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At last – I am able to have a holiday – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 11,729
edited April 2021 in General
imageAt last – I am able to have a holiday – politicalbetting.com

Like millions of other I feel as though I’ve been cooped up in my home office for more than a year. Well I’m going on holiday to North Northumberland in the morning returning in a week to get my second jab.

Read the full story here

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Comments

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    Enjoy.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 28,059
    Third. And don't be fetching any viruses up here. :wink:
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 28,059
    edited April 2021
    Alnmouth?
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,279
    Enjoy, nice view.

    All seats for Northumberland council are up for election in May though so you may not escape the local elections
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,012

    This means I can have a very nice quiet relaxing next eight days then based on past experiences.

    Which first, Taiwan war or Donbas? Second wave to explode in China precipitating economic collapse?
  • Options
    Foxy said:

    This means I can have a very nice quiet relaxing next eight days then based on past experiences.

    Which first, Taiwan war or Donbas? Second wave to explode in China precipitating economic collapse?
    Texas seceding.
  • Options
    sladeslade Posts: 1,941
    Regrets, I've had a few. Just surfing the web and found this. My very first car was a 1936 Singer Le Mans which I bought for £25. It would now cost me approx $150,000 to buy one now.
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,316
    Foxy said:

    This means I can have a very nice quiet relaxing next eight days then based on past experiences.

    Which first, Taiwan war or Donbas? Second wave to explode in China precipitating economic collapse?
    Samantha Power was comparing the situation in Myanmar to Syria in 2011.

    https://twitter.com/SamanthaJPower/status/1382438431989506049
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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,796
    That looks like a lovely spot Mike. I hope that the weather is kind to you.
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Well there goes the neighborhood Ukraine.

    Have a good holiday Mike!
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    TimTTimT Posts: 6,328

    Foxy said:

    This means I can have a very nice quiet relaxing next eight days then based on past experiences.

    Which first, Taiwan war or Donbas? Second wave to explode in China precipitating economic collapse?
    Texas seceding.
    European Parliament rejecting the Brexit deal.
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    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    Northumberland is a lovely place.

    On Covid and Brazil

    This just leaves me in a cold sweat

    "Some Brazilian hospitals have run out of sedatives, forcing doctors to use restraints while coronavirus patients are intubated

    "I never thought I would be living through something like this," a doctor says. "The patient is submitted to a form of torture"

    https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1382790485329252354
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    CatManCatMan Posts: 2,819
    As someone else has already said, Russian invasion of Ukraine now nailed on!
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    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,750
    "AT LAST – I AM ABLE TO HAVE A HOLIDAY"

    Wasn't that the SECOND thing Winston Churchill said, upon hearing the results of the 1945 general election?

    Have fun, Mike - and don't forget to send up a postcard!
  • Options
    CatManCatMan Posts: 2,819
    Foxy said:

    This means I can have a very nice quiet relaxing next eight days then based on past experiences.

    Which first, Taiwan war or Donbas? Second wave to explode in China precipitating economic collapse?
    US Government confirms Alien life
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    MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 7,382

    Have a great holiday. You have no idea how great a help this site has been over the last year. It has for many years been an interesting source of good betting information. But over the past hellish 13 months it has also been a great solace to read the views of well informed and sensible people when the media has been so full of tripe. You are an absolute hero and I look forward to the day when I am allowed to buy you a drink and hug you.

    Thank you. That's really appreciated.
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,606
    Have a great holiday Mike.

    There seems to be no jealous emoji on Vanilla.
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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,796
    I saw earlier that one hospital in India had doubled its bed capacity for Covid patients by putting them two to a bed.

    And things are still getting worse there.
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    MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 7,382
    Does anybody know if I'll be able to pop across the border into Scotland?
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    TimT said:

    Foxy said:

    This means I can have a very nice quiet relaxing next eight days then based on past experiences.

    Which first, Taiwan war or Donbas? Second wave to explode in China precipitating economic collapse?
    Texas seceding.
    European Parliament rejecting the Brexit deal.
    I've been prepping for that at work for a while.
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    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,269
    Have a great holiday Mike, the site goes from strength to strength.

    Thank you.
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    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,012
    edited April 2021
    Floater said:

    Northumberland is a lovely place.

    On Covid and Brazil

    This just leaves me in a cold sweat

    "Some Brazilian hospitals have run out of sedatives, forcing doctors to use restraints while coronavirus patients are intubated

    "I never thought I would be living through something like this," a doctor says. "The patient is submitted to a form of torture"

    https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1382790485329252354

    We came close to running out of some agents in both waves. Anaesthetic agents, kidney filtration kit, even oxygen bandwidth.

    My medical student this morning is still doing bank shifts as HCA on ICU. Only a third of the ICU nurses remain at present, the rest are conscripts from the press gangs, though some proper staff may return. Staff attrition is horrific.
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    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,269
    edited April 2021

    Does anybody know if I'll be able to pop across the border into Scotland?

    I was told that the border has been closed for several months. I guess that could be untrue however?
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    ridaligoridaligo Posts: 174
    slade said:

    Regrets, I've had a few. Just surfing the web and found this. My very first car was a 1936 Singer Le Mans which I bought for £25. It would now cost me approx $150,000 to buy one now.

    For me, 1974 Escort Mk1 bought for £3,000 in 1988 ... now £50,000 for a good one.

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    TimTTimT Posts: 6,328
    ridaligo said:

    slade said:

    Regrets, I've had a few. Just surfing the web and found this. My very first car was a 1936 Singer Le Mans which I bought for £25. It would now cost me approx $150,000 to buy one now.

    For me, 1974 Escort Mk1 bought for £3,000 in 1988 ... now £50,000 for a good one.

    Not sure I should be admitting to a Austin Maxi 1800 for GBP300
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,587

    Have a great holiday. You have no idea how great a help this site has been over the last year. It has for many years been an interesting source of good betting information. But over the past hellish 13 months it has also been a great solace to read the views of well informed and sensible people when the media has been so full of tripe. You are an absolute hero and I look forward to the day when I am allowed to buy you a drink and hug you.

    Absolutely. Although I am not sure I recall being on here that particular day, the site has helped us all get through.
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    LeonLeon Posts: 47,785
    Foxy said:

    Floater said:

    Northumberland is a lovely place.

    On Covid and Brazil

    This just leaves me in a cold sweat

    "Some Brazilian hospitals have run out of sedatives, forcing doctors to use restraints while coronavirus patients are intubated

    "I never thought I would be living through something like this," a doctor says. "The patient is submitted to a form of torture"

    https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1382790485329252354

    We came close to running out of some agents in both waves. Anaesthetic agents, kidney filtration kit, even oxygen bandwidth.

    My medical student this morning is still doing bank shifts as HCA on ICU. Only a third of the ICU nurses remain at present, the rest are conscripts from the press gangs, though some proper staff may return. Staff attrition is horrific.
    That is horrific

    At least give them some fucking pethidine. I don't want to drown in my own lung fluid. in total agony
  • Options
    ridaligoridaligo Posts: 174
    TimT said:

    ridaligo said:

    slade said:

    Regrets, I've had a few. Just surfing the web and found this. My very first car was a 1936 Singer Le Mans which I bought for £25. It would now cost me approx $150,000 to buy one now.

    For me, 1974 Escort Mk1 bought for £3,000 in 1988 ... now £50,000 for a good one.

    Not sure I should be admitting to a Austin Maxi 1800 for GBP300
    At least it wasn’t an Allegro!
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    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,012
    ridaligo said:

    slade said:

    Regrets, I've had a few. Just surfing the web and found this. My very first car was a 1936 Singer Le Mans which I bought for £25. It would now cost me approx $150,000 to buy one now.

    For me, 1974 Escort Mk1 bought for £3,000 in 1988 ... now £50,000 for a good one.

    1972 Simca 1301s for me. Cost £225 in 1983, but can be had from £3500 now.

    Though who in their right mind would want one!
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    TimTTimT Posts: 6,328
    ridaligo said:

    TimT said:

    ridaligo said:

    slade said:

    Regrets, I've had a few. Just surfing the web and found this. My very first car was a 1936 Singer Le Mans which I bought for £25. It would now cost me approx $150,000 to buy one now.

    For me, 1974 Escort Mk1 bought for £3,000 in 1988 ... now £50,000 for a good one.

    Not sure I should be admitting to a Austin Maxi 1800 for GBP300
    At least it wasn’t an Allegro!
    H reg, so 1969.
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    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,466
    edited April 2021
    Have a wonderful holiday in the hidden gem that is North Northumberland

    My family moved to Berwick when I was 10 and upto starting work in Edinburgh when I was 17 I had the most fantastic time canoeing, sailing, playing golf, football and cricket, cross county running and of course exploring the great beaches and enjoying Bamburgh with its castle and connection to Grace Darling , also Holy Island

    I highly recommend it for a 'staycation' holiday that will not disappoint
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,012
    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    Floater said:

    Northumberland is a lovely place.

    On Covid and Brazil

    This just leaves me in a cold sweat

    "Some Brazilian hospitals have run out of sedatives, forcing doctors to use restraints while coronavirus patients are intubated

    "I never thought I would be living through something like this," a doctor says. "The patient is submitted to a form of torture"

    https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1382790485329252354

    We came close to running out of some agents in both waves. Anaesthetic agents, kidney filtration kit, even oxygen bandwidth.

    My medical student this morning is still doing bank shifts as HCA on ICU. Only a third of the ICU nurses remain at present, the rest are conscripts from the press gangs, though some proper staff may return. Staff attrition is horrific.
    That is horrific

    At least give them some fucking pethidine. I don't want to drown in my own lung fluid. in total agony
    Let's hope we never go back to those dark days again. I don't think the NHS or country could take another major wave. I don't think we will, but many countries still have a long way to go. India is scary, but some less visible bits of Asia too.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,785

    Have a great holiday. You have no idea how great a help this site has been over the last year. It has for many years been an interesting source of good betting information. But over the past hellish 13 months it has also been a great solace to read the views of well informed and sensible people when the media has been so full of tripe. You are an absolute hero and I look forward to the day when I am allowed to buy you a drink and hug you.

    Thank you. That's really appreciated.
    Likewise. Enjoy. Your site has kept me sane for a year (unlike some commenters ;) )

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    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,117
    Floater said:

    Northumberland is a lovely place.

    You've clearly never been to Ashington
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,279
    edited April 2021
    Buckingham Palace announces the 30 guests who have been invited to Prince Philip's funeral on Saturday.

    They are: The Queen, Prince Charles, Camilla, Princess Anne and husband, and their children and Mike Tindall, Prince Andrew his daughters and their husbands, Prince Edward and his wife and children, William, Catherine and Harry, The Duke of Kent, the Duke of Gloucester, Princess Alexandra, Bernhard, Prince of Baden, Donatus, Landgrave of Hesse, Philipp, Prince of Hohenlohe-Langenburg, The Earl of Snowdon, Lady Sarah Chatto and husband and Countess Mountbatten of Burma.

    No place for Fergie nor the Duchesses of Gloucester and Kent nor Prince and Princess Michael of Kent
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9475169/Prince-Philips-funeral-guest-list-30-mourners-include-close-friend-Penny-Brabourne.html#comments
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    Floater said:

    Northumberland is a lovely place.

    You've clearly never been to Ashington
    As a young teenager I did a cross country run in Ashington in dreadful cold, rain, and mud that was like running through treacle

    Mind you it was the birthplace of the Charlton brothers, so it was not all bad
  • Options
    FenmanFenman Posts: 1,047
    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    Floater said:

    Northumberland is a lovely place.

    On Covid and Brazil

    This just leaves me in a cold sweat

    "Some Brazilian hospitals have run out of sedatives, forcing doctors to use restraints while coronavirus patients are intubated

    "I never thought I would be living through something like this," a doctor says. "The patient is submitted to a form of torture"

    https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1382790485329252354

    We came close to running out of some agents in both waves. Anaesthetic agents, kidney filtration kit, even oxygen bandwidth.

    My medical student this morning is still doing bank shifts as HCA on ICU. Only a third of the ICU nurses remain at present, the rest are conscripts from the press gangs, though some proper staff may return. Staff attrition is horrific.
    That is horrific

    At least give them some fucking pethidine. I don't want to drown in my own lung fluid. in total agony
    My wife has just quit. She feels exhausted and unappreciated. She's going back to a care home. The impression I get is that while patients appreciate the NHS, staff don't.
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,685
    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    Floater said:

    Northumberland is a lovely place.

    On Covid and Brazil

    This just leaves me in a cold sweat

    "Some Brazilian hospitals have run out of sedatives, forcing doctors to use restraints while coronavirus patients are intubated

    "I never thought I would be living through something like this," a doctor says. "The patient is submitted to a form of torture"

    https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1382790485329252354

    We came close to running out of some agents in both waves. Anaesthetic agents, kidney filtration kit, even oxygen bandwidth.

    My medical student this morning is still doing bank shifts as HCA on ICU. Only a third of the ICU nurses remain at present, the rest are conscripts from the press gangs, though some proper staff may return. Staff attrition is horrific.
    That is horrific

    At least give them some fucking pethidine. I don't want to drown in my own lung fluid. in total agony
    I would expect, in the crucible of covid, for lots of novel therapies and creative strategies for covid to emerge - and perhaps they are, but we don't seem to hear about them. It seems instead that the situation is just becoming a helpless, hopeless, grind for those concerned.
  • Options
    HYUFD said:

    Buckingham Palace announces the 30 guests who have been invited to Prince Philip's funeral on Saturday.

    They are: The Queen, Prince Charles, Camilla, Princess Anne and husband, and their children and Mike Tindall, Prince Andrew his daughters and their husbands, Prince Edward and his wife and children, William, Catherine and Harry, The Duke of Kent, the Duke of Gloucester, Princess Alexandra, Bernhard, Prince of Baden, Donatus, Landgrave of Hesse, Philipp, Prince of Hohenlohe-Langenburg, The Earl of Snowdon, Lady Sarah Chatto and husband and Countess Mountbatten of Burma.

    No place for Fergie nor the Duchesses of Gloucester and Kent nor Prince and Princess Michael of Kent
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9475169/Prince-Philips-funeral-guest-list-30-mourners-include-close-friend-Penny-Brabourne.html#comments

    The unfortunate part about this is that Peter Philips has been placed between William and Harry in a clear statement that their relationship is fractured

    Why on earth they could not come together for this occasion, of all occasions, is just simply sad
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,785
    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    Floater said:

    Northumberland is a lovely place.

    On Covid and Brazil

    This just leaves me in a cold sweat

    "Some Brazilian hospitals have run out of sedatives, forcing doctors to use restraints while coronavirus patients are intubated

    "I never thought I would be living through something like this," a doctor says. "The patient is submitted to a form of torture"

    https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1382790485329252354

    We came close to running out of some agents in both waves. Anaesthetic agents, kidney filtration kit, even oxygen bandwidth.

    My medical student this morning is still doing bank shifts as HCA on ICU. Only a third of the ICU nurses remain at present, the rest are conscripts from the press gangs, though some proper staff may return. Staff attrition is horrific.
    That is horrific

    At least give them some fucking pethidine. I don't want to drown in my own lung fluid. in total agony
    Let's hope we never go back to those dark days again. I don't think the NHS or country could take another major wave. I don't think we will, but many countries still have a long way to go. India is scary, but some less visible bits of Asia too.
    As I understand it, a death from unsedated, unoxygenated Covid is absolutely hideous: long minutes, even hours, of "dry drowning". Fucking awful

    I don't understand how any remotely organised country could run out of basic morphine, pethidine, benzos, xanax, etc? Brazil is not Switzerland but it is not dirt poor either

    Surely it is better to sedate people to death if you have no other choice

    i agree we would struggle, so badly, with another bad wave. I believe humanity would struggle, in toto. India looks terrible

    If this plague comes back for another worse attack I would expect wars, if only as a distraction from the misery
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 28,059

    Floater said:

    Northumberland is a lovely place.

    You've clearly never been to Ashington
    I see that.
    And raise you Seaton Deleval.
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    solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,623

    Does anybody know if I'll be able to pop across the border into Scotland?

    I was supposed to be going to Northumberland first week of May, but was postponed a few months back as it wasn't clear I'd be able to do the opposite and pop across from Scotland.

    Rescheduled for mid-September.

    Better happen, as it was originally meant to happen May 2020, then May 2021...
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,785

    Does anybody know if I'll be able to pop across the border into Scotland?

    I was supposed to be going to Northumberland first week of May, but was postponed a few months back as it wasn't clear I'd be able to do the opposite and pop across from Scotland.

    Rescheduled for mid-September.

    Better happen, as it was originally meant to happen May 2020, then May 2021...
    I was meant to be going to Nicaragua for business (first time ever in central America) in spring 2020. Then it was late 2020. Then it became "early 2021". Now it is, maybe, "late 2021", if we're lucky. But really no one expects it before "early" 2022?

    I sometimes wonder if this well ever quite end, and if travel will ever return as we knew it
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,012
    Fenman said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    Floater said:

    Northumberland is a lovely place.

    On Covid and Brazil

    This just leaves me in a cold sweat

    "Some Brazilian hospitals have run out of sedatives, forcing doctors to use restraints while coronavirus patients are intubated

    "I never thought I would be living through something like this," a doctor says. "The patient is submitted to a form of torture"

    https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1382790485329252354

    We came close to running out of some agents in both waves. Anaesthetic agents, kidney filtration kit, even oxygen bandwidth.

    My medical student this morning is still doing bank shifts as HCA on ICU. Only a third of the ICU nurses remain at present, the rest are conscripts from the press gangs, though some proper staff may return. Staff attrition is horrific.
    That is horrific

    At least give them some fucking pethidine. I don't want to drown in my own lung fluid. in total agony
    My wife has just quit. She feels exhausted and unappreciated. She's going back to a care home. The impression I get is that while patients appreciate the NHS, staff don't.
    Yes, no way is Mrs Foxy going back to ICU. She knows her limits. She is having a well earned week off on the IoW seeing her mum, but eager to get back to her regular work.
  • Options
    solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,623
    Leon said:

    Does anybody know if I'll be able to pop across the border into Scotland?

    I was supposed to be going to Northumberland first week of May, but was postponed a few months back as it wasn't clear I'd be able to do the opposite and pop across from Scotland.

    Rescheduled for mid-September.

    Better happen, as it was originally meant to happen May 2020, then May 2021...
    I was meant to be going to Nicaragua for business (first time ever in central America) in spring 2020. Then it was late 2020. Then it became "early 2021". Now it is, maybe, "late 2021", if we're lucky. But really no one expects it before "early" 2022?

    I sometimes wonder if this well ever quite end, and if travel will ever return as we knew it
    Yeah in that context Nicaragua might as well be Mars. Northumberland is now just Australia. Or something.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,012
    Leon said:

    Does anybody know if I'll be able to pop across the border into Scotland?

    I was supposed to be going to Northumberland first week of May, but was postponed a few months back as it wasn't clear I'd be able to do the opposite and pop across from Scotland.

    Rescheduled for mid-September.

    Better happen, as it was originally meant to happen May 2020, then May 2021...
    I was meant to be going to Nicaragua for business (first time ever in central America) in spring 2020. Then it was late 2020. Then it became "early 2021". Now it is, maybe, "late 2021", if we're lucky. But really no one expects it before "early" 2022?

    I sometimes wonder if this well ever quite end, and if travel will ever return as we knew it
    Is Nicaraguan Flint particularly prized by artisans, or is it that Nicaraguans are particularly in need of dildos?
  • Options
    MortimerMortimer Posts: 13,960

    Have a great holiday. You have no idea how great a help this site has been over the last year. It has for many years been an interesting source of good betting information. But over the past hellish 13 months it has also been a great solace to read the views of well informed and sensible people when the media has been so full of tripe. You are an absolute hero and I look forward to the day when I am allowed to buy you a drink and hug you.

    Well said.

    Have a great break, Mike.
  • Options
    YokesYokes Posts: 1,203
    edited April 2021
    Ukraine: The increase is statements of concern & talk of consequences out of Washington suggests they really do fear Russia will do something.

    If you are a kleptocractic, effective dictator of a leader like Putin is, how do you take such talk but with the absence of actual threat and the absence of preventative measures.

    Pretty much like every dictator in history has reacted before, probably.

  • Options
    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 27,182
    edited April 2021
    O/T — In London today I was surprised to find myself giving directions to Japanese tourists. I had thought that all tourism from other countries was off the cards atm.
  • Options
    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Does anybody know if I'll be able to pop across the border into Scotland?

    I have just popped up and down again, Devon to Inverness, without let or hindrance.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,287
    Floater said:

    Northumberland is a lovely place.

    On Covid and Brazil

    This just leaves me in a cold sweat

    "Some Brazilian hospitals have run out of sedatives, forcing doctors to use restraints while coronavirus patients are intubated

    "I never thought I would be living through something like this," a doctor says. "The patient is submitted to a form of torture"

    https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1382790485329252354

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/14/us/politics/trump-coronavirus-mar-a-lago.html
  • Options
    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    Yokes said:

    Ukraine: The increase is statements of concern & talk of consequences out of Washington suggests they really do fear Russia will do something.

    If you are a kleptocractic, effective dictator of a leader like Putin is, how do you take such talk but with the absence of actual threat and the absence of preventative measures.

    Pretty much like every dictator in history has reacted before, probably.

    I think the probability now is that they act.

  • Options
    NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,380
    Have a lovely time, and, as others have said, thank you so much for keeping us all entertained throughout these difficult times!
  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    slade said:

    Regrets, I've had a few. Just surfing the web and found this. My very first car was a 1936 Singer Le Mans which I bought for £25. It would now cost me approx $150,000 to buy one now.

    My Dad used to have a Dino. Blamed me for forcing me to sell it as you couldn’t fit a baby bassinet (me) and a toddler (my brother) in the back
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 63,209
    edited April 2021

    This means I can have a very nice quiet relaxing next eight days then based on past experiences.

    Indeed. I can’t think what could possibly go wrong.

    (Texas seceding wouldn’t necessarily be a bad thing.)
  • Options
    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    Floater said:

    Northumberland is a lovely place.

    On Covid and Brazil

    This just leaves me in a cold sweat

    "Some Brazilian hospitals have run out of sedatives, forcing doctors to use restraints while coronavirus patients are intubated

    "I never thought I would be living through something like this," a doctor says. "The patient is submitted to a form of torture"

    https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1382790485329252354

    We came close to running out of some agents in both waves. Anaesthetic agents, kidney filtration kit, even oxygen bandwidth.

    My medical student this morning is still doing bank shifts as HCA on ICU. Only a third of the ICU nurses remain at present, the rest are conscripts from the press gangs, though some proper staff may return. Staff attrition is horrific.
    That is horrific

    At least give them some fucking pethidine. I don't want to drown in my own lung fluid. in total agony
    When I saw that story about Brazil I was thinking I would rather die than be intubated like that
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,587
    Andy_JS said:

    O/T — In London today I was surprised to find myself giving directions to Japanese tourists. I had thought that all tourism from other countries was off the cards atm.

    I met some German tourists on the beach here earlier this week
  • Options
    another_richardanother_richard Posts: 25,158
    Have fun Mike.

    Covid has been almost eradicated in that part of the country:

    https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/interactive-map
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    Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 7,981
    @MikeSmithson - have a great time and enjoy your holiday
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 27,182
    Best wishes to OGH for the Northumberland holiday.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,785
    As far as I can tell, this is true


    Facebook just prevented me sharing this on my (seldom used - I hate FB - FB account). Perhaps it is deemed Fake News. But is it?


    https://twitter.com/alexsalvinews/status/1382825704572788737?s=21
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    Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 7,981
    Leon said:

    As far as I can tell, this is true


    Facebook just prevented me sharing this on my (seldom used - I hate FB - FB account). Perhaps it is deemed Fake News. But is it?


    https://twitter.com/alexsalvinews/status/1382825704572788737?s=21

    Looking at the other tweets on that account, most of them are Trumpian or far-right or conspiracy stuff. Based on the other tweets, this one is probably much the same.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,279
    France's Covid death toll tops 100,000, joining the US, UK, India, Brazil, Russia, Italy and Mexico who have also passed that milestone
    'https://twitter.com/DarrenGBNews/status/1382796960210501636?s=20
  • Options
    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    Leon said:

    As far as I can tell, this is true


    Facebook just prevented me sharing this on my (seldom used - I hate FB - FB account). Perhaps it is deemed Fake News. But is it?


    https://twitter.com/alexsalvinews/status/1382825704572788737?s=21

    I see they banned the guy who posted the videos of the CNN guy admitting bias
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,712
    Leon said:

    As far as I can tell, this is true


    Facebook just prevented me sharing this on my (seldom used - I hate FB - FB account). Perhaps it is deemed Fake News. But is it?


    https://twitter.com/alexsalvinews/status/1382825704572788737?s=21

    The tweet says: Facebook is blocking links to this New York Post story detailing the finances of Black Lives Matter co-founder Patrisse Khan-Cullors from being shared on the platform.

    Didn't we do this (the underlying story) the other day? I've no idea what Facebook makes of it.
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,750
    Could it be . . . that going on a "break" to some semi-explored section of wildest Northumberland is just a dodge by OGH. Similar to that used by the elderly Sherlock Holmes when the famed sleuth supposedly "retired"to keep bees in Sussex. Yeah, right!

    My own quasi-learned guess, is that he (Mike, not Sherlock) is REALLY engaged in secret undercover campaigning in some already benighted part of Further England, for god-knows what sinister ideology and/or self-serving agenda.

    Cave suffragator!
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,287
    Leon said:

    As far as I can tell, this is true


    Facebook just prevented me sharing this on my (seldom used - I hate FB - FB account). Perhaps it is deemed Fake News. But is it?


    https://twitter.com/alexsalvinews/status/1382825704572788737?s=21

    It's also odd to ban what is, basically, a non story. She inherited some money. She bought two properties, both of which are nice, but neither of which is particularly ostentatious. (One was for something like $500k - but now worth $800k!!!, While the other was for a little more than a million.)

    The highlight of the article seems to be that she looked (online) at some property in Barbados, that she can't afford and didn't visit or purchase.
  • Options
    Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905
    edited April 2021
    Andy_JS said:

    O/T — In London today I was surprised to find myself giving directions to Japanese tourists. I had thought that all tourism from other countries was off the cards atm.

    It would appear that the Government is, in essence, operating an open door policy for visitors from the whole world, except those travelling from red list countries (and presumably visitors from e.g. Brazil could just get around the feeble rules by travelling via a third country and lying on whatever declarations they have to make when they get here, if sufficiently determined to do so?)

    Like I said the other day, it's so reckless and illogical a policy that it only really makes sense if one assumes that ministers want to import variants, in order to have surge testing, panic in the press, and thus to maintain the general atmosphere of emergency. The emergency is wildly popular with the Tories' frightened elderly supporters, it gives them cover to act with impunity, and it serves further to neuter an already ineffectual Opposition. Why would they ever want it to end?
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,033
    Good morning, everyone.

    Hope you have a relaxing holiday, Mr. Smithson.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,287

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T — In London today I was surprised to find myself giving directions to Japanese tourists. I had thought that all tourism from other countries was off the cards atm.

    It would appear that the Government is, in essence, operating an open door policy for visitors from the whole world, except those travelling from red list countries (and presumably visitors from e.g. Brazil could just get around the feeble rules by travelling via a third country and lying on whatever declarations they have to make when they get here, if sufficiently determined to do so?)

    Like I said the other day, it's so reckless and illogical a policy that it only really makes sense if one assumes that ministers want to import variants, in order to have surge testing, panic in the press, and thus to maintain the general atmosphere of emergency. The emergency is wildly popular with the Tories' frightened elderly supporters, it gives them cover to act with impunity, and it serves further to neuter an already ineffectual Opposition. Why would they ever want it to end?
    Because there are more votes in ending lockdown than continuing it? And free economies are more successful than locked down ones?
  • Options
    swing_voterswing_voter Posts: 1,437
    Whats the view on the impact of Greensill on the Scottish elections..... London's stock cant have slid much lower - surely this sees the Independence cause creep that little bit closer.... (never though D Cameron would come back to haunt the Union)
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,193

    Could it be . . . that going on a "break" to some semi-explored section of wildest Northumberland is just a dodge by OGH. Similar to that used by the elderly Sherlock Holmes when the famed sleuth supposedly "retired"to keep bees in Sussex. Yeah, right!

    My own quasi-learned guess, is that he (Mike, not Sherlock) is REALLY engaged in secret undercover campaigning in some already benighted part of Further England, for god-knows what sinister ideology and/or self-serving agenda.

    Cave suffragator!

    Personally, I don't reckon he'll make it past Hartlepool....

    He's clearly there masterminding the Yellow Peril's Great Comeback. It's the poor Lady OGH you have to feel sorry for.
  • Options
    Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905
    rcs1000 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T — In London today I was surprised to find myself giving directions to Japanese tourists. I had thought that all tourism from other countries was off the cards atm.

    It would appear that the Government is, in essence, operating an open door policy for visitors from the whole world, except those travelling from red list countries (and presumably visitors from e.g. Brazil could just get around the feeble rules by travelling via a third country and lying on whatever declarations they have to make when they get here, if sufficiently determined to do so?)

    Like I said the other day, it's so reckless and illogical a policy that it only really makes sense if one assumes that ministers want to import variants, in order to have surge testing, panic in the press, and thus to maintain the general atmosphere of emergency. The emergency is wildly popular with the Tories' frightened elderly supporters, it gives them cover to act with impunity, and it serves further to neuter an already ineffectual Opposition. Why would they ever want it to end?
    Because there are more votes in ending lockdown than continuing it? And free economies are more successful than locked down ones?
    1. Are there? Much of the population remains irrationally terrified and such opinion is disproportionately concentrated amongst elderly authoritarians, who are (a) numerous and (b) heavily inclined to turn out to vote.
    2. Who cares about the economy when you can just borrow to plug the gaps in your finances?
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,193

    Whats the view on the impact of Greensill on the Scottish elections..... London's stock cant have slid much lower - surely this sees the Independence cause creep that little bit closer.... (never though D Cameron would come back to haunt the Union)

    Except, Scotland has a £500m bill for Greensill, in the shape of guarantees given by the SNP Government. Why would they do that, when Westminster wouldn't? What is the lobbying story there?

    You want to see this thing go off at a weird angle, that might be it....
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 50,071

    Hi guys. Thanks for the nice comments. Just about to start the long drive north on a road that used to be called "The Great North Road"

    Have fun, enjoy your break!
  • Options
    squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,400
    edited April 2021
    Talking of first cars,mine was a Hillman Husky which I bought for 35 quid, DMK 111A not knowing the gearbox was filled with sawdust.
    I sold it for 40 quid to an old boy who I told the story of the gearbox who told me not to worry about it. It was immaculate inside and out and rust free. Rather sad really.
  • Options
    Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905

    Whats the view on the impact of Greensill on the Scottish elections..... London's stock cant have slid much lower - surely this sees the Independence cause creep that little bit closer.... (never though D Cameron would come back to haunt the Union)

    Except, Scotland has a £500m bill for Greensill, in the shape of guarantees given by the SNP Government. Why would they do that, when Westminster wouldn't? What is the lobbying story there?

    You want to see this thing go off at a weird angle, that might be it....
    I don't think the odd half-a-billion pounds makes a difference to anything myself (you actually have to wonder if any degree of fiscal incompetence or skulduggery would anymore, in an era of such astronomical spending and borrowing numbers - but anyway...) The Scottish Government is essentially protected by a suit of kevlar-lined, teflon-coated plate armour. The entire Salmond debacle barely scratched it. If they chucked some money to try to prop up an aluminium smelter in a remote corner of the Highlands that most Scots won't even have visited then honestly, who is really going to care?
  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    As far as I can tell, this is true


    Facebook just prevented me sharing this on my (seldom used - I hate FB - FB account). Perhaps it is deemed Fake News. But is it?


    https://twitter.com/alexsalvinews/status/1382825704572788737?s=21

    It's also odd to ban what is, basically, a non story. She inherited some money. She bought two properties, both of which are nice, but neither of which is particularly ostentatious. (One was for something like $500k - but now worth $800k!!!, While the other was for a little more than a million.)

    The highlight of the article seems to be that she looked (online) at some property in Barbados, that she can't afford and didn't visit or purchase.
    It’s a hypocrisy story
  • Options
    DayTripperDayTripper Posts: 129
    TimT said:

    ridaligo said:

    slade said:

    Regrets, I've had a few. Just surfing the web and found this. My very first car was a 1936 Singer Le Mans which I bought for £25. It would now cost me approx $150,000 to buy one now.

    For me, 1974 Escort Mk1 bought for £3,000 in 1988 ... now £50,000 for a good one.

    Not sure I should be admitting to a Austin Maxi 1800 for GBP300
    Could be worse. I had an Austin 1800 landcrab (ex-Naval surplus). It consumed oil at approximately the same rate as petrol.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 50,071
    Charles said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    As far as I can tell, this is true


    Facebook just prevented me sharing this on my (seldom used - I hate FB - FB account). Perhaps it is deemed Fake News. But is it?


    https://twitter.com/alexsalvinews/status/1382825704572788737?s=21

    It's also odd to ban what is, basically, a non story. She inherited some money. She bought two properties, both of which are nice, but neither of which is particularly ostentatious. (One was for something like $500k - but now worth $800k!!!, While the other was for a little more than a million.)

    The highlight of the article seems to be that she looked (online) at some property in Barbados, that she can't afford and didn't visit or purchase.
    It’s a hypocrisy story
    Also in the context of an organisation which raised some $75m last year, and people are starting to ask where the money went.
  • Options
    GadflyGadfly Posts: 1,191

    I had the most fantastic time canoeing, sailing, playing golf, football and cricket, cross county running...

    I am confident that OGH is going enjoy doing all of those things :)

  • Options
    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,408

    Whats the view on the impact of Greensill on the Scottish elections..... London's stock cant have slid much lower - surely this sees the Independence cause creep that little bit closer.... (never though D Cameron would come back to haunt the Union)

    Except, Scotland has a £500m bill for Greensill, in the shape of guarantees given by the SNP Government. Why would they do that, when Westminster wouldn't? What is the lobbying story there?

    You want to see this thing go off at a weird angle, that might be it....
    If the German language doesn’t have a compound word for the combined activity of pointing at squirrels and clutching at straws, it bloody well should.
  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    rcs1000 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T — In London today I was surprised to find myself giving directions to Japanese tourists. I had thought that all tourism from other countries was off the cards atm.

    It would appear that the Government is, in essence, operating an open door policy for visitors from the whole world, except those travelling from red list countries (and presumably visitors from e.g. Brazil could just get around the feeble rules by travelling via a third country and lying on whatever declarations they have to make when they get here, if sufficiently determined to do so?)

    Like I said the other day, it's so reckless and illogical a policy that it only really makes sense if one assumes that ministers want to import variants, in order to have surge testing, panic in the press, and thus to maintain the general atmosphere of emergency. The emergency is wildly popular with the Tories' frightened elderly supporters, it gives them cover to act with impunity, and it serves further to neuter an already ineffectual Opposition. Why would they ever want it to end?
    Because there are more votes in ending lockdown than continuing it? And free economies are more successful than locked down ones?
    1. Are there? Much of the population remains irrationally terrified and such opinion is disproportionately concentrated amongst elderly authoritarians, who are (a) numerous and (b) heavily inclined to turn out to vote.
    2. Who cares about the economy when you can just borrow to plug the gaps in your finances?
    We’re printing money not borrowing it
  • Options
    StockyStocky Posts: 9,742
    edited April 2021

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T — In London today I was surprised to find myself giving directions to Japanese tourists. I had thought that all tourism from other countries was off the cards atm.

    It would appear that the Government is, in essence, operating an open door policy for visitors from the whole world, except those travelling from red list countries (and presumably visitors from e.g. Brazil could just get around the feeble rules by travelling via a third country and lying on whatever declarations they have to make when they get here, if sufficiently determined to do so?)

    Like I said the other day, it's so reckless and illogical a policy that it only really makes sense if one assumes that ministers want to import variants, in order to have surge testing, panic in the press, and thus to maintain the general atmosphere of emergency. The emergency is wildly popular with the Tories' frightened elderly supporters, it gives them cover to act with impunity, and it serves further to neuter an already ineffectual Opposition. Why would they ever want it to end?
    Populism rules logic and principle again. I've posted about this a couple of times. We are in this position because the government has followed what the lumpen says it wants,

    All the opprobrium pored on international travel over the last year has been directed at UK citizens rather than foreign nationals coming here. This, to me, points at vindictiveness and envy and an element of relish in curtailing the freedoms enjoyed by some that the majority do not themselves enjoy.

    Now we are in the position that non-UK citizens have more rights than UK citizens as a direct result of our own government's policies. This has gone on for months - though 17 May is likely to correct this to some extent.
  • Options
    StockyStocky Posts: 9,742
    Charles said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T — In London today I was surprised to find myself giving directions to Japanese tourists. I had thought that all tourism from other countries was off the cards atm.

    It would appear that the Government is, in essence, operating an open door policy for visitors from the whole world, except those travelling from red list countries (and presumably visitors from e.g. Brazil could just get around the feeble rules by travelling via a third country and lying on whatever declarations they have to make when they get here, if sufficiently determined to do so?)

    Like I said the other day, it's so reckless and illogical a policy that it only really makes sense if one assumes that ministers want to import variants, in order to have surge testing, panic in the press, and thus to maintain the general atmosphere of emergency. The emergency is wildly popular with the Tories' frightened elderly supporters, it gives them cover to act with impunity, and it serves further to neuter an already ineffectual Opposition. Why would they ever want it to end?
    Because there are more votes in ending lockdown than continuing it? And free economies are more successful than locked down ones?
    1. Are there? Much of the population remains irrationally terrified and such opinion is disproportionately concentrated amongst elderly authoritarians, who are (a) numerous and (b) heavily inclined to turn out to vote.
    2. Who cares about the economy when you can just borrow to plug the gaps in your finances?
    We’re printing money not borrowing it
    How is that actually done? Literally printing or metaphorically? Are other comparable countries doing the same and roughly to the same extent?
  • Options
    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,408
    R4 Today doing an in depth piece on the table upon which Prince Philip was birthed. Let’s have no more sniggering about the Pacific island that has deified Phil #fetishnation
  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Stocky said:

    Charles said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T — In London today I was surprised to find myself giving directions to Japanese tourists. I had thought that all tourism from other countries was off the cards atm.

    It would appear that the Government is, in essence, operating an open door policy for visitors from the whole world, except those travelling from red list countries (and presumably visitors from e.g. Brazil could just get around the feeble rules by travelling via a third country and lying on whatever declarations they have to make when they get here, if sufficiently determined to do so?)

    Like I said the other day, it's so reckless and illogical a policy that it only really makes sense if one assumes that ministers want to import variants, in order to have surge testing, panic in the press, and thus to maintain the general atmosphere of emergency. The emergency is wildly popular with the Tories' frightened elderly supporters, it gives them cover to act with impunity, and it serves further to neuter an already ineffectual Opposition. Why would they ever want it to end?
    Because there are more votes in ending lockdown than continuing it? And free economies are more successful than locked down ones?
    1. Are there? Much of the population remains irrationally terrified and such opinion is disproportionately concentrated amongst elderly authoritarians, who are (a) numerous and (b) heavily inclined to turn out to vote.
    2. Who cares about the economy when you can just borrow to plug the gaps in your finances?
    We’re printing money not borrowing it
    How is that actually done? Literally printing or metaphorically? Are other comparable countries doing the same and roughly to the same extent?
    Metaphorically

    The Bank of England fires up its spreadsheet and buys assets from banks who turn around and lend it to the government. They call it Quantative Easing so it sounds boring and technical and people’s eyes glaze over.

    We’ve been doing it for years but generally less than the EU and the US.

    That’s the reason why we have horrendous asset price inflation - there’s too much money around and not enough quality assets
  • Options
    StockyStocky Posts: 9,742
    Charles said:

    Stocky said:

    Charles said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T — In London today I was surprised to find myself giving directions to Japanese tourists. I had thought that all tourism from other countries was off the cards atm.

    It would appear that the Government is, in essence, operating an open door policy for visitors from the whole world, except those travelling from red list countries (and presumably visitors from e.g. Brazil could just get around the feeble rules by travelling via a third country and lying on whatever declarations they have to make when they get here, if sufficiently determined to do so?)

    Like I said the other day, it's so reckless and illogical a policy that it only really makes sense if one assumes that ministers want to import variants, in order to have surge testing, panic in the press, and thus to maintain the general atmosphere of emergency. The emergency is wildly popular with the Tories' frightened elderly supporters, it gives them cover to act with impunity, and it serves further to neuter an already ineffectual Opposition. Why would they ever want it to end?
    Because there are more votes in ending lockdown than continuing it? And free economies are more successful than locked down ones?
    1. Are there? Much of the population remains irrationally terrified and such opinion is disproportionately concentrated amongst elderly authoritarians, who are (a) numerous and (b) heavily inclined to turn out to vote.
    2. Who cares about the economy when you can just borrow to plug the gaps in your finances?
    We’re printing money not borrowing it
    How is that actually done? Literally printing or metaphorically? Are other comparable countries doing the same and roughly to the same extent?
    Metaphorically

    The Bank of England fires up its spreadsheet and buys assets from banks who turn around and lend it to the government. They call it Quantative Easing so it sounds boring and technical and people’s eyes glaze over.

    We’ve been doing it for years but generally less than the EU and the US.

    That’s the reason why we have horrendous asset price inflation - there’s too much money around and not enough quality assets
    If banks are lending assets it to the government then surely this IS government borrowing in a real sense - i.e. with interest being charged and repayment at some point to be made?
  • Options
    Andy_CookeAndy_Cooke Posts: 4,820
    Foxy said:

    Floater said:

    Northumberland is a lovely place.

    On Covid and Brazil

    This just leaves me in a cold sweat

    "Some Brazilian hospitals have run out of sedatives, forcing doctors to use restraints while coronavirus patients are intubated

    "I never thought I would be living through something like this," a doctor says. "The patient is submitted to a form of torture"

    https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1382790485329252354

    We came close to running out of some agents in both waves. Anaesthetic agents, kidney filtration kit, even oxygen bandwidth.

    My medical student this morning is still doing bank shifts as HCA on ICU. Only a third of the ICU nurses remain at present, the rest are conscripts from the press gangs, though some proper staff may return. Staff attrition is horrific.
    I’m sure Toby Young will be highlighting this on Lockdown Sceptics. After all, he must be interested on what happens when a large country is actually run by a lockdown sceptic; Bolsonaro has done almost everything he demands.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,012
    edited April 2021

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T — In London today I was surprised to find myself giving directions to Japanese tourists. I had thought that all tourism from other countries was off the cards atm.

    It would appear that the Government is, in essence, operating an open door policy for visitors from the whole world, except those travelling from red list countries (and presumably visitors from e.g. Brazil could just get around the feeble rules by travelling via a third country and lying on whatever declarations they have to make when they get here, if sufficiently determined to do so?)

    Like I said the other day, it's so reckless and illogical a policy that it only really makes sense if one assumes that ministers want to import variants, in order to have surge testing, panic in the press, and thus to maintain the general atmosphere of emergency. The emergency is wildly popular with the Tories' frightened elderly supporters, it gives them cover to act with impunity, and it serves further to neuter an already ineffectual Opposition. Why would they ever want it to end?
    It seems to me that if I lived in a plague city, like Mumbai or Paris then this might be a good time to holiday in the UK.
  • Options
    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    edited April 2021
    Stocky said:

    Charles said:

    Stocky said:

    Charles said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T — In London today I was surprised to find myself giving directions to Japanese tourists. I had thought that all tourism from other countries was off the cards atm.

    It would appear that the Government is, in essence, operating an open door policy for visitors from the whole world, except those travelling from red list countries (and presumably visitors from e.g. Brazil could just get around the feeble rules by travelling via a third country and lying on whatever declarations they have to make when they get here, if sufficiently determined to do so?)

    Like I said the other day, it's so reckless and illogical a policy that it only really makes sense if one assumes that ministers want to import variants, in order to have surge testing, panic in the press, and thus to maintain the general atmosphere of emergency. The emergency is wildly popular with the Tories' frightened elderly supporters, it gives them cover to act with impunity, and it serves further to neuter an already ineffectual Opposition. Why would they ever want it to end?
    Because there are more votes in ending lockdown than continuing it? And free economies are more successful than locked down ones?
    1. Are there? Much of the population remains irrationally terrified and such opinion is disproportionately concentrated amongst elderly authoritarians, who are (a) numerous and (b) heavily inclined to turn out to vote.
    2. Who cares about the economy when you can just borrow to plug the gaps in your finances?
    We’re printing money not borrowing it
    How is that actually done? Literally printing or metaphorically? Are other comparable countries doing the same and roughly to the same extent?
    Metaphorically

    The Bank of England fires up its spreadsheet and buys assets from banks who turn around and lend it to the government. They call it Quantative Easing so it sounds boring and technical and people’s eyes glaze over.

    We’ve been doing it for years but generally less than the EU and the US.

    That’s the reason why we have horrendous asset price inflation - there’s too much money around and not enough quality assets
    If banks are lending assets it to the government then surely this IS government borrowing in a real sense - i.e. with interest being charged and repayment at some point to be made?
    The Bank buys an old government bond from banks.

    The banks use that money to buy a new bond from the Government.

    The Government owns the Bank so doesn't pay interest to the Bank on the bond it bought.

    Net effect the Government has sold a new bond, the banks have the same, the Bank owns some it didn't and claims no interest.

    But theoretically no money has been printed. Theoretically the Bank isn't buying from the Government.
  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Stocky said:

    Charles said:

    Stocky said:

    Charles said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T — In London today I was surprised to find myself giving directions to Japanese tourists. I had thought that all tourism from other countries was off the cards atm.

    It would appear that the Government is, in essence, operating an open door policy for visitors from the whole world, except those travelling from red list countries (and presumably visitors from e.g. Brazil could just get around the feeble rules by travelling via a third country and lying on whatever declarations they have to make when they get here, if sufficiently determined to do so?)

    Like I said the other day, it's so reckless and illogical a policy that it only really makes sense if one assumes that ministers want to import variants, in order to have surge testing, panic in the press, and thus to maintain the general atmosphere of emergency. The emergency is wildly popular with the Tories' frightened elderly supporters, it gives them cover to act with impunity, and it serves further to neuter an already ineffectual Opposition. Why would they ever want it to end?
    Because there are more votes in ending lockdown than continuing it? And free economies are more successful than locked down ones?
    1. Are there? Much of the population remains irrationally terrified and such opinion is disproportionately concentrated amongst elderly authoritarians, who are (a) numerous and (b) heavily inclined to turn out to vote.
    2. Who cares about the economy when you can just borrow to plug the gaps in your finances?
    We’re printing money not borrowing it
    How is that actually done? Literally printing or metaphorically? Are other comparable countries doing the same and roughly to the same extent?
    Metaphorically

    The Bank of England fires up its spreadsheet and buys assets from banks who turn around and lend it to the government. They call it Quantative Easing so it sounds boring and technical and people’s eyes glaze over.

    We’ve been doing it for years but generally less than the EU and the US.

    That’s the reason why we have horrendous asset price inflation - there’s too much money around and not enough quality assets
    If banks are lending assets it to the government then surely this IS government borrowing in a real sense - i.e. with interest being charged and repayment at some point to be made?
    Not really

    Bank buys £300bn Uk government debt from the market.

    Market buys £300bn of new debt from the government

    Net result is that government debt has gone up £300bn and Bank of England assets have gone up £300bn.

    Government pays same interest to market (assuming no change in rates). Government pays more interest to the Bank of England (in practice I don’t think they bother any more) which pays a dividend to the government with the proceeds.

    When the Bank of England debts come due they enter into a contract with the government to roll over the loan into a new instrument
  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    edited April 2021

    Stocky said:

    Charles said:

    Stocky said:

    Charles said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T — In London today I was surprised to find myself giving directions to Japanese tourists. I had thought that all tourism from other countries was off the cards atm.

    It would appear that the Government is, in essence, operating an open door policy for visitors from the whole world, except those travelling from red list countries (and presumably visitors from e.g. Brazil could just get around the feeble rules by travelling via a third country and lying on whatever declarations they have to make when they get here, if sufficiently determined to do so?)

    Like I said the other day, it's so reckless and illogical a policy that it only really makes sense if one assumes that ministers want to import variants, in order to have surge testing, panic in the press, and thus to maintain the general atmosphere of emergency. The emergency is wildly popular with the Tories' frightened elderly supporters, it gives them cover to act with impunity, and it serves further to neuter an already ineffectual Opposition. Why would they ever want it to end?
    Because there are more votes in ending lockdown than continuing it? And free economies are more successful than locked down ones?
    1. Are there? Much of the population remains irrationally terrified and such opinion is disproportionately concentrated amongst elderly authoritarians, who are (a) numerous and (b) heavily inclined to turn out to vote.
    2. Who cares about the economy when you can just borrow to plug the gaps in your finances?
    We’re printing money not borrowing it
    How is that actually done? Literally printing or metaphorically? Are other comparable countries doing the same and roughly to the same extent?
    Metaphorically

    The Bank of England fires up its spreadsheet and buys assets from banks who turn around and lend it to the government. They call it Quantative Easing so it sounds boring and technical and people’s eyes glaze over.

    We’ve been doing it for years but generally less than the EU and the US.

    That’s the reason why we have horrendous asset price inflation - there’s too much money around and not enough quality assets
    If banks are lending assets it to the government then surely this IS government borrowing in a real sense - i.e. with interest being charged and repayment at some point to be made?
    The Bank buys an old government bond from a bank.

    The bank uses that money to buy a new bond from the Government.

    The Government owns the Bank so doesn't pay interest to the Bank on the bond it bought.

    Net effect the Government has sold a new bond, the banks have the same, the Bank owns some it didn't and claims no interest.

    But theoretically no money has been printed. Theoretically the Bank isn't buying from the Government.
    The Bank of England is creating the money to pay for the bonds out of thin air - it is they who have responsibility for the money supply not the government
  • Options
    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Charles said:

    Stocky said:

    Charles said:

    Stocky said:

    Charles said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T — In London today I was surprised to find myself giving directions to Japanese tourists. I had thought that all tourism from other countries was off the cards atm.

    It would appear that the Government is, in essence, operating an open door policy for visitors from the whole world, except those travelling from red list countries (and presumably visitors from e.g. Brazil could just get around the feeble rules by travelling via a third country and lying on whatever declarations they have to make when they get here, if sufficiently determined to do so?)

    Like I said the other day, it's so reckless and illogical a policy that it only really makes sense if one assumes that ministers want to import variants, in order to have surge testing, panic in the press, and thus to maintain the general atmosphere of emergency. The emergency is wildly popular with the Tories' frightened elderly supporters, it gives them cover to act with impunity, and it serves further to neuter an already ineffectual Opposition. Why would they ever want it to end?
    Because there are more votes in ending lockdown than continuing it? And free economies are more successful than locked down ones?
    1. Are there? Much of the population remains irrationally terrified and such opinion is disproportionately concentrated amongst elderly authoritarians, who are (a) numerous and (b) heavily inclined to turn out to vote.
    2. Who cares about the economy when you can just borrow to plug the gaps in your finances?
    We’re printing money not borrowing it
    How is that actually done? Literally printing or metaphorically? Are other comparable countries doing the same and roughly to the same extent?
    Metaphorically

    The Bank of England fires up its spreadsheet and buys assets from banks who turn around and lend it to the government. They call it Quantative Easing so it sounds boring and technical and people’s eyes glaze over.

    We’ve been doing it for years but generally less than the EU and the US.

    That’s the reason why we have horrendous asset price inflation - there’s too much money around and not enough quality assets
    If banks are lending assets it to the government then surely this IS government borrowing in a real sense - i.e. with interest being charged and repayment at some point to be made?
    The Bank buys an old government bond from a bank.

    The bank uses that money to buy a new bond from the Government.

    The Government owns the Bank so doesn't pay interest to the Bank on the bond it bought.

    Net effect the Government has sold a new bond, the banks have the same, the Bank owns some it didn't and claims no interest.

    But theoretically no money has been printed. Theoretically the Bank isn't buying from the Government.
    The Bank of England is creating the money to pay for the bonds out of thin air - it is they who have responsibility for the money supply not the government
    That was my point yes. The Bank creates the money and pays it but because it's a loan than could theoretically be repaid (but we know never will) they maintain the polite fiction that money wasn't printed.
  • Options
    StockyStocky Posts: 9,742
    Charles said:

    Stocky said:

    Charles said:

    Stocky said:

    Charles said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T — In London today I was surprised to find myself giving directions to Japanese tourists. I had thought that all tourism from other countries was off the cards atm.

    It would appear that the Government is, in essence, operating an open door policy for visitors from the whole world, except those travelling from red list countries (and presumably visitors from e.g. Brazil could just get around the feeble rules by travelling via a third country and lying on whatever declarations they have to make when they get here, if sufficiently determined to do so?)

    Like I said the other day, it's so reckless and illogical a policy that it only really makes sense if one assumes that ministers want to import variants, in order to have surge testing, panic in the press, and thus to maintain the general atmosphere of emergency. The emergency is wildly popular with the Tories' frightened elderly supporters, it gives them cover to act with impunity, and it serves further to neuter an already ineffectual Opposition. Why would they ever want it to end?
    Because there are more votes in ending lockdown than continuing it? And free economies are more successful than locked down ones?
    1. Are there? Much of the population remains irrationally terrified and such opinion is disproportionately concentrated amongst elderly authoritarians, who are (a) numerous and (b) heavily inclined to turn out to vote.
    2. Who cares about the economy when you can just borrow to plug the gaps in your finances?
    We’re printing money not borrowing it
    How is that actually done? Literally printing or metaphorically? Are other comparable countries doing the same and roughly to the same extent?
    Metaphorically

    The Bank of England fires up its spreadsheet and buys assets from banks who turn around and lend it to the government. They call it Quantative Easing so it sounds boring and technical and people’s eyes glaze over.

    We’ve been doing it for years but generally less than the EU and the US.

    That’s the reason why we have horrendous asset price inflation - there’s too much money around and not enough quality assets
    If banks are lending assets it to the government then surely this IS government borrowing in a real sense - i.e. with interest being charged and repayment at some point to be made?
    Not really

    Bank buys £300bn Uk government debt from the market.

    Market buys £300bn of new debt from the government

    Net result is that government debt has gone up £300bn and Bank of England assets have gone up £300bn.

    Government pays same interest to market (assuming no change in rates). Government pays more interest to the Bank of England (in practice I don’t think they bother any more) which pays a dividend to the government with the proceeds.

    When the Bank of England debts come due they enter into a contract with the government to roll over the loan into a new instrument
    This makes my head spin.

    So to what extent is this actually a problem? If Covid ends up costing us, say, £800 billion - surely there must be a limit to this?

    If ,say, ten years slip by and there is another pandemic caused by a new virus, could QE be used to generate a brand new £800 billion?
This discussion has been closed.