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Ipsos brings bad news for Starmer – politicalbetting.com

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  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 32,526
    kinabalu said:

    It looks like it will get far, far worse for Starmer.

    Nick Ferrari crucified Labour today for neither agreeing with Trump's weekend win nor support for Iran. It would seem to be a binary choice and Starmer doesn't know if he supports the Mullahs or Trump. Macron, Merz and Carney also seem to be fence sitting, if not as badly, almost as badly as Starmer..

    The Tories on the other hand in the form of Cartlidge and Shappsy have gone full on for the pro-Trump win and are super critical of Starmer's treason. Most Tories and Reformers have all gone full on Barty Bobbins.

    Team Kemi winning here!

    Nick Ferrari shows the way. A man with clear opinions not afraid to express them. Why oh why can't our wet blanket of a PM take a leaf from this crisp and decisive radio talkshow host?
    He's had a few big gotchas over the last fortnight with peculiar binary questions. One would think no Government Minister would touch him with a barge pole, but still they do. Tomorrow's gotcha is Met Police Commissioner Rowley.
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 24,930
    kinabalu said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Trump will feel enormous pressure to hit back
    Gary O'Donoghue
    Chief North America correspondent, Washington DC"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/cn7ze4vmk2pt

    He should do nothing. If he responds it will be gratuitous, self-indulgent and foolish. Iran's action (so far) is symbolic, for face, de-escalatory.

    C'mon DT, surprise on the upside. It's about time you did. Big chance here. Do not forsake it.
    He surprised on the upside when he didn't TACO out and took out Fordow.

    Don't worry, he'll return to type and TACO this time. He's not going to take out the Mullahs, unfortunately.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 11,077
    edited June 23

    It looks like it will get far, far worse for Starmer.

    Nick Ferrari crucified Labour today for neither agreeing with Trump's weekend win nor support for Iran. It would seem to be a binary choice and Starmer doesn't know if he supports the Mullahs or Trump. Macron, Merz and Carney also seem to be fence sitting, if not as badly, almost as badly as Starmer..

    The Tories on the other hand in the form of Cartlidge and Shappsy have gone full on for the pro-Trump win and are super critical of Starmer's treason. Most Tories and Reformers have all gone full on Barty Bobbins.

    Team Kemi winning here!

    I find it amusing that here at Mullah Corner, my view that we shouldn't allow nuclear proliferation to Iran is a "full on" position, while standing back and doing nothing to stop the Mullahs from getting nukes is considered the sensible, moderate position.
    I don't disagree, but don't pretend you've been banging on about it for months or years - Hamas has been your pre-occupation. It's a very sudden concern, and you should be aware of how easily you could be misled on this issue.

    At the moment we depend on the Netanyahu and Trump administrations for the truth. Fills one with confidence. /s
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 30,499
    Now Trump is attacking journalists on Lie Social. How Dare They question his statement that the Fordaw site was "totally destroyed". That Netanyahu had to fire missiles at the "totally destroyed" site after it was "totally destroyed" is a clue.

    Small-dick TACO action.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 32,526
    edited June 23

    It looks like it will get far, far worse for Starmer.

    Nick Ferrari crucified Labour today for neither agreeing with Trump's weekend win nor support for Iran. It would seem to be a binary choice and Starmer doesn't know if he supports the Mullahs or Trump. Macron, Merz and Carney also seem to be fence sitting, if not as badly, almost as badly as Starmer..

    The Tories on the other hand in the form of Cartlidge and Shappsy have gone full on for the pro-Trump win and are super critical of Starmer's treason. Most Tories and Reformers have all gone full on Barty Bobbins.

    Team Kemi winning here!

    I find it amusing that here at Mullah Corner, my view that we shouldn't allow nuclear proliferation to Iran is a "full on" position, while standing back and doing nothing to stop the Mullahs from getting nukes is considered the sensible, moderate position.
    Why would men of the cloth need weapons of mass destruction anyway?

    I don't want to see the Mullahs with nukes either. But neither do I want to see absolute f*****' headers like Trump, Putin or Netanyahu ( or Modi for that matter) anywhere near a nuclear button.

    Do you believe Trump would baulk at nuking 10 million Tehranians or 90 million Iranians? He wouldn't give a f***! Last week I thought that might be wrong because of the retaliatory ramifications, but now I know he couldn't give a shiny one. It would cement Trump into the hardman of the World history books.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 10,287
    I'd love to see the back of the Mullahs, but what is the plan for afterwards ? The Shah"s son is not universally popular, and there's about 150k Irgc.
  • maxhmaxh Posts: 1,676

    Now Trump is attacking journalists on Lie Social. How Dare They question his statement that the Fordaw site was "totally destroyed". That Netanyahu had to fire missiles at the "totally destroyed" site after it was "totally destroyed" is a clue.

    Small-dick TACO action.

    I wonder in what proportion Trump's decision-making about whether to send in the B2's or not was driven by his snowflake-like dislike of the TACO label. I suspect its a scarily high proportion.
  • TheValiantTheValiant Posts: 1,993
    Nigelb said:

    Am I the only one who thinks Starmer is doing okay (just okay, not amazing)?

    I'm not so deluded as to think the UK is a world power, or even a major regional one anymore.

    I don't think whomever is in charge could seriously turn things around; whether that be Badenoch, Starmer, Farage, Davey or Denyer.

    We're living in bad times, with bad actors like Trump, Xi, Putin all pretending to be the good guys but doing horrible things, and no one really wants to make the tough choices to stop them, or explain to us that, yep, our economies are so interlinked if Trump fucks up America, he fucks up the world.....

    I agree. Given a hypothetical choice, a world run by, say, Starmer and Macron would be considerably safer and saner than one run by Trump, Netanyahu and Putin.
    There'd be the risk of Leon expiring from boredom, but I think we might just live with that.
    He could always watch "Threads" again, to keep him going........
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 44,087

    I'd love to see the back of the Mullahs, but what is the plan for afterwards ? The Shah"s son is not universally popular, and there's about 150k Irgc.

    This is quite informative, if not especially encouraging.

    https://x.com/thecyrusjanssen/status/1936939653879439617
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 32,526
    edited June 23
    Andy_JS said:

    Just spent 5 mins on BlueSky. Discovered most people on there don't like Israel very much. Left the site.

    Are you sure you ( and perhaps they) are not conflating Netanyahu with the people of Israel? I call that the Corbyn Conundrum.

    Best off on X. A lot of people there don't like Israel for wholly different reasons.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 10,287
    Khomeini planned for this moment for 70 years, by creating a huge Republican guard corps. First there's he question of them, and then of whioor what could replace the regime.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 32,526

    viewcode said:

    Speaking of which, your regular reminder that several PBers have Bluesky accounts

    https://bsky.app/starter-pack/mattwardman.bsky.social/3lfk4fvp5yv26

    PBers blathering on how they stay away from Bluesky cos it's a woke echo chamber remind me a bit of those who kept endlessly reminding everyone of which other PBers they'd blocked. Why quietly ignore people/things when you can make a big song and dance about it is very much the zeitgeist.
    A certain brand of PBer surely.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 4,022

    Now Trump is attacking journalists on Lie Social. How Dare They question his statement that the Fordaw site was "totally destroyed". That Netanyahu had to fire missiles at the "totally destroyed" site after it was "totally destroyed" is a clue.

    Small-dick TACO action.

    They had to even more totally destroy it, totally.
  • TheValiantTheValiant Posts: 1,993
    DavidL said:

    For a bunch of insane psychopaths, desperate to meet a bunch of virgins (why, by the way, surely someone who knows what they're doing...never mind) .......

    I really want you to continue that train of thought!

    As a good staunch atheist, I never thought of it that way, but you're right.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 10,287
    Sorry for the typos - *the* question of them, and then *who or what*.
  • eekeek Posts: 30,354

    I'd love to see the back of the Mullahs, but what is the plan for afterwards ? The Shah"s son is not universally popular, and there's about 150k Irgc.

    This is quite informative, if not especially encouraging.

    https://x.com/thecyrusjanssen/status/1936939653879439617
    Got to say u can’t fault a single thing he says - better the devil you know than the disaster that is Lebanon, Iraq or Syria
  • FffsFffs Posts: 107

    DavidL said:

    For a bunch of insane psychopaths, desperate to meet a bunch of virgins (why, by the way, surely someone who knows what they're doing...never mind) .......

    I really want you to continue that train of thought!

    As a good staunch atheist, I never thought of it that way, but you're right.
    More to the point, if someone's main virtue is that they're a virgin you're going to be disappointed pretty quickly… Even 99 of them aren't going to last long when you have all eternity.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 55,254

    I'd love to see the back of the Mullahs, but what is the plan for afterwards ? The Shah"s son is not universally popular, and there's about 150k Irgc.

    When the end comes, the IRGC will melt away like the rest.

    The most probable end is that the grip of the regime slips. It’s worth noting that there is a functioning electoral system - just one where the candidates are all vetted to be religious nutters.

    The Shah’s son means nothing to the millions of very young Iranians. They want, in general, the removal of the religious control of politics.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 31,268
    viewcode said:

    OT Vanilla is planning to randomly break PB over the next couple of weeks.

    How, plz?

    PRODUCTION Environment Maintenance: June 24–July 4, 2025
    Jun 24, 2025 17:00 - Jul 5, 2025 17:00 EDT
    We will be performing scheduled maintenance on our PRODUCTION environments from June 24 through July 4, 2025. This is part of our continued efforts to improve reliability, performance, and security.

    Impacted Plans levels:
    Essential
    Corporate

    If you have any questions or concerns, please reach out to our support team.
    Posted on Jun 23, 2025 - 13:52 EDT

    https://status.vanillaforums.com/

    That is the Vanilla status page, and iirc you can also sign up for email alerts. I have many infrastructure status pages bookmarked so I can quickly check any outage is not my fault. Saves a lot of pointless troubleshooting.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 10,287

    I'd love to see the back of the Mullahs, but what is the plan for afterwards ? The Shah"s son is not universally popular, and there's about 150k Irgc.

    This is quite informative, if not especially encouraging.

    https://x.com/thecyrusjanssen/status/1936939653879439617
    Indeed. It's an awful dilemma Iranians ; Either risk becoming Iraq, or risk missing one of the only chances to shake off another 100 years of the Mullahs' nightmare.

    Poor country, I feel for Iran.
  • TheValiantTheValiant Posts: 1,993

    Qatar threatening to respond to the attack. Regional war anyone?

    Nawh.

    We're all off to the Winchester and let this whole thing blow over.........

    (Iran is desperately trying to de-escalate now, whilst pretending their response is heavy for domestic consumption and they've definitely killed at least 1 trillion American soldiers, yes siree.)

    Iran's government (that survived) is going to try and wind down as fast and as hard as they can, without giving any ideas to their people that there response wasn't tough enough. They're desperate to stay in power and they know a full scale response (even if they could mount it, and I doubt they could anymore) means they're finished.

    Will it work?

    If Trump wasn't US President, and Netanyhu wasn't Israeli PM, I'd say it was very likely to work........
  • Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 5,658
    maxh said:

    Now Trump is attacking journalists on Lie Social. How Dare They question his statement that the Fordaw site was "totally destroyed". That Netanyahu had to fire missiles at the "totally destroyed" site after it was "totally destroyed" is a clue.

    Small-dick TACO action.

    I wonder in what proportion Trump's decision-making about whether to send in the B2's or not was driven by his snowflake-like dislike of the TACO label. I suspect its a scarily high proportion.
    My somewhat meta reading has been that, with the TACO label ringing in his ears, Trump didn't act the hard man, rather he chickened out of chickening out. TACOOCO.
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 4,956
    viewcode said:

    Speaking of which, your regular reminder that several PBers have Bluesky accounts

    https://bsky.app/starter-pack/mattwardman.bsky.social/3lfk4fvp5yv26

    Ta! I have blindly pressed 'Follow All' :-)
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 10,287
    An awful dilemma *for* Iranians, that should ofcourse be.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 32,526
    DavidL said:

    Yokes said:

    I said in my post last night, do not rule out the Iranians doing something symbolic, telegraphing it, claiming success and then stopping the cycle with the Americans.

    Stories have it the attack on the airbase in Qatar is right along those lines. The airbase, and the ports in Bahrain were largely emptied last week.

    For a bunch of insane psychopaths, desperate to meet a bunch of virgins (why, by the way, surely someone who knows what they're doing...never mind) the Mullahs have shown themselves to be pragmatic and very cautious over the last few years. I think a symbolic gesture would fit.
    A bigly genius would procure his 72 virgins from Jeffrey Epstein without having to vaporise himself in a retaliatory nuclear attack.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 60,370
    moonshine said:

    Taz said:

    Sandpit said:

    *de-lurks*

    Is World War III about to kick off?

    *re-lurks*

    Can I plead with you to delurk permanently? The whys and wherefores of the last war seem meaningless compared to the direct realities of this new war. You are far closer than we are and your input to discussions would be very much appreciated.
    Ah but will he be treated with courtesy and respect, or subjected to the usual PB purity test where not holding one view automatically makes you a shill for our enemies ?

    With his personal investment in both Ukraine and the Middle East why subject yourself to it from people thousands of miles away 🤔
    Physical location does not matter. Neither does stated attachments.

    You simply cannot support Ukraine and Trump. I treated @Sandpit with courtesy and respect, whilst pointing that out. I often liked his comments, and valued his input. But it did not detract from the fact you simply cannot support Trump and Ukraine.

    If Sandpit would like to tell us how the first ~6 months of Trump's presidency has helped Ukraine, I'd be all ears.
    You are genuinely pretty immune to anyone’s viewpoint but your own, which is a pretty major reason why I too gave up on this place for months.

    But… The straitjacket on the use of military equipment has been removed. Ukrainian civilian and military deaths are assessed as slightly down since Jan 2025 than the six months prior. Net territorial losses per day are also markedly down, by around a third. Since Trump assumed office, the at times quite threatening nuclear hum emanating from Moscow has dulled. Meanwhile there (at least rhetorically) appears to be renewed effort on behalf of Europe to re-arm, as a direct consequence of trumps return.

    None of these are trivial wins for the Ukrainian people. Then there was the airbase spectacular last month. It is unknowable if there was US intelligence assistance. Or if it needed a green light that had not been forthcoming during the tail of Biden’s time. But it happened now after a supposed 18 month lead time.

    I’m sure you’re ready with some sort of aggressive response. Hopefully it falls short of telling me to fuck off and die this time, in which case perhaps I shall be minded to continue engagement with you.
    On the other hand, pretty much all US military aid has ended.
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 4,956

    viewcode said:

    OT Vanilla is planning to randomly break PB over the next couple of weeks.

    How, plz?

    PRODUCTION Environment Maintenance: June 24–July 4, 2025
    Jun 24, 2025 17:00 - Jul 5, 2025 17:00 EDT
    We will be performing scheduled maintenance on our PRODUCTION environments from June 24 through July 4, 2025. This is part of our continued efforts to improve reliability, performance, and security.

    Impacted Plans levels:
    Essential
    Corporate

    If you have any questions or concerns, please reach out to our support team.
    Posted on Jun 23, 2025 - 13:52 EDT

    https://status.vanillaforums.com/

    That is the Vanilla status page, and iirc you can also sign up for email alerts. I have many infrastructure status pages bookmarked so I can quickly check any outage is not my fault. Saves a lot of pointless troubleshooting.
    You need a status page of your status pages.

    (My rates are very reasonable... ;-)
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 55,185

    The oil price has lost all the risk premium that it had gained since Israel's attacks on Iran started, so the market judgement is clearly that Iran will not attempt to close the Strait of Hormuz in any circumstance, and the risk of a wider regional war is very low.

    Fingers crossed they're right.

    The Illuminati have so decided.
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 4,956

    I'd love to see the back of the Mullahs, but what is the plan for afterwards ? The Shah"s son is not universally popular, and there's about 150k Irgc.

    This is quite informative, if not especially encouraging.

    https://x.com/thecyrusjanssen/status/1936939653879439617
    Reminded me of an old Bjork lyric :

    "I thought I could organise freedom. How very Scandinavian of me."
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 55,843
    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 4,956

    I'd love to see the back of the Mullahs, but what is the plan for afterwards ? The Shah"s son is not universally popular, and there's about 150k Irgc.

    This is quite informative, if not especially encouraging.

    https://x.com/thecyrusjanssen/status/1936939653879439617
    Indeed. It's an awful dilemma Iranians ; Either risk becoming Iraq, or risk missing one of the only chances to shake off another 100 years of the Mullahs' nightmare.

    Poor country, I feel for Iran.
    I'm sure I've posted this before, but there is an old-ish BBC Show called "A Taste of Iran" which is quite delightful and quite informative :

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00n59zt

    "This programme is not currently available on BBC iPlayer", obviously. But I'm sure it's available elsewhere in the usual BBC foot-gun way.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 10,287

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    Hahahaha.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 4,022

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    Fly free, little missile. FLY FREE
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 78,539
    Worst of the worst.

    California mom detained by ICE—locked up 1,400 miles away from breastfeeding baby.

    "She keeps looking for her mom and doesn't want the bottle... she just starts tantrums."

    She is married to U.S. citizen with legal family petition—instead of good news at unscheduled check in she was ordered to attend—she was given 30 seconds to say goodbye.

    "She was reporting, you know. They knew exactly where she lived, they knew... She would always appear when called."

    Ana Gabriella Diaz came to the U.S. with her oldest daughter 4 years ago seeking asylum from El Salvador.

    She got married and had another baby in 2024—filing a family petition to stay in the U.S.

    https://x.com/LongTimeHistory/status/1936895126816841819
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 24,930
    eek said:

    I'd love to see the back of the Mullahs, but what is the plan for afterwards ? The Shah"s son is not universally popular, and there's about 150k Irgc.

    This is quite informative, if not especially encouraging.

    https://x.com/thecyrusjanssen/status/1936939653879439617
    Got to say u can’t fault a single thing he says - better the devil you know than the disaster that is Lebanon, Iraq or Syria
    Iraq is far, far better off than Iran.
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 3,557

    viewcode said:

    Speaking of which, your regular reminder that several PBers have Bluesky accounts

    https://bsky.app/starter-pack/mattwardman.bsky.social/3lfk4fvp5yv26

    PBers blathering on how they stay away from Bluesky cos it's a woke echo chamber remind me a bit of those who kept endlessly reminding everyone of which other PBers they'd blocked. Why quietly ignore people/things when you can make a big song and dance about it is very much the zeitgeist.
    A certain brand of PBer surely.
    Well three of them
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 31,268

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    Hahahaha.
    No, this is good news. It looks like the non-interventionist MAGA Trump is back, at least for now.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 66,434

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    Hahahaha.
    If only Kissinger was alive to pontificate on this form of statecraft.
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 3,557

    Taz said:

    I know working class East End lad, Tommy Skinner, isn’t to the taste of most people here. He probably drinks Madri and his perfect wine is Jacob’s Creek, however here he is with Robert Jenrick supporting his campaign over tool theft for tradesmen.

    The next step for JENRICK

    Jenrick has seen what The Apprentice has done for Donald Trump's political career.
    Is there a book on who is going to the Aussie jungle this winter?

    It is so going to be Jenrick.
    The scorpions may be a bit more fatal this year?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 78,539
    .
    rcs1000 said:

    moonshine said:

    Taz said:

    Sandpit said:

    *de-lurks*

    Is World War III about to kick off?

    *re-lurks*

    Can I plead with you to delurk permanently? The whys and wherefores of the last war seem meaningless compared to the direct realities of this new war. You are far closer than we are and your input to discussions would be very much appreciated.
    Ah but will he be treated with courtesy and respect, or subjected to the usual PB purity test where not holding one view automatically makes you a shill for our enemies ?

    With his personal investment in both Ukraine and the Middle East why subject yourself to it from people thousands of miles away 🤔
    Physical location does not matter. Neither does stated attachments.

    You simply cannot support Ukraine and Trump. I treated @Sandpit with courtesy and respect, whilst pointing that out. I often liked his comments, and valued his input. But it did not detract from the fact you simply cannot support Trump and Ukraine.

    If Sandpit would like to tell us how the first ~6 months of Trump's presidency has helped Ukraine, I'd be all ears.
    You are genuinely pretty immune to anyone’s viewpoint but your own, which is a pretty major reason why I too gave up on this place for months.

    But… The straitjacket on the use of military equipment has been removed. Ukrainian civilian and military deaths are assessed as slightly down since Jan 2025 than the six months prior. Net territorial losses per day are also markedly down, by around a third. Since Trump assumed office, the at times quite threatening nuclear hum emanating from Moscow has dulled. Meanwhile there (at least rhetorically) appears to be renewed effort on behalf of Europe to re-arm, as a direct consequence of trumps return.

    None of these are trivial wins for the Ukrainian people. Then there was the airbase spectacular last month. It is unknowable if there was US intelligence assistance. Or if it needed a green light that had not been forthcoming during the tail of Biden’s time. But it happened now after a supposed 18 month lead time.

    I’m sure you’re ready with some sort of aggressive response. Hopefully it falls short of telling me to fuck off and die this time, in which case perhaps I shall be minded to continue engagement with you.
    On the other hand, pretty much all US military aid has ended.
    Don't worry.
    Here's the arse trying to 'negotiate' with Putin.

    Walking around the EOB/West Wing today there is a "different feel". Like if you are sports team that won a major game or in business winning a major competitive contract. You "strut" differently. Helps when you have a President @POTUS and a military able to be described in two words. Bad Ass.
    https://x.com/generalkellogg/status/1937142262951006331
  • YokesYokes Posts: 1,408
    I posted last night that do not be surprised if Israel calls it a wrap as they are coming into the 10 to.14 day period they planned on.

    The Israelis are reported tonight to have reportedly passed this on to Iran that they are prepared to close for now.
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,732
    edited June 23
    Taz said:

    eek said:

    Taz said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Just spent 5 mins on BlueSky. Discovered most people on there don't like Israel very much. Left the site.

    You mis-spelled it. Its called BlueShite
    I saw JD Vance set up and account there and was banned 15 minutes later.

    I’ve never moved there. Thankfully my Twitter feed it fine. Investing, wrestling, Birmingham City and shit/giggles. Free of far right politics.
    Jd Vance isn’t banned. The problem he has is that it has decent built in moderation tools so the people he was trying to trigger just flicked the switch and ignored him
    Oh come on.

    He was banned. Within 15 minutes.

    Sure, the ban came down, but he set up the account and was banned in 15 minutes.

    Decent moderation - banning people for no good reason.
    Their spam algorithms thought it was an imposter account, it was blocked for about 20 minutes then a human checked it and they unblocked it and added a verified badge.

    If anyone else is ever a united states vice-president and finds themselves in this situation, try setting up your domain name, for example if he'd set up the handle as vp.whitehouse.gov there wouldn't have been any doubt about who it was.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 18,155
    As people are talking about Bluesky thought I might share this thread about SS Windrush and its previous history in Nazi Germany for no particular reason than I think it's interesting.

    https://bsky.app/profile/alanallport.bsky.social/post/3ls4tnspsks2s
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 6,380
    FF43 said:

    As people are talking about Bluesky thought I might share this thread about SS Windrush and its previous history in Nazi Germany for no particular reason than I think it's interesting.

    https://bsky.app/profile/alanallport.bsky.social/post/3ls4tnspsks2s

    Requires an account to view, sadly.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 44,087

    Taz said:

    eek said:

    Taz said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Just spent 5 mins on BlueSky. Discovered most people on there don't like Israel very much. Left the site.

    You mis-spelled it. Its called BlueShite
    I saw JD Vance set up and account there and was banned 15 minutes later.

    I’ve never moved there. Thankfully my Twitter feed it fine. Investing, wrestling, Birmingham City and shit/giggles. Free of far right politics.
    Jd Vance isn’t banned. The problem he has is that it has decent built in moderation tools so the people he was trying to trigger just flicked the switch and ignored him
    Oh come on.

    He was banned. Within 15 minutes.

    Sure, the ban came down, but he set up the account and was banned in 15 minutes.

    Decent moderation - banning people for no good reason.
    Their spam algorithms thought it was an imposter account, it was blocked for about 20 minutes then a human checked it and they unblocked it and added a verified badge.

    If anyone else is ever a united states vice-president and finds themselves in this situation, try setting up your domain name, for example if he'd set up the handle as vp.whitehouse.gov there wouldn't have been any doubt about who it was.
    Please don’t bring facts to a chimps flinging excrement fight.
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,732

    viewcode said:

    Speaking of which, your regular reminder that several PBers have Bluesky accounts

    https://bsky.app/starter-pack/mattwardman.bsky.social/3lfk4fvp5yv26

    PBers blathering on how they stay away from Bluesky cos it's a woke echo chamber remind me a bit of those who kept endlessly reminding everyone of which other PBers they'd blocked. Why quietly ignore people/things when you can make a big song and dance about it is very much the zeitgeist.
    The real power move is to write about how you don't like it in the Spectator. You get loads of traffic from Bluesky because it's basically the only remaining platform that doesn't massively down-weight links for fear of people leaving the site and not coming back.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 32,526

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    The man is as mad as a March hare.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 55,843

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    The man is as mad as a March hare.
    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937240524806914515

    CONGRATULATIONS WORLD, IT'S TIME FOR PEACE!
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 18,155
    carnforth said:

    FF43 said:

    As people are talking about Bluesky thought I might share this thread about SS Windrush and its previous history in Nazi Germany for no particular reason than I think it's interesting.

    https://bsky.app/profile/alanallport.bsky.social/post/3ls4tnspsks2s

    Requires an account to view, sadly.
    That's a shame. Sorry.
  • glwglw Posts: 10,444

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    The man is as mad as a March hare.
    Full moonbat. It would take very little for him to hit the big red button in a rage. God help us if there isn't anyone willing to ignore his orders, as occurred with Nixon.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 78,539

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    The man is as mad as a March hare.
    I do think it's time for a serious discussion about that.
    https://x.com/OJoelsen/status/1937149283155009897
  • RattersRatters Posts: 1,376
    Yokes said:

    I posted last night that do not be surprised if Israel calls it a wrap as they are coming into the 10 to.14 day period they planned on.

    The Israelis are reported tonight to have reportedly passed this on to Iran that they are prepared to close for now.

    In your view does this turn into a frozen conflict that Israel reignites as and when it sees nuclear activity it dislikes the look of (with missile stockpiles topped up)?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 60,370
    Nigelb said:

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    The man is as mad as a March hare.
    I do think it's time for a serious discussion about that.
    https://x.com/OJoelsen/status/1937149283155009897
    With oil below $70, there's not going to be much new drilling in the US.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 32,526

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    The man is as mad as a March hare.
    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937240524806914515

    CONGRATULATIONS WORLD, IT'S TIME FOR PEACE!
    As you well know by teatime he might opine that "I have just started a beautiful, beautiful war".
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 30,219

    DavidL said:

    For a bunch of insane psychopaths, desperate to meet a bunch of virgins (why, by the way, surely someone who knows what they're doing...never mind) .......

    I really want you to continue that train of thought!

    As a good staunch atheist, I never thought of it that way, but you're right.
    I think the premise is if you're utterly crap in bed they won't know any different.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 60,370

    I'd love to see the back of the Mullahs, but what is the plan for afterwards ? The Shah"s son is not universally popular, and there's about 150k Irgc.

    When the end comes, the IRGC will melt away like the rest.

    The most probable end is that the grip of the regime slips. It’s worth noting that there is a functioning electoral system - just one where the candidates are all vetted to be religious nutters.

    The Shah’s son means nothing to the millions of very young Iranians. They want, in general, the removal of the religious control of politics.
    Usually what happens is that someone turns out to be significantly more liberal than was expected.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 5,603

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    The man is as mad as a March hare.
    In this instance though we should be relieved that as mad as he is he stopped from going down the route some might have expected .
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 79,657

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    That's probably the most truthful statement he's ever posted. Probably way more honest than most US presidents would post in that situation
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 55,843
    nico67 said:

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    The man is as mad as a March hare.
    In this instance though we should be relieved that as mad as he is he stopped from going down the route some might have expected .
    Imagine if he’d been in charge after 9/11. Just a one-off retaliatory raid and then time for peace.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 55,254

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    Hahahaha.
    If only Kissinger was alive to pontificate on this form of statecraft.
    Poor Tom Lehrer - for some reason I can’t imagine him spinning smoothly in his grave. More jerking spasmodically all over the place..
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 78,539
    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    The man is as mad as a March hare.
    I do think it's time for a serious discussion about that.
    https://x.com/OJoelsen/status/1937149283155009897
    With oil below $70, there's not going to be much new drilling in the US.
    He seems to be some sort of manic phase.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 5,603

    nico67 said:

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    The man is as mad as a March hare.
    In this instance though we should be relieved that as mad as he is he stopped from going down the route some might have expected .
    Imagine if he’d been in charge after 9/11. Just a one-off retaliatory raid and then time for peace.
    That’s an interesting point . Unfortunately we can’t turn back the clock . You know my opinion of Trump but I’m willing in this instance to give him credit for not escalating the situation.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 55,254
    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    The man is as mad as a March hare.
    I do think it's time for a serious discussion about that.
    https://x.com/OJoelsen/status/1937149283155009897
    With oil below $70, there's not going to be much new drilling in the US.
    He seems to be some sort of manic phase.

    We all feel like that, Reggie, now and then, especially when Spring is upon us, but few of us would care to put it on our cards. It takes a Turk to do that.

  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 54,682

    nico67 said:

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    The man is as mad as a March hare.
    In this instance though we should be relieved that as mad as he is he stopped from going down the route some might have expected .
    Imagine if he’d been in charge after 9/11. Just a one-off retaliatory raid and then time for peace.
    "Great job, team. Head back to base for debriefing and cocktails!"
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 39,032
    @stevenmazie.bsky.social‬

    BREAKING: the Supreme Court *grants* the Trump administration's emergency plea in DHS v. D.V.D. to resume deporting non-citizens to third countries. Justices Sotomayor, Kagan and Jackson dissent at length. The majority cites no reasons for granting the government's request.
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 24,930
    nico67 said:

    nico67 said:

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    The man is as mad as a March hare.
    In this instance though we should be relieved that as mad as he is he stopped from going down the route some might have expected .
    Imagine if he’d been in charge after 9/11. Just a one-off retaliatory raid and then time for peace.
    That’s an interesting point . Unfortunately we can’t turn back the clock . You know my opinion of Trump but I’m willing in this instance to give him credit for not escalating the situation.
    I'm glad to be back to criticising Trump.

    Him doing the right thing was so far out of character that praising him felt weird. That he's now TACO again and I can oppose him again seems like a reversion to norm.

    If only we had a Bush or Cheney in the Oval Office who'd be brave enough to get rid of the Mullahs instead of being burdened with Trump who only wants to fight his own citizens and the woke.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 55,254

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    Hahahaha.
    If only Kissinger was alive to pontificate on this form of statecraft.
    Poor Tom Lehrer - for some reason I can’t imagine him spinning smoothly in his grave. More jerking spasmodically all over the place..
    He's still alive.

    97.
    Really? One can only imagine his thoughts on the Orange One.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 54,682

    eek said:

    I'd love to see the back of the Mullahs, but what is the plan for afterwards ? The Shah"s son is not universally popular, and there's about 150k Irgc.

    This is quite informative, if not especially encouraging.

    https://x.com/thecyrusjanssen/status/1936939653879439617
    Got to say u can’t fault a single thing he says - better the devil you know than the disaster that is Lebanon, Iraq or Syria
    Iraq is far, far better off than Iran.
    "Last year I went to Iraq. Before Team America showed up, it was a happy place. They had flowery meadows and rainbow skies, and rivers made of chocolate, where the children danced and laughed and played with gumdrop smiles!"
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 66,434

    OSINTdefender
    @sentdefender
    ·
    20m
    According to
    @BarakRavid
    of Axios, “A White House official told me that Trump's goal now is to end the war and he is going to make it clear to Israeli prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu. “We want a deal and don't want any more war,” the official said”

  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 24,930


    OSINTdefender
    @sentdefender
    ·
    20m
    According to
    @BarakRavid
    of Axios, “A White House official told me that Trump's goal now is to end the war and he is going to make it clear to Israeli prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu. “We want a deal and don't want any more war,” the official said”

    Pathetic TACO.
  • glwglw Posts: 10,444
    edited June 23


    OSINTdefender
    @sentdefender
    ·
    20m
    According to
    @BarakRavid
    of Axios, “A White House official told me that Trump's goal now is to end the war and he is going to make it clear to Israeli prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu. “We want a deal and don't want any more war,” the official said”

    Peace.
    Attack.
    Regime change?
    End the war.

    All in about 4-5 days. Does anyone think this guy is well? Or that this nonsense makes any sense at all?
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 39,032
    glw said:


    OSINTdefender
    @sentdefender
    ·
    20m
    According to
    @BarakRavid
    of Axios, “A White House official told me that Trump's goal now is to end the war and he is going to make it clear to Israeli prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu. “We want a deal and don't want any more war,” the official said”

    Peace.
    Attack.
    Regime change?
    End the war.

    All in about 4-5 days. Does anyone think this guy is well? Or that this nonsense makes any sense at all?
    He started a war to distract from bad headlines. Now he needs to end the same war to distract from bad headlines...
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 44,087

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    Hahahaha.
    If only Kissinger was alive to pontificate on this form of statecraft.
    Poor Tom Lehrer - for some reason I can’t imagine him spinning smoothly in his grave. More jerking spasmodically all over the place..
    Old Tom is still going!
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 55,843

    nico67 said:

    nico67 said:

    https://x.com/trump_repost/status/1937238008140562772

    Iran has officially responded to our Obliteration of their Nuclear Facilities with a very weak response, which we expected, and have very effectively countered. There have been 14 missiles fired — 13 were knocked down, and 1 was "set free," because it was headed in a nonthreatening direction. I am pleased to report that NO Americans were harmed, and hardly any damage was done. Most importantly, they've gotten it all out of their "system," and there will, hopefully, be no further HATE. I want to thank Iran for giving us early notice, which made it possible for no lives to be lost, and nobody to be injured. Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

    DONALD J. TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    The man is as mad as a March hare.
    In this instance though we should be relieved that as mad as he is he stopped from going down the route some might have expected .
    Imagine if he’d been in charge after 9/11. Just a one-off retaliatory raid and then time for peace.
    That’s an interesting point . Unfortunately we can’t turn back the clock . You know my opinion of Trump but I’m willing in this instance to give him credit for not escalating the situation.
    I'm glad to be back to criticising Trump.

    Him doing the right thing was so far out of character that praising him felt weird. That he's now TACO again and I can oppose him again seems like a reversion to norm.

    If only we had a Bush or Cheney in the Oval Office who'd be brave enough to get rid of the Mullahs instead of being burdened with Trump who only wants to fight his own citizens and the woke.
    It’s up to the Iranians to decide that their regime has no future. Trump has given the necessary demonstration.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 45,783


    OSINTdefender
    @sentdefender
    ·
    20m
    According to
    @BarakRavid
    of Axios, “A White House official told me that Trump's goal now is to end the war and he is going to make it clear to Israeli prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu. “We want a deal and don't want any more war,” the official said”

    Let's see if Netanyahu is as good as Putin at the game of 'manipulate Donald Trump and keep on warmongering'. I think he might be.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 14,863
    edited June 23
    Trump administration going after (another) Democrat lawmaker: https://youtu.be/yeWHyGbx7Xc (Legal Eagle)

    And also lying, and being corrupt.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 15,627
    One of the most remarkable headlines of this weird new world order we live in:

    “Oil prices crash after Iran strikes US bases”.

    Imagine reading that one out to a journalist in the early 1980s.
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 24,930
    glw said:


    OSINTdefender
    @sentdefender
    ·
    20m
    According to
    @BarakRavid
    of Axios, “A White House official told me that Trump's goal now is to end the war and he is going to make it clear to Israeli prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu. “We want a deal and don't want any more war,” the official said”

    Peace.
    Attack.
    Regime change?
    End the war.

    All in about 4-5 days. Does anyone think this guy is well? Or that this nonsense makes any sense at all?
    Ending the war makes no sense whatsoever!

    The very minimum "deal" should be that Iran agrees to abolish all nuclear pretensions, everything that remains is demolished under IAEA supervision, the enriched uranium is accounted for and transferred to someone else.

    The maximum should be the above plus regime change.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 32,526
    Scott_xP said:

    @stevenmazie.bsky.social‬

    BREAKING: the Supreme Court *grants* the Trump administration's emergency plea in DHS v. D.V.D. to resume deporting non-citizens to third countries. Justices Sotomayor, Kagan and Jackson dissent at length. The majority cites no reasons for granting the government's request.

    That is really quite concerning for the future.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 30,219

    Scott_xP said:

    @stevenmazie.bsky.social‬

    BREAKING: the Supreme Court *grants* the Trump administration's emergency plea in DHS v. D.V.D. to resume deporting non-citizens to third countries. Justices Sotomayor, Kagan and Jackson dissent at length. The majority cites no reasons for granting the government's request.

    That is really quite concerning for the future.
    I'm quite concerned enough now, thank you.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 39,032

    Scott_xP said:

    @stevenmazie.bsky.social‬

    BREAKING: the Supreme Court *grants* the Trump administration's emergency plea in DHS v. D.V.D. to resume deporting non-citizens to third countries. Justices Sotomayor, Kagan and Jackson dissent at length. The majority cites no reasons for granting the government's request.

    That is really quite concerning for the future.
    The Supreme Court endorsing contempt in Trump's name?

    Why would that be concerning...
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 24,934
    Scott_xP said:

    @stevenmazie.bsky.social‬

    BREAKING: the Supreme Court *grants* the Trump administration's emergency plea in DHS v. D.V.D. to resume deporting non-citizens to third countries. Justices Sotomayor, Kagan and Jackson dissent at length. The majority cites no reasons for granting the government's request.

    https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/24pdf/24a1153_l5gm.pdf

  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 24,930
    kinabalu said:


    OSINTdefender
    @sentdefender
    ·
    20m
    According to
    @BarakRavid
    of Axios, “A White House official told me that Trump's goal now is to end the war and he is going to make it clear to Israeli prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu. “We want a deal and don't want any more war,” the official said”

    Let's see if Netanyahu is as good as Putin at the game of 'manipulate Donald Trump and keep on warmongering'. I think he might be.
    One can only hope, until the Mullahs are gone, or at least all their nuclear facilities entirely are.

    Slapping them, then they rebuild, should not be the point.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 66,434

    Scott_xP said:

    @stevenmazie.bsky.social‬

    BREAKING: the Supreme Court *grants* the Trump administration's emergency plea in DHS v. D.V.D. to resume deporting non-citizens to third countries. Justices Sotomayor, Kagan and Jackson dissent at length. The majority cites no reasons for granting the government's request.

    That is really quite concerning for the future.
    Looks like more of a pause at this point.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 23,072
    Nigelb said:

    .

    rcs1000 said:

    moonshine said:

    Taz said:

    Sandpit said:

    *de-lurks*

    Is World War III about to kick off?

    *re-lurks*

    Can I plead with you to delurk permanently? The whys and wherefores of the last war seem meaningless compared to the direct realities of this new war. You are far closer than we are and your input to discussions would be very much appreciated.
    Ah but will he be treated with courtesy and respect, or subjected to the usual PB purity test where not holding one view automatically makes you a shill for our enemies ?

    With his personal investment in both Ukraine and the Middle East why subject yourself to it from people thousands of miles away 🤔
    Physical location does not matter. Neither does stated attachments.

    You simply cannot support Ukraine and Trump. I treated @Sandpit with courtesy and respect, whilst pointing that out. I often liked his comments, and valued his input. But it did not detract from the fact you simply cannot support Trump and Ukraine.

    If Sandpit would like to tell us how the first ~6 months of Trump's presidency has helped Ukraine, I'd be all ears.
    You are genuinely pretty immune to anyone’s viewpoint but your own, which is a pretty major reason why I too gave up on this place for months.

    But… The straitjacket on the use of military equipment has been removed. Ukrainian civilian and military deaths are assessed as slightly down since Jan 2025 than the six months prior. Net territorial losses per day are also markedly down, by around a third. Since Trump assumed office, the at times quite threatening nuclear hum emanating from Moscow has dulled. Meanwhile there (at least rhetorically) appears to be renewed effort on behalf of Europe to re-arm, as a direct consequence of trumps return.

    None of these are trivial wins for the Ukrainian people. Then there was the airbase spectacular last month. It is unknowable if there was US intelligence assistance. Or if it needed a green light that had not been forthcoming during the tail of Biden’s time. But it happened now after a supposed 18 month lead time.

    I’m sure you’re ready with some sort of aggressive response. Hopefully it falls short of telling me to fuck off and die this time, in which case perhaps I shall be minded to continue engagement with you.
    On the other hand, pretty much all US military aid has ended.
    Don't worry.
    Here's the arse trying to 'negotiate' with Putin.

    Walking around the EOB/West Wing today there is a "different feel". Like if you are sports team that won a major game or in business winning a major competitive contract. You "strut" differently. Helps when you have a President @POTUS and a military able to be described in two words. Bad Ass.
    https://x.com/generalkellogg/status/1937142262951006331
    Bad ass? Piles or a nasty rash?
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 31,805

    Scott_xP said:

    @stevenmazie.bsky.social‬

    BREAKING: the Supreme Court *grants* the Trump administration's emergency plea in DHS v. D.V.D. to resume deporting non-citizens to third countries. Justices Sotomayor, Kagan and Jackson dissent at length. The majority cites no reasons for granting the government's request.

    That is really quite concerning for the future.
    I don't see why, unless they start deporting them here.
  • eekeek Posts: 30,354

    Scott_xP said:

    @stevenmazie.bsky.social‬

    BREAKING: the Supreme Court *grants* the Trump administration's emergency plea in DHS v. D.V.D. to resume deporting non-citizens to third countries. Justices Sotomayor, Kagan and Jackson dissent at length. The majority cites no reasons for granting the government's request.

    That is really quite concerning for the future.
    I don't see why, unless they start deporting them here.
    I think it's more that the Supreme court hasn't provided any legal basis or precedents for its decision whilst the dissent has spent a while showing how they came to their decision.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 39,032
    eek said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @stevenmazie.bsky.social‬

    BREAKING: the Supreme Court *grants* the Trump administration's emergency plea in DHS v. D.V.D. to resume deporting non-citizens to third countries. Justices Sotomayor, Kagan and Jackson dissent at length. The majority cites no reasons for granting the government's request.

    That is really quite concerning for the future.
    I don't see why, unless they start deporting them here.
    I think it's more that the Supreme court hasn't provided any legal basis or precedents for its decision whilst the dissent has spent a while showing how they came to their decision.
    Trump is King

    Deal with it...
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 66,434
    Scott_xP said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @stevenmazie.bsky.social‬

    BREAKING: the Supreme Court *grants* the Trump administration's emergency plea in DHS v. D.V.D. to resume deporting non-citizens to third countries. Justices Sotomayor, Kagan and Jackson dissent at length. The majority cites no reasons for granting the government's request.

    That is really quite concerning for the future.
    The Supreme Court endorsing contempt in Trump's name?

    Why would that be concerning...
    "The court’s brief order gave no reasons and said the judge’s [original] ruling would remain paused while the government pursues an appeal and, after that, until the Supreme Court acts."

    NY Times

    It 'aint over.
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 24,930
    edited June 23
    eek said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @stevenmazie.bsky.social‬

    BREAKING: the Supreme Court *grants* the Trump administration's emergency plea in DHS v. D.V.D. to resume deporting non-citizens to third countries. Justices Sotomayor, Kagan and Jackson dissent at length. The majority cites no reasons for granting the government's request.

    That is really quite concerning for the future.
    I don't see why, unless they start deporting them here.
    I think it's more that the Supreme court hasn't provided any legal basis or precedents for its decision whilst the dissent has spent a while showing how they came to their decision.
    The legal basis in full:

    "We're in charge, nah nah nah nah nahhh."
  • YokesYokes Posts: 1,408
    Ratters said:

    Yokes said:

    I posted last night that do not be surprised if Israel calls it a wrap as they are coming into the 10 to.14 day period they planned on.

    The Israelis are reported tonight to have reportedly passed this on to Iran that they are prepared to close for now.

    In your view does this turn into a frozen conflict that Israel reignites as and when it sees nuclear activity it dislikes the look of (with missile stockpiles topped up)?
    I'd not look beyond the next week. Iran may choose to carry on with Israel for a bit. Their no1 priority is breathing space but they could keep going after the initial shock if they are willing to sustain more damage to not be seen as dancing to Israel's tune.

    The conflict, however, is never frozen. Iran and Israel are always on maneuveres against each other. This is something the Trump admin may want to consider. Neither of those parties forget and Iran will be looking to get the US in the long grass.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 39,032
    Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!" - President Donald J. Trump

    @jimsciutto
    Israel does not appear to be stopping attacks despite Trump’s urging:

    New: Israel’s military has issued an evacuation warning for people in District 7 of Tehran.

    “The IDF is continuing to operate in the area, as it has in recent days across Iran, targeting the Iranian regime's military infrastructure,” the Israeli military said in a statement posted on X in Farsi. It called on citizens to “immediately” evacuate an area it marked on a map shared in the post.

    “Your presence in this area puts your life at risk,” the military said.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 27,921
    edited June 23

    stodge said:

    Reform in actual government latest:


    Andrew Topping
    @AToppingJourno

    NEW: 'No idea, genuinely': Watch as Reform economic chief gets confused over existing relationships between Notts County Council and regional leaders.

    Cllr James Walker-Gurley, a new Reform cabinet member in Notts, sat down with us last week. It didn't go well.

    @laurenamonaghan

    https://x.com/AToppingJourno/status/1937134139473277269

    This is the problem when you have a revolution.

    The revolutionaries take over and most of them don't have a clue. I mentioned last week how the first Cabinet meetings in Kent and Derbyshire weren't until the end of July so for the better part of three months, these authorities have mostly been leaderless and rudderless.

    I don't know the extent to which Reform councillors are able to act without having to consult their HQ first but the notion of Yusuf micro-managing hundreds of councillors is absurd.

    The other side of the revolution will be the extent to which Reform councillors get "nobbled" by senior officers who will tell them not just how things do work but how things should work.
    I know little of local governance but I do wonder if it has parallels with student union politics. The students make lots of big pledges trying to get elected and when they are in power are very quickly steered by the university down the line of what is possible and what isn't.

    Local councils may be similar.
    With Local Govt it's far more to do with it being gutted of resources and capacity by national politicians; there's relatively little they can actually do.

    That's why very little works, everything is neglected and resources need to be substantially up not down. Starmer's Gov are making a start with Council tax going up by approx. 5% each year in this Parliament, and greater central support, but that will only recover a fraction of the cuts imposed since 2010 and I think a little before (around 25% in real terms).

    It also needs quite significant reform and longer term financial settlements etc, which are on the way in Regional Mayors etc and I hope works.

    Reform's problem is that they their head up their own backside and believed their own neo-Doge shtick, and have made a series of promises from cloud cuckoo land - despite plenty of published information being available.

    And now they have to face up to the lunacy of what they believed, and the BS they put out. As, unfortunately, do the electorate. Unfortunately for Reform, the Magic Money Tree does not exist.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 18,974

    eek said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @stevenmazie.bsky.social‬

    BREAKING: the Supreme Court *grants* the Trump administration's emergency plea in DHS v. D.V.D. to resume deporting non-citizens to third countries. Justices Sotomayor, Kagan and Jackson dissent at length. The majority cites no reasons for granting the government's request.

    That is really quite concerning for the future.
    I don't see why, unless they start deporting them here.
    I think it's more that the Supreme court hasn't provided any legal basis or precedents for its decision whilst the dissent has spent a while showing how they came to their decision.
    The legal basis in full:

    "We're in charge, nah nah nah nah nahhh."
    Partly that and partly "it never occurred to us that ruling that 'face-eating leopards have a constitutional right to eat faces' would encourage face-eating leopards to eat our faces'".
  • MattWMattW Posts: 27,921
    edited June 23
    Scott_xP said:

    Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!" - President Donald J. Trump

    @jimsciutto
    Israel does not appear to be stopping attacks despite Trump’s urging:

    New: Israel’s military has issued an evacuation warning for people in District 7 of Tehran.

    “The IDF is continuing to operate in the area, as it has in recent days across Iran, targeting the Iranian regime's military infrastructure,” the Israeli military said in a statement posted on X in Farsi. It called on citizens to “immediately” evacuate an area it marked on a map shared in the post.

    “Your presence in this area puts your life at risk,” the military said.

    I don't see why they would stop. What practical agency does Trump have that he is willing to use? The ghost of Paul Daniels has the answer.

    I'm not sure whether Iran has sleeper agents, but if I were they I'd be learning the lessons of Operation Spiderweb, and be having a look at all those strategic bombers they have just attacked me with sitting in rows just like Pearl Harbour.

    One that Perun was pointing out several weeks ago.
  • vikvik Posts: 543
    Scott_xP said:

    Perhaps Iran can now proceed to Peace and Harmony in the Region, and I will enthusiastically encourage Israel to do the same. Thank you for your attention to this matter!" - President Donald J. Trump

    @jimsciutto
    Israel does not appear to be stopping attacks despite Trump’s urging:

    New: Israel’s military has issued an evacuation warning for people in District 7 of Tehran.

    “The IDF is continuing to operate in the area, as it has in recent days across Iran, targeting the Iranian regime's military infrastructure,” the Israeli military said in a statement posted on X in Farsi. It called on citizens to “immediately” evacuate an area it marked on a map shared in the post.

    “Your presence in this area puts your life at risk,” the military said.

    Yeah, I don't buy the arguments on PB that the Israelis are also looking for an off-ramp & will very soon stop their attacks.

    For one thing, Netenyahu (unlike Trump) needs a war to stay out of prison.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 27,921

    Trump administration going after (another) Democrat lawmaker: https://youtu.be/yeWHyGbx7Xc (Legal Eagle)

    And also lying, and being corrupt.

    That's technically an existing politician aiui - she was one of the one's who was inspecting the Private Prison operating without right as Congrssmen are entitled to do in law, when the Mayor of New Jersey was arrested under false pretences. The charge on the Mayor of NJ was dropped because it was performative BS so she needs to cover for her backside.

    Alina Habba-Dabba-Doo (Acting Attornney of NJ with a month left to run for her 130 days max) is abusing a summary procedure to avoid having to supply correct probable cause. This one will collapse as well, because it is also BS - but it's all about the performance and the intimidation as ever.
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