The shifting tides: voting trends since 2005 – politicalbetting.com

LadyG said:

I think critical race theory, cultural Marxism, the idea of original sin of White Racism and Fragility, and so on, are arguably more menacing, long term, to American democracy, than Trump's everyday lunacies.

He's a terrible, odious president, but at most he can only run one more term (and he's surely going to lose); Cultural Marxism/Critical Race Theory and all that goes with it is a terrible but powerful IDEA, and ideas are more important in the end. This particular idea will presage a race war in the USA if it gets worse.

Moreover, America is exporting the madness of Critical Race Theory around the world, roiling other western nations.

MaxPB said:

On the 10pm shut off - had lunch today with a friend of mine who owns and runs a restaurant (and now takeaway), inevitably the subject got onto the 10pm closing time. His view - it won't drive restaurants to bankruptcy as most are now baseline profitable from their takeaway business, at least if they are good enough for repeat business. His major insight to me is that the shift to takeaway has made the restaurant business into much more of a meritocracy as punters rely on reviews on takeaway websites and less so on passing trade than before. Give customers a bad food experience and they won't come back.

On how the restriction will change things, the kitchen now closed at around 9:30pm and last orders are at around 9pm. This means they now have just one dinner sitting down from two. He said pre-COVID they would have 320 diners per night and they were basically fully booked every night of the week, with social distancing this went down to 140 diners and now they are down to just 70. He's happy that they developed a website and e-commerce business as soon as lockdown started and they got the government grant because now they sell sauces, marinades and seasoning mixes on their own website for local and now national delivery. He said this makes up for basically all of the revenue loss of the eat in business.

His view on pubs - they're fucked and the government has completely fucked it for them. After speaking to him I'm very worried about @Cyclefree and her daughter's pub. That the government are throwing away thousands of businesses and millions of jobs just to make it look like they are doing something is absolutely devastating.

Cyclefree said:

MaxPB said:

On the 10pm shut off - had lunch today with a friend of mine who owns and runs a restaurant (and now takeaway), inevitably the subject got onto the 10pm closing time. His view - it won't drive restaurants to bankruptcy as most are now baseline profitable from their takeaway business, at least if they are good enough for repeat business. His major insight to me is that the shift to takeaway has made the restaurant business into much more of a meritocracy as punters rely on reviews on takeaway websites and less so on passing trade than before. Give customers a bad food experience and they won't come back.

On how the restriction will change things, the kitchen now closed at around 9:30pm and last orders are at around 9pm. This means they now have just one dinner sitting down from two. He said pre-COVID they would have 320 diners per night and they were basically fully booked every night of the week, with social distancing this went down to 140 diners and now they are down to just 70. He's happy that they developed a website and e-commerce business as soon as lockdown started and they got the government grant because now they sell sauces, marinades and seasoning mixes on their own website for local and now national delivery. He said this makes up for basically all of the revenue loss of the eat in business.

His view on pubs - they're fucked and the government has completely fucked it for them. After speaking to him I'm very worried about @Cyclefree and her daughter's pub. That the government are throwing away thousands of businesses and millions of jobs just to make it look like they are doing something is absolutely devastating.

It’s evil. Not just devastating. Especially as (a) the scientific basis for the 10 pm curfew is non-existent; (b) it will do little to stop the spread of the virus.

Daughter has effectively since July turned her pub into a restaurant and this will only accelerate given these new restrictions. She is shortening the menu to minimise waste and make the restaurant as efficient and profitable as possible. She will continue with the takeaway business. She’s had to let one member of staff go, sadly. And she will reduce the use of casual labour - youngsters hoping to train in the business - to the bare minimum or nothing, if needed.

She is hoping that this will - with whatever other measures she can think of - be enough to see her though to the spring.

If there is a full lockdown without further support, then it’s the end for her business, the loss of the remaining jobs, a landlord with no income, breweries and local suppliers with one less customer and 4 villages without their only socialising space.

“Levelling up” - my arse!

LadyG said:

MaxPB said:

LadyG said:

MaxPB said:

On the 10pm shut off - had lunch today with a friend of mine who owns and runs a restaurant (and now takeaway), inevitably the subject got onto the 10pm closing time. His view - it won't drive restaurants to bankruptcy as most are now baseline profitable from their takeaway business, at least if they are good enough for repeat business. His major insight to me is that the shift to takeaway has made the restaurant business into much more of a meritocracy as punters rely on reviews on takeaway websites and less so on passing trade than before. Give customers a bad food experience and they won't come back.

On how the restriction will change things, the kitchen now closed at around 9:30pm and last orders are at around 9pm. This means they now have just one dinner sitting down from two. He said pre-COVID they would have 320 diners per night and they were basically fully booked every night of the week, with social distancing this went down to 140 diners and now they are down to just 70. He's happy that they developed a website and e-commerce business as soon as lockdown started and they got the government grant because now they sell sauces, marinades and seasoning mixes on their own website for local and now national delivery. He said this makes up for basically all of the revenue loss of the eat in business.

His view on pubs - they're fucked and the government has completely fucked it for them. After speaking to him I'm very worried about @Cyclefree and her daughter's pub. That the government are throwing away thousands of businesses and millions of jobs just to make it look like they are doing something is absolutely devastating.

I am meant to be going for a pub drink-up in Soho with friends tonight.

It's a cold grey evening, like November. I know we will be corralled to our allotted table and people in masks will hover, and track, and trace, and we won't have time to get properly sozzled.

Utterly depressing. I'd rather stay home and drink my own good (cheaper) wine, with my own music and food, and have a couple of these friends over.

This, indeed, is how pubs will die

Yeah he's actually talking to a pub owner he knows about how they can help him but pubs aren't in the same position as he was because none of them really have unique products, their food is good but nothing unique there, they offer good quality beer and wine but people can buy that from the supermarket and they can't really run a takeaway business that will keep them going and they don't have any chance of an e-commerce sideline.

There's no way out for them, he's run a pub previously and says that around 60% of their revenue came between 9pm and midnight, now pubs only have 30 mins to sell drinks in that window with much reduced capacity.

I want to fucking emigrate

Northern_Al said:

LadyG said:

Alistair said:

LadyG said:

https://twitter.com/MarinaMedvin/status/1306737500086566912?s=20

So on one hand you got a random on the street spouting awful opinions and on the other hand you have the president of the United States glorifying violence against his political opponents and refusing to confirm he will stand down if defeated.

Do you see how the equivalency fails?

Also I haven't seen a single top level Dem politician praise the Marxist front orginisation BlackLivesMatters as opposed to the general amorphous movement made of ordinary people pushing for racial justice that has the same name.

Well then you're blind as well as stupid

rcs1000 said:

LadyG said:

rottenborough said:

It is astonishing and extremely upsetting to watch American democracy self-destruct.

Both sides are responsible for this tragedy. The insane identity politics of the American Left are as corrosive and damaging as the stupidity and aggression of the Trumpians.

The insane identity politics are - of course - ridiculous and damaging.

But if Trump was just attacking that, and immigration, and free trade, etc., then we while we might not agree with him on everything, that would be well within his right.

But "insane identity politics" are not a threat to democracy. What is currently happening in the US *is* a threat to democracy. And we need to call it out when we see it, not attempt to say "there are good people on both sides".

The US (like the UK) has been successful because it has a good system. Once you dismantle a good system, you are on the highway to hell.

I think critical race theory, cultural Marxism, the idea of original sin of White Racism and Fragility, and so on, are arguably more menacing, long term, to American democracy, than Trump's everyday lunacies.

He's a terrible, odious president, but at most he can only run one more term (and he's surely going to lose); Cultural Marxism/Critical Race Theory and all that goes with it is a terrible but powerful IDEA, and ideas are more important in the end. This particular idea will presage a race war in the USA if it gets worse.

Moreover, America is exporting the madness of Critical Race Theory around the world, roiling other western nations.

You don't half write some bollocks (for an apparently intelligent lady).

CorrectHorseBattery said:

Omnium said:

LadyG said:

MaxPB said:

LadyG said:

MaxPB said:

On the 10pm shut off - had lunch today with a friend of mine who owns and runs a restaurant (and now takeaway), inevitably the subject got onto the 10pm closing time. His view - it won't drive restaurants to bankruptcy as most are now baseline profitable from their takeaway business, at least if they are good enough for repeat business. His major insight to me is that the shift to takeaway has made the restaurant business into much more of a meritocracy as punters rely on reviews on takeaway websites and less so on passing trade than before. Give customers a bad food experience and they won't come back.

On how the restriction will change things, the kitchen now closed at around 9:30pm and last orders are at around 9pm. This means they now have just one dinner sitting down from two. He said pre-COVID they would have 320 diners per night and they were basically fully booked every night of the week, with social distancing this went down to 140 diners and now they are down to just 70. He's happy that they developed a website and e-commerce business as soon as lockdown started and they got the government grant because now they sell sauces, marinades and seasoning mixes on their own website for local and now national delivery. He said this makes up for basically all of the revenue loss of the eat in business.

His view on pubs - they're fucked and the government has completely fucked it for them. After speaking to him I'm very worried about @Cyclefree and her daughter's pub. That the government are throwing away thousands of businesses and millions of jobs just to make it look like they are doing something is absolutely devastating.

I am meant to be going for a pub drink-up in Soho with friends tonight.

It's a cold grey evening, like November. I know we will be corralled to our allotted table and people in masks will hover, and track, and trace, and we won't have time to get properly sozzled.

Utterly depressing. I'd rather stay home and drink my own good (cheaper) wine, with my own music and food, and have a couple of these friends over.

This, indeed, is how pubs will die

Yeah he's actually talking to a pub owner he knows about how they can help him but pubs aren't in the same position as he was because none of them really have unique products, their food is good but nothing unique there, they offer good quality beer and wine but people can buy that from the supermarket and they can't really run a takeaway business that will keep them going and they don't have any chance of an e-commerce sideline.

There's no way out for them, he's run a pub previously and says that around 60% of their revenue came between 9pm and midnight, now pubs only have 30 mins to sell drinks in that window with much reduced capacity.

I want to fucking emigrate

If you're not picky then that's very easy. Even if you are, if you have some sort of asset base and some sort of skills then you'll be fine. Do let us know how you get on! (Sorry )

He only needs to do it in his head

LadyG said:

MaxPB said:

LadyG said:

MaxPB said:

On the 10pm shut off - had lunch today with a friend of mine who owns and runs a restaurant (and now takeaway), inevitably the subject got onto the 10pm closing time. His view - it won't drive restaurants to bankruptcy as most are now baseline profitable from their takeaway business, at least if they are good enough for repeat business. His major insight to me is that the shift to takeaway has made the restaurant business into much more of a meritocracy as punters rely on reviews on takeaway websites and less so on passing trade than before. Give customers a bad food experience and they won't come back.

On how the restriction will change things, the kitchen now closed at around 9:30pm and last orders are at around 9pm. This means they now have just one dinner sitting down from two. He said pre-COVID they would have 320 diners per night and they were basically fully booked every night of the week, with social distancing this went down to 140 diners and now they are down to just 70. He's happy that they developed a website and e-commerce business as soon as lockdown started and they got the government grant because now they sell sauces, marinades and seasoning mixes on their own website for local and now national delivery. He said this makes up for basically all of the revenue loss of the eat in business.

His view on pubs - they're fucked and the government has completely fucked it for them. After speaking to him I'm very worried about @Cyclefree and her daughter's pub. That the government are throwing away thousands of businesses and millions of jobs just to make it look like they are doing something is absolutely devastating.

I am meant to be going for a pub drink-up in Soho with friends tonight.

It's a cold grey evening, like November. I know we will be corralled to our allotted table and people in masks will hover, and track, and trace, and we won't have time to get properly sozzled.

Utterly depressing. I'd rather stay home and drink my own good (cheaper) wine, with my own music and food, and have a couple of these friends over.

This, indeed, is how pubs will die

Yeah he's actually talking to a pub owner he knows about how they can help him but pubs aren't in the same position as he was because none of them really have unique products, their food is good but nothing unique there, they offer good quality beer and wine but people can buy that from the supermarket and they can't really run a takeaway business that will keep them going and they don't have any chance of an e-commerce sideline.

There's no way out for them, he's run a pub previously and says that around 60% of their revenue came between 9pm and midnight, now pubs only have 30 mins to sell drinks in that window with much reduced capacity.

I want to fucking emigrate

MaxPB said:

LadyG said:

MaxPB said:

On the 10pm shut off - had lunch today with a friend of mine who owns and runs a restaurant (and now takeaway), inevitably the subject got onto the 10pm closing time. His view - it won't drive restaurants to bankruptcy as most are now baseline profitable from their takeaway business, at least if they are good enough for repeat business. His major insight to me is that the shift to takeaway has made the restaurant business into much more of a meritocracy as punters rely on reviews on takeaway websites and less so on passing trade than before. Give customers a bad food experience and they won't come back.

On how the restriction will change things, the kitchen now closed at around 9:30pm and last orders are at around 9pm. This means they now have just one dinner sitting down from two. He said pre-COVID they would have 320 diners per night and they were basically fully booked every night of the week, with social distancing this went down to 140 diners and now they are down to just 70. He's happy that they developed a website and e-commerce business as soon as lockdown started and they got the government grant because now they sell sauces, marinades and seasoning mixes on their own website for local and now national delivery. He said this makes up for basically all of the revenue loss of the eat in business.

His view on pubs - they're fucked and the government has completely fucked it for them. After speaking to him I'm very worried about @Cyclefree and her daughter's pub. That the government are throwing away thousands of businesses and millions of jobs just to make it look like they are doing something is absolutely devastating.

I am meant to be going for a pub drink-up in Soho with friends tonight.

It's a cold grey evening, like November. I know we will be corralled to our allotted table and people in masks will hover, and track, and trace, and we won't have time to get properly sozzled.

Utterly depressing. I'd rather stay home and drink my own good (cheaper) wine, with my own music and food, and have a couple of these friends over.

This, indeed, is how pubs will die

Yeah he's actually talking to a pub owner he knows about how they can help him but pubs aren't in the same position as he was because none of them really have unique products, their food is good but nothing unique there, they offer good quality beer and wine but people can buy that from the supermarket and they can't really run a takeaway business that will keep them going and they don't have any chance of an e-commerce sideline.

There's no way out for them, he's run a pub previously and says that around 60% of their revenue came between 9pm and midnight, now pubs only have 30 mins to sell drinks in that window with much reduced capacity.

Cyclefree said:

MaxPB said:

LadyG said:

MaxPB said:

On the 10pm shut off - had lunch today with a friend of mine who owns and runs a restaurant (and now takeaway), inevitably the subject got onto the 10pm closing time. His view - it won't drive restaurants to bankruptcy as most are now baseline profitable from their takeaway business, at least if they are good enough for repeat business. His major insight to me is that the shift to takeaway has made the restaurant business into much more of a meritocracy as punters rely on reviews on takeaway websites and less so on passing trade than before. Give customers a bad food experience and they won't come back.

On how the restriction will change things, the kitchen now closed at around 9:30pm and last orders are at around 9pm. This means they now have just one dinner sitting down from two. He said pre-COVID they would have 320 diners per night and they were basically fully booked every night of the week, with social distancing this went down to 140 diners and now they are down to just 70. He's happy that they developed a website and e-commerce business as soon as lockdown started and they got the government grant because now they sell sauces, marinades and seasoning mixes on their own website for local and now national delivery. He said this makes up for basically all of the revenue loss of the eat in business.

His view on pubs - they're fucked and the government has completely fucked it for them. After speaking to him I'm very worried about @Cyclefree and her daughter's pub. That the government are throwing away thousands of businesses and millions of jobs just to make it look like they are doing something is absolutely devastating.

I am meant to be going for a pub drink-up in Soho with friends tonight.

It's a cold grey evening, like November. I know we will be corralled to our allotted table and people in masks will hover, and track, and trace, and we won't have time to get properly sozzled.

Utterly depressing. I'd rather stay home and drink my own good (cheaper) wine, with my own music and food, and have a couple of these friends over.

This, indeed, is how pubs will die

Yeah he's actually talking to a pub owner he knows about how they can help him but pubs aren't in the same position as he was because none of them really have unique products, their food is good but nothing unique there, they offer good quality beer and wine but people can buy that from the supermarket and they can't really run a takeaway business that will keep them going and they don't have any chance of an e-commerce sideline.

There's no way out for them, he's run a pub previously and says that around 60% of their revenue came between 9pm and midnight, now pubs only have 30 mins to sell drinks in that window with much reduced capacity.

A lot of restaurants provide a very indifferent product, often overpriced.

Plus around here, most pubs are in fact restaurants as well so the distinction between pubs and restaurants is not as marked as it may be in London. But he’s certainly right that the loss of the trade from 9:30 onwards will hurt.

MaxPB said:

rcs1000 said:

Cyclefree said:

MaxPB said:

On the 10pm shut off - had lunch today with a friend of mine who owns and runs a restaurant (and now takeaway), inevitably the subject got onto the 10pm closing time. His view - it won't drive restaurants to bankruptcy as most are now baseline profitable from their takeaway business, at least if they are good enough for repeat business. His major insight to me is that the shift to takeaway has made the restaurant business into much more of a meritocracy as punters rely on reviews on takeaway websites and less so on passing trade than before. Give customers a bad food experience and they won't come back.

On how the restriction will change things, the kitchen now closed at around 9:30pm and last orders are at around 9pm. This means they now have just one dinner sitting down from two. He said pre-COVID they would have 320 diners per night and they were basically fully booked every night of the week, with social distancing this went down to 140 diners and now they are down to just 70. He's happy that they developed a website and e-commerce business as soon as lockdown started and they got the government grant because now they sell sauces, marinades and seasoning mixes on their own website for local and now national delivery. He said this makes up for basically all of the revenue loss of the eat in business.

His view on pubs - they're fucked and the government has completely fucked it for them. After speaking to him I'm very worried about @Cyclefree and her daughter's pub. That the government are throwing away thousands of businesses and millions of jobs just to make it look like they are doing something is absolutely devastating.

It’s evil. Not just devastating. Especially as (a) the scientific basis for the 10 pm curfew is non-existent; (b) it will do little to stop the spread of the virus.

Daughter has effectively since July turned her pub into a restaurant and this will only accelerate given these new restrictions. She is shortening the menu to minimise waste and make the restaurant as efficient and profitable as possible. She will continue with the takeaway business. She’s had to let one member of staff go, sadly. And she will reduce the use of casual labour - youngsters hoping to train in the business - to the bare minimum or nothing, if needed.

She is hoping that this will - with whatever other measures she can think of - be enough to see her though to the spring.

If there is a full lockdown without further support, then it’s the end for her business, the loss of the remaining jobs, a landlord with no income, breweries and local suppliers with one less customer and 4 villages without their only socialising space.

“Levelling up” - my arse!

Oh, the 10pm curfew means everyone is leaving at the same time, so it's probably means the virus will spread more easily.

It's a pretty stupid policy.

It's killing businesses and causing packed trains of drunk people.

Foxy said:

CorrectHorseBattery said:

https://twitter.com/Gabriel_Pogrund/status/1309907164560060416

I am not unsympathetic, but isn't that the same regime as for anyone having to self isolate?

Foxy said:

LadyG said:

rcs1000 said:

LadyG said:

MaxPB said:

LadyG said:

MaxPB said:

On the 10pm shut off - had lunch today with a friend of mine who owns and runs a restaurant (and now takeaway), inevitably the subject got onto the 10pm closing time. His view - it won't drive restaurants to bankruptcy as most are now baseline profitable from their takeaway business, at least if they are good enough for repeat business. His major insight to me is that the shift to takeaway has made the restaurant business into much more of a meritocracy as punters rely on reviews on takeaway websites and less so on passing trade than before. Give customers a bad food experience and they won't come back.

On how the restriction will change things, the kitchen now closed at around 9:30pm and last orders are at around 9pm. This means they now have just one dinner sitting down from two. He said pre-COVID they would have 320 diners per night and they were basically fully booked every night of the week, with social distancing this went down to 140 diners and now they are down to just 70. He's happy that they developed a website and e-commerce business as soon as lockdown started and they got the government grant because now they sell sauces, marinades and seasoning mixes on their own website for local and now national delivery. He said this makes up for basically all of the revenue loss of the eat in business.

His view on pubs - they're fucked and the government has completely fucked it for them. After speaking to him I'm very worried about @Cyclefree and her daughter's pub. That the government are throwing away thousands of businesses and millions of jobs just to make it look like they are doing something is absolutely devastating.

I am meant to be going for a pub drink-up in Soho with friends tonight.

It's a cold grey evening, like November. I know we will be corralled to our allotted table and people in masks will hover, and track, and trace, and we won't have time to get properly sozzled.

Utterly depressing. I'd rather stay home and drink my own good (cheaper) wine, with my own music and food, and have a couple of these friends over.

This, indeed, is how pubs will die

Yeah he's actually talking to a pub owner he knows about how they can help him but pubs aren't in the same position as he was because none of them really have unique products, their food is good but nothing unique there, they offer good quality beer and wine but people can buy that from the supermarket and they can't really run a takeaway business that will keep them going and they don't have any chance of an e-commerce sideline.

There's no way out for them, he's run a pub previously and says that around 60% of their revenue came between 9pm and midnight, now pubs only have 30 mins to sell drinks in that window with much reduced capacity.

I want to fucking emigrate

I'm currently in Santa Fe, New Mexico.

It's crazy and beautiful here, rugged high desert. There are some great restaraunts, and they're all open (albeit) with slightly reduced capacity. The bars all have big open areas with space heaters, so you can go for a drink after dinner if you like.

But they also take CV19 very seriously. Everyone assidiously wears a mask on the street, or while queuing for a table or in a shop. And schools and colleges are on-line learning only.

In the whole county (150,000 population) there are about five CV19 cases a day.

I LOVE New Mexico. Indeed all the SW USA desert states.

Southern Utah is high on my list of Places to Die

New Mexico, I agree.

Utah is a bit dry, in the teetotal sense, for me.

alex_ said:

One major difference is that it is being enforced. Strictly. Which makes a big difference. And not even allowing people to place posters in windows protesting. And furthermore, whilst for most people if required to self isolate it will likely be a one off to endure. For students forced to isolate in vast halls of residence ("officially" in many cases not even allowed to socialise with those with whom they are isolating! - see University of Stirling guidance posted above) they face the prospect of having to do so repeatedly for months. Every time there's a positive test somewhere in the vicinity.

Tres said:

Don't mention the slavery!

Foxy said:

alex_ said:

One major difference is that it is being enforced. Strictly. Which makes a big difference. And not even allowing people to place posters in windows protesting. And furthermore, whilst for most people if required to self isolate it will likely be a one off to endure. For students forced to isolate in vast halls of residence ("officially" in many cases not even allowed to socialise with those with whom they are isolating! - see University of Stirling guidance posted above) they face the prospect of having to do so repeatedly for months. Every time there's a positive test somewhere in the vicinity.

When I was in halls in the 1980s we weren't allowed (amongst other rules) posters in the window.

I am glad Fox jr2 is not in Halls. He seems to be having a good time in his first week at Uni.

Casino_Royale said:

LadyG said:

Alistair said:

LadyG said:

https://twitter.com/MarinaMedvin/status/1306737500086566912?s=20

So on one hand you got a random on the street spouting awful opinions and on the other hand you have the president of the United States glorifying violence against his political opponents and refusing to confirm he will stand down if defeated.

Do you see how the equivalency fails?

Also I haven't seen a single top level Dem politician praise the Marxist front orginisation BlackLivesMatters as opposed to the general amorphous movement made of ordinary people pushing for racial justice that has the same name.

Well then you're blind as well as stupid

rcs1000 said:

LadyG said:

rottenborough said:

It is astonishing and extremely upsetting to watch American democracy self-destruct.

Both sides are responsible for this tragedy. The insane identity politics of the American Left are as corrosive and damaging as the stupidity and aggression of the Trumpians.

The insane identity politics are - of course - ridiculous and damaging.

But if Trump was just attacking that, and immigration, and free trade, etc., then we while we might not agree with him on everything, that would be well within his right.

But "insane identity politics" are not a threat to democracy. What is currently happening in the US *is* a threat to democracy. And we need to call it out when we see it, not attempt to say "there are good people on both sides".

The US (like the UK) has been successful because it has a good system. Once you dismantle a good system, you are on the highway to hell.

I think critical race theory, cultural Marxism, the idea of original sin of White Racism and Fragility, and so on, are arguably more menacing, long term, to American democracy, than Trump's everyday lunacies.

He's a terrible, odious president, but at most he can only run one more term (and he's surely going to lose); Cultural Marxism/Critical Race Theory and all that goes with it is a terrible but powerful IDEA, and ideas are more important in the end. This particular idea will presage a race war in the USA if it gets worse.

Moreover, America is exporting the madness of Critical Race Theory around the world, roiling other western nations.

It's infected our own National Trust too, which is why I cancelled my membership this week.

Cyclefree said:

MaxPB said:

Cyclefree said:

MaxPB said:

On the 10pm shut off - had lunch today with a friend of mine who owns and runs a restaurant (and now takeaway), inevitably the subject got onto the 10pm closing time. His view - it won't drive restaurants to bankruptcy as most are now baseline profitable from their takeaway business, at least if they are good enough for repeat business. His major insight to me is that the shift to takeaway has made the restaurant business into much more of a meritocracy as punters rely on reviews on takeaway websites and less so on passing trade than before. Give customers a bad food experience and they won't come back.

On how the restriction will change things, the kitchen now closed at around 9:30pm and last orders are at around 9pm. This means they now have just one dinner sitting down from two. He said pre-COVID they would have 320 diners per night and they were basically fully booked every night of the week, with social distancing this went down to 140 diners and now they are down to just 70. He's happy that they developed a website and e-commerce business as soon as lockdown started and they got the government grant because now they sell sauces, marinades and seasoning mixes on their own website for local and now national delivery. He said this makes up for basically all of the revenue loss of the eat in business.

His view on pubs - they're fucked and the government has completely fucked it for them. After speaking to him I'm very worried about @Cyclefree and her daughter's pub. That the government are throwing away thousands of businesses and millions of jobs just to make it look like they are doing something is absolutely devastating.

It’s evil. Not just devastating. Especially as (a) the scientific basis for the 10 pm curfew is non-existent; (b) it will do little to stop the spread of the virus.

Daughter has effectively since July turned her pub into a restaurant and this will only accelerate given these new restrictions. She is shortening the menu to minimise waste and make the restaurant as efficient and profitable as possible. She will continue with the takeaway business. She’s had to let one member of staff go, sadly. And she will reduce the use of casual labour - youngsters hoping to train in the business - to the bare minimum or nothing, if needed.

She is hoping that this will - with whatever other measures she can think of - be enough to see her though to the spring.

If there is a full lockdown without further support, then it’s the end for her business, the loss of the remaining jobs, a landlord with no income, breweries and local suppliers with one less customer and 4 villages without their only socialising space.

“Levelling up” - my arse!

I hope she's able to survive this and find a way to operate as a pub again when the time comes. On it being devastating, I meant to the pub industry rather than the motivation. I think the motivation is simply ignorant rather than evil, they didn't think through any of the consequences of the decision because no one there is in touch with the real world.

For politicians to be so ignorant is utterly negligent - and in the circumstances of this year - quite malicious.

CorrectHorseBattery said:

Foxy said:

Foxy said:

alex_ said:

One major difference is that it is being enforced. Strictly. Which makes a big difference. And not even allowing people to place posters in windows protesting. And furthermore, whilst for most people if required to self isolate it will likely be a one off to endure. For students forced to isolate in vast halls of residence ("officially" in many cases not even allowed to socialise with those with whom they are isolating! - see University of Stirling guidance posted above) they face the prospect of having to do so repeatedly for months. Every time there's a positive test somewhere in the vicinity.

When I was in halls in the 1980s we weren't allowed (amongst other rules) posters in the window.

I am glad Fox jr2 is not in Halls. He seems to be having a good time in his first week at Uni.

So far as he can tell he is the only male on his course of 30, Out tonight for an in person meet up. Clearly not an engineer!

Some engineers have social skills!

CorrectHorseBattery said:

@Gallowgate has a point though, software engineering makes us sound more intelligent than we are and software engineering jobs seem to get higher salaries - at least that was the case when I was applying

Foxy said:

CorrectHorseBattery said:

Foxy said:

Foxy said:

alex_ said:

One major difference is that it is being enforced. Strictly. Which makes a big difference. And not even allowing people to place posters in windows protesting. And furthermore, whilst for most people if required to self isolate it will likely be a one off to endure. For students forced to isolate in vast halls of residence ("officially" in many cases not even allowed to socialise with those with whom they are isolating! - see University of Stirling guidance posted above) they face the prospect of having to do so repeatedly for months. Every time there's a positive test somewhere in the vicinity.

When I was in halls in the 1980s we weren't allowed (amongst other rules) posters in the window.

I am glad Fox jr2 is not in Halls. He seems to be having a good time in his first week at Uni.

So far as he can tell he is the only male on his course of 30, Out tonight for an in person meet up. Clearly not an engineer!

Some engineers have social skills!

Possibly (my brother always seemed to have a girl) but on an engineering course the gender balance would be different to Comparative Literature*.

*Course reading looks great, much more interesting than English Lit.

Alistair said:

dixiedean said:

Course you can't really get much more of an identity politician than Trump.

I don't think you understand: appealing to racists is 'acceptable politics'. Fighting against racism is 'identity politics' which is bad.

IshmaelZ said:

Foxy said:

Tres said:

Don't mention the slavery!

Yes, we must ignore the parts of our history that we no longer like.

But that's not happening. The slave trade is as well and widely documented and acknowledged as the Industrial Revolution. Which makes you look a complete twit if you purport to have the historical firepower to run the National Trust and then come up with the Hang on, lads, we've made some unwelcome discoveries spiel.

LadyG said:

rcs1000 said:

LadyG said:

I think critical race theory, cultural Marxism, the idea of original sin of White Racism and Fragility, and so on, are arguably more menacing, long term, to American democracy, than Trump's everyday lunacies.

He's a terrible, odious president, but at most he can only run one more term (and he's surely going to lose); Cultural Marxism/Critical Race Theory and all that goes with it is a terrible but powerful IDEA, and ideas are more important in the end. This particular idea will presage a race war in the USA if it gets worse.

Moreover, America is exporting the madness of Critical Race Theory around the world, roiling other western nations.

Only one thing really matters: being accepting of the judgement of the electorate.

Because that is the natural self correcting mechanism.

In the 1960s and 1970s, we had some bloody awful governments, who took tax rates up to 98% on unearned income. Incredible, damaging, stupid things.

But the electoral system worked, and we got rid of people that peddled stupidity.

I'm also struggling to see who's standing on the platform you describe. Let's not forget, AOC and her cohort were an utter failure in the Democratic Primaries this year. Of the 19 people she and her PAC supported, only two won in the Primaries, and both look certain to lose.

One last thing: if you ask what proportion of the US believes in "critical race theory, cultural Marxism, the idea of original sin of White Racism and Fragility", you'll get - what 10-15%. At most. That's rather less than believe QAnon conspiracies.

Idiotically naive.

That 10-15% of Critical Race Theory Believers has completely captured academe, and from there they have spread and evolved, taking over media, the arts, liberal politics, the charity sector.

The Q Anon people are the plebs, they have no power. By contrast, the Left has completely won the Culture War, at the highest level of society, and these Lefties are infected with this mad identity politics fungus. Look at the Lib Dems denying biological gender.

It's bad in the UK and the situation is far worse in the USA, because the racial antagonism is so much more serious.

There will be blood.

CorrectHorseBattery said:

Can't private institutions and charities do what they want

Gallowgate said:

Casino_Royale said:

Tres said:

Casino_Royale said:

LadyG said:

Alistair said:

LadyG said:

https://twitter.com/MarinaMedvin/status/1306737500086566912?s=20

So on one hand you got a random on the street spouting awful opinions and on the other hand you have the president of the United States glorifying violence against his political opponents and refusing to confirm he will stand down if defeated.

Do you see how the equivalency fails?

Also I haven't seen a single top level Dem politician praise the Marxist front orginisation BlackLivesMatters as opposed to the general amorphous movement made of ordinary people pushing for racial justice that has the same name.

Well then you're blind as well as stupid

rcs1000 said:

LadyG said:

rottenborough said:

It is astonishing and extremely upsetting to watch American democracy self-destruct.

Both sides are responsible for this tragedy. The insane identity politics of the American Left are as corrosive and damaging as the stupidity and aggression of the Trumpians.

The insane identity politics are - of course - ridiculous and damaging.

But if Trump was just attacking that, and immigration, and free trade, etc., then we while we might not agree with him on everything, that would be well within his right.

But "insane identity politics" are not a threat to democracy. What is currently happening in the US *is* a threat to democracy. And we need to call it out when we see it, not attempt to say "there are good people on both sides".

The US (like the UK) has been successful because it has a good system. Once you dismantle a good system, you are on the highway to hell.

I think critical race theory, cultural Marxism, the idea of original sin of White Racism and Fragility, and so on, are arguably more menacing, long term, to American democracy, than Trump's everyday lunacies.

He's a terrible, odious president, but at most he can only run one more term (and he's surely going to lose); Cultural Marxism/Critical Race Theory and all that goes with it is a terrible but powerful IDEA, and ideas are more important in the end. This particular idea will presage a race war in the USA if it gets worse.

Moreover, America is exporting the madness of Critical Race Theory around the world, roiling other western nations.

It's infected our own National Trust too, which is why I cancelled my membership this week.

Bonkers! What on earth did the National Trust do?

It is indeed bonkers.

The National Trust report was one of the most astonishingly inept pieces of work I've ever seen. It's a massive self-inflicted wound.

You can read more about the problem in the links below. Rather than adding to their record of the stories of their properties in a fair and balanced way, where things are currently lopsided or inaccurate, and looking to add more and new stories of non-whites in (which would have been welcome) - they've thrown everyone in the same boat and damned them all. The last 400 years. The lot.

They've equated slavery and colonialism as exactly the same thing, linked people together to both with all sorts of tendentious and tangential evidence, without context, and littered the foreword and the main body report with Wokeness about "power" and "privilege" and a general narcisstic tone of atonement permeates the whole report.

It's largely been written by agenda pursuing left-wing academics - a hectoring, partial, nihilistic, anti-patriotic hatchet job - and the NT has contracted this out to them in the belief this creates "inclusivity" and "all parts of society" - when in reality it will do the opposite.

If that's the furrow they want to plough in future they won't be getting any more of my money. And I have told them so.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-national-trusts-shameful-manifesto/amp

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8762205/amp/DOMINIC-SANDBROOK-dare-National-Trust-link-Wordsworth-slavery.html

Like I said. Pathetic. You need to get a life. The national trust is still the same organization, it’s just highlighting some uncomfortable truths which you are welcome to ignore if you like.

Who gives a sh*t? Just ignore it if you don’t like it like 99% of people.

Gallowgate said:

CorrectHorseBattery said:

Can't private institutions and charities do what they want

It’s not even a big deal, I don’t know why some people are so obsessed. Have they not got anything better to do?

The same people who are whining about the National Trust are probably the same pathetic losers who feel the need to spend their precious time complaining to ofcom about a BLM necklace on TV.

They just need to get a life. This isn’t about the “culture war” whatsoever. A vast majority of people are happy to just get on with their lives.

Gallowgate said:

Casino_Royale said:

Tres said:

Casino_Royale said:

LadyG said:

Alistair said:

LadyG said:

https://twitter.com/MarinaMedvin/status/1306737500086566912?s=20

So on one hand you got a random on the street spouting awful opinions and on the other hand you have the president of the United States glorifying violence against his political opponents and refusing to confirm he will stand down if defeated.

Do you see how the equivalency fails?

Also I haven't seen a single top level Dem politician praise the Marxist front orginisation BlackLivesMatters as opposed to the general amorphous movement made of ordinary people pushing for racial justice that has the same name.

Well then you're blind as well as stupid

rcs1000 said:

LadyG said:

rottenborough said:

It is astonishing and extremely upsetting to watch American democracy self-destruct.

Both sides are responsible for this tragedy. The insane identity politics of the American Left are as corrosive and damaging as the stupidity and aggression of the Trumpians.

The insane identity politics are - of course - ridiculous and damaging.

But if Trump was just attacking that, and immigration, and free trade, etc., then we while we might not agree with him on everything, that would be well within his right.

But "insane identity politics" are not a threat to democracy. What is currently happening in the US *is* a threat to democracy. And we need to call it out when we see it, not attempt to say "there are good people on both sides".

The US (like the UK) has been successful because it has a good system. Once you dismantle a good system, you are on the highway to hell.

I think critical race theory, cultural Marxism, the idea of original sin of White Racism and Fragility, and so on, are arguably more menacing, long term, to American democracy, than Trump's everyday lunacies.

He's a terrible, odious president, but at most he can only run one more term (and he's surely going to lose); Cultural Marxism/Critical Race Theory and all that goes with it is a terrible but powerful IDEA, and ideas are more important in the end. This particular idea will presage a race war in the USA if it gets worse.

Moreover, America is exporting the madness of Critical Race Theory around the world, roiling other western nations.

It's infected our own National Trust too, which is why I cancelled my membership this week.

Bonkers! What on earth did the National Trust do?

It is indeed bonkers.

The National Trust report was one of the most astonishingly inept pieces of work I've ever seen. It's a massive self-inflicted wound.

You can read more about the problem in the links below. Rather than adding to their record of the stories of their properties in a fair and balanced way, where things are currently lopsided or inaccurate, and looking to add more and new stories of non-whites in (which would have been welcome) - they've thrown everyone in the same boat and damned them all. The last 400 years. The lot.

They've equated slavery and colonialism as exactly the same thing, linked people together to both with all sorts of tendentious and tangential evidence, without context, and littered the foreword and the main body report with Wokeness about "power" and "privilege" and a general narcisstic tone of atonement permeates the whole report.

It's largely been written by agenda pursuing left-wing academics - a hectoring, partial, nihilistic, anti-patriotic hatchet job - and the NT has contracted this out to them in the belief this creates "inclusivity" and "all parts of society" - when in reality it will do the opposite.

If that's the furrow they want to plough in future they won't be getting any more of my money. And I have told them so.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-national-trusts-shameful-manifesto/amp

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8762205/amp/DOMINIC-SANDBROOK-dare-National-Trust-link-Wordsworth-slavery.html

Like I said. Pathetic. You need to get a life. The national trust is still the same organization, it’s just highlighting some uncomfortable truths which you are welcome to ignore if you like.

Who gives a sh*t? Just ignore it if you don’t like it like 99% of people.

Gallowgate said:

Casino_Royale said:

Gallowgate said:

Casino_Royale said:

Tres said:

Casino_Royale said:

LadyG said:

Alistair said:

LadyG said:

https://twitter.com/MarinaMedvin/status/1306737500086566912?s=20

So on one hand you got a random on the street spouting awful opinions and on the other hand you have the president of the United States glorifying violence against his political opponents and refusing to confirm he will stand down if defeated.

Do you see how the equivalency fails?

Also I haven't seen a single top level Dem politician praise the Marxist front orginisation BlackLivesMatters as opposed to the general amorphous movement made of ordinary people pushing for racial justice that has the same name.

Well then you're blind as well as stupid

rcs1000 said:

LadyG said:

rottenborough said:

It is astonishing and extremely upsetting to watch American democracy self-destruct.

Both sides are responsible for this tragedy. The insane identity politics of the American Left are as corrosive and damaging as the stupidity and aggression of the Trumpians.

The insane identity politics are - of course - ridiculous and damaging.

But if Trump was just attacking that, and immigration, and free trade, etc., then we while we might not agree with him on everything, that would be well within his right.

But "insane identity politics" are not a threat to democracy. What is currently happening in the US *is* a threat to democracy. And we need to call it out when we see it, not attempt to say "there are good people on both sides".

The US (like the UK) has been successful because it has a good system. Once you dismantle a good system, you are on the highway to hell.

I think critical race theory, cultural Marxism, the idea of original sin of White Racism and Fragility, and so on, are arguably more menacing, long term, to American democracy, than Trump's everyday lunacies.

He's a terrible, odious president, but at most he can only run one more term (and he's surely going to lose); Cultural Marxism/Critical Race Theory and all that goes with it is a terrible but powerful IDEA, and ideas are more important in the end. This particular idea will presage a race war in the USA if it gets worse.

Moreover, America is exporting the madness of Critical Race Theory around the world, roiling other western nations.

It's infected our own National Trust too, which is why I cancelled my membership this week.

Bonkers! What on earth did the National Trust do?

It is indeed bonkers.

The National Trust report was one of the most astonishingly inept pieces of work I've ever seen. It's a massive self-inflicted wound.

You can read more about the problem in the links below. Rather than adding to their record of the stories of their properties in a fair and balanced way, where things are currently lopsided or inaccurate, and looking to add more and new stories of non-whites in (which would have been welcome) - they've thrown everyone in the same boat and damned them all. The last 400 years. The lot.

They've equated slavery and colonialism as exactly the same thing, linked people together to both with all sorts of tendentious and tangential evidence, without context, and littered the foreword and the main body report with Wokeness about "power" and "privilege" and a general narcisstic tone of atonement permeates the whole report.

It's largely been written by agenda pursuing left-wing academics - a hectoring, partial, nihilistic, anti-patriotic hatchet job - and the NT has contracted this out to them in the belief this creates "inclusivity" and "all parts of society" - when in reality it will do the opposite.

If that's the furrow they want to plough in future they won't be getting any more of my money. And I have told them so.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-national-trusts-shameful-manifesto/amp

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8762205/amp/DOMINIC-SANDBROOK-dare-National-Trust-link-Wordsworth-slavery.html

Like I said. Pathetic. You need to get a life. The national trust is still the same organization, it’s just highlighting some uncomfortable truths which you are welcome to ignore if you like.

Who gives a sh*t? Just ignore it if you don’t like it like 99% of people.

Again this is a very typical reaction from ignoramuses who fail to understand the importance of context, selection and presentation of historical facts.

The authors of this report understood this very well of course - which is precisely why they choose to present it in this way. It includes charmers like this:

"One of the report’s editors is Professor Corinne Fowler, director of the Colonial Countryside project at Leicester university, and author of Green Unpleasant Land: Creative Responses to Rural Britain’s Colonial Histories. She retweets things like ‘Rural racism means POC [People of Colour] don’t feel safe in there. The countryside is one of the last bastions of Empire’ and ‘Amid a global reckoning over the history of slavery one institution has remained silent: the British monarchy’"

In answer to your last question the answer is: millions of people, which is why the National Trust will now find they've got a big problem.

They've just taken sides in the culture wars.

It’s just a fact of life that a vast majority of our historical figures were, by today’s standards, bad people.

And so what? Why do you want to hide that? It doesn’t change anything. It doesn’t make any race “evil” and it shouldn’t lead to any “white guilt” or any of that nonsense. It’s just a fact.

I suggest you get over it.