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The Tory irrelevance continues – politicalbetting.com

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  • TresTres Posts: 2,775

    kamski said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    algarkirk said:

    TimS said:

    Speaker Mike Johnson

    @SpeakerJohnson
    The House is working overtime to limit the abuses of activist federal judges. Our @JudiciaryGOP
    will expose the worst offenders in a high profile hearing & we are preparing urgent legislative action, like the @repdarrellissa bill to stop unfounded nationwide injunctions.

    https://x.com/SpeakerJohnson/status/1903529228085109157

    My periodic check: are we agreed the USA is becoming a dictatorship yet, or is the - um -jury still out?
    Yes, it is so becoming; that is the intention. The jury is not still out. The jury is still out about outcomes. Remaining questions include:

    Is the intention a continuing 'elected' dictatorship or a rigged/non elected one?

    Will the SCOTUS intervene decisively, and if so will their judgment be enforced?

    Will there be an enforced clamp down on the jurisdiction of the courts?

    Will the, fairly wide, degree of free speech (under intimidation) and free media be allowed to continue?

    Will there be a 'Reichstag Fire' event?

    Will there be a counter-coup?

    (So far this is all at the very worst end of my expectations).
    Is the Trump administration doing anything that would be unconstitutional for a newly-elected majority government in Britain?
    Yes.
    What's the clearest example of this?
    Sacking people without due process.
    And without notice and/or action by Congress where explicitly required by legislation
    Terminating funding voted by Congress without authorisation (which I suppose is linked).

    Edit - empowering improperly appointed persons to seize and/or destroy government files.
    I don't know why you peeps bother. I just assume that @williamglenn lives in St Petersburg and has no experience of how the rule of law is supposed to work in a democracy. Has zero understanding of democracy either - the other day he claimed Germany isn't a democracy because the AfD aren't part of the government.

    You'd really have to start at the kindergarten level with this fool, not that they have any interest in answers to all the "questions" they ask. You'd have to start by saying that even though the United Kingdom and the United States both begin with the same word, they are actually different countries with different constitutions. But it's a waste of time with this troll.
    He has so radically changed his viewpoint over the last decade, than I think he is either:
    *) Utterly trolling us.
    *) Not the same WilliamGlenn, and instead a hijacked account.
    its obv been a hijacked account for years
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 18,153

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    The Dems need to look outside of DC and outside of coastal liberalism for their next candidate
    Why?

    In normal times, picking a candidate to eke out a few more swing voters in swing states might make sense. These times aren't normal, and Republicans lost the right to complain about the other lot's candidate choice when they fell in behind DJT.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 27,370

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    The Dems need to look outside of DC and outside of coastal liberalism for their next candidate
    Why?

    In normal times, picking a candidate to eke out a few more swing voters in swing states might make sense. These times aren't normal, and Republicans lost the right to complain about the other lot's candidate choice when they fell in behind DJT.
    It always makes sense to chose a candidate who can connect with swing voters in swing states.

    And the DC Dems will forever be tainted with supporting an 82 year old senile man as presidential candidate.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,469
    Yet on every poll there will be a hung parliament. So even if Kemi doesn't become PM she or Ed Davey will decide if Starmer or Farage becomes PM
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 43,109
    edited March 23

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    The Dems need to look outside of DC and outside of coastal liberalism for their next candidate
    Why?

    In normal times, picking a candidate to eke out a few more swing voters in swing states might make sense. These times aren't normal, and Republicans lost the right to complain about the other lot's candidate choice when they fell in behind DJT.
    It always makes sense to chose a candidate who can connect with swing voters in swing states.

    And the DC Dems will forever be tainted with supporting an 82 year old senile man as presidential candidate.
    The taint of DC Reps supporting a senile prez seems to have worn off pdq, not to mention DC Dems going along with the lie of a virtually paraplegic president being fit as butcher’s dog. Outrage, particularly the manufactured kind, has a short shelf life I think.
  • TazTaz Posts: 17,105
    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    I think it would be particularly hard to be more malevolent and inimical to democracy or Western interests than Trump. Not easy at all.
    A typical lightweight and insubstantive Lib Dem response.

    Ask a serious question, expect a reasonable answer. Get the equivalent of a drunk vomiting. FFS.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 18,153
    HYUFD said:

    Yet on every poll there will be a hung parliament. So even if Kemi doesn't become PM she or Ed Davey will decide if Starmer or Farage becomes PM

    Would, rather than will.
  • TazTaz Posts: 17,105

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    She's a lefty Taz, you're never going to like her.
    .
    Yeah, which is why I voted Labour in 2024 🙄
  • MattWMattW Posts: 26,141
    edited March 23
    algarkirk said:

    algarkirk said:

    TimS said:

    Speaker Mike Johnson

    @SpeakerJohnson
    The House is working overtime to limit the abuses of activist federal judges. Our @JudiciaryGOP
    will expose the worst offenders in a high profile hearing & we are preparing urgent legislative action, like the @repdarrellissa bill to stop unfounded nationwide injunctions.

    https://x.com/SpeakerJohnson/status/1903529228085109157

    My periodic check: are we agreed the USA is becoming a dictatorship yet, or is the - um -jury still out?
    Yes, it is so becoming; that is the intention. The jury is not still out. The jury is still out about outcomes. Remaining questions include:

    Is the intention a continuing 'elected' dictatorship or a rigged/non elected one?

    Will the SCOTUS intervene decisively, and if so will their judgment be enforced?

    Will there be an enforced clamp down on the jurisdiction of the courts?

    Will the, fairly wide, degree of free speech (under intimidation) and free media be allowed to continue?

    Will there be a 'Reichstag Fire' event?

    Will there be a counter-coup?

    (So far this is all at the very worst end of my expectations).
    Is the Trump administration doing anything that would be unconstitutional for a newly-elected majority government in Britain?
    Acting without legislative approval to do so. Eg, peremptory deportation without an act of parliament ousting the jurisdiction of the courts.
    "Unconstitutional" is a nebulous concept applied to the UK. In the USA Trump is doing blatantly unconstitutional things constantly.

    One he did this week was to interfere with the administration of justice by pulling security clearance from the New York Attorney General Letitia James, which will make bringing some cases difficult.

    Then we have the corruption on public display in the Department of Justice where they tried to trade a withdrawal of a prosecution of New York Mayor Eric Adams for him doing political favours for Trump. That was more egregious than Nixon's manoeuvres. Commentary:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jehv5qXQAD8

    There's no end to it.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 50,731

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    The Dems need to look outside of DC and outside of coastal liberalism for their next candidate
    I have a few quid on Governor Pritzker for this reason. 70 on BFX at present.

    I like AOC, and I think she can connect in ways that more mainstream Dems do not. She can gather a left wing populism that can smash the broligarchy and money men running American politics. She is very articulate, just watch the videos of her crossexamining in the HoR, far more forensic than most lawyers.

    She would actually be considered only mildly left of centre in the rest of the world.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 50,731
    Dura_Ace said:

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    She's a lefty Taz, you're never going to like her.

    Fair enough, but frankly no one who is willing to adhere to the US constitution is going to be worse than Trump.
    AOC:

    Good dancer.
    Competent player of Among Us on Twitch.
    Not obviously insane.

    That's going to seem like an upgrade if there's an election in 2028.
    Also can make a decent Margarita. Some real world practical skills.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 13,806
    stodge said:

    Morning all :)

    Not quite as cheap as @Eabhal has found it but, yes, some positive news re: fuel prices with oil still below $70 a barrel. Whether that has the political or economic impact it once did I'm less certain but it should mitigate inflation to an extent. We used to be able to track Conservative VI and petrol prices quite closely in the dim and distant.

    To be fair to Kemi Badenoch, she inherited a Conservative Party which had just endured its worst ever defeat - worse, I'd argue, than the losses of 1945 or 1997. The actions of previous Prime Ministers had left the Party exposed to an existential threat from a populist party on the "right" (Reform aren't by any serious measure a right wing party but if you lie down with dogs you'll get up with fleas as a wise man once said.)

    Another maxim is "to thine own self be true" and let's be honest, past iterations of the Conservative Party proved both popular and successful. Whether you call it "traditional" or "One Nation", there was once a strand of Conservative thinking which aligned with middle class urban and suburban Britain while maintaining its Tory rural roots and that electoral combination was often unbeatable.

    You could argue that Britain has gone - perhaps - but political parties, to survive, must move with the times. If I were advising the Conservatives, I think I'd tell them to talk less and listen more.

    The trad or One Nation Britain you mention may have gone; has it? The rural, urban, suburban middle class One Nation vote was indeed the backbone of Tory support. I was brought up in it and voted that way in GEs until 2024, when I voted Labour. I voted Labour because it was the nearest thing available.

    One Nation Toryism at its best combined these three elements, though of course very imperfectly:

    Both public and private sectors were at heart service of the community as a whole; and at the same time the private sector could make a lot of money. The public sector was highly respected.

    Equality of outcomes was not important, but working towards equality of opportunity, while impossible to achieve, was always a target.

    Honesty and honour was built into the dealings of institutions as a norm not the exception. Spivs were a sideshow, not the crowd running the whole programme.


    I don't think this set of aims and ideals is either impossible or unimportant. If the Tories stood for them I would vote for them.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 27,370

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    The Dems need to look outside of DC and outside of coastal liberalism for their next candidate
    Why?

    In normal times, picking a candidate to eke out a few more swing voters in swing states might make sense. These times aren't normal, and Republicans lost the right to complain about the other lot's candidate choice when they fell in behind DJT.
    It always makes sense to chose a candidate who can connect with swing voters in swing states.

    And the DC Dems will forever be tainted with supporting an 82 year old senile man as presidential candidate.
    The taint of DC Reps supporting a senile prez seems to have worn off pdq, not to mention DC Dems going along with the lie of a virtually paraplegic president being fit as butcher’s dog. Outrage, particularly the manufactured kind, has a short shelf life I think.
    When elections are decided by a swing of one or two percent then everything matters.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 98,242
    edited March 23
    Civil service running costs are not going to be cut by 15%, it's just silly that anyone is pretending otherwise and the government is basing its plans on that.

    It will find it impolitic to cut sufficient jobs or slash planned investments (I know they say running costs are the target, but I doubt that will last when it doesn't prove enough), and estimates to be saved from vague and undefinied new processes or AI will not emerge to the level they will inevitably predict.

    No doubt plans will be described as aspirational or ambitious, long since designated code words for 'unachievable, and everyone knows it'.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 14,377
    HYUFD said:

    Yet on every poll there will be a hung parliament. So even if Kemi doesn't become PM she or Ed Davey will decide if Starmer or Farage becomes PM

    I certainly agree the numbers don't suggest any party will form a majority were a GE to be held now.

    However, as others have said, applying UNS is fraught with risk given the intricacies of a multi party system operating under FPTP. As I noted last evening, the significant move within the electorate since last July has been of Conservative and Labour voters to Reform - in the case of the Conservatives, 20% of those who supported the party last year would now vote Reform.

    To be fair, the Conservatives have picked up small numbers from other parties. It's also interesting to note among those aged 65+, the Conservatives and Reform are now tied at 31% while the lead enjoyed by the Conservatives over Reform at the election among that age cohort was 26 points.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 98,242
    edited March 23

    kamski said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    algarkirk said:

    TimS said:

    Speaker Mike Johnson

    @SpeakerJohnson
    The House is working overtime to limit the abuses of activist federal judges. Our @JudiciaryGOP
    will expose the worst offenders in a high profile hearing & we are preparing urgent legislative action, like the @repdarrellissa bill to stop unfounded nationwide injunctions.

    https://x.com/SpeakerJohnson/status/1903529228085109157

    My periodic check: are we agreed the USA is becoming a dictatorship yet, or is the - um -jury still out?
    Yes, it is so becoming; that is the intention. The jury is not still out. The jury is still out about outcomes. Remaining questions include:

    Is the intention a continuing 'elected' dictatorship or a rigged/non elected one?

    Will the SCOTUS intervene decisively, and if so will their judgment be enforced?

    Will there be an enforced clamp down on the jurisdiction of the courts?

    Will the, fairly wide, degree of free speech (under intimidation) and free media be allowed to continue?

    Will there be a 'Reichstag Fire' event?

    Will there be a counter-coup?

    (So far this is all at the very worst end of my expectations).
    Is the Trump administration doing anything that would be unconstitutional for a newly-elected majority government in Britain?
    Yes.
    What's the clearest example of this?
    Sacking people without due process.
    And without notice and/or action by Congress where explicitly required by legislation
    Terminating funding voted by Congress without authorisation (which I suppose is linked).

    Edit - empowering improperly appointed persons to seize and/or destroy government files.
    I don't know why you peeps bother. I just assume that @williamglenn lives in St Petersburg and has no experience of how the rule of law is supposed to work in a democracy. Has zero understanding of democracy either - the other day he claimed Germany isn't a democracy because the AfD aren't part of the government.

    You'd really have to start at the kindergarten level with this fool, not that they have any interest in answers to all the "questions" they ask. You'd have to start by saying that even though the United Kingdom and the United States both begin with the same word, they are actually different countries with different constitutions. But it's a waste of time with this troll.
    He has so radically changed his viewpoint over the last decade, than I think he is either:
    *) Utterly trolling us.
    *) Not the same WilliamGlenn, and instead a hijacked account.
    People do radically change their viewpoints, even in ways that don't seem to make much sense. Some level of trolling may be in play, but those trolling usually break character occasionally, so I doubt it.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 98,242
    edited March 23
    Foxy said:

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    The Dems need to look outside of DC and outside of coastal liberalism for their next candidate
    I have a few quid on Governor Pritzker for this reason. 70 on BFX at present.

    I like AOC, and I think she can connect in ways that more mainstream Dems do not. She can gather a left wing populism that can smash the broligarchy and money men running American politics. She is very articulate, just watch the videos of her crossexamining in the HoR, far more forensic than most lawyers.

    She would actually be considered only mildly left of centre in the rest of the world.
    Sure, but she is in America where 50% of the voting public prefer Trump, and 80% of that 50% adore him.

    I'm sure she's fine if too work or whatever, but absent some severe buyer's remorse leading to complete overcorrection I cannot see her winning over what counts as the american middle.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 54,203
    Foxy said:

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    The Dems need to look outside of DC and outside of coastal liberalism for their next candidate
    I have a few quid on Governor Pritzker for this reason. 70 on BFX at present.

    I like AOC, and I think she can connect in ways that more mainstream Dems do not. She can gather a left wing populism that can smash the broligarchy and money men running American politics. She is very articulate, just watch the videos of her crossexamining in the HoR, far more forensic than most lawyers.

    She would actually be considered only mildly left of centre in the rest of the world.
    Of course, the greatest irony of Trump is if - on a huge swing of the pendulum - he were to deliver socialism (however low-fat) to America.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 26,141
    edited March 23

    MattW said:

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    Fuel is extraordinarily cheap now. Just filled up at 129p. Approaching a 25% real terms cut since 2010.

    It’s nice to see a good news story for a change.
    Fuel duty will be a good test of whether Reeves and Starmer are still frightened of addressing Conservative talking points head on.

    I wonder if the blowback on the other things they have done will have made this obvious one to address relatively more palatable.
    Increase the cost of fuel and watch inflation rise with the Government taking the blame.
    I don't see the relevance. Government needs to be paid for, and for a start the "temporary" 5p reduction in fuel duty brought in one (or several) CofEs during the headless chicken period to 'counter market disruption during COVID', by one or several of Jeremy Hunt, Kwasi Kwarteng, Nadhim Zahawi and Rishi Sunak - who were the Tory Chancellors of the Exchequer in 2022.

    That alone is adding about 2.5bn per annum to the deficit and National Debt, and the pandemic was over some time ago. It needs simply to go.


    Source: https://www.smf.co.uk/commentary_podcasts/fuel-duty-and-public-finances/

  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 13,806
    MattW said:

    algarkirk said:

    algarkirk said:

    TimS said:

    Speaker Mike Johnson

    @SpeakerJohnson
    The House is working overtime to limit the abuses of activist federal judges. Our @JudiciaryGOP
    will expose the worst offenders in a high profile hearing & we are preparing urgent legislative action, like the @repdarrellissa bill to stop unfounded nationwide injunctions.

    https://x.com/SpeakerJohnson/status/1903529228085109157

    My periodic check: are we agreed the USA is becoming a dictatorship yet, or is the - um -jury still out?
    Yes, it is so becoming; that is the intention. The jury is not still out. The jury is still out about outcomes. Remaining questions include:

    Is the intention a continuing 'elected' dictatorship or a rigged/non elected one?

    Will the SCOTUS intervene decisively, and if so will their judgment be enforced?

    Will there be an enforced clamp down on the jurisdiction of the courts?

    Will the, fairly wide, degree of free speech (under intimidation) and free media be allowed to continue?

    Will there be a 'Reichstag Fire' event?

    Will there be a counter-coup?

    (So far this is all at the very worst end of my expectations).
    Is the Trump administration doing anything that would be unconstitutional for a newly-elected majority government in Britain?
    Acting without legislative approval to do so. Eg, peremptory deportation without an act of parliament ousting the jurisdiction of the courts.
    "Unconstitutional" is a nebulous concept applied to the UK. In the USA Trump is doing blatantly unconstitutional things constantly.

    One he did this week was to interfere with the administration of justice by pulling security clearance from the New York Attorney General Letitia James, which will make bringing some cases difficult.

    Then we have the corruption on public display in the Department of Justice where they tried to trade a withdrawal of a prosecution of New York Mayor Eric Adams for him doing political favours for Trump. That was more egregious than Nixon's manoeuvres. Commentary:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jehv5qXQAD8

    There's no end to it.
    Agree. A point often overlooked, perhaps by Willaim Glenn above, about our muddled and diverse but generally brilliant constitution is that supreme power does not belong to government. It belongs to parliament. Government does not make the law, it is governed by the law and has to obey it. The dictatorial power belongs to a ragbag of 650 Burkean representatives varying in quality from Laurel and Hardy to Aristotle who as a whole make a very unimpressive imitation of Stalin or Hitler. Or Trump. Ain't bust, don't fix it.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,666
    kle4 said:

    Foxy said:

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    The Dems need to look outside of DC and outside of coastal liberalism for their next candidate
    I have a few quid on Governor Pritzker for this reason. 70 on BFX at present.

    I like AOC, and I think she can connect in ways that more mainstream Dems do not. She can gather a left wing populism that can smash the broligarchy and money men running American politics. She is very articulate, just watch the videos of her crossexamining in the HoR, far more forensic than most lawyers.

    She would actually be considered only mildly left of centre in the rest of the world.
    Sure, but she is in Anerica where 50% of the voting public prefer Trump, and 80% of that 50% adore him.

    I'm sure she's fine if too work or whatever, but absent some severe buyer's remorse leading to complete overcorrection I cannot see her winning over what counts as the american middle.
    Possibly VP. so people got used to her?
  • MattWMattW Posts: 26,141

    Foxy said:

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    The Dems need to look outside of DC and outside of coastal liberalism for their next candidate
    I have a few quid on Governor Pritzker for this reason. 70 on BFX at present.

    I like AOC, and I think she can connect in ways that more mainstream Dems do not. She can gather a left wing populism that can smash the broligarchy and money men running American politics. She is very articulate, just watch the videos of her crossexamining in the HoR, far more forensic than most lawyers.

    She would actually be considered only mildly left of centre in the rest of the world.
    Of course, the greatest irony of Trump is if - on a huge swing of the pendulum - he were to deliver socialism (however low-fat) to America.
    AIUI his random chainsaw cuts will be impacting Red States much harder, so there may be strange outcomes.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 5,511
    MattW said:

    MattW said:

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    Fuel is extraordinarily cheap now. Just filled up at 129p. Approaching a 25% real terms cut since 2010.

    It’s nice to see a good news story for a change.
    Fuel duty will be a good test of whether Reeves and Starmer are still frightened of addressing Conservative talking points head on.

    I wonder if the blowback on the other things they have done will have made this obvious one to address relatively more palatable.
    Increase the cost of fuel and watch inflation rise with the Government taking the blame.
    I don't see the relevance. Government needs to be paid for, and for a start the "temporary" 5p reduction in fuel duty brought in one (or several) CofEs during the headless chicken period to 'counter market disruption during COVID', by one or several of Jeremy Hunt, Kwasi Kwarteng, Nadhim Zahawi and Rishi Sunak - who were the Tory Chancellors of the Exchequer in 2022.

    That alone is adding about 2.5bn per annum to the deficit and National Debt, and the pandemic was over some time ago. It needs simply to go.


    Source: https://www.smf.co.uk/commentary_podcasts/fuel-duty-and-public-finances/

    Theory: Labour are still institutionally scarred by the 2000 fuel protests - and will leave well alone.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 14,377
    algarkirk said:

    stodge said:

    Morning all :)

    Not quite as cheap as @Eabhal has found it but, yes, some positive news re: fuel prices with oil still below $70 a barrel. Whether that has the political or economic impact it once did I'm less certain but it should mitigate inflation to an extent. We used to be able to track Conservative VI and petrol prices quite closely in the dim and distant.

    To be fair to Kemi Badenoch, she inherited a Conservative Party which had just endured its worst ever defeat - worse, I'd argue, than the losses of 1945 or 1997. The actions of previous Prime Ministers had left the Party exposed to an existential threat from a populist party on the "right" (Reform aren't by any serious measure a right wing party but if you lie down with dogs you'll get up with fleas as a wise man once said.)

    Another maxim is "to thine own self be true" and let's be honest, past iterations of the Conservative Party proved both popular and successful. Whether you call it "traditional" or "One Nation", there was once a strand of Conservative thinking which aligned with middle class urban and suburban Britain while maintaining its Tory rural roots and that electoral combination was often unbeatable.

    You could argue that Britain has gone - perhaps - but political parties, to survive, must move with the times. If I were advising the Conservatives, I think I'd tell them to talk less and listen more.

    The trad or One Nation Britain you mention may have gone; has it? The rural, urban, suburban middle class One Nation vote was indeed the backbone of Tory support. I was brought up in it and voted that way in GEs until 2024, when I voted Labour. I voted Labour because it was the nearest thing available.

    One Nation Toryism at its best combined these three elements, though of course very imperfectly:

    Both public and private sectors were at heart service of the community as a whole; and at the same time the private sector could make a lot of money. The public sector was highly respected.

    Equality of outcomes was not important, but working towards equality of opportunity, while impossible to achieve, was always a target.

    Honesty and honour was built into the dealings of institutions as a norm not the exception. Spivs were a sideshow, not the crowd running the whole programme.

    I don't think this set of aims and ideals is either impossible or unimportant. If the Tories stood for them I would vote for them.
    You're not wrong - the Conservatives were once the party of aspiration and people like to aspire to something better if not for themselves then for their families and communities.

    Why did the Conservatives turn so completely away from these basic One Nation principles? @HYUFD may argue they haven't but last year suggested they had (and I'd also argue the LDs and even the Greens were the repository of those votes in some areas. Look at Chichester and explain a 30% swing to the LDs.

    Was it an inevitable consequence of Brexit or a kneejerk response to Faragist populism? I have no idea but Johnson took the Party in a new and different direction which won him an election but lost the Party its soul.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 98,242
    stodge said:

    Morning all :)

    Not quite as cheap as @Eabhal has found it but, yes, some positive news re: fuel prices with oil still below $70 a barrel. Whether that has the political or economic impact it once did I'm less certain but it should mitigate inflation to an extent. We used to be able to track Conservative VI and petrol prices quite closely in the dim and distant.

    To be fair to Kemi Badenoch, she inherited a Conservative Party which had just endured its worst ever defeat - worse, I'd argue, than the losses of 1945 or 1997. The actions of previous Prime Ministers had left the Party exposed to an existential threat from a populist party on the "right" (Reform aren't by any serious measure a right wing party but if you lie down with dogs you'll get up with fleas as a wise man once said.)

    Another maxim is "to thine own self be true" and let's be honest, past iterations of the Conservative Party proved both popular and successful. Whether you call it "traditional" or "One Nation", there was once a strand of Conservative thinking which aligned with middle class urban and suburban Britain while maintaining its Tory rural roots and that electoral combination was often unbeatable.

    You could argue that Britain has gone - perhaps - but political parties, to survive, must move with the times. If I were advising the Conservatives, I think I'd tell them to talk less and listen more.

    What does that actually mean in practice though? Not literally talking less I assume, since a political party that does not speak does not get heard, even if they have good ideas. Indeed, getting heard is a major problem for minor parties, and an inherent advantage for the Tories to make use of.

    So I assume it's more about tapping into lingering conservative sentiment and addressing what it is concerned about (rather than the NuTruss breed of politicians who so clearly want to ape America after spending all their time on twitter it is painful), so that when the public are ready to listen (not now), they will in fact be heard.

    The difficulty being that the current support still needs to be enthused and encouraged too, and half of that likes Reform-esque rousing, and half is put off by it.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 75,813

    algarkirk said:

    TimS said:

    Speaker Mike Johnson

    @SpeakerJohnson
    The House is working overtime to limit the abuses of activist federal judges. Our @JudiciaryGOP
    will expose the worst offenders in a high profile hearing & we are preparing urgent legislative action, like the @repdarrellissa bill to stop unfounded nationwide injunctions.

    https://x.com/SpeakerJohnson/status/1903529228085109157

    My periodic check: are we agreed the USA is becoming a dictatorship yet, or is the - um -jury still out?
    Yes, it is so becoming; that is the intention. The jury is not still out. The jury is still out about outcomes. Remaining questions include:

    Is the intention a continuing 'elected' dictatorship or a rigged/non elected one?

    Will the SCOTUS intervene decisively, and if so will their judgment be enforced?

    Will there be an enforced clamp down on the jurisdiction of the courts?

    Will the, fairly wide, degree of free speech (under intimidation) and free media be allowed to continue?

    Will there be a 'Reichstag Fire' event?

    Will there be a counter-coup?

    (So far this is all at the very worst end of my expectations).
    Is the Trump administration doing anything that would be unconstitutional for a newly-elected majority government in Britain?
    Yes.
    A large number of executive actions unsupported by legislation would be equally lawless here.
    Direct intimidation of judges likewise.

    Dont be a pillock, william.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 75,813
    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    In what way ?
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 30,410
    Taz said:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3w10816en3o

    UKTV industry apparently in crisis, although from the article it is the Beeb and itv.

    The solution to this non problem is, of course, more money from taxpayers rather than finding new streams of income, nice timing too given the current debate on future funding of the BBC.

    The BBC seems to favour a sliding scale with wealthier homes paying more than less well off homes.

    It’s time to get rid of the license fee, fund the network from general taxation, and let the BBC seek its funding in the open market.

    Not good. We used to lead the world in TV production. Too many reasons to list as to this sorry state of affairs.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 98,242
    edited March 23
    Nigelb said:

    algarkirk said:

    TimS said:

    Speaker Mike Johnson

    @SpeakerJohnson
    The House is working overtime to limit the abuses of activist federal judges. Our @JudiciaryGOP
    will expose the worst offenders in a high profile hearing & we are preparing urgent legislative action, like the @repdarrellissa bill to stop unfounded nationwide injunctions.

    https://x.com/SpeakerJohnson/status/1903529228085109157

    My periodic check: are we agreed the USA is becoming a dictatorship yet, or is the - um -jury still out?
    Yes, it is so becoming; that is the intention. The jury is not still out. The jury is still out about outcomes. Remaining questions include:

    Is the intention a continuing 'elected' dictatorship or a rigged/non elected one?

    Will the SCOTUS intervene decisively, and if so will their judgment be enforced?

    Will there be an enforced clamp down on the jurisdiction of the courts?

    Will the, fairly wide, degree of free speech (under intimidation) and free media be allowed to continue?

    Will there be a 'Reichstag Fire' event?

    Will there be a counter-coup?

    (So far this is all at the very worst end of my expectations).
    Is the Trump administration doing anything that would be unconstitutional for a newly-elected majority government in Britain?
    Yes.
    A large number of executive actions unsupported by legislation would be equally lawless here.
    Direct intimidation of judges likewise.

    Dont be a pillock, william.
    It's just a dumbly phrased question anyway. I assume the intent is to suggest that the British government theoretically could do many things a traditionally separation of powers constitutionally restrained US Government couldn't, but whilst we do have a constitution the 'unconstitutional' allegation has far different connotations than in our system. Plus as you point out they definitely have been doing things which would be unlawful.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 13,806
    stodge said:

    algarkirk said:

    stodge said:

    Morning all :)

    Not quite as cheap as @Eabhal has found it but, yes, some positive news re: fuel prices with oil still below $70 a barrel. Whether that has the political or economic impact it once did I'm less certain but it should mitigate inflation to an extent. We used to be able to track Conservative VI and petrol prices quite closely in the dim and distant.

    To be fair to Kemi Badenoch, she inherited a Conservative Party which had just endured its worst ever defeat - worse, I'd argue, than the losses of 1945 or 1997. The actions of previous Prime Ministers had left the Party exposed to an existential threat from a populist party on the "right" (Reform aren't by any serious measure a right wing party but if you lie down with dogs you'll get up with fleas as a wise man once said.)

    Another maxim is "to thine own self be true" and let's be honest, past iterations of the Conservative Party proved both popular and successful. Whether you call it "traditional" or "One Nation", there was once a strand of Conservative thinking which aligned with middle class urban and suburban Britain while maintaining its Tory rural roots and that electoral combination was often unbeatable.

    You could argue that Britain has gone - perhaps - but political parties, to survive, must move with the times. If I were advising the Conservatives, I think I'd tell them to talk less and listen more.

    The trad or One Nation Britain you mention may have gone; has it? The rural, urban, suburban middle class One Nation vote was indeed the backbone of Tory support. I was brought up in it and voted that way in GEs until 2024, when I voted Labour. I voted Labour because it was the nearest thing available.

    One Nation Toryism at its best combined these three elements, though of course very imperfectly:

    Both public and private sectors were at heart service of the community as a whole; and at the same time the private sector could make a lot of money. The public sector was highly respected.

    Equality of outcomes was not important, but working towards equality of opportunity, while impossible to achieve, was always a target.

    Honesty and honour was built into the dealings of institutions as a norm not the exception. Spivs were a sideshow, not the crowd running the whole programme.

    I don't think this set of aims and ideals is either impossible or unimportant. If the Tories stood for them I would vote for them.
    You're not wrong - the Conservatives were once the party of aspiration and people like to aspire to something better if not for themselves then for their families and communities.

    Why did the Conservatives turn so completely away from these basic One Nation principles? @HYUFD may argue they haven't but last year suggested they had (and I'd also argue the LDs and even the Greens were the repository of those votes in some areas. Look at Chichester and explain a 30% swing to the LDs.

    Was it an inevitable consequence of Brexit or a kneejerk response to Faragist populism? I have no idea but Johnson took the Party in a new and different direction which won him an election but lost the Party its soul.
    You ask a very big question. I mention just one seminal moment. Two things happened immediately after the Brexit vote: The man we elected to see us though 5 years in 2015 resigned and it became clear that the Tory government did not have a comprehensive plan for what to do if we voted for Brexit.

    This betrayal of the country is almost impossible to recover from, and they haven't.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 30,845
    ...

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    The Dems need to look outside of DC and outside of coastal liberalism for their next candidate
    Why?

    In normal times, picking a candidate to eke out a few more swing voters in swing states might make sense. These times aren't normal, and Republicans lost the right to complain about the other lot's candidate choice when they fell in behind DJT.
    It always makes sense to chose a candidate who can connect with swing voters in swing states.

    And the DC Dems will forever be tainted with supporting an 82 year old senile man as presidential candidate.
    You are gaslighting again.

    Other than four years what is the difference between a senile 82 year old and a senile 78 year old?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 75,813
    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    That dynamic is far more likely to unseat Democratic incumbents in primaries than it is to determine votes in the actual midterms.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,420
    Rachel Reeves tells Laura Kuenssberg that Trump is absolutely right to worry about countries that have a trade surplus with the US.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 75,813

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    The Dems need to look outside of DC and outside of coastal liberalism for their next candidate
    Why?

    In normal times, picking a candidate to eke out a few more swing voters in swing states might make sense. These times aren't normal, and Republicans lost the right to complain about the other lot's candidate choice when they fell in behind DJT.
    It always makes sense to chose a candidate who can connect with swing voters in swing states.

    And the DC Dems will forever be tainted with supporting an 82 year old senile man as presidential candidate.
    Will they ?
    I doubt that.

    Having paid for it at the last election - in a situation which was made impossible for them by Biden's decision to run a second time - I doubt it will have much effect next time around.
  • Nunu3Nunu3 Posts: 257
    edited March 23

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    AOC v JD Vance would be one hell of an election...
    Hell being the kind of place where voters would be faced with that choice. I mean, you would have to go AOC in that situation, but a lot of voters would really struggle with it.
    when was the last time American voters chose the far left when given a choice of "far left" vs "far right"?

    Never in modern times.
  • OllyTOllyT Posts: 5,025
    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    Nobody wants to see the back of Trump/Vance more desparately than I do but I'm convinced that AOC would manage to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. The US is not going to elect a radical female no matter how big the crowds she attracts - it would be an electoral disaster of Corbynite proportions
  • TimSTimS Posts: 14,663
    Nunu3 said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    AOC v JD Vance would be one hell of an election...
    Hell being the kind of place where voters would be faced with that choice. I mean, you would have to go AOC in that situation, but a lot of voters would really struggle with it.
    when was the last time American voters chose the far left when given a choice of "far left" vs "far right"?

    Never in modern times.
    We’re all assuming they will have a real choice in 4 years time. I’m not sure they will. I think we are still in continuity bias.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,389
    If you accept the argument that Trumpski was a reaction to America electing Obama, then it's not impossible they could elect AOC as a reaction to Trump
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 30,845

    Rachel Reeves tells Laura Kuenssberg that Trump is absolutely right to worry about countries that have a trade surplus with the US.

    Do you get a good BBC1 signal in St Petersburg?
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 54,203

    ...

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    The Dems need to look outside of DC and outside of coastal liberalism for their next candidate
    Why?

    In normal times, picking a candidate to eke out a few more swing voters in swing states might make sense. These times aren't normal, and Republicans lost the right to complain about the other lot's candidate choice when they fell in behind DJT.
    It always makes sense to chose a candidate who can connect with swing voters in swing states.

    And the DC Dems will forever be tainted with supporting an 82 year old senile man as presidential candidate.
    You are gaslighting again.

    Other than four years what is the difference between a senile 82 year old and a senile 78 year old?
    The 78 year old still has enough marbles left to be vindictive...
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 27,370

    ...

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    The Dems need to look outside of DC and outside of coastal liberalism for their next candidate
    Why?

    In normal times, picking a candidate to eke out a few more swing voters in swing states might make sense. These times aren't normal, and Republicans lost the right to complain about the other lot's candidate choice when they fell in behind DJT.
    It always makes sense to chose a candidate who can connect with swing voters in swing states.

    And the DC Dems will forever be tainted with supporting an 82 year old senile man as presidential candidate.
    You are gaslighting again.

    Other than four years what is the difference between a senile 82 year old and a senile 78 year old?
    Trump is worse, Trump is worse, Trump is worse, Trump is worse, Trump is worse.

    Repeat endlessly rather than look at what went wrong and how things could be done better.

    Its better in life to learn from mistakes than to wallow in denial.

    Feinstein, Biden, the two Dem Congressmen who have just died.

    The Dems have a problem of continuing to support decrepit candidates.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 30,410
    On topic, this is really quite fascinating as a proxy question to assess the level of Reform support. It's like an 'I am not voting for Reform but all my neighbours are' sort of question. Hard to unpick obviously, given that Labour aren't in it.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 30,845
    OllyT said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    Nobody wants to see the back of Trump/Vance more desparately than I do but I'm convinced that AOC would manage to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. The US is not going to elect a radical female no matter how big the crowds she attracts - it would be an electoral disaster of Corbynite proportions
    Trump will more than likely have expired by then, but before he does, US general elections will have been formatted to the Russian model.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 75,813
    kle4 said:

    Nigelb said:

    algarkirk said:

    TimS said:

    Speaker Mike Johnson

    @SpeakerJohnson
    The House is working overtime to limit the abuses of activist federal judges. Our @JudiciaryGOP
    will expose the worst offenders in a high profile hearing & we are preparing urgent legislative action, like the @repdarrellissa bill to stop unfounded nationwide injunctions.

    https://x.com/SpeakerJohnson/status/1903529228085109157

    My periodic check: are we agreed the USA is becoming a dictatorship yet, or is the - um -jury still out?
    Yes, it is so becoming; that is the intention. The jury is not still out. The jury is still out about outcomes. Remaining questions include:

    Is the intention a continuing 'elected' dictatorship or a rigged/non elected one?

    Will the SCOTUS intervene decisively, and if so will their judgment be enforced?

    Will there be an enforced clamp down on the jurisdiction of the courts?

    Will the, fairly wide, degree of free speech (under intimidation) and free media be allowed to continue?

    Will there be a 'Reichstag Fire' event?

    Will there be a counter-coup?

    (So far this is all at the very worst end of my expectations).
    Is the Trump administration doing anything that would be unconstitutional for a newly-elected majority government in Britain?
    Yes.
    A large number of executive actions unsupported by legislation would be equally lawless here.
    Direct intimidation of judges likewise.

    Dont be a pillock, william.
    It's just a dumbly phrased question anyway. I assume the intent is to suggest that the British government theoretically could do many things a traditionally separation of powers constitutionally restrained US Government couldn't, but whilst we do have a constitution the 'unconstitutional' allegation has far different connotations than in our system. Plus as you point out they definitely have been doing things which would be unlawful.
    William is fond of asking foolish questions like that.
    It's an undeniably successful tactic, in provoking a response, anyway.

  • MattWMattW Posts: 26,141
    carnforth said:

    MattW said:

    MattW said:

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    Fuel is extraordinarily cheap now. Just filled up at 129p. Approaching a 25% real terms cut since 2010.

    It’s nice to see a good news story for a change.
    Fuel duty will be a good test of whether Reeves and Starmer are still frightened of addressing Conservative talking points head on.

    I wonder if the blowback on the other things they have done will have made this obvious one to address relatively more palatable.
    Increase the cost of fuel and watch inflation rise with the Government taking the blame.
    I don't see the relevance. Government needs to be paid for, and for a start the "temporary" 5p reduction in fuel duty brought in one (or several) CofEs during the headless chicken period to 'counter market disruption during COVID', by one or several of Jeremy Hunt, Kwasi Kwarteng, Nadhim Zahawi and Rishi Sunak - who were the Tory Chancellors of the Exchequer in 2022.

    That alone is adding about 2.5bn per annum to the deficit and National Debt, and the pandemic was over some time ago. It needs simply to go.


    Source: https://www.smf.co.uk/commentary_podcasts/fuel-duty-and-public-finances/

    Theory: Labour are still institutionally scarred by the 2000 fuel protests - and will leave well alone.
    One interesting political aspect is an overlap between the self-declared "driver lobby" and Reform / Tory Right / Further Right (choose your word!), as attempted to be weaponised by the Conservatives in the Election Campaign 2024 and the year or two before, as as a culture war lever.

    It's personified in Howard Cox founder of Fair Fuel UK, who stood for London Mayor for Reform UK. But Howard Cox has now gone full 'Tommy Robinson Political Prisoner', and left Reform as they are not something something something enough.

    He is now agreeing with Gerard Batten, who was an associate of Paul Joseph Watson of Infowars.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 50,731
    kle4 said:

    Civil service running costs are not going to be cut by 15%, it's just silly that anyone is pretending otherwise and the government is basing its plans on that.

    It will find it impolitic to cut sufficient jobs or slash planned investments (I know they say running costs are the target, but I doubt that will last when it doesn't prove enough), and estimates to be saved from vague and undefinied new processes or AI will not emerge to the level they will inevitably predict.

    No doubt plans will be described as aspirational or ambitious, long since designated code words for 'unachievable, and everyone knows it'.

    As well as closing NHS England, instructions have gone out to the ICBs* that they need to cut their admin costs (so staff) by 50% by Christmas. As a result no one will be doing useful work over the next year, just buffing their CVs.

    * Integrated Care Boards: the successor to PCTs including a larger local authority element focused on Social Care.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 30,410

    ...

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    The Dems need to look outside of DC and outside of coastal liberalism for their next candidate
    Why?

    In normal times, picking a candidate to eke out a few more swing voters in swing states might make sense. These times aren't normal, and Republicans lost the right to complain about the other lot's candidate choice when they fell in behind DJT.
    It always makes sense to chose a candidate who can connect with swing voters in swing states.

    And the DC Dems will forever be tainted with supporting an 82 year old senile man as presidential candidate.
    You are gaslighting again.

    Other than four years what is the difference between a senile 82 year old and a senile 78 year old?
    One has advanced senile dementia and one doesn't. You appear to have invented a new form of ageing and disease where we all suffer from exactly the same degrees of affliction at the same time.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 34,384

    Rachel Reeves tells Laura Kuenssberg that Trump is absolutely right to worry about countries that have a trade surplus with the US.

    Do you get a good BBC1 signal in St Petersburg?
    Be fair. She did say that, or something very like it.

    The solution to the problem, if problem there is, is that country A, the country which imports more from country B, establishes if there is, actually, a problem, and, if there is, tries to export more to B.
    Not just make life harder for B.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 30,845

    ...

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    The Dems need to look outside of DC and outside of coastal liberalism for their next candidate
    Why?

    In normal times, picking a candidate to eke out a few more swing voters in swing states might make sense. These times aren't normal, and Republicans lost the right to complain about the other lot's candidate choice when they fell in behind DJT.
    It always makes sense to chose a candidate who can connect with swing voters in swing states.

    And the DC Dems will forever be tainted with supporting an 82 year old senile man as presidential candidate.
    You are gaslighting again.

    Other than four years what is the difference between a senile 82 year old and a senile 78 year old?
    Trump is worse, Trump is worse, Trump is worse, Trump is worse, Trump is worse.

    Repeat endlessly rather than look at what went wrong and how things could be done better.

    Its better in life to learn from mistakes than to wallow in denial.

    Feinstein, Biden, the two Dem Congressmen who have just died.

    The Dems have a problem of continuing to support decrepit candidates.
    I don't believe Dems or old school Republicans realise that the levers of power have been seized by the executive. They are still relying on Congress and the judiciary to save them. But the executive own those levers of power too.

    The Founding Fathers wrote the Constitution in the event of Trump, but it seems they didn't do a very good job.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 9,937
    edited March 23
    stodge said:

    algarkirk said:

    stodge said:

    Morning all :)

    Not quite as cheap as @Eabhal has found it but, yes, some positive news re: fuel prices with oil still below $70 a barrel. Whether that has the political or economic impact it once did I'm less certain but it should mitigate inflation to an extent. We used to be able to track Conservative VI and petrol prices quite closely in the dim and distant.

    To be fair to Kemi Badenoch, she inherited a Conservative Party which had just endured its worst ever defeat - worse, I'd argue, than the losses of 1945 or 1997. The actions of previous Prime Ministers had left the Party exposed to an existential threat from a populist party on the "right" (Reform aren't by any serious measure a right wing party but if you lie down with dogs you'll get up with fleas as a wise man once said.)

    Another maxim is "to thine own self be true" and let's be honest, past iterations of the Conservative Party proved both popular and successful. Whether you call it "traditional" or "One Nation", there was once a strand of Conservative thinking which aligned with middle class urban and suburban Britain while maintaining its Tory rural roots and that electoral combination was often unbeatable.

    You could argue that Britain has gone - perhaps - but political parties, to survive, must move with the times. If I were advising the Conservatives, I think I'd tell them to talk less and listen more.

    The trad or One Nation Britain you mention may have gone; has it? The rural, urban, suburban middle class One Nation vote was indeed the backbone of Tory support. I was brought up in it and voted that way in GEs until 2024, when I voted Labour. I voted Labour because it was the nearest thing available.

    One Nation Toryism at its best combined these three elements, though of course very imperfectly:

    Both public and private sectors were at heart service of the community as a whole; and at the same time the private sector could make a lot of money. The public sector was highly respected.

    Equality of outcomes was not important, but working towards equality of opportunity, while impossible to achieve, was always a target.

    Honesty and honour was built into the dealings of institutions as a norm not the exception. Spivs were a sideshow, not the crowd running the whole programme.

    I don't think this set of aims and ideals is either impossible or unimportant. If the Tories stood for them I would vote for them.
    You're not wrong - the Conservatives were once the party of aspiration and people like to aspire to something better if not for themselves then for their families and communities.

    Why did the Conservatives turn so completely away from these basic One Nation principles? @HYUFD may argue they haven't but last year suggested they had (and I'd also argue the LDs and even the Greens were the repository of those votes in some areas. Look at Chichester and explain a 30% swing to the LDs.

    Was it an inevitable consequence of Brexit or a kneejerk response to Faragist populism? I have no idea but Johnson took the Party in a new and different direction which won him an election but lost the Party its soul.
    I disagree. I think Johnson's policies - levelling up etc - were both aspirational and optimistic. It wasn't until Sunak started to hint at culture war (in desperation) that the Conservatives started to slide in that direction. I don't think Badenoch has decided either way, just testing the water.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 30,845

    ...

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    The Dems need to look outside of DC and outside of coastal liberalism for their next candidate
    Why?

    In normal times, picking a candidate to eke out a few more swing voters in swing states might make sense. These times aren't normal, and Republicans lost the right to complain about the other lot's candidate choice when they fell in behind DJT.
    It always makes sense to chose a candidate who can connect with swing voters in swing states.

    And the DC Dems will forever be tainted with supporting an 82 year old senile man as presidential candidate.
    You are gaslighting again.

    Other than four years what is the difference between a senile 82 year old and a senile 78 year old?
    One has advanced senile dementia and one doesn't. You appear to have invented a new form of ageing and disease where we all suffer from exactly the same degrees of affliction at the same time.
    I am not sure I agree with your analysis. After the first debate Biden looked like he might have early onset Alzheimer's too.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 14,663

    On topic, this is really quite fascinating as a proxy question to assess the level of Reform support. It's like an 'I am not voting for Reform but all my neighbours are' sort of question. Hard to unpick obviously, given that Labour aren't in it.

    These questions aren’t necessarily more accurate than polling on voting intention - I recall there was a “neighbour” poll suggesting AfD would be on over 30% - but they do say interesting things about people’s assumptions.

    If I were Tory I’d be really nervous about this sort of result. Not because of a realistic risk of being overtaken by Reform - I really think they’d need to be way above the Tories now at the latter’s post election hangover nadir to have a chance - but because it will make tactical anti-Labour voting so much more difficult. It’s the Ref-Con equivalent of the tactical question in Con-LD marginals.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,469
    OllyT said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    Nobody wants to see the back of Trump/Vance more desparately than I do but I'm convinced that AOC would manage to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. The US is not going to elect a radical female no matter how big the crowds she attracts - it would be an electoral disaster of Corbynite proportions
    Would not be so sure, if Trump's tariffs raise prices without growing jobs even AOC could win.

    Vance is also less charismatic than Trump albeit brighter and Trump can't run again.

    Remember in 2017 Corbyn nearly won
  • MattWMattW Posts: 26,141
    edited March 23
    OllyT said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    Nobody wants to see the back of Trump/Vance more desparately than I do but I'm convinced that AOC would manage to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. The US is not going to elect a radical female no matter how big the crowds she attracts - it would be an electoral disaster of Corbynite proportions
    I haven't particularly studied AOC, nor her policy positions.

    It's clear that she's a very good campaigner / speaker, especially online. eg In UK terms is she a Corbyn, or given the USA Overton window is she actually a Lib Dem :wink: .

    A background effect may be what the Trump impact on the less wealthy / 'left behind' demographic who he persuaded to vote for him will be, who are heavily impacted by his tax / 'demolition of the state' policies will be, and their voting reaction.

    At present it seems to be cut expenture of the state by $1.5-2 trillion, and introduce major tax changes, both of which will result in a big shift in financial favour of very wealthy people.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 20,248
    edited March 23
    Taz said:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3w10816en3o

    UKTV industry apparently in crisis, although from the article it is the Beeb and itv.

    The solution to this non problem is, of course, more money from taxpayers rather than finding new streams of income, nice timing too given the current debate on future funding of the BBC.

    The BBC seems to favour a sliding scale with wealthier homes paying more than less well off homes.

    It’s time to get rid of the license fee, fund the network from general taxation, and let the BBC seek its funding in the open market.

    That would be really short sighted. The BBC is one of the best institutions in this country and has been responsible for nurturing some extraorinary talent. The media is one area where the UK punches well above it's weight and much of this is down to the BBC. Holywood is full of talent originally nurtured by the BBC The Scott brothers to name but two but if you add those lower down the scale the British expertise and influence thanks to the BBC is everywhere
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,469
    stodge said:

    algarkirk said:

    stodge said:

    Morning all :)

    Not quite as cheap as @Eabhal has found it but, yes, some positive news re: fuel prices with oil still below $70 a barrel. Whether that has the political or economic impact it once did I'm less certain but it should mitigate inflation to an extent. We used to be able to track Conservative VI and petrol prices quite closely in the dim and distant.

    To be fair to Kemi Badenoch, she inherited a Conservative Party which had just endured its worst ever defeat - worse, I'd argue, than the losses of 1945 or 1997. The actions of previous Prime Ministers had left the Party exposed to an existential threat from a populist party on the "right" (Reform aren't by any serious measure a right wing party but if you lie down with dogs you'll get up with fleas as a wise man once said.)

    Another maxim is "to thine own self be true" and let's be honest, past iterations of the Conservative Party proved both popular and successful. Whether you call it "traditional" or "One Nation", there was once a strand of Conservative thinking which aligned with middle class urban and suburban Britain while maintaining its Tory rural roots and that electoral combination was often unbeatable.

    You could argue that Britain has gone - perhaps - but political parties, to survive, must move with the times. If I were advising the Conservatives, I think I'd tell them to talk less and listen more.

    The trad or One Nation Britain you mention may have gone; has it? The rural, urban, suburban middle class One Nation vote was indeed the backbone of Tory support. I was brought up in it and voted that way in GEs until 2024, when I voted Labour. I voted Labour because it was the nearest thing available.

    One Nation Toryism at its best combined these three elements, though of course very imperfectly:

    Both public and private sectors were at heart service of the community as a whole; and at the same time the private sector could make a lot of money. The public sector was highly respected.

    Equality of outcomes was not important, but working towards equality of opportunity, while impossible to achieve, was always a target.

    Honesty and honour was built into the dealings of institutions as a norm not the exception. Spivs were a sideshow, not the crowd running the whole programme.

    I don't think this set of aims and ideals is either impossible or unimportant. If the Tories stood for them I would vote for them.
    You're not wrong - the Conservatives were once the party of aspiration and people like to aspire to something better if not for themselves then for their families and communities.

    Why did the Conservatives turn so completely away from these basic One Nation principles? @HYUFD may argue they haven't but last year suggested they had (and I'd also argue the LDs and even the Greens were the repository of those votes in some areas. Look at Chichester and explain a 30% swing to the LDs.

    Was it an inevitable consequence of Brexit or a kneejerk response to Faragist populism? I have no idea but Johnson took the Party in a new and different direction which won him an election but lost the Party its soul.
    Johnson spent hugely, welcomed immigrants was socially liberal. Apart from Brexit Boris was One Nation, certainly more than Thatcher was.

    Even Kemi won on a more One Nation platform than Jenrick offered which was basically Farage lite
  • UnpopularUnpopular Posts: 912
    Pro_Rata said:

    When we say the Democratic Party leadership is supine, here's what is hard for a British person to understand.

    A politic party in the UK has a leader and the general expectation is that party electees broadly at least try to speak in the terms laid out by that leader, else it is branded disloyalty.

    Without a president or presidential candidate, the leadership of a US party is much more diffuse, leaders in the house and senate, not necessarily with the same scope, party donors and men in grey suit types. How does a coherent Democratic Party line possibly emerge in all this, in short, how does opposition crystallise within the US political system?

    They hold their primary next year, row in behind them and spend the next few years hammering Trump along the party line.

    If they could pull it off, it could reap huge rewards but it would involve a lot of people subordinating their ambition to an individual. Many of those highly ambitious people might well lose their chance at the top job because of it. I imagine a lot of potential Dem candidates are instead thinking of keeping their powder dry for the bloodletting that will be their Primary in 2028. Instead, they need to put all that powder together and attack the GOP using it for the next four years.

    Run the Primary now, get it all out, and then hammer the Republicans over anything and everything.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,666
    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    A more potentially immediate question is what we make of the VP, given Trump's age. I can't judge whether he's seriously unhinged or merely a politician who adjusts his message to suit the moment. What do others make of him?
  • TimSTimS Posts: 14,663
    MattW said:

    OllyT said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    Nobody wants to see the back of Trump/Vance more desparately than I do but I'm convinced that AOC would manage to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. The US is not going to elect a radical female no matter how big the crowds she attracts - it would be an electoral disaster of Corbynite proportions
    I haven't particularly studied AOC, nor her policy positions.

    It's clear that she's a very good campaigner / speaker, especially online. eg In UK terms is she a Corbyn, or given the USA Overton window is she actually a Lib Dem :wink: .

    A background effect may be what the Trump impact on the less wealthy / 'left behind' demographic who he persuaded to vote for him will be, who are heavily impacted by his tax / 'demolition of the state' policies will be, and their voting reaction.

    At present it seems to be cut expenture of the state by $1.5-2 trillion, and introduce major tax changes, both of which will result in a big shift in financial favour of very wealthy people.
    One thing she does have (as does Bernie Sanders) is confidence. Sheer untrammelled confidence has taken Trump a long way. Among the centrists Pete Buttigieg has it too. They really need that - the FU attitude that says I’m not cowed, I’m going after you Trump.

    Realistically policy and ideology may well be secondary in 2026 and 2028. They’ll need an operation that is up for fighting for democratic institutions and taking on the MAGA machine before it’s too late.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 45,059
    Roger said:

    Taz said:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3w10816en3o

    UKTV industry apparently in crisis, although from the article it is the Beeb and itv.

    The solution to this non problem is, of course, more money from taxpayers rather than finding new streams of income, nice timing too given the current debate on future funding of the BBC.

    The BBC seems to favour a sliding scale with wealthier homes paying more than less well off homes.

    It’s time to get rid of the license fee, fund the network from general taxation, and let the BBC seek its funding in the open market.

    That would be really short sighted. The BBC is one of the best institutions in this country and has been responsible for nurturing some extraorinary talent. The media is one area where the UK punches well above it's weight and much of this is down to the BBC. Holywood is full of talent originally nurtured by the BBC The Scott brothers to name but two but if you add those lower down the scale the British expertise and influence thanks to the BBC is everywhere
    I agree with that to an extent; but the media market has changed so much in the last couple of decades, keeping the licence fee is a bit like a government mandating horse-drawn ploughs.

    I like the BBC, but it just isn't a mainstay of people's viewing habits in the way it was. There are too many very rich competitors.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 29,809
    edited March 23
    Walk-in degrees, sham students and a giant university fraud scandal
    Applicants are suspected of scamming taxpayers out of hundreds of millions of pounds for courses they don’t intend to take

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/education/article/revealed-colleges-student-loans-fraud-pd7wlgb3v (£££)

    ETA eyebrows were first raised at the Student Loan Company, not the ST, and EdSec is on the case.
  • MattW said:

    MattW said:

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    Fuel is extraordinarily cheap now. Just filled up at 129p. Approaching a 25% real terms cut since 2010.

    It’s nice to see a good news story for a change.
    Fuel duty will be a good test of whether Reeves and Starmer are still frightened of addressing Conservative talking points head on.

    I wonder if the blowback on the other things they have done will have made this obvious one to address relatively more palatable.
    Increase the cost of fuel and watch inflation rise with the Government taking the blame.
    I don't see the relevance. Government needs to be paid for, and for a start the "temporary" 5p reduction in fuel duty brought in one (or several) CofEs during the headless chicken period to 'counter market disruption during COVID', by one or several of Jeremy Hunt, Kwasi Kwarteng, Nadhim Zahawi and Rishi Sunak - who were the Tory Chancellors of the Exchequer in 2022.

    That alone is adding about 2.5bn per annum to the deficit and National Debt, and the pandemic was over some time ago. It needs simply to go.


    Source: https://www.smf.co.uk/commentary_podcasts/fuel-duty-and-public-finances/

    Bullshit.

    Meanwhile back in the real world the Exchequer is making £24.3bn per annum from fuel duty, money that is not spent on either maintaining existing roads or building new roads.

    Drivers are not adding to the deficit, let alone the National Debt, we are being fleeced.

    With fuel duty being one of the most regressive taxes that exists in the entire country as the richest with electric vehicles can opt out of paying the tax whatsoever while poor drivers who need to drive their old banger to work, possibly for minimum wage, have to spend a far higher proportion of income on fuel.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 98,242
    Pro_Rata said:

    When we say the Democratic Party leadership is supine, here's what is hard for a British person to understand.

    A politic party in the UK has a leader and the general expectation is that party electees broadly at least try to speak in the terms laid out by that leader, else it is branded disloyalty.

    Without a president or presidential candidate, the leadership of a US party is much more diffuse, leaders in the house and senate, not necessarily with the same scope, party donors and men in grey suit types. How does a coherent Democratic Party line possibly emerge in all this, in short, how does opposition crystallise within the US political system?

    Trump of course was the exception in that he absolutely dominated as the leader even before being the candidate last time. They did go through the motions and a few contrary voices whispered from time to time, but they knew who was in charge.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,991
    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    Beginning to look like Forrest Gump would be better
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 98,242

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    A more potentially immediate question is what we make of the VP, given Trump's age. I can't judge whether he's seriously unhinged or merely a politician who adjusts his message to suit the moment. What do others make of him?
    He's vicious, but has a brain.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 34,384
    Nick P wrote:
    "I can't judge whether he's seriously unhinged or merely a politician who adjusts his message to suit the moment."

    Does that refer to the current President or his Vice-President?
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,991
    stodge said:

    Morning all :)

    Not quite as cheap as @Eabhal has found it but, yes, some positive news re: fuel prices with oil still below $70 a barrel. Whether that has the political or economic impact it once did I'm less certain but it should mitigate inflation to an extent. We used to be able to track Conservative VI and petrol prices quite closely in the dim and distant.

    To be fair to Kemi Badenoch, she inherited a Conservative Party which had just endured its worst ever defeat - worse, I'd argue, than the losses of 1945 or 1997. The actions of previous Prime Ministers had left the Party exposed to an existential threat from a populist party on the "right" (Reform aren't by any serious measure a right wing party but if you lie down with dogs you'll get up with fleas as a wise man once said.)

    Another maxim is "to thine own self be true" and let's be honest, past iterations of the Conservative Party proved both popular and successful. Whether you call it "traditional" or "One Nation", there was once a strand of Conservative thinking which aligned with middle class urban and suburban Britain while maintaining its Tory rural roots and that electoral combination was often unbeatable.

    You could argue that Britain has gone - perhaps - but political parties, to survive, must move with the times. If I were advising the Conservatives, I think I'd tell them to talk less and listen more.

    Scandalous that diesel is 5p or 6p more expensive
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 30,845

    ...

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    The Dems need to look outside of DC and outside of coastal liberalism for their next candidate
    Why?

    In normal times, picking a candidate to eke out a few more swing voters in swing states might make sense. These times aren't normal, and Republicans lost the right to complain about the other lot's candidate choice when they fell in behind DJT.
    It always makes sense to chose a candidate who can connect with swing voters in swing states.

    And the DC Dems will forever be tainted with supporting an 82 year old senile man as presidential candidate.
    You are gaslighting again.

    Other than four years what is the difference between a senile 82 year old and a senile 78 year old?
    The 78 year old still has enough marbles left to be vindictive...
    I would argue the other way.

    Trump imagines Rosie O'Donnell has hidden his diapers out of spite so he has to s*** the bed. He then spends the morning plotting his revenge against Rosie O'Donnell. And all because Trump forgot to ask his carer to replace the last soiled diaper with a fresh one.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 30,410
    HYUFD said:

    stodge said:

    algarkirk said:

    stodge said:

    Morning all :)

    Not quite as cheap as @Eabhal has found it but, yes, some positive news re: fuel prices with oil still below $70 a barrel. Whether that has the political or economic impact it once did I'm less certain but it should mitigate inflation to an extent. We used to be able to track Conservative VI and petrol prices quite closely in the dim and distant.

    To be fair to Kemi Badenoch, she inherited a Conservative Party which had just endured its worst ever defeat - worse, I'd argue, than the losses of 1945 or 1997. The actions of previous Prime Ministers had left the Party exposed to an existential threat from a populist party on the "right" (Reform aren't by any serious measure a right wing party but if you lie down with dogs you'll get up with fleas as a wise man once said.)

    Another maxim is "to thine own self be true" and let's be honest, past iterations of the Conservative Party proved both popular and successful. Whether you call it "traditional" or "One Nation", there was once a strand of Conservative thinking which aligned with middle class urban and suburban Britain while maintaining its Tory rural roots and that electoral combination was often unbeatable.

    You could argue that Britain has gone - perhaps - but political parties, to survive, must move with the times. If I were advising the Conservatives, I think I'd tell them to talk less and listen more.

    The trad or One Nation Britain you mention may have gone; has it? The rural, urban, suburban middle class One Nation vote was indeed the backbone of Tory support. I was brought up in it and voted that way in GEs until 2024, when I voted Labour. I voted Labour because it was the nearest thing available.

    One Nation Toryism at its best combined these three elements, though of course very imperfectly:

    Both public and private sectors were at heart service of the community as a whole; and at the same time the private sector could make a lot of money. The public sector was highly respected.

    Equality of outcomes was not important, but working towards equality of opportunity, while impossible to achieve, was always a target.

    Honesty and honour was built into the dealings of institutions as a norm not the exception. Spivs were a sideshow, not the crowd running the whole programme.

    I don't think this set of aims and ideals is either impossible or unimportant. If the Tories stood for them I would vote for them.
    You're not wrong - the Conservatives were once the party of aspiration and people like to aspire to something better if not for themselves then for their families and communities.

    Why did the Conservatives turn so completely away from these basic One Nation principles? @HYUFD may argue they haven't but last year suggested they had (and I'd also argue the LDs and even the Greens were the repository of those votes in some areas. Look at Chichester and explain a 30% swing to the LDs.

    Was it an inevitable consequence of Brexit or a kneejerk response to Faragist populism? I have no idea but Johnson took the Party in a new and different direction which won him an election but lost the Party its soul.
    Johnson spent hugely, welcomed immigrants was socially liberal. Apart from Brexit Boris was One Nation, certainly more than Thatcher was.

    Even Kemi won on a more One Nation platform than Jenrick offered which was basically Farage lite
    'One Nation' is phrase that simply means 'go away and let the left run the Tories'. There is no actual ideological thread or tradition that connects Benjamin Disraeli with David Gauke or Anna Soubry.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 14,663
    kle4 said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    A more potentially immediate question is what we make of the VP, given Trump's age. I can't judge whether he's seriously unhinged or merely a politician who adjusts his message to suit the moment. What do others make of him?
    He's vicious, but has a brain.
    He is a type that has existed in other historical periods too: the extremist intellectual. The thinking man’s ideologue. Pol Pot and Radovan Karadzic being 2 prominent examples, but there are plenty more.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 20,248

    kamski said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    algarkirk said:

    TimS said:

    Speaker Mike Johnson

    @SpeakerJohnson
    The House is working overtime to limit the abuses of activist federal judges. Our @JudiciaryGOP
    will expose the worst offenders in a high profile hearing & we are preparing urgent legislative action, like the @repdarrellissa bill to stop unfounded nationwide injunctions.

    https://x.com/SpeakerJohnson/status/1903529228085109157

    My periodic check: are we agreed the USA is becoming a dictatorship yet, or is the - um -jury still out?
    Yes, it is so becoming; that is the intention. The jury is not still out. The jury is still out about outcomes. Remaining questions include:

    Is the intention a continuing 'elected' dictatorship or a rigged/non elected one?

    Will the SCOTUS intervene decisively, and if so will their judgment be enforced?

    Will there be an enforced clamp down on the jurisdiction of the courts?

    Will the, fairly wide, degree of free speech (under intimidation) and free media be allowed to continue?

    Will there be a 'Reichstag Fire' event?

    Will there be a counter-coup?

    (So far this is all at the very worst end of my expectations).
    Is the Trump administration doing anything that would be unconstitutional for a newly-elected majority government in Britain?
    Yes.
    What's the clearest example of this?
    Sacking people without due process.
    And without notice and/or action by Congress where explicitly required by legislation
    Terminating funding voted by Congress without authorisation (which I suppose is linked).

    Edit - empowering improperly appointed persons to seize and/or destroy government files.
    I don't know why you peeps bother. I just assume that @williamglenn lives in St Petersburg and has no experience of how the rule of law is supposed to work in a democracy. Has zero understanding of democracy either - the other day he claimed Germany isn't a democracy because the AfD aren't part of the government.

    You'd really have to start at the kindergarten level with this fool, not that they have any interest in answers to all the "questions" they ask. You'd have to start by saying that even though the United Kingdom and the United States both begin with the same word, they are actually different countries with different constitutions. But it's a waste of time with this troll.
    He has so radically changed his viewpoint over the last decade, than I think he is either:
    *) Utterly trolling us.
    *) Not the same WilliamGlenn, and instead a hijacked account.
    Isn't it possible there are several WilliamGlenns? A sort of off the peg username for anyone who wants to ask an oddball question? Like those hire bikes. The WilliamGlenn who nabbed the name during Brexit was one of my favourite posters. I wonder why he stopped posting?
  • BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 9,002
    TimS said:

    MattW said:

    OllyT said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    Nobody wants to see the back of Trump/Vance more desparately than I do but I'm convinced that AOC would manage to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. The US is not going to elect a radical female no matter how big the crowds she attracts - it would be an electoral disaster of Corbynite proportions
    I haven't particularly studied AOC, nor her policy positions.

    It's clear that she's a very good campaigner / speaker, especially online. eg In UK terms is she a Corbyn, or given the USA Overton window is she actually a Lib Dem :wink: .

    A background effect may be what the Trump impact on the less wealthy / 'left behind' demographic who he persuaded to vote for him will be, who are heavily impacted by his tax / 'demolition of the state' policies will be, and their voting reaction.

    At present it seems to be cut expenture of the state by $1.5-2 trillion, and introduce major tax changes, both of which will result in a big shift in financial favour of very wealthy people.
    One thing she does have (as does Bernie Sanders) is confidence. Sheer untrammelled confidence has taken Trump a long way. Among the centrists Pete Buttigieg has it too. They really need that - the FU attitude that says I’m not cowed, I’m going after you Trump.

    Realistically policy and ideology may well be secondary in 2026 and 2028. They’ll need an operation that is up for fighting for democratic institutions and taking on the MAGA machine before it’s too late.
    I agree. Personality trumps policy and ideology.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 26,141
    edited March 23

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    A more potentially immediate question is what we make of the VP, given Trump's age. I can't judge whether he's seriously unhinged or merely a politician who adjusts his message to suit the moment. What do others make of him?
    As my attempt at a serious answer, I think that philosophically and politically he has a narrow base to his views, and he treats it as an intellectual citadel from which to defend and attack, and not as a centre from which to engage and explore.

    And I think he has an exaggerated Trump-like view of America the Dominant (which is untrue), and seems to share something of Trump's callous disregard of weaker human beings, which is in line with a belief in ""the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must". It will perhaps be a shock when he discovers that he is out of line with what is actually out there.

    I don't know what his attitude is to expert advisers, or if - unlike Trump - he is temperamentally capable of accepting that other people may know better about their knowledge domains, and it is better to have those around him than a parade of empty-headed yes-men.

    That makes him fragile and defensive to challenge, and he operates from his strong assumptions about others rather than read the background and ask them what they actually think. His sharp disagreements are characterised by responses of fear and contempt, not of engagement and wanting to collaborate / learn. He has a megaphone but also needs an ear trumpet.

    Given that he is a creature of Peter Thiel, that makes it very very awkward for anyone.

    This piece is his explanation of his philosophical journey to Catholicism, which is instructive. He is very clear about what he has rejected, but I don't think see that he has explored what he has professed - especially around the social and human vales and obligations. That is the hole at his centre.

    https://thelampmagazine.com/blog/how-i-joined-the-resistance

  • RogerRoger Posts: 20,248

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    Her unwavering support for Senile Joe:

    Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez reaffirmed her commitment to President Joe Biden as the presumptive Democratic nominee on Monday evening amid heightened tensions within the party over his mental fitness.

    “Joe Biden is our nominee, he is not leaving this race, he is in this race and I support him,” Ocasio-Cortez told a group of reporters outside of the Capitol.

    The New York rep’s assertion comes as Democratic lawmakers scramble to find consensus on whether or not to support Biden, 81, as the presidential nominee.

    At least six House Democrats have publicly called for the president to withdraw from the race following his disappointing and concerning debate performance at the end of June. The president’s failure to confidently debate his political opponent has led to concerns that he is not well enough to run a campaign or defeat Donald Trump.


    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/aoc-backing-biden-democratic-nominee-b2576756.html
    Yes loyalty is a desirable quality and in very short supply
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 9,937
    edited March 23

    MattW said:

    MattW said:

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    Fuel is extraordinarily cheap now. Just filled up at 129p. Approaching a 25% real terms cut since 2010.

    It’s nice to see a good news story for a change.
    Fuel duty will be a good test of whether Reeves and Starmer are still frightened of addressing Conservative talking points head on.

    I wonder if the blowback on the other things they have done will have made this obvious one to address relatively more palatable.
    Increase the cost of fuel and watch inflation rise with the Government taking the blame.
    I don't see the relevance. Government needs to be paid for, and for a start the "temporary" 5p reduction in fuel duty brought in one (or several) CofEs during the headless chicken period to 'counter market disruption during COVID', by one or several of Jeremy Hunt, Kwasi Kwarteng, Nadhim Zahawi and Rishi Sunak - who were the Tory Chancellors of the Exchequer in 2022.

    That alone is adding about 2.5bn per annum to the deficit and National Debt, and the pandemic was over some time ago. It needs simply to go.


    Source: https://www.smf.co.uk/commentary_podcasts/fuel-duty-and-public-finances/

    Bullshit.

    Meanwhile back in the real world the Exchequer is making £24.3bn per annum from fuel duty, money that is not spent on either maintaining existing roads or building new roads.

    Drivers are not adding to the deficit, let alone the National Debt, we are being fleeced.

    With fuel duty being one of the most regressive taxes that exists in the entire country as the richest with electric vehicles can opt out of paying the tax whatsoever while poor drivers who need to drive their old banger to work, possibly for minimum wage, have to spend a far higher proportion of income on fuel.
    Everything is regressive if you express it as a proportion of total income.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 30,845

    Foxy said:

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    I know little of her aside from the more superficial stuff. I don’t think the ‘she can’t be any worse’ argument cuts it really. She could easily.

    The Dems need to look outside of DC and outside of coastal liberalism for their next candidate
    I have a few quid on Governor Pritzker for this reason. 70 on BFX at present.

    I like AOC, and I think she can connect in ways that more mainstream Dems do not. She can gather a left wing populism that can smash the broligarchy and money men running American politics. She is very articulate, just watch the videos of her crossexamining in the HoR, far more forensic than most lawyers.

    She would actually be considered only mildly left of centre in the rest of the world.
    Of course, the greatest irony of Trump is if - on a huge swing of the pendulum - he were to deliver socialism (however low-fat) to America.
    Not really that ironic. He bought into the Soviet Union in the 1980s, some say as long ago as 1978.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,904
    Really shocking story in the ST today about Franchise colleges and the hundreds of millions that have been stolen for non existent students from Romania in the main signing on to get student loans and, of course, grants which are then shared between the colleges, the lead Universities and the providers of the students.

    The scale of it is almost beyond belief. Those involved in both the franchise colleges and indeed in the Universities have surely acted illegally and dishonestly. Hundreds of them really need to go to jail and the franchise colleges involved need to be closed. What this does to a sector already struggling, god alone knows.

    I don't have an electronic account but for those that do: https://www.thetimes.com/uk/education/article/revealed-colleges-student-loans-fraud-pd7wlgb3v
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 73,046
    DavidL said:

    Really shocking story in the ST today about Franchise colleges and the hundreds of millions that have been stolen for non existent students from Romania in the main signing on to get student loans and, of course, grants which are then shared between the colleges, the lead Universities and the providers of the students.

    The scale of it is almost beyond belief. Those involved in both the franchise colleges and indeed in the Universities have surely acted illegally and dishonestly. Hundreds of them really need to go to jail and the franchise colleges involved need to be closed. What this does to a sector already struggling, god alone knows.

    I don't have an electronic account but for those that do: https://www.thetimes.com/uk/education/article/revealed-colleges-student-loans-fraud-pd7wlgb3v

    It must have been pretty bad if it was so blatant even the SLC noticed something bad was going on.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 29,593
    Comedy Gold from the stewards in China
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 30,845
    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    Really shocking story in the ST today about Franchise colleges and the hundreds of millions that have been stolen for non existent students from Romania in the main signing on to get student loans and, of course, grants which are then shared between the colleges, the lead Universities and the providers of the students.

    The scale of it is almost beyond belief. Those involved in both the franchise colleges and indeed in the Universities have surely acted illegally and dishonestly. Hundreds of them really need to go to jail and the franchise colleges involved need to be closed. What this does to a sector already struggling, god alone knows.

    I don't have an electronic account but for those that do: https://www.thetimes.com/uk/education/article/revealed-colleges-student-loans-fraud-pd7wlgb3v

    It must have been pretty bad if it was so blatant even the SLC noticed something bad was going on.
    Ooh, ooh, talking of Tory irrelevance did you catch a tearful Dame Amanda Spielman on WATO last week. She was outraged that Phillipson was dismantling her golden legacy.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 26,141
    edited March 23
    MattW said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    A more potentially immediate question is what we make of the VP, given Trump's age. I can't judge whether he's seriously unhinged or merely a politician who adjusts his message to suit the moment. What do others make of him?
    As my attempt at a serious answer, I think that philosophically and politically he has a narrow base to his views, and he treats it as an intellectual citadel from which to defend and attack, and not as a centre from which to engage and explore.

    And I think he has an exaggerated Trump-like view of America the Dominant (which is untrue), and seems to share something of Trump's callous disregard of weaker human beings, which is in line with a belief in ""the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must". It will perhaps be a shock when he discovers that he is out of line with what is actually out there.

    I don't know what his attitude is to expert advisers, or if - unlike Trump - he is temperamentally capable of accepting that other people may know better about their knowledge domains, and it is better to have those around him than a parade of empty-headed yes-men.

    That makes him fragile and defensive to challenge, and he operates from his strong assumptions about others rather than read the background and ask them what they actually think. His sharp disagreements are characterised by responses of fear and contempt, not of engagement and wanting to collaborate / learn. He has a megaphone but also needs an ear trumpet.

    Given that he is a creature of Peter Thiel, that makes it very very awkward for anyone.

    This piece is his explanation of his philosophical journey to Catholicism, which is instructive. He is very clear about what he has rejected, but I don't think see that he has explored what he has professed - especially around the social and human vales and obligations. That is the hole at his centre.

    https://thelampmagazine.com/blog/how-i-joined-the-resistance

    This piece, which is looking at Vance's description of himself as a "postliberal", explores his political positions a bit more:

    https://www.ncronline.org/news/jd-vances-catholicism-helped-shape-his-views-so-did-little-known-group-catholic-thinkers

    I'm interested in his attitude to undermining liberal democratic structures in order to impose his version of a postliberal settlement, whatever that turns out to be. The piece discusses the combination of a Catholic-Right traditionalist social policy, with a controlling big Government setup.

    That sounds to me more like the Catholic Right in Europe that were fellow-travellers with regimes such as Mussolini's in Italy, or perhaps more recently in Hungary (I don't know Hungary well), or the pre-Tusk Government in Poland that tried to control the judiciary.

    I'd welcome any comment.
  • Eabhal said:

    MattW said:

    MattW said:

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    Fuel is extraordinarily cheap now. Just filled up at 129p. Approaching a 25% real terms cut since 2010.

    It’s nice to see a good news story for a change.
    Fuel duty will be a good test of whether Reeves and Starmer are still frightened of addressing Conservative talking points head on.

    I wonder if the blowback on the other things they have done will have made this obvious one to address relatively more palatable.
    Increase the cost of fuel and watch inflation rise with the Government taking the blame.
    I don't see the relevance. Government needs to be paid for, and for a start the "temporary" 5p reduction in fuel duty brought in one (or several) CofEs during the headless chicken period to 'counter market disruption during COVID', by one or several of Jeremy Hunt, Kwasi Kwarteng, Nadhim Zahawi and Rishi Sunak - who were the Tory Chancellors of the Exchequer in 2022.

    That alone is adding about 2.5bn per annum to the deficit and National Debt, and the pandemic was over some time ago. It needs simply to go.


    Source: https://www.smf.co.uk/commentary_podcasts/fuel-duty-and-public-finances/

    Bullshit.

    Meanwhile back in the real world the Exchequer is making £24.3bn per annum from fuel duty, money that is not spent on either maintaining existing roads or building new roads.

    Drivers are not adding to the deficit, let alone the National Debt, we are being fleeced.

    With fuel duty being one of the most regressive taxes that exists in the entire country as the richest with electric vehicles can opt out of paying the tax whatsoever while poor drivers who need to drive their old banger to work, possibly for minimum wage, have to spend a far higher proportion of income on fuel.
    Everything is regressive if you express it as a proportion of total income.
    As a proportion of total income is quite literally how progressive/regressive is defined.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,904
    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    Really shocking story in the ST today about Franchise colleges and the hundreds of millions that have been stolen for non existent students from Romania in the main signing on to get student loans and, of course, grants which are then shared between the colleges, the lead Universities and the providers of the students.

    The scale of it is almost beyond belief. Those involved in both the franchise colleges and indeed in the Universities have surely acted illegally and dishonestly. Hundreds of them really need to go to jail and the franchise colleges involved need to be closed. What this does to a sector already struggling, god alone knows.

    I don't have an electronic account but for those that do: https://www.thetimes.com/uk/education/article/revealed-colleges-student-loans-fraud-pd7wlgb3v

    It must have been pretty bad if it was so blatant even the SLC noticed something bad was going on.
    Indeed. But what on earth was the mindset of those who had proper jobs in real Universities who thought this was a good way of getting huge amounts of money into their institutions? As I say, they really should be prosecuted for fraud on an epic scale and that is essential if we are to ensure that people in the public sector are never tempted to do this again.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,360

    Comedy Gold from the stewards in China

    Watching highlights or has a post-race nonsense occurred?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 73,046

    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    Really shocking story in the ST today about Franchise colleges and the hundreds of millions that have been stolen for non existent students from Romania in the main signing on to get student loans and, of course, grants which are then shared between the colleges, the lead Universities and the providers of the students.

    The scale of it is almost beyond belief. Those involved in both the franchise colleges and indeed in the Universities have surely acted illegally and dishonestly. Hundreds of them really need to go to jail and the franchise colleges involved need to be closed. What this does to a sector already struggling, god alone knows.

    I don't have an electronic account but for those that do: https://www.thetimes.com/uk/education/article/revealed-colleges-student-loans-fraud-pd7wlgb3v

    It must have been pretty bad if it was so blatant even the SLC noticed something bad was going on.
    Ooh, ooh, talking of Tory irrelevance did you catch a tearful Dame Amanda Spielman on WATO last week. She was outraged that Phillipson was dismantling her golden legacy.
    Yes, and I found myself in full agreement with Ms Phillipson when she said Spielman should STFU and show some humility by reflecting on her utter failure in the role of Ofsted boss.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 26,141
    DavidL said:

    Really shocking story in the ST today about Franchise colleges and the hundreds of millions that have been stolen for non existent students from Romania in the main signing on to get student loans and, of course, grants which are then shared between the colleges, the lead Universities and the providers of the students.

    The scale of it is almost beyond belief. Those involved in both the franchise colleges and indeed in the Universities have surely acted illegally and dishonestly. Hundreds of them really need to go to jail and the franchise colleges involved need to be closed. What this does to a sector already struggling, god alone knows.

    I don't have an electronic account but for those that do: https://www.thetimes.com/uk/education/article/revealed-colleges-student-loans-fraud-pd7wlgb3v

    Full piece:
    https://archive.is/20250323103854/https://www.thetimes.com/uk/education/article/revealed-colleges-student-loans-fraud-pd7wlgb3v
  • MattWMattW Posts: 26,141
    edited March 23

    MattW said:

    MattW said:

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    Fuel is extraordinarily cheap now. Just filled up at 129p. Approaching a 25% real terms cut since 2010.

    It’s nice to see a good news story for a change.
    Fuel duty will be a good test of whether Reeves and Starmer are still frightened of addressing Conservative talking points head on.

    I wonder if the blowback on the other things they have done will have made this obvious one to address relatively more palatable.
    Increase the cost of fuel and watch inflation rise with the Government taking the blame.
    I don't see the relevance. Government needs to be paid for, and for a start the "temporary" 5p reduction in fuel duty brought in one (or several) CofEs during the headless chicken period to 'counter market disruption during COVID', by one or several of Jeremy Hunt, Kwasi Kwarteng, Nadhim Zahawi and Rishi Sunak - who were the Tory Chancellors of the Exchequer in 2022.

    That alone is adding about 2.5bn per annum to the deficit and National Debt, and the pandemic was over some time ago. It needs simply to go.


    Source: https://www.smf.co.uk/commentary_podcasts/fuel-duty-and-public-finances/

    Bullshit.

    Meanwhile back in the real world the Exchequer is making £24.3bn per annum from fuel duty, money that is not spent on either maintaining existing roads or building new roads.

    Drivers are not adding to the deficit, let alone the National Debt, we are being fleeced.

    With fuel duty being one of the most regressive taxes that exists in the entire country as the richest with electric vehicles can opt out of paying the tax whatsoever while poor drivers who need to drive their old banger to work, possibly for minimum wage, have to spend a far higher proportion of income on fuel.
    Good morning Bart :smiley: .

    This presumption of a group called "drivers" who are allegedly "being fleeced" is a fiction.

    Drivers are nearly all of us who are adults, and it is a matter of decision as a society from where we wish to draw our tax revenue.

    A concession was given for a short time for a specific purpose - to help during Covid. That reason no longer exists, so the concession can be withdrawn, and the national finances can be helped to recover.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 34,384
    MattW said:

    MattW said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    A more potentially immediate question is what we make of the VP, given Trump's age. I can't judge whether he's seriously unhinged or merely a politician who adjusts his message to suit the moment. What do others make of him?
    As my attempt at a serious answer, I think that philosophically and politically he has a narrow base to his views, and he treats it as an intellectual citadel from which to defend and attack, and not as a centre from which to engage and explore.

    And I think he has an exaggerated Trump-like view of America the Dominant (which is untrue), and seems to share something of Trump's callous disregard of weaker human beings, which is in line with a belief in ""the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must". It will perhaps be a shock when he discovers that he is out of line with what is actually out there.

    I don't know what his attitude is to expert advisers, or if - unlike Trump - he is temperamentally capable of accepting that other people may know better about their knowledge domains, and it is better to have those around him than a parade of empty-headed yes-men.

    That makes him fragile and defensive to challenge, and he operates from his strong assumptions about others rather than read the background and ask them what they actually think. His sharp disagreements are characterised by responses of fear and contempt, not of engagement and wanting to collaborate / learn. He has a megaphone but also needs an ear trumpet.

    Given that he is a creature of Peter Thiel, that makes it very very awkward for anyone.

    This piece is his explanation of his philosophical journey to Catholicism, which is instructive. He is very clear about what he has rejected, but I don't think see that he has explored what he has professed - especially around the social and human vales and obligations. That is the hole at his centre.

    https://thelampmagazine.com/blog/how-i-joined-the-resistance

    This piece, which is looking at Vance's description of himself as a "postliberal", explores his political positions a bit more:

    https://www.ncronline.org/news/jd-vances-catholicism-helped-shape-his-views-so-did-little-known-group-catholic-thinkers

    I'm interested in his attitude to undermining liberal democratic structures in order to impose his version of a postliberal settlement, whatever that turns out to be. The piece discusses the combination of a Catholic-Right traditionalist social policy, with a controlling big Government setup.

    That sounds to me more like the Catholic Right in Europe that were fellow-travellers with regimes such as Mussolini's in Italy, or perhaps more recently in Hungary (I don't know Hungary well), or the pre-Tusk Government in Poland that tried to control the judiciary.

    I'd welcome any comment.
    Shades of de Valera during WWII?
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 38,326
    MattW said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    A more potentially immediate question is what we make of the VP, given Trump's age. I can't judge whether he's seriously unhinged or merely a politician who adjusts his message to suit the moment. What do others make of him?
    As my attempt at a serious answer, I think that philosophically and politically he has a narrow base to his views, and he treats it as an intellectual citadel from which to defend and attack, and not as a centre from which to engage and explore.

    And I think he has an exaggerated Trump-like view of America the Dominant (which is untrue), and seems to share something of Trump's callous disregard of weaker human beings, which is in line with a belief in ""the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must". It will perhaps be a shock when he discovers that he is out of line with what is actually out there.

    I don't know what his attitude is to expert advisers, or if - unlike Trump - he is temperamentally capable of accepting that other people may know better about their knowledge domains, and it is better to have those around him than a parade of empty-headed yes-men.

    That makes him fragile and defensive to challenge, and he operates from his strong assumptions about others rather than read the background and ask them what they actually think. His sharp disagreements are characterised by responses of fear and contempt, not of engagement and wanting to collaborate / learn. He has a megaphone but also needs an ear trumpet.

    Given that he is a creature of Peter Thiel, that makes it very very awkward for anyone.

    This piece is his explanation of his philosophical journey to Catholicism, which is instructive. He is very clear about what he has rejected, but I don't think see that he has explored what he has professed - especially around the social and human vales and obligations. That is the hole at his centre.

    https://thelampmagazine.com/blog/how-i-joined-the-resistance

    “The strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must” is actually a very stupid outlook. Because there will always come a time when you need allies and supporters (as Athens ultimately did).

    Unlike the Greeks, the Romans were good diplomats who always left something on the table, for their clients.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,360
    F1: probably going to lead to Hamilton's disqualification: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/articles/cn0j7gvnk89o

    Good news for Alpine, means they get a point. Bad news for me, I need to rewrite quite a bit of the podcast script...
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 73,046

    F1: probably going to lead to Hamilton's disqualification: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/articles/cn0j7gvnk89o

    Good news for Alpine, means they get a point. Bad news for me, I need to rewrite quite a bit of the podcast script...

    Unfortunate timing given his comments on 'yapping' critics.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 18,153
    Sean_F said:

    MattW said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    A more potentially immediate question is what we make of the VP, given Trump's age. I can't judge whether he's seriously unhinged or merely a politician who adjusts his message to suit the moment. What do others make of him?
    As my attempt at a serious answer, I think that philosophically and politically he has a narrow base to his views, and he treats it as an intellectual citadel from which to defend and attack, and not as a centre from which to engage and explore.

    And I think he has an exaggerated Trump-like view of America the Dominant (which is untrue), and seems to share something of Trump's callous disregard of weaker human beings, which is in line with a belief in ""the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must". It will perhaps be a shock when he discovers that he is out of line with what is actually out there.

    I don't know what his attitude is to expert advisers, or if - unlike Trump - he is temperamentally capable of accepting that other people may know better about their knowledge domains, and it is better to have those around him than a parade of empty-headed yes-men.

    That makes him fragile and defensive to challenge, and he operates from his strong assumptions about others rather than read the background and ask them what they actually think. His sharp disagreements are characterised by responses of fear and contempt, not of engagement and wanting to collaborate / learn. He has a megaphone but also needs an ear trumpet.

    Given that he is a creature of Peter Thiel, that makes it very very awkward for anyone.

    This piece is his explanation of his philosophical journey to Catholicism, which is instructive. He is very clear about what he has rejected, but I don't think see that he has explored what he has professed - especially around the social and human vales and obligations. That is the hole at his centre.

    https://thelampmagazine.com/blog/how-i-joined-the-resistance

    “The strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must” is actually a very stupid outlook. Because there will always come a time when you need allies and supporters (as Athens ultimately did).

    Unlike the Greeks, the Romans were good diplomats who always left something on the table, for their clients.
    Though that only matters if you forsee a time when you need allies and supporters. It's pretty clear that Trump doesn't.

    The question is where is is on the spectrum between "enormous hubris" and "intends to nail things down with himself as permagod". And it's not that difficult a question- a bunch of politicians this awful daren't risk nemesis. If they look like losing, they will have to try to fiddle the next elections.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 30,845
    edited March 23
    Roger said:

    kamski said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    algarkirk said:

    TimS said:

    Speaker Mike Johnson

    @SpeakerJohnson
    The House is working overtime to limit the abuses of activist federal judges. Our @JudiciaryGOP
    will expose the worst offenders in a high profile hearing & we are preparing urgent legislative action, like the @repdarrellissa bill to stop unfounded nationwide injunctions.

    https://x.com/SpeakerJohnson/status/1903529228085109157

    My periodic check: are we agreed the USA is becoming a dictatorship yet, or is the - um -jury still out?
    Yes, it is so becoming; that is the intention. The jury is not still out. The jury is still out about outcomes. Remaining questions include:

    Is the intention a continuing 'elected' dictatorship or a rigged/non elected one?

    Will the SCOTUS intervene decisively, and if so will their judgment be enforced?

    Will there be an enforced clamp down on the jurisdiction of the courts?

    Will the, fairly wide, degree of free speech (under intimidation) and free media be allowed to continue?

    Will there be a 'Reichstag Fire' event?

    Will there be a counter-coup?

    (So far this is all at the very worst end of my expectations).
    Is the Trump administration doing anything that would be unconstitutional for a newly-elected majority government in Britain?
    Yes.
    What's the clearest example of this?
    Sacking people without due process.
    And without notice and/or action by Congress where explicitly required by legislation
    Terminating funding voted by Congress without authorisation (which I suppose is linked).

    Edit - empowering improperly appointed persons to seize and/or destroy government files.
    I don't know why you peeps bother. I just assume that @williamglenn lives in St Petersburg and has no experience of how the rule of law is supposed to work in a democracy. Has zero understanding of democracy either - the other day he claimed Germany isn't a democracy because the AfD aren't part of the government.

    You'd really have to start at the kindergarten level with this fool, not that they have any interest in answers to all the "questions" they ask. You'd have to start by saying that even though the United Kingdom and the United States both begin with the same word, they are actually different countries with different constitutions. But it's a waste of time with this troll.
    He has so radically changed his viewpoint over the last decade, than I think he is either:
    *) Utterly trolling us.
    *) Not the same WilliamGlenn, and instead a hijacked account.
    Isn't it possible there are several WilliamGlenns? A sort of off the peg username for anyone who wants to ask an oddball question? Like those hire bikes. The WilliamGlenn who nabbed the name during Brexit was one of my favourite posters. I wonder why he stopped posting?
    I liked Eurofederalist William Glenn too.

    I suspect he stood too close to a tenth floor window.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,360
    ydoethur said:

    F1: probably going to lead to Hamilton's disqualification: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/articles/cn0j7gvnk89o

    Good news for Alpine, means they get a point. Bad news for me, I need to rewrite quite a bit of the podcast script...

    Unfortunate timing given his comments on 'yapping' critics.
    Entirely beyond his control, though.

    Great news for Haas, and it'd push Alpine/Gasly off of zero.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 18,153

    MattW said:

    MattW said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Taz said:
    What will happen to Democratic candidates’ accounts as we approach the US midterms?
    The "titans of free speech" who had the nerve to come to Europe and lecture us. It is just sickening to observe the maga hypocrisy.

    And yes, the mid-terms are going to be a nail biter when it comes to the prospects for constitutional democracy vs authoritarianism in the US. I think it is 50/50 between overriding and supreme court decision and tanking the midterms as the definitive moment. I mean ignoring court orders on deportation due process is bad enough. But I think the other two will be the flash point for a serious crisis in America.
    A thread I have planned is that the crisis could come much sooner than the mid terms.

    With special elections/defection it is possible the Dems take control of the House this year.
    I would like to believe this but with the Democrats even less popular than the Republicans right now, I'm doubtful.
    Unpopular for being supine.

    Those speaking out like Bernie and AOC are getting vast support.

    AOC would be a great president, assuming that there are further US elections.
    What would make her a good president ?

    I'm no fan at all of AOC but she couldn't possibly be as bad as this one. Even if she can be just as arrogant she is at least possessed of a functioning brain.
    A more potentially immediate question is what we make of the VP, given Trump's age. I can't judge whether he's seriously unhinged or merely a politician who adjusts his message to suit the moment. What do others make of him?
    As my attempt at a serious answer, I think that philosophically and politically he has a narrow base to his views, and he treats it as an intellectual citadel from which to defend and attack, and not as a centre from which to engage and explore.

    And I think he has an exaggerated Trump-like view of America the Dominant (which is untrue), and seems to share something of Trump's callous disregard of weaker human beings, which is in line with a belief in ""the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must". It will perhaps be a shock when he discovers that he is out of line with what is actually out there.

    I don't know what his attitude is to expert advisers, or if - unlike Trump - he is temperamentally capable of accepting that other people may know better about their knowledge domains, and it is better to have those around him than a parade of empty-headed yes-men.

    That makes him fragile and defensive to challenge, and he operates from his strong assumptions about others rather than read the background and ask them what they actually think. His sharp disagreements are characterised by responses of fear and contempt, not of engagement and wanting to collaborate / learn. He has a megaphone but also needs an ear trumpet.

    Given that he is a creature of Peter Thiel, that makes it very very awkward for anyone.

    This piece is his explanation of his philosophical journey to Catholicism, which is instructive. He is very clear about what he has rejected, but I don't think see that he has explored what he has professed - especially around the social and human vales and obligations. That is the hole at his centre.

    https://thelampmagazine.com/blog/how-i-joined-the-resistance

    This piece, which is looking at Vance's description of himself as a "postliberal", explores his political positions a bit more:

    https://www.ncronline.org/news/jd-vances-catholicism-helped-shape-his-views-so-did-little-known-group-catholic-thinkers

    I'm interested in his attitude to undermining liberal democratic structures in order to impose his version of a postliberal settlement, whatever that turns out to be. The piece discusses the combination of a Catholic-Right traditionalist social policy, with a controlling big Government setup.

    That sounds to me more like the Catholic Right in Europe that were fellow-travellers with regimes such as Mussolini's in Italy, or perhaps more recently in Hungary (I don't know Hungary well), or the pre-Tusk Government in Poland that tried to control the judiciary.

    I'd welcome any comment.
    Shades of de Valera during WWII?
    Somewhere between that (possibly not so bad) and the Opus Dei technocrats of late-era Francoist Spain. Though the Opus Dei crew were reasonably technically competent (as such things go).
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