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First like the draw in the cricket.0
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Second, like a bloke with a sponge by a boxing ring.0
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Third, loike what comes out of me arsh.0
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My view is that punters are still being influenced by what happened last time.
Spot on. Good value on Biden. Tbh Clinton would have been good value at an implied 56% chance last time round. That the bet would have lost is neither here nor there.
Biden's position is certainly stronger than Clinton's was though.2 -
I wonder how much good Trump thinks the clips of Hillary looking ill did him last time round.0
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Compare "With the exception is the Republican-friendly pollster, Rasmussen, all the other surveys have dire numbers for Trump and there is no precedent for an incumbent with such disapproval levels getting re-elected." And this bias has been very obvious for at least 10 years.
Remembering TSE's comment yesterday about YouGov "Quite simply their brand would be ruined if their methodology was a pro Tory position, ..."
So I'm wondering why are Rasmussen still being quoted as serious pollsters?
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FPT
No it wasn't. Do the maths and show how you get a majority behind a Labour government.DecrepiterJohnL said:
Quite what? Without Bercow, there was a general election so that point is moot. Until then, it was possible (if unlikely) to construct a Labour government to revoke Article 50 and call an election.CarlottaVance said:0 -
I don't think he thinks he's winning:
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1297922993021042688?s=200 -
FPT
@TheScreamingEagles
Actually, "God Save The Queen" is a much more mournful dirge than "Jerusalem"!0 -
You could argue that the other way too. Big time.eristdoof said:Compare "With the exception is the Republican-friendly pollster, Rasmussen, all the other surveys have dire numbers for Trump and there is no precedent for an incumbent with such disapproval levels getting re-elected." And this bias has been very obvious for at least 10 years.
Remembering TSE's comment yesterday about YouGov "Quite simply their brand would be ruined if their methodology was a pro Tory position, ..."
So I'm wondering why are Rasmussen still being quoted as serious pollsters?
Who are largely the paymasters of the other pollsters? organisations for whom Trump is a total anathema, not just a political opponent. A figure of complete and utter visceral hatred. A figure who, even if he did something right, simply could not do anything right. Someone they don;t just want beaten, but erased.
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Mad stat, today there are 474 covid postive patients in hospital in England and 246 in Scotland. England has 10 times the population of Scotland.0
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If it would clear away from Arundel as well, that would be good.ydoethur said:
If the rain could bugger off to Taunton, that would be immensely helpful.tlg86 said:First like the draw in the cricket.
Disappointing to abandon our discussion about large organs in favour of a thread about the world's largest organ.
However, can someone please explain to me why every topic here recently has been an 'undefined discussion subject'?
When, as with the current one, it clearly isn't.0 -
Where as he is "setting the table" for disputing the result.CarlottaVance said:I don't think he thinks he's winning:
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1297922993021042688?s=201 -
Including Fox News??contrarian said:
You could argue that the other way too. Big time.eristdoof said:Compare "With the exception is the Republican-friendly pollster, Rasmussen, all the other surveys have dire numbers for Trump and there is no precedent for an incumbent with such disapproval levels getting re-elected." And this bias has been very obvious for at least 10 years.
Remembering TSE's comment yesterday about YouGov "Quite simply their brand would be ruined if their methodology was a pro Tory position, ..."
So I'm wondering why are Rasmussen still being quoted as serious pollsters?
Who are largely the paymasters of the other pollsters? organisations for whom Trump is a total anathema, not just a political opponent. A figure of complete and utter visceral hatred. A figure who, even if he did something right, simply could not do anything right. Someone they don;t just want beaten, but erased.0 -
I don't think you will find many people in the world who disagree with you on that one.Sunil_Prasannan said:FPT
@TheScreamingEagles
Actually, "God Save The Queen" is a much more mournful dirge than "Jerusalem"!0 -
Except that the other US pollsters on average get the national elections right. Rasmussen were biassed before Trump and they are biassed in the Trump era.contrarian said:
You could argue that the other way too. Big time.eristdoof said:Compare "With the exception is the Republican-friendly pollster, Rasmussen, all the other surveys have dire numbers for Trump and there is no precedent for an incumbent with such disapproval levels getting re-elected." And this bias has been very obvious for at least 10 years.
Remembering TSE's comment yesterday about YouGov "Quite simply their brand would be ruined if their methodology was a pro Tory position, ..."
So I'm wondering why are Rasmussen still being quoted as serious pollsters?
Who are largely the paymasters of the other pollsters? organisations for whom Trump is a total anathema, not just a political opponent. A figure of complete and utter visceral hatred. A figure who, even if he did something right, simply could not do anything right. Someone they don;t just want beaten, but erased.0 -
Fair point, but I said 'largely' And Fox may be right wing, but not in a populist sense, I think its fair to say.eristdoof said:
Where as he is "setting the table" for disputing the result.CarlottaVance said:I don't think he thinks he's winning:
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1297922993021042688?s=20MikeSmithson said:
Including Fox News??contrarian said:
You could argue that the other way too. Big time.eristdoof said:Compare "With the exception is the Republican-friendly pollster, Rasmussen, all the other surveys have dire numbers for Trump and there is no precedent for an incumbent with such disapproval levels getting re-elected." And this bias has been very obvious for at least 10 years.
Remembering TSE's comment yesterday about YouGov "Quite simply their brand would be ruined if their methodology was a pro Tory position, ..."
So I'm wondering why are Rasmussen still being quoted as serious pollsters?
Who are largely the paymasters of the other pollsters? organisations for whom Trump is a total anathema, not just a political opponent. A figure of complete and utter visceral hatred. A figure who, even if he did something right, simply could not do anything right. Someone they don;t just want beaten, but erased.0 -
FPT
CarlottaVance said:
» show previous quotes
The SNP White Paper did:
What about our share of the national debt?
Scotland and the rest of the UK will agree a share of the national debt. This could be by reference to the historical contribution made to the ’s public finances by Scotland. n alternative approach would be to use our population share.
Page 50.
That was based on a fair share of ALL of the value of UK assets being deposited in our central bank. Usual half (s)tory from an ally of George Galloway. Tories don't half keep rum company.0 -
I haven't bothered today - but the cases numbers later in the week, after we are out of the weekend shadow might be interesting.NerysHughes said:Mad stat, today there are 474 covid postive patients in hospital in England and 246 in Scotland. England has 10 times the population of Scotland.
Every other indicator is down, in England.0 -
There are different levels of wearing face masks in schools. One is you have to wear a face mask when on the move, but do not have to when sat down during a lesson.CarlottaVance said:
Another is you have to wear a face mask at all times including during lessons.
The question blurs this important distinction.0 -
No.eristdoof said:
I don't think you will find many people in the world who disagree with you on that one.Sunil_Prasannan said:FPT
@TheScreamingEagles
Actually, "God Save The Queen" is a much more mournful dirge than "Jerusalem"!
The General Wade verse is quite amusing though. It should be brought out at Murrayfield every 2 years.
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Doesn't seem to be dropping in London.CarlottaVance said:0 -
There hasn't so there must be something wrong at your end.OldKingCole said:
If it would clear away from Arundel as well, that would be good.ydoethur said:
If the rain could bugger off to Taunton, that would be immensely helpful.tlg86 said:First like the draw in the cricket.
Disappointing to abandon our discussion about large organs in favour of a thread about the world's largest organ.
However, can someone please explain to me why every topic here recently has been an 'undefined discussion subject'?
When, as with the current one, it clearly isn't.0 -
Though, at the moment, the UK government guidance is to not wear them at all. As in a positive instruction to not wear them, rather than "do what you think is best". (Scotland changed its view on this this afternoon, I think).eristdoof said:
There are different levels of wearing face masks in schools. One is you have to wear a face mask when on the move, but do not have to when sat down during a lesson.CarlottaVance said:
Another is you have to wear a face mask at all times including during lessons.
The question blurs this important distinction.
This is one of the reasons that teachers are less than convinced that the UK government has their best interests at heart.0 -
I do think face masks should be allowed for staff at school0
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What penny needs to drop in Brussels? No Deal will be no problem for the UK, why do we even care what they think now?0
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You could if you really wanted to.contrarian said:
You could argue that the other way too. Big time...eristdoof said:Compare "With the exception is the Republican-friendly pollster, Rasmussen, all the other surveys have dire numbers for Trump and there is no precedent for an incumbent with such disapproval levels getting re-elected." And this bias has been very obvious for at least 10 years.
Remembering TSE's comment yesterday about YouGov "Quite simply their brand would be ruined if their methodology was a pro Tory position, ..."
So I'm wondering why are Rasmussen still being quoted as serious pollsters?
But pollsters are usually judged on their performance rather than who owns them.
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/pollster-ratings/0 -
The SNP White Paper did not propose a Central Bank, but "a seat on the Board of the Bank of England".malcolmg said:FPT
CarlottaVance said:
» show previous quotes
The SNP White Paper did:
What about our share of the national debt?
Scotland and the rest of the UK will agree a share of the national debt. This could be by reference to the historical contribution made to the ’s public finances by Scotland. n alternative approach would be to use our population share.
Page 50.
That was based on a fair share of ALL of the value of UK assets being deposited in our central bank. Usual half (s)tory from an ally of George Galloway. Tories don't half keep rum company.0 -
Well they are not banned. Is it not down to the individual teachers?CorrectHorseBattery said:I do think face masks should be allowed for staff at school
I must say I can't really imagine teaching with a face mask on. It muffles your voice, reduces the ability of the kids to read your facial expressions and is quite uncomfortable for long periods. But for moving around corridors etc, yes, I probably would.0 -
If the virus is spread in saliva, then teachers projecting their voices without masks is an obvious risk. Perhaps teachers should be mic'd up.DavidL said:
Well they are not banned. Is it not down to the individual teachers?CorrectHorseBattery said:I do think face masks should be allowed for staff at school
I must say I can't really imagine teaching with a face mask on. It muffles your voice, reduces the ability of the kids to read your facial expressions and is quite uncomfortable for long periods. But for moving around corridors etc, yes, I probably would.0 -
Indeed. My son is not wearing them during lessons but is supposed to in the corridors or playground.eristdoof said:
There are different levels of wearing face masks in schools. One is you have to wear a face mask when on the move, but do not have to when sat down during a lesson.CarlottaVance said:
Another is you have to wear a face mask at all times including during lessons.
The question blurs this important distinction.0 -
That should kill any remaining tourism stone dead:
https://twitter.com/standardnews/status/1297931318332923905?s=200 -
They stay at least 2m away from the children, normally more. They aren't bawling, I think that's enough.DecrepiterJohnL said:
If the virus is spread in saliva, then teachers projecting their voices without masks is an obvious risk. Perhaps teachers should be mic'd up.DavidL said:
Well they are not banned. Is it not down to the individual teachers?CorrectHorseBattery said:I do think face masks should be allowed for staff at school
I must say I can't really imagine teaching with a face mask on. It muffles your voice, reduces the ability of the kids to read your facial expressions and is quite uncomfortable for long periods. But for moving around corridors etc, yes, I probably would.0 -
Good. International travel right now needs to be discouraged. Period. We can start again once we have a vaccine.CarlottaVance said:That should kill any remaining tourism stone dead:
https://twitter.com/standardnews/status/1297931318332923905?s=203 -
Why is it mad, we went into it later and would expect to be lagging , no-one is dying so it is not an issue.NerysHughes said:Mad stat, today there are 474 covid postive patients in hospital in England and 246 in Scotland. England has 10 times the population of Scotland.
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Its a bit like the Wales daily admission figure. You wonder if it is correct,malcolmg said:
Why is it mad, we went into it later and would expect to be lagging , no-one is dying so it is not an issue.NerysHughes said:Mad stat, today there are 474 covid postive patients in hospital in England and 246 in Scotland. England has 10 times the population of Scotland.
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Bit more detail on the HK re-infection case;
https://twitter.com/mugecevik/status/1297884940042985472
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https://labourlist.org/2020/08/labours-backlog-of-antisemitism-cases-is-being-cleared-says-nec-member/
I think we can all agree this is good.0 -
"Of course most Americans are only just now starting to pay attention"
I really am not sure that is true this election cycle.0 -
False positive, Shirley?Nigelb said:Bit more detail on the HK re-infection case;
https://twitter.com/mugecevik/status/1297884940042985472
If he got it the first time and showed symptoms, why would he not have any symptoms second time around if it was not for an immune response?0 -
The Sun's reporting of the EU basically saying "sod off" is very entertaining0
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And if asymptomatic, does it matter? If we all caught it but were all asymptomatic there would be no problem.Luckyguy1983 said:
False positive, Shirley?Nigelb said:Bit more detail on the HK re-infection case;
https://twitter.com/mugecevik/status/1297884940042985472
If he got it the first time and showed symptoms, why would he not have any symptoms second time around if it was not for an immune response?0 -
Extracted viral RNA and sequenced it, I believe - different seqwuences.Luckyguy1983 said:
False positive, Shirley?Nigelb said:Bit more detail on the HK re-infection case;
https://twitter.com/mugecevik/status/1297884940042985472
If he got it the first time and showed symptoms, why would he not have any symptoms second time around if it was not for an immune response?0 -
Barnier's team doesn't have a mandate to say anything except sod off. The real negotiations begin in the 'tunnel' phase (or whatever it's called) and involve the Heads of Government of the 27.CorrectHorseBattery said:The Sun's reporting of the EU basically saying "sod off" is very entertaining
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Perhaps if the UK stopped undermining the deal it signed, some progress might be made. Let's be honest they wanted no trade deal and they're going to blame the EU for it.Luckyguy1983 said:
Barnier's team doesn't have a mandate to say anything except sod off. The real negotiations begin in the 'tunnel' phase (or whatever it's called) and involve the Heads of Government of the 27.CorrectHorseBattery said:The Sun's reporting of the EU basically saying "sod off" is very entertaining
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You must have missed the earlier reports, which explained that the virus from both tests happened to be sequenced, and were quite clearly genetically distinct.Luckyguy1983 said:
False positive, Shirley?Nigelb said:Bit more detail on the HK re-infection case;
https://twitter.com/mugecevik/status/1297884940042985472
If he got it the first time and showed symptoms, why would he not have any symptoms second time around if it was not for an immune response?
As we know, you can be infected and asymptomatic - and it may indeed be a persistent immune response from the first infection that ensured the second infection was so mild.
That doesn't make it a false positive, but it does suggest that the danger of reinfection might be less than everyone feared.
Without seeing a detailed report on the incident (no paper has been published), it's not easy to say much more.
(edit)
As a virologist confirms:
https://twitter.com/VirusesImmunity/status/12978904181688606740 -
It's the opposite. They only go into the 'tunnel' if there is already the basis of a high-level agreement, and at that point the heads of government are taken out of the loop.Luckyguy1983 said:
Barnier's team doesn't have a mandate to say anything except sod off. The real negotiations begin in the 'tunnel' phase (or whatever it's called) and involve the Heads of Government of the 27.CorrectHorseBattery said:The Sun's reporting of the EU basically saying "sod off" is very entertaining
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When the current estimates are that something like 70% of transmission events might be from airborne virus, it's extraordinary that government guidance has so little to say about it (in contrast to a great deal about hand washing).DavidL said:
Indeed. My son is not wearing them during lessons but is supposed to in the corridors or playground.eristdoof said:
There are different levels of wearing face masks in schools. One is you have to wear a face mask when on the move, but do not have to when sat down during a lesson.CarlottaVance said:
Another is you have to wear a face mask at all times including during lessons.
The question blurs this important distinction.
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/actions-for-schools-during-the-coronavirus-outbreak/guidance-for-full-opening-schools
They do helpfully remind schools of their legal responsibilities to conduct risk assessments ...0 -
Ok, thanks to you and Carnyx for the clarification.Nigelb said:
You must have missed the earlier reports, which explained that the virus from both tests happened to be sequenced, and were quite clearly genetically distinct.Luckyguy1983 said:
False positive, Shirley?Nigelb said:Bit more detail on the HK re-infection case;
https://twitter.com/mugecevik/status/1297884940042985472
If he got it the first time and showed symptoms, why would he not have any symptoms second time around if it was not for an immune response?
As we know, you can be infected and asymptomatic - and it may indeed be a persistent immune response from the first infection that ensured the second infection was so mild.
That doesn't make it a false positive, but it does suggest that the danger of reinfection might be less than everyone feared.
Without seeing a detailed report on the incident (no paper has been published), it's not easy to say much more.
It would stand to reason that the difference in symptoms was due to an immune reaction.0 -
https://twitter.com/BBCWorld/status/1297938133397450753
Yes it is easy to build on the back of Obama's economy0 -
I am happy to give way to your superior knowledge of the terminology and timings. The phase I am speaking of could well be before 'the tunnel'. However, my basic point stands, which is that in the current phase, Barnier and his team do not have the power to make substantive concessions even if the case for doing so was cast iron. It's play acting.williamglenn said:
It's the opposite. They only go into the 'tunnel' if there is already the basis of a high-level agreement, and at that point the heads of government are taken out of the loop.Luckyguy1983 said:
Barnier's team doesn't have a mandate to say anything except sod off. The real negotiations begin in the 'tunnel' phase (or whatever it's called) and involve the Heads of Government of the 27.CorrectHorseBattery said:The Sun's reporting of the EU basically saying "sod off" is very entertaining
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There must be more detail out there somewhere, as this is from the thread I posted a link to above:Luckyguy1983 said:
Ok, thanks to you and Carnyx for the clarification.Nigelb said:
You must have missed the earlier reports, which explained that the virus from both tests happened to be sequenced, and were quite clearly genetically distinct.Luckyguy1983 said:
False positive, Shirley?Nigelb said:Bit more detail on the HK re-infection case;
https://twitter.com/mugecevik/status/1297884940042985472
If he got it the first time and showed symptoms, why would he not have any symptoms second time around if it was not for an immune response?
As we know, you can be infected and asymptomatic - and it may indeed be a persistent immune response from the first infection that ensured the second infection was so mild.
That doesn't make it a false positive, but it does suggest that the danger of reinfection might be less than everyone feared.
Without seeing a detailed report on the incident (no paper has been published), it's not easy to say much more.
It would stand to reason that the difference in symptoms was due to an immune reaction.
https://twitter.com/VirusesImmunity/status/1297890434262474758
The two shot prime/boost vaccines are based on a similar idea.1 -
Usain Bolt, positive for coronavirus:0
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Agreed 100%DavidL said:
Good. International travel right now needs to be discouraged. Period. We can start again once we have a vaccine.CarlottaVance said:That should kill any remaining tourism stone dead:
https://twitter.com/standardnews/status/1297931318332923905?s=20
Anyone prioritising international travel over ensuring we can have our own country open during a plague is mad. If we hadn't needed a lockdown then the idea of closing international travel would be insane, but having been through a lockdown the priority should be ensuring that never happens again - not being able to visit second homes overseas or having a holiday overseas.0 -
The UK isn't undermining* the deal it signed, the problem is the EU disingenuously trying to rewrite the deal to mean the opposite of what it actually says in black and white - of which Barnier is very guilty.CorrectHorseBattery said:
Perhaps if the UK stopped undermining the deal it signed, some progress might be made. Let's be honest they wanted no trade deal and they're going to blame the EU for it.Luckyguy1983 said:
Barnier's team doesn't have a mandate to say anything except sod off. The real negotiations begin in the 'tunnel' phase (or whatever it's called) and involve the Heads of Government of the 27.CorrectHorseBattery said:The Sun's reporting of the EU basically saying "sod off" is very entertaining
* Some batshit crazy loons are but they're not part of the government and best off ignored.0 -
Given Barnier's disgraceful attitude no trade deal is the best thing that can happen right now it seems, unless they change tact.CorrectHorseBattery said:
Perhaps if the UK stopped undermining the deal it signed, some progress might be made. Let's be honest they wanted no trade deal and they're going to blame the EU for it.Luckyguy1983 said:
Barnier's team doesn't have a mandate to say anything except sod off. The real negotiations begin in the 'tunnel' phase (or whatever it's called) and involve the Heads of Government of the 27.CorrectHorseBattery said:The Sun's reporting of the EU basically saying "sod off" is very entertaining
After we've gone through no deal and diverged from them then maybe they will come to their senses and start talking properly. If so then a deal can be agreed later, but we will have already diverged more from them by then.0 -
Nigel, surely that virologist's explanation only makes sense if the spike protein is different between the strains? A healthy memory T-cell and IgM response to the original spike protein would be expected to prevent reinfection, rather than just ameliorate the symptoms, would it not?Nigelb said:
You must have missed the earlier reports, which explained that the virus from both tests happened to be sequenced, and were quite clearly genetically distinct.Luckyguy1983 said:
False positive, Shirley?Nigelb said:Bit more detail on the HK re-infection case;
https://twitter.com/mugecevik/status/1297884940042985472
If he got it the first time and showed symptoms, why would he not have any symptoms second time around if it was not for an immune response?
As we know, you can be infected and asymptomatic - and it may indeed be a persistent immune response from the first infection that ensured the second infection was so mild.
That doesn't make it a false positive, but it does suggest that the danger of reinfection might be less than everyone feared.
Without seeing a detailed report on the incident (no paper has been published), it's not easy to say much more.
(edit)
As a virologist confirms:
https://twitter.com/VirusesImmunity/status/12978904181688606740 -
The debates, if they happen, will be must see TV.CorrectHorseBattery said:https://twitter.com/BBCWorld/status/1297938133397450753
Yes it is easy to build on the back of Obama's economy
But will they?1 -
That the UK is going to be an equal sovereign nation and not a supplicant colony subjugated to their rules.CorrectHorseBattery said:What penny needs to drop in Brussels? No Deal will be no problem for the UK, why do we even care what they think now?
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Barnier is trying to undermine the deal the EU signed, is he? No.Philip_Thompson said:
Given Barnier's disgraceful attitude no trade deal is the best thing that can happen right now it seems, unless they change tact.CorrectHorseBattery said:
Perhaps if the UK stopped undermining the deal it signed, some progress might be made. Let's be honest they wanted no trade deal and they're going to blame the EU for it.Luckyguy1983 said:
Barnier's team doesn't have a mandate to say anything except sod off. The real negotiations begin in the 'tunnel' phase (or whatever it's called) and involve the Heads of Government of the 27.CorrectHorseBattery said:The Sun's reporting of the EU basically saying "sod off" is very entertaining
After we've gone through no deal and diverged from them then maybe they will come to their senses and start talking properly. If so then a deal can be agreed later, but we will have already diverged more from them by then.
The EU doesn't care about No Deal, how many times is this going to need to be said. It's blatantly clear to anyone not blinkered the EU just need to sit and wait and we'll come back to them.0 -
In any negotiation there is a strong party and a weak party. The UK is the weak party, this is obvious.0
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What a whole load of utter nonsense PhilipPhilip_Thompson said:
That the UK is going to be an equal sovereign nation and not a supplicant colony subjugated to their rules.CorrectHorseBattery said:What penny needs to drop in Brussels? No Deal will be no problem for the UK, why do we even care what they think now?
0 -
Yes he is on the LPF he is explicitly undermining it.CorrectHorseBattery said:
Barnier is trying to undermine the deal the EU signed, is he? No.Philip_Thompson said:
Given Barnier's disgraceful attitude no trade deal is the best thing that can happen right now it seems, unless they change tact.CorrectHorseBattery said:
Perhaps if the UK stopped undermining the deal it signed, some progress might be made. Let's be honest they wanted no trade deal and they're going to blame the EU for it.Luckyguy1983 said:
Barnier's team doesn't have a mandate to say anything except sod off. The real negotiations begin in the 'tunnel' phase (or whatever it's called) and involve the Heads of Government of the 27.CorrectHorseBattery said:The Sun's reporting of the EU basically saying "sod off" is very entertaining
After we've gone through no deal and diverged from them then maybe they will come to their senses and start talking properly. If so then a deal can be agreed later, but we will have already diverged more from them by then.
The EU doesn't care about No Deal, how many times is this going to need to be said. It's blatantly clear to anyone not blinkered the EU just need to sit and wait and we'll come back to them.
I don't think we will come back to them but so be it we will see. I'm quite content for No Deal too - its people like you that seem most flustered about it.0 -
Equal my arsePhilip_Thompson said:
That the UK is going to be an equal sovereign nation and not a supplicant colony subjugated to their rules.CorrectHorseBattery said:What penny needs to drop in Brussels? No Deal will be no problem for the UK, why do we even care what they think now?
1 -
It depends how busy were dentists on the day of the vote.Philip_Thompson said:FPT
No it wasn't. Do the maths and show how you get a majority behind a Labour government.DecrepiterJohnL said:
Quite what? Without Bercow, there was a general election so that point is moot. Until then, it was possible (if unlikely) to construct a Labour government to revoke Article 50 and call an election.CarlottaVance said:0 -
You're right we're not equal, we're better than them. But I'm being polite.nichomar said:
Equal my arsePhilip_Thompson said:
That the UK is going to be an equal sovereign nation and not a supplicant colony subjugated to their rules.CorrectHorseBattery said:What penny needs to drop in Brussels? No Deal will be no problem for the UK, why do we even care what they think now?
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Nice to see you fall for the Tory propaganda.Philip_Thompson said:
Given Barnier's disgraceful attitude no trade deal is the best thing that can happen right now it seems, unless they change tact.CorrectHorseBattery said:
Perhaps if the UK stopped undermining the deal it signed, some progress might be made. Let's be honest they wanted no trade deal and they're going to blame the EU for it.Luckyguy1983 said:
Barnier's team doesn't have a mandate to say anything except sod off. The real negotiations begin in the 'tunnel' phase (or whatever it's called) and involve the Heads of Government of the 27.CorrectHorseBattery said:The Sun's reporting of the EU basically saying "sod off" is very entertaining
After we've gone through no deal and diverged from them then maybe they will come to their senses and start talking properly. If so then a deal can be agreed later, but we will have already diverged more from them by then.
The Tories don't want a deal because they aren't bright enough to understand the consequences of not having one.1 -
Oooh go on, tell me about these scary terrifying consequences I don't understand. I'll be patient, I can even understand big words.eek said:
Nice to see you fall for the Tory propaganda.Philip_Thompson said:
Given Barnier's disgraceful attitude no trade deal is the best thing that can happen right now it seems, unless they change tact.CorrectHorseBattery said:
Perhaps if the UK stopped undermining the deal it signed, some progress might be made. Let's be honest they wanted no trade deal and they're going to blame the EU for it.Luckyguy1983 said:
Barnier's team doesn't have a mandate to say anything except sod off. The real negotiations begin in the 'tunnel' phase (or whatever it's called) and involve the Heads of Government of the 27.CorrectHorseBattery said:The Sun's reporting of the EU basically saying "sod off" is very entertaining
After we've gone through no deal and diverged from them then maybe they will come to their senses and start talking properly. If so then a deal can be agreed later, but we will have already diverged more from them by then.
The Tories don't want a deal because they aren't bright enough to understand the consequences of not having one.0 -
If we want to be equal to the members of the EU, we need to be in the EU.Philip_Thompson said:
That the UK is going to be an equal sovereign nation and not a supplicant colony subjugated to their rules.CorrectHorseBattery said:What penny needs to drop in Brussels? No Deal will be no problem for the UK, why do we even care what they think now?
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That’s the problem you actually believe that rubbish.Philip_Thompson said:
You're right we're not equal, we're better than them. But I'm being polite.nichomar said:
Equal my arsePhilip_Thompson said:
That the UK is going to be an equal sovereign nation and not a supplicant colony subjugated to their rules.CorrectHorseBattery said:What penny needs to drop in Brussels? No Deal will be no problem for the UK, why do we even care what they think now?
1 -
Yours truly is one of the 51 million, being an active registered voter in an all vote-by-mail state.CarlottaVance said:I don't think he thinks he's winning:
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1297922993021042688?s=20
Trumpsky's attacks - rhetorical and operational - are serious. BUT hope that Dems are NOT jumping into another rabbit hole, like they did with impeachment.
That is, playing into Trumpsky's hands.1 -
USA GOP VP betting
Something very odd is happening on Betfair. Someone has just backed Kristi Noem and Nicki Haley at 1000, even after Pence has been nominated at the RNC.0 -
Fine but France is the nation most visited by tourists in the world, the UK is only the 10th most visited nation (though London is the 3rd most visited city)CarlottaVance said:That should kill any remaining tourism stone dead:
https://twitter.com/standardnews/status/1297931318332923905?s=20
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Tourism_rankings
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_by_international_visitors0 -
There wouldn't be one day of a vote, for there to be a functioning government there are votes practically every day. You can't rely on the dentist for all of them.DecrepiterJohnL said:
It depends how busy were dentists on the day of the vote.Philip_Thompson said:FPT
No it wasn't. Do the maths and show how you get a majority behind a Labour government.DecrepiterJohnL said:
Quite what? Without Bercow, there was a general election so that point is moot. Until then, it was possible (if unlikely) to construct a Labour government to revoke Article 50 and call an election.CarlottaVance said:
The numbers weren't there in the last Parliament for what you propose.0 -
That can’t be true we’re better than they areHYUFD said:
Fine but France is the nation most visited by tourists in the world, the UK is only the 10th most visited nation (though London is the 3rd most visited city)CarlottaVance said:That should kill any remaining tourism stone dead:
https://twitter.com/standardnews/status/1297931318332923905?s=20
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Tourism_rankings
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_by_international_visitors
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Not necessarily, if you look at the difference in antibody titres between the first and second infection ?TimT said:
Nigel, surely that virologist's explanation only makes sense if the spike protein is different between the strains? A healthy memory T-cell and IgM response to the original spike protein would be expected to prevent reinfection, rather than just ameliorate the symptoms, would it not?Nigelb said:
You must have missed the earlier reports, which explained that the virus from both tests happened to be sequenced, and were quite clearly genetically distinct.Luckyguy1983 said:
False positive, Shirley?Nigelb said:Bit more detail on the HK re-infection case;
https://twitter.com/mugecevik/status/1297884940042985472
If he got it the first time and showed symptoms, why would he not have any symptoms second time around if it was not for an immune response?
As we know, you can be infected and asymptomatic - and it may indeed be a persistent immune response from the first infection that ensured the second infection was so mild.
That doesn't make it a false positive, but it does suggest that the danger of reinfection might be less than everyone feared.
Without seeing a detailed report on the incident (no paper has been published), it's not easy to say much more.
(edit)
As a virologist confirms:
https://twitter.com/VirusesImmunity/status/1297890418168860674
It seems to me (FWIW) that there's still very large amount we don't understand about the detailed mechanics of the complicated interplay between viral infection and the immune system.
It's clearly not a completely binary infected/immune picture.0 -
The offer from Labour was purdah terms.Philip_Thompson said:
There wouldn't be one day of a vote, for there to be a functioning government there are votes practically every day. You can't rely on the dentist for all of them.DecrepiterJohnL said:
It depends how busy were dentists on the day of the vote.Philip_Thompson said:FPT
No it wasn't. Do the maths and show how you get a majority behind a Labour government.DecrepiterJohnL said:
Quite what? Without Bercow, there was a general election so that point is moot. Until then, it was possible (if unlikely) to construct a Labour government to revoke Article 50 and call an election.CarlottaVance said:
The numbers weren't there in the last Parliament for what you propose.0 -
Better than the original headline that detail.Nigelb said:Bit more detail on the HK re-infection case;
https://twitter.com/mugecevik/status/12978849400429854720 -
Its not rubbish. How would you like to measure it?nichomar said:
That’s the problem you actually believe that rubbish.Philip_Thompson said:
You're right we're not equal, we're better than them. But I'm being polite.nichomar said:
Equal my arsePhilip_Thompson said:
That the UK is going to be an equal sovereign nation and not a supplicant colony subjugated to their rules.CorrectHorseBattery said:What penny needs to drop in Brussels? No Deal will be no problem for the UK, why do we even care what they think now?
GDP per capita?
Median household income?
Median wages?
On any reasonable metric the UK is better than the EU.0 -
But, she wasn't by election night.Pulpstar said:My view is that punters are still being influenced by what happened last time.
Spot on. Good value on Biden. Tbh Clinton would have been good value at an implied 56% chance last time round. That the bet would have lost is neither here nor there.
Biden's position is certainly stronger than Clinton's was though.
I've never turned a position around so fast. Saved me losing a big one.0 -
We had and arguably still have a bigger economy but they have Paris, the Alps for skiing, the south of France with better weather for their beaches as well as more countryside and still history like we have with their chateaux and museumsnichomar said:
That can’t be true we’re better than they areHYUFD said:
Fine but France is the nation most visited by tourists in the world, the UK is only the 10th most visited nation (though London is the 3rd most visited city)CarlottaVance said:That should kill any remaining tourism stone dead:
https://twitter.com/standardnews/status/1297931318332923905?s=20
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Tourism_rankings
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_by_international_visitors0 -
We're not equal to the members of the EU, they're subordinate to the EU.williamglenn said:
If we want to be equal to the members of the EU, we need to be in the EU.Philip_Thompson said:
That the UK is going to be an equal sovereign nation and not a supplicant colony subjugated to their rules.CorrectHorseBattery said:What penny needs to drop in Brussels? No Deal will be no problem for the UK, why do we even care what they think now?
We need to be talking on equal terms with the EU itself, not its members.0 -
@TheScreamingEagles
Indian
Satchins (Behind Central Station)
Dabbawal (High Bridge or Jesmond)
English
Blackfriars (Friar Street)
Marco Polo (Dean Street)
Redhouse (Sandhill - Quayside)0 -
In any negotiation there are parties seeking to create value from an agreement. If any one or more party(ies) gain nothing - or lose - then there should be no deal.CorrectHorseBattery said:In any negotiation there is a strong party and a weak party. The UK is the weak party, this is obvious.
In this case, you could argue that both parties are not seeking to create value, but to minimize loss, but that is to ignore the elements with non-economic value.
Personally, at this stage, I would argue we may have no ZOPA (zone of potential agreement) because the two biggest non-economic issues are, for the EU, showing the rEU that leaving the EU is too painful and, for the UK, re-establishing British sovereignty, and these two big value items are pulling in opposite directions.0 -
I think it's less complex than that. Barnier is just going for EU-max. He's been given a wishlist, and he has not really diverted from it in the entire course of the negotiations. Because he can't. Barnier is a civil servant - he couldn't produce some flourish of a great deal even if he wanted to because he doesn't have the power to make decisions that affect Spanish and French fishermen etc. Frustratingly for all concerned, this phase is just neither side giving much until the real negotiations start. What we can say is thank God our negotiators aren't giving any concessions at this stage - that would be the height of foolishness. Basically thank God we've not got May and her 'negotiating team'.Philip_Thompson said:
Yes he is on the LPF he is explicitly undermining it.CorrectHorseBattery said:
Barnier is trying to undermine the deal the EU signed, is he? No.Philip_Thompson said:
Given Barnier's disgraceful attitude no trade deal is the best thing that can happen right now it seems, unless they change tact.CorrectHorseBattery said:
Perhaps if the UK stopped undermining the deal it signed, some progress might be made. Let's be honest they wanted no trade deal and they're going to blame the EU for it.Luckyguy1983 said:
Barnier's team doesn't have a mandate to say anything except sod off. The real negotiations begin in the 'tunnel' phase (or whatever it's called) and involve the Heads of Government of the 27.CorrectHorseBattery said:The Sun's reporting of the EU basically saying "sod off" is very entertaining
After we've gone through no deal and diverged from them then maybe they will come to their senses and start talking properly. If so then a deal can be agreed later, but we will have already diverged more from them by then.
The EU doesn't care about No Deal, how many times is this going to need to be said. It's blatantly clear to anyone not blinkered the EU just need to sit and wait and we'll come back to them.
I don't think we will come back to them but so be it we will see. I'm quite content for No Deal too - its people like you that seem most flustered about it.1 -
The UK is not equal to the EU, Scotland is not equal to the rest of the UK, if you declare independence you take the hit of a subsequent trade deal which will hit you more than them if you are the smaller partnerwilliamglenn said:
If we want to be equal to the members of the EU, we need to be in the EU.Philip_Thompson said:
That the UK is going to be an equal sovereign nation and not a supplicant colony subjugated to their rules.CorrectHorseBattery said:What penny needs to drop in Brussels? No Deal will be no problem for the UK, why do we even care what they think now?
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France != the EU and yes we are on any measurable metric I can think of measuring it per capita. I'd be curious as to how you think otherwise.nichomar said:
That can’t be true we’re better than they areHYUFD said:
Fine but France is the nation most visited by tourists in the world, the UK is only the 10th most visited nation (though London is the 3rd most visited city)CarlottaVance said:That should kill any remaining tourism stone dead:
https://twitter.com/standardnews/status/1297931318332923905?s=20
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Tourism_rankings
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_by_international_visitors
But tourism alone does not a country make. The Dominican Republic has a major trade surplus on tourism - doesn't mean its a better country to live in than the UK though.1 -
And people are risking their lives to cross the channel on rubber dinghies to leave all that?HYUFD said:
We had and arguably still have a bigger economy but they have Paris, the Alps for skiing, the south of France with better weather for their beaches as well as more countryside and still history like we have with their chateaux and museumsnichomar said:
That can’t be true we’re better than they areHYUFD said:
Fine but France is the nation most visited by tourists in the world, the UK is only the 10th most visited nation (though London is the 3rd most visited city)CarlottaVance said:That should kill any remaining tourism stone dead:
https://twitter.com/standardnews/status/1297931318332923905?s=20
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Tourism_rankings
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_by_international_visitors
Are they mad?1 -
@CarlottaVance
I'm a Brexiteer. I think both the UK and the EU (not just the UK, and not just the EU either) are being pricks over the full FTA.
State Aid and Fish (WTF?) are silly hills to die-on for a full FTA that is in both parties interests, and where both have come so far already.
Both need to put their cocks away, get round the negotiating table, eat some humble pie where necessary, and do a f--king deal.0 -
This is the problem, you actually think the UK is weak.CorrectHorseBattery said:In any negotiation there is a strong party and a weak party. The UK is the weak party, this is obvious.
0
This discussion has been closed.