politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Beware the over-prompting of Mark Reckless and UKIP in Roch
Comments
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Ed Miliband and you might be falling into the same trap. It is individual voters' economic circumstances that matter, not the headline aggregate figures, so the question is: whose real wages are rising and whose are not?DavidL said:A fairly consistent trend over the last couple of years is that when Ed drifts into think tank mode and disappears from our screens Labour drift somewhat higher but when he is on the news they drift lower.
It is quite brave of him to test that theory when Labour are already lower (mainly thanks to him of course).
It may just be me but is another vacuous soundbite like the zero zero economy really the way to go? The day after real wages finally started rising again. In a country where an ever increasing share of the tax burden is borne by the highest paid? Is this latest critique going to have a longer shelf life than the squeezed middle? He really is risking simply keeping the story going with another banal speech made up of sociological terminology which people struggle to ascribe meaning to.0 -
Lets stop arguing semantics for the sake of it. I could have said "significantly", or "massively" and got the same answer. Men and women's brains are different, in lots of significant, scientifically measurable ways, I am not going to get into an argument whether a particular difference is a slight or major difference, thats a matter of opinion. There are however, lots of differences, it would be fair to assume some are "slight", others less so.Innocent_Abroad said:
I suggest you read it again. Apart from anything else, what would "slightly" mean in this context?Indigo said:
http://www.dana.org/Cerebrum/2014/Equal_≠_The_Same__Sex_Differences_in_the_Human_Brain/Innocent_Abroad said:
Justify that "slightly"...Socrates said:It makes sense to have some degree of positive discrimination for women, as women's brains are shown to work slightly differently to men, so you benefit by having a mixed team with different approaches to a problem. Only a racist would say that a black man's brain works differently to a white man's brain, so with regards to race we should be colour blind.
The brains of women exhibit significantly stronger patterns of interconnectivity across brain regions-including across the hemispheres-than do the brains of men, which conversely exhibit significantly greater average connectivity within local brain regions
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People were much happier thoughOldKingCole said:
Obviously life was better in the 50’s.CarlottaVance said:Further evidence UKIP voters are a breed apart- net support for
UKIP (OA)
Positive discrimination for women in employment: +9 (+21)
Positive discrimination for ethnic minorities in employment: -29 (+6)
Right of same sex couples to marry: -12 (+30)
http://cdn.yougov.com/cumulus_uploads/document/dil2gusjn0/RedBoxResults_141111_political_issues_website.pdf
Maybe it's because they are around twice as likely to have first had sex at 15 or under?
(My recall for that era says no it wasn’t as easy as it appears to be now. Anecdotes available if required!?0 -
NickP,
Gordon got a sympathy vote over the Sun and the signature, but that was because he was trying to do the right thing and we knew he only had one eye. Ed's problem is that he appears gormless at times, and in a potential PM with his finger (theoretically) on the red button, that's worrying.
After a certain stage, constant harrying will be counter-productive, as Ukip have found to their benefit; especially when it has a definite political edge. But laughing at the clown may well get boring before it becomes a sympathy vote.0 -
OT
Thirteen people have been arrested over a trafficking ring which saw a pregnant woman almost tricked into an abortion following a sham marriage.
The 20-year-old from Slovakia was sold for up to £15,000 by a gang in Greater Manchester who organised a marriage to a man facing deportation, police said.
Officers were alerted when the woman told an interpreter she had been "sold against her will" and was "appalled" by the prospect of an abortion.
Ten men and three women were arrested.
The group, aged between 24 and 57, was arrested on suspicion of various offences including trafficking people for exploitation and conspiracy to facilitate breach of immigration law.
'Nefarious motives'
In May the woman, who was 25 weeks pregnant, was flown to Luton, believing she was going to visit her sister.
She was met by a man, claiming to be her sister's friend and was taken to an address in Failsworth, Oldham.
In July, the pair married under Sharia law in Rochdale.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-300332010 -
What do you imagine that Mr and Mrs White Van Man make of Ed Miliband walking around in an "I'm a Feminist" t-shirt?NickPalmer said:
I think people feel the media coverage has strayed into trivial bullying - the hissing of the reporter asking the leadership question at the CBI conference was one example of people getting fed up - and we'll see some recovery. not necessarily because of the speech and the strong BBC interview last night, but because he's been oversold by the hostile coverage. An optimistic view is that people have actually been inoculated by the personal attacks going OTT too early: it's going to be hard to keep them up till May.
Do they see a Prime Minister?
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List of politicians who have won due to a sympathy vote ;Patrick said:
Translation: You hope your gimp will get a sympathy vote. Good luck with that.NickPalmer said:
I think people feel the media coverage has strayed into trivial bullying - the hissing of the reporter asking the leadership question at the CBI conference was one example of people getting fed up - and we'll see some recovery. not necessarily because of the speech and the strong BBC interview last night, but because he's been oversold by the hostile coverage. An optimistic view is that people have actually been inoculated by the personal attacks going OTT too early: it's going to be hard to keep them up till May.Patrick said:Flash PB poll please:
What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?
A. Clear success, great speech, polls recover.
B. Clear flop, doesn't speak human, polling gets even worse.
C. Meh. Nothing changes.
Er...
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Then later on in the article..Financier said:OT
Thirteen people have been arrested over a trafficking ring which saw a pregnant woman almost tricked into an abortion following a sham marriage.
The 20-year-old from Slovakia was sold for up to £15,000 by a gang in Greater Manchester who organised a marriage to a man facing deportation, police said.
Officers were alerted when the woman told an interpreter she had been "sold against her will" and was "appalled" by the prospect of an abortion.
Ten men and three women were arrested.
The group, aged between 24 and 57, was arrested on suspicion of various offences including trafficking people for exploitation and conspiracy to facilitate breach of immigration law.
'Nefarious motives'
In May the woman, who was 25 weeks pregnant, was flown to Luton, believing she was going to visit her sister.
She was met by a man, claiming to be her sister's friend and was taken to an address in Failsworth, Oldham.
In July, the pair married under Sharia law in Rochdale.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-30033201
"Police said they believed there were currently 400 cases of sham marriages in Manchester."
What's the spread on the number that were carried out under sharia law?0 -
So we will be the wealth creators, not just the wealth distributors;
http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/11/13/Leaked-Miliband-Speech
I wonder what specific policies he will outline?0 -
Sharia law marriages are rarely legal unless the imam is also a Deputy Registrar. Very few are. This constitutes a criminal offence.JonnyJimmy said:
Then later on in the article..Financier said:OT
Thirteen people have been arrested over a trafficking ring which saw a pregnant woman almost tricked into an abortion following a sham marriage.
The 20-year-old from Slovakia was sold for up to £15,000 by a gang in Greater Manchester who organised a marriage to a man facing deportation, police said.
Officers were alerted when the woman told an interpreter she had been "sold against her will" and was "appalled" by the prospect of an abortion.
Ten men and three women were arrested.
The group, aged between 24 and 57, was arrested on suspicion of various offences including trafficking people for exploitation and conspiracy to facilitate breach of immigration law.
'Nefarious motives'
In May the woman, who was 25 weeks pregnant, was flown to Luton, believing she was going to visit her sister.
She was met by a man, claiming to be her sister's friend and was taken to an address in Failsworth, Oldham.
In July, the pair married under Sharia law in Rochdale.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-30033201
"Police said they believed there were currently 400 cases of sham marriages in Manchester."
What's the spread on the number that were carried out under sharia law?
The list of laws not enforced against Muslims in this country just grows longer.
Planning regulations
School regulations
Marriage laws
[Moderated]0 -
Looks like the Labour- Kipper love in is over.CarlottaVance said:So we will be the wealth creators, not just the wealth distributors;
http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/11/13/Leaked-Miliband-Speech
I wonder what specific policies he will outline?0 -
I'm hoping that we might get a post later from Henry G Manson on EdM etc. If something will/won't happen Henry will be the first to know!0
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Constant harrying is counter-productive when it comes from a privileged elite unfairly using their power against a weaker opponent who deserves a fair hearing. Miliband is Leader of the Opposition and so already has a powerful platform. He is fair game, providing the criticism is seen as legitimate and chimes with a public perception.CD13 said:NickP,
Gordon got a sympathy vote over the Sun and the signature, but that was because he was trying to do the right thing and we knew he only had one eye. Ed's problem is that he appears gormless at times, and in a potential PM with his finger (theoretically) on the red button, that's worrying.
After a certain stage, constant harrying will be counter-productive, as Ukip have found to their benefit; especially when it has a definite political edge. But laughing at the clown may well get boring before it becomes a sympathy vote.0 -
That's certainly an optimistic view. I think you overestimate how much attention people pay to the news. The drip-drip of "Ed is a loser" will only solidify views.NickPalmer said:
I think people feel the media coverage has strayed into trivial bullying - the hissing of the reporter asking the leadership question at the CBI conference was one example of people getting fed up - and we'll see some recovery. not necessarily because of the speech and the strong BBC interview last night, but because he's been oversold by the hostile coverage. An optimistic view is that people have actually been inoculated by the personal attacks going OTT too early: it's going to be hard to keep them up till May.Patrick said:Flash PB poll please:
What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?
A. Clear success, great speech, polls recover.
B. Clear flop, doesn't speak human, polling gets even worse.
C. Meh. Nothing changes.0 -
Patrick
"What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?"
It'll be neutral. I agree with Nick to a point. The negative coverage has gone well over the top and most people are fair so will give him a hearing.
I've tried hard to stay optimistic since his spirited performance during the Syrian bombing episode. It was a worthwhille cause as evnts have shown but that was a long time ago.
Since then we have been forced to watch Alex Salmond leading a great left wing crusade in Scotland (and taking Labour's voters) while Ed has hidden under the table only occasionally popping up to ape UKIP. When he's spoken he's been incoherent.
I'm afraid its become too depressing to watch. He doesn't know how to hold the rifle let alone where to point it. Labour should offer Salmond all the money its got to teach Milliband how to look like a left of centre leader with a cause that peole want to follow.
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NickP,
Incidentally, I saw the interview with David M last night about his work with Syria. He may not be my favourite politician, but I can see why you voted for him and not his bro. I suspect you made the right decision but that's history now.
Young bro is going nowhere (in more ways than one).0 -
On topic.
if under-prompting depresses the shares then over-prompting could have the opposite effect
Not the way I think, Mike.
My objection to not prompting for UKIP is that the ballot DOES prompt for UKIP.
Has this by-election "prompted" for Reckless? Judging by PB, yes. I mean, has Kelly Tollhurst acquired her own epithet?
As an aside, selecting what is basicly a Kipper as the Tory candidate doesn't seem to have worked for the Tories. This bodes well for Farage in Thanet South where he is up against a former leader of UKIP.0 -
I think I've said this before, but Ian Macdonald (the author of Revolution in the Head) argued that anyone born between 1945 and 1955 and therefore a teenager in the 60s enjoyed the greatest years to be alive, culturally and in terms of opportunity etc.malcolmg said:
People were much happier thoughOldKingCole said:
Obviously life was better in the 50’s.CarlottaVance said:Further evidence UKIP voters are a breed apart- net support for
UKIP (OA)
Positive discrimination for women in employment: +9 (+21)
Positive discrimination for ethnic minorities in employment: -29 (+6)
Right of same sex couples to marry: -12 (+30)
http://cdn.yougov.com/cumulus_uploads/document/dil2gusjn0/RedBoxResults_141111_political_issues_website.pdf
Maybe it's because they are around twice as likely to have first had sex at 15 or under?
(My recall for that era says no it wasn’t as easy as it appears to be now. Anecdotes available if required!?
Ironically, Macdonald - himself born around 1945 - committed suicide later in life!
Nevertheless, Revolution in the Head is a wonderful book and he paints a picture of the late 50s and the 60s as a great time to be a teenager.
Anyone who has read Stephen King's (born in 1947ish) books too, will be aware of his nostalgic view of that era. King essentially argues in his books that the Vietnam War changed everything. He famously opens his Hearts in Atlantis book with the Easy Rider quote "we blew it".0 -
Doesn't Ed's PR people know that no government can be wealth creators, it can only set out the environment whereby wealth can be created.0
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Is there any evidence that the press are making up all of the internal Labour criticism of Ed M, or pressuring MPs into briefing against their leader? Miliband's problem liesdavid_herdson said:
Constant harrying is counter-productive when it comes from a privileged elite unfairly using their power against a weaker opponent who deserves a fair hearing. Miliband is Leader of the Opposition and so already has a powerful platform. He is fair game, providing the criticism is seen as legitimate and chimes with a public perception.CD13 said:NickP,
Gordon got a sympathy vote over the Sun and the signature, but that was because he was trying to do the right thing and we knew he only had one eye. Ed's problem is that he appears gormless at times, and in a potential PM with his finger (theoretically) on the red button, that's worrying.
After a certain stage, constant harrying will be counter-productive, as Ukip have found to their benefit; especially when it has a definite political edge. But laughing at the clown may well get boring before it becomes a sympathy vote.
1. with the public
2. with his MPs
end of.0 -
The peak of the anti-Ed hostile coverage was the Observer and its story about the 20 shadow ministers. Was this then a clever ploy by the Labour Party and the left wing press to make people feel sorry your hopeless leader?NickPalmer said:
I think people feel the media coverage has strayed into trivial bullying - the hissing of the reporter asking the leadership question at the CBI conference was one example of people getting fed up - and we'll see some recovery. not necessarily because of the speech and the strong BBC interview last night, but because he's been oversold by the hostile coverage. An optimistic view is that people have actually been inoculated by the personal attacks going OTT too early: it's going to be hard to keep them up till May.Patrick said:Flash PB poll please:
What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?
A. Clear success, great speech, polls recover.
B. Clear flop, doesn't speak human, polling gets even worse.
C. Meh. Nothing changes.0 -
Classic Russian tactics:
http://www.lsm.lv/en/article/societ/society/kraslava-mayor-warns-of-local-pro-russian-agitation.a106040
Doesn't look like propaganda to me.0 -
They can grow magic money treesFinancier said:Doesn't Ed's PR people know that no government can be wealth creators, it can only set out the environment whereby wealth can be created.
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I thought Ed was to make a really important speech last Monday on Europe!!
probably another really really important speech tomorrow0 -
People like the kick the government between real elections...the only question mark is whether enough people will still want to kick the Conservatives next yearDavidL said:...
The most interesting part of the Ashcroft poll was of course the part indicating that the tories may well recover the seat in May. That is a curious effect. No doubt it is a lack of imagination on my part but I really can't see circumstances in which I would vote differently in a by election and then less than 6 months later. I can imagine turnout being different but why would people change their vote when being asked the same question? Maybe its just me.0 -
Must be great to meet someone so involved in a matter which interests youMikeSmithson said:Just to add. Lord Ashcroft invited me to his office yesterday where we met for the first time and had great discussion on polling. I mentioned the above thoughts on Rochester.
He's a really nice guy and it was real pleasure seeing him
On that point I am quite amazed that you haven't said a word about the revelation that Jim Messina was behind the push polling in Rochester that bad mouthed Mark Reckless... Surely this is a massive development for so done as interested in polls as you? You were very keen to find out about it when Carswell accused the Conservatives of being involved
What do you think of it all?0 -
just like all those other "no offence committed" inquiries we have going at present in England which will reach the same result.TGOHF said:as predicted
Gary Robertson @BBCGaryR · 17m 17 minutes ago
Sussex Police investigating a number of complaints about an effigy of Alex Salmond @ Lewes bonfire event say "no criminal offence occurred."0 -
Sorry Nick what you've just written above is wishful nonsense. Ed Miliband is a dead man walking, nothing you or Labour do before the election will make him live again.NickPalmer said:
I think people feel the media coverage has strayed into trivial bullying - the hissing of the reporter asking the leadership question at the CBI conference was one example of people getting fed up - and we'll see some recovery. not necessarily because of the speech and the strong BBC interview last night, but because he's been oversold by the hostile coverage. An optimistic view is that people have actually been inoculated by the personal attacks going OTT too early: it's going to be hard to keep them up till May.Patrick said:Flash PB poll please:
What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?
A. Clear success, great speech, polls recover.
B. Clear flop, doesn't speak human, polling gets even worse.
C. Meh. Nothing changes.0 -
Ed's "tackling inequality" theme seems to me like he's trying to shore up his left flank from SNP/Greens. I doubt it will work with SNP switchers, Salmond is too charismatic but Labour must feel they can get back some of the green vote still - though as a fair chunk of that has come from the Lib Dems it will be a tough ask.0
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Have to agree, my parents did not have lots of money , but my father worked, and childhood was great , we could afford a holiday. I loved 70's as well, everybody could work and you did not need much to enjoy life and even got monthly pay rises, anybody could afford a night out. I am even luckier now but lots and lots are not.Fenster said:
I think I've said this before, but Ian Macdonald (the author of Revolution in the Head) argued that anyone born between 1945 and 1955 and therefore a teenager in the 60s enjoyed the greatest years to be alive, culturally and in terms of opportunity etc.malcolmg said:
People were much happier thoughOldKingCole said:
Obviously life was better in the 50’s.CarlottaVance said:Further evidence UKIP voters are a breed apart- net support for
UKIP (OA)
Positive discrimination for women in employment: +9 (+21)
Positive discrimination for ethnic minorities in employment: -29 (+6)
Right of same sex couples to marry: -12 (+30)
http://cdn.yougov.com/cumulus_uploads/document/dil2gusjn0/RedBoxResults_141111_political_issues_website.pdf
Maybe it's because they are around twice as likely to have first had sex at 15 or under?
(My recall for that era says no it wasn’t as easy as it appears to be now. Anecdotes available if required!?
Ironically, Macdonald - himself born around 1945 - committed suicide later in life!
Nevertheless, Revolution in the Head is a wonderful book and he paints a picture of the late 50s and the 60s as a great time to be a teenager.
Anyone who has read Stephen King's (born in 1947ish) books too, will be aware of his nostalgic view of that era. King essentially argues in his books that the Vietnam War changed everything. He famously opens his Hearts in Atlantis book with the Easy Rider quote "we blew it".0 -
I was disappointed they didn't add that if it had been the real Salmond that again no offence would have been committed.malcolmg said:
just like all those other "no offence committed" inquiries we have going at present in England which will reach the same result.TGOHF said:as predicted
Gary Robertson @BBCGaryR · 17m 17 minutes ago
Sussex Police investigating a number of complaints about an effigy of Alex Salmond @ Lewes bonfire event say "no criminal offence occurred."
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Just read an article on a subject I am barred from discussing.
Isn't it sad to see such a prevalence of Selective Memory Loss amongst such highly-paid and educated politicians, civil servants and journalists.
Perhaps we could have a whip-round at Dirty Dicks in aid of relieving this dreadful affliction?0 -
Most people are only marginally interested in politics and won't give him a hearing at all. Many of people who'll vote next year don't even bother to vote at local or Euro-elections, never mind pay attention to unprompted speeches by the LotO. They've had four years to make up their mind as to whether he deserves a hearing and appear to have decided 'no'.Roger said:Patrick
"What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?"
It'll be neutral. I agree with Nick to a point. The negative coverage has gone well over the top and most people are fair so will give him a hearing.
Hmm. The effect of Western non-intervention in Syria was that Assad's forces gained the upper hand on one side against the FSA, while ISIS gained on the other. Meanwhile, Putin eyed the opportunity while the West flagged up that it had no desire for foreign adventures, annexed part of a sovereign state and clearly has designs on more. That's Ed's foreign policy legacy.Roger said:I've tried hard to stay optimistic since his spirited performance during the Syrian bombing episode. It was a worthwhille cause as evnts have shown but that was a long time ago.
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Sure they would have got same result and subsequent establishment enquiry headed by one of their chums would have found the required result.TGOHF said:
I was disappointed they didn't add that if it had been the real Salmond that again no offence would have been committed.malcolmg said:
just like all those other "no offence committed" inquiries we have going at present in England which will reach the same result.TGOHF said:as predicted
Gary Robertson @BBCGaryR · 17m 17 minutes ago
Sussex Police investigating a number of complaints about an effigy of Alex Salmond @ Lewes bonfire event say "no criminal offence occurred."0 -
Ed's decency,honesty and integrity will shine through in the end-no secret deals with Murdoch and Dacre either.MikeK said:
Sorry Nick what you've just written above is wishful nonsense. Ed Miliband is a dead man walking, nothing you or Labour do before the election will make him live again.NickPalmer said:
I think people feel the media coverage has strayed into trivial bullying - the hissing of the reporter asking the leadership question at the CBI conference was one example of people getting fed up - and we'll see some recovery. not necessarily because of the speech and the strong BBC interview last night, but because he's been oversold by the hostile coverage. An optimistic view is that people have actually been inoculated by the personal attacks going OTT too early: it's going to be hard to keep them up till May.Patrick said:Flash PB poll please:
What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?
A. Clear success, great speech, polls recover.
B. Clear flop, doesn't speak human, polling gets even worse.
C. Meh. Nothing changes.
0 -
No but Stagecoach will be running extra services on the offended bus next November incase there is a repeat.malcolmg said:
Sure they would have got same result and subsequent establishment enquiry headed by one of their chums would have found the required result.TGOHF said:
I was disappointed they didn't add that if it had been the real Salmond that again no offence would have been committed.malcolmg said:
just like all those other "no offence committed" inquiries we have going at present in England which will reach the same result.TGOHF said:as predicted
Gary Robertson @BBCGaryR · 17m 17 minutes ago
Sussex Police investigating a number of complaints about an effigy of Alex Salmond @ Lewes bonfire event say "no criminal offence occurred."0 -
No, I think they genuinely believe that governments and government spending creates wealth in a self sustaining cycle. It is quite alarming.Financier said:Doesn't Ed's PR people know that no government can be wealth creators, it can only set out the environment whereby wealth can be created.
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Financier
"Thirteen people have been arrested over a trafficking ring which saw a pregnant woman almost tricked into an abortion following a sham marriage."
A totally illogical and therefore ridiculous story. A gang tricked a pregnant woman to come from Slovakia against her will to marry a man who was about to be deported. She also was obliged to have an abortion.
Wouldn't it have been cheaper and simpler to find an unpregnant woman from Longsight to do the same thing. Methinks Greater Manchester police need a new Slovakian interpreter0 -
Margaret Thatcher Excepted - the left still worry about her a quarter of a century after she left No 10.Indigo said:
By and large people dont worry about women changing the culture of their country...CarlottaVance said:
But these "right wing voters" were much more relaxed about gender based positve discrimination:Sean_F said:
So, right wing voters tend to be hostile. Left wing voters are supportive. That's not a very surprising finding.CarlottaVance said:
On ethnic Minorities both Labour and UKIP are at the extremes:Sean_F said:
On the other two issues, it's Labour voters who are the outlier.CarlottaVance said:
On same sex marriage, a majority of other party voters supported it. A majority of UKIP voters opposed it.Sean_F said:
Actually it's Labour supporters whose response is markedly different from the rest. On "Positive" discrimination for ethnic minorities, Conservative voters are opposed by 12%, Lib Dems are evenly divided. Labour are in favour by 32%. WRT discrimination in favour of women, Conservatives are evenly divided, Labour in favour by 41%.CarlottaVance said:
The wording was the same for UKIP voters as everyone else. Their response was different.Sean_F said:
It's all in the wording.CarlottaVance said:Further evidence UKIP voters are a breed apart- net support for
UKIP (OA)
Positive discrimination for women in employment: +9 (+21)
Positive discrimination for ethnic minorities in employment: -29 (+6)
Right of same sex couples to marry: -12 (+30)
http://cdn.yougov.com/cumulus_uploads/document/dil2gusjn0/RedBoxResults_141111_political_issues_website.pdf
Maybe it's because they are around twice as likely to have first had sex at 15 or under?
Even the 60+ demographic were evenly split (all others heavily in favour)
Net support:
Lab: +32
LibD: +2
Con: -12
UKIP: -29 (60+: -9)
Net support:
Lab: +39
UKIP: +9
LibD: +8
Con: +2
It's only when you get to ethnic minorities and gays that they discover their "social conservatism".......
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Putin annexed Crimea because Ed Miliband did what exactly ... ? Even if we buy your analysis, Miliband is not running the United States, NATO or even HMG.david_herdson said:
Most people are only marginally interested in politics and won't give him a hearing at all. Many of people who'll vote next year don't even bother to vote at local or Euro-elections, never mind pay attention to unprompted speeches by the LotO. They've had four years to make up their mind as to whether he deserves a hearing and appear to have decided 'no'.Roger said:Patrick
"What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?"
It'll be neutral. I agree with Nick to a point. The negative coverage has gone well over the top and most people are fair so will give him a hearing.
Hmm. The effect of Western non-intervention in Syria was that Assad's forces gained the upper hand on one side against the FSA, while ISIS gained on the other. Meanwhile, Putin eyed the opportunity while the West flagged up that it had no desire for foreign adventures, annexed part of a sovereign state and clearly has designs on more. That's Ed's foreign policy legacy.Roger said:I've tried hard to stay optimistic since his spirited performance during the Syrian bombing episode. It was a worthwhille cause as evnts have shown but that was a long time ago.
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Keep the faith until the GE starts.volcanopete said:
Ed's decency,honesty and integrity will shine through in the end-no secret deals with Murdoch and Dacre either.MikeK said:
Sorry Nick what you've just written above is wishful nonsense. Ed Miliband is a dead man walking, nothing you or Labour do before the election will make him live again.NickPalmer said:
I think people feel the media coverage has strayed into trivial bullying - the hissing of the reporter asking the leadership question at the CBI conference was one example of people getting fed up - and we'll see some recovery. not necessarily because of the speech and the strong BBC interview last night, but because he's been oversold by the hostile coverage. An optimistic view is that people have actually been inoculated by the personal attacks going OTT too early: it's going to be hard to keep them up till May.Patrick said:Flash PB poll please:
What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?
A. Clear success, great speech, polls recover.
B. Clear flop, doesn't speak human, polling gets even worse.
C. Meh. Nothing changes.
0 -
What, you doubt Labour's magic money tree?DavidL said:
No, I think they genuinely believe that governments and government spending creates wealth in a self sustaining cycle. It is quite alarming.Financier said:Doesn't Ed's PR people know that no government can be wealth creators, it can only set out the environment whereby wealth can be created.
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Something the left don't understand. Anything they don't like is NOT by definition criminal. And if the actions annoy the left then so much the better.TGOHF said:as predicted
Gary Robertson @BBCGaryR · 17m 17 minutes ago
Sussex Police investigating a number of complaints about an effigy of Alex Salmond @ Lewes bonfire event say "no criminal offence occurred."0 -
Hmmmm
Labour MPs cheered jokes about killing the Royal Family and lynching a Tory Cabinet minister at a tasteless Remembrance Sunday event, it emerged last night
The ‘anti-war comedy night’ even featured remarks mocking the ceramic poppies at the Tower of London.
Among those attending the event at a club in Covent Garden were former shadow minister Diane Abbott and Left-wing MP Jeremy Corbyn.
They heard another Left-winger, John McDonnell give a speech joking about Employment Minister Esther McVey being lynched.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2832286/Labour-MPs-cheered-jokes-lynching-Tory-minister-killing-royal-sick-alternative-poppy-day-comedy-night.html0 -
Although I don't like it when people say " the British people think..." Or " it's not the British way...' Etc, I do think it's fair to say that we don't like bullying of the perceived underdog in the way that seems popular American mediaNickPalmer said:
I think people feel the media coverage has strayed into trivial bullying - the hissing of the reporter asking the leadership question at the CBI conference was one example of people getting fed up - and we'll see some recovery. not necessarily because of the speech and the strong BBC interview last night, but because he's been oversold by the hostile coverage. An optimistic view is that people have actually been inoculated by the personal attacks going OTT too early: it's going to be hard to keep them up till May.Patrick said:Flash PB poll please:
What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?
A. Clear success, great speech, polls recover.
B. Clear flop, doesn't speak human, polling gets even worse.
C. Meh. Nothing changes.
I didn't particularly like Farage calling him an unelectable joke last night on twitter for that reason
0 -
Three unwise monkeys, Galloway, Livingstone & Rahman.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-30032251
If George and Ken think that all is above board in Tower Hamlets, then Frances is my aunt, and Robert is my uncle.
0 -
Good article OGH - again a new insight that the papers do not provide.0
-
On topic, this Ashcroft poll is going to be so crucial.
If he gets the UKIP majority about right, then the next May question/result will be assumed to be correct.0 -
The problem is that in the privacy of the voting booth, most voters dont want decency, honesty and integrity half as much as they want competence, someone that will maintain their lifestyle, and someone that will put money in their pockets rather than take it away.volcanopete said:
Ed's decency,honesty and integrity will shine through in the end-no secret deals with Murdoch and Dacre either.MikeK said:
Sorry Nick what you've just written above is wishful nonsense. Ed Miliband is a dead man walking, nothing you or Labour do before the election will make him live again.NickPalmer said:
I think people feel the media coverage has strayed into trivial bullying - the hissing of the reporter asking the leadership question at the CBI conference was one example of people getting fed up - and we'll see some recovery. not necessarily because of the speech and the strong BBC interview last night, but because he's been oversold by the hostile coverage. An optimistic view is that people have actually been inoculated by the personal attacks going OTT too early: it's going to be hard to keep them up till May.Patrick said:Flash PB poll please:
What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?
A. Clear success, great speech, polls recover.
B. Clear flop, doesn't speak human, polling gets even worse.
C. Meh. Nothing changes.0 -
Yeah but London NMRing in Syria can give Russia the space it needs to invade Ukraine.DecrepitJohnL said:
Putin annexed Crimea because Ed Miliband did what exactly ... ? Even if we buy your analysis, Miliband is not running the United States, NATO or even HMG.david_herdson said:
Most people are only marginally interested in politics and won't give him a hearing at all. Many of people who'll vote next year don't even bother to vote at local or Euro-elections, never mind pay attention to unprompted speeches by the LotO. They've had four years to make up their mind as to whether he deserves a hearing and appear to have decided 'no'.Roger said:Patrick
"What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?"
It'll be neutral. I agree with Nick to a point. The negative coverage has gone well over the top and most people are fair so will give him a hearing.
Hmm. The effect of Western non-intervention in Syria was that Assad's forces gained the upper hand on one side against the FSA, while ISIS gained on the other. Meanwhile, Putin eyed the opportunity while the West flagged up that it had no desire for foreign adventures, annexed part of a sovereign state and clearly has designs on more. That's Ed's foreign policy legacy.Roger said:I've tried hard to stay optimistic since his spirited performance during the Syrian bombing episode. It was a worthwhille cause as evnts have shown but that was a long time ago.
0 -
Let's hope the bookies think like that too, although that's unlikelyTheScreamingEagles said:On topic, this Ashcroft poll is going to be so crucial.
If he gets the UKIP majority about right, then the next May question/result will be assumed to be correct.0 -
weejonnie said:
Something the left don't understand. Anything they don't like is NOT by definition criminal. And if the actions annoy the left then so much the better.TGOHF said:as predicted
Gary Robertson @BBCGaryR · 17m 17 minutes ago
Sussex Police investigating a number of complaints about an effigy of Alex Salmond @ Lewes bonfire event say "no criminal offence occurred."
A rather pleasing conjunction of posts.TheScreamingEagles said:Hmmmm
Labour MPs cheered jokes about killing the Royal Family and lynching a Tory Cabinet minister at a tasteless Remembrance Sunday event, it emerged last night
The ‘anti-war comedy night’ even featured remarks mocking the ceramic poppies at the Tower of London.
Among those attending the event at a club in Covent Garden were former shadow minister Diane Abbott and Left-wing MP Jeremy Corbyn.
They heard another Left-winger, John McDonnell give a speech joking about Employment Minister Esther McVey being lynched.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2832286/Labour-MPs-cheered-jokes-lynching-Tory-minister-killing-royal-sick-alternative-poppy-day-comedy-night.html0 -
Even that?! The humanity! Wont someone please think of the ceramic flowers!TheScreamingEagles said:
The ‘anti-war comedy night’ even featured remarks mocking the ceramic poppies at the Tower of London.0 -
Odds will depend on margin of victory and turnout I think, if Reckless wins by more than 10% he'll be favourite for the GE - if its say 42-37 then I think the Tories are.isam said:
Let's hope the bookies think like that too, although that's unlikelyTheScreamingEagles said:On topic, this Ashcroft poll is going to be so crucial.
If he gets the UKIP majority about right, then the next May question/result will be assumed to be correct.0 -
Which means it'll probably be 46-37 and I'll be stumped ^_~0
-
Poor Old Eck what a shame.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/scotland/
"Salmond: I will miss weekly grilling."0 -
divvie are you too much of a divvy to see the difference ?Theuniondivvie said:weejonnie said:
Something the left don't understand. Anything they don't like is NOT by definition criminal. And if the actions annoy the left then so much the better.TGOHF said:as predicted
Gary Robertson @BBCGaryR · 17m 17 minutes ago
Sussex Police investigating a number of complaints about an effigy of Alex Salmond @ Lewes bonfire event say "no criminal offence occurred."
A rather pleasing conjunction of posts.TheScreamingEagles said:Hmmmm
Labour MPs cheered jokes about killing the Royal Family and lynching a Tory Cabinet minister at a tasteless Remembrance Sunday event, it emerged last night
The ‘anti-war comedy night’ even featured remarks mocking the ceramic poppies at the Tower of London.
Among those attending the event at a club in Covent Garden were former shadow minister Diane Abbott and Left-wing MP Jeremy Corbyn.
They heard another Left-winger, John McDonnell give a speech joking about Employment Minister Esther McVey being lynched.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2832286/Labour-MPs-cheered-jokes-lynching-Tory-minister-killing-royal-sick-alternative-poppy-day-comedy-night.html
The 37%'ers wanted bonfire revellers arrested and the dear leaders image protected by law
The Mail suggests you may not want to vote for a bunch of hypocrites.
Bring your own chips to the bonfire next November - there is one on each shoulder.0 -
Intellectual self confidence can lead to those sort of conclusionsAlanbrooke said:So Ed has decided what the UK needs is more Ed.
0 -
Do you want a single or a return for the outrage bus?TGOHF said:
divvie are you too much of a divvy to see the difference ?Theuniondivvie said:weejonnie said:
Something the left don't understand. Anything they don't like is NOT by definition criminal. And if the actions annoy the left then so much the better.TGOHF said:as predicted
Gary Robertson @BBCGaryR · 17m 17 minutes ago
Sussex Police investigating a number of complaints about an effigy of Alex Salmond @ Lewes bonfire event say "no criminal offence occurred."
A rather pleasing conjunction of posts.TheScreamingEagles said:Hmmmm
Labour MPs cheered jokes about killing the Royal Family and lynching a Tory Cabinet minister at a tasteless Remembrance Sunday event, it emerged last night
The ‘anti-war comedy night’ even featured remarks mocking the ceramic poppies at the Tower of London.
Among those attending the event at a club in Covent Garden were former shadow minister Diane Abbott and Left-wing MP Jeremy Corbyn.
They heard another Left-winger, John McDonnell give a speech joking about Employment Minister Esther McVey being lynched.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2832286/Labour-MPs-cheered-jokes-lynching-Tory-minister-killing-royal-sick-alternative-poppy-day-comedy-night.html
The 37%'ers wanted bonfire revellers arrested and the dear leaders image protected by law
The Mail suggests you may not want to vote for a bunch of hypocrites.
Bring your own chips to the bonfire next November - there is one on each shoulder.0 -
Having recently defended James McClean's decision not to wear a poppy, I'm not getting into any more rows about poppies.Neil said:
Even that?! The humanity! Wont someone please think of the ceramic flowers!TheScreamingEagles said:
The ‘anti-war comedy night’ even featured remarks mocking the ceramic poppies at the Tower of London.
It was like a discussion about AV on steroids.0 -
No thanks - I laughed and laughed at both stories - your fellow neverendum numpties weren't quite so mellow.Theuniondivvie said:
Do you want a single or a return for the outrage bus?TGOHF said:
divvie are you too much of a divvy to see the difference ?Theuniondivvie said:weejonnie said:
Something the left don't understand. Anything they don't like is NOT by definition criminal. And if the actions annoy the left then so much the better.TGOHF said:as predicted
Gary Robertson @BBCGaryR · 17m 17 minutes ago
Sussex Police investigating a number of complaints about an effigy of Alex Salmond @ Lewes bonfire event say "no criminal offence occurred."
A rather pleasing conjunction of posts.TheScreamingEagles said:Hmmmm
Labour MPs cheered jokes about killing the Royal Family and lynching a Tory Cabinet minister at a tasteless Remembrance Sunday event, it emerged last night
The ‘anti-war comedy night’ even featured remarks mocking the ceramic poppies at the Tower of London.
Among those attending the event at a club in Covent Garden were former shadow minister Diane Abbott and Left-wing MP Jeremy Corbyn.
They heard another Left-winger, John McDonnell give a speech joking about Employment Minister Esther McVey being lynched.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2832286/Labour-MPs-cheered-jokes-lynching-Tory-minister-killing-royal-sick-alternative-poppy-day-comedy-night.html
The 37%'ers wanted bonfire revellers arrested and the dear leaders image protected by law
The Mail suggests you may not want to vote for a bunch of hypocrites.
Bring your own chips to the bonfire next November - there is one on each shoulder.0 -
Isam
"I didn't particularly like Farage calling him an unelectable joke last night on twitter for that reason"
He has form....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8oXSfEQuJjc0 -
@volcanopetevolcanopete said:
Ed's decency,honesty and integrity will shine through in the end-no secret deals with Murdoch and Dacre either.MikeK said:
Sorry Nick what you've just written above is wishful nonsense. Ed Miliband is a dead man walking, nothing you or Labour do before the election will make him live again.NickPalmer said:
I think people feel the media coverage has strayed into trivial bullying - the hissing of the reporter asking the leadership question at the CBI conference was one example of people getting fed up - and we'll see some recovery. not necessarily because of the speech and the strong BBC interview last night, but because he's been oversold by the hostile coverage. An optimistic view is that people have actually been inoculated by the personal attacks going OTT too early: it's going to be hard to keep them up till May.Patrick said:Flash PB poll please:
What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?
A. Clear success, great speech, polls recover.
B. Clear flop, doesn't speak human, polling gets even worse.
C. Meh. Nothing changes.
Come on pete, This is a man who betrayed his brother with a well aimed union knife in the back. I know what shines through and it ain't decency,honesty and integrity; quite the opposite in fact.0 -
On topic, the second most interesting about Lord Ashcroft yesterday, after meeting Mike was that the Times reported overnight
Lord Ashcroft back among Tories’ top donors0 -
ECJ Benefit ruling not quite as "excellent" as Dave hoped, doesn't appear to include in-work benefits. Hopes by other European politicians that is means PM can drop his need to control immigration seems rather wide of the mark.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2832420/Don-t-duped-Brussels-crackdown-benefit-tourists-EU-court-ruling-stopping-migrant-claiming-welfare-hailed-breakthrough-true-writes-DAVID-GREEN.html0 -
I see the traitorous pig dog is out of this Friday's match against the country that nurtured and schooled him as he has a hamstring injury - karma.TheScreamingEagles said:
Having recently defended James McClean's decision not to wear a poppy, I'm not getting into any more rows about poppies.Neil said:
Even that?! The humanity! Wont someone please think of the ceramic flowers!TheScreamingEagles said:
The ‘anti-war comedy night’ even featured remarks mocking the ceramic poppies at the Tower of London.
It was like a discussion about AV on steroids.
0 -
Yes but the post related to the Ashcroft poll which was over 10% wasn't it?Pulpstar said:
Odds will depend on margin of victory and turnout I think, if Reckless wins by more than 10% he'll be favourite for the GE - if its say 42-37 then I think the Tories are.isam said:
Let's hope the bookies think like that too, although that's unlikelyTheScreamingEagles said:On topic, this Ashcroft poll is going to be so crucial.
If he gets the UKIP majority about right, then the next May question/result will be assumed to be correct.
0 -
A pretty old but still rather accurate and amusing review of how the country sees weird Ed
http://www.spiked-online.com/review_of_books/article/10944#.VGR9OssgGSN0 -
He isn't as bad as Mark Reckless.TGOHF said:
I see the traitorous pig dog is out of this Friday's match against the country that nurtured and schooled him as he has a hamstring injury - karma.TheScreamingEagles said:
Having recently defended James McClean's decision not to wear a poppy, I'm not getting into any more rows about poppies.Neil said:
Even that?! The humanity! Wont someone please think of the ceramic flowers!TheScreamingEagles said:
The ‘anti-war comedy night’ even featured remarks mocking the ceramic poppies at the Tower of London.
It was like a discussion about AV on steroids.0 -
Good morning, everyone.
Ah, FIFA. The organisation that makes the way F1 is run look good.
England's been criticised. Not sure if it's because we pointed out a summer tournament in 50C might not be very clever.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/300314050 -
No you miss the point... That isn't the same as Van Rompouy wasn't a struggling underdog. He had just been elected to one if the most powerful positions in the worldRoger said:Isam
"I didn't particularly like Farage calling him an unelectable joke last night on twitter for that reason"
He has form....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8oXSfEQuJjc0 -
He's saving himself for the finals in France, Harry. We'll send you a postcard.TGOHF said:
I see the traitorous pig dog is out of this Friday's match against the country that nurtured and schooled him as he has a hamstring injury - karma.TheScreamingEagles said:
Having recently defended James McClean's decision not to wear a poppy, I'm not getting into any more rows about poppies.Neil said:
Even that?! The humanity! Wont someone please think of the ceramic flowers!TheScreamingEagles said:
The ‘anti-war comedy night’ even featured remarks mocking the ceramic poppies at the Tower of London.
It was like a discussion about AV on steroids.
0 -
Did you see last night, I'm mulling a double on Ireland winning the six nations and World Cup.Neil said:
He's saving himself for the finals in France, Harry. We'll send you a postcard.TGOHF said:
I see the traitorous pig dog is out of this Friday's match against the country that nurtured and schooled him as he has a hamstring injury - karma.TheScreamingEagles said:
Having recently defended James McClean's decision not to wear a poppy, I'm not getting into any more rows about poppies.Neil said:
Even that?! The humanity! Wont someone please think of the ceramic flowers!TheScreamingEagles said:
The ‘anti-war comedy night’ even featured remarks mocking the ceramic poppies at the Tower of London.
It was like a discussion about AV on steroids.0 -
Good to see Twitter police getting their fingers burnt.
http://www.sussex.police.uk/whats-happening/latest/news-stories/2014/11/13/no-offence-disclosed-in-lewes-bonfire-investigation0 -
I hope you hold out for some good odds.TheScreamingEagles said:
Did you see last night, I'm mulling a double on Ireland winning the six nations and World Cup.Neil said:
He's saving himself for the finals in France, Harry. We'll send you a postcard.TGOHF said:
I see the traitorous pig dog is out of this Friday's match against the country that nurtured and schooled him as he has a hamstring injury - karma.TheScreamingEagles said:
Having recently defended James McClean's decision not to wear a poppy, I'm not getting into any more rows about poppies.Neil said:
Even that?! The humanity! Wont someone please think of the ceramic flowers!TheScreamingEagles said:
The ‘anti-war comedy night’ even featured remarks mocking the ceramic poppies at the Tower of London.
It was like a discussion about AV on steroids.
0 -
Red-face reactionary dressed in 'The' Rangers onesie, laughing gormlessly at a computer screen.TGOHF said:
No thanks - I laughed and laughed at both stories - your fellow neverendum numpties weren't quite so mellow.Theuniondivvie said:
Do you want a single or a return for the outrage bus?TGOHF said:
divvie are you too much of a divvy to see the difference ?Theuniondivvie said:weejonnie said:
Something the left don't understand. Anything they don't like is NOT by definition criminal. And if the actions annoy the left then so much the better.TGOHF said:as predicted
Gary Robertson @BBCGaryR · 17m 17 minutes ago
Sussex Police investigating a number of complaints about an effigy of Alex Salmond @ Lewes bonfire event say "no criminal offence occurred."
A rather pleasing conjunction of posts.TheScreamingEagles said:Hmmmm
Labour MPs cheered jokes about killing the Royal Family and lynching a Tory Cabinet minister at a tasteless Remembrance Sunday event, it emerged last night
The ‘anti-war comedy night’ even featured remarks mocking the ceramic poppies at the Tower of London.
Among those attending the event at a club in Covent Garden were former shadow minister Diane Abbott and Left-wing MP Jeremy Corbyn.
They heard another Left-winger, John McDonnell give a speech joking about Employment Minister Esther McVey being lynched.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2832286/Labour-MPs-cheered-jokes-lynching-Tory-minister-killing-royal-sick-alternative-poppy-day-comedy-night.html
The 37%'ers wanted bonfire revellers arrested and the dear leaders image protected by law
The Mail suggests you may not want to vote for a bunch of hypocrites.
Bring your own chips to the bonfire next November - there is one on each shoulder.
An image to treasure.
0 -
Big dramatic improvement (as far as I was concerned anyway) was the ending of National Service in 1960. Suddenly for young men like me loads of doors opened, especially that of travel.malcolmg said:
Have to agree, my parents did not have lots of money , but my father worked, and childhood was great , we could afford a holiday. I loved 70's as well, everybody could work and you did not need much to enjoy life and even got monthly pay rises, anybody could afford a night out. I am even luckier now but lots and lots are not.Fenster said:
I think I've said this before, but Ian Macdonald (the author of Revolution in the Head) argued that anyone born between 1945 and 1955 and therefore a teenager in the 60s enjoyed the greatest years to be alive, culturally and in terms of opportunity etc.malcolmg said:
People were much happier thoughOldKingCole said:
Obviously life was better in the 50’s.CarlottaVance said:Further evidence UKIP voters are a breed apart- net support for
UKIP (OA)
Positive discrimination for women in employment: +9 (+21)
Positive discrimination for ethnic minorities in employment: -29 (+6)
Right of same sex couples to marry: -12 (+30)
http://cdn.yougov.com/cumulus_uploads/document/dil2gusjn0/RedBoxResults_141111_political_issues_website.pdf
Maybe it's because they are around twice as likely to have first had sex at 15 or under?
(My recall for that era says no it wasn’t as easy as it appears to be now. Anecdotes available if required!?
Ironically, Macdonald - himself born around 1945 - committed suicide later in life!
Nevertheless, Revolution in the Head is a wonderful book and he paints a picture of the late 50s and the 60s as a great time to be a teenager.
Anyone who has read Stephen King's (born in 1947ish) books too, will be aware of his nostalgic view of that era. King essentially argues in his books that the Vietnam War changed everything. He famously opens his Hearts in Atlantis book with the Easy Rider quote "we blew it".0 -
For the love of...MikeK said:
@volcanopetevolcanopete said:
Ed's decency,honesty and integrity will shine through in the end-no secret deals with Murdoch and Dacre either.MikeK said:
Sorry Nick what you've just written above is wishful nonsense. Ed Miliband is a dead man walking, nothing you or Labour do before the election will make him live again.NickPalmer said:
I think people feel the media coverage has strayed into trivial bullying - the hissing of the reporter asking the leadership question at the CBI conference was one example of people getting fed up - and we'll see some recovery. not necessarily because of the speech and the strong BBC interview last night, but because he's been oversold by the hostile coverage. An optimistic view is that people have actually been inoculated by the personal attacks going OTT too early: it's going to be hard to keep them up till May.Patrick said:Flash PB poll please:
What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?
A. Clear success, great speech, polls recover.
B. Clear flop, doesn't speak human, polling gets even worse.
C. Meh. Nothing changes.
Come on pete, This is a man who betrayed his brother with a well aimed union knife in the back. I know what shines through and it ain't decency,honesty and integrity; quite the opposite in fact.
Of all the critisicsms aimed at Ed Miliband running for the Labour party top job with his brother, his brother that had a golden opportunity with Purnell's resignation to get rid of calamity Brown at the top of the shop and who bottled it, this is oversold and piss weak.
0 -
Russia had not previously reintegrated Crimea, even when Crimea voted to do so in 1994, because Ukraine was a friendly nation, when the US overthrew the elected government and installed a hostile one that changed and the Crimean request accepted. Intended Western actions in Syria merely confirmed that the West could not be trusted and was dangerous, especially coming on the back of Libya where anarchy reigned and international law ignored.Pulpstar said:
Yeah but London NMRing in Syria can give Russia the space it needs to invade Ukraine.DecrepitJohnL said:
Putin annexed Crimea because Ed Miliband did what exactly ... ? Even if we buy your analysis, Miliband is not running the United States, NATO or even HMG.david_herdson said:
Most people are only marginally interested in politics and won't give him a hearing at all. Many of people who'll vote next year don't even bother to vote at local or Euro-elections, never mind pay attention to unprompted speeches by the LotO. They've had four years to make up their mind as to whether he deserves a hearing and appear to have decided 'no'.Roger said:Patrick
"What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?"
It'll be neutral. I agree with Nick to a point. The negative coverage has gone well over the top and most people are fair so will give him a hearing.
Hmm. The effect of Western non-intervention in Syria was that Assad's forces gained the upper hand on one side against the FSA, while ISIS gained on the other. Meanwhile, Putin eyed the opportunity while the West flagged up that it had no desire for foreign adventures, annexed part of a sovereign state and clearly has designs on more. That's Ed's foreign policy legacy.Roger said:I've tried hard to stay optimistic since his spirited performance during the Syrian bombing episode. It was a worthwhille cause as evnts have shown but that was a long time ago.
0 -
I looked last night, and saw I had already backed Ireland for the world cup last year at 22/1Neil said:
I hope you hold out for some good odds.TheScreamingEagles said:
Did you see last night, I'm mulling a double on Ireland winning the six nations and World Cup.Neil said:
He's saving himself for the finals in France, Harry. We'll send you a postcard.TGOHF said:
I see the traitorous pig dog is out of this Friday's match against the country that nurtured and schooled him as he has a hamstring injury - karma.TheScreamingEagles said:
Having recently defended James McClean's decision not to wear a poppy, I'm not getting into any more rows about poppies.Neil said:
Even that?! The humanity! Wont someone please think of the ceramic flowers!TheScreamingEagles said:
The ‘anti-war comedy night’ even featured remarks mocking the ceramic poppies at the Tower of London.
It was like a discussion about AV on steroids.0 -
Mr. Eagles, can't see them winning the World Cup.0
-
Morning Mike.
Yes, the question looks a touch tendentious, but wasn't the poll broadly in line with earlier polls?
My notes indicate leads of 11%, 13%, 15% (Survation) and of course his Lordship's poll which gave 12%.
You two must have had a very interesting discussion. What a great honour for him to meet you!0 -
A Norwegian comedian did some very funny documentaries done on sociology and its fast and loose approach to science, actually got an institution shutdown by the government on the back of it.Innocent_Abroad said:
I suggest you read it again. Apart from anything else, what would "slightly" mean in this context?Indigo said:
http://www.dana.org/Cerebrum/2014/Equal_≠_The_Same__Sex_Differences_in_the_Human_Brain/Innocent_Abroad said:
Justify that "slightly"...Socrates said:It makes sense to have some degree of positive discrimination for women, as women's brains are shown to work slightly differently to men, so you benefit by having a mixed team with different approaches to a problem. Only a racist would say that a black man's brain works differently to a white man's brain, so with regards to race we should be colour blind.
http://www.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/1vuho8/the_documentary_that_made_scandinavians_cut_all/0 -
Well they gave the Springboks a shellacking last week, which I backed last week.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Eagles, can't see them winning the World Cup.
Although I am loathe to back any side with the vile Cian Healy in it0 -
What has "the left" got to do with the price of fish? It is becoming common on here for posters to attribute anything they dislike to their political opponents. Is it "the left" or Scots Nationalists more likely to have been offended by burning the sainted Alex?weejonnie said:
Something the left don't understand. Anything they don't like is NOT by definition criminal. And if the actions annoy the left then so much the better.TGOHF said:as predicted
Gary Robertson @BBCGaryR · 17m 17 minutes ago
Sussex Police investigating a number of complaints about an effigy of Alex Salmond @ Lewes bonfire event say "no criminal offence occurred."0 -
Worse than that. If David had bothered to fight for the lower preferences of some of his PLP colleagues he would have won. But he didnt. Worst leadership campaign ever.Pulpstar said:
For the love of...MikeK said:
@volcanopetevolcanopete said:
Ed's decency,honesty and integrity will shine through in the end-no secret deals with Murdoch and Dacre either.MikeK said:
Sorry Nick what you've just written above is wishful nonsense. Ed Miliband is a dead man walking, nothing you or Labour do before the election will make him live again.NickPalmer said:
I think people feel the media coverage has strayed into trivial bullying - the hissing of the reporter asking the leadership question at the CBI conference was one example of people getting fed up - and we'll see some recovery. not necessarily because of the speech and the strong BBC interview last night, but because he's been oversold by the hostile coverage. An optimistic view is that people have actually been inoculated by the personal attacks going OTT too early: it's going to be hard to keep them up till May.Patrick said:Flash PB poll please:
What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?
A. Clear success, great speech, polls recover.
B. Clear flop, doesn't speak human, polling gets even worse.
C. Meh. Nothing changes.
Come on pete, This is a man who betrayed his brother with a well aimed union knife in the back. I know what shines through and it ain't decency,honesty and integrity; quite the opposite in fact.
Of all the critisicsms aimed at Ed Miliband running for the Labour party top job with his brother, his brother that had a golden opportunity with Purnell's resignation to get rid of calamity Brown at the top of the shop and who bottled it, this is oversold and piss weak.0 -
If Reckless wins by that amount then you should be in clover as the Tories will be perhaps 6-4 to win the seat with UKIP odds on.isam said:
Yes but the post related to the Ashcroft poll which was over 10% wasn't it?Pulpstar said:
Odds will depend on margin of victory and turnout I think, if Reckless wins by more than 10% he'll be favourite for the GE - if its say 42-37 then I think the Tories are.isam said:
Let's hope the bookies think like that too, although that's unlikelyTheScreamingEagles said:On topic, this Ashcroft poll is going to be so crucial.
If he gets the UKIP majority about right, then the next May question/result will be assumed to be correct.
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If we are so unfair and unjust perhaps Ed could explain what the last Labour government did to put things right?Scott_P said:
@simonsketch: "That which doesn't kill you makes you stronger."Ed Miliband declares war on his party.Alanbrooke said:So Ed has decided what the UK needs is more Ed.
@simonsketch: Ed will say we are a "deeply unequal, deeply unfair, deeply unjust country". Why does he say he loves Britain, he doesn't like us at all!
@simonsketch: And if we're so unfair, unequal and unjust, why are the poor of Europe flocking here in their millions to work?
I can't see any problems at all with this strategy. We want more Ed. All Ed, all the time...
Oh0 -
I think you're forgetting Michael Portillo's leadership campaign in 2001.Neil said:
Worse than that. If David had bothered to fight for the lower preferences of some of his PLP colleagues he would have won. But he didnt. Worst leadership campaign ever.Pulpstar said:
For the love of...MikeK said:
@volcanopetevolcanopete said:
Ed's decency,honesty and integrity will shine through in the end-no secret deals with Murdoch and Dacre either.MikeK said:
Sorry Nick what you've just written above is wishful nonsense. Ed Miliband is a dead man walking, nothing you or Labour do before the election will make him live again.NickPalmer said:
I think people feel the media coverage has strayed into trivial bullying - the hissing of the reporter asking the leadership question at the CBI conference was one example of people getting fed up - and we'll see some recovery. not necessarily because of the speech and the strong BBC interview last night, but because he's been oversold by the hostile coverage. An optimistic view is that people have actually been inoculated by the personal attacks going OTT too early: it's going to be hard to keep them up till May.Patrick said:Flash PB poll please:
What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?
A. Clear success, great speech, polls recover.
B. Clear flop, doesn't speak human, polling gets even worse.
C. Meh. Nothing changes.
Come on pete, This is a man who betrayed his brother with a well aimed union knife in the back. I know what shines through and it ain't decency,honesty and integrity; quite the opposite in fact.
Of all the critisicsms aimed at Ed Miliband running for the Labour party top job with his brother, his brother that had a golden opportunity with Purnell's resignation to get rid of calamity Brown at the top of the shop and who bottled it, this is oversold and piss weak.0 -
Another slice of the wacky wisdom of TSE, who sees all things through a prism of the deepest turquoise.TheScreamingEagles said:On topic, this Ashcroft poll is going to be so crucial.
If he gets the UKIP majority about right, then the next May question/result will be assumed to be correct.0 -
There is a link between Ed's posturing on Syria and the Crimea (and let's remember, it wasn't principled opposition but a desire to have parliament support his motion rather than the government's that led to the defeat of both).DecrepitJohnL said:
Putin annexed Crimea because Ed Miliband did what exactly ... ? Even if we buy your analysis, Miliband is not running the United States, NATO or even HMG.david_herdson said:
Most people are only marginally interested in politics and won't give him a hearing at all. Many of people who'll vote next year don't even bother to vote at local or Euro-elections, never mind pay attention to unprompted speeches by the LotO. They've had four years to make up their mind as to whether he deserves a hearing and appear to have decided 'no'.Roger said:Patrick
"What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?"
It'll be neutral. I agree with Nick to a point. The negative coverage has gone well over the top and most people are fair so will give him a hearing.
Hmm. The effect of Western non-intervention in Syria was that Assad's forces gained the upper hand on one side against the FSA, while ISIS gained on the other. Meanwhile, Putin eyed the opportunity while the West flagged up that it had no desire for foreign adventures, annexed part of a sovereign state and clearly has designs on more. That's Ed's foreign policy legacy.Roger said:I've tried hard to stay optimistic since his spirited performance during the Syrian bombing episode. It was a worthwhille cause as evnts have shown but that was a long time ago.
The vote in the Commons stiffened resistance in Congress. That sapping of confidence on both sides of the Atlantic was a factor in both Putin's aggression in the Crimea and Ukraine more generally and the lack of resolve in the response.
I am not saying that the one is directly responsible for the other, and more than Versailles was directly responsible for WWII, but nor can the consequences be ignored.
And now I must be off for the day.0 -
Yeah I think they'll be a lot bigger than thatPulpstar said:
If Reckless wins by that amount then you should be in clover as the Tories will be perhaps 6-4 to win the seat with UKIP odds on.isam said:
Yes but the post related to the Ashcroft poll which was over 10% wasn't it?Pulpstar said:
Odds will depend on margin of victory and turnout I think, if Reckless wins by more than 10% he'll be favourite for the GE - if its say 42-37 then I think the Tories are.isam said:
Let's hope the bookies think like that too, although that's unlikelyTheScreamingEagles said:On topic, this Ashcroft poll is going to be so crucial.
If he gets the UKIP majority about right, then the next May question/result will be assumed to be correct.0 -
Hey, I'm not saying that David Miliband was any good. Both a heap of rubbish. Yeah!TheScreamingEagles said:
I think you're forgetting Michael Portillo's leadership campaign in 2001.Neil said:
Worse than that. If David had bothered to fight for the lower preferences of some of his PLP colleagues he would have won. But he didnt. Worst leadership campaign ever.Pulpstar said:
For the love of...MikeK said:
@volcanopetevolcanopete said:
Ed's decency,honesty and integrity will shine through in the end-no secret deals with Murdoch and Dacre either.MikeK said:
Sorry Nick what you've just written above is wishful nonsense. Ed Miliband is a dead man walking, nothing you or Labour do before the election will make him live again.NickPalmer said:
I think people feel the media coverage has strayed into trivial bullying - the hissing of the reporter asking the leadership question at the CBI conference was one example of people getting fed up - and we'll see some recovery. not necessarily because of the speech and the strong BBC interview last night, but because he's been oversold by the hostile coverage. An optimistic view is that people have actually been inoculated by the personal attacks going OTT too early: it's going to be hard to keep them up till May.Patrick said:Flash PB poll please:
What will be the reaction to Ed's "I'm a credible PM really" fightback speech?
A. Clear success, great speech, polls recover.
B. Clear flop, doesn't speak human, polling gets even worse.
C. Meh. Nothing changes.
Come on pete, This is a man who betrayed his brother with a well aimed union knife in the back. I know what shines through and it ain't decency,honesty and integrity; quite the opposite in fact.
Of all the critisicsms aimed at Ed Miliband running for the Labour party top job with his brother, his brother that had a golden opportunity with Purnell's resignation to get rid of calamity Brown at the top of the shop and who bottled it, this is oversold and piss weak.
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Unlike yourself, and the other Shrieking Kippers!MikeK said:
Another slice of the wacky wisdom of TSE, who sees all things through a prism of the deepest turquoise.TheScreamingEagles said:On topic, this Ashcroft poll is going to be so crucial.
If he gets the UKIP majority about right, then the next May question/result will be assumed to be correct.0 -
Won't that bet be a related contingency? I am not sure that bookies will allow a double on that at single oddsTheScreamingEagles said:
I looked last night, and saw I had already backed Ireland for the world cup last year at 22/1Neil said:
I hope you hold out for some good odds.TheScreamingEagles said:
Did you see last night, I'm mulling a double on Ireland winning the six nations and World Cup.Neil said:
He's saving himself for the finals in France, Harry. We'll send you a postcard.TGOHF said:
I see the traitorous pig dog is out of this Friday's match against the country that nurtured and schooled him as he has a hamstring injury - karma.TheScreamingEagles said:
Having recently defended James McClean's decision not to wear a poppy, I'm not getting into any more rows about poppies.Neil said:
Even that?! The humanity! Wont someone please think of the ceramic flowers!TheScreamingEagles said:
The ‘anti-war comedy night’ even featured remarks mocking the ceramic poppies at the Tower of London.
It was like a discussion about AV on steroids.
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England and Australia apparently cess-pits of corruption. Russia and Qatar found to be pure as the driven snow.Morris_Dancer said:Good morning, everyone.
Ah, FIFA. The organisation that makes the way F1 is run look good.
England's been criticised. Not sure if it's because we pointed out a summer tournament in 50C might not be very clever.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/30031405
That's actually so ridiculous it's hilarious. My mind is boggled.0 -
Come now, Mr Watcher; you know I don't shriek, I'm the epitome of high class discussion.TheWatcher said:
Unlike yourself, and the other Shrieking Kippers!MikeK said:
Another slice of the wacky wisdom of TSE, who sees all things through a prism of the deepest turquoise.TheScreamingEagles said:On topic, this Ashcroft poll is going to be so crucial.
If he gets the UKIP majority about right, then the next May question/result will be assumed to be correct.0 -
Poor trolling effort divs - malcy is far superior in this.Theuniondivvie said:
Red-face reactionary dressed in 'The' Rangers onesie, laughing gormlessly at a computer screen.TGOHF said:
No thanks - I laughed and laughed at both stories - your fellow neverendum numpties weren't quite so mellow.Theuniondivvie said:
Do you want a single or a return for the outrage bus?TGOHF said:
divvie are you too much of a divvy to see the difference ?Theuniondivvie said:weejonnie said:
Something the left don't understand. Anything they don't like is NOT by definition criminal. And if the actions annoy the left then so much the better.TGOHF said:as predicted
Gary Robertson @BBCGaryR · 17m 17 minutes ago
Sussex Police investigating a number of complaints about an effigy of Alex Salmond @ Lewes bonfire event say "no criminal offence occurred."
A rather pleasing conjunction of posts.TheScreamingEagles said:Hmmmm
Labour MPs cheered jokes about killing the Royal Family and lynching a Tory Cabinet minister at a tasteless Remembrance Sunday event, it emerged last night
The ‘anti-war comedy night’ even featured remarks mocking the ceramic poppies at the Tower of London.
Among those attending the event at a club in Covent Garden were former shadow minister Diane Abbott and Left-wing MP Jeremy Corbyn.
They heard another Left-winger, John McDonnell give a speech joking about Employment Minister Esther McVey being lynched.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2832286/Labour-MPs-cheered-jokes-lynching-Tory-minister-killing-royal-sick-alternative-poppy-day-comedy-night.html
The 37%'ers wanted bonfire revellers arrested and the dear leaders image protected by law
The Mail suggests you may not want to vote for a bunch of hypocrites.
Bring your own chips to the bonfire next November - there is one on each shoulder.
An image to treasure.0
