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  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 46,368
    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    So no one knows why @williamglenn is banned

    Did they come for him at 3AM, like the NKVD from the Lubyanka?

    The mod policy here is interesting, considering Cyclefree made a libellous claim about Beth Upton in the previous thread and got a free pass.
    Is there a PB superinjunction about merely discussing the fact a ban exists? Or why?

    Quite bizarre
    I think it would be useful if a post were stickied in PB on mod policy and what is and isn't allowed to be said.

    I'm hugely in favour of free speech which is why I have no issue with most of the comments posted here even when I disagree with them, though if I were Dr Upton I would probs consider legal action on the allegations made in the previous thread.

    Williamglenn is at best a provocateur and at worst an asshole and russian troll, but we probably deserve to know what he said and why he was banned for saying it.

    We know that rooming bangs aren't something we're allowed to discuss here, but what else gets the ban hammer (when libel doesn't?). A clear list of rules and 'do not cross' lines would be useful (especially for new commentators, who may not be familiar with edicts issued in threads months ago).
    It's a very good idea, as the number of Banning Offences is growing. the other day @TSE made - I think - a joking remark that linking to the Spectator is a bannable offence. I presume it was a gag, but it might not be

    Ditto the new rules on swearing at others, the unmentionable subjects, and so forth...

    The site can only function with rules, and the mods are entitled to impose rules as they see fit. We all accept that. But commenters can only function if they KNOW the rules
    So, I don't know why @williamglenn is no longer able to post, but it is worth remembering that 90% of bans are no such thing: most are 24 or 48 hour time outs after someone has overstepped a line.
    He started channelling the language of the far right with calls for self deportations of British citizens born outside the UK, something a few PBers called him out on.

    He was a few posts away talking about remigration.

    Last time I spoke to your Dad he didn’t want that kind of post to go unpunished.
    So he came out with political opinions you don't like. That's it?
    I have a new concept for you.

    Sit down. Get ready. Brace. Put a mouth guard in. This may hurt.

    Some ideas are unacceptable to decent people. Even when they are just ideas.
    So who are the "decent people". Who defines them? What is decent? I have a strange idea that you will be one of THE DECENT and those who you disagree with, not

    It is lucky there is a ban against foul language because I would now submit you to a finely crafted fusillade of the same. As it is I shall restrict myself to noting that you are morally repulsive
    Since you seem to have a low IQ, I’ll spell it out for you.

    OGH = Our Gracious Host

    This is his place. His definition of decent. @TheScreamingEagles is his emissary, enforcing his edicts.

    If you want to say things that OGH doesn’t like, you do it elsewhere.

    His house, his rules.
    Christ, can this site get any more pompous? The odour of the self righteous centrist dad is pungent, tonight
    You can always set up Knappy-Gaz-betting.com or something?
    I miss @IshmaelZ

    He was fun. Vituperative when drunk, but fun

    The site is poorer for all the free-thinkers chased away. We are left with the dregs of the centrists
    +1 for Ish. A vituperative and argumentative old public school bugger I used to argue with often. I miss him. I often think he is me in another 40 years.

    Also:

    Al Meeks I disagreed with on everything but thought him a valuable and insightful commentator. Educated and intellectual, he provided the chum that got the rest of PB's sharks into a feeding frenzy.

    Charles. Was deeply interesting once you got past the "do you know who I am?" - I'm a bit posh but not *that* posh. Charles provided genuine insight into a worldview most don't get to meet.

    148grss - perhaps the site's only interesting and intellectual marxist. Did I agree with a word he said? No. Did I find his words challenged my worldview? Hell yes, in a way few other posters on here ever do.
    Yes indeed. And @Richard_Nabavi

    If this is gonna become a site when you can be banned for literally having an opinion that the centrist dads - the most tedious people on earth - find “unacceptable” simply because they don’t like it, then I shan’t last long

    We have lost too many diverse voices because of this hegemony of the mediocre. People like @Malmesbury or @kinabalu or @IanB2 who never ever ever ever say anything politically interesting, ever. Even if the odd dog photo is cute

    I really miss @Charles, @AlastairMeeks and @Richard_Nabavi. I still very much enjoy the site but I am not sure that the level of analysis we once got is currently matched. No doubt these things come in cycles (or even @Cyclefrees).
    One of those here with delta name!
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 30,348

    Got hit by a car at work today, so I'm now in hospital with three ribs and an ankle broken

    Christ.
    Best wishes.
    It may not appear so now, but you've probably got away lightly.
    Look after yourself. All the best.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 46,368
    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    So no one knows why @williamglenn is banned

    Did they come for him at 3AM, like the NKVD from the Lubyanka?

    The mod policy here is interesting, considering Cyclefree made a libellous claim about Beth Upton in the previous thread and got a free pass.
    Is there a PB superinjunction about merely discussing the fact a ban exists? Or why?

    Quite bizarre
    I think it would be useful if a post were stickied in PB on mod policy and what is and isn't allowed to be said.

    I'm hugely in favour of free speech which is why I have no issue with most of the comments posted here even when I disagree with them, though if I were Dr Upton I would probs consider legal action on the allegations made in the previous thread.

    Williamglenn is at best a provocateur and at worst an asshole and russian troll, but we probably deserve to know what he said and why he was banned for saying it.

    We know that rooming bangs aren't something we're allowed to discuss here, but what else gets the ban hammer (when libel doesn't?). A clear list of rules and 'do not cross' lines would be useful (especially for new commentators, who may not be familiar with edicts issued in threads months ago).
    It's a very good idea, as the number of Banning Offences is growing. the other day @TSE made - I think - a joking remark that linking to the Spectator is a bannable offence. I presume it was a gag, but it might not be

    Ditto the new rules on swearing at others, the unmentionable subjects, and so forth...

    The site can only function with rules, and the mods are entitled to impose rules as they see fit. We all accept that. But commenters can only function if they KNOW the rules
    So, I don't know why @williamglenn is no longer able to post, but it is worth remembering that 90% of bans are no such thing: most are 24 or 48 hour time outs after someone has overstepped a line.
    He started channelling the language of the far right with calls for self deportations of British citizens born outside the UK, something a few PBers called him out on.

    He was a few posts away talking about remigration.

    Last time I spoke to your Dad he didn’t want that kind of post to go unpunished.
    So he came out with political opinions you don't like. That's it?
    I have a new concept for you.

    Sit down. Get ready. Brace. Put a mouth guard in. This may hurt.

    Some ideas are unacceptable to decent people. Even when they are just ideas.
    So who are the "decent people". Who defines them? What is decent? I have a strange idea that you will be one of THE DECENT and those who you disagree with, not

    It is lucky there is a ban against foul language because I would now submit you to a finely crafted fusillade of the same. As it is I shall restrict myself to noting that you are morally repulsive
    Since you seem to have a low IQ, I’ll spell it out for you.

    OGH = Our Gracious Host

    This is his place. His definition of decent. @TheScreamingEagles is his emissary, enforcing his edicts.

    If you want to say things that OGH doesn’t like, you do it elsewhere.

    His house, his rules.
    Christ, can this site get any more pompous? The odour of the self righteous centrist dad is pungent, tonight
    You're the one being pompous. Making out that a poster getting 'banned' from PB for a couple of days is some sort of moral atrocity. The free-thinking outlaw renegades being censored by a stultifying middlebrow centrist blob. It's the most utter self-regarding preeny precious tosh.
    Once, just once, say something interesting. Or funny. Or clever. Or witty. Just once?

    Somewhere in that desolate pit of nullity that is your golfing non-soul, there must be ONE comment worth making
    Quite content with that one for now.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,629

    Got hit by a car at work today, so I'm now in hospital with three ribs and an ankle broken

    Wishing you a speedy recovery, Blanche!
  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,455

    Got hit by a car at work today, so I'm now in hospital with three ribs and an ankle broken

    Sorry to hear that, wishing you a speedy recovery.
  • maxhmaxh Posts: 1,695
    Leon said:

    Roger said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    It's horrendous. The Israelis have slaughtered more civilians in Gaza in two years than the Nazis killed in Bergen Belsen in four. And we're still listening to the tape of Richard Attenborough's heartbreaking broadcast 80 years on.
    If you want a serious debate, rather than a rant - what do you honestly think the Gazans would do to Israeli Jews, given the chance?

    And how do you see this being solved? What should Israel do, to bring this to a humane resolution?
    Meh. You're apologising for genocide.
    There may not be a solution. There may not be a resolution. That doesn't make mass starvation okay.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 63,425
    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    So no one knows why @williamglenn is banned

    Did they come for him at 3AM, like the NKVD from the Lubyanka?

    The mod policy here is interesting, considering Cyclefree made a libellous claim about Beth Upton in the previous thread and got a free pass.
    Is there a PB superinjunction about merely discussing the fact a ban exists? Or why?

    Quite bizarre
    I think it would be useful if a post were stickied in PB on mod policy and what is and isn't allowed to be said.

    I'm hugely in favour of free speech which is why I have no issue with most of the comments posted here even when I disagree with them, though if I were Dr Upton I would probs consider legal action on the allegations made in the previous thread.

    Williamglenn is at best a provocateur and at worst an asshole and russian troll, but we probably deserve to know what he said and why he was banned for saying it.

    We know that rooming bangs aren't something we're allowed to discuss here, but what else gets the ban hammer (when libel doesn't?). A clear list of rules and 'do not cross' lines would be useful (especially for new commentators, who may not be familiar with edicts issued in threads months ago).
    It's a very good idea, as the number of Banning Offences is growing. the other day @TSE made - I think - a joking remark that linking to the Spectator is a bannable offence. I presume it was a gag, but it might not be

    Ditto the new rules on swearing at others, the unmentionable subjects, and so forth...

    The site can only function with rules, and the mods are entitled to impose rules as they see fit. We all accept that. But commenters can only function if they KNOW the rules
    So, I don't know why @williamglenn is no longer able to post, but it is worth remembering that 90% of bans are no such thing: most are 24 or 48 hour time outs after someone has overstepped a line.
    He started channelling the language of the far right with calls for self deportations of British citizens born outside the UK, something a few PBers called him out on.

    He was a few posts away talking about remigration.

    Last time I spoke to your Dad he didn’t want that kind of post to go unpunished.
    So he came out with political opinions you don't like. That's it?
    I have a new concept for you.

    Sit down. Get ready. Brace. Put a mouth guard in. This may hurt.

    Some ideas are unacceptable to decent people. Even when they are just ideas.
    So who are the "decent people". Who defines them? What is decent? I have a strange idea that you will be one of THE DECENT and those who you disagree with, not

    It is lucky there is a ban against foul language because I would now submit you to a finely crafted fusillade of the same. As it is I shall restrict myself to noting that you are morally repulsive
    Since you seem to have a low IQ, I’ll spell it out for you.

    OGH = Our Gracious Host

    This is his place. His definition of decent. @TheScreamingEagles is his emissary, enforcing his edicts.

    If you want to say things that OGH doesn’t like, you do it elsewhere.

    His house, his rules.
    Christ, can this site get any more pompous? The odour of the self righteous centrist dad is pungent, tonight
    You're the one being pompous. Making out that a poster getting 'banned' from PB for a couple of days is some sort of moral atrocity. The free-thinking outlaw renegades being censored by a stultifying middlebrow centrist blob. It's the most utter self-regarding preeny precious tosh.
    Once, just once, say something interesting. Or funny. Or clever. Or witty. Just once?

    Somewhere in that desolate pit of nullity that is your golfing non-soul, there must be ONE comment worth making
    Quite content with that one for now.
    I can imagine. Like a desperately constipated gnu excreting a mackerel's eye. You tried to be funny, or biting, and you failed, but at least you got something out
  • kyf_100kyf_100 Posts: 4,969

    I was recently banned for the first time, some 18 years after first commenting. I understand the site was doing it for legal reasons but those legal reasons struck me as a disgrace and made me wonder who was behind it. Certainly influenced my politics.

    Oh behave, when several PBers start posting legally problematic posts it puts the site at risk we restrict discussions on that topic, we've done it over for example the phone hacking scandal, Lord McAlpine, and other topics.

    If you think it was a disgrace you need to give your head a wobble.
    If we're going by https://vf.politicalbetting.com/discussion/comment/1895932#Comment_1895932 as highlighted by ydoethur, then surely Cyclefree's comment in the previous thread, claiming Beth Upton was using the ladies so she could perve on other women would meet the criterion under (4) for the banhammer.

    I'm pro free speech and anti boo hoo let's get the lawyers in, so you'll have none of that from me. But I do think it would be useful to have a codified set of pb rules against which the banhammer is applied, the rules should be regularly updated and easily accessible so that a newcomer to the site understands them.

    The rules should be consistent, accessible and universal. Otherwise it's just 'mod's choice'.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 63,425
    maxh said:

    Leon said:

    Roger said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    It's horrendous. The Israelis have slaughtered more civilians in Gaza in two years than the Nazis killed in Bergen Belsen in four. And we're still listening to the tape of Richard Attenborough's heartbreaking broadcast 80 years on.
    If you want a serious debate, rather than a rant - what do you honestly think the Gazans would do to Israeli Jews, given the chance?

    And how do you see this being solved? What should Israel do, to bring this to a humane resolution?
    Meh. You're apologising for genocide.
    There may not be a solution. There may not be a resolution. That doesn't make mass starvation okay.
    F off. I'm not apologising. I'm just not gonna sit here and bleat, whine and virtuously signal my outrage, performatively. There needs to be a solution. The only solution that can satisfy all sides, at this late appalling stage, is what Trump said. Mad as that sounds
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 36,522

    Got hit by a car at work today, so I'm now in hospital with three ribs and an ankle broken

    Sorry to hear it. Best wishes.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 44,434
    Leon said:

    Roger said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    It's horrendous. The Israelis have slaughtered more civilians in Gaza in two years than the Nazis killed in Bergen Belsen in four. And we're still listening to the tape of Richard Attenborough's heartbreaking broadcast 80 years on.
    If you want a serious debate, rather than a rant - what do you honestly think the Gazans would do to Israeli Jews, given the chance?

    And how do you see this being solved? What should Israel do, to bring this to a humane resolution?
    Pretty sure a shitload more Gazans are filled with genocidal rage towards Israelis than there were two years ago, so that’s worked out well.
  • Frank_BoothFrank_Booth Posts: 427

    I was recently banned for the first time, some 18 years after first commenting. I understand the site was doing it for legal reasons but those legal reasons struck me as a disgrace and made me wonder who was behind it. Certainly influenced my politics.

    Oh behave, when several PBers start posting legally problematic posts it puts the site at risk we restrict discussions on that topic, we've done it over for example the phone hacking scandal, Lord McAlpine, and other topics.

    If you think it was a disgrace you need to give your head a wobble.
    Disgraceful on behalf of the authorities who were trying to close down discussion of a hugely important issue. I'm not blaming the mods for that.

    We now of course have an attempt to come up with a definition of Islamophobia. I think we all know what its purpose is.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 28,544

    Andy_JS said:

    Was Charles upper-class?

    Yes, but his family were only 17th century nouveaux.

    Also:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Les_Jackson_(cricketer)

    Two tests for England in 1949 and 1961.
    His (counts on fingers) Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Grandad bought his own furniture (or married into it).
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 36,522
    "Jake Berry – Kemi Badenoch is toast, Nigel Farage should be PM

    Former Tory chairman says Kemi Badenoch is ‘toast’ and weighs in on unrest in Epping" (£)

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/07/23/the-daily-t-tory-reform-defector-jake-berry-badenoch-farage
  • MattWMattW Posts: 28,544
    Andy_JS said:

    Got hit by a car at work today, so I'm now in hospital with three ribs and an ankle broken

    Sorry to hear it. Best wishes.
    +!. Wishing you all the best, and hoping it is not too serious, and that your insurance has legal cover.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 60,794
    Leon said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    Israel Palestine is the most potent geopolitical evidence for Larkin's immortal insight:

    Man hands on misery to man.
    It deepens like a coastal shelf.
    Get out as early as you can,
    And don’t have any kids yourself


    As the Germans did to the Jews, so the Jews are doing to the Palestinians. With the added complication that, given the chance, we all know that many many Gazans - far too many - would do exactly the same to every Jew they could find

    There is no solution other than the one proposed by - ironically - Trump. Move the Gazans away and stuff their mouths with gold
    Well, firstly it's not really a solution. Because giving $5,000 a person doesn't solve the issue that there's nowhere obvious else for them to go. Unless Israel is planning on letting them go to the West Bank.

    Which I'm guessing they aren't that keen on.

    And which brings us to the other problem. What about the West Bank? Every day - as you know from your travels there - the Israelis take control of more of the territory, and each day they make the lives of Palestinians there a little bit worse.

    At some point, the Palestinians will have been resrticted to an area, say, the size of Gaza. And will not doubt act out. As you would do in that scenario. And then are we to sanction another bit of ethnic cleansing?
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 36,522
    edited July 23
    This is interesting.

    "Former Tory MP expelled by party after ‘serious complaints’

    Tom Hunt, Ipswich MP from 2019-24, tells The Telegraph: ‘I am deeply disappointed by this provisional decision’" (£)

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2025/07/21/former-tory-mp-tom-hunt-expelled-by-party-after-complaints
  • maxhmaxh Posts: 1,695
    Leon said:

    maxh said:

    Leon said:

    Roger said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    It's horrendous. The Israelis have slaughtered more civilians in Gaza in two years than the Nazis killed in Bergen Belsen in four. And we're still listening to the tape of Richard Attenborough's heartbreaking broadcast 80 years on.
    If you want a serious debate, rather than a rant - what do you honestly think the Gazans would do to Israeli Jews, given the chance?

    And how do you see this being solved? What should Israel do, to bring this to a humane resolution?
    Meh. You're apologising for genocide.
    There may not be a solution. There may not be a resolution. That doesn't make mass starvation okay.
    F off. I'm not apologising. I'm just not gonna sit here and bleat, whine and virtuously signal my outrage, performatively. There needs to be a solution. The only solution that can satisfy all sides, at this late appalling stage, is what Trump said. Mad as that sounds
    Fair enough. I read implicit justification for what David linked to in your post. If that was my misread, I apologise.

    I think seeking solutions to the bigger problem at this stage is a fool's game, if it serves as any distraction at all from solving the immediate problem of forcing Israel and Egypt to let aid in so that fewer innocent people starve.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 10,528
    edited July 23
    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    Israel Palestine is the most potent geopolitical evidence for Larkin's immortal insight:

    Man hands on misery to man.
    It deepens like a coastal shelf.
    Get out as early as you can,
    And don’t have any kids yourself


    As the Germans did to the Jews, so the Jews are doing to the Palestinians. With the added complication that, given the chance, we all know that many many Gazans - far too many - would do exactly the same to every Jew they could find

    There is no solution other than the one proposed by - ironically - Trump. Move the Gazans away and stuff their mouths with gold
    Well, firstly it's not really a solution. Because giving $5,000 a person doesn't solve the issue that there's nowhere obvious else for them to go. Unless Israel is planning on letting them go to the West Bank.

    Which I'm guessing they aren't that keen on.

    And which brings us to the other problem. What about the West Bank? Every day - as you know from your travels there - the Israelis take control of more of the territory, and each day they make the lives of Palestinians there a little bit worse.

    At some point, the Palestinians will have been resrticted to an area, say, the size of Gaza. And will not doubt act out. As you would do in that scenario. And then are we to sanction another bit of ethnic cleansing?
    The only answer, or recourse, at this point is international isolation and sanctions, similar to the apartheid era's, on Netanyahu's government.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 63,425

    Leon said:

    Roger said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    It's horrendous. The Israelis have slaughtered more civilians in Gaza in two years than the Nazis killed in Bergen Belsen in four. And we're still listening to the tape of Richard Attenborough's heartbreaking broadcast 80 years on.
    If you want a serious debate, rather than a rant - what do you honestly think the Gazans would do to Israeli Jews, given the chance?

    And how do you see this being solved? What should Israel do, to bring this to a humane resolution?
    Pretty sure a shitload more Gazans are filled with genocidal rage towards Israelis than there were two years ago, so that’s worked out well.
    Well quite. It's getting worse. If I was a young Gazan, I would be filled with anti-Semitic hatred and I would want to slaughter every Jew I could find. Anywhere on earth. And I would be filled with righteous anger, too, not ashamed of my blood-lust

    Where does that get us?

    There is no coming back from the levels of hatred now evidenced - on both sides - in this tedious tedious 80 year old conflict

    So what is the solution? The two state answer is over. It's done. It's never coming back. Israel will not tolerate Palestinians living nearby. Meanwhile Palestinians are filled with - entirely justifiable - anti-Semitic rage

    The only solution is to pay off the Palestinians. Give them all condos in Egypt or Indonesia, anything. Give them £1m each. They are never going "home" to Palestine, the only way that happens is if Iran manages to nuke Israel, which means they can't go home because it will be an irradiated wasteland for 1000 years

    Trump is right
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 32,178
    Andy_JS said:

    "Jake Berry – Kemi Badenoch is toast, Nigel Farage should be PM

    Former Tory chairman says Kemi Badenoch is ‘toast’ and weighs in on unrest in Epping" (£)

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/07/23/the-daily-t-tory-reform-defector-jake-berry-badenoch-farage

    I lost interest after the initial bit (minus Berry) about the police vanning in counter protestors.

    He didn't grab me to be honest, and this coming from someone who had a pound on him for future leader. It's actually not a simple transition from even right-wing Tory to Reformer, in terms of tone.

    Did you enjoy the interview? Might dip back in.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 60,794
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Roger said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    It's horrendous. The Israelis have slaughtered more civilians in Gaza in two years than the Nazis killed in Bergen Belsen in four. And we're still listening to the tape of Richard Attenborough's heartbreaking broadcast 80 years on.
    If you want a serious debate, rather than a rant - what do you honestly think the Gazans would do to Israeli Jews, given the chance?

    And how do you see this being solved? What should Israel do, to bring this to a humane resolution?
    Pretty sure a shitload more Gazans are filled with genocidal rage towards Israelis than there were two years ago, so that’s worked out well.
    Well quite. It's getting worse. If I was a young Gazan, I would be filled with anti-Semitic hatred and I would want to slaughter every Jew I could find. Anywhere on earth. And I would be filled with righteous anger, too, not ashamed of my blood-lust

    Where does that get us?

    There is no coming back from the levels of hatred now evidenced - on both sides - in this tedious tedious 80 year old conflict

    So what is the solution? The two state answer is over. It's done. It's never coming back. Israel will not tolerate Palestinians living nearby. Meanwhile Palestinians are filled with - entirely justifiable - anti-Semitic rage

    The only solution is to pay off the Palestinians. Give them all condos in Egypt or Indonesia, anything. Give them £1m each. They are never going "home" to Palestine, the only way that happens is if Iran manages to nuke Israel, which means they can't go home because it will be an irradiated wasteland for 1000 years

    Trump is right
    There are almost exactly the same number of Palestinians and Israelis between the river and the sea. Why shouldn't it be the Israelis who are evicted?
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 15,272
    Taz said:

    Got hit by a car at work today, so I'm now in hospital with three ribs and an ankle broken

    Ouch! My sympathies. One broken rib was the worst pain I've ever had. Best wishes for a speedy recovery... although it'll probably be about 8 weeks, I guess!
    I had a couple of ribs cracked, my only ever cycling accident on the coast to coast, some idiot came speeding round a blind bend and hit me.

    It’s not pleasant and there’s nothing the medics can do. It just has to knit back. Some stuff like reaching for something becomes wince inducing.

    As for pain, the worst I’ve had was toothache.
    I was in a car crash and broke a rib (and a collarbone), but the two ends of the broken rib stayed in place. About a week later, I'm at work, I twist round to pick something up and only then did the two parts of the rib separate. That hurt more than the original car crash! Every breath was painful. Staggered to A&E and collapsed on the floor.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 63,425
    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    Israel Palestine is the most potent geopolitical evidence for Larkin's immortal insight:

    Man hands on misery to man.
    It deepens like a coastal shelf.
    Get out as early as you can,
    And don’t have any kids yourself


    As the Germans did to the Jews, so the Jews are doing to the Palestinians. With the added complication that, given the chance, we all know that many many Gazans - far too many - would do exactly the same to every Jew they could find

    There is no solution other than the one proposed by - ironically - Trump. Move the Gazans away and stuff their mouths with gold
    Well, firstly it's not really a solution. Because giving $5,000 a person doesn't solve the issue that there's nowhere obvious else for them to go. Unless Israel is planning on letting them go to the West Bank.

    Which I'm guessing they aren't that keen on.

    And which brings us to the other problem. What about the West Bank? Every day - as you know from your travels there - the Israelis take control of more of the territory, and each day they make the lives of Palestinians there a little bit worse.

    At some point, the Palestinians will have been resrticted to an area, say, the size of Gaza. And will not doubt act out. As you would do in that scenario. And then are we to sanction another bit of ethnic cleansing?
    I agree that $5k is nowhere near enough. But there will be a price where it might work. $50k? $500k per Palestinian? At some point it will be worth it, for the majority of them, and the host country will also have to be very very amply rewarded
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 32,178
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Roger said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    It's horrendous. The Israelis have slaughtered more civilians in Gaza in two years than the Nazis killed in Bergen Belsen in four. And we're still listening to the tape of Richard Attenborough's heartbreaking broadcast 80 years on.
    If you want a serious debate, rather than a rant - what do you honestly think the Gazans would do to Israeli Jews, given the chance?

    And how do you see this being solved? What should Israel do, to bring this to a humane resolution?
    Pretty sure a shitload more Gazans are filled with genocidal rage towards Israelis than there were two years ago, so that’s worked out well.
    Well quite. It's getting worse. If I was a young Gazan, I would be filled with anti-Semitic hatred and I would want to slaughter every Jew I could find. Anywhere on earth. And I would be filled with righteous anger, too, not ashamed of my blood-lust

    Where does that get us?

    There is no coming back from the levels of hatred now evidenced - on both sides - in this tedious tedious 80 year old conflict

    So what is the solution? The two state answer is over. It's done. It's never coming back. Israel will not tolerate Palestinians living nearby. Meanwhile Palestinians are filled with - entirely justifiable - anti-Semitic rage

    The only solution is to pay off the Palestinians. Give them all condos in Egypt or Indonesia, anything. Give them £1m each. They are never going "home" to Palestine, the only way that happens is if Iran manages to nuke Israel, which means they can't go home because it will be an irradiated wasteland for 1000 years

    Trump is right
    They should give them the illegal Israeli settlements. Give the settlers places in the new Gaza.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 32,178
    Andy_JS said:

    This is interesting.

    "Former Tory MP expelled by party after ‘serious complaints’

    Tom Hunt, Ipswich MP from 2019-24, tells The Telegraph: ‘I am deeply disappointed by this provisional decision’" (£)

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2025/07/21/former-tory-mp-tom-hunt-expelled-by-party-after-complaints

    Another one for Reform?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 63,425
    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Roger said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    It's horrendous. The Israelis have slaughtered more civilians in Gaza in two years than the Nazis killed in Bergen Belsen in four. And we're still listening to the tape of Richard Attenborough's heartbreaking broadcast 80 years on.
    If you want a serious debate, rather than a rant - what do you honestly think the Gazans would do to Israeli Jews, given the chance?

    And how do you see this being solved? What should Israel do, to bring this to a humane resolution?
    Pretty sure a shitload more Gazans are filled with genocidal rage towards Israelis than there were two years ago, so that’s worked out well.
    Well quite. It's getting worse. If I was a young Gazan, I would be filled with anti-Semitic hatred and I would want to slaughter every Jew I could find. Anywhere on earth. And I would be filled with righteous anger, too, not ashamed of my blood-lust

    Where does that get us?

    There is no coming back from the levels of hatred now evidenced - on both sides - in this tedious tedious 80 year old conflict

    So what is the solution? The two state answer is over. It's done. It's never coming back. Israel will not tolerate Palestinians living nearby. Meanwhile Palestinians are filled with - entirely justifiable - anti-Semitic rage

    The only solution is to pay off the Palestinians. Give them all condos in Egypt or Indonesia, anything. Give them £1m each. They are never going "home" to Palestine, the only way that happens is if Iran manages to nuke Israel, which means they can't go home because it will be an irradiated wasteland for 1000 years

    Trump is right
    There are almost exactly the same number of Palestinians and Israelis between the river and the sea. Why shouldn't it be the Israelis who are evicted?
    Because they have nukes. Basically
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 36,522

    Andy_JS said:

    "Jake Berry – Kemi Badenoch is toast, Nigel Farage should be PM

    Former Tory chairman says Kemi Badenoch is ‘toast’ and weighs in on unrest in Epping" (£)

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/07/23/the-daily-t-tory-reform-defector-jake-berry-badenoch-farage

    I lost interest after the initial bit (minus Berry) about the police vanning in counter protestors.

    He didn't grab me to be honest, and this coming from someone who had a pound on him for future leader. It's actually not a simple transition from even right-wing Tory to Reformer, in terms of tone.

    Did you enjoy the interview? Might dip back in.
    I speed-read it, didn't look like the most interesting article ever.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 15,065

    Got hit by a car at work today, so I'm now in hospital with three ribs and an ankle broken

    Sorry to hear that. Hope for a quick as possible recovery.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 55,235
    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Roger said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    It's horrendous. The Israelis have slaughtered more civilians in Gaza in two years than the Nazis killed in Bergen Belsen in four. And we're still listening to the tape of Richard Attenborough's heartbreaking broadcast 80 years on.
    If you want a serious debate, rather than a rant - what do you honestly think the Gazans would do to Israeli Jews, given the chance?

    And how do you see this being solved? What should Israel do, to bring this to a humane resolution?
    Pretty sure a shitload more Gazans are filled with genocidal rage towards Israelis than there were two years ago, so that’s worked out well.
    Well quite. It's getting worse. If I was a young Gazan, I would be filled with anti-Semitic hatred and I would want to slaughter every Jew I could find. Anywhere on earth. And I would be filled with righteous anger, too, not ashamed of my blood-lust

    Where does that get us?

    There is no coming back from the levels of hatred now evidenced - on both sides - in this tedious tedious 80 year old conflict

    So what is the solution? The two state answer is over. It's done. It's never coming back. Israel will not tolerate Palestinians living nearby. Meanwhile Palestinians are filled with - entirely justifiable - anti-Semitic rage

    The only solution is to pay off the Palestinians. Give them all condos in Egypt or Indonesia, anything. Give them £1m each. They are never going "home" to Palestine, the only way that happens is if Iran manages to nuke Israel, which means they can't go home because it will be an irradiated wasteland for 1000 years

    Trump is right
    There are almost exactly the same number of Palestinians and Israelis between the river and the sea. Why shouldn't it be the Israelis who are evicted?
    Because they have nukes. Basically
    The fallout would hit them too.
  • TazTaz Posts: 19,905
    edited July 23

    Taz said:

    Got hit by a car at work today, so I'm now in hospital with three ribs and an ankle broken

    Ouch! My sympathies. One broken rib was the worst pain I've ever had. Best wishes for a speedy recovery... although it'll probably be about 8 weeks, I guess!
    I had a couple of ribs cracked, my only ever cycling accident on the coast to coast, some idiot came speeding round a blind bend and hit me.

    It’s not pleasant and there’s nothing the medics can do. It just has to knit back. Some stuff like reaching for something becomes wince inducing.

    As for pain, the worst I’ve had was toothache.
    I was in a car crash and broke a rib (and a collarbone), but the two ends of the broken rib stayed in place. About a week later, I'm at work, I twist round to pick something up and only then did the two parts of the rib separate. That hurt more than the original car crash! Every breath was painful. Staggered to A&E and collapsed on the floor.
    That sounds far worse than the pain I had. The ribs had cracked and were knitting back together and my occasional twist just had a sharp stab of pain but it was brief.

    Just shows how frail the human body can be.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 15,272

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Roger said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    It's horrendous. The Israelis have slaughtered more civilians in Gaza in two years than the Nazis killed in Bergen Belsen in four. And we're still listening to the tape of Richard Attenborough's heartbreaking broadcast 80 years on.
    If you want a serious debate, rather than a rant - what do you honestly think the Gazans would do to Israeli Jews, given the chance?

    And how do you see this being solved? What should Israel do, to bring this to a humane resolution?
    Pretty sure a shitload more Gazans are filled with genocidal rage towards Israelis than there were two years ago, so that’s worked out well.
    Well quite. It's getting worse. If I was a young Gazan, I would be filled with anti-Semitic hatred and I would want to slaughter every Jew I could find. Anywhere on earth. And I would be filled with righteous anger, too, not ashamed of my blood-lust

    Where does that get us?

    There is no coming back from the levels of hatred now evidenced - on both sides - in this tedious tedious 80 year old conflict

    So what is the solution? The two state answer is over. It's done. It's never coming back. Israel will not tolerate Palestinians living nearby. Meanwhile Palestinians are filled with - entirely justifiable - anti-Semitic rage

    The only solution is to pay off the Palestinians. Give them all condos in Egypt or Indonesia, anything. Give them £1m each. They are never going "home" to Palestine, the only way that happens is if Iran manages to nuke Israel, which means they can't go home because it will be an irradiated wasteland for 1000 years

    Trump is right
    There are almost exactly the same number of Palestinians and Israelis between the river and the sea. Why shouldn't it be the Israelis who are evicted?
    Because they have nukes. Basically
    The fallout would hit them too.
    They know that, but might not care: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samson_Option
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 10,216

    Andy_JS said:

    This is interesting.

    "Former Tory MP expelled by party after ‘serious complaints’

    Tom Hunt, Ipswich MP from 2019-24, tells The Telegraph: ‘I am deeply disappointed by this provisional decision’" (£)

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2025/07/21/former-tory-mp-tom-hunt-expelled-by-party-after-complaints

    Another one for Reform?
    Does Nigel really want Reform to become a dustbin for every disaffected Tory with a stalled career? He can probably rise above that now.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 36,522
    Germany are always value in this tournament compared to the initial odds.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 55,884

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Roger said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    It's horrendous. The Israelis have slaughtered more civilians in Gaza in two years than the Nazis killed in Bergen Belsen in four. And we're still listening to the tape of Richard Attenborough's heartbreaking broadcast 80 years on.
    If you want a serious debate, rather than a rant - what do you honestly think the Gazans would do to Israeli Jews, given the chance?

    And how do you see this being solved? What should Israel do, to bring this to a humane resolution?
    Pretty sure a shitload more Gazans are filled with genocidal rage towards Israelis than there were two years ago, so that’s worked out well.
    Well quite. It's getting worse. If I was a young Gazan, I would be filled with anti-Semitic hatred and I would want to slaughter every Jew I could find. Anywhere on earth. And I would be filled with righteous anger, too, not ashamed of my blood-lust

    Where does that get us?

    There is no coming back from the levels of hatred now evidenced - on both sides - in this tedious tedious 80 year old conflict

    So what is the solution? The two state answer is over. It's done. It's never coming back. Israel will not tolerate Palestinians living nearby. Meanwhile Palestinians are filled with - entirely justifiable - anti-Semitic rage

    The only solution is to pay off the Palestinians. Give them all condos in Egypt or Indonesia, anything. Give them £1m each. They are never going "home" to Palestine, the only way that happens is if Iran manages to nuke Israel, which means they can't go home because it will be an irradiated wasteland for 1000 years

    Trump is right
    There are almost exactly the same number of Palestinians and Israelis between the river and the sea. Why shouldn't it be the Israelis who are evicted?
    Because they have nukes. Basically
    The fallout would hit them too.
    Airbuses don’t produce much (if any) fallout
  • Frank_BoothFrank_Booth Posts: 427
    I notice almost no-one so desperately concerned about the plight of the Palestinians has urged Egypt to open the border.

    Funny that.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 15,272

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Roger said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    It's horrendous. The Israelis have slaughtered more civilians in Gaza in two years than the Nazis killed in Bergen Belsen in four. And we're still listening to the tape of Richard Attenborough's heartbreaking broadcast 80 years on.
    If you want a serious debate, rather than a rant - what do you honestly think the Gazans would do to Israeli Jews, given the chance?

    And how do you see this being solved? What should Israel do, to bring this to a humane resolution?
    Pretty sure a shitload more Gazans are filled with genocidal rage towards Israelis than there were two years ago, so that’s worked out well.
    Well quite. It's getting worse. If I was a young Gazan, I would be filled with anti-Semitic hatred and I would want to slaughter every Jew I could find. Anywhere on earth. And I would be filled with righteous anger, too, not ashamed of my blood-lust

    Where does that get us?

    There is no coming back from the levels of hatred now evidenced - on both sides - in this tedious tedious 80 year old conflict

    So what is the solution? The two state answer is over. It's done. It's never coming back. Israel will not tolerate Palestinians living nearby. Meanwhile Palestinians are filled with - entirely justifiable - anti-Semitic rage

    The only solution is to pay off the Palestinians. Give them all condos in Egypt or Indonesia, anything. Give them £1m each. They are never going "home" to Palestine, the only way that happens is if Iran manages to nuke Israel, which means they can't go home because it will be an irradiated wasteland for 1000 years

    Trump is right
    There are almost exactly the same number of Palestinians and Israelis between the river and the sea. Why shouldn't it be the Israelis who are evicted?
    Because they have nukes. Basically
    The fallout would hit them too.
    Airbuses don’t produce much (if any) fallout
    What? Compared to Boeing???
  • LeonLeon Posts: 63,425

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    Israel Palestine is the most potent geopolitical evidence for Larkin's immortal insight:

    Man hands on misery to man.
    It deepens like a coastal shelf.
    Get out as early as you can,
    And don’t have any kids yourself


    As the Germans did to the Jews, so the Jews are doing to the Palestinians. With the added complication that, given the chance, we all know that many many Gazans - far too many - would do exactly the same to every Jew they could find

    There is no solution other than the one proposed by - ironically - Trump. Move the Gazans away and stuff their mouths with gold
    Well, firstly it's not really a solution. Because giving $5,000 a person doesn't solve the issue that there's nowhere obvious else for them to go. Unless Israel is planning on letting them go to the West Bank.

    Which I'm guessing they aren't that keen on.

    And which brings us to the other problem. What about the West Bank? Every day - as you know from your travels there - the Israelis take control of more of the territory, and each day they make the lives of Palestinians there a little bit worse.

    At some point, the Palestinians will have been resrticted to an area, say, the size of Gaza. And will not doubt act out. As you would do in that scenario. And then are we to sanction another bit of ethnic cleansing?
    The only answer, or recourse, at this point is international isolation and sanctions, similar to the apartheid era's, on Netanyahu's government.
    The Israelis don't give a fuck. They've been through an actual Holocaust. International anger and being-banned-from-rugby is not gonna cut it
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 55,235
    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    Israel Palestine is the most potent geopolitical evidence for Larkin's immortal insight:

    Man hands on misery to man.
    It deepens like a coastal shelf.
    Get out as early as you can,
    And don’t have any kids yourself


    As the Germans did to the Jews, so the Jews are doing to the Palestinians. With the added complication that, given the chance, we all know that many many Gazans - far too many - would do exactly the same to every Jew they could find

    There is no solution other than the one proposed by - ironically - Trump. Move the Gazans away and stuff their mouths with gold
    Well, firstly it's not really a solution. Because giving $5,000 a person doesn't solve the issue that there's nowhere obvious else for them to go. Unless Israel is planning on letting them go to the West Bank.

    Which I'm guessing they aren't that keen on.

    And which brings us to the other problem. What about the West Bank? Every day - as you know from your travels there - the Israelis take control of more of the territory, and each day they make the lives of Palestinians there a little bit worse.

    At some point, the Palestinians will have been resrticted to an area, say, the size of Gaza. And will not doubt act out. As you would do in that scenario. And then are we to sanction another bit of ethnic cleansing?
    The only answer, or recourse, at this point is international isolation and sanctions, similar to the apartheid era's, on Netanyahu's government.
    The Israelis don't give a fuck. They've been through an actual Holocaust. International anger and being-banned-from-rugby is not gonna cut it
    Do the Israelis play rugby?
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 36,522
    "Children could be limited to two hours per day on social media sites in a bid to break 'unhealthy' doomscrolling habits.

    Peter Kyle, the Technology Secretary, said the Government was 'looking very carefully' at how to stop youngsters spending hours viewing online content.

    The Cabinet minister warned that children were displaying 'compulsive behaviour' on some apps and 'need some help just to take control of their online lives'."

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-14932057/Under-16s-limited-two-hours-day-social-media-sites-break-unhealthy-doomscrolling-habits-says-Cabinet-minister.html
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 67,010
    edited July 23
    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Roger said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    It's horrendous. The Israelis have slaughtered more civilians in Gaza in two years than the Nazis killed in Bergen Belsen in four. And we're still listening to the tape of Richard Attenborough's heartbreaking broadcast 80 years on.
    If you want a serious debate, rather than a rant - what do you honestly think the Gazans would do to Israeli Jews, given the chance?

    And how do you see this being solved? What should Israel do, to bring this to a humane resolution?
    Pretty sure a shitload more Gazans are filled with genocidal rage towards Israelis than there were two years ago, so that’s worked out well.
    Well quite. It's getting worse. If I was a young Gazan, I would be filled with anti-Semitic hatred and I would want to slaughter every Jew I could find. Anywhere on earth. And I would be filled with righteous anger, too, not ashamed of my blood-lust

    Where does that get us?

    There is no coming back from the levels of hatred now evidenced - on both sides - in this tedious tedious 80 year old conflict

    So what is the solution? The two state answer is over. It's done. It's never coming back. Israel will not tolerate Palestinians living nearby. Meanwhile Palestinians are filled with - entirely justifiable - anti-Semitic rage

    The only solution is to pay off the Palestinians. Give them all condos in Egypt or Indonesia, anything. Give them £1m each. They are never going "home" to Palestine, the only way that happens is if Iran manages to nuke Israel, which means they can't go home because it will be an irradiated wasteland for 1000 years

    Trump is right
    There are almost exactly the same number of Palestinians and Israelis between the river and the sea. Why shouldn't it be the Israelis who are evicted?
    Because they have nukes. Basically
    "The only solution is to pay off the Palestinians. Give them all condos in Egypt or Indonesia, anything. Give them £1m each."

    Human nature means that would not work. The attachment to history, to land, to soil, to myths and legends of a nation are far stronger than Trump's $.

    Would your extended family all agree to leave Cornwall and move to Albania in exchange for $1m?

  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 55,235
    edited July 23

    I notice almost no-one so desperately concerned about the plight of the Palestinians has urged Egypt to open the border.

    Funny that.

    We would be interested to know what figures the world-renowned experts at the Frank Booth Foundation have for the true number of Palestinian casualties.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 63,425
    edited July 23

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Roger said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    It's horrendous. The Israelis have slaughtered more civilians in Gaza in two years than the Nazis killed in Bergen Belsen in four. And we're still listening to the tape of Richard Attenborough's heartbreaking broadcast 80 years on.
    If you want a serious debate, rather than a rant - what do you honestly think the Gazans would do to Israeli Jews, given the chance?

    And how do you see this being solved? What should Israel do, to bring this to a humane resolution?
    Pretty sure a shitload more Gazans are filled with genocidal rage towards Israelis than there were two years ago, so that’s worked out well.
    Well quite. It's getting worse. If I was a young Gazan, I would be filled with anti-Semitic hatred and I would want to slaughter every Jew I could find. Anywhere on earth. And I would be filled with righteous anger, too, not ashamed of my blood-lust

    Where does that get us?

    There is no coming back from the levels of hatred now evidenced - on both sides - in this tedious tedious 80 year old conflict

    So what is the solution? The two state answer is over. It's done. It's never coming back. Israel will not tolerate Palestinians living nearby. Meanwhile Palestinians are filled with - entirely justifiable - anti-Semitic rage

    The only solution is to pay off the Palestinians. Give them all condos in Egypt or Indonesia, anything. Give them £1m each. They are never going "home" to Palestine, the only way that happens is if Iran manages to nuke Israel, which means they can't go home because it will be an irradiated wasteland for 1000 years

    Trump is right
    There are almost exactly the same number of Palestinians and Israelis between the river and the sea. Why shouldn't it be the Israelis who are evicted?
    Because they have nukes. Basically
    "The only solution is to pay off the Palestinians. Give them all condos in Egypt or Indonesia, anything. Give them £1m each."

    Human nature means that would not work. The attachment to history, to land, to soil, to myths and legends of a nation are far stronger than Trump's $.

    Would your extended family all agree to leave Cornwall and move to Albania in exchange for $1m?

    Each? Yes, probably

    Especially if Cornwall was a diseased toilet turned into a concentration camp, with no long term future of any change, just more of the same
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 15,272
    Big polling report on Israelis' views of the possibility of peace, what to do with Gaza, etc.: https://www.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/20/2025/06/pg_2025.06.03_israel_report.pdf
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 30,348
    Andy_JS said:

    This is interesting.

    "Former Tory MP expelled by party after ‘serious complaints’

    Tom Hunt, Ipswich MP from 2019-24, tells The Telegraph: ‘I am deeply disappointed by this provisional decision’" (£)

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2025/07/21/former-tory-mp-tom-hunt-expelled-by-party-after-complaints

    I have "serious complaints" about every Tory MP 2019-24.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 55,235
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Roger said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    It's horrendous. The Israelis have slaughtered more civilians in Gaza in two years than the Nazis killed in Bergen Belsen in four. And we're still listening to the tape of Richard Attenborough's heartbreaking broadcast 80 years on.
    If you want a serious debate, rather than a rant - what do you honestly think the Gazans would do to Israeli Jews, given the chance?

    And how do you see this being solved? What should Israel do, to bring this to a humane resolution?
    Pretty sure a shitload more Gazans are filled with genocidal rage towards Israelis than there were two years ago, so that’s worked out well.
    Well quite. It's getting worse. If I was a young Gazan, I would be filled with anti-Semitic hatred and I would want to slaughter every Jew I could find. Anywhere on earth. And I would be filled with righteous anger, too, not ashamed of my blood-lust

    Where does that get us?

    There is no coming back from the levels of hatred now evidenced - on both sides - in this tedious tedious 80 year old conflict

    So what is the solution? The two state answer is over. It's done. It's never coming back. Israel will not tolerate Palestinians living nearby. Meanwhile Palestinians are filled with - entirely justifiable - anti-Semitic rage

    The only solution is to pay off the Palestinians. Give them all condos in Egypt or Indonesia, anything. Give them £1m each. They are never going "home" to Palestine, the only way that happens is if Iran manages to nuke Israel, which means they can't go home because it will be an irradiated wasteland for 1000 years

    Trump is right
    There are almost exactly the same number of Palestinians and Israelis between the river and the sea. Why shouldn't it be the Israelis who are evicted?
    Because they have nukes. Basically
    "The only solution is to pay off the Palestinians. Give them all condos in Egypt or Indonesia, anything. Give them £1m each."

    Human nature means that would not work. The attachment to history, to land, to soil, to myths and legends of a nation are far stronger than Trump's $.

    Would your extended family all agree to leave Cornwall and move to Albania in exchange for $1m?

    Each? Yes, probably

    Especially if Cornwall was a diseased toilet turned into a concentration camp, with no long term future of any change, just more of the same
    That's just a night out in Newquay...
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 10,528
    edited July 23
    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    Israel Palestine is the most potent geopolitical evidence for Larkin's immortal insight:

    Man hands on misery to man.
    It deepens like a coastal shelf.
    Get out as early as you can,
    And don’t have any kids yourself


    As the Germans did to the Jews, so the Jews are doing to the Palestinians. With the added complication that, given the chance, we all know that many many Gazans - far too many - would do exactly the same to every Jew they could find

    There is no solution other than the one proposed by - ironically - Trump. Move the Gazans away and stuff their mouths with gold
    Well, firstly it's not really a solution. Because giving $5,000 a person doesn't solve the issue that there's nowhere obvious else for them to go. Unless Israel is planning on letting them go to the West Bank.

    Which I'm guessing they aren't that keen on.

    And which brings us to the other problem. What about the West Bank? Every day - as you know from your travels there - the Israelis take control of more of the territory, and each day they make the lives of Palestinians there a little bit worse.

    At some point, the Palestinians will have been resrticted to an area, say, the size of Gaza. And will not doubt act out. As you would do in that scenario. And then are we to sanction another bit of ethnic cleansing?
    The only answer, or recourse, at this point is international isolation and sanctions, similar to the apartheid era's, on Netanyahu's government.
    The Israelis don't give a fuck. They've been through an actual Holocaust. International anger and being-banned-from-rugby is not gonna cut it
    That depends on how extensive the sanctions and international trade isolation would be.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 67,010
    Isn't Obama still a very popular figure in America?

    Saying you are going to arrest him isn't going help with Trump's dire ratings me thinks.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 52,291

    Isn't Obama still a very popular figure in America?

    Saying you are going to arrest him isn't going help with Trump's dire ratings me thinks.

    Its only a problem if there is another election...
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 32,178

    Andy_JS said:

    This is interesting.

    "Former Tory MP expelled by party after ‘serious complaints’

    Tom Hunt, Ipswich MP from 2019-24, tells The Telegraph: ‘I am deeply disappointed by this provisional decision’" (£)

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2025/07/21/former-tory-mp-tom-hunt-expelled-by-party-after-complaints

    Another one for Reform?
    Does Nigel really want Reform to become a dustbin for every disaffected Tory with a stalled career? He can probably rise above that now.
    I think it's more about recruitment of people relatively experienced in governing.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 36,522
    edited July 23
    "Cleverly refuses to endorse Badenoch’s stance on ECHR
    The Tory leader said last month she was ‘increasingly of the view that we will need to leave’ the treaty" (£)

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2025/07/23/cleverly-refuses-to-endorse-badenoch-ehcr-stance
  • Frank_BoothFrank_Booth Posts: 427

    I notice almost no-one so desperately concerned about the plight of the Palestinians has urged Egypt to open the border.

    Funny that.

    We would be interested to know what figures the world-renowned experts at the Frank Booth Foundation have for the true number of Palestinian casualties.
    I don't have any. But I have linked to data that comes from Hamas' own reporting. Are you unhappy with that?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 52,291

    Big polling report on Israelis' views of the possibility of peace, what to do with Gaza, etc.: https://www.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/20/2025/06/pg_2025.06.03_israel_report.pdf

    Interesting reading. Even now only 50% of Israelis think a 2 state solution impossible.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 10,528
    edited July 23
    Before the Eichmann trial, it's rarely remembered now that the Israeli Right was not actually greatly proud of Holocaust survivors. Ben-Gurion considered them weaklings.
  • Frank_BoothFrank_Booth Posts: 427
    edited July 23
    Foxy said:

    Big polling report on Israelis' views of the possibility of peace, what to do with Gaza, etc.: https://www.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/20/2025/06/pg_2025.06.03_israel_report.pdf

    Interesting reading. Even now only 50% of Israelis think a 2 state solution impossible.
    If only there'd been a party on the other side interested in a two state solution. Of course that wouldn't have satisfied their enablers in the Soviet Union, Tehran and Doha of course.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 129,088
    Andy_JS said:

    This is interesting.

    "Former Tory MP expelled by party after ‘serious complaints’

    Tom Hunt, Ipswich MP from 2019-24, tells The Telegraph: ‘I am deeply disappointed by this provisional decision’" (£)

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2025/07/21/former-tory-mp-tom-hunt-expelled-by-party-after-complaints

    I had lunch with Tom before the 2017 general election, disappointing as he seemed a decent guy and had been a hardworking MP
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 67,010

    Spencer Hakimian
    @SpencerHakimian


    Question: Does Trump support federal agencies contracting with Elon Musk's AI company?

    Leavitt: No.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 33,294
    WSJ doubling down on Epstein files.

    A tip for Donald Trump. "Don't f*** with Rupert Murdoch".
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 129,088
    Andy_JS said:

    "Cleverly refuses to endorse Badenoch’s stance on ECHR
    The Tory leader said last month she was ‘increasingly of the view that we will need to leave’ the treaty" (£)

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2025/07/23/cleverly-refuses-to-endorse-badenoch-ehcr-stance

    High risk for Kemi, if she does say we must leave the ECHR then ex Cleverly backing MPs will join Jenrick backing MPs to topple her
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 129,088
    Foxy said:

    Isn't Obama still a very popular figure in America?

    Saying you are going to arrest him isn't going help with Trump's dire ratings me thinks.

    Its only a problem if there is another election...
    Arresting a politician more popular than you is never a good idea, even if you have the army behind you for now
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 33,294
    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    So no one knows why @williamglenn is banned

    Did they come for him at 3AM, like the NKVD from the Lubyanka?

    The mod policy here is interesting, considering Cyclefree made a libellous claim about Beth Upton in the previous thread and got a free pass.
    Is there a PB superinjunction about merely discussing the fact a ban exists? Or why?

    Quite bizarre
    I think it would be useful if a post were stickied in PB on mod policy and what is and isn't allowed to be said.

    I'm hugely in favour of free speech which is why I have no issue with most of the comments posted here even when I disagree with them, though if I were Dr Upton I would probs consider legal action on the allegations made in the previous thread.

    Williamglenn is at best a provocateur and at worst an asshole and russian troll, but we probably deserve to know what he said and why he was banned for saying it.

    We know that rooming bangs aren't something we're allowed to discuss here, but what else gets the ban hammer (when libel doesn't?). A clear list of rules and 'do not cross' lines would be useful (especially for new commentators, who may not be familiar with edicts issued in threads months ago).
    It's a very good idea, as the number of Banning Offences is growing. the other day @TSE made - I think - a joking remark that linking to the Spectator is a bannable offence. I presume it was a gag, but it might not be

    Ditto the new rules on swearing at others, the unmentionable subjects, and so forth...

    The site can only function with rules, and the mods are entitled to impose rules as they see fit. We all accept that. But commenters can only function if they KNOW the rules
    So, I don't know why @williamglenn is no longer able to post, but it is worth remembering that 90% of bans are no such thing: most are 24 or 48 hour time outs after someone has overstepped a line.
    He started channelling the language of the far right with calls for self deportations of British citizens born outside the UK, something a few PBers called him out on.

    He was a few posts away talking about remigration.

    Last time I spoke to your Dad he didn’t want that kind of post to go unpunished.
    So he came out with political opinions you don't like. That's it?
    I have a new concept for you.

    Sit down. Get ready. Brace. Put a mouth guard in. This may hurt.

    Some ideas are unacceptable to decent people. Even when they are just ideas.
    So who are the "decent people". Who defines them? What is decent? I have a strange idea that you will be one of THE DECENT and those who you disagree with, not

    It is lucky there is a ban against foul language because I would now submit you to a finely crafted fusillade of the same. As it is I shall restrict myself to noting that you are morally repulsive
    Since you seem to have a low IQ, I’ll spell it out for you.

    OGH = Our Gracious Host

    This is his place. His definition of decent. @TheScreamingEagles is his emissary, enforcing his edicts.

    If you want to say things that OGH doesn’t like, you do it elsewhere.

    His house, his rules.
    Christ, can this site get any more pompous? The odour of the self righteous centrist dad is pungent, tonight
    You're the one being pompous. Making out that a poster getting 'banned' from PB for a couple of days is some sort of moral atrocity. The free-thinking outlaw renegades being censored by a stultifying middlebrow centrist blob. It's the most utter self-regarding preeny precious tosh.
    Once, just once, say something interesting. Or funny. Or clever. Or witty. Just once?

    Somewhere in that desolate pit of nullity that is your golfing non-soul, there must be ONE comment worth making
    Quite content with that one for now.
    I find it remarkable that @Leon feels it acceptable to be personally offensive to several posters who don't share his rather unusual edgy brand of unpleasant politics.

    What I find even more remarkable is whenever I have challenged @Leon for some of his very peculiar social and political opinions I get duffed up by his fanbois.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 20,772
    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    Israel Palestine is the most potent geopolitical evidence for Larkin's immortal insight:

    Man hands on misery to man.
    It deepens like a coastal shelf.
    Get out as early as you can,
    And don’t have any kids yourself


    As the Germans did to the Jews, so the Jews are doing to the Palestinians. With the added complication that, given the chance, we all know that many many Gazans - far too many - would do exactly the same to every Jew they could find

    There is no solution other than the one proposed by - ironically - Trump. Move the Gazans away and stuff their mouths with gold
    Well, firstly it's not really a solution. Because giving $5,000 a person doesn't solve the issue that there's nowhere obvious else for them to go. Unless Israel is planning on letting them go to the West Bank.

    Which I'm guessing they aren't that keen on.

    And which brings us to the other problem. What about the West Bank? Every day - as you know from your travels there - the Israelis take control of more of the territory, and each day they make the lives of Palestinians there a little bit worse.

    At some point, the Palestinians will have been resrticted to an area, say, the size of Gaza. And will not doubt act out. As you would do in that scenario. And then are we to sanction another bit of ethnic cleansing?
    The only answer, or recourse, at this point is international isolation and sanctions, similar to the apartheid era's, on Netanyahu's government.
    The Israelis don't give a fuck. They've been through an actual Holocaust. International anger and being-banned-from-rugby is not gonna cut it
    Less than 1% holocaust survivors in Israel
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 55,235

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    So no one knows why @williamglenn is banned

    Did they come for him at 3AM, like the NKVD from the Lubyanka?

    The mod policy here is interesting, considering Cyclefree made a libellous claim about Beth Upton in the previous thread and got a free pass.
    Is there a PB superinjunction about merely discussing the fact a ban exists? Or why?

    Quite bizarre
    I think it would be useful if a post were stickied in PB on mod policy and what is and isn't allowed to be said.

    I'm hugely in favour of free speech which is why I have no issue with most of the comments posted here even when I disagree with them, though if I were Dr Upton I would probs consider legal action on the allegations made in the previous thread.

    Williamglenn is at best a provocateur and at worst an asshole and russian troll, but we probably deserve to know what he said and why he was banned for saying it.

    We know that rooming bangs aren't something we're allowed to discuss here, but what else gets the ban hammer (when libel doesn't?). A clear list of rules and 'do not cross' lines would be useful (especially for new commentators, who may not be familiar with edicts issued in threads months ago).
    It's a very good idea, as the number of Banning Offences is growing. the other day @TSE made - I think - a joking remark that linking to the Spectator is a bannable offence. I presume it was a gag, but it might not be

    Ditto the new rules on swearing at others, the unmentionable subjects, and so forth...

    The site can only function with rules, and the mods are entitled to impose rules as they see fit. We all accept that. But commenters can only function if they KNOW the rules
    So, I don't know why @williamglenn is no longer able to post, but it is worth remembering that 90% of bans are no such thing: most are 24 or 48 hour time outs after someone has overstepped a line.
    He started channelling the language of the far right with calls for self deportations of British citizens born outside the UK, something a few PBers called him out on.

    He was a few posts away talking about remigration.

    Last time I spoke to your Dad he didn’t want that kind of post to go unpunished.
    So he came out with political opinions you don't like. That's it?
    I have a new concept for you.

    Sit down. Get ready. Brace. Put a mouth guard in. This may hurt.

    Some ideas are unacceptable to decent people. Even when they are just ideas.
    So who are the "decent people". Who defines them? What is decent? I have a strange idea that you will be one of THE DECENT and those who you disagree with, not

    It is lucky there is a ban against foul language because I would now submit you to a finely crafted fusillade of the same. As it is I shall restrict myself to noting that you are morally repulsive
    Since you seem to have a low IQ, I’ll spell it out for you.

    OGH = Our Gracious Host

    This is his place. His definition of decent. @TheScreamingEagles is his emissary, enforcing his edicts.

    If you want to say things that OGH doesn’t like, you do it elsewhere.

    His house, his rules.
    Christ, can this site get any more pompous? The odour of the self righteous centrist dad is pungent, tonight
    You're the one being pompous. Making out that a poster getting 'banned' from PB for a couple of days is some sort of moral atrocity. The free-thinking outlaw renegades being censored by a stultifying middlebrow centrist blob. It's the most utter self-regarding preeny precious tosh.
    Once, just once, say something interesting. Or funny. Or clever. Or witty. Just once?

    Somewhere in that desolate pit of nullity that is your golfing non-soul, there must be ONE comment worth making
    Quite content with that one for now.
    I find it remarkable that @Leon feels it acceptable to be personally offensive to several posters who don't share his rather unusual edgy brand of unpleasant politics.

    What I find even more remarkable is whenever I have challenged @Leon for some of his very peculiar social and political opinions I get duffed up by his fanbois.
    Because he's a Centrist Dad in denial?
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 4,740
    Roger said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    Israel Palestine is the most potent geopolitical evidence for Larkin's immortal insight:

    Man hands on misery to man.
    It deepens like a coastal shelf.
    Get out as early as you can,
    And don’t have any kids yourself


    As the Germans did to the Jews, so the Jews are doing to the Palestinians. With the added complication that, given the chance, we all know that many many Gazans - far too many - would do exactly the same to every Jew they could find

    There is no solution other than the one proposed by - ironically - Trump. Move the Gazans away and stuff their mouths with gold
    Well, firstly it's not really a solution. Because giving $5,000 a person doesn't solve the issue that there's nowhere obvious else for them to go. Unless Israel is planning on letting them go to the West Bank.

    Which I'm guessing they aren't that keen on.

    And which brings us to the other problem. What about the West Bank? Every day - as you know from your travels there - the Israelis take control of more of the territory, and each day they make the lives of Palestinians there a little bit worse.

    At some point, the Palestinians will have been resrticted to an area, say, the size of Gaza. And will not doubt act out. As you would do in that scenario. And then are we to sanction another bit of ethnic cleansing?
    The only answer, or recourse, at this point is international isolation and sanctions, similar to the apartheid era's, on Netanyahu's government.
    The Israelis don't give a fuck. They've been through an actual Holocaust. International anger and being-banned-from-rugby is not gonna cut it
    Less than 1% holocaust survivors in Israel
    There's more holocaust victims in Gaza than survivors in Israel.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 52,291
    Well done Spain.

    It will be a tough match on Sunday.
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 4,740
    Foxy said:

    Well done Spain.

    It will be a tough match on Sunday.

    England need to play out of their skins.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 39,370
    @ReallyAmerican1

    Trump BUSTED Lying on Video: In a shocking reveal, Trump denied on July 15 that he was told his name appears in the Epstein files. The Wall Street Journal just revealed in that he was informed by the DOJ in May.

    https://x.com/ReallyAmerican1/status/1948111027624640897
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 67,010

    Kemi Badenoch

    @KemiBadenoch

    Conservatives will deport any asylum seeker who commits a crime. No ifs, no buts.

    https://x.com/KemiBadenoch/status/1948097720851607956


    How?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 67,010
    Scott_xP said:

    @ReallyAmerican1

    Trump BUSTED Lying on Video: In a shocking reveal, Trump denied on July 15 that he was told his name appears in the Epstein files. The Wall Street Journal just revealed in that he was informed by the DOJ in May.

    https://x.com/ReallyAmerican1/status/1948111027624640897

    Maybe he forgot?

  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 79,567
    HYUFD said:

    Foxy said:

    Isn't Obama still a very popular figure in America?

    Saying you are going to arrest him isn't going help with Trump's dire ratings me thinks.

    Its only a problem if there is another election...
    Arresting a politician more popular than you is never a good idea, even if you have the army behind you for now
    Fox News Publishes Op-Ed Warning Tulsi Gabbard’s Obama Accusations Are a Dangerous ‘Effort to Rewrite History’
    https://x.com/nedprice/status/1948120252111630646
  • RogerRoger Posts: 20,772

    Roger said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    Israel Palestine is the most potent geopolitical evidence for Larkin's immortal insight:

    Man hands on misery to man.
    It deepens like a coastal shelf.
    Get out as early as you can,
    And don’t have any kids yourself


    As the Germans did to the Jews, so the Jews are doing to the Palestinians. With the added complication that, given the chance, we all know that many many Gazans - far too many - would do exactly the same to every Jew they could find

    There is no solution other than the one proposed by - ironically - Trump. Move the Gazans away and stuff their mouths with gold
    Well, firstly it's not really a solution. Because giving $5,000 a person doesn't solve the issue that there's nowhere obvious else for them to go. Unless Israel is planning on letting them go to the West Bank.

    Which I'm guessing they aren't that keen on.

    And which brings us to the other problem. What about the West Bank? Every day - as you know from your travels there - the Israelis take control of more of the territory, and each day they make the lives of Palestinians there a little bit worse.

    At some point, the Palestinians will have been resrticted to an area, say, the size of Gaza. And will not doubt act out. As you would do in that scenario. And then are we to sanction another bit of ethnic cleansing?
    The only answer, or recourse, at this point is international isolation and sanctions, similar to the apartheid era's, on Netanyahu's government.
    The Israelis don't give a fuck. They've been through an actual Holocaust. International anger and being-banned-from-rugby is not gonna cut it
    Less than 1% holocaust survivors in Israel
    There's more holocaust victims in Gaza than survivors in Israel.
    That's true. Extraordinary. Look at the rest of the photographic sequence posted by DavidL. Thery're on BBC News. Up there with the Vietnamese nepalm photo of the burning girl. Starvation pictures of children are particularly penetrating.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 67,010
    The Lincoln Project
    @ProjectLincoln
    ·
    1h
    So let me get this straight - @dbongino @PamBondi and Kash Patel are all working for a guy in the Epstein files after they made it their entire mission to expose the corruption and the list.

    https://x.com/ProjectLincoln


  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 39,370
    @WilliamHill

    The Lionesses will face Spain in the Women's Euro final on Sunday.

    🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 - 15/8
    🇪🇸 - 2/5
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 39,370
    @briantylercohen.bsky.social‬

    BREAKING: Oversight Democrats just passed a motion in subcommittee to subpoena the DOJ to release the Epstein files. Total vote was 8-2 in favor (all Democrats voted in favor, 3 Rs for and 2 Rs against)

    https://bsky.app/profile/briantylercohen.bsky.social/post/3lunx7hwpk22l
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 46,368
    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    So no one knows why @williamglenn is banned

    Did they come for him at 3AM, like the NKVD from the Lubyanka?

    The mod policy here is interesting, considering Cyclefree made a libellous claim about Beth Upton in the previous thread and got a free pass.
    Is there a PB superinjunction about merely discussing the fact a ban exists? Or why?

    Quite bizarre
    I think it would be useful if a post were stickied in PB on mod policy and what is and isn't allowed to be said.

    I'm hugely in favour of free speech which is why I have no issue with most of the comments posted here even when I disagree with them, though if I were Dr Upton I would probs consider legal action on the allegations made in the previous thread.

    Williamglenn is at best a provocateur and at worst an asshole and russian troll, but we probably deserve to know what he said and why he was banned for saying it.

    We know that rooming bangs aren't something we're allowed to discuss here, but what else gets the ban hammer (when libel doesn't?). A clear list of rules and 'do not cross' lines would be useful (especially for new commentators, who may not be familiar with edicts issued in threads months ago).
    It's a very good idea, as the number of Banning Offences is growing. the other day @TSE made - I think - a joking remark that linking to the Spectator is a bannable offence. I presume it was a gag, but it might not be

    Ditto the new rules on swearing at others, the unmentionable subjects, and so forth...

    The site can only function with rules, and the mods are entitled to impose rules as they see fit. We all accept that. But commenters can only function if they KNOW the rules
    So, I don't know why @williamglenn is no longer able to post, but it is worth remembering that 90% of bans are no such thing: most are 24 or 48 hour time outs after someone has overstepped a line.
    He started channelling the language of the far right with calls for self deportations of British citizens born outside the UK, something a few PBers called him out on.

    He was a few posts away talking about remigration.

    Last time I spoke to your Dad he didn’t want that kind of post to go unpunished.
    So he came out with political opinions you don't like. That's it?
    I have a new concept for you.

    Sit down. Get ready. Brace. Put a mouth guard in. This may hurt.

    Some ideas are unacceptable to decent people. Even when they are just ideas.
    So who are the "decent people". Who defines them? What is decent? I have a strange idea that you will be one of THE DECENT and those who you disagree with, not

    It is lucky there is a ban against foul language because I would now submit you to a finely crafted fusillade of the same. As it is I shall restrict myself to noting that you are morally repulsive
    Since you seem to have a low IQ, I’ll spell it out for you.

    OGH = Our Gracious Host

    This is his place. His definition of decent. @TheScreamingEagles is his emissary, enforcing his edicts.

    If you want to say things that OGH doesn’t like, you do it elsewhere.

    His house, his rules.
    Christ, can this site get any more pompous? The odour of the self righteous centrist dad is pungent, tonight
    You're the one being pompous. Making out that a poster getting 'banned' from PB for a couple of days is some sort of moral atrocity. The free-thinking outlaw renegades being censored by a stultifying middlebrow centrist blob. It's the most utter self-regarding preeny precious tosh.
    Once, just once, say something interesting. Or funny. Or clever. Or witty. Just once?

    Somewhere in that desolate pit of nullity that is your golfing non-soul, there must be ONE comment worth making
    Quite content with that one for now.
    I can imagine. Like a desperately constipated gnu excreting a mackerel's eye. You tried to be funny, or biting, and you failed, but at least you got something out
    I might call for public ownership of the utilities next.

    Anyway I see you're being very interesting by saying Donald Trump's 'plan' to turn Gaza into a resort complex for international holidaymakers is the way to resolve the Israel Palestine conflict rather than bland vanilla stuff like using US leverage to pressure Israel to stop massacring Palestinians and recognise their statehood and sovereignty over a suitable territory in the region.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 79,567
    Nigelb said:

    HYUFD said:

    Foxy said:

    Isn't Obama still a very popular figure in America?

    Saying you are going to arrest him isn't going help with Trump's dire ratings me thinks.

    Its only a problem if there is another election...
    Arresting a politician more popular than you is never a good idea, even if you have the army behind you for now
    Fox News Publishes Op-Ed Warning Tulsi Gabbard’s Obama Accusations Are a Dangerous ‘Effort to Rewrite History’
    https://x.com/nedprice/status/1948120252111630646
    Fox News.

    For a moment there, I saw a glimmer of hope for the US.

    Then I saw this poll.

    Jul 23 poll of 2,243 U.S. adults (+/-2.9%)
    % who think Adam Sandler is very or somewhat funny | not very or not at all funny
    U.S. adults: 71% | 22%
    18-29: 67% | 19%
    30-44: 78% | 15%
    45-64: 72% | 23%
    65+: 64% | 30%

    https://x.com/YouGovAmerica/status/1948111924794667051
  • RogerRoger Posts: 20,772
    edited July 23

    I notice almost no-one so desperately concerned about the plight of the Palestinians has urged Egypt to open the border.

    Funny that.

    I know you have said you don't know any Jews or any Arabs. But do you actually think Egyptians and Palestinians are one and the same.? Are they just 'darkies'?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 67,010
    Scott_xP said:

    @briantylercohen.bsky.social‬

    BREAKING: Oversight Democrats just passed a motion in subcommittee to subpoena the DOJ to release the Epstein files. Total vote was 8-2 in favor (all Democrats voted in favor, 3 Rs for and 2 Rs against)

    https://bsky.app/profile/briantylercohen.bsky.social/post/3lunx7hwpk22l

    Didn't Johnson shut down congress early? How does this work?
  • RattersRatters Posts: 1,401
    I think we're at the point where we need to put in place comprehensive sanctions on Israel.

    I gave them the benefit of the doubt initially after a October 7th, but they are now clearly much closer to the 'genocide' end of the spectrum than they are the 'legitimate self defence' end.

    It won't make any difference but we and like-minded countries should do it anyway.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 30,348

    WSJ doubling down on Epstein files.

    A tip for Donald Trump. "Don't f*** with Rupert Murdoch".

    Jerry Hall said that.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 30,348


    Kemi Badenoch

    @KemiBadenoch

    Conservatives will deport any asylum seeker who commits a crime. No ifs, no buts.

    https://x.com/KemiBadenoch/status/1948097720851607956


    How?

    And more pertinently why not when they were in government?
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 46,368
    HYUFD said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Cleverly refuses to endorse Badenoch’s stance on ECHR
    The Tory leader said last month she was ‘increasingly of the view that we will need to leave’ the treaty" (£)

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2025/07/23/cleverly-refuses-to-endorse-badenoch-ehcr-stance

    High risk for Kemi, if she does say we must leave the ECHR then ex Cleverly backing MPs will join Jenrick backing MPs to topple her
    Stride is 40/1 for next leader. Worth a couple of quid iyo?
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 30,348
    Trump lying and rewriting history?
    Whatever the fuck next?
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 39,370

    Scott_xP said:

    @briantylercohen.bsky.social‬

    BREAKING: Oversight Democrats just passed a motion in subcommittee to subpoena the DOJ to release the Epstein files. Total vote was 8-2 in favor (all Democrats voted in favor, 3 Rs for and 2 Rs against)

    https://bsky.app/profile/briantylercohen.bsky.social/post/3lunx7hwpk22l

    Didn't Johnson shut down congress early? How does this work?
    They can't debate it or vote on the floor (I think) but this appears to be a committee which can maybe still examine evidence
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 67,010
    Scott_xP said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @briantylercohen.bsky.social‬

    BREAKING: Oversight Democrats just passed a motion in subcommittee to subpoena the DOJ to release the Epstein files. Total vote was 8-2 in favor (all Democrats voted in favor, 3 Rs for and 2 Rs against)

    https://bsky.app/profile/briantylercohen.bsky.social/post/3lunx7hwpk22l

    Didn't Johnson shut down congress early? How does this work?
    They can't debate it or vote on the floor (I think) but this appears to be a committee which can maybe still examine evidence
    It would all be a lot quicker if one of Elon's software kids just dumped the bloody files on Github and let's be done with it.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 67,010
    dixiedean said:

    Trump lying and rewriting history?
    Whatever the fuck next?

    Greenland is enjoying a v rare heatwave. Time to invade and stop them sitting around in swim suits?
  • MonkeysMonkeys Posts: 808

    I notice almost no-one so desperately concerned about the plight of the Palestinians has urged Egypt to open the border.

    Funny that.

    Egypt are aligned with Turkey who are opposed to Iran, my feeling is that Iran and Turkey are the meaningful poles in the ME. I can see Turkey rolling over the top of Northern Iraq and Northern Syria and they already have military actions there, both of those are only countries on paper, not reality.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 39,370

    Scott_xP said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @briantylercohen.bsky.social‬

    BREAKING: Oversight Democrats just passed a motion in subcommittee to subpoena the DOJ to release the Epstein files. Total vote was 8-2 in favor (all Democrats voted in favor, 3 Rs for and 2 Rs against)

    https://bsky.app/profile/briantylercohen.bsky.social/post/3lunx7hwpk22l

    Didn't Johnson shut down congress early? How does this work?
    They can't debate it or vote on the floor (I think) but this appears to be a committee which can maybe still examine evidence
    It would all be a lot quicker if one of Elon's software kids just dumped the bloody files on Github and let's be done with it.
    The good news is that Johnson has firmly placed himself on the MAGA 'protecting pedophiles (sic)' list
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 25,308
    Andy_JS said:

    Was Charles upper-class?

    Given that he used the term "cadet branch" when describing his family tree and put a link to his father's obituary in the papers and showed pictures of one of his (ancestor's?) homes, he was possibly the most upper-class poster the site's ever had. But I think not the richest.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 67,010
    edited July 23
    dixiedean said:


    Kemi Badenoch

    @KemiBadenoch

    Conservatives will deport any asylum seeker who commits a crime. No ifs, no buts.

    https://x.com/KemiBadenoch/status/1948097720851607956


    How?

    And more pertinently why not when they were in government?
    She's always saying 'i was trained as a software engineer' and 'project management' etc etc.

    So why not just say - we failed to do this in government because of X and Y and Z and so logically these are the things I will sort?

    Until she can explain, or indeed Farage can explain, how they will make the Home Office fit for purpose on its current funding then they should shut the f up.

  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 36,522
    "Scottish Daily Mail
    @MailOnlineScot

    🗞️Thursday's Scottish Daily Mail front page: Asylum seekers gambling away taxpayer cash

    #TomorrowsPapersToday #scotpapers
    👉 Read more on #MailOnline http://dailymail.co.uk/scotland"

    https://x.com/MailOnlineScot/status/1948140764094947406
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 5,137
    Monkeys said:

    I notice almost no-one so desperately concerned about the plight of the Palestinians has urged Egypt to open the border.

    Funny that.

    Egypt are aligned with Turkey who are opposed to Iran, my feeling is that Iran and Turkey are the meaningful poles in the ME. I can see Turkey rolling over the top of Northern Iraq and Northern Syria and they already have military actions there, both of those are only countries on paper, not reality.
    Lovely country you've got there. Shame if something.... 'appened to it.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 55,235

    dixiedean said:

    Trump lying and rewriting history?
    Whatever the fuck next?

    Greenland is enjoying a v rare heatwave. Time to invade and stop them sitting around in swim suits?
    "Nuuk 'em!"
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 5,137
    dixiedean said:

    WSJ doubling down on Epstein files.

    A tip for Donald Trump. "Don't f*** with Rupert Murdoch".

    Jerry Hall said that.
    You're pegging your comment on very little....
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 33,294
    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    DavidL said:

    God, I feel sick: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce9xkx7vnmxo

    This is the holocaust all over again. This time done by Jews.

    Oh, but you who philosophize, disgrace and criticize all fears
    Bury the rag deep in your face for now's the time for your tears

    Israel Palestine is the most potent geopolitical evidence for Larkin's immortal insight:

    Man hands on misery to man.
    It deepens like a coastal shelf.
    Get out as early as you can,
    And don’t have any kids yourself


    As the Germans did to the Jews, so the Jews are doing to the Palestinians. With the added complication that, given the chance, we all know that many many Gazans - far too many - would do exactly the same to every Jew they could find

    There is no solution other than the one proposed by - ironically - Trump. Move the Gazans away and stuff their mouths with gold
    Well, firstly it's not really a solution. Because giving $5,000 a person doesn't solve the issue that there's nowhere obvious else for them to go. Unless Israel is planning on letting them go to the West Bank.

    Which I'm guessing they aren't that keen on.

    And which brings us to the other problem. What about the West Bank? Every day - as you know from your travels there - the Israelis take control of more of the territory, and each day they make the lives of Palestinians there a little bit worse.

    At some point, the Palestinians will have been resrticted to an area, say, the size of Gaza. And will not doubt act out. As you would do in that scenario. And then are we to sanction another bit of ethnic cleansing?
    I agree that $5k is nowhere near enough. But there will be a price where it might work. $50k? $500k per Palestinian? At some point it will be worth it, for the majority of them, and the host country will also have to be very very amply rewarded
    So you are advocating ethnic cleansing, but with a token to a modestly generous bounty. Who pays the half a million buck x 10 million people? Have you thought this through sober?
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 25,308

    Got hit by a car at work today, so I'm now in hospital with three ribs and an ankle broken

    Ouch! That's bad. I hope that they are treating you well. I hope the recovery goes as well as possible.
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 5,137

    Scott_xP said:

    @briantylercohen.bsky.social‬

    BREAKING: Oversight Democrats just passed a motion in subcommittee to subpoena the DOJ to release the Epstein files. Total vote was 8-2 in favor (all Democrats voted in favor, 3 Rs for and 2 Rs against)

    https://bsky.app/profile/briantylercohen.bsky.social/post/3lunx7hwpk22l

    Didn't Johnson shut down congress early? How does this work?
    Johnson always claims to be 'shutting down congress early' but then ends up with another sprog and/or wife...

    Oh!

    Different Johnson!
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