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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Concern about ballot form confusion could be behind falling off of Ukip in most EP seats Betfair markets
Ukip most seats at Euros price easing from a 72% chance to a 54% on Betfair. pic.twitter.com/JYYSXpBJPE
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Maybe but I think they were just oversold. If the polling is close you do have to wonder what proportions of what party will turn out to make up the 30-35% who will vote. A lot of supporters who are NOTA is a risk in that scenario.
Edit. Gosh a first, first one in ages.
Edit edit. Hullo? Anyone there?0 -
FPT @anotherDave
You are probably right about the photos (something which really should be made illegal) but pretending to be a member of the public when you are a full time staffer is not very smart. Especially when your looks are so, eh, memorable.0 -
Afternoon all
Well, the pace of electioneering has quickened on this fine Bank Holiday in lowland East London. First, this morning I had the pleasure of meeting the Labour team as I was putting the recycling out. Two of the current Councillors are standing again and I know them both reasonably so we had a pleasant chat.
This afternoon the Lib Dems came to call - very nice lady and of course happy to talk to a party member (probably doesn't happen that often).
Labour will likely win every seat again in Newham though it will be fascinating to see how the Christian People's Alliance (CPA) - our version of UKIP if you like - fare as they are contesting every seat with almost a full slate while both the LDs and UKIP are only putting up odd candidates (as are TUSC) around the Borough.
Labour and the Conservatives are of course running full slates - no Respect or BNP candidates this time. The best Tory hopes are in Royal Docks where they've come close in by-elections.0 -
I think all the UKIP PEBs use UKIP people. As long as they aren't claiming to not be UKIP people, I don't see a problem.DavidL said:FPT @anotherDave
You are probably right about the photos (something which really should be made illegal) but pretending to be a member of the public when you are a full time staffer is not very smart. Especially when your looks are so, eh, memorable.
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Not entirely convinced by the 'confusion of alternative to Ukip' - The UKIP strap line may change depending on the elections they are standing, but the party logo has not altered in yonks. I know we should never underestimate the stupidity of some, but it's a ruddy big '£' sign with UKIP through the middle.0
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I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
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I really don't buy this confusion argument. They got top of the ballot by adopting a very bizzare form of words which sounds nothing like UKIP or United Kingdom Independance Party, so I struggle to see how many UKIP voters will be conned. This is no Literal Democrats.0
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Would be so funny if Lizzy Vaid stood and won Newark...
Which party has the highest proportion of female/BAME MP's?0 -
On topic
I wouldn't be surprised if it were people meaning to back most votes and getting had over
Paddy Power have both Labour and UKIP at under or over 23.5 5/6, so Labour must be the value bet at odds against?0 -
100% of Green MPs are female.isam said:Would be so funny if Lizzy Vaid stood and won Newark...
Which party has the highest proportion of female/BAME MP's?0 -
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.CarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.3459150 -
Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.
Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.
Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.
The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.
It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.0 -
Considering how well UKIP poll without prompting, the fact they're the only party on the ballot paper with a name that sounds anything at all like UKIP should help them.MikeL said:Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.
Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.
Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.
The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.
It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.0 -
Just think, if we had PR for all election, this would be a standard ballot paper.
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Of course it will help them. Of course the vast majority of people planning to vote UKIP will vote UKIP.maaarsh said:
Considering how well UKIP poll without prompting, the fact they're the only party on the ballot paper with a name that sounds anything at all like UKIP should help them.MikeL said:Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.
Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.
Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.
The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.
It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.
But that is not the point.
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And along comes malcolm to prove my point.....his reaction to a democratic 'no' will be to leave the country!malcolmg said:
The Better Together mob do not like democracyCarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
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Accordingly, it would be lawful for the party to select on the basis of all male shortlists to reduce this horrifying "inequality"...antifrank said:100% of Green MPs are female.
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" “What is normally a good vibe and community activity in the town was spoilt — they took trade away from the market stalls, and donations away from Cupar in Bloom."malcolmg said:
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.CarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
Can't your activists leave the people in peace, just for one afternoon? Bores.
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Jon Snow -The Visceral hatred of Westminster.
http://blogs.channel4.com/snowblog/visceral-hatred-westminister-politics/23805
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Another reason to vote No.CarlottaVance said:
And along comes malcolm to prove my point.....his reaction to a democratic 'no' will be to leave the country!malcolmg said:
The Better Together mob do not like democracyCarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
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An Independence from Europe shares as much similarity with UKIP as Green Party does with Labour Party.MikeL said:
Of course it will help them. Of course the vast majority of people planning to vote UKIP will vote UKIP.maaarsh said:
Considering how well UKIP poll without prompting, the fact they're the only party on the ballot paper with a name that sounds anything at all like UKIP should help them.MikeL said:Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.
Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.
Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.
The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.
It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.
But that is not the point.
You can't simply state some of the electorate are disengaged and dim (true) and therefore randomly pick which parties will be hurt by this. The so called faux UKIP just does not look anything like UKIP on the ballot paper.0 -
I am afraid that is all too typical. A comment to the Courier by 2 doctors who indicated that they might move back to England if Scotland went independent was followed the next day by a flurry of letters offering to pay their bus fares, right now.CarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.
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Which polls suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade?MikeL said:Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.
Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.
Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.
The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.
It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.0 -
Actually, the same is also true of the Alliance Party.Life_ina_market_town said:
Accordingly, it would be lawful for the party to select on the basis of all male shortlists to reduce this horrifying "inequality"...antifrank said:100% of Green MPs are female.
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Yeah, that's right, all the 'abuse' is on one side.DavidL said:
Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.
I'm sure you'd wish to take the opportunity to condemn this kind of thing (asterisks inserted by me), a selection from the last couple of days:
Chris Ibrox Kerr @1872chriskerr · 5h
@Richiethefifer salmond is a fud n I'm voting naw
Don Stuart @don_stuart · 6h
@YouYesYet I'm voting UKIP on 22nd. Come and chase me out of Scotland you Fascist C***.
Fusel Jeremiad @diskgrinder · 13h
In Scotland, thistles count as flowers, and a cup of tea probably has knives in it. Vote yes and f*** off Scotland
Stephen McCabe @kilmacolm1 · 22h
@newsundayherald @GerryBraiden Ever thought the editor's head is up his own *rse Gerry?
CanYouFeelMyFarts? @fuckamuck · May 3
"King Salmond" f*** off you f***ing w**ker.
joanne henry @JoanHenry7 · May 3
@Tahir_Mohammed Yes of course you're Scottish mate, you'll be the Inverness Mohammed clan then? #VoteNo @iclare1
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The last 3 or 4 have all had UKIP on the high 20s/low 30s, suggesting the two which had them on mid to high 30s were either outliers or a peak which has faded.isam said:
Which polls suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade?MikeL said:Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.
Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.
Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.
The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.
It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.0 -
But the wheeze of the ungrammatical name designed purely to get priority on the ballot paper would be an embarrassment in Student Union elections, never mind national ones. These people should have been told that "a/an" are disregarded for alphabetical ordering and put after the Greens, and we need proper rules to prevent similar ploys in future (which there will be, especially if this one pays off). After GE 2010 one often wonders what the Electoral Commission is actually for.maaarsh said:
An Independence from Europe shares as much similarity with UKIP as Green Party does with Labour Party.MikeL said:
Of course it will help them. Of course the vast majority of people planning to vote UKIP will vote UKIP.maaarsh said:
Considering how well UKIP poll without prompting, the fact they're the only party on the ballot paper with a name that sounds anything at all like UKIP should help them.MikeL said:Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.
Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.
Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.
The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.
It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.
But that is not the point.
You can't simply state some of the electorate are disengaged and dim (true) and therefore randomly pick which parties will be hurt by this. The so called faux UKIP just does not look anything like UKIP on the ballot paper.
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Without accepting the veracity of any of these supposed quotes when did I ever say it was one sided? Fitalass's comment, with which I agree, is that this referendum is proving divisive and ever more vituperative. What we see on here is pretty typical.Theuniondivvie said:
Yeah, that's right, all the 'abuse' is on one side.DavidL said:
Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.
I'm sure you'd wish to take the opportunity to condemn this kind of thing (asterisks inserted by me), a selection from the last couple of days:
Chris Ibrox Kerr @1872chriskerr · 5h
@Richiethefifer salmond is a fud n I'm voting naw
Don Stuart @don_stuart · 6h
@YouYesYet I'm voting UKIP on 22nd. Come and chase me out of Scotland you Fascist C***.
Fusel Jeremiad @diskgrinder · 13h
In Scotland, thistles count as flowers, and a cup of tea probably has knives in it. Vote yes and f*** off Scotland
Stephen McCabe @kilmacolm1 · 22h
@newsundayherald @GerryBraiden Ever thought the editor's head is up his own *rse Gerry?
CanYouFeelMyFarts? @fuckamuck · May 3
"King Salmond" f*** off you f***ing w**ker.
joanne henry @JoanHenry7 · May 3
@Tahir_Mohammed Yes of course you're Scottish mate, you'll be the Inverness Mohammed clan then? #VoteNo @iclare1
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But have they dropped with the same poller? The EU polls are so all over the shop I don't think you can say they have slumped because ComRes had 38% and You Gov had 29%Quincel said:
The last 3 or 4 have all had UKIP on the high 20s/low 30s, suggesting the two which had them on mid to high 30s were either outliers or a peak which has faded.isam said:
Which polls suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade?MikeL said:Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.
Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.
Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.
The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.
It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.0 -
They both have "Independence" in their name.maaarsh said:
An Independence from Europe shares as much similarity with UKIP as Green Party does with Labour Party.MikeL said:
Of course it will help them. Of course the vast majority of people planning to vote UKIP will vote UKIP.maaarsh said:
Considering how well UKIP poll without prompting, the fact they're the only party on the ballot paper with a name that sounds anything at all like UKIP should help them.MikeL said:Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.
Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.
Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.
The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.
It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.
But that is not the point.
You can't simply state some of the electorate are disengaged and dim (true) and therefore randomly pick which parties will be hurt by this. The so called faux UKIP just does not look anything like UKIP on the ballot paper.
UKIP is even written on the ballot paper as "UK Independence Party (UKIP)"
So they both have "Independence" in their name - and both in exactly the same place - ie the second word after a two letter opening word.
That looks a bit more similar to me than "Labour" and "Green".
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Advantages what advantages...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27284489
No UK trade benefit from EU membership - Civitas report0 -
F**k off you cretinMonikerDiCanio said:
" “What is normally a good vibe and community activity in the town was spoilt — they took trade away from the market stalls, and donations away from Cupar in Bloom."malcolmg said:
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.CarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
Can't your activists leave the people in peace, just for one afternoon? Bores.0 -
Lol, 5 minutes ago?DavidL said:when did I ever say it was one sided?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".
'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'
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LOL, what part of Scotland do you live in Toom TabardCarlottaVance said:
And along comes malcolm to prove my point.....his reaction to a democratic 'no' will be to leave the country!malcolmg said:
The Better Together mob do not like democracyCarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.3459150 -
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.Theuniondivvie said:
Lol, 5 minutes ago?DavidL said:when did I ever say it was one sided?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".
'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'
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David , do you ever read unionist websites or newspaper comments.DavidL said:
I am afraid that is all too typical. A comment to the Courier by 2 doctors who indicated that they might move back to England if Scotland went independent was followed the next day by a flurry of letters offering to pay their bus fares, right now.CarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.0 -
Quincel has partially answered.isam said:
But have they dropped with the same poller? The EU polls are so all over the shop I don't think you can say they have slumped because ComRes had 38% and You Gov had 29%Quincel said:
The last 3 or 4 have all had UKIP on the high 20s/low 30s, suggesting the two which had them on mid to high 30s were either outliers or a peak which has faded.isam said:
Which polls suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade?MikeL said:Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.
Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.
Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.
The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.
It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.
They have also dropped with the same pollster - they were 31 with YouGov last Sunday - yesterday YouGov had them on 29 in two different polls.
Not a large drop - arguably MOE - though it is two polls - but at a minimum it does indicate upward momentum has stopped and potentially starting to edge downwards.
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Unionists, the new Pharisees (feel free to mark that down as another instance of Cybernat abuse).DavidL said:
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.Theuniondivvie said:
Lol, 5 minutes ago?DavidL said:when did I ever say it was one sided?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".
'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'
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Malcolm, you must be in the pay of No.malcolmg said:
F**k off you cretinMonikerDiCanio said:
" “What is normally a good vibe and community activity in the town was spoilt — they took trade away from the market stalls, and donations away from Cupar in Bloom."malcolmg said:
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.CarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
Can't your activists leave the people in peace, just for one afternoon? Bores.
0 -
David, caught lying and you resort to some fantasy rubbish. Go back over the posts here for the last year and you will find that most of the YES people have been driven from the site by vile abuse. You unionists like to give it out , lie through your teeth but do not like to receive it. At least man up and stop being a big jessie whinging and lying about those nasty YES voters.DavidL said:
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.Theuniondivvie said:
Lol, 5 minutes ago?DavidL said:when did I ever say it was one sided?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".
'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'0 -
No thicko I am posting as if I am a NO voter, very deliberately. Copying cretins like you, even though you do not even have a vote.MonikerDiCanio said:
Malcolm, you must be in the pay of No.malcolmg said:
F**k off you cretinMonikerDiCanio said:
" “What is normally a good vibe and community activity in the town was spoilt — they took trade away from the market stalls, and donations away from Cupar in Bloom."malcolmg said:
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.CarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
Can't your activists leave the people in peace, just for one afternoon? Bores.
0 -
We get a similar thing in Guernsey - 'The boat sails at five' - but its usually proffered by those opposing change, not advocating it!DavidL said:
A comment to the Courier by 2 doctors who indicated that they might move back to England if Scotland went independent was followed the next day by a flurry of letters offering to pay their bus fares, right now.CarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
0 -
Actually I am not aware of any unionist websites. I do sometimes look at the comments on sites like the Scotsman but my perception, although it is far from one sided, is that the aggression and hostility is largely from the Yes camp. Doesn't mean some of the unionist comments are not witless of course.malcolmg said:
David , do you ever read unionist websites or newspaper comments.DavidL said:
I am afraid that is all too typical. A comment to the Courier by 2 doctors who indicated that they might move back to England if Scotland went independent was followed the next day by a flurry of letters offering to pay their bus fares, right now.CarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.
0 -
If it wasn't at the top maybe but some will react to the keywords in the name and make their cross automatically before engaging brain. Be interesting to see how many. It would either be a sign of thickness or how hyped up they were to vote.SimonStClare said:Not entirely convinced by the 'confusion of alternative to Ukip' - The UKIP strap line may change depending on the elections they are standing, but the party logo has not altered in yonks. I know we should never underestimate the stupidity of some, but it's a ruddy big '£' sign with UKIP through the middle.
0 -
Driven from the site by abuse ? Let's see:malcolmg said:
David, caught lying and you resort to some fantasy rubbish. Go back over the posts here for the last year and you will find that most of the YES people have been driven from the site by vile abuse. You unionists like to give it out , lie through your teeth but do not like to receive it. At least man up and stop being a big jessie whinging and lying about those nasty YES voters.DavidL said:
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.Theuniondivvie said:
Lol, 5 minutes ago?DavidL said:when did I ever say it was one sided?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".
'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'
James got banned for ignoring site rules
Oldnat just got bored but occasionally pops in
JPJ2 had a hissy fit and left
Mick repetitive posts so gets mistaken for spam
Stuart left and came back again
I'm failing to see the abuse there malc.
0 -
Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place0
-
Most people have only a passing interest in party politics - I'm sure that a lot of voters think that the English Democrats and the EDL are one and the same. Seeing a party at the top of the ballot with the word independence in the name and "UK Independence" in the description is going to fool a lot of voters. It's just a pity we don't have the Conversatives standing!0
-
Lying?malcolmg said:
David, caught lying and you resort to some fantasy rubbish. Go back over the posts here for the last year and you will find that most of the YES people have been driven from the site by vile abuse. You unionists like to give it out , lie through your teeth but do not like to receive it. At least man up and stop being a big jessie whinging and lying about those nasty YES voters.DavidL said:
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.Theuniondivvie said:
Lol, 5 minutes ago?DavidL said:when did I ever say it was one sided?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".
'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'
0 -
A witty and scintillating bit of repartee.malcolmg said:
F**k off you cretinMonikerDiCanio said:
" “What is normally a good vibe and community activity in the town was spoilt — they took trade away from the market stalls, and donations away from Cupar in Bloom."malcolmg said:
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.CarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
Can't your activists leave the people in peace, just for one afternoon? Bores.0 -
All in the space of a little over 40 minutes.......malcolmg said:
The Better Together mob do not like democracy....
F**k off you cretin...
Toom Tabard
David, caught lying.......
resort to some fantasy rubbish....
lie through your teeth ...
big jessie whinging.....
lying about those nasty YES voters.
No thicko .....
cretins like you.....0 -
You need to compare like with like. The top-line Certain to Vote figures were 36% with TNS and 38% with Com Res. With Yougov, their Certain to Vote number for UKIP was 34%.isam said:
But have they dropped with the same poller? The EU polls are so all over the shop I don't think you can say they have slumped because ComRes had 38% and You Gov had 29%Quincel said:
The last 3 or 4 have all had UKIP on the high 20s/low 30s, suggesting the two which had them on mid to high 30s were either outliers or a peak which has faded.isam said:
Which polls suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade?MikeL said:Remember - 95% of people do not follow politics anything like as carefully as people who post on here.
Most people won't have a clue what the UKIP logo is.
Confusion could easily cost UKIP approx 2% - ie enough to mean 27% becomes 25%.
The other point is that polls do suggest the UKIP bounce may now be starting to fade - not a lot but it does appear they are losing a bit of momentum.
It could be that all the "fruitcake" stories are starting to sow a few seeds of doubt in potential voters - and if momentum has changed then it could keep running.0 -
Blimey! :Omalcolmg said:
F**k off you cretinMonikerDiCanio said:
" “What is normally a good vibe and community activity in the town was spoilt — they took trade away from the market stalls, and donations away from Cupar in Bloom."malcolmg said:
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.CarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
Can't your activists leave the people in peace, just for one afternoon? Bores.
0 -
your rosy unionist specs must have a good filter David. Go look how nice the unionists are. Robot archiving BritNat abuse/smears.DavidL said:
Actually I am not aware of any unionist websites. I do sometimes look at the comments on sites like the Scotsman but my perception, although it is far from one sided, is that the aggression and hostility is largely from the Yes camp. Doesn't mean some of the unionist comments are not witless of course.malcolmg said:
David , do you ever read unionist websites or newspaper comments.DavidL said:
I am afraid that is all too typical. A comment to the Courier by 2 doctors who indicated that they might move back to England if Scotland went independent was followed the next day by a flurry of letters offering to pay their bus fares, right now.CarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.
https://twitter.com/BritNatAbuseBot0 -
I pretty much agree with most of that. This should not have been allowed as it is.MrJones said:
If it wasn't at the top maybe but some will react to the keywords in the name and make their cross automatically before engaging brain. Be interesting to see how many. It would either be a sign of thickness or how hyped up they were to vote.SimonStClare said:Not entirely convinced by the 'confusion of alternative to Ukip' - The UKIP strap line may change depending on the elections they are standing, but the party logo has not altered in yonks. I know we should never underestimate the stupidity of some, but it's a ruddy big '£' sign with UKIP through the middle.
However: the AIFE party is different from UKIP. *Some* of their votes will be genuine, although from looking at their website, it is hard to discern what they're so different. There seems to be less concentration on immigration, and more against HS2 and anti-rail. Both of which could be seen as UKIP positions. I'm not sure that nationalisation of the M6 toll would be, though.
http://www.aipmep.org/
Personally, their website seems 'freindlier' in terms of usability that UKIP's, to me at least.0 -
For the sake of precision, a moderator said that was the case and it should be fixed in 'hours'; 4 days later he still can't post on the site, and PB moderators have ignored my pm and post about it.Alanbrooke said:
Driven from the site by abuse ? Let's see:
Mick repetitive posts so gets mistaken for spam
I'm failing to see the abuse there malc.
0 -
Scintillating sarcasm and rapid repartee are my forte, however it is wasted on trolls like Monica.Sean_F said:
A witty and scintillating bit of repartee.malcolmg said:
F**k off you cretinMonikerDiCanio said:
" “What is normally a good vibe and community activity in the town was spoilt — they took trade away from the market stalls, and donations away from Cupar in Bloom."malcolmg said:
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.CarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
Can't your activists leave the people in peace, just for one afternoon? Bores.0 -
I am sure that malcolmg only gets away with his constant abuse of other posters in contravention of board policy because he is in fact an alter ego of OGHSean_F said:
A witty and scintillating bit of repartee.malcolmg said:
F**k off you cretinMonikerDiCanio said:
" “What is normally a good vibe and community activity in the town was spoilt — they took trade away from the market stalls, and donations away from Cupar in Bloom."malcolmg said:
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.CarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
Can't your activists leave the people in peace, just for one afternoon? Bores.0 -
Nobody forcing you to stay, if you cannot post any sensible take a hike.richardDodd said:Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place
0 -
yes, you tried to make out the abuse is all one sided, given you are on this blog and see it from unionists regularly then I can only assume you are not addled but are being economical with the truth.DavidL said:
Lying?malcolmg said:
David, caught lying and you resort to some fantasy rubbish. Go back over the posts here for the last year and you will find that most of the YES people have been driven from the site by vile abuse. You unionists like to give it out , lie through your teeth but do not like to receive it. At least man up and stop being a big jessie whinging and lying about those nasty YES voters.DavidL said:
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.Theuniondivvie said:
Lol, 5 minutes ago?DavidL said:when did I ever say it was one sided?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".
'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'0 -
I'll give you 'rapid', scintillating....no, and repartee, got a dictionary to hand?malcolmg said:
Scintillating sarcasm and rapid repartee are my forte, however it is wasted on trolls like Monica.Sean_F said:
A witty and scintillating bit of repartee.malcolmg said:
F**k off you cretinMonikerDiCanio said:
" “What is normally a good vibe and community activity in the town was spoilt — they took trade away from the market stalls, and donations away from Cupar in Bloom."malcolmg said:
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.CarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
Can't your activists leave the people in peace, just for one afternoon? Bores.
When was the last time you engaged with an argument, rather than abused its proponent?
0 -
You have posted nothing but personal abuse in all of your 3,000 odd posts .malcolmg said:
Nobody forcing you to stay, if you cannot post any sensible take a hike.richardDodd said:Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place
-1 -
You accused me of lying Malcolm. What are you talking about?malcolmg said:
your rosy unionist specs must have a good filter David. Go look how nice the unionists are. Robot archiving BritNat abuse/smears.DavidL said:
Actually I am not aware of any unionist websites. I do sometimes look at the comments on sites like the Scotsman but my perception, although it is far from one sided, is that the aggression and hostility is largely from the Yes camp. Doesn't mean some of the unionist comments are not witless of course.malcolmg said:
David , do you ever read unionist websites or newspaper comments.DavidL said:
I am afraid that is all too typical. A comment to the Courier by 2 doctors who indicated that they might move back to England if Scotland went independent was followed the next day by a flurry of letters offering to pay their bus fares, right now.CarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.
https://twitter.com/BritNatAbuseBot
And that is not a website but a collection of tweets that someone has allegedly put together. Something else Cameron was right about.
0 -
Alan, you are being a bit obtuse there, James was well abused on here, you also missed Redcliffe who gave up. There is not much welcome here unless you are for NO, with regard to the referendum of course. Plenty of them like to give it out but do not like any back.Alanbrooke said:
Driven from the site by abuse ? Let's see:malcolmg said:
David, caught lying and you resort to some fantasy rubbish. Go back over the posts here for the last year and you will find that most of the YES people have been driven from the site by vile abuse. You unionists like to give it out , lie through your teeth but do not like to receive it. At least man up and stop being a big jessie whinging and lying about those nasty YES voters.DavidL said:
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.Theuniondivvie said:
Lol, 5 minutes ago?DavidL said:when did I ever say it was one sided?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".
'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'
James got banned for ignoring site rules
Oldnat just got bored but occasionally pops in
JPJ2 had a hissy fit and left
Mick repetitive posts so gets mistaken for spam
Stuart left and came back again
I'm failing to see the abuse there malc.0 -
Well fair does divvie, but it does seem odd that Mick is consistently the poster that keeps losing access whereas all the other posters of whatever persusasion appear to be able to get back on. personally I suspect he has something on his PC that is giving him the problem. Why doesn't he just re-register under a new name and see if it works better for him.Theuniondivvie said:
For the sake of precision, a moderator said that was the case and it should be fixed in 'hours'; 4 days later he still can't post on the site, and PB moderators have ignored my pm and post about it.Alanbrooke said:
Driven from the site by abuse ? Let's see:
Mick repetitive posts so gets mistaken for spam
I'm failing to see the abuse there malc.0 -
malcolm, are you seriously arguing that DavidL is more abusive than you?malcolmg said:
you are on this blog and see it from unionists regularly then I can only assume you are not addled but are being economical with the truth.DavidL said:
Lying?malcolmg said:
David, caught lying and you resort to some fantasy rubbish. Go back over the posts here for the last year and you will find that most of the YES people have been driven from the site by vile abuse. You unionists like to give it out , lie through your teeth but do not like to receive it. At least man up and stop being a big jessie whinging and lying about those nasty YES voters.DavidL said:
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.Theuniondivvie said:
Lol, 5 minutes ago?DavidL said:when did I ever say it was one sided?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".
'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'
0 -
Malcolm you really aren't helping your cause here. I am very pro-Independence for all the positive Yes reasons but it is pretty embarrassing to be associated with the sorts of vitriol you are pumping out on here.malcolmg said:
Nobody forcing you to stay, if you cannot post any sensible take a hike.richardDodd said:Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place
I am damn sure you have good points you can make and ways of expressing them that do not resort to foul mouthed insult.It would serve you much better than the continuous stream of bile you are posting at the moment.0 -
Malcolm that is just nonsense. I did nothing of the sort. But pretty much all of the personal abuse on this site these days is from you. It does nothing for your argument.malcolmg said:
yes, you tried to make out the abuse is all one sided, given you are on this blog and see it from unionists regularly then I can only assume you are not addled but are being economical with the truth.DavidL said:
Lying?malcolmg said:
David, caught lying and you resort to some fantasy rubbish. Go back over the posts here for the last year and you will find that most of the YES people have been driven from the site by vile abuse. You unionists like to give it out , lie through your teeth but do not like to receive it. At least man up and stop being a big jessie whinging and lying about those nasty YES voters.DavidL said:
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.Theuniondivvie said:
Lol, 5 minutes ago?DavidL said:when did I ever say it was one sided?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".
'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'
0 -
I thought you argue that its Unionists that give it out but can't take it?malcolmg said:
James was well abused on hereAlanbrooke said:
Driven from the site by abuse ? Let's see:malcolmg said:
David, caught lying and you resort to some fantasy rubbish. Go back over the posts here for the last year and you will find that most of the YES people have been driven from the site by vile abuse. You unionists like to give it out , lie through your teeth but do not like to receive it. At least man up and stop being a big jessie whinging and lying about those nasty YES voters.DavidL said:
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.Theuniondivvie said:
Lol, 5 minutes ago?DavidL said:when did I ever say it was one sided?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".
'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'
James got banned for ignoring site rules
Oldnat just got bored but occasionally pops in
JPJ2 had a hissy fit and left
Mick repetitive posts so gets mistaken for spam
Stuart left and came back again
I'm failing to see the abuse there malc.
James was banned because he believed he was bigger than OGH site rules.....
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I am impersonating a NO supporter, since you seem to be unable to spot it anywhere else, your rose tinted specs only see the opposite.CarlottaVance said:
All in the space of a little over 40 minutes.......malcolmg said:
The Better Together mob do not like democracy....
F**k off you cretin...
Toom Tabard
David, caught lying.......
resort to some fantasy rubbish....
lie through your teeth ...
big jessie whinging.....
lying about those nasty YES voters.
No thicko .....
cretins like you.....
I note you have not said where in Scotland you are living, after your last snide remark.
Always quick to sneer and smear , but you should follow your own guidance a la Cameron and butt out when you are not involved.0 -
You are obviously not right if you read all of them and came up with that horse manure.MarkSenior said:
You have posted nothing but personal abuse in all of your 3,000 odd posts .malcolmg said:
Nobody forcing you to stay, if you cannot post any sensible take a hike.richardDodd said:Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place
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malc a spat with James was always a good bit of crack, and he gave as good as he got. However that's not the reason he isn't posting.malcolmg said:
Alan, you are being a bit obtuse there, James was well abused on here, you also missed Redcliffe who gave up. There is not much welcome here unless you are for NO, with regard to the referendum of course. Plenty of them like to give it out but do not like any back.Alanbrooke said:
Driven from the site by abuse ? Let's see:malcolmg said:
David, caught lying and you resort to some fantasy rubbish. Go back over the posts here for the last year and you will find that most of the YES people have been driven from the site by vile abuse. You unionists like to give it out , lie through your teeth but do not like to receive it. At least man up and stop being a big jessie whinging and lying about those nasty YES voters.DavidL said:
Well I think anyone reading this thread, or indeed any thread in the last several months, can make up their own minds.Theuniondivvie said:
Lol, 5 minutes ago?DavidL said:when did I ever say it was one sided?
Oh, sorry, of course you didn't mean it was JUST Cybernats using any level of abuse in "retaliation".
'Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.'
James got banned for ignoring site rules
Oldnat just got bored but occasionally pops in
JPJ2 had a hissy fit and left
Mick repetitive posts so gets mistaken for spam
Stuart left and came back again
I'm failing to see the abuse there malc.
Redcliffe to the best of my knowledge still posts but certainly nowhere near as much as previously. I haven't seen anything saying he's given up, but maybe I missed it.0 -
It is not a very good impersonation...malcolmg said:
I am impersonating a NO supporter, since you seem to be unable to spot it anywhere else, your rose tinted specs only see the opposite.CarlottaVance said:
All in the space of a little over 40 minutes.......malcolmg said:
The Better Together mob do not like democracy....
F**k off you cretin...
Toom Tabard
David, caught lying.......
resort to some fantasy rubbish....
lie through your teeth ...
big jessie whinging.....
lying about those nasty YES voters.
No thicko .....
cretins like you.....
I note you have not said where in Scotland you are living, after your last snide remark.
Always quick to sneer and smear , but you should follow your own guidance a la Cameron and butt out when you are not involved.
0 -
Enlighten us.malcolmg said:
You are obviously not right if you read all of them and came up with that horse manure.MarkSenior said:
You have posted nothing but personal abuse in all of your 3,000 odd posts .malcolmg said:
Nobody forcing you to stay, if you cannot post any sensible take a hike.richardDodd said:Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place
Post one of you engaging with an argument about the merits of Scottish independence from this thread.
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OK, so twitter abuse does not count. So what is your criteria , a stupid anecdote from the Courier is the only one that counts. There are none so blind as those that will not see.DavidL said:
You accused me of lying Malcolm. What are you talking about?malcolmg said:
your rosy unionist specs must have a good filter David. Go look how nice the unionists are. Robot archiving BritNat abuse/smears.DavidL said:
Actually I am not aware of any unionist websites. I do sometimes look at the comments on sites like the Scotsman but my perception, although it is far from one sided, is that the aggression and hostility is largely from the Yes camp. Doesn't mean some of the unionist comments are not witless of course.malcolmg said:
David , do you ever read unionist websites or newspaper comments.DavidL said:
I am afraid that is all too typical. A comment to the Courier by 2 doctors who indicated that they might move back to England if Scotland went independent was followed the next day by a flurry of letters offering to pay their bus fares, right now.CarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.
https://twitter.com/BritNatAbuseBot
And that is not a website but a collection of tweets that someone has allegedly put together. Something else Cameron was right about.0 -
Got a mirror, dear?malcolmg said:
Always quick to sneer and smearCarlottaVance said:
All in the space of a little over 40 minutes.......malcolmg said:
The Better Together mob do not like democracy....
F**k off you cretin...
Toom Tabard
David, caught lying.......
resort to some fantasy rubbish....
lie through your teeth ...
big jessie whinging.....
lying about those nasty YES voters.
No thicko .....
cretins like you.....
0 -
LOL , you are barking, but thanks for the compliment nonetheless.MarkSenior said:
I am sure that malcolmg only gets away with his constant abuse of other posters in contravention of board policy because he is in fact an alter ego of OGHSean_F said:
A witty and scintillating bit of repartee.malcolmg said:
F**k off you cretinMonikerDiCanio said:
" “What is normally a good vibe and community activity in the town was spoilt — they took trade away from the market stalls, and donations away from Cupar in Bloom."malcolmg said:
The Better Together mob do not like democracy, since they have no organisation the ytry their best to get the YES activists banned from wherever they can. They lost in Cupar despite the council trying to help them as they were illegally moved from where they were.CarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
Can't your activists leave the people in peace, just for one afternoon? Bores.0 -
The Courier point was about 'Scotland being divided, what ever the outcome'.malcolmg said:
a stupid anecdote from the CourierDavidL said:
You accused me of lying Malcolm. What are you talking about?malcolmg said:
your rosy unionist specs must have a good filter David. Go look how nice the unionists are. Robot archiving BritNat abuse/smears.DavidL said:
Actually I am not aware of any unionist websites. I do sometimes look at the comments on sites like the Scotsman but my perception, although it is far from one sided, is that the aggression and hostility is largely from the Yes camp. Doesn't mean some of the unionist comments are not witless of course.malcolmg said:
David , do you ever read unionist websites or newspaper comments.DavidL said:
I am afraid that is all too typical. A comment to the Courier by 2 doctors who indicated that they might move back to England if Scotland went independent was followed the next day by a flurry of letters offering to pay their bus fares, right now.CarlottaVance said:
I suspect that's the case - and it would do them no long-term harm if expectations were damped down somewhat before the day.DavidL said:Maybe but I think they were just oversold.
Apropos Fitalass comment on the previous thread about division within Scotland - I'd always assumed that the rancour and vituperation we see on here was a function of i) the sites focus on, and interest in, politics and ii) the opinions being offered from across the Union, not just from within Scotland.
I was therefore disheartened to see almost exactly the same types of post on a random page I stumbled upon in my former local paper - debating whether Yes Scotland should distribute leaflets on the Farmer's market day in Cupar:
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/yes-scotland-campaigners-accused-of-spoiling-cupar-farmers-market-with-in-your-face-presence-1.345915
Cybernats clearly feel, with some justification, that the majority of the media is against them. Unfortunately the non sequitur is that this seems to justify in their minds almost any level of abuse in "retaliation". A lot of people are getting increasingly worried about what sort of a country they would end up living in. Most were already voting no anyway but there is a tipping point for some.
https://twitter.com/BritNatAbuseBot
And that is not a website but a collection of tweets that someone has allegedly put together. Something else Cameron was right about.
Thank you for your energetic reinforcement of my point.
0 -
Just warming upCarlottaVance said:
All in the space of a little over 40 minutes.......malcolmg said:
The Better Together mob do not like democracy....
F**k off you cretin...
Toom Tabard
David, caught lying.......
resort to some fantasy rubbish....
lie through your teeth ...
big jessie whinging.....
lying about those nasty YES voters.
No thicko .....
cretins like you.....
0 -
David, At least I do not try to pretend everybody in YES is an angel. Your one eyed view is a bit silly given the daily evidence of the nastiness of the unionists.DavidL said:
It is not a very good impersonation...malcolmg said:
I am impersonating a NO supporter, since you seem to be unable to spot it anywhere else, your rose tinted specs only see the opposite.CarlottaVance said:
All in the space of a little over 40 minutes.......malcolmg said:
The Better Together mob do not like democracy....
F**k off you cretin...
Toom Tabard
David, caught lying.......
resort to some fantasy rubbish....
lie through your teeth ...
big jessie whinging.....
lying about those nasty YES voters.
No thicko .....
cretins like you.....
I note you have not said where in Scotland you are living, after your last snide remark.
Always quick to sneer and smear , but you should follow your own guidance a la Cameron and butt out when you are not involved.0 -
Come along, chaps, there's months and months to get. Let's not get het up.0
-
AIFE might well take some votes away from UKIP - but not all that many from confused people. I imagine most of the votes they get will be from people who are anti-EU but feel queasy about UKIP.0
-
Malcol G...your offensive and repetive insults to anyone who even slightly disagrees with you suggests you are not entirely sober...0
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LOL yes Mr S worked out that nearly 3 years of bitterness and griping was a solid platform on which to build a nation.Morris_Dancer said:Come along, chaps, there's months and months to get. Let's not get het up.
0 -
LOL ; )malcolmg said:
Just warming upCarlottaVance said:
All in the space of a little over 40 minutes.......malcolmg said:
The Better Together mob do not like democracy....
F**k off you cretin...
Toom Tabard
David, caught lying.......
resort to some fantasy rubbish....
lie through your teeth ...
big jessie whinging.....
lying about those nasty YES voters.
No thicko .....
cretins like you.....0 -
Regretfully malcolmg has neither the intelligence nor a sufficient command of the English language to engage in meaningful debate - that is why he has to resort to a stream of personal insults and swearing at PBers.CarlottaVance said:
Enlighten us.malcolmg said:
You are obviously not right if you read all of them and came up with that horse manure.MarkSenior said:
You have posted nothing but personal abuse in all of your 3,000 odd posts .malcolmg said:
Nobody forcing you to stay, if you cannot post any sensible take a hike.richardDodd said:Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place
Post one of you engaging with an argument about the merits of Scottish independence from this thread.
0 -
Vanilla just reset my preferences at a point when I was at the zoo and couldn't change them.
Much as I like you guys, getting email copies of everyone of your posts is not helpful...0 -
Richard, If there was a sensible debate to be had then I would do as you say. Boredom of the repetitive crap from the usual subjects has hacked me off a bit.Richard_Tyndall said:
Malcolm you really aren't helping your cause here. I am very pro-Independence for all the positive Yes reasons but it is pretty embarrassing to be associated with the sorts of vitriol you are pumping out on here.malcolmg said:
Nobody forcing you to stay, if you cannot post any sensible take a hike.richardDodd said:Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place
I am damn sure you have good points you can make and ways of expressing them that do not resort to foul mouthed insult.It would serve you much better than the continuous stream of bile you are posting at the moment.
Hard to see how you try and associate it with yourself though.0 -
And then there's the post vote DevoMax/Indy negotiations.......Morris_Dancer said:Come along, chaps, there's months and months to get. Let's not get het up.
On DevoMax, I hope the UK parties say 'we'll put it in our manifestos for 2015 and you can vote on that' (because it involves all of the UK) to let things cool down a bit...
If its 'Indy' then "If it were done when ’tis done, then ’twere well It were done quickly.
Scotland on her way by May 2015, with a few loose ends to tie up, and rUK to sort out her own future....
0 -
Yes, it is, rather.malcolmg said:
repetitive crapRichard_Tyndall said:
Malcolm you really aren't helping your cause here. I am very pro-Independence for all the positive Yes reasons but it is pretty embarrassing to be associated with the sorts of vitriol you are pumping out on here.malcolmg said:
Nobody forcing you to stay, if you cannot post any sensible take a hike.richardDodd said:Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place
I am damn sure you have good points you can make and ways of expressing them that do not resort to foul mouthed insult.It would serve you much better than the continuous stream of bile you are posting at the moment.
0 -
The more I look at that voting slip the dodgier it gets.
The list follows a pattern of the party name followed by a strap line and the first entry has almost the Ukip party name as the strap line. Someone reading from the top down may not see the pattern: party name first, strap line second, until after they put their cross.
Is that fightable / worth it? The publicity from a fight might reduce the number of people who make the mistake while making it look like the political class is trying to rig the vote.
0 -
It's not just the Natrass splinter/Literal Democrat move. The most recent polling has been YouGov which has lower UKIP shares than some pollsters. Also Labour has it's hard hitting 'Pay to see your GP' leaflet going out. Also low liquidity.
My view is this will cost UKIP some votes. It's as much the distance between Natrass and UKIP on the ballot paper. The Alpha and Omega. Also if they really are turning out long term non voters how many have encountered a PR ballot paper ?
But that many ?UKIP is now a recognisable enough brand for Travel Lodge to sucessfully skit.
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I hope I am associated with the Yes side as I have made it clear that is what I would like the result to be. There are many positive reasons for an Englishman to want a friendly, successful and independent neighbour and of course the fact that I work in Scotland much of the time these days means I don't demonise the nationalists in the way some of my fellow countrymen do - and some of yours come to that though I suppose that is more understandable given what they feel they have to lose.malcolmg said:
Richard, If there was a sensible debate to be had then I would do as you say. Boredom of the repetitive crap from the usual subjects has hacked me off a bit.Richard_Tyndall said:
Malcolm you really aren't helping your cause here. I am very pro-Independence for all the positive Yes reasons but it is pretty embarrassing to be associated with the sorts of vitriol you are pumping out on here.malcolmg said:
Nobody forcing you to stay, if you cannot post any sensible take a hike.richardDodd said:Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place
I am damn sure you have good points you can make and ways of expressing them that do not resort to foul mouthed insult.It would serve you much better than the continuous stream of bile you are posting at the moment.
Hard to see how you try and associate it with yourself though.
All I am saying is that there are plenty of philosophical and practical reasons why someone should want an independent Scotland and throwing around insults is not likely to change any minds nor make the debate (or this site) any more welcoming.
0 -
The 'strap line' is a description agreed by the Electoral Commission - most parties do not use it - UKIP could have, had they wanted to.MrJones said:The list follows a pattern of the party name followed by a strap line
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@Yellow_Submarine: Welcome back!0
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If voters are that thick they deserve to vote for the wrong party.SandyRentool said:Most people have only a passing interest in party politics - I'm sure that a lot of voters think that the English Democrats and the EDL are one and the same. Seeing a party at the top of the ballot with the word independence in the name and "UK Independence" in the description is going to fool a lot of voters. It's just a pity we don't have the Conversatives standing!
0 -
Sorry to disappoint you Sherlock. I do not appreciate halfwits like you trying to imply that I am not sober. If you have nothing relevant to add then crawl back under your rock and give us peace.richardDodd said:Malcol G...your offensive and repetive insults to anyone who even slightly disagrees with you suggests you are not entirely sober...
0 -
On topic: Very hard to judge how much potential confusion there will be. The fact that the ballot paper includes party logos should help reduce the confusion; overall, I wouldn't expect the effect to be very significant. Still, the Electoral Commission should not have allowed such a strapline, and UKIP should have noticed it and objected before it was approved.
Also, I was interested by the BNP strapline: "Fighting Unsustainable Housing Because We Care". Is this a new approach by the BNP?0 -
Richard , I am well aware of that. I tend to reply in kind , even if a bit more "robust" than some on here. If they sneer and make snide remarks to me , I am not one to turn the other cheek. If they do not like it then tough.Richard_Tyndall said:
I hope I am associated with the Yes side as I have made it clear that is what I would like the result to be. There are many positive reasons for an Englishman to want a friendly, successful and independent neighbour and of course the fact that I work in Scotland much of the time these days means I don't demonise the nationalists in the way some of my fellow countrymen do - and some of yours come to that though I suppose that is more understandable given what they feel they have to lose.malcolmg said:
Richard, If there was a sensible debate to be had then I would do as you say. Boredom of the repetitive crap from the usual subjects has hacked me off a bit.Richard_Tyndall said:
Malcolm you really aren't helping your cause here. I am very pro-Independence for all the positive Yes reasons but it is pretty embarrassing to be associated with the sorts of vitriol you are pumping out on here.malcolmg said:
Nobody forcing you to stay, if you cannot post any sensible take a hike.richardDodd said:Malcolm G..can you tone down the offensive insults..totally needless....makes the site a very unwelcome place
I am damn sure you have good points you can make and ways of expressing them that do not resort to foul mouthed insult.It would serve you much better than the continuous stream of bile you are posting at the moment.
Hard to see how you try and associate it with yourself though.
All I am saying is that there are plenty of philosophical and practical reasons why someone should want an independent Scotland and throwing around insults is not likely to change any minds nor make the debate (or this site) any more welcoming.0 -
Sounds like they're targetting property owners in Sussex, you're in the BNP target demographic Richard ;-)Richard_Nabavi said:On topic: Very hard to judge how much potential confusion there will be. The fact that the ballot paper includes party logos should help reduce the confusion; overall, I wouldn't expect the effect to be very significant. Still, the Electoral Commission should not have allowed such a strapline, and UKIP should have noticed it and objected before it was approved.
Also, I was interested by the BNP strapline: "Fighting Unsustainable Housing Because We Care". Is this a new approach by the BNP?0 -
Thank You ! It's lovely to see so many familar faces !Richard_Nabavi said:
@Yellow_Submarine: Welcome back!
0
This discussion has been closed.