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A “baldie” to succeed Boris as CON leader – previous ones haven’t done well – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 12,602
edited April 2022 in General
imageA “baldie” to succeed Boris as CON leader – previous ones haven’t done well – politicalbetting.com

Having been bald myself since my mid-thirties I’ve always been conscious of suggestions that it could be a limiting factor in a political career.

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  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 56,006
    I do recall many discussions about 2 bald men arguing over a comb in times past, that is true.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 56,006
    Wallace strikes me as a decent sort. Sensible rather than bright, goodish instincts and pragmatic. Definitely one of the better performers in this very ordinary cabinet. Whether he quite has the star dust for the top post, however, I am not so sure.

    But in politics, like those being chased by the bear, you don't need to be good or fast, just better or faster than the others.
  • CorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorseBattery Posts: 21,436
    I'd have Wallace. So he won't win of course.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Interesting how Scotch politics and regiments take in English Tories and set them on a trajectory to the very top South of the Border. You can sense the pride the likes of @Theuniondivvie must derive from this.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 44,158
    Beware what happened the last time a Jock Guard took charge of the Cons.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 11,811
    Wallace does look a possible.

    It's been interesting to see the differing views of Wallace, Tugendhat, and Ellwood during this war. Of the three I think I prefer Tugendhat's views (a bit more spending, although that is of course tricky in the current climate). Ellwood's advocay of a NFZ seems dangeous to me.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 30,349
    Key point in header is this.
    Tory leader won't be facing Blair.
    Worse luck.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 32,035
    edited March 2022
    Beefing up the armed forces is very much on trend, as the cool kids say, but didn't Wallace sign off on the last round of Tory cuts that would have knocked another 10,000 soldiers off the parade ground?
    https://www.itv.com/news/2021-03-22/army-will-be-cut-to-72500-troops-by-2025-defence-secretary-says
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Last Secretary of State for Defence to progress to a GooS/PM?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 129,221
    edited March 2022
    A baldie as a Conservative leader does not necessarily have to mean defeat, Berlusconi in Italy and John Howard in Australia won multiple elections as bald conservatives.

    However in the UK you do yes have to go back to Churchill in 1951 for a bald leader who won. Though Hague and IDS faced Blair at his peak and had a tough time of it, had either been facing Neil Kinnock, another baldie, or Gordon Brown I expect it would have been closer.

    Wallace is not particularly charismatic but serious and hardworking if a bit dull. Given the usual pattern of Tory leaders goes charismatic then dull eg Thatcher, Major, Hague (who was a charismatic speaker), IDS and Howard, Cameron, May and Boris, Wallace looks an excellent bet to succeed Boris as Tory leader when he eventually goes. Though I think Boris is safe as PM until the next general election
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,455
    IshmaelZ said:

    Last Secretary of State for Defence to progress to a GooS/PM?

    The last PM to have been in the Cabinet with the Defence brief was Macmillan. He was Minister of Defence, but that was the senior position.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 86,351
    edited March 2022
    Woopsie....

    The Academy does not condone violence of any form. Tonight we are delighted to celebrate our 94th Academy Awards winners, who deserve this moment of recognition from their peers and movie lovers around the world.

    https://twitter.com/TheAcademy/status/1508310547564953606?s=20&t=ZYh6upw8RzT8F7n3DddLjg

    And an hour later...

    Best Actor in a Leading Role goes to Will Smith for his incredible performance in 'King Richard' Congratulations!

    https://twitter.com/TheAcademy/status/1508292151389548544?s=20&t=ZYh6upw8RzT8F7n3DddLjg
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,455
    TheWhiteRabbit said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Last Secretary of State for Defence to progress to a GooS/PM?

    The last PM to have been in the Cabinet with the Defence brief was Macmillan. He was Minister of Defence, but that was the senior position.
    Incidentally while I did know that the Minister of Defence was for a while the senior role, I hadn't realise that for 18 years after the war, two Secretaries of State (War and Air) were formally subordinate to a Minister.
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,776
    TheWhiteRabbit said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Last Secretary of State for Defence to progress to a GooS/PM?

    The last PM to have been in the Cabinet with the Defence brief was Macmillan. He was Minister of Defence, but that was the senior position.
    The only others I can find are Eden, Churchill and Campbell-Bannerman (as MInister for War)
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 14,394
    MoonRabbit said:

    SandyRentool said:

    Say what you like about Gavin Williamson, he never thumped anyone at the annual "Fireplace Salesman of the Year" awards.

    He wasn’t put between a rock and fireplace
    Best Dress Sophie Hunter

    Best Hair Timothee Chalamet

    Best Legs Kristen Stewart 🤤

    Worst Dress Billie Eilish (by the same mile as the length of it)
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,981
    HYUFD said:

    A baldie as a Conservative leader does not necessarily have to mean defeat, Berlusconi in Italy and John Howard in Australia won multiple elections as bald conservatives.

    However in the UK you do yes have to go back to Churchill in 1951 for a bald leader who won. Though Hague and IDS faced Blair at his peak and had a tough time of it, had either been facing Neil Kinnock, another baldie, or Gordon Brown I expect it would have been closer.

    Wallace is not particularly charismatic but serious and hardworking if a bit dull. Given the usual pattern of Tory leaders goes charismatic then dull eg Thatcher, Major, Hague (who was a charismatic speaker), IDS and Howard, Cameron, May and Boris, Wallace looks an excellent bet to succeed Boris as Tory leader when he eventually goes. Though I think Boris is safe as PM until the next general election

    I'm disappointed in this, as it's largely anecdotal.

    Surely you've got some polling to cite from You Gov or wherever on % willing to vote for a) hairy, b) balding or c) bald PM, and whether there are any significant differences between the Red Wall and middle England, and between Remainers and Leavers?
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 30,660
    HYUFD said:

    A baldie as a Conservative leader does not necessarily have to mean defeat, Berlusconi in Italy and John Howard in Australia won multiple elections as bald conservatives.

    However in the UK you do yes have to go back to Churchill in 1951 for a bald leader who won. Though Hague and IDS faced Blair at his peak and had a tough time of it, had either been facing Neil Kinnock, another baldie, or Gordon Brown I expect it would have been closer.

    Wallace is not particularly charismatic but serious and hardworking if a bit dull. Given the usual pattern of Tory leaders goes charismatic then dull eg Thatcher, Major, Hague (who was a charismatic speaker), IDS and Howard, Cameron, May and Boris, Wallace looks an excellent bet to succeed Boris as Tory leader when he eventually goes. Though I think Boris is safe as PM until the next general election

    Being dull is better than being a liar, no...?
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 30,660
    FPT
    Stuartinromford said:

    CorrectHorseBattery said:

    This correction isn't going to correct prices for people that can afford it, it's going to correct prices for those that can't.

    And the Tories are going to do nothing, unlike those big banks who take our money.

    If you have a decent slug of equity, a fall in house prices is annoying, but it's losing paper money. Easy come, easy go and at the end of the day you still have a house.

    If you don't have said equity (probably because you didn't have the foresight to buy ten years ago because you were still studying then), falling house prices can wipe you out.

    The other thing to remember is that, for mortgage payers, there's no such thing as a uniform housing price. It all depends on when you bought- you then fix that price in place for the duration. The basically identical houses in my street cost anywhere between £100 000 and £500 000 depending on when the current owners bought them.

    Hence the age profile we currently see, where younger people can't buy houses and older people are baffled as to why this is so.

    It's a scam, and a scam that politicians of all parties have ridden for decades. But whilst it deserves to be unwound, unwinding it ain't going to be pretty, and I'm not sure what can be done about it, short of inventing a time machine and going back to the mid 1980's.
    Starter for 10? Empower housing associations to build private developer style apartments & housing which have to be let at a regulated rent. That crashes the BTL market and dumps a load of housing stock onto the market for people to buy and the prices will go down as its a property dump. Can't charge market rents > can't deliver ROI > price drops.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 56,018
    MoonRabbit said:

    SandyRentool said:

    Say what you like about Gavin Williamson, he never thumped anyone at the annual "Fireplace Salesman of the Year" awards.

    He wasn’t put between a rock and fireplace
    The Rock - further evidence that baldies can make it to the top.....
  • ApplicantApplicant Posts: 3,379
    HYUFD said:

    A baldie as a Conservative leader does not necessarily have to mean defeat, Berlusconi in Italy and John Howard in Australia won multiple elections as bald conservatives.

    However in the UK you do yes have to go back to Churchill in 1951 for a bald leader who won. Though Hague and IDS faced Blair at his peak and had a tough time of it, had either been facing Neil Kinnock, another baldie, or Gordon Brown I expect it would have been closer.

    Wallace is not particularly charismatic but serious and hardworking if a bit dull. Given the usual pattern of Tory leaders goes charismatic then dull eg Thatcher, Major, Hague (who was a charismatic speaker), IDS and Howard, Cameron, May and Boris, Wallace looks an excellent bet to succeed Boris as Tory leader when he eventually goes. Though I think Boris is safe as PM until the next general election

    "serious and hardworking if a bit dull" should cancel out SKS's biggest plus, should it not?
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 55,538
    Putin doesn't have much hair on top either.

    Wallace just needs to ride a horse, topless, to show he is man enough for the top job.
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,776
    RochdalePioneers said:

    HYUFD said:

    A baldie as a Conservative leader does not necessarily have to mean defeat, Berlusconi in Italy and John Howard in Australia won multiple elections as bald conservatives.

    However in the UK you do yes have to go back to Churchill in 1951 for a bald leader who won. Though Hague and IDS faced Blair at his peak and had a tough time of it, had either been facing Neil Kinnock, another baldie, or Gordon Brown I expect it would have been closer.

    Wallace is not particularly charismatic but serious and hardworking if a bit dull. Given the usual pattern of Tory leaders goes charismatic then dull eg Thatcher, Major, Hague (who was a charismatic speaker), IDS and Howard, Cameron, May and Boris, Wallace looks an excellent bet to succeed Boris as Tory leader when he eventually goes. Though I think Boris is safe as PM until the next general election

    Being dull is better than being a liar, no...?
    And I think that significantly underestimates Major's in-person charisma; his soapbox campaign trail is still, I think, credited with a significant swing to the Tories during the campaign in 1992. Had his 'charisma' been of the "big event" grandstanding variety, the Labour "we're all right!" event might not have looked so triumphal/out-of-place and had less negative impact.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 18,230
    williamglenn said:

    Putin’s spokesman says that Russia won’t supply Europe with gas for free if they refuse to pay in rubles. We’re getting closer to the tap being turned off.

    Possibly precipitating the inevitable. Germany, the biggest consumer, intends to be completely clear of Russian gas by 2024; coal and oil this year.
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,776
    FF43 said:

    williamglenn said:

    Putin’s spokesman says that Russia won’t supply Europe with gas for free if they refuse to pay in rubles. We’re getting closer to the tap being turned off.

    Possibly precipitating the inevitable. Germany, the biggest consumer, intends to be completely clear of Russian gas by 2024; coal and oil this year.
    I agree. While that threat is clearly intended to drive a wedge in the western allies, the closer it gets to realisation (and should it actually occur), I believe it has the opposite effect. Putin can only turn the gas off once.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,783
    Posted earlier today, my post-race ramble about Saudi Arabia:
    https://enormo-haddock.blogspot.com/2022/03/saudi-arabia-post-race-analysis-2022.html
  • CookieCookie Posts: 15,733
    Malmesbury said:

    MoonRabbit said:

    SandyRentool said:

    Say what you like about Gavin Williamson, he never thumped anyone at the annual "Fireplace Salesman of the Year" awards.

    He wasn’t put between a rock and fireplace
    The Rock - further evidence that baldies can make it to the top.....
    A mistake I have only just learned I have been making all these years: Chris Rock <> Dwayne 'The Rock' Johnson. The latter is bald, the former was slapped by Will Smith.
  • Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 14,851
    Applicant said:

    HYUFD said:

    A baldie as a Conservative leader does not necessarily have to mean defeat, Berlusconi in Italy and John Howard in Australia won multiple elections as bald conservatives.

    However in the UK you do yes have to go back to Churchill in 1951 for a bald leader who won. Though Hague and IDS faced Blair at his peak and had a tough time of it, had either been facing Neil Kinnock, another baldie, or Gordon Brown I expect it would have been closer.

    Wallace is not particularly charismatic but serious and hardworking if a bit dull. Given the usual pattern of Tory leaders goes charismatic then dull eg Thatcher, Major, Hague (who was a charismatic speaker), IDS and Howard, Cameron, May and Boris, Wallace looks an excellent bet to succeed Boris as Tory leader when he eventually goes. Though I think Boris is safe as PM until the next general election

    "serious and hardworking if a bit dull" should cancel out SKS's biggest plus, should it not?
    I was thinking that. Either could be an antidote to "clownish and lazy if a bit charismatic"
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 56,018
    edited March 2022
    FF43 said:

    williamglenn said:

    Putin’s spokesman says that Russia won’t supply Europe with gas for free if they refuse to pay in rubles. We’re getting closer to the tap being turned off.

    Possibly precipitating the inevitable. Germany, the biggest consumer, intends to be completely clear of Russian gas by 2024; coal and oil this year.
    That would require some astonishing build rates for new LNG vessels, and the pipelines from the existing terminals in Poland - and possibly the other neighbours.

    Also, adding new capacity to existing ports won't be a cheap or quick.

    Building the new LNG terminals that has been announced, in Germany, will definitely take more than a year or 2.

    image

    from https://www.gie.eu/download/2018/GIE_Brochure_The_Benefits_and_Role_of_LNG_in_Europe_January2018.pdf
  • TazTaz Posts: 19,994
    Cookie said:

    Malmesbury said:

    MoonRabbit said:

    SandyRentool said:

    Say what you like about Gavin Williamson, he never thumped anyone at the annual "Fireplace Salesman of the Year" awards.

    He wasn’t put between a rock and fireplace
    The Rock - further evidence that baldies can make it to the top.....
    A mistake I have only just learned I have been making all these years: Chris Rock <> Dwayne 'The Rock' Johnson. The latter is bald, the former was slapped by Will Smith.
    Do you smell what the Rock is cooking ?
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 44,517
    edited March 2022
    IshmaelZ said:

    Interesting how Scotch politics and regiments take in English Tories and set them on a trajectory to the very top South of the Border. You can sense the pride the likes of @Theuniondivvie must derive from this.

    It was IDS adding the extra ‘i’ into Iain for the full Scotchy McScotchface effect that made me really warm to him. I suppose baldy Ben could gaelicise to Bheinn.

    I read that his first name is actually Robert; Boaby Wallace has a fine ring to it.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,422
    Cyclefree pointing out the obvious downthread:

    The main insight from this morning's LBC interview with Starmer is that Labour is going to get hit with a whole bunch of culture war wedge issues in the run-up to the next election. Those issues say a lot more about the distorted concerns of Westminster/media than the country.

    https://twitter.com/drjennings/status/1508384695234478082

    I'm not sure "women's rights & safety" are a "distorted concern"....
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 55,538
    FF43 said:

    williamglenn said:

    Putin’s spokesman says that Russia won’t supply Europe with gas for free if they refuse to pay in rubles. We’re getting closer to the tap being turned off.

    Possibly precipitating the inevitable. Germany, the biggest consumer, intends to be completely clear of Russian gas by 2024; coal and oil this year.
    Give it 5 years, and Russia will be having to give it away free. Or at least, accepting not many Rupees.

    The trashing of Russian tank regiments will be as nothing to the way this war will be remembered for destroying the Russian economy.
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 9,183
    I hope he has a dog named Gromit.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 56,018
    geoffw said:

    I hope he has a dog named Gromit.

    Tonto? Or is it too soon?
  • ApplicantApplicant Posts: 3,379
    geoffw said:

    I hope he has a dog named Gromit.

    I was rather hoping that Wensleydale was made in his constituency.

    But it isn't - it's in Sunak's...
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 9,183
    edited March 2022
    The payment in rubles stuff is puzzling if you expect the ruble to maintain convertibility. So perhaps Elvira Nabiullina has plans for a dual currency in the manner of the Renminbi/Yuan of the 1980s.
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 5,995
    Cookie said:

    Malmesbury said:

    MoonRabbit said:

    SandyRentool said:

    Say what you like about Gavin Williamson, he never thumped anyone at the annual "Fireplace Salesman of the Year" awards.

    He wasn’t put between a rock and fireplace
    The Rock - further evidence that baldies can make it to the top.....
    A mistake I have only just learned I have been making all these years: Chris Rock <> Dwayne 'The Rock' Johnson. The latter is bald, the former was slapped by Will Smith.
    It’s always an interesting wake up call on pb realising how disconnected a lot of people are from modern culture. Comments like not being able to recognise Will Smith in the street. Really?

    Even The Rock’s gross box office is over $5bn, the 20th highest grossing actor of all time. And that’s his second successful career (as per Will Smith).
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 35,392
    CarlottaVance said:

    Cyclefree pointing out the obvious downthread:

    The main insight from this morning's LBC interview with Starmer is that Labour is going to get hit with a whole bunch of culture war wedge issues in the run-up to the next election. Those issues say a lot more about the distorted concerns of Westminster/media than the country.

    https://twitter.com/drjennings/status/1508384695234478082

    I'm not sure "women's rights & safety" are a "distorted concern"....

    There are a lot of 'yebbuts' in those sorts of issues. For example, the man in the pub is initially against whatever it is, but then says 'yebbut' and turns out that on reflection he thinks it's quite a good idea.
    Like gay marriage. Your average 'straight' isn't bothered, finds it mildly amusing, but if it's not hurting anyone, and it protects the survivors rights on death, why not?
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 19,717
    IshmaelZ said:

    Last Secretary of State for Defence to progress to a GooS/PM?

    Philip Hammond was Secretary of State for Defence (2011-14) and later became Foreign Secretary (2014-16) and Chancellor of the Exchequer (2016-19), before becoming a non-person following the Johnson revolution.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 14,394
    MarqueeMark said:

    Putin doesn't have much hair on top either.

    Wallace just needs to ride a horse, topless, to show he is man enough for the top job.

    Isn’t that the image we associate with full Tonto?
  • ApplicantApplicant Posts: 3,379
    edited March 2022
    LostPassword said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Last Secretary of State for Defence to progress to a GooS/PM?

    Philip Hammond was Secretary of State for Defence (2011-14) and later became Foreign Secretary (2014-16) and Chancellor of the Exchequer (2016-19), before becoming a non-person following the Johnson revolution.
    You mean "resigning from the Cabinet, deliberately losing the whip and declining to seek re-election"?
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,776
    BartholomewRoberts said:

    Interesting that you consider young people who struggle to buy homes at an 8x house price to earnings ratio to be merely "dickheads".

    The only dickheads are those who have invested in a portfolio of properties expecting young people to keep paying them rent, and view that investment as their "pension". If they lose out, then sucks to be them, investments can go down as well as up.

    The problem is the bimodality. There are dickheads at one end and poorly advised+overstretched at the other. A solution needs to deal with both.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,738
    OldKingCole said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    Cyclefree pointing out the obvious downthread:

    The main insight from this morning's LBC interview with Starmer is that Labour is going to get hit with a whole bunch of culture war wedge issues in the run-up to the next election. Those issues say a lot more about the distorted concerns of Westminster/media than the country.

    https://twitter.com/drjennings/status/1508384695234478082

    I'm not sure "women's rights & safety" are a "distorted concern"....

    There are a lot of 'yebbuts' in those sorts of issues. For example, the man in the pub is initially against whatever it is, but then says 'yebbut' and turns out that on reflection he thinks it's quite a good idea.
    Like gay marriage. Your average 'straight' isn't bothered, finds it mildly amusing, but if it's not hurting anyone, and it protects the survivors rights on death, why not?
    I've some sympathy with Cyclefree's view as I have two friends who feel equally strongly. But it is nonetheless not something that comes up much on the doorstep even if one feels it should, and taking sides in culture wars is as fundamental a mistake as a councillor taking sides in a neighbour dispute - everybody involved (including whoever you back) feels you're not sufficiently on their side, need to say more, etc., and you just get sucked in. Meanwhile, everyone else thinks you're obsessed with something they don't care about because they've never met a trans person.

    It's a big deal in the Green Party, where quite a few activists are very deeply entrenched on both sides - I know some senior party people who said they'd quit if the leadership candidate with the "wrong" view got elected.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 56,018
    mwadams said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    Interesting that you consider young people who struggle to buy homes at an 8x house price to earnings ratio to be merely "dickheads".

    The only dickheads are those who have invested in a portfolio of properties expecting young people to keep paying them rent, and view that investment as their "pension". If they lose out, then sucks to be them, investments can go down as well as up.

    The problem is the bimodality. There are dickheads at one end and poorly advised+overstretched at the other. A solution needs to deal with both.
    The middle solution would be to reduce the rate of house price growth to less than pay inflation but more than general inflation.

    After about a hundred years, houses would be affordable again.

    The chances of creating that situation are about equal to Putin & Co. making it to the English Channel...
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 22,107
    Wallace is far too sensible to be Tory leader. Carton writers field day. His chancellor would inevitably be drawn as Grommet.
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 25,501
    mwadams said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    Interesting that you consider young people who struggle to buy homes at an 8x house price to earnings ratio to be merely "dickheads".

    The only dickheads are those who have invested in a portfolio of properties expecting young people to keep paying them rent, and view that investment as their "pension". If they lose out, then sucks to be them, investments can go down as well as up.

    The problem is the bimodality. There are dickheads at one end and poorly advised+overstretched at the other. A solution needs to deal with both.
    Absolutely.

    But its like Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs - a property providing a roof over the head of someone, and that someone being able to afford their own property is almost infinitely more important a priority than someone who is investing in homes they don't live in, in order to extract a rent from that person.

    Especially given our f***ed up planning system that doesn't allow new housing to be built to replace any homes that people who don't live in it own. If the planning system was reformed so that anyone who wanted a home of their own could just build one anywhere they wanted, instead of having to rent it off someone who is closing the market off to purchasers, then it wouldn't be an issue.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 44,158
    NickPalmer said:

    OldKingCole said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    Cyclefree pointing out the obvious downthread:

    The main insight from this morning's LBC interview with Starmer is that Labour is going to get hit with a whole bunch of culture war wedge issues in the run-up to the next election. Those issues say a lot more about the distorted concerns of Westminster/media than the country.

    https://twitter.com/drjennings/status/1508384695234478082

    I'm not sure "women's rights & safety" are a "distorted concern"....

    There are a lot of 'yebbuts' in those sorts of issues. For example, the man in the pub is initially against whatever it is, but then says 'yebbut' and turns out that on reflection he thinks it's quite a good idea.
    Like gay marriage. Your average 'straight' isn't bothered, finds it mildly amusing, but if it's not hurting anyone, and it protects the survivors rights on death, why not?
    It's a big deal in the Green Party, where quite a few activists are very deeply entrenched on both sides - I know some senior party people who said they'd quit if the leadership candidate with the "wrong" view got elected.
    I think this is what happened to the Cons, not least some if not much of its PB contingent.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 129,221
    edited March 2022
    LostPassword said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Last Secretary of State for Defence to progress to a GooS/PM?

    Philip Hammond was Secretary of State for Defence (2011-14) and later became Foreign Secretary (2014-16) and Chancellor of the Exchequer (2016-19), before becoming a non-person following the Johnson revolution.
    IDS was Shadow Defence Secretary then Tory Leader.

    Now it looks likely that the next Tory Leader will be Leader of the Opposition, the polls are close enough now for Boris to stay PM and lead the Tories into the next general election (although he could be re elected still of course even if Labour narrowly lead polls now)
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 79,731
    geoffw said:

    I hope he has a dog named Gromit.

    Jean-Paul Sartre had a cat called Nothing.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 7,085
    Loving the bald thread topic!

    Mike is clearly onto something with this. There seems to be a fair amount of anecfacta that voters don't warm to bald political leaders. Probably not to ginger ones either.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 129,221
    edited March 2022
    BartholomewRoberts said:

    mwadams said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    Interesting that you consider young people who struggle to buy homes at an 8x house price to earnings ratio to be merely "dickheads".

    The only dickheads are those who have invested in a portfolio of properties expecting young people to keep paying them rent, and view that investment as their "pension". If they lose out, then sucks to be them, investments can go down as well as up.

    The problem is the bimodality. There are dickheads at one end and poorly advised+overstretched at the other. A solution needs to deal with both.
    Absolutely.

    But its like Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs - a property providing a roof over the head of someone, and that someone being able to afford their own property is almost infinitely more important a priority than someone who is investing in homes they don't live in, in order to extract a rent from that person.

    Especially given our f***ed up planning system that doesn't allow new housing to be built to replace any homes that people who don't live in it own. If the planning system was reformed so that anyone who wanted a home of their own could just build one anywhere they wanted, instead of having to rent it off someone who is closing the market off to purchasers, then it wouldn't be an issue.
    You can build new homes, just it should ideally be in brownfield not greenbelt land and be in keeping with the street scene and if on large scale come with appropriate infrastructure.

    Renting not ownership is still mainly a London problem and to a lesser extent a Home Counties problem. In the North and Midlands and Wales and Scotland and NI while people may rent when young they can still afford to buy a property in their 30s relatively easily as prices are far cheaper
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 32,035
    HYUFD said:

    LostPassword said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Last Secretary of State for Defence to progress to a GooS/PM?

    Philip Hammond was Secretary of State for Defence (2011-14) and later became Foreign Secretary (2014-16) and Chancellor of the Exchequer (2016-19), before becoming a non-person following the Johnson revolution.
    IDS was Shadow Defence Secretary then Tory Leader.

    Now it looks likely that the next Tory Leader will be Leader of the Opposition, the polls are close enough now for Boris to stay PM and lead the Tories into the next general election (although he could be re elected still of course even if Labour narrowly lead)
    Leader of the Opposition would not appeal to Boris. No free homes, cars and flights. I still think Boris will seek to retire at the top, which probably means before the next election, in order to cash in as the man who never lost, and who led Britain through successive crises.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 7,085
    moonshine said:

    Cookie said:

    Malmesbury said:

    MoonRabbit said:

    SandyRentool said:

    Say what you like about Gavin Williamson, he never thumped anyone at the annual "Fireplace Salesman of the Year" awards.

    He wasn’t put between a rock and fireplace
    The Rock - further evidence that baldies can make it to the top.....
    A mistake I have only just learned I have been making all these years: Chris Rock <> Dwayne 'The Rock' Johnson. The latter is bald, the former was slapped by Will Smith.
    It’s always an interesting wake up call on pb realising how disconnected a lot of people are from modern culture. Comments like not being able to recognise Will Smith in the street. Really?

    Even The Rock’s gross box office is over $5bn, the 20th highest grossing actor of all time. And that’s his second successful career (as per Will Smith).
    Yep I refrained from commenting in response this morning but the disconnect between pb and the public was really shown up by that remark earlier.

    Most everyone under 40 knows Will Smith by name, sight, probably voice.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 79,731
    PM's sister advocates division of Ukraine:
    https://mobile.twitter.com/LBC/status/1508151165363658757

    Useless idiocy seems to run in the family.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 44,590
    DavidL said:

    Wallace strikes me as a decent sort. Sensible rather than bright, goodish instincts and pragmatic. Definitely one of the better performers in this very ordinary cabinet. Whether he quite has the star dust for the top post, however, I am not so sure.

    But in politics, like those being chased by the bear, you don't need to be good or fast, just better or faster than the others.

    Shows how absolutely dire a state the Tories are in when he is a candidate for PM.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 32,035
    Heathener said:

    Loving the bald thread topic!

    Mike is clearly onto something with this. There seems to be a fair amount of anecfacta that voters don't warm to bald political leaders. Probably not to ginger ones either.

    Churchill was both, of course. No wonder he lost in 45.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 129,221
    edited March 2022
    DecrepiterJohnL said:

    HYUFD said:

    LostPassword said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Last Secretary of State for Defence to progress to a GooS/PM?

    Philip Hammond was Secretary of State for Defence (2011-14) and later became Foreign Secretary (2014-16) and Chancellor of the Exchequer (2016-19), before becoming a non-person following the Johnson revolution.
    IDS was Shadow Defence Secretary then Tory Leader.

    Now it looks likely that the next Tory Leader will be Leader of the Opposition, the polls are close enough now for Boris to stay PM and lead the Tories into the next general election (although he could be re elected still of course even if Labour narrowly lead)
    Leader of the Opposition would not appeal to Boris. No free homes, cars and flights. I still think Boris will seek to retire at the top, which probably means before the next election, in order to cash in as the man who never lost, and who led Britain through successive crises.
    If Labour had a big lead that might be the case, the polls are close enough now however Boris could still win and his ego will therefore want to go for one final battle.

    Trump too of course in the end fought for re election in 2020 despite earlier talk he would bow out and although he lost it was still reasonably close
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 7,085
    CarlottaVance said:

    Cyclefree pointing out the obvious downthread:

    The main insight from this morning's LBC interview with Starmer is that Labour is going to get hit with a whole bunch of culture war wedge issues in the run-up to the next election. Those issues say a lot more about the distorted concerns of Westminster/media than the country.

    https://twitter.com/drjennings/status/1508384695234478082

    I'm not sure "women's rights & safety" are a "distorted concern"....

    Until the extremists on the Daily Mail and Telegraph started whipping this up most people really couldn't care a less about gender identity. If people want to identify as female or non-binary then that's fine. And, again, until the haters went on their rampage most women I know couldn't give a fig if a trans person uses the ladies. Trans people are almost invariably non-violent, despite what Allison Pearson and co tell you.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    moonshine said:

    Cookie said:

    Malmesbury said:

    MoonRabbit said:

    SandyRentool said:

    Say what you like about Gavin Williamson, he never thumped anyone at the annual "Fireplace Salesman of the Year" awards.

    He wasn’t put between a rock and fireplace
    The Rock - further evidence that baldies can make it to the top.....
    A mistake I have only just learned I have been making all these years: Chris Rock <> Dwayne 'The Rock' Johnson. The latter is bald, the former was slapped by Will Smith.
    It’s always an interesting wake up call on pb realising how disconnected a lot of people are from modern culture. Comments like not being able to recognise Will Smith in the street. Really?

    Even The Rock’s gross box office is over $5bn, the 20th highest grossing actor of all time. And that’s his second successful career (as per Will Smith).
    A hilariously self-torpedoing post, because The Rock is Dwayne Johnson, while Chris Rock is Chris Rock.
  • CorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorseBattery Posts: 21,436
    Just think, if BoJo had retired after Hartlepool he'd go down as one of of the most popular PMs of the last 100 years
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 129,221
    DecrepiterJohnL said:

    Heathener said:

    Loving the bald thread topic!

    Mike is clearly onto something with this. There seems to be a fair amount of anecfacta that voters don't warm to bald political leaders. Probably not to ginger ones either.

    Churchill was both, of course. No wonder he lost in 45.
    But won in 51
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 7,085
    p.s. and it's pretty obvious by now that J.K.Rowling has a lot of hurt and anger from her past as well as a distinctly unprogressive attitude on many things. Witness just how incredibly all-white and undiverse the heroes in the Potter franchise are. Just about the only ethnically diverse person turns out to betray the nice white kids ...
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,776
    Heathener said:

    moonshine said:

    Cookie said:

    Malmesbury said:

    MoonRabbit said:

    SandyRentool said:

    Say what you like about Gavin Williamson, he never thumped anyone at the annual "Fireplace Salesman of the Year" awards.

    He wasn’t put between a rock and fireplace
    The Rock - further evidence that baldies can make it to the top.....
    A mistake I have only just learned I have been making all these years: Chris Rock <> Dwayne 'The Rock' Johnson. The latter is bald, the former was slapped by Will Smith.
    It’s always an interesting wake up call on pb realising how disconnected a lot of people are from modern culture. Comments like not being able to recognise Will Smith in the street. Really?

    Even The Rock’s gross box office is over $5bn, the 20th highest grossing actor of all time. And that’s his second successful career (as per Will Smith).
    Yep I refrained from commenting in response this morning but the disconnect between pb and the public was really shown up by that remark earlier.

    Most everyone under 40 knows Will Smith by name, sight, probably voice.
    I would extend that to "under 50" - FPoBE started in 1990, and his movie career kicked off in 1997 (mid 20s being prime moviegoer demographic). You would have to have been living as a Hermit on Iona not to recognize him from that.
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 25,501
    IshmaelZ said:

    moonshine said:

    Cookie said:

    Malmesbury said:

    MoonRabbit said:

    SandyRentool said:

    Say what you like about Gavin Williamson, he never thumped anyone at the annual "Fireplace Salesman of the Year" awards.

    He wasn’t put between a rock and fireplace
    The Rock - further evidence that baldies can make it to the top.....
    A mistake I have only just learned I have been making all these years: Chris Rock <> Dwayne 'The Rock' Johnson. The latter is bald, the former was slapped by Will Smith.
    It’s always an interesting wake up call on pb realising how disconnected a lot of people are from modern culture. Comments like not being able to recognise Will Smith in the street. Really?

    Even The Rock’s gross box office is over $5bn, the 20th highest grossing actor of all time. And that’s his second successful career (as per Will Smith).
    A hilariously self-torpedoing post, because The Rock is Dwayne Johnson, while Chris Rock is Chris Rock.
    Laughing at people for medical conditions is supposed to be well beyond the pale nowadays so I wonder if this incident will mean that now everybody hates Chris?
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 33,487
    edited March 2022
    Heathener said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    Cyclefree pointing out the obvious downthread:

    The main insight from this morning's LBC interview with Starmer is that Labour is going to get hit with a whole bunch of culture war wedge issues in the run-up to the next election. Those issues say a lot more about the distorted concerns of Westminster/media than the country.

    https://twitter.com/drjennings/status/1508384695234478082

    I'm not sure "women's rights & safety" are a "distorted concern"....

    Until the extremists on the Daily Mail and Telegraph started whipping this up most people really couldn't care a less about gender identity. If people want to identify as female or non-binary then that's fine. And, again, until the haters went on their rampage most women I know couldn't give a fig if a trans person uses the ladies. Trans people are almost invariably non-violent, despite what Allison Pearson and co tell you.
    So the rape in the hospital and the rape at the prison didn't happen? And the hospital was right to lie to the police about there being anyone capable of committing a rape on a ward and compound the rape by accusing the victim of lying?

    You have some very warped views and they have nothing to do with the rights of people to be non-binary.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 7,085
    HYUFD said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    mwadams said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    Interesting that you consider young people who struggle to buy homes at an 8x house price to earnings ratio to be merely "dickheads".

    The only dickheads are those who have invested in a portfolio of properties expecting young people to keep paying them rent, and view that investment as their "pension". If they lose out, then sucks to be them, investments can go down as well as up.

    The problem is the bimodality. There are dickheads at one end and poorly advised+overstretched at the other. A solution needs to deal with both.
    Absolutely.

    But its like Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs - a property providing a roof over the head of someone, and that someone being able to afford their own property is almost infinitely more important a priority than someone who is investing in homes they don't live in, in order to extract a rent from that person.

    Especially given our f***ed up planning system that doesn't allow new housing to be built to replace any homes that people who don't live in it own. If the planning system was reformed so that anyone who wanted a home of their own could just build one anywhere they wanted, instead of having to rent it off someone who is closing the market off to purchasers, then it wouldn't be an issue.
    You can build new homes, just it should ideally be in brownfield not greenbelt land and be in keeping with the street scene and if on large scale come with appropriate infrastructure.

    Renting not ownership is still mainly a London problem and to a lesser extent a Home Counties problem. In the North and Midlands and Wales and Scotland and NI while people may rent when young they can still afford to buy a property in their 30s relatively easily as prices are far cheaper
    Wow that's spectacularly out of touch on almost every level.
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,776
    mwadams said:

    Heathener said:

    moonshine said:

    Cookie said:

    Malmesbury said:

    MoonRabbit said:

    SandyRentool said:

    Say what you like about Gavin Williamson, he never thumped anyone at the annual "Fireplace Salesman of the Year" awards.

    He wasn’t put between a rock and fireplace
    The Rock - further evidence that baldies can make it to the top.....
    A mistake I have only just learned I have been making all these years: Chris Rock <> Dwayne 'The Rock' Johnson. The latter is bald, the former was slapped by Will Smith.
    It’s always an interesting wake up call on pb realising how disconnected a lot of people are from modern culture. Comments like not being able to recognise Will Smith in the street. Really?

    Even The Rock’s gross box office is over $5bn, the 20th highest grossing actor of all time. And that’s his second successful career (as per Will Smith).
    Yep I refrained from commenting in response this morning but the disconnect between pb and the public was really shown up by that remark earlier.

    Most everyone under 40 knows Will Smith by name, sight, probably voice.
    I would extend that to "under 50" - FPoBE started in 1990, and his movie career kicked off in 1997 (mid 20s being prime moviegoer demographic). You would have to have been living as a Hermit on Iona not to recognize him from that.
    FPoBE => FPoBA
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 32,035
    Heathener said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    Cyclefree pointing out the obvious downthread:

    The main insight from this morning's LBC interview with Starmer is that Labour is going to get hit with a whole bunch of culture war wedge issues in the run-up to the next election. Those issues say a lot more about the distorted concerns of Westminster/media than the country.

    https://twitter.com/drjennings/status/1508384695234478082

    I'm not sure "women's rights & safety" are a "distorted concern"....

    Until the extremists on the Daily Mail and Telegraph started whipping this up most people really couldn't care a less about gender identity. If people want to identify as female or non-binary then that's fine. And, again, until the haters went on their rampage most women I know couldn't give a fig if a trans person uses the ladies. Trans people are almost invariably non-violent, despite what Allison Pearson and co tell you.
    No doubt at the election, CCHQ will be sending two electric letters, one on each side, to those voters they identify as being on one side or the other, with the rest getting the Savile smear.
  • CorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorseBattery Posts: 21,436
    BartholomewRoberts said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    moonshine said:

    Cookie said:

    Malmesbury said:

    MoonRabbit said:

    SandyRentool said:

    Say what you like about Gavin Williamson, he never thumped anyone at the annual "Fireplace Salesman of the Year" awards.

    He wasn’t put between a rock and fireplace
    The Rock - further evidence that baldies can make it to the top.....
    A mistake I have only just learned I have been making all these years: Chris Rock <> Dwayne 'The Rock' Johnson. The latter is bald, the former was slapped by Will Smith.
    It’s always an interesting wake up call on pb realising how disconnected a lot of people are from modern culture. Comments like not being able to recognise Will Smith in the street. Really?

    Even The Rock’s gross box office is over $5bn, the 20th highest grossing actor of all time. And that’s his second successful career (as per Will Smith).
    A hilariously self-torpedoing post, because The Rock is Dwayne Johnson, while Chris Rock is Chris Rock.
    Laughing at people for medical conditions is supposed to be well beyond the pale nowadays so I wonder if this incident will mean that now everybody hates Chris?
    So we're pro cancel culture now?
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 7,085
    Richard_Tyndall said:

    Heathener said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    Cyclefree pointing out the obvious downthread:

    The main insight from this morning's LBC interview with Starmer is that Labour is going to get hit with a whole bunch of culture war wedge issues in the run-up to the next election. Those issues say a lot more about the distorted concerns of Westminster/media than the country.

    https://twitter.com/drjennings/status/1508384695234478082

    I'm not sure "women's rights & safety" are a "distorted concern"....

    Until the extremists on the Daily Mail and Telegraph started whipping this up most people really couldn't care a less about gender identity. If people want to identify as female or non-binary then that's fine. And, again, until the haters went on their rampage most women I know couldn't give a fig if a trans person uses the ladies. Trans people are almost invariably non-violent, despite what Allison Pearson and co tell you.

    You have some very warped views and they have nothing to do with the rights of people to be non-binary.
    Yawn
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 44,517
    NickPalmer said:

    OldKingCole said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    Cyclefree pointing out the obvious downthread:

    The main insight from this morning's LBC interview with Starmer is that Labour is going to get hit with a whole bunch of culture war wedge issues in the run-up to the next election. Those issues say a lot more about the distorted concerns of Westminster/media than the country.

    https://twitter.com/drjennings/status/1508384695234478082

    I'm not sure "women's rights & safety" are a "distorted concern"....

    There are a lot of 'yebbuts' in those sorts of issues. For example, the man in the pub is initially against whatever it is, but then says 'yebbut' and turns out that on reflection he thinks it's quite a good idea.
    Like gay marriage. Your average 'straight' isn't bothered, finds it mildly amusing, but if it's not hurting anyone, and it protects the survivors rights on death, why not?
    I've some sympathy with Cyclefree's view as I have two friends who feel equally strongly. But it is nonetheless not something that comes up much on the doorstep even if one feels it should, and taking sides in culture wars is as fundamental a mistake as a councillor taking sides in a neighbour dispute - everybody involved (including whoever you back) feels you're not sufficiently on their side, need to say more, etc., and you just get sucked in. Meanwhile, everyone else thinks you're obsessed with something they don't care about because they've never met a trans person.

    It's a big deal in the Green Party, where quite a few activists are very deeply entrenched on both sides - I know some senior party people who said they'd quit if the leadership candidate with the "wrong" view got elected.
    In general people who feel strongly about an issue are often incapable of accepting that others may not feel strongly (let's not even consider them accepting the validity of opposing views). There also appears to be a significant lump of folk who are desperate for it to be a wedge issue.

    BBC Scotland recently did a survey on public attitudes to trans issues and GRA reform in Scotland; the general consensus seemed to be that folk weren't that bothered and in general had a mild preference that life should be made a bit easier for trans people. You could almost see the cloud of thwarted disappointment above Pacific Quay.
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 10,219
    Heathener said:

    p.s. and it's pretty obvious by now that J.K.Rowling has a lot of hurt and anger from her past as well as a distinctly unprogressive attitude on many things. Witness just how incredibly all-white and undiverse the heroes in the Potter franchise are. Just about the only ethnically diverse person turns out to betray the nice white kids ...

    If she'd invented non-white characters she'd no doubt have been accused of cultural appropriation.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 44,590
    BartholomewRoberts said:

    malcolmg said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    Richard_Tyndall said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/property/uk/hidden-crisis-hitting-property-market/

    Housing market collapsing from bottom up

    At long last, a good news story?

    We're well overdue a "correction" to the housing market. It would be fantastic if house price to earnings ratios could be corrected back to 3-4x rather than 7-8x ratios.
    Great destination, rubbish journey to get there
    A bit like going to the gym, "no pain, no gain".
    Yes, but a bit flippant. The pain will consist of converting very poor people into very poor homeless people, the gain will accrue further up the food chain.
    "All investments can go down in value as well as up".

    I'm sorry but I have little sympathy for people who are investing in housing that then see their investments lose value. For people living in their homes rather than using them as investments, they won't become homeless unless they can no longer afford the mortgage repayments which is just the same if they can't afford the rent. The supposed "value" of the house is not really that relevant so long as you're not planning on moving any time soon.
    CorrectHorseBattery said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/property/uk/hidden-crisis-hitting-property-market/

    Housing market collapsing from bottom up

    At long last, a good news story?

    We're well overdue a "correction" to the housing market. It would be fantastic if house price to earnings ratios could be corrected back to 3-4x rather than 7-8x ratios.
    Great destination, rubbish journey to get there
    A bit like going to the gym, "no pain, no gain".
    Yes, but a bit flippant. The pain will consist of converting very poor people into very poor homeless people, the gain will accrue further up the food chain.
    If you look at the graph in the Telegraph article, the rich's houses have got more expensive and more in demand.

    So another transfer of wealth
    So houses are becoming more affordable for the poor and less affordable for the rich - isn't that a good news story?

    Are you in favour of more affordable housing, or more "housing wealth", you seem to be giving out mixed signals.
    I think the problem you have - whilst I agree with you about houses being a place to live rather than an investment - is that the Government of all stripes has so utterly screwed the pension system over the last few decades that their home is the lifeline for many people to allow them to have any sort of retirement. More over as has already been noted, many people use their homes as collateral for all manner of enterprises, especially business start ups.

    So whilst I actually agree with you on balance about houses being homes not investments and also that I would welcome a big correction, this is just one part of a massively failed system and a correction in this area is only going to lead to massive pain and more failure in others.
    Oh I 100% agree with all that.

    The problem is that I don't see the pain the correction will result in as a reason not to have the correction.

    Its a bit like the issue with obesity. Eating healthier and exercising can be painful, its hard and difficult, but it doesn't make it the wrong thing to do. The easier thing to do is to say "I wouldn't start from here" but if you've got "here" and need to get "there" then there aren't any quick and easy and painless solutions, but that doesn't make wallowing and doing nothing the right solution either.
    Why would you crash house prices and have people homeless and unable to pay high rents so that some dickheads who could not afford them previously can now afford them. Do any Tories have a brain.
    Interesting that you consider young people who struggle to buy homes at an 8x house price to earnings ratio to be merely "dickheads".

    The only dickheads are those who have invested in a portfolio of properties expecting young people to keep paying them rent, and view that investment as their "pension". If they lose out, then sucks to be them, investments can go down as well as up.

    People being able to afford their own home is more important a priority than people's investments being secure.
    Do you ever come out with anything sensible. How many people do you know that have a portfolio of houses. There are far more that could not survive a price crash than there are property moguls.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 32,035
    HYUFD said:

    DecrepiterJohnL said:

    HYUFD said:

    LostPassword said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Last Secretary of State for Defence to progress to a GooS/PM?

    Philip Hammond was Secretary of State for Defence (2011-14) and later became Foreign Secretary (2014-16) and Chancellor of the Exchequer (2016-19), before becoming a non-person following the Johnson revolution.
    IDS was Shadow Defence Secretary then Tory Leader.

    Now it looks likely that the next Tory Leader will be Leader of the Opposition, the polls are close enough now for Boris to stay PM and lead the Tories into the next general election (although he could be re elected still of course even if Labour narrowly lead)
    Leader of the Opposition would not appeal to Boris. No free homes, cars and flights. I still think Boris will seek to retire at the top, which probably means before the next election, in order to cash in as the man who never lost, and who led Britain through successive crises.
    If Labour had a big lead that might be the case, the polls are close enough now however Boris could still win and his ego will therefore want to go for one final battle.

    Trump too of course in the end fought for re election in 2020 despite earlier talk he would bow out and although he lost it was still reasonably close
    Yes, it is all subject to polling, of course. And Trump is a billionaire so does not have to worry about who pays for the gold leaf wallpaper.
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 25,501
    CorrectHorseBattery said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    moonshine said:

    Cookie said:

    Malmesbury said:

    MoonRabbit said:

    SandyRentool said:

    Say what you like about Gavin Williamson, he never thumped anyone at the annual "Fireplace Salesman of the Year" awards.

    He wasn’t put between a rock and fireplace
    The Rock - further evidence that baldies can make it to the top.....
    A mistake I have only just learned I have been making all these years: Chris Rock <> Dwayne 'The Rock' Johnson. The latter is bald, the former was slapped by Will Smith.
    It’s always an interesting wake up call on pb realising how disconnected a lot of people are from modern culture. Comments like not being able to recognise Will Smith in the street. Really?

    Even The Rock’s gross box office is over $5bn, the 20th highest grossing actor of all time. And that’s his second successful career (as per Will Smith).
    A hilariously self-torpedoing post, because The Rock is Dwayne Johnson, while Chris Rock is Chris Rock.
    Laughing at people for medical conditions is supposed to be well beyond the pale nowadays so I wonder if this incident will mean that now everybody hates Chris?
    So we're pro cancel culture now?
    Joke
    ^
    ^
    ^
    ^
    Your Head

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Everybody_Hates_Chris
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 7,085
    Theuniondivvie said:

    NickPalmer said:

    OldKingCole said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    Cyclefree pointing out the obvious downthread:

    The main insight from this morning's LBC interview with Starmer is that Labour is going to get hit with a whole bunch of culture war wedge issues in the run-up to the next election. Those issues say a lot more about the distorted concerns of Westminster/media than the country.

    https://twitter.com/drjennings/status/1508384695234478082

    I'm not sure "women's rights & safety" are a "distorted concern"....

    There are a lot of 'yebbuts' in those sorts of issues. For example, the man in the pub is initially against whatever it is, but then says 'yebbut' and turns out that on reflection he thinks it's quite a good idea.
    Like gay marriage. Your average 'straight' isn't bothered, finds it mildly amusing, but if it's not hurting anyone, and it protects the survivors rights on death, why not?
    I've some sympathy with Cyclefree's view as I have two friends who feel equally strongly. But it is nonetheless not something that comes up much on the doorstep even if one feels it should, and taking sides in culture wars is as fundamental a mistake as a councillor taking sides in a neighbour dispute - everybody involved (including whoever you back) feels you're not sufficiently on their side, need to say more, etc., and you just get sucked in. Meanwhile, everyone else thinks you're obsessed with something they don't care about because they've never met a trans person.

    It's a big deal in the Green Party, where quite a few activists are very deeply entrenched on both sides - I know some senior party people who said they'd quit if the leadership candidate with the "wrong" view got elected.
    In general people who feel strongly about an issue are often incapable of accepting that others may not feel strongly (let's not even consider them accepting the validity of opposing views). There also appears to be a significant lump of folk who are desperate for it to be a wedge issue.

    BBC Scotland recently did a survey on public attitudes to trans issues and GRA reform in Scotland; the general consensus seemed to be that folk weren't that bothered and in general had a mild preference that life should be made a bit easier for trans people. You could almost see the cloud of thwarted disappointment above Pacific Quay.
    Quite.

    And whatever Tyndall thinks, as I said most trans people are invariably non-violent.

    Of course a few slip through or, worse, use this as a cover but there's violence everywhere and they are in the extreme. I've seen very violent cis women in ladies loos after a few drinks.
  • CorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorseBattery Posts: 21,436
    BartholomewRoberts said:

    CorrectHorseBattery said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    moonshine said:

    Cookie said:

    Malmesbury said:

    MoonRabbit said:

    SandyRentool said:

    Say what you like about Gavin Williamson, he never thumped anyone at the annual "Fireplace Salesman of the Year" awards.

    He wasn’t put between a rock and fireplace
    The Rock - further evidence that baldies can make it to the top.....
    A mistake I have only just learned I have been making all these years: Chris Rock <> Dwayne 'The Rock' Johnson. The latter is bald, the former was slapped by Will Smith.
    It’s always an interesting wake up call on pb realising how disconnected a lot of people are from modern culture. Comments like not being able to recognise Will Smith in the street. Really?

    Even The Rock’s gross box office is over $5bn, the 20th highest grossing actor of all time. And that’s his second successful career (as per Will Smith).
    A hilariously self-torpedoing post, because The Rock is Dwayne Johnson, while Chris Rock is Chris Rock.
    Laughing at people for medical conditions is supposed to be well beyond the pale nowadays so I wonder if this incident will mean that now everybody hates Chris?
    So we're pro cancel culture now?
    Joke
    ^
    ^
    ^
    ^
    Your Head

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Everybody_Hates_Chris
    No I got the reference, I just wondered if we are or not
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 33,487
    Heathener said:

    Richard_Tyndall said:

    Heathener said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    Cyclefree pointing out the obvious downthread:

    The main insight from this morning's LBC interview with Starmer is that Labour is going to get hit with a whole bunch of culture war wedge issues in the run-up to the next election. Those issues say a lot more about the distorted concerns of Westminster/media than the country.

    https://twitter.com/drjennings/status/1508384695234478082

    I'm not sure "women's rights & safety" are a "distorted concern"....

    Until the extremists on the Daily Mail and Telegraph started whipping this up most people really couldn't care a less about gender identity. If people want to identify as female or non-binary then that's fine. And, again, until the haters went on their rampage most women I know couldn't give a fig if a trans person uses the ladies. Trans people are almost invariably non-violent, despite what Allison Pearson and co tell you.

    You have some very warped views and they have nothing to do with the rights of people to be non-binary.
    Yawn
    So yes, you confirm you don't care about rape as long as we all follow the correct naming conventions. You really are a scumbag.
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 5,995
    IshmaelZ said:

    moonshine said:

    Cookie said:

    Malmesbury said:

    MoonRabbit said:

    SandyRentool said:

    Say what you like about Gavin Williamson, he never thumped anyone at the annual "Fireplace Salesman of the Year" awards.

    He wasn’t put between a rock and fireplace
    The Rock - further evidence that baldies can make it to the top.....
    A mistake I have only just learned I have been making all these years: Chris Rock <> Dwayne 'The Rock' Johnson. The latter is bald, the former was slapped by Will Smith.
    It’s always an interesting wake up call on pb realising how disconnected a lot of people are from modern culture. Comments like not being able to recognise Will Smith in the street. Really?

    Even The Rock’s gross box office is over $5bn, the 20th highest grossing actor of all time. And that’s his second successful career (as per Will Smith).
    A hilariously self-torpedoing post, because The Rock is Dwayne Johnson, while Chris Rock is Chris Rock.
    Was this aimed at me? I was referring to Dwayne Johnson’s wrestling career. You know. As The Rock. I am aware he is not the same person as Chris Rock. That was kind of the whole point of my post. Oh well…
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 7,085
    malcolmg said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    malcolmg said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    Richard_Tyndall said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/property/uk/hidden-crisis-hitting-property-market/

    Housing market collapsing from bottom up

    At long last, a good news story?

    We're well overdue a "correction" to the housing market. It would be fantastic if house price to earnings ratios could be corrected back to 3-4x rather than 7-8x ratios.
    Great destination, rubbish journey to get there
    A bit like going to the gym, "no pain, no gain".
    Yes, but a bit flippant. The pain will consist of converting very poor people into very poor homeless people, the gain will accrue further up the food chain.
    "All investments can go down in value as well as up".

    I'm sorry but I have little sympathy for people who are investing in housing that then see their investments lose value. For people living in their homes rather than using them as investments, they won't become homeless unless they can no longer afford the mortgage repayments which is just the same if they can't afford the rent. The supposed "value" of the house is not really that relevant so long as you're not planning on moving any time soon.
    CorrectHorseBattery said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/property/uk/hidden-crisis-hitting-property-market/

    Housing market collapsing from bottom up

    At long last, a good news story?

    We're well overdue a "correction" to the housing market. It would be fantastic if house price to earnings ratios could be corrected back to 3-4x rather than 7-8x ratios.
    Great destination, rubbish journey to get there
    A bit like going to the gym, "no pain, no gain".
    Yes, but a bit flippant. The pain will consist of converting very poor people into very poor homeless people, the gain will accrue further up the food chain.
    If you look at the graph in the Telegraph article, the rich's houses have got more expensive and more in demand.

    So another transfer of wealth
    So houses are becoming more affordable for the poor and less affordable for the rich - isn't that a good news story?

    Are you in favour of more affordable housing, or more "housing wealth", you seem to be giving out mixed signals.
    I think the problem you have - whilst I agree with you about houses being a place to live rather than an investment - is that the Government of all stripes has so utterly screwed the pension system over the last few decades that their home is the lifeline for many people to allow them to have any sort of retirement. More over as has already been noted, many people use their homes as collateral for all manner of enterprises, especially business start ups.

    So whilst I actually agree with you on balance about houses being homes not investments and also that I would welcome a big correction, this is just one part of a massively failed system and a correction in this area is only going to lead to massive pain and more failure in others.
    Oh I 100% agree with all that.

    The problem is that I don't see the pain the correction will result in as a reason not to have the correction.

    Its a bit like the issue with obesity. Eating healthier and exercising can be painful, its hard and difficult, but it doesn't make it the wrong thing to do. The easier thing to do is to say "I wouldn't start from here" but if you've got "here" and need to get "there" then there aren't any quick and easy and painless solutions, but that doesn't make wallowing and doing nothing the right solution either.
    Why would you crash house prices and have people homeless and unable to pay high rents so that some dickheads who could not afford them previously can now afford them. Do any Tories have a brain.
    Interesting that you consider young people who struggle to buy homes at an 8x house price to earnings ratio to be merely "dickheads".

    The only dickheads are those who have invested in a portfolio of properties expecting young people to keep paying them rent, and view that investment as their "pension". If they lose out, then sucks to be them, investments can go down as well as up.

    People being able to afford their own home is more important a priority than people's investments being secure.
    How many people do you know that have a portfolio of houses.
    There are quite a lot of them around actually, especially in University towns and cities.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 40,399
    CorrectHorseBattery said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    moonshine said:

    Cookie said:

    Malmesbury said:

    MoonRabbit said:

    SandyRentool said:

    Say what you like about Gavin Williamson, he never thumped anyone at the annual "Fireplace Salesman of the Year" awards.

    He wasn’t put between a rock and fireplace
    The Rock - further evidence that baldies can make it to the top.....
    A mistake I have only just learned I have been making all these years: Chris Rock <> Dwayne 'The Rock' Johnson. The latter is bald, the former was slapped by Will Smith.
    It’s always an interesting wake up call on pb realising how disconnected a lot of people are from modern culture. Comments like not being able to recognise Will Smith in the street. Really?

    Even The Rock’s gross box office is over $5bn, the 20th highest grossing actor of all time. And that’s his second successful career (as per Will Smith).
    A hilariously self-torpedoing post, because The Rock is Dwayne Johnson, while Chris Rock is Chris Rock.
    Laughing at people for medical conditions is supposed to be well beyond the pale nowadays so I wonder if this incident will mean that now everybody hates Chris?
    So we're pro cancel culture now?
    Nah, no need to cancel either of them, just funny watching Chris Rock take a beat down after shit chatting another dude's wife that he's got a personal beef with. I mean what did he expect to happen.
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,776
    DecrepiterJohnL said:

    HYUFD said:

    DecrepiterJohnL said:

    HYUFD said:

    LostPassword said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Last Secretary of State for Defence to progress to a GooS/PM?

    Philip Hammond was Secretary of State for Defence (2011-14) and later became Foreign Secretary (2014-16) and Chancellor of the Exchequer (2016-19), before becoming a non-person following the Johnson revolution.
    IDS was Shadow Defence Secretary then Tory Leader.

    Now it looks likely that the next Tory Leader will be Leader of the Opposition, the polls are close enough now for Boris to stay PM and lead the Tories into the next general election (although he could be re elected still of course even if Labour narrowly lead)
    Leader of the Opposition would not appeal to Boris. No free homes, cars and flights. I still think Boris will seek to retire at the top, which probably means before the next election, in order to cash in as the man who never lost, and who led Britain through successive crises.
    If Labour had a big lead that might be the case, the polls are close enough now however Boris could still win and his ego will therefore want to go for one final battle.

    Trump too of course in the end fought for re election in 2020 despite earlier talk he would bow out and although he lost it was still reasonably close
    Yes, it is all subject to polling, of course. And Trump is a billionaire so does not have to worry about who pays for the gold leaf wallpaper.
    Trump is a con man, so the supplier probably pays for the gold leaf wallpaper in the end
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 56,006
    malcolmg said:

    DavidL said:

    Wallace strikes me as a decent sort. Sensible rather than bright, goodish instincts and pragmatic. Definitely one of the better performers in this very ordinary cabinet. Whether he quite has the star dust for the top post, however, I am not so sure.

    But in politics, like those being chased by the bear, you don't need to be good or fast, just better or faster than the others.

    Shows how absolutely dire a state the Tories are in when he is a candidate for PM.
    Just remember the analogy of the bear Malcolm. It is poor but the alternatives are worse.

    A good example, at the moment, is the absolutely mindblowing failure that is the Ferry contract. There is an article in the Scotsman by a former Auditor General saying that Nicola really should resign for this. A fixed price contract for £97m for 2 ferries has turned into £240m for one rusting and unusable hulk and one that doesn't even exist. The latest cunning plan seems to be to blame Derek Mackay on the bases that (a) he was once Transport Minister (b) he is a bye word for utter incompetence and (c) he is no longer about.

    Which rather begs the question of why Nicola thought it was a good idea to promote him to Finance Secretary.

    I know you are not a fan of Nicola or the current leadership of the SNP but someone like Wallace would be well out of sight of the bear before that lot had their running shoes on.
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,776
    mwadams said:

    DecrepiterJohnL said:

    HYUFD said:

    DecrepiterJohnL said:

    HYUFD said:

    LostPassword said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Last Secretary of State for Defence to progress to a GooS/PM?

    Philip Hammond was Secretary of State for Defence (2011-14) and later became Foreign Secretary (2014-16) and Chancellor of the Exchequer (2016-19), before becoming a non-person following the Johnson revolution.
    IDS was Shadow Defence Secretary then Tory Leader.

    Now it looks likely that the next Tory Leader will be Leader of the Opposition, the polls are close enough now for Boris to stay PM and lead the Tories into the next general election (although he could be re elected still of course even if Labour narrowly lead)
    Leader of the Opposition would not appeal to Boris. No free homes, cars and flights. I still think Boris will seek to retire at the top, which probably means before the next election, in order to cash in as the man who never lost, and who led Britain through successive crises.
    If Labour had a big lead that might be the case, the polls are close enough now however Boris could still win and his ego will therefore want to go for one final battle.

    Trump too of course in the end fought for re election in 2020 despite earlier talk he would bow out and although he lost it was still reasonably close
    Yes, it is all subject to polling, of course. And Trump is a billionaire so does not have to worry about who pays for the gold leaf wallpaper.
    Trump is a con man, so the supplier probably pays for the gold leaf wallpaper in the end
    My lawyer advises me to add "allegedly, see accusations in the media passim"
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 44,517
    On topic, don't Lab and Cons always go inappropriately gooey eyed over anyone ex military? The amount of guff expelled over Dan Jarvis as a leader in waiting was silly.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    BartholomewRoberts said:

    mwadams said:

    Heathener said:

    moonshine said:

    Cookie said:

    Malmesbury said:

    MoonRabbit said:

    SandyRentool said:

    Say what you like about Gavin Williamson, he never thumped anyone at the annual "Fireplace Salesman of the Year" awards.

    He wasn’t put between a rock and fireplace
    The Rock - further evidence that baldies can make it to the top.....
    A mistake I have only just learned I have been making all these years: Chris Rock <> Dwayne 'The Rock' Johnson. The latter is bald, the former was slapped by Will Smith.
    It’s always an interesting wake up call on pb realising how disconnected a lot of people are from modern culture. Comments like not being able to recognise Will Smith in the street. Really?

    Even The Rock’s gross box office is over $5bn, the 20th highest grossing actor of all time. And that’s his second successful career (as per Will Smith).
    Yep I refrained from commenting in response this morning but the disconnect between pb and the public was really shown up by that remark earlier.

    Most everyone under 40 knows Will Smith by name, sight, probably voice.
    I would extend that to "under 50" - FPoBE started in 1990, and his movie career kicked off in 1997 (mid 20s being prime moviegoer demographic). You would have to have been living as a Hermit on Iona not to recognize him from that.
    Half the people I know my age could probably recite the Fresh Prince lyrics off the top of their head, even now thirty years later.

    I find the idea anyone doesn't know who he is pretty incomprehensible.
    Or, his name is so bland that they only think they don't know who he is. If you say the guy of colour in Men in Black you'll get substantially higher recognition
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,455
    BartholomewRoberts said:

    mwadams said:

    Heathener said:

    moonshine said:

    Cookie said:

    Malmesbury said:

    MoonRabbit said:

    SandyRentool said:

    Say what you like about Gavin Williamson, he never thumped anyone at the annual "Fireplace Salesman of the Year" awards.

    He wasn’t put between a rock and fireplace
    The Rock - further evidence that baldies can make it to the top.....
    A mistake I have only just learned I have been making all these years: Chris Rock <> Dwayne 'The Rock' Johnson. The latter is bald, the former was slapped by Will Smith.
    It’s always an interesting wake up call on pb realising how disconnected a lot of people are from modern culture. Comments like not being able to recognise Will Smith in the street. Really?

    Even The Rock’s gross box office is over $5bn, the 20th highest grossing actor of all time. And that’s his second successful career (as per Will Smith).
    Yep I refrained from commenting in response this morning but the disconnect between pb and the public was really shown up by that remark earlier.

    Most everyone under 40 knows Will Smith by name, sight, probably voice.
    I would extend that to "under 50" - FPoBE started in 1990, and his movie career kicked off in 1997 (mid 20s being prime moviegoer demographic). You would have to have been living as a Hermit on Iona not to recognize him from that.
    Half the people I know my age could probably recite the Fresh Prince lyrics off the top of their head, even now thirty years later.

    I find the idea anyone doesn't know who he is pretty incomprehensible.
    Will Smith has got in one little fight and his mom has got scared (probably)
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 7,085
    Richard_Tyndall said:

    Heathener said:

    Richard_Tyndall said:

    Heathener said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    Cyclefree pointing out the obvious downthread:

    The main insight from this morning's LBC interview with Starmer is that Labour is going to get hit with a whole bunch of culture war wedge issues in the run-up to the next election. Those issues say a lot more about the distorted concerns of Westminster/media than the country.

    https://twitter.com/drjennings/status/1508384695234478082

    I'm not sure "women's rights & safety" are a "distorted concern"....

    Until the extremists on the Daily Mail and Telegraph started whipping this up most people really couldn't care a less about gender identity. If people want to identify as female or non-binary then that's fine. And, again, until the haters went on their rampage most women I know couldn't give a fig if a trans person uses the ladies. Trans people are almost invariably non-violent, despite what Allison Pearson and co tell you.

    You have some very warped views and they have nothing to do with the rights of people to be non-binary.
    Yawn
    So yes, you confirm you don't care about rape as long as we all follow the correct naming conventions. You really are a scumbag.
    No I'm really not Richard. By name calling like that you just reveal yourself to be want you sling at others.

    I'm saying that it's wild exaggeration by you. As I mentioned, there will always be some exceptions and there are also some who use it as a cover. But by and large transsexuals are non-violent.

    As I say, I've seen a fair few violent women in the ladies after some drinks inside them. Which leads to a better discussion about the place of alcohol in society.

    As you, I suspect, know nothing of the topic and have never been inside a ladies I shall park your rudeness in the category of 'ignorance.'
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,981
    edited March 2022
    Nigelb said:

    geoffw said:

    I hope he has a dog named Gromit.

    Jean-Paul Sartre had a cat called Nothing.
    Deleted - cat not dog. Was thinking Rien le Chien was neat.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 33,487
    Heathener said:

    Theuniondivvie said:

    NickPalmer said:

    OldKingCole said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    Cyclefree pointing out the obvious downthread:

    The main insight from this morning's LBC interview with Starmer is that Labour is going to get hit with a whole bunch of culture war wedge issues in the run-up to the next election. Those issues say a lot more about the distorted concerns of Westminster/media than the country.

    https://twitter.com/drjennings/status/1508384695234478082

    I'm not sure "women's rights & safety" are a "distorted concern"....

    There are a lot of 'yebbuts' in those sorts of issues. For example, the man in the pub is initially against whatever it is, but then says 'yebbut' and turns out that on reflection he thinks it's quite a good idea.
    Like gay marriage. Your average 'straight' isn't bothered, finds it mildly amusing, but if it's not hurting anyone, and it protects the survivors rights on death, why not?
    I've some sympathy with Cyclefree's view as I have two friends who feel equally strongly. But it is nonetheless not something that comes up much on the doorstep even if one feels it should, and taking sides in culture wars is as fundamental a mistake as a councillor taking sides in a neighbour dispute - everybody involved (including whoever you back) feels you're not sufficiently on their side, need to say more, etc., and you just get sucked in. Meanwhile, everyone else thinks you're obsessed with something they don't care about because they've never met a trans person.

    It's a big deal in the Green Party, where quite a few activists are very deeply entrenched on both sides - I know some senior party people who said they'd quit if the leadership candidate with the "wrong" view got elected.
    In general people who feel strongly about an issue are often incapable of accepting that others may not feel strongly (let's not even consider them accepting the validity of opposing views). There also appears to be a significant lump of folk who are desperate for it to be a wedge issue.

    BBC Scotland recently did a survey on public attitudes to trans issues and GRA reform in Scotland; the general consensus seemed to be that folk weren't that bothered and in general had a mild preference that life should be made a bit easier for trans people. You could almost see the cloud of thwarted disappointment above Pacific Quay.
    Quite.

    And whatever Tyndall thinks, as I said most trans people are invariably non-violent.

    Of course a few slip through or, worse, use this as a cover but there's violence everywhere and they are in the extreme. I've seen very violent cis women in ladies loos after a few drinks.
    Ah not just a scumbag but an ignorant scumbag.

    Invariably definition - "in every case or on every occasion; always."

    So if a 'few slip through' then they cannot be 'invariably' non-violent.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 15,065
    edited March 2022
    BartholomewRoberts said:

    mwadams said:

    Heathener said:

    moonshine said:

    Cookie said:

    Malmesbury said:

    MoonRabbit said:

    SandyRentool said:

    Say what you like about Gavin Williamson, he never thumped anyone at the annual "Fireplace Salesman of the Year" awards.

    He wasn’t put between a rock and fireplace
    The Rock - further evidence that baldies can make it to the top.....
    A mistake I have only just learned I have been making all these years: Chris Rock <> Dwayne 'The Rock' Johnson. The latter is bald, the former was slapped by Will Smith.
    It’s always an interesting wake up call on pb realising how disconnected a lot of people are from modern culture. Comments like not being able to recognise Will Smith in the street. Really?

    Even The Rock’s gross box office is over $5bn, the 20th highest grossing actor of all time. And that’s his second successful career (as per Will Smith).
    Yep I refrained from commenting in response this morning but the disconnect between pb and the public was really shown up by that remark earlier.

    Most everyone under 40 knows Will Smith by name, sight, probably voice.
    I would extend that to "under 50" - FPoBE started in 1990, and his movie career kicked off in 1997 (mid 20s being prime moviegoer demographic). You would have to have been living as a Hermit on Iona not to recognize him from that.
    Half the people I know my age could probably recite the Fresh Prince lyrics off the top of their head, even now thirty years later.

    I find the idea anyone doesn't know who he is pretty incomprehensible.
    The question can only be answered by hard reliable data where a genuinely random group of people are asked non leading questions and all that. The results would be interesting.

    PS Never heard of whoever it is we are talking about.

  • CorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorseBattery Posts: 21,436
    MaxPB said:

    CorrectHorseBattery said:

    BartholomewRoberts said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    moonshine said:

    Cookie said:

    Malmesbury said:

    MoonRabbit said:

    SandyRentool said:

    Say what you like about Gavin Williamson, he never thumped anyone at the annual "Fireplace Salesman of the Year" awards.

    He wasn’t put between a rock and fireplace
    The Rock - further evidence that baldies can make it to the top.....
    A mistake I have only just learned I have been making all these years: Chris Rock <> Dwayne 'The Rock' Johnson. The latter is bald, the former was slapped by Will Smith.
    It’s always an interesting wake up call on pb realising how disconnected a lot of people are from modern culture. Comments like not being able to recognise Will Smith in the street. Really?

    Even The Rock’s gross box office is over $5bn, the 20th highest grossing actor of all time. And that’s his second successful career (as per Will Smith).
    A hilariously self-torpedoing post, because The Rock is Dwayne Johnson, while Chris Rock is Chris Rock.
    Laughing at people for medical conditions is supposed to be well beyond the pale nowadays so I wonder if this incident will mean that now everybody hates Chris?
    So we're pro cancel culture now?
    Nah, no need to cancel either of them, just funny watching Chris Rock take a beat down after shit chatting another dude's wife that he's got a personal beef with. I mean what did he expect to happen.
    Violence is never the response.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 33,487
    Heathener said:

    Richard_Tyndall said:

    Heathener said:

    Richard_Tyndall said:

    Heathener said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    Cyclefree pointing out the obvious downthread:

    The main insight from this morning's LBC interview with Starmer is that Labour is going to get hit with a whole bunch of culture war wedge issues in the run-up to the next election. Those issues say a lot more about the distorted concerns of Westminster/media than the country.

    https://twitter.com/drjennings/status/1508384695234478082

    I'm not sure "women's rights & safety" are a "distorted concern"....

    Until the extremists on the Daily Mail and Telegraph started whipping this up most people really couldn't care a less about gender identity. If people want to identify as female or non-binary then that's fine. And, again, until the haters went on their rampage most women I know couldn't give a fig if a trans person uses the ladies. Trans people are almost invariably non-violent, despite what Allison Pearson and co tell you.

    You have some very warped views and they have nothing to do with the rights of people to be non-binary.
    Yawn
    So yes, you confirm you don't care about rape as long as we all follow the correct naming conventions. You really are a scumbag.
    No I'm really not Richard. By name calling like that you just reveal yourself to be want you sling at others.

    I'm saying that it's wild exaggeration by you. As I mentioned, there will always be some exceptions and there are also some who use it as a cover. But by and large transsexuals are non-violent.

    As I say, I've seen a fair few violent women in the ladies after some drinks inside them. Which leads to a better discussion about the place of alcohol in society.

    As you, I suspect, know nothing of the topic and have never been inside a ladies I shall park your rudeness in the category of 'ignorance.'
    Whereas I shall park you back in the category of fuckwit
This discussion has been closed.

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