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Starmer now a 74% betting chance to be PM after next election – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 11,002
edited October 2022 in General
imageStarmer now a 74% betting chance to be PM after next election – politicalbetting.com

Inevitably given the way the opinion polls have moved so sharply to Labour then Keir starmer has moved up in the betting to be the prime minister after the next general election.

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • Options
    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    edited October 2022
    First

    So, who tipped lab maj at 5/1? On here, so's you could all see.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,567
    First, like SKS at Westminster.
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    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,834
    I've never seen numbers like this before. It's mid-1990s territory

    Labour 53%
    Conservatives 19%

    @PeoplePolling Oct 12

    https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1580656789015891969
  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,834
    “Among the general public, 50% want Truss to be ousted. Just 9% think the Conservatives chose the right leader this summer….”
    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/tories-plot-to-replace-truss-with-rishi-sunak-and-penny-mordaunt-wjdfwzzvk
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,095
    Scott_xP said:

    I've never seen numbers like this before. It's mid-1990s territory

    Labour 53%
    Conservatives 19%

    @PeoplePolling Oct 12

    https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1580656789015891969

    It's "voter strike 2019 to get rid of May" territory.
  • Options
    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,622
    Scott_xP said:

    I've never seen numbers like this before. It's mid-1990s territory

    Labour 53%
    Conservatives 19%

    @PeoplePolling Oct 12

    https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1580656789015891969

    Just missing a literally in there to go full colemanballs......
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    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,834
    - Apparently, the Tories' poll rating is high among teens.
    - Really?
    - Oh, no, sorry. The Tories' poll rating is in the high teens.

    https://twitter.com/DavidMills73/status/1580650576345694208
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    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    Theuniondivvie said:

    Well, that's my pal Bruce gone; into the hospice at 1pm yesterday, on the morphine pretty much immediately, turned down the respirator gradually, took the mask away at 1am today, battled on till 4pm.

    Since The Times won't be doing an obit, I will.

    Pompey boy, uncle went down on the Hood, joined the RN at 16, qualified as an artificer, worked subsequently mainly as a helicopter mechanic for Bristows.

    Serial obsessive which included rock climbing, Nordic skiing, cycling, playing the flute, jazz, opera, birdwatching, life drawing, photography, neolithic stones.

    Abiding passions Wagner, Blake, art and dressing well.

    Complicated love life.

    And just to keep it real for PB, detested the Tories and all they stand for.

    Sorry to hear.
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,299
    Theuniondivvie said:

    Well, that's my pal Bruce gone; into the hospice at 1pm yesterday, on the morphine pretty much immediately, turned down the respirator gradually, took the mask away at 1am today, battled on till 4pm.

    Since The Times won't be doing an obit, I will.

    Pompey boy, uncle went down on the Hood, joined the RN at 16, qualified as an artificer, worked subsequently mainly as a helicopter mechanic for Bristows.

    Serial obsessive which included rock climbing, Nordic skiing, cycling, playing the flute, jazz, opera, birdwatching, life drawing, photography, neolithic stones.

    Abiding passions Wagner, Blake, art and dressing well.

    Complicated love life.

    And just to keep it real for PB, detested the Tories and all they stand for.

    Very sorry for your loss.
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    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,195
    Jonathan said:

    So… thought experiment. You wake up tomorrow You’re Liz Truss. What do you do?

    After 15 minutes, I would find myself ejected beside the New Jersey Turnpike.
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    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,834
    This would be unprecedented, even astounding, if it happens. But I did say tonight on Radio 4’s PM that Ms Truss might not last as long as Bonar Law, who was Tory PM for only seven months. He stepped down for health reasons (throat cancer). Not incompetence.

    https://twitter.com/afneil/status/1580663139401465856
    https://twitter.com/thetimes/status/1580658752457707521
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    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,543
    Theuniondivvie said:

    Well, that's my pal Bruce gone; into the hospice at 1pm yesterday, on the morphine pretty much immediately, turned down the respirator gradually, took the mask away at 1am today, battled on till 4pm.

    Since The Times won't be doing an obit, I will.

    Pompey boy, uncle went down on the Hood, joined the RN at 16, qualified as an artificer, worked subsequently mainly as a helicopter mechanic for Bristows.

    Serial obsessive which included rock climbing, Nordic skiing, cycling, playing the flute, jazz, opera, birdwatching, life drawing, photography, neolithic stones.

    Abiding passions Wagner, Blake, art and dressing well.

    Complicated love life.

    And just to keep it real for PB, detested the Tories and all they stand for.

    Sounds like a great guy. Sorry to hear your news.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,137
    noneoftheabove said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I've never seen numbers like this before. It's mid-1990s territory

    Labour 53%
    Conservatives 19%

    @PeoplePolling Oct 12

    https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1580656789015891969

    Just missing a literally in there to go full colemanballs......
    He would have been about 14 when the Tory mid 1990s disaster happened.
  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,834
    ...
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,137
    Theuniondivvie said:

    Well, that's my pal Bruce gone; into the hospice at 1pm yesterday, on the morphine pretty much immediately, turned down the respirator gradually, took the mask away at 1am today, battled on till 4pm.

    Since The Times won't be doing an obit, I will.

    Pompey boy, uncle went down on the Hood, joined the RN at 16, qualified as an artificer, worked subsequently mainly as a helicopter mechanic for Bristows.

    Serial obsessive which included rock climbing, Nordic skiing, cycling, playing the flute, jazz, opera, birdwatching, life drawing, photography, neolithic stones.

    Abiding passions Wagner, Blake, art and dressing well.

    Complicated love life.

    And just to keep it real for PB, detested the Tories and all they stand for.

    Sorry for your loss.

    Sounds an interesting fellow.
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    NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,317
    Theuniondivvie said:

    Well, that's my pal Bruce gone; into the hospice at 1pm yesterday, on the morphine pretty much immediately, turned down the respirator gradually, took the mask away at 1am today, battled on till 4pm.

    Since The Times won't be doing an obit, I will.

    Pompey boy, uncle went down on the Hood, joined the RN at 16, qualified as an artificer, worked subsequently mainly as a helicopter mechanic for Bristows.

    Serial obsessive which included rock climbing, Nordic skiing, cycling, playing the flute, jazz, opera, birdwatching, life drawing, photography, neolithic stones.

    Abiding passions Wagner, Blake, art and dressing well.

    Complicated love life.

    And just to keep it real for PB, detested the Tories and all they stand for.

    He sounds amazing, and lived a life most of us won't achieve. I'm so sorry that he's gone but it sounds as though he had a very good friend in you. All the very best.
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    JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901
    Theuniondivvie said:

    Well, that's my pal Bruce gone; into the hospice at 1pm yesterday, on the morphine pretty much immediately, turned down the respirator gradually, took the mask away at 1am today, battled on till 4pm.

    Since The Times won't be doing an obit, I will.

    Pompey boy, uncle went down on the Hood, joined the RN at 16, qualified as an artificer, worked subsequently mainly as a helicopter mechanic for Bristows.

    Serial obsessive which included rock climbing, Nordic skiing, cycling, playing the flute, jazz, opera, birdwatching, life drawing, photography, neolithic stones.

    Abiding passions Wagner, Blake, art and dressing well.

    Complicated love life.

    And just to keep it real for PB, detested the Tories and all they stand for.

    Condolences. Very Sorry.
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    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,834
    EXCL: Tory MPs discussing whether they can replace Liz Truss with increasing urgency

    Grandees think they can arrange a coronation *if* Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt agree to team up

    YouGov polling finds almost half of 2019 Tories want Truss ousted

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/eb045534-4b2e-11ed-8b55-aaf85c581598?shareToken=3130b41ff617eb0423ded1d66208e71c
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,137
    Not for the first time, the Star manages to capture the moment...


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    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,567
    edited October 2022
    rottenborough said:

    Theuniondivvie said:

    Well, that's my pal Bruce gone; into the hospice at 1pm yesterday, on the morphine pretty much immediately, turned down the respirator gradually, took the mask away at 1am today, battled on till 4pm.

    Since The Times won't be doing an obit, I will.

    Pompey boy, uncle went down on the Hood, joined the RN at 16, qualified as an artificer, worked subsequently mainly as a helicopter mechanic for Bristows.

    Serial obsessive which included rock climbing, Nordic skiing, cycling, playing the flute, jazz, opera, birdwatching, life drawing, photography, neolithic stones.

    Abiding passions Wagner, Blake, art and dressing well.

    Complicated love life.

    And just to keep it real for PB, detested the Tories and all they stand for.

    Sorry for your loss.

    Sounds an interesting fellow.
    RN artificer apprentice: would have been superbly trained. Sort of training where you had to make your own tools. My dad had the same training, albeit during WW2 (and not an air mech).

    The kind of ongoing test they had was to make a perfect metal cube one inch on every side, by hand tools only.
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    JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901
    Scott_xP said:

    Imagine the humiliation of a Liz Truss Downing St resignation speech in the coming weeks.

    “I’m proud of the achievements of my government. We had a very successful induction day. Our first tea run went smoothly. I personally scored 84% on the health & safety at work assessment.”

    https://twitter.com/KirstyStricklan/status/1580663857697415168

    “I didn’t get fined By the police and didn’t call an election or referendum and go on to lose it.”
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,137
    Scott_xP said:

    EXCL: Tory MPs discussing whether they can replace Liz Truss with increasing urgency

    Grandees think they can arrange a coronation *if* Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt agree to team up

    YouGov polling finds almost half of 2019 Tories want Truss ousted

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/eb045534-4b2e-11ed-8b55-aaf85c581598?shareToken=3130b41ff617eb0423ded1d66208e71c

    Starmer is praying that 'if' is a massive big 'if'.

    Is there anything he can do to help save her?
  • Options
    Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 4,799
    FPT: my list, going through, of all even remotely credible unity candidates beyond Wallace:


    Green, May, Hunt, Cox, Julian Smith, Brady, Barclay.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,137
    Scott_xP said:

    Imagine the humiliation of a Liz Truss Downing St resignation speech in the coming weeks.

    “I’m proud of the achievements of my government. We had a very successful induction day. Our first tea run went smoothly. I personally scored 84% on the health & safety at work assessment.”

    https://twitter.com/KirstyStricklan/status/1580663857697415168

    Her bit of the funeral was ok.

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    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,543
    Jonathan said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Imagine the humiliation of a Liz Truss Downing St resignation speech in the coming weeks.

    “I’m proud of the achievements of my government. We had a very successful induction day. Our first tea run went smoothly. I personally scored 84% on the health & safety at work assessment.”

    https://twitter.com/KirstyStricklan/status/1580663857697415168

    “I didn’t get fined By the police and didn’t call an election or referendum and go on to lose it.”
    "Never lost a Commons vote"?
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,299
    Scott_xP said:

    EXCL: Tory MPs discussing whether they can replace Liz Truss with increasing urgency

    Grandees think they can arrange a coronation *if* Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt agree to team up

    YouGov polling finds almost half of 2019 Tories want Truss ousted

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/eb045534-4b2e-11ed-8b55-aaf85c581598?shareToken=3130b41ff617eb0423ded1d66208e71c

    These 'grandees' think they're ending someone else's career, but it seems like they're ending their own to me.
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    PJHPJH Posts: 480
    Theuniondivvie said:

    Well, that's my pal Bruce gone; into the hospice at 1pm yesterday, on the morphine pretty much immediately, turned down the respirator gradually, took the mask away at 1am today, battled on till 4pm.

    Since The Times won't be doing an obit, I will.

    Pompey boy, uncle went down on the Hood, joined the RN at 16, qualified as an artificer, worked subsequently mainly as a helicopter mechanic for Bristows.

    Serial obsessive which included rock climbing, Nordic skiing, cycling, playing the flute, jazz, opera, birdwatching, life drawing, photography, neolithic stones.

    Abiding passions Wagner, Blake, art and dressing well.

    Complicated love life.

    And just to keep it real for PB, detested the Tories and all they stand for.

    You have my sympathies. I lost my oldest friend earlier this year in similar circumstances (though he stayed at home to the end) and before his time.
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,299
    rottenborough said:

    Scott_xP said:

    EXCL: Tory MPs discussing whether they can replace Liz Truss with increasing urgency

    Grandees think they can arrange a coronation *if* Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt agree to team up

    YouGov polling finds almost half of 2019 Tories want Truss ousted

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/eb045534-4b2e-11ed-8b55-aaf85c581598?shareToken=3130b41ff617eb0423ded1d66208e71c

    Starmer is praying that 'if' is a massive big 'if'.

    Is there anything he can do to help save her?
    Just keep being shit and hope that's enough.
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    TheValiantTheValiant Posts: 1,693
    Meant to try and catch up on the British politics earlier on, but never got around to it till now. Too busy looking at accruals (interesting) and following the war in Ukraine.

    Anyway, Truss seems doomed, but equally there is no good way out for the party.
    If they try and get rid, even a coronation, its going to look awful and the members will rightly throw an absolute fit. They voted for Truss and they get..... Sunak? Mordaunt? Johnson! May!? Crazy. The party will be punished both by members ripping up their cards and leaving, and at the upcoming election which is now surely lost (though I'll always caveat it with 'events dear boy events').

    If they stick with Truss, its becoming more and more obvious that she isn't fit to be Prime Minister (some example of the Peter Principle here.... and maybe even more than that). She could lurch from crisis to crisis in the next two years before finally getting thrashed at the polls. But whether the country can cope with her for two years is another question.

    One thing I've not necessarily seen mentioned, is that, just like in the summer with Johnson's removal, the Leader of the Opposition has a role to play here.
    If I was Starmer, I'd call a Parliamentary VoNC. Force the Conservatives to back her.... or not.
    If the perceived wisdom is a GE is needed, then calling the VoNC will force backbenches to rally behind her. And Starmer can remind them of that at every opportunity.
    And if they don't.... then its a November GE.... one that Labour could win.

    But I'm not sure Starmer is up to this. He wasn't in the summer......
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    RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 2,976
    Luckyguy1983 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    EXCL: Tory MPs discussing whether they can replace Liz Truss with increasing urgency

    Grandees think they can arrange a coronation *if* Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt agree to team up

    YouGov polling finds almost half of 2019 Tories want Truss ousted

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/eb045534-4b2e-11ed-8b55-aaf85c581598?shareToken=3130b41ff617eb0423ded1d66208e71c

    These 'grandees' think they're ending someone else's career, but it seems like they're ending their own to me.
    Na, that ended the moment the membership went for Truss. As was friggin obvious
  • Options
    solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,623
    Jonathan said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Imagine the humiliation of a Liz Truss Downing St resignation speech in the coming weeks.

    “I’m proud of the achievements of my government. We had a very successful induction day. Our first tea run went smoothly. I personally scored 84% on the health & safety at work assessment.”

    https://twitter.com/KirstyStricklan/status/1580663857697415168

    “I didn’t get fined By the police and didn’t call an election or referendum and go on to lose it.”
    "Didn't lose Scotland on my watch. Didn't have time to!"
  • Options
    RobDRobD Posts: 58,955
    edited October 2022
    Luckyguy1983 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    EXCL: Tory MPs discussing whether they can replace Liz Truss with increasing urgency

    Grandees think they can arrange a coronation *if* Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt agree to team up

    YouGov polling finds almost half of 2019 Tories want Truss ousted

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/eb045534-4b2e-11ed-8b55-aaf85c581598?shareToken=3130b41ff617eb0423ded1d66208e71c

    These 'grandees' think they're ending someone else's career, but it seems like they're ending their own to me.
    That's more likely if she stays on than if she goes.
  • Options
    Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 4,799
    rottenborough said:

    Scott_xP said:

    EXCL: Tory MPs discussing whether they can replace Liz Truss with increasing urgency

    Grandees think they can arrange a coronation *if* Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt agree to team up

    YouGov polling finds almost half of 2019 Tories want Truss ousted

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/eb045534-4b2e-11ed-8b55-aaf85c581598?shareToken=3130b41ff617eb0423ded1d66208e71c

    Starmer is praying that 'if' is a massive big 'if'.

    Is there anything he can do to help save her?
    Get steaming drunk, have a massive korma, throw up profusely on the sole copy of Kwarteng's special financial operation. Collude with Truss to pretend the last month never happened.

    .....HMQ steps out of the shower to meet the new PM.
  • Options
    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,622
    rottenborough said:

    noneoftheabove said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I've never seen numbers like this before. It's mid-1990s territory

    Labour 53%
    Conservatives 19%

    @PeoplePolling Oct 12

    https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1580656789015891969

    Just missing a literally in there to go full colemanballs......
    He would have been about 14 when the Tory mid 1990s disaster happened.
    Regardless of age, how does he know its mid 90s territory if he has never seen numbers like it? I know I am too pedantic and literal but this kind of hyperbole makes my head explode over and over again.
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,935
    Luckyguy1983 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    EXCL: Tory MPs discussing whether they can replace Liz Truss with increasing urgency

    Grandees think they can arrange a coronation *if* Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt agree to team up

    YouGov polling finds almost half of 2019 Tories want Truss ousted

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/eb045534-4b2e-11ed-8b55-aaf85c581598?shareToken=3130b41ff617eb0423ded1d66208e71c

    These 'grandees' think they're ending someone else's career, but it seems like they're ending their own to me.
    We are at the stage now where I think even Grant Shapps counts as a grandee!
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    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,543
    noneoftheabove said:

    rottenborough said:

    noneoftheabove said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I've never seen numbers like this before. It's mid-1990s territory

    Labour 53%
    Conservatives 19%

    @PeoplePolling Oct 12

    https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1580656789015891969

    Just missing a literally in there to go full colemanballs......
    He would have been about 14 when the Tory mid 1990s disaster happened.
    Regardless of age, how does he know its mid 90s territory if he has never seen numbers like it? I know I am too pedantic and literal but this kind of hyperbole makes my head explode over and over again.
    Literally makes your head explode?

    How many times?
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    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,834
    Westminster Voting Intention:

    LAB: 53% (+1)
    CON: 19% (-1)

    Via @PeoplePolling, 12 Oct.
    Changes w/ 6 Oct.
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/10/13/just-nine-per-cent-have-favourable-view-liz-truss/


  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,488
    The North Evington (Leicester) by-election tonight is an interesting one. The area is heavily Asian, a mixture of Muslims, Hindus and Sikhs in that order. The Labour candidate is a supporter of Modi and RSS, with the Tory candidate a close second last time.

    It wouldn't surprise me if the Tory gain here. There are some strange politics in the area at the moment. This area was one of the centres of the recent communal violence.


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    PJHPJH Posts: 480
    Pro_Rata said:

    FPT: my list, going through, of all even remotely credible unity candidates beyond Wallace:


    Green, May, Hunt, Cox, Julian Smith, Brady, Barclay.

    I can't see any of them being realistic. My view as an informed non-Tory:

    Green - who?
    May - we got rid of her once already, no thanks
    Hunt - unacceptable to both types of Brexit ultra
    Cox - really? My daughters think he is some kind of comedy parody of a Tory
    Smith - Hmm, hadn't though of him. I know he made a decent fist of NI so must have some ability, but I have no idea who he is actually
    Brady - too smarmy
    Barclay - too anonymous, not a leader
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    JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901
    Scott_xP said:

    Westminster Voting Intention:

    LAB: 53% (+1)
    CON: 19% (-1)

    Via @PeoplePolling, 12 Oct.
    Changes w/ 6 Oct.
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/10/13/just-nine-per-cent-have-favourable-view-liz-truss/


    SNP opposition leader. Nice.
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    Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 4,799
    PJH said:

    Pro_Rata said:

    FPT: my list, going through, of all even remotely credible unity candidates beyond Wallace:


    Green, May, Hunt, Cox, Julian Smith, Brady, Barclay.

    I can't see any of them being realistic. My view as an informed non-Tory:

    Green - who?
    May - we got rid of her once already, no thanks
    Hunt - unacceptable to both types of Brexit ultra
    Cox - really? My daughters think he is some kind of comedy parody of a Tory
    Smith - Hmm, hadn't though of him. I know he made a decent fist of NI so must have some ability, but I have no idea who he is actually
    Brady - too smarmy
    Barclay - too anonymous, not a leader
    So, Wallace it is then?
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,137
    Jonathan said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Westminster Voting Intention:

    LAB: 53% (+1)
    CON: 19% (-1)

    Via @PeoplePolling, 12 Oct.
    Changes w/ 6 Oct.
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/10/13/just-nine-per-cent-have-favourable-view-liz-truss/


    SNP opposition leader. Nice.
    Tories could run with that: "Don't vote Labour, you'll end up with Sturgeon as Opposition Leader."

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    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,834
    ...
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    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,622
    Benpointer said:

    noneoftheabove said:

    rottenborough said:

    noneoftheabove said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I've never seen numbers like this before. It's mid-1990s territory

    Labour 53%
    Conservatives 19%

    @PeoplePolling Oct 12

    https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1580656789015891969

    Just missing a literally in there to go full colemanballs......
    He would have been about 14 when the Tory mid 1990s disaster happened.
    Regardless of age, how does he know its mid 90s territory if he has never seen numbers like it? I know I am too pedantic and literal but this kind of hyperbole makes my head explode over and over again.
    Literally makes your head explode?

    How many times?
    Almost as many as Truss mishaps each day.
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,419
    O/T

    "Russia 1985-1999: TraumaZone
    What it felt like to live through the collapse of communism and democracy. A series of films by Adam Curtis.
    7 Episodes Available"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episodes/p0d3hwl1/russia-19851999-traumazone
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,935
    rottenborough said:

    Jonathan said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Westminster Voting Intention:

    LAB: 53% (+1)
    CON: 19% (-1)

    Via @PeoplePolling, 12 Oct.
    Changes w/ 6 Oct.
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/10/13/just-nine-per-cent-have-favourable-view-liz-truss/


    SNP opposition leader. Nice.
    Tories could run with that: "Don't vote Labour, you'll end up with Sturgeon as Opposition Leader."

    To be honest the Labour left on Starmer's backbenches would be his main opposition given that big a Labour majority
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,299
    HYUFD said:

    Luckyguy1983 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    EXCL: Tory MPs discussing whether they can replace Liz Truss with increasing urgency

    Grandees think they can arrange a coronation *if* Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt agree to team up

    YouGov polling finds almost half of 2019 Tories want Truss ousted

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/eb045534-4b2e-11ed-8b55-aaf85c581598?shareToken=3130b41ff617eb0423ded1d66208e71c

    These 'grandees' think they're ending someone else's career, but it seems like they're ending their own to me.
    We are at the stage now where I think even Grant Shapps counts as a grandee!
    Two grandees if you count the toupee.
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    darkagedarkage Posts: 4,787
    TheValiant said:

    Meant to try and catch up on the British politics earlier on, but never got around to it till now. Too busy looking at accruals (interesting) and following the war in Ukraine.

    Anyway, Truss seems doomed, but equally there is no good way out for the party.
    If they try and get rid, even a coronation, its going to look awful and the members will rightly throw an absolute fit. They voted for Truss and they get..... Sunak? Mordaunt? Johnson! May!? Crazy. The party will be punished both by members ripping up their cards and leaving, and at the upcoming election which is now surely lost (though I'll always caveat it with 'events dear boy events').

    If they stick with Truss, its becoming more and more obvious that she isn't fit to be Prime Minister (some example of the Peter Principle here.... and maybe even more than that). She could lurch from crisis to crisis in the next two years before finally getting thrashed at the polls. But whether the country can cope with her for two years is another question.

    One thing I've not necessarily seen mentioned, is that, just like in the summer with Johnson's removal, the Leader of the Opposition has a role to play here.
    If I was Starmer, I'd call a Parliamentary VoNC. Force the Conservatives to back her.... or not.
    If the perceived wisdom is a GE is needed, then calling the VoNC will force backbenches to rally behind her. And Starmer can remind them of that at every opportunity.
    And if they don't.... then its a November GE.... one that Labour could win.

    But I'm not sure Starmer is up to this. He wasn't in the summer......

    If the conservative membership rip up their cards that can only be a good thing for the party. They need to get rid of the part of the membership who voted for Truss, and think it is a good idea that she remains PM.
  • Options
    solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,623
    HYUFD said:

    rottenborough said:

    Jonathan said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Westminster Voting Intention:

    LAB: 53% (+1)
    CON: 19% (-1)

    Via @PeoplePolling, 12 Oct.
    Changes w/ 6 Oct.
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/10/13/just-nine-per-cent-have-favourable-view-liz-truss/


    SNP opposition leader. Nice.
    Tories could run with that: "Don't vote Labour, you'll end up with Sturgeon as Opposition Leader."

    To be honest the Labour left on Starmer's backbenches would be his main opposition given that big a Labour majority
    Yes Labour would probably split and be able to form both government and official LOTO. Which would be funny.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,929
    Scott_xP said:

    Westminster Voting Intention:

    LAB: 53% (+1)
    CON: 19% (-1)

    Via @PeoplePolling, 12 Oct.
    Changes w/ 6 Oct.
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/10/13/just-nine-per-cent-have-favourable-view-liz-truss/


    4 Conservatives. Any idea who they are?
    And which two would be sent to the membership?
    It may need a penalty shootout.
  • Options
    EabhalEabhal Posts: 5,878
    Jonathan said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Westminster Voting Intention:

    LAB: 53% (+1)
    CON: 19% (-1)

    Via @PeoplePolling, 12 Oct.
    Changes w/ 6 Oct.
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/10/13/just-nine-per-cent-have-favourable-view-liz-truss/


    SNP opposition leader. Nice.
    Ian Blackford 6 questions. PMQs will take about 3 hours.
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,894
    RobD said:

    Luckyguy1983 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    EXCL: Tory MPs discussing whether they can replace Liz Truss with increasing urgency

    Grandees think they can arrange a coronation *if* Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt agree to team up

    YouGov polling finds almost half of 2019 Tories want Truss ousted

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/eb045534-4b2e-11ed-8b55-aaf85c581598?shareToken=3130b41ff617eb0423ded1d66208e71c

    These 'grandees' think they're ending someone else's career, but it seems like they're ending their own to me.
    That's more likely if she stays on than if she goes.
    The Tories are fully deserving of a Humiliating defeat no matter who they pick. I think the only one that might be able to salvage them to a respectable loss (220 seats tops) is Wallace.
  • Options
    RandallFlaggRandallFlagg Posts: 1,155
    Theuniondivvie said:

    Well, that's my pal Bruce gone; into the hospice at 1pm yesterday, on the morphine pretty much immediately, turned down the respirator gradually, took the mask away at 1am today, battled on till 4pm.

    Since The Times won't be doing an obit, I will.

    Pompey boy, uncle went down on the Hood, joined the RN at 16, qualified as an artificer, worked subsequently mainly as a helicopter mechanic for Bristows.

    Serial obsessive which included rock climbing, Nordic skiing, cycling, playing the flute, jazz, opera, birdwatching, life drawing, photography, neolithic stones.

    Abiding passions Wagner, Blake, art and dressing well.

    Complicated love life.

    And just to keep it real for PB, detested the Tories and all they stand for.

    Looks like he had a great hinterland. Sorry for your loss, TUD.
  • Options
    Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,281
    I think Liz's only option now is some kind of put-up-or-shut-up manoeuvre: say she'll resign if her critics can unite around a single chosen candidate, otherwise she will go on and on. What else is there to do?
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,299
    edited October 2022
    darkage said:

    TheValiant said:

    Meant to try and catch up on the British politics earlier on, but never got around to it till now. Too busy looking at accruals (interesting) and following the war in Ukraine.

    Anyway, Truss seems doomed, but equally there is no good way out for the party.
    If they try and get rid, even a coronation, its going to look awful and the members will rightly throw an absolute fit. They voted for Truss and they get..... Sunak? Mordaunt? Johnson! May!? Crazy. The party will be punished both by members ripping up their cards and leaving, and at the upcoming election which is now surely lost (though I'll always caveat it with 'events dear boy events').

    If they stick with Truss, its becoming more and more obvious that she isn't fit to be Prime Minister (some example of the Peter Principle here.... and maybe even more than that). She could lurch from crisis to crisis in the next two years before finally getting thrashed at the polls. But whether the country can cope with her for two years is another question.

    One thing I've not necessarily seen mentioned, is that, just like in the summer with Johnson's removal, the Leader of the Opposition has a role to play here.
    If I was Starmer, I'd call a Parliamentary VoNC. Force the Conservatives to back her.... or not.
    If the perceived wisdom is a GE is needed, then calling the VoNC will force backbenches to rally behind her. And Starmer can remind them of that at every opportunity.
    And if they don't.... then its a November GE.... one that Labour could win.

    But I'm not sure Starmer is up to this. He wasn't in the summer......

    If the conservative membership rip up their cards that can only be a good thing for the party. They need to get rid of the part of the membership who voted for Truss, and think it is a good idea that she remains PM.
    The Conservative membership IS the party.
  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,834
    🔴 Alterations to the mini-Budget could be announced within days, rather than waiting for the wider “medium-term fiscal plan” on October 31, it is understood

    🔓 This front page story is currently free to read 👇
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/10/13/kwasi-kwarteng-insists-not-going-anywhere-liz-truss-set-reverse/
  • Options
    ClippPClippP Posts: 1,676
    edited October 2022
    HYUFD said:

    rottenborough said:

    Jonathan said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Westminster Voting Intention:

    LAB: 53% (+1)
    CON: 19% (-1)

    Via @PeoplePolling, 12 Oct.
    Changes w/ 6 Oct.
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/10/13/just-nine-per-cent-have-favourable-view-liz-truss/


    SNP opposition leader. Nice.
    Tories could run with that: "Don't vote Labour, you'll end up with Sturgeon as Opposition Leader."
    To be honest the Labour left on Starmer's backbenches would be his main opposition given that big a Labour majority
    But he is not going to get that big a majority, young HY. The basis for that projection is the baxterisation of an opinion poll, which was taken just after a relatively successful Labour conference, the shambles of the Conservative one, and the cancellation of the Liberal Democrat one.

    In addition, you have to bear in mind that the Lib Dem effort is not going to be evenly distributed throughout the whole country. There are seats where the result will be much better for the Lib Dems than you think.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,137
    Total LOL.


    Neil Henderson
    @hendopolis
    ·
    3m
    TELEGRAPH: ⁦
    @KwasiKwarteng insists: I’m not going anywhere

    #TomorrowsPapersToday
  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,834
    Stark_Dawning said:

    I think Liz's only option now is some kind of put-up-or-shut-up manoeuvre: say she'll resign if her critics can unite around a single chosen candidate, otherwise she will go on and on. What else is there to do?

    the only thing she can do is sack her entire team
  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,834
    Times reporting that Mordaunt and Sunak could launch a joint ticket to replace Liz Truss.

    One Tory MP tells me “it seems quite sensible”, another questions the exact combo but tells me some sort of unity ticket is the only option.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/eb045534-4b2e-11ed-8b55-aaf85c581598?shareToken=5c148679c14899be060c29bc9ce8f199
  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,834
    Trussonomics is the spliff that Brexit smoked after a long session in the pub.

    Tories now having a market whitey, kneeling in front of the toilet, room spinning.

    https://twitter.com/rafaelbehr/status/1580669278558167041
  • Options
    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,572
    Pro_Rata said:

    FPT: my list, going through, of all even remotely credible unity candidates beyond Wallace:


    Green, May, Hunt, Cox, Julian Smith, Brady, Barclay.

    Wrong Smith.

    #Chloe4Leader
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,095
    Scott_xP said:

    Imagine the humiliation of a Liz Truss Downing St resignation speech in the coming weeks.

    “I’m proud of the achievements of my government. We had a very successful induction day. Our first tea run went smoothly. I personally scored 84% on the health & safety at work assessment.”

    https://twitter.com/KirstyStricklan/status/1580663857697415168

    "The world wasn't ready for me..."
  • Options
    RobDRobD Posts: 58,955
    MarqueeMark said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Imagine the humiliation of a Liz Truss Downing St resignation speech in the coming weeks.

    “I’m proud of the achievements of my government. We had a very successful induction day. Our first tea run went smoothly. I personally scored 84% on the health & safety at work assessment.”

    https://twitter.com/KirstyStricklan/status/1580663857697415168

    "The world wasn't ready for me..."
    She's utterly dreadful. How anyone in their right mind thought she'd be a good PM is beyond me.
  • Options
    EabhalEabhal Posts: 5,878
    A
    Scott_xP said:

    🔴 Alterations to the mini-Budget could be announced within days, rather than waiting for the wider “medium-term fiscal plan” on October 31, it is understood

    🔓 This front page story is currently free to read 👇
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/10/13/kwasi-kwarteng-insists-not-going-anywhere-liz-truss-set-reverse/

    I feel for everyone at the OBR.
  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,834
    🔺 EXCLUSIVE: Senior Conservatives are holding talks about replacing Liz Truss with a joint ticket of Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt as part of a “coronation” by MPs https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/tories-plot-to-replace-truss-with-rishi-sunak-and-penny-mordaunt-wjdfwzzvk

    You lost, get over it. You can’t just vote again if you don’t like the first result.

    https://twitter.com/Herring1967/status/1580670067184144385
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,543
    dixiedean said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Westminster Voting Intention:

    LAB: 53% (+1)
    CON: 19% (-1)

    Via @PeoplePolling, 12 Oct.
    Changes w/ 6 Oct.
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/10/13/just-nine-per-cent-have-favourable-view-liz-truss/


    4 Conservatives. Any idea who they are?
    And which two would be sent to the membership?
    It may need a penalty shootout.
    Only a small taxi required.
  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,834
    "He doesn't want to be kneecapped"

    Analysis for @skynews @ 10 https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1580670199090581505/video/1
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,543
    Stark_Dawning said:

    I think Liz's only option now is some kind of put-up-or-shut-up manoeuvre: say she'll resign if her critics can unite around a single chosen candidate, otherwise she will go on and on. What else is there to do?

    Better than resign, she could threaten to call a GE.
  • Options
    RobDRobD Posts: 58,955
    edited October 2022
    Scott_xP said:

    🔺 EXCLUSIVE: Senior Conservatives are holding talks about replacing Liz Truss with a joint ticket of Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt as part of a “coronation” by MPs https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/tories-plot-to-replace-truss-with-rishi-sunak-and-penny-mordaunt-wjdfwzzvk

    You lost, get over it. You can’t just vote again if you don’t like the first result.

    https://twitter.com/Herring1967/status/1580670067184144385

    Truss as PM was implemented. No-one said anything about the duration of her tenure.
  • Options
    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,572
    Foxy said:

    The North Evington (Leicester) by-election tonight is an interesting one. The area is heavily Asian, a mixture of Muslims, Hindus and Sikhs in that order. The Labour candidate is a supporter of Modi and RSS, with the Tory candidate a close second last time.

    It wouldn't surprise me if the Tory gain here. There are some strange politics in the area at the moment. This area was one of the centres of the recent communal violence.


    Anyone voicing support for a Fascist like Modi should be thrown out of the Labour Party. Certainly not standing as a candidate.
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,543
    Luckyguy1983 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Luckyguy1983 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    EXCL: Tory MPs discussing whether they can replace Liz Truss with increasing urgency

    Grandees think they can arrange a coronation *if* Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt agree to team up

    YouGov polling finds almost half of 2019 Tories want Truss ousted

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/eb045534-4b2e-11ed-8b55-aaf85c581598?shareToken=3130b41ff617eb0423ded1d66208e71c

    These 'grandees' think they're ending someone else's career, but it seems like they're ending their own to me.
    We are at the stage now where I think even Grant Shapps counts as a grandee!
    Two grandees if you count the toupee.
    A Tory and a Whig?
  • Options
    solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,623
    Eabhal said:

    A

    Scott_xP said:

    🔴 Alterations to the mini-Budget could be announced within days, rather than waiting for the wider “medium-term fiscal plan” on October 31, it is understood

    🔓 This front page story is currently free to read 👇
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/10/13/kwasi-kwarteng-insists-not-going-anywhere-liz-truss-set-reverse/

    I feel for everyone at the OBR.
    It's ok, the Government are going to rely on Mystic Meg instead.
  • Options
    WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 8,503
    edited October 2022
    Rishi and Penny would certainly be the opposite of the current incumbent.
    The charm team, with added TV-friendliness and likeability.

  • Options
    darkagedarkage Posts: 4,787
    Luckyguy1983 said:

    darkage said:

    TheValiant said:

    Meant to try and catch up on the British politics earlier on, but never got around to it till now. Too busy looking at accruals (interesting) and following the war in Ukraine.

    Anyway, Truss seems doomed, but equally there is no good way out for the party.
    If they try and get rid, even a coronation, its going to look awful and the members will rightly throw an absolute fit. They voted for Truss and they get..... Sunak? Mordaunt? Johnson! May!? Crazy. The party will be punished both by members ripping up their cards and leaving, and at the upcoming election which is now surely lost (though I'll always caveat it with 'events dear boy events').

    If they stick with Truss, its becoming more and more obvious that she isn't fit to be Prime Minister (some example of the Peter Principle here.... and maybe even more than that). She could lurch from crisis to crisis in the next two years before finally getting thrashed at the polls. But whether the country can cope with her for two years is another question.

    One thing I've not necessarily seen mentioned, is that, just like in the summer with Johnson's removal, the Leader of the Opposition has a role to play here.
    If I was Starmer, I'd call a Parliamentary VoNC. Force the Conservatives to back her.... or not.
    If the perceived wisdom is a GE is needed, then calling the VoNC will force backbenches to rally behind her. And Starmer can remind them of that at every opportunity.
    And if they don't.... then its a November GE.... one that Labour could win.

    But I'm not sure Starmer is up to this. He wasn't in the summer......

    If the conservative membership rip up their cards that can only be a good thing for the party. They need to get rid of the part of the membership who voted for Truss, and think it is a good idea that she remains PM.
    The Conservative membership IS the party.
    Yes they are part of the party.
    In the end though, the activists, MPs and donors are more important.
  • Options
    pingping Posts: 3,731
    edited October 2022
    The focus will now, gradually, shift to Labour and Starmer.

    I think they’re up to it. And I think there’s enough buy-in to Starmers competent centrist managerialism that even the Speccie, the Mail and the express will fall into line, or at least be ambivalent.

    Perhaps not? They might take on their readers. They may go super-low and double down on the saville smears and whatever other dirt they can use.

    I don’t think so, though. I think Labour have this in the bag.

    We’ll see.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,137
    Benpointer said:

    Stark_Dawning said:

    I think Liz's only option now is some kind of put-up-or-shut-up manoeuvre: say she'll resign if her critics can unite around a single chosen candidate, otherwise she will go on and on. What else is there to do?

    Better than resign, she could threaten to call a GE.
    Good idea. Let's just get on with it.

  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,834
    Power cuts this winter could cause mobile phone networks to fail. The UK’s telecoms infrastructure depends on the National Grid & not all of it has back up power. Here’s our piece for ⁦@TimesBusiness⁩

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/ff4fb2ce-4b0e-11ed-8b55-aaf85c581598?shareToken=0551be613a8e3d533e047576833e9435
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,137
    RobD said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Imagine the humiliation of a Liz Truss Downing St resignation speech in the coming weeks.

    “I’m proud of the achievements of my government. We had a very successful induction day. Our first tea run went smoothly. I personally scored 84% on the health & safety at work assessment.”

    https://twitter.com/KirstyStricklan/status/1580663857697415168

    "The world wasn't ready for me..."
    She's utterly dreadful. How anyone in their right mind thought she'd be a good PM is beyond me.
    It was all there in the first debate.

  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,834
    ...
  • Options
    FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,044
    edited October 2022
    I've just forked out £3200 for a new boiler. I was surprised to learn that replacing an old boiler might cut your energy use by a third as new boilers are around 92% efficient. The £3200 does of course include the additional 20% VAT. Might it not have made some sense for the government to remove VAT on new home boilers? Or even to reduce it? It might this have cost less than the energy subsidy?
  • Options
    darkagedarkage Posts: 4,787
    Is there any polling of the Conservative membership on how well they think Truss is doing?
  • Options
    RobDRobD Posts: 58,955
    Scott_xP said:

    ...

    Oh to have been a fly on the wall during that meeting.
  • Options
    DJ41DJ41 Posts: 792
    edited October 2022
    Latest from D Cummings, in a piece entitled "Hundreds of Auschwitz's [sic] in a hour":

    "It’s roughly 100% irrelevant to UK/US interests whether eastern UKR is controlled by the Putin-oligarchs-KGB-mafia or the Zelensky-oligarchs-KGB-mafia.

    ‘International law and the rules based order’? You mean the ‘rules based order’ that applied to us invading Iraq?

    ‘Humanitarian concern’? You mean the ‘concern’ we showed when millions got slaughtered in the middle of Africa, and we sat on our asses watching TV?

    ‘His tanks will keep going across Europe’? You mean the army that has failed so badly in Ukraine is going to defeat the whole of Europe and America using conventional weapons?

    (...)

    Every Deep State person I ask says the same thing: there is no fucking plan, the idiots in No10 just keep saying Putin must fail, Truss wants us to recapture Crimea starting World War III, the MoD has got even shitter than ever in 2022.

    (...)

    But now Professors at Oxbridge and Harvard are happy to tweet gloatingly drone footage of Russian ‘orcs’ being blown to pieces, resembling the 4chan Nazi teens they’re normally so down on. Before the war, Congress defined Azov as a neo-Nazi organisation and banned funds going to it — now our 4chan Profs retweet their propaganda while we shovel zillions to them and rebrand them as … anti-Putin so … anti-Nazi!

    People who suggest that threatening hundreds of Auschwitz’s in an hour is justified only by the most existential of interests are denounced as KGB agents and insufficiently full of hate for the enemy, sometimes by the same crowd who called me ‘mad’ for saying Putin may have blown up the Moscow flats himself to justify the Chechnya war.

    (...)

    I’ve been called mad for 20 years. My warnings, year after year, that our Idiocracy could blunder into pandemics and nuclear escalation was seen as so mad it wasn’t worth arguing with. I didn’t expect that the evidence finally convincing elite media and academia that I’m insane and/or a Putin-agent, would be my suggestion that JFK’s handling of the Cuban missile crisis (including rejecting military advice to escalate and bomb) is highly relevant to avoiding hundreds of Auschwitz’s, and that I would finally be seen as ‘beyond the pale’ for saying things like ‘welcome Russians fleeing Putin, don’t ban them from sports and arts, aren’t we supposed to oppose inflicting punishments on ethnic/national groups simply for belonging to such a group?’.    "

    A problem is that DC seems to think the reason the current line is being taken is the idiocy of those who parrot it. It's not, though. They'll parrot whatever they're told. But 1-2 quibbles aside, all minor, he is right on the essential. And it's good to see that someone else remembers the Moscow flat bombs of 1999, which considerably assisted with Putin's ascendance to the presidency. ISTR Blair told Putin hey we know you understand our 911 pain because it's just like yours after those bombs. Funny how nobody ever called him a Putin stooge...
  • Options
    MortimerMortimer Posts: 13,936
    edited October 2022
    ping said:

    The focus will now, gradually shift to Labour and Starmer.

    I think they’re up to it. And I think there’s enough buy-in to Starmers competent centrist managerialism that even the Speccie, the Mail and the express will fall into line, or at least be ambivalent.

    Perhaps not? They might take on their readers. They may go super-low and double down on the saville smears and whatever other dirt they can use.

    I don’t think so, though. I think Labour have this in the bag. We’ll see.

    What I still find utterly bizarre is that the consumer economy seems absolutely booming. I'm struggling to get hotel, restaurant bookings, concert tix etc.

    The media-bond-market complex are trying to stop economic change of tack. I'm not sure the country is in as parlous a state as some like to paint it as.

  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,834
    ...
  • Options
    EabhalEabhal Posts: 5,878
    Scott_xP said:

    Power cuts this winter could cause mobile phone networks to fail. The UK’s telecoms infrastructure depends on the National Grid & not all of it has back up power. Here’s our piece for ⁦@TimesBusiness⁩

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/ff4fb2ce-4b0e-11ed-8b55-aaf85c581598?shareToken=0551be613a8e3d533e047576833e9435

    Dear oh dear
  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,834
    To follow up on @hzeffman, have also picked up notion circulating that a Tory grandee cld convene meeting to put forward a leader agreed on by MPs, backed up by a unity cabinet of different wings of party. How you get there? 🤯 And whether it can work… but these live discussions

    https://twitter.com/BethRigby/status/1580673263662833664
    https://twitter.com/hzeffman/status/1580663980984762368
  • Options
    SirNorfolkPassmoreSirNorfolkPassmore Posts: 6,247
    darkage said:

    Is there any polling of the Conservative membership on how well they think Truss is doing?

    Honestly, who gives a sh1t how Tory members think Truss is doing?

    A tiny group of appalling people who shouldn't have been allowed within 1000 miles of the decision, and won't again.
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    RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 27,152
    Lets assume the government does fall and the Tories appoint yet another ringer. Who from the current cabinet can expect to retain a seat around that table...?
  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,834
    RochdalePioneers said:

    Lets assume the government does fall and the Tories appoint yet another ringer. Who from the current cabinet can expect to retain a seat around that table...?

    Wallace
  • Options
    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,788
    Theuniondivvie said:

    Well, that's my pal Bruce gone; into the hospice at 1pm yesterday, on the morphine pretty much immediately, turned down the respirator gradually, took the mask away at 1am today, battled on till 4pm.

    Since The Times won't be doing an obit, I will.

    Pompey boy, uncle went down on the Hood, joined the RN at 16, qualified as an artificer, worked subsequently mainly as a helicopter mechanic for Bristows.

    Serial obsessive which included rock climbing, Nordic skiing, cycling, playing the flute, jazz, opera, birdwatching, life drawing, photography, neolithic stones.

    Abiding passions Wagner, Blake, art and dressing well.

    Complicated love life.

    And just to keep it real for PB, detested the Tories and all they stand for.

    Very sorry to hear that. RIP to Bruce.
  • Options
    darkagedarkage Posts: 4,787
    DJ41 said:

    Latest from D Cummings, in a piece entitled "Hundreds of Auschwitz's [sic] in a hour":

    "It’s roughly 100% irrelevant to UK/US interests whether eastern UKR is controlled by the Putin-oligarchs-KGB-mafia or the Zelensky-oligarchs-KGB-mafia.

    ‘International law and the rules based order’? You mean the ‘rules based order’ that applied to us invading Iraq?

    ‘Humanitarian concern’? You mean the ‘concern’ we showed when millions got slaughtered in the middle of Africa, and we sat on our asses watching TV?

    ‘His tanks will keep going across Europe’? You mean the army that has failed so badly in Ukraine is going to defeat the whole of Europe and America using conventional weapons?

    (...)

    Every Deep State person I ask says the same thing: there is no fucking plan, the idiots in No10 just keep saying Putin must fail, Truss wants us to recapture Crimea starting World War III, the MoD has got even shitter than ever in 2022.

    (...)

    But now Professors at Oxbridge and Harvard are happy to tweet gloatingly drone footage of Russian ‘orcs’ being blown to pieces, resembling the 4chan Nazi teens they’re normally so down on. Before the war, Congress defined Azov as a neo-Nazi organisation and banned funds going to it — now our 4chan Profs retweet their propaganda while we shovel zillions to them and rebrand them as … anti-Putin so … anti-Nazi!

    People who suggest that threatening hundreds of Auschwitz’s in an hour is justified only by the most existential of interests are denounced as KGB agents and insufficiently full of hate for the enemy, sometimes by the same crowd who called me ‘mad’ for saying Putin may have blown up the Moscow flats himself to justify the Chechnya war.

    (...)

    I’ve been called mad for 20 years. My warnings, year after year, that our Idiocracy could blunder into pandemics and nuclear escalation was seen as so mad it wasn’t worth arguing with. I didn’t expect that the evidence finally convincing elite media and academia that I’m insane and/or a Putin-agent, would be my suggestion that JFK’s handling of the Cuban missile crisis (including rejecting military advice to escalate and bomb) is highly relevant to avoiding hundreds of Auschwitz’s, and that I would finally be seen as ‘beyond the pale’ for saying things like ‘welcome Russians fleeing Putin, don’t ban them from sports and arts, aren’t we supposed to oppose inflicting punishments on ethnic/national groups simply for belonging to such a group?’.    "

    A problem with this is that DC seems to think the reason the current line is being taken is the idiocy of those who parrot it. It's not, though. But one or two quibbles aside, all minor, he is right on the essential. And it's good to see that someone else remembers the Moscow flat bombs of 1999, which considerably assisted with Putin's ascendancy to the presidency. ISTR Blair told Putin hey we know you understand our 911 pain because it's just like yours after those bombs. Funny how nobody ever called him a Putin stooge...

    I thought this comment from Dom on the 'idiocracy' was very good:

    ... what does our Idiocracy do, other than hope that he’s shot and replaced by a Russian version of AOC who applies for EU membership and leads LGBTQ++ marches through Red Square with Zelensky live tweeting, finally resolving the long debate about whether ‘Russia is a European country’…? Assume he gets shot. What do we do if the person who shoots him is no AOC lookalike but a Kadyrov lookalike who says ‘Putin f**ked up by not solving this in 2014, he was too weak, I will solve it’?
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