I wonder how a Trump operative managed to con those Guardianistas into campaigning for him. Will he be able to get them to campaign in Irish working class neighborhoods? That would be one obvious place they would be effective in increasing the Trump vote.
I don't think we should knock reparations until we've tried it. I think we have a huge claim against Italy. After all, what did the Romans ever do for us?
Unlike Trump they managed to build a wall. (Very near me too, and some of it is still standing).
*Two* walls, of course, in the provinces of Britannia: and rather a lot more elsewhere, though more strictly border line systems rather than full walls.
Does anyone know if the second was built because (a) the first was a great success or (b) the first was a failure?
More column B, I believe. The Antonine Wall came later as a kind of force projection when the raids from Caledonia continued even after Hadrian's was built.
I wouldn't know myself, but this has reminded me that just to add complication there is a third frontier system still further north - the Gask Ridge in Perthshire, a patrol road with a string of watchtowers, a few (just earthworks now) open to the public.
I think they came much earlier with the initial attempt at conquest. They got as far as Cawdor.
And then there is the mystery of Mons Graupius. Always on the look out for something unusual when I'm walking and cycling about in the Cairngorms - just imagine stumbling across that battlefield.
(Will somebody please elect/appoint a PM who understands their duty is to the United Kingdom and not Canzuk, the Commonwealth, the Anglosphere, or any other polity?)
The Starmer photo at the bottom of that section is very 'This is fine..."
Interesting from the article. @Leon Starmer is buckling, as you said he would.
"Keir Starmer is open to discussing non-cash forms of reparatory justice for Britain’s former colonies, the Guardian understands.
The prime minister is under pressure to open the door to reparations at the Commonwealth heads of government meeting (Chogm) in Samoa this week.
Caribbean countries have been pushing for the issue to be discussed at the summit, despite resistance from the UK government.
No 10 has ruled out paying reparations or apologising for the UK’s role in the transatlantic slave trade, and this uncompromising tone has irritated some Commonwealth countries.
But a Downing Street source indicated that the UK could support some forms of reparatory justice, such restructuring financial institutions and providing debt relief. The source said:
There is a general sense that these multilateral institutions give out loans to developing countries then charge large interest rates for repayments.
They added that reforming financial situations was something the UK often took a lead on and was a form of reparatory justice that would not come at a cost to UK taxpayers.
Other proposed forms of restorative justice include making a formal apology, running educational programmes, establishing cultural institutions and providing economic and public health support.
A draft of the CHOGM communique leaked to the BBC said that governments, “noting calls for discussions on reparatory justice with regard to the transatlantic trade in enslaved Africans and chattel enslavement … agreed that the time has come for a meaningful, truthful and respectful conversation towards forging a common future based on equity.”
According to the broadcaster the communique sought to broaden the issue to include the slave trade not just across the Atlantic but in the Pacific, by saying that a majority of Commonwealth countries “share common historical experiences”."
So a document conveniently leaked to, and recycled by, the Beeb now has them looking to expand the shakedown to Pacific nations too.
Trebles all round.
He folded on Chagos. He will fold on this. He is a supine vain cowardly imbecile who will bankrupt us all and destroy his government in months
Look at the photo of Starmer at Samoa they are using in the guardian. Even they despise him
The Labour government is going to fold. They really are. Everyone can see how they caved on Chagos
From the guardian
“Starmer under pressure to accept case for slavery reparations, as Commonwealth minister claims UK will eventually agree Keir Starmer has been told by Commonwealth leaders he must come to the table to discuss reparations for the “ill effects” of slavery, PA Media reports.
Commonwealth nations are looking at an agreement that could begin conversations on the issue through a communique, according to the BBC.
Frederick Mitchell, foreign minister for the Bahamas, told the Today programme that Starmer should take part in a discussion which “needs to be had about the history” around reparations. Mitchell said:
There appears to be even a reluctance to have the conversation start. Many of the institutions in the UK have already conceded the point of apology, the British government isn’t quite there. But at this time, the discussion needs to be had about the history of this and the ill effects of what happened after slavery was abolished, which continue to affect our societies today. Mitchell said that he expected discussions on the wording of the communique to continue overnight and that leaders might have to get involved in settling the details. He indicated there was some opposition to having a declaration on reparatory justice in the communique – even though countries like his, he said, thought this wording was “innocuous” and that there really should be “an apology and a commitment to reparations”. He also predicted that eventually Starmer would shift on this. “It’s only a matter of time before his position changes, I am confident of it,” Mitchell said”
I bet he’s confident. Labour will buckle but they will try and disguise it as something else. Spineless fucking cretins
You voted for them too Leon !!!
A shakedown is a shakedown but I suspect you are right. Labour will buckle. Just as the Tories did on Climate reparations at a COP meeting. It starts small but ends up growing and becoming vast.
I also noted that Ayesha Hazarika was, on TV today, pretty much saying we should pay them and she is not from the lunatic labour fringe.
Labour will yield on this. It won't be the trillions, but they will yield.
People living in the Caribbean now benefit hugely from slavery, as Caribbean living standards (average GDP per head $6,820) are on average much higher than those in West Africa (average GDP per head $1,937).
So if anybody owes anybody anything for what happened centuries ago, they owe us.
Or the impact of constant slaving raids devastated West Africa, and denuded it of its most capable citizens.
Am I the only one who thinks some form historical rebalancing with our Commonwealth family might be… a good idea?
Why don’t you offer to pay personally then?
While you’re at it you can give me some money for my grandmother who worked as a child slave in the st Agnes tin mines age 9, and died aged 48 partly as a result. Thanks. DM me for my bank deets
I think reform voters would love Ashgabat. Everything is so black or white. The buildings are all white. White marble. Even the sweeping roads are bordered by marble.
The cars are all white (okay, a few choose the allowed silvery white or goldy white - but if you want a British Racing Green Morgan, you will have to leave it at the city limits).
There is no litter.
There is no graffiti.
There are no flyers.
I have seen but a single cyclist.
And only one person who looked a bit like Bhorat.
But plenty of doe-eyed central-Asian ladies. In national dress. Who giggle with a fetching charm.
And on the way to the Conference, you get your own police car outrider. With blues and twos flashing.
And on the way back.
And when going out to dinner. Although there is no crime.
At dinner you are entertained by the Turkmen Elvis. And a pyramid made by young Turkmen acrobats. And a troupe of doe-eyed central-Asian ladies. In national dress.
At a bus stop, you get a luxury shelter. With aircon.
Every road crossing looks like the entrance to a subway. With escalators.
Fuel is crazy cheap.
As is electricity.
And heating.
Let's face it Nige, it's a lot better than Jaywick...
I imagine the police outrider is to keep you in line, not to keep the natives away.
(Will somebody please elect/appoint a PM who understands their duty is to the United Kingdom and not Canzuk, the Commonwealth, the Anglosphere, or any other polity?)
The Starmer photo at the bottom of that section is very 'This is fine..."
Interesting from the article. @Leon Starmer is buckling, as you said he would.
"Keir Starmer is open to discussing non-cash forms of reparatory justice for Britain’s former colonies, the Guardian understands.
The prime minister is under pressure to open the door to reparations at the Commonwealth heads of government meeting (Chogm) in Samoa this week.
Caribbean countries have been pushing for the issue to be discussed at the summit, despite resistance from the UK government.
No 10 has ruled out paying reparations or apologising for the UK’s role in the transatlantic slave trade, and this uncompromising tone has irritated some Commonwealth countries.
But a Downing Street source indicated that the UK could support some forms of reparatory justice, such restructuring financial institutions and providing debt relief. The source said:
There is a general sense that these multilateral institutions give out loans to developing countries then charge large interest rates for repayments.
They added that reforming financial situations was something the UK often took a lead on and was a form of reparatory justice that would not come at a cost to UK taxpayers.
Other proposed forms of restorative justice include making a formal apology, running educational programmes, establishing cultural institutions and providing economic and public health support.
A draft of the CHOGM communique leaked to the BBC said that governments, “noting calls for discussions on reparatory justice with regard to the transatlantic trade in enslaved Africans and chattel enslavement … agreed that the time has come for a meaningful, truthful and respectful conversation towards forging a common future based on equity.”
According to the broadcaster the communique sought to broaden the issue to include the slave trade not just across the Atlantic but in the Pacific, by saying that a majority of Commonwealth countries “share common historical experiences”."
So a document conveniently leaked to, and recycled by, the Beeb now has them looking to expand the shakedown to Pacific nations too.
The Labour government is going to fold. They really are. Everyone can see how they caved on Chagos
From the guardian
“Starmer under pressure to accept case for slavery reparations, as Commonwealth minister claims UK will eventually agree Keir Starmer has been told by Commonwealth leaders he must come to the table to discuss reparations for the “ill effects” of slavery, PA Media reports.
Commonwealth nations are looking at an agreement that could begin conversations on the issue through a communique, according to the BBC.
Frederick Mitchell, foreign minister for the Bahamas, told the Today programme that Starmer should take part in a discussion which “needs to be had about the history” around reparations. Mitchell said:
There appears to be even a reluctance to have the conversation start. Many of the institutions in the UK have already conceded the point of apology, the British government isn’t quite there. But at this time, the discussion needs to be had about the history of this and the ill effects of what happened after slavery was abolished, which continue to affect our societies today. Mitchell said that he expected discussions on the wording of the communique to continue overnight and that leaders might have to get involved in settling the details. He indicated there was some opposition to having a declaration on reparatory justice in the communique – even though countries like his, he said, thought this wording was “innocuous” and that there really should be “an apology and a commitment to reparations”. He also predicted that eventually Starmer would shift on this. “It’s only a matter of time before his position changes, I am confident of it,” Mitchell said”
I bet he’s confident. Labour will buckle but they will try and disguise it as something else. Spineless fucking cretins
You voted for them too Leon !!!
A shakedown is a shakedown but I suspect you are right. Labour will buckle. Just as the Tories did on Climate reparations at a COP meeting. It starts small but ends up growing and becoming vast.
I also noted that Ayesha Hazarika was, on TV today, pretty much saying we should pay them and she is not from the lunatic labour fringe.
Labour will yield on this. It won't be the trillions, but they will yield.
People living in the Caribbean now benefit hugely from slavery, as Caribbean living standards (average GDP per head $6,820) are on average much higher than those in West Africa (average GDP per head $1,937).
So if anybody owes anybody anything for what happened centuries ago, they owe us.
Or the impact of constant slaving raids devastated West Africa, and denuded it of its most capable citizens.
Not my period, but I don't hear the counter-argument raised too much.
Also, the Harrowing of the North led to the death (from memory of Marc Morris' book on the Norman Conquest) of about 75% of the people there.
A pissing contest of historical grievance is useful only for those trying to guilt trip self-hating morons. Everybody has ancestors who perpetrated and suffered terrible things.
Nearly four million died on Britain’s watch, there has to be a reckoning even if it wasn’t malicious.
Why do our generation need to pay a 'reckoning' for stuff that happened a generation or two ago? Let alone stuff that happened longer ago.
And if so, what other things need a reckoning for? has Germany fully 'reckoned' with WW2? Japan certainly has not. Why are we unique in that we need to pay reparations?
Because the UK profited from the invasion and occupation of India.
Give back the Koh-i-Noor for starters.
Again, I ask: Why do our generation need to pay a 'reckoning' for stuff that happened a generation or two ago?
I daresay if I go back in your family tree far enough I'll find a rapist or a murderer. Ditto my own. Would you expect to personally pay reparations to the relatives of the victims?
Do you expect India to pay reparations to the people they jailed in 1948 in Hyderabad - after independence?
The trouble is people and countries are getting confused between the question of reparations from those - usually wealthy families - that benefited financially from theft of labour or assets in the past (and continue to, through their inherited endowments), and the much more sketchy question of paying reparations for past wrongs more generally.
If you are rich, and one of the reasons you are rich is because your forebears nicked stuff that wasn't theirs, then I think there is a case to answer. If you just happen to live in a country whose people did bad stuff to other people in the past, well then you are probably about 99% of the world population.
I think if someone feels that they personally want to contribute something of their inherited wealth to assuage their conscience, that is absolutely fine and and quite a worthy view (though who you give it to is a bigger question). I don’t think you’re obliged to, though - it’s not your actions after all. But yes, morally, I understand the argument.
But, like you, I do not agree that there is some generic obligation on nations and peoples to compensate for stuff that that nation did that no-one in charge today had any responsibility for. The framing of the debate is frustrating though. Morally, many would argue that through the principles of charity etc it is incumbent on more wealthy/powerful countries to support poorer ones. It’s why we have an overseas aid budget, of course. Dressing support up in the language of reparations etc just generates and sustains grievances.
I think that's right, and I'm in favour of a larger overseas aid budget - it's ridiculous that we worry about minor inconveniences and grudges when people are literally starving. It should be based on a mixture of where it's most needed and where it will be spent most effectively. It shouldn't be based on what our forebears did 500 years ago. Arguably that would lead us to send money to prosperous countries in Europe which we treated badly in a previous century.
Agree. Would a sensible way forward be to acknowledge again that slavery, and our part in it, was wrong; note that slavery has been endemic in the human condition and in some places still is; that we are totally committed to its eradication; say clearly that it isn't possible to apologise for things we, the living, have not been doing; and, finally, commit to massively increasing overseas aid, prioritising aid for states most affected by any slavery in the past (not only UK inspired slavery); and also prioritising eradication of slavery in the present.
We give far too much overseas aid as it is.
And the public overwhelmingly agree - it is by far the least poopular form of public spending.
The reason these countries live in poverty these days has nothing to do with slavery, or empires, or anything like that. Plenty of currently prosperous countries were colonised, plenty of nations were enslaved. Countries are poor today because they have crap governments - corrupt, venal, incompetent and often vicious. Sort of like Starmer, except several orders of magnitude worse. Until those are improved, any aid we give is like bailing out the ocean with a teaspoon.
All else is just noise, often made by those same goverments to distract from their gigantic failings.
(Will somebody please elect/appoint a PM who understands their duty is to the United Kingdom and not Canzuk, the Commonwealth, the Anglosphere, or any other polity?)
The Starmer photo at the bottom of that section is very 'This is fine..."
Interesting from the article. @Leon Starmer is buckling, as you said he would.
"Keir Starmer is open to discussing non-cash forms of reparatory justice for Britain’s former colonies, the Guardian understands.
The prime minister is under pressure to open the door to reparations at the Commonwealth heads of government meeting (Chogm) in Samoa this week.
Caribbean countries have been pushing for the issue to be discussed at the summit, despite resistance from the UK government.
No 10 has ruled out paying reparations or apologising for the UK’s role in the transatlantic slave trade, and this uncompromising tone has irritated some Commonwealth countries.
But a Downing Street source indicated that the UK could support some forms of reparatory justice, such restructuring financial institutions and providing debt relief. The source said:
There is a general sense that these multilateral institutions give out loans to developing countries then charge large interest rates for repayments.
They added that reforming financial situations was something the UK often took a lead on and was a form of reparatory justice that would not come at a cost to UK taxpayers.
Other proposed forms of restorative justice include making a formal apology, running educational programmes, establishing cultural institutions and providing economic and public health support.
A draft of the CHOGM communique leaked to the BBC said that governments, “noting calls for discussions on reparatory justice with regard to the transatlantic trade in enslaved Africans and chattel enslavement … agreed that the time has come for a meaningful, truthful and respectful conversation towards forging a common future based on equity.”
According to the broadcaster the communique sought to broaden the issue to include the slave trade not just across the Atlantic but in the Pacific, by saying that a majority of Commonwealth countries “share common historical experiences”."
So a document conveniently leaked to, and recycled by, the Beeb now has them looking to expand the shakedown to Pacific nations too.
Trebles all round.
Next we will be paying USA and China reparations
Harris is open to reparations for US African Americans
(Will somebody please elect/appoint a PM who understands their duty is to the United Kingdom and not Canzuk, the Commonwealth, the Anglosphere, or any other polity?)
The Starmer photo at the bottom of that section is very 'This is fine..."
Interesting from the article. @Leon Starmer is buckling, as you said he would.
"Keir Starmer is open to discussing non-cash forms of reparatory justice for Britain’s former colonies, the Guardian understands.
The prime minister is under pressure to open the door to reparations at the Commonwealth heads of government meeting (Chogm) in Samoa this week.
Caribbean countries have been pushing for the issue to be discussed at the summit, despite resistance from the UK government.
No 10 has ruled out paying reparations or apologising for the UK’s role in the transatlantic slave trade, and this uncompromising tone has irritated some Commonwealth countries.
But a Downing Street source indicated that the UK could support some forms of reparatory justice, such restructuring financial institutions and providing debt relief. The source said:
There is a general sense that these multilateral institutions give out loans to developing countries then charge large interest rates for repayments.
They added that reforming financial situations was something the UK often took a lead on and was a form of reparatory justice that would not come at a cost to UK taxpayers.
Other proposed forms of restorative justice include making a formal apology, running educational programmes, establishing cultural institutions and providing economic and public health support.
A draft of the CHOGM communique leaked to the BBC said that governments, “noting calls for discussions on reparatory justice with regard to the transatlantic trade in enslaved Africans and chattel enslavement … agreed that the time has come for a meaningful, truthful and respectful conversation towards forging a common future based on equity.”
According to the broadcaster the communique sought to broaden the issue to include the slave trade not just across the Atlantic but in the Pacific, by saying that a majority of Commonwealth countries “share common historical experiences”."
So a document conveniently leaked to, and recycled by, the Beeb now has them looking to expand the shakedown to Pacific nations too.
Trebles all round.
In the Pacific the practice was known as "blackbirding" and carried on well past the abolition of slavery:
There is a Kanak community in Queens land descended from these people.
I'm not sure this is as difficult as being made out, as a UK taxpayer I'm quite annoyed that up until 2018 I was paying off slaveowners, but we've got all the details of who benefitted and their descendants, so HMRC could recover the money and it could be paid out in reparation. HRH could also put his hand in his pocket.
Am I the only one who thinks some form historical rebalancing with our Commonwealth family might be… a good idea?
Why don’t you offer to pay personally then?
While you’re at it you can give me some money for my grandmother who worked as a child slave in the st Agnes tin mines age 9, and died aged 48 partly as a result. Thanks. DM me for my bank deets
Well I’m a UK taxpayer so I will be paying personally. That’s kinda how tax and spend works. Duh!
Fuxsake. On the phone to an Irish insurance company and my mind goes blank, I can't remember the phonetic alphabet, so in my very English accent I use: "Victory. Europe." to spell out "VE".
Full credit to the guy on the phone, he doesn't miss a beat repeating it back to me correctly: "Victor. Echo."
Am I the only one who thinks some form historical rebalancing with our Commonwealth family might be… a good idea?
Why don’t you offer to pay personally then?
While you’re at it you can give me some money for my grandmother who worked as a child slave in the st Agnes tin mines age 9, and died aged 48 partly as a result. Thanks. DM me for my bank deets
Well I’m a UK taxpayer so I will be paying personally. That’s kinda how tax and spend works. Duh!
You can volunteer to pay extra. Some people do every year. The tax man is more than happy to accept extra donations.
Not my period, but I don't hear the counter-argument raised too much.
Also, the Harrowing of the North led to the death (from memory of Marc Morris' book on the Norman Conquest) of about 75% of the people there.
A pissing contest of historical grievance is useful only for those trying to guilt trip self-hating morons. Everybody has ancestors who perpetrated and suffered terrible things.
Nearly four million died on Britain’s watch, there has to be a reckoning even if it wasn’t malicious.
Why do our generation need to pay a 'reckoning' for stuff that happened a generation or two ago? Let alone stuff that happened longer ago.
And if so, what other things need a reckoning for? has Germany fully 'reckoned' with WW2? Japan certainly has not. Why are we unique in that we need to pay reparations?
Because the UK profited from the invasion and occupation of India.
Give back the Koh-i-Noor for starters.
Again, I ask: Why do our generation need to pay a 'reckoning' for stuff that happened a generation or two ago?
I daresay if I go back in your family tree far enough I'll find a rapist or a murderer. Ditto my own. Would you expect to personally pay reparations to the relatives of the victims?
Do you expect India to pay reparations to the people they jailed in 1948 in Hyderabad - after independence?
The trouble is people and countries are getting confused between the question of reparations from those - usually wealthy families - that benefited financially from theft of labour or assets in the past (and continue to, through their inherited endowments), and the much more sketchy question of paying reparations for past wrongs more generally.
If you are rich, and one of the reasons you are rich is because your forebears nicked stuff that wasn't theirs, then I think there is a case to answer. If you just happen to live in a country whose people did bad stuff to other people in the past, well then you are probably about 99% of the world population.
I think if someone feels that they personally want to contribute something of their inherited wealth to assuage their conscience, that is absolutely fine and and quite a worthy view (though who you give it to is a bigger question). I don’t think you’re obliged to, though - it’s not your actions after all. But yes, morally, I understand the argument.
But, like you, I do not agree that there is some generic obligation on nations and peoples to compensate for stuff that that nation did that no-one in charge today had any responsibility for. The framing of the debate is frustrating though. Morally, many would argue that through the principles of charity etc it is incumbent on more wealthy/powerful countries to support poorer ones. It’s why we have an overseas aid budget, of course. Dressing support up in the language of reparations etc just generates and sustains grievances.
I think that's right, and I'm in favour of a larger overseas aid budget - it's ridiculous that we worry about minor inconveniences and grudges when people are literally starving. It should be based on a mixture of where it's most needed and where it will be spent most effectively. It shouldn't be based on what our forebears did 500 years ago. Arguably that would lead us to send money to prosperous countries in Europe which we treated badly in a previous century.
Agree. Would a sensible way forward be to acknowledge again that slavery, and our part in it, was wrong; note that slavery has been endemic in the human condition and in some places still is; that we are totally committed to its eradication; say clearly that it isn't possible to apologise for things we, the living, have not been doing; and, finally, commit to massively increasing overseas aid, prioritising aid for states most affected by any slavery in the past (not only UK inspired slavery); and also prioritising eradication of slavery in the present.
We give far too much overseas aid as it is.
And the public overwhelmingly agree - it is by far the least poopular form of public spending.
The reason these countries live in poverty these days has nothing to do with slavery, or empires, or anything like that. Plenty of currently prosperous countries were colonised, plenty of nations were enslaved. Countries are poor today because they have crap governments - corrupt, venal, incompetent and often vicious. Sort of like Starmer, except several orders of magnitude worse. Until those are improved, any aid we give is like bailing out the ocean with a teaspoon.
All else is just noise, often made by those same goverments to distract from their gigantic failings.
The dingbats are already trying to rationalise why this absurd nonsense might be a good idea, and how maybe it is only about presentation.
Absolutely lost their minds. The government are really trying their best to be a one term administration.
(Will somebody please elect/appoint a PM who understands their duty is to the United Kingdom and not Canzuk, the Commonwealth, the Anglosphere, or any other polity?)
The Starmer photo at the bottom of that section is very 'This is fine..."
Interesting from the article. @Leon Starmer is buckling, as you said he would.
"Keir Starmer is open to discussing non-cash forms of reparatory justice for Britain’s former colonies, the Guardian understands.
The prime minister is under pressure to open the door to reparations at the Commonwealth heads of government meeting (Chogm) in Samoa this week.
Caribbean countries have been pushing for the issue to be discussed at the summit, despite resistance from the UK government.
No 10 has ruled out paying reparations or apologising for the UK’s role in the transatlantic slave trade, and this uncompromising tone has irritated some Commonwealth countries.
But a Downing Street source indicated that the UK could support some forms of reparatory justice, such restructuring financial institutions and providing debt relief. The source said:
There is a general sense that these multilateral institutions give out loans to developing countries then charge large interest rates for repayments.
They added that reforming financial situations was something the UK often took a lead on and was a form of reparatory justice that would not come at a cost to UK taxpayers.
Other proposed forms of restorative justice include making a formal apology, running educational programmes, establishing cultural institutions and providing economic and public health support.
A draft of the CHOGM communique leaked to the BBC said that governments, “noting calls for discussions on reparatory justice with regard to the transatlantic trade in enslaved Africans and chattel enslavement … agreed that the time has come for a meaningful, truthful and respectful conversation towards forging a common future based on equity.”
According to the broadcaster the communique sought to broaden the issue to include the slave trade not just across the Atlantic but in the Pacific, by saying that a majority of Commonwealth countries “share common historical experiences”."
So a document conveniently leaked to, and recycled by, the Beeb now has them looking to expand the shakedown to Pacific nations too.
Trebles all round.
Next we will be paying USA and China reparations
I am strongly of the opinion that any spare money should be going towards freeing those who are currently enslaved.
Crime up 10% over past year in England and Wales, ONS says
Robbery, violence with injury and fraud increased notably in the 12 months up to June 2024 – returning to pre-pandemic levels. Meanwhile, the number of shoplifting offences recorded by police rose by 29% to reach a 20-year high. Theft from an individual also increased 20%.
Reform UK gets its first county councillor in Essex as Ongar and Rural former Tory county and district councillor and briefly Hemel Hempstead parliamentary candidate Jaymey McIvor defects to the party https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3rxdynqyppo
I don't know if it was mentioned on here yesterday, but Geoff Capes died, aged 75.
Part of my childhood. RIP.
It was mentioned at the time. He had been rather ill with numerous issues, in no short part having grown to a huge size by continuing to eat the same as he did when he was strong man.
Fuxsake. On the phone to an Irish insurance company and my mind goes blank, I can't remember the phonetic alphabet, so in my very English accent I use: "Victory. Europe." to spell out "VE".
Full credit to the guy on the phone, he doesn't miss a beat repeating it back to me correctly: "Victor. Echo."
A friend is a compliance and complaints manager for Sky, he told me he had to deal with a customer who once told him ‘Q for cucumber’.
Reform UK gets its first county councillor in Essex as Ongar and Rural former Tory county and district councillor and briefly Hemel Hempstead parliamentary candidate Jaymey McIvor defects to the party https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3rxdynqyppo
Any news on what led to the Conservative Party deselecting him?
(Will somebody please elect/appoint a PM who understands their duty is to the United Kingdom and not Canzuk, the Commonwealth, the Anglosphere, or any other polity?)
The Starmer photo at the bottom of that section is very 'This is fine..."
Interesting from the article. @Leon Starmer is buckling, as you said he would.
"Keir Starmer is open to discussing non-cash forms of reparatory justice for Britain’s former colonies, the Guardian understands.
The prime minister is under pressure to open the door to reparations at the Commonwealth heads of government meeting (Chogm) in Samoa this week.
Caribbean countries have been pushing for the issue to be discussed at the summit, despite resistance from the UK government.
No 10 has ruled out paying reparations or apologising for the UK’s role in the transatlantic slave trade, and this uncompromising tone has irritated some Commonwealth countries.
But a Downing Street source indicated that the UK could support some forms of reparatory justice, such restructuring financial institutions and providing debt relief. The source said:
There is a general sense that these multilateral institutions give out loans to developing countries then charge large interest rates for repayments.
They added that reforming financial situations was something the UK often took a lead on and was a form of reparatory justice that would not come at a cost to UK taxpayers.
Other proposed forms of restorative justice include making a formal apology, running educational programmes, establishing cultural institutions and providing economic and public health support.
A draft of the CHOGM communique leaked to the BBC said that governments, “noting calls for discussions on reparatory justice with regard to the transatlantic trade in enslaved Africans and chattel enslavement … agreed that the time has come for a meaningful, truthful and respectful conversation towards forging a common future based on equity.”
According to the broadcaster the communique sought to broaden the issue to include the slave trade not just across the Atlantic but in the Pacific, by saying that a majority of Commonwealth countries “share common historical experiences”."
So a document conveniently leaked to, and recycled by, the Beeb now has them looking to expand the shakedown to Pacific nations too.
Trebles all round.
Next we will be paying USA and China reparations
I am strongly of the opinion that any spare money should be going towards freeing those who are currently enslaved.
Good afternoon, everyone.
Indeed. And that includes people enslaved for prostitution, around the world. Something one of our 'illustrious' contributors should think about.
We may well end up giving billions to countries whose own policies are not dramatically different to the ones we are paying out for.
Am I the only one who thinks some form historical rebalancing with our Commonwealth family might be… a good idea?
Why don’t you offer to pay personally then?
While you’re at it you can give me some money for my grandmother who worked as a child slave in the st Agnes tin mines age 9, and died aged 48 partly as a result. Thanks. DM me for my bank deets
Well I’m a UK taxpayer so I will be paying personally. That’s kinda how tax and spend works. Duh!
You can volunteer to pay extra. Some people do every year. The tax man is more than happy to accept extra donations.
I can’t volunteer not to pay tax for rightwingers’ quarterwitted projects such as Brexit and cancelling HS2, but sadly I have no choice. Such is life.
(Will somebody please elect/appoint a PM who understands their duty is to the United Kingdom and not Canzuk, the Commonwealth, the Anglosphere, or any other polity?)
The Starmer photo at the bottom of that section is very 'This is fine..."
Interesting from the article. @Leon Starmer is buckling, as you said he would.
"Keir Starmer is open to discussing non-cash forms of reparatory justice for Britain’s former colonies, the Guardian understands.
The prime minister is under pressure to open the door to reparations at the Commonwealth heads of government meeting (Chogm) in Samoa this week.
Caribbean countries have been pushing for the issue to be discussed at the summit, despite resistance from the UK government.
No 10 has ruled out paying reparations or apologising for the UK’s role in the transatlantic slave trade, and this uncompromising tone has irritated some Commonwealth countries.
But a Downing Street source indicated that the UK could support some forms of reparatory justice, such restructuring financial institutions and providing debt relief. The source said:
There is a general sense that these multilateral institutions give out loans to developing countries then charge large interest rates for repayments.
They added that reforming financial situations was something the UK often took a lead on and was a form of reparatory justice that would not come at a cost to UK taxpayers.
Other proposed forms of restorative justice include making a formal apology, running educational programmes, establishing cultural institutions and providing economic and public health support.
A draft of the CHOGM communique leaked to the BBC said that governments, “noting calls for discussions on reparatory justice with regard to the transatlantic trade in enslaved Africans and chattel enslavement … agreed that the time has come for a meaningful, truthful and respectful conversation towards forging a common future based on equity.”
According to the broadcaster the communique sought to broaden the issue to include the slave trade not just across the Atlantic but in the Pacific, by saying that a majority of Commonwealth countries “share common historical experiences”."
So a document conveniently leaked to, and recycled by, the Beeb now has them looking to expand the shakedown to Pacific nations too.
Trebles all round.
Next we will be paying USA and China reparations
I am strongly of the opinion that any spare money should be going towards freeing those who are currently enslaved.
Good afternoon, everyone.
Indeed. And that includes people enslaved for prostitution, around the world. Something one of our 'illustrious' contributors should think about.
We may well end up giving billions to countries whose own policies are not dramatically different to the ones we are paying out for.
It would be grimly funny to end up paying money to nations that .... practise slavery.
Am I the only one who thinks some form historical rebalancing with our Commonwealth family might be… a good idea?
Depends what you mean by "historical rebalancing" really.
Indeed. Up for discussion- hence why I chose the words “some form”. Isn’t this what is being proposed, a discussion with our Commonwealth friends and partners?
The only point taken in the appeal was that of whether the trial should have been abandoned due to the prejudice created by the media storm. Answer: No.
Interesting points to note: The appeal didn't raise the issue of whether there was a case to answer at the close of prosecution, unlike the first appeal.
In this case there was no expert evidence at all. Letby was convicted on circumstantial and eye witness testimony.
The defence didn't appeal allowing evidence of the other convictions being in evidence at the second trial. The judge had given a full and proper direction on how to approach its relevance.
The remaining possible row over the quality of the evidence is that the doctor eye witness didn't report anything at the time. Which is indeed troubling. This was fully examined at the trial.
Reform UK gets its first county councillor in Essex as Ongar and Rural former Tory county and district councillor and briefly Hemel Hempstead parliamentary candidate Jaymey McIvor defects to the party https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3rxdynqyppo
Any news on what led to the Conservative Party deselecting him?
The Labour government is going to fold. They really are. Everyone can see how they caved on Chagos
From the guardian
“Starmer under pressure to accept case for slavery reparations, as Commonwealth minister claims UK will eventually agree Keir Starmer has been told by Commonwealth leaders he must come to the table to discuss reparations for the “ill effects” of slavery, PA Media reports.
Commonwealth nations are looking at an agreement that could begin conversations on the issue through a communique, according to the BBC.
Frederick Mitchell, foreign minister for the Bahamas, told the Today programme that Starmer should take part in a discussion which “needs to be had about the history” around reparations. Mitchell said:
There appears to be even a reluctance to have the conversation start. Many of the institutions in the UK have already conceded the point of apology, the British government isn’t quite there. But at this time, the discussion needs to be had about the history of this and the ill effects of what happened after slavery was abolished, which continue to affect our societies today. Mitchell said that he expected discussions on the wording of the communique to continue overnight and that leaders might have to get involved in settling the details. He indicated there was some opposition to having a declaration on reparatory justice in the communique – even though countries like his, he said, thought this wording was “innocuous” and that there really should be “an apology and a commitment to reparations”. He also predicted that eventually Starmer would shift on this. “It’s only a matter of time before his position changes, I am confident of it,” Mitchell said”
I bet he’s confident. Labour will buckle but they will try and disguise it as something else. Spineless fucking cretins
You voted for them too Leon !!!
A shakedown is a shakedown but I suspect you are right. Labour will buckle. Just as the Tories did on Climate reparations at a COP meeting. It starts small but ends up growing and becoming vast.
I also noted that Ayesha Hazarika was, on TV today, pretty much saying we should pay them and she is not from the lunatic labour fringe.
Labour will yield on this. It won't be the trillions, but they will yield.
People living in the Caribbean now benefit hugely from slavery, as Caribbean living standards (average GDP per head $6,820) are on average much higher than those in West Africa (average GDP per head $1,937).
So if anybody owes anybody anything for what happened centuries ago, they owe us.
Or the impact of constant slaving raids devastated West Africa, and denuded it of its most capable citizens.
Yes, but that was other Africans. And Arabs. Really it should be Africans paying Caribbeans reparations. But then Nigerians aren't taught that Nigeria is the root of all evil, so would tell them to do one. Or maybe the whole idea is a) a grift, b) unworkable and c) stupid.
Reform UK gets its first county councillor in Essex as Ongar and Rural former Tory county and district councillor and briefly Hemel Hempstead parliamentary candidate Jaymey McIvor defects to the party https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3rxdynqyppo
Any news on what led to the Conservative Party deselecting him?
Reform UK gets its first county councillor in Essex as Ongar and Rural former Tory county and district councillor and briefly Hemel Hempstead parliamentary candidate Jaymey McIvor defects to the party https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3rxdynqyppo
Any news on what led to the Conservative Party deselecting him?
Reform UK gets its first county councillor in Essex as Ongar and Rural former Tory county and district councillor and briefly Hemel Hempstead parliamentary candidate Jaymey McIvor defects to the party https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3rxdynqyppo
Any news on what led to the Conservative Party deselecting him?
He didnt go willingly they suspended his membership following a complaint taking him out from being the PPC.
Seems like there are still some Russia hawks in the Republican Party.
House Intelligence Committee Chair Mike Turner (R-Ohio) on Wednesday said the U.S. should consider taking “direct military action” if North Korean troops enter the war in Ukraine. .. “The Biden-Harris Administration must make clear that North Korean troops entering this conflict are a red line for the United States,” Turner said in a statement.
“If North Korean troops were to invade Ukraine’s sovereign territory, the United States needs to seriously consider taking direct military action against the North Korean troops,” he added.
"In 1971, the BIOT commissioner and governor of the Seychelles, Sir Bruce Greatbatch,[71] enacted an Immigration Ordinance that made it unlawful for any person to enter or remain in the Chagos Archipelago without a permit.[72] This law did not apply to members of the British armed forces or UK government officials.[73]
The same year, Greatbatch ordered all the dogs on Diego Garcia to be killed, an order that was carried out by company manager Marcel Moulinie. Moulinie described later how he first tried shooting the dogs, then poisoning them. Eventually more than 1,000 dogs, including pets, were gassed with exhaust fumes, from pipes attached to the exhaust pipes of US military vehicles.[74] Talate Louis said her family’s dog was killed; they felt it was done to make them leave."
The Labour government is going to fold. They really are. Everyone can see how they caved on Chagos
From the guardian
“Starmer under pressure to accept case for slavery reparations, as Commonwealth minister claims UK will eventually agree Keir Starmer has been told by Commonwealth leaders he must come to the table to discuss reparations for the “ill effects” of slavery, PA Media reports.
Commonwealth nations are looking at an agreement that could begin conversations on the issue through a communique, according to the BBC.
Frederick Mitchell, foreign minister for the Bahamas, told the Today programme that Starmer should take part in a discussion which “needs to be had about the history” around reparations. Mitchell said:
There appears to be even a reluctance to have the conversation start. Many of the institutions in the UK have already conceded the point of apology, the British government isn’t quite there. But at this time, the discussion needs to be had about the history of this and the ill effects of what happened after slavery was abolished, which continue to affect our societies today. Mitchell said that he expected discussions on the wording of the communique to continue overnight and that leaders might have to get involved in settling the details. He indicated there was some opposition to having a declaration on reparatory justice in the communique – even though countries like his, he said, thought this wording was “innocuous” and that there really should be “an apology and a commitment to reparations”. He also predicted that eventually Starmer would shift on this. “It’s only a matter of time before his position changes, I am confident of it,” Mitchell said”
I bet he’s confident. Labour will buckle but they will try and disguise it as something else. Spineless fucking cretins
You voted for them too Leon !!!
A shakedown is a shakedown but I suspect you are right. Labour will buckle. Just as the Tories did on Climate reparations at a COP meeting. It starts small but ends up growing and becoming vast.
I also noted that Ayesha Hazarika was, on TV today, pretty much saying we should pay them and she is not from the lunatic labour fringe.
Labour will yield on this. It won't be the trillions, but they will yield.
People living in the Caribbean now benefit hugely from slavery, as Caribbean living standards (average GDP per head $6,820) are on average much higher than those in West Africa (average GDP per head $1,937).
So if anybody owes anybody anything for what happened centuries ago, they owe us.
Or the impact of constant slaving raids devastated West Africa, and denuded it of its most capable citizens.
Yes, but that was other Africans. And Arabs. Really it should be Africans paying Caribbeans reparations. But then Nigerians aren't taught that Nigeria is the root of all evil, so would tell them to do one. Or maybe the whole idea is a) a grift, b) unworkable and c) stupid.
grift by a bunch of lazy shysters for sure. Too used to being spoon fed with aid , they are addicted now and want more.
(Will somebody please elect/appoint a PM who understands their duty is to the United Kingdom and not Canzuk, the Commonwealth, the Anglosphere, or any other polity?)
The Starmer photo at the bottom of that section is very 'This is fine..."
Interesting from the article. @Leon Starmer is buckling, as you said he would.
"Keir Starmer is open to discussing non-cash forms of reparatory justice for Britain’s former colonies, the Guardian understands.
The prime minister is under pressure to open the door to reparations at the Commonwealth heads of government meeting (Chogm) in Samoa this week.
Caribbean countries have been pushing for the issue to be discussed at the summit, despite resistance from the UK government.
No 10 has ruled out paying reparations or apologising for the UK’s role in the transatlantic slave trade, and this uncompromising tone has irritated some Commonwealth countries.
But a Downing Street source indicated that the UK could support some forms of reparatory justice, such restructuring financial institutions and providing debt relief. The source said:
There is a general sense that these multilateral institutions give out loans to developing countries then charge large interest rates for repayments.
They added that reforming financial situations was something the UK often took a lead on and was a form of reparatory justice that would not come at a cost to UK taxpayers.
Other proposed forms of restorative justice include making a formal apology, running educational programmes, establishing cultural institutions and providing economic and public health support.
A draft of the CHOGM communique leaked to the BBC said that governments, “noting calls for discussions on reparatory justice with regard to the transatlantic trade in enslaved Africans and chattel enslavement … agreed that the time has come for a meaningful, truthful and respectful conversation towards forging a common future based on equity.”
According to the broadcaster the communique sought to broaden the issue to include the slave trade not just across the Atlantic but in the Pacific, by saying that a majority of Commonwealth countries “share common historical experiences”."
So a document conveniently leaked to, and recycled by, the Beeb now has them looking to expand the shakedown to Pacific nations too.
Trebles all round.
Next we will be paying USA and China reparations
Harris is open to reparations for US African Americans
Am I the only one who thinks some form historical rebalancing with our Commonwealth family might be… a good idea?
Depends what you mean by "historical rebalancing" really.
Indeed. Up for discussion- hence why I chose the words “some form”. Isn’t this what is being proposed, a discussion with our Commonwealth friends and partners?
Which is why I posted the Caricom proposals because they are more subtle and nuanced than the cash grab being proposed by some Caribbean politicians.
Harris' average lead with 538 has more or less halved, since the end of August.
All the vibes are saying Trump has this in the bag, aren't they? We'd better get used to the idea.
Yep. As that Sean Trende article yesterday noted, what the candidates are doing suggests both know that Harris is behind in rust belt and that the popular vote might be possible for Trump....
Reform UK gets its first county councillor in Essex as Ongar and Rural former Tory county and district councillor and briefly Hemel Hempstead parliamentary candidate Jaymey McIvor defects to the party https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3rxdynqyppo
Any news on what led to the Conservative Party deselecting him?
But the Tory party also suspended his membership - so I wouldn't say he defected, more rejected..
I'm trying to... I am obviously missing something, a comment at the bottom refers to him possibly batting for the other side, but that's more or less compulsory in the party now anyway so it wont be that.
Must have been pretty serious to suspend his candidacy just before closure of nominations. It does suggest maybe Reform have bit done due diligence.
Reform UK gets its first county councillor in Essex as Ongar and Rural former Tory county and district councillor and briefly Hemel Hempstead parliamentary candidate Jaymey McIvor defects to the party https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3rxdynqyppo
Any news on what led to the Conservative Party deselecting him?
Bestiality.
To be fair that is mildly better than what i feared.
Harris' average lead with 538 has more or less halved, since the end of August.
All the vibes are saying Trump has this in the bag, aren't they? We'd better get used to the idea.
Yep. As that Sean Trende article yesterday noted, what the candidates are doing suggests both know that Harris is behind in rust belt and that the popular vote might be possible for Trump....
that will put the cat among the pigeons in Europe when the lazy barstewards realise they will need to fight Putin on their own.
(Will somebody please elect/appoint a PM who understands their duty is to the United Kingdom and not Canzuk, the Commonwealth, the Anglosphere, or any other polity?)
The Starmer photo at the bottom of that section is very 'This is fine..."
Interesting from the article. @Leon Starmer is buckling, as you said he would.
"Keir Starmer is open to discussing non-cash forms of reparatory justice for Britain’s former colonies, the Guardian understands.
The prime minister is under pressure to open the door to reparations at the Commonwealth heads of government meeting (Chogm) in Samoa this week.
Caribbean countries have been pushing for the issue to be discussed at the summit, despite resistance from the UK government.
No 10 has ruled out paying reparations or apologising for the UK’s role in the transatlantic slave trade, and this uncompromising tone has irritated some Commonwealth countries.
But a Downing Street source indicated that the UK could support some forms of reparatory justice, such restructuring financial institutions and providing debt relief. The source said:
There is a general sense that these multilateral institutions give out loans to developing countries then charge large interest rates for repayments.
They added that reforming financial situations was something the UK often took a lead on and was a form of reparatory justice that would not come at a cost to UK taxpayers.
Other proposed forms of restorative justice include making a formal apology, running educational programmes, establishing cultural institutions and providing economic and public health support.
A draft of the CHOGM communique leaked to the BBC said that governments, “noting calls for discussions on reparatory justice with regard to the transatlantic trade in enslaved Africans and chattel enslavement … agreed that the time has come for a meaningful, truthful and respectful conversation towards forging a common future based on equity.”
According to the broadcaster the communique sought to broaden the issue to include the slave trade not just across the Atlantic but in the Pacific, by saying that a majority of Commonwealth countries “share common historical experiences”."
So a document conveniently leaked to, and recycled by, the Beeb now has them looking to expand the shakedown to Pacific nations too.
Trebles all round.
Next we will be paying USA and China reparations
I am strongly of the opinion that any spare money should be going towards freeing those who are currently enslaved.
Good afternoon, everyone.
Steady on.
Can't you wait until the chaps in the Libyan Coastguard have finished selling them, first?
Harris' average lead with 538 has more or less halved, since the end of August.
All the vibes are saying Trump has this in the bag, aren't they? We'd better get used to the idea.
Yep. As that Sean Trende article yesterday noted, what the candidates are doing suggests both know that Harris is behind in rust belt and that the popular vote might be possible for Trump....
Trump campaigning in places like New York is not outlandish when you consider that there are competitive House races there.
The Labour government is going to fold. They really are. Everyone can see how they caved on Chagos
From the guardian
“Starmer under pressure to accept case for slavery reparations, as Commonwealth minister claims UK will eventually agree Keir Starmer has been told by Commonwealth leaders he must come to the table to discuss reparations for the “ill effects” of slavery, PA Media reports.
Commonwealth nations are looking at an agreement that could begin conversations on the issue through a communique, according to the BBC.
Frederick Mitchell, foreign minister for the Bahamas, told the Today programme that Starmer should take part in a discussion which “needs to be had about the history” around reparations. Mitchell said:
There appears to be even a reluctance to have the conversation start. Many of the institutions in the UK have already conceded the point of apology, the British government isn’t quite there. But at this time, the discussion needs to be had about the history of this and the ill effects of what happened after slavery was abolished, which continue to affect our societies today. Mitchell said that he expected discussions on the wording of the communique to continue overnight and that leaders might have to get involved in settling the details. He indicated there was some opposition to having a declaration on reparatory justice in the communique – even though countries like his, he said, thought this wording was “innocuous” and that there really should be “an apology and a commitment to reparations”. He also predicted that eventually Starmer would shift on this. “It’s only a matter of time before his position changes, I am confident of it,” Mitchell said”
I bet he’s confident. Labour will buckle but they will try and disguise it as something else. Spineless fucking cretins
You voted for them too Leon !!!
A shakedown is a shakedown but I suspect you are right. Labour will buckle. Just as the Tories did on Climate reparations at a COP meeting. It starts small but ends up growing and becoming vast.
I also noted that Ayesha Hazarika was, on TV today, pretty much saying we should pay them and she is not from the lunatic labour fringe.
Labour will yield on this. It won't be the trillions, but they will yield.
People living in the Caribbean now benefit hugely from slavery, as Caribbean living standards (average GDP per head $6,820) are on average much higher than those in West Africa (average GDP per head $1,937).
So if anybody owes anybody anything for what happened centuries ago, they owe us.
Or the impact of constant slaving raids devastated West Africa, and denuded it of its most capable citizens.
Yes, but that was other Africans. And Arabs. Really it should be Africans paying Caribbeans reparations. But then Nigerians aren't taught that Nigeria is the root of all evil, so would tell them to do one. Or maybe the whole idea is a) a grift, b) unworkable and c) stupid.
Nigerians are scary.
I have a Nigerian friend/colleague and she told me how badly her father reacted to the time she came home with 11 A+ results and an A in some school exams.
Apparently she had brought shame on the family for getting a mere A and her father didn’t speak to her for a week and grounded her!
That is a common reaction amongst Nigerian parents.
The Labour government is going to fold. They really are. Everyone can see how they caved on Chagos
From the guardian
“Starmer under pressure to accept case for slavery reparations, as Commonwealth minister claims UK will eventually agree Keir Starmer has been told by Commonwealth leaders he must come to the table to discuss reparations for the “ill effects” of slavery, PA Media reports.
Commonwealth nations are looking at an agreement that could begin conversations on the issue through a communique, according to the BBC.
Frederick Mitchell, foreign minister for the Bahamas, told the Today programme that Starmer should take part in a discussion which “needs to be had about the history” around reparations. Mitchell said:
There appears to be even a reluctance to have the conversation start. Many of the institutions in the UK have already conceded the point of apology, the British government isn’t quite there. But at this time, the discussion needs to be had about the history of this and the ill effects of what happened after slavery was abolished, which continue to affect our societies today. Mitchell said that he expected discussions on the wording of the communique to continue overnight and that leaders might have to get involved in settling the details. He indicated there was some opposition to having a declaration on reparatory justice in the communique – even though countries like his, he said, thought this wording was “innocuous” and that there really should be “an apology and a commitment to reparations”. He also predicted that eventually Starmer would shift on this. “It’s only a matter of time before his position changes, I am confident of it,” Mitchell said”
I bet he’s confident. Labour will buckle but they will try and disguise it as something else. Spineless fucking cretins
You voted for them too Leon !!!
A shakedown is a shakedown but I suspect you are right. Labour will buckle. Just as the Tories did on Climate reparations at a COP meeting. It starts small but ends up growing and becoming vast.
I also noted that Ayesha Hazarika was, on TV today, pretty much saying we should pay them and she is not from the lunatic labour fringe.
Labour will yield on this. It won't be the trillions, but they will yield.
People living in the Caribbean now benefit hugely from slavery, as Caribbean living standards (average GDP per head $6,820) are on average much higher than those in West Africa (average GDP per head $1,937).
So if anybody owes anybody anything for what happened centuries ago, they owe us.
Or the impact of constant slaving raids devastated West Africa, and denuded it of its most capable citizens.
Yes, but that was other Africans. And Arabs. Really it should be Africans paying Caribbeans reparations. But then Nigerians aren't taught that Nigeria is the root of all evil, so would tell them to do one. Or maybe the whole idea is a) a grift, b) unworkable and c) stupid.
Harris' average lead with 538 has more or less halved, since the end of August.
All the vibes are saying Trump has this in the bag, aren't they? We'd better get used to the idea.
Yep. As that Sean Trende article yesterday noted, what the candidates are doing suggests both know that Harris is behind in rust belt and that the popular vote might be possible for Trump....
The Labour government is going to fold. They really are. Everyone can see how they caved on Chagos
From the guardian
“Starmer under pressure to accept case for slavery reparations, as Commonwealth minister claims UK will eventually agree Keir Starmer has been told by Commonwealth leaders he must come to the table to discuss reparations for the “ill effects” of slavery, PA Media reports.
Commonwealth nations are looking at an agreement that could begin conversations on the issue through a communique, according to the BBC.
Frederick Mitchell, foreign minister for the Bahamas, told the Today programme that Starmer should take part in a discussion which “needs to be had about the history” around reparations. Mitchell said:
There appears to be even a reluctance to have the conversation start. Many of the institutions in the UK have already conceded the point of apology, the British government isn’t quite there. But at this time, the discussion needs to be had about the history of this and the ill effects of what happened after slavery was abolished, which continue to affect our societies today. Mitchell said that he expected discussions on the wording of the communique to continue overnight and that leaders might have to get involved in settling the details. He indicated there was some opposition to having a declaration on reparatory justice in the communique – even though countries like his, he said, thought this wording was “innocuous” and that there really should be “an apology and a commitment to reparations”. He also predicted that eventually Starmer would shift on this. “It’s only a matter of time before his position changes, I am confident of it,” Mitchell said”
I bet he’s confident. Labour will buckle but they will try and disguise it as something else. Spineless fucking cretins
You voted for them too Leon !!!
A shakedown is a shakedown but I suspect you are right. Labour will buckle. Just as the Tories did on Climate reparations at a COP meeting. It starts small but ends up growing and becoming vast.
I also noted that Ayesha Hazarika was, on TV today, pretty much saying we should pay them and she is not from the lunatic labour fringe.
Labour will yield on this. It won't be the trillions, but they will yield.
People living in the Caribbean now benefit hugely from slavery, as Caribbean living standards (average GDP per head $6,820) are on average much higher than those in West Africa (average GDP per head $1,937).
So if anybody owes anybody anything for what happened centuries ago, they owe us.
Or the impact of constant slaving raids devastated West Africa, and denuded it of its most capable citizens.
Yes, but that was other Africans. And Arabs. Really it should be Africans paying Caribbeans reparations. But then Nigerians aren't taught that Nigeria is the root of all evil, so would tell them to do one. Or maybe the whole idea is a) a grift, b) unworkable and c) stupid.
Nigerians are scary.
I have a Nigerian friend/colleague and she told me how badly her father reacted to the time she came home with 11 A+ results and an A in some school exams.
Apparently she had brought shame on the family for getting a mere A and her father didn’t speak to her for a week and grounded her!
That is a common reaction amongst Nigerian parents.
That's uncanny. My step-son's maths tutor told me about a family from the Ivory Coast that did the same, only with 9A* and 1A, at GCSE.
The mother likewise told the daughter that she had brought shame upon her family. The tutor tried unsuccessfully to persuade the family that the daughter had done really well.
Ambition over self-awareness usually explains why largely unheralded politicians put themselves forward to be political party leader. But perhaps Robert Jenrick threW his hat in the ring for an even more basic reason.
New Milton Keynes MP Chris Curtis wasn't able to move into his parliamentary office until just recently - because Robert Jenrick was very slow to vacate it.
Post election, Jenrick was being shuffled from his really nice big office to one described as "tiny and shit".
Win against Kemi, however, and his housing status is likely assured once more.
The Labour government is going to fold. They really are. Everyone can see how they caved on Chagos
From the guardian
“Starmer under pressure to accept case for slavery reparations, as Commonwealth minister claims UK will eventually agree Keir Starmer has been told by Commonwealth leaders he must come to the table to discuss reparations for the “ill effects” of slavery, PA Media reports.
Commonwealth nations are looking at an agreement that could begin conversations on the issue through a communique, according to the BBC.
Frederick Mitchell, foreign minister for the Bahamas, told the Today programme that Starmer should take part in a discussion which “needs to be had about the history” around reparations. Mitchell said:
There appears to be even a reluctance to have the conversation start. Many of the institutions in the UK have already conceded the point of apology, the British government isn’t quite there. But at this time, the discussion needs to be had about the history of this and the ill effects of what happened after slavery was abolished, which continue to affect our societies today. Mitchell said that he expected discussions on the wording of the communique to continue overnight and that leaders might have to get involved in settling the details. He indicated there was some opposition to having a declaration on reparatory justice in the communique – even though countries like his, he said, thought this wording was “innocuous” and that there really should be “an apology and a commitment to reparations”. He also predicted that eventually Starmer would shift on this. “It’s only a matter of time before his position changes, I am confident of it,” Mitchell said”
I bet he’s confident. Labour will buckle but they will try and disguise it as something else. Spineless fucking cretins
You voted for them too Leon !!!
A shakedown is a shakedown but I suspect you are right. Labour will buckle. Just as the Tories did on Climate reparations at a COP meeting. It starts small but ends up growing and becoming vast.
I also noted that Ayesha Hazarika was, on TV today, pretty much saying we should pay them and she is not from the lunatic labour fringe.
Labour will yield on this. It won't be the trillions, but they will yield.
People living in the Caribbean now benefit hugely from slavery, as Caribbean living standards (average GDP per head $6,820) are on average much higher than those in West Africa (average GDP per head $1,937).
So if anybody owes anybody anything for what happened centuries ago, they owe us.
Or the impact of constant slaving raids devastated West Africa, and denuded it of its most capable citizens.
Yes, but that was other Africans. And Arabs. Really it should be Africans paying Caribbeans reparations. But then Nigerians aren't taught that Nigeria is the root of all evil, so would tell them to do one. Or maybe the whole idea is a) a grift, b) unworkable and c) stupid.
Nigerians are scary.
I have a Nigerian friend/colleague and she told me how badly her father reacted to the time she came home with 11 A+ results and an A in some school exams.
Apparently she had brought shame on the family for getting a mere A and her father didn’t speak to her for a week and grounded her!
That is a common reaction amongst Nigerian parents.
My Ghanian ex was the same.
Her reaction to an incident where one of her sons got bullied for "Acting White" by getting straight As at school was interesting.
She did like my solution, when the school refused to act.
The Labour government is going to fold. They really are. Everyone can see how they caved on Chagos
From the guardian
“Starmer under pressure to accept case for slavery reparations, as Commonwealth minister claims UK will eventually agree Keir Starmer has been told by Commonwealth leaders he must come to the table to discuss reparations for the “ill effects” of slavery, PA Media reports.
Commonwealth nations are looking at an agreement that could begin conversations on the issue through a communique, according to the BBC.
Frederick Mitchell, foreign minister for the Bahamas, told the Today programme that Starmer should take part in a discussion which “needs to be had about the history” around reparations. Mitchell said:
There appears to be even a reluctance to have the conversation start. Many of the institutions in the UK have already conceded the point of apology, the British government isn’t quite there. But at this time, the discussion needs to be had about the history of this and the ill effects of what happened after slavery was abolished, which continue to affect our societies today. Mitchell said that he expected discussions on the wording of the communique to continue overnight and that leaders might have to get involved in settling the details. He indicated there was some opposition to having a declaration on reparatory justice in the communique – even though countries like his, he said, thought this wording was “innocuous” and that there really should be “an apology and a commitment to reparations”. He also predicted that eventually Starmer would shift on this. “It’s only a matter of time before his position changes, I am confident of it,” Mitchell said”
I bet he’s confident. Labour will buckle but they will try and disguise it as something else. Spineless fucking cretins
You voted for them too Leon !!!
A shakedown is a shakedown but I suspect you are right. Labour will buckle. Just as the Tories did on Climate reparations at a COP meeting. It starts small but ends up growing and becoming vast.
I also noted that Ayesha Hazarika was, on TV today, pretty much saying we should pay them and she is not from the lunatic labour fringe.
Labour will yield on this. It won't be the trillions, but they will yield.
People living in the Caribbean now benefit hugely from slavery, as Caribbean living standards (average GDP per head $6,820) are on average much higher than those in West Africa (average GDP per head $1,937).
So if anybody owes anybody anything for what happened centuries ago, they owe us.
Or the impact of constant slaving raids devastated West Africa, and denuded it of its most capable citizens.
Yes, but that was other Africans. And Arabs. Really it should be Africans paying Caribbeans reparations. But then Nigerians aren't taught that Nigeria is the root of all evil, so would tell them to do one. Or maybe the whole idea is a) a grift, b) unworkable and c) stupid.
Nigerians are scary.
I have a Nigerian friend/colleague and she told me how badly her father reacted to the time she came home with 11 A+ results and an A in some school exams.
Apparently she had brought shame on the family for getting a mere A and her father didn’t speak to her for a week and grounded her!
That is a common reaction amongst Nigerian parents.
The Labour government is going to fold. They really are. Everyone can see how they caved on Chagos
From the guardian
“Starmer under pressure to accept case for slavery reparations, as Commonwealth minister claims UK will eventually agree Keir Starmer has been told by Commonwealth leaders he must come to the table to discuss reparations for the “ill effects” of slavery, PA Media reports.
Commonwealth nations are looking at an agreement that could begin conversations on the issue through a communique, according to the BBC.
Frederick Mitchell, foreign minister for the Bahamas, told the Today programme that Starmer should take part in a discussion which “needs to be had about the history” around reparations. Mitchell said:
There appears to be even a reluctance to have the conversation start. Many of the institutions in the UK have already conceded the point of apology, the British government isn’t quite there. But at this time, the discussion needs to be had about the history of this and the ill effects of what happened after slavery was abolished, which continue to affect our societies today. Mitchell said that he expected discussions on the wording of the communique to continue overnight and that leaders might have to get involved in settling the details. He indicated there was some opposition to having a declaration on reparatory justice in the communique – even though countries like his, he said, thought this wording was “innocuous” and that there really should be “an apology and a commitment to reparations”. He also predicted that eventually Starmer would shift on this. “It’s only a matter of time before his position changes, I am confident of it,” Mitchell said”
I bet he’s confident. Labour will buckle but they will try and disguise it as something else. Spineless fucking cretins
You voted for them too Leon !!!
A shakedown is a shakedown but I suspect you are right. Labour will buckle. Just as the Tories did on Climate reparations at a COP meeting. It starts small but ends up growing and becoming vast.
I also noted that Ayesha Hazarika was, on TV today, pretty much saying we should pay them and she is not from the lunatic labour fringe.
Labour will yield on this. It won't be the trillions, but they will yield.
People living in the Caribbean now benefit hugely from slavery, as Caribbean living standards (average GDP per head $6,820) are on average much higher than those in West Africa (average GDP per head $1,937).
So if anybody owes anybody anything for what happened centuries ago, they owe us.
Or the impact of constant slaving raids devastated West Africa, and denuded it of its most capable citizens.
Yes, but that was other Africans. And Arabs. Really it should be Africans paying Caribbeans reparations. But then Nigerians aren't taught that Nigeria is the root of all evil, so would tell them to do one. Or maybe the whole idea is a) a grift, b) unworkable and c) stupid.
Nigerians are scary.
I have a Nigerian friend/colleague and she told me how badly her father reacted to the time she came home with 11 A+ results and an A in some school exams.
Apparently she had brought shame on the family for getting a mere A and her father didn’t speak to her for a week and grounded her!
That is a common reaction amongst Nigerian parents.
"Is it cos I is black?"
With my 3A's and 4B's for O Level, I'd have been beaten black and blue by a West African mother.
The Labour government is going to fold. They really are. Everyone can see how they caved on Chagos
From the guardian
“Starmer under pressure to accept case for slavery reparations, as Commonwealth minister claims UK will eventually agree Keir Starmer has been told by Commonwealth leaders he must come to the table to discuss reparations for the “ill effects” of slavery, PA Media reports.
Commonwealth nations are looking at an agreement that could begin conversations on the issue through a communique, according to the BBC.
Frederick Mitchell, foreign minister for the Bahamas, told the Today programme that Starmer should take part in a discussion which “needs to be had about the history” around reparations. Mitchell said:
There appears to be even a reluctance to have the conversation start. Many of the institutions in the UK have already conceded the point of apology, the British government isn’t quite there. But at this time, the discussion needs to be had about the history of this and the ill effects of what happened after slavery was abolished, which continue to affect our societies today. Mitchell said that he expected discussions on the wording of the communique to continue overnight and that leaders might have to get involved in settling the details. He indicated there was some opposition to having a declaration on reparatory justice in the communique – even though countries like his, he said, thought this wording was “innocuous” and that there really should be “an apology and a commitment to reparations”. He also predicted that eventually Starmer would shift on this. “It’s only a matter of time before his position changes, I am confident of it,” Mitchell said”
I bet he’s confident. Labour will buckle but they will try and disguise it as something else. Spineless fucking cretins
You voted for them too Leon !!!
A shakedown is a shakedown but I suspect you are right. Labour will buckle. Just as the Tories did on Climate reparations at a COP meeting. It starts small but ends up growing and becoming vast.
I also noted that Ayesha Hazarika was, on TV today, pretty much saying we should pay them and she is not from the lunatic labour fringe.
Labour will yield on this. It won't be the trillions, but they will yield.
People living in the Caribbean now benefit hugely from slavery, as Caribbean living standards (average GDP per head $6,820) are on average much higher than those in West Africa (average GDP per head $1,937).
So if anybody owes anybody anything for what happened centuries ago, they owe us.
Or the impact of constant slaving raids devastated West Africa, and denuded it of its most capable citizens.
Yes, but that was other Africans. And Arabs. Really it should be Africans paying Caribbeans reparations. But then Nigerians aren't taught that Nigeria is the root of all evil, so would tell them to do one. Or maybe the whole idea is a) a grift, b) unworkable and c) stupid.
Nigerians are scary.
I have a Nigerian friend/colleague and she told me how badly her father reacted to the time she came home with 11 A+ results and an A in some school exams.
Apparently she had brought shame on the family for getting a mere A and her father didn’t speak to her for a week and grounded her!
That is a common reaction amongst Nigerian parents.
That's uncanny. My step-son's maths tutor told me about a family from the Ivory Coast that did the same, only with 9A* and 1A, at GCSE.
The mother likewise told the daughter that she had brought shame upon her family. The tutor tried unsuccessfully to persuade the family that the daughter had done really well.
These were mock exams about six months before she sat her actual exams.
"In 1971, the BIOT commissioner and governor of the Seychelles, Sir Bruce Greatbatch,[71] enacted an Immigration Ordinance that made it unlawful for any person to enter or remain in the Chagos Archipelago without a permit.[72] This law did not apply to members of the British armed forces or UK government officials.[73]
The same year, Greatbatch ordered all the dogs on Diego Garcia to be killed, an order that was carried out by company manager Marcel Moulinie. Moulinie described later how he first tried shooting the dogs, then poisoning them. Eventually more than 1,000 dogs, including pets, were gassed with exhaust fumes, from pipes attached to the exhaust pipes of US military vehicles.[74] Talate Louis said her family’s dog was killed; they felt it was done to make them leave."
I think you must be mistaken. The British Empire was a wise and noble endeavour, that brought civilisation to primitive savages, or so PB consensus insists.
@TSE and others, on this theme, do you ever still get exam dreams?
Last night I dreamt I was it was the day before A Level History, and I'd done no revision. I was frantically looking up wikipedia about the Tudors.
While I was writing my Dissertation, in 2022/3 I was getting these exam dreams about once a month, but this is the first one this year.
Maybe once a year. Given I'm self-employed, work alone, and never have so much as a difficult meeting or nervewracking presentation, much less an exam, I'm not sure why. The feeling of relief upon waking is real, though.
Keir Starmer has a worse PM job rating than all of his recent predecessors by this point in their tenure (*except for Liz Truss, who didn't last this long)
Starmer: 26% well vs 58% badly Sunak: 29% vs 53% Truss*: 11% vs 71% Johnson: 40% vs 49% May: 46% vs 22% Cameron: 59% vs 32% Brown: 59% vs 29% https://x.com/YouGov/status/1849441038030500073
"In 1971, the BIOT commissioner and governor of the Seychelles, Sir Bruce Greatbatch,[71] enacted an Immigration Ordinance that made it unlawful for any person to enter or remain in the Chagos Archipelago without a permit.[72] This law did not apply to members of the British armed forces or UK government officials.[73]
The same year, Greatbatch ordered all the dogs on Diego Garcia to be killed, an order that was carried out by company manager Marcel Moulinie. Moulinie described later how he first tried shooting the dogs, then poisoning them. Eventually more than 1,000 dogs, including pets, were gassed with exhaust fumes, from pipes attached to the exhaust pipes of US military vehicles.[74] Talate Louis said her family’s dog was killed; they felt it was done to make them leave."
I think you must be mistaken. The British Empire was a wise and noble endeavour, that brought civilisation to primitive savages, or so PB consensus insists.
Western medicine created vaccines. How many lives have been saved by vaccines, often given free to third-world countries? For polio alone, 1.5 million.
@TSE and others, on this theme, do you ever still get exam dreams?
Last night I dreamt I was it was the day before A Level History, and I'd done no revision. I was frantically looking up wikipedia about the Tudors.
While I was writing my Dissertation, in 2022/3 I was getting these exam dreams about once a month, but this is the first one this year.
I do occasionally.
During my final Further Maths A Level exam I had three hours to complete
Question 1 (worth 50 marks)
Question 2 (worth 25 marks)
Question 3 (worth 25 marks)
So I had to spend 90 mins on Q1, an hour in and I thought I was on track, put my head down to finish Q1, when I finished Q1 I saw I only had 40 mins to complete Qs 2 & 3.
I rushed them but covered the bases.
As a callow 18 year old I wasn’t as self confident as I am now and thought I had screwed up my university first choice up until results day when it turned I still got the A I needed.
"In 1971, the BIOT commissioner and governor of the Seychelles, Sir Bruce Greatbatch,[71] enacted an Immigration Ordinance that made it unlawful for any person to enter or remain in the Chagos Archipelago without a permit.[72] This law did not apply to members of the British armed forces or UK government officials.[73]
The same year, Greatbatch ordered all the dogs on Diego Garcia to be killed, an order that was carried out by company manager Marcel Moulinie. Moulinie described later how he first tried shooting the dogs, then poisoning them. Eventually more than 1,000 dogs, including pets, were gassed with exhaust fumes, from pipes attached to the exhaust pipes of US military vehicles.[74] Talate Louis said her family’s dog was killed; they felt it was done to make them leave."
I think you must be mistaken. The British Empire was a wise and noble endeavour, that brought civilisation to primitive savages, or so PB consensus insists.
Western medicine created vaccines. How many lives have been saved by vaccines, often given free to third-world countries? For polio alone, 1.5 million.
That's just one contrary point on the ledger.
Indeed. A worthy bit of reparations, and good use of our technological advantage. It doesn't pay the whole bill of debts we owe, but is a step in the right direction.
"In 1971, the BIOT commissioner and governor of the Seychelles, Sir Bruce Greatbatch,[71] enacted an Immigration Ordinance that made it unlawful for any person to enter or remain in the Chagos Archipelago without a permit.[72] This law did not apply to members of the British armed forces or UK government officials.[73]
The same year, Greatbatch ordered all the dogs on Diego Garcia to be killed, an order that was carried out by company manager Marcel Moulinie. Moulinie described later how he first tried shooting the dogs, then poisoning them. Eventually more than 1,000 dogs, including pets, were gassed with exhaust fumes, from pipes attached to the exhaust pipes of US military vehicles.[74] Talate Louis said her family’s dog was killed; they felt it was done to make them leave."
I think you must be mistaken. The British Empire was a wise and noble endeavour, that brought civilisation to primitive savages, or so PB consensus insists.
This consensus presumably exists only in your mind as no one has said that or even implied it.
(Will somebody please elect/appoint a PM who understands their duty is to the United Kingdom and not Canzuk, the Commonwealth, the Anglosphere, or any other polity?)
The Starmer photo at the bottom of that section is very 'This is fine..."
Interesting from the article. @Leon Starmer is buckling, as you said he would.
"Keir Starmer is open to discussing non-cash forms of reparatory justice for Britain’s former colonies, the Guardian understands.
The prime minister is under pressure to open the door to reparations at the Commonwealth heads of government meeting (Chogm) in Samoa this week.
Caribbean countries have been pushing for the issue to be discussed at the summit, despite resistance from the UK government.
No 10 has ruled out paying reparations or apologising for the UK’s role in the transatlantic slave trade, and this uncompromising tone has irritated some Commonwealth countries.
But a Downing Street source indicated that the UK could support some forms of reparatory justice, such restructuring financial institutions and providing debt relief. The source said:
There is a general sense that these multilateral institutions give out loans to developing countries then charge large interest rates for repayments.
They added that reforming financial situations was something the UK often took a lead on and was a form of reparatory justice that would not come at a cost to UK taxpayers.
Other proposed forms of restorative justice include making a formal apology, running educational programmes, establishing cultural institutions and providing economic and public health support.
A draft of the CHOGM communique leaked to the BBC said that governments, “noting calls for discussions on reparatory justice with regard to the transatlantic trade in enslaved Africans and chattel enslavement … agreed that the time has come for a meaningful, truthful and respectful conversation towards forging a common future based on equity.”
According to the broadcaster the communique sought to broaden the issue to include the slave trade not just across the Atlantic but in the Pacific, by saying that a majority of Commonwealth countries “share common historical experiences”."
So a document conveniently leaked to, and recycled by, the Beeb now has them looking to expand the shakedown to Pacific nations too.
Trebles all round.
He folded on Chagos. He will fold on this. He is a supine vain cowardly imbecile who will bankrupt us all and destroy his government in months
Look at the photo of Starmer at Samoa they are using in the guardian. Even they despise him
If it's any consolation, it will be fun watching as local elections give as a rerun of 1967-69 and 1976-78.
It'll be something to cheer me up, that's for sure.
On current trends the world, even if countries meet all their carbon pledges, is heading to 2.6 and 2.8 degrees of warming
I look forward to owning a beachfront property on the new Humber Sea.
It just seems that nature is far more powerful than mankind, and certainly the trillions suggested to mitigate the rate of increase and the lack of will by many countries means that nature will ultimately do what it always has
"In 1971, the BIOT commissioner and governor of the Seychelles, Sir Bruce Greatbatch,[71] enacted an Immigration Ordinance that made it unlawful for any person to enter or remain in the Chagos Archipelago without a permit.[72] This law did not apply to members of the British armed forces or UK government officials.[73]
The same year, Greatbatch ordered all the dogs on Diego Garcia to be killed, an order that was carried out by company manager Marcel Moulinie. Moulinie described later how he first tried shooting the dogs, then poisoning them. Eventually more than 1,000 dogs, including pets, were gassed with exhaust fumes, from pipes attached to the exhaust pipes of US military vehicles.[74] Talate Louis said her family’s dog was killed; they felt it was done to make them leave."
I think you must be mistaken. The British Empire was a wise and noble endeavour, that brought civilisation to primitive savages, or so PB consensus insists.
Western medicine created vaccines. How many lives have been saved by vaccines, often given free to third-world countries? For polio alone, 1.5 million.
That's just one contrary point on the ledger.
Indeed. A worthy bit of reparations, and good use of our technological advantage. It doesn't pay the whole bill of debts we owe, but is a step in the right direction.
I'd argue it may well go *beyond* the debts we owe. Why don't they pay *us* for all the advantages technology has given them?
"In 1971, the BIOT commissioner and governor of the Seychelles, Sir Bruce Greatbatch,[71] enacted an Immigration Ordinance that made it unlawful for any person to enter or remain in the Chagos Archipelago without a permit.[72] This law did not apply to members of the British armed forces or UK government officials.[73]
The same year, Greatbatch ordered all the dogs on Diego Garcia to be killed, an order that was carried out by company manager Marcel Moulinie. Moulinie described later how he first tried shooting the dogs, then poisoning them. Eventually more than 1,000 dogs, including pets, were gassed with exhaust fumes, from pipes attached to the exhaust pipes of US military vehicles.[74] Talate Louis said her family’s dog was killed; they felt it was done to make them leave."
I think you must be mistaken. The British Empire was a wise and noble endeavour, that brought civilisation to primitive savages, or so PB consensus insists.
Western medicine created vaccines. How many lives have been saved by vaccines, often given free to third-world countries? For polio alone, 1.5 million.
That's just one contrary point on the ledger.
Indeed. A worthy bit of reparations, and good use of our technological advantage. It doesn't pay the whole bill of debts we owe, but is a step in the right direction.
The West could actually offer to kill two birds with one stone here and say "we will take on the cost of modernising your infrastructure and factories".
So many of these nations essentially get a huge upgrade in an extended Marshall Plan style format. And by upgrading these countries and their prospects, it gives the inhabitants less reason to migrate.
That's not terrible though. If countries can raise the ambition of their current pledges by a bit, and meet those, then we should be able to limit warming to 2.5C. That then gives us a bit of a safety cushion under 3C, and the world would have successfully avoided the very worst effects of global warming that would come from 3C or 4C of warming.
Obviously keeping under 2C or 1.5C would be better, but this isn't a binary pass/fail situation. These sorts of stories should be presented much more optimistically. The world could do a lot worse than 2.6-2.8C of warming.
"In 1971, the BIOT commissioner and governor of the Seychelles, Sir Bruce Greatbatch,[71] enacted an Immigration Ordinance that made it unlawful for any person to enter or remain in the Chagos Archipelago without a permit.[72] This law did not apply to members of the British armed forces or UK government officials.[73]
The same year, Greatbatch ordered all the dogs on Diego Garcia to be killed, an order that was carried out by company manager Marcel Moulinie. Moulinie described later how he first tried shooting the dogs, then poisoning them. Eventually more than 1,000 dogs, including pets, were gassed with exhaust fumes, from pipes attached to the exhaust pipes of US military vehicles.[74] Talate Louis said her family’s dog was killed; they felt it was done to make them leave."
I think you must be mistaken. The British Empire was a wise and noble endeavour, that brought civilisation to primitive savages, or so PB consensus insists.
Western medicine created vaccines. How many lives have been saved by vaccines, often given free to third-world countries? For polio alone, 1.5 million.
That's just one contrary point on the ledger.
Indeed. A worthy bit of reparations, and good use of our technological advantage. It doesn't pay the whole bill of debts we owe, but is a step in the right direction.
Who are "we" in this sentence? Are you making a distinction between Britons of British heritage and Britons descended from elsewhere?
On current trends the world, even if countries meet all their carbon pledges, is heading to 2.6 and 2.8 degrees of warming
I look forward to owning a beachfront property on the new Humber Sea.
It just seems that nature is far more powerful than mankind, and certainly the trillions suggested to mitigate the rate of increase and the lack of will by many countries means that nature will ultimately do what it always has
2040 - The Guardian
"The atmospheric carbon extraction industry is another example of the rich world helping itself to the commons of all mankind without responsibility. Originally fostered to reduce CO2 in the atmosphere, it has become a juggernaught - using solar power to create fossil fuel replacements without consideration of the effects.
The ongoing famine and civil war in Saudi Arabia is bad enough. With CO2 levels now falling, Third World countries are now exposed to climate change - but in reverse....."
@TSE and others, on this theme, do you ever still get exam dreams?
Last night I dreamt I was it was the day before A Level History, and I'd done no revision. I was frantically looking up wikipedia about the Tudors.
While I was writing my Dissertation, in 2022/3 I was getting these exam dreams about once a month, but this is the first one this year.
Even though I've been retired from teaching for 6 years now, I still get anxiety dreams concerning not being prepared to teach lessons.
I imagine anxiety about something in one's current life is exactly what causes such dreams. Those that have been actors or performers will know the "not learned my lines" dream.
On current trends the world, even if countries meet all their carbon pledges, is heading to 2.6 and 2.8 degrees of warming
I look forward to owning a beachfront property on the new Humber Sea.
It just seems that nature is far more powerful than mankind, and certainly the trillions suggested to mitigate the rate of increase and the lack of will by many countries means that nature will ultimately do what it always has
2040 - The Guardian
"The atmospheric carbon extraction industry is another example of the rich world helping itself to the commons of all mankind without responsibility. Originally fostered to reduce CO2 in the atmosphere, it has become a juggernaught - using solar power to create fossil fuel replacements without consideration of the effects.
The ongoing famine and civil war in Saudi Arabia is bad enough. With CO2 levels now falling, Third World countries are now exposed to climate change - but in reverse....."
Huge assumption there - that The Guardian will still be going in 2040...
"In 1971, the BIOT commissioner and governor of the Seychelles, Sir Bruce Greatbatch,[71] enacted an Immigration Ordinance that made it unlawful for any person to enter or remain in the Chagos Archipelago without a permit.[72] This law did not apply to members of the British armed forces or UK government officials.[73]
The same year, Greatbatch ordered all the dogs on Diego Garcia to be killed, an order that was carried out by company manager Marcel Moulinie. Moulinie described later how he first tried shooting the dogs, then poisoning them. Eventually more than 1,000 dogs, including pets, were gassed with exhaust fumes, from pipes attached to the exhaust pipes of US military vehicles.[74] Talate Louis said her family’s dog was killed; they felt it was done to make them leave."
I think you must be mistaken. The British Empire was a wise and noble endeavour, that brought civilisation to primitive savages, or so PB consensus insists.
This consensus presumably exists only in your mind as no one has said that or even implied it.
Although travelling from civilised Hong Kong into primitive and savage China in about 2000 as I did, it might not be as far from the mark as some imply.
Even more so in the 60s when millions fled the savagery and mindlessness of the Great Proletarian Cultural Revolution to find safety and freedom under British law and the Union Jack.
Of course as savage China has ruined Hong Kong since we left, you wouldn't get the same feeling today.
Comments
And then there is the mystery of Mons Graupius. Always on the look out for something unusual when I'm walking and cycling about in the Cairngorms - just imagine stumbling across that battlefield.
She's still going to win.
While you’re at it you can give me some money for my grandmother who worked as a child slave in the st Agnes tin mines age 9, and died aged 48 partly as a result. Thanks. DM me for my bank deets
And the public overwhelmingly agree - it is by far the least poopular form of public spending.
The reason these countries live in poverty these days has nothing to do with slavery, or empires, or anything like that. Plenty of currently prosperous countries were colonised, plenty of nations were enslaved. Countries are poor today because they have crap governments - corrupt, venal, incompetent and often vicious. Sort of like Starmer, except several orders of magnitude worse. Until those are improved, any aid we give is like bailing out the ocean with a teaspoon.
All else is just noise, often made by those same goverments to distract from their gigantic failings.
Just do it now. Wire it to Nigeria
https://www.newsweek.com/kamala-harris-repararations-black-peopel-1931159
https://www.ft.com/content/091ca9be-e18b-4fd4-8311-f586b8aaa936
HRH could also put his hand in his pocket.
"Victory. Europe."
to spell out "VE".
Full credit to the guy on the phone, he doesn't miss a beat repeating it back to me correctly: "Victor. Echo."
Absolutely lost their minds. The government are really trying their best to be a one term administration.
Good afternoon, everyone.
Robbery, violence with injury and fraud increased notably in the 12 months up to June 2024 – returning to pre-pandemic levels. Meanwhile, the number of shoplifting offences recorded by police rose by 29% to reach a 20-year high. Theft from an individual also increased 20%.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cpwr89rv9qno
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3rxdynqyppo
Part of my childhood. RIP.
We may well end up giving billions to countries whose own policies are not dramatically different to the ones we are paying out for.
Next.
https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2024/10/R-v-LETBY-202402750-B4-FINAL-_.pdf
The only point taken in the appeal was that of whether the trial should have been abandoned due to the prejudice created by the media storm. Answer: No.
Interesting points to note: The appeal didn't raise the issue of whether there was a case to answer at the close of prosecution, unlike the first appeal.
In this case there was no expert evidence at all. Letby was convicted on circumstantial and eye witness testimony.
The defence didn't appeal allowing evidence of the other convictions being in evidence at the second trial. The judge had given a full and proper direction on how to approach its relevance.
The remaining possible row over the quality of the evidence is that the doctor eye witness didn't report anything at the time. Which is indeed troubling. This was fully examined at the trial.
Or maybe the whole idea is a) a grift, b) unworkable and c) stupid.
But the Tory party also suspended his membership - so I wouldn't say he defected, more rejected..
House Intelligence Committee Chair Mike Turner (R-Ohio) on Wednesday said the U.S. should consider taking “direct military action” if North Korean troops enter the war in Ukraine.
..
“The Biden-Harris Administration must make clear that North Korean troops entering this conflict are a red line for the United States,” Turner said in a statement.
“If North Korean troops were to invade Ukraine’s sovereign territory, the United States needs to seriously consider taking direct military action against the North Korean troops,” he added.
https://thehill.com/policy/defense/4949714-north-korean-troops-ukraine-war/
"In 1971, the BIOT commissioner and governor of the Seychelles, Sir Bruce Greatbatch,[71] enacted an Immigration Ordinance that made it unlawful for any person to enter or remain in the Chagos Archipelago without a permit.[72] This law did not apply to members of the British armed forces or UK government officials.[73]
The same year, Greatbatch ordered all the dogs on Diego Garcia to be killed, an order that was carried out by company manager Marcel Moulinie. Moulinie described later how he first tried shooting the dogs, then poisoning them. Eventually more than 1,000 dogs, including pets, were gassed with exhaust fumes, from pipes attached to the exhaust pipes of US military vehicles.[74] Talate Louis said her family’s dog was killed; they felt it was done to make them leave."
https://www.hrw.org/report/2023/02/15/thats-when-nightmare-started/uk-and-us-forced-displacement-chagossians-and
Anybody think Trump has won very many votes over the last few weeks? We are testing Harris' ceiling. Trump's is locked.
Must have been pretty serious to suspend his candidacy just before closure of nominations. It does suggest maybe Reform have bit done due diligence.
Can't you wait until the chaps in the Libyan Coastguard have finished selling them, first?
They should build lots of roads and railways here, establish schools and universities, pay for our defence and improve our legal system.
Oh, and getting rid of the current government and setting up a better one would also be a bonus.
As with everything else here we aren't close enough to the story to know exactly what is going on...
Staying at the forefront of AI development will likely require being able to build 5 gigawatt clusters within 5 years — this is really hard to do.
I spent the last few months digging into the technical challenges and solutions to doing this in the US.
Here’s what I found… 🧵
https://x.com/fiiiiiist/status/1849173667797721566
This is the kind of shit we should be worrying about, rather than arguing about theoretical reparations.
I have a Nigerian friend/colleague and she told me how badly her father reacted to the time she came home with 11 A+ results and an A in some school exams.
Apparently she had brought shame on the family for getting a mere A and her father didn’t speak to her for a week and grounded her!
That is a common reaction amongst Nigerian parents.
Mauretania in 1981.
No one has a clue who's winning.
The mother likewise told the daughter that she had brought shame upon her family. The tutor tried unsuccessfully to persuade the family that the daughter had done really well.
Housing crisis
Jenrick's room rage
Ambition over self-awareness usually explains why largely unheralded politicians put themselves forward to be political party leader. But perhaps Robert Jenrick threW his hat in the ring for an even more basic reason.
New Milton Keynes MP Chris Curtis wasn't able to move into his parliamentary office until just recently - because Robert Jenrick was very slow to vacate it.
Post election, Jenrick was being shuffled from his really nice big office to one described as "tiny and shit".
Win against Kemi, however, and his housing status is likely assured once more.
Early + mail voting update
Total mail ballots returned: 221,116 (🔵 D+12)
Total early ballots cast: 176,679 (🔴 R+25)
Ballots by party registration
🔴 Republican 40.1% | 159,388 ballots
🔵 Democratic 35.4% | 140,878 ballots
⚪️ Other 24.5% | 97,529 ballots
https://x.com/VoteHubUS/status/1849304267158364551
Her reaction to an incident where one of her sons got bullied for "Acting White" by getting straight As at school was interesting.
She did like my solution, when the school refused to act.
Last night I dreamt I was it was the day before A Level History, and I'd done no revision. I was frantically looking up wikipedia about the Tudors.
While I was writing my Dissertation, in 2022/3 I was getting these exam dreams about once a month, but this is the first one this year.
That's how it used to be.
On current trends the world, even if countries meet all their carbon pledges, is heading to 2.6 and 2.8 degrees of warming
https://news.sky.com/story/chance-of-limiting-global-warming-to-15c-is-virtually-zero-on-current-trends-un-warns-13240328
Starmer: 26% well vs 58% badly
Sunak: 29% vs 53%
Truss*: 11% vs 71%
Johnson: 40% vs 49%
May: 46% vs 22%
Cameron: 59% vs 32%
Brown: 59% vs 29%
https://x.com/YouGov/status/1849441038030500073
That's just one contrary point on the ledger.
During my final Further Maths A Level exam I had three hours to complete
Question 1 (worth 50 marks)
Question 2 (worth 25 marks)
Question 3 (worth 25 marks)
So I had to spend 90 mins on Q1, an hour in and I thought I was on track, put my head down to finish Q1, when I finished Q1 I saw I only had 40 mins to complete Qs 2 & 3.
I rushed them but covered the bases.
As a callow 18 year old I wasn’t as self confident as I am now and thought I had screwed up my university first choice up until results day when it turned I still got the A I needed.
I still have dreams related to that.
So many of these nations essentially get a huge upgrade in an extended Marshall Plan style format. And by upgrading these countries and their prospects, it gives the inhabitants less reason to migrate.
Obviously keeping under 2C or 1.5C would be better, but this isn't a binary pass/fail situation. These sorts of stories should be presented much more optimistically. The world could do a lot worse than 2.6-2.8C of warming.
"The atmospheric carbon extraction industry is another example of the rich world helping itself to the commons of all mankind without responsibility. Originally fostered to reduce CO2 in the atmosphere, it has become a juggernaught - using solar power to create fossil fuel replacements without consideration of the effects.
The ongoing famine and civil war in Saudi Arabia is bad enough. With CO2 levels now falling, Third World countries are now exposed to climate change - but in reverse....."
Even more so in the 60s when millions fled the savagery and mindlessness of the Great Proletarian Cultural Revolution to find safety and freedom under British law and the Union Jack.
Of course as savage China has ruined Hong Kong since we left, you wouldn't get the same feeling today.