I can’t remember how to write 1, 1000, 51, 6, and 500 in Roman numerals, I M LIVID

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  • logical_song
    logical_song Posts: 10,082
    Taz said:

    If only the democrats hadn’t anointed an incompetent clown who flopped badly in the primaries when Biden won as a candidate to stand against Trump. We may not be in this mess.

    So somehow it's the Democrat's fault?
    The Republicans had chances to get rid of Trump and failed to do so.
  • numbertwelve
    numbertwelve Posts: 7,727
    nico67 said:

    numbertwelve said:

    nico67 said:

    There’s no chance the state visit gets cancelled. To dis-invite Trump now would lead to a major fallout .

    I agree it won’t, but it puts Starmer in a tricky position now. He tried to placate him and get warm words by handing out pretty baubles but unfortunately we have seen the type of person we’re dealing with here.
    I’m sure Starmer and the cabinet are under no illusions as to who they’re dealing with .
    True. But time will tell how well this has been played.
  • Eabhal
    Eabhal Posts: 11,275
    edited February 28
    another_richard said:

    Instead of frothing about state visits - the previous one took three years to organise it seems - how about we deal with practicalities.

    Time to get rid of triple lock pensions and reduce/reform/replace pension credits and various other welfarism.

    And spend the money on military and industrial security.

    Nothing stopping us putting the RAF over Kyiv tonight either. The fact is it would take years - decades - to build up the kind of capability that you are talking about, but we have a major issue right now.

    Either the Realms + EU have Ukraine's back this evening, with moral and military support, or it could all quickly unravel.
  • Big_G_NorthWales
    Big_G_NorthWales Posts: 66,238
    News conference cancelled

    This is a real crisis

    Trump - Zelensky come back when ready for peace
  • kle4
    kle4 Posts: 99,113
    Richard_Tyndall said:

    logical_song said:

    Mexicanpete said:

    ...

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    If Starmer wants to win the next election and the King wants to turn me into a monarchist they have to cancel the state visit after that Oval Office disgrace.

    After this the invitation should be summarily withdrawn

    Trump just said this is great television !!!!!
    Note to Starmer and @williamglenn .Lie with dogs get fleas
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    My wife is shaking with anger demanding Trump is uninvited to the UK

    Neither of us can believe what we are witnessing

    And neither can the media

    It turned out by going AWOL for a week Farage played a blinder. Farage needs to call out Trump and Starmer.
    Farage is a Trump backer, if you dislike Trump you should also dislike Farage.
    Farage has already come out publically and said Trump is wrong about Ukraine. He did it last week.
    Implausibly so.
  • Jonathan
    Jonathan Posts: 22,107
    Was this planned?
  • another_richard
    another_richard Posts: 27,927
    Taz said:

    If only the democrats hadn’t anointed an incompetent clown who flopped badly in the primaries when Biden won as a candidate to stand against Trump. We may not be in this mess.

    The Dems (who we are often told are the educated, intelligent people):

    Had an attorney general who made no effort to bring Trump to justice.

    All claimed that a senile old man was good for another four years.

    At the last moment replaced the senile old man with someone who everyone said was unelectable and who couldn't even be bothered to campaign on Biden's economic achievements.
  • another_richard
    another_richard Posts: 27,927
    Richard_Tyndall said:

    another_richard said:

    Instead of frothing about state visits - the previous one took three years to organise it seems - how about we deal with practicalities.

    Time to get rid of triple lock pensions and reduce/reform/replace pension credits and various other welfarism.

    And spend the money on military and industrial security.

    We are capable of doing both you know.
    Are we ?

    When are you expecting the announcement that triple lock pensions will be ended and welfare be reformed ?
  • Eabhal
    Eabhal Posts: 11,275
    Fairliered said:

    Eabhal said:

    jonny83 said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    HYUFD said:

    Yesterday not looking quite such a good day for Starmer.

    He has just invited for a second state visit to the UK a US President who has just engaged in a shouting match with Zelensky for not grovelling to him enough for a deal while trying to defend his country from Putin

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/us/politics/2025/02/28/zelensky-trump-meeting-white-house-us/?WT.mc_id=e_DM524873&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_FPM_New&utmsource=email&utm_medium=Edi_FPM_New20250228&utm_campaign=DM524873

    Starmer can only correct this by withdrawing the invite

    The King cannot welcome Trump now

    Can anyone imagine the demonstrations

    Just not acceptable and a case could be made for the invite being offered far too soon anyway
    They will just kick it into the long grass.

    "Oh such a shame the diaries don't quite line up, we will come back to you".
    "The King has been advised to focus on his cancer treatment".
    Better still, KCIII publicly cancels the invitation and humiliates Trump. He can cite Canada if necessary.
    Nah. Do it the British way - that's what everyone loves about us.
  • Stuartinromford
    Stuartinromford Posts: 19,145
    logical_song said:

    Taz said:

    If only the democrats hadn’t anointed an incompetent clown who flopped badly in the primaries when Biden won as a candidate to stand against Trump. We may not be in this mess.

    So somehow it's the Democrat's fault?
    The Republicans had chances to get rid of Trump and failed to do so.
    First rule of the authoritarians.

    Anything wrong they do is the fault of their opponents.

    Always has been. Always will be.
  • Big_G_NorthWales
    Big_G_NorthWales Posts: 66,238
    Jonathan said:

    Was this planned?

    Sky are asking the question if this was actually planned by the White House
  • Eabhal
    Eabhal Posts: 11,275
    Taz said:

    If only the democrats hadn’t anointed an incompetent clown who flopped badly in the primaries when Biden won as a candidate to stand against Trump. We may not be in this mess.

    Took you longer than normal.

    "They made us end western civilisation".
  • williamglenn
    williamglenn Posts: 56,289
    Why did we not offer Zelensky any tips on how to handle Trump?
  • Daveyboy1961
    Daveyboy1961 Posts: 4,726
    According to LBC this was a premeditated mugging by Trump and Vance.

    What a pair of bastards.
  • Razedabode
    Razedabode Posts: 3,117
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Jonathan said:

    Was this planned?

    Sky are asking the question if this was actually planned by the White House
    To appeal to the hardcore MAGA lot? I guess they don’t care how this looks to the rest of the world
  • Fairliered
    Fairliered Posts: 6,023
    Eabhal said:

    Fairliered said:

    Eabhal said:

    jonny83 said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    HYUFD said:

    Yesterday not looking quite such a good day for Starmer.

    He has just invited for a second state visit to the UK a US President who has just engaged in a shouting match with Zelensky for not grovelling to him enough for a deal while trying to defend his country from Putin

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/us/politics/2025/02/28/zelensky-trump-meeting-white-house-us/?WT.mc_id=e_DM524873&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_FPM_New&utmsource=email&utm_medium=Edi_FPM_New20250228&utm_campaign=DM524873

    Starmer can only correct this by withdrawing the invite

    The King cannot welcome Trump now

    Can anyone imagine the demonstrations

    Just not acceptable and a case could be made for the invite being offered far too soon anyway
    They will just kick it into the long grass.

    "Oh such a shame the diaries don't quite line up, we will come back to you".
    "The King has been advised to focus on his cancer treatment".
    Better still, KCIII publicly cancels the invitation and humiliates Trump. He can cite Canada if necessary.
    Nah. Do it the British way - that's what everyone loves about us.
    I don’t want Trump’s love. I want Trump’s death.
  • Richard_Tyndall
    Richard_Tyndall Posts: 33,463
    another_richard said:

    Richard_Tyndall said:

    another_richard said:

    Instead of frothing about state visits - the previous one took three years to organise it seems - how about we deal with practicalities.

    Time to get rid of triple lock pensions and reduce/reform/replace pension credits and various other welfarism.

    And spend the money on military and industrial security.

    We are capable of doing both you know.
    Are we ?

    When are you expecting the announcement that triple lock pensions will be ended and welfare be reformed ?
    I am not. I said we are capable of doing it. I didn't say it would be done, not least because Labour don't want to do it. But linking the two togather is facile and stupid. Any Government with a bit of backbone could and should do both.
  • dixiedean
    dixiedean Posts: 30,316
    edited February 28
    All this is the natural conclusion of owning the Libs.
    Is anyone rational surprised?
    Hope youse are all satisfied that the bathroom business is clarified.
  • kle4
    kle4 Posts: 99,113
    jonny83 said:

    Eabhal said:

    Zelensky kicked out of the White House.

    Pathetic statement saying he disrespected the Oval Office. Trump and Vance were the ones that disrespected the office.
    "We have decided to stop supporting Ukraine to resist Russia, thus forcing Zelensky to come to terms. He then disrespected the USA by not being grateful enough for this"

    99% Republicans: Yeah, take down that fascist Ukrainian bastard!
  • Jonathan
    Jonathan Posts: 22,107
    edited February 28
    williamglenn said:

    Why did we not offer Zelensky any tips on how to handle Trump?

    He should have been coached. He obviously wasn’t. Small slips poured petrol on the flames lit by Vance.
  • HYUFD
    HYUFD Posts: 128,924
    edited February 28
    another_richard said:

    Taz said:

    If only the democrats hadn’t anointed an incompetent clown who flopped badly in the primaries when Biden won as a candidate to stand against Trump. We may not be in this mess.

    The Dems (who we are often told are the educated, intelligent people):

    Had an attorney general who made no effort to bring Trump to justice.

    All claimed that a senile old man was good for another four years.

    At the last moment replaced the senile old man with someone who everyone said was unelectable and who couldn't even be bothered to campaign on Biden's economic achievements.
    The Dems would have lost regardless because of cost of living, which with Trump's tariffs should also likely see the GOP lose in 2026 and 2028
  • another_richard
    another_richard Posts: 27,927
    logical_song said:

    Taz said:

    If only the democrats hadn’t anointed an incompetent clown who flopped badly in the primaries when Biden won as a candidate to stand against Trump. We may not be in this mess.

    So somehow it's the Democrat's fault?
    The Republicans had chances to get rid of Trump and failed to do so.
    Its the fault of both GOP and Dems.

    A long trail of self-serving ineptitude by the leadership of both parties.
  • kle4
    kle4 Posts: 99,113
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    nico67 said:

    There’s no chance the state visit gets cancelled. To dis-invite Trump now would lead to a major fallout .

    But not to is to acquiesce to a bully

    We have to stand by Zelensky and decency - not Trump
    Not going to happen I'm afraid.
  • Taz
    Taz Posts: 19,666
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Hmmm


    Presumably he didn’t sign the minerals deal
  • IanB2
    IanB2 Posts: 52,310
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    I think we need to boycott the 2026 World Cup and the 2028 Olympics.

    Just yesterday I was being criticised here for cancelling my Netflix and Apple TV!
  • logical_song
    logical_song Posts: 10,082
    HYUFD said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    HYUFD said:

    Yesterday not looking quite such a good day for Starmer.

    He has just invited for a second state visit to the UK a US President who has just engaged in a shouting match with Zelensky for not grovelling to him enough for a deal while trying to defend his country from Putin

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/us/politics/2025/02/28/zelensky-trump-meeting-white-house-us/?WT.mc_id=e_DM524873&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_FPM_New&utmsource=email&utm_medium=Edi_FPM_New20250228&utm_campaign=DM524873

    Starmer can only correct this by withdrawing the invite

    The King cannot welcome Trump now

    Can anyone imagine the demonstrations

    Just not acceptable and a case could be made for the invite being offered far too soon anyway
    Or else he invites Zelensky for a State Visit first and the King also travels to Canada before Trump arrives (I believe they were hoping to confine Trump to Balmoral Estate, Dumfries House and Windsor Castle and keep him out of London anyway)
    HYUFD said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    HYUFD said:

    Yesterday not looking quite such a good day for Starmer.

    He has just invited for a second state visit to the UK a US President who has just engaged in a shouting match with Zelensky for not grovelling to him enough for a deal while trying to defend his country from Putin

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/us/politics/2025/02/28/zelensky-trump-meeting-white-house-us/?WT.mc_id=e_DM524873&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_FPM_New&utmsource=email&utm_medium=Edi_FPM_New20250228&utm_campaign=DM524873

    Starmer can only correct this by withdrawing the invite

    The King cannot welcome Trump now

    Can anyone imagine the demonstrations

    Just not acceptable and a case could be made for the invite being offered far too soon anyway
    Or else he invites Zelensky for a State Visit first and the King also travels to Canada before Trump arrives (I believe they were hoping to confine Trump to Balmoral Estate, Dumfries House and Windsor Castle and keep him out of London anyway)
    Rejoin the EU, invite Canada and Ukraine to also join.
  • biggles
    biggles Posts: 6,817
    Imagine being Starmer or Macron tonight. I don’t envy them. The future is more uncertain than at any time I can recall since… well last week.

    I miss precedented times.

    We haven’t even examined in great detail what gives Starmer and Trump exchanged.
  • dixiedean
    dixiedean Posts: 30,316
    Taz said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Hmmm


    Presumably he didn’t sign the minerals deal
    The bastard.
    His country deserves to die.
  • another_richard
    another_richard Posts: 27,927
    HYUFD said:

    another_richard said:

    Taz said:

    If only the democrats hadn’t anointed an incompetent clown who flopped badly in the primaries when Biden won as a candidate to stand against Trump. We may not be in this mess.

    The Dems (who we are often told are the educated, intelligent people):

    Had an attorney general who made no effort to bring Trump to justice.

    All claimed that a senile old man was good for another four years.

    At the last moment replaced the senile old man with someone who everyone said was unelectable and who couldn't even be bothered to campaign on Biden's economic achievements.
    The Dems would have lost regardless because of cost of living, which with Trump's tariffs should also likely see the GOP lose in 2026 and 2028
    The tipping point state was Pennsylvania, which Trump won by 1.71% - it was very close.

    If Biden had announced he was going to serve only one term and allowed a proper primary the Dems could have won.
  • kle4
    kle4 Posts: 99,113
    kinabalu said:

    Well hopefully this ends all equivocation even amongst the most alty righty of our community about who and what this man is and what he represents. It's nothing to do with your politics. He's evil.

    Very naiive of you. The pretexts for continued support write themselves:

    Trump's language may have been a bit harsh, but Zelensky is an unelected leader sending consripts to die in a war which, to be fair, we in the West partly caused, and I don't want my children to die in WW3 either do you, and it's just common sense that you agree to a deal if you go to the White House, Zelensky shouldn't have gone if he was not prepared to do so, and Trump, though rude, is trying to get things to return to peace so ultimately he is in the right.

    And so on.
  • biggles
    biggles Posts: 6,817
    logical_song said:

    HYUFD said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    HYUFD said:

    Yesterday not looking quite such a good day for Starmer.

    He has just invited for a second state visit to the UK a US President who has just engaged in a shouting match with Zelensky for not grovelling to him enough for a deal while trying to defend his country from Putin

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/us/politics/2025/02/28/zelensky-trump-meeting-white-house-us/?WT.mc_id=e_DM524873&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_FPM_New&utmsource=email&utm_medium=Edi_FPM_New20250228&utm_campaign=DM524873

    Starmer can only correct this by withdrawing the invite

    The King cannot welcome Trump now

    Can anyone imagine the demonstrations

    Just not acceptable and a case could be made for the invite being offered far too soon anyway
    Or else he invites Zelensky for a State Visit first and the King also travels to Canada before Trump arrives (I believe they were hoping to confine Trump to Balmoral Estate, Dumfries House and Windsor Castle and keep him out of London anyway)
    HYUFD said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    HYUFD said:

    Yesterday not looking quite such a good day for Starmer.

    He has just invited for a second state visit to the UK a US President who has just engaged in a shouting match with Zelensky for not grovelling to him enough for a deal while trying to defend his country from Putin

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/us/politics/2025/02/28/zelensky-trump-meeting-white-house-us/?WT.mc_id=e_DM524873&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_FPM_New&utmsource=email&utm_medium=Edi_FPM_New20250228&utm_campaign=DM524873

    Starmer can only correct this by withdrawing the invite

    The King cannot welcome Trump now

    Can anyone imagine the demonstrations

    Just not acceptable and a case could be made for the invite being offered far too soon anyway
    Or else he invites Zelensky for a State Visit first and the King also travels to Canada before Trump arrives (I believe they were hoping to confine Trump to Balmoral Estate, Dumfries House and Windsor Castle and keep him out of London anyway)
    Rejoin the EU, invite Canada and Ukraine to also join.
    Not the EU. It’s something else but the something needs to form this weekend.
  • Big_G_NorthWales
    Big_G_NorthWales Posts: 66,238
    Taz said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Hmmm


    Presumably he didn’t sign the minerals deal
    Apparently Zelensky is about to leave with no deal signed
  • Daveyboy1961
    Daveyboy1961 Posts: 4,726
    kle4 said:

    kinabalu said:

    Well hopefully this ends all equivocation even amongst the most alty righty of our community about who and what this man is and what he represents. It's nothing to do with your politics. He's evil.

    Very naiive of you. The pretexts for continued support write themselves:

    Trump's language may have been a bit harsh, but Zelensky is an unelected leader sending consripts to die in a war which, to be fair, we in the West partly caused, and I don't want my children to die in WW3 either do you, and it's just common sense that you agree to a deal if you go to the White House, Zelensky shouldn't have gone if he was not prepared to do so, and Trump, though rude, is trying to get things to return to peace so ultimately he is in the right.

    And so on.
    unelected? stop parroting putin myths.
  • Malmesbury
    Malmesbury Posts: 55,723
    Daveyboy1961 said:

    Daveyboy1961 said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Daveyboy1961 said:

    omg, what a pair of bastards.

    Not Zelensky
    Totally, I meant Trump and Vance

    Very shocked that the press pack didn't intervene somehow.
    I've sent an email to Downing Street demanding they withdraw the invite.
    Terrible idea.

    Much better. Trump flies in. No one there to greet him. Starmer says "What invitation?"
  • Big_G_NorthWales
    Big_G_NorthWales Posts: 66,238
    Putin and the Kremlin must be toasting Trump to the rafters
  • Taz
    Taz Posts: 19,666
    HYUFD said:

    another_richard said:

    Taz said:

    If only the democrats hadn’t anointed an incompetent clown who flopped badly in the primaries when Biden won as a candidate to stand against Trump. We may not be in this mess.

    The Dems (who we are often told are the educated, intelligent people):

    Had an attorney general who made no effort to bring Trump to justice.

    All claimed that a senile old man was good for another four years.

    At the last moment replaced the senile old man with someone who everyone said was unelectable and who couldn't even be bothered to campaign on Biden's economic achievements.
    The Dems would have lost regardless because of cost of living, which with Trump's tariffs should also likely see the GOP lose in 2026 and 2028
    Given Trumps economic policies inflation is rising, consumer confidence is slipping, he’s got a whole lot of pain to come unless he reverse ferrets.
  • Foxy
    Foxy Posts: 52,169
    So how are those people who thought Trump would be good for Ukraine feeling?

    They didn't believe that Trump would do what he said he would do.

    Thoughts and prayers.
  • kle4
    kle4 Posts: 99,113
    Richard_Tyndall said:

    williamglenn said:

    Why did we not offer Zelensky any tips on how to handle Trump?

    I don't think there were any tips we could have offered. Trump wanted things to fall this way.
    Indeed, perhaps he was worried there was a chance people had been sympathising with Zelensky a bit much recently so wanted a chance to potray him as a greedy warmonger rejecting Trump's reasonable peaceful offers.

    We're all in a right tizzy about this, but what will the right leaning networks in America say? They are the only voice Trump might worry about, as some of his base at least might question some of his acts if the media chamber did even a little.

    I imagine they will lead on Zelensky being provocative and not being willing to engage to seek peace.
  • Big_G_NorthWales
    Big_G_NorthWales Posts: 66,238
    Zelensky leaves the White House
  • Richard_Tyndall
    Richard_Tyndall Posts: 33,463
    logical_song said:

    HYUFD said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    HYUFD said:

    Yesterday not looking quite such a good day for Starmer.

    He has just invited for a second state visit to the UK a US President who has just engaged in a shouting match with Zelensky for not grovelling to him enough for a deal while trying to defend his country from Putin

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/us/politics/2025/02/28/zelensky-trump-meeting-white-house-us/?WT.mc_id=e_DM524873&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_FPM_New&utmsource=email&utm_medium=Edi_FPM_New20250228&utm_campaign=DM524873

    Starmer can only correct this by withdrawing the invite

    The King cannot welcome Trump now

    Can anyone imagine the demonstrations

    Just not acceptable and a case could be made for the invite being offered far too soon anyway
    Or else he invites Zelensky for a State Visit first and the King also travels to Canada before Trump arrives (I believe they were hoping to confine Trump to Balmoral Estate, Dumfries House and Windsor Castle and keep him out of London anyway)
    HYUFD said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    HYUFD said:

    Yesterday not looking quite such a good day for Starmer.

    He has just invited for a second state visit to the UK a US President who has just engaged in a shouting match with Zelensky for not grovelling to him enough for a deal while trying to defend his country from Putin

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/us/politics/2025/02/28/zelensky-trump-meeting-white-house-us/?WT.mc_id=e_DM524873&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_FPM_New&utmsource=email&utm_medium=Edi_FPM_New20250228&utm_campaign=DM524873

    Starmer can only correct this by withdrawing the invite

    The King cannot welcome Trump now

    Can anyone imagine the demonstrations

    Just not acceptable and a case could be made for the invite being offered far too soon anyway
    Or else he invites Zelensky for a State Visit first and the King also travels to Canada before Trump arrives (I believe they were hoping to confine Trump to Balmoral Estate, Dumfries House and Windsor Castle and keep him out of London anyway)
    Rejoin the EU, invite Canada and Ukraine to also join.
    I should be amused by your idiocy but it is sad to see you using this crisis to push your own warped agenda.
  • Daveyboy1961
    Daveyboy1961 Posts: 4,726
    kle4 said:

    kinabalu said:

    Well hopefully this ends all equivocation even amongst the most alty righty of our community about who and what this man is and what he represents. It's nothing to do with your politics. He's evil.

    Very naiive of you. The pretexts for continued support write themselves:

    Trump's language may have been a bit harsh, but Zelensky is an unelected leader sending consripts to die in a war which, to be fair, we in the West partly caused, and I don't want my children to die in WW3 either do you, and it's just common sense that you agree to a deal if you go to the White House, Zelensky shouldn't have gone if he was not prepared to do so, and Trump, though rude, is trying to get things to return to peace so ultimately he is in the right.

    And so on.
    shill
  • kle4
    kle4 Posts: 99,113
    Daveyboy1961 said:

    kle4 said:

    kinabalu said:

    Well hopefully this ends all equivocation even amongst the most alty righty of our community about who and what this man is and what he represents. It's nothing to do with your politics. He's evil.

    Very naiive of you. The pretexts for continued support write themselves:

    Trump's language may have been a bit harsh, but Zelensky is an unelected leader sending consripts to die in a war which, to be fair, we in the West partly caused, and I don't want my children to die in WW3 either do you, and it's just common sense that you agree to a deal if you go to the White House, Zelensky shouldn't have gone if he was not prepared to do so, and Trump, though rude, is trying to get things to return to peace so ultimately he is in the right.

    And so on.
    unelected? stop parroting putin myths.
    The paragraph was an example of what people will say to justify supporting Trump's actions, which will include many Putin myths.
  • Razedabode
    Razedabode Posts: 3,117
    Where do we go from here? Someone needs to stand up to Trump, surely?
  • HYUFD
    HYUFD Posts: 128,924
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Taz said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Hmmm


    Presumably he didn’t sign the minerals deal
    Apparently Zelensky is about to leave with no deal signed
    Well no surprise there after that
  • Stuartinromford
    Stuartinromford Posts: 19,145
    Razedabode said:

    Where do we go from here? Someone needs to stand up to Trump, surely?

    But who?
  • another_richard
    another_richard Posts: 27,927
    Richard_Tyndall said:

    another_richard said:

    Richard_Tyndall said:

    another_richard said:

    Instead of frothing about state visits - the previous one took three years to organise it seems - how about we deal with practicalities.

    Time to get rid of triple lock pensions and reduce/reform/replace pension credits and various other welfarism.

    And spend the money on military and industrial security.

    We are capable of doing both you know.
    Are we ?

    When are you expecting the announcement that triple lock pensions will be ended and welfare be reformed ?
    I am not. I said we are capable of doing it. I didn't say it would be done, not least because Labour don't want to do it. But linking the two togather is facile and stupid. Any Government with a bit of backbone could and should do both.
    Which is what I was trying to point out.

    We need to do the practical things even if they are hard.

    Whereas telling Trump his state visit is off is merely doing the easy bit which makes us feel good.
  • HYUFD
    HYUFD Posts: 128,924
    another_richard said:

    HYUFD said:

    another_richard said:

    Taz said:

    If only the democrats hadn’t anointed an incompetent clown who flopped badly in the primaries when Biden won as a candidate to stand against Trump. We may not be in this mess.

    The Dems (who we are often told are the educated, intelligent people):

    Had an attorney general who made no effort to bring Trump to justice.

    All claimed that a senile old man was good for another four years.

    At the last moment replaced the senile old man with someone who everyone said was unelectable and who couldn't even be bothered to campaign on Biden's economic achievements.
    The Dems would have lost regardless because of cost of living, which with Trump's tariffs should also likely see the GOP lose in 2026 and 2028
    The tipping point state was Pennsylvania, which Trump won by 1.71% - it was very close.

    If Biden had announced he was going to serve only one term and allowed a proper primary the Dems could have won.
    I repeat, they would not have because of cost of living, that was what all the polls said was the main reason why 2020 Biden voters who switched to Trump last November did so
  • nico67
    nico67 Posts: 5,650
    I think Zelenskyy is going to stand down as the only chance to save the country now. Trump loathes him and I just don’t see how things can improve after today .
  • kle4
    kle4 Posts: 99,113
    Fox News website says Zelensky will sit for an interview with Bret Baier at 6PM

    Could be painful - Zelensky cannot exactly deny things got super heated, but the Fox audience won't want to hear that Trump did anything wrong. Blame Vance for things going sour?
  • kle4
    kle4 Posts: 99,113
    nico67 said:

    I think Zelenskyy is going to stand down as the only chance to save the country now. Trump loathes him and I just don’t see how things can improve after today .

    He has previously suggested he would be willing to, and if it was the price of a deal many a leader would accept being forced out. When shitty options are all that you have what can he do that will positively move things in Ukraine's direction after all?

  • kinabalu
    kinabalu Posts: 46,267
    Daveyboy1961 said:

    kle4 said:

    kinabalu said:

    Well hopefully this ends all equivocation even amongst the most alty righty of our community about who and what this man is and what he represents. It's nothing to do with your politics. He's evil.

    Very naiive of you. The pretexts for continued support write themselves:

    Trump's language may have been a bit harsh, but Zelensky is an unelected leader sending consripts to die in a war which, to be fair, we in the West partly caused, and I don't want my children to die in WW3 either do you, and it's just common sense that you agree to a deal if you go to the White House, Zelensky shouldn't have gone if he was not prepared to do so, and Trump, though rude, is trying to get things to return to peace so ultimately he is in the right.

    And so on.
    shill
    Kle4 was sending up the shills there.
  • Nigelb
    Nigelb Posts: 79,347
    edited February 28
    another_richard said:

    Instead of frothing about state visits - the previous one took three years to organise it seems - how about we deal with practicalities.

    Time to get rid of triple lock pensions and reduce/reform/replace pension credits and various other welfarism.

    And spend the money on military and industrial security.

    Yes, time to start preparing.
    Protesting is a waste of time, and probably counterproductive.
  • Fairliered
    Fairliered Posts: 6,023
    IanB2 said:

    Taz said:

    HYUFD said:

    another_richard said:

    Taz said:

    If only the democrats hadn’t anointed an incompetent clown who flopped badly in the primaries when Biden won as a candidate to stand against Trump. We may not be in this mess.

    The Dems (who we are often told are the educated, intelligent people):

    Had an attorney general who made no effort to bring Trump to justice.

    All claimed that a senile old man was good for another four years.

    At the last moment replaced the senile old man with someone who everyone said was unelectable and who couldn't even be bothered to campaign on Biden's economic achievements.
    The Dems would have lost regardless because of cost of living, which with Trump's tariffs should also likely see the GOP lose in 2026 and 2028
    Given Trumps economic policies inflation is rising, consumer confidence is slipping, he’s got a whole lot of pain to come unless he reverse ferrets.
    In the short term the consequences for Ukraine may well be tragic.

    Taking a longer view, we’re witnessing the death throes of US global dominance.
    The free world needs to work together against the USA, Russia, China, North Korea and other anti-democratic countries.
  • biggles
    biggles Posts: 6,817
    kle4 said:

    Fox News website says Zelensky will sit for an interview with Bret Baier at 6PM

    Could be painful - Zelensky cannot exactly deny things got super heated, but the Fox audience won't want to hear that Trump did anything wrong. Blame Vance for things going sour?

    He might be on Fox but he’s a real journalist. They don’t have many but they have some.
  • another_richard
    another_richard Posts: 27,927
    HYUFD said:

    another_richard said:

    HYUFD said:

    another_richard said:

    Taz said:

    If only the democrats hadn’t anointed an incompetent clown who flopped badly in the primaries when Biden won as a candidate to stand against Trump. We may not be in this mess.

    The Dems (who we are often told are the educated, intelligent people):

    Had an attorney general who made no effort to bring Trump to justice.

    All claimed that a senile old man was good for another four years.

    At the last moment replaced the senile old man with someone who everyone said was unelectable and who couldn't even be bothered to campaign on Biden's economic achievements.
    The Dems would have lost regardless because of cost of living, which with Trump's tariffs should also likely see the GOP lose in 2026 and 2028
    The tipping point state was Pennsylvania, which Trump won by 1.71% - it was very close.

    If Biden had announced he was going to serve only one term and allowed a proper primary the Dems could have won.
    I repeat, they would not have because of cost of living, that was what all the polls said was the main reason why 2020 Biden voters who switched to Trump last November did so
    It would have taken a 1% swing.

    A different candidate might have achieved that.

    There are plenty of cases where a different candidate has made the difference both in the USA and in other countries.
  • MattW
    MattW Posts: 28,302
    Epstein files release proceeding as smoothly and seriously as expected:

    Congresswoman furious after GOP House Judiciary Epstein document troll

    Florida Representative Anna Paulina Luna, head of the congressional task force charged with releasing federal secrets, called for the person in charge of the House Republicans on the Judiciary Committee’s X account to be fired after rickrolling social media users.

    The official government account wrote, ”EPSTEIN FILES RELEASED” only to include a link to musician Rick Astley’s song Never Gonna Give You Up – a form of trolling people.

    “The amount of people hurt by Epstein is not a joke. Whoever posted this is going to get fired. Disgusting behavior,” Luna tweeted Thursday evening, sharing the now-removed link to the post.

    How Pam Bondi rolls....
  • AnthonyT
    AnthonyT Posts: 149
    Eabhal said:

    Cancel the visit. People won't stand for this. I don't blame Starmer for giving diplomacy a go but...

    The c-word rule is being pushed to the limit here.

    If the State visit goes ahead - and it shouldn't - we should invite Zelensky to the state banquet and give him a prominent seat.

    Hell, let's invite the Canadian and Danish PMs as well.
  • Taz
    Taz Posts: 19,666
    biggles said:

    I think some former presidents have to speak out. Starting with Bush.

    Yes, words from the Warmonger of the Middle East is what we need right now.
  • Richard_Tyndall
    Richard_Tyndall Posts: 33,463
    Daveyboy1961 said:

    kle4 said:

    kinabalu said:

    Well hopefully this ends all equivocation even amongst the most alty righty of our community about who and what this man is and what he represents. It's nothing to do with your politics. He's evil.

    Very naiive of you. The pretexts for continued support write themselves:

    Trump's language may have been a bit harsh, but Zelensky is an unelected leader sending consripts to die in a war which, to be fair, we in the West partly caused, and I don't want my children to die in WW3 either do you, and it's just common sense that you agree to a deal if you go to the White House, Zelensky shouldn't have gone if he was not prepared to do so, and Trump, though rude, is trying to get things to return to peace so ultimately he is in the right.

    And so on.
    shill
    Kle4 was writing an example of what the alt-right Trump apologists on here will say to excuse their beloved leader. He wasn't advocating that position for himself. That should be obvious from the way the post was constructed.
  • Nigelb
    Nigelb Posts: 79,347
    Daveyboy1961 said:

    According to LBC this was a premeditated mugging by Trump and Vance.

    What a pair of bastards.

    That was pretty clear with the Vance interventions.
    Who knows with Trump ? Vance had very clearly prepped his lines.
  • IanB2
    IanB2 Posts: 52,310
    MattW said:

    Epstein files release proceeding as smoothly and seriously as expected:

    Congresswoman furious after GOP House Judiciary Epstein document troll

    Florida Representative Anna Paulina Luna, head of the congressional task force charged with releasing federal secrets, called for the person in charge of the House Republicans on the Judiciary Committee’s X account to be fired after rickrolling social media users.

    The official government account wrote, ”EPSTEIN FILES RELEASED” only to include a link to musician Rick Astley’s song Never Gonna Give You Up – a form of trolling people.

    “The amount of people hurt by Epstein is not a joke. Whoever posted this is going to get fired. Disgusting behavior,” Luna tweeted Thursday evening, sharing the now-removed link to the post.

    How Pam Bondi rolls....

    If the Epstein thing were coming to a climax now, he’d have got off, wouldn’t he?
  • Taz
    Taz Posts: 19,666
    kle4 said:

    Fox News website says Zelensky will sit for an interview with Bret Baier at 6PM

    Could be painful - Zelensky cannot exactly deny things got super heated, but the Fox audience won't want to hear that Trump did anything wrong. Blame Vance for things going sour?

    Perhaps the Fox audience needs to hear it.
  • Malmesbury
    Malmesbury Posts: 55,723
    IanB2 said:

    Taz said:

    HYUFD said:

    another_richard said:

    Taz said:

    If only the democrats hadn’t anointed an incompetent clown who flopped badly in the primaries when Biden won as a candidate to stand against Trump. We may not be in this mess.

    The Dems (who we are often told are the educated, intelligent people):

    Had an attorney general who made no effort to bring Trump to justice.

    All claimed that a senile old man was good for another four years.

    At the last moment replaced the senile old man with someone who everyone said was unelectable and who couldn't even be bothered to campaign on Biden's economic achievements.
    The Dems would have lost regardless because of cost of living, which with Trump's tariffs should also likely see the GOP lose in 2026 and 2028
    Given Trumps economic policies inflation is rising, consumer confidence is slipping, he’s got a whole lot of pain to come unless he reverse ferrets.
    In the short term the consequences for Ukraine may well be tragic.

    Taking a longer view, we’re witnessing the death throes of US global dominance.
    Oxcalic acid, old bean. Oxaclic acid.

    Must write that header.
  • kle4
    kle4 Posts: 99,113
    edited February 28
    biggles said:

    kle4 said:

    Fox News website says Zelensky will sit for an interview with Bret Baier at 6PM

    Could be painful - Zelensky cannot exactly deny things got super heated, but the Fox audience won't want to hear that Trump did anything wrong. Blame Vance for things going sour?

    He might be on Fox but he’s a real journalist. They don’t have many but they have some.
    Taz said:

    kle4 said:

    Fox News website says Zelensky will sit for an interview with Bret Baier at 6PM

    Could be painful - Zelensky cannot exactly deny things got super heated, but the Fox audience won't want to hear that Trump did anything wrong. Blame Vance for things going sour?

    Perhaps the Fox audience needs to hear it.

    He can only do so much though.

    The Dominion voting lawsuit at Fox revealed that at the highest levels of the company they panic when news their audience did not like (i.e not aligning with what Trump says) gets on the network, as it upsets the audience and leads them to watch more extreme alternatives.
  • Nigelb
    Nigelb Posts: 79,347
    Daveyboy1961 said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Daveyboy1961 said:

    omg, what a pair of bastards.

    Not Zelensky
    Totally, I meant Trump and Vance

    Very shocked that the press pack didn't intervene somehow.
    One journalist tried, and got the same treatment as Zelensky.
  • Taz
    Taz Posts: 19,666
    dixiedean said:

    Taz said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Hmmm


    Presumably he didn’t sign the minerals deal
    The bastard.
    His country deserves to die.
    You miss my point as much as an Everton forward misses the goal.
  • kle4
    kle4 Posts: 99,113
    glw said:

    Jonathan said:

    Was this planned?

    The deal was so one sided with outrageous demands that there was no way Ukraine could agree to it. Give us your wealth, and we'll give you nothing, and let Putin rearm for another go. Who would agree to that?

    .
    And just in case it might still get done, let's publicly upbraid Zelensky in front of the cameras so we can then say he disrespected us.
  • HYUFD
    HYUFD Posts: 128,924
    edited February 28
    another_richard said:

    HYUFD said:

    another_richard said:

    HYUFD said:

    another_richard said:

    Taz said:

    If only the democrats hadn’t anointed an incompetent clown who flopped badly in the primaries when Biden won as a candidate to stand against Trump. We may not be in this mess.

    The Dems (who we are often told are the educated, intelligent people):

    Had an attorney general who made no effort to bring Trump to justice.

    All claimed that a senile old man was good for another four years.

    At the last moment replaced the senile old man with someone who everyone said was unelectable and who couldn't even be bothered to campaign on Biden's economic achievements.
    The Dems would have lost regardless because of cost of living, which with Trump's tariffs should also likely see the GOP lose in 2026 and 2028
    The tipping point state was Pennsylvania, which Trump won by 1.71% - it was very close.

    If Biden had announced he was going to serve only one term and allowed a proper primary the Dems could have won.
    I repeat, they would not have because of cost of living, that was what all the polls said was the main reason why 2020 Biden voters who switched to Trump last November did so
    It would have taken a 1% swing.

    A different candidate might have achieved that.

    There are plenty of cases where a different candidate has made the difference both in the USA and in other countries.
    They would not, they already switched candidates to Harris and she got a bounce but the head to head polls were clear, no alternative to Harris would have done better v Trump.

    American voters had made up their mind they wanted Trump back and now they own that for the next 4 years
  • logical_song
    logical_song Posts: 10,082
    biggles said:

    logical_song said:

    HYUFD said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    HYUFD said:

    Yesterday not looking quite such a good day for Starmer.

    He has just invited for a second state visit to the UK a US President who has just engaged in a shouting match with Zelensky for not grovelling to him enough for a deal while trying to defend his country from Putin

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/us/politics/2025/02/28/zelensky-trump-meeting-white-house-us/?WT.mc_id=e_DM524873&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_FPM_New&utmsource=email&utm_medium=Edi_FPM_New20250228&utm_campaign=DM524873

    Starmer can only correct this by withdrawing the invite

    The King cannot welcome Trump now

    Can anyone imagine the demonstrations

    Just not acceptable and a case could be made for the invite being offered far too soon anyway
    Or else he invites Zelensky for a State Visit first and the King also travels to Canada before Trump arrives (I believe they were hoping to confine Trump to Balmoral Estate, Dumfries House and Windsor Castle and keep him out of London anyway)
    HYUFD said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    HYUFD said:

    Yesterday not looking quite such a good day for Starmer.

    He has just invited for a second state visit to the UK a US President who has just engaged in a shouting match with Zelensky for not grovelling to him enough for a deal while trying to defend his country from Putin

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/us/politics/2025/02/28/zelensky-trump-meeting-white-house-us/?WT.mc_id=e_DM524873&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_FPM_New&utmsource=email&utm_medium=Edi_FPM_New20250228&utm_campaign=DM524873

    Starmer can only correct this by withdrawing the invite

    The King cannot welcome Trump now

    Can anyone imagine the demonstrations

    Just not acceptable and a case could be made for the invite being offered far too soon anyway
    Or else he invites Zelensky for a State Visit first and the King also travels to Canada before Trump arrives (I believe they were hoping to confine Trump to Balmoral Estate, Dumfries House and Windsor Castle and keep him out of London anyway)
    Rejoin the EU, invite Canada and Ukraine to also join.
    Not the EU. It’s something else but the something needs to form this weekend.
    If we (and Canada) can no longer rely on the US (and thus NATO) an expanded EU is our best bet.
  • scampi25
    scampi25 Posts: 187
    Razedabode said:

    Stuartinromford said:

    Razedabode said:

    Where do we go from here? Someone needs to stand up to Trump, surely?

    But who?
    Has to be a collective European response. And that means the UK aligning closer to Europe to be honest.

    I’d always felt closer toward the USA - not any more
    Yes. But how many EU countries remain totally silent on increasing their spend on defence? Europe is not united on the next steps. They mostly say the right thing until hard cash is required. Very sad
  • AnneJGP
    AnneJGP Posts: 3,743
    kle4 said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Putin and the Kremlin must be toasting Trump to the rafters

    Putin: And you're sure we've not got anything on him?
    FSB: I've told you a thousand times, boss, not a thing! He just genuinely likes you.
    "..... but given what the man will do unbribed, there's no occasion to."
  • kinabalu
    kinabalu Posts: 46,267
    IanB2 said:

    MattW said:

    Epstein files release proceeding as smoothly and seriously as expected:

    Congresswoman furious after GOP House Judiciary Epstein document troll

    Florida Representative Anna Paulina Luna, head of the congressional task force charged with releasing federal secrets, called for the person in charge of the House Republicans on the Judiciary Committee’s X account to be fired after rickrolling social media users.

    The official government account wrote, ”EPSTEIN FILES RELEASED” only to include a link to musician Rick Astley’s song Never Gonna Give You Up – a form of trolling people.

    “The amount of people hurt by Epstein is not a joke. Whoever posted this is going to get fired. Disgusting behavior,” Luna tweeted Thursday evening, sharing the now-removed link to the post.

    How Pam Bondi rolls....

    If the Epstein thing were coming to a climax now, he’d have got off, wouldn’t he?
    Cabinet.
  • Razedabode
    Razedabode Posts: 3,117
    logical_song said:

    biggles said:

    logical_song said:

    HYUFD said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    HYUFD said:

    Yesterday not looking quite such a good day for Starmer.

    He has just invited for a second state visit to the UK a US President who has just engaged in a shouting match with Zelensky for not grovelling to him enough for a deal while trying to defend his country from Putin

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/us/politics/2025/02/28/zelensky-trump-meeting-white-house-us/?WT.mc_id=e_DM524873&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_FPM_New&utmsource=email&utm_medium=Edi_FPM_New20250228&utm_campaign=DM524873

    Starmer can only correct this by withdrawing the invite

    The King cannot welcome Trump now

    Can anyone imagine the demonstrations

    Just not acceptable and a case could be made for the invite being offered far too soon anyway
    Or else he invites Zelensky for a State Visit first and the King also travels to Canada before Trump arrives (I believe they were hoping to confine Trump to Balmoral Estate, Dumfries House and Windsor Castle and keep him out of London anyway)
    HYUFD said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    HYUFD said:

    Yesterday not looking quite such a good day for Starmer.

    He has just invited for a second state visit to the UK a US President who has just engaged in a shouting match with Zelensky for not grovelling to him enough for a deal while trying to defend his country from Putin

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/us/politics/2025/02/28/zelensky-trump-meeting-white-house-us/?WT.mc_id=e_DM524873&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_FPM_New&utmsource=email&utm_medium=Edi_FPM_New20250228&utm_campaign=DM524873

    Starmer can only correct this by withdrawing the invite

    The King cannot welcome Trump now

    Can anyone imagine the demonstrations

    Just not acceptable and a case could be made for the invite being offered far too soon anyway
    Or else he invites Zelensky for a State Visit first and the King also travels to Canada before Trump arrives (I believe they were hoping to confine Trump to Balmoral Estate, Dumfries House and Windsor Castle and keep him out of London anyway)
    Rejoin the EU, invite Canada and Ukraine to also join.
    Not the EU. It’s something else but the something needs to form this weekend.
    If we (and Canada) can no longer rely on the US (and thus NATO) an expanded EU is our best bet.
    Absolutely. Draw Canada in closely
  • Sunil_Prasannan
    Sunil_Prasannan Posts: 55,076
    kle4 said:


    glw said:

    Jonathan said:

    Was this planned?

    The deal was so one sided with outrageous demands that there was no way Ukraine could agree to it. Give us your wealth, and we'll give you nothing, and let Putin rearm for another go. Who would agree to that?

    .
    And just in case it might still get done, let's publicly upbraid Zelensky in front of the cameras so we can then say he disrespected us.
    Shades of Hacha and Hitler in 1939.
  • Mexicanpete
    Mexicanpete Posts: 33,110
    another_richard said:

    HYUFD said:

    another_richard said:

    HYUFD said:

    another_richard said:

    Taz said:

    If only the democrats hadn’t anointed an incompetent clown who flopped badly in the primaries when Biden won as a candidate to stand against Trump. We may not be in this mess.

    The Dems (who we are often told are the educated, intelligent people):

    Had an attorney general who made no effort to bring Trump to justice.

    All claimed that a senile old man was good for another four years.

    At the last moment replaced the senile old man with someone who everyone said was unelectable and who couldn't even be bothered to campaign on Biden's economic achievements.
    The Dems would have lost regardless because of cost of living, which with Trump's tariffs should also likely see the GOP lose in 2026 and 2028
    The tipping point state was Pennsylvania, which Trump won by 1.71% - it was very close.

    If Biden had announced he was going to serve only one term and allowed a proper primary the Dems could have won.
    I repeat, they would not have because of cost of living, that was what all the polls said was the main reason why 2020 Biden voters who switched to Trump last November did so
    It would have taken a 1% swing.

    A different candidate might have achieved that.

    There are plenty of cases where a different candidate has made the difference both in the USA and in other countries.
    This is outrageous that you are blaming Kamala. The orange hood is clearly a Russian asset.
This discussion has been closed.

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