politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Local By-Elections: January 22nd 2014 – Harry Hayfield
Kirkcaldy East on Fife (SNP defence)
Result of council at last election (2012): Labour 35, Scottish Nationalists 26, Liberal Democrats 10, Conservatives 3, Independents 3, Non Party Independent 1 (No Overall Control, Labour short by 5)
Result of ward at last election (2012):
Comments
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First!!!0
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Random fact: King Saud, the half-brother of Kings Abdullah and Salman, reigned 1953-64, had 115 kids....0
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Mike
Do you now believe that the consistent evidence from the polls is correct. The SNP surge is real lo even unto fortress Kirkcaldy, that it has nothing to do with the nationality of phone pollsters, that it is reflected in local elections, valid polls and party membership. Is it now game , set and match to we believers.0 -
Statistically speaking he must have had quite a few gay kids. Now those are coming out stories I'd like to hear.RodCrosby said:
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You didn't get the gag, did you...Tim_B said:0 -
How long has this thread been here?!0
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Neil
Not the cup final. Just the first leg!0 -
http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/80463000/jpg/_80463058_indy.jpg
Really...The BBC seems very uninterested in this. I can't even find that fact that the Mirror had to make a large series of payouts today.0 -
This generation will demand the VOW. The next will carry off the Cup!
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possibly the "Scottish League Cup presented by QTS"0
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Scots for EVEL - +21% net.....
Voters in Scotland are also sympathetic to the principle that Scottish MPs be prevented from voting on matters that have no direct impact on Scotland.
The poll found that 27% of Scots "strongly support" EVEL and a further 24% "tend to support" it, putting overall backing for the measure at 51%. Eighteen percent "strongly oppose" such a move while 12% "tend to oppose", totalling 30% in opposition. Fourteen percent said they neither supported nor opposed the policy.
http://news.stv.tv/scotland-decides/news/307531-stv-ipsos-mori-poll-on-smith-commission-and-english-votes-for-english-laws/0 -
Con selection — Newcastle Upon Tyne East: Duncan Crute.
https://www.conservatives.com/OurTeam/Prospective_Parliamentary_Candidates/Crute_Duncan.aspx0 -
Only the other day we were being told there was no sign of the SNP surge in local elections.....0
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I wonder how long Labour will remain committed to the Union if they lose most of their Scottish seats in May. They still have Wales... for now.0
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Felix
Wasn't the theory of no SNP surge based on the work of a former Tory MP?0 -
A shot in the dark but you may be thinking of Iain Dale - who was a candidate, not an MP.scotslass said:Felix
Wasn't the theory of no SNP surge based on the work of a former Tory MP?
Iain very bravely makes predictions for every seat in the UK here:
iaindale.com/posts/2014/12/29/general-election-predictions-the-complete-list0 -
There was also the analysis that Rob Haywood (?) the ex-Tory MP did for Cameron/the 1922. I'm not sure what it said about Scotland.GeoffM said:
A shot in the dark but you may be thinking of Iain Dale - who was a candidate, not an MP.scotslass said:Felix
Wasn't the theory of no SNP surge based on the work of a former Tory MP?
Iain very bravely makes predictions for every seat in the UK here:
iaindale.com/posts/2014/12/29/general-election-predictions-the-complete-list
But I suspect that @scotslass is conflating Iain and Rob's work.0 -
scotslass said:
Felix
Wasn't the theory of no SNP surge based on the work of a former Tory MP?
No, it was an analysis of recent Scottish local by-elections by Rob Hayward (MP for Kingswood, 1983 to 1992). There was only ward (South Argyll) before yesterday that showed a big swing to the SNP from the 2012 results. There had only really been one SNP v Labour contest in that sample (Midlothian something), because most of the contests were pretty rural (Aberdeenshire, Elgin something, two in Argyll).GeoffM said:
A shot in the dark but you may be thinking of Iain Dale - who was a candidate, not an MP.scotslass said:Felix
Wasn't the theory of no SNP surge based on the work of a former Tory MP?
Iain very bravely makes predictions for every seat in the UK here:
iaindale.com/posts/2014/12/29/general-election-predictions-the-complete-list0 -
Felix
A quick check reveals that our host was relying on the work of former Tory MP, Mike Hayward. I have never detected any pro or indeed anti Labour sympathy from Mike just a bucket load of anti SNP sympathy.
I'm on my way to work in a train which always gets me thinking. Is it possible that one of the many reasons for Labour's Scottish malaise is that Murphy is - and I know this will come across as sexist - profoundly unattractive in his maner and presentation ie does Labour now have a women problem?0 -
Unfortunately he tends to ignore (a) the Scottish opinion polls, and (b) Ashcroft polling.GeoffM said:
A shot in the dark but you may be thinking of Iain Dale - who was a candidate, not an MP.scotslass said:Felix
Wasn't the theory of no SNP surge based on the work of a former Tory MP?
Iain very bravely makes predictions for every seat in the UK here:
iaindale.com/posts/2014/12/29/general-election-predictions-the-complete-list0 -
That's an indication that SNP voters aren't that bothered about EVEL. In fact, some of them will support it because they think it will improve the prospects of independence.CarlottaVance said:Scots for EVEL - +21% net.....
Voters in Scotland are also sympathetic to the principle that Scottish MPs be prevented from voting on matters that have no direct impact on Scotland.
The poll found that 27% of Scots "strongly support" EVEL and a further 24% "tend to support" it, putting overall backing for the measure at 51%. Eighteen percent "strongly oppose" such a move while 12% "tend to oppose", totalling 30% in opposition. Fourteen percent said they neither supported nor opposed the policy.
http://news.stv.tv/scotland-decides/news/307531-stv-ipsos-mori-poll-on-smith-commission-and-english-votes-for-english-laws/0 -
The same Iain Dale who was sure he'd win Norfolk north and was hammered. He makes Dan Hodges seem prescient.AndyJS said:Unfortunately he tends to ignore (a) the Scottish opinion polls, and (b) Ashcroft polling.
GeoffM said:
A shot in the dark but you may be thinking of Iain Dale - who was a candidate, not an MP.scotslass said:Felix
Wasn't the theory of no SNP surge based on the work of a former Tory MP?
Iain very bravely makes predictions for every seat in the UK here:
iaindale.com/posts/2014/12/29/general-election-predictions-the-complete-list0 -
Murray through but Federer out of the Australian Open.
Meanwhile .... Standing German men can still take the piss :
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-309374920 -
Indeed, and irrespective of independence they also don't see why their MP should be wasting his time sorting out problems and issues that they don't see as their concern. If my local (English) MP spent a proportion of his time looking at issues with the SHS I wouldn't be very impressed either.JamesMo said:
That's an indication that SNP voters aren't that bothered about EVEL. In fact, some of them will support it because they think it will improve the prospects of independence.CarlottaVance said:Scots for EVEL - +21% net.....
Voters in Scotland are also sympathetic to the principle that Scottish MPs be prevented from voting on matters that have no direct impact on Scotland.
The poll found that 27% of Scots "strongly support" EVEL and a further 24% "tend to support" it, putting overall backing for the measure at 51%. Eighteen percent "strongly oppose" such a move while 12% "tend to oppose", totalling 30% in opposition. Fourteen percent said they neither supported nor opposed the policy.
http://news.stv.tv/scotland-decides/news/307531-stv-ipsos-mori-poll-on-smith-commission-and-english-votes-for-english-laws/0 -
I'm sure they're keeping their powder dry until the civil trial starts, and then it will be wall to wall coverage across all platforms. Not.FrancisUrquhart said:http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/80463000/jpg/_80463058_indy.jpg
Really...The BBC seems very uninterested in this. I can't even find that fact that the Mirror had to make a large series of payouts today.0 -
Telegraph Politics @TelePolitics · 38m38 minutes ago
What the SNP really wants is Mr Cameron back in No 10 http://tgr.ph/1JqKscm
"The only goal that matters to the SNP is independence – and that means assembling a narrative of a Scotland suing for divorce on the grounds of irreconcilable political differences. Without a villain, Ms Sturgeon will not have much of a pantomime; so she needs Cameron, the Old Etonian with a Brasenose First, as prime minister. Ideally in coalition with Nigel Farage. And most of all, she wants his in-or-out referendum on the European Union. If England votes to leave and Scotland to stay, it would induce the constitutional crisis that the SNP needs. This is the new road map to independence.
But for now, the SNP needs to win as many seats as possible – which means publicly entertaining the idea of coalition with Ed Miliband. Polls show that such an alliance would be the most popular election result in Scotland – which is precisely why, in the end, Ms Sturgeon can’t allow it to happen"0 -
In the 1975 referendum Scotland was more anti-Europe than England.isam said:
Telegraph Politics @TelePolitics · 38m38 minutes ago
What the SNP really wants is Mr Cameron back in No 10 http://tgr.ph/1JqKscm
"The only goal that matters to the SNP is independence – and that means assembling a narrative of a Scotland suing for divorce on the grounds of irreconcilable political differences. Without a villain, Ms Sturgeon will not have much of a pantomime; so she needs Cameron, the Old Etonian with a Brasenose First, as prime minister. Ideally in coalition with Nigel Farage. And most of all, she wants his in-or-out referendum on the European Union. If England votes to leave and Scotland to stay, it would induce the constitutional crisis that the SNP needs. This is the new road map to independence.
But for now, the SNP needs to win as many seats as possible – which means publicly entertaining the idea of coalition with Ed Miliband. Polls show that such an alliance would be the most popular election result in Scotland – which is precisely why, in the end, Ms Sturgeon can’t allow it to happen"0 -
Greatest support for EVEL is among Con (39) and Lib Dems (66). SNP (15) are a bit more enthusiastic than Laab (2)JamesMo said:
That's an indication that SNP voters aren't that bothered about EVEL. In fact, some of them will support it because they think it will improve the prospects of independence.CarlottaVance said:Scots for EVEL - +21% net.....
Voters in Scotland are also sympathetic to the principle that Scottish MPs be prevented from voting on matters that have no direct impact on Scotland.
The poll found that 27% of Scots "strongly support" EVEL and a further 24% "tend to support" it, putting overall backing for the measure at 51%. Eighteen percent "strongly oppose" such a move while 12% "tend to oppose", totalling 30% in opposition. Fourteen percent said they neither supported nor opposed the policy.
http://news.stv.tv/scotland-decides/news/307531-stv-ipsos-mori-poll-on-smith-commission-and-english-votes-for-english-laws/0 -
The guy who beat Federer isn't much younger than he is. A couple of years or so.JackW said:Murray through but Federer out of the Australian Open.
Meanwhile .... Standing German men can still take the piss :
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-309374920 -
Pretty much on the button. A Tory government in Westminster would be a gift to the SNP. A Labour one would set back the case for independence a long way.isam said:Telegraph Politics @TelePolitics · 38m38 minutes ago
What the SNP really wants is Mr Cameron back in No 10 http://tgr.ph/1JqKscm
"The only goal that matters to the SNP is independence – and that means assembling a narrative of a Scotland suing for divorce on the grounds of irreconcilable political differences. Without a villain, Ms Sturgeon will not have much of a pantomime; so she needs Cameron, the Old Etonian with a Brasenose First, as prime minister. Ideally in coalition with Nigel Farage. And most of all, she wants his in-or-out referendum on the European Union. If England votes to leave and Scotland to stay, it would induce the constitutional crisis that the SNP needs. This is the new road map to independence.
But for now, the SNP needs to win as many seats as possible – which means publicly entertaining the idea of coalition with Ed Miliband. Polls show that such an alliance would be the most popular election result in Scotland – which is precisely why, in the end, Ms Sturgeon can’t allow it to happen"
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Further to my point about Murphy and women. I know that this is not Labour's biggest problem which is probably Milliband among men and women. How ever if you compare Murphy not with Sturgeon who is plus 47 per cent among women , or with Salmond who was always strong plus among women but even with Swinney and Harvie of the Greens then Murphy comes out badly.
On the current MORI figures Swinney is plus 16 among women, Harvie plus 10 but Murphy minus 1. And so as I go into work is it possible that Murphy's lack of appeal is a further problem for Labour. They do look at best old fashioned and at worst like machine politicians from a bygone age!0 -
The coverage of this story in other news outlets is, of course, overwhelming. It's just the BBC that is ignoring it.TheWatcher said:
I'm sure they're keeping their powder dry until the civil trial starts, and then it will be wall to wall coverage across all platforms. Not.FrancisUrquhart said:http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/80463000/jpg/_80463058_indy.jpg
Really...The BBC seems very uninterested in this. I can't even find that fact that the Mirror had to make a large series of payouts today.
http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-30933790
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Try http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-30933790FrancisUrquhart said:http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/80463000/jpg/_80463058_indy.jpg
Really...The BBC seems very uninterested in this. I can't even find that fact that the Mirror had to make a large series of payouts today.
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Yeah I thought that...if I were a left wing unionist I think it would be perfect if Labour governed with an SNP deputy PM. In fact it seems the fairest way for the Union to workSouthamObserver said:
Pretty much on the button. A Tory government in Westminster would be a gift to the SNP. A Labour one would set back the case for independence a long way.isam said:Telegraph Politics @TelePolitics · 38m38 minutes ago
What the SNP really wants is Mr Cameron back in No 10 http://tgr.ph/1JqKscm
"The only goal that matters to the SNP is independence – and that means assembling a narrative of a Scotland suing for divorce on the grounds of irreconcilable political differences. Without a villain, Ms Sturgeon will not have much of a pantomime; so she needs Cameron, the Old Etonian with a Brasenose First, as prime minister. Ideally in coalition with Nigel Farage. And most of all, she wants his in-or-out referendum on the European Union. If England votes to leave and Scotland to stay, it would induce the constitutional crisis that the SNP needs. This is the new road map to independence.
But for now, the SNP needs to win as many seats as possible – which means publicly entertaining the idea of coalition with Ed Miliband. Polls show that such an alliance would be the most popular election result in Scotland – which is precisely why, in the end, Ms Sturgeon can’t allow it to happen"0 -
Labour's problem is that it is part of a Westminster elite that voters across Britain feel - quite rightly - is totally disconnected from them. And in Scotland voters have the perfect vehicle through which to express that dissatisfaction. It'll take Murphy a lot longer than two months to undo this.scotslass said:Further to my point about Murphy and women. I know that this is not Labour's biggest problem which is probably Milliband among men and women. How ever if you compare Murphy not with Sturgeon who is plus 47 per cent among women , or with Salmond who was always strong plus among women but even with Swinney and Harvie of the Greens then Murphy comes out badly.
On the current MORI figures Swinney is plus 16 among women, Harvie plus 10 but Murphy minus 1. And so as I go into work is it possible that Murphy's lack of appeal is a further problem for Labour. They do look at best old fashioned and at worst like machine politicians from a bygone age!
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I wouldn't place money on some of those.GeoffM said:
A shot in the dark but you may be thinking of Iain Dale - who was a candidate, not an MP.scotslass said:Felix
Wasn't the theory of no SNP surge based on the work of a former Tory MP?
Iain very bravely makes predictions for every seat in the UK here:
iaindale.com/posts/2014/12/29/general-election-predictions-the-complete-list0 -
If you believe in the Union you live with its consequences - good and bad. But the SNP rejects the Union and would never go into coalition with Labour. And Labour would be opposed to. But what both sides know is that the SNP would never help the Tories bring a minority Labour government down.isam said:
Yeah I thought that...if I were a left wing unionist I think it would be perfect if Labour governed with an SNP deputy PM. In fact it seems the fairest way for the Union to workSouthamObserver said:
Pretty much on the button. A Tory government in Westminster would be a gift to the SNP. A Labour one would set back the case for independence a long way.isam said:Telegraph Politics @TelePolitics · 38m38 minutes ago
What the SNP really wants is Mr Cameron back in No 10 http://tgr.ph/1JqKscm
"The only goal that matters to the SNP is independence – and that means assembling a narrative of a Scotland suing for divorce on the grounds of irreconcilable political differences. Without a villain, Ms Sturgeon will not have much of a pantomime; so she needs Cameron, the Old Etonian with a Brasenose First, as prime minister. Ideally in coalition with Nigel Farage. And most of all, she wants his in-or-out referendum on the European Union. If England votes to leave and Scotland to stay, it would induce the constitutional crisis that the SNP needs. This is the new road map to independence.
But for now, the SNP needs to win as many seats as possible – which means publicly entertaining the idea of coalition with Ed Miliband. Polls show that such an alliance would be the most popular election result in Scotland – which is precisely why, in the end, Ms Sturgeon can’t allow it to happen"
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It's not the job of MPs to "sort out problems".Indigo said:
Indeed, and irrespective of independence they also don't see why their MP should be wasting his time sorting out problems and issues that they don't see as their concern. If my local (English) MP spent a proportion of his time looking at issues with the SHS I wouldn't be very impressed either.JamesMo said:
That's an indication that SNP voters aren't that bothered about EVEL. In fact, some of them will support it because they think it will improve the prospects of independence.CarlottaVance said:Scots for EVEL - +21% net.....
Voters in Scotland are also sympathetic to the principle that Scottish MPs be prevented from voting on matters that have no direct impact on Scotland.
The poll found that 27% of Scots "strongly support" EVEL and a further 24% "tend to support" it, putting overall backing for the measure at 51%. Eighteen percent "strongly oppose" such a move while 12% "tend to oppose", totalling 30% in opposition. Fourteen percent said they neither supported nor opposed the policy.
http://news.stv.tv/scotland-decides/news/307531-stv-ipsos-mori-poll-on-smith-commission-and-english-votes-for-english-laws/
Their job is to hold the executive (who should be sorting the problems) to account. It's irrelevant whether the specific problem is one part of the country or other - it's good that the executive should be beaten up and cowed from time to time pour les encourager les autres
[Note: this recipe includes a healthy dash of idealism]0 -
The BBC does not make the point the Independent does, that MGN hacking was substantially greater than Murdoch press, instead focussing on the celebrity angle.SouthamObserver said:
The coverage of this story in other news outlets is, of course, overwhelming. It's just the BBC that is ignoring it.TheWatcher said:
I'm sure they're keeping their powder dry until the civil trial starts, and then it will be wall to wall coverage across all platforms. Not.FrancisUrquhart said:http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/80463000/jpg/_80463058_indy.jpg
Really...The BBC seems very uninterested in this. I can't even find that fact that the Mirror had to make a large series of payouts today.
http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-309337900 -
Indeed.AndyJS said:
The guy who beat Federer isn't much younger than he is. A couple of years or so.JackW said:Murray through but Federer out of the Australian Open.
Meanwhile .... Standing German men can still take the piss :
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-30937492
Federer was also in Murray's half of the draw so a good result for the Scot. Nadal plays last today and his form is patchy. He is also in Murray's half.
In the last sixteen Murray plays Dimitrov which is likely to be a much tougher match.
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Just reading up on Spain's Podemos party, compared to the eruption that would take place if they win (and they are currently leading the polls in Spain) in December, the probable victory of Syriza would be the merest clearing of the throat.
Their key policies appear to be resiling from the Lisbon Treaty and most of the MoUs with the EU, withdrawing from NATO, droping swinging taxes on multinationals to promote local businesses and a range of SWP/Environmental policies that would make our Green Party blush.... and at the same time they want to break down barriers across the EU!0 -
Indeed, but the SNP could appear reasonable whilst making a deal with Labour impossible (trident etc), and then stand back in faux horror as Cameron becomes PM, and gives them what they actually want, but cant say.SouthamObserver said:
If you believe in the Union you live with its consequences - good and bad. But the SNP rejects the Union and would never go into coalition with Labour. And Labour would be opposed to. But what both sides know is that the SNP would never help the Tories bring a minority Labour government down.isam said:
Yeah I thought that...if I were a left wing unionist I think it would be perfect if Labour governed with an SNP deputy PM. In fact it seems the fairest way for the Union to workSouthamObserver said:
Pretty much on the button. A Tory government in Westminster would be a gift to the SNP. A Labour one would set back the case for independence a long way.isam said:Telegraph Politics @TelePolitics · 38m38 minutes ago
What the SNP really wants is Mr Cameron back in No 10 http://tgr.ph/1JqKscm
"The only goal that matters to the SNP is independence – and that means assembling a narrative of a Scotland suing for divorce on the grounds of irreconcilable political differences. Without a villain, Ms Sturgeon will not have much of a pantomime; so she needs Cameron, the Old Etonian with a Brasenose First, as prime minister. Ideally in coalition with Nigel Farage. And most of all, she wants his in-or-out referendum on the European Union. If England votes to leave and Scotland to stay, it would induce the constitutional crisis that the SNP needs. This is the new road map to independence.
But for now, the SNP needs to win as many seats as possible – which means publicly entertaining the idea of coalition with Ed Miliband. Polls show that such an alliance would be the most popular election result in Scotland – which is precisely why, in the end, Ms Sturgeon can’t allow it to happen"
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I think all those constituencies MPs who spend their time is local surgeries listening to Mrs Miggins complaining about the poor service the local Fire Brigade gave in retrieving her cat from a tree might wish it were so!Charles said:
It's not the job of MPs to "sort out problems".Indigo said:
Indeed, and irrespective of independence they also don't see why their MP should be wasting his time sorting out problems and issues that they don't see as their concern. If my local (English) MP spent a proportion of his time looking at issues with the SHS I wouldn't be very impressed either.JamesMo said:
That's an indication that SNP voters aren't that bothered about EVEL. In fact, some of them will support it because they think it will improve the prospects of independence.CarlottaVance said:Scots for EVEL - +21% net.....
Voters in Scotland are also sympathetic to the principle that Scottish MPs be prevented from voting on matters that have no direct impact on Scotland.
The poll found that 27% of Scots "strongly support" EVEL and a further 24% "tend to support" it, putting overall backing for the measure at 51%. Eighteen percent "strongly oppose" such a move while 12% "tend to oppose", totalling 30% in opposition. Fourteen percent said they neither supported nor opposed the policy.
http://news.stv.tv/scotland-decides/news/307531-stv-ipsos-mori-poll-on-smith-commission-and-english-votes-for-english-laws/
Their job is to hold the executive (who should be sorting the problems) to account. It's irrelevant whether the specific problem is one part of the country or other - it's good that the executive should be beaten up and cowed from time to time pour les encourager les autres
[Note: this recipe includes a healthy dash of idealism]
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Like the SNP did in 1979.SouthamObserver said:
If you believe in the Union you live with its consequences - good and bad. But the SNP rejects the Union and would never go into coalition with Labour. And Labour would be opposed to. But what both sides know is that the SNP would never help the Tories bring a minority Labour government down.isam said:
Yeah I thought that...if I were a left wing unionist I think it would be perfect if Labour governed with an SNP deputy PM. In fact it seems the fairest way for the Union to workSouthamObserver said:
Pretty much on the button. A Tory government in Westminster would be a gift to the SNP. A Labour one would set back the case for independence a long way.isam said:Telegraph Politics @TelePolitics · 38m38 minutes ago
What the SNP really wants is Mr Cameron back in No 10 http://tgr.ph/1JqKscm
"The only goal that matters to the SNP is independence – and that means assembling a narrative of a Scotland suing for divorce on the grounds of irreconcilable political differences. Without a villain, Ms Sturgeon will not have much of a pantomime; so she needs Cameron, the Old Etonian with a Brasenose First, as prime minister. Ideally in coalition with Nigel Farage. And most of all, she wants his in-or-out referendum on the European Union. If England votes to leave and Scotland to stay, it would induce the constitutional crisis that the SNP needs. This is the new road map to independence.
But for now, the SNP needs to win as many seats as possible – which means publicly entertaining the idea of coalition with Ed Miliband. Polls show that such an alliance would be the most popular election result in Scotland – which is precisely why, in the end, Ms Sturgeon can’t allow it to happen"0 -
That's not their job.Indigo said:
I think all those constituencies MPs who spend their time is local surgeries listening to Mrs Miggins complaining about the poor service the local Fire Brigade gave in retrieving her cat from a tree might wish it were so!Charles said:
It's not the job of MPs to "sort out problems".Indigo said:
Indeed, and irrespective of independence they also don't see why their MP should be wasting his time sorting out problems and issues that they don't see as their concern. If my local (English) MP spent a proportion of his time looking at issues with the SHS I wouldn't be very impressed either.JamesMo said:
That's an indication that SNP voters aren't that bothered about EVEL. In fact, some of them will support it because they think it will improve the prospects of independence.CarlottaVance said:Scots for EVEL - +21% net.....
Voters in Scotland are also sympathetic to the principle that Scottish MPs be prevented from voting on matters that have no direct impact on Scotland.
The poll found that 27% of Scots "strongly support" EVEL and a further 24% "tend to support" it, putting overall backing for the measure at 51%. Eighteen percent "strongly oppose" such a move while 12% "tend to oppose", totalling 30% in opposition. Fourteen percent said they neither supported nor opposed the policy.
http://news.stv.tv/scotland-decides/news/307531-stv-ipsos-mori-poll-on-smith-commission-and-english-votes-for-english-laws/
Their job is to hold the executive (who should be sorting the problems) to account. It's irrelevant whether the specific problem is one part of the country or other - it's good that the executive should be beaten up and cowed from time to time pour les encourager les autres
[Note: this recipe includes a healthy dash of idealism]
They do it because it helps them get re-elected. But it's a voluntary activity.0 -
Yesterday you complained the BBC made you read all the way to the second sentence to discover the Mirror had settled.FrancisUrquhart said:http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/80463000/jpg/_80463058_indy.jpg
Really...The BBC seems very uninterested in this. I can't even find that fact that the Mirror had to make a large series of payouts today.
Look at other news outlets, such as, well, Sky. The story does not make the front page of Sky News (news.sky.com) so either it is your news judgement that is awry or Rupert Murdoch is part of a conspiracy to save the Mirror's blushes.0 -
Exactly. And look what happened to them as a result.DecrepitJohnL said:
Like the SNP did in 1979.SouthamObserver said:
If you believe in the Union you live with its consequences - good and bad. But the SNP rejects the Union and would never go into coalition with Labour. And Labour would be opposed to. But what both sides know is that the SNP would never help the Tories bring a minority Labour government down.isam said:
Yeah I thought that...if I were a left wing unionist I think it would be perfect if Labour governed with an SNP deputy PM. In fact it seems the fairest way for the Union to workSouthamObserver said:
Pretty much on the button. A Tory government in Westminster would be a gift to the SNP. A Labour one would set back the case for independence a long way.isam said:Telegraph Politics @TelePolitics · 38m38 minutes ago
What the SNP really wants is Mr Cameron back in No 10 http://tgr.ph/1JqKscm
"The only goal that matters to the SNP is independence – and that means assembling a narrative of a Scotland suing for divorce on the grounds of irreconcilable political differences. Without a villain, Ms Sturgeon will not have much of a pantomime; so she needs Cameron, the Old Etonian with a Brasenose First, as prime minister. Ideally in coalition with Nigel Farage. And most of all, she wants his in-or-out referendum on the European Union. If England votes to leave and Scotland to stay, it would induce the constitutional crisis that the SNP needs. This is the new road map to independence.
But for now, the SNP needs to win as many seats as possible – which means publicly entertaining the idea of coalition with Ed Miliband. Polls show that such an alliance would be the most popular election result in Scotland – which is precisely why, in the end, Ms Sturgeon can’t allow it to happen"
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naaaah.. more like every mention of hacking kicks Murdoch and NI in the goolies..again There are other battles to fight...DecrepitJohnL said:
Yesterday you complained the BBC made you read all the way to the second sentence to discover the Mirror had settled.FrancisUrquhart said:http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/80463000/jpg/_80463058_indy.jpg
Really...The BBC seems very uninterested in this. I can't even find that fact that the Mirror had to make a large series of payouts today.
Look at other news outlets, such as, well, Sky. The story does not make the front page of Sky News (news.sky.com) so either it is your news judgement that is awry or Rupert Murdoch is part of a conspiracy to save the Mirror's blushes.0 -
Just possibly, there are other interesting events going on in the world at present, such as council by elections in Fife, that push the surprising news that tabloid journalists are low-life down the batting order.DecrepitJohnL said:
Yesterday you complained the BBC made you read all the way to the second sentence to discover the Mirror had settled.FrancisUrquhart said:http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/80463000/jpg/_80463058_indy.jpg
Really...The BBC seems very uninterested in this. I can't even find that fact that the Mirror had to make a large series of payouts today.
Look at other news outlets, such as, well, Sky. The story does not make the front page of Sky News (news.sky.com) so either it is your news judgement that is awry or Rupert Murdoch is part of a conspiracy to save the Mirror's blushes.0 -
MGN has not spent recent years parking its tanks on Auntie's lawn. So there is no agenda to go after it as a threat to their life force....CarlottaVance said:
The BBC does not make the point the Independent does, that MGN hacking was substantially greater than Murdoch press, instead focussing on the celebrity angle.SouthamObserver said:
The coverage of this story in other news outlets is, of course, overwhelming. It's just the BBC that is ignoring it.TheWatcher said:
I'm sure they're keeping their powder dry until the civil trial starts, and then it will be wall to wall coverage across all platforms. Not.FrancisUrquhart said:http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/80463000/jpg/_80463058_indy.jpg
Really...The BBC seems very uninterested in this. I can't even find that fact that the Mirror had to make a large series of payouts today.
http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-30933790
0 -
Southampton Observer
Now at work so I'll keep this short. I think Murphy is making things worse not better. Most politicians get a leaders honey moon. He is having a reverse honey moon. One reason may be that he is profoundly unattractive. I don't mean physically just that male machine politicians are a profound turn off for women.
The figures from the MORI survey tend to bear out the theory that Murphy is part of Labour' s Many problems.0 -
Been thinking about this Scottish problem and I just invented the SUP!0
-
"Progressive" London coming to its senses over Islamic extremists
"Nearly half of Londoners back bringing back the death penalty for terrorist murders, a shock poll reveals today.
The YouGov survey for the Standard showed 49 per cent of adults in the capital support capital punishment for murder during terrorist attacks, such as the killing of Fusilier Lee Rigby.
Men are more hardline, with 55 per cent believing terrorist killers should be executed, compared to 42 per cent of women"
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/nearly-half-of-londoners-support-death-penalty-for-terrorist-murders-9994720.html0 -
Another 3mil borrowed... was this to pay for Cameron's EU Budget Victory?
Suzanne Evans @SuzanneEvans1 · 18m18 minutes ago
£1.7bn EU demand; £2.9bn added to National debt in direct consequence. From @standardnews #BetterOffOut pic.twitter.com/MW3olrFyIb
0 -
Firstly its not a shock poll, secondly it is well known that public opinion is and always has been in favour of the death penalty. So its not much of a story and one wonders why the Standard should have wasted its money on the poll unless it was to pander to the more unreasoned feelings in society. The death penalty will never return and that's a good thing.isam said:"Progressive" London coming to its senses over Islamic extremists
"Nearly half of Londoners back bringing back the death penalty for terrorist murders, a shock poll reveals today.
The YouGov survey for the Standard showed 49 per cent of adults in the capital support capital punishment for murder during terrorist attacks, such as the killing of Fusilier Lee Rigby.
Men are more hardline, with 55 per cent believing terrorist killers should be executed, compared to 42 per cent of women"
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/nearly-half-of-londoners-support-death-penalty-for-terrorist-murders-9994720.html0 -
She's wrong, though (arguably - IANAA)isam said:Another 3mil borrowed... was this to pay for Cameron's EU Budget Victory?
Suzanne Evans @SuzanneEvans1 · 18m18 minutes ago
£1.7bn EU demand; £2.9bn added to National debt in direct consequence. From @standardnews #BetterOffOut pic.twitter.com/MW3olrFyIb
It's largely an accounting charge, with no cash transferred. So it comes down to how you define national debt. But the government won't need to borrow any extra to pay for it.0 -
Never is a long time. That sort of law is always only one election away, you just need an angry enough population.SquareRoot said:
Firstly its not a shock poll, secondly it is well known that public opinion is and always has been in favour of the death penalty. So its not much of a story and one wonders why the Standard should have wasted its money on the poll unless it was to pander to the more unreasoned feelings in society. The death penalty will never return and that's a good thing.isam said:"Progressive" London coming to its senses over Islamic extremists
"Nearly half of Londoners back bringing back the death penalty for terrorist murders, a shock poll reveals today.
The YouGov survey for the Standard showed 49 per cent of adults in the capital support capital punishment for murder during terrorist attacks, such as the killing of Fusilier Lee Rigby.
Men are more hardline, with 55 per cent believing terrorist killers should be executed, compared to 42 per cent of women"
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/nearly-half-of-londoners-support-death-penalty-for-terrorist-murders-9994720.html0 -
In your opinionSquareRoot said:
Firstly its not a shock poll, secondly it is well known that public opinion is and always has been in favour of the death penalty. So its not much of a story and one wonders why the Standard should have wasted its money on the poll unless it was to pander to the more unreasoned feelings in society. The death penalty will never return and that's a good thing.isam said:"Progressive" London coming to its senses over Islamic extremists
"Nearly half of Londoners back bringing back the death penalty for terrorist murders, a shock poll reveals today.
The YouGov survey for the Standard showed 49 per cent of adults in the capital support capital punishment for murder during terrorist attacks, such as the killing of Fusilier Lee Rigby.
Men are more hardline, with 55 per cent believing terrorist killers should be executed, compared to 42 per cent of women"
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/nearly-half-of-londoners-support-death-penalty-for-terrorist-murders-9994720.html
I don't see why the two blokes who cut off Lee Rigby's head shouldn't be killed0 -
Ok not in your or my lifetime, nor anyone who is currently alive and of voting age.. Is that long enough?Indigo said:
Never is a long time.SquareRoot said:
Firstly its not a shock poll, secondly it is well known that public opinion is and always has been in favour of the death penalty. So its not much of a story and one wonders why the Standard should have wasted its money on the poll unless it was to pander to the more unreasoned feelings in society. The death penalty will never return and that's a good thing.isam said:"Progressive" London coming to its senses over Islamic extremists
"Nearly half of Londoners back bringing back the death penalty for terrorist murders, a shock poll reveals today.
The YouGov survey for the Standard showed 49 per cent of adults in the capital support capital punishment for murder during terrorist attacks, such as the killing of Fusilier Lee Rigby.
Men are more hardline, with 55 per cent believing terrorist killers should be executed, compared to 42 per cent of women"
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/nearly-half-of-londoners-support-death-penalty-for-terrorist-murders-9994720.html0 -
You might be right. Europe implodes. UKIP wins the election in 2020 and offers the population a referendum on it, population votes in favor. Not likely, but smug in the extreme to suggest its more than a heartbeat away. Putting that in context, Podemas didn't exists 9 months ago, and is probably going to win the next Spanish election.SquareRoot said:
Ok not in your or my lifetime, nor anyone who is currently alive and of voting age.. Is that long enough?Indigo said:
Never is a long time.SquareRoot said:
Firstly its not a shock poll, secondly it is well known that public opinion is and always has been in favour of the death penalty. So its not much of a story and one wonders why the Standard should have wasted its money on the poll unless it was to pander to the more unreasoned feelings in society. The death penalty will never return and that's a good thing.isam said:"Progressive" London coming to its senses over Islamic extremists
"Nearly half of Londoners back bringing back the death penalty for terrorist murders, a shock poll reveals today.
The YouGov survey for the Standard showed 49 per cent of adults in the capital support capital punishment for murder during terrorist attacks, such as the killing of Fusilier Lee Rigby.
Men are more hardline, with 55 per cent believing terrorist killers should be executed, compared to 42 per cent of women"
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/nearly-half-of-londoners-support-death-penalty-for-terrorist-murders-9994720.html
0 -
Good morning, everyone.
King Abdullah of Saudi Arabia is dead:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-309453240 -
The commentary on the Kirkcaldy by-election result is a complete misinterpretation of the outcome. It is a massive swing of 13.9% to the SNP, as the by-election is effectively conducted on the AV system, whereas the original council election was STV, in which Labour was the clear winner. For what it's worth, given the typical low council by-election turnout, it is in line with the SNP's current massive lead in Scottish opinion polls. The latter, if it actually occurs on 7/5/15, would pose the sort of challenge to the current configuration of the UK as SF's sweep of nearly all the seats in the 26 counties did in 1918, which led to their liberation from Westminster rule less than 4 years later.0
-
I am sure you don't, and that's why the likes of you should never be allowed anywhere near the levers of power.isam said:
In your opinionSquareRoot said:
Firstly its not a shock poll, secondly it is well known that public opinion is and always has been in favour of the death penalty. So its not much of a story and one wonders why the Standard should have wasted its money on the poll unless it was to pander to the more unreasoned feelings in society. The death penalty will never return and that's a good thing.isam said:"Progressive" London coming to its senses over Islamic extremists
"Nearly half of Londoners back bringing back the death penalty for terrorist murders, a shock poll reveals today.
The YouGov survey for the Standard showed 49 per cent of adults in the capital support capital punishment for murder during terrorist attacks, such as the killing of Fusilier Lee Rigby.
Men are more hardline, with 55 per cent believing terrorist killers should be executed, compared to 42 per cent of women"
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/nearly-half-of-londoners-support-death-penalty-for-terrorist-murders-9994720.html
I don't see why the two blokes who cut off Lee Rigby's head shouldn't be killed0 -
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/jan/22/cilla-black-settle-phone-hacking-damages-claim-mirror
Funnily enough, the Guardian too makes no mention of MGN hacking being greeter than Murdoch press....0 -
SquareRoot,
"that's why the likes of you should never be allowed anywhere near the levers of power."
You've not quite got the hang of this democracy lark, have you?
The important people make the decisions, the plebs suck it up. Interesting. And btw, I'm not in favour of the death penalty, but my vote is worth no more than any one else.
I disagree with other things and sometimes find myself in a minority. Some people just won't be told.0 -
If European living standards continue to flatline, or decline, then almost every basic assumption about politics will go out the window.Indigo said:
You might be right. Europe implodes. UKIP wins the election in 2020 and offers the population a referendum on it, population votes in favor. Not likely, but smug in the extreme to suggest its more than a heartbeat away. Putting that in context, Podemas didn't exists 9 months ago, and is probably going to win the next Spanish election.SquareRoot said:
Ok not in your or my lifetime, nor anyone who is currently alive and of voting age.. Is that long enough?Indigo said:
Never is a long time.SquareRoot said:
Firstly its not a shock poll, secondly it is well known that public opinion is and always has been in favour of the death penalty. So its not much of a story and one wonders why the Standard should have wasted its money on the poll unless it was to pander to the more unreasoned feelings in society. The death penalty will never return and that's a good thing.isam said:"Progressive" London coming to its senses over Islamic extremists
"Nearly half of Londoners back bringing back the death penalty for terrorist murders, a shock poll reveals today.
The YouGov survey for the Standard showed 49 per cent of adults in the capital support capital punishment for murder during terrorist attacks, such as the killing of Fusilier Lee Rigby.
Men are more hardline, with 55 per cent believing terrorist killers should be executed, compared to 42 per cent of women"
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/nearly-half-of-londoners-support-death-penalty-for-terrorist-murders-9994720.html0 -
@ Morris Dancer:
I note the fawning in the media regarding the late King Abdullah. An interesting contrast with the attitude towards Iran, which while hardly an upholder of human rights, is a paragon of democracy compared to the despotic Saudi regime. There are no polls in the Arabian peninsula0 -
SquareRoot said:
I am sure you don't, and that's why the likes of you should never be allowed anywhere near the levers of power.isam said:
In your opinionSquareRoot said:
Firstly its not a shock poll, secondly it is well known that public opinion is and always has been in favour of the death penalty. So its not much of a story and one wonders why the Standard should have wasted its money on the poll unless it was to pander to the more unreasoned feelings in society. The death penalty will never return and that's a good thing.isam said:"Progressive" London coming to its senses over Islamic extremists
"Nearly half of Londoners back bringing back the death penalty for terrorist murders, a shock poll reveals today.
The YouGov survey for the Standard showed 49 per cent of adults in the capital support capital punishment for murder during terrorist attacks, such as the killing of Fusilier Lee Rigby.
Men are more hardline, with 55 per cent believing terrorist killers should be executed, compared to 42 per cent of women"
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/nearly-half-of-londoners-support-death-penalty-for-terrorist-murders-9994720.html
I don't see why the two blokes who cut off Lee Rigby's head shouldn't be killed
Really? Who made you the judge and jury of everything?SquareRoot said:
I am sure you don't, and that's why the likes of you should never be allowed anywhere near the levers of power.isam said:
In your opinionSquareRoot said:
Firstly its not a shock poll, secondly it is well known that public opinion is and always has been in favour of the death penalty. So its not much of a story and one wonders why the Standard should have wasted its money on the poll unless it was to pander to the more unreasoned feelings in society. The death penalty will never return and that's a good thing.isam said:"Progressive" London coming to its senses over Islamic extremists
"Nearly half of Londoners back bringing back the death penalty for terrorist murders, a shock poll reveals today.
The YouGov survey for the Standard showed 49 per cent of adults in the capital support capital punishment for murder during terrorist attacks, such as the killing of Fusilier Lee Rigby.
Men are more hardline, with 55 per cent believing terrorist killers should be executed, compared to 42 per cent of women"
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/nearly-half-of-londoners-support-death-penalty-for-terrorist-murders-9994720.html
I don't see why the two blokes who cut off Lee Rigby's head shouldn't be killed
Let me guess? You0 -
Mr. Dao, welcome to pb.com.
I only checked the headline so can't comment on coverage generally, but Iran is still seen as an enemy. Why KSA, with its funding of lunatics around the world, is not is beyond me.0 -
People who spend their life in the (recently) peaceful UK have unrealistic expectation of how fast the world changes when people get unhappy. One glance at the policies of Podemas shows you a taste. Personally I think that if 1,000 extremists come back from Syria and there is a mainland terrorism campaign as a result, in a far more visceral and unpleasant way than the IRA managed, the views of the British public on all sorts of things will change very fast. I hope it doesn't come to that, but the prerequisites are starting to line up.Sean_F said:
If European living standards continue to flatline, or decline, then almost every basic assumption about politics will go out the window.Indigo said:
You might be right. Europe implodes. UKIP wins the election in 2020 and offers the population a referendum on it, population votes in favor. Not likely, but smug in the extreme to suggest its more than a heartbeat away. Putting that in context, Podemas didn't exists 9 months ago, and is probably going to win the next Spanish election.SquareRoot said:
Ok not in your or my lifetime, nor anyone who is currently alive and of voting age.. Is that long enough?Indigo said:
Never is a long time.SquareRoot said:
Firstly its not a shock poll, secondly it is well known that public opinion is and always has been in favour of the death penalty. So its not much of a story and one wonders why the Standard should have wasted its money on the poll unless it was to pander to the more unreasoned feelings in society. The death penalty will never return and that's a good thing.isam said:"Progressive" London coming to its senses over Islamic extremists
"Nearly half of Londoners back bringing back the death penalty for terrorist murders, a shock poll reveals today.
The YouGov survey for the Standard showed 49 per cent of adults in the capital support capital punishment for murder during terrorist attacks, such as the killing of Fusilier Lee Rigby.
Men are more hardline, with 55 per cent believing terrorist killers should be executed, compared to 42 per cent of women"
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/nearly-half-of-londoners-support-death-penalty-for-terrorist-murders-9994720.html0 -
Steven Finn's back!0
-
I think I have. You need 326MPs to vote for the death penalty and then the House of Lords.. I think democracy will stop it happening.CD13 said:SquareRoot,
"that's why the likes of you should never be allowed anywhere near the levers of power."
You've not quite got the hang of this democracy lark, have you?
The important people make the decisions, the plebs suck it up. Interesting. And btw, I'm not in favour of the death penalty, but my vote is worth no more than any one else.
I disagree with other things and sometimes find myself in a minority. Some people just won't be told.
If UKIP can get 326MP's all of whom support the death penalty then we will see.
0 -
Talking about the Standard, there was a very amusing advert I saw yesterday.SquareRoot said:
Firstly its not a shock poll, secondly it is well known that public opinion is and always has been in favour of the death penalty. So its not much of a story and one wonders why the Standard should have wasted its money on the poll unless it was to pander to the more unreasoned feelings in society. The death penalty will never return and that's a good thing.isam said:"Progressive" London coming to its senses over Islamic extremists
"Nearly half of Londoners back bringing back the death penalty for terrorist murders, a shock poll reveals today.
The YouGov survey for the Standard showed 49 per cent of adults in the capital support capital punishment for murder during terrorist attacks, such as the killing of Fusilier Lee Rigby.
Men are more hardline, with 55 per cent believing terrorist killers should be executed, compared to 42 per cent of women"
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/nearly-half-of-londoners-support-death-penalty-for-terrorist-murders-9994720.html
First Great Western is running one of those tedious campaigns with a model pretending to be an employee, and talking about her contribution to your life as a customer. Funny thing is she's a black lady called Tory.
So you have lot's a nice photos of a pretty, industrious women with the strap lines
"Tory's keeping you moving"
"Tory's building a greater West"
"Tory's investing in your future"
...couldn't have planned it better myself...
0 -
Not even close. How many MPs initially supported the AV referendum ? 57. It still happened. All you need is a government desperate for a coalition partner and all sorts of magic happens on relatively few votes. I personally don't want the death penalty either, but your high handed approach to what might prove to be the democratic will of the people is offensive.SquareRoot said:
I think I have. You need 326MPs to vote for the death penalty and then the House of Lords.. I think democracy will stop it happening.CD13 said:SquareRoot,
"that's why the likes of you should never be allowed anywhere near the levers of power."
You've not quite got the hang of this democracy lark, have you?
The important people make the decisions, the plebs suck it up. Interesting. And btw, I'm not in favour of the death penalty, but my vote is worth no more than any one else.
I disagree with other things and sometimes find myself in a minority. Some people just won't be told.
If UKIP gan get 326MP's then we will see.0 -
Because it reverses the relationship between the State and the Citizenisam said:
In your opinionSquareRoot said:
Firstly its not a shock poll, secondly it is well known that public opinion is and always has been in favour of the death penalty. So its not much of a story and one wonders why the Standard should have wasted its money on the poll unless it was to pander to the more unreasoned feelings in society. The death penalty will never return and that's a good thing.isam said:"Progressive" London coming to its senses over Islamic extremists
"Nearly half of Londoners back bringing back the death penalty for terrorist murders, a shock poll reveals today.
The YouGov survey for the Standard showed 49 per cent of adults in the capital support capital punishment for murder during terrorist attacks, such as the killing of Fusilier Lee Rigby.
Men are more hardline, with 55 per cent believing terrorist killers should be executed, compared to 42 per cent of women"
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/nearly-half-of-londoners-support-death-penalty-for-terrorist-murders-9994720.html
I don't see why the two blokes who cut off Lee Rigby's head shouldn't be killed
Giving the State the power to decide which of its Citizens can live or die would be an obscenity.0 -
Hmmm....I do. There is no rowing back from an erroneous conviction that leads to someone being executed. It means the state has taken a life without reason or recourse. Thus I oppose the death penalty.isam said:
I don't see why the two blokes who cut off Lee Rigby's head shouldn't be killedSquareRoot said:
Firstly its not a shock poll, secondly it is well known that public opinion is and always has been in favour of the death penalty. So its not much of a story and one wonders why the Standard should have wasted its money on the poll unless it was to pander to the more unreasoned feelings in society. The death penalty will never return and that's a good thing.isam said:"Progressive" London coming to its senses over Islamic extremists
"Nearly half of Londoners back bringing back the death penalty for terrorist murders, a shock poll reveals today.
The YouGov survey for the Standard showed 49 per cent of adults in the capital support capital punishment for murder during terrorist attacks, such as the killing of Fusilier Lee Rigby.
Men are more hardline, with 55 per cent believing terrorist killers should be executed, compared to 42 per cent of women"
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/nearly-half-of-londoners-support-death-penalty-for-terrorist-murders-9994720.html
I do, however, fully support the notion of punishment and that some crimes deserve life without the possibility of parole. This is in effect 'death by prison' as opposed to death by hanging. Sutcliffe, Hindley, Shipman - these type of people should just stay in a cell forever. Maybe in a way that is a worse fate than a swift end...0 -
I agree, but that's democracy for you you. The people over time have been stupid enough to give the government all sorts of powers over them that they shouldn't have.Charles said:
Because it reverses the relationship between the State and the Citizenisam said:
In your opinionSquareRoot said:
Firstly its not a shock poll, secondly it is well known that public opinion is and always has been in favour of the death penalty. So its not much of a story and one wonders why the Standard should have wasted its money on the poll unless it was to pander to the more unreasoned feelings in society. The death penalty will never return and that's a good thing.isam said:"Progressive" London coming to its senses over Islamic extremists
"Nearly half of Londoners back bringing back the death penalty for terrorist murders, a shock poll reveals today.
The YouGov survey for the Standard showed 49 per cent of adults in the capital support capital punishment for murder during terrorist attacks, such as the killing of Fusilier Lee Rigby.
Men are more hardline, with 55 per cent believing terrorist killers should be executed, compared to 42 per cent of women"
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/nearly-half-of-londoners-support-death-penalty-for-terrorist-murders-9994720.html
I don't see why the two blokes who cut off Lee Rigby's head shouldn't be killed
Giving the State the power to decide which of its Citizens can live or die would be an obscenity.
0 -
If I was Greek, I'd vote for Syriza.Indigo said:
People who spend their life in the (recently) peaceful UK have unrealistic expectation of how fast the world changes when people get unhappy. One glance at the policies of Podemas shows you a taste. Personally I think that if 1,000 extremists come back from Syria and there is a mainland terrorism campaign as a result, in a far more visceral and unpleasant way than the IRA managed, the views of the British public on all sorts of things will change very fast. I hope it doesn't come to that, but the prerequisites are starting to line up.Sean_F said:
If European living standards continue to flatline, or decline, then almost every basic assumption about politics will go out the window.Indigo said:
You might be right. Europe implodes. UKIP wins the election in 2020 and offers the population a referendum on it, population votes in favor. Not likely, but smug in the extreme to suggest its more than a heartbeat away. Putting that in context, Podemas didn't exists 9 months ago, and is probably going to win the next Spanish election.SquareRoot said:
Ok not in your or my lifetime, nor anyone who is currently alive and of voting age.. Is that long enough?Indigo said:
Never is a long time.SquareRoot said:
Firstly its not a shock poll, secondly it is well known that public opinion is and always has been in favour of the death penalty. So its not much of a story and one wonders why the Standard should have wasted its money on the poll unless it was to pander to the more unreasoned feelings in society. The death penalty will never return and that's a good thing.isam said:"Progressive" London coming to its senses over Islamic extremists
"Nearly half of Londoners back bringing back the death penalty for terrorist murders, a shock poll reveals today.
The YouGov survey for the Standard showed 49 per cent of adults in the capital support capital punishment for murder during terrorist attacks, such as the killing of Fusilier Lee Rigby.
Men are more hardline, with 55 per cent believing terrorist killers should be executed, compared to 42 per cent of women"
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/nearly-half-of-londoners-support-death-penalty-for-terrorist-murders-9994720.html
0 -
LOL AV isn't the death penalty.. Funny how there is so much talk of the death penalty in Amerca and the screams at the injustice of it (and rightly so ) and given the miscarriages of justice that go on daily both here and in the USA.. the death penalty isn't coming back, its final, and you can't row back from it.Indigo said:
Not even close. How many MPs initially supported the AV referendum ? 57. It still happened. All you need is a government desperate for a coalition partner and all sorts of magic happens on relatively few votes. I personally don't want the death penalty either, but your high handed approach to what might prove to be the democratic will of the people is offensive.SquareRoot said:
I think I have. You need 326MPs to vote for the death penalty and then the House of Lords.. I think democracy will stop it happening.CD13 said:SquareRoot,
"that's why the likes of you should never be allowed anywhere near the levers of power."
You've not quite got the hang of this democracy lark, have you?
The important people make the decisions, the plebs suck it up. Interesting. And btw, I'm not in favour of the death penalty, but my vote is worth no more than any one else.
I disagree with other things and sometimes find myself in a minority. Some people just won't be told.
If UKIP gan get 326MP's then we will see.
There will always be terrorist and mass murderers, doesn't mean we have to sink to their level.0 -
It took several hundred years of work to move from the tyranny of the Tudors to the current restraints on the executive... I'd rather we didn't throw it away (and, in fact, I'd want to strengthen the ability of parliament to hold the executive to account)Indigo said:
I agree, but that's democracy for you you. The people over time have been stupid enough to give the government all sorts of powers over them that they shouldn't have.Charles said:
Because it reverses the relationship between the State and the Citizenisam said:
In your opinionSquareRoot said:
Firstly its not a shock poll, secondly it is well known that public opinion is and always has been in favour of the death penalty. So its not much of a story and one wonders why the Standard should have wasted its money on the poll unless it was to pander to the more unreasoned feelings in society. The death penalty will never return and that's a good thing.isam said:"Progressive" London coming to its senses over Islamic extremists
"Nearly half of Londoners back bringing back the death penalty for terrorist murders, a shock poll reveals today.
The YouGov survey for the Standard showed 49 per cent of adults in the capital support capital punishment for murder during terrorist attacks, such as the killing of Fusilier Lee Rigby.
Men are more hardline, with 55 per cent believing terrorist killers should be executed, compared to 42 per cent of women"
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/nearly-half-of-londoners-support-death-penalty-for-terrorist-murders-9994720.html
I don't see why the two blokes who cut off Lee Rigby's head shouldn't be killed
Giving the State the power to decide which of its Citizens can live or die would be an obscenity.0 -
So we should abolish the NHS ?Charles said:
Because it reverses the relationship between the State and the Citizenisam said:
In your opinionSquareRoot said:
Firstly its not a shock poll, secondly it is well known that public opinion is and always has been in favour of the death penalty. So its not much of a story and one wonders why the Standard should have wasted its money on the poll unless it was to pander to the more unreasoned feelings in society. The death penalty will never return and that's a good thing.isam said:"Progressive" London coming to its senses over Islamic extremists
"Nearly half of Londoners back bringing back the death penalty for terrorist murders, a shock poll reveals today.
The YouGov survey for the Standard showed 49 per cent of adults in the capital support capital punishment for murder during terrorist attacks, such as the killing of Fusilier Lee Rigby.
Men are more hardline, with 55 per cent believing terrorist killers should be executed, compared to 42 per cent of women"
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/nearly-half-of-londoners-support-death-penalty-for-terrorist-murders-9994720.html
I don't see why the two blokes who cut off Lee Rigby's head shouldn't be killed
Giving the State the power to decide which of its Citizens can live or die would be an obscenity.0 -
SNP voters are more anti Europe than the Scottish population at large. If you love "big tent" politics then you have to love the SNP as the finest example.AndyJS said:In the 1975 referendum Scotland was more anti-Europe than England.
isam said:Telegraph Politics @TelePolitics · 38m38 minutes ago
What the SNP really wants is Mr Cameron back in No 10 http://tgr.ph/1JqKscm
"The only goal that matters to the SNP is independence – and that means assembling a narrative of a Scotland suing for divorce on the grounds of irreconcilable political differences. Without a villain, Ms Sturgeon will not have much of a pantomime; so she needs Cameron, the Old Etonian with a Brasenose First, as prime minister. Ideally in coalition with Nigel Farage. And most of all, she wants his in-or-out referendum on the European Union. If England votes to leave and Scotland to stay, it would induce the constitutional crisis that the SNP needs. This is the new road map to independence.
But for now, the SNP needs to win as many seats as possible – which means publicly entertaining the idea of coalition with Ed Miliband. Polls show that such an alliance would be the most popular election result in Scotland – which is precisely why, in the end, Ms Sturgeon can’t allow it to happen"0 -
Philosophically I'd think about it as exile: the State has the right to say 'if you won't abide by the rules of our society, we have the right to exclude you from membership'.Patrick said:
Hmmm....I do. There is no rowing back from an erroneous conviction that leads to someone being executed. It means the state has taken a life without reason or recourse. Thus I oppose the death penalty.isam said:
I don't see why the two blokes who cut off Lee Rigby's head shouldn't be killedSquareRoot said:
Firstly its not a shock poll, secondly it is well known that public opinion is and always has been in favour of the death penalty. So its not much of a story and one wonders why the Standard should have wasted its money on the poll unless it was to pander to the more unreasoned feelings in society. The death penalty will never return and that's a good thing.isam said:"Progressive" London coming to its senses over Islamic extremists
"Nearly half of Londoners back bringing back the death penalty for terrorist murders, a shock poll reveals today.
The YouGov survey for the Standard showed 49 per cent of adults in the capital support capital punishment for murder during terrorist attacks, such as the killing of Fusilier Lee Rigby.
Men are more hardline, with 55 per cent believing terrorist killers should be executed, compared to 42 per cent of women"
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/nearly-half-of-londoners-support-death-penalty-for-terrorist-murders-9994720.html
I do, however, fully support the notion of punishment and that some crimes deserve life without the possibility of parole. This is in effect 'death by prison' as opposed to death by hanging. Sutcliffe, Hindley, Shipman - these type of people should just stay in a cell forever. Maybe in a way that is a worse fate than a swift end...
This translates as exile: either external (deportation...transportation being somewhat out of fashion at the moment) or internal (prison without parole).0 -
Only just catching up on this, and it may have been noted before on here but:
Rumour has it Labour might not go ahead with the TV debates ...0 -
I don't think the LiBDems were even that keen on AV - they wanted multi-member costituencies with STVIndigo said:
Not even close. How many MPs initially supported the AV referendum ? 57. It still happened. All you need is a government desperate for a coalition partner and all sorts of magic happens on relatively few votes. I personally don't want the death penalty either, but your high handed approach to what might prove to be the democratic will of the people is offensive.SquareRoot said:
I think I have. You need 326MPs to vote for the death penalty and then the House of Lords.. I think democracy will stop it happening.CD13 said:SquareRoot,
"that's why the likes of you should never be allowed anywhere near the levers of power."
You've not quite got the hang of this democracy lark, have you?
The important people make the decisions, the plebs suck it up. Interesting. And btw, I'm not in favour of the death penalty, but my vote is worth no more than any one else.
I disagree with other things and sometimes find myself in a minority. Some people just won't be told.
If UKIP gan get 326MP's then we will see.
I voted against AV. I might vote for MMC-STV0 -
Your sounding desperate, and illogical.SquareRoot said:
LOL AV isn't the death penalty.. Funny how there is so much talk of the death penalty in Amerca and the screams at the injustice of it (and rightly so ) and given the miscarriages of justice that go on daily both here and in the USA.. the death penalty isn't coming back, its final, and you can't row back from it.Indigo said:
Not even close. How many MPs initially supported the AV referendum ? 57. It still happened. All you need is a government desperate for a coalition partner and all sorts of magic happens on relatively few votes. I personally don't want the death penalty either, but your high handed approach to what might prove to be the democratic will of the people is offensive.SquareRoot said:
I think I have. You need 326MPs to vote for the death penalty and then the House of Lords.. I think democracy will stop it happening.CD13 said:SquareRoot,
"that's why the likes of you should never be allowed anywhere near the levers of power."
You've not quite got the hang of this democracy lark, have you?
The important people make the decisions, the plebs suck it up. Interesting. And btw, I'm not in favour of the death penalty, but my vote is worth no more than any one else.
I disagree with other things and sometimes find myself in a minority. Some people just won't be told.
If UKIP gan get 326MP's then we will see.
There will always be terrorist and mass murderers, doesn't mean we have to sink to their level.
You either believe in democracy or you don't. If you do you, have to accept that the people have the right to vote for stupid things, as they historically have done any number of times. The question isn't whether we have to sink their their level, clearly we don't, the question is will we sink to their level, and the answer if the population gets angry enough is yes. The emergence is Spain of a new political force that is going to win the next election because the population is angry is proof of that.0 -
C-Alanbrooke said:
So we should abolish the NHS ?Charles said:
Because it reverses the relationship between the State and the Citizenisam said:
In your opinionSquareRoot said:
Firstly its not a shock poll, secondly it is well known that public opinion is and always has been in favour of the death penalty. So its not much of a story and one wonders why the Standard should have wasted its money on the poll unless it was to pander to the more unreasoned feelings in society. The death penalty will never return and that's a good thing.isam said:"Progressive" London coming to its senses over Islamic extremists
"Nearly half of Londoners back bringing back the death penalty for terrorist murders, a shock poll reveals today.
The YouGov survey for the Standard showed 49 per cent of adults in the capital support capital punishment for murder during terrorist attacks, such as the killing of Fusilier Lee Rigby.
Men are more hardline, with 55 per cent believing terrorist killers should be executed, compared to 42 per cent of women"
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/nearly-half-of-londoners-support-death-penalty-for-terrorist-murders-9994720.html
I don't see why the two blokes who cut off Lee Rigby's head shouldn't be killed
Giving the State the power to decide which of its Citizens can live or die would be an obscenity.
Disappointing. You can troll better than that.
0 -
Iran isn't our enemy, it is Israel's. Regional rival, supports Hezbollah and the Palestinians.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Dao, welcome to pb.com.
I only checked the headline so can't comment on coverage generally, but Iran is still seen as an enemy. Why KSA, with its funding of lunatics around the world, is not is beyond me.
http://original.antiwar.com/justin/2015/01/22/the-great-iran-debate/0
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