Could Sunak face a challenge before the election? – politicalbetting.com

Nigelb said:

The climate change policy review commissioned by Liz Truss, aimed at making it more business focused, concludes that we should be accelerating not delaying efforts to achieve net zero.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-64257057

@Luckyguy1983 please note.

Malmesbury said:

Stuartinromford said:

IanB2 said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

Nigel_Foremain said:

I really have got stuff to do, but a battle between @Richard_Tyndall and @Leon is far more tempting than my low calorie lunch. Maybe I should stay awhile. It'll be close, but I think I might bet on @Richard_Tyndall getting the upper. Sorry @Leon old buddy

Beating on Leon is fun but in the end a pointless exercise. No one is convinced by his protestations - even those who agree with him on stuff have to give a wry smile everytime he digs himself into a hole. And like the argument he had with kjh on the last thread, it will just get tedious for everyone else.

Time to let him drown his sorrows once again. After all the sun is well over the yard arm in Bangkok.

His problem is one of self-awareness; he is aware that (in Belbin terms) he is the group ‘Plant’, but unaware that his role is to throw in a few ideas and then stand back while the adults in the room exercise some judgement.

That's one of the reasons Britain in general, and the centre-right in particular, is in the pickle it's in.

Gove and Johnson are both capable op-ed writers. It's a good thing that the Spectator exists to publish an unfiltered stream-of-conciousness from a right wing viewpoint. But their stuff needs filtering before it becomes a programme for government. For every good idea, there are multiple ideas that won't work and ideas that, even if they are workable, aren't good in the cold light of day.

For various reasons, the government is now run by Belbin plants, and the necessary filters between them and the levers of power have been removed.

Every great thinker needs an Alanbrooke.

Perhaps the forgotten aspect of Churchill was that you could say no to his ideas. And he would actually drop them, if given good reasons. And then oppose others coming up with same idea.

For example, the 9.2” “Ultra” Heavy cruisers proposed in 1940.

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Malmesbury said:

Stuartinromford said:

IanB2 said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

Nigel_Foremain said:

I really have got stuff to do, but a battle between @Richard_Tyndall and @Leon is far more tempting than my low calorie lunch. Maybe I should stay awhile. It'll be close, but I think I might bet on @Richard_Tyndall getting the upper. Sorry @Leon old buddy

Beating on Leon is fun but in the end a pointless exercise. No one is convinced by his protestations - even those who agree with him on stuff have to give a wry smile everytime he digs himself into a hole. And like the argument he had with kjh on the last thread, it will just get tedious for everyone else.

Time to let him drown his sorrows once again. After all the sun is well over the yard arm in Bangkok.

His problem is one of self-awareness; he is aware that (in Belbin terms) he is the group ‘Plant’, but unaware that his role is to throw in a few ideas and then stand back while the adults in the room exercise some judgement.

That's one of the reasons Britain in general, and the centre-right in particular, is in the pickle it's in.

Gove and Johnson are both capable op-ed writers. It's a good thing that the Spectator exists to publish an unfiltered stream-of-conciousness from a right wing viewpoint. But their stuff needs filtering before it becomes a programme for government. For every good idea, there are multiple ideas that won't work and ideas that, even if they are workable, aren't good in the cold light of day.

For various reasons, the government is now run by Belbin plants, and the necessary filters between them and the levers of power have been removed.

Every great thinker needs an Alanbrooke.

Perhaps the forgotten aspect of Churchill was that you could say no to his ideas. And he would actually drop them, if given good reasons. And then oppose others coming up with same idea.

For example, the 9.2” “Ultra” Heavy cruisers proposed in 1940.

Which 9.2" cruisers? News to me!

SeaShantyIrish2 said:

Malmesbury said:

Stuartinromford said:

IanB2 said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

Nigel_Foremain said:

I really have got stuff to do, but a battle between @Richard_Tyndall and @Leon is far more tempting than my low calorie lunch. Maybe I should stay awhile. It'll be close, but I think I might bet on @Richard_Tyndall getting the upper. Sorry @Leon old buddy

Beating on Leon is fun but in the end a pointless exercise. No one is convinced by his protestations - even those who agree with him on stuff have to give a wry smile everytime he digs himself into a hole. And like the argument he had with kjh on the last thread, it will just get tedious for everyone else.

Time to let him drown his sorrows once again. After all the sun is well over the yard arm in Bangkok.

His problem is one of self-awareness; he is aware that (in Belbin terms) he is the group ‘Plant’, but unaware that his role is to throw in a few ideas and then stand back while the adults in the room exercise some judgement.

That's one of the reasons Britain in general, and the centre-right in particular, is in the pickle it's in.

Gove and Johnson are both capable op-ed writers. It's a good thing that the Spectator exists to publish an unfiltered stream-of-conciousness from a right wing viewpoint. But their stuff needs filtering before it becomes a programme for government. For every good idea, there are multiple ideas that won't work and ideas that, even if they are workable, aren't good in the cold light of day.

For various reasons, the government is now run by Belbin plants, and the necessary filters between them and the levers of power have been removed.

Every great thinker needs an Alanbrooke.

Perhaps the forgotten aspect of Churchill was that you could say no to his ideas. And he would actually drop them, if given good reasons. And then oppose others coming up with same idea.

For example, the 9.2” “Ultra” Heavy cruisers proposed in 1940.

What is the explanation for Anzio? Plenty of highly-placed people told him it was NOT a good idea. Yet he refused to give it up, kept pushing and pushing and pushing for it.

NOT among his better WW2 decisions. Along with Leros fiasco.

MarqueeMark said:

Luckyguy1983 said:

FPT

Nigelb said:

The climate change policy review commissioned by Liz Truss, aimed at making it more business focused, concludes that we should be accelerating not delaying efforts to achieve net zero.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-64257057

@Luckyguy1983 please note.

Thanks @Nigelb for drawing this to my attention. I see no evidence that Chris Skidmore has provided to back up his assertions, and I am afraid I have no desire to read his report, though of course forcing everyone to scrap their boiler would no doubt 'create jobs' in the crudest sense.

There are some green schemes I do support - tidal is a sensible and reliable form of power generation, and we should go for it. If he's getting behind that, good on him. If it's more mindless ramping of solar and wind for the UK, meh.

Just questioning the case for nuclear power instead of renewables would make a change. One of the very first things Sunak did was to confirm he supported Boris's inane desire to build more nuclear power stations. Which might help in about 20 years time - at about three times the cost. Unless you ride completely roughshod over planning objections.

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Malmesbury said:

Stuartinromford said:

IanB2 said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

Nigel_Foremain said:

I really have got stuff to do, but a battle between @Richard_Tyndall and @Leon is far more tempting than my low calorie lunch. Maybe I should stay awhile. It'll be close, but I think I might bet on @Richard_Tyndall getting the upper. Sorry @Leon old buddy

Beating on Leon is fun but in the end a pointless exercise. No one is convinced by his protestations - even those who agree with him on stuff have to give a wry smile everytime he digs himself into a hole. And like the argument he had with kjh on the last thread, it will just get tedious for everyone else.

Time to let him drown his sorrows once again. After all the sun is well over the yard arm in Bangkok.

His problem is one of self-awareness; he is aware that (in Belbin terms) he is the group ‘Plant’, but unaware that his role is to throw in a few ideas and then stand back while the adults in the room exercise some judgement.

That's one of the reasons Britain in general, and the centre-right in particular, is in the pickle it's in.

Gove and Johnson are both capable op-ed writers. It's a good thing that the Spectator exists to publish an unfiltered stream-of-conciousness from a right wing viewpoint. But their stuff needs filtering before it becomes a programme for government. For every good idea, there are multiple ideas that won't work and ideas that, even if they are workable, aren't good in the cold light of day.

For various reasons, the government is now run by Belbin plants, and the necessary filters between them and the levers of power have been removed.

Every great thinker needs an Alanbrooke.

Perhaps the forgotten aspect of Churchill was that you could say no to his ideas. And he would actually drop them, if given good reasons. And then oppose others coming up with same idea.

For example, the 9.2” “Ultra” Heavy cruisers proposed in 1940.

Which 9.2" cruisers? News to me!

A 9.2" cruiser sounds like a pocket battleship.

Sunil_Prasannan said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Malmesbury said:

Stuartinromford said:

IanB2 said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

Nigel_Foremain said:

I really have got stuff to do, but a battle between @Richard_Tyndall and @Leon is far more tempting than my low calorie lunch. Maybe I should stay awhile. It'll be close, but I think I might bet on @Richard_Tyndall getting the upper. Sorry @Leon old buddy

Beating on Leon is fun but in the end a pointless exercise. No one is convinced by his protestations - even those who agree with him on stuff have to give a wry smile everytime he digs himself into a hole. And like the argument he had with kjh on the last thread, it will just get tedious for everyone else.

Time to let him drown his sorrows once again. After all the sun is well over the yard arm in Bangkok.

His problem is one of self-awareness; he is aware that (in Belbin terms) he is the group ‘Plant’, but unaware that his role is to throw in a few ideas and then stand back while the adults in the room exercise some judgement.

That's one of the reasons Britain in general, and the centre-right in particular, is in the pickle it's in.

Gove and Johnson are both capable op-ed writers. It's a good thing that the Spectator exists to publish an unfiltered stream-of-conciousness from a right wing viewpoint. But their stuff needs filtering before it becomes a programme for government. For every good idea, there are multiple ideas that won't work and ideas that, even if they are workable, aren't good in the cold light of day.

For various reasons, the government is now run by Belbin plants, and the necessary filters between them and the levers of power have been removed.

Every great thinker needs an Alanbrooke.

Perhaps the forgotten aspect of Churchill was that you could say no to his ideas. And he would actually drop them, if given good reasons. And then oppose others coming up with same idea.

For example, the 9.2” “Ultra” Heavy cruisers proposed in 1940.

Which 9.2" cruisers? News to me!

A 9.2" cruiser sounds like a pocket battleship.

No, there were several 9.2" "armoured cruisers" in WW1 (eg. Minotaur, Shannon, Defence, etc), whereas the German Pocket Battleships of the 1930s (eg. Graf Spee) had 11" guns.

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Malmesbury said:

Stuartinromford said:

IanB2 said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

Nigel_Foremain said:

I really have got stuff to do, but a battle between @Richard_Tyndall and @Leon is far more tempting than my low calorie lunch. Maybe I should stay awhile. It'll be close, but I think I might bet on @Richard_Tyndall getting the upper. Sorry @Leon old buddy

Beating on Leon is fun but in the end a pointless exercise. No one is convinced by his protestations - even those who agree with him on stuff have to give a wry smile everytime he digs himself into a hole. And like the argument he had with kjh on the last thread, it will just get tedious for everyone else.

Time to let him drown his sorrows once again. After all the sun is well over the yard arm in Bangkok.

His problem is one of self-awareness; he is aware that (in Belbin terms) he is the group ‘Plant’, but unaware that his role is to throw in a few ideas and then stand back while the adults in the room exercise some judgement.

That's one of the reasons Britain in general, and the centre-right in particular, is in the pickle it's in.

Gove and Johnson are both capable op-ed writers. It's a good thing that the Spectator exists to publish an unfiltered stream-of-conciousness from a right wing viewpoint. But their stuff needs filtering before it becomes a programme for government. For every good idea, there are multiple ideas that won't work and ideas that, even if they are workable, aren't good in the cold light of day.

For various reasons, the government is now run by Belbin plants, and the necessary filters between them and the levers of power have been removed.

Every great thinker needs an Alanbrooke.

Perhaps the forgotten aspect of Churchill was that you could say no to his ideas. And he would actually drop them, if given good reasons. And then oppose others coming up with same idea.

For example, the 9.2” “Ultra” Heavy cruisers proposed in 1940.

Which 9.2" cruisers? News to me!

A 9.2" cruiser sounds like a pocket battleship.

SeaShantyIrish2 said:

Luckyguy1983 said:

Theuniondivvie said:

Fackin hell, Twitter is still an education. An account I follow which I thought was a pretty nerdy and respectable one on WWI battlefield topography and archaeology has liked the Andrew Bridgen tweet threatening to sue Hancock for calling him an antisemite.

Bridgen v Hancock would of course be the shittest Alien v Predator ever, and therefore hugely entertaining.

Is he an anti-semite? His comments can perhaps be deemed inappropriate and insensitive, but they aren't anti-semitic in content. If he was trying to belittle the holocaust it's an extremely oblique way to do it. I thought Sunak's response in parliament majoring on this angle of criticism was wrong. I think Sunak should have said that his comments had no scientific basis and that vaccines had been tested (which they have) and had enabled the UK to look beyond covid.

JTA.org - British parliament member booted from Conservative Party after comparing COVID-19 vaccination to Holocaust

. . . . “Andrew Bridgen has crossed a line, causing great offense in the process,” said Simon Hart, the Conservative Party’s chief whip. “As a nation we should be very proud of what has been achieved through the vaccine program. The vaccine is the best defense against COVID that we have.”

Prime Minister Rishi Sunak, a Conservative, linked Bridgen’s comments to antisemitism.

“Obviously, it is utterly unacceptable to make linkages and use language like that, and I’m determined that the scourge of antisemitism is eradicated,” Sunak said on the floor of the House of Commons.

In the U.K., as elsewhere in the world, anti-vaxxer and antisemitic rhetoric have often been deeply linked.

“The accusations that the pandemic is fake and that Jewish conspirators created the virus are the most dominant in anti-vaxxer communities,” said a report released by the British government in the fall of 2020. “Whilst the groups themselves are rarely established to spread antisemitism, they become a hotbed for antisemitic conspiracy theories.” . . .

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Malmesbury said:

Stuartinromford said:

IanB2 said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

Nigel_Foremain said:

I really have got stuff to do, but a battle between @Richard_Tyndall and @Leon is far more tempting than my low calorie lunch. Maybe I should stay awhile. It'll be close, but I think I might bet on @Richard_Tyndall getting the upper. Sorry @Leon old buddy

Beating on Leon is fun but in the end a pointless exercise. No one is convinced by his protestations - even those who agree with him on stuff have to give a wry smile everytime he digs himself into a hole. And like the argument he had with kjh on the last thread, it will just get tedious for everyone else.

Time to let him drown his sorrows once again. After all the sun is well over the yard arm in Bangkok.

His problem is one of self-awareness; he is aware that (in Belbin terms) he is the group ‘Plant’, but unaware that his role is to throw in a few ideas and then stand back while the adults in the room exercise some judgement.

That's one of the reasons Britain in general, and the centre-right in particular, is in the pickle it's in.

Gove and Johnson are both capable op-ed writers. It's a good thing that the Spectator exists to publish an unfiltered stream-of-conciousness from a right wing viewpoint. But their stuff needs filtering before it becomes a programme for government. For every good idea, there are multiple ideas that won't work and ideas that, even if they are workable, aren't good in the cold light of day.

For various reasons, the government is now run by Belbin plants, and the necessary filters between them and the levers of power have been removed.

Every great thinker needs an Alanbrooke.

Perhaps the forgotten aspect of Churchill was that you could say no to his ideas. And he would actually drop them, if given good reasons. And then oppose others coming up with same idea.

For example, the 9.2” “Ultra” Heavy cruisers proposed in 1940.

Which 9.2" cruisers? News to me!

A 9.2" cruiser sounds like a pocket battleship.

No, there were several 9.2" "armoured cruisers" in WW1 (eg. Minotaur, Shannon, Defence, etc), whereas the German Pocket Battleships of the 1930s (eg. Graf Spee) had 11" guns.

Sorry, I made the mistake of making a joke, based on the idea that 9.2" sounds quite small for a ship.

stodge said:

Musing on Boris Johnson.

I have a modicum of sympathy for the man - he had conspired, agitated and worked his way toward his life ambition of becoming Prime Minister for the thick end of 25 years betraying friends and enemies alike so that by the summer of 2019 the Conservative Party begged him to save them from an oblivion he had done so much to create.

He became Leader and then easily saw off Jeremy Corbyn to be the most powerful politician since Blair with a strong mandate, a new legion of MPs beholden to him and the world at his feet. He could rule for a decade or more and combine the best of his two idols, Thatcher and Churchill, transforming the country he loved for the 21st century and establishing a political legacy few could surpass.

Within 4 weeks of that election win, he was facing the biggest crisis of a generation and the biggest public health crisis of modern times. This time the enemy wouldn't respond to Churchillean prose - it was a virus, relentless and remorseless.

Churchill was an ordinary peacetime politician who was transformed to greatness by extraordinary circumstances. Johnson was an ordinary peacetime politician who was brought down by extraordinary circumstances. He needed an inheritance analogous to that of Blair - he had the mandate to transform as did Thatcher but in the end he couldn't cope with the scale of what confronted him and the manner with which he comported himself in office was out of touch with the mores of the time.

In the end, the enemies he made on the road to the top returned and had their revenge.

NickyBreakspear said:

MoonRabbit said:

Foxy said:

Westminster voting intention:

LAB: 47% (+1)
CON: 26% (+1)
LDEM: 8% (-1)
REF: 7% (-1)
GRN: 5% (-)

via @techneUK, 11 - 12 Jan

https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1614257777270034434?t=rXrjZrHCzKMUnf5D-ga6TA&s=19

That’s still a poll that’s finding more Tories than the last poll, though up just 1 from 25 still suggests Inheriting low 20s moving to mid twenties once voters measured him as PM is probably not what Tories hoped for from moving against Boris and his 30 odd % opinion polling.

If you look at all the news narrative, it’s hard to imagine a Tory bounce at this time - blaming the crisis on strikers and taking them on, Thatcher style, may not even be a core vote firmer, the Express hasn’t been on side with that.

Surely an Opinium today - last time it was no change on 29, which looks high figure based on the recent drop across other polls, so will it drop to 28 tonight? Surely it can’t drop more than 1 as 26/27 is where The undoctored polls already are? If Opinium give 30% for Tories in this narrative, that would be a BIG boost for the Tories and sigh of relief in number ten.

So far this year we have had two polls from YouGov, Techne, People Polling, Omnisis, and Redfield & Wilton, with one poll from Deltapoll. The Deltapoll had a Labour lead of 14% compared with 20% and over for the others.

We are awaiting polls from Savanta, Opinium, Ipsos and Kantar. Ipsos and Kantar would appear to poll monthly, whilst Opinium appear to be fortnightly (based on December polls).

Opinium tend to have higher numbers for Conservatives, but not as high as Deltapoll.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_next_United_Kingdom_general_election for more information.

SeaShantyIrish2 said:

Luckyguy1983 said:

SeaShantyIrish2 said:

Luckyguy1983 said:

Theuniondivvie said:

Fackin hell, Twitter is still an education. An account I follow which I thought was a pretty nerdy and respectable one on WWI battlefield topography and archaeology has liked the Andrew Bridgen tweet threatening to sue Hancock for calling him an antisemite.

Bridgen v Hancock would of course be the shittest Alien v Predator ever, and therefore hugely entertaining.

Is he an anti-semite? His comments can perhaps be deemed inappropriate and insensitive, but they aren't anti-semitic in content. If he was trying to belittle the holocaust it's an extremely oblique way to do it. I thought Sunak's response in parliament majoring on this angle of criticism was wrong. I think Sunak should have said that his comments had no scientific basis and that vaccines had been tested (which they have) and had enabled the UK to look beyond covid.

JTA.org - British parliament member booted from Conservative Party after comparing COVID-19 vaccination to Holocaust

. . . . “Andrew Bridgen has crossed a line, causing great offense in the process,” said Simon Hart, the Conservative Party’s chief whip. “As a nation we should be very proud of what has been achieved through the vaccine program. The vaccine is the best defense against COVID that we have.”

Prime Minister Rishi Sunak, a Conservative, linked Bridgen’s comments to antisemitism.

“Obviously, it is utterly unacceptable to make linkages and use language like that, and I’m determined that the scourge of antisemitism is eradicated,” Sunak said on the floor of the House of Commons.

In the U.K., as elsewhere in the world, anti-vaxxer and antisemitic rhetoric have often been deeply linked.

“The accusations that the pandemic is fake and that Jewish conspirators created the virus are the most dominant in anti-vaxxer communities,” said a report released by the British government in the fall of 2020. “Whilst the groups themselves are rarely established to spread antisemitism, they become a hotbed for antisemitic conspiracy theories.” . . .

They may well be correlated, that would surprise nobody. But I think it's not right to use anti-semitism to dismiss something when there is no actual, provable antisemitic content in the statement that he has endorsed. If I were Jewish, I think I'd be slightly annoyed if people were being shut down on vax issues by others claiming to be rushing to my defense all the time. 'Leave me the fuck out of it, thanks all the same' would be my response.

You make some reasonable points.

However, for ANY politico to compare vaccinations to the Holocaust is either deliberately incendiary OR absurdly moronic. Not exactly first time that this "linkage" has been suggested - and vociferously condemned.

So which is Brigden? My guess is - both.

SeaShantyIrish2 said:

Malmesbury said:

Stuartinromford said:

IanB2 said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

Nigel_Foremain said:

I really have got stuff to do, but a battle between @Richard_Tyndall and @Leon is far more tempting than my low calorie lunch. Maybe I should stay awhile. It'll be close, but I think I might bet on @Richard_Tyndall getting the upper. Sorry @Leon old buddy

Beating on Leon is fun but in the end a pointless exercise. No one is convinced by his protestations - even those who agree with him on stuff have to give a wry smile everytime he digs himself into a hole. And like the argument he had with kjh on the last thread, it will just get tedious for everyone else.

Time to let him drown his sorrows once again. After all the sun is well over the yard arm in Bangkok.

His problem is one of self-awareness; he is aware that (in Belbin terms) he is the group ‘Plant’, but unaware that his role is to throw in a few ideas and then stand back while the adults in the room exercise some judgement.

That's one of the reasons Britain in general, and the centre-right in particular, is in the pickle it's in.

Gove and Johnson are both capable op-ed writers. It's a good thing that the Spectator exists to publish an unfiltered stream-of-conciousness from a right wing viewpoint. But their stuff needs filtering before it becomes a programme for government. For every good idea, there are multiple ideas that won't work and ideas that, even if they are workable, aren't good in the cold light of day.

For various reasons, the government is now run by Belbin plants, and the necessary filters between them and the levers of power have been removed.

Every great thinker needs an Alanbrooke.

Perhaps the forgotten aspect of Churchill was that you could say no to his ideas. And he would actually drop them, if given good reasons. And then oppose others coming up with same idea.

For example, the 9.2” “Ultra” Heavy cruisers proposed in 1940.

What is the explanation for Anzio? Plenty of highly-placed people told him it was NOT a good idea. Yet he refused to give it up, kept pushing
and pushing and pushing for it.

NOT among his better WW2 decisions. Along with Leros fiasco.

Richard_Tyndall said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Malmesbury said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Nigelb said:

Guns appear, literally, to have become a religion in the IS.

Obituary for the Utah man who fatally shot his five children, mother-in-law and estranged wife: “Michael made it a point to spend quality time with each and every one of his children. Michael enjoyed making memories with the family.”
https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/status/1614063872771604486

And if that’s not gross enough, the wife’s family put out a statement supporting … guns: “This is the type of loss that will continue to occur in families, communities and this nation when protective arms are no longer accessible.”
https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/status/1614081794852409344

Guns do not kill people. Toddlers do...

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/toddler-shoots-kills-mom-during-video-call-after-finding-gun-n1276722

I guess lots of Americans just like shooting each other.

See Switzerland - heavily armed and very very low rate of shooting each other.

Or Israel…

Oh... some whataboutery!!!

What about Brazil, Mexico, Colombia, South Africa, etc, etc, with huge gun crime statistics. Besides, what exactly are guns for other than for killing? Do you think the inventor said "I know - let us invent a new hobby with these projectile accelerating devices. That will be fun..."

The gun advocates - and I am actually one of them - will never be able to make a reasoned case for guns in the US for as long as so many of them resist the basic common sense rules. You can have countries with high gun ownership. But to have that you also need sensible rules - background checks, bans for those with mental issues, age limits and cooling off periods. Only once those are in place can you even begin to have a proper debate about gun ownership.

Northern_Al said:

Luckyguy1983 said:

Theuniondivvie said:

Fackin hell, Twitter is still an education. An account I follow which I thought was a pretty nerdy and respectable one on WWI battlefield topography and archaeology has liked the Andrew Bridgen tweet threatening to sue Hancock for calling him an antisemite.

Bridgen v Hancock would of course be the shittest Alien v Predator ever, and therefore hugely entertaining.

Is he an anti-semite? His comments can perhaps be deemed inappropriate and insensitive, but they aren't anti-semitic in content. If he was trying to belittle the holocaust it's an extremely oblique way to do it. I thought Sunak's response in parliament majoring on this angle of criticism was wrong. I think Sunak should have said that his comments had no scientific basis and that vaccines had been tested (which they have) and had enabled the UK to look beyond covid.

I'm inclined to agree; the comparison with the holocaust is insensitive and ludicrous, more than anti-semitic. A broader look at Bridgen's output is that he is spreading disinformation, tantamount to conspiracy theories, about vaccines. It is on those grounds that Sunak could have withdrawn the whip.

Mind you, if the 'holocaust' tweet had been posted by J. Corbyn I'd bet he wouldn't have been given the benefit of the doubt.

Luckyguy1983 said:

MarqueeMark said:

Luckyguy1983 said:

FPT

Nigelb said:

The climate change policy review commissioned by Liz Truss, aimed at making it more business focused, concludes that we should be accelerating not delaying efforts to achieve net zero.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-64257057

@Luckyguy1983 please note.

Thanks @Nigelb for drawing this to my attention. I see no evidence that Chris Skidmore has provided to back up his assertions, and I am afraid I have no desire to read his report, though of course forcing everyone to scrap their boiler would no doubt 'create jobs' in the crudest sense.

There are some green schemes I do support - tidal is a sensible and reliable form of power generation, and we should go for it. If he's getting behind that, good on him. If it's more mindless ramping of solar and wind for the UK, meh.

Just questioning the case for nuclear power instead of renewables would make a change. One of the very first things Sunak did was to confirm he supported Boris's inane desire to build more nuclear power stations. Which might help in about 20 years time - at about three times the cost. Unless you ride completely roughshod over planning objections.

Agree. What irks me about nuclear is that the same people who are horrified about Russia, and what's happened at the Ukrainian nuclear power plant, are happy to see us commission what are essentially terrorist/invader targets, that also need to buy their fuel from Russia. To say nothing of being built by the Chinese (or worse, the French )

I'm not dismissing the idea but I do think there's a security dimension that is being blithely ignored.

By contrast, tidal seems ultra clean and ultra safe.

Beibheirli_C said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Malmesbury said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Nigelb said:

Guns appear, literally, to have become a religion in the IS.

Obituary for the Utah man who fatally shot his five children, mother-in-law and estranged wife: “Michael made it a point to spend quality time with each and every one of his children. Michael enjoyed making memories with the family.”
https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/status/1614063872771604486

And if that’s not gross enough, the wife’s family put out a statement supporting … guns: “This is the type of loss that will continue to occur in families, communities and this nation when protective arms are no longer accessible.”
https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/status/1614081794852409344

Guns do not kill people. Toddlers do...

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/toddler-shoots-kills-mom-during-video-call-after-finding-gun-n1276722

I guess lots of Americans just like shooting each other.

See Switzerland - heavily armed and very very low rate of shooting each other.

Or Israel…

Oh... some whataboutery!!!

What about Brazil, Mexico, Colombia, South Africa, etc, etc, with huge gun crime statistics. Besides, what exactly are guns for other than for killing? Do you think the inventor said "I know - let us invent a new hobby with these projectile accelerating devices. That will be fun..."

The gun advocates - and I am actually one of them - will never be able to make a reasoned case for guns in the US for as long as so many of them resist the basic common sense rules. You can have countries with high gun ownership. But to have that you also need sensible rules - background checks, bans for those with mental issues, age limits and cooling off periods. Only once those are in place can you even begin to have a proper debate about gun ownership.

My personal position is that anyone wanting to possess a gun needs putting on some sort of watch list. How many devices can you buy on the basis that you want to purchase something that can only be used for killing - and in the case of handguns, almost exclusively for killing people - and not be reported to the cops?

Hells bells, people have been arrested for trying to buy ammonium nitrate (bombs) or castor beans (ricin) and both of those have actual non-
violent uses as fertiliser or medicine. But a handgun? "Certainly! And how many boxes of
bullets would you like?"

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Malmesbury said:

Stuartinromford said:

IanB2 said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

Nigel_Foremain said:

I really have got stuff to do, but a battle between @Richard_Tyndall and @Leon is far more tempting than my low calorie lunch. Maybe I should stay awhile. It'll be close, but I think I might bet on @Richard_Tyndall getting the upper. Sorry @Leon old buddy

Beating on Leon is fun but in the end a pointless exercise. No one is convinced by his protestations - even those who agree with him on stuff have to give a wry smile everytime he digs himself into a hole. And like the argument he had with kjh on the last thread, it will just get tedious for everyone else.

Time to let him drown his sorrows once again. After all the sun is well over the yard arm in Bangkok.

His problem is one of self-awareness; he is aware that (in Belbin terms) he is the group ‘Plant’, but unaware that his role is to throw in a few ideas and then stand back while the adults in the room exercise some judgement.

That's one of the reasons Britain in general, and the centre-right in particular, is in the pickle it's in.

Gove and Johnson are both capable op-ed writers. It's a good thing that the Spectator exists to publish an unfiltered stream-of-conciousness from a right wing viewpoint. But their stuff needs filtering before it becomes a programme for government. For every good idea, there are multiple ideas that won't work and ideas that, even if they are workable, aren't good in the cold light of day.

For various reasons, the government is now run by Belbin plants, and the necessary filters between them and the levers of power have been removed.

Every great thinker needs an Alanbrooke.

Perhaps the forgotten aspect of Churchill was that you could say no to his ideas. And he would actually drop them, if given good reasons. And then oppose others coming up with same idea.

For example, the 9.2” “Ultra” Heavy cruisers proposed in 1940.

Which 9.2" cruisers? News to me!

A 9.2" cruiser sounds like a pocket battleship.

No, there were several 9.2" "armoured cruisers" in WW1 (eg. Minotaur, Shannon, Defence, etc), whereas the German Pocket Battleships of the 1930s (eg. Graf Spee) had 11" guns.

Sorry, I made the mistake of making a joke, based on the idea that 9.2" sounds quite small for a ship.

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

SeaShantyIrish2 said:

Malmesbury said:

Stuartinromford said:

IanB2 said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

Nigel_Foremain said:

I really have got stuff to do, but a battle between @Richard_Tyndall and @Leon is far more tempting than my low calorie lunch. Maybe I should stay awhile. It'll be close, but I think I might bet on @Richard_Tyndall getting the upper. Sorry @Leon old buddy

Beating on Leon is fun but in the end a pointless exercise. No one is convinced by his protestations - even those who agree with him on stuff have to give a wry smile everytime he digs himself into a hole. And like the argument he had with kjh on the last thread, it will just get tedious for everyone else.

Time to let him drown his sorrows once again. After all the sun is well over the yard arm in Bangkok.

His problem is one of self-awareness; he is aware that (in Belbin terms) he is the group ‘Plant’, but unaware that his role is to throw in a few ideas and then stand back while the adults in the room exercise some judgement.

That's one of the reasons Britain in general, and the centre-right in particular, is in the pickle it's in.

Gove and Johnson are both capable op-ed writers. It's a good thing that the Spectator exists to publish an unfiltered stream-of-conciousness from a right wing viewpoint. But their stuff needs filtering before it becomes a programme for government. For every good idea, there are multiple ideas that won't work and ideas that, even if they are workable, aren't good in the cold light of day.

For various reasons, the government is now run by Belbin plants, and the necessary filters between them and the levers of power have been removed.

Every great thinker needs an Alanbrooke.

Perhaps the forgotten aspect of Churchill was that you could say no to his ideas. And he would actually drop them, if given good reasons. And then oppose others coming up with same idea.

For example, the 9.2” “Ultra” Heavy cruisers proposed in 1940.

What is the explanation for Anzio? Plenty of highly-placed people told him it was NOT a good idea. Yet he refused to give it up, kept pushing
and pushing and pushing for it.

NOT among his better WW2 decisions. Along with Leros fiasco.

Wavell was on the receiving end of some awful comments from Churchill, who could not understand that the man’s responsibilities extended far beyond defeating Rommel.

Churchill was a brilliant flawed genius who could also be a cold unfeeling prick.

The problem with Boris is that he recognised himself in the second (although AFAIK Churchill was 100% loyal to Clemmie) and therefore assumed he must also be the first too.

He wasn't and isn't.

ydoethur said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Malmesbury said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Nigelb said:

Guns appear, literally, to have become a religion in the IS.

Obituary for the Utah man who fatally shot his five children, mother-in-law and estranged wife: “Michael made it a point to spend quality time with each and every one of his children. Michael enjoyed making memories with the family.”
https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/status/1614063872771604486

And if that’s not gross enough, the wife’s family put out a statement supporting … guns: “This is the type of loss that will continue to occur in families, communities and this nation when protective arms are no longer accessible.”
https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/status/1614081794852409344

Guns do not kill people. Toddlers do...

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/toddler-shoots-kills-mom-during-video-call-after-finding-gun-n1276722

I guess lots of Americans just like shooting each other.

See Switzerland - heavily armed and very very low rate of shooting each other.

Or Israel…

Oh... some whataboutery!!!

What about Brazil, Mexico, Colombia, South Africa, etc, etc, with huge gun crime statistics. Besides, what exactly are guns for other than for killing? Do you think the inventor said "I know - let us invent a new hobby with these projectile accelerating devices. That will be fun..."

The gun advocates - and I am actually one of them - will never be able to make a reasoned case for guns in the US for as long as so many of them resist the basic common sense rules. You can have countries with high gun ownership. But to have that you also need sensible rules - background checks, bans for those with mental issues, age limits and cooling off periods. Only once those are in place can you even begin to have a proper debate about gun ownership.

My personal position is that anyone wanting to possess a gun needs putting on some sort of watch list. How many devices can you buy on the basis that you want to purchase something that can only be used for killing - and in the case of handguns, almost exclusively for killing people - and not be reported to the cops?

Hells bells, people have been arrested for trying to buy ammonium nitrate (bombs) or castor beans (ricin) and both of those have actual non-violent uses as fertiliser or medicine. But a handgun? "Certainly! And how many boxes of bullets would you like?"

My father owned a handgun, which he used for killing large animals - cattle, horses and sheep.

There weren't actually any other practicable ways to kill them quickly and humanely. Captive bolts had significant drawbacks (no pun intended).

Jim_Miller said:

On a lighter note, I must say that this picture of Leon seems quite flattering.
https://www.gocomics.com/lola/2023/01/10

(He might want to send a note of thanks to Todd Clark.)

MoonRabbit said:

tlg86 said:

MoonRabbit said:

Man Utd’s win just confirms they will finish runners up to Man City in my view in the title race this season. It’s not just the run of wins they are on, it’s the fantastic record against top sides. Man City, Liverpool, Tottenham, Arsenal all beaten by them now, that’s a great indicator of a top 2 finish come the end. Who comes 3rd 4th is a toss up between Tottenham, Newcastle and Arsenal - of those 3 sides Tottenham have by far the stronger bench and quality in the squad and better manager, should be one of the two for the CL spot.

Big day tomorrow in the battle for the top four then

Sure, Man Utd have beaten both Arsenal and Man City (they also got thumped at City), but those two wins were with a huge helping hand from the officials.

It's interesting to note that Man Utd have scored 29 goals this season. Eight of those have been against Arsenal and Man City.

Yes spot on - tomorrow afternoons match is a key one in the battle for top 4 place, denying spurs 2 points would be a good result for arsenal. spurs have the depth in quality of squad and experience of manager to go on a strong run in what remains of the season. I think Arsenal will get 4th spot ahead of Newcastle, but the bench is so thin, any more injuries and the inevitable wobble will be become slump - Arsenal missed top 4 last season because the squad was so thin of quality, clapped out tired and crocked players took the field, and the situation is already little different this time round.

I think we can dismiss misfiring Liverpool and Chelsea from making top 4 this season. I feel sorry for Klopp, it’s like the board havn’t helped him quick enough and it’s not his fault.

MoonRabbit said:

tlg86 said:

MoonRabbit said:

Man Utd’s win just confirms they will finish runners up to Man City in my view in the title race this season. It’s not just the run of wins they are on, it’s the fantastic record against top sides. Man City, Liverpool, Tottenham, Arsenal all beaten by them now, that’s a great indicator of a top 2 finish come the end. Who comes 3rd 4th is a toss up between Tottenham, Newcastle and Arsenal - of those 3 sides Tottenham have by far the stronger bench and quality in the squad and better manager, should be one of the two for the CL spot.

Big day tomorrow in the battle for the top four then

Sure, Man Utd have beaten both Arsenal and Man City (they also got thumped at City), but those two wins were with a huge helping hand from the officials.

It's interesting to note that Man Utd have scored 29 goals this season. Eight of those have been against Arsenal and Man City.

Yes spot on - tomorrow afternoons match is a key one in the battle for top 4 place, denying spurs 2 points would be a good result for arsenal. spurs have the depth in quality of squad and experience of manager to go on a strong run in what remains of the season. I think Arsenal will get 4th spot ahead of Newcastle, but the bench is so thin, any more injuries and the inevitable wobble will be become slump - Arsenal missed top 4 last season because the squad was so thin of quality, clapped out tired and crocked players took the field, and the situation is already little different this time round.

I think we can dismiss misfiring Liverpool and Chelsea from making top 4 this season. I feel sorry for Klopp, it’s like the board havn’t helped him quick enough and it’s not his fault.

Andy_Cooke said:

Jim_Miller said:

On a lighter note, I must say that this picture of Leon seems quite flattering.
https://www.gocomics.com/lola/2023/01/10

(He might want to send a note of thanks to Todd Clark.)

This smbc comic explains EVERYTHING: fears of AI, social media online, and Elon Musk buying Twitter:

https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/artificial-incompetence

kjh said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Malmesbury said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Nigelb said:

Guns appear, literally, to have become a religion in the IS.

Obituary for the Utah man who fatally shot his five children, mother-in-law and estranged wife: “Michael made it a point to spend quality time with each and every one of his children. Michael enjoyed making memories with the family.”
https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/status/1614063872771604486

And if that’s not gross enough, the wife’s family put out a statement supporting … guns: “This is the type of loss that will continue to occur in families, communities and this nation when protective arms are no longer accessible.”
https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/status/1614081794852409344

Guns do not kill people. Toddlers do...

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/toddler-shoots-kills-mom-during-video-call-after-finding-gun-n1276722

I guess lots of Americans just like shooting each other.

See Switzerland - heavily armed and very very low rate of shooting each other.

Or Israel…

Oh... some whataboutery!!!

What about Brazil, Mexico, Colombia, South Africa, etc, etc, with huge gun crime statistics. Besides, what exactly are guns for other than for killing? Do you think the inventor said "I know - let us invent a new hobby with these projectile accelerating devices. That will be fun..."

The gun advocates - and I am actually one of them - will never be able to make a reasoned case for guns in the US for as long as so many of them resist the basic common sense rules. You can have countries with high gun ownership. But to have that you also need sensible rules - background checks, bans for those with mental issues, age limits and cooling off periods. Only once those are in place can you even begin to have a proper debate about gun ownership.

My personal position is that anyone wanting to possess a gun needs putting on some sort of watch list. How many devices can you buy on the basis that you want to purchase something that can only be used for killing - and in the case of handguns, almost exclusively for killing people - and not be reported to the cops?

Hells bells, people have been arrested for trying to buy ammonium nitrate (bombs) or castor beans (ricin) and both of those have actual non-violent uses as fertiliser or medicine. But a handgun? "Certainly! And how many boxes of bullets would you like?"

Generally I wouldn't disagree with you but there are reasons for some to own a hand gun. As I reported here a few years ago we had a deer in the garden that had green bottle maggots eating away at the skull. I looked after it until the deer rescue people arrived. It was so far gone it just stayed with me. They decided it was best to kill it. They used a hand gun.

Northern_Al said:

MoonRabbit said:

tlg86 said:

MoonRabbit said:

Man Utd’s win just confirms they will finish runners up to Man City in my view in the title race this season. It’s not just the run of wins they are on, it’s the fantastic record against top sides. Man City, Liverpool, Tottenham, Arsenal all beaten by them now, that’s a great indicator of a top 2 finish come the end. Who comes 3rd 4th is a toss up between Tottenham, Newcastle and Arsenal - of those 3 sides Tottenham have by far the stronger bench and quality in the squad and better manager, should be one of the two for the CL spot.

Big day tomorrow in the battle for the top four then

Sure, Man Utd have beaten both Arsenal and Man City (they also got thumped at City), but those two wins were with a huge helping hand from the officials.

It's interesting to note that Man Utd have scored 29 goals this season. Eight of those have been against Arsenal and Man City.

Yes spot on - tomorrow afternoons match is a key one in the battle for top 4 place, denying spurs 2 points would be a good result for arsenal. spurs have the depth in quality of squad and experience of manager to go on a strong run in what remains of the season. I think Arsenal will get 4th spot ahead of Newcastle, but the bench is so thin, any more injuries and the inevitable wobble will be become slump - Arsenal missed top 4 last season because the squad was so thin of quality, clapped out tired and crocked players took the field, and the situation is already little different this time round.

I think we can dismiss misfiring Liverpool and Chelsea from making top 4 this season. I feel sorry for Klopp, it’s like the board havn’t helped him quick enough and it’s not his fault.

Don't agree with you on Arsenal. They've added Jesus and Zinchenko, and others have improved.

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Malmesbury said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Nigelb said:

Guns appear, literally, to have become a religion in the IS.

Obituary for the Utah man who fatally shot his five children, mother-in-law and estranged wife: “Michael made it a point to spend quality time with each and every one of his children. Michael enjoyed making memories with the family.”
https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/status/1614063872771604486

And if that’s not gross enough, the wife’s family put out a statement supporting … guns: “This is the type of loss that will continue to occur in families, communities and this nation when protective arms are no longer accessible.”
https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/status/1614081794852409344

Guns do not kill people. Toddlers do...

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/toddler-shoots-kills-mom-during-video-call-after-finding-gun-n1276722

I guess lots of Americans just like shooting each other.

See Switzerland - heavily armed and very very low rate of shooting each other.

Or Israel…

Oh... some whataboutery!!!

What about Brazil, Mexico, Colombia, South Africa, etc, etc, with huge gun crime statistics. Besides, what exactly are guns for other than for killing? Do you think the inventor said "I know - let us invent a new hobby with these projectile accelerating devices. That will be fun..."

The gun advocates - and I am actually one of them - will never be able to make a reasoned case for guns in the US for as long as so many of them resist the basic common sense rules. You can have countries with high gun ownership. But to have that you also need sensible rules - background checks, bans for those with mental issues, age limits and cooling off periods. Only once those are in place can you even begin to have a proper debate about gun ownership.

My personal position is that anyone wanting to possess a gun needs putting on some sort of watch list. How many devices can you buy on the basis that you want to purchase something that can only be used for killing - and in the case of handguns, almost exclusively for killing people - and not be reported to the cops?

Hells bells, people have been arrested for trying to buy ammonium nitrate (bombs) or castor beans (ricin) and both of those have actual non-
violent uses as fertiliser or medicine. But a handgun? "Certainly! And how many boxes of
bullets would you like?"

Owning a gun for hunting or killing vermin is entirely reasonable.

I don't see why this is so controversial.

We are absurdly sentimental about animals in this country, presumably because we are so socially uneasy with our fellow humans so use them as a surrogate.

Beibheirli_C said:

kjh said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Malmesbury said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Nigelb said:

Guns appear, literally, to have become a religion in the IS.

Obituary for the Utah man who fatally shot his five children, mother-in-law and estranged wife: “Michael made it a point to spend quality time with each and every one of his children. Michael enjoyed making memories with the family.”
https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/status/1614063872771604486

And if that’s not gross enough, the wife’s family put out a statement supporting … guns: “This is the type of loss that will continue to occur in families, communities and this nation when protective arms are no longer accessible.”
https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/status/1614081794852409344

Guns do not kill people. Toddlers do...

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/toddler-shoots-kills-mom-during-video-call-after-finding-gun-n1276722

I guess lots of Americans just like shooting each other.

See Switzerland - heavily armed and very very low rate of shooting each other.

Or Israel…

Oh... some whataboutery!!!

What about Brazil, Mexico, Colombia, South Africa, etc, etc, with huge gun crime statistics. Besides, what exactly are guns for other than for killing? Do you think the inventor said "I know - let us invent a new hobby with these projectile accelerating devices. That will be fun..."

The gun advocates - and I am actually one of them - will never be able to make a reasoned case for guns in the US for as long as so many of them resist the basic common sense rules. You can have countries with high gun ownership. But to have that you also need sensible rules - background checks, bans for those with mental issues, age limits and cooling off periods. Only once those are in place can you even begin to have a proper debate about gun ownership.

My personal position is that anyone wanting to possess a gun needs putting on some sort of watch list. How many devices can you buy on the basis that you want to purchase something that can only be used for killing - and in the case of handguns, almost exclusively for killing people - and not be reported to the cops?

Hells bells, people have been arrested for trying to buy ammonium nitrate (bombs) or castor beans (ricin) and both of those have actual non-violent uses as fertiliser or medicine. But a handgun? "Certainly! And how many boxes of bullets would you like?"

Generally I wouldn't disagree with you but there are reasons for some to own a hand gun. As I reported here a few years ago we had a deer in the garden that had green bottle maggots eating away at the skull. I looked after it until the deer rescue people arrived. It was so far gone it just stayed with me. They decided it was best to kill it. They used a hand gun.

Somebody like a vet (or deer rescue) applying for a humane killing gun is in a different league to Joe Bloggs "just wanting one" as per the American method. I would expect the vet's gun is a low-accuracy single shot device and not a Glock with a 13 bullet quick change magazine.

dixiedean said:

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/jan/14/steve-barclay-nhs-unions-rishi-sunak-pay-health-secretary

Tl:Dr.

Barclay wants to be able to seriously negotiate a better deal. Asks Unions to help him.
Sunak and Hunt don't want to know.

My take. Tory Party is split on everything.

MoonRabbit said:

tlg86 said:

MoonRabbit said:

Man Utd’s win just confirms they will finish runners up to Man City in my view in the title race this season. It’s not just the run of wins they are on, it’s the fantastic record against top sides. Man City, Liverpool, Tottenham, Arsenal all beaten by them now, that’s a great indicator of a top 2 finish come the end. Who comes 3rd 4th is a toss up between Tottenham, Newcastle and Arsenal - of those 3 sides Tottenham have by far the stronger bench and quality in the squad and better manager, should be one of the two for the CL spot.

Big day tomorrow in the battle for the top four then

Sure, Man Utd have beaten both Arsenal and Man City (they also got thumped at City), but those two wins were with a huge helping hand from the officials.

It's interesting to note that Man Utd have scored 29 goals this season. Eight of those have been against Arsenal and Man City.

Yes spot on - tomorrow afternoons match is a key one in the battle for top 4 place, denying spurs 2 points would be a good result for arsenal. spurs have the depth in quality of squad and experience of manager to go on a strong run in what remains of the season. I think Arsenal will get 4th spot ahead of Newcastle, but the bench is so thin, any more injuries and the inevitable wobble will be become slump - Arsenal missed top 4 last season because the squad was so thin of quality, clapped out tired and crocked players took the field, and the situation is already little different this time round.

I think we can dismiss misfiring Liverpool and Chelsea from making top 4 this season. I feel sorry for Klopp, it’s like the board havn’t helped him quick enough and it’s not his fault.

TheScreamingEagles said:

Peace talks plan: moves to reconcile Prince Harry with the Windsors before the coronation

Royal insiders believe there’s a chance of a reunion. But they need to persuade William and Kate to put Harry’s outbursts behind them

A royal source, who has the King’s ear and who knows the Sussexes well, believes a reconciliation meeting will happen in the coming months and needs to take place before the coronation on Saturday, May 6. “It’s going to take flexibility on all sides, but it can be done, it’s fixable,” says the source. “It needs Harry over here, in the room with the King and Prince of Wales, a couple of other family members, some of ‘his people’ he trusts who always had his back, so he doesn’t think he’s being ambushed. Someone like Elf [Ed Lane Fox, Harry’s former private secretary] and Christopher [Lord Geidt, the late Queen’s former private secretary who advised the Sussexes].

“Both sides need to hold their hands up and admit we didn’t get everything right, and we got a lot wrong, and we have to say to him ‘we understand the pain you’ve been through’. The King can do it.”

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/peace-talks-plan-moves-to-reconcile-prince-harry-with-the-windsors-before-the-coronation-w3v7t6j2c

tlg86 said:

MoonRabbit said:

tlg86 said:

MoonRabbit said:

Man Utd’s win just confirms they will finish runners up to Man City in my view in the title race this season. It’s not just the run of wins they are on, it’s the fantastic record against top sides. Man City, Liverpool, Tottenham, Arsenal all beaten by them now, that’s a great indicator of a top 2 finish come the end. Who comes 3rd 4th is a toss up between Tottenham, Newcastle and Arsenal - of those 3 sides Tottenham have by far the stronger bench and quality in the squad and better manager, should be one of the two for the CL spot.

Big day tomorrow in the battle for the top four then

Sure, Man Utd have beaten both Arsenal and Man City (they also got thumped at City), but those two wins were with a huge helping hand from the officials.

It's interesting to note that Man Utd have scored 29 goals this season. Eight of those have been against Arsenal and Man City.

Yes spot on - tomorrow afternoons match is a key one in the battle for top 4 place, denying spurs 2 points would be a good result for arsenal. spurs have the depth in quality of squad and experience of manager to go on a strong run in what remains of the season. I think Arsenal will get 4th spot ahead of Newcastle, but the bench is so thin, any more injuries and the inevitable wobble will be become slump - Arsenal missed top 4 last season because the squad was so thin of quality, clapped out tired and crocked players took the field, and the situation is already little different this time round.

I think we can dismiss misfiring Liverpool and Chelsea from making top 4 this season. I feel sorry for Klopp, it’s like the board havn’t helped him quick enough and it’s not his fault.

538 make Arsenal a 96% change to finish top four. You can lay them at 1.07 if you fancy making a decent amount of money (if you're right, of course).

IanB2 said:

Gardenwalker said:

Manhattan of course has a wonderful grid system. I don’t know if this eases traffic, but I want to say it seems easier to travel up and downtown than London which by the time I left has become perma-gridlocked by road closures and low traffic neighbourhoods.

London also has all these weird gyratories and other schemes, some of which have admittedly been removed, but seem to further clog and destroy localities where they still remain.

The disaster that is Aldgate, for example, or the mad five way system that is King’s Cross-Caledonian-Euston-Gray’s Inn Road.

When I was in the US I was reading an interesting book about the origins of New York’s grid street plan. Which was actually developed when there already roads and tracks in place, many dating from the original Dutch settlement. The process of surveying the land and mapping out the proposed street plan was very controversial - involving surveyors encroaching onto private land - in once case mapping out a road that would run through someone’s kitchen, resulting in litigation, and the council had to adopt special powers to force its plans - which were drawn and redrawn several times, through. A fair few properties were demolished to impose the grid onto the city.

On the London case, I have a copy of the original London plan that had concentric rings of highways mapped out around the capital, which included a South Circular built to a similar standard to the North. These proposals over-reached and were strongly resisted and eventually watered down considerably, although they did plant the seed that eventually led to the M25.

DJ41 said:

SeaShantyIrish2 said:

Luckyguy1983 said:

Theuniondivvie said:

Fackin hell, Twitter is still an education. An account I follow which I thought was a pretty nerdy and respectable one on WWI battlefield topography and archaeology has liked the Andrew Bridgen tweet threatening to sue Hancock for calling him an antisemite.

Bridgen v Hancock would of course be the shittest Alien v Predator ever, and therefore hugely entertaining.

Is he an anti-semite? His comments can perhaps be deemed inappropriate and insensitive, but they aren't anti-semitic in content. If he was trying to belittle the holocaust it's an extremely oblique way to do it. I thought Sunak's response in parliament majoring on this angle of criticism was wrong. I think Sunak should have said that his comments had no scientific basis and that vaccines had been tested (which they have) and had enabled the UK to look beyond covid.

JTA.org - British parliament member booted from Conservative Party after comparing COVID-19 vaccination to Holocaust

. . . . “Andrew Bridgen has crossed a line, causing great offense in the process,” said Simon Hart, the Conservative Party’s chief whip. “As a nation we should be very proud of what has been achieved through the vaccine program. The vaccine is the best defense against COVID that we have.”

Prime Minister Rishi Sunak, a Conservative, linked Bridgen’s comments to antisemitism.

“Obviously, it is utterly unacceptable to make linkages and use language like that, and I’m determined that the scourge of antisemitism is eradicated,” Sunak said on the floor of the House of Commons.

In the U.K., as elsewhere in the world, anti-vaxxer and antisemitic rhetoric have often been deeply linked.

“The accusations that the pandemic is fake and that Jewish conspirators created the virus are the most dominant in anti-vaxxer communities,” said a report released by the British government in the fall of 2020. “Whilst the groups themselves are rarely established to spread antisemitism, they become a hotbed for antisemitic conspiracy theories.” . . .

What document was that? Got a link?

The document if it exists didn't yield to the following search either at DuckDuckGo or Google:

"anti-vaxxer communities" site:gov.uk

Edit:

Found it! This is the document that is referred to, and the words are on page 8 of it:

https://combatantisemitism.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/Antisemitism-antivaxxer-report.pdf

It was issued by the Office of HMG's Independent Adviser on Antisemitism.

tlg86 said:

MoonRabbit said:

tlg86 said:

MoonRabbit said:

tlg86 said:

MoonRabbit said:

Man Utd’s win just confirms they will finish runners up to Man City in my view in the title race this season. It’s not just the run of wins they are on, it’s the fantastic record against top sides. Man City, Liverpool, Tottenham, Arsenal all beaten by them now, that’s a great indicator of a top 2 finish come the end. Who comes 3rd 4th is a toss up between Tottenham, Newcastle and Arsenal - of those 3 sides Tottenham have by far the stronger bench and quality in the squad and better manager, should be one of the two for the CL spot.

Big day tomorrow in the battle for the top four then

Sure, Man Utd have beaten both Arsenal and Man City (they also got thumped at City), but those two wins were with a huge helping hand from the officials.

It's interesting to note that Man Utd have scored 29 goals this season. Eight of those have been against Arsenal and Man City.

Yes spot on - tomorrow afternoons match is a key one in the battle for top 4 place, denying spurs 2 points would be a good result for arsenal. spurs have the depth in quality of squad and experience of manager to go on a strong run in what remains of the season. I think Arsenal will get 4th spot ahead of Newcastle, but the bench is so thin, any more injuries and the inevitable wobble will be become slump - Arsenal missed top 4 last season because the squad was so thin of quality, clapped out tired and crocked players took the field, and the situation is already little different this time round.

I think we can dismiss misfiring Liverpool and Chelsea from making top 4 this season. I feel sorry for Klopp, it’s like the board havn’t helped him quick enough and it’s not his fault.

538 make Arsenal a 96% change to finish top four. You can lay them at 1.07 if you fancy making a decent amount of money (if you're right, of course).

I think Arsenal will make top 4, no chance of top 2 though - I know a bit about it because dear gf and her Dad are fans, but to me their transfer process has been just too slow to resolve the problem that cost them last season, an okay 11 that’s too knackered at the end without help; two or three quality players can knock the under 20’s off that bench this week, not just negotiate 1 person at a time. Mudryk doesn’t help them much this season, he hasn’t played 90 minutes for months! He might settle in okay in future though. Not worth more than Gapko tbh, they are paying way over the top.

Well, good job Mudryk is on his way to Stamford Bridge!

beinndearg said:

HYUFD said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Peace talks plan: moves to reconcile Prince Harry with the Windsors before the coronation

Royal insiders believe there’s a chance of a reunion. But they need to persuade William and Kate to put Harry’s outbursts behind them

A royal source, who has the King’s ear and who knows the Sussexes well, believes a reconciliation meeting will happen in the coming months and needs to take place before the coronation on Saturday, May 6. “It’s going to take flexibility on all sides, but it can be done, it’s fixable,” says the source. “It needs Harry over here, in the room with the King and Prince of Wales, a couple of other family members, some of ‘his people’ he trusts who always had his back, so he doesn’t think he’s being ambushed. Someone like Elf [Ed Lane Fox, Harry’s former private secretary] and Christopher [Lord Geidt, the late Queen’s former private secretary who advised the Sussexes].

“Both sides need to hold their hands up and admit we didn’t get everything right, and we got a lot wrong, and we have to say to him ‘we understand the pain you’ve been through’. The King can do it.”

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/peace-talks-plan-moves-to-reconcile-prince-harry-with-the-windsors-before-the-coronation-w3v7t6j2c

Archbishop of Canterbury Justin Welby to be mediator between the Sussexes and the rest of the royal family as apparently one of the few establishment figures trusted by both sides.


Personally I would offer them roles as Ambassadors to the Commonwealth as they are interested in but formally restrict HRHs to working royals

They'd be working Royals then would they not?

Shoulda gone for Sentamu, what with the colour thang and him being retired. Charles is Welby's boss. But perhaps we are in a Don't mention the Y word period of royal PR.

Malmesbury said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Malmesbury said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Malmesbury said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Nigelb said:

Guns appear, literally, to have become a religion in the IS.

Obituary for the Utah man who fatally shot his five children, mother-in-law and estranged wife: “Michael made it a point to spend quality time with each and every one of his children. Michael enjoyed making memories with the family.”
https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/status/1614063872771604486

And if that’s not gross enough, the wife’s family put out a statement supporting … guns: “This is the type of loss that will continue to occur in families, communities and this nation when protective arms are no longer accessible.”
https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/status/1614081794852409344

Guns do not kill people. Toddlers do...

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/toddler-shoots-kills-mom-during-video-call-after-finding-gun-n1276722

I guess lots of Americans just like shooting each other.

See Switzerland - heavily armed and very very low rate of shooting each other.

Or Israel…

Oh... some whataboutery!!!

What about Brazil, Mexico, Colombia, South Africa, etc, etc, with huge gun crime statistics. Besides, what exactly are guns for other than for killing? Do you think the inventor said "I know - let us invent a new hobby with these projectile accelerating devices. That will be fun..."

The gun advocates - and I am actually one of them - will never be able to make a reasoned case for guns in the US for as long as so many of them resist the basic common sense rules. You can have countries with high gun ownership. But to have that you also need sensible rules - background checks, bans for those with mental issues, age limits and cooling off periods. Only once those are in place can you even begin to have a proper debate about gun ownership.

My personal position is that anyone wanting to possess a gun needs putting on some sort of watch list. How many devices can you buy on the basis that you want to purchase something that can only be used for killing - and in the case of handguns, almost exclusively for killing people - and not be reported to the cops?

Hells bells, people have been arrested for trying to buy ammonium nitrate (bombs) or castor beans (ricin) and both of those have actual non-
violent uses as fertiliser or medicine. But a handgun? "Certainly! And how many boxes of
bullets would you like?"

Owning a gun for hunting or killing vermin is entirely reasonable.

I don't see why this is so controversial.

We are absurdly sentimental about animals in this country, presumably because we are so socially uneasy with our fellow humans so use them as a surrogate.

I am not worried about killing vermin. I am more concerned about killing people. You know fathers, mothers, daughters, nephews, etc.

You are aware that in the countryside, everyone is packin' ?

Farmers. Farmers mums.

https://clip.cafe/hot-fuzz-2007/i-may-not-be-a-man-of-god/

OK then - let us try the US approach and put a gun shop on every street corner. I am sure it will be fine because all gun owners are moral, upstanding citizens since it is well known that possessing a gun inculcates self-discipline and no gun owner would therefore ever shoot another person. Statistically no one has ever been shot, have they?

I’m not suggesting that.

Gun control in this country has worked and doesn’t need to be tinkered with, IMHO.

The problem the US has is a violent culture - look at the knife crime rate. In between shooting each other it’s stab stab stab.

beinndearg said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Malmesbury said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Malmesbury said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Malmesbury said:

Beibheirli_C said:

Nigelb said:

Guns appear, literally, to have become a religion in the IS.

Obituary for the Utah man who fatally shot his five children, mother-in-law and estranged wife: “Michael made it a point to spend quality time with each and every one of his children. Michael enjoyed making memories with the family.”
https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/status/1614063872771604486

And if that’s not gross enough, the wife’s family put out a statement supporting … guns: “This is the type of loss that will continue to occur in families, communities and this nation when protective arms are no longer accessible.”
https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/status/1614081794852409344

Guns do not kill people. Toddlers do...

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/toddler-shoots-kills-mom-during-video-call-after-finding-gun-n1276722

I guess lots of Americans just like shooting each other.

See Switzerland - heavily armed and very very low rate of shooting each other.

Or Israel…

Oh... some whataboutery!!!

What about Brazil, Mexico, Colombia, South Africa, etc, etc, with huge gun crime statistics. Besides, what exactly are guns for other than for killing? Do you think the inventor said "I know - let us invent a new hobby with these projectile accelerating devices. That will be fun..."

The gun advocates - and I am actually one of them - will never be able to make a reasoned case for guns in the US for as long as so many of them resist the basic common sense rules. You can have countries with high gun ownership. But to have that you also need sensible rules - background checks, bans for those with mental issues, age limits and cooling off periods. Only once those are in place can you even begin to have a proper debate about gun ownership.

My personal position is that anyone wanting to possess a gun needs putting on some sort of watch list. How many devices can you buy on the basis that you want to purchase something that can only be used for killing - and in the case of handguns, almost exclusively for killing people - and not be reported to the cops?

Hells bells, people have been arrested for trying to buy ammonium nitrate (bombs) or castor beans (ricin) and both of those have actual non-
violent uses as fertiliser or medicine. But a handgun? "Certainly! And how many boxes of
bullets would you like?"

Owning a gun for hunting or killing vermin is entirely reasonable.

I don't see why this is so controversial.

We are absurdly sentimental about animals in this country, presumably because we are so socially uneasy with our fellow humans so use them as a surrogate.

I am not worried about killing vermin. I am more concerned about killing people. You know fathers, mothers, daughters, nephews, etc.

You are aware that in the countryside, everyone is packin' ?

Farmers. Farmers mums.

https://clip.cafe/hot-fuzz-2007/i-may-not-be-a-man-of-god/

OK then - let us try the US approach and put a gun shop on every street corner. I am sure it will be fine because all gun owners are moral, upstanding citizens since it is well known that possessing a gun inculcates self-discipline and no gun owner would therefore ever shoot another person. Statistically no one has ever been shot, have they?

I’m not suggesting that.

Gun control in this country has worked and doesn’t need to be tinkered with, IMHO.

The problem the US has is a violent culture - look at the knife crime rate. In between shooting each other it’s stab stab stab.

Sorry - you seemed to be saying that there are loads of guns in the UK and everything is peachy so what is the fuss?

I am objecting to Joe Bloggs running about with handguns because he rather fancied the idea. Not farmers, not vets - people who can justify it for animal or pest control.

BTW, just to be clear, regardless of the number of shotguns in the countryside, farmers are not allowed to shoot people either. Nor are vets.

Handguns are completely illegal here since Dunblane. If you mean the US it's John Doe not Joe Bloggs.

Gardenwalker said:

I doubt Harry and Meghan want to return to being working royals, because it means a level of press scrutiny or even harassment that both cannot tolerate.

They’ve also proven - to themselves, at least - that they can earn a living outside the royal system.

beinndearg said:

HYUFD said:

beinndearg said:

HYUFD said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Peace talks plan: moves to reconcile Prince Harry with the Windsors before the coronation

Royal insiders believe there’s a chance of a reunion. But they need to persuade William and Kate to put Harry’s outbursts behind them

A royal source, who has the King’s ear and who knows the Sussexes well, believes a reconciliation meeting will happen in the coming months and needs to take place before the coronation on Saturday, May 6. “It’s going to take flexibility on all sides, but it can be done, it’s fixable,” says the source. “It needs Harry over here, in the room with the King and Prince of Wales, a couple of other family members, some of ‘his people’ he trusts who always had his back, so he doesn’t think he’s being ambushed. Someone like Elf [Ed Lane Fox, Harry’s former private secretary] and Christopher [Lord Geidt, the late Queen’s former private secretary who advised the Sussexes].

“Both sides need to hold their hands up and admit we didn’t get everything right, and we got a lot wrong, and we have to say to him ‘we understand the pain you’ve been through’. The King can do it.”

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/peace-talks-plan-moves-to-reconcile-prince-harry-with-the-windsors-before-the-coronation-w3v7t6j2c

Archbishop of Canterbury Justin Welby to be mediator between the Sussexes and the rest of the royal family as apparently one of the few establishment figures trusted by both sides.


Personally I would offer them roles as Ambassadors to the Commonwealth as they are interested in but formally restrict HRHs to working royals

They'd be working Royals then would they not?

Shoulda gone for Sentamu, what with the colour thang and him being retired. Charles is Welby's boss. But perhaps we are in a Don't mention the Y word period of royal PR.

Not full time working royals no and certainly not even part time working royals in the UK so they would still not be HRHs, though they would keep Duke and Duchess. It would be a similar solution as was found for Edward and Wallis. He became Governor of the Bahamas, they were Duke and Duchess of Windsor but she was not HRH.

Welby is more woke and liberal than Sentamu who despite being black is more socially conservative than the Archbishop of Canterbury and does not even approve of marrying divorcees like Meghan in church. Whereas Welby did Harry and Meghan’s wedding

Welby did that because he is Charles's and was HMQ's lackey. That's the point.

Andy_JS said:

Andrew Bridgen's statement on YouTube.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LD2lhNnlDbQ