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The NHS waiting list reaches new high – politicalbetting.com

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  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,771

    Stocky said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    So easy to be first these days! TSE must have his keys taken away!

    I've been on holiday for the past week.
    So... you go on holiday, and nothing happens ... I mean zip, niento, bugger all, not a thing! Mike pops down to Waitrose ...!
    I'm still reeling from paying £9 for a 750 ml bottle of water in London.
    And you paid it? Bottled water, rather than tap, is for those with more money than sense at any price.
    Comes oot the tap fur nu'hin.
    Nothing brings out my inner Scotsman quite like being asked to pay for water.
    The problem is that, if you have got used to delicious fresh well water, then you will struggle with chlorinated town water.

    Our recent trip to Bath was marred by the disgusting tap water. This was a fairly strange experience for a born and bred Londoner, who had fallen ill on a Scout trip to Galway as a teenager because the chlorine was missing from the water (not actually a diagnosis, but whatevs).

    Is it acceptable to ask for a drink of the tap water when looking at a house for sale?
    It all tastes the same if it's cold.
    It really, really doesn't.
    Blind taste testing says it does:

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30189556/
  • Options
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    Foxy said:

    Eabhal said:

    stodge said:

    The NHS is devolved and it is always the English NHS that is criticised, when in truth all the devolved nations are experiencing the same issues albeit Wales is run by Labour and Scotland by the SNP/Greens

    Indeed Drakeford indicated yesterday of an overspend of nearly 1 billion in Wales, and suggested cuts will be needed in the Wales NHS and Education, notwithstanding that Wales receives £1.20 per head from the treasury compared to £1 in England

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-65616395

    That reads as a desperate attempt to somehow exonerate the Conservatives.

    The truth is your party has led the Government for the last thirteen years or more - apart from throwing money at it (allegedly), what have the Conservatives actually done to improve the English NHS?

    As an example, in my part of London, we are constantly building new flats and increasing the population but where are the medical services to support the increased population? Where are the new Medical Centres, the new GP surgeries, the additional hospital capacity?

    This is where those who argue for an unfettered planning process have it so wrong - they forget housing isn't just about four walls and a roof for someone to live but it's about all the amenities and networks supporting that new property from sewage and drainage via power to transport and medical.

    All significant developments should be supported by additional infrastructure paid for and provided by the developer as a condition for granting permission - the current Section 106 arrangements are a sop, we need something with serious financial teeth.
    I reject that accusation as my family and friends live here in Wales and have had terrible experiences of our NHS and our health authority are in special measures

    How England performs does not affect us, but Wales certainly does and when I read of the failures in England's NHS I only have to look at ours and see the same and even worse issues

    The wider point is no political party has the answer to the NHS either in England or the devolved nations
    Not quite - if England's performance improves, the amount of money that is allocated to Wales will fall in line with that reduction in spending (or vice versa). You should be grateful that England is doing so badly!

    I'm assuming Wales' funding works a bit likes ours in Scotland.
    Wales already receives £1.20 in Barnett formula (£1 in England) and has overspent by nearly one billion and even Drakeford announced this week cuts to NHS and Education will be needed

    And let's not pretend this is recent, Wales NHS has been failing for years and long before the 2019 GE
    Is that adjusted for Wales having an older, poorer and more socially deprived population than England? All these, and remoteness, contribute to health care demand.
    And who is responsible for that other than decades of labour in power in Wales
    And why do the Welsh not vote Tory?
    Good question but maybe like Scotland it is the Celtic nature of the population and especially in the South Wales valleys

    Also the conservatives have a very poor leader in Wales

    The Conservatives got their highest voteshare and number of AMs in the Senedd elections ever in 2021 under the leadership of Andrew RT Davies
    He is a terrible leader at present
    On electoral results alone RT is the greatest Welsh Conservative leader this century
    He isn't right now when it matters
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,503
    @ohnotnow the Australian and German models look most interesting to me based on that analysis.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,060

    In other news, I'm glad / alarmed / amazed to see our HST 125's, nearly fifty years old, being exported to Mexico for further service. AIUI on a new railway line:

    https://twitter.com/Clinnick1/status/1689677346251395072

    That's a bit weird.
    Yes, it seems like it is three power cars and a number of coaches. That won't be enough for a full service, so I assume it's for something else. An inspection train? A luxury train?
  • Options
    EabhalEabhal Posts: 5,917
    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Foxy said:

    Eabhal said:

    stodge said:

    The NHS is devolved and it is always the English NHS that is criticised, when in truth all the devolved nations are experiencing the same issues albeit Wales is run by Labour and Scotland by the SNP/Greens

    Indeed Drakeford indicated yesterday of an overspend of nearly 1 billion in Wales, and suggested cuts will be needed in the Wales NHS and Education, notwithstanding that Wales receives £1.20 per head from the treasury compared to £1 in England

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-65616395

    That reads as a desperate attempt to somehow exonerate the Conservatives.

    The truth is your party has led the Government for the last thirteen years or more - apart from throwing money at it (allegedly), what have the Conservatives actually done to improve the English NHS?

    As an example, in my part of London, we are constantly building new flats and increasing the population but where are the medical services to support the increased population? Where are the new Medical Centres, the new GP surgeries, the additional hospital capacity?

    This is where those who argue for an unfettered planning process have it so wrong - they forget housing isn't just about four walls and a roof for someone to live but it's about all the amenities and networks supporting that new property from sewage and drainage via power to transport and medical.

    All significant developments should be supported by additional infrastructure paid for and provided by the developer as a condition for granting permission - the current Section 106 arrangements are a sop, we need something with serious financial teeth.
    I reject that accusation as my family and friends live here in Wales and have had terrible experiences of our NHS and our health authority are in special measures

    How England performs does not affect us, but Wales certainly does and when I read of the failures in England's NHS I only have to look at ours and see the same and even worse issues

    The wider point is no political party has the answer to the NHS either in England or the devolved nations
    Not quite - if England's performance improves, the amount of money that is allocated to Wales will fall in line with that reduction in spending (or vice versa). You should be grateful that England is doing so badly!

    I'm assuming Wales' funding works a bit likes ours in Scotland.
    Wales already receives £1.20 in Barnett formula (£1 in England) and has overspent by nearly one billion and even Drakeford announced this week cuts to NHS and Education will be needed

    And let's not pretend this is recent, Wales NHS has been failing for years and long before the 2019 GE
    Is that adjusted for Wales having an older, poorer and more socially deprived population than England? All these, and remoteness, contribute to health care demand.
    And who is responsible for that other than decades of labour in power in Wales
    And why do the Welsh not vote Tory?
    Good question but maybe like Scotland it is the Celtic nature of the population and especially in the South Wales valleys

    Also the conservatives have a very poor leader in Wales

    Racially different, eh? Don't believe it myself. Edit: not least because many/most Scots are not 'Celtic' or at least only partly so.
    And aren't the Welsh British? And Glaswegians Welsh? And Edinburgh is Northumbria.

    I get confused.

    Source: Total War: Thrones of Britannia
  • Options
    stodgestodge Posts: 12,883
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    Foxy said:

    Eabhal said:

    stodge said:

    The NHS is devolved and it is always the English NHS that is criticised, when in truth all the devolved nations are experiencing the same issues albeit Wales is run by Labour and Scotland by the SNP/Greens

    Indeed Drakeford indicated yesterday of an overspend of nearly 1 billion in Wales, and suggested cuts will be needed in the Wales NHS and Education, notwithstanding that Wales receives £1.20 per head from the treasury compared to £1 in England

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-65616395

    That reads as a desperate attempt to somehow exonerate the Conservatives.

    The truth is your party has led the Government for the last thirteen years or more - apart from throwing money at it (allegedly), what have the Conservatives actually done to improve the English NHS?

    As an example, in my part of London, we are constantly building new flats and increasing the population but where are the medical services to support the increased population? Where are the new Medical Centres, the new GP surgeries, the additional hospital capacity?

    This is where those who argue for an unfettered planning process have it so wrong - they forget housing isn't just about four walls and a roof for someone to live but it's about all the amenities and networks supporting that new property from sewage and drainage via power to transport and medical.

    All significant developments should be supported by additional infrastructure paid for and provided by the developer as a condition for granting permission - the current Section 106 arrangements are a sop, we need something with serious financial teeth.
    I reject that accusation as my family and friends live here in Wales and have had terrible experiences of our NHS and our health authority are in special measures

    How England performs does not affect us, but Wales certainly does and when I read of the failures in England's NHS I only have to look at ours and see the same and even worse issues

    The wider point is no political party has the answer to the NHS either in England or the devolved nations
    Not quite - if England's performance improves, the amount of money that is allocated to Wales will fall in line with that reduction in spending (or vice versa). You should be grateful that England is doing so badly!

    I'm assuming Wales' funding works a bit likes ours in Scotland.
    Wales already receives £1.20 in Barnett formula (£1 in England) and has overspent by nearly one billion and even Drakeford announced this week cuts to NHS and Education will be needed

    And let's not pretend this is recent, Wales NHS has been failing for years and long before the 2019 GE
    Is that adjusted for Wales having an older, poorer and more socially deprived population than England? All these, and remoteness, contribute to health care demand.
    And who is responsible for that other than decades of labour in power in Wales
    And why do the Welsh not vote Tory?
    Good question but maybe like Scotland it is the Celtic nature of the population and especially in the South Wales valleys

    Also the conservatives have a very poor leader in Wales

    The Conservatives got their highest voteshare and number of AMs in the Senedd elections ever in 2021 under the leadership of Andrew RT Davies
    He is a terrible leader at present
    On electoral results alone RT is the greatest Welsh Conservative leader this century
    How do you assess his performance in the 2022 local elections - a loss of 86 of 197 seats or 43% if you prefer?

    Makes him a better leader than Rishi Sunak who lost only 32% of Conservative local seats this year.
  • Options
    MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855
    edited August 2023

    There's a thing called Cinema Paradiso which for mail users of it is like a DVD library

    Out of the 1,600 or so houses I deliver to in Marlborough there are two active subscribers

    They're both young men. One of them is called Kane

    The other, I kid you fucking not, is called Abel

    I tell people this as one of my markers of how much I like them

    If you're not struck by the unlikeliness and beauty of this coincidence, then you need rewiring

    Please don't do this. Unless it's an equivalence thing, and the real names are Jekyll and Hyde. Names are googleable and Marlborough is small.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,114
    stodge said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    Foxy said:

    Eabhal said:

    stodge said:

    The NHS is devolved and it is always the English NHS that is criticised, when in truth all the devolved nations are experiencing the same issues albeit Wales is run by Labour and Scotland by the SNP/Greens

    Indeed Drakeford indicated yesterday of an overspend of nearly 1 billion in Wales, and suggested cuts will be needed in the Wales NHS and Education, notwithstanding that Wales receives £1.20 per head from the treasury compared to £1 in England

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-65616395

    That reads as a desperate attempt to somehow exonerate the Conservatives.

    The truth is your party has led the Government for the last thirteen years or more - apart from throwing money at it (allegedly), what have the Conservatives actually done to improve the English NHS?

    As an example, in my part of London, we are constantly building new flats and increasing the population but where are the medical services to support the increased population? Where are the new Medical Centres, the new GP surgeries, the additional hospital capacity?

    This is where those who argue for an unfettered planning process have it so wrong - they forget housing isn't just about four walls and a roof for someone to live but it's about all the amenities and networks supporting that new property from sewage and drainage via power to transport and medical.

    All significant developments should be supported by additional infrastructure paid for and provided by the developer as a condition for granting permission - the current Section 106 arrangements are a sop, we need something with serious financial teeth.
    I reject that accusation as my family and friends live here in Wales and have had terrible experiences of our NHS and our health authority are in special measures

    How England performs does not affect us, but Wales certainly does and when I read of the failures in England's NHS I only have to look at ours and see the same and even worse issues

    The wider point is no political party has the answer to the NHS either in England or the devolved nations
    Not quite - if England's performance improves, the amount of money that is allocated to Wales will fall in line with that reduction in spending (or vice versa). You should be grateful that England is doing so badly!

    I'm assuming Wales' funding works a bit likes ours in Scotland.
    Wales already receives £1.20 in Barnett formula (£1 in England) and has overspent by nearly one billion and even Drakeford announced this week cuts to NHS and Education will be needed

    And let's not pretend this is recent, Wales NHS has been failing for years and long before the 2019 GE
    Is that adjusted for Wales having an older, poorer and more socially deprived population than England? All these, and remoteness, contribute to health care demand.
    And who is responsible for that other than decades of labour in power in Wales
    And why do the Welsh not vote Tory?
    Good question but maybe like Scotland it is the Celtic nature of the population and especially in the South Wales valleys

    Also the conservatives have a very poor leader in Wales

    The Conservatives got their highest voteshare and number of AMs in the Senedd elections ever in 2021 under the leadership of Andrew RT Davies
    He is a terrible leader at present
    On electoral results alone RT is the greatest Welsh Conservative leader this century
    How do you assess his performance in the 2022 local elections - a loss of 86 of 197 seats or 43% if you prefer?

    Makes him a better leader than Rishi Sunak who lost only 32% of Conservative local seats this year.
    In 2021 he won more Welsh AMs and voteshare than any other Tory Senedd leader ever, he is leader of the Tories in the Senedd, Rishi is national Tory UK leader and therefore more responsible for general and local election results (as well as Tory group local council leaders for the latter)
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,881
    edited August 2023
    Eabhal said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Foxy said:

    Eabhal said:

    stodge said:

    The NHS is devolved and it is always the English NHS that is criticised, when in truth all the devolved nations are experiencing the same issues albeit Wales is run by Labour and Scotland by the SNP/Greens

    Indeed Drakeford indicated yesterday of an overspend of nearly 1 billion in Wales, and suggested cuts will be needed in the Wales NHS and Education, notwithstanding that Wales receives £1.20 per head from the treasury compared to £1 in England

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-65616395

    That reads as a desperate attempt to somehow exonerate the Conservatives.

    The truth is your party has led the Government for the last thirteen years or more - apart from throwing money at it (allegedly), what have the Conservatives actually done to improve the English NHS?

    As an example, in my part of London, we are constantly building new flats and increasing the population but where are the medical services to support the increased population? Where are the new Medical Centres, the new GP surgeries, the additional hospital capacity?

    This is where those who argue for an unfettered planning process have it so wrong - they forget housing isn't just about four walls and a roof for someone to live but it's about all the amenities and networks supporting that new property from sewage and drainage via power to transport and medical.

    All significant developments should be supported by additional infrastructure paid for and provided by the developer as a condition for granting permission - the current Section 106 arrangements are a sop, we need something with serious financial teeth.
    I reject that accusation as my family and friends live here in Wales and have had terrible experiences of our NHS and our health authority are in special measures

    How England performs does not affect us, but Wales certainly does and when I read of the failures in England's NHS I only have to look at ours and see the same and even worse issues

    The wider point is no political party has the answer to the NHS either in England or the devolved nations
    Not quite - if England's performance improves, the amount of money that is allocated to Wales will fall in line with that reduction in spending (or vice versa). You should be grateful that England is doing so badly!

    I'm assuming Wales' funding works a bit likes ours in Scotland.
    Wales already receives £1.20 in Barnett formula (£1 in England) and has overspent by nearly one billion and even Drakeford announced this week cuts to NHS and Education will be needed

    And let's not pretend this is recent, Wales NHS has been failing for years and long before the 2019 GE
    Is that adjusted for Wales having an older, poorer and more socially deprived population than England? All these, and remoteness, contribute to health care demand.
    And who is responsible for that other than decades of labour in power in Wales
    And why do the Welsh not vote Tory?
    Good question but maybe like Scotland it is the Celtic nature of the population and especially in the South Wales valleys

    Also the conservatives have a very poor leader in Wales

    Racially different, eh? Don't believe it myself. Edit: not least because many/most Scots are not 'Celtic' or at least only partly so.
    And aren't the Welsh British? And Glaswegians Welsh? And Edinburgh is Northumbria.

    I get confused.

    Source: Total War: Thrones of Britannia
    I do too, vide the recent PB poster, or a quotation posted here, who referred to the British language in a context which implied it wasn't the good old Cymraeg.
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,509

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    Foxy said:

    Eabhal said:

    stodge said:

    The NHS is devolved and it is always the English NHS that is criticised, when in truth all the devolved nations are experiencing the same issues albeit Wales is run by Labour and Scotland by the SNP/Greens

    Indeed Drakeford indicated yesterday of an overspend of nearly 1 billion in Wales, and suggested cuts will be needed in the Wales NHS and Education, notwithstanding that Wales receives £1.20 per head from the treasury compared to £1 in England

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-65616395

    That reads as a desperate attempt to somehow exonerate the Conservatives.

    The truth is your party has led the Government for the last thirteen years or more - apart from throwing money at it (allegedly), what have the Conservatives actually done to improve the English NHS?

    As an example, in my part of London, we are constantly building new flats and increasing the population but where are the medical services to support the increased population? Where are the new Medical Centres, the new GP surgeries, the additional hospital capacity?

    This is where those who argue for an unfettered planning process have it so wrong - they forget housing isn't just about four walls and a roof for someone to live but it's about all the amenities and networks supporting that new property from sewage and drainage via power to transport and medical.

    All significant developments should be supported by additional infrastructure paid for and provided by the developer as a condition for granting permission - the current Section 106 arrangements are a sop, we need something with serious financial teeth.
    I reject that accusation as my family and friends live here in Wales and have had terrible experiences of our NHS and our health authority are in special measures

    How England performs does not affect us, but Wales certainly does and when I read of the failures in England's NHS I only have to look at ours and see the same and even worse issues

    The wider point is no political party has the answer to the NHS either in England or the devolved nations
    Not quite - if England's performance improves, the amount of money that is allocated to Wales will fall in line with that reduction in spending (or vice versa). You should be grateful that England is doing so badly!

    I'm assuming Wales' funding works a bit likes ours in Scotland.
    Wales already receives £1.20 in Barnett formula (£1 in England) and has overspent by nearly one billion and even Drakeford announced this week cuts to NHS and Education will be needed

    And let's not pretend this is recent, Wales NHS has been failing for years and long before the 2019 GE
    Is that adjusted for Wales having an older, poorer and more socially deprived population than England? All these, and remoteness, contribute to health care demand.
    And who is responsible for that other than decades of labour in power in Wales
    And why do the Welsh not vote Tory?
    Good question but maybe like Scotland it is the Celtic nature of the population and especially in the South Wales valleys

    Also the conservatives have a very poor leader in Wales

    The Conservatives got their highest voteshare and number of AMs in the Senedd elections ever in 2021 under the leadership of Andrew RT Davies
    He is a terrible leader at present
    On electoral results alone RT is the greatest Welsh Conservative leader this century
    He isn't right now when it matters
    He should have changed his surname to Tudor (which I believe is one of his middle names) it would have eliminated the confusion and sounded quite distinguished.
  • Options
    Puts my gambling obsession into context.

    Phil Mickelson wagered $1 billion over three decades on sports betting and tried to stake $400,000 on the result of the Ryder Cup, according to the forthcoming autobiography of one of America’s most renowned gamblers.

    Las Vegas legend Billy Walters makes the sensational claims in ‘Gambler, Secrets of a Life at Risk’ published later this month. Mickelson last year admitted that his gambling became “reckless” and “embarrassing” after another expose estimated his losses at $40 million, but the long-awaited Walters account takes the deficit to a new level.

    The 77-year-old struck up a friendship with the six-time major winner in 2006 and alleges that he and Mickelson would bet together. Walters also asserts that the left-hander would frequently stake at least $100,000 on individual matches in American football, baseball and basketball and, in all, lost close to $100 million between 2010 and 2014.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/golf/2023/08/10/phil-mickelson-betting-new-book-ryder-cup-billy-walters/
  • Options
    Miklosvar said:

    There's a thing called Cinema Paradiso which for mail users of it is like a DVD library

    Out of the 1,600 or so houses I deliver to in Marlborough there are two active subscribers

    They're both young men. One of them is called Kane

    The other, I kid you fucking not, is called Abel

    I tell people this as one of my markers of how much I like them

    If you're not struck by the unlikeliness and beauty of this coincidence, then you need rewiring

    Please don't do this. Unless it's an equivalence thing, and the real names are Jekyll and Hyde. Names are googleable and Marlborough is small.
    You set me up beautifully

    I do have a Jacqueline Hide on my route

    And a Raymond Scarr

    Am I a real postie, or Terry Wogan's ghost?
  • Options
    HYUFD said:

    stodge said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    Foxy said:

    Eabhal said:

    stodge said:

    The NHS is devolved and it is always the English NHS that is criticised, when in truth all the devolved nations are experiencing the same issues albeit Wales is run by Labour and Scotland by the SNP/Greens

    Indeed Drakeford indicated yesterday of an overspend of nearly 1 billion in Wales, and suggested cuts will be needed in the Wales NHS and Education, notwithstanding that Wales receives £1.20 per head from the treasury compared to £1 in England

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-65616395

    That reads as a desperate attempt to somehow exonerate the Conservatives.

    The truth is your party has led the Government for the last thirteen years or more - apart from throwing money at it (allegedly), what have the Conservatives actually done to improve the English NHS?

    As an example, in my part of London, we are constantly building new flats and increasing the population but where are the medical services to support the increased population? Where are the new Medical Centres, the new GP surgeries, the additional hospital capacity?

    This is where those who argue for an unfettered planning process have it so wrong - they forget housing isn't just about four walls and a roof for someone to live but it's about all the amenities and networks supporting that new property from sewage and drainage via power to transport and medical.

    All significant developments should be supported by additional infrastructure paid for and provided by the developer as a condition for granting permission - the current Section 106 arrangements are a sop, we need something with serious financial teeth.
    I reject that accusation as my family and friends live here in Wales and have had terrible experiences of our NHS and our health authority are in special measures

    How England performs does not affect us, but Wales certainly does and when I read of the failures in England's NHS I only have to look at ours and see the same and even worse issues

    The wider point is no political party has the answer to the NHS either in England or the devolved nations
    Not quite - if England's performance improves, the amount of money that is allocated to Wales will fall in line with that reduction in spending (or vice versa). You should be grateful that England is doing so badly!

    I'm assuming Wales' funding works a bit likes ours in Scotland.
    Wales already receives £1.20 in Barnett formula (£1 in England) and has overspent by nearly one billion and even Drakeford announced this week cuts to NHS and Education will be needed

    And let's not pretend this is recent, Wales NHS has been failing for years and long before the 2019 GE
    Is that adjusted for Wales having an older, poorer and more socially deprived population than England? All these, and remoteness, contribute to health care demand.
    And who is responsible for that other than decades of labour in power in Wales
    And why do the Welsh not vote Tory?
    Good question but maybe like Scotland it is the Celtic nature of the population and especially in the South Wales valleys

    Also the conservatives have a very poor leader in Wales

    The Conservatives got their highest voteshare and number of AMs in the Senedd elections ever in 2021 under the leadership of Andrew RT Davies
    He is a terrible leader at present
    On electoral results alone RT is the greatest Welsh Conservative leader this century
    How do you assess his performance in the 2022 local elections - a loss of 86 of 197 seats or 43% if you prefer?

    Makes him a better leader than Rishi Sunak who lost only 32% of Conservative local seats this year.
    In 2021 he won more Welsh AMs and voteshare than any other Tory Senedd leader ever, he is leader of the Tories in the Senedd, Rishi is national Tory UK leader and therefore more responsible for general and local election results (as well as Tory group local council leaders for the latter)
    Though there was a pretty huge halo effect for any Conservative candidate in 2021, with the vaccine bounce and all that.

    On the other hand, I'd be interested to hear from BigG what ARTD has done (or not done) that's so terrible.
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,406
    Foxy said:

    Stocky said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    So easy to be first these days! TSE must have his keys taken away!

    I've been on holiday for the past week.
    So... you go on holiday, and nothing happens ... I mean zip, niento, bugger all, not a thing! Mike pops down to Waitrose ...!
    I'm still reeling from paying £9 for a 750 ml bottle of water in London.
    And you paid it? Bottled water, rather than tap, is for those with more money than sense at any price.
    Comes oot the tap fur nu'hin.
    Nothing brings out my inner Scotsman quite like being asked to pay for water.
    The problem is that, if you have got used to delicious fresh well water, then you will struggle with chlorinated town water.

    Our recent trip to Bath was marred by the disgusting tap water. This was a fairly strange experience for a born and bred Londoner, who had fallen ill on a Scout trip to Galway as a teenager because the chlorine was missing from the water (not actually a diagnosis, but whatevs).

    Is it acceptable to ask for a drink of the tap water when looking at a house for sale?
    It all tastes the same if it's cold.
    It really, really doesn't.
    Blind taste testing says it does:

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30189556/
    I wasn't talking about bottled water though. I was talking about the fresh water from the well we have here.
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,406

    Miklosvar said:

    There's a thing called Cinema Paradiso which for mail users of it is like a DVD library

    Out of the 1,600 or so houses I deliver to in Marlborough there are two active subscribers

    They're both young men. One of them is called Kane

    The other, I kid you fucking not, is called Abel

    I tell people this as one of my markers of how much I like them

    If you're not struck by the unlikeliness and beauty of this coincidence, then you need rewiring

    Please don't do this. Unless it's an equivalence thing, and the real names are Jekyll and Hyde. Names are googleable and Marlborough is small.
    You set me up beautifully

    I do have a Jacqueline Hide on my route

    And a Raymond Scarr

    Am I a real postie, or Terry Wogan's ghost?
    And this, ladies and gentlemen, is why we shouldn't centralise all the information on government databases into one central database.
  • Options
    TimSTimS Posts: 9,725

    Foxy said:

    Stocky said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    So easy to be first these days! TSE must have his keys taken away!

    I've been on holiday for the past week.
    So... you go on holiday, and nothing happens ... I mean zip, niento, bugger all, not a thing! Mike pops down to Waitrose ...!
    I'm still reeling from paying £9 for a 750 ml bottle of water in London.
    And you paid it? Bottled water, rather than tap, is for those with more money than sense at any price.
    Comes oot the tap fur nu'hin.
    Nothing brings out my inner Scotsman quite like being asked to pay for water.
    The problem is that, if you have got used to delicious fresh well water, then you will struggle with chlorinated town water.

    Our recent trip to Bath was marred by the disgusting tap water. This was a fairly strange experience for a born and bred Londoner, who had fallen ill on a Scout trip to Galway as a teenager because the chlorine was missing from the water (not actually a diagnosis, but whatevs).

    Is it acceptable to ask for a drink of the tap water when looking at a house for sale?
    It all tastes the same if it's cold.
    It really, really doesn't.
    Blind taste testing says it does:

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30189556/
    I wasn't talking about bottled water though. I was talking about the fresh water from the well we have here.
    Main thing with water is how cold it is.
  • Options
    Miklosvar said:

    There's a thing called Cinema Paradiso which for mail users of it is like a DVD library

    Out of the 1,600 or so houses I deliver to in Marlborough there are two active subscribers

    They're both young men. One of them is called Kane

    The other, I kid you fucking not, is called Abel

    I tell people this as one of my markers of how much I like them

    If you're not struck by the unlikeliness and beauty of this coincidence, then you need rewiring

    Please don't do this. Unless it's an equivalence thing, and the real names are Jekyll and Hyde. Names are googleable and Marlborough is small.
    Also..

    There are several young men called Kane around here

    About as many as there are Richards

    There is only one Abel that I've seen

    Is the statement "There is a young man called Abel who lives somewhere in or around Marlborough" really problematic?

    Am I helping the people hunting down someone called Abel?

    Who the fuck is hunting down Abel on PB?


  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,776
    This is interesting (though not entirely surprising).
    These are likely votes lost to the Republicans for a generation.

    Interesting admission from pollster Celinda Lake. In 2016, Democrats struggled to convince voters that the thrice-married Donald Trump would actually roll back abortion rights.

    Then came his three Supreme Court justices and Dobbs. Now it’s different.

    https://twitter.com/sahilkapur/status/1689398765596160000
  • Options
    TimSTimS Posts: 9,725
    I’m surprised Labour haven’t made more about the NHS. It’s one of the most visible failures of the current government, and an international embarrassment.

    Our French visitors the other day were moaning about their health service. Apparently sometimes people are forged off with the wrong medicines. I had to laugh - I told them how long it takes to get an elective operation and they were incredulous. Then I said how long it takes to be seen at A&E. And they started feeling happy about the French health service.

    Perhaps SKS is frightened someone will ask him how much it’s going to cost or what pay rises he’d give to nurses.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,334

    Stocky said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    So easy to be first these days! TSE must have his keys taken away!

    I've been on holiday for the past week.
    So... you go on holiday, and nothing happens ... I mean zip, niento, bugger all, not a thing! Mike pops down to Waitrose ...!
    I'm still reeling from paying £9 for a 750 ml bottle of water in London.
    And you paid it? Bottled water, rather than tap, is for those with more money than sense at any price.
    Comes oot the tap fur nu'hin.
    Nothing brings out my inner Scotsman quite like being asked to pay for water.
    The problem is that, if you have got used to delicious fresh well water, then you will struggle with chlorinated town water.

    Our recent trip to Bath was marred by the disgusting tap water. This was a fairly strange experience for a born and bred Londoner, who had fallen ill on a Scout trip to Galway as a teenager because the chlorine was missing from the water (not actually a diagnosis, but whatevs).

    Is it acceptable to ask for a drink of the tap water when looking at a house for sale?
    It depends. If the house is occupied, maybe it would be OK.

    If it isn't, I would think twice before drinking from the system. A sensible vendor will have turned water off at the main. But if they haven't, that's when nasty bugs including Legionnaires disease can start accumulating in the system.
  • Options
    MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855

    Miklosvar said:

    There's a thing called Cinema Paradiso which for mail users of it is like a DVD library

    Out of the 1,600 or so houses I deliver to in Marlborough there are two active subscribers

    They're both young men. One of them is called Kane

    The other, I kid you fucking not, is called Abel

    I tell people this as one of my markers of how much I like them

    If you're not struck by the unlikeliness and beauty of this coincidence, then you need rewiring

    Please don't do this. Unless it's an equivalence thing, and the real names are Jekyll and Hyde. Names are googleable and Marlborough is small.
    Also..

    There are several young men called Kane around here

    About as many as there are Richards

    There is only one Abel that I've seen

    Is the statement "There is a young man called Abel who lives somewhere in or around Marlborough" really problematic?

    Am I helping the people hunting down someone called Abel?

    Who the fuck is hunting down Abel on PB?


    Fucking hell, mate, I'm not fussed, if my data get leaked 50 times over I am intensely relaxed about 50 groups of people knowing that I am Tarquin Smith of 14 Railway Cuttings, if people didn't know that how would the mail ever get to me? Other people, on the other hand, are, including (and this is my point) your employers.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,771

    Foxy said:

    Eabhal said:

    Eabhal said:

    stodge said:

    The NHS is devolved and it is always the English NHS that is criticised, when in truth all the devolved nations are experiencing the same issues albeit Wales is run by Labour and Scotland by the SNP/Greens

    Indeed Drakeford indicated yesterday of an overspend of nearly 1 billion in Wales, and suggested cuts will be needed in the Wales NHS and Education, notwithstanding that Wales receives £1.20 per head from the treasury compared to £1 in England

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-65616395

    That reads as a desperate attempt to somehow exonerate the Conservatives.

    The truth is your party has led the Government for the last thirteen years or more - apart from throwing money at it (allegedly), what have the Conservatives actually done to improve the English NHS?

    As an example, in my part of London, we are constantly building new flats and increasing the population but where are the medical services to support the increased population? Where are the new Medical Centres, the new GP surgeries, the additional hospital capacity?

    This is where those who argue for an unfettered planning process have it so wrong - they forget housing isn't just about four walls and a roof for someone to live but it's about all the amenities and networks supporting that new property from sewage and drainage via power to transport and medical.

    All significant developments should be supported by additional infrastructure paid for and provided by the developer as a condition for granting permission - the current Section 106 arrangements are a sop, we need something with serious financial teeth.
    I reject that accusation as my family and friends live here in Wales and have had terrible experiences of our NHS and our health authority are in special measures

    How England performs does not affect us, but Wales certainly does and when I read of the failures in England's NHS I only have to look at ours and see the same and even worse issues

    The wider point is no political party has the answer to the NHS either in England or the devolved nations
    Not quite - if England's performance improves, the amount of money that is allocated to Wales will fall in line with that reduction in spending (or vice versa). You should be grateful that England is doing so badly!

    I'm assuming Wales' funding works a bit likes ours in Scotland.
    Wales already receives £1.20 in Barnett formula (£1 in England) and has overspent by nearly one billion and even Drakeford announced this week cuts to NHS and Education will be needed

    And let's not pretend this is recent, Wales NHS has been failing for years and long before the 2019 GE
    I wasn't disagreeing, just pointing out that there is a link between NHS spending in England and the funding available to the Welsh Government.
    Yes and I understand that and it applies to Scotland, but my concern is for my family and friends who are treated by Wales NHS and in the last 3 months a relative of my son in law had a botched routine operation and contacted sepsis, and died within a couple of weeks of the operation to the distress of his family

    I have also learned today that the husband of a neighbour also went in for a routine operation a couple of days ago and the surgeon damaged his bowel and he very ill at present

    To me the problem is right across the UK health services and while the English will attack the conservatives for their inability to resolve the issues, we are entitled to attack those in Wales equally responsible which is Wales Labour
    A 35 year old GP friend of mine has just had a stroke due to medical negligence by an anaesthetist. That was in Australia.

    Complications are not necessarily down to negligence. As the surgical dictum goes " the only way to have no complications is to never operate". Surgery is like any medical care about taking a balance of risk and benefit for treatment vs no treatment.

    I don't think England or Wales is systemically worse at misdiagnosis or errors than other countries. International comparison is difficult, but some have tried to do this:

    "The countries where hospital incidents are more prone to occur are Latvia (32%), Denmark (29%), and Poland (28%), while the countries where prescribed medication errors are more frequent are Latvia (23%) and Denmark (21%), Estonia and Malta (18% each).

    Within the most accurate healthcare providers from Europe, Austria, Germany, and Hungary are having the least numbers of medical errors in hospitals (11%) and the lowest number of medical prescription errors (7%)."

    "Annually, almost 12 million American people in need for outpatient medical care services are misdiagnosed, meaning that 1 out of 20 people has not been provided with the correct diagnosis.

    Studies show that from the total of 12 million people misdiagnosed, between 10% and 20% are patients that present serious conditions, and 44% out of them have actually types of cancers that are misdiagnosed. The most commonly misdiagnosed are Prostate cancer, Thyroid cancer, and Breast cancer. Moreover, 28% of the misdiagnoses are life-threatening or, even, life-altering and can lead to unnecessary treatments, increased costs, physical and emotional stress, and in worst case scenarios even death."

    https://icloudhospital.com/articles/global-misdiagnosis-insides-medical-error-statistics-by-countries
    This is our health board and it is understandable why there is widespread anger and dismay about it

    BBC News - Betsi Cadwaladr: NHS health board back in special measures
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-64788234
    If you want to compare quality of care by NHS Trust, probably the best indicator is the SHMI (Standardised Hospital Mortality Index. This is the number of deaths encountered vs expected, adjusted for age and social deprivation).

    Recent figures are a bit affected by covid, but this was 2019 in England:

    https://acrobat.adobe.com/id/urn:aaid:sc:EU:59f39d5f-d22d-422b-9a85-18c35a7cb982

    I haven't yet found comparable figures for Wales.
  • Options
    BlancheLivermoreBlancheLivermore Posts: 5,278
    edited August 2023

    Miklosvar said:

    There's a thing called Cinema Paradiso which for mail users of it is like a DVD library

    Out of the 1,600 or so houses I deliver to in Marlborough there are two active subscribers

    They're both young men. One of them is called Kane

    The other, I kid you fucking not, is called Abel

    I tell people this as one of my markers of how much I like them

    If you're not struck by the unlikeliness and beauty of this coincidence, then you need rewiring

    Please don't do this. Unless it's an equivalence thing, and the real names are Jekyll and Hyde. Names are googleable and Marlborough is small.
    You set me up beautifully

    I do have a Jacqueline Hide on my route

    And a Raymond Scarr

    Am I a real postie, or Terry Wogan's ghost?
    And this, ladies and gentlemen, is why we shouldn't centralise all the information on government databases into one central database.
    I've spoken with both Mrs Hide and Mr Scarr. Neither minds me telling people about their funny names coming from Marlborough

    Nor do Abel's Mum or Kane's Dad

    I don't have it in writing, but I doubt I'll need it
  • Options
    MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855
    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    There's a thing called Cinema Paradiso which for mail users of it is like a DVD library

    Out of the 1,600 or so houses I deliver to in Marlborough there are two active subscribers

    They're both young men. One of them is called Kane

    The other, I kid you fucking not, is called Abel

    I tell people this as one of my markers of how much I like them

    If you're not struck by the unlikeliness and beauty of this coincidence, then you need rewiring

    Please don't do this. Unless it's an equivalence thing, and the real names are Jekyll and Hyde. Names are googleable and Marlborough is small.
    Also..

    There are several young men called Kane around here

    About as many as there are Richards

    There is only one Abel that I've seen

    Is the statement "There is a young man called Abel who lives somewhere in or around Marlborough" really problematic?

    Am I helping the people hunting down someone called Abel?

    Who the fuck is hunting down Abel on PB?


    Fucking hell, mate, I'm not fussed, if my data get leaked 50 times over I am intensely relaxed about 50 groups of people knowing that I am Tarquin Smith of 14 Railway Cuttings, if people didn't know that how would the mail ever get to me? Other people, on the other hand, are, including (and this is my point) your employers.
    I mean, I don't know if the white pages telephone directory is still printed and distributed, but back in the day when a new edition came out the broadsheets didn't lead on GPO IN MASSIVE DATA LEAK

    And cf all this knicker wetting about ID cards, OMG my NI number and GP surgery are going to be ON THE SAME DATABASE IT'S LIKE 1984 COME EARLY
  • Options
    El_CapitanoEl_Capitano Posts: 3,873
    edited August 2023

    Miklosvar said:

    There's a thing called Cinema Paradiso which for mail users of it is like a DVD library

    Out of the 1,600 or so houses I deliver to in Marlborough there are two active subscribers

    They're both young men. One of them is called Kane

    The other, I kid you fucking not, is called Abel

    I tell people this as one of my markers of how much I like them

    If you're not struck by the unlikeliness and beauty of this coincidence, then you need rewiring

    Please don't do this. Unless it's an equivalence thing, and the real names are Jekyll and Hyde. Names are googleable and Marlborough is small.
    You set me up beautifully

    I do have a Jacqueline Hide on my route

    And a Raymond Scarr

    Am I a real postie, or Terry Wogan's ghost?
    And this, ladies and gentlemen, is why we shouldn't centralise all the information on government databases into one central database.
    When I was about 20, a friend had an illicitly purloined CD-ROM searchable database compiled from all the electoral registers in Britain.

    We were beyond delighted to learn there was a Mr Wankowski in Peterborough.
  • Options
    Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 3,389

    Miklosvar said:

    There's a thing called Cinema Paradiso which for mail users of it is like a DVD library

    Out of the 1,600 or so houses I deliver to in Marlborough there are two active subscribers

    They're both young men. One of them is called Kane

    The other, I kid you fucking not, is called Abel

    I tell people this as one of my markers of how much I like them

    If you're not struck by the unlikeliness and beauty of this coincidence, then you need rewiring

    Please don't do this. Unless it's an equivalence thing, and the real names are Jekyll and Hyde. Names are googleable and Marlborough is small.
    You set me up beautifully

    I do have a Jacqueline Hide on my route

    And a Raymond Scarr

    Am I a real postie, or Terry Wogan's ghost?
    And this, ladies and gentlemen, is why we shouldn't centralise all the information on government databases into one central database.
    I've spoken with both Mrs Hide and Mr Scarr. Neither minds me telling people about their funny names coming from Marlborough

    Nor do Abel's Mum or Kane's Dad

    I don't have it in writing, but I doubt I'll need it
    I remember teaching a Kelvin, whose surname was/is Hall...
  • Options
    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 18,924
    edited August 2023

    In other news, I'm glad / alarmed / amazed to see our HST 125's, nearly fifty years old, being exported to Mexico for further service. AIUI on a new railway line:

    https://twitter.com/Clinnick1/status/1689677346251395072

    Best trains ever built in this country...
    Unfortunately that qualification is necessary

  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,406
    edited August 2023
    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    There's a thing called Cinema Paradiso which for mail users of it is like a DVD library

    Out of the 1,600 or so houses I deliver to in Marlborough there are two active subscribers

    They're both young men. One of them is called Kane

    The other, I kid you fucking not, is called Abel

    I tell people this as one of my markers of how much I like them

    If you're not struck by the unlikeliness and beauty of this coincidence, then you need rewiring

    Please don't do this. Unless it's an equivalence thing, and the real names are Jekyll and Hyde. Names are googleable and Marlborough is small.
    Also..

    There are several young men called Kane around here

    About as many as there are Richards

    There is only one Abel that I've seen

    Is the statement "There is a young man called Abel who lives somewhere in or around Marlborough" really problematic?

    Am I helping the people hunting down someone called Abel?

    Who the fuck is hunting down Abel on PB?


    Fucking hell, mate, I'm not fussed, if my data get leaked 50 times over I am intensely relaxed about 50 groups of people knowing that I am Tarquin Smith of 14 Railway Cuttings, if people didn't know that how would the mail ever get to me? Other people, on the other hand, are, including (and this is my point) your employers.
    I mean, I don't know if the white pages telephone directory is still printed and distributed, but back in the day when a new edition came out the broadsheets didn't lead on GPO IN MASSIVE DATA LEAK

    And cf all this knicker wetting about ID cards, OMG my NI number and GP surgery are going to be ON THE SAME DATABASE IT'S LIKE 1984 COME EARLY
    He's telling everyone who in the town is subscribed to certain mail order services and had previously shared photos of people's mail. It's not going to end well.
  • Options
    FairlieredFairliered Posts: 4,014

    In other news, I'm glad / alarmed / amazed to see our HST 125's, nearly fifty years old, being exported to Mexico for further service. AIUI on a new railway line:

    https://twitter.com/Clinnick1/status/1689677346251395072

    I raise you the 1972 Stock on the Bakerloo Line, already 51 years old!
    If they can last another 20 years, they’ll be old enough to send to the Isle Of Wight.
  • Options
    MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    There's a thing called Cinema Paradiso which for mail users of it is like a DVD library

    Out of the 1,600 or so houses I deliver to in Marlborough there are two active subscribers

    They're both young men. One of them is called Kane

    The other, I kid you fucking not, is called Abel

    I tell people this as one of my markers of how much I like them

    If you're not struck by the unlikeliness and beauty of this coincidence, then you need rewiring

    Please don't do this. Unless it's an equivalence thing, and the real names are Jekyll and Hyde. Names are googleable and Marlborough is small.
    Also..

    There are several young men called Kane around here

    About as many as there are Richards

    There is only one Abel that I've seen

    Is the statement "There is a young man called Abel who lives somewhere in or around Marlborough" really problematic?

    Am I helping the people hunting down someone called Abel?

    Who the fuck is hunting down Abel on PB?


    Fucking hell, mate, I'm not fussed, if my data get leaked 50 times over I am intensely relaxed about 50 groups of people knowing that I am Tarquin Smith of 14 Railway Cuttings, if people didn't know that how would the mail ever get to me? Other people, on the other hand, are, including (and this is my point) your employers.
    I mean, I don't know if the white pages telephone directory is still printed and distributed, but back in the day when a new edition came out the broadsheets didn't lead on GPO IN MASSIVE DATA LEAK

    And cf all this knicker wetting about ID cards, OMG my NI number and GP surgery are going to be ON THE SAME DATABASE IT'S LIKE 1984 COME EARLY
    He's telling everyone who in the town is subscribed to certain mail order services and had previously shared photos of people's mail. It's not going to end well.
    Yes, I am running two, actually consistent, arguments here:

    1. The fuss is ridiculous

    2. The fuss about the fuss is very serious indeed, because it leads very easily indeed to job loss and criminal liability.
  • Options

    In other news, I'm glad / alarmed / amazed to see our HST 125's, nearly fifty years old, being exported to Mexico for further service. AIUI on a new railway line:

    https://twitter.com/Clinnick1/status/1689677346251395072

    I raise you the 1972 Stock on the Bakerloo Line, already 51 years old!
    If they can last another 20 years, they’ll be old enough to send to the Isle Of Wight.
    Well, the current trains there, converted from D-stock (1978), are only 45 years old!

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Class_484

  • Options
    FairlieredFairliered Posts: 4,014

    Stocky said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    So easy to be first these days! TSE must have his keys taken away!

    I've been on holiday for the past week.
    So... you go on holiday, and nothing happens ... I mean zip, niento, bugger all, not a thing! Mike pops down to Waitrose ...!
    I'm still reeling from paying £9 for a 750 ml bottle of water in London.
    And you paid it? Bottled water, rather than tap, is for those with more money than sense at any price.
    They took advantage of this working class Northerner.

    London is so fecking expensive.
    I live very cheaply in London.

    The place is optimised to extract moolah from status obsessed northerners and other foreigners. No one I know goes to the Ritz for goodness sakes!
    I stayed at Claridge's though because my other half loves art deco.

    Edit - £100 for Hanky Panky in the Ritz though.
    So, your afternoon cost £109?
  • Options

    In other news, I'm glad / alarmed / amazed to see our HST 125's, nearly fifty years old, being exported to Mexico for further service. AIUI on a new railway line:

    https://twitter.com/Clinnick1/status/1689677346251395072

    I raise you the 1972 Stock on the Bakerloo Line, already 51 years old!
    If they can last another 20 years, they’ll be old enough to send to the Isle Of Wight.
    Well, the current trains there, converted from D-stock (1978), are only 45 years old!

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Class_484

    That's younger than most of the residents.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,771
    ECOWAS has authorised action against the coup in Niger, and it sounds as if Nigeria will be acting militarily.

    https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1689674900829618176?t=LYBNsnx2vpIx3kUg0Sqahg&s=19
  • Options
    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 18,924
    edited August 2023

    Miklosvar said:

    There's a thing called Cinema Paradiso which for mail users of it is like a DVD library

    Out of the 1,600 or so houses I deliver to in Marlborough there are two active subscribers

    They're both young men. One of them is called Kane

    The other, I kid you fucking not, is called Abel

    I tell people this as one of my markers of how much I like them

    If you're not struck by the unlikeliness and beauty of this coincidence, then you need rewiring

    Please don't do this. Unless it's an equivalence thing, and the real names are Jekyll and Hyde. Names are googleable and Marlborough is small.
    Is the statement "There is a young man called Abel who lives somewhere in or around Marlborough" really problematic?

    If I identified a named individual in the course of my job I'd be fired. Journalists have been tried and fined for it. Google "jigsaw identification". It's unethical and under certain circumstances actually illegal. Official figures (census, LA figures etc) may even be perturbed slightly to prevent it. Google "statistical disclosure control".

  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,360
    rcs1000 said:

    Waiting lists can only get higher over the winter. It could be this time next year before they start falling - if they do even then. Another nail in the Tories coffin.

    Not if all the people on them died.
    Are you kidding? Those in danger of death are the only supporters the Tories have left!
  • Options
    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 18,924
    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    There's a thing called Cinema Paradiso which for mail users of it is like a DVD library

    Out of the 1,600 or so houses I deliver to in Marlborough there are two active subscribers

    They're both young men. One of them is called Kane

    The other, I kid you fucking not, is called Abel

    I tell people this as one of my markers of how much I like them

    If you're not struck by the unlikeliness and beauty of this coincidence, then you need rewiring

    Please don't do this. Unless it's an equivalence thing, and the real names are Jekyll and Hyde. Names are googleable and Marlborough is small.
    Also..

    There are several young men called Kane around here

    About as many as there are Richards

    There is only one Abel that I've seen

    Is the statement "There is a young man called Abel who lives somewhere in or around Marlborough" really problematic?

    Am I helping the people hunting down someone called Abel?

    Who the fuck is hunting down Abel on PB?


    Fucking hell, mate, I'm not fussed, if my data get leaked 50 times over I am intensely relaxed about 50 groups of people knowing that I am Tarquin Smith of 14 Railway Cuttings, if people didn't know that how would the mail ever get to me? Other people, on the other hand, are, including (and this is my point) your employers.
    I mean, I don't know if the white pages telephone directory is still printed and distributed, but back in the day when a new edition came out the broadsheets didn't lead on GPO IN MASSIVE DATA LEAK

    And cf all this knicker wetting about ID cards, OMG my NI number and GP surgery are going to be ON THE SAME DATABASE IT'S LIKE 1984 COME EARLY
    The telephone directory gave you the option to remove your listing. The question is consent. What is acceptable to you may not be acceptable to somebody else and revealing details of an individual without their consent is regarded as unethical. We're not journalists (makes "ew" face).
  • Options

    HYUFD said:

    stodge said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    Foxy said:

    Eabhal said:

    stodge said:

    The NHS is devolved and it is always the English NHS that is criticised, when in truth all the devolved nations are experiencing the same issues albeit Wales is run by Labour and Scotland by the SNP/Greens

    Indeed Drakeford indicated yesterday of an overspend of nearly 1 billion in Wales, and suggested cuts will be needed in the Wales NHS and Education, notwithstanding that Wales receives £1.20 per head from the treasury compared to £1 in England

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-65616395

    That reads as a desperate attempt to somehow exonerate the Conservatives.

    The truth is your party has led the Government for the last thirteen years or more - apart from throwing money at it (allegedly), what have the Conservatives actually done to improve the English NHS?

    As an example, in my part of London, we are constantly building new flats and increasing the population but where are the medical services to support the increased population? Where are the new Medical Centres, the new GP surgeries, the additional hospital capacity?

    This is where those who argue for an unfettered planning process have it so wrong - they forget housing isn't just about four walls and a roof for someone to live but it's about all the amenities and networks supporting that new property from sewage and drainage via power to transport and medical.

    All significant developments should be supported by additional infrastructure paid for and provided by the developer as a condition for granting permission - the current Section 106 arrangements are a sop, we need something with serious financial teeth.
    I reject that accusation as my family and friends live here in Wales and have had terrible experiences of our NHS and our health authority are in special measures

    How England performs does not affect us, but Wales certainly does and when I read of the failures in England's NHS I only have to look at ours and see the same and even worse issues

    The wider point is no political party has the answer to the NHS either in England or the devolved nations
    Not quite - if England's performance improves, the amount of money that is allocated to Wales will fall in line with that reduction in spending (or vice versa). You should be grateful that England is doing so badly!

    I'm assuming Wales' funding works a bit likes ours in Scotland.
    Wales already receives £1.20 in Barnett formula (£1 in England) and has overspent by nearly one billion and even Drakeford announced this week cuts to NHS and Education will be needed

    And let's not pretend this is recent, Wales NHS has been failing for years and long before the 2019 GE
    Is that adjusted for Wales having an older, poorer and more socially deprived population than England? All these, and remoteness, contribute to health care demand.
    And who is responsible for that other than decades of labour in power in Wales
    And why do the Welsh not vote Tory?
    Good question but maybe like Scotland it is the Celtic nature of the population and especially in the South Wales valleys

    Also the conservatives have a very poor leader in Wales

    The Conservatives got their highest voteshare and number of AMs in the Senedd elections ever in 2021 under the leadership of Andrew RT Davies
    He is a terrible leader at present
    On electoral results alone RT is the greatest Welsh Conservative leader this century
    How do you assess his performance in the 2022 local elections - a loss of 86 of 197 seats or 43% if you prefer?

    Makes him a better leader than Rishi Sunak who lost only 32% of Conservative local seats this year.
    In 2021 he won more Welsh AMs and voteshare than any other Tory Senedd leader ever, he is leader of the Tories in the Senedd, Rishi is national Tory UK leader and therefore more responsible for general and local election results (as well as Tory group local council leaders for the latter)
    Though there was a pretty huge halo effect for any Conservative candidate in 2021, with the vaccine bounce and all that.

    On the other hand, I'd be interested to hear from BigG what ARTD has done (or not done) that's so terrible.
    He is anonymous
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    CiceroCicero Posts: 2,251
    Foxy said:

    ECOWAS has authorised action against the coup in Niger, and it sounds as if Nigeria will be acting militarily.

    https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1689674900829618176?t=LYBNsnx2vpIx3kUg0Sqahg&s=19

    If true, that will certainly upset the Wagnerites, not to mention the cretins on Russian media channels that cheer lead for thuggish neo-fascism.
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,114
    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Waiting lists can only get higher over the winter. It could be this time next year before they start falling - if they do even then. Another nail in the Tories coffin.

    Not if all the people on them died.
    Are you kidding? Those in danger of death are the only supporters the Tories have left!
    And Leavers and Hindus
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    GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 3,002
    Social care and primary care are both f*cked and various other services that would have made for earlier, cheaper interventions (SureStart being one, but LA funding in general too) have been winnowed away. Schools are acting as frontline care services, and social work is in an even more dire state of recruitment than teaching or healthcare. Public health is dire, yet gets dominated by such pin-head-dancing as the ‘sugar tax’.

    The NHS is the end of the line here.
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    HYUFD said:

    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Waiting lists can only get higher over the winter. It could be this time next year before they start falling - if they do even then. Another nail in the Tories coffin.

    Not if all the people on them died.
    Are you kidding? Those in danger of death are the only supporters the Tories have left!
    And Leavers and Hindus
    Still-committed Leavers and the elderly are two groups with a very large overlap, though.

    And the 2 % Hindu population in the UK does not make for an election victory.
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    HYUFD said:

    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Waiting lists can only get higher over the winter. It could be this time next year before they start falling - if they do even then. Another nail in the Tories coffin.

    Not if all the people on them died.
    Are you kidding? Those in danger of death are the only supporters the Tories have left!
    And Leavers and Hindus
    Hindus slightly favour Labour in fact.
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    FairlieredFairliered Posts: 4,014

    HYUFD said:

    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Waiting lists can only get higher over the winter. It could be this time next year before they start falling - if they do even then. Another nail in the Tories coffin.

    Not if all the people on them died.
    Are you kidding? Those in danger of death are the only supporters the Tories have left!
    And Leavers and Hindus
    Hindus slightly favour Labour in fact.
    What’s a hindu? Lay iggs!
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    StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 7,082

    @ohnotnow the Australian and German models look most interesting to me based on that analysis.

    German model has a lot of corruption, plus poor primary care. Additionally many new products are not launched there because of SHV’s pricing policy
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    GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 3,002
    Cicero said:

    Foxy said:

    ECOWAS has authorised action against the coup in Niger, and it sounds as if Nigeria will be acting militarily.

    https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1689674900829618176?t=LYBNsnx2vpIx3kUg0Sqahg&s=19

    If true, that will certainly upset the Wagnerites, not to mention the cretins on Russian media channels that cheer lead for thuggish neo-fascism.
    It is hard to see this ending well.
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    Pagan2Pagan2 Posts: 8,846
    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Eabhal said:

    Eabhal said:

    stodge said:

    The NHS is devolved and it is always the English NHS that is criticised, when in truth all the devolved nations are experiencing the same issues albeit Wales is run by Labour and Scotland by the SNP/Greens

    Indeed Drakeford indicated yesterday of an overspend of nearly 1 billion in Wales, and suggested cuts will be needed in the Wales NHS and Education, notwithstanding that Wales receives £1.20 per head from the treasury compared to £1 in England

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-65616395

    That reads as a desperate attempt to somehow exonerate the Conservatives.

    The truth is your party has led the Government for the last thirteen years or more - apart from throwing money at it (allegedly), what have the Conservatives actually done to improve the English NHS?

    As an example, in my part of London, we are constantly building new flats and increasing the population but where are the medical services to support the increased population? Where are the new Medical Centres, the new GP surgeries, the additional hospital capacity?

    This is where those who argue for an unfettered planning process have it so wrong - they forget housing isn't just about four walls and a roof for someone to live but it's about all the amenities and networks supporting that new property from sewage and drainage via power to transport and medical.

    All significant developments should be supported by additional infrastructure paid for and provided by the developer as a condition for granting permission - the current Section 106 arrangements are a sop, we need something with serious financial teeth.
    I reject that accusation as my family and friends live here in Wales and have had terrible experiences of our NHS and our health authority are in special measures

    How England performs does not affect us, but Wales certainly does and when I read of the failures in England's NHS I only have to look at ours and see the same and even worse issues

    The wider point is no political party has the answer to the NHS either in England or the devolved nations
    Not quite - if England's performance improves, the amount of money that is allocated to Wales will fall in line with that reduction in spending (or vice versa). You should be grateful that England is doing so badly!

    I'm assuming Wales' funding works a bit likes ours in Scotland.
    Wales already receives £1.20 in Barnett formula (£1 in England) and has overspent by nearly one billion and even Drakeford announced this week cuts to NHS and Education will be needed

    And let's not pretend this is recent, Wales NHS has been failing for years and long before the 2019 GE
    I wasn't disagreeing, just pointing out that there is a link between NHS spending in England and the funding available to the Welsh Government.
    Yes and I understand that and it applies to Scotland, but my concern is for my family and friends who are treated by Wales NHS and in the last 3 months a relative of my son in law had a botched routine operation and contacted sepsis, and died within a couple of weeks of the operation to the distress of his family

    I have also learned today that the husband of a neighbour also went in for a routine operation a couple of days ago and the surgeon damaged his bowel and he very ill at present

    To me the problem is right across the UK health services and while the English will attack the conservatives for their inability to resolve the issues, we are entitled to attack those in Wales equally responsible which is Wales Labour
    A 35 year old GP friend of mine has just had a stroke due to medical negligence by an anaesthetist. That was in Australia.

    Complications are not necessarily down to negligence. As the surgical dictum goes " the only way to have no complications is to never operate". Surgery is like any medical care about taking a balance of risk and benefit for treatment vs no treatment.

    I don't think England or Wales is systemically worse at misdiagnosis or errors than other countries. International comparison is difficult, but some have tried to do this:

    "The countries where hospital incidents are more prone to occur are Latvia (32%), Denmark (29%), and Poland (28%), while the countries where prescribed medication errors are more frequent are Latvia (23%) and Denmark (21%), Estonia and Malta (18% each).

    Within the most accurate healthcare providers from Europe, Austria, Germany, and Hungary are having the least numbers of medical errors in hospitals (11%) and the lowest number of medical prescription errors (7%)."

    "Annually, almost 12 million American people in need for outpatient medical care services are misdiagnosed, meaning that 1 out of 20 people has not been provided with the correct diagnosis.

    Studies show that from the total of 12 million people misdiagnosed, between 10% and 20% are patients that present serious conditions, and 44% out of them have actually types of cancers that are misdiagnosed. The most commonly misdiagnosed are Prostate cancer, Thyroid cancer, and Breast cancer. Moreover, 28% of the misdiagnoses are life-threatening or, even, life-altering and can lead to unnecessary treatments, increased costs, physical and emotional stress, and in worst case scenarios even death."

    https://icloudhospital.com/articles/global-misdiagnosis-insides-medical-error-statistics-by-countries
    This is our health board and it is understandable why there is widespread anger and dismay about it

    BBC News - Betsi Cadwaladr: NHS health board back in special measures
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-64788234
    If you want to compare quality of care by NHS Trust, probably the best indicator is the SHMI (Standardised Hospital Mortality Index. This is the number of deaths encountered vs expected, adjusted for age and social deprivation).

    Recent figures are a bit affected by covid, but this was 2019 in England:

    https://acrobat.adobe.com/id/urn:aaid:sc:EU:59f39d5f-d22d-422b-9a85-18c35a7cb982

    I haven't yet found comparable figures for Wales.
    The NHS spends too much money keeping people alive that shouldn't be. An example is my father now 83....they keep curing him, he doesnt know what day of the week it is....half the time he doesnt know who I am. He cant dress himself, cant cook for himself.....basically using up the time of two people having to look after him. Frankly stop let him go I dont want him to end up in a home which he would hate and its where he is heading. He has little quality of life yet the fuckwits still go yes we can keep him going
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    StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 7,082

    Miklosvar said:

    There's a thing called Cinema Paradiso which for mail users of it is like a DVD library

    Out of the 1,600 or so houses I deliver to in Marlborough there are two active subscribers

    They're both young men. One of them is called Kane

    The other, I kid you fucking not, is called Abel

    I tell people this as one of my markers of how much I like them

    If you're not struck by the unlikeliness and beauty of this coincidence, then you need rewiring

    Please don't do this. Unless it's an equivalence thing, and the real names are Jekyll and Hyde. Names are googleable and Marlborough is small.
    You set me up beautifully

    I do have a Jacqueline Hide on my route

    And a Raymond Scarr

    Am I a real postie, or Terry Wogan's ghost?
    And this, ladies and gentlemen, is why we shouldn't centralise all the information on government databases into one central database.
    I've spoken with both Mrs Hide and Mr Scarr. Neither minds me telling people about their funny names coming from Marlborough

    Nor do Abel's Mum or Kane's Dad

    I don't have it in writing, but I doubt I'll need it
    I remember teaching a Kelvin, whose surname was/is Hall...
    The best names story I heard was when Neil Marten was showing some of his constituents around the Palace of Westminster.

    In the Great Hall he came across his old friend, Quintin Hailsham, who was Lord High Chancellor at the time - fully robed with his Mace being carried in front of his and surrounded by assorted flunkies with silver buckles.

    Ever mischievous, Hailsham lifted one arm in the air and roared “Neil!” across the empty void.

    And the visitors did…

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    RogerRoger Posts: 18,894
    edited August 2023
    I came across this wonderful short documentary entitled 'Clacton- on- Sea. Living in a post Brexit society'.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QUej2pWLUUc
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,114
    Cicero said:

    Foxy said:

    ECOWAS has authorised action against the coup in Niger, and it sounds as if Nigeria will be acting militarily.

    https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1689674900829618176?t=LYBNsnx2vpIx3kUg0Sqahg&s=19

    If true, that will certainly upset the Wagnerites, not to mention the cretins on Russian media channels that cheer lead for thuggish neo-fascism.
    Could signal Nigeria becoming a regional superpower in Africa and in this case curtailing Russian influence which is good news
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,114
    edited August 2023

    HYUFD said:

    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Waiting lists can only get higher over the winter. It could be this time next year before they start falling - if they do even then. Another nail in the Tories coffin.

    Not if all the people on them died.
    Are you kidding? Those in danger of death are the only supporters the Tories have left!
    And Leavers and Hindus
    Hindus slightly favour Labour in fact.
    They did pre Rishi, as the huge swing to the Tories in Hindu heavy Leicester in the local elections and the Tory hold in strong Hindu Uxbridge showed they don't now
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,114
    edited August 2023
    Roger said:

    I came across this wonderful short documentary entitled 'Clacton- on- Sea. Living in a post Brexit society'.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QUej2pWLUUc

    Well Clacton did vote overwhelmingly for Brexit
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,827
    edited August 2023
    I can't believe "Barbenheimer" has its own Wikipedia page.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbenheimer
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    Peck2Peck2 Posts: 1
    Michelle Obama would be my no.1 choice. She would be far superior to Kamala Harris who is just a career politician. But since I'm a pessimist I doubt that Mrs Obama will run.
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    NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,358
    Ghedebrav said:

    Cicero said:

    Foxy said:

    ECOWAS has authorised action against the coup in Niger, and it sounds as if Nigeria will be acting militarily.

    https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1689674900829618176?t=LYBNsnx2vpIx3kUg0Sqahg&s=19

    If true, that will certainly upset the Wagnerites, not to mention the cretins on Russian media channels that cheer lead for thuggish neo-fascism.
    It is hard to see this ending well.
    A new war is rarely good news. Let's hope it's quick, and doesn't spread.
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    Peck2 said:

    Michelle Obama would be my no.1 choice. She would be far superior to Kamala Harris who is just a career politician. But since I'm a pessimist I doubt that Mrs Obama will run.
    Both Michelle Obama and Kamala Harris used to be lawyers.
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    fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,279
    edited August 2023
    Blimey, the SNP must be getting a very poor reception on the doorsteps of Rutherglen and Hamilton West if this is where their by-election campaign strategy is heading already!

    https://twitter.com/ChrisMusson/status/1689765572756549632
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    sladeslade Posts: 1,939
    Lib Dem gain in Somerset. Expected but big swing.
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    CiceroCicero Posts: 2,251
    slade said:

    Lib Dem gain in Somerset. Expected but big swing.

    Crushing defeat for the Tories.
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    Peck2 said:

    Michelle Obama would be my no.1 choice. She would be far superior to Kamala Harris who is just a career politician. But since I'm a pessimist I doubt that Mrs Obama will run.
    Both Michelle Obama and Kamala Harris used to be lawyers.
    Lefty Lawyers standing in our way?
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,827
    She'd be a good president IMO. Hope it happens.
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    fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,279
    Andy_JS said:

    She'd be a good president IMO. Hope it happens.
    I thought that years ago when she was the first lady, hope it happens too.
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    Shakespeare’s Romeo and Juliet cancelled by DeSantis’s ‘don’t say gay’ law
    Florida school district cites 'pre-marital sex' as reason to ban students studying play

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/08/09/william-shakespeare-cancelled-romeo-and-juliet-ron-desantis/ (£££)

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    MonksfieldMonksfield Posts: 2,206
    edited August 2023
    So as a politics geek I was thrilled to pass this afternoon, in a matter of a few miles, through Bretton Woods then Hart’s Location. Whilst the Mount Washington Hotel at the former was visible from afar, I didn’t find anywhere where I could get a photo in front of a sign at the latter. Heaven knows where they go to vote, it was all forest….

    Anyway I recommend the drive up Mount Washington, fab views.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,954

    Shakespeare’s Romeo and Juliet cancelled by DeSantis’s ‘don’t say gay’ law
    Florida school district cites 'pre-marital sex' as reason to ban students studying play

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/08/09/william-shakespeare-cancelled-romeo-and-juliet-ron-desantis/ (£££)

    I saw something online about some evangelical pastors getting worried as they apparently quote from things like the sermon on the mount and get angry parishioners coming up to them asking where this lefty liberal crap is coming from. When told its Jesus it apparently doesn't shake the angry people.

    Just an anecdote, but amusing if true.
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    StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 7,082
    Andy_JS said:

    She'd be a good president IMO. Hope it happens.
    She’s said she’s not interested. There’s no evidence ever to suggest she would be interested. Don’t waste your hope
  • Options
    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,827

    So as a politics geek I was thrilled to pass this afternoon, in a matter of a few miles, through Bretton Woods then Hart’s Location. Whilst the Mount Washington Hotel at the former was visible from afar, I didn’t find anywhere where I could get a photo in front of a sign at the latter. Heaven knows where they go to vote, it was all forest….

    Anyway I recommend the drive up Mount Washington, fab views.

    I've been lucky enough to visit the hotel and sit in the room where apparently the famous meeting took place. Also been on the cog railway. 2015 IIRC.
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    OT Spain are through to the semi-final; Netherlands are out; result was 2-1.
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    Angus MacNeil: SNP MP announces expulsion from party after chief whip row
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-66470026
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,974

    Andy_JS said:

    She'd be a good president IMO. Hope it happens.
    She’s said she’s not interested. There’s no evidence ever to suggest she would be interested. Don’t waste your hope
    The absolute state of these puff pieces. Toby Young was adamant Gavin Newsom would be the nominee a few weeks back
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,776
    Pulpstar said:

    Andy_JS said:

    She'd be a good president IMO. Hope it happens.
    She’s said she’s not interested. There’s no evidence ever to suggest she would be interested. Don’t waste your hope
    The absolute state of these puff pieces. Toby Young was adamant Gavin Newsom would be the nominee a few weeks back
    The Telegraph is perhaps not the most authoritative voice on US politics. Or much else.
    They should stick to the internal politics of the Conservative Party.
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,334
    Pulpstar said:

    Andy_JS said:

    She'd be a good president IMO. Hope it happens.
    She’s said she’s not interested. There’s no evidence ever to suggest she would be interested. Don’t waste your hope
    The absolute state of these puff pieces. Toby Young was adamant Gavin Newsom would be the nominee a few weeks back
    If Toby Young says something will happen that’s usually a good indication it won’t.
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    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 33,119
    ...
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    bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 7,754

    "The big NHS news this afternoon is that the NHS waiting list in England is now almost at 8m – the highest level yet."

    But where is this big news being reported? BBC? No. Guardian? No. Very strange.

    I posted the BBC article on it here yesterday. It was on the front page of the BBC news website.
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    bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 7,754
    nico679 said:

    No party will go near the NHS in terms of a major reform . Its too dangerous to their election chances . You can get away with more people treated in the private sector to help lower waiting lists but you’re not asking people to pay anything extra or making fundamental changes to the model .

    The French system whilst not perfect has many areas that the British could learn from and its public private model works well.

    The private isn’t what many would properly class as in the true sense of the term . It’s non-profit based in the main .

    Both main parties have made major reforms to the NHS.

    The French system spends more money per person. To quote the ONS:

    “In 2017, the UK spent £2,989 per person on healthcare, which was around the median for members of the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development: OECD (£2,913 per person).

    “However, of the G7 group of large, developed economies, UK healthcare spending per person was the second-lowest, with the highest spenders being France (£3,737), Germany (£4,432) and the United States (£7,736).”
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    bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 7,754
    Andy_JS said:

    I can't believe "Barbenheimer" has its own Wikipedia page.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbenheimer

    There was a long and hard-fought discussion over whether to keep it or delete it.
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    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,610
    edited August 2023
    I think we're probably the only country in the world that would produce two competing GDP figures that are wildly different on the same day. Loads of people this morning asking the same question, "is it 0.4% or 0.9%?" I'm going with 0.4% but other people suggest the 0.9% is probably a more accurate reflection of where we are because the monthly index has proved itself better with fewer revisions than the quarterly number.
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    TimSTimS Posts: 9,725
    edited August 2023

    nico679 said:

    No party will go near the NHS in terms of a major reform . Its too dangerous to their election chances . You can get away with more people treated in the private sector to help lower waiting lists but you’re not asking people to pay anything extra or making fundamental changes to the model .

    The French system whilst not perfect has many areas that the British could learn from and its public private model works well.

    The private isn’t what many would properly class as in the true sense of the term . It’s non-profit based in the main .

    Both main parties have made major reforms to the NHS.

    The French system spends more money per person. To quote the ONS:

    “In 2017, the UK spent £2,989 per person on healthcare, which was around the median for members of the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development: OECD (£2,913 per person).

    “However, of the G7 group of large, developed economies, UK healthcare spending per person was the second-lowest, with the highest spenders being France (£3,737), Germany (£4,432) and the United States (£7,736).”
    The US is the clear outlier there for two main reasons: lack of consolidated buying power, because the market is decentralised; and higher salaries for healthcare professionals.

    France seems excellent value for money. My experience of the system has been spotless modern hospitals with virtually no waiting and rapid treatment, generous doling out of medicine, and very competent nursing staff.
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    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,135

    nico679 said:

    No party will go near the NHS in terms of a major reform . Its too dangerous to their election chances . You can get away with more people treated in the private sector to help lower waiting lists but you’re not asking people to pay anything extra or making fundamental changes to the model .

    The French system whilst not perfect has many areas that the British could learn from and its public private model works well.

    The private isn’t what many would properly class as in the true sense of the term . It’s non-profit based in the main .

    Both main parties have made major reforms to the NHS.

    The French system spends more money per person. To quote the ONS:

    “In 2017, the UK spent £2,989 per person on healthcare, which was around the median for members of the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development: OECD (£2,913 per person).

    “However, of the G7 group of large, developed economies, UK healthcare spending per person was the second-lowest, with the highest spenders being France (£3,737), Germany (£4,432) and the United States (£7,736).”
    Always worth bearing in mind how staggeringly inefficient the US private healthcare system is, but certainly there are things to learn from France and Germany. If I felt the Tories could be trusted I would be happier breaking with some of the NHS shiboleths, but my concern is once you go down the route of some insurance component and a more mixed provision the Tories are going to fuck the whole thing up and sell things to their pals or to well financed US private equity groups, like they fuck up everything they get their avaricious, incompetent and corrupt little hands on. Making the NHS into our state religion may be the only way to protect it from utter destruction next time they get into power.
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,334

    Shakespeare’s Romeo and Juliet cancelled by DeSantis’s ‘don’t say gay’ law
    Florida school district cites 'pre-marital sex' as reason to ban students studying play

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/08/09/william-shakespeare-cancelled-romeo-and-juliet-ron-desantis/ (£££)

    I thought it was the woke who were wanting to ban the classics for offending someone or other. Who would have thought the anti-wokists were a bunch of hypocrites and authoritarians? I'm sure none of us saw that coming.
    It isn't necessarily either/or.
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,334

    nico679 said:

    No party will go near the NHS in terms of a major reform . Its too dangerous to their election chances . You can get away with more people treated in the private sector to help lower waiting lists but you’re not asking people to pay anything extra or making fundamental changes to the model .

    The French system whilst not perfect has many areas that the British could learn from and its public private model works well.

    The private isn’t what many would properly class as in the true sense of the term . It’s non-profit based in the main .

    Both main parties have made major reforms to the NHS.

    The French system spends more money per person. To quote the ONS:

    “In 2017, the UK spent £2,989 per person on healthcare, which was around the median for members of the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development: OECD (£2,913 per person).

    “However, of the G7 group of large, developed economies, UK healthcare spending per person was the second-lowest, with the highest spenders being France (£3,737), Germany (£4,432) and the United States (£7,736).”
    Always worth bearing in mind how staggeringly inefficient the US private healthcare system is, but certainly there are things to learn from France and Germany. If I felt the Tories could be trusted I would be happier breaking with some of the NHS shiboleths, but my concern is once you go down the route of some insurance component and a more mixed provision the Tories are going to fuck the whole thing up and sell things to their pals or to well financed US private equity groups, like they fuck up everything they get their avaricious, incompetent and corrupt little hands on. Making the NHS into our state religion may be the only way to protect it from utter destruction next time they get into power.
    Or alternatively, may make reforms so difficult the whole thing implodes and whoever is in power can have a free hand with the remains of it (and Labour are just as capable of selling things to their chums and can be even more avaricious, incompetent and corrupt. This is about politicians not particular parties).

    Dogma is the enemy of good public sector provision, regardless of whose dogma we are talking about.
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    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,135
    ydoethur said:

    nico679 said:

    No party will go near the NHS in terms of a major reform . Its too dangerous to their election chances . You can get away with more people treated in the private sector to help lower waiting lists but you’re not asking people to pay anything extra or making fundamental changes to the model .

    The French system whilst not perfect has many areas that the British could learn from and its public private model works well.

    The private isn’t what many would properly class as in the true sense of the term . It’s non-profit based in the main .

    Both main parties have made major reforms to the NHS.

    The French system spends more money per person. To quote the ONS:

    “In 2017, the UK spent £2,989 per person on healthcare, which was around the median for members of the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development: OECD (£2,913 per person).

    “However, of the G7 group of large, developed economies, UK healthcare spending per person was the second-lowest, with the highest spenders being France (£3,737), Germany (£4,432) and the United States (£7,736).”
    Always worth bearing in mind how staggeringly inefficient the US private healthcare system is, but certainly there are things to learn from France and Germany. If I felt the Tories could be trusted I would be happier breaking with some of the NHS shiboleths, but my concern is once you go down the route of some insurance component and a more mixed provision the Tories are going to fuck the whole thing up and sell things to their pals or to well financed US private equity groups, like they fuck up everything they get their avaricious, incompetent and corrupt little hands on. Making the NHS into our state religion may be the only way to protect it from utter destruction next time they get into power.
    Or alternatively, may make reforms so difficult the whole thing implodes and whoever is in power can have a free hand with the remains of it (and Labour are just as capable of selling things to their chums and can be even more avaricious, incompetent and corrupt. This is about politicians not particular parties).

    Dogma is the enemy of good public sector provision, regardless of whose dogma we are talking about.
    I think the current government has set the bar so high on incompetence, avarice and corruption that I really struggle to see Labour getting anywhere near it any time soon.
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    TimS said:

    nico679 said:

    No party will go near the NHS in terms of a major reform . Its too dangerous to their election chances . You can get away with more people treated in the private sector to help lower waiting lists but you’re not asking people to pay anything extra or making fundamental changes to the model .

    The French system whilst not perfect has many areas that the British could learn from and its public private model works well.

    The private isn’t what many would properly class as in the true sense of the term . It’s non-profit based in the main .

    Both main parties have made major reforms to the NHS.

    The French system spends more money per person. To quote the ONS:

    “In 2017, the UK spent £2,989 per person on healthcare, which was around the median for members of the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development: OECD (£2,913 per person).

    “However, of the G7 group of large, developed economies, UK healthcare spending per person was the second-lowest, with the highest spenders being France (£3,737), Germany (£4,432) and the United States (£7,736).”
    The US is the clear outlier there for two main reasons: lack of consolidated buying power, because the market is decentralised; and higher salaries for healthcare professionals.

    France seems excellent value for money. My experience of the system has been spotless modern hospitals with virtually no waiting and rapid treatment, generous doling out of medicine, and very competent nursing staff.
    As well as inputs, we should occasionally glance at health outcomes and remind ourselves the United States has higher cancer survival rates than Europe, and that Britain has worse.
  • Options
    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,135
    MaxPB said:

    I think we're probably the only country in the world that would produce two competing GDP figures that are wildly different on the same day. Loads of people this morning asking the same question, "is it 0.4% or 0.9%?" I'm going with 0.4% but other people suggest the 0.9% is probably a more accurate reflection of where we are because the monthly index has proved itself better with fewer revisions than the quarterly number.

    Er it's 0.2% for q/q growth in Q2, not 0.4% or 0.9%. Not sure what you mean about competing measures either. The monthly and quarterly data are consistent with each other.
  • Options
    TimSTimS Posts: 9,725

    ydoethur said:

    nico679 said:

    No party will go near the NHS in terms of a major reform . Its too dangerous to their election chances . You can get away with more people treated in the private sector to help lower waiting lists but you’re not asking people to pay anything extra or making fundamental changes to the model .

    The French system whilst not perfect has many areas that the British could learn from and its public private model works well.

    The private isn’t what many would properly class as in the true sense of the term . It’s non-profit based in the main .

    Both main parties have made major reforms to the NHS.

    The French system spends more money per person. To quote the ONS:

    “In 2017, the UK spent £2,989 per person on healthcare, which was around the median for members of the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development: OECD (£2,913 per person).

    “However, of the G7 group of large, developed economies, UK healthcare spending per person was the second-lowest, with the highest spenders being France (£3,737), Germany (£4,432) and the United States (£7,736).”
    Always worth bearing in mind how staggeringly inefficient the US private healthcare system is, but certainly there are things to learn from France and Germany. If I felt the Tories could be trusted I would be happier breaking with some of the NHS shiboleths, but my concern is once you go down the route of some insurance component and a more mixed provision the Tories are going to fuck the whole thing up and sell things to their pals or to well financed US private equity groups, like they fuck up everything they get their avaricious, incompetent and corrupt little hands on. Making the NHS into our state religion may be the only way to protect it from utter destruction next time they get into power.
    Or alternatively, may make reforms so difficult the whole thing implodes and whoever is in power can have a free hand with the remains of it (and Labour are just as capable of selling things to their chums and can be even more avaricious, incompetent and corrupt. This is about politicians not particular parties).

    Dogma is the enemy of good public sector provision, regardless of whose dogma we are talking about.
    I think the current government has set the bar so high on incompetence, avarice and corruption that I really struggle to see Labour getting anywhere near it any time soon.
    The trouble with politics is it’s about priorities, and for all their occasional pious talk about healthcare the Tories’ priorities in the last couple of years have been Brexit, arguing about tax cuts, and pretending to stop the boats.
  • Options
    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,610

    MaxPB said:

    I think we're probably the only country in the world that would produce two competing GDP figures that are wildly different on the same day. Loads of people this morning asking the same question, "is it 0.4% or 0.9%?" I'm going with 0.4% but other people suggest the 0.9% is probably a more accurate reflection of where we are because the monthly index has proved itself better with fewer revisions than the quarterly number.

    Er it's 0.2% for q/q growth in Q2, not 0.4% or 0.9%. Not sure what you mean about competing measures either. The monthly and quarterly data are consistent with each other.
    YoY, and they aren't consistent.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,334

    ydoethur said:

    nico679 said:

    No party will go near the NHS in terms of a major reform . Its too dangerous to their election chances . You can get away with more people treated in the private sector to help lower waiting lists but you’re not asking people to pay anything extra or making fundamental changes to the model .

    The French system whilst not perfect has many areas that the British could learn from and its public private model works well.

    The private isn’t what many would properly class as in the true sense of the term . It’s non-profit based in the main .

    Both main parties have made major reforms to the NHS.

    The French system spends more money per person. To quote the ONS:

    “In 2017, the UK spent £2,989 per person on healthcare, which was around the median for members of the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development: OECD (£2,913 per person).

    “However, of the G7 group of large, developed economies, UK healthcare spending per person was the second-lowest, with the highest spenders being France (£3,737), Germany (£4,432) and the United States (£7,736).”
    Always worth bearing in mind how staggeringly inefficient the US private healthcare system is, but certainly there are things to learn from France and Germany. If I felt the Tories could be trusted I would be happier breaking with some of the NHS shiboleths, but my concern is once you go down the route of some insurance component and a more mixed provision the Tories are going to fuck the whole thing up and sell things to their pals or to well financed US private equity groups, like they fuck up everything they get their avaricious, incompetent and corrupt little hands on. Making the NHS into our state religion may be the only way to protect it from utter destruction next time they get into power.
    Or alternatively, may make reforms so difficult the whole thing implodes and whoever is in power can have a free hand with the remains of it (and Labour are just as capable of selling things to their chums and can be even more avaricious, incompetent and corrupt. This is about politicians not particular parties).

    Dogma is the enemy of good public sector provision, regardless of whose dogma we are talking about.
    I think the current government has set the bar so high on incompetence, avarice and corruption that I really struggle to see Labour getting anywhere near it any time soon.
    Do you? You're lucky then.

    I will probably vote Labour, but give a party that thinks Lesley Griffiths is fit to be a minister ten years in government and I'm sure they'll find fascinating new ways of siphoning off our money and wrecking public services.
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    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,881
    kle4 said:

    Shakespeare’s Romeo and Juliet cancelled by DeSantis’s ‘don’t say gay’ law
    Florida school district cites 'pre-marital sex' as reason to ban students studying play

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/08/09/william-shakespeare-cancelled-romeo-and-juliet-ron-desantis/ (£££)

    I saw something online about some evangelical pastors getting worried as they apparently quote from things like the sermon on the mount and get angry parishioners coming up to them asking where this lefty liberal crap is coming from. When told its Jesus it apparently doesn't shake the angry people.

    Just an anecdote, but amusing if true.
    They ought to quote from the Sermon on the Mound, is what their parishioners want, perhaps? Scope for confusion there.
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    TimSTimS Posts: 9,725

    TimS said:

    nico679 said:

    No party will go near the NHS in terms of a major reform . Its too dangerous to their election chances . You can get away with more people treated in the private sector to help lower waiting lists but you’re not asking people to pay anything extra or making fundamental changes to the model .

    The French system whilst not perfect has many areas that the British could learn from and its public private model works well.

    The private isn’t what many would properly class as in the true sense of the term . It’s non-profit based in the main .

    Both main parties have made major reforms to the NHS.

    The French system spends more money per person. To quote the ONS:

    “In 2017, the UK spent £2,989 per person on healthcare, which was around the median for members of the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development: OECD (£2,913 per person).

    “However, of the G7 group of large, developed economies, UK healthcare spending per person was the second-lowest, with the highest spenders being France (£3,737), Germany (£4,432) and the United States (£7,736).”
    The US is the clear outlier there for two main reasons: lack of consolidated buying power, because the market is decentralised; and higher salaries for healthcare professionals.

    France seems excellent value for money. My experience of the system has been spotless modern hospitals with virtually no waiting and rapid treatment, generous doling out of medicine, and very competent nursing staff.
    As well as inputs, we should occasionally glance at health outcomes and remind ourselves the United States has higher cancer survival rates than Europe, and that Britain has worse.
    Britain does pretty poorly on most scores. “Europe” isn’t a helpful unit because its health systems vary massively. France tends to come out top on most outcomes based measures for the largest economies, though behind some Scandinavian countries.

    Cancer is interesting - over 65 almost everyone qualifies for Medicare in the US so there’s not the same inequality of access as for younger people.
  • Options
    EabhalEabhal Posts: 5,917
    edited August 2023
    Trying to cancel my TV licence and get a refund (moving away).
    • Aggressive warnings about police action if I watch TV
    • Deliberately misleading about what you can watch without one
    • You can only cancel it 14 days in advance (convinced this is so people forget)
    • I have to provide proof that I am moving away (so I'm sending them my visa ?!)
    I'm never getting a TV licence again.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,881
    Hmm, it's not far off defamation, that tweet.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,334
    Carnyx said:

    Hmm, it's not far off defamation, that tweet.
    It's probably based on the idea that using cash is more expensive than card, therefore anyone charging less for cash must be making the margin up illegally.

    As we can see that is well established as an idea (including on these boards) but if you live near a bank branch with a night safe isn't actually correct.
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    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,771

    MaxPB said:

    I think we're probably the only country in the world that would produce two competing GDP figures that are wildly different on the same day. Loads of people this morning asking the same question, "is it 0.4% or 0.9%?" I'm going with 0.4% but other people suggest the 0.9% is probably a more accurate reflection of where we are because the monthly index has proved itself better with fewer revisions than the quarterly number.

    Er it's 0.2% for q/q growth in Q2, not 0.4% or 0.9%. Not sure what you mean about competing measures either. The monthly and quarterly data are consistent with each other.
    I think too that wet July's figures will not look good next to sunny June's. A lot of sales on trying to clear unsold summer stock, from BBQ meats to summer clothes.

    Health care strikes contributing to anaemic growth and to growing waiting lists, with 2 more Consultant strikes planned in August and aseptember. Perhaps it is time for the government to actually negotiate.
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    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,881
    Eabhal said:

    Trying to cancel my TV licence and get a refund (moving away).


    • Aggressive warnings about police action if I watch TV
    • Deliberately misleading about what you can watch without one
    • You can only cancel it 14 days in advance (convinced this is so people forget)
    • I have to provide proof that I am moving away (so I'm sending them my visa ?!)
    I'm never getting a TV licence again.
    They kept sending harassing post after my dad died. I had to send a pretty emphatic letter to tell them to lay off. Even then they said they'd start up again in a year, or something, and they did.

    Remember in Scotland the law re TV licensing is different. AIUI it's the PF who decides prosecutions - not the BBC or their commercial thugs. I wonder if their bumf even recognises that?

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    NerysHughesNerysHughes Posts: 3,349
    Foxy said:

    MaxPB said:

    I think we're probably the only country in the world that would produce two competing GDP figures that are wildly different on the same day. Loads of people this morning asking the same question, "is it 0.4% or 0.9%?" I'm going with 0.4% but other people suggest the 0.9% is probably a more accurate reflection of where we are because the monthly index has proved itself better with fewer revisions than the quarterly number.

    Er it's 0.2% for q/q growth in Q2, not 0.4% or 0.9%. Not sure what you mean about competing measures either. The monthly and quarterly data are consistent with each other.
    I think too that wet July's figures will not look good next to sunny June's. A lot of sales on trying to clear unsold summer stock, from BBQ meats to summer clothes.

    Health care strikes contributing to anaemic growth and to growing waiting lists, with 2 more Consultant strikes planned in August and aseptember. Perhaps it is time for the government to actually negotiate.
    Or for Consultants who earn £200k+ pa to stop complaining
  • Options
    Scott_xP said:

    ...

    So how are the priorities looking?

    Inflation on track?
    Economy growing, even if it doesn't feel that way?
    Debt still seems to be going up?
    Waiting lists growing?
    Boats unstopped?

    Not great on a test the PM devised himself.
This discussion has been closed.