politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Beware the over-prompting of Mark Reckless and UKIP in Roch
Comments
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Well "Zero-Zero" last longer than or shorter than "One Nation"?0
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The first - and largest - cases of ethnic cleansing in Kosovo was by Serbs against Albanians. At that point there is a responsibility of the international community to step in. In Crimea, no ethnic cleansing was carried out against the Russians, so it is entirely an aggressive war for Russia to invade.
Oh, and Kosovo was given independence. It wasn't annexed by the USA in a land grab. In fact, it was even banned from being annexed by Albania.0 -
Why doesn't the Labour Party pay "its fair share"?bigjohnowls said:Q How much UK tax does Vodaphone pay on its £9.5Bn profits
A minus £4m
Why do Kippers and Tories try to defend this scandal?
"Labour has reduced its corporation tax bill from £561,000 to zero by offsetting expenses and previous tax losses. Despite a £2.8 million surplus."
http://order-order.com/2013/07/26/labour-lessons-in-reducing-your-tax-bill-to-zero/0 -
Have you found any proof of your lie yesterday about 3.7% increase in wages for those in work for 12 months yet?TGOHF said:
Vodaphone are not paying any employers NICs in the Uk ? Now that is a story.bigjohnowls said:Q How much UK tax does Vodaphone pay on its £9.5Bn profits
A minus £4m
Why do Kippers and Tories try to defend this scandal?
How much Nics and IT are their employees paying ?
In your own time BJO..
Do you think its OK to pay minus £4m on a 9.5 Bn profit?
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If someone said they voted Ukip in 2010, does that go down as 'other' or DNV?Richard_Nabavi said:
I think that is already covered. 28 out of 254 Reckless supporters said they voted 'Other' (i.e. not Con/Lab/LD). You might be right that some of those actually voted Conservative, but I've included them as 2010 voters anyway, so it doesn't matter from the point of view of the argument I was making.isam said:Be very wary of falling into the DNV trap in (2)
Many if them probably said they voted Ukip... In my opinion this is more likely to mean they voted for Reckless than DNV0 -
264 and out. Just like watching Jonathon Trott.0
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Ever since TB replaced the late John Smith, it became quite apparent that he and his clique were hi-jacking the Labour party and its wwc for their own benefit by controlling the press and finding safe seats for their friends.state_go_away said:I think the Labour party is now so infested with luvvies and champagne socialists that even a no brainer policy like raising some tax from people in £2 million pound houses causes many influential supporters to grumble ( as it may affect them) .
In a way that is a ridiculous state for a working person's party to get itself into.
TB was happy to leave when he saw that his route to personal wealth and glory was advanced and open and others have followed in his wake.
Now to those left behind and their surprise, the support of the wwc is unraveling and that same support is looking elsewhere for succour and representation (e.g. UKIP and Green), as slowly some of them come to realise that their support has been used and their representations ignored..
So in the coming GE, whilst Labour may still get loyal support form the economically poor NE and Wales and other parts of the N, there is a big question mark over the destination of their traditional support in the Midlands.0 -
Big ideas: Decency & Determination.
Well that's the GE sewn up then.0 -
Listening to Milicraperoo on r5 now, he really is a car crash0
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@PickardJE: Miliband speech had eight words on the deficit. Should be easy to remember this time.0
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Do you have a clue, even the faintest clue, how Corporation Tax actually works?bigjohnowls said:Q How much UK tax does Vodaphone pay on its £9.5Bn profits
A minus £4m
Why do Kippers and Tories try to defend this scandal?0 -
Erm.... that it is factually incorrect. The top 1% don't pay zero tax, in fact they pay most of the tax.bigjohnowls said:We need to change the Zero/Zero society
What is there to disagree with?0 -
Ed with his pleading voice.
I'm not a geek. I'm normal. Really. Really. I promise. I can almost see him holding back the tears.
He just needs to tell us he feels our pain. And he'll get angry on our behalf.
I'm pretty sure he won't tell us he'll unwind his IHT wheeze and pay back the tax monies due. When is a journalist going to bring him up on this?
Good he mentioned immigration. Some empty words as usual.
False promises? Must be the magic money tree then.0 -
He's friends with Lord Ashcroft.OldKingCole said:
How come S comes before C? Mine’s not here yet. Is it because Mike lives somewhere beginning with B?MikeSmithson said:I've just got my pensioners' winter fuel payment which I have deposited in my Betfair account.
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Not sure, but I would imagine 'Other'.isam said:If someone said they voted Ukip in 2010, does that go down as 'other' or DNV?
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That is perfectly true . There were several years in the late 1990s when the increase in GDP of the country as a whole was taken by bonuses and increased salaries of bankers and company CEOs . The rest of the population had a loss of GDP per person .john_zims said:@DecrepitJohnL
' It is individual voters' economic circumstances that matter, not the headline aggregate figures, so the question is: whose real wages are rising and whose are not?'
So apart from the energy freeze what is Ed offering,a 5% across the board wage increase?
Is he going to continue with the tax freeze on fuel?
Is he going to continue with the council tax freeze?
Is he going to cut VAT?
Is he going to freeze NI contributions?0 -
Its in the Welfare piece of the Osbourne Pie chart if you want to find it rather than pensions.TheWatcher said:
No wonder it always needs more cash, for things other than patient care.bigjohnowls said:
I would say early 50'sTheWatcher said:
And more money than Owls is sucking out of the NHS having retired in his mid 50's.philiph said:
More under this administration than the last administration?bigjohnowls said:
NHS pension scheme was in profit prior to 2010 like the NHS
Now both are fooked.0 -
Country-by-country reporting is the foundation of a fair tax system that allows local business to compete with multi-nationals.DavidL said:
In one of those happy coincidences a major reason for the lack of a CT bill for Vodaphone is their use of aggressive tax avoidance using the incredibly lax and internationally unacceptable laws of Luxemburg promoted by Mr Juncker.bigjohnowls said:Q How much UK tax does Vodaphone pay on its £9.5Bn profits
A minus £4m
Why do Kippers and Tories try to defend this scandal?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/mediatechnologyandtelecoms/telecoms/10525215/Vodafone-defends-zero-corporation-tax-bill.html
And just to demonstrate that they have a sense of humour they point out that the settlement of the tax avoidance claim made against them by the UK government had the effect of reducing their direct tax bill for the latest year.
I said the other day on here this kind of behaviour is unacceptable and inexcusable. We need to find ways of charging multinationals at least another £10-15bn a year for the privilege of trading in the UK.
By forcing companies to declare revenue and profit in every country we force them to declare their global corporate structure. The basics for how the Luxemburg based avoidance scheme works is declaring one corporate structure in Country A whilst declaring a different corporate structure in Country L.
Country-by-country reporting exposes the structure on a cross border basis an removes the ability to lie about their corporate structure.
It would also help if HMRC didn't just nod through blatantly obvious exploitative Transfer Pricing Arrangements but that's a different battle.0 -
The late 90's you say - after 1997?MarkSenior said:
That is perfectly true . There were several years in the late 1990s when the increase in GDP of the country as a whole was taken by bonuses and increased salaries of bankers and company CEOs . The rest of the population had a loss of GDP per person .john_zims said:@DecrepitJohnL
' It is individual voters' economic circumstances that matter, not the headline aggregate figures, so the question is: whose real wages are rising and whose are not?'
So apart from the energy freeze what is Ed offering,a 5% across the board wage increase?
Is he going to continue with the tax freeze on fuel?
Is he going to continue with the council tax freeze?
Is he going to cut VAT?
Is he going to freeze NI contributions?0 -
Zero-Zero?
Reminds me vaguely of the Captain Planet theme tune: "...gonna take pollution down to zero..."
And, of course, Clegg's 'alarm clock Britain' slogan. Not a fan of slogans generally, but that's especially bad.0 -
Ed going for UKIP. Not a Britain he wants to live in.0
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Too many taking rather than giving.bigjohnowls said:
Its in the Welfare piece of the Osbourne Pie chart if you want to find it rather than pensions.TheWatcher said:
No wonder it always needs more cash, for things other than patient care.bigjohnowls said:
I would say early 50'sTheWatcher said:
And more money than Owls is sucking out of the NHS having retired in his mid 50's.philiph said:
More under this administration than the last administration?bigjohnowls said:
NHS pension scheme was in profit prior to 2010 like the NHS
Now both are fooked.0 -
Don't you think he looks tired.0
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The contention by many is that Starbucks (thourgh the financial advantage of their tax structure) force out local coffee shops who would pay staff salaries and supply purchase and would pay corporation tax as well.TheWatcher said:
Corporation tax?bigjohnowls said:
Have a think about what other revenues they contribute directly or indirectly, through such things as staff salaries, and supply purchase.0 -
Socrates said:
The first - and largest - cases of ethnic cleansing in Kosovo was by Serbs against Albanians. At that point there is a responsibility of the international community to step in. In Crimea, no ethnic cleansing was carried out against the Russians, so it is entirely an aggressive war for Russia to invade.
Oh, and Kosovo was given independence. It wasn't annexed by the USA in a land grab. In fact, it was even banned from being annexed by Albania.
Kosovo was invaded by NATO and carved out of Serbia. The non-Albanian % of the population went from 20% to 5%. But I guess that is not ethnic cleansing. Robin Cook told me. And Tony got the avenue named after him so that is ok.0 -
The 3.7% came from a BBC journo.bigjohnowls said:
Have you found any proof of your lie yesterday about 3.7% increase in wages for those in work for 12 months yet?TGOHF said:
Vodaphone are not paying any employers NICs in the Uk ? Now that is a story.bigjohnowls said:Q How much UK tax does Vodaphone pay on its £9.5Bn profits
A minus £4m
Why do Kippers and Tories try to defend this scandal?
How much Nics and IT are their employees paying ?
In your own time BJO..
Do you think its OK to pay minus £4m on a 9.5 Bn profit?
Their contribution to the Uk is more than corp tax. R+D investment is corp tax free - would you rather they closed their labs and paid cash ?
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OT I've a technology problem - I think I need an organigram - and I never thought I'd type those words. Does anyone know a way to navigate around a bunch of devices without getting lost? I thought I'd been very big and clever getting all mine talking to each other wirelessly - now I'm totally lost even after renaming them all after my cats.
I'm playing a one-armed techie bandit here and no idea how I stumbled across a random app or set of files - or what's talking with my TV. All suggestions most welcome, I'm not usually phased by this stuff, but I'm flummoxed.0 -
Both before and after 1997 .TheWatcher said:
The late 90's you say - after 1997?MarkSenior said:
That is perfectly true . There were several years in the late 1990s when the increase in GDP of the country as a whole was taken by bonuses and increased salaries of bankers and company CEOs . The rest of the population had a loss of GDP per person .john_zims said:@DecrepitJohnL
' It is individual voters' economic circumstances that matter, not the headline aggregate figures, so the question is: whose real wages are rising and whose are not?'
So apart from the energy freeze what is Ed offering,a 5% across the board wage increase?
Is he going to continue with the tax freeze on fuel?
Is he going to continue with the council tax freeze?
Is he going to cut VAT?
Is he going to freeze NI contributions?0 -
Mr. Borough, he could always emigrate.0
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I completely agree with this. We must be at the point that the larger countries simply impose it on the smaller ones. I, for one, am sick of the likes of Luxemburg (and Eire) stealing our money.Alistair said:
Country-by-country reporting is the foundation of a fair tax system that allows local business to compete with multi-nationals.DavidL said:
In one of those happy coincidences a major reason for the lack of a CT bill for Vodaphone is their use of aggressive tax avoidance using the incredibly lax and internationally unacceptable laws of Luxemburg promoted by Mr Juncker.bigjohnowls said:Q How much UK tax does Vodaphone pay on its £9.5Bn profits
A minus £4m
Why do Kippers and Tories try to defend this scandal?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/mediatechnologyandtelecoms/telecoms/10525215/Vodafone-defends-zero-corporation-tax-bill.html
And just to demonstrate that they have a sense of humour they point out that the settlement of the tax avoidance claim made against them by the UK government had the effect of reducing their direct tax bill for the latest year.
I said the other day on here this kind of behaviour is unacceptable and inexcusable. We need to find ways of charging multinationals at least another £10-15bn a year for the privilege of trading in the UK.
By forcing companies to declare revenue and profit in every country we force them to declare their global corporate structure. The basics for how the Luxemburg based avoidance scheme works is declaring one corporate structure in Country A whilst declaring a different corporate structure in Country L.
Country-by-country reporting exposes the structure on a cross border basis an removes the ability to lie about their corporate structure.
It would also help if HMRC didn't just nod through blatantly obvious exploitative Transfer Pricing Arrangements but that's a different battle.0 -
Ed doing ok IMHO. Why the hell didn't he give this speech at conference?0
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Well there speaks a hoperNorm said:
I also wonder to what extent Kelly Tolhurst is attracting switchers back to the Tories as the campaign progresses and she becomes better known. The Tory candidate in Clacton didn't seem to make any real impact which I'm not sure is true this time. Obviously Kelly's twitter feed will present her in a good light but she does seem to connect well in quite a natural way with the schoolkids and with a whole host of people and businesses she has visited in what looks like quite an energetic campaign. With another week to go that could reasonably chip another couple of percentage points off the lead. One more poll next week without any pre-prompting might be interesting.Richard_Nabavi said:
I think that is already covered. 28 out of 254 Reckless supporters said they voted 'Other' (i.e. not Con/Lab/LD). You might be right that some of those actually voted Conservative, but I've included them as 2010 voters anyway, so it doesn't matter from the point of view of the argument I was making.isam said:Be very wary of falling into the DNV trap in (2)
Many if them probably said they voted Ukip... In my opinion this is more likely to mean they voted for Reckless than DNV
I canvassed in clacton and actually the conservative candidate was a local man who many people seemed to like
In the posh part , Frinton, many seemed to be on first name terms with him0 -
Is he ill?TheScreamingEagles said:Don't you think he looks tired.
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Looks fine to me, but I'm not on high-defTheWatcher said:
Is he ill?TheScreamingEagles said:Don't you think he looks tired.
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The thing that fucks me right off is the apologists going "well it's perfectly legal" when it relies on claiming your company is structured in different ways depending on which tax authority you are talking too. Whilst that might not be technically illegal it's clearly lying and I was told lying was wrong when I was a nipper.DavidL said:
I completely agree with this. We must be at the point that the larger countries simply impose it on the smaller ones. I, for one, am sick of the likes of Luxemburg (and Eire) stealing our money.Alistair said:
Country-by-country reporting is the foundation of a fair tax system that allows local business to compete with multi-nationals.DavidL said:
In one of those happy coincidences a major reason for the lack of a CT bill for Vodaphone is their use of aggressive tax avoidance using the incredibly lax and internationally unacceptable laws of Luxemburg promoted by Mr Juncker.bigjohnowls said:Q How much UK tax does Vodaphone pay on its £9.5Bn profits
A minus £4m
Why do Kippers and Tories try to defend this scandal?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/mediatechnologyandtelecoms/telecoms/10525215/Vodafone-defends-zero-corporation-tax-bill.html
And just to demonstrate that they have a sense of humour they point out that the settlement of the tax avoidance claim made against them by the UK government had the effect of reducing their direct tax bill for the latest year.
I said the other day on here this kind of behaviour is unacceptable and inexcusable. We need to find ways of charging multinationals at least another £10-15bn a year for the privilege of trading in the UK.
By forcing companies to declare revenue and profit in every country we force them to declare their global corporate structure. The basics for how the Luxemburg based avoidance scheme works is declaring one corporate structure in Country A whilst declaring a different corporate structure in Country L.
Country-by-country reporting exposes the structure on a cross border basis an removes the ability to lie about their corporate structure.
It would also help if HMRC didn't just nod through blatantly obvious exploitative Transfer Pricing Arrangements but that's a different battle.0 -
0
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Yes, it was invaded by NATO and carved out of Serbia because the Serbs were going genocidal on the Albanians. In such circumstances it was the moral thing to do. The fact that Serbs later fled because they didn't want to be ruled by Albanians, is not evidence for ethnic cleansing.Itajai said:
Kosovo was invaded by NATO and carved out of Serbia. The non-Albanian % of the population went from 20% to 5%. But I guess that is not ethnic cleansing. Robin Cook told me. And Tony got the avenue named after him so that is ok.Socrates said:The first - and largest - cases of ethnic cleansing in Kosovo was by Serbs against Albanians. At that point there is a responsibility of the international community to step in. In Crimea, no ethnic cleansing was carried out against the Russians, so it is entirely an aggressive war for Russia to invade.
Oh, and Kosovo was given independence. It wasn't annexed by the USA in a land grab. In fact, it was even banned from being annexed by Albania.
Your last two comments are just stupid because I've never been a fan of Tony Blair.0 -
I'll bite.bigjohnowls said:We need to change the Zero/Zero society
What is there to disagree with?
EdM (from BBC report): A major theme will be the "zero-zero economy", which he said was about "people asking why they are on zero-hours contracts while those at the top get away with zero tax".
Given the context, it's pretty clear he's talking about people, not corporations.
Zero number 1: This government is making it illegal to include an exclusivity clause in such contracts. Most people on zero-hours contracts are very happy with the arrangement because of the flexibility it allows. Most of them are relatively low-paid, and more likely to vote Labour.
Zero number 2: This government has taxed the very wealthy at higher levels than have been seen since the 1980s (one month of the last government aside). Tax avoidance schemes tolerated under Labour have been torn down left, right, and centre.
So, to answer your question, that's what to disagree with. Next.0 -
I think you should retire early its great.TheWatcher said:
Too many taking rather than giving.bigjohnowls said:
Its in the Welfare piece of the Osbourne Pie chart if you want to find it rather than pensions.TheWatcher said:
No wonder it always needs more cash, for things other than patient care.bigjohnowls said:
I would say early 50'sTheWatcher said:
And more money than Owls is sucking out of the NHS having retired in his mid 50's.philiph said:
More under this administration than the last administration?bigjohnowls said:
NHS pension scheme was in profit prior to 2010 like the NHS
Now both are fooked.0 -
Much better from Edward Miliband. I rather enjoyed that speech0
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I'm not sure how the Conservatives should play this. Reminding less well-off voters about the rich, and telling them to be grateful, might not be the vote winner you imagine.Patrick said:
Erm.... that it is factually incorrect. The top 1% don't pay zero tax, in fact they pay most of the tax.bigjohnowls said:We need to change the Zero/Zero society
What is there to disagree with?
But then I'm no Lynton Crosby. As in the famous Frost Report class sketch, I know my place.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K2k1iRD2f-c0 -
Starbucks, Costa etc are not the cheap option when you want a hot drink.Alistair said:
The contention by many is that Starbucks (thourgh the financial advantage of their tax structure) force out local coffee shops who would pay staff salaries and supply purchase and would pay corporation tax as well.TheWatcher said:
Corporation tax?bigjohnowls said:
Have a think about what other revenues they contribute directly or indirectly, through such things as staff salaries, and supply purchase.
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Actually, the billboards behind Ed say "One Nation" - so its back.BannedInParis said:Well "Zero-Zero" last longer than or shorter than "One Nation"?
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Because some overpaid and underbrained election guru told him the important thing for a conference speech was not to use notes, presumably on the grounds that David Cameron had done it once.rottenborough said:Ed doing ok IMHO. Why the hell didn't he give this speech at conference?
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Norm said:
I also wonder to what extent Kelly Tolhurst is attracting switchers back to the Tories as the campaign progresses and she becomes better known. The Tory candidate in Clacton didn't seem to make any real impact which I'm not sure is true this time. Obviously Kelly's twitter feed will present her in a good light but she does seem to connect well in quite a natural way with the schoolkids and with a whole host of people and businesses she has visited in what looks like quite an energetic campaign. With another week to go that could reasonably chip another couple of percentage points off the lead. One more poll next week without any pre-prompting might be interesting.Richard_Nabavi said:
I think that is already covered. 28 out of 254 Reckless supporters said they voted 'Other' (i.e. not Con/Lab/LD). You might be right that some of those actually voted Conservative, but I've included them as 2010 voters anyway, so it doesn't matter from the point of view of the argument I was making.isam said:Be very wary of falling into the DNV trap in (2)
Many if them probably said they voted Ukip... In my opinion this is more likely to mean they voted for Reckless than DNV
The Tory candidate in Clacton was in fact pretty good, Norm.
Nothing wrong with Ms Tolhurst either, except perhaps a little inexperience. As I posted earlier, LA's prompted poll produced a similar result to other pollsters, all within the 10%/15% range.
The Parties will have their own House polls, canvass returns and other feedback. We can have a good guess at what they are saying from the number of visits Dave has made to the area - five in the early days of the campaign, none since. That corresponds to a swift change in tone from Conservative HQ; the kitchen-sink strategy has given way to it's-only-a-by-election (we'll win it back in May.)
The punters have smelt the coffee and Reckless is now 18/1 on. Doesn't look like much of a betting heat to me. The vote percentage market might throw up an odd result though, especially if turnout is low (as I expect it will be.) Might be worth backing the outside ranges, but only to small stakes.
Been a bit of a disappointment, this election. Never mind. Plenty of punting opportunities at Cheltenham this weekend....and I have my Fuel Allowance to spend! :-)
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Yes, the reason that the top 1% pay 30% of all the IT is because they get all the money. Hmmm...DecrepitJohnL said:
I'm not sure how the Conservatives should play this. Reminding less well-off voters about the rich, and telling them to be grateful, might not be the vote winner you imagine.Patrick said:
Erm.... that it is factually incorrect. The top 1% don't pay zero tax, in fact they pay most of the tax.bigjohnowls said:We need to change the Zero/Zero society
What is there to disagree with?
But then I'm no Lynton Crosby. As in the famous Frost Report class sketch, I know my place.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K2k1iRD2f-c0 -
I recall several years ago Prince Charles moaning about not having a voice. FFS.
I mean really? It's laughable lack of self-awareness.david_herdson said:
Constant harrying is counter-productive when it comes from a privileged elite unfairly using their power against a weaker opponent who deserves a fair hearing. Miliband is Leader of the Opposition and so already has a powerful platform. He is fair game, providing the criticism is seen as legitimate and chimes with a public perception.CD13 said:NickP,
Gordon got a sympathy vote over the Sun and the signature, but that was because he was trying to do the right thing and we knew he only had one eye. Ed's problem is that he appears gormless at times, and in a potential PM with his finger (theoretically) on the red button, that's worrying.
After a certain stage, constant harrying will be counter-productive, as Ukip have found to their benefit; especially when it has a definite political edge. But laughing at the clown may well get boring before it becomes a sympathy vote.0 -
Miss Plato, can't recall that, but it does sound ridiculous.
Did Miliband remember to confirm we'd get free owls under a Labour Government?0 -
Paul Waugh @paulwaugh 2m2 minutes ago
Perils of holding press + party Q and A, journalists hissed at (@chrisshipitv) or heckled (@andybell5news) by members. Is that a good look?0 -
Zero Zero
One Nation
Two Eds
Three ...
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FIFA report writer has appealed against his own report as he feels FIFA have misrepresented him!!0
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Possibly so. Much would have depended on how Home and Wilson had reacted to such a result.OldKingCole said:
Unlikely. Lab-Lib much more likely then; Libs were seen as the non-socialist left-ish alterntive. After 13 years the Tories were getting tired and a bit scandal-prone..JackW said:
Quite so and by such fine margins did Harold's pipe and gannex hold sway over Downing Street for six years.RodCrosby said:
If just 42 people had voted differently (in Kemptown, Ealing North and Wellingborough) there would have been a hung parliament and possible Con-Lib coalition...JackW said:Musing on yesterdays BBC parliament broadcast of the close 1964 general election and our own Coalition today it's noteworthy how close the nation came to a near tie.
The actual result was :
Lab 317 .. Con 304 (including Speaker) .. Libs 9.
A few Conservative holds here and there and perhaps a few extra Liberals with a result of :
Lab 309 .. Con 309 .. Lib 12
would have seen interesting times. A Con/Lib Coalition running through to 1968/9 ?? .... who knows but certainly the political landscape would have been considerably different.
We have an insight for Wilson from Feb 74 when he assumed office without offering the Liberals anything. I think Home might well have been more pragmatic and having almost come back from the electoral dead been more generous to Jo Grimond.
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Socrates said:
Yes, it was invaded by NATO and carved out of Serbia because the Serbs were going genocidal on the Albanians. In such circumstances it was the moral thing to do. The fact that Serbs later fled because they didn't want to be ruled by Albanians, is not evidence for ethnic cleansing.Itajai said:
Kosovo was invaded by NATO and carved out of Serbia. The non-Albanian % of the population went from 20% to 5%. But I guess that is not ethnic cleansing. Robin Cook told me. And Tony got the avenue named after him so that is ok.Socrates said:The first - and largest - cases of ethnic cleansing in Kosovo was by Serbs against Albanians. At that point there is a responsibility of the international community to step in. In Crimea, no ethnic cleansing was carried out against the Russians, so it is entirely an aggressive war for Russia to invade.
Oh, and Kosovo was given independence. It wasn't annexed by the USA in a land grab. In fact, it was even banned from being annexed by Albania.
Your last two comments are just stupid because I've never been a fan of Tony Blair.
Genocidal on the Albanians? Please. Which afterwards turned out not be true but who cares about that.
Serbs left because the KLA started killing them, and harvesting their organs. Under the noses of NATO. Who didn't care. But I guess that was not a "moral" imperative by that point.
Glad to hear you're not a fan of Tony.0 -
Well quite.
I've been to the Lewes bonfire a couple of times and what an experience that is - like an oversold rock concert populated with fancy dress and serious reenactment sorts - plus those pretending to be Genghis Khan.
It was a crush. I wouldn't go again. It's a bucket list item.TGOHF said:as predicted
Gary Robertson @BBCGaryR · 17m 17 minutes ago
Sussex Police investigating a number of complaints about an effigy of Alex Salmond @ Lewes bonfire event say "no criminal offence occurred."0 -
@The_Last_Boy_Scout
'Much better from Edward Miliband. I rather enjoyed that speech'
Well received by the hand picked audience of Labour supporters.0 -
That's the key thing to know... How can we find out?Richard_Nabavi said:
Not sure, but I would imagine 'Other'.isam said:If someone said they voted Ukip in 2010, does that go down as 'other' or DNV?
English democrats got 4.5% last time, I'd have thought they were the majority of 'others' voting for reckless
Look at the green vote... Only 4/23 say they voted 'others'.. That's 17% when it should be around 37%0 -
Department of Do Keep UP
I’ve just been invited to do a Yougov survey. As I ticked through I found this:
"Chris Huhne
(posted) 19 minutes ago by Member 380499
The clock is ticking on mr Huhne. Very controversial and hopefully will lose his seat in Parliament next May."0 -
Mr. Jimmy, it's almost beyond satire how dubious FIFA is.0
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50.892224
Of to Weatherspoons' for a final farewell for the next few weeks. Please keep me informed.
:still-one-point-nine-percent-too-high:
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O/T:
Does anyone know whether Betfair will work in Portugal? I've found a website that says it will, except the same site says it works in Italy and I know from experience that it doesn't.0 -
Zombie Ed may be more electable.MikeK said:
Sorry Nick what you've just written above is wishful nonsense. Ed Miliband is a dead man walking, nothing you or Labour do before the election will make him live again.NickPalmer said:
I think people feel the media coverage has strayed into trivial bullying - the hissing of the reporter asking the leadership question at the CBI conference was one example of people getting fed up - and we'll see some recovery. not necessarily because of the speech and the strong BBC interview last night, but because he's been oversold by the hostile coverage. An optimistic view is that people have actually been inoculated by the personal attacks going OTT too early: it's going to be hard to keep them up till May.Patrick said:Flash PB poll please:
What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?
A. Clear success, great speech, polls recover.
B. Clear flop, doesn't speak human, polling gets even worse.
C. Meh. Nothing changes.0 -
Dr Who reference?TheScreamingEagles said:Don't you think he looks tired.
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Never mind 1/18, I have already collected part of my Rochester winnings from my local CoralPeter_the_Punter said:Norm said:
I also wonder to what extent Kelly Tolhurst is attracting switchers back to the Tories as the campaign progresses and she becomes better known. The Tory candidate in Clacton didn't seem to make any real impact which I'm not sure is true this time. Obviously Kelly's twitter feed will present her in a good light but she does seem to connect well in quite a natural way with the schoolkids and with a whole host of people and businesses she has visited in what looks like quite an energetic campaign. With another week to go that could reasonably chip another couple of percentage points off the lead. One more poll next week without any pre-prompting might be interesting.Richard_Nabavi said:
I think that is already covered. 28 out of 254 Reckless supporters said they voted 'Other' (i.e. not Con/Lab/LD). You might be right that some of those actually voted Conservative, but I've included them as 2010 voters anyway, so it doesn't matter from the point of view of the argument I was making.isam said:Be very wary of falling into the DNV trap in (2)
Many if them probably said they voted Ukip... In my opinion this is more likely to mean they voted for Reckless than DNV
The Tory candidate in Clacton was in fact pretty good, Norm.
Nothing wrong with Ms Tolhurst either, except perhaps a little inexperience. As I posted earlier, LA's prompted poll produced a similar result to other pollsters, all within the 10%/15% range.
The Parties will have their own House polls, canvass returns and other feedback. We can have a good guess at what they are saying from the number of visits Dave has made to the area - five in the early days of the campaign, none since. That corresponds to a swift change in tone from Conservative HQ; the kitchen-sink strategy has given way to it's-only-a-by-election (we'll win it back in May.)
The punters have smelt the coffee and Reckless is now 18/1 on. Doesn't look like much of a betting heat to me. The vote percentage market might throw up an odd result though, especially if turnout is low (as I expect it will be.) Might be worth backing the outside ranges, but only to small stakes.
Been a bit of a disappointment, this election. Never mind. Plenty of punting opportunities at Cheltenham this weekend....and I have my Fuel Allowance to spend! :-)0 -
Does zero/zero refer to the number of people who think Miliband is a good choice for PM / think Labour have any idea what to do in a world where there is no money?0
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Miss Plato, being dead doesn't necessarily mean one is unappealing. I understand many a lady likes the idea of getting to know Dracula (or Angel).
Dracula was originally going to be a woman. And it's based on the Romanian word for 'evil' (dracul), as devil is based on the English.0 -
RodCrosby said:
"grandparents murdered by the Nazis"
Um.
Paternal grandfather died 1966
Paternal grandmother died 1975
Maternal grandmother lived in Israel for a while after the war, date of death unknown
Maternal grandfather alleged to have died in Auschwitz, but The Telegraph discovered he died in Czestochowa on May 12, 1945, four days after the end of the war.
So about 5 months after the Red Army reached that area of Poland.
Why should anyone believe anything a Labourite says?0 -
I'd type LOL, if I didn't think you were being sincere here.
Starry-eyes are self delusion methinks. You've a dud in charge - that non-Labourites are delighted with him says everything.
#ILoveEdvolcanopete said:
Ed's decency,honesty and integrity will shine through in the end-no secret deals with Murdoch and Dacre either.MikeK said:
Sorry Nick what you've just written above is wishful nonsense. Ed Miliband is a dead man walking, nothing you or Labour do before the election will make him live again.NickPalmer said:
I think people feel the media coverage has strayed into trivial bullying - the hissing of the reporter asking the leadership question at the CBI conference was one example of people getting fed up - and we'll see some recovery. not necessarily because of the speech and the strong BBC interview last night, but because he's been oversold by the hostile coverage. An optimistic view is that people have actually been inoculated by the personal attacks going OTT too early: it's going to be hard to keep them up till May.Patrick said:Flash PB poll please:
What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?
A. Clear success, great speech, polls recover.
B. Clear flop, doesn't speak human, polling gets even worse.
C. Meh. Nothing changes.0 -
A friend of mine knows the guy who designed the poppies - the RBL hasn't paid him for it. Whilst I've enormous respect their mission - that's a very poor show.
PS I met Mr Corbyn a few years ago = he likes corduroy. I can't fault his parsimony, but I prefer his mad professor weather-geek brother.TheScreamingEagles said:Hmmmm
Labour MPs cheered jokes about killing the Royal Family and lynching a Tory Cabinet minister at a tasteless Remembrance Sunday event, it emerged last night
The ‘anti-war comedy night’ even featured remarks mocking the ceramic poppies at the Tower of London.
Among those attending the event at a club in Covent Garden were former shadow minister Diane Abbott and Left-wing MP Jeremy Corbyn.
They heard another Left-winger, John McDonnell give a speech joking about Employment Minister Esther McVey being lynched.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2832286/Labour-MPs-cheered-jokes-lynching-Tory-minister-killing-royal-sick-alternative-poppy-day-comedy-night.html0 -
So another catastrophic memory lapse by Ed. He seems to have forgotten that the top 1% of earners pay for the NHS....0
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Ed's abondoned the "35% Strategy". He's now on the "Moron Strategy", focussed on retained that section of the electorate which will believe absolutely anything he says as long as it involves bashing the rich or the Tories.MarqueeMark said:So another catastrophic memory lapse by Ed. He seems to have forgotten that the top 1% of earners pay for the NHS....
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@Isam
Excellent work, Sam - collecting future winnings early to pay immediate expenses. Did you get the idea from George Osborne?
Let me know if you have anything interesting for the Paddy Power meeting. Off now.0 -
Miss Plato, assuming he was meant to be paid, that's damned shoddy.0
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0
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Of course.DavidL said:
Dr Who reference?TheScreamingEagles said:Don't you think he looks tired.
He did look a bit knackered.0 -
So...did Redward actually say anything? Any policies or plans forthcoming? Or was it just more Dave bashing?0
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They won't if Farage gets his way.MarqueeMark said:So another catastrophic memory lapse by Ed. He seems to have forgotten that the top 1% of earners pay for the NHS....
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/nov/12/film-nigel-farage-insurance-based-nhs-private-companies
We will all be paying through the nose in an insurance based system. France pays half as much again as we do under that system and of course Farage forgets that companies pay as well for every worker.0 -
In the Ashcroft Poll, UKIP are estimated to get 44%
11% of Reckless' vote is from 2010 "others"
In 2010 The English Democrats got 4.5%
Doesn't seem to much of a stretch to me to say that 4.5% fits nicely with 11% of 44
This would indicate to me that those who said they voted UKIP were put in DNV, but it would be great to find out if anyone could
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I'll raise you.MikeSmithson said:I've just got my pensioners' winter fuel payment which I have deposited in my Betfair account.
My best friend's father gets the winter fuel payment.
He lives in the South of Spain.0 -
The one sure way of getting into Betfair while in France & other counties is to go through your phone data connection. Trouble is that you'll incur roaming charges. Thankfully, due to that wonder institution that the Tories took us into in 1973, now called the EU, there will be no roaming charges from some point next year .Anorak said:
Firefox plus Hola! extension should make it work.AndyJS said:O/T:
Does anyone know whether Betfair will work in Portugal? I've found a website that says it will, except the same site says it works in Italy and I know from experience that it doesn't.
The kipper MEPS couldn't be arsed to be there when this came up in the EP.
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@TheScreamingEagles
'Labour MPs cheered jokes about killing the Royal Family and lynching a Tory Cabinet minister at a tasteless Remembrance Sunday event, it emerged last night'
But Ed's already condemned them and withdrawn the whip,right?0 -
Ireland is currently changing from an NHS type health system to an insurance funded system.Flightpath said:
They won't if Farage gets his way.MarqueeMark said:So another catastrophic memory lapse by Ed. He seems to have forgotten that the top 1% of earners pay for the NHS....
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/nov/12/film-nigel-farage-insurance-based-nhs-private-companies
We will all be paying through the nose in an insurance based system. France pays half as much gain as we do under that system and of course Farage forgets that companies pay as well for every worker.
http://civitas.org.uk/newblog/2013/12/new-report-on-healthcare-could-irelands-emerging-healthcare-reforms-hold-lessons-for-the-uk/0 -
What do you make of Jim Messina's push polling in Rochester?MikeSmithson said:
The one sure way of getting into Betfair while in France & other counties is to go through your phone data connection. Trouble is that you'll incur roaming charges. Thankfully, due to that wonder institution that the Tories took us into in 1973, now called the EU, there will be no roaming charges from some point next year .Anorak said:
Firefox plus Hola! extension should make it work.AndyJS said:O/T:
Does anyone know whether Betfair will work in Portugal? I've found a website that says it will, except the same site says it works in Italy and I know from experience that it doesn't.
The kipper MEPS couldn't be arsed to be there when this came up in the EP.
He named Reckless too, just like your old mucker LA0 -
Just imagine. Substitute Tories/UKIP and Nelson Mandela. Cue mass outrage on the BBC and the usual media. Wall to wall coverage. Police investigating... Resignations demanded... Shame on Britain... Dave/Nigel need to have a clearout of members...john_zims said:@TheScreamingEagles
'Labour MPs cheered jokes about killing the Royal Family and lynching a Tory Cabinet minister at a tasteless Remembrance Sunday event, it emerged last night'
But Ed's already condemned them and withdrawn the whip,right?0 -
Afternoon all.
Have I missed Ed’s re-launch Mk5 speech – how did it go?0 -
Just one more reason to suppose that UKIP is just a chancer organisation led by a barrow boy shyster only interested in the gravy train.MikeSmithson said:
The one sure way of getting into Betfair while in France & other counties is to go through your phone data connection. Trouble is that you'll incur roaming charges. Thankfully, due to that wonder institution that the Tories took us into in 1973, now called the EU, there will be no roaming charges from some point next year .Anorak said:
Firefox plus Hola! extension should make it work.AndyJS said:O/T:
Does anyone know whether Betfair will work in Portugal? I've found a website that says it will, except the same site says it works in Italy and I know from experience that it doesn't.
The kipper MEPS couldn't be arsed to be there when this came up in the EP.0 -
Ed Miliband - not so much zero zero as dear oh dear oh.....0
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Trains going through Dawlish are being delayed due to adverse weather conditions. I hope there aren't any problems with the new track/embankment there.0
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Tristram Hunt @TristramHuntMP 1h1 hour ago
Focus eyes on the prize of changing Britain - that's our task. That's what we're doing #6monthstowin
Has Hunt been re-educated?0 -
IF you define the WFP as part of the State Pension then there's no reason why it shouldn't be paid to pensioners living abroad. If it is a benefit, it shouldn't be.Ninoinoz said:
I'll raise you.MikeSmithson said:I've just got my pensioners' winter fuel payment which I have deposited in my Betfair account.
My best friend's father gets the winter fuel payment.
He lives in the South of Spain.
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Money well spent, if you compare their healthcare to our 'envy of the (third) world' service.Flightpath said:
France pays half as much again as we do under that systemMarqueeMark said:So another catastrophic memory lapse by Ed. He seems to have forgotten that the top 1% of earners pay for the NHS....
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Tories on here love distasteful jokes about dead South Africans, and no one criticises itItajai said:
Just imagine. Substitute Tories/UKIP and Nelson Mandela. Cue mass outrage on the BBC and the usual media. Wall to wall coverage. Police investigating... Resignations demanded... Shame on Britain... Dave/Nigel need to have a clearout of members...john_zims said:@TheScreamingEagles
'Labour MPs cheered jokes about killing the Royal Family and lynching a Tory Cabinet minister at a tasteless Remembrance Sunday event, it emerged last night'
But Ed's already condemned them and withdrawn the whip,right?0 -
Hopefully this is simply the sort of delay that is relatively routine in high winds/waves for this line, but you and I are not going to be the only ones thinking nervously of the Dawlish seafront every time there is an Atlantic depression on its way this winter.AndyJS said:Trains going through Dawlish are being delayed due to adverse weather conditions. I hope there aren't any problems with the new track/embankment there.
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But does France actually have a system that works? How long do you wait if you need, for example, a hip replacement?Flightpath said:
They won't if Farage gets his way.MarqueeMark said:So another catastrophic memory lapse by Ed. He seems to have forgotten that the top 1% of earners pay for the NHS....
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/nov/12/film-nigel-farage-insurance-based-nhs-private-companies
We will all be paying through the nose in an insurance based system. France pays half as much again as we do under that system and of course Farage forgets that companies pay as well for every worker.
0 -
BJO
I very much enjoy your stories of multi national tax evasion and the egregious behaviour of the profiteers at the NHS and I agree that the blame lies squarely with the mindset of the get rich quick Tories and their lackey coalition partners. Where I struggle is in believing Ed's Labour Party are leading an alternativet. All I hear from him is how he's going to tackle immigration.. No big vote of thanks to the thousands of immigrants who keep our public services running. Why isn't he putting the case for benefit claimants rather than joining the chorus of those who blame them?
Alex Salmond showed that not everyone is a nasty little Scotlander/Englander and if you sell compassion properly the people will follow. (Well at least enough to win the election)0 -
0
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I saw a photo of the revamped sea wall at Dawlish that holds back the ground supporting the replaced rail line. Was somewhat surprised to see it is:OblitusSumMe said:
Hopefully this is simply the sort of delay that is relatively routine in high winds/waves for this line, but you and I are not going to be the only ones thinking nervously of the Dawlish seafront every time there is an Atlantic depression on its way this winter.AndyJS said:Trains going through Dawlish are being delayed due to adverse weather conditions. I hope there aren't any problems with the new track/embankment there.
A. Made of mortared-together stone blocks; and
B. Vertical (ie the rail-bed and wall are square in cross section)
It was cracked at the top.
Vertical walls are shite at holding back potentially slipping ground on steep slopes. I have seen pretty much everywhere in Switzerland for example that the down-slope walls beneath chalets and other buildings are:
A. Massive
B. Sloping inwards
C. Made of reinforced concrete
Just saying...
(Have you BTW made yer mind up yet about how ships float?)0 -
I have a couple of hours spare this evening and I have reserved them for going through EdM's new policies he announced today ..so excited..no blank piece of paper anymore...0
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