politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Irish General Election 2020 : Predictions & Review, Part 2

Theuniondivvie said:

I believe Morris Dancer likes a coin? Better snap up a gold 50p piece before the sovvy ring brigade snaffle them all.

https://twitter.com/Feorlean/status/1222806123935346692?s=20

How much does it weigh?

I’m gonna take a random guess that the price isn’t a million miles away from today’s gold price.

Endillion said:

ManchesterKurt said:

Endillion said:

SandyRentool said:

HYUFD said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Tate Britain defends job ad for £40k 'head of coffee'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-51310516

Seems rather low paid for London to me....

Yet curators average only £37 500 in London.

The average London salary is £700 a month ie £36 400

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/economy-business/work-incomes/constituency-data-wages/

And yet the Daily Mail tells us that folk on £100k are "Middle Class".

Well, as opposed to what?

Where the 'middle' is ?

I wouldn't say people on £100k are the epitome of middle class, but how else would you classify them, other than middle class?

Absolutely not the middle as that excuses them for not recognising that they are absolutely at the top end of income.

So upper / Top or anything other than middle as suggesting that is 'middle' makes them feel that they are not hugely privileged.

ManchesterKurt said:

Endillion said:

ManchesterKurt said:

Endillion said:

SandyRentool said:

HYUFD said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Tate Britain defends job ad for £40k 'head of coffee'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-51310516

Seems rather low paid for London to me....

Yet curators average only £37 500 in London.

The average London salary is £700 a month ie £36 400

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/economy-business/work-incomes/constituency-data-wages/

And yet the Daily Mail tells us that folk on £100k are "Middle Class".

Well, as opposed to what?

Where the 'middle' is ?

I wouldn't say people on £100k are the epitome of middle class, but how else would you classify them, other than middle class?

Absolutely not the middle as that excuses them for not recognising that they are absolutely at the top end of income.

So upper / Top or anything other than middle as suggesting that is 'middle' makes them feel that they are not hugely privileged.

The Mail are good at finding people who “struggle” to “cope” on six figure salaries living in Surrey, what with the massive mortgage, three sets of school fees and the skiing holiday to pay for...

They’re trolling, and best ignored.

DecrepiterJohnL said:

Sandpit said:

Theuniondivvie said:

I believe Morris Dancer likes a coin? Better snap up a gold 50p piece before the sovvy ring brigade snaffle them all.

https://twitter.com/Feorlean/status/1222806123935346692?s=20

How much does it weigh?

I’m gonna take a random guess that the price isn’t a million miles away from today’s gold price.

I'm going to take a random guess that it is at least 10 times its scrap value as gold. The whole point is to make a profit from collectors and you can't do that buy selling below cost.

I'd imagine if 'brilliant uncirculated' goes for £10, a 1000% mark up would be the least of it.

DecrepiterJohnL said:

Sandpit said:

Theuniondivvie said:

I believe Morris Dancer likes a coin? Better snap up a gold 50p piece before the sovvy ring brigade snaffle them all.

https://twitter.com/Feorlean/status/1222806123935346692?s=20

How much does it weigh?

I’m gonna take a random guess that the price isn’t a million miles away from today’s gold price.

I'm going to take a random guess that it is at least 10 times its scrap value as gold. The whole point is to make a profit from collectors and you can't do that buy selling below cost.

15.5g of 22 carat gold is about £600.

AlastairMeeks said:

Pulpstar said:

AlastairMeeks said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Tate Britain defends job ad for £40k 'head of coffee'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-51310516

Seems rather low paid for London to me....

This morning I went into an independent coffee shop and was confronted with a menu with a string of items that I hadn't heard of. Am I pig ignorant for not knowing what a "half and half" or a "Lawson" is?

I'm afraid you're out of step with the cool kids, now you're living out in deepest Brexitshire.
FPT re the Essex-Suffolk border, I once went out with a girl from Nayland.

That sounds like the start of a limerick. Nayland is very nice, but since it is in Suffolk, it is clearly not in the Suffolk-Essex borders, which is only found in north Essex. Everything north of the border is south Suffolk.

There once was a girl from Nayland
Who worked as a fitter for Leyland
When she left my life
She ran off with my wife.
Now I’m all alone in this grey land.

ManchesterKurt said:

Endillion said:

ManchesterKurt said:

Endillion said:

ManchesterKurt said:

Endillion said:

SandyRentool said:

HYUFD said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Tate Britain defends job ad for £40k 'head of coffee'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-51310516

Seems rather low paid for London to me....

Yet curators average only £37 500 in London.

The average London salary is £700 a month ie £36 400

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/economy-business/work-incomes/constituency-data-wages/

And yet the Daily Mail tells us that folk on £100k are "Middle Class".

Well, as opposed to what?

Where the 'middle' is ?

I wouldn't say people on £100k are the epitome of middle class, but how else would you classify them, other than middle class?

Absolutely not the middle as that excuses them for not recognising that they are absolutely at the top end of income.

So upper / Top or anything other than middle as suggesting that is 'middle' makes them feel that they are not hugely privileged.

I think we're talking at crossed purposes here. Clearly it's an upper tier salary. My point is that it doesn't make a person "upper class".

I earn over 100k and live in London. I'm also mortgaged to the hilt on a 2 bed flat. I definitely am not anyone's idea of upper class, even by @kinabalu's weird description.

Earn £100k per year and you are upper anything to do with income.

Whatever conditions you try to justify not describing it as such.

My goodness, it's like talking to a wall.

Income is nothing to do with class. I'm talking specifically about class.

DecrepiterJohnL said:

Sandpit said:

Theuniondivvie said:

I believe Morris Dancer likes a coin? Better snap up a gold 50p piece before the sovvy ring brigade snaffle them all.

https://twitter.com/Feorlean/status/1222806123935346692?s=20

How much does it weigh?

I’m gonna take a random guess that the price isn’t a million miles away from today’s gold price.

I'm going to take a random guess that it is at least 10 times its scrap value as gold. The whole point is to make a profit from collectors and you can't do that buy selling below cost.

A little research suggests half an ounce of gold in a 50p piece, so about £605 of gold at today’s price.

https://www.bullionbypost.co.uk/gold-coins/uk-currency-coins/gold-fifty-pence-piece/

Also, the Brexit gold coin is limited to 1,500 pieces, so will have future collectible value as a coin.

Endillion said:

ManchesterKurt said:

Endillion said:

ManchesterKurt said:

Endillion said:

SandyRentool said:

HYUFD said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Tate Britain defends job ad for £40k 'head of coffee'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-51310516

Seems rather low paid for London to me....

Yet curators average only £37 500 in London.

The average London salary is £700 a month ie £36 400

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/economy-business/work-incomes/constituency-data-wages/

And yet the Daily Mail tells us that folk on £100k are "Middle Class".

Well, as opposed to what?

Where the 'middle' is ?

I wouldn't say people on £100k are the epitome of middle class, but how else would you classify them, other than middle class?

Absolutely not the middle as that excuses them for not recognising that they are absolutely at the top end of income.

So upper / Top or anything other than middle as suggesting that is 'middle' makes them feel that they are not hugely privileged.

I think we're talking at crossed purposes here. Clearly it's an upper tier salary. My point is that it doesn't make a person "upper class".

I earn over 100k and live in London. I'm also mortgaged to the hilt on a 2 bed flat. I definitely am not anyone's idea of upper class, even by @kinabalu's weird description.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9tXBC-71aZs

Endillion said:

ManchesterKurt said:

Endillion said:

ManchesterKurt said:

Endillion said:

SandyRentool said:

HYUFD said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Tate Britain defends job ad for £40k 'head of coffee'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-51310516

Seems rather low paid for London to me....

Yet curators average only £37 500 in London.

The average London salary is £700 a month ie £36 400

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/economy-business/work-incomes/constituency-data-wages/

And yet the Daily Mail tells us that folk on £100k are "Middle Class".

Well, as opposed to what?

Where the 'middle' is ?

I wouldn't say people on £100k are the epitome of middle class, but how else would you classify them, other than middle class?

Absolutely not the middle as that excuses them for not recognising that they are absolutely at the top end of income.

So upper / Top or anything other than middle as suggesting that is 'middle' makes them feel that they are not hugely privileged.

I think we're talking at crossed purposes here. Clearly it's an upper tier salary. My point is that it doesn't make a person "upper class".

I earn over 100k and live in London. I'm also mortgaged to the hilt on a 2 bed flat. I definitely am not anyone's idea of upper class, even by @kinabalu's weird description.

Accidentally watched an episode of Question Time recently, where there was spat between Richard Burgon and an audience member. Burgon said that anyone earning over £80k was well off, and the audience member said that he was lying; he earned that and wasn't, and that every solicitor or doctor earned more than that. Burgon said that when he practised a solicitor he earned half of that.

I didn't see/hear how it ended.

ManchesterKurt said:

Endillion said:

ManchesterKurt said:

Endillion said:

ManchesterKurt said:

Endillion said:

SandyRentool said:

HYUFD said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Tate Britain defends job ad for £40k 'head of coffee'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-51310516

Seems rather low paid for London to me....

Yet curators average only £37 500 in London.

The average London salary is £700 a month ie £36 400

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/economy-business/work-incomes/constituency-data-wages/

And yet the Daily Mail tells us that folk on £100k are "Middle Class".

Well, as opposed to what?

Where the 'middle' is ?

I wouldn't say people on £100k are the epitome of middle class, but how else would you classify them, other than middle class?

Absolutely not the middle as that excuses them for not recognising that they are absolutely at the top end of income.

So upper / Top or anything other than middle as suggesting that is 'middle' makes them feel that they are not hugely privileged.

I think we're talking at crossed purposes here. Clearly it's an upper tier salary. My point is that it doesn't make a person "upper class".

I earn over 100k and live in London. I'm also mortgaged to the hilt on a 2 bed flat. I definitely am not anyone's idea of upper class, even by @kinabalu's weird description.

Earn £100k per year and you are upper anything to do with income.

Whatever conditions you try to justify not describing it as such.

Upper income yes. That's not the phrase you used though is it?

logical_song said:

RobD said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

Sandpit said:

Theuniondivvie said:

I believe Morris Dancer likes a coin? Better snap up a gold 50p piece before the sovvy ring brigade snaffle them all.

https://twitter.com/Feorlean/status/1222806123935346692?s=20

How much does it weigh?

I’m gonna take a random guess that the price isn’t a million miles away from today’s gold price.

I'm going to take a random guess that it is at least 10 times its scrap value as gold. The whole point is to make a profit from collectors and you can't do that buy selling below cost.

15.5g of 22 carat gold is about £600.

A bit like the Lottery and DVLA selling personalised Number Plates - a voluntary tax.

I don't know what people are complaining about, there are far worse ways of wasting money, a lot of jewellery and luxury goods have much higher mark-ups.

glw said:

logical_song said:

RobD said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

Sandpit said:

Theuniondivvie said:

I believe Morris Dancer likes a coin? Better snap up a gold 50p piece before the sovvy ring brigade snaffle them all.

https://twitter.com/Feorlean/status/1222806123935346692?s=20

How much does it weigh?

I’m gonna take a random guess that the price isn’t a million miles away from today’s gold price.

I'm going to take a random guess that it is at least 10 times its scrap value as gold. The whole point is to make a profit from collectors and you can't do that buy selling below cost.

15.5g of 22 carat gold is about £600.

A bit like the Lottery and DVLA selling personalised Number Plates - a voluntary tax.

I don't know what people are complaining about, there are far worse ways of wasting money, a lot of jewellery and luxury goods have much higher mark-ups.

They might even strike one out of the 1500 with an oxford comma. That one would be worth a fortune.

HYUFD said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Theuniondivvie said:

Too late for the last, more appropriate thread.

https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1222871376111054848?s=20

https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1222871398516916224

So Scots oppose indyref2 even if the SNP won a majority in 2021, they do not want another one until at least 2025

Have to say I read "In 5 years" as within 5 years.

kinabalu said:

Endillion said:

I think we're talking at crossed purposes here. Clearly it's an upper tier salary. My point is that it doesn't make a person "upper class".

I earn over 100k and live in London. I'm also mortgaged to the hilt on a 2 bed flat. I definitely am not anyone's idea of upper class, even by @kinabalu's weird description.

Did I "do" you and you weren't happy with the outcome? Don't fully recall.

What I do recall is that @isam is a Provisional 9 (working class) but has yet to provide sufficient data for me to go Final on it.

I think I agreed with your assessment but couldn't see how you'd gotten there from your description of the system. Third generation white collar professional - which I claimed was a 12 and you seemed to think should be higher.

Sandpit said:

The Mail are good at finding people who “struggle” to “cope” on six figure salaries living in Surrey, what with the massive mortgage, three sets of SCHOOL FEES and the skiing holiday to pay for...

Indeed. These take up a big slice of income for many struggling affluents. Their removal would be tantamount to a massive middle class tax break. Much more left in pocket and available for holidays, cars, vintage wines, cashmere sweaters, whatever. This is why the elimination of private schools is not Class War but a genuine "win win" One Nation policy.

alterego said:

glw said:

logical_song said:

RobD said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

Sandpit said:

Theuniondivvie said:

I believe Morris Dancer likes a coin? Better snap up a gold 50p piece before the sovvy ring brigade snaffle them all.

https://twitter.com/Feorlean/status/1222806123935346692?s=20

How much does it weigh?

I’m gonna take a random guess that the price isn’t a million miles away from today’s gold price.

I'm going to take a random guess that it is at least 10 times its scrap value as gold. The whole point is to make a profit from collectors and you can't do that buy selling below cost.

15.5g of 22 carat gold is about £600.

A bit like the Lottery and DVLA selling personalised Number Plates - a voluntary tax.

I don't know what people are complaining about, there are far worse ways of wasting money, a lot of jewellery and luxury goods have much higher mark-ups.

What use of gold makes it worth what it is? Why do many world governments hoard it?

Its rarity.

rcs1000 said:

llef said:

good news for the UK's electric van maker Arrival

"UPS announced Wednesday investments in electric trucks, the testing of self-driving vans and the construction of a new “super hub” as part of its efforts to capitalize on the growth of e-commerce.

UPS, which sees electric vehicles as a key part of its sustainability efforts, will purchase 10,000 electric vehicles from U.K.-based startup Arrival and take a minority stake in the company. The financial details were not disclosed."

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/01/29/ups-is-eyeing-a-driverless-and-electric-future-for-its-fleet.html?__source=twitter|main

That's amazingly good news.

Very shrewd - ticks lots of boxes for (I suspect) not too much real risk investment.

Sandpit said:

kinabalu said:

Sandpit said:

The Mail are good at finding people who “struggle” to “cope” on six figure salaries living in Surrey, what with the massive mortgage, three sets of SCHOOL FEES and the skiing holiday to pay for...

Indeed. These take up a big slice of income for many struggling affluents. Their removal would be tantamount to a massive middle class tax break. Much more left in pocket and available for holidays, cars, vintage wines, cashmere sweaters, whatever. This is why the elimination of private schools is not Class War but a genuine "win win" One Nation policy.

Err, nope. It’ll all go on the mortgage to get in the right catchment area for the ‘good school’, as house prices in those areas increase drastically.

100% agreed.

For some reason people like kinablu expect all schools to be the same. Which would entail all teachers being the same. I always wonder if people with these views think so little of teachers they expect them to be mere identikit robots rather than have any humanity, skill, intelligence, empathy or other personal qualities that matter.

alterego said:

RobD said:

alterego said:

glw said:

logical_song said:

RobD said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

Sandpit said:

Theuniondivvie said:

I believe Morris Dancer likes a coin? Better snap up a gold 50p piece before the sovvy ring brigade snaffle them all.

https://twitter.com/Feorlean/status/1222806123935346692?s=20

How much does it weigh?

I’m gonna take a random guess that the price isn’t a million miles away from today’s gold price.

I'm going to take a random guess that it is at least 10 times its scrap value as gold. The whole point is to make a profit from collectors and you can't do that buy selling below cost.

15.5g of 22 carat gold is about £600.

A bit like the Lottery and DVLA selling personalised Number Plates - a voluntary tax.

I don't know what people are complaining about, there are far worse ways of wasting money, a lot of jewellery and luxury goods have much higher mark-ups.

What use of gold makes it worth what it is? Why do many world governments hoard it?

Its rarity.

My shit is rare - any offers?

I have my own stable supply, thanks.

Sandpit said:

kinabalu said:

Sandpit said:

The Mail are good at finding people who “struggle” to “cope” on six figure salaries living in Surrey, what with the massive mortgage, three sets of SCHOOL FEES and the skiing holiday to pay for...

Indeed. These take up a big slice of income for many struggling affluents. Their removal would be tantamount to a massive middle class tax break. Much more left in pocket and available for holidays, cars, vintage wines, cashmere sweaters, whatever. This is why the elimination of private schools is not Class War but a genuine "win win" One Nation policy.

Err, nope. It’ll all go on the mortgage to get in the right catchment area for the ‘good school’, as house prices in those areas increase drastically.

The Islington set proposing the abolition of private schooling have never seen what Alastair Campbell (and his missus) called a “Bog standard secondary”

How can you say that? We all know there must be bogs in Islington .....

Philip_Thompson said:

rcs1000 said:

llef said:

good news for the UK's electric van maker Arrival

"UPS announced Wednesday investments in electric trucks, the testing of self-driving vans and the construction of a new “super hub” as part of its efforts to capitalize on the growth of e-commerce.

UPS, which sees electric vehicles as a key part of its sustainability efforts, will purchase 10,000 electric vehicles from U.K.-based startup Arrival and take a minority stake in the company. The financial details were not disclosed."

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/01/29/ups-is-eyeing-a-driverless-and-electric-future-for-its-fleet.html?__source=twitter|main

That's amazingly good news.

Never heard of them before but that's fantastic.

Russian billionaire startup, with recent investment form Korean manufacturers. Promising.

OldKingCole said:

Endillion said:

ManchesterKurt said:

Endillion said:

ManchesterKurt said:

Endillion said:

SandyRentool said:

HYUFD said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Tate Britain defends job ad for £40k 'head of coffee'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-51310516

Seems rather low paid for London to me....

Yet curators average only £37 500 in London.

The average London salary is £700 a month ie £36 400

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/economy-business/work-incomes/constituency-data-wages/

And yet the Daily Mail tells us that folk on £100k are "Middle Class".

Well, as opposed to what?

Where the 'middle' is ?

I wouldn't say people on £100k are the epitome of middle class, but how else would you classify them, other than middle class?

Absolutely not the middle as that excuses them for not recognising that they are absolutely at the top end of income.

So upper / Top or anything other than middle as suggesting that is 'middle' makes them feel that they are not hugely privileged.

I think we're talking at crossed purposes here. Clearly it's an upper tier salary. My point is that it doesn't make a person "upper class".

I earn over 100k and live in London. I'm also mortgaged to the hilt on a 2 bed flat. I definitely am not anyone's idea of upper class, even by @kinabalu's weird description.

Accidentally watched an episode of Question Time recently, where there was spat between Richard Burgon and an audience member. Burgon said that anyone earning over £80k was well off, and the audience member said that he was lying; he earned that and wasn't, and that every solicitor or doctor earned more than that. Burgon said that when he practised a solicitor he earned half of that.

I didn't see/hear how it ended.

TBF, who would pick Burgon for their lawyer ?

kinabalu said:

Sandpit said:

Err, nope. It’ll all go on the mortgage to get in the right catchment area for the ‘good school’, as house prices in those areas increase drastically.

The Islington set proposing the abolition of private schooling have never seen what Alastair Campbell (and his missus) called a “Bog standard secondary”

You are trying to nitpick your way out of a policy that you instinctively dislike because it has a "politics of envy" feel to it. I'm used to this.

If you're used to it, maybe you should engage in less politics of envy?

Endillion said:

alterego said:

RobD said:

alterego said:

glw said:

logical_song said:

RobD said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

Sandpit said:

Theuniondivvie said:

I believe Morris Dancer likes a coin? Better snap up a gold 50p piece before the sovvy ring brigade snaffle them all.

https://twitter.com/Feorlean/status/1222806123935346692?s=20

How much does it weigh?

I’m gonna take a random guess that the price isn’t a million miles away from today’s gold price.

I'm going to take a random guess that it is at least 10 times its scrap value as gold. The whole point is to make a profit from collectors and you can't do that buy selling below cost.

15.5g of 22 carat gold is about £600.

A bit like the Lottery and DVLA selling personalised Number Plates - a voluntary tax.

I don't know what people are complaining about, there are far worse ways of wasting money, a lot of jewellery and luxury goods have much higher mark-ups.

What use of gold makes it worth what it is? Why do many world governments hoard it?

Its rarity.

My shit is rare - any offers?

Does it come in "brilliant uncirculated"?

I don't know about brilliant but it's definitely uncirculated at source

Nigelb said:

OldKingCole said:

Endillion said:

ManchesterKurt said:

Endillion said:

ManchesterKurt said:

Endillion said:

SandyRentool said:

HYUFD said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Tate Britain defends job ad for £40k 'head of coffee'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-51310516

Seems rather low paid for London to me....

Yet curators average only £37 500 in London.

The average London salary is £700 a month ie £36 400

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/economy-business/work-incomes/constituency-data-wages/

And yet the Daily Mail tells us that folk on £100k are "Middle Class".

Well, as opposed to what?

Where the 'middle' is ?

I wouldn't say people on £100k are the epitome of middle class, but how else would you classify them, other than middle class?

Absolutely not the middle as that excuses them for not recognising that they are absolutely at the top end of income.

So upper / Top or anything other than middle as suggesting that is 'middle' makes them feel that they are not hugely privileged.

I think we're talking at crossed purposes here. Clearly it's an upper tier salary. My point is that it doesn't make a person "upper class".

I earn over 100k and live in London. I'm also mortgaged to the hilt on a 2 bed flat. I definitely am not anyone's idea of upper class, even by @kinabalu's weird description.

Accidentally watched an episode of Question Time recently, where there was spat between Richard Burgon and an audience member. Burgon said that anyone earning over £80k was well off, and the audience member said that he was lying; he earned that and wasn't, and that every solicitor or doctor earned more than that. Burgon said that when he practised a solicitor he earned half of that.

I didn't see/hear how it ended.

TBF, who would pick Burgon for their lawyer ?

Who would pick Burgon as a garden gnome? Hold on .....

Philip_Thompson said:

If you're used to it, maybe you should engage in less politics of envy?

Hmm, but that's easier said than done because that label - or Class War - tends to get attached to any idea which has a halfway decent chance of diversifying wealth and opportunity away from those on the right side of our current MO to those on the wrong side of it.

Nigelb said:

OldKingCole said:

Endillion said:

ManchesterKurt said:

Endillion said:

ManchesterKurt said:

Endillion said:

SandyRentool said:

HYUFD said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Tate Britain defends job ad for £40k 'head of coffee'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-51310516

Seems rather low paid for London to me....

Yet curators average only £37 500 in London.

The average London salary is £700 a month ie £36 400

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/economy-business/work-incomes/constituency-data-wages/

And yet the Daily Mail tells us that folk on £100k are "Middle Class".

Well, as opposed to what?

Where the 'middle' is ?

I wouldn't say people on £100k are the epitome of middle class, but how else would you classify them, other than middle class?

Absolutely not the middle as that excuses them for not recognising that they are absolutely at the top end of income.

So upper / Top or anything other than middle as suggesting that is 'middle' makes them feel that they are not hugely privileged.

I think we're talking at crossed purposes here. Clearly it's an upper tier salary. My point is that it doesn't make a person "upper class".

I earn over 100k and live in London. I'm also mortgaged to the hilt on a 2 bed flat. I definitely am not anyone's idea of upper class, even by @kinabalu's weird description.

Accidentally watched an episode of Question Time recently, where there was spat between Richard Burgon and an audience member. Burgon said that anyone earning over £80k was well off, and the audience member said that he was lying; he earned that and wasn't, and that every solicitor or doctor earned more than that. Burgon said that when he practised a solicitor he earned half of that.

I didn't see/hear how it ended.

TBF, who would pick Burgon for their lawyer ?

I did wonder. Might say more about Burgon than he realised.

rcs1000 said:

logical_song said:

RobD said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

Sandpit said:

Theuniondivvie said:

I believe Morris Dancer likes a coin? Better snap up a gold 50p piece before the sovvy ring brigade snaffle them all.

https://twitter.com/Feorlean/status/1222806123935346692?s=20

How much does it weigh?

I’m gonna take a random guess that the price isn’t a million miles away from today’s gold price.

I'm going to take a random guess that it is at least 10 times its scrap value as gold. The whole point is to make a profit from collectors and you can't do that buy selling below cost.

15.5g of 22 carat gold is about £600.

A bit like the Lottery and DVLA selling personalised Number Plates - a voluntary tax.

In California, the DMV allows you have whatever plate you like (so long as no-one else has it) for just $30 more year.

I wanted rcs1000, but my wife said "no".

You only have one car? How very un-American.

AlastairMeeks said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Tate Britain defends job ad for £40k 'head of coffee'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-51310516

Seems rather low paid for London to me....

This morning I went into an independent coffee shop and was confronted with a menu with a string of items that I hadn't heard of. Am I pig ignorant for not knowing what a "half and half" or a "Lawson" is?

Does the “Lawson*” come with a “big bang” and a “boom” a few minutes later?

(*If it’s the other one, maybe you just wink at the camera and drizzle it over your breast instead)

Update on Trump's impeachment.
All signs point to an acquital vote by Saturday morning.

kinabalu said:

Philip_Thompson said:

For some reason people like kinablu expect all schools to be the same. Which would entail all teachers being the same. I always wonder if people with these views think so little of teachers they expect them to be mere identikit robots rather than have any humanity, skill, intelligence, empathy or other personal qualities that matter.

Not at all. This is really not where I'm coming from. I want all schools to be the same (and high) STANDARD. Not 100% possible, of course, but this should be the goal to work towards. It does not mean the same. I'm off analogies atm but just to use one here which is apt. There are different ways to skin a cat - this is so true that it's become a saying - but the end result (if done well and properly) will look broadly similar.

That only works if you’re in favour of what the Americans call “busing” in the meantime.

Each child in London gets assigned to a random school in London, and is provided with transport to get there. No exceptions, and no discussions between parents and schools in advance of admission.

You’re in favour of this, or are you in favour of allowing the already wealthy to keep the catchment areas around their own excellent state schools?

speedy2 said:

Update on Trump's impeachment.
All signs point to an acquital vote by Saturday morning.

Just in time for his State of the Union address due Tuesday night

Theuniondivvie said:

Endillion said:

alterego said:

RobD said:

alterego said:

glw said:

logical_song said:

RobD said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

Sandpit said:

Theuniondivvie said:

I believe Morris Dancer likes a coin? Better snap up a gold 50p piece before the sovvy ring brigade snaffle them all.

https://twitter.com/Feorlean/status/1222806123935346692?s=20

How much does it weigh?

I’m gonna take a random guess that the price isn’t a million miles away from today’s gold price.

I'm going to take a random guess that it is at least 10 times its scrap value as gold. The whole point is to make a profit from collectors and you can't do that buy selling below cost.

15.5g of 22 carat gold is about £600.

A bit like the Lottery and DVLA selling personalised Number Plates - a voluntary tax.

I don't know what people are complaining about, there are far worse ways of wasting money, a lot of jewellery and luxury goods have much higher mark-ups.

What use of gold makes it worth what it is? Why do many world governments hoard it?

Its rarity.

My shit is rare - any offers?

Does it come in "brilliant uncirculated"?

Polished at least..

You seem very excited.

How many times have you ‘polished’ your own ‘coin’ over that opinion poll this afternoon so far?

kinabalu said:

Philip_Thompson said:

If you're used to it, maybe you should engage in less politics of envy?

Hmm, but that's easier said than done because that label - or Class War - tends to get attached to any idea which has a halfway decent chance of diversifying wealth and opportunity away from those on the right side of our current MO to those on the wrong side of it.

I'll just repost this from the previous thread about the Guardian's video on abolition:

Utterly bonkers.

For the Left to threaten private education provokes the same kind of emotional reaction as if the Right were threatening the NHS. You're going to get nuclear-level pushback for minimal political gain. Want a Tory vote stuck at 40%+ indefinitely? Then have Labour push spiteful class war policies like this one.

marke0903 said:

speedy2 said:

Update on Trump's impeachment.
All signs point to an acquital vote by Saturday morning.

Just in time for his State of the Union address due Tuesday night

And the Iowa caucuses on Monday night

Man convicted of trying to steal Magna Carta from Salisbury Cathedral

Sandpit said:

kinabalu said:

Philip_Thompson said:

For some reason people like kinablu expect all schools to be the same. Which would entail all teachers being the same. I always wonder if people with these views think so little of teachers they expect them to be mere identikit robots rather than have any humanity, skill, intelligence, empathy or other personal qualities that matter.

Not at all. This is really not where I'm coming from. I want all schools to be the same (and high) STANDARD. Not 100% possible, of course, but this should be the goal to work towards. It does not mean the same. I'm off analogies atm but just to use one here which is apt. There are different ways to skin a cat - this is so true that it's become a saying - but the end result (if done well and properly) will look broadly similar.

That only works if you’re in favour of what the Americans call “busing” in the meantime.

Each child in London gets assigned to a random school in London, and is provided with transport to get there. No exceptions, and no discussions between parents and schools in advance of admission.

You’re in favour of this, or are you in favour of allowing the already wealthy to keep the catchment areas around their own excellent state schools?

It is an absolutely rubbish argument, you may as well ban Marks and Spencer and Waitrose and bus all customers to their nearest Lidl or Asda (and at least private schools provide scholarships and bursaries).

In any case vouchers are now more in favour from Sweden to the US to allow real choice not one size fits all

Nigelb said:

Philip_Thompson said:

rcs1000 said:

llef said:

good news for the UK's electric van maker Arrival

"UPS announced Wednesday investments in electric trucks, the testing of self-driving vans and the construction of a new “super hub” as part of its efforts to capitalize on the growth of e-commerce.

UPS, which sees electric vehicles as a key part of its sustainability efforts, will purchase 10,000 electric vehicles from U.K.-based startup Arrival and take a minority stake in the company. The financial details were not disclosed."

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/01/29/ups-is-eyeing-a-driverless-and-electric-future-for-its-fleet.html?__source=twitter|main

That's amazingly good news.

Never heard of them before but that's fantastic.

Russian billionaire startup, with recent investment form Korean manufacturers. Promising.

There had been a degree of scepticism in the EV space about them, as they had been very good at showing renders of their vehicles, but didn't have a single preproduction demo vehicle.

kinabalu said:

OldKingCole said:

One of the issues that schools face is that different classes or year groups are different. One lot will be generally studious and biddable, the next year's more rowdy.
All the teachers in my family ...... and there are lots, of different age.......have told me the same.

Yes. All makes for a very difficult job. One that adds real value too. If I was Schools Czar, I would up the pay, plus higher pay for the "harder" environments, make it a high status, difficult to get into profession - like medicine - and then I would allow absolutely loads of autonomy at individual school level. All state schools but no heavy hand of the state. Let those teachers teach. Every child goes to a high quality state school that's close to them. And given other policies will "level up" regions and areas, this means that every child, regardless of parental means, has at least a reasonably equal shot at entering adulthood with a following wind. The best of all things in the best of all possible worlds. Ah bisto.

What does "loads of autonomy" mean with respect to the schools in Birmingham who don't want to cover certain aspects of the current SRE curriculum?

rcs1000 said:

Nigelb said:

Philip_Thompson said:

rcs1000 said:

llef said:

good news for the UK's electric van maker Arrival

"UPS announced Wednesday investments in electric trucks, the testing of self-driving vans and the construction of a new “super hub” as part of its efforts to capitalize on the growth of e-commerce.

UPS, which sees electric vehicles as a key part of its sustainability efforts, will purchase 10,000 electric vehicles from U.K.-based startup Arrival and take a minority stake in the company. The financial details were not disclosed."

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/01/29/ups-is-eyeing-a-driverless-and-electric-future-for-its-fleet.html?__source=twitter|main

That's amazingly good news.

Never heard of them before but that's fantastic.

Russian billionaire startup, with recent investment form Korean manufacturers. Promising.

There had been a degree of scepticism in the EV space about them, as they had been very good at showing renders of their vehicles, but didn't have a single preproduction demo vehicle.

I’d never heard of them before today either, which surprised me.

How much of today’s announcement is an actual order for actual vehicles, and how much is investment by UPS to get the tech to market?

Endillion said:

What does "loads of autonomy" mean with respect to the schools in Birmingham who don't want to cover certain aspects of the current SRE curriculum?

Ah, indeed. No, not on that sort of thing. They will have to abide by our core principles of respect for all.

rcs1000 said:

Nigelb said:

Philip_Thompson said:

rcs1000 said:

llef said:

good news for the UK's electric van maker Arrival

"UPS announced Wednesday investments in electric trucks, the testing of self-driving vans and the construction of a new “super hub” as part of its efforts to capitalize on the growth of e-commerce.

UPS, which sees electric vehicles as a key part of its sustainability efforts, will purchase 10,000 electric vehicles from U.K.-based startup Arrival and take a minority stake in the company. The financial details were not disclosed."

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/01/29/ups-is-eyeing-a-driverless-and-electric-future-for-its-fleet.html?__source=twitter|main

That's amazingly good news.

Never heard of them before but that's fantastic.

Russian billionaire startup, with recent investment form Korean manufacturers. Promising.

There had been a degree of scepticism in the EV space about them, as they had been very good at showing renders of their vehicles, but didn't have a single preproduction demo vehicle.

" It now has 800 employees in the UK, Europe, and the United States. It has developed the skateboard that serves as a foundation for its vehicles in-house and says it can design new models for as little as £100 million whereas other companies require an investment of £1 billion or more to do the same thing. Gaining access to the manufacturing technology is one of the benefits Hyundai and KIA will get from their investment."
https://cleantechnica.com/2020/01/21/hyundai-kia-invest-in-uk-electric-van-maker-arrival/

I think this is code from the new Speaker that the peerage for John Bercow can go do one:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-51311862

It seems the UK and US have agreed a truce over Huawei:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-51313481

One doesn’t half wonder if this is all carefully choreographed sometimes.

It very probably is.

kinabalu said:

Philip_Thompson said:

Maybe stop trying to diversify wealth away from anyone then and instead try and enable others to grow their own wealth?

That sounds like a folksy piece of "give a man a fish?" type sentiment. You can't have all winners, I'm afraid. You can't make a serious dent in inequality without being prepared to remove unfair advantage from those who currently have it. To govern is to choose.

What you have said is obviously true, but that is because you have focused on inequality while Mr Thompson is talking about poverty.

You also seem to assume that everyone else has the same definition of unfair advantage as you do.

Casino_Royale said:

I see it differently.

I favour maximising diversity and choice in the education sector, because it’s by that mechanism that we encourage innovation and flexibility so we can raise overall education standards for the maximum number of child as high as possible as broadly as possible.

Fair enough. But that is to accept that parental financial muscle will play a big role in a child's schooling. It allows people who can afford it to buy a "better start in life" for their kids compared to others. They can - and will - do that anyway in other ways but this is to allow money to talk in educational matters too. It's important to be honest about this. You are prioritizing diversity and choice (for some) - and the right of every freeborn Englishman to spend his or her hard earned (or otherwise) money as they see fit - above equal opportunities. It's a VALUE judgement you have made and I make the opposite one. No right or wrong. Difference in values. We could talk about this for ever and that would always be where we end up. I know this because I have often done it.

kinabalu said:

Casino_Royale said:

I see it differently.

I favour maximising diversity and choice in the education sector, because it’s by that mechanism that we encourage innovation and flexibility so we can raise overall education standards for the maximum number of child as high as possible as broadly as possible.

Fair enough. But that is to accept that parental financial muscle will play a big role in a child's schooling. It allows people who can afford it to buy a "better start in life" for their kids compared to others. They can - and will - do that anyway in other ways but this is to allow money to talk in educational matters too. It's important to be honest about this. You are prioritizing diversity and choice (for some) - and the right of every freeborn Englishman to spend his or her hard earned (or otherwise) money as they see fit - above equal opportunities. It's a VALUE judgement you have made and I make the opposite one. No right or wrong. Difference in values. We could talk about this for ever and that would always be where we end up. I know this because I have often done it.

No right or wrong? Perhaps. But one side definitely suits the British character, whereas the other ... does not.

I'm (sort of) following the education discussion and wondering how Ydoethyr has got on with his interview.

Sandpit said:

kinabalu said:

Casino_Royale said:

I see it differently.

I favour maximising diversity and choice in the education sector, because it’s by that mechanism that we encourage innovation and flexibility so we can raise overall education standards for the maximum number of child as high as possible as broadly as possible.

Fair enough. But that is to accept that parental financial muscle will play a big role in a child's schooling. It allows people who can afford it to buy a "better start in life" for their kids compared to others. They can - and will - do that anyway in other ways but this is to allow money to talk in educational matters too. It's important to be honest about this. You are prioritizing diversity and choice (for some) - and the right of every freeborn Englishman to spend his or her hard earned (or otherwise) money as they see fit - above equal opportunities. It's a VALUE judgement you have made and I make the opposite one. No right or wrong. Difference in values. We could talk about this for ever and that would always be where we end up. I know this because I have often done it.

So, you’re in favour of “busing”?

He is in favour of communism, just starting off with education