LAB extends lead in new “Red Wall” polling – politicalbetting.com

HYUFD said:

Almost all these seats were virtually always Labour until 2019 when they loaned Boris, note Boris not the Tories, their votes to get Brexit done and beat Corbyn. Now Boris and Corbyn have gone and Brexit has been done, no surprise they are returning to Labour.

However while the Tories are falling back in these working class seats under Sunak, Sunak is holding up better in the upper middle class Blue Wall.

So perhaps TSE might feel safe to vote Tory again now after voting LD since Cameron, given the average Tory voter is much posher and less common under Rishi than they were under Boris in 2019?

Even if Rishi loses the next general election he has at least made it safe for snobs to vote Tory again!!

ydoethur said:

Nigelb said:

ydoethur said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Andrew Bridgen sues Matt Hancock for £100,000 over Covid vaccine row

Hancock accused Bridgen of spouting ‘anti-Semitic, anti-vax conspiracy theories’ after he compared effects of the vaccines to the Holocaust

According to the seven-page “letter before action”, Mr Bridgen wants Mr Hancock to “retract and delete the defamatory statement contained in the tweet complained of with immediate effect”.

It adds that he should “apologise for the tweet complained of - both orally in the House of Commons - and in writing on Mr Hancock's personal Twitter account”.

And he said Mr Hancock should “acknowledge full and final settlement of any prospective claim in the form of a payment of £100,000 - to be transferred into a legal fund on behalf of persons seeking collective redress for vaccine harms (under the UK Government's Vaccine Damages Payment Scheme)”.

Mr Bridgen's legal action is being funded by the Reclaim Party and the ‘Bad Law Project’.

Laurence Fox, the leader of Reclaim, said: “The Reclaim Party and the Bad Law Project is providing its full support to Mr Bridgen and we want a full apology from Mr Hancock.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2023/01/26/matt-hancock-sued-andrew-bridgen-covid-vaccine-holocaust-row/

I'm on Team Hancock.

Andrew Bridgen should be done for high treason, hanged, drawn and quartered.

For making us all endorse Matt Fucking Hancock.

This Bridgen ?

What value would you place on his reputation in the unlikely event he were to succeed in his lawsuit ?
...In April 2022, High Court Judge Brian Rawlings ruled against Bridgen, stating that he "lied under oath and behaved in an abusive, arrogant and aggressive manner", was "an unreliable and combative witness who tried to conceal his own misconduct", and "gave evasive and argumentative answers and tangential speeches that avoided answering the questions". ..

The funniest outcome in some ways would be for Hancock to lose but the judge to set damages at five pounds on the grounds Bridgen has no reputation worth more than that.

That would exasperate Hancock and bankrupt Bridgen.

HYUFD said:

Almost all these seats were virtually always Labour until 2019 when they loaned Boris, note Boris not the Tories, their votes to get Brexit done and beat Corbyn. Now Boris and Corbyn have gone and Brexit has been done, no surprise they are returning to Labour.

However while the Tories are falling back in these working class seats under Sunak, Sunak is holding up better in the upper middle class Blue Wall.

So perhaps TSE might feel safe to vote Tory again now after voting LD since Cameron, given the average Tory voter is much posher and less common under Rishi than they were under Boris in 2019?

Even if Rishi loses the next general election he has at least made it safe for snobs to vote Tory again!!

TOPPING said:

HYUFD said:

Almost all these seats were virtually always Labour until 2019 when they loaned Boris, note Boris not the Tories, their votes to get Brexit done and beat Corbyn. Now Boris and Corbyn have gone and Brexit has been done, no surprise they are returning to Labour.

However while the Tories are falling back in these working class seats under Sunak, Sunak is holding up better in the upper middle class Blue Wall.

So perhaps TSE might feel safe to vote Tory again now after voting LD since Cameron, given the average Tory voter is much posher and less common under Rishi than they were under Boris in 2019?

Even if Rishi loses the next general election he has at least made it safe for snobs to vote Tory again!!

How on earth did you manage to read the thread, come up with a cogent and relatively lengthy response, and be first poster btl!?

Nigelb said:

Apologies for FPTing this, but it raises an interesting point of law.

ydoethur said:

Nigelb said:

ydoethur said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Andrew Bridgen sues Matt Hancock for £100,000 over Covid vaccine row

Hancock accused Bridgen of spouting ‘anti-Semitic, anti-vax conspiracy theories’ after he compared effects of the vaccines to the Holocaust

According to the seven-page “letter before action”, Mr Bridgen wants Mr Hancock to “retract and delete the defamatory statement contained in the tweet complained of with immediate effect”.

It adds that he should “apologise for the tweet complained of - both orally in the House of Commons - and in writing on Mr Hancock's personal Twitter account”.

And he said Mr Hancock should “acknowledge full and final settlement of any prospective claim in the form of a payment of £100,000 - to be transferred into a legal fund on behalf of persons seeking collective redress for vaccine harms (under the UK Government's Vaccine Damages Payment Scheme)”.

Mr Bridgen's legal action is being funded by the Reclaim Party and the ‘Bad Law Project’.

Laurence Fox, the leader of Reclaim, said: “The Reclaim Party and the Bad Law Project is providing its full support to Mr Bridgen and we want a full apology from Mr Hancock.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2023/01/26/matt-hancock-sued-andrew-bridgen-covid-vaccine-holocaust-row/

I'm on Team Hancock.

Andrew Bridgen should be done for high treason, hanged, drawn and quartered.

For making us all endorse Matt Fucking Hancock.

This Bridgen ?

What value would you place on his reputation in the unlikely event he were to succeed in his lawsuit ?
...In April 2022, High Court Judge Brian Rawlings ruled against Bridgen, stating that he "lied under oath and behaved in an abusive, arrogant and aggressive manner", was "an unreliable and combative witness who tried to conceal his own misconduct", and "gave evasive and argumentative answers and tangential speeches that avoided answering the questions". ..

The funniest outcome in some ways would be for Hancock to lose but the judge to set damages at five pounds on the grounds Bridgen has no reputation worth more than that.

That would exasperate Hancock and bankrupt Bridgen.

I think he's being crowd (of numpties) funded.

He perhaps has a case which can be argued even if not won, since his complaint is about being associated with antisemitism.

Does equating his pet conspiracy theory with the Holocaust amount to antisemitism, or is it just offensive and imbecilic ?

And if there's a distinction, is it actionable ?

Selebian said:

Nigelb said:

Apologies for FPTing this, but it raises an interesting point of law.

ydoethur said:

Nigelb said:

ydoethur said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Andrew Bridgen sues Matt Hancock for £100,000 over Covid vaccine row

Hancock accused Bridgen of spouting ‘anti-Semitic, anti-vax conspiracy theories’ after he compared effects of the vaccines to the Holocaust

According to the seven-page “letter before action”, Mr Bridgen wants Mr Hancock to “retract and delete the defamatory statement contained in the tweet complained of with immediate effect”.

It adds that he should “apologise for the tweet complained of - both orally in the House of Commons - and in writing on Mr Hancock's personal Twitter account”.

And he said Mr Hancock should “acknowledge full and final settlement of any prospective claim in the form of a payment of £100,000 - to be transferred into a legal fund on behalf of persons seeking collective redress for vaccine harms (under the UK Government's Vaccine Damages Payment Scheme)”.

Mr Bridgen's legal action is being funded by the Reclaim Party and the ‘Bad Law Project’.

Laurence Fox, the leader of Reclaim, said: “The Reclaim Party and the Bad Law Project is providing its full support to Mr Bridgen and we want a full apology from Mr Hancock.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2023/01/26/matt-hancock-sued-andrew-bridgen-covid-vaccine-holocaust-row/

I'm on Team Hancock.

Andrew Bridgen should be done for high treason, hanged, drawn and quartered.

For making us all endorse Matt Fucking Hancock.

This Bridgen ?

What value would you place on his reputation in the unlikely event he were to succeed in his lawsuit ?
...In April 2022, High Court Judge Brian Rawlings ruled against Bridgen, stating that he "lied under oath and behaved in an abusive, arrogant and aggressive manner", was "an unreliable and combative witness who tried to conceal his own misconduct", and "gave evasive and argumentative answers and tangential speeches that avoided answering the questions". ..

The funniest outcome in some ways would be for Hancock to lose but the judge to set damages at five pounds on the grounds Bridgen has no reputation worth more than that.

That would exasperate Hancock and bankrupt Bridgen.

I think he's being crowd (of numpties) funded.

He perhaps has a case which can be argued even if not won, since his complaint is about being associated with antisemitism.

Does equating his pet conspiracy theory with the Holocaust amount to antisemitism, or is it just offensive and imbecilic ?

And if there's a distinction, is it actionable ?

It is interesting. If he was pro-vaccine then it's clearly antisemitic - vaccine is good and the holocause is like the vaccine - but if he sincerely believes vaccines cause a harm on the scale of the holocaust then perhaps it isn't, merely imbecilic.

Nigelb said:

Selebian said:

Nigelb said:

Apologies for FPTing this, but it raises an interesting point of law.

ydoethur said:

Nigelb said:

ydoethur said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Andrew Bridgen sues Matt Hancock for £100,000 over Covid vaccine row

Hancock accused Bridgen of spouting ‘anti-Semitic, anti-vax conspiracy theories’ after he compared effects of the vaccines to the Holocaust

According to the seven-page “letter before action”, Mr Bridgen wants Mr Hancock to “retract and delete the defamatory statement contained in the tweet complained of with immediate effect”.

It adds that he should “apologise for the tweet complained of - both orally in the House of Commons - and in writing on Mr Hancock's personal Twitter account”.

And he said Mr Hancock should “acknowledge full and final settlement of any prospective claim in the form of a payment of £100,000 - to be transferred into a legal fund on behalf of persons seeking collective redress for vaccine harms (under the UK Government's Vaccine Damages Payment Scheme)”.

Mr Bridgen's legal action is being funded by the Reclaim Party and the ‘Bad Law Project’.

Laurence Fox, the leader of Reclaim, said: “The Reclaim Party and the Bad Law Project is providing its full support to Mr Bridgen and we want a full apology from Mr Hancock.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2023/01/26/matt-hancock-sued-andrew-bridgen-covid-vaccine-holocaust-row/

I'm on Team Hancock.

Andrew Bridgen should be done for high treason, hanged, drawn and quartered.

For making us all endorse Matt Fucking Hancock.

This Bridgen ?

What value would you place on his reputation in the unlikely event he were to succeed in his lawsuit ?
...In April 2022, High Court Judge Brian Rawlings ruled against Bridgen, stating that he "lied under oath and behaved in an abusive, arrogant and aggressive manner", was "an unreliable and combative witness who tried to conceal his own misconduct", and "gave evasive and argumentative answers and tangential speeches that avoided answering the questions". ..

The funniest outcome in some ways would be for Hancock to lose but the judge to set damages at five pounds on the grounds Bridgen has no reputation worth more than that.

That would exasperate Hancock and bankrupt Bridgen.

I think he's being crowd (of numpties) funded.

He perhaps has a case which can be argued even if not won, since his complaint is about being associated with antisemitism.

Does equating his pet conspiracy theory with the Holocaust amount to antisemitism, or is it just offensive and imbecilic ?

And if there's a distinction, is it actionable ?

It is interesting. If he was pro-vaccine then it's clearly antisemitic - vaccine is good and the holocause is like the vaccine - but if he sincerely believes vaccines cause a harm on the scale of the holocaust then perhaps it isn't, merely imbecilic.

One could also argue that it's not unreasonable to associate belittling the Holocaust in this manner with antisemitism.

Selebian said:

Nigelb said:

Selebian said:

Nigelb said:

Apologies for FPTing this, but it raises an interesting point of law.

ydoethur said:

Nigelb said:

ydoethur said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Andrew Bridgen sues Matt Hancock for £100,000 over Covid vaccine row

Hancock accused Bridgen of spouting ‘anti-Semitic, anti-vax conspiracy theories’ after he compared effects of the vaccines to the Holocaust

According to the seven-page “letter before action”, Mr Bridgen wants Mr Hancock to “retract and delete the defamatory statement contained in the tweet complained of with immediate effect”.

It adds that he should “apologise for the tweet complained of - both orally in the House of Commons - and in writing on Mr Hancock's personal Twitter account”.

And he said Mr Hancock should “acknowledge full and final settlement of any prospective claim in the form of a payment of £100,000 - to be transferred into a legal fund on behalf of persons seeking collective redress for vaccine harms (under the UK Government's Vaccine Damages Payment Scheme)”.

Mr Bridgen's legal action is being funded by the Reclaim Party and the ‘Bad Law Project’.

Laurence Fox, the leader of Reclaim, said: “The Reclaim Party and the Bad Law Project is providing its full support to Mr Bridgen and we want a full apology from Mr Hancock.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2023/01/26/matt-hancock-sued-andrew-bridgen-covid-vaccine-holocaust-row/

I'm on Team Hancock.

Andrew Bridgen should be done for high treason, hanged, drawn and quartered.

For making us all endorse Matt Fucking Hancock.

This Bridgen ?

What value would you place on his reputation in the unlikely event he were to succeed in his lawsuit ?
...In April 2022, High Court Judge Brian Rawlings ruled against Bridgen, stating that he "lied under oath and behaved in an abusive, arrogant and aggressive manner", was "an unreliable and combative witness who tried to conceal his own misconduct", and "gave evasive and argumentative answers and tangential speeches that avoided answering the questions". ..

The funniest outcome in some ways would be for Hancock to lose but the judge to set damages at five pounds on the grounds Bridgen has no reputation worth more than that.

That would exasperate Hancock and bankrupt Bridgen.

I think he's being crowd (of numpties) funded.

He perhaps has a case which can be argued even if not won, since his complaint is about being associated with antisemitism.

Does equating his pet conspiracy theory with the Holocaust amount to antisemitism, or is it just offensive and imbecilic ?

And if there's a distinction, is it actionable ?

It is interesting. If he was pro-vaccine then it's clearly antisemitic - vaccine is good and the holocause is like the vaccine - but if he sincerely believes vaccines cause a harm on the scale of the holocaust then perhaps it isn't, merely imbecilic.

One could also argue that it's not unreasonable to associate belittling the Holocaust in this manner with antisemitism.

One could indeed. Bridgen will presumably have to try hard to prove that he is sufficiently stupid to believe equivalence and therefore wasn't belittling.

But yes - an interesting piece of law if it goes to court on whether Hancock's comments re antisemitism are held to be fair or not.

JosiasJessop said:

SandyRentool said:

In the words of Mr P. Weller:

Governments crack and systems fall
Coz unity is powerful
Lights go out- walls come tumbling down

Alternatively:

It's coming home
It's coming home
The Red Wall's coming home

Labour lost the 'Red Wall' because they ignored Red Wallers for too long; there was an attitude of "who else will they vote for?". This was after they failed to learn the lessons from Glasgow a few years earlier. The Conservatives actually pretended to acknowledge Red Wallers existed.

The Red Wall are pi**ed off with the Tories at the moment, like most of the rest of the country. But Labour have a leader who seems to get a nosebleed if he goes outside the M25, and Red Wallers have realised they *can* vote for parties other than Labour. Many will turn back to Labour at the next GE, but unless Labour listens to them, the party will get punished in the future.

bigjohnowls said:

Mrs BJ claims to have seen a parakeet fly over our house this morning.

I asked her how she knew it was a parakeet

She told me that at first she thought it could have been Donald Trump as they look the same have a similar IQ.

She realised it wasn't though as it was tweeting

This is why I married Mrs BJ

bigjohnowls said:

Mrs BJ claims to have seen a parakeet fly over our house this morning.

I asked her how she knew it was a parakeet

She told me that at first she thought it could have been Donald Trump as they look the same have a similar IQ.

She realised it wasn't though as it was tweeting

This is why I married Mrs BJ

Carnyx said:

bigjohnowls said:

Mrs BJ claims to have seen a parakeet fly over our house this morning.

I asked her how she knew it was a parakeet

She told me that at first she thought it could have been Donald Trump as they look the same have a similar IQ.

She realised it wasn't though as it was tweeting

This is why I married Mrs BJ

Mr Trump doesn't tweet? News to us all.

bigjohnowls said:

On Topic what was Labour's lead in these seats in 2017?

Cookie said:

bigjohnowls said:

Mrs BJ claims to have seen a parakeet fly over our house this morning.

I asked her how she knew it was a parakeet

She told me that at first she thought it could have been Donald Trump as they look the same have a similar IQ.

She realised it wasn't though as it was tweeting

This is why I married Mrs BJ

I see parakeets most days in suburban South Manchester.
Five years ago, I saw my first one, and was astonished. In fact my then three year old saw it - 'parrot', she said. I didn't really believe her (although the noise it made was rather exotic) - but I looked, and yes, a parrot, or near enough. And now you see them most days. They nest in the Mersey Valley and flock in great numbers. The speed of their population growth is faintly alarming. Though we don't yet have as many here as I saw in Sefton Park in Liverpool. Bloody hundreds of them there.

ydoethur said:

bigjohnowls said:

On Topic what was Labour's lead in these seats in 2017?

Quite narrow, in many cases. Newcastle under Lyme was held by 34 votes, Bishop Auckland by 502, Dudley North by 22, Wakefield by just over 2000, Delyn by 1200.

Yes, there were some spectacular swings like Bassetlaw, North West Durham, Blyth Valley and Bridgend which had been safely Labour and fell to the Tories in 2019 but the unspoken story of the last 20 years has been the gradual creep of the Conservatives in semi-rural ex-industrial seats. Corbyn scored some spectacular successes in 2017 but that general trend was unchanged.

In fact, with a very modest change in campaigning focus to win a few thousand votes in just 50 seats May might well have won a majority analogous to Johnosn's.

TheScreamingEagles said:

I’m not voting Tory.

I’m contemplating voting Labour.

I’m utterly sick of the sleaze, grift, and outright corruption this government has normalised.

Scott_xP said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

I’m not voting Tory.

I’m contemplating voting Labour.

I’m utterly sick of the sleaze, grift, and outright corruption this government has normalised.

Are you bored of Tory sleaze stories? Most Conservative MPs are. They’re fed up with the way their party keeps tripping over its own shoelaces, wearied of new revelations about senior figures and sums of money their constituents can’t even imagine.

But they also hope their voters are bored. “We aren’t being shouted at on the doorstep by our own supporters, like we were in the worst days of Boris,” says one MP, wanly. “I’m not sure many of them are paying attention or care about these latest rows,” says a senior backbencher, rather hopefully.

This is a pretty dismal situation for Conservatives to be in: hoping their voters are bored of their dysfunction or at least numbed to it.

https://www.standard.co.uk/comment/tory-sleaze-problem-govern-b1055824.html

bigjohnowls said:

JosiasJessop said:

The Big Z is a class act:

"The moment @ZelenskyyUa 's found out Germany was sending Leopard 2s to Ukraine."

https://twitter.com/walter_report/status/1618316719445143552

Looks like he needs a good sleep.

Hopefully, he will get one soon.

Scott_xP said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

I’m not voting Tory.

I’m contemplating voting Labour.

I’m utterly sick of the sleaze, grift, and outright corruption this government has normalised.

Are you bored of Tory sleaze stories? Most Conservative MPs are. They’re fed up with the way their party keeps tripping over its own shoelaces, wearied of new revelations about senior figures and sums of money their constituents can’t even imagine.

But they also hope their voters are bored. “We aren’t being shouted at on the doorstep by our own supporters, like we were in the worst days of Boris,” says one MP, wanly. “I’m not sure many of them are paying attention or care about these latest rows,” says a senior backbencher, rather hopefully.

This is a pretty dismal situation for Conservatives to be in: hoping their voters are bored of their dysfunction or at least numbed to it.

https://www.standard.co.uk/comment/tory-sleaze-problem-govern-b1055824.html

Nigelb said:

Russian response to the Ukraine tank news.
https://twitter.com/Gerashchenko_en/status/1618564448582774784

Cookie said:

bigjohnowls said:

Mrs BJ claims to have seen a parakeet fly over our house this morning.

I asked her how she knew it was a parakeet

She told me that at first she thought it could have been Donald Trump as they look the same have a similar IQ.

She realised it wasn't though as it was tweeting

This is why I married Mrs BJ

I see parakeets most days in suburban South Manchester.
Five years ago, I saw my first one, and was astonished. In fact my then three year old saw it - 'parrot', she said. I didn't really believe her (although the noise it made was rather exotic) - but I looked, and yes, a parrot, or near enough. And now you see them most days. They nest in the Mersey Valley and flock in great numbers. The speed of their population growth is faintly alarming. Though we don't yet have as many here as I saw in Sefton Park in Liverpool. Bloody hundreds of them there.

TheScreamingEagles said:

HYUFD said:

Almost all these seats were virtually always Labour until 2019 when they loaned Boris, note Boris not the Tories, their votes to get Brexit done and beat Corbyn. Now Boris and Corbyn have gone and Brexit has been done, no surprise they are returning to Labour.

However while the Tories are falling back in these working class seats under Sunak, Sunak is holding up better in the upper middle class Blue Wall.

So perhaps TSE might feel safe to vote Tory again now after voting LD since Cameron, given the average Tory voter is much posher and less common under Rishi than they were under Boris in 2019?

Even if Rishi loses the next general election he has at least made it safe for snobs to vote Tory again!!

I’m not voting Tory.

I’m contemplating voting Labour.

I’m utterly sick of the sleaze, grift, and outright corruption this government has normalised.

Selebian said:

Nigelb said:

Russian response to the Ukraine tank news.
https://twitter.com/Gerashchenko_en/status/1618564448582774784

Tried. Tested. Retired Retried

NerysHughes said:

Scott_xP said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

I’m not voting Tory.

I’m contemplating voting Labour.

I’m utterly sick of the sleaze, grift, and outright corruption this government has normalised.

Are you bored of Tory sleaze stories? Most Conservative MPs are. They’re fed up with the way their party keeps tripping over its own shoelaces, wearied of new revelations about senior figures and sums of money their constituents can’t even imagine.

But they also hope their voters are bored. “We aren’t being shouted at on the doorstep by our own supporters, like we were in the worst days of Boris,” says one MP, wanly. “I’m not sure many of them are paying attention or care about these latest rows,” says a senior backbencher, rather hopefully.

This is a pretty dismal situation for Conservatives to be in: hoping their voters are bored of their dysfunction or at least numbed to it.

https://www.standard.co.uk/comment/tory-sleaze-problem-govern-b1055824.html

I suspect the seatbelt story being headline news has led to the numbing

Selebian said:

CarlottaVance said:

Make no mistake. This is a comprehensive defeat and singular humiliation for Sturgeon. All that "criminals won't try to get into female spaces", all that "most marginalised people", all that "be kind and respect a self declared identity"
That house of cards just utterly collapsed

https://twitter.com/jebadoo2/status/1618591781410729989

Is it though? I haven't followed this very closely, but hasn't someone (apparently) trying to abuse self-ID to get sent to a women's prison just been denied that opportunity?

(Happy to be corrected if I'm wrong, but it seems to show (i) that yes, some people will try to take the piss, but (ii) that won't be permitted)

JosiasJessop said:

Selebian said:

Nigelb said:

Russian response to the Ukraine tank news.
https://twitter.com/Gerashchenko_en/status/1618564448582774784

Tried. Tested. Retired Retried

Built in the 1950s, apparently.

This deal has been mentioned elsewhere months ago. Someone said it wasn't anything to do with the war in Ukraine, but Russia has a massive fondness for the Great Patriotic War, and many of the T34s they use for parades and such are in terrible condition. These are going to be used as spares, or to replace/expand the parade fleet.

It'd be like the RAF buying three Spitfires, or one Lancaster, for the BBMF.

Cookie said:

bigjohnowls said:

Mrs BJ claims to have seen a parakeet fly over our house this morning.

I asked her how she knew it was a parakeet

She told me that at first she thought it could have been Donald Trump as they look the same have a similar IQ.

She realised it wasn't though as it was tweeting

This is why I married Mrs BJ

I see parakeets most days in suburban South Manchester.
Five years ago, I saw my first one, and was astonished. In fact my then three year old saw it - 'parrot', she said. I didn't really believe her (although the noise it made was rather exotic) - but I looked, and yes, a parrot, or near enough. And now you see them most days. They nest in the Mersey Valley and flock in great numbers. The speed of their population growth is faintly alarming. Though we don't yet have as many here as I saw in Sefton Park in Liverpool. Bloody hundreds of them there.

mwadams said:

JosiasJessop said:

Selebian said:

Nigelb said:

Russian response to the Ukraine tank news.
https://twitter.com/Gerashchenko_en/status/1618564448582774784

Tried. Tested. Retired Retried

Built in the 1950s, apparently.

This deal has been mentioned elsewhere months ago. Someone said it wasn't anything to do with the war in Ukraine, but Russia has a massive fondness for the Great Patriotic War, and many of the T34s they use for parades and such are in terrible condition. These are going to be used as spares, or to replace/expand the parade fleet.

It'd be like the RAF buying three Spitfires, or one Lancaster, for the BBMF.

Is this all on the basis that a tank looks like a tank to Ivan Kuznetsov?

ManchesterKurt said:

Cookie said:

bigjohnowls said:

Mrs BJ claims to have seen a parakeet fly over our house this morning.

I asked her how she knew it was a parakeet

She told me that at first she thought it could have been Donald Trump as they look the same have a similar IQ.

She realised it wasn't though as it was tweeting

This is why I married Mrs BJ

I see parakeets most days in suburban South Manchester.
Five years ago, I saw my first one, and was astonished. In fact my then three year old saw it - 'parrot', she said. I didn't really believe her (although the noise it made was rather exotic) - but I looked, and yes, a parrot, or near enough. And now you see them most days. They nest in the Mersey Valley and flock in great numbers. The speed of their population growth is faintly alarming. Though we don't yet have as many here as I saw in Sefton Park in Liverpool. Bloody hundreds of them there.

I'm a member at Chorlton Golf Club, loads seem to live there and at the neighbouring water park.

Selebian said:

Malmesbury said:

Selebian said:

CarlottaVance said:

Make no mistake. This is a comprehensive defeat and singular humiliation for Sturgeon. All that "criminals won't try to get into female spaces", all that "most marginalised people", all that "be kind and respect a self declared identity"
That house of cards just utterly collapsed

https://twitter.com/jebadoo2/status/1618591781410729989

Is it though? I haven't followed this very closely, but hasn't someone (apparently) trying to abuse self-ID to get sent to a women's prison just been denied that opportunity?

(Happy to be corrected if I'm wrong, but it seems to show (i) that yes, some people will try to take the piss, but (ii) that won't be permitted)

1) Sturgeon said that the amendment to carry out an action was unacceptable.
2) Sturgeon used executive powers to carry out exactly the action that was stated to be unacceptable and would never be needed anyway.

Hmm, I can see that does look a bit embarassing.

SeaShantyIrish2 said:

Cookie said:

bigjohnowls said:

Mrs BJ claims to have seen a parakeet fly over our house this morning.

I asked her how she knew it was a parakeet

She told me that at first she thought it could have been Donald Trump as they look the same have a similar IQ.

She realised it wasn't though as it was tweeting

This is why I married Mrs BJ

I see parakeets most days in suburban South Manchester.
Five years ago, I saw my first one, and was astonished. In fact my then three year old saw it - 'parrot', she said. I didn't really believe her (although the noise it made was rather exotic) - but I looked, and yes, a parrot, or near enough. And now you see them most days. They nest in the Mersey Valley and flock in great numbers. The speed of their population growth is faintly alarming. Though we don't yet have as many here as I saw in Sefton Park in Liverpool. Bloody hundreds of them there.

Parrots in the Midlands = canaries in the coal mines re: global warming?

In Emerald City of Seattle, also seeing more birds from more southerly climes more often, such as hummingbirds.

Driver said:

eek said:

Gardenwalker said:

I don’t think Britain will Brejoin, although I concede it is likelier than I ever thought it might be.

As @Driver notes, nobody has really made the case for why the EU is better (apart from trade). There needs to be a hearts, not just minds, case.

For any Government the reason for Brejoin is easy - it allows you to pin all the troubles the Daily Mail write about on someone who isn't the Government and lives far away (in Brussels).

If the buck stops with you as PM, all the blame ends up with you as well - even if the thing is relatively minor.

And stopping that nonsense was one of the big reasons for voting Leave - in a democracy it's simply not good enough for a government that wants to do something unpopular to quietly get an EU directive passed and then say to the British voters "sorry, guv, I got no choice".

Cookie said:

bigjohnowls said:

Mrs BJ claims to have seen a parakeet fly over our house this morning.

I asked her how she knew it was a parakeet

She told me that at first she thought it could have been Donald Trump as they look the same have a similar IQ.

She realised it wasn't though as it was tweeting

This is why I married Mrs BJ

I see parakeets most days in suburban South Manchester.
Five years ago, I saw my first one, and was astonished. In fact my then three year old saw it - 'parrot', she said. I didn't really believe her (although the noise it made was rather exotic) - but I looked, and yes, a parrot, or near enough. And now you see them most days. They nest in the Mersey Valley and flock in great numbers. The speed of their population growth is faintly alarming. Though we don't yet have as many here as I saw in Sefton Park in Liverpool. Bloody hundreds of them there.

Gardenwalker said:

But I confess I don’t have a three word slogan to that effect.

Scott_xP said:

Gardenwalker said:

But I confess I don’t have a three word slogan to that effect.

There will come a point when "Take Back Control" is an effective anti-Brexit campaign slogan

SeaShantyIrish2 said:

Cookie said:

bigjohnowls said:

Mrs BJ claims to have seen a parakeet fly over our house this morning.

I asked her how she knew it was a parakeet

She told me that at first she thought it could have been Donald Trump as they look the same have a similar IQ.

She realised it wasn't though as it was tweeting

This is why I married Mrs BJ

I see parakeets most days in suburban South Manchester.
Five years ago, I saw my first one, and was astonished. In fact my then three year old saw it - 'parrot', she said. I didn't really believe her (although the noise it made was rather exotic) - but I looked, and yes, a parrot, or near enough. And now you see them most days. They nest in the Mersey Valley and flock in great numbers. The speed of their population growth is faintly alarming. Though we don't yet have as many here as I saw in Sefton Park in Liverpool. Bloody hundreds of them there.

Parrots in the Midlands = canaries in the coal mines re: global warming?

In Emerald City of Seattle, also seeing more birds from more southerly climes more often, such as hummingbirds.

Gardenwalker said:

OldKingCole said:

Gardenwalker said:

I don’t think Britain will Brejoin, although I concede it is likelier than I ever thought it might be.

As @Driver notes, nobody has really made the case for why the EU is better (apart from trade). There needs to be a hearts, not just minds, case.

I am a convinced European; in 1975, I was pounding the streets for the Cause. I always felt Western Europe in particular had a considerable degree of shared history and culture and made sense as an economic and political union. I have to say I was less convinced by the addition of Eastern Europe and particularly South-eastern, but I was happy to go along with it.
I didn’t work so hard in the referendum, due to old age, although I did contribute money and stand on street corners handing out leaflets.
And I’d vote to Rejoin.

Of course I would vote to Rejoin.

I am not in love with the EU, but it’s not possible to wish it away, and Britain’s only opportunity to push it in the most convivial direction is from the inside.

But I confess I don’t have a three word slogan to that effect.

Cookie said:

northern_monkey said:

Gardenwalker said:

I don’t think Britain will Brejoin, although I concede it is likelier than I ever thought it might be.

As @Driver notes, nobody has really made the case for why the EU is better (apart from trade). There needs to be a hearts, not just minds, case.

You’re right. It’ll come.

I was speaking to my niece and her fella, both born in 2000, at Xmas when they came to visit from Bristol. They’re both fucking livid that they can’t afford a house and, a close second, livid at Brexit. Pissed off they were too young to vote. Feel they’ve been betrayed by the Boomers on both issues. The heart thing seems ingrained with them. They want to be able to afford a house and they want freedom of movement, to be part of something bigger, something better than this right-wing shithole we’ve descended to. They’re not rich, or ‘woke’, just normal kids who feel betrayed.

I hope they’re representative of their age group.

I'd say freedom of movement across Europe is somewhat inimical to being able to afford a house in the UK.

Driver said:

Scott_xP said:

Gardenwalker said:

But I confess I don’t have a three word slogan to that effect.

There will come a point when "Take Back Control" is an effective anti-Brexit campaign slogan

Rejoin won't win until its adovcates get themselves out of the "anti" mindset. This is why you lost last time.

Peter_the_Punter said:

Cookie said:

bigjohnowls said:

Mrs BJ claims to have seen a parakeet fly over our house this morning.

I asked her how she knew it was a parakeet

She told me that at first she thought it could have been Donald Trump as they look the same have a similar IQ.

She realised it wasn't though as it was tweeting

This is why I married Mrs BJ

I see parakeets most days in suburban South Manchester.
Five years ago, I saw my first one, and was astonished. In fact my then three year old saw it - 'parrot', she said. I didn't really believe her (although the noise it made was rather exotic) - but I looked, and yes, a parrot, or near enough. And now you see them most days. They nest in the Mersey Valley and flock in great numbers. The speed of their population growth is faintly alarming. Though we don't yet have as many here as I saw in Sefton Park in Liverpool. Bloody hundreds of them there.

There was a pirch invasion by parakeets at Leyton Orient recently.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lnrOggdSoi8