already dead in the water. For all her faults she is one of the most dynamic and charismatic of Labour's front benches, very much her own person and not cut from the identi-cut PPE/SPAD/MP cloth. She may well have to go, and has certainly blotted her copy book very badly.
A couple of thoughts though:
Of our 650 MPs a great number have 2 or more homes, including Farage, Sunak, Jenrick etc etc, and even more notably the King and other members of the Royal family.. There may well be further casualties to this sort of scrutiny over property affairs. Rayner's came to light because of her visibility as a politician and role in charge of housing, but I bet there are a number of others looking anxiously over their property assets and tax affairs. There are some professions and domestic situations that multiple properties are a requirement rather than an extravagance.
Secondly, this entire mess has arisen from the differential treatment of second properties, and the anomalies arising from that. Stamp Duty used to be a transaction tax, but now is being used to punish second home owners, landlords etc as a way of distorting the market in favour of a perceived policy goal. Council tax replaced the Poll Tax (and that in turn replaced the Rates) and was originally designed to fund local services. At one time Council Tax had a discount for second homes (I think on the grounds that as part time residents, owners were light users of local services) but now are charged 2 or more times the rate as a way of punishing owners. If properties were merely taxed on the capital value rather than as a way of punishing second home owners then none of these issues would have arisen.
"Of our 650 MPs a great number have 2 or more homes, including Farage, Sunak, Jenrick etc etc, and even more notably the King and other members of the Royal family"
That's going to be the case, as being an MP is an unusual job as it has two separate work locations, often very far apart: their constituency and London. An MP having a home in both locations makes sense, and buying a second home even more sense if you expect to be MP for more than one term.
"There may well be further casualties to this sort of scrutiny over property affairs."
There may well be; but that's a rather silly defence of Rayner. It's also been Labour MPs who have had property-related issues over the recent period, especially as poor (at best) landlords.
Rayner did wrong, and has (eventually) admitted it. That's either incompetence on her part, which does not reflect well on her, or deliberate. The fact she is a woman and has kids is irrelevant.
Sure, but there are a number of other jobs than MPs that require people to be in 2 places, with a family home in one city and a work address in another. Royals, Newspaper editors, business leaders, Mayors, actors, media performers, journalists all may well have reasonable need for multiple properties. We saw some years ago that many MPs flipped houses for expense purposes. How likely is it that they have done so for tax purposes too?
When the dogs get released in such a case they don't just bite the intended target, and there's nothing more British than getting hot under the collar about hypocrisy. Rayner won't be the only casualty of this.
That line would be much easier to justify if the property in question were not in Brighton.
Again, there may be logical reasons for it, but it's not her constituency or her workplace, and nothing says 'tough working class northerner' like a flat in Brighton.
Her new partner lives there doesn't he? Hence her spending weekends there when her ex-husband is in the Ashton house with the kids.
Yes, that's the 'logical reason' but it's not going to cut across much. In particular I don't think it's going to play well in Ashton.
A Gazette editor just texted me to say he's run into a TV personality in NYC, in a studio
She's not very well known now, but she was once really quite famous. Older PB-ers, ie 87% of us, will definitely know her
Anyway the subject moved on to ME, because she said she'd read my stuff, and did the editor know that she and me went on a date? The editor said No, so she explained how the date went (not very well, I seemed "troubled"). She told my editor how she'd researched me before, so she knew what to expect, but still found me "unexpected"
Here is the kicker. I don't remember this date. It clearly happened (why would she make this up??) but I do not remember a date. With a fairly famous TV presenter. I must have been so off my tits on drugs it goet erased in the mess
Was it Judith Chalmers?
I was infatuated with Anna Ford (in a fairly pure way) when an adolescent. It sort of intensified when I learned she was the wife/widow of Mark Boxer.
Yeah, but did you go on a date with Anna Ford, when you were so fucked up on heroin you didn't even realise it was a date, and then you forgot it anyway?
No, nor with Judith. I did catch a glimpse of the fragrant Anna in Chelsea in the mid 80s but by then the fire had died down.
To unite two strands when I was just out of uni and drifting I worked as a security person on a big Picasso exhibition at the Hayward, just STEM me plus a load of art students were the team, fish out of water, and one evening there was a private viewing for the incredibly crushable Francesca Annis, and she smiled at me, straight at me.
Good one, Francesca was a stunner. Diana Quick was another one of that generation.
Welcome to the old farts’ nostalgic letching club.
IMHO I feel very sorry for her reading that Telegraph article.
She had a horrific pregnancy/birth and
Sources close to the Deputy Prime Minister claim she was given three separate pieces of legal advice from a conveyancer and two experts in trust law, all of which suggested the amount of stamp duty she paid was correct.
But the Telegraph revelations last week had prompted her to re-examine that advice and to seek out a leading tax barrister, understood to Jonathan Peacock KC. He is thought to have reported back on Monday that the extra stamp duty should, in fact, have been paid.
Sources suggested that had she waited a few months longer, until her son’s 18th birthday, she would not have owed the extra stamp duty because her ownership would have passed entirely to him.
As I said earlier. It seems she took legal advice and it was shit.
Who amongst can throw a stone on that basis?
Or she spoke to some bloke in a pub and took his advice. She will have to pony up the evidence in writing re what she told them and what they gave as guidance.
IMHO I feel very sorry for her reading that Telegraph article.
She had a horrific pregnancy/birth and
Sources close to the Deputy Prime Minister claim she was given three separate pieces of legal advice from a conveyancer and two experts in trust law, all of which suggested the amount of stamp duty she paid was correct.
But the Telegraph revelations last week had prompted her to re-examine that advice and to seek out a leading tax barrister, understood to Jonathan Peacock KC. He is thought to have reported back on Monday that the extra stamp duty should, in fact, have been paid.
Sources suggested that had she waited a few months longer, until her son’s 18th birthday, she would not have owed the extra stamp duty because her ownership would have passed entirely to him.
As I said earlier. It seems she took legal advice and it was shit.
This is ridiculous - you can find the official gov.uk guidance on higher rate stamp duty for second home purchases in two clicks from googling 'stamp duty rules' where it says
If any of you will own, or part own more than one residential property worth £40,000 or more, you will have to pay the higher rates on your new purchase (unless there is another reason why the higher rates do not apply).
Include any residential property that:
is owned on behalf of children under the age of 18 (parents are treated as the owners even if the property is held through a trust and they are not the trustees) you have an interest in as the beneficiary of a trust Include your current home, if you still own it at the end of the day you buy your new home.
'Expert opinion, complicated tax blah blah blah'
She can fuck right off
Based on what you know, is it clear to you it was a second home? What other home did she own?
The trust thing that was set up, that she thought she had completely withdrawn from and no longer counted for her (or that’s what she’s claiming she understood it based on advice.) is it still a crime if it happened based on someone else’s guidance from whom you sought how to do such things right, and whose answers you trusted? If the bad advice was from the trust who already had all the details of her particular position so she couldn’t have misled them in anyway.
But reading her body language, it tells me I completely agree with you - she knew she was on the make, and that she has to resign from government when the fast track investigation concludes. Do we have eta for the commissioners report?
But after resigning from Government, perhaps for the first time, what standard should she then be held to? Will you call for her to resign as an MP as well over this? when others have made strong political comebacks after very similar things, after time on back benches. Because if she doesn’t stand down as MP, and survives the election in May 2029, we know she will be back on the front bench because it’s what always happens. Ultimately can those who set themselves up as White Knights really be held to sterner punishments than everybody else? 🤷♀️
I think losing Rayner would be a major blow to a Starmer government that is already dead in the water. For all her faults she is one of the most dynamic and charismatic of Labour's front benches, very much her own person and not cut from the identi-cut PPE/SPAD/MP cloth. She may well have to go, and has certainly blotted her copy book very badly.
A couple of thoughts though:
Of our 650 MPs a great number have 2 or more homes, including Farage, Sunak, Jenrick etc etc, and even more notably the King and other members of the Royal family.. There may well be further casualties to this sort of scrutiny over property affairs. Rayner's came to light because of her visibility as a politician and role in charge of housing, but I bet there are a number of others looking anxiously over their property assets and tax affairs. There are some professions and domestic situations that multiple properties are a requirement rather than an extravagance.
Secondly, this entire mess has arisen from the differential treatment of second properties, and the anomalies arising from that. Stamp Duty used to be a transaction tax, but now is being used to punish second home owners, landlords etc as a way of distorting the market in favour of a perceived policy goal. Council tax replaced the Poll Tax (and that in turn replaced the Rates) and was originally designed to fund local services. At one time Council Tax had a discount for second homes (I think on the grounds that as part time residents, owners were light users of local services) but now are charged 2 or more times the rate as a way of punishing owners. If properties were merely taxed on the capital value rather than as a way of punishing second home owners then none of these issues would have arisen.
"Of our 650 MPs a great number have 2 or more homes, including Farage, Sunak, Jenrick etc etc, and even more notably the King and other members of the Royal family"
That's going to be the case, as being an MP is an unusual job as it has two separate work locations, often very far apart: their constituency and London. An MP having a home in both locations makes sense, and buying a second home even more sense if you expect to be MP for more than one term.
"There may well be further casualties to this sort of scrutiny over property affairs."
There may well be; but that's a rather silly defence of Rayner. It's also been Labour MPs who have had property-related issues over the recent period, especially as poor (at best) landlords.
Rayner did wrong, and has (eventually) admitted it. That's either incompetence on her part, which does not reflect well on her, or deliberate. The fact she is a woman and has kids is irrelevant.
Sure, but there are a number of other jobs than MPs that require people to be in 2 places, with a family home in one city and a work address in another. Royals, Newspaper editors, business leaders, Mayors, actors, media performers, journalists all may well have reasonable need for multiple properties. We saw some years ago that many MPs flipped houses for expense purposes. How likely is it that they have done so for tax purposes too?
When the dogs get released in such a case they don't just bite the intended target, and there's nothing more British than getting hot under the collar about hypocrisy. Rayner won't be the only casualty of this.
How is a 'newspaper editor' required to work in two places to the extent an MP is? They may not like to live in London, or whichever city their publication is from, and I can imagine the job requires much travel, but that is personal choice. Again with a mayor, or an actor, or journalist.
No advertisement, promotion, entreatment, inducement or related commercial activity in relation to the 25th December shall take place before the 6th November.
Well, it's more succinct than the Ordnance which banned Christmas outright at least. And what the heck is Whitsuntide?
All Festivals and Holy Days abolished,; Time allotted for Recreation.
Forasmuch as the Feasts of the Nativity of Christ, Easter and Whitsuntide, and other Festivals commonly called Holy-Dayes, have been heretofore superstitiously used and observed Be it Ordained, by the Lords and Commons in Parliament assembled, That the said Feast of the Nativity of Christ, Easter and Whitsuntide, and all other Festival dayes, commonly called Holy-dayes, be no longer observed as Festivals or Holy-dayes within this Kingdome of England and Dominion of Wales, any Law, Statute, Custome, Constitution, or Cannon to the contrary in any wise notwithstanding: And to the end that there may be a convenient time allotted to Scholars, Apprentices, and other Servants for their Recreation: Be it Ordained by the authority aforesaid, That all Scholars, Apprentices, and other Servants shall, with the leave and approbation of their Masters respectively first had and obtained, have such convenient reasonable Recreation and Relaxation from their constant and ordinary Labours on every second Tuesday in the moneth throughout the year, as formerly they have used to have on such aforesaid Festivals, commonly called Holy-dayes. And that Masters of all Scholars, Apprentices, and Servants, shall grant unto them respectively such time for their Recreations on the aforesaid second Tuesdaies in every moneth, as they may conveniently spare from their extraordinary and necessary Services and Occasions. And it is further Ordained by the said Lords and Commons, That if any difference shall arise between any Master and Servant concerning the Liberty hereby granted, the next Justice of the Peace shall have power to hear and determine the same.
It’s White Sunday or Pentecost. I think it is 40 days after Easter?
Did they ever get to the bottom of who profited from the vast amounts of money spent on dodgy material purchased during Covid. And the VIP preferences. Or is it all forgotten while the next media circus rolls into town.
Not only have the government been clueless and visionless in the first year in government, we haven't half had a fair number of scandals. Its like Carry On Conservatives, not as Starmer promised a new page.
This is ridiculous - you can find the official gov.uk guidance on higher rate stamp duty for second home purchases in two clicks from googling 'stamp duty rules' where it says
If any of you will own, or part own more than one residential property worth £40,000 or more, you will have to pay the higher rates on your new purchase (unless there is another reason why the higher rates do not apply).
Include any residential property that:
is owned on behalf of children under the age of 18 (parents are treated as the owners even if the property is held through a trust and they are not the trustees) you have an interest in as the beneficiary of a trust Include your current home, if you still own it at the end of the day you buy your new home.
'Expert opinion, complicated tax blah blah blah'
She can fuck right off
Based on what you know, is it clear to you it was a second home? What other home did she own?
The trust thing that was set up, that she thought she had completely withdrawn from and no longer counted for her (or that’s what she’s claiming she understood it based on advice.) is it still a crime if it happened based on someone else’s guidance from whom you sought how to do such things right, and whose answers you trusted? If the bad advice was from the trust who already had all the details of her particular position so she couldn’t have misled them in anyway.
But reading her body language, it tells me I completely agree with you - she knew she was on the make, and that she has to resign from government when the fast track investigation concludes. Do we have eta for the commissioners report?
But after resigning from Government, perhaps for the first time, what standard should she then be held to? Will you call for her to resign as an MP as well over this? when others have made strong political comebacks after very similar things, after time on back benches. Because if she doesn’t stand down as MP, and survives the election in May 2029, we know she will be back on the front bench because it’s what always happens. Ultimately can those who set themselves up as White Knights really be held to sterner punishments than everybody else? 🤷♀️
I think losing Rayner would be a major blow to a Starmer government that is already dead in the water. For all her faults she is one of the most dynamic and charismatic of Labour's front benches, very much her own person and not cut from the identi-cut PPE/SPAD/MP cloth. She may well have to go, and has certainly blotted her copy book very badly.
A couple of thoughts though:
Of our 650 MPs a great number have 2 or more homes, including Farage, Sunak, Jenrick etc etc, and even more notably the King and other members of the Royal family.. There may well be further casualties to this sort of scrutiny over property affairs. Rayner's came to light because of her visibility as a politician and role in charge of housing, but I bet there are a number of others looking anxiously over their property assets and tax affairs. There are some professions and domestic situations that multiple properties are a requirement rather than an extravagance.
Secondly, this entire mess has arisen from the differential treatment of second properties, and the anomalies arising from that. Stamp Duty used to be a transaction tax, but now is being used to punish second home owners, landlords etc as a way of distorting the market in favour of a perceived policy goal. Council tax replaced the Poll Tax (and that in turn replaced the Rates) and was originally designed to fund local services. At one time Council Tax had a discount for second homes (I think on the grounds that as part time residents, owners were light users of local services) but now are charged 2 or more times the rate as a way of punishing owners. If properties were merely taxed on the capital value rather than as a way of punishing second home owners then none of these issues would have arisen.
"Of our 650 MPs a great number have 2 or more homes, including Farage, Sunak, Jenrick etc etc, and even more notably the King and other members of the Royal family"
That's going to be the case, as being an MP is an unusual job as it has two separate work locations, often very far apart: their constituency and London. An MP having a home in both locations makes sense, and buying a second home even more sense if you expect to be MP for more than one term.
"There may well be further casualties to this sort of scrutiny over property affairs."
There may well be; but that's a rather silly defence of Rayner. It's also been Labour MPs who have had property-related issues over the recent period, especially as poor (at best) landlords.
Rayner did wrong, and has (eventually) admitted it. That's either incompetence on her part, which does not reflect well on her, or deliberate. The fact she is a woman and has kids is irrelevant.
Sure, but there are a number of other jobs than MPs that require people to be in 2 places, with a family home in one city and a work address in another. Royals, Newspaper editors, business leaders, Mayors, actors, media performers, journalists all may well have reasonable need for multiple properties. We saw some years ago that many MPs flipped houses for expense purposes. How likely is it that they have done so for tax purposes too?
When the dogs get released in such a case they don't just bite the intended target, and there's nothing more British than getting hot under the collar about hypocrisy. Rayner won't be the only casualty of this.
That line would be much easier to justify if the property in question were not in Brighton.
Again, there may be logical reasons for it, but it's not her constituency or her workplace, and nothing says 'tough working class northerner' like a flat in Brighton.
Her new partner lives there doesn't he? Hence her spending weekends there when her ex-husband is in the Ashton house with the kids.
Yes, that's the 'logical reason' but it's not going to cut across much. In particular I don't think it's going to play well in Ashton.
Well, I'm off to work so I can find out exactly how it's going to play in Ashton.
This is ridiculous - you can find the official gov.uk guidance on higher rate stamp duty for second home purchases in two clicks from googling 'stamp duty rules' where it says
If any of you will own, or part own more than one residential property worth £40,000 or more, you will have to pay the higher rates on your new purchase (unless there is another reason why the higher rates do not apply).
Include any residential property that:
is owned on behalf of children under the age of 18 (parents are treated as the owners even if the property is held through a trust and they are not the trustees) you have an interest in as the beneficiary of a trust Include your current home, if you still own it at the end of the day you buy your new home.
'Expert opinion, complicated tax blah blah blah'
She can fuck right off
Based on what you know, is it clear to you it was a second home? What other home did she own?
The trust thing that was set up, that she thought she had completely withdrawn from and no longer counted for her (or that’s what she’s claiming she understood it based on advice.) is it still a crime if it happened based on someone else’s guidance from whom you sought how to do such things right, and whose answers you trusted? If the bad advice was from the trust who already had all the details of her particular position so she couldn’t have misled them in anyway.
But reading her body language, it tells me I completely agree with you - she knew she was on the make, and that she has to resign from government when the fast track investigation concludes. Do we have eta for the commissioners report?
But after resigning from Government, perhaps for the first time, what standard should she then be held to? Will you call for her to resign as an MP as well over this? when others have made strong political comebacks after very similar things, after time on back benches. Because if she doesn’t stand down as MP, and survives the election in May 2029, we know she will be back on the front bench because it’s what always happens. Ultimately can those who set themselves up as White Knights really be held to sterner punishments than everybody else? 🤷♀️
I think losing Rayner would be a major blow to a Starmer government that is already dead in the water. For all her faults she is one of the most dynamic and charismatic of Labour's front benches, very much her own person and not cut from the identi-cut PPE/SPAD/MP cloth. She may well have to go, and has certainly blotted her copy book very badly.
A couple of thoughts though:
Of our 650 MPs a great number have 2 or more homes, including Farage, Sunak, Jenrick etc etc, and even more notably the King and other members of the Royal family.. There may well be further casualties to this sort of scrutiny over property affairs. Rayner's came to light because of her visibility as a politician and role in charge of housing, but I bet there are a number of others looking anxiously over their property assets and tax affairs. There are some professions and domestic situations that multiple properties are a requirement rather than an extravagance.
Secondly, this entire mess has arisen from the differential treatment of second properties, and the anomalies arising from that. Stamp Duty used to be a transaction tax, but now is being used to punish second home owners, landlords etc as a way of distorting the market in favour of a perceived policy goal. Council tax replaced the Poll Tax (and that in turn replaced the Rates) and was originally designed to fund local services. At one time Council Tax had a discount for second homes (I think on the grounds that as part time residents, owners were light users of local services) but now are charged 2 or more times the rate as a way of punishing owners. If properties were merely taxed on the capital value rather than as a way of punishing second home owners then none of these issues would have arisen.
"Of our 650 MPs a great number have 2 or more homes, including Farage, Sunak, Jenrick etc etc, and even more notably the King and other members of the Royal family"
That's going to be the case, as being an MP is an unusual job as it has two separate work locations, often very far apart: their constituency and London. An MP having a home in both locations makes sense, and buying a second home even more sense if you expect to be MP for more than one term.
"There may well be further casualties to this sort of scrutiny over property affairs."
There may well be; but that's a rather silly defence of Rayner. It's also been Labour MPs who have had property-related issues over the recent period, especially as poor (at best) landlords.
Rayner did wrong, and has (eventually) admitted it. That's either incompetence on her part, which does not reflect well on her, or deliberate. The fact she is a woman and has kids is irrelevant.
Sure, but there are a number of other jobs than MPs that require people to be in 2 places, with a family home in one city and a work address in another. Royals, Newspaper editors, business leaders, Mayors, actors, media performers, journalists all may well have reasonable need for multiple properties. We saw some years ago that many MPs flipped houses for expense purposes. How likely is it that they have done so for tax purposes too?
When the dogs get released in such a case they don't just bite the intended target, and there's nothing more British than getting hot under the collar about hypocrisy. Rayner won't be the only casualty of this.
That line would be much easier to justify if the property in question were not in Brighton.
Again, there may be logical reasons for it, but it's not her constituency or her workplace, and nothing says 'tough working class northerner' like a flat in Brighton.
North Sea gas is FOUR times less carbon intensive than the imported LNG that we are now increasingly using.
Guardian
As I understand it the challenge is getting enough gas from the North Sea at a viable price. ReFUK want to replace wind with gas tomorrow. Even if we manage to extract more gas we will be importing more.
It's Ed Miliband who is subsidising new build CCGT plants. Plus blue hydrogen. Locking in demand for imported LNG.
I am aware of that. My point is that Reform want to switch the windfarms off *today*. Which means a huge uptick in gas burning which means a huge uptick in imports.
I don't think Rayner will resign. There will be a list of excuses and in the end Labour will not only brazen it out but can give examples of the Tories doing the same (Patel as an example).
No advertisement, promotion, entreatment, inducement or related commercial activity in relation to the 25th December shall take place before the 6th November.
Well, it's more succinct than the Ordnance which banned Christmas outright at least. And what the heck is Whitsuntide?
All Festivals and Holy Days abolished,; Time allotted for Recreation.
Forasmuch as the Feasts of the Nativity of Christ, Easter and Whitsuntide, and other Festivals commonly called Holy-Dayes, have been heretofore superstitiously used and observed Be it Ordained, by the Lords and Commons in Parliament assembled, That the said Feast of the Nativity of Christ, Easter and Whitsuntide, and all other Festival dayes, commonly called Holy-dayes, be no longer observed as Festivals or Holy-dayes within this Kingdome of England and Dominion of Wales, any Law, Statute, Custome, Constitution, or Cannon to the contrary in any wise notwithstanding: And to the end that there may be a convenient time allotted to Scholars, Apprentices, and other Servants for their Recreation: Be it Ordained by the authority aforesaid, That all Scholars, Apprentices, and other Servants shall, with the leave and approbation of their Masters respectively first had and obtained, have such convenient reasonable Recreation and Relaxation from their constant and ordinary Labours on every second Tuesday in the moneth throughout the year, as formerly they have used to have on such aforesaid Festivals, commonly called Holy-dayes. And that Masters of all Scholars, Apprentices, and Servants, shall grant unto them respectively such time for their Recreations on the aforesaid second Tuesdaies in every moneth, as they may conveniently spare from their extraordinary and necessary Services and Occasions. And it is further Ordained by the said Lords and Commons, That if any difference shall arise between any Master and Servant concerning the Liberty hereby granted, the next Justice of the Peace shall have power to hear and determine the same.
It’s White Sunday or Pentecost. I think it is 40 days after Easter?
Indeed, we now call it Late May Bank Holiday. Used to be Whitsun.
I don't think Rayner will resign. There will be a list of excuses and in the end Labour will not only brazen it out but can give examples of the Tories doing the same (Patel as an example).
Just to troll Leon, the director of an AI company was on R4 this morning, and still talking about Brexit.
And how it made the UK a less attractive place for them to invest.
I was at an AI business event recently, its not Brexit, the cosensus was first and foremost our backwards culture of being incredibly risk averse when it comes to tech startups. The US mentality is totally different, they will give you £10m over lunch on a hunch. But if you think its bad here, try raising money for tech in somewhere like Germany, its like the stone age.
IMHO I feel very sorry for her reading that Telegraph article.
She had a horrific pregnancy/birth and
Sources close to the Deputy Prime Minister claim she was given three separate pieces of legal advice from a conveyancer and two experts in trust law, all of which suggested the amount of stamp duty she paid was correct.
But the Telegraph revelations last week had prompted her to re-examine that advice and to seek out a leading tax barrister, understood to Jonathan Peacock KC. He is thought to have reported back on Monday that the extra stamp duty should, in fact, have been paid.
Sources suggested that had she waited a few months longer, until her son’s 18th birthday, she would not have owed the extra stamp duty because her ownership would have passed entirely to him.
As I said earlier. It seems she took legal advice and it was shit.
Who amongst can throw a stone on that basis?
*If* she gave them the correct information.
The claim is that multiple experts were consulted and gave wrong advice on multiple things.
I don't think Rayner will resign. There will be a list of excuses and in the end Labour will not only brazen it out but can give examples of the Tories doing the same (Patel as an example).
They have teh brass neck for it for sure but even Starmer must realise it is fatal for him if he lets it drag on.
I don't think Rayner will resign. There will be a list of excuses and in the end Labour will not only brazen it out but can give examples of the Tories doing the same (Patel as an example).
Comments
I think the criticism by the gutter press is rather unfair and have sympathy for the poor woman.
Universal criticism of her across the political spectrum
She may survive but seriously discredited
https://news.sky.com/liveblog-webview/wednesdays-national-newspaper-front-pages-12427754
Im expecting the resignation letter in the morning
Hypocrisy of the highest order.
When im wrong i'll be seething all day
Christmas Parties can make a significant chunk of business for a pub - and many of them will be booked by early November. Planning takes time, for all concerned, and you want to advertise in advance of plans being made not miss the boat.
Have you never had a lead time in your work? Its just the same in hospitality, leave it to the last minute and that could drive you out of business.
All Festivals and Holy Days abolished,; Time allotted for Recreation.
Forasmuch as the Feasts of the Nativity of Christ, Easter and Whitsuntide, and other Festivals commonly called Holy-Dayes, have been heretofore superstitiously used and observed Be it Ordained, by the Lords and Commons in Parliament assembled, That the said Feast of the Nativity of Christ, Easter and Whitsuntide, and all other Festival dayes, commonly called Holy-dayes, be no longer observed as Festivals or Holy-dayes within this Kingdome of England and Dominion of Wales, any Law, Statute, Custome, Constitution, or Cannon to the contrary in any wise notwithstanding: And to the end that there may be a convenient time allotted to Scholars, Apprentices, and other Servants for their Recreation: Be it Ordained by the authority aforesaid, That all Scholars, Apprentices, and other Servants shall, with the leave and approbation of their Masters respectively first had and obtained, have such convenient reasonable Recreation and Relaxation from their constant and ordinary Labours on every second Tuesday in the moneth throughout the year, as formerly they have used to have on such aforesaid Festivals, commonly called Holy-dayes. And that Masters of all Scholars, Apprentices, and Servants, shall grant unto them respectively such time for their Recreations on the aforesaid second Tuesdaies in every moneth, as they may conveniently spare from their extraordinary and necessary Services and Occasions. And it is further Ordained by the said Lords and Commons, That if any difference shall arise between any Master and Servant concerning the Liberty hereby granted, the next Justice of the Peace shall have power to hear and determine the same.
She's the one he fears.
Once you convince yourself of that, you can justify any behaviour.
Let the ranting recommence.
They will be horrible. Brutal.
Meanwhile the leader of the great British Patriotic movement of 2025 is off talking about what a shithole it is
What times
It smells a bit fishy to me. She is claiming when she sold up her bit of the trust she thought it meant she could buy a first home (lower tax) rather than it being classed as second home (extra tax). But has subsequently after taxes paid found out that understanding was wrong.
The people who advised her how much tax she should pay, had she informed them clear enough of her circumstances? for example did the tax advice come from those who set her trust up, in which case yes, they knew all the details, there’s an argument those advisors should have known better - which the Lib Dem’s seemed to have swallowed - in which case she gets off safe as houses and largely unscathed.
But if the advice was from someone else, a solicitor involved with the flat purchase, who when they gave advice didn’t know details of the trust arrangement, or there was bits of info she should have given them but failed to, then resign as an MP and off to jail she goes, because Ang hasn’t got where she is today, that close to being a British Prime Minister, without being smart rather than that stupid.
Correct me where mistaken.
I guess whitsun was the first long weekend for a nice marriage with a bit of decent weather after the start of tax year?
Whitsun was quite big when I was a young child in the North.
I remember the local town had a parade and as a child I was roped in to walk through the town with other kids holding some kind of banner. We got a smart new shirt for the day. There were treats. In the afternoon there was a fete at the local school with all sorts of games and stalls and more treats.
Craig Revel Horwood:
Trump birthday parade in June: 2
China parade in September: 11
If any of you will own, or part own more than one residential property worth £40,000 or more, you will have to pay the higher rates on your new purchase (unless there is another reason why the higher rates do not apply).
Include any residential property that:
is owned on behalf of children under the age of 18 (parents are treated as the owners even if the property is held through a trust and they are not the trustees)
you have an interest in as the beneficiary of a trust
Include your current home, if you still own it at the end of the day you buy your new home.
'Expert opinion, complicated tax blah blah blah'
She can fuck right off
The trust thing that was set up, that she thought she had completely withdrawn from and no longer counted for her (or that’s what she’s claiming she understood it based on advice.) is it still a crime if it happened based on someone else’s guidance from whom you sought how to do such things right, and whose answers you trusted? If the bad advice was from the trust who already had all the details of her particular position so she couldn’t have misled them in anyway.
But reading her body language, it tells me I completely agree with you - she knew she was on the make, and that she has to resign from government when the fast track investigation concludes. Do we have eta for the commissioners report?
But after resigning from Government, perhaps for the first time, what standard should she then be held to? Will you call for her to resign as an MP as well over this? when others have made strong political comebacks after very similar things, after time on back benches. Because if she doesn’t stand down as MP, and survives the election in May 2029, we know she will be back on the front bench because it’s what always happens. Ultimately can those who set themselves up as White Knights really be held to sterner punishments than everybody else? 🤷♀️
is owned on behalf of children under the age of 18 (parents are treated as the owners even if the property is held through a trust and they are not the trustees)*
She knows she is her sons parent and that the property is held by a trust
Less than one minutes googling. Its not remotely complicated.
Commission report early next week
Sorry.
"unless there is another reason why the higher rates do not apply"
How do you know that doesn't include the reason "is Angela Rayner"?
A couple of thoughts though:
Of our 650 MPs a great number have 2 or more homes, including Farage, Sunak, Jenrick etc etc, and even more notably the King and other members of the Royal family.. There may well be further casualties to this sort of scrutiny over property affairs. Rayner's came to light because of her visibility as a politician and role in charge of housing, but I bet there are a number of others looking anxiously over their property assets and tax affairs. There are some professions and domestic situations that multiple properties are a requirement rather than an extravagance.
Secondly, this entire mess has arisen from the differential treatment of second properties, and the anomalies arising from that. Stamp Duty used to be a transaction tax, but now is being used to punish second home owners, landlords etc as a way of distorting the market in favour of a perceived policy goal. Council tax replaced the Poll Tax (and that in turn replaced the Rates) and was originally designed to fund local services. At one time Council Tax had a discount for second homes (I think on the grounds that as part time residents, owners were light users of local services) but now are charged 2 or more times the rate as a way of punishing owners. If properties were merely taxed on the capital value rather than as a way of punishing second home owners then none of these issues would have arisen.
Has she even decided from which of her three roles she’s going to resign?
As a minister is probably the most likely, as an MP is unlikely unless convicted of fraud.
The difficult one is as the elected deputy leader of the party. Does she resign from that and force Labour Conference to deal with an election?
That's going to be the case, as being an MP is an unusual job as it has two separate work locations, often very far apart: their constituency and London. An MP having a home in both locations makes sense, and buying a second home even more sense if you expect to be MP for more than one term.
"There may well be further casualties to this sort of scrutiny over property affairs."
There may well be; but that's a rather silly defence of Rayner. It's also been Labour MPs who have had property-related issues over the recent period, especially as poor (at best) landlords.
Rayner did wrong, and has (eventually) admitted it. That's either incompetence on her part, which does not reflect well on her, or deliberate. The fact she is a woman and has kids is irrelevant.
"Mandelson initially thought he could weather the press storm, but had to resign when it became clear that the Prime Minister thought nothing else would clear the air..."
And he had done nothing wrong.
When the dogs get released in such a case they don't just bite the intended target, and there's nothing more British than getting hot under the collar about hypocrisy. Rayner won't be the only casualty of this.
Again, there may be logical reasons for it, but it's not her constituency or her workplace, and nothing says 'tough working class northerner' like a flat in Brighton.
Labour's prospects of electoral survival just got a lot worse, and all because of their punitive approach to second homes.
The other fun question is what does the mortgage on the new place look like if she resigns as a minister and takes a c.£70k pay cut?
Oops
Prediction: very badly.
BBC News - Rayner consulted three people about flat purchase
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cqxzj2qq1lno
Boring.
Just to troll Leon, the director of an AI company was on R4 this morning, and still talking about Brexit.
And how it made the UK a less attractive place for them to invest.
There was also an interesting implication in the BBC story:
Rayner acknowledged her "reliance on advice on lawyers" did not take into account all the provisions of the situation.
That’s the clearest I think I’ve seen that she didn’t tell the lawyers all the facts
Not the best line to take.