politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Concern about ballot form confusion could be behind falling

System · May 2014

politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Concern about ballot form confusion could be behind falling off of Ukip in most EP seats Betfair markets

Ukip most seats at Euros price easing from a 72% chance to a 54% on Betfair. pic.twitter.com/JYYSXpBJPE

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DavidL · May 2014

Maybe but I think they were just oversold. If the polling is close you do have to wonder what proportions of what party will turn out to make up the 30-35% who will vote. A lot of supporters who are NOTA is a risk in that scenario.

Edit. Gosh a first, first one in ages.

Edit edit. Hullo? Anyone there?

DavidL · May 2014

FPT @anotherDave

You are probably right about the photos (something which really should be made illegal) but pretending to be a member of the public when you are a full time staffer is not very smart. Especially when your looks are so, eh, memorable.

stodge · May 2014

Afternoon all

Well, the pace of electioneering has quickened on this fine Bank Holiday in lowland East London. First, this morning I had the pleasure of meeting the Labour team as I was putting the recycling out. Two of the current Councillors are standing again and I know them both reasonably so we had a pleasant chat.

This afternoon the Lib Dems came to call - very nice lady and of course happy to talk to a party member (probably doesn't happen that often).

Labour will likely win every seat again in Newham though it will be fascinating to see how the Christian People's Alliance (CPA) - our version of UKIP if you like - fare as they are contesting every seat with almost a full slate while both the LDs and UKIP are only putting up odd candidates (as are TUSC) around the Borough.

Labour and the Conservatives are of course running full slates - no Respect or BNP candidates this time. The best Tory hopes are in Royal Docks where they've come close in by-elections.

anotherDave · May 2014

DavidL said:
FPT @anotherDave

You are probably right about the photos (something which really should be made illegal) but pretending to be a member of the public when you are a full time staffer is not very smart. Especially when your looks are so, eh, memorable.

I think all the UKIP PEBs use UKIP people. As long as they aren't claiming to not be UKIP people, I don't see a problem.

SimonStClare · May 2014

Not entirely convinced by the 'confusion of alternative to Ukip' - The UKIP strap line may change depending on the elections they are standing, but the party logo has not altered in yonks. I know we should never underestimate the stupidity of some, but it's a ruddy big '£' sign with UKIP through the middle.

CarlottaVance · May 2014

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.

I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915

maaarsh · May 2014

I really don't buy this confusion argument. They got top of the ballot by adopting a very bizzare form of words which sounds nothing like UKIP or United Kingdom Independance Party, so I struggle to see how many UKIP voters will be conned. This is no Literal Democrats.

isam · May 2014

Would be so funny if Lizzy Vaid stood and won Newark...

Which party has the highest proportion of female/BAME MP's?

isam · May 2014

On topic

I wouldn't be surprised if it were people meaning to back most votes and getting had over

Paddy Power have both Labour and UKIP at under or over 23.5 5/6, so Labour must be the value bet at odds against?

AlastairMeeks · May 2014

isam said:
Would be so funny if Lizzy Vaid stood and won Newark...

Which party has the highest proportion of female/BAME MP's?

100% of Green MPs are female.

malcolmg · May 2014

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915

The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.

MikeL · May 2014

Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.

Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.

Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.

The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.

It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.

maaarsh · May 2014

MikeL said:
Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.

Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.

Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.

The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.

It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.

Considering how well UKIP poll without prompting, the fact they're the only party on the ballot paper with a name that sounds anything at all like UKIP should help them.

GIN1138 · May 2014

Just think, if we had PR for all election, this would be a standard ballot paper.

MikeL · May 2014

maaarsh said:

MikeL said:
Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.

Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.

Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.

The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.

It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.
Considering how well UKIP poll without prompting, the fact they're the only party on the ballot paper with a name that sounds anything at all like UKIP should help them.

Of course it will help them. Of course the vast majority of people planning to vote UKIP will vote UKIP.

But that is not the point.

CarlottaVance · May 2014

malcolmg said:

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
The Better Together mob do not like democracy

And along comes malcolm to prove my point.....his reaction to a democratic 'no' will be to leave the country!

Life_ina_market_town · May 2014

antifrank said:
100% of Green MPs are female.

Accordingly, it would be lawful for the party to select on the basis of all male shortlists to reduce this horrifying "inequality"...

MonikerDiCanio · May 2014

malcolmg said:

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.

" “What is normally a good vibe and community activity in the town was spoilt — they took trade away from the market stalls, and donations away from Cupar in Bloom."

Can't your activists leave the people in peace, just for one afternoon? Bores.

volcanopete · May 2014

Jon Snow -The Visceral hatred of Westminster.

http://blogs.channel4.com/snowblog/visceral-hatred-westminister-politics/23805

MonikerDiCanio · May 2014

CarlottaVance said:

malcolmg said:

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
The Better Together mob do not like democracy
And along comes malcolm to prove my point.....his reaction to a democratic 'no' will be to leave the country!

Another reason to vote No.

maaarsh · May 2014

MikeL said:

maaarsh said:

MikeL said:
Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.

Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.

Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.

The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.

It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.
Considering how well UKIP poll without prompting, the fact they're the only party on the ballot paper with a name that sounds anything at all like UKIP should help them.
Of course it will help them. Of course the vast majority of people planning to vote UKIP will vote UKIP.

But that is not the point.

An Independence from Europe shares as much similarity with UKIP as Green Party does with Labour Party.

You can't simply state some of the electorate are disengaged and dim (true) and therefore randomly pick which parties will be hurt by this. The so called faux UKIP just does not look anything like UKIP on the ballot paper.

DavidL · May 2014

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915

I am afraid that is all too typical. A comment to the Courier by 2 doctors who indicated that they might move back to England if Scotland went independent was followed the next day by a flurry of letters offering to pay their bus fares, right now.

Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.

isam · May 2014

MikeL said:
Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.

Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.

Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.

The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.

It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.

Which polls suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade?

AlastairMeeks · May 2014

Life_ina_market_town said:

antifrank said:
100% of Green MPs are female.
Accordingly, it would be lawful for the party to select on the basis of all male shortlists to reduce this horrifying "inequality"...

Actually, the same is also true of the Alliance Party.

Theuniondivvie · May 2014

DavidL said:

Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.

Yeah, that's right, all the 'abuse' is on one side.

I'm sure you'd wish to take the opportunity to condemn this kind of thing (asterisks inserted by me), a selection from the last couple of days:

Chris Ibrox Kerr @1872chriskerr · 5h
@Richiethefifer salmond is a fud n I'm voting naw

Don Stuart @don_stuart · 6h
@YouYesYet I'm voting UKIP on 22nd. Come and chase me out of Scotland you Fascist C***.

Fusel Jeremiad @diskgrinder · 13h
In Scotland, thistles count as flowers, and a cup of tea probably has knives in it. Vote yes and f*** off Scotland

Stephen McCabe @kilmacolm1 · 22h
@newsundayherald @GerryBraiden Ever thought the editor's head is up his own *rse Gerry?

CanYouFeelMyFarts? @fuckamuck · May 3
"King Salmond" f*** off you f***ing w**ker.

joanne henry @JoanHenry7 · May 3
@Tahir_Mohammed Yes of course you're Scottish mate, you'll be the Inverness Mohammed clan then? #VoteNo @iclare1

Quincel · May 2014

isam said:

MikeL said:
Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.

Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.

Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.

The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.

It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.
Which polls suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade?

The last 3 or 4 have all had UKIP on the high 20s/low 30s, suggesting the two which had them on mid to high 30s were either outliers or a peak which has faded.

Ishmael_X · May 2014

maaarsh said:

MikeL said:

maaarsh said:

MikeL said:
Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.

Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.

Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.

The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.

It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.
Considering how well UKIP poll without prompting, the fact they're the only party on the ballot paper with a name that sounds anything at all like UKIP should help them.
Of course it will help them. Of course the vast majority of people planning to vote UKIP will vote UKIP.

But that is not the point.

An Independence from Europe shares as much similarity with UKIP as Green Party does with Labour Party.

You can't simply state some of the electorate are disengaged and dim (true) and therefore randomly pick which parties will be hurt by this. The so called faux UKIP just does not look anything like UKIP on the ballot paper.

But the wheeze of the ungrammatical name designed purely to get priority on the ballot paper would be an embarrassment in Student Union elections, never mind national ones. These people should have been told that "a/an" are disregarded for alphabetical ordering and put after the Greens, and we need proper rules to prevent similar ploys in future (which there will be, especially if this one pays off). After GE 2010 one often wonders what the Electoral Commission is actually for.

DavidL · May 2014

Theuniondivvie said:

DavidL said:

Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.
Yeah, that's right, all the 'abuse' is on one side.

I'm sure you'd wish to take the opportunity to condemn this kind of thing (asterisks inserted by me), a selection from the last couple of days:

Chris Ibrox Kerr @1872chriskerr · 5h
@Richiethefifer salmond is a fud n I'm voting naw

Don Stuart @don_stuart · 6h
@YouYesYet I'm voting UKIP on 22nd. Come and chase me out of Scotland you Fascist C***.

Fusel Jeremiad @diskgrinder · 13h
In Scotland, thistles count as flowers, and a cup of tea probably has knives in it. Vote yes and f*** off Scotland

Stephen McCabe @kilmacolm1 · 22h
@newsundayherald @GerryBraiden Ever thought the editor's head is up his own *rse Gerry?

CanYouFeelMyFarts? @fuckamuck · May 3
"King Salmond" f*** off you f***ing w**ker.

joanne henry @JoanHenry7 · May 3
@Tahir_Mohammed Yes of course you're Scottish mate, you'll be the Inverness Mohammed clan then? #VoteNo @iclare1

Without accepting the veracity of any of these supposed quotes when did I ever say it was one sided? Fitalass's comment, with which I agree, is that this referendum is proving divisive and ever more vituperative. What we see on here is pretty typical.

isam · May 2014

Quincel said:

isam said:

MikeL said:
Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.

Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.

Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.

The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.

It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.
Which polls suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade?
The last 3 or 4 have all had UKIP on the high 20s/low 30s, suggesting the two which had them on mid to high 30s were either outliers or a peak which has faded.

But have they dropped with the same poller? The EU polls are so all over the shop I don't think you can say they have slumped because ComRes had 38% and You Gov had 29%

MikeL · May 2014

maaarsh said:

MikeL said:

maaarsh said:

MikeL said:
Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.

Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.

Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.

The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.

It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.
Considering how well UKIP poll without prompting, the fact they're the only party on the ballot paper with a name that sounds anything at all like UKIP should help them.
Of course it will help them. Of course the vast majority of people planning to vote UKIP will vote UKIP.

But that is not the point.

An Independence from Europe shares as much similarity with UKIP as Green Party does with Labour Party.

You can't simply state some of the electorate are disengaged and dim (true) and therefore randomly pick which parties will be hurt by this. The so called faux UKIP just does not look anything like UKIP on the ballot paper.

They both have "Independence" in their name.

UKIP is even written on the ballot paper as "UK Independence Party (UKIP)"

So they both have "Independence" in their name - and both in exactly the same place - ie the second word after a two letter opening word.

That looks a bit more similar to me than "Labour" and "Green".

dr_spyn · May 2014

Advantages what advantages...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27284489

No UK trade benefit from EU membership - Civitas report

malcolmg · May 2014

MonikerDiCanio said:

malcolmg said:

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.
" “What is normally a good vibe and community activity in the town was spoilt — they took trade away from the market stalls, and donations away from Cupar in Bloom."

Can't your activists leave the people in peace, just for one afternoon? Bores.

F**k off you cretin

Theuniondivvie · May 2014

DavidL said:
when did I ever say it was one sided?

Lol, 5 minutes ago?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".

'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'

malcolmg · May 2014

CarlottaVance said:

malcolmg said:

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
The Better Together mob do not like democracy
And along comes malcolm to prove my point.....his reaction to a democratic 'no' will be to leave the country!

LOL, what part of Scotland do you live in Toom Tabard

DavidL · May 2014

Theuniondivvie said:

DavidL said:
when did I ever say it was one sided?
Lol, 5 minutes ago?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".

'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'

Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.

malcolmg · May 2014

DavidL said:

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
I am afraid that is all too typical. A comment to the Courier by 2 doctors who indicated that they might move back to England if Scotland went independent was followed the next day by a flurry of letters offering to pay their bus fares, right now.

Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.

David , do you ever read unionist websites or newspaper comments.

MikeL · May 2014

isam said:

Quincel said:

isam said:

MikeL said:
Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.

Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.

Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.

The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.

It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.
Which polls suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade?
The last 3 or 4 have all had UKIP on the high 20s/low 30s, suggesting the two which had them on mid to high 30s were either outliers or a peak which has faded.
But have they dropped with the same poller? The EU polls are so all over the shop I don't think you can say they have slumped because ComRes had 38% and You Gov had 29%

Quincel has partially answered.

They have also dropped with the same pollster - they were 31 with YouGov last Sunday - yesterday YouGov had them on 29 in two different polls.

Not a large drop - arguably MOE - though it is two polls - but at a minimum it does indicate upward momentum has stopped and potentially starting to edge downwards.

Theuniondivvie · May 2014

DavidL said:

Theuniondivvie said:

DavidL said:
when did I ever say it was one sided?
Lol, 5 minutes ago?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".

'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.

Unionists, the new Pharisees (feel free to mark that down as another instance of Cybernat abuse).

MonikerDiCanio · May 2014

malcolmg said:

MonikerDiCanio said:

malcolmg said:

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.
" “What is normally a good vibe and community activity in the town was spoilt — they took trade away from the market stalls, and donations away from Cupar in Bloom."

Can't your activists leave the people in peace, just for one afternoon? Bores.
F**k off you cretin

Malcolm, you must be in the pay of No.

malcolmg · May 2014

DavidL said:

Theuniondivvie said:

DavidL said:
when did I ever say it was one sided?
Lol, 5 minutes ago?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".

'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.

David, caught lying and you resort to some fantasy rubbish. Go back over the posts here for the last year and you will find that most of the YES people have been driven from the site by vile abuse. You unionists like to give it out , lie through your teeth but do not like to receive it. At least man up and stop being a big jessie whinging and lying about those nasty YES voters.

malcolmg · May 2014

MonikerDiCanio said:

malcolmg said:

MonikerDiCanio said:

malcolmg said:

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.
" “What is normally a good vibe and community activity in the town was spoilt — they took trade away from the market stalls, and donations away from Cupar in Bloom."

Can't your activists leave the people in peace, just for one afternoon? Bores.
F**k off you cretin
Malcolm, you must be in the pay of No.

No thicko I am posting as if I am a NO voter, very deliberately. Copying cretins like you, even though you do not even have a vote.

CarlottaVance · May 2014

DavidL said:

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
A comment to the Courier by 2 doctors who indicated that they might move back to England if Scotland went independent was followed the next day by a flurry of letters offering to pay their bus fares, right now.

We get a similar thing in Guernsey - 'The boat sails at five' - but its usually proffered by those opposing change, not advocating it!

DavidL · May 2014

malcolmg said:

DavidL said:

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
I am afraid that is all too typical. A comment to the Courier by 2 doctors who indicated that they might move back to England if Scotland went independent was followed the next day by a flurry of letters offering to pay their bus fares, right now.

Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.

David , do you ever read unionist websites or newspaper comments.

Actually I am not aware of any unionist websites. I do sometimes look at the comments on sites like the Scotsman but my perception, although it is far from one sided, is that the aggression and hostility is largely from the Yes camp. Doesn't mean some of the unionist comments are not witless of course.

MrJones · May 2014

SimonStClare said:
Not entirely convinced by the 'confusion of alternative to Ukip' - The UKIP strap line may change depending on the elections they are standing, but the party logo has not altered in yonks. I know we should never underestimate the stupidity of some, but it's a ruddy big '£' sign with UKIP through the middle.

If it wasn't at the top maybe but some will react to the keywords in the name and make their cross automatically before engaging brain. Be interesting to see how many. It would either be a sign of thickness or how hyped up they were to vote.

Alanbrooke · May 2014

malcolmg said:

DavidL said:

Theuniondivvie said:

DavidL said:
when did I ever say it was one sided?
Lol, 5 minutes ago?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".

'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.
David, caught lying and you resort to some fantasy rubbish. Go back over the posts here for the last year and you will find that most of the YES people have been driven from the site by vile abuse. You unionists like to give it out , lie through your teeth but do not like to receive it. At least man up and stop being a big jessie whinging and lying about those nasty YES voters.

Driven from the site by abuse ? Let's see:

James got banned for ignoring site rules
Oldnat just got bored but occasionally pops in
JPJ2 had a hissy fit and left
Mick repetitive posts so gets mistaken for spam
Stuart left and came back again

I'm failing to see the abuse there malc.

richardDodd · May 2014

Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place

SandyRentool · May 2014

Most people have only a passing interest in party politics - I'm sure that a lot of voters think that the English Democrats and the EDL are one and the same. Seeing a party at the top of the ballot with the word independence in the name and "UK Independence" in the description is going to fool a lot of voters. It's just a pity we don't have the Conversatives standing!

DavidL · May 2014

malcolmg said:

DavidL said:

Theuniondivvie said:

DavidL said:
when did I ever say it was one sided?
Lol, 5 minutes ago?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".

'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.
David, caught lying and you resort to some fantasy rubbish. Go back over the posts here for the last year and you will find that most of the YES people have been driven from the site by vile abuse. You unionists like to give it out , lie through your teeth but do not like to receive it. At least man up and stop being a big jessie whinging and lying about those nasty YES voters.

Lying?

Sean_F · May 2014

malcolmg said:

MonikerDiCanio said:

malcolmg said:

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.
" “What is normally a good vibe and community activity in the town was spoilt — they took trade away from the market stalls, and donations away from Cupar in Bloom."

Can't your activists leave the people in peace, just for one afternoon? Bores.
F**k off you cretin

A witty and scintillating bit of repartee.

CarlottaVance · May 2014

malcolmg said:

The Better Together mob do not like democracy....

F**k off you cretin...

Toom Tabard

David, caught lying.......

resort to some fantasy rubbish....

lie through your teeth ...

big jessie whinging.....

lying about those nasty YES voters.

No thicko .....

cretins like you.....

All in the space of a little over 40 minutes.......

Sean_F · May 2014

isam said:

Quincel said:

isam said:

MikeL said:
Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.

Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.

Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.

The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.

It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.
Which polls suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade?
The last 3 or 4 have all had UKIP on the high 20s/low 30s, suggesting the two which had them on mid to high 30s were either outliers or a peak which has faded.
But have they dropped with the same poller? The EU polls are so all over the shop I don't think you can say they have slumped because ComRes had 38% and You Gov had 29%

You need to compare like with like. The top-line Certain to Vote figures were 36% with TNS and 38% with Com Res. With Yougov, their Certain to Vote number for UKIP was 34%.

GIN1138 · May 2014

malcolmg said:

MonikerDiCanio said:

malcolmg said:

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.
" “What is normally a good vibe and community activity in the town was spoilt — they took trade away from the market stalls, and donations away from Cupar in Bloom."

Can't your activists leave the people in peace, just for one afternoon? Bores.
F**k off you cretin

Blimey! :O

malcolmg · May 2014

DavidL said:

malcolmg said:

DavidL said:

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
I am afraid that is all too typical. A comment to the Courier by 2 doctors who indicated that they might move back to England if Scotland went independent was followed the next day by a flurry of letters offering to pay their bus fares, right now.

Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.

David , do you ever read unionist websites or newspaper comments.
Actually I am not aware of any unionist websites. I do sometimes look at the comments on sites like the Scotsman but my perception, although it is far from one sided, is that the aggression and hostility is largely from the Yes camp. Doesn't mean some of the unionist comments are not witless of course.

your rosy unionist specs must have a good filter David. Go look how nice the unionists are. Robot archiving BritNat abuse/smears.
https://twitter.com/BritNatAbuseBot

JosiasJessop · May 2014

MrJones said:

SimonStClare said:
Not entirely convinced by the 'confusion of alternative to Ukip' - The UKIP strap line may change depending on the elections they are standing, but the party logo has not altered in yonks. I know we should never underestimate the stupidity of some, but it's a ruddy big '£' sign with UKIP through the middle.
If it wasn't at the top maybe but some will react to the keywords in the name and make their cross automatically before engaging brain. Be interesting to see how many. It would either be a sign of thickness or how hyped up they were to vote.

I pretty much agree with most of that. This should not have been allowed as it is.

However: the AIFE party is different from UKIP. *Some* of their votes will be genuine, although from looking at their website, it is hard to discern what they're so different. There seems to be less concentration on immigration, and more against HS2 and anti-rail. Both of which could be seen as UKIP positions. I'm not sure that nationalisation of the M6 toll would be, though.

http://www.aipmep.org/

Personally, their website seems 'freindlier' in terms of usability that UKIP's, to me at least.

Theuniondivvie · May 2014

Alanbrooke said:

Driven from the site by abuse ? Let's see:

Mick repetitive posts so gets mistaken for spam

I'm failing to see the abuse there malc.

For the sake of precision, a moderator said that was the case and it should be fixed in 'hours'; 4 days later he still can't post on the site, and PB moderators have ignored my pm and post about it.

malcolmg · May 2014

Sean_F said:

malcolmg said:

MonikerDiCanio said:

malcolmg said:

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.
" “What is normally a good vibe and community activity in the town was spoilt — they took trade away from the market stalls, and donations away from Cupar in Bloom."

Can't your activists leave the people in peace, just for one afternoon? Bores.
F**k off you cretin
A witty and scintillating bit of repartee.

Scintillating sarcasm and rapid repartee are my forte, however it is wasted on trolls like Monica.

MarkSenior · May 2014

Sean_F said:

malcolmg said:

MonikerDiCanio said:

malcolmg said:

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.
" “What is normally a good vibe and community activity in the town was spoilt — they took trade away from the market stalls, and donations away from Cupar in Bloom."

Can't your activists leave the people in peace, just for one afternoon? Bores.
F**k off you cretin
A witty and scintillating bit of repartee.

I am sure that malcolmg only gets away with his constant abuse of other posters in contravention of board policy because he is in fact an alter ego of OGH

malcolmg · May 2014

richardDodd said:
Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place

Nobody forcing you to stay, if you cannot post any sensible take a hike.

malcolmg · May 2014

DavidL said:

malcolmg said:

DavidL said:

Theuniondivvie said:

DavidL said:
when did I ever say it was one sided?
Lol, 5 minutes ago?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".

'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.
David, caught lying and you resort to some fantasy rubbish. Go back over the posts here for the last year and you will find that most of the YES people have been driven from the site by vile abuse. You unionists like to give it out , lie through your teeth but do not like to receive it. At least man up and stop being a big jessie whinging and lying about those nasty YES voters.
Lying?

yes, you tried to make out the abuse is all one sided, given you are on this blog and see it from unionists regularly then I can only assume you are not addled but are being economical with the truth.

CarlottaVance · May 2014

malcolmg said:

Sean_F said:

malcolmg said:

MonikerDiCanio said:

malcolmg said:

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.
" “What is normally a good vibe and community activity in the town was spoilt — they took trade away from the market stalls, and donations away from Cupar in Bloom."

Can't your activists leave the people in peace, just for one afternoon? Bores.
F**k off you cretin
A witty and scintillating bit of repartee.
Scintillating sarcasm and rapid repartee are my forte, however it is wasted on trolls like Monica.

I'll give you 'rapid', scintillating....no, and repartee, got a dictionary to hand?

When was the last time you engaged with an argument, rather than abused its proponent?

MarkSenior · May 2014

malcolmg said:

richardDodd said:
Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place
Nobody forcing you to stay, if you cannot post any sensible take a hike.

You have posted nothing but personal abuse in all of your 3,000 odd posts .

DavidL · May 2014

malcolmg said:

DavidL said:

malcolmg said:

DavidL said:

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
I am afraid that is all too typical. A comment to the Courier by 2 doctors who indicated that they might move back to England if Scotland went independent was followed the next day by a flurry of letters offering to pay their bus fares, right now.

Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.

David , do you ever read unionist websites or newspaper comments.
Actually I am not aware of any unionist websites. I do sometimes look at the comments on sites like the Scotsman but my perception, although it is far from one sided, is that the aggression and hostility is largely from the Yes camp. Doesn't mean some of the unionist comments are not witless of course.

your rosy unionist specs must have a good filter David. Go look how nice the unionists are. Robot archiving BritNat abuse/smears.
https://twitter.com/BritNatAbuseBot

You accused me of lying Malcolm. What are you talking about?

And that is not a website but a collection of tweets that someone has allegedly put together. Something else Cameron was right about.

malcolmg · May 2014

Alanbrooke said:

malcolmg said:

DavidL said:

Theuniondivvie said:

DavidL said:
when did I ever say it was one sided?
Lol, 5 minutes ago?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".

'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.
David, caught lying and you resort to some fantasy rubbish. Go back over the posts here for the last year and you will find that most of the YES people have been driven from the site by vile abuse. You unionists like to give it out , lie through your teeth but do not like to receive it. At least man up and stop being a big jessie whinging and lying about those nasty YES voters.
Driven from the site by abuse ? Let's see:

James got banned for ignoring site rules
Oldnat just got bored but occasionally pops in
JPJ2 had a hissy fit and left
Mick repetitive posts so gets mistaken for spam
Stuart left and came back again
I'm failing to see the abuse there malc.

Alan, you are being a bit obtuse there, James was well abused on here, you also missed Redcliffe who gave up. There is not much welcome here unless you are for NO, with regard to the referendum of course. Plenty of them like to give it out but do not like any back.

Alanbrooke · May 2014

Theuniondivvie said:

Alanbrooke said:

Driven from the site by abuse ? Let's see:

Mick repetitive posts so gets mistaken for spam

I'm failing to see the abuse there malc.
For the sake of precision, a moderator said that was the case and it should be fixed in 'hours'; 4 days later he still can't post on the site, and PB moderators have ignored my pm and post about it.

Well fair does divvie, but it does seem odd that Mick is consistently the poster that keeps losing access whereas all the other posters of whatever persusasion appear to be able to get back on. personally I suspect he has something on his PC that is giving him the problem. Why doesn't he just re-register under a new name and see if it works better for him.

CarlottaVance · May 2014

malcolmg said:

DavidL said:

malcolmg said:

DavidL said:

Theuniondivvie said:

DavidL said:
when did I ever say it was one sided?
Lol, 5 minutes ago?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".

'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.
David, caught lying and you resort to some fantasy rubbish. Go back over the posts here for the last year and you will find that most of the YES people have been driven from the site by vile abuse. You unionists like to give it out , lie through your teeth but do not like to receive it. At least man up and stop being a big jessie whinging and lying about those nasty YES voters.
Lying?

you are on this blog and see it from unionists regularly then I can only assume you are not addled but are being economical with the truth.

malcolm, are you seriously arguing that DavidL is more abusive than you?

Richard_Tyndall · May 2014

malcolmg said:

richardDodd said:
Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place
Nobody forcing you to stay, if you cannot post any sensible take a hike.

Malcolm you really aren't helping your cause here. I am very pro-Independence for all the positive Yes reasons but it is pretty embarrassing to be associated with the sorts of vitriol you are pumping out on here.

I am damn sure you have good points you can make and ways of expressing them that do not resort to foul mouthed insult.It would serve you much better than the continuous stream of bile you are posting at the moment.

DavidL · May 2014

malcolmg said:

DavidL said:

malcolmg said:

DavidL said:

Theuniondivvie said:

DavidL said:
when did I ever say it was one sided?
Lol, 5 minutes ago?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".

'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.
David, caught lying and you resort to some fantasy rubbish. Go back over the posts here for the last year and you will find that most of the YES people have been driven from the site by vile abuse. You unionists like to give it out , lie through your teeth but do not like to receive it. At least man up and stop being a big jessie whinging and lying about those nasty YES voters.
Lying?

yes, you tried to make out the abuse is all one sided, given you are on this blog and see it from unionists regularly then I can only assume you are not addled but are being economical with the truth.

Malcolm that is just nonsense. I did nothing of the sort. But pretty much all of the personal abuse on this site these days is from you. It does nothing for your argument.

CarlottaVance · May 2014

malcolmg said:

Alanbrooke said:

malcolmg said:

DavidL said:

Theuniondivvie said:

DavidL said:
when did I ever say it was one sided?
Lol, 5 minutes ago?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".

'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.
David, caught lying and you resort to some fantasy rubbish. Go back over the posts here for the last year and you will find that most of the YES people have been driven from the site by vile abuse. You unionists like to give it out , lie through your teeth but do not like to receive it. At least man up and stop being a big jessie whinging and lying about those nasty YES voters.
Driven from the site by abuse ? Let's see:

James got banned for ignoring site rules
Oldnat just got bored but occasionally pops in
JPJ2 had a hissy fit and left
Mick repetitive posts so gets mistaken for spam
Stuart left and came back again
I'm failing to see the abuse there malc.
James was well abused on here

I thought you argue that its Unionists that give it out but can't take it?

James was banned because he believed he was bigger than OGH site rules.....

malcolmg · May 2014

CarlottaVance said:

malcolmg said:

The Better Together mob do not like democracy....

F**k off you cretin...

Toom Tabard

David, caught lying.......

resort to some fantasy rubbish....

lie through your teeth ...

big jessie whinging.....

lying about those nasty YES voters.

No thicko .....

cretins like you.....
All in the space of a little over 40 minutes.......

I am impersonating a NO supporter, since you seem to be unable to spot it anywhere else, your rose tinted specs only see the opposite.

I note you have not said where in Scotland you are living, after your last snide remark.
Always quick to sneer and smear , but you should follow your own guidance a la Cameron and butt out when you are not involved.

malcolmg · May 2014

MarkSenior said:

malcolmg said:

richardDodd said:
Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place
Nobody forcing you to stay, if you cannot post any sensible take a hike.
You have posted nothing but personal abuse in all of your 3,000 odd posts .

You are obviously not right if you read all of them and came up with that horse manure.

Alanbrooke · May 2014

malcolmg said:

Alanbrooke said:

malcolmg said:

DavidL said:

Theuniondivvie said:

DavidL said:
when did I ever say it was one sided?
Lol, 5 minutes ago?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".

'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.
David, caught lying and you resort to some fantasy rubbish. Go back over the posts here for the last year and you will find that most of the YES people have been driven from the site by vile abuse. You unionists like to give it out , lie through your teeth but do not like to receive it. At least man up and stop being a big jessie whinging and lying about those nasty YES voters.
Driven from the site by abuse ? Let's see:

James got banned for ignoring site rules
Oldnat just got bored but occasionally pops in
JPJ2 had a hissy fit and left
Mick repetitive posts so gets mistaken for spam
Stuart left and came back again
I'm failing to see the abuse there malc.
Alan, you are being a bit obtuse there, James was well abused on here, you also missed Redcliffe who gave up. There is not much welcome here unless you are for NO, with regard to the referendum of course. Plenty of them like to give it out but do not like any back.

malc a spat with James was always a good bit of crack, and he gave as good as he got. However that's not the reason he isn't posting.

Redcliffe to the best of my knowledge still posts but certainly nowhere near as much as previously. I haven't seen anything saying he's given up, but maybe I missed it.

DavidL · May 2014

malcolmg said:

CarlottaVance said:

malcolmg said:

The Better Together mob do not like democracy....

F**k off you cretin...

Toom Tabard

David, caught lying.......

resort to some fantasy rubbish....

lie through your teeth ...

big jessie whinging.....

lying about those nasty YES voters.

No thicko .....

cretins like you.....
All in the space of a little over 40 minutes.......
I am impersonating a NO supporter, since you seem to be unable to spot it anywhere else, your rose tinted specs only see the opposite.

I note you have not said where in Scotland you are living, after your last snide remark.
Always quick to sneer and smear , but you should follow your own guidance a la Cameron and butt out when you are not involved.

It is not a very good impersonation...

CarlottaVance · May 2014

malcolmg said:

MarkSenior said:

malcolmg said:

richardDodd said:
Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place
Nobody forcing you to stay, if you cannot post any sensible take a hike.
You have posted nothing but personal abuse in all of your 3,000 odd posts .
You are obviously not right if you read all of them and came up with that horse manure.

Enlighten us.

Post one of you engaging with an argument about the merits of Scottish independence from this thread.

malcolmg · May 2014

DavidL said:

malcolmg said:

DavidL said:

malcolmg said:

DavidL said:

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
I am afraid that is all too typical. A comment to the Courier by 2 doctors who indicated that they might move back to England if Scotland went independent was followed the next day by a flurry of letters offering to pay their bus fares, right now.

Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.

David , do you ever read unionist websites or newspaper comments.
Actually I am not aware of any unionist websites. I do sometimes look at the comments on sites like the Scotsman but my perception, although it is far from one sided, is that the aggression and hostility is largely from the Yes camp. Doesn't mean some of the unionist comments are not witless of course.

your rosy unionist specs must have a good filter David. Go look how nice the unionists are. Robot archiving BritNat abuse/smears.
https://twitter.com/BritNatAbuseBot
You accused me of lying Malcolm. What are you talking about?

And that is not a website but a collection of tweets that someone has allegedly put together. Something else Cameron was right about.

OK, so twitter abuse does not count. So what is your criteria , a stupid anecdote from the Courier is the only one that counts. There are none so blind as those that will not see.

CarlottaVance · May 2014

malcolmg said:

CarlottaVance said:

malcolmg said:

The Better Together mob do not like democracy....

F**k off you cretin...

Toom Tabard

David, caught lying.......

resort to some fantasy rubbish....

lie through your teeth ...

big jessie whinging.....

lying about those nasty YES voters.

No thicko .....

cretins like you.....
All in the space of a little over 40 minutes.......
Always quick to sneer and smear

Got a mirror, dear?

malcolmg · May 2014

MarkSenior said:

Sean_F said:

malcolmg said:

MonikerDiCanio said:

malcolmg said:

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.
" “What is normally a good vibe and community activity in the town was spoilt — they took trade away from the market stalls, and donations away from Cupar in Bloom."

Can't your activists leave the people in peace, just for one afternoon? Bores.
F**k off you cretin
A witty and scintillating bit of repartee.
I am sure that malcolmg only gets away with his constant abuse of other posters in contravention of board policy because he is in fact an alter ego of OGH

LOL , you are barking, but thanks for the compliment nonetheless.

CarlottaVance · May 2014

malcolmg said:

DavidL said:

malcolmg said:

DavidL said:

malcolmg said:

DavidL said:

CarlottaVance said:

DavidL said:
Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.

Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.

I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
I am afraid that is all too typical. A comment to the Courier by 2 doctors who indicated that they might move back to England if Scotland went independent was followed the next day by a flurry of letters offering to pay their bus fares, right now.

Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.

David , do you ever read unionist websites or newspaper comments.
Actually I am not aware of any unionist websites. I do sometimes look at the comments on sites like the Scotsman but my perception, although it is far from one sided, is that the aggression and hostility is largely from the Yes camp. Doesn't mean some of the unionist comments are not witless of course.

your rosy unionist specs must have a good filter David. Go look how nice the unionists are. Robot archiving BritNat abuse/smears.
https://twitter.com/BritNatAbuseBot
You accused me of lying Malcolm. What are you talking about?

And that is not a website but a collection of tweets that someone has allegedly put together. Something else Cameron was right about.

a stupid anecdote from the Courier

The Courier point was about 'Scotland being divided, what ever the outcome'.

Thank you for your energetic reinforcement of my point.

malcolmg · May 2014

CarlottaVance said:

malcolmg said:

The Better Together mob do not like democracy....

F**k off you cretin...

Toom Tabard

David, caught lying.......

resort to some fantasy rubbish....

lie through your teeth ...

big jessie whinging.....

lying about those nasty YES voters.

No thicko .....

cretins like you.....
All in the space of a little over 40 minutes.......

Just warming up

malcolmg · May 2014

DavidL said:

malcolmg said:

CarlottaVance said:

malcolmg said:

The Better Together mob do not like democracy....

F**k off you cretin...

Toom Tabard

David, caught lying.......

resort to some fantasy rubbish....

lie through your teeth ...

big jessie whinging.....

lying about those nasty YES voters.

No thicko .....

cretins like you.....
All in the space of a little over 40 minutes.......
I am impersonating a NO supporter, since you seem to be unable to spot it anywhere else, your rose tinted specs only see the opposite.

I note you have not said where in Scotland you are living, after your last snide remark.
Always quick to sneer and smear , but you should follow your own guidance a la Cameron and butt out when you are not involved.
It is not a very good impersonation...

David, At least I do not try to pretend everybody in YES is an angel. Your one eyed view is a bit silly given the daily evidence of the nastiness of the unionists.

Morris_Dancer · May 2014

Come along, chaps, there's months and months to get. Let's not get het up.

Steven_Whaley · May 2014

AIFE might well take some votes away from UKIP - but not all that many from confused people. I imagine most of the votes they get will be from people who are anti-EU but feel queasy about UKIP.

richardDodd · May 2014

Malcol G...your offensive and repetive insults to anyone who even slightly disagrees with you suggests you are not entirely sober...

Alanbrooke · May 2014

Morris_Dancer said:
Come along, chaps, there's months and months to get. Let's not get het up.

LOL yes Mr S worked out that nearly 3 years of bitterness and griping was a solid platform on which to build a nation.

SimonStClare · May 2014

malcolmg said:

CarlottaVance said:

malcolmg said:

The Better Together mob do not like democracy....

F**k off you cretin...

Toom Tabard

David, caught lying.......

resort to some fantasy rubbish....

lie through your teeth ...

big jessie whinging.....

lying about those nasty YES voters.

No thicko .....

cretins like you.....
All in the space of a little over 40 minutes.......
Just warming up

LOL ; )

Financier · May 2014

CarlottaVance said:

malcolmg said:

MarkSenior said:

malcolmg said:

richardDodd said:
Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place
Nobody forcing you to stay, if you cannot post any sensible take a hike.
You have posted nothing but personal abuse in all of your 3,000 odd posts .
You are obviously not right if you read all of them and came up with that horse manure.
Enlighten us.

Post one of you engaging with an argument about the merits of Scottish independence from this thread.

Regretfully malcolmg has neither the intelligence nor a sufficient command of the English language to engage in meaningful debate - that is why he has to resort to a stream of personal insults and swearing at PBers.

Charles · May 2014

Vanilla just reset my preferences at a point when I was at the zoo and couldn't change them.

Much as I like you guys, getting email copies of everyone of your posts is not helpful...

malcolmg · May 2014

Richard_Tyndall said:

malcolmg said:

richardDodd said:
Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place
Nobody forcing you to stay, if you cannot post any sensible take a hike.
Malcolm you really aren't helping your cause here. I am very pro-Independence for all the positive Yes reasons but it is pretty embarrassing to be associated with the sorts of vitriol you are pumping out on here.

I am damn sure you have good points you can make and ways of expressing them that do not resort to foul mouthed insult.It would serve you much better than the continuous stream of bile you are posting at the moment.

Richard, If there was a sensible debate to be had then I would do as you say. Boredom of the repetitive crap from the usual subjects has hacked me off a bit.
Hard to see how you try and associate it with yourself though.

CarlottaVance · May 2014

Morris_Dancer said:
Come along, chaps, there's months and months to get. Let's not get het up.

And then there's the post vote DevoMax/Indy negotiations.......

On DevoMax, I hope the UK parties say 'we'll put it in our manifestos for 2015 and you can vote on that' (because it involves all of the UK) to let things cool down a bit...

If its 'Indy' then "If it were done when ’tis done, then ’twere well It were done quickly.

Scotland on her way by May 2015, with a few loose ends to tie up, and rUK to sort out her own future....

CarlottaVance · May 2014

malcolmg said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

malcolmg said:

richardDodd said:
Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place
Nobody forcing you to stay, if you cannot post any sensible take a hike.
Malcolm you really aren't helping your cause here. I am very pro-Independence for all the positive Yes reasons but it is pretty embarrassing to be associated with the sorts of vitriol you are pumping out on here.

I am damn sure you have good points you can make and ways of expressing them that do not resort to foul mouthed insult.It would serve you much better than the continuous stream of bile you are posting at the moment.
repetitive crap

Yes, it is, rather.

MrJones · May 2014

The more I look at that voting slip the dodgier it gets.

The list follows a pattern of the party name followed by a strap line and the first entry has almost the Ukip party name as the strap line. Someone reading from the top down may not see the pattern: party name first, strap line second, until after they put their cross.

Is that fightable / worth it? The publicity from a fight might reduce the number of people who make the mistake while making it look like the political class is trying to rig the vote.

Yellow_Submarine · May 2014

It's not just the Natrass splinter/Literal Democrat move. The most recent polling has been YouGov which has lower UKIP shares than some pollsters. Also Labour has it's hard hitting 'Pay to see your GP' leaflet going out. Also low liquidity.

My view is this will cost UKIP some votes. It's as much the distance between Natrass and UKIP on the ballot paper. The Alpha and Omega. Also if they really are turning out long term non voters how many have encountered a PR ballot paper ?

But that many ?UKIP is now a recognisable enough brand for Travel Lodge to sucessfully skit.

Richard_Tyndall · May 2014

malcolmg said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

malcolmg said:

richardDodd said:
Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place
Nobody forcing you to stay, if you cannot post any sensible take a hike.
Malcolm you really aren't helping your cause here. I am very pro-Independence for all the positive Yes reasons but it is pretty embarrassing to be associated with the sorts of vitriol you are pumping out on here.

I am damn sure you have good points you can make and ways of expressing them that do not resort to foul mouthed insult.It would serve you much better than the continuous stream of bile you are posting at the moment.
Richard, If there was a sensible debate to be had then I would do as you say. Boredom of the repetitive crap from the usual subjects has hacked me off a bit.
Hard to see how you try and associate it with yourself though.

I hope I am associated with the Yes side as I have made it clear that is what I would like the result to be. There are many positive reasons for an Englishman to want a friendly, successful and independent neighbour and of course the fact that I work in Scotland much of the time these days means I don't demonise the nationalists in the way some of my fellow countrymen do - and some of yours come to that though I suppose that is more understandable given what they feel they have to lose.

All I am saying is that there are plenty of philosophical and practical reasons why someone should want an independent Scotland and throwing around insults is not likely to change any minds nor make the debate (or this site) any more welcoming.

CarlottaVance · May 2014

MrJones said:
The list follows a pattern of the party name followed by a strap line

The 'strap line' is a description agreed by the Electoral Commission - most parties do not use it - UKIP could have, had they wanted to.

Richard_Nabavi · May 2014

@Yellow_Submarine: Welcome back!

AndyJS · May 2014

SandyRentool said:
Most people have only a passing interest in party politics - I'm sure that a lot of voters think that the English Democrats and the EDL are one and the same. Seeing a party at the top of the ballot with the word independence in the name and "UK Independence" in the description is going to fool a lot of voters. It's just a pity we don't have the Conversatives standing!

If voters are that thick they deserve to vote for the wrong party.

malcolmg · May 2014

richardDodd said:
Malcol G...your offensive and repetive insults to anyone who even slightly disagrees with you suggests you are not entirely sober...

Sorry to disappoint you Sherlock. I do not appreciate halfwits like you trying to imply that I am not sober. If you have nothing relevant to add then crawl back under your rock and give us peace.

Richard_Nabavi · May 2014

On topic: Very hard to judge how much potential confusion there will be. The fact that the ballot paper includes party logos should help reduce the confusion; overall, I wouldn't expect the effect to be very significant. Still, the Electoral Commission should not have allowed such a strapline, and UKIP should have noticed it and objected before it was approved.

Also, I was interested by the BNP strapline: "Fighting Unsustainable Housing Because We Care". Is this a new approach by the BNP?

malcolmg · May 2014

Richard_Tyndall said:

malcolmg said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

malcolmg said:

richardDodd said:
Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place
Nobody forcing you to stay, if you cannot post any sensible take a hike.
Malcolm you really aren't helping your cause here. I am very pro-Independence for all the positive Yes reasons but it is pretty embarrassing to be associated with the sorts of vitriol you are pumping out on here.

I am damn sure you have good points you can make and ways of expressing them that do not resort to foul mouthed insult.It would serve you much better than the continuous stream of bile you are posting at the moment.
Richard, If there was a sensible debate to be had then I would do as you say. Boredom of the repetitive crap from the usual subjects has hacked me off a bit.
Hard to see how you try and associate it with yourself though.
I hope I am associated with the Yes side as I have made it clear that is what I would like the result to be. There are many positive reasons for an Englishman to want a friendly, successful and independent neighbour and of course the fact that I work in Scotland much of the time these days means I don't demonise the nationalists in the way some of my fellow countrymen do - and some of yours come to that though I suppose that is more understandable given what they feel they have to lose.

All I am saying is that there are plenty of philosophical and practical reasons why someone should want an independent Scotland and throwing around insults is not likely to change any minds nor make the debate (or this site) any more welcoming.

Richard , I am well aware of that. I tend to reply in kind , even if a bit more "robust" than some on here. If they sneer and make snide remarks to me , I am not one to turn the other cheek. If they do not like it then tough.

Alanbrooke · May 2014

Richard_Nabavi said:
On topic: Very hard to judge how much potential confusion there will be. The fact that the ballot paper includes party logos should help reduce the confusion; overall, I wouldn't expect the effect to be very significant. Still, the Electoral Commission should not have allowed such a strapline, and UKIP should have noticed it and objected before it was approved.

Also, I was interested by the BNP strapline: "Fighting Unsustainable Housing Because We Care". Is this a new approach by the BNP?

Sounds like they're targetting property owners in Sussex, you're in the BNP target demographic Richard ;-)

Yellow_Submarine · May 2014

Thank You ! It's lovely to see so many familar faces !

Richard_Nabavi said:
@Yellow_Submarine: Welcome back!

Howdy, Stranger!

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