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Punters continue to think Labour will win the most seats at the next election – politicalbetting.com

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  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 23,801

    Interesting comment from a Reform supporter:

    https://x.com/sandyofsuffolk/status/1901271473559392584

    This tweet is going to shock you all.

    I think what Wes Streeting is doing for the NHS is better and more than any minister has done in at least the last 30 years.

    I also think he's the only Labour minister I've heard speaking who doesn't sound like a robot or an inarticulate patronizing halfwit. He sounds human.

    There. Shocked? Or not?

    Most unshocking thing I’ll see all day.
    Funnily enough I think and have thought Wes was robotic and patronising, but obviously Wes wants to appeal to Reform voters rather than anyone to the left of Labour First. Mission accomplished.
    Having read all of "Get In" (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/223672572-get-in ), Streeting is the Blairite prince-over-the-water and is after Starmer's job muy gusto. I don't think Blairism works any more.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 30,627
    Scott_xP said:

    @SamRo

    "Business activity dropped significantly in New York State in March... Optimism about the outlook waned considerably for a second consecutive month"
    @NYFedResearch

    That Reeves budget has had a negative impact across the World.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,151
    DavidL said:

    The problem of the Democrats is similar to Labour’s problems here. There is a growing disconnect between their middle class public sector supporters and the working classes they are supposed to represent. The obsessions of the middle classes are simply not shared by the working class and their worries, such as immigration and gang related violence, are thought both vulgar and racist.

    In the US those vulgar people are now MAGA supporters and here they are now Reform.

    How that coalition is rebuilt is an interesting question in both cases. The middle class consider themselves morally superior because they “care” but what they care about is of little to no interest to those they pretend to represent.

    Is altruism selfish?

    The left have traditionally made the argument that helping others helps ourselves. We can collectively grow the pie

    MAGA and reform are pitching the argument if anybody else gets anything that means less for 'us', and those that are getting it are undeserving.

    The latter messaging is better, but the former argument is better

    It remains to be seen if anybody can effectively make it
  • StereodogStereodog Posts: 773
    edited March 17
    Leon said:

    As Trump and MAGA become ever more demonstrably horrific, I’ve seen this trend for their supporters to shout ever louder about the (fictional) evils of the Democrats, the “Biden crime family”, the Clintons’ supposed evils, etc. It seems like a desperate attempt to avoid talking about the obvious problems today by repeating the greatest hits of disinformation past.

    You think Hunter Biden's CONFESSED crimes, Joe Biden swearng never to pardon him (then pardoning him), then the pardons given to the entire Biden family, then the pardon given to Antony "lableak" Fauci, then the revelation that the Bidens and elite Democrats lied to the Americans for years about Biden's mental health (thereby paving the way for Trump) - you think those are all "fictional"?

    I mean, you are as deluded as a QANONer. I guess that shouldn't be a surprise from an obscure midbrow twat like you who still shouts "it came from the wet market!!!" like the last embarrassing drunk on the nightbus, but still, for the rest of PB which may not be as absurd as you, this stuff is worth pointing out

    Why? Because it is the context. It is one reason Trump is elected (despite being an oaf) and one reason opposition to him (and his many grievous ills) may be harder to organise. A lot of American voters (see the polls) think the Dems are easily as bad as the Republicans - even now - and with reason

    No doubt I will be banned again soon for daring to make these points. But then PB will be reduced to this echo chanber of bedwetters, moaning haplessly about The Donald, and with zero insight

    If one of your children had incurred the ire of an incoming President noted for their vengefulness would you do any differently? I don't think it was a principled thing to do but it's entirely understandable on a human level. Also what actual evidence do you have that Biden had dementia during his presidency?
  • Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 14,700

    As Trump and MAGA become ever more demonstrably horrific, I’ve seen this trend for their supporters to shout ever louder about the (fictional) evils of the Democrats, the “Biden crime family”, the Clintons’ supposed evils, etc. It seems like a desperate attempt to avoid talking about the obvious problems today by repeating the greatest hits of disinformation past.

    It is a form of psychological projection mixed with deliberate misinformation, the latter of which is designed to say; "hey well obviously we are probably crooked and corrupt, but the other lot are as bad, or worse, so us having a criminal leader is OK"
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 13,117
    Pulpstar said:

    What the Democrats primarily need is someone who can articulate a confident and cohesive vision for America, while concisely and charismatically being able to rebut Trumpism.

    The problem they have at the moment, I think, is that they are too associated (rightly or wrongly) with the whiff of managed American decline and a perception that they are too far removed from the average American. They need someone with the common touch, who can energise but actually authentically sell a future. They are so vulnerable to the Trumpian claims that they are out of touch, incompetent establishment figures and they need to combat it. They could do with a few more AOCs I think - not necessarily for her politics but just a bit more of an authentic backstory and vision.

    The Democrats have a great recent track record of winning the popular vote. They suffer from the Senate and thus the electoral college overweighting some small Republican states. In 2024, the incumbent suffered because of a period of high inflation, as we saw in numerous countries.
    The electoral bias last presidential election was about 0.2% to Trump, the lowest electoral college bias since 1988
    Indeed. But the electoral bias on the preceding elections was much higher. Had Trump lost in 2016, he wouldn’t be President now, I suggest, and he only won in 2016 because of the electoral college.
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,771
    Scott_xP said:

    mwadams said:

    A few weeks ago, we were discussing the fact that we weren't quite at the point where the rule of law had broken down in the US, and there were still legal constraints on the Trump administration.

    After the deportation flights - not just the fact that they ignored the order, but the fact that the AG issued a note suggesting that they did not believe the court had the jurisdiction to make the order, and carried on regardless - are we still hiding behind a fig leaf that the courts have any power over this Presidency?

    Depends what happens next.

    If the administration is effectively sanctioned for ignoring the law, then the rule of law still holds.

    If they get away with it, the US is fucked.
    Does anyone think they *aren't* going to get away with it? What sanction does the court have that the President will acknowledge and enforcement will uphold?
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 5,404
    On Mark Carney's plate, aside from the Trump stuff:



    GDP per capita growth, selected countries.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 58,986
    IanB2 said:

    Leon said:

    I'm beginning to think Sanders is the only hope for America. If he can give tens of more speeches like this, he can mobilise millions. In fact, I see that duplicate version of this are already attracting millions on social media.

    Bernie is too mad to do that. The DNC needs to find a straight version of Pete Buttigieg. With a pretty wife and all American name. Pete is sensationally good. But he’s gat, and appalling as it is I think that’s enough to sink him as a post-Trump contender.

    Assuming there are any post-Trump contenders…
    Buttgieg was also mediocre in office and was one of the liars who said that Biden was good for another four years.

    The Dems need a clean break from those involved in the administration of the Biden crime family.
    "Biden crime family"?

    Can I help you out of that deep rabbit hole?
    The levels of cognitive dissonance are astonishing. Let’s assume that Hunter Biden is a bad’un. May be true. But his crimes are rather pale in comparison to Trump’s own ongoing criminality.

    What kind of person do you have to be to ignore that gargantuan plank sticking out of your eye because you are performatively excited by the splinter in someone else’s eye?
    The entire Biden family conspired to disguise the fact that Joe Biden is fucking demented, has been for years, and was unfit to run in 2024. They committed an immense fraud on the American people, on American democracy, and one of the reasons they did it was so that their convicted criminal son, Hunter - still facing some spectacular allegations on top of his confessed crimes - could escape any jail time. Via a presidential pardon

    And by doing this the Biden family assured that Trump would get elected. They enabled Trump

    So, yeah, calling the Bidens a crime family is quite moderate, in the circs. The only reason they aren't all potentially facing time is because - why? - oh yeah, Biden gave them all yet more of his "pre-emptive pardons"
    When did you first have your brain washed by the MAGA nutters, or was it completely voluntary? MAGA became obsessed by Hunter because it was a useful distraction against the reality that they, MAGA, have a criminal leader. No doubt you will soon be suggesting that Russia didn't invade Ukraine or any other factually incorrect nonsense spouted by the intellectual pigmies that now run the US.
    Although it could just be a controversial narrative designed to trigger posters Leon likes to trigger. He's triggered this poster. Life is too short to engage with such bollocks.
    Our credulous cretin is back. Sadly for us.
    My return was so triggering it caused @BatteryCorrectHorse to quit the site. Supposedly

  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 13,117

    Pulpstar said:

    What the Democrats primarily need is someone who can articulate a confident and cohesive vision for America, while concisely and charismatically being able to rebut Trumpism.

    The problem they have at the moment, I think, is that they are too associated (rightly or wrongly) with the whiff of managed American decline and a perception that they are too far removed from the average American. They need someone with the common touch, who can energise but actually authentically sell a future. They are so vulnerable to the Trumpian claims that they are out of touch, incompetent establishment figures and they need to combat it. They could do with a few more AOCs I think - not necessarily for her politics but just a bit more of an authentic backstory and vision.

    The Democrats have a great recent track record of winning the popular vote. They suffer from the Senate and thus the electoral college overweighting some small Republican states. In 2024, the incumbent suffered because of a period of high inflation, as we saw in numerous countries.
    The electoral bias last presidential election was about 0.2% to Trump, the lowest electoral college bias since 1988
    Currently, Americans have no sensible choice of who to vote for. It’s the equivalent of a choice between Truss and Corbyn, without even a Lib Dem alternative.
    Truss is much more mainstream than Trump and Harris a fair way from Corbyn. 2024 was more like a choice between Adolf Hitler and Ed Miliband.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 14,180
    IanB2 said:

    Leon said:

    I'm beginning to think Sanders is the only hope for America. If he can give tens of more speeches like this, he can mobilise millions. In fact, I see that duplicate version of this are already attracting millions on social media.

    Bernie is too mad to do that. The DNC needs to find a straight version of Pete Buttigieg. With a pretty wife and all American name. Pete is sensationally good. But he’s gat, and appalling as it is I think that’s enough to sink him as a post-Trump contender.

    Assuming there are any post-Trump contenders…
    Buttgieg was also mediocre in office and was one of the liars who said that Biden was good for another four years.

    The Dems need a clean break from those involved in the administration of the Biden crime family.
    "Biden crime family"?

    Can I help you out of that deep rabbit hole?
    The levels of cognitive dissonance are astonishing. Let’s assume that Hunter Biden is a bad’un. May be true. But his crimes are rather pale in comparison to Trump’s own ongoing criminality.

    What kind of person do you have to be to ignore that gargantuan plank sticking out of your eye because you are performatively excited by the splinter in someone else’s eye?
    The entire Biden family conspired to disguise the fact that Joe Biden is fucking demented, has been for years, and was unfit to run in 2024. They committed an immense fraud on the American people, on American democracy, and one of the reasons they did it was so that their convicted criminal son, Hunter - still facing some spectacular allegations on top of his confessed crimes - could escape any jail time. Via a presidential pardon

    And by doing this the Biden family assured that Trump would get elected. They enabled Trump

    So, yeah, calling the Bidens a crime family is quite moderate, in the circs. The only reason they aren't all potentially facing time is because - why? - oh yeah, Biden gave them all yet more of his "pre-emptive pardons"
    When did you first have your brain washed by the MAGA nutters, or was it completely voluntary? MAGA became obsessed by Hunter because it was a useful distraction against the reality that they, MAGA, have a criminal leader. No doubt you will soon be suggesting that Russia didn't invade Ukraine or any other factually incorrect nonsense spouted by the intellectual pigmies that now run the US.
    Although it could just be a controversial narrative designed to trigger posters Leon likes to trigger. He's triggered this poster. Life is too short to engage with such bollocks.
    Our credulous cretin is back. Sadly for us.
    It's like when Beca comes back to the Barden Belles in Pitch Perfect.

    🎶Don't you forget about me🎶
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 13,117
    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    What the Democrats primarily need is someone who can articulate a confident and cohesive vision for America, while concisely and charismatically being able to rebut Trumpism.

    The problem they have at the moment, I think, is that they are too associated (rightly or wrongly) with the whiff of managed American decline and a perception that they are too far removed from the average American. They need someone with the common touch, who can energise but actually authentically sell a future. They are so vulnerable to the Trumpian claims that they are out of touch, incompetent establishment figures and they need to combat it. They could do with a few more AOCs I think - not necessarily for her politics but just a bit more of an authentic backstory and vision.

    You hear about decline but the US is amongst the richest countries on Earth with a staggeringly resilient and dynamic economy. Its biggest problem is gross inequality such that large numbers of people don't share in its success. It ought to be possible for the Dems to develop a strong platform which addresses this. If they do it will stand in positive contrast to the GOP who seek to patronise and exploit the 'left behind' rather than help them.
    1992 Dems - 'it's the economy, stupid'

    2024 Dems - trans rights, slavery reparations, unrestricted abortion, more immigration

    In 2016 Bill Clinton warned the Dems they were losing working class votes:

    Bill Clinton was alarmed by the dropoff in support for his wife among white working class voters, but that his concerns went unheeded within the campaign staff.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shattered:_Inside_Hillary_Clinton's_Doomed_Campaign#Contents

    In 2024 the Dems extended that loss of support to Hispanic working class voters.
    That was not the 2024 Democratic manifesto. That is how Republicans sought to describe it.

    Democrats won the Hispanic vote and the working class vote.
    Trump won 54% of Hispanic men and 56% of voters with no college degree and 50% of voters earning under $50,000.

    Harris won 51% of voters earning over $100,000 and 56% of college graduates

    https://edition.cnn.com/election/2024/exit-polls/national-results/general/president/0
    Women get the vote too, HYUFD (at least for now). Harris won the Hispanic vote.

    If we take income as the best proxy for working class, OK, I retract my statement. The parties tied on the working class vote.

    However, it is thus clear that Harris won Hispanic working class voters.
  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 4,858
    carnforth said:

    On Mark Carney's plate, aside from the Trump stuff:



    GDP per capita growth, selected countries.

    The way they are going, the US are going to do -20% shortly.

    Is this a reflection of Canada having more primary industry?
  • Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 14,700
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    I'm beginning to think Sanders is the only hope for America. If he can give tens of more speeches like this, he can mobilise millions. In fact, I see that duplicate version of this are already attracting millions on social media.

    Bernie is too mad to do that. The DNC needs to find a straight version of Pete Buttigieg. With a pretty wife and all American name. Pete is sensationally good. But he’s gat, and appalling as it is I think that’s enough to sink him as a post-Trump contender.

    Assuming there are any post-Trump contenders…
    Buttgieg was also mediocre in office and was one of the liars who said that Biden was good for another four years.

    The Dems need a clean break from those involved in the administration of the Biden crime family.
    "Biden crime family"?

    Can I help you out of that deep rabbit hole?
    The levels of cognitive dissonance are astonishing. Let’s assume that Hunter Biden is a bad’un. May be true. But his crimes are rather pale in comparison to Trump’s own ongoing criminality.

    What kind of person do you have to be to ignore that gargantuan plank sticking out of your eye because you are performatively excited by the splinter in someone else’s eye?
    The entire Biden family conspired to disguise the fact that Joe Biden is fucking demented, has been for years, and was unfit to run in 2024. They committed an immense fraud on the American people, on American democracy, and one of the reasons they did it was so that their convicted criminal son, Hunter - still facing some spectacular allegations on top of his confessed crimes - could escape any jail time. Via a presidential pardon

    And by doing this the Biden family assured that Trump would get elected. They enabled Trump

    So, yeah, calling the Bidens a crime family is quite moderate, in the circs. The only reason they aren't all potentially facing time is because - why? - oh yeah, Biden gave them all yet more of his "pre-emptive pardons"
    When did you first have your brain washed by the MAGA nutters, or was it completely voluntary? MAGA became obsessed by Hunter because it was a useful distraction against the reality that they, MAGA, have a criminal leader. No doubt you will soon be suggesting that Russia didn't invade Ukraine or any other factually incorrect nonsense spouted by the intellectual pigmies that now run the US.
    Are you

    1. Denying that Joe Biden was obviously gaga and the family (and inner Democratic circle) kept it hidden for months if not years?

    Or


    2. Hunter Biden is a convicted criminal?

    I hope not, because both are provably and obviously true, so that would mean you are arguing with reality, and I would therefore stop reading your comments altogether, by adjudging you insane. I already SKIM. Consider this a last warning before I give you a yellow card, UPGRADEABLE TO RED
    Lol. You do realise that UPGRADEABLE TO RED is what most people on here did with your posts long ago you sad, miserable, swivel-eyed little twerp.

    I used to find you stupid but amusing, but sadly you have now lost the latter part as there is nothing amusing about anyone who regurgitates MAGA hyperbole and propaganda. I had heard that to be a second-rate journo one needed to be uniquely naïve and gullible, and thought that unfair, but you do seem to be determined to prove it.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,572
    Dura_Ace said:

    IanB2 said:

    Leon said:

    I'm beginning to think Sanders is the only hope for America. If he can give tens of more speeches like this, he can mobilise millions. In fact, I see that duplicate version of this are already attracting millions on social media.

    Bernie is too mad to do that. The DNC needs to find a straight version of Pete Buttigieg. With a pretty wife and all American name. Pete is sensationally good. But he’s gat, and appalling as it is I think that’s enough to sink him as a post-Trump contender.

    Assuming there are any post-Trump contenders…
    Buttgieg was also mediocre in office and was one of the liars who said that Biden was good for another four years.

    The Dems need a clean break from those involved in the administration of the Biden crime family.
    "Biden crime family"?

    Can I help you out of that deep rabbit hole?
    The levels of cognitive dissonance are astonishing. Let’s assume that Hunter Biden is a bad’un. May be true. But his crimes are rather pale in comparison to Trump’s own ongoing criminality.

    What kind of person do you have to be to ignore that gargantuan plank sticking out of your eye because you are performatively excited by the splinter in someone else’s eye?
    The entire Biden family conspired to disguise the fact that Joe Biden is fucking demented, has been for years, and was unfit to run in 2024. They committed an immense fraud on the American people, on American democracy, and one of the reasons they did it was so that their convicted criminal son, Hunter - still facing some spectacular allegations on top of his confessed crimes - could escape any jail time. Via a presidential pardon

    And by doing this the Biden family assured that Trump would get elected. They enabled Trump

    So, yeah, calling the Bidens a crime family is quite moderate, in the circs. The only reason they aren't all potentially facing time is because - why? - oh yeah, Biden gave them all yet more of his "pre-emptive pardons"
    When did you first have your brain washed by the MAGA nutters, or was it completely voluntary? MAGA became obsessed by Hunter because it was a useful distraction against the reality that they, MAGA, have a criminal leader. No doubt you will soon be suggesting that Russia didn't invade Ukraine or any other factually incorrect nonsense spouted by the intellectual pigmies that now run the US.
    Although it could just be a controversial narrative designed to trigger posters Leon likes to trigger. He's triggered this poster. Life is too short to engage with such bollocks.
    Our credulous cretin is back. Sadly for us.
    It's like when Beca comes back to the Barden Belles in Pitch Perfect.

    🎶Don't you forget about me🎶
    80Fitz is phenomemal.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,333
    carnforth said:

    On Mark Carney's plate, aside from the Trump stuff:



    GDP per capita growth, selected countries.

    Hence he axed Trudeau's carbon tax on day 1, US growth has also been downgraded after Trump's tariffs

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c9wpq0g10xjo#:~:text=Growth in the US has,result of the trade tensions.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 58,986
    Stereodog said:

    Leon said:

    As Trump and MAGA become ever more demonstrably horrific, I’ve seen this trend for their supporters to shout ever louder about the (fictional) evils of the Democrats, the “Biden crime family”, the Clintons’ supposed evils, etc. It seems like a desperate attempt to avoid talking about the obvious problems today by repeating the greatest hits of disinformation past.

    You think Hunter Biden's CONFESSED crimes, Joe Biden swearng never to pardon him (then pardoning him), then the pardons given to the entire Biden family, then the pardon given to Antony "lableak" Fauci, then the revelation that the Bidens and elite Democrats lied to the Americans for years about Biden's mental health (thereby paving the way for Trump) - you think those are all "fictional"?

    I mean, you are as deluded as a QANONer. I guess that shouldn't be a surprise from an obscure midbrow twat like you who still shouts "it came from the wet market!!!" like the last embarrassing drunk on the nightbus, but still, for the rest of PB which may not be as absurd as you, this stuff is worth pointing out

    Why? Because it is the context. It is one reason Trump is elected (despite being an oaf) and one reason opposition to him (and his many grievous ills) may be harder to organise. A lot of American voters (see the polls) think the Dems are easily as bad as the Republicans - even now - and with reason

    No doubt I will be banned again soon for daring to make these points. But then PB will be reduced to this echo chanber of bedwetters, moaning haplessly about The Donald, and with zero insight

    If one of your children had incurred the ire of an incoming President noted for their vengefulness would you do any differently? I don't think it was a principled thing to do but it's entirely understandable on a human level. Also what actual evidence do you have that Biden had dementia during his presidency?
    Hunter Biden was tried, he CONFESSED and was then convicted during the Biden presidency. Biden and multiple Democrats then loudly shouted how they would never pardon him, that's not the Democrat way, we follow the rule of law, etc. Then Biden realised that Hunter Biden was up for sentencing, was very likely to go to jail (because that's what courts do to criminals) and Joe might not be around in the White House to give Hunter a last minute pardon. So Gaga Joe pardoned him anyway. Proving that Biden's entire shtick about "following the law" was a lie. It was very little to do with Trump, it was Biden pardoning his son just, you know, because

    Thereby demolishing any claims Dems have to the moral high ground in following "the rule of law"

    PB finds it increasingly difficult to deal with uncomfortable facts. It is sad to see

  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 4,858
    MattW said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    'Generation Z are giving up on work, a new study suggests, with almost four in 10 considering leaving their job and ending up on benefits.

    PwC warned that a generation of workers were now in danger of permanently drifting out of the jobs market, and identified mental health conditions as a “major driver” of youth worklessness.

    It said economic inactivity, where people are neither in work nor looking for a job, was on course to rise further, with 4.4m workers – one in 10 of the overall workforce – now “on the brink of leaving the labour market”.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2025/03/17/gen-z-risk-benefit-crisis-four-in-10-consider-give-up-work/

    Perhaps it is time to look at the question in a different way?
    Why is paid employment in the UK so uniquely unpopular, unfulfilling and unattractive?
    See all those seeking to retire very early indeed.
    Some of that is the pernicious "retirement industry" that wants people to believe that once they reach a point in their life they are on permanent holiday, when the reality is often anything but. People of all ages should be encouraged to find work that is productive and fulfilling, and , where they desire it, flexible to enable them to maybe spend more time with family or travelling. Encouraging fit and able people to do nothing is totally dumb.
    Agreed. I worked on beyond pension age because I enjoyed my work, had decent bosses, good clients and was able to work flexibly. If I had been in a poorly paid shit job, with bullying bosses and working long hours for a grasping company, I would have thought differently. If we want people to work longer, we need to ensure that they are treated fairly and flexibly.
    I've just "retired", mid 50s, because I was in a shit job for a large corporation albeit reasonably paid.

    I will now be spending more time doing interesting stuff but it won't be a permanent "holiday" by any means. I don't think I could ever slob around.

    Perhaps the problem is that social media is selling 'lifestyles' a bit too much, either through people selling things, or just 'friends' pretending their life is better than it is. Expectations are too high.

    [This is where I turn in to an atheist Wee Free]
    Not in the Flatland.

    You become a Peculiar Person :smile: .

    Unless you are campaigning to abolish the charges for public loos.
    Lol.

    I think Peculiar Person is a given...
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 14,180
    Leon said:

    Stereodog said:

    Leon said:

    As Trump and MAGA become ever more demonstrably horrific, I’ve seen this trend for their supporters to shout ever louder about the (fictional) evils of the Democrats, the “Biden crime family”, the Clintons’ supposed evils, etc. It seems like a desperate attempt to avoid talking about the obvious problems today by repeating the greatest hits of disinformation past.

    You think Hunter Biden's CONFESSED crimes, Joe Biden swearng never to pardon him (then pardoning him), then the pardons given to the entire Biden family, then the pardon given to Antony "lableak" Fauci, then the revelation that the Bidens and elite Democrats lied to the Americans for years about Biden's mental health (thereby paving the way for Trump) - you think those are all "fictional"?

    I mean, you are as deluded as a QANONer. I guess that shouldn't be a surprise from an obscure midbrow twat like you who still shouts "it came from the wet market!!!" like the last embarrassing drunk on the nightbus, but still, for the rest of PB which may not be as absurd as you, this stuff is worth pointing out

    Why? Because it is the context. It is one reason Trump is elected (despite being an oaf) and one reason opposition to him (and his many grievous ills) may be harder to organise. A lot of American voters (see the polls) think the Dems are easily as bad as the Republicans - even now - and with reason

    No doubt I will be banned again soon for daring to make these points. But then PB will be reduced to this echo chanber of bedwetters, moaning haplessly about The Donald, and with zero insight

    If one of your children had incurred the ire of an incoming President noted for their vengefulness would you do any differently? I don't think it was a principled thing to do but it's entirely understandable on a human level. Also what actual evidence do you have that Biden had dementia during his presidency?
    Hunter Biden was tried, he CONFESSED and was then convicted during the Biden presidency. Biden and multiple Democrats then loudly shouted how they would never pardon him, that's not the Democrat way, we follow the rule of law, etc. Then Biden realised that Hunter Biden was up for sentencing, was very likely to go to jail (because that's what courts do to criminals) and Joe might not be around in the White House to give Hunter a last minute pardon. So Gaga Joe pardoned him anyway. Proving that Biden's entire shtick about "following the law" was a lie. It was very little to do with Trump, it was Biden pardoning his son just, you know, because

    Thereby demolishing any claims Dems have to the moral high ground in following "the rule of law"

    PB finds it increasingly difficult to deal with uncomfortable facts. It is sad to see

    Pull the throttles off the firewall, pa. You're going to give yourself a gripper.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,333
    edited March 17
    DavidL said:

    The problem of the Democrats is similar to Labour’s problems here. There is a growing disconnect between their middle class public sector supporters and the working classes they are supposed to represent. The obsessions of the middle classes are simply not shared by the working class and their worries, such as immigration and gang related violence, are thought both vulgar and racist.

    In the US those vulgar people are now MAGA supporters and here they are now Reform.

    How that coalition is rebuilt is an interesting question in both cases. The middle class consider themselves morally superior because they “care” but what they care about is of little to no interest to those they pretend to represent.

    It won't be, the white working class in most of the West is now solidly rightwing, fuelled by anti immigration, anti woke, anti net zero taxes and protectionism in particular.

    The left liberal core vote is the public sector and ethnic minorities and those living in inner cities (albeit Hispanics and non Muslim Asians in particular can vote conservative in significant numbers).

    The swing voters are now white suburban and commuter belt high earning graduates
  • LeonLeon Posts: 58,986

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    I'm beginning to think Sanders is the only hope for America. If he can give tens of more speeches like this, he can mobilise millions. In fact, I see that duplicate version of this are already attracting millions on social media.

    Bernie is too mad to do that. The DNC needs to find a straight version of Pete Buttigieg. With a pretty wife and all American name. Pete is sensationally good. But he’s gat, and appalling as it is I think that’s enough to sink him as a post-Trump contender.

    Assuming there are any post-Trump contenders…
    Buttgieg was also mediocre in office and was one of the liars who said that Biden was good for another four years.

    The Dems need a clean break from those involved in the administration of the Biden crime family.
    "Biden crime family"?

    Can I help you out of that deep rabbit hole?
    The levels of cognitive dissonance are astonishing. Let’s assume that Hunter Biden is a bad’un. May be true. But his crimes are rather pale in comparison to Trump’s own ongoing criminality.

    What kind of person do you have to be to ignore that gargantuan plank sticking out of your eye because you are performatively excited by the splinter in someone else’s eye?
    The entire Biden family conspired to disguise the fact that Joe Biden is fucking demented, has been for years, and was unfit to run in 2024. They committed an immense fraud on the American people, on American democracy, and one of the reasons they did it was so that their convicted criminal son, Hunter - still facing some spectacular allegations on top of his confessed crimes - could escape any jail time. Via a presidential pardon

    And by doing this the Biden family assured that Trump would get elected. They enabled Trump

    So, yeah, calling the Bidens a crime family is quite moderate, in the circs. The only reason they aren't all potentially facing time is because - why? - oh yeah, Biden gave them all yet more of his "pre-emptive pardons"
    When did you first have your brain washed by the MAGA nutters, or was it completely voluntary? MAGA became obsessed by Hunter because it was a useful distraction against the reality that they, MAGA, have a criminal leader. No doubt you will soon be suggesting that Russia didn't invade Ukraine or any other factually incorrect nonsense spouted by the intellectual pigmies that now run the US.
    Are you

    1. Denying that Joe Biden was obviously gaga and the family (and inner Democratic circle) kept it hidden for months if not years?

    Or


    2. Hunter Biden is a convicted criminal?

    I hope not, because both are provably and obviously true, so that would mean you are arguing with reality, and I would therefore stop reading your comments altogether, by adjudging you insane. I already SKIM. Consider this a last warning before I give you a yellow card, UPGRADEABLE TO RED
    Lol. You do realise that UPGRADEABLE TO RED is what most people on here did with your posts long ago you sad, miserable, swivel-eyed little twerp.

    I used to find you stupid but amusing, but sadly you have now lost the latter part as there is nothing amusing about anyone who regurgitates MAGA hyperbole and propaganda. I had heard that to be a second-rate journo one needed to be uniquely naïve and gullible, and thought that unfair, but you do seem to be determined to prove it.
    You should start a whole new PB where I'm not allowed, for all the people so triggered by my they are sent insane or need stents, or maybe those special DDLG nappy things

  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 9,794
    edited March 17
    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    'Generation Z are giving up on work, a new study suggests, with almost four in 10 considering leaving their job and ending up on benefits.

    PwC warned that a generation of workers were now in danger of permanently drifting out of the jobs market, and identified mental health conditions as a “major driver” of youth worklessness.

    It said economic inactivity, where people are neither in work nor looking for a job, was on course to rise further, with 4.4m workers – one in 10 of the overall workforce – now “on the brink of leaving the labour market”.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2025/03/17/gen-z-risk-benefit-crisis-four-in-10-consider-give-up-work/

    Perhaps it is time to look at the question in a different way?
    Why is paid employment in the UK so uniquely unpopular, unfulfilling and unattractive?
    The Telegraph is attempting to pin everything on young people, as ever. Youth unemployment in the UK is roughly the same as the OECD average, and the employment rate is higher. We're comparable with other rich countries.

    Our older age groups aren't bad either. Whatever you might think about the UK, economic activity isn't a particular issue.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 13,117
    carnforth said:

    On Mark Carney's plate, aside from the Trump stuff:



    GDP per capita growth, selected countries.

    I can speak a bit of French and that graph clearly shows croissant production by country. Now, Canada may be slipping behind in croissant production, but they do make more Timbits than any other country and that has to count for something.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 4,853
    Leon said:

    Stereodog said:

    Leon said:

    As Trump and MAGA become ever more demonstrably horrific, I’ve seen this trend for their supporters to shout ever louder about the (fictional) evils of the Democrats, the “Biden crime family”, the Clintons’ supposed evils, etc. It seems like a desperate attempt to avoid talking about the obvious problems today by repeating the greatest hits of disinformation past.

    You think Hunter Biden's CONFESSED crimes, Joe Biden swearng never to pardon him (then pardoning him), then the pardons given to the entire Biden family, then the pardon given to Antony "lableak" Fauci, then the revelation that the Bidens and elite Democrats lied to the Americans for years about Biden's mental health (thereby paving the way for Trump) - you think those are all "fictional"?

    I mean, you are as deluded as a QANONer. I guess that shouldn't be a surprise from an obscure midbrow twat like you who still shouts "it came from the wet market!!!" like the last embarrassing drunk on the nightbus, but still, for the rest of PB which may not be as absurd as you, this stuff is worth pointing out

    Why? Because it is the context. It is one reason Trump is elected (despite being an oaf) and one reason opposition to him (and his many grievous ills) may be harder to organise. A lot of American voters (see the polls) think the Dems are easily as bad as the Republicans - even now - and with reason

    No doubt I will be banned again soon for daring to make these points. But then PB will be reduced to this echo chanber of bedwetters, moaning haplessly about The Donald, and with zero insight

    If one of your children had incurred the ire of an incoming President noted for their vengefulness would you do any differently? I don't think it was a principled thing to do but it's entirely understandable on a human level. Also what actual evidence do you have that Biden had dementia during his presidency?
    Hunter Biden was tried, he CONFESSED and was then convicted during the Biden presidency. Biden and multiple Democrats then loudly shouted how they would never pardon him, that's not the Democrat way, we follow the rule of law, etc. Then Biden realised that Hunter Biden was up for sentencing, was very likely to go to jail (because that's what courts do to criminals) and Joe might not be around in the White House to give Hunter a last minute pardon. So Gaga Joe pardoned him anyway. Proving that Biden's entire shtick about "following the law" was a lie. It was very little to do with Trump, it was Biden pardoning his son just, you know, because

    Thereby demolishing any claims Dems have to the moral high ground in following "the rule of law"

    PB finds it increasingly difficult to deal with uncomfortable facts. It is sad to see

    This really is false equivalence on steroids ! Against the litany of law breaking by Trump and the cesspit that surrounds him .
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 23,801
    DavidL said:

    The problem of the Democrats is similar to Labour’s problems here. There is a growing disconnect between their middle class public sector supporters and the working classes they are supposed to represent. The obsessions of the middle classes are simply not shared by the working class and their worries, such as immigration and gang related violence, are thought both vulgar and racist.

    In the US those vulgar people are now MAGA supporters and here they are now Reform.

    How that coalition is rebuilt is an interesting question in both cases. The middle class consider themselves morally superior because they “care” but what they care about is of little to no interest to those they pretend to represent.

    Whilst true, I need to point out that, in terms of salary if nothing else, most people on PB are at least middle class, many are rich, and some are very rich

  • LeonLeon Posts: 58,986
    Dura_Ace said:

    Leon said:

    Stereodog said:

    Leon said:

    As Trump and MAGA become ever more demonstrably horrific, I’ve seen this trend for their supporters to shout ever louder about the (fictional) evils of the Democrats, the “Biden crime family”, the Clintons’ supposed evils, etc. It seems like a desperate attempt to avoid talking about the obvious problems today by repeating the greatest hits of disinformation past.

    You think Hunter Biden's CONFESSED crimes, Joe Biden swearng never to pardon him (then pardoning him), then the pardons given to the entire Biden family, then the pardon given to Antony "lableak" Fauci, then the revelation that the Bidens and elite Democrats lied to the Americans for years about Biden's mental health (thereby paving the way for Trump) - you think those are all "fictional"?

    I mean, you are as deluded as a QANONer. I guess that shouldn't be a surprise from an obscure midbrow twat like you who still shouts "it came from the wet market!!!" like the last embarrassing drunk on the nightbus, but still, for the rest of PB which may not be as absurd as you, this stuff is worth pointing out

    Why? Because it is the context. It is one reason Trump is elected (despite being an oaf) and one reason opposition to him (and his many grievous ills) may be harder to organise. A lot of American voters (see the polls) think the Dems are easily as bad as the Republicans - even now - and with reason

    No doubt I will be banned again soon for daring to make these points. But then PB will be reduced to this echo chanber of bedwetters, moaning haplessly about The Donald, and with zero insight

    If one of your children had incurred the ire of an incoming President noted for their vengefulness would you do any differently? I don't think it was a principled thing to do but it's entirely understandable on a human level. Also what actual evidence do you have that Biden had dementia during his presidency?
    Hunter Biden was tried, he CONFESSED and was then convicted during the Biden presidency. Biden and multiple Democrats then loudly shouted how they would never pardon him, that's not the Democrat way, we follow the rule of law, etc. Then Biden realised that Hunter Biden was up for sentencing, was very likely to go to jail (because that's what courts do to criminals) and Joe might not be around in the White House to give Hunter a last minute pardon. So Gaga Joe pardoned him anyway. Proving that Biden's entire shtick about "following the law" was a lie. It was very little to do with Trump, it was Biden pardoning his son just, you know, because

    Thereby demolishing any claims Dems have to the moral high ground in following "the rule of law"

    PB finds it increasingly difficult to deal with uncomfortable facts. It is sad to see

    Pull the throttles off the firewall, pa. You're going to give yourself a gripper.
    Mitte 5m Ramipril, per diem
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 83,019
    In the OECD's latest forecast:

    Canada's economy is predicted to grow by just 0.7% this year and in 2026, compared with the previous forecast of 2% for both years

    Mexico is now forecast to contract by 1.3% this year and shrink a further 0.6% next year, instead of growing by 1.2% and 1.6% as previously expected

    Growth in the US has also been downgraded, with growth of 2.2% expected this year and 1.6% in 2025, down from previous forecasts of 2.4% and 2.1%

    Despite the US imposing tariffs on China, the OECD has increased its growth forecast for the country slightly to 4.8%.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c9wpq0g10xjo
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,778
    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is the US law which Trump relied on for the deportations.
    The government argues, quite literally, that it cannot even be examined by the courts.

    Perviously it has been invoked three times in the last couple of centuries, each time when the US was actually at war.

    https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/50/21
    Whenever there is a declared war between the United States and any foreign nation or government, or any invasion or predatory incursion is perpetrated, attempted, or threatened against the territory of the United States by any foreign nation or government, and the President makes public proclamation of the event, all natives, citizens, denizens, or subjects of the hostile nation or government, being of the age of fourteen years and upward, who shall be within the United States and not actually naturalized, shall be liable to be apprehended, restrained, secured, and removed as alien enemies. The President is authorized in any such event, by his proclamation thereof, or other public act, to direct the conduct to be observed on the part of the United States, toward the aliens who become so liable; the manner and degree of the restraint to which they shall be subject and in what cases, and upon what security their residence shall be permitted, and to provide for the removal of those who, not being permitted to reside within the United States, refuse or neglect to depart therefrom; and to establish any other regulations which are found necessary in the premises and for the public safety.

    Errr…. I think I detect a problem.
    Go on.
    Well, the US is not at war with El Salvador so the conditions for the operation of the power simply don’t exist.

    Sorry, a bit obvious, but jeez.

    Well, yes.
    For a moment I thought you might be about to come up with some clever justification.

    It's about as naked a power grab as is possible to imagine. The implications run way beyond a few hundred deportees.

    Genuine Enabling Law stuff, if they get away with it.
    Come on , you should know me better than that!
  • Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 14,700
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    I'm beginning to think Sanders is the only hope for America. If he can give tens of more speeches like this, he can mobilise millions. In fact, I see that duplicate version of this are already attracting millions on social media.

    Bernie is too mad to do that. The DNC needs to find a straight version of Pete Buttigieg. With a pretty wife and all American name. Pete is sensationally good. But he’s gat, and appalling as it is I think that’s enough to sink him as a post-Trump contender.

    Assuming there are any post-Trump contenders…
    Buttgieg was also mediocre in office and was one of the liars who said that Biden was good for another four years.

    The Dems need a clean break from those involved in the administration of the Biden crime family.
    "Biden crime family"?

    Can I help you out of that deep rabbit hole?
    The levels of cognitive dissonance are astonishing. Let’s assume that Hunter Biden is a bad’un. May be true. But his crimes are rather pale in comparison to Trump’s own ongoing criminality.

    What kind of person do you have to be to ignore that gargantuan plank sticking out of your eye because you are performatively excited by the splinter in someone else’s eye?
    The entire Biden family conspired to disguise the fact that Joe Biden is fucking demented, has been for years, and was unfit to run in 2024. They committed an immense fraud on the American people, on American democracy, and one of the reasons they did it was so that their convicted criminal son, Hunter - still facing some spectacular allegations on top of his confessed crimes - could escape any jail time. Via a presidential pardon

    And by doing this the Biden family assured that Trump would get elected. They enabled Trump

    So, yeah, calling the Bidens a crime family is quite moderate, in the circs. The only reason they aren't all potentially facing time is because - why? - oh yeah, Biden gave them all yet more of his "pre-emptive pardons"
    When did you first have your brain washed by the MAGA nutters, or was it completely voluntary? MAGA became obsessed by Hunter because it was a useful distraction against the reality that they, MAGA, have a criminal leader. No doubt you will soon be suggesting that Russia didn't invade Ukraine or any other factually incorrect nonsense spouted by the intellectual pigmies that now run the US.
    Are you

    1. Denying that Joe Biden was obviously gaga and the family (and inner Democratic circle) kept it hidden for months if not years?

    Or


    2. Hunter Biden is a convicted criminal?

    I hope not, because both are provably and obviously true, so that would mean you are arguing with reality, and I would therefore stop reading your comments altogether, by adjudging you insane. I already SKIM. Consider this a last warning before I give you a yellow card, UPGRADEABLE TO RED
    Lol. You do realise that UPGRADEABLE TO RED is what most people on here did with your posts long ago you sad, miserable, swivel-eyed little twerp.

    I used to find you stupid but amusing, but sadly you have now lost the latter part as there is nothing amusing about anyone who regurgitates MAGA hyperbole and propaganda. I had heard that to be a second-rate journo one needed to be uniquely naïve and gullible, and thought that unfair, but you do seem to be determined to prove it.
    You should start a whole new PB where I'm not allowed, for all the people so triggered by my they are sent insane or need stents, or maybe those special DDLG nappy things

    I'm not that bothered either way as I am not on here that often enough to care. I think anyone that gets triggered by you needs to understand that someone who is so insecure that they need to spend a large part of their life boasting about their pointless travels to people they don't know or espousing points of view that are based on total ignorance and bombast isn't really worth getting triggered over.

    How exciting is your most recent trip by the way? Oh, is that the time, so sorry you are boring me already.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,208
    carnforth said:

    On Mark Carney's plate, aside from the Trump stuff:



    GDP per capita growth, selected countries.

    It’s a real mystery:

    image
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 13,117
    HYUFD said:

    DavidL said:

    The problem of the Democrats is similar to Labour’s problems here. There is a growing disconnect between their middle class public sector supporters and the working classes they are supposed to represent. The obsessions of the middle classes are simply not shared by the working class and their worries, such as immigration and gang related violence, are thought both vulgar and racist.

    In the US those vulgar people are now MAGA supporters and here they are now Reform.

    How that coalition is rebuilt is an interesting question in both cases. The middle class consider themselves morally superior because they “care” but what they care about is of little to no interest to those they pretend to represent.

    It won't be, the white working class in most of the West is now solidly rightwing, fuelled by anti immigration, anti woke, anti net zero taxes and protectionism in particular.

    The left liberal core vote is the public sector and ethnic minorities and those living in inner cities (albeit Hispanics and non Muslim Asians in particular can vote conservative in significant numbers).

    The swing voters are now white suburban and commuter belt high earning graduates
    At last year’s general election, Labour got the highest vote share in every class category, every income category, and in every housing category except “own outright” (won by Reform). See details at https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/49978-how-britain-voted-in-the-2024-general-election
  • LeonLeon Posts: 58,986
    edited March 17

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    I'm beginning to think Sanders is the only hope for America. If he can give tens of more speeches like this, he can mobilise millions. In fact, I see that duplicate version of this are already attracting millions on social media.

    Bernie is too mad to do that. The DNC needs to find a straight version of Pete Buttigieg. With a pretty wife and all American name. Pete is sensationally good. But he’s gat, and appalling as it is I think that’s enough to sink him as a post-Trump contender.

    Assuming there are any post-Trump contenders…
    Buttgieg was also mediocre in office and was one of the liars who said that Biden was good for another four years.

    The Dems need a clean break from those involved in the administration of the Biden crime family.
    "Biden crime family"?

    Can I help you out of that deep rabbit hole?
    The levels of cognitive dissonance are astonishing. Let’s assume that Hunter Biden is a bad’un. May be true. But his crimes are rather pale in comparison to Trump’s own ongoing criminality.

    What kind of person do you have to be to ignore that gargantuan plank sticking out of your eye because you are performatively excited by the splinter in someone else’s eye?
    The entire Biden family conspired to disguise the fact that Joe Biden is fucking demented, has been for years, and was unfit to run in 2024. They committed an immense fraud on the American people, on American democracy, and one of the reasons they did it was so that their convicted criminal son, Hunter - still facing some spectacular allegations on top of his confessed crimes - could escape any jail time. Via a presidential pardon

    And by doing this the Biden family assured that Trump would get elected. They enabled Trump

    So, yeah, calling the Bidens a crime family is quite moderate, in the circs. The only reason they aren't all potentially facing time is because - why? - oh yeah, Biden gave them all yet more of his "pre-emptive pardons"
    When did you first have your brain washed by the MAGA nutters, or was it completely voluntary? MAGA became obsessed by Hunter because it was a useful distraction against the reality that they, MAGA, have a criminal leader. No doubt you will soon be suggesting that Russia didn't invade Ukraine or any other factually incorrect nonsense spouted by the intellectual pigmies that now run the US.
    Are you

    1. Denying that Joe Biden was obviously gaga and the family (and inner Democratic circle) kept it hidden for months if not years?

    Or


    2. Hunter Biden is a convicted criminal?

    I hope not, because both are provably and obviously true, so that would mean you are arguing with reality, and I would therefore stop reading your comments altogether, by adjudging you insane. I already SKIM. Consider this a last warning before I give you a yellow card, UPGRADEABLE TO RED
    Lol. You do realise that UPGRADEABLE TO RED is what most people on here did with your posts long ago you sad, miserable, swivel-eyed little twerp.

    I used to find you stupid but amusing, but sadly you have now lost the latter part as there is nothing amusing about anyone who regurgitates MAGA hyperbole and propaganda. I had heard that to be a second-rate journo one needed to be uniquely naïve and gullible, and thought that unfair, but you do seem to be determined to prove it.
    You should start a whole new PB where I'm not allowed, for all the people so triggered by my they are sent insane or need stents, or maybe those special DDLG nappy things

    I'm not that bothered either way as I am not on here that often enough to care. I think anyone that gets triggered by you needs to understand that someone who is so insecure that they need to spend a large part of their life boasting about their pointless travels to people they don't know or espousing points of view that are based on total ignorance and bombast isn't really worth getting triggered over.

    How exciting is your most recent trip by the way? Oh, is that the time, so sorry you are boring me already.
    It's amazing how many people on here who claim to be "not that bothered" by me, or "don't care either way" or feel I'm "not worth getting triggered over" or actually "just ignore" all my posts - then have total meltdowns every five and a half minutes when I am around, and sometimes urgently need a urine gourd from the nurse due to anger management stuff

    It's also, if I may so, quite gratifying (for me). So, thanks
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 23,801
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    I'm beginning to think Sanders is the only hope for America. If he can give tens of more speeches like this, he can mobilise millions. In fact, I see that duplicate version of this are already attracting millions on social media.

    Bernie is too mad to do that. The DNC needs to find a straight version of Pete Buttigieg. With a pretty wife and all American name. Pete is sensationally good. But he’s gat, and appalling as it is I think that’s enough to sink him as a post-Trump contender.

    Assuming there are any post-Trump contenders…
    Buttgieg was also mediocre in office and was one of the liars who said that Biden was good for another four years.

    The Dems need a clean break from those involved in the administration of the Biden crime family.
    "Biden crime family"?

    Can I help you out of that deep rabbit hole?
    The levels of cognitive dissonance are astonishing. Let’s assume that Hunter Biden is a bad’un. May be true. But his crimes are rather pale in comparison to Trump’s own ongoing criminality.

    What kind of person do you have to be to ignore that gargantuan plank sticking out of your eye because you are performatively excited by the splinter in someone else’s eye?
    The entire Biden family conspired to disguise the fact that Joe Biden is fucking demented, has been for years, and was unfit to run in 2024. They committed an immense fraud on the American people, on American democracy, and one of the reasons they did it was so that their convicted criminal son, Hunter - still facing some spectacular allegations on top of his confessed crimes - could escape any jail time. Via a presidential pardon

    And by doing this the Biden family assured that Trump would get elected. They enabled Trump

    So, yeah, calling the Bidens a crime family is quite moderate, in the circs. The only reason they aren't all potentially facing time is because - why? - oh yeah, Biden gave them all yet more of his "pre-emptive pardons"
    When did you first have your brain washed by the MAGA nutters, or was it completely voluntary? MAGA became obsessed by Hunter because it was a useful distraction against the reality that they, MAGA, have a criminal leader. No doubt you will soon be suggesting that Russia didn't invade Ukraine or any other factually incorrect nonsense spouted by the intellectual pigmies that now run the US.
    Are you

    1. Denying that Joe Biden was obviously gaga and the family (and inner Democratic circle) kept it hidden for months if not years?

    Or


    2. Hunter Biden is a convicted criminal?

    I hope not, because both are provably and obviously true, so that would mean you are arguing with reality, and I would therefore stop reading your comments altogether, by adjudging you insane. I already SKIM. Consider this a last warning before I give you a yellow card, UPGRADEABLE TO RED
    Lol. You do realise that UPGRADEABLE TO RED is what most people on here did with your posts long ago you sad, miserable, swivel-eyed little twerp.

    I used to find you stupid but amusing, but sadly you have now lost the latter part as there is nothing amusing about anyone who regurgitates MAGA hyperbole and propaganda. I had heard that to be a second-rate journo one needed to be uniquely naïve and gullible, and thought that unfair, but you do seem to be determined to prove it.
    You should start a whole new PB where I'm not allowed, for all the people so triggered by my they are sent insane or need stents, or maybe those special DDLG nappy things

    I initially thought that was a reference to the USS Zumwalt (DDG-1000).
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 58,850

    carnforth said:

    On Mark Carney's plate, aside from the Trump stuff:



    GDP per capita growth, selected countries.

    It’s a real mystery:

    image
    Not enough illegal immigrants relative to legal ones, you think?

  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 53,531
    edited March 17
    viewcode said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    I'm beginning to think Sanders is the only hope for America. If he can give tens of more speeches like this, he can mobilise millions. In fact, I see that duplicate version of this are already attracting millions on social media.

    Bernie is too mad to do that. The DNC needs to find a straight version of Pete Buttigieg. With a pretty wife and all American name. Pete is sensationally good. But he’s gat, and appalling as it is I think that’s enough to sink him as a post-Trump contender.

    Assuming there are any post-Trump contenders…
    Buttgieg was also mediocre in office and was one of the liars who said that Biden was good for another four years.

    The Dems need a clean break from those involved in the administration of the Biden crime family.
    "Biden crime family"?

    Can I help you out of that deep rabbit hole?
    The levels of cognitive dissonance are astonishing. Let’s assume that Hunter Biden is a bad’un. May be true. But his crimes are rather pale in comparison to Trump’s own ongoing criminality.

    What kind of person do you have to be to ignore that gargantuan plank sticking out of your eye because you are performatively excited by the splinter in someone else’s eye?
    The entire Biden family conspired to disguise the fact that Joe Biden is fucking demented, has been for years, and was unfit to run in 2024. They committed an immense fraud on the American people, on American democracy, and one of the reasons they did it was so that their convicted criminal son, Hunter - still facing some spectacular allegations on top of his confessed crimes - could escape any jail time. Via a presidential pardon

    And by doing this the Biden family assured that Trump would get elected. They enabled Trump

    So, yeah, calling the Bidens a crime family is quite moderate, in the circs. The only reason they aren't all potentially facing time is because - why? - oh yeah, Biden gave them all yet more of his "pre-emptive pardons"
    When did you first have your brain washed by the MAGA nutters, or was it completely voluntary? MAGA became obsessed by Hunter because it was a useful distraction against the reality that they, MAGA, have a criminal leader. No doubt you will soon be suggesting that Russia didn't invade Ukraine or any other factually incorrect nonsense spouted by the intellectual pigmies that now run the US.
    Are you

    1. Denying that Joe Biden was obviously gaga and the family (and inner Democratic circle) kept it hidden for months if not years?

    Or


    2. Hunter Biden is a convicted criminal?

    I hope not, because both are provably and obviously true, so that would mean you are arguing with reality, and I would therefore stop reading your comments altogether, by adjudging you insane. I already SKIM. Consider this a last warning before I give you a yellow card, UPGRADEABLE TO RED
    Lol. You do realise that UPGRADEABLE TO RED is what most people on here did with your posts long ago you sad, miserable, swivel-eyed little twerp.

    I used to find you stupid but amusing, but sadly you have now lost the latter part as there is nothing amusing about anyone who regurgitates MAGA hyperbole and propaganda. I had heard that to be a second-rate journo one needed to be uniquely naïve and gullible, and thought that unfair, but you do seem to be determined to prove it.
    You should start a whole new PB where I'm not allowed, for all the people so triggered by my they are sent insane or need stents, or maybe those special DDLG nappy things

    I initially thought that was a reference to the USS Zumwalt (DDG-1000).
    That triggers quite a few naval architects.

    The arguments about tumblehome and stability were getting to the Dreyfus level at one point in the late 19th Cent.

    image

  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 16,276

    HYUFD said:

    DavidL said:

    The problem of the Democrats is similar to Labour’s problems here. There is a growing disconnect between their middle class public sector supporters and the working classes they are supposed to represent. The obsessions of the middle classes are simply not shared by the working class and their worries, such as immigration and gang related violence, are thought both vulgar and racist.

    In the US those vulgar people are now MAGA supporters and here they are now Reform.

    How that coalition is rebuilt is an interesting question in both cases. The middle class consider themselves morally superior because they “care” but what they care about is of little to no interest to those they pretend to represent.

    It won't be, the white working class in most of the West is now solidly rightwing, fuelled by anti immigration, anti woke, anti net zero taxes and protectionism in particular.

    The left liberal core vote is the public sector and ethnic minorities and those living in inner cities (albeit Hispanics and non Muslim Asians in particular can vote conservative in significant numbers).

    The swing voters are now white suburban and commuter belt high earning graduates
    I feel I need to push back a little against this assertion that the white working class are a monolithic, “anti-woke”, anti-immigrant, Farage-loving bloc a little.

    I think it is fairer to say that a lot of people in that category feel increasingly let down by the mainstream and are increasingly distrustful of the ‘establishment’. That does not in and of itself always manifest in right wing protest politics. It can do, and for some increasingly does, but it is not universal.
    Yes there is a hell of a lot of generalization going on - people tend to look monolithic to people who don't know them very well, but in reality people are complex and don't fit into neat buckets or caricatures.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 83,019
    Statue of peace campaigner Brian Haw unveiled
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/ckgdr7ln0pdo

    Another example that sculpting humans seems to be dying art form....
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 9,375
    dixiedean said:

    Scott_xP said:

    If the US is to survive Trusk, a necessary (but not sufficient) condition would be a free press that actually reported the facts

    @ashtonlattimore.bsky.social‬

    I've been waiting all day for a single headline that states "Trump administration deports 300 in violation of court order" - the actual, undisputed facts of the situation. Instead, mainstream outlets have been twisting themselves in knots to avoid just SAYING WHAT HAPPENED.


    The oligarchs that are desperate to stay on the good side of Trusk to avoid their own 'deportations' are unwilling to do so on the platforms they own...

    Silly nicknames like “Trusk” make you look silly and thereby weakens your argument. It also implicitly diminishes Trump’s responsibility for what is happening on his watch
    Mump is better anyways.
    It's onomatopoeic.
    Pity America wasn’t vaccinated against them

  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 83,019
    edited March 17
    Three German citizens have recently been denied entry to the United States and placed in detention, leading Berlin to question if there has been a possible “change in American immigration policy,” AFP reported.

    Tourists from several western countries have reportedly been detained by US immigration authorities in the past few weeks

    Two of the cases had been resolved, Fischer said, but Germany remained “in contact with the local authorities” regarding the third case.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2025/mar/17/russia-us-ukraine-donald-trump-vladimir-putin-volodymyr-zelenskyy-ceasefire-peace-talks-europe-latest-live-news

    This follows on from what I said earlier. 3 in several weeks. I can completely imagine the going rate of 1 a week is quite normal for people having complications / irregular paperwork from a large country (in fact I would have thought it would be higher) leading to them being temporarily detained.

    Mrs U once got detained for an afternoon after somebody with the same name and month / year of birth had previously been deported and her regular travel to and via the US was brought up by immigration as suss.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 75,312
    LOL
    Looks more like Farage.

    Golden Mount Rushmore monument with Trump’s likeness unveiled at Mar-a-Lago.
    https://x.com/PolymarketIntel/status/1901584599764947421

    Either way, he's a steaming loon.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 83,019
    edited March 17
    Nigelb said:

    LOL
    Looks more like Farage.

    Golden Mount Rushmore monument with Trump’s likeness unveiled at Mar-a-Lago.
    https://x.com/PolymarketIntel/status/1901584599764947421

    Either way, he's a steaming loon.

    Yet another example to add to my thesis that sculpting is dying art form.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,978
    Re Andrew Brigden... I wouldn't apologise to him even if I was in the wrong.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,208
    rcs1000 said:

    carnforth said:

    On Mark Carney's plate, aside from the Trump stuff:



    GDP per capita growth, selected countries.

    It’s a real mystery:

    image
    Not enough illegal immigrants relative to legal ones, you think?

    Absolutely. Legal immigration is worse than illegal immigration because it comes with access to entitlements. Even the British “no recourse to public funds” doesn’t exclude all benefits.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 14,180

    Nigelb said:

    LOL
    Looks more like Farage.

    Golden Mount Rushmore monument with Trump’s likeness unveiled at Mar-a-Lago.
    https://x.com/PolymarketIntel/status/1901584599764947421

    Either way, he's a steaming loon.

    Yet another example to add to my thesis that sculpting is dying art form.
    Bobby Fingers is really good at it.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 64,721
    "there is increasing evidence in public opinion data that Americans are growing impatient to get the primary thing they feel they were promised: a more stable economy where the cost of living is more affordable."

    "the No. 1 issue in America remains the No. 1 issue, and there are real political risks to a strategy that asks voters to grin and bear it in the checkout line today for a promise of something better tomorrow."

    https://www.nytimes.com/2025/03/17/opinion/trump-economy-polling.html
  • kjhkjh Posts: 12,323
    edited March 17

    carnforth said:

    On Mark Carney's plate, aside from the Trump stuff:



    GDP per capita growth, selected countries.

    It’s a real mystery:

    image
    Is that really an OECD graph or one created from OECD data because the y axis is (I assume GDP per person) but there isn't anything shown for population on the y axis and population hasn't increased 7 fold since 2018 as that graph implies. Presumably the x axis is crossing the y axis regarding population at something like 50 million and then there are huge distances on the y axis for subsequent million people giving a very distorted picture of the increase in population.

    I'm a LD and even I would be embarrassed by that graph.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 9,794

    HYUFD said:

    DavidL said:

    The problem of the Democrats is similar to Labour’s problems here. There is a growing disconnect between their middle class public sector supporters and the working classes they are supposed to represent. The obsessions of the middle classes are simply not shared by the working class and their worries, such as immigration and gang related violence, are thought both vulgar and racist.

    In the US those vulgar people are now MAGA supporters and here they are now Reform.

    How that coalition is rebuilt is an interesting question in both cases. The middle class consider themselves morally superior because they “care” but what they care about is of little to no interest to those they pretend to represent.

    It won't be, the white working class in most of the West is now solidly rightwing, fuelled by anti immigration, anti woke, anti net zero taxes and protectionism in particular.

    The left liberal core vote is the public sector and ethnic minorities and those living in inner cities (albeit Hispanics and non Muslim Asians in particular can vote conservative in significant numbers).

    The swing voters are now white suburban and commuter belt high earning graduates
    I feel I need to push back a little against this assertion that the white working class are a monolithic, “anti-woke”, anti-immigrant, Farage-loving bloc a little.

    I think it is fairer to say that a lot of people in that category feel increasingly let down by the mainstream and are increasingly distrustful of the ‘establishment’. That does not in and of itself always manifest in right wing protest politics. It can do, and for some increasingly does, but it is not universal.
    And if we were were to take "working" class literally, Reform's best cohorts are the unemployed and retired.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 23,801
    edited March 17
    Gary's Economics on the steaming pile we are in and how to get out.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAb_p5DCC3E (45 mins)
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 58,850
    kjh said:

    carnforth said:

    On Mark Carney's plate, aside from the Trump stuff:



    GDP per capita growth, selected countries.

    It’s a real mystery:

    image
    Is that really an OECD graph or one created from OECD data because the y axis is (I assume GDP per person) but there isn't anything shown for population on the y axis and population hasn't increased 7 fold since 2018 as that graph implies. Presumably the x axis is crossing the y axis regarding population at something like 50 million and then there are huge distances on the y axis for subsequent million people giving a very distorted picture.

    I'm a LD and even I would be embarrassed by that graph.
    I think it's indexed at 2020 = 100.

  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,151

    "there is increasing evidence in public opinion data that Americans are growing impatient to get the primary thing they feel they were promised: a more stable economy where the cost of living is more affordable."

    "the No. 1 issue in America remains the No. 1 issue, and there are real political risks to a strategy that asks voters to grin and bear it in the checkout line today for a promise of something better tomorrow."

    https://www.nytimes.com/2025/03/17/opinion/trump-economy-polling.html

    There are no political risks in a oligarchical monarchy
  • kjhkjh Posts: 12,323
    edited March 17
    rcs1000 said:

    kjh said:

    carnforth said:

    On Mark Carney's plate, aside from the Trump stuff:



    GDP per capita growth, selected countries.

    It’s a real mystery:

    image
    Is that really an OECD graph or one created from OECD data because the y axis is (I assume GDP per person) but there isn't anything shown for population on the y axis and population hasn't increased 7 fold since 2018 as that graph implies. Presumably the x axis is crossing the y axis regarding population at something like 50 million and then there are huge distances on the y axis for subsequent million people giving a very distorted picture.

    I'm a LD and even I would be embarrassed by that graph.
    I think it's indexed at 2020 = 100.

    Yep got it. Post withdrawn. Do hate it when I'm wrong. Both GDP and population percentages on y axis using start of 2020 as base. Saw it for GDP, but not for population. Idiot.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,852
    DavidL said:

    The problem of the Democrats is similar to Labour’s problems here. There is a growing disconnect between their middle class public sector supporters and the working classes they are supposed to represent. The obsessions of the middle classes are simply not shared by the working class and their worries, such as immigration and gang related violence, are thought both vulgar and racist.

    In the US those vulgar people are now MAGA supporters and here they are now Reform.

    How that coalition is rebuilt is an interesting question in both cases. The middle class consider themselves morally superior because they “care” but what they care about is of little to no interest to those they pretend to represent.

    Yes, but there’s a similar disconnect between the Tories and the middle classes they are ‘supposed’ to represent.

    Such that talking about British politics in terms of class is pretty much redundant in its utility.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,208
    JD Vance has seen the Canada graph:

    https://x.com/jdvance/status/1901631931298525519

    Western societies keep running the experiment of importing millions of low wage immigrants and expecting it to boost per capita productivity or GDP. And they keep failing.

    It's time to follow a different path:
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,852
    The days when a LIbDem canvasser could tell Labour and Tory voters apart by making superficial judgements about their lifestyle are long gone.

    As a young student, I always remember canvassing this tumbledown house during the Bermondsey by-election, as this guy in stained trousers and a string vest staggered towards answering the door, clearly already under the influence by late morning. My pen was already hovering over the Labour box on my canvass card when, to my amazement, he told me he was voting Tory.

    If only I had realised that, far from being a random aberration, thay guy was a straw in the wind as to political changes incoming….

    And to think that I met one of Leon’s relatives, way back then.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,151
    The King will meet the new Canadian PM later today
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,333
    IanB2 said:

    The days when a LIbDem canvasser could tell Labour and Tory voters apart by making superficial judgements about their lifestyle are long gone.

    As a young student, I always remember canvassing this tumbledown house during the Bermondsey by-election, as this guy in stained trousers and a string vest staggered towards answering the door, clearly already under the influence by late morning. My pen was already hovering over the Labour box on my canvass card when, to my amazement, he told me he was voting Tory.

    If only I had realised that, far from being a random aberration, thay guy was a straw in the wind as to political changes incoming….

    And to think that I met one of Leon’s relatives, way back then.

    You can tell more by their age between Labour and Tory, the class divide is now more between LD and Reform voters
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,333
    Eabhal said:

    HYUFD said:

    DavidL said:

    The problem of the Democrats is similar to Labour’s problems here. There is a growing disconnect between their middle class public sector supporters and the working classes they are supposed to represent. The obsessions of the middle classes are simply not shared by the working class and their worries, such as immigration and gang related violence, are thought both vulgar and racist.

    In the US those vulgar people are now MAGA supporters and here they are now Reform.

    How that coalition is rebuilt is an interesting question in both cases. The middle class consider themselves morally superior because they “care” but what they care about is of little to no interest to those they pretend to represent.

    It won't be, the white working class in most of the West is now solidly rightwing, fuelled by anti immigration, anti woke, anti net zero taxes and protectionism in particular.

    The left liberal core vote is the public sector and ethnic minorities and those living in inner cities (albeit Hispanics and non Muslim Asians in particular can vote conservative in significant numbers).

    The swing voters are now white suburban and commuter belt high earning graduates
    I feel I need to push back a little against this assertion that the white working class are a monolithic, “anti-woke”, anti-immigrant, Farage-loving bloc a little.

    I think it is fairer to say that a lot of people in that category feel increasingly let down by the mainstream and are increasingly distrustful of the ‘establishment’. That does not in and of itself always manifest in right wing protest politics. It can do, and for some increasingly does, but it is not universal.
    And if we were were to take "working" class literally, Reform's best cohorts are the unemployed and retired.
    No, Reform did better with 50-59 year olds than the retired at the GE and better with C2 skilled working class voters than unemployed and unskilled DEs

    https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/49978-how-britain-voted-in-the-2024-general-election
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,333
    edited March 17

    HYUFD said:

    DavidL said:

    The problem of the Democrats is similar to Labour’s problems here. There is a growing disconnect between their middle class public sector supporters and the working classes they are supposed to represent. The obsessions of the middle classes are simply not shared by the working class and their worries, such as immigration and gang related violence, are thought both vulgar and racist.

    In the US those vulgar people are now MAGA supporters and here they are now Reform.

    How that coalition is rebuilt is an interesting question in both cases. The middle class consider themselves morally superior because they “care” but what they care about is of little to no interest to those they pretend to represent.

    It won't be, the white working class in most of the West is now solidly rightwing, fuelled by anti immigration, anti woke, anti net zero taxes and protectionism in particular.

    The left liberal core vote is the public sector and ethnic minorities and those living in inner cities (albeit Hispanics and non Muslim Asians in particular can vote conservative in significant numbers).

    The swing voters are now white suburban and commuter belt high earning graduates
    At last year’s general election, Labour got the highest vote share in every class category, every income category, and in every housing category except “own outright” (won by Reform). See details at https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/49978-how-britain-voted-in-the-2024-general-election
    On that chart Labour did tied best with middle class ABs and C1s and worst with skilled working class C2s and the LDs did best in terms of their percentage of vote with the highest earners over £70k a year. The combined right vote of Tories and Reform did best with C2s and worst with lower middle class C1s (albeit the Sunak Tories did best with ABs).

    So thanks for proving my point, though the Tories won 'own outright' not Reform

    https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/49978-how-britain-voted-in-the-2024-general-election
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,208
    Stat of the day. Reform have the highest vote ceiling.

    https://x.com/leftiestats/status/1901612376064987338

    % of voters who would consider voting for...

    🟣 Ref ~ 36% (+6)
    🔴 Lab ~ 31% (-16)
    🔵 Con ~ 30% (-)
    🟠 LD ~ 29% (-1)
    🟢 Grn ~ 26% (-3)

    Via @IpsosUK, 7-11 Feb 2025 (+/- vs July 2024)
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,333

    Stat of the day. Reform have the highest vote ceiling.

    https://x.com/leftiestats/status/1901612376064987338

    % of voters who would consider voting for...

    🟣 Ref ~ 36% (+6)
    🔴 Lab ~ 31% (-16)
    🔵 Con ~ 30% (-)
    🟠 LD ~ 29% (-1)
    🟢 Grn ~ 26% (-3)

    Via @IpsosUK, 7-11 Feb 2025 (+/- vs July 2024)

    Though before Labour had 47% so really a reflection of how unpopular this Labour government now is
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 9,153

    Statue of peace campaigner Brian Haw unveiled
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/ckgdr7ln0pdo

    Another example that sculpting humans seems to be dying art form....

    He was very small, wasn't he? :wink:
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,151
    Here is a picture to brighten everyone's day

    https://bsky.app/profile/followtheh.bsky.social/post/3lklbdnx6lc2h
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,151
    @thetimes

    Mark Carney, the prime minister of Canada, has invited President Zelensky to the G7 summit in June. The event will be held in the Canadian province of Alberta
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 18,369

    Statue of peace campaigner Brian Haw unveiled
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/ckgdr7ln0pdo

    Another example that sculpting humans seems to be dying art form....

    Opened up the story and thought - wow, thats an amazing likeness, before realising it was a photo of him, not the statue...
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 9,153
    kjh said:

    rcs1000 said:

    kjh said:

    carnforth said:

    On Mark Carney's plate, aside from the Trump stuff:



    GDP per capita growth, selected countries.

    It’s a real mystery:

    image
    Is that really an OECD graph or one created from OECD data because the y axis is (I assume GDP per person) but there isn't anything shown for population on the y axis and population hasn't increased 7 fold since 2018 as that graph implies. Presumably the x axis is crossing the y axis regarding population at something like 50 million and then there are huge distances on the y axis for subsequent million people giving a very distorted picture.

    I'm a LD and even I would be embarrassed by that graph.
    I think it's indexed at 2020 = 100.

    Yep got it. Post withdrawn. Do hate it when I'm wrong. Both GDP and population percentages on y axis using start of 2020 as base. Saw it for GDP, but not for population. Idiot.
    The pink background suggests FT, which also implies a fair chance of J B-M. Big 'don't diss' warning :wink:
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 18,369
    Scott_xP said:

    The King will meet the new Canadian PM later today

    Over Teams I hope. Not wasting jet fuel on a transatlantic meeting, surely?
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,852
    Scott_xP said:

    Here is a picture to brighten everyone's day

    https://bsky.app/profile/followtheh.bsky.social/post/3lklbdnx6lc2h

    Especially given my sell position, already into a four figure profit
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,151

    Scott_xP said:

    The King will meet the new Canadian PM later today

    Over Teams I hope. Not wasting jet fuel on a transatlantic meeting, surely?
    Carney is in France right now
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 18,369
    IanB2 said:

    The days when a LIbDem canvasser could tell Labour and Tory voters apart by making superficial judgements about their lifestyle are long gone.

    As a young student, I always remember canvassing this tumbledown house during the Bermondsey by-election, as this guy in stained trousers and a string vest staggered towards answering the door, clearly already under the influence by late morning. My pen was already hovering over the Labour box on my canvass card when, to my amazement, he told me he was voting Tory.

    If only I had realised that, far from being a random aberration, thay guy was a straw in the wind as to political changes incoming….

    And to think that I met one of Leon’s relatives, way back then.

    People live their lives in many different ways. I help with the Lions Christmas collections locally and get to see a lot of peoples hallways. I think you can probably tell a lot about someone by their hallway, be it neat and tidy or messy as feck. In winter the temperature of the house is always interesting too. I recall on house on a council estate with tropical heat and the occupants in shorts (and no tops for the 'gents') in December.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 18,369
    Scott_xP said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The King will meet the new Canadian PM later today

    Over Teams I hope. Not wasting jet fuel on a transatlantic meeting, surely?
    Carney is in France right now
    Aha!
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 18,369
    Scott_xP said:

    @thetimes

    Mark Carney, the prime minister of Canada, has invited President Zelensky to the G7 summit in June. The event will be held in the Canadian province of Alberta

    Presumably Trump will be invited too. Can the press all do that thing they did to Johnson of choosing shots of him looking isolated and lonely?
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 9,153
    edited March 17
    .
    Selebian said:

    kjh said:

    rcs1000 said:

    kjh said:

    carnforth said:

    On Mark Carney's plate, aside from the Trump stuff:



    GDP per capita growth, selected countries.

    It’s a real mystery:

    image
    Is that really an OECD graph or one created from OECD data because the y axis is (I assume GDP per person) but there isn't anything shown for population on the y axis and population hasn't increased 7 fold since 2018 as that graph implies. Presumably the x axis is crossing the y axis regarding population at something like 50 million and then there are huge distances on the y axis for subsequent million people giving a very distorted picture.

    I'm a LD and even I would be embarrassed by that graph.
    I think it's indexed at 2020 = 100.

    Yep got it. Post withdrawn. Do hate it when I'm wrong. Both GDP and population percentages on y axis using start of 2020 as base. Saw it for GDP, but not for population. Idiot.
    The pink background suggests FT, which also implies a fair chance of J B-M. Big 'don't diss' warning :wink:
    It's actually not indexed to 2020 though, unless my eyes are squiffy (possible!). Looks more like Sept/Oct 2019 or so. Presumably some logic to that. The original would have had a caption, of course...
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 30,627
    edited March 17
    ...
    Nigelb said:

    LOL
    Looks more like Farage.

    Golden Mount Rushmore monument with Trump’s likeness unveiled at Mar-a-Lago.
    https://x.com/PolymarketIntel/status/1901584599764947421

    Either way, he's a steaming loon.

    If Mount Rushmore Presidents reflects key stages of American history, Trump would fit in perfectly. The death of the Constitution and democracy is pretty momentous.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,151
    edited March 17

    Presumably Trump will be invited too.

    That is (remarkably) an interesting question...
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,333

    Scott_xP said:

    @thetimes

    Mark Carney, the prime minister of Canada, has invited President Zelensky to the G7 summit in June. The event will be held in the Canadian province of Alberta

    Presumably Trump will be invited too. Can the press all do that thing they did to Johnson of choosing shots of him looking isolated and lonely?
    Meloni will be there too and likes Trump and Sir Keir will no doubt suck up to Trump as usual
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 58,850
    Selebian said:

    .

    Selebian said:

    kjh said:

    rcs1000 said:

    kjh said:

    carnforth said:

    On Mark Carney's plate, aside from the Trump stuff:



    GDP per capita growth, selected countries.

    It’s a real mystery:

    image
    Is that really an OECD graph or one created from OECD data because the y axis is (I assume GDP per person) but there isn't anything shown for population on the y axis and population hasn't increased 7 fold since 2018 as that graph implies. Presumably the x axis is crossing the y axis regarding population at something like 50 million and then there are huge distances on the y axis for subsequent million people giving a very distorted picture.

    I'm a LD and even I would be embarrassed by that graph.
    I think it's indexed at 2020 = 100.

    Yep got it. Post withdrawn. Do hate it when I'm wrong. Both GDP and population percentages on y axis using start of 2020 as base. Saw it for GDP, but not for population. Idiot.
    The pink background suggests FT, which also implies a fair chance of J B-M. Big 'don't diss' warning :wink:
    It's actually not indexed to 2020 though, unless my eyes are squiffy (possible!). Looks more like Sept/Oct 2019 or so. Presumably some logic to that. The original would have had a caption, of course...
    I always like to index things to weird, arbitrary dates. It's a key part of making sure that the data tells the story it is supposed to tell.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 30,627
    ...
    Leon said:

    IanB2 said:

    Leon said:

    I'm beginning to think Sanders is the only hope for America. If he can give tens of more speeches like this, he can mobilise millions. In fact, I see that duplicate version of this are already attracting millions on social media.

    Bernie is too mad to do that. The DNC needs to find a straight version of Pete Buttigieg. With a pretty wife and all American name. Pete is sensationally good. But he’s gat, and appalling as it is I think that’s enough to sink him as a post-Trump contender.

    Assuming there are any post-Trump contenders…
    Buttgieg was also mediocre in office and was one of the liars who said that Biden was good for another four years.

    The Dems need a clean break from those involved in the administration of the Biden crime family.
    "Biden crime family"?

    Can I help you out of that deep rabbit hole?
    The levels of cognitive dissonance are astonishing. Let’s assume that Hunter Biden is a bad’un. May be true. But his crimes are rather pale in comparison to Trump’s own ongoing criminality.

    What kind of person do you have to be to ignore that gargantuan plank sticking out of your eye because you are performatively excited by the splinter in someone else’s eye?
    The entire Biden family conspired to disguise the fact that Joe Biden is fucking demented, has been for years, and was unfit to run in 2024. They committed an immense fraud on the American people, on American democracy, and one of the reasons they did it was so that their convicted criminal son, Hunter - still facing some spectacular allegations on top of his confessed crimes - could escape any jail time. Via a presidential pardon

    And by doing this the Biden family assured that Trump would get elected. They enabled Trump

    So, yeah, calling the Bidens a crime family is quite moderate, in the circs. The only reason they aren't all potentially facing time is because - why? - oh yeah, Biden gave them all yet more of his "pre-emptive pardons"
    When did you first have your brain washed by the MAGA nutters, or was it completely voluntary? MAGA became obsessed by Hunter because it was a useful distraction against the reality that they, MAGA, have a criminal leader. No doubt you will soon be suggesting that Russia didn't invade Ukraine or any other factually incorrect nonsense spouted by the intellectual pigmies that now run the US.
    Although it could just be a controversial narrative designed to trigger posters Leon likes to trigger. He's triggered this poster. Life is too short to engage with such bollocks.
    Our credulous cretin is back. Sadly for us.
    My return was so triggering it caused @BatteryCorrectHorse to quit the site. Supposedly

    Who liked that post? Weird.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 18,369
    edited March 17
    From the BBC - growth vs views - growth wins folks!

    https://bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c2kgvdgeq1yo

    Now clearly those poor home owners are a bit upset, but the photo's suggest rather large gardens, so its not all bad folks. I'd be planting a fast growing hedge at the far end myself.

    Mr Thomas seems to have an odd understanding of how sunshine works, if he truly believes that he barely gets any sun now...
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 58,850
    New thread.

    But don't tell @Leon
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,230

    NEW THREAD

  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 18,080

    ...

    Nigelb said:

    LOL
    Looks more like Farage.

    Golden Mount Rushmore monument with Trump’s likeness unveiled at Mar-a-Lago.
    https://x.com/PolymarketIntel/status/1901584599764947421

    Either way, he's a steaming loon.

    If Mount Rushmore Presidents reflects key stages of American history, Trump would fit in perfectly. The death of the Constitution and democracy is pretty momentous.
    There is the pious story (which may be tosh) that Pontius Pilate really really wanted to be remembered, to go down in history. So God gave him what he really really wanted.

    Whatever happens, Trump will go down in history.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 13,689
    Scott_xP said:

    "there is increasing evidence in public opinion data that Americans are growing impatient to get the primary thing they feel they were promised: a more stable economy where the cost of living is more affordable."

    "the No. 1 issue in America remains the No. 1 issue, and there are real political risks to a strategy that asks voters to grin and bear it in the checkout line today for a promise of something better tomorrow."

    https://www.nytimes.com/2025/03/17/opinion/trump-economy-polling.html

    There are no political risks in a oligarchical monarchy
    James II, Edward II, Charles I, Henry VI, Richard III and Richard II are all relieved to hear this.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 53,225

    Scott_xP said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The King will meet the new Canadian PM later today

    Over Teams I hope. Not wasting jet fuel on a transatlantic meeting, surely?
    Carney is in France right now
    Aha!
    "Take on me"
  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 5,429
    HYUFD said:

    Eabhal said:

    HYUFD said:

    DavidL said:

    The problem of the Democrats is similar to Labour’s problems here. There is a growing disconnect between their middle class public sector supporters and the working classes they are supposed to represent. The obsessions of the middle classes are simply not shared by the working class and their worries, such as immigration and gang related violence, are thought both vulgar and racist.

    In the US those vulgar people are now MAGA supporters and here they are now Reform.

    How that coalition is rebuilt is an interesting question in both cases. The middle class consider themselves morally superior because they “care” but what they care about is of little to no interest to those they pretend to represent.

    It won't be, the white working class in most of the West is now solidly rightwing, fuelled by anti immigration, anti woke, anti net zero taxes and protectionism in particular.

    The left liberal core vote is the public sector and ethnic minorities and those living in inner cities (albeit Hispanics and non Muslim Asians in particular can vote conservative in significant numbers).

    The swing voters are now white suburban and commuter belt high earning graduates
    I feel I need to push back a little against this assertion that the white working class are a monolithic, “anti-woke”, anti-immigrant, Farage-loving bloc a little.

    I think it is fairer to say that a lot of people in that category feel increasingly let down by the mainstream and are increasingly distrustful of the ‘establishment’. That does not in and of itself always manifest in right wing protest politics. It can do, and for some increasingly does, but it is not universal.
    And if we were were to take "working" class literally, Reform's best cohorts are the unemployed and retired.
    No, Reform did better with 50-59 year olds than the retired at the GE and better with C2 skilled working class voters than unemployed and unskilled DEs

    https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/49978-how-britain-voted-in-the-2024-general-election
    Reform are the party of the have nots. That includes the prospect of a pension sufficient to live on comfortably.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 44,363

    Scott_xP said:

    @thetimes

    Mark Carney, the prime minister of Canada, has invited President Zelensky to the G7 summit in June. The event will be held in the Canadian province of Alberta

    Presumably Trump will be invited too. Can the press all do that thing they did to Johnson of choosing shots of him looking isolated and lonely?
    Trump will probably say he's not going unless Putin is.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,692

    carnforth said:

    On Mark Carney's plate, aside from the Trump stuff:



    GDP per capita growth, selected countries.

    The way they are going, the US are going to do -20% shortly.

    Is this a reflection of Canada having more primary industry?
    No, it's reflection that Canada had a very extreme policy on immigration for low skill, low value workers for a very long time under Trudeau.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 30,237
    edited March 17
    ...
    Dura_Ace said:

    IanB2 said:

    Leon said:

    I'm beginning to think Sanders is the only hope for America. If he can give tens of more speeches like this, he can mobilise millions. In fact, I see that duplicate version of this are already attracting millions on social media.

    Bernie is too mad to do that. The DNC needs to find a straight version of Pete Buttigieg. With a pretty wife and all American name. Pete is sensationally good. But he’s gat, and appalling as it is I think that’s enough to sink him as a post-Trump contender.

    Assuming there are any post-Trump contenders…
    Buttgieg was also mediocre in office and was one of the liars who said that Biden was good for another four years.

    The Dems need a clean break from those involved in the administration of the Biden crime family.
    "Biden crime family"?

    Can I help you out of that deep rabbit hole?
    The levels of cognitive dissonance are astonishing. Let’s assume that Hunter Biden is a bad’un. May be true. But his crimes are rather pale in comparison to Trump’s own ongoing criminality.

    What kind of person do you have to be to ignore that gargantuan plank sticking out of your eye because you are performatively excited by the splinter in someone else’s eye?
    The entire Biden family conspired to disguise the fact that Joe Biden is fucking demented, has been for years, and was unfit to run in 2024. They committed an immense fraud on the American people, on American democracy, and one of the reasons they did it was so that their convicted criminal son, Hunter - still facing some spectacular allegations on top of his confessed crimes - could escape any jail time. Via a presidential pardon

    And by doing this the Biden family assured that Trump would get elected. They enabled Trump

    So, yeah, calling the Bidens a crime family is quite moderate, in the circs. The only reason they aren't all potentially facing time is because - why? - oh yeah, Biden gave them all yet more of his "pre-emptive pardons"
    When did you first have your brain washed by the MAGA nutters, or was it completely voluntary? MAGA became obsessed by Hunter because it was a useful distraction against the reality that they, MAGA, have a criminal leader. No doubt you will soon be suggesting that Russia didn't invade Ukraine or any other factually incorrect nonsense spouted by the intellectual pigmies that now run the US.
    Although it could just be a controversial narrative designed to trigger posters Leon likes to trigger. He's triggered this poster. Life is too short to engage with such bollocks.
    Our credulous cretin is back. Sadly for us.
    It's like when Beca comes back to the Barden Belles in Pitch Perfect.

    🎶Don't you forget about me🎶
    Me neither.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 13,117

    HYUFD said:

    DavidL said:

    The problem of the Democrats is similar to Labour’s problems here. There is a growing disconnect between their middle class public sector supporters and the working classes they are supposed to represent. The obsessions of the middle classes are simply not shared by the working class and their worries, such as immigration and gang related violence, are thought both vulgar and racist.

    In the US those vulgar people are now MAGA supporters and here they are now Reform.

    How that coalition is rebuilt is an interesting question in both cases. The middle class consider themselves morally superior because they “care” but what they care about is of little to no interest to those they pretend to represent.

    It won't be, the white working class in most of the West is now solidly rightwing, fuelled by anti immigration, anti woke, anti net zero taxes and protectionism in particular.

    The left liberal core vote is the public sector and ethnic minorities and those living in inner cities (albeit Hispanics and non Muslim Asians in particular can vote conservative in significant numbers).

    The swing voters are now white suburban and commuter belt high earning graduates
    At last year’s general election, Labour got the highest vote share in every class category, every income category, and in every housing category except “own outright” (won by Reform). See details at https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/49978-how-britain-voted-in-the-2024-general-election
    Mea culpa on the Own Outright category: I read that wrong.

    What stands out for me on the socio-economic group chart is now similar the vote share is across all the groups. Class is not the major determiner of voting intention it once was. It’s age and education level that matter more, and there are still plenty of people at all ages and education levels voting for all the different parties.
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