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Is the Daily Mail turning on Truss? – politicalbetting.com

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  • eek said:

    Shared 2 Nobel prizes for chemistry and joins a select group

    Bardeen 2x physics; Sanger 2x chemistry; Curie physics + chem; Pauling chem + peace

    I would still love to understand what he won them for...
    Give it an hour or so for the Wikipedia writers to
    eek said:

    Shared 2 Nobel prizes for chemistry and joins a select group

    Bardeen 2x physics; Sanger 2x chemistry; Curie physics + chem; Pauling chem + peace

    I would still love to understand what he won them for...
    You need the press release (and soon Wikipedia!)
    https://www.nobelprize.org/prizes/chemistry/2022/press-release/
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Fuckity fuck, this is a pitch to the conference for the party leadership.
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 7,219
    “I want what you want.”

    A Labour government?
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Give it an hour or so for the Wikipedia writers to You need the press release (and soon Wikipedia!)
    https://www.nobelprize.org/prizes/chemistry/2022/press-release/
    So, who and who have won both an Oscar and a Nobel?
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 44,617
    Scott_xP said:

    Liz Truss: “I want what you want”

    a general election?

    A snooze after lunch and index-linked pension increase?
  • That was a good story about being presented with a junior air hostess badge while her brothers were given junior pilot badges.

    Regardless of left or right politics, one thing I hope we can all agree that has really improved for the better in the past decades is how young girls aren't treated that way anymore.
  • El_CapitanoEl_Capitano Posts: 4,241

    “I want what you want.”

    A Labour government?

    A stiff drink?
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 44,617
    IshmaelZ said:

    So, who and who have won both an Oscar and a Nobel?
    Ernest Hemingway?
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,795
    She can't keep dining out on the energy stuff.
  • Green peace demonstration
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,137
    “I know how it feels to have your potential dismissed by people who think they know better,” says Liz Truss…just a thought but what if they did know better?
    https://twitter.com/tompeck/status/1577603392972771329
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,795
    heckles!!!!
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,841
    Lol
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,277
    Who votes for this ! Exactly .

    I don’t support interrupting her speech but they have a point .
  • El_CapitanoEl_Capitano Posts: 4,241
    "I knew that inaction would have been unconscionable"

    She hasn't exactly got the best speech-writers for this, has she?
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,795
    That will have helped Truss more than harmed her.
  • nico679 said:

    Who votes for this ! Exactly .

    I don’t support interrupting her speech but they have a point .

    Not the best move by Green peace
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 64,709

    Green peace demonstration

    Is it really Greenpeace?

    Or two tory activists put up to it in order to bring the crowd onto losing Liz's side?

    I am a cycnic.
  • Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 8,192
    Let's get them removed...."

    Probably the most memorable part of the speech
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    That was a good story about being presented with a junior air hostess badge while her brothers were given junior pilot badges.

    Regardless of left or right politics, one thing I hope we can all agree that has really improved for the better in the past decades is how young girls aren't treated that way anymore.

    It is an oldie e.g. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11020931/How-Liz-Truss-set-path-challenge-Prime-Minister.html

    And it's where she got the idea that success would come from presenting herself with a junior Margaret Thatcher badge, so don't knock it.
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,771
    Their disguise as young Tories was immaculate.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 44,617

    Is it really Greenpeace?

    Or two tory activists put up to it in order to bring the crowd onto losing Liz's side?

    I am a cycnic.
    Given the security, you have a good point.
  • Is it really Greenpeace?

    Or two tory activists put up to it in order to bring the crowd onto losing Liz's side?

    I am a cycnic.
    Indeed you are but it will not harm Truss
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,277

    Not the best move by Green peace
    The slogan though is quite apt though .
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Fuck it love you've already got the gig.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 64,709
    John Rentoul
    @JohnRentoul
    ·
    41m
    Braverman becomes the new darling of the Tory grassroots –
    @AndrewGimson

    ====

    Tory Opposition leader for the first few years of their decade out of office?
  • ChelyabinskChelyabinsk Posts: 509
    edited October 2022

    then they started shouting and singing about "Fenians". Sectarian scum! It's hard to imagine an identity solely based on hating a certain perceived group of outsiders, but here...this is what you have.

    How would you have felt if they'd sung Flower of Scotland?
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 7,219
    To be fair she dealt with the interruption quite well. I thought that might cause a malfunction
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,841

    Is it really Greenpeace?

    Or two tory activists put up to it in order to bring the crowd onto losing Liz's side?

    I am a cycnic.
    Hello Leon?

    Way too risky. The press will be after their backgrounds as we speak.
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,398
    This is all very reminiscent of Theresa May, 2017-2019
  • AlistairMAlistairM Posts: 2,005
    edited October 2022

    It’s just stunning how entirely expected this was.

    I remember watching a Tory leadership debate on ITV and seeing the unique appeal of each candidate.

    Sunak - was Chancellor, spoke well, talked cautiously about not doing Truss’s economics etc
    Badenoch - would appeal to the right, was young, but would also potentially allow the Tories to attract new voters (who knows how true this is, but at least it was something)
    Tudgenhat - the kind of ‘sensible’ guy that might win back some Tories that would go to the Lib Dems. Moderation on Brexit could have been good to shore up their vote. Though uninspiring, I don’t think you get a sub 200 seat tally in 2024 with someone like him.
    Mordaunt - a much better speaker than Truss, military background, etc.

    All of them, in their own way, seemed to have something that Truss didn’t. Liz Truss winning almost didn’t make any sense, apart from her appeal to the Press and the Membership. She was, arguably, the worst placed of the 5 to actually win an election. I dare say she was who Starmer hoped would win.

    Truss would have lost with the members to Kemi or Penny. The MPs are the ones who made the mistake by putting Truss to the membership. The same mistake Labour MPs made in 2015 by putting Corbyn to the membership.
  • Libertarianism is about personal responsibility and people choosing to freely do as they choose, which of course includes the right to free assembly and therefore to join unions etc if they choose to do so - rather than being forced either that they must, or must not join one.

    People freely choosing to join a union is perfectly compatible with a free market. If the state starts banning people from joining unions, then that is a state action which is illiberal, not libertarian.
    An employer and a union voluntarily agree a closed-shop arrangement. Sorted. Liberty!

    A competitor employer who says he won't sign such an agreement can start advertising vacancies. Utopia!
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,773
    A Conservative government who want to reduce the deficit are spending more subsidising the use of energy than any other country in Europe.

    Err...clap?
  • Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 8,192

    She can't keep dining out on the energy stuff.

    It is all she has
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,795
    darkage said:

    This is all very reminiscent of Theresa May, 2017-2019

    May was a titan compared with Truss.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,841
    If we don’t get growth….
  • Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 8,192
    Her "Pie growth" analogy does not seem to get that poverty is relative.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 64,709
    Is she teaching an infants reception class?

    That's the tone coming across to me. It's like ploddy, dull, mindless dumbed down garbage.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,310
    Betting Post

    Football: some more wibbling tips here:
    https://enormo-haddock.blogspot.com/2022/10/epl-serie-la-liga-thoughts-5-october.html

    Backed Arsenal to beat Liverpool at 2.64, and Bournemouth to beat Leicester at 3.65 (both home matches).
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Lloyd George and MacDonald also attended non-selective state schools, before they were called comprehensives

    https://twitter.com/JohnRentoul/status/1577605243461726208
  • eek said:

    The USA ain't the UK...
    No it isn't, but the same can happen in the UK too.

    Miliband (first leader in Opposition) was more reasonable than Corbyn (second), yet Corbyn got more MPs than Miliband did and came close to getting in like Trump did.

    Hague (first) was more reasonable than IDS (second).

    In one way it probably doesn't matter who the Tories choose after they lose the election, since Labour winning a second term would be pretty nailed on no matter what I expect.
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 7,219
    Growth.

  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,908
    I mean she's a massive whopper but I quite like Liz Truss, I have to admit.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 44,617
    edited October 2022

    Off-topic: I was in a motorway service station yesterday in northern England and there were lots of raucous Rangers fans. Youngsters being cheerful before a football game, I thought. Good luck to them, I thought. And then they started shouting and singing about "Fenians". Sectarian scum! It's hard to imagine an identity solely based on hating a certain perceived group of outsiders, but here...this is what you have.

    ...
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 23,153
    edited October 2022

    Her "Pie growth" analogy does not seem to get that poverty is relative.

    True poverty is absolute.

    Inequality is relative.
  • DriverDriver Posts: 5,559

    Of course you do, just not directly, but everything's connected.

    If eg your a customer on a train then you could end up paying more in train fees, in order to allow the train firm to pay their staff more, which allows the dispute to be resolved. Or you could choose to take your business elsewhere, drive instead of getting the train, which means that the train firm has less revenue and may need to make redundancies instead.

    Everything is connected. If you don't want to be a party to a dispute, don't get involved. Don't use that business or service, if you do, then you're a party whether you want to be or not.
    Yes, don't go to work - genius solution!
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 64,709

    Her "Pie growth" analogy does not seem to get that poverty is relative.

    Tories have never ever liked the "poverty is relative" argument/approach/reality.

  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 44,617
    edited October 2022
    IshmaelZ said:

    Lloyd George and MacDonald also attended non-selective state schools, before they were called comprehensives

    https://twitter.com/JohnRentoul/status/1577605243461726208

    Ramsay Mac? Wasn't he at Free Kirk and then Kirk of Scotland schools?
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Growth.

    See doctor.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,277
    The most memorable part of the speech was the Greenpeace demonstration.

    Because the slogan fits perfectly with what many people are thinking .
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 14,170
    mwadams said:

    Their disguise as young Tories was immaculate.

    Depressingly non-violent.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,841
    Lol @ “sound money”
  • Driver said:

    Yes, don't go to work - genius solution!
    Who said don't go to work?

    Go to work, but don't rely upon the services of those who are on strike to do so. If you normally get a train then drive instead and so on. If you can't, then be prepared to pay more to the staff since you must value them so highly that you're so dependant upon them.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 64,709

    She's talking about poverty and "low growth" in Paisley and Leeds when she grew up there "in the 80s and 90s".

    Which party was in power then?

    How many boarded up shops were there in leafy Roundhay, Leeds?
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,795
    lol fiscal responsibility hahah
  • Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 8,192
    I have all the platitudes I can stand for one morning. I have switched her off.
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 10,022
    Were there seats available in the hall?
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Carnyx said:

    Ramsay Mac? Wasn't he at Free Kirk and then Kirk of Scotland schools?
    It says here

    Ramsay MacDonald received an elementary education at the Free Church of Scotland school in Lossiemouth from 1872 to 1875, and then at Drainie parish school. He left school at the end of the summer term in 1881, at the age of 15, and began work on a nearby farm. In December 1881, he was appointed a pupil teacher at Drainie parish school.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Carnyx said:

    Ernest Hemingway?
    Bob Dylan, GB Shaw.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 58,970
    DougSeal said:

    Really? Are you sure you mentioned it?
    Ah. A jokelet? Hmm
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,642
    Who was the only Nobel Prize Winner to play first class cricket? (pretty easy this one)
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    I have all the platitudes I can stand for one morning. I have switched her off.

    A great big nothingburger.
  • Is she teaching an infants reception class?

    That's the tone coming across to me. It's like ploddy, dull, mindless dumbed down garbage.

    LizT still has what I have previously called a French delivery. Like the French, she often speaks in short phrases with the emphasis on the last syllable, and then a short pause. Since she is not French, it might be an artefact of the way the autocue text is formatted, or a 60-a-day smoking habit.
  • DriverDriver Posts: 5,559
    edited October 2022
    DougSeal said:

    "They" don't choose to strike. Their members, ordinary decent working people, who themselves are the victims of vindictive employers, choose to strike. The unions are merely the vehicles through which their members lodge their protests. The companies who force them to strike should be paying. Where do you think the unions would find the money to pay these claims? Through their already downtrodden members, who you seem to think lower than the people they normally serve without complaint, for some reason.
    The companies don't "force" them to strike. They choose to strike.

    And if you're claiming a train driveron £50k+ is "downtrodden", you've got a lot of convincing to do.
  • eekeek Posts: 29,399
    https://twitter.com/robfordmancs/status/1577606862173790209

    The case for low taxes Truss is making in this speech is almost identical to the case put to voters in each year’s British Social Attitudes surveys. In last year’s survey they rejected this argument by the largest margins in a generation:

    https://bsa.natcen.ac.uk/media/39481/bsa39_taxation-welfare-and-inequality.pdf
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 10,022
    DougSeal said:

    Who was the only Nobel Prize Winner to play first class cricket? (pretty easy this one)

    Samuel Beckett?
  • DougSeal said:

    Who was the only Nobel Prize Winner to play first class cricket? (pretty easy this one)

    Samuel Beckett.
  • Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 8,192

    Is she teaching an infants reception class?

    That's the tone coming across to me. It's like ploddy, dull, mindless dumbed down garbage.

    She has no passion. She is just reading the script, it is not being used to prompt her to give her vision and allow her a bit of latitude in the delivery. When Thatcher or Blair got going you could tell there was energy there, often some (low grade political) humour and you had a sense that they believed in what they were saying.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 44,617
    IshmaelZ said:

    It says here

    Ramsay MacDonald received an elementary education at the Free Church of Scotland school in Lossiemouth from 1872 to 1875, and then at Drainie parish school. He left school at the end of the summer term in 1881, at the age of 15, and began work on a nearby farm. In December 1881, he was appointed a pupil teacher at Drainie parish school.
    On cxhecking the parish school was probably funded by the state anyway (bit like an English free school) by that time, so it counts.

    Gordon Brown was also at Kirkcaldy High School.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,277
    We have your back ! Pass the sickbag .
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,771
    DougSeal said:

    Who was the only Nobel Prize Winner to play first class cricket? (pretty easy this one)

    Am I correct in thinking that the Nobel Prize in question was Literature?
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,795
    This is turgid stuff. Just meaningless, 'growth' 'we've got your back' bleh

    No meat, no policy, nothing of substance.
  • Driver said:

    The companies don't "force" them to strike. They choose to strike.
    And their workers don't "force" you to use their services either, you choose to do so.

    They need to take responsibility for their decisions, you need to take responsibility for yours. That is a liberal free market.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,773
    Lordy, they are still doing that change the name stuff on EU legislation. Surely we have far more priorities than that sort of nonsense.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,841
    One hostage to fortune after another…
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 7,219
    Gee Liz is going to help me get a good mobile phone signal.

    Is there no limit to her ambition?
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,795
    How are they paying for anything???
  • Gee Liz is going to help me get a good mobile phone signal.

    Is there no limit to her ambition?

    A policy for @CorrectHorseBattery ?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 64,709

    Growth.

    Where?
  • El_CapitanoEl_Capitano Posts: 4,241

    Gee Liz is going to help me get a good mobile phone signal.

    Is there no limit to her ambition?

    It's all a bit Cones Hotline, isn't it?
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 7,219
    I don’t think she’s talking about growth enough, personally.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    IanB2 said:

    One hostage to fortune after another…

    Palmed off on others, T Coffey hung out to dry there
  • DriverDriver Posts: 5,559
    DougSeal said:

    No, its their employees, who the managers force into this position.

    How does an individual whose only marketable skill is, say, laying railway tracks express his opposition to the actions of management save through striking? Move to to a rival provider to Network Rail? Ditto nurses and firemen. Should they just find another job?
    There's no "force" about it. Striking is a pure choice by the workers/unions.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,642
    Driver said:

    The companies don't "force" them to strike. They choose to strike.
    Sometimes workers have no choice. They suffer from strikes too - they don't get paid for the days they're om strike. You don't wake up in the morning and go "oh, I fancy a day off"
  • Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 5,507
    Starmer - veritable buckets of charisma.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 64,709
    Speaking to the public as if they are five years old is an approach I suppose.

  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 44,617

    How would you have felt if they'd sung Flower of Scotland?
    Instantly identified them as Edinburgh rugger buggers.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,841
    She will end this speech with a good reason to sack almost every one of her colleagues for failure, down the line
  • eekeek Posts: 29,399
    DavidL said:

    Lordy, they are still doing that change the name stuff on EU legislation. Surely we have far more priorities than that sort of nonsense.

    as @NickPalmer pointed out yesterday - the desire to remove all EU law from the statute book is going to consume the whole of the next Parliament and that's if it's waved through...
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Driver said:

    There's no "force" about it. Striking is a pure choice by the workers/unions.
    You think it is entirely arbitrary? You do realise there is a downside to striking?
  • Driver said:

    There's no "force" about it. Striking is a pure choice by the workers/unions.
    So is choosing to use their service.

    In a free society everyone is free to make their own choices. If you want to use other people's labour, even when they don't want to provide it, then there's a word for that.

    Why should you get to choose to use their service, or not, but they don't get to choose whether to offer it, or not?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 64,709

    Gee Liz is going to help me get a good mobile phone signal.

    Is there no limit to her ambition?

    I'd rather she concentrated on that than working on wrecking my pension pot which seems to be what she has been mainly working on.
  • eekeek Posts: 29,399

    It's all a bit Cones Hotline, isn't it?
    The cones hotline had a vague purpose and dealt with an annoyance people had...
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 64,709
    Defence to get the 3%.

    Keep those printing presses going BoE.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 44,617
    Re Ms T's schooling, those folk were not impressed with her comments last summer - and they were there with her

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/jul/18/liz-truss-roundhay-school-foreign-secretary-education
  • El_CapitanoEl_Capitano Posts: 4,241
    "Our tough Foreign and Defence Secretaries are updating the integrated review"

    Putin is literally watching this thinking "Oh shit! Not the integrated review!"
  • AlistairMAlistairM Posts: 2,005
    This speech reminds me of IDS in 2003. Cheered to the rafters and then got rid of straight afterwards.
This discussion has been closed.