Any attempt to limit it to a manageable length to make it meaningful?
Have not heard of - let alone watched - most of them - but Green Wing, 2012 (and its follow up W1A) and Gomorrah should be on that list.
PEAKY ******* BLINDERS!!!!
Skins, love island (bleurgh), This Week
Coupling. It's a shit list really
Any such list is going to be flawed, and a matter of taste (and there's much on there the leaves me cold), but I was interested what outstanding series that I hadn't seen might have been missed off.
snip The centre is much more promising, since it's being vacated from both ends. If anything the Tory end feels more like a permanent abandonment of the centre than the Labour end.
I tried to post a comment saying this but Vanilla didn't play ball.
The strategy is about expanding across the centre (something I've been trying to argue with the sandalistas for years).
People who want to revoke without a referendum vote LibDem. People who want to revoke with a referendum vote Green. People who don't like Brexit but have always voted Labour and don't watch the news much vote Labour.
People who want to leave with a deal, leave without a deal, leave with a deal but not this one, and people who have always voted Conservative and don't watch the news much vote Conservative.
Agreed.
I am in now way a green voter or a fan of Lucas but she is totally correct in what she says.. Its one thing to cancel brexit through a referendum but a totally different one to just ignore the referendum..
I suspect this shift to revoke won't have the electoral advantage the LDs think it will.. It may solidify their vote in the remain heartlands of London, Bristol and Cambridge but will play badly in the shires and northern towns.. There are not that many ultra remain constituencies don't forget so they have really backed themselves into a corner with this policy
Yes I think you're right. Although I'm a committed remainer I am uncomfortable about the idea of reversing the process without another referendum. However, the fact that the LDs have adopted this policy and Labour is now clearly in favour of another referendum (even if it is not entirely clear about the options) shows an unmistakable direction of travel - Brexit is not a done deal and the forces pushing back against it are becoming bolder and more confident.
It's also a factor in voting patterns etc, the comfortably off demonize the poor for voting leave (in broad terms and for example) without having any clue as to the experience of living a breadline life and how that shapes views
And they shouldn't do that. Demonize. But it begs an interesting question -
If you genuinely think that someone's view is being informed by ignorance and xenophobia, should you pull punches on account of the person being poor?
IMO, yes you should. But not to the extent of a complete airbrushing.
Trump is unlikely to win reelection for many reasons.
Yet another reason is that he did get lucky in 2016.
Trump had a 30% chance of winning last time and rolled a five. *IF* everything goes well for him in the coming year he will still only be in the 30-40% range, and he will once again need to get a lucky die roll.
I don't see the logic of this - he is the incumbent, the economy is doing reasonably well, he has delivered on the immigration front and there is no reason for the religious right to abandon him. Look at his rallies and how many are turning up. Then look at his likely Democratic opponents. If he gets Warren, she will be dogged by "Pochahontas" and whether she lied or not about her heritage; the "Sleepy Joe" tag will likelwise be a killer for Biden while Sanders will come across as a crochety old Grandpa.
I mean, Bush Sr was more popular than Trump and he didn't get reelected. Granted, the economy wasn't doing great and the GOP had had 3 terms in the WH, but I think Trump is very unpopular despite the good economy. Obviously partisanship is a big factor, with 80-90% of GOP members thinking he is doing a good job, but if the economy is inflating his personal ratings and the economy does get worse (as many think it will) then he could easily go further down to only those who really like him.
People who want to revoke without a referendum vote LibDem. People who want to revoke with a referendum vote Green. People who don't like Brexit but have always voted Labour and don't watch the news much vote Labour.
People who want to leave with a deal, leave without a deal, leave with a deal but not this one, and people who have always voted Conservative and don't watch the news much vote Conservative.
Agreed.
I am in now way a green voter or a fan of Lucas but she is totally correct in what she says.. Its one thing to cancel brexit through a referendum but a totally different one to just ignore the referendum..
I suspect this shift to revoke won't have the electoral advantage the LDs think it will.. It may solidify their vote in the remain heartlands of London, Bristol and Cambridge but will play badly in the shires and northern towns.. There are not that many ultra remain constituencies don't forget so they have really backed themselves into a corner with this policy
Yes I think you're right. Although I'm a committed remainer I am uncomfortable about the idea of reversing the process without another referendum. However, the fact that the LDs have adopted this policy and Labour is now clearly in favour of another referendum (even if it is not entirely clear about the options) shows an unmistakable direction of travel - Brexit is not a done deal and the forces pushing back against it are becoming bolder and more confident.
To use a metaphor, Brexiteers have been taking a sledgehammer to a reinforced concrete wall. They've created a few cracks, but don't have an plans on what to replace it with.
Remainers are now starting to try to relieve them of the sledgehammer and patch up the wall.
"People who don't like Brexit but have always voted Labour and don't watch the news much vote Labour."
This is an absolubtely massive vote block, and just a big a problem for Boris in the north as it is for the Lib Dems in the south. You could sell almost anything to these people with a red rosette on and they'd buy it.
That’s because it’s not about policy, it’s about identity.
Because the LibDems are second (and some close second) in way more Con seats than Lab seats they focus in the short term gain from Cons.
The long term electoral benefit for the LibDems of the current political situation is the possibility of replacing Lab as the main party of the left.
While it is a fine LibDem tradition to be all things to all people, they will find they are unable to achieve the long term ambition of becoming the largest party of the left while aiming to dislodge Cons where LibDems are in second place.
The offer (strategy and mindset) to the electorate for each of these is different. To be the main party of the left, you have to usurp the current occupant of the position, Lab. That requires a defined and specific approach.
LibDems have to decide which they think is the best route to the main party of the left, if that is the goal they have, and focus relentlessly on it.
Replacing Labour as the long-term party of the left would be a long-term project, and it's unlikely Corbyn will stick around for long enough to let them do it.
The centre is much more promising, since it's being vacated from both ends. If anything the Tory end feels more like a permanent abandonment of the centre than the Labour end.
I doubt that a BJ manifesto will be chock a block full of right wing ideology. But then, I am nearly always wrong, so time (if he lasts as Con leader to a manifesto writing stage) will tell.
There are more easy Con gains to be made, that is true and therefore tempting. Problem is as the Cons track back to the centre at some stage they are the easier gains for the Cons, thus to retain them the LibDems have to track right, which loses an possibility of replacing Lab on the left. It is easy and potentially short term.
Corbyn may not remain, but I have lost track of where the party machine is on the spectrum, but I anticipate hearing it is well to the left in its composition than it was 5 years ago. Corbyn moving on is not a blank cheque for a more moderate or electable option.
It's also a factor in voting patterns etc, the comfortably off demonize the poor for voting leave (in broad terms and for example) without having any clue as to the experience of living a breadline life and how that shapes views
And they shouldn't do that. Demonize. But it begs an interesting question -
If you genuinely think that someone's view is being informed by ignorance and xenophobia, should you pull punches on account of the person being poor?
IMO, yes you should. But not to the extent of a complete airbrushing.
Yeah I'd agree there. It should be about working out why a poorer lifestyle might lead to those views and what that says about how we run the country and treat areas of poverty
"People who don't like Brexit but have always voted Labour and don't watch the news much vote Labour."
This is an absolubtely massive vote block, and just a big a problem for Boris in the north as it is for the Lib Dems in the south. You could sell almost anything to these people with a red rosette on and they'd buy it.
That’s because it’s not about policy, it’s about identity.
Which is good news, because that sort of cloth cap working class solidarity type identity is literally dying out.
Trouble is, at some point the LibDems will need to hold their noses and choose between normally unpalatable options. Right now, they must canvass support for themselves and their policies. The day after polling day, once the votes have been counted, hard choices will need to be made.
Strikes me that Swinson is going in loud and leery against Corbyn in order to maximize the LD votes to be picked up from moderate pro-remain tories who cannot abide the softhead populist direction that Johnson/Cummings - and the members TBF - are taking the Cons in.
And I wish her well in this - because it works for Labour too.
The Lib Dems policy on Brexit is an issue now - not because it's so far materially different to another referendum on a deal vs remain but because they can't have any complaints if the Tories run on a platform of unilaterally re-invoking A50 to leave even after another referendum. In essence it sets up Brexit for a long long long term battle which the remain side will have to constantly keep winning every GE.
People who want to revoke without a referendum vote LibDem. People who want to revoke with a referendum vote Green. People who don't like Brexit but have always voted Labour and don't watch the news much vote Labour.
People who want to leave with a deal, leave without a deal, leave with a deal but not this one, and people who have always voted Conservative and don't watch the news much vote Conservative.
Agreed.
I am in now way a green voter or a fan of Lucas but she is totally correct in what she says.. Its one thing to cancel brexit through a referendum but a totally different one to just ignore the referendum..
I suspect this shift to revoke won't have the electoral advantage the LDs think it will.. It may solidify their vote in the remain heartlands of London, Bristol and Cambridge but will play badly in the shires and northern towns.. There are not that many ultra remain constituencies don't forget so they have really backed themselves into a corner with this policy
Yes I think you're right. Although I'm a committed remainer I am uncomfortable about the idea of reversing the process without another referendum. However, the fact that the LDs have adopted this policy and Labour is now clearly in favour of another referendum (even if it is not entirely clear about the options) shows an unmistakable direction of travel - Brexit is not a done deal and the forces pushing back against it are becoming bolder and more confident.
To use a metaphor, Brexiteers have been taking a sledgehammer to a reinforced concrete wall. They've created a few cracks, but don't have an plans on what to replace it with.
Remainers are now starting to try to relieve them of the sledgehammer and patch up the wall.
Over the past couple of weeks the Brexiteers made a powerful bomb with which to blow up the wall but it exploded prematurely causing severe damage to their own side whilst leaving the wall pretty much untouched.
People who want to revoke without a referendum vote LibDem. People who want to revoke with a referendum vote Green. People who don't like Brexit but have always voted Labour and don't watch the news much vote Labour.
People who want to leave with a deal, leave without a deal, leave with a deal but not this one, and people who have always voted Conservative and don't watch the news much vote Conservative.
Interesting. Caroline Lucas can feel the surge. She'd be a loss to the coalition of the Remainers though
The Lib Dems won't contest Brighton Pavilion (they didn't last time either). It's just posturing over how the "Remain Alliance" will work in practice. As @dyedwoolie points out, outside of Wales it just means the Greens stepping aside for the Lib Dems. In Wales, it still means the Greens stepping aside, it's just less clear who for.
Lib Dems only really have 7 realistic Labour targets but 43 Tory ones varying from hopeful to a bit unrealistic.
I think the Lib Dem policy is likely to work better in the former than the latter .
Until we have some new polling then we’re not really going to see whether it was a misjudged change of policy .
In reality , only Sheffield Hallam is likely to be at risk.
Not Leeds NW ?
I live 10 mins walk from the middle of Headingley. The Lib Dems have always had a following in Leeds North West but Headingley and some of the outer suburbs of Leeds NW have turned increasingly Labour over the past decade and there's been no sign of a revival in the May elections just gone. I don't think the LDs will regain it. Otley is still strongly LD but Alex Sobel is a popular and active local MP and I think he'll be gaining a decent personal vote.
Lib Dems only really have 7 realistic Labour targets but 43 Tory ones varying from hopeful to a bit unrealistic.
I think the Lib Dem policy is likely to work better in the former than the latter .
Until we have some new polling then we’re not really going to see whether it was a misjudged change of policy .
In reality , only Sheffield Hallam is likely to be at risk.
Not Leeds NW ?
Jo was asked yesterday what her strategy was for winning in the north of England. Just just wibbled. Don't expect the LDs to make any progress north of Sheff Hallam.
People who want to revoke without a referendum vote LibDem. People who want to revoke with a referendum vote Green. People who don't like Brexit but have always voted Labour and don't watch the news much vote Labour.
People who want to leave with a deal, leave without a deal, leave with a deal but not this one, and people who have always voted Conservative and don't watch the news much vote Conservative.
Remarkable that none of those 2017 Lab/Gen/LD voters knew what they were voting for.
"People who don't like Brexit but have always voted Labour and don't watch the news much vote Labour."
This is an absolubtely massive vote block, and just a big a problem for Boris in the north as it is for the Lib Dems in the south. You could sell almost anything to these people with a red rosette on and they'd buy it.
That’s because it’s not about policy, it’s about identity.
Which is good news, because that sort of cloth cap working class solidarity type identity is literally dying out.
Lib Dems only really have 7 realistic Labour targets but 43 Tory ones varying from hopeful to a bit unrealistic.
I think the Lib Dem policy is likely to work better in the former than the latter .
Until we have some new polling then we’re not really going to see whether it was a misjudged change of policy .
In reality , only Sheffield Hallam is likely to be at risk.
Not Leeds NW ?
Jo was asked yesterday what her strategy was for winning in the north of England. Just just wibbled. Don't expect the LDs to make any progress north of Sheff Hallam.
Do you think Berwick possibly close if Brexit party does well ?
Just catching up on.th Guardian comment.. what the hell was the Guardian editor thinking.. must have takem leave of their senses.. ir is political knee in the goolies just the overrinding thiught orocess even if Cameron is no longer PM?
It's also a factor in voting patterns etc, the comfortably off demonize the poor for voting leave (in broad terms and for example) without having any clue as to the experience of living a breadline life and how that shapes views
And they shouldn't do that. Demonize. But it begs an interesting question -
If you genuinely think that someone's view is being informed by ignorance and xenophobia, should you pull punches on account of the person being poor?
IMO, yes you should. But not to the extent of a complete airbrushing.
I once canvassed a bloke who said that he voted Tory because he only had time to read the Mail and they gave the impression that they were the only sensible choice: he apologised nicely for it and said he realised this was almost certainly a one-sided view, but he had a hectic life and he had to go on what little information he could pick up when glancing at the paper. I thought it was disarmingly honest and probably not worth canvass time to try to convert, so I just thanked him for explaining. I think there's more of that sort of attitude (among "always X" for any party) than we like to think - politics is a footnote for many people.
That said, there's Trotsky's sinisterly accurate comment: "You may not be interested in politics. But you will find that politics is interested in you..."
Just catching up on.th Guardian comment.. what the hell was the Guardian editor thinking.. must have takem leave of their senses.. ir is political knee in the goolies just the overrinding thiught orocess even if Cameron is no longer PM?
Someone should start a new thread for people who just want to discuss the bloody Guardian editorial.
Babylon Berlin, Ray Donovan and Mum kick the asses of a number of comparable shows on that list (apols if they're on there and I've missed them). edit: & Chernobyl.
Peaky Blinders is definitely the most overrated thing going currently.
It's also a factor in voting patterns etc, the comfortably off demonize the poor for voting leave (in broad terms and for example) without having any clue as to the experience of living a breadline life and how that shapes views
And they shouldn't do that. Demonize. But it begs an interesting question -
If you genuinely think that someone's view is being informed by ignorance and xenophobia, should you pull punches on account of the person being poor?
IMO, yes you should. But not to the extent of a complete airbrushing.
I once canvassed a bloke who said that he voted Tory because he only had time to read the Mail and they gave the impression that they were the only sensible choice: he apologised nicely for it and said he realised this was almost certainly a one-sided view, but he had a hectic life and he had to go on what little information he could pick up when glancing at the paper. I thought it was disarmingly honest and probably not worth canvass time to try to convert, so I just thanked him for explaining. I think there's more of that sort of attitude (among "always X" for any party) than we like to think - politics is a footnote for many people.
That said, there's Trotsky's sinisterly accurate comment: "You may not be interested in politics. But you will find that politics is interested in you..."
I’m amazed that there are still so many people who take newspapers seriously.
I doubt that a BJ manifesto will be chock a block full of right wing ideology. But then, I am nearly always wrong, so time (if he lasts as Con leader to a manifesto writing stage) will tell.
There are more easy Con gains to be made, that is true and therefore tempting. Problem is as the Cons track back to the centre at some stage they are the easier gains for the Cons, thus to retain them the LibDems have to track right, which loses an possibility of replacing Lab on the left. It is easy and potentially short term.
Corbyn may not remain, but I have lost track of where the party machine is on the spectrum, but I anticipate hearing it is well to the left in its composition than it was 5 years ago. Corbyn moving on is not a blank cheque for a more moderate or electable option.
It'll be right-populist. This is partly Brexit, but there's other stuff too - deficits don't matter any more, for example.
That leaves the Philip Hammond faction (in parliament as on pb) politically homeless, and it's hard to imagine the Tories coming back for them any time soon.
Trump is unlikely to win reelection for many reasons.
Yet another reason is that he did get lucky in 2016.
Trump had a 30% chance of winning last time and rolled a five. *IF* everything goes well for him in the coming year he will still only be in the 30-40% range, and he will once again need to get a lucky die roll.
I don't see the logic of this - he is the incumbent, the economy is doing reasonably well, he has delivered on the immigration front and there is no reason for the religious right to abandon him. Look at his rallies and how many are turning up. Then look at his likely Democratic opponents. If he gets Warren, she will be dogged by "Pochahontas" and whether she lied or not about her heritage; the "Sleepy Joe" tag will likelwise be a killer for Biden while Sanders will come across as a crochety old Grandpa.
If American voters really decide who to vote for based on school-playground taunts from a man-baby then frankly they deserve the President that they have got. Good luck to them when TRump's economic chickens come home to roost
Just catching up on.th Guardian comment.. what the hell was the Guardian editor thinking.. must have takem leave of their senses.. ir is political knee in the goolies just the overrinding thiught orocess even if Cameron is no longer PM?
Awful stuff from them, but to be honest, it's the kind of misstep that's a regular feature of the British press. That kind of hateful pettiness is a regular feature of other papers' outputs, and they just brazen it out.
OT David Cameron's football team is in action tonight as the team in claret and blue take on the team in claret and blue. Aston Villa vs West Ham United. https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/49630159
Babylon Berlin, Ray Donovan and Mum kick the asses of a number of comparable shows on that list (apols if they're on there and I've missed them). edit: & Chernobyl.
Peaky Blinders is definitely the most overrated thing going currently.
Latest Peaky has not been very good, previous years were brilliant. The script this time is dire and an Irishman as leader of the Billy Boys, Oh Dear , mangling his Irish accent to try and sound like a weegie.
Comments
The strategy is about expanding across the centre (something I've been trying to argue with the sandalistas for years).
If you genuinely think that someone's view is being informed by ignorance and xenophobia, should you pull punches on account of the person being poor?
IMO, yes you should. But not to the extent of a complete airbrushing.
Remainers are now starting to try to relieve them of the sledgehammer and patch up the wall.
There are more easy Con gains to be made, that is true and therefore tempting. Problem is as the Cons track back to the centre at some stage they are the easier gains for the Cons, thus to retain them the LibDems have to track right, which loses an possibility of replacing Lab on the left. It is easy and potentially short term.
Corbyn may not remain, but I have lost track of where the party machine is on the spectrum, but I anticipate hearing it is well to the left in its composition than it was 5 years ago. Corbyn moving on is not a blank cheque for a more moderate or electable option.
And I wish her well in this - because it works for Labour too.
In essence it sets up Brexit for a long long long term battle which the remain side will have to constantly keep winning every GE.
That said, there's Trotsky's sinisterly accurate comment: "You may not be interested in politics. But you will find that politics is interested in you..."
Peaky Blinders is definitely the most overrated thing going currently.
Surprised - and slightly perturbed - by this.
That leaves the Philip Hammond faction (in parliament as on pb) politically homeless, and it's hard to imagine the Tories coming back for them any time soon.
The LDs are in 2nd place to the Conservatives in 29 seats, and as for their prospects of coming from 3rd only Southport is in play for them.
On UNS, to get all 29 they need a swing from Con to LD of 21%.
There are better choices way down the list.
Adonis and Lucas might be whinging but it’s not going to stop them coalescing with the Libs if need be.
I've seen every episode of 58/100 so that's been a life well spent.
https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/49630159