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    @ydoethur

    You might like to try Vic Marks' latest book, Original Spin. He's no radical but almost inadvertently lifts the lid on the cliqueishness and amateurism of the English game. It would make you realise that the kind of sophistications you propose are still light years aways and that the Old Boys Network remains the best path to selection and preferment.

    Marks himself did little to earn his caps - first with Somerset, then with England. Typically, he dropped out of the England scene without ever actually having done much wrong. But at least he got a fair chance. I'd sympathise with more had I not watched Ray East and David Acfield bowl Essex to much success round about the same time. Neither were ever capped.

    The book is an enjoyable read, but a little depressing if you care about the game.

    I've not read the book, but agree with sentiments about East and Acfield.
    I suspect Porter would be spoken about more as a possible if he played for Surrey.
    He's not the answer to England's prayers but I watched him play against Middlesex two seasons ago when all the pacemen struggled on a hard flat pitch. Porter was the pick of them howver, followed by Stephen Finn, and then Toby Roland-Jones. Soon after, TRJ won his first England cap and was subsequently picked for the Ashes tour.

    I think the simple and unexaggerated truth is that if you play regularly for Middlesex you will sooner or later be picked for England. If you play for any other County, it is not necessarily sufficient to be of Test standard. Generally speaking, the further your County is from St John's Wood the less chance you have of an England cap.
    Or Surrey.
    And wasn't selection highly influenced by the 'Essex Mafia' back in the early 90s?
    Yup, I think at one time the only people who hadn't played for England at Essex were the overseas players and Mike Garnham.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,929

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    Roger said:

    Faiza Shaheen is another Labour front bencher who drops more letters than she uses. She's obviously well educated so why would she want to sound like a moron? Accents don't matter much unless you want to be a voice over but sounding stupid when you aren't is an odd choice to make

    you're probably just another well spoken mediocrity.
    How do you know?
    I hear them on Sky news (although they probably do interviews for the beeb as well)
    Do you disapprove of Scottish accents? As a Unionist, they must doubly irk you.
    Why would I disapprove of Scottish accents? I have one myself ableit softened.

    FTR - Unionist don't disapprove of Scottish accents.
    Is that softened to a disney one Briskin
    Nope. English people can tell I'm Scottish. Scottish people often ask. Make of that what you will.
    A couple of months living in England will make you lose your accent right enough
    Not if you're a weegie.

    But I'm not and I did live in England for over 5 years so my accent softened. Ms Brisk went to private school in Aberdeen so also has a somewhat softened accent so we make the perfect couple :)
    Briskin, I lived years in England, years in USA and lots of time in other European countries, I did not lose my accent.
    You have to want to lose it, sheena Eastonesque
    Yes, I did want to soften it - so that I could be more understood. I believe George Bernard Shaw did the same kind of thing and even wrote a famous play/film about it.

    My accent is what it is. (probably not Scottish enough for your tastes)
    Do you sound like Michael Gove?
    No - Gove has a much posher accent than me or Ms Brisk.
    Nobody would mistake Gove's accent as being Scottish.
    He sounds 'posh Scottish' to me.
    Not as posh as Rifkind. That's the ultimate Edinburgh middle class accent
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    Pulpstar said:

    Not as posh as Rifkind. That's the ultimate Edinburgh middle class accent

    Nah, Tony Blair has the ultimate Edinburgh middle class accent.
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    I wonder if they wargamed Parliament being recalled?

    Much of the plan so far seems to rely on BoZo not being asked any awkward questions during his taxpayer funded propaganda blitz...
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    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,744
    RobD said:

    Scott_P said:
    The UK government deciding where UK taxpayer’s money is spent? It’ll never catch on.
    The UK government taking money off the workers whilst simultaneously making their jobs more risky to pay leave voting rich landlowners (the rural elite?). It will definitely catch on.
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    Scott_P said:

    I wonder if they wargamed Parliament being recalled?

    Much of the plan so far seems to rely on BoZo not being asked any awkward questions during his taxpayer funded propaganda blitz...

    I spoke to a former SPAD earlier on this week, they said it is clear that Cummings nor Johnson understand the FTPA.

    Given that they also think we get a transition with No Deal we have to conclude Cummings and Johnson aren't very bright.
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    Finally the blue on blue action that should have happened during the original campaign...
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    ralphmalphralphmalph Posts: 2,201
    Scott_P said:
    Brilliant, they have written a letter, pats on backs all round.
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    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,990

    @ydoethur

    You might like to try Vic Marks' latest book, Original Spin. He's no radical but almost inadvertently lifts the lid on the cliqueishness and amateurism of the English game. It would make you realise that the kind of sophistications you propose are still light years aways and that the Old Boys Network remains the best path to selection and preferment.

    Marks himself did little to earn his caps - first with Somerset, then with England. Typically, he dropped out of the England scene without ever actually having done much wrong. But at least he got a fair chance. I'd sympathise with more had I not watched Ray East and David Acfield bowl Essex to much success round about the same time. Neither were ever capped.

    The book is an enjoyable read, but a little depressing if you care about the game.

    I've not read the book, but agree with sentiments about East and Acfield.
    I suspect Porter would be spoken about more as a possible if he played for Surrey.
    He's not the answer to England's prayers but I watched him play against Middlesex two seasons ago when all the pacemen struggled on a hard flat pitch. Porter was the pick of them howver, followed by Stephen Finn, and then Toby Roland-Jones. Soon after, TRJ won his first England cap and was subsequently picked for the Ashes tour.

    I think the simple and unexaggerated truth is that if you play regularly for Middlesex you will sooner or later be picked for England. If you play for any other County, it is not necessarily sufficient to be of Test standard. Generally speaking, the further your County is from St John's Wood the less chance you have of an England cap.
    Or Surrey.
    And wasn't selection highly influenced by the 'Essex Mafia' back in the early 90s?
    Yup, I think at one time the only people who hadn't played for England at Essex were the overseas players and Mike Garnham.
    When we were there or thereabouts in most competitions?
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    steve_garnersteve_garner Posts: 1,019
    Scott_P said:
    Yikes, Boris, Gove and Cummings will be cowering.
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    @ydoethur

    You might like to try Vic Marks' latest book, Original Spin. He's no radical but almost inadvertently lifts the lid on the cliqueishness and amateurism of the English game. It would make you realise that the kind of sophistications you propose are still light years aways and that the Old Boys Network remains the best path to selection and preferment.

    Marks himself did little to earn his caps - first with Somerset, then with England. Typically, he dropped out of the England scene without ever actually having done much wrong. But at least he got a fair chance. I'd sympathise with more had I not watched Ray East and David Acfield bowl Essex to much success round about the same time. Neither were ever capped.

    The book is an enjoyable read, but a little depressing if you care about the game.

    I've not read the book, but agree with sentiments about East and Acfield.
    I suspect Porter would be spoken about more as a possible if he played for Surrey.
    He's not the answer to England's prayers but I watched him play against Middlesex two seasons ago when all the pacemen struggled on a hard flat pitch. Porter was the pick of them howver, followed by Stephen Finn, and then Toby Roland-Jones. Soon after, TRJ won his first England cap and was subsequently picked for the Ashes tour.

    I think the simple and unexaggerated truth is that if you play regularly for Middlesex you will sooner or later be picked for England. If you play for any other County, it is not necessarily sufficient to be of Test standard. Generally speaking, the further your County is from St John's Wood the less chance you have of an England cap.
    Or Surrey.
    And wasn't selection highly influenced by the 'Essex Mafia' back in the early 90s?
    Yup, I think at one time the only people who hadn't played for England at Essex were the overseas players and Mike Garnham.
    When we were there or thereabouts in most competitions?
    If Mark Illott was a test match bowler then I'm a Frenchman.
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    JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 6,010

    Scott_P said:
    Yikes, Boris, Gove and Cummings will be cowering.
    Surely if enough MPs were to ask the Speaker to recall Parliament he could do so.
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    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,847

    Scott_P said:
    Yikes, Boris, Gove and Cummings will be cowering.
    Surely if enough MPs were to ask the Speaker to recall Parliament he could do so.
    Perhaps it would need a majority of parliamentarians. 100 is not enough.
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    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Scott_P said:
    Guto Bebb and Dominic Grieve have signed this. Nick Boles and Philip Lee apparently have not.
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    steve_garnersteve_garner Posts: 1,019

    Scott_P said:
    Yikes, Boris, Gove and Cummings will be cowering.
    Surely if enough MPs were to ask the Speaker to recall Parliament he could do so.
    No idea. What might be achieved if he did so? Maybe TSE's SPAD contact can advise since apparently he understands these things.
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453

    Surely if enough MPs were to ask the Speaker to recall Parliament he could do so.

    We are about to find out, although the Sunday shows will be awash with Brexiteers who whine incessantly about Parliamentary Sovereignty explaining why Parliament must NOT be allowed to sit right now...
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    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,847
    Scott_P said:

    So Johnson is blaming Hammond for No Deal, Swinson is blaming Corbyn, Corbyn is blaming Swinson, and Hammond is blaming Johnson.

    It must be a shit idea to attract so much blame throwing, so perhaps worth cancelling?
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    JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 6,010

    Scott_P said:
    Yikes, Boris, Gove and Cummings will be cowering.
    Surely if enough MPs were to ask the Speaker to recall Parliament he could do so.
    Perhaps it would need a majority of parliamentarians. 100 is not enough.
    Well, quite. Only a sixth of MPs are interested, so they are having to ask the PM to do it instead.
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    Scott_P said:
    Boris Johnson should call an election to crush the saboteurs
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    JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 6,010
    Scott_P said:

    Surely if enough MPs were to ask the Speaker to recall Parliament he could do so.

    We are about to find out, although the Sunday shows will be awash with Brexiteers who whine incessantly about Parliamentary Sovereignty explaining why Parliament must NOT be allowed to sit right now...
    There is a difference between the sovereignty of The Queen in Parliament, and recalling some gobshites to talk a lot. We now seem to be ruled by resolutions of the House of Commons which, any constitutional lawyer will tell you, does not change the law.
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    Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,304
    Scott_P said:
    I thought this would happen. Boris was only gung-ho about No Deal when he thought parliament wouldn't let him do it. Now that's looking less likely by the day, Cummings has had to hastily re-brand Boris as a No Deal sceptic. The membership must be scratching their heads and wondering what they voted for.
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    NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,336
    Scott_P said:

    Surely if enough MPs were to ask the Speaker to recall Parliament he could do so.

    We are about to find out, although the Sunday shows will be awash with Brexiteers who whine incessantly about Parliamentary Sovereignty explaining why Parliament must NOT be allowed to sit right now...
    No, unfortunately. https://www.parliament.uk/about/how/occasions/recallparliament/
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    edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,150
    edited August 2019
    This paragraph reads sort-of low key but taking a step back it's striking how bananas the whole operation is:

    Downing Street is said to be holding daily meetings about how to delay legislation in September – a tactic designed to take away opportunities for MPs to hijack government plans with measures opposing no deal.

    Not only are they ripping up all their existing trade arrangements with nothing to replace them, they are doing it while conducting an ongoing denial-of-service attack on their own parliament. Which means they can't pass any legislation to prepare for what they're about to do, or even do anything else. This is absolutely mental.
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    Scott_P said:

    Surely if enough MPs were to ask the Speaker to recall Parliament he could do so.

    We are about to find out, although the Sunday shows will be awash with Brexiteers who whine incessantly about Parliamentary Sovereignty explaining why Parliament must NOT be allowed to sit right now...
    No, unfortunately. https://www.parliament.uk/about/how/occasions/recallparliament/
    Bercow's a convention buster.
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    steve_garnersteve_garner Posts: 1,019

    Scott_P said:

    Surely if enough MPs were to ask the Speaker to recall Parliament he could do so.

    We are about to find out, although the Sunday shows will be awash with Brexiteers who whine incessantly about Parliamentary Sovereignty explaining why Parliament must NOT be allowed to sit right now...
    No, unfortunately. https://www.parliament.uk/about/how/occasions/recallparliament/
    Bercow's a convention buster.
    He sure is. But those that celebrate that cannot reasonably complain if other parliamentarians bust convention.
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    OllyTOllyT Posts: 4,913

    Scott_P said:
    Yikes, Boris, Gove and Cummings will be cowering.
    The only thing that will have Johnson and Cummings cowering is if we get close to Oct 31st and Parliament hasn't stopped them.
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    anothernickanothernick Posts: 3,578

    Scott_P said:
    I thought this would happen. Boris was only gung-ho about No Deal when he thought parliament wouldn't let him do it. Now that's looking less likely by the day, Cummings has had to hastily re-brand Boris as a No Deal sceptic. The membership must be scratching their heads and wondering what they voted for.
    So he's trying to make Hammond and co really really angry so they become more determined to stop no deal? Difficult to find another explanation for this stuff.
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    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300

    Pulpstar said:

    Not as posh as Rifkind. That's the ultimate Edinburgh middle class accent

    Nah, Tony Blair has the ultimate Edinburgh middle class accent.
    Given Tony Blair went to school in Scotland, there really ought to be a stewards' enquiry into his accent.
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453

    Boris Johnson should call an election to crush the saboteurs

    Followed by the purge...
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    Pulpstar said:

    Not as posh as Rifkind. That's the ultimate Edinburgh middle class accent

    Nah, Tony Blair has the ultimate Edinburgh middle class accent.
    Given Tony Blair went to school in Scotland, there really ought to be a stewards' enquiry into his accent.
    Not only did he go to school in Scotland, he was born in Edinburgh.

    Tony Blair = Scot.

    Only Blood and Soil Scot Nats will disagree.
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    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,847

    This paragraph reads sort-of low key but taking a step back it's striking how bananas the whole operation is:

    Downing Street is said to be holding daily meetings about how to delay legislation in September – a tactic designed to take away opportunities for MPs to hijack government plans with measures opposing no deal.

    Not only are they ripping up all their existing trade arrangements with nothing to replace them, they are doing it while conducting an ongoing denial-of-service attack on their own parliament. Which means they can't pass any legislation to prepare for what they're about to do, or even do anything else. This is absolutely mental.
    Johnson has turned the country into a giant Kursk submarine.

    The oxygen is running out and no one has a fucking clue what to do.
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    Scott_P said:
    Don't worry Scotland, England aren't going to win the world cup either.
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    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,067

    Scott_P said:
    Boris Johnson should call an election to crush the saboteurs
    And he should leave the manifesto to Cummings. What could go wrong?
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    Scott_P said:
    Boris Johnson should call an election to crush the saboteurs
    And he should leave the manifesto to Cummings. What could go wrong?
    Given that Sir Lynton Crosby is also working for Boris Johnson and Crosby and Cummings have a lot of history* this definitely will turn out well.

    *Not the good kind.
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    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,067

    This paragraph reads sort-of low key but taking a step back it's striking how bananas the whole operation is:

    Downing Street is said to be holding daily meetings about how to delay legislation in September – a tactic designed to take away opportunities for MPs to hijack government plans with measures opposing no deal.

    Not only are they ripping up all their existing trade arrangements with nothing to replace them, they are doing it while conducting an ongoing denial-of-service attack on their own parliament. Which means they can't pass any legislation to prepare for what they're about to do, or even do anything else. This is absolutely mental.
    Johnson has turned the country into a giant Kursk submarine.

    The oxygen is running out and no one has a fucking clue what to do.
    I wonder if the cabinet are writing letters.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/norway/1372059/Doomed-sailors-letter-from-the-Kursk.html
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    steve_garnersteve_garner Posts: 1,019

    This paragraph reads sort-of low key but taking a step back it's striking how bananas the whole operation is:

    Downing Street is said to be holding daily meetings about how to delay legislation in September – a tactic designed to take away opportunities for MPs to hijack government plans with measures opposing no deal.

    Not only are they ripping up all their existing trade arrangements with nothing to replace them, they are doing it while conducting an ongoing denial-of-service attack on their own parliament. Which means they can't pass any legislation to prepare for what they're about to do, or even do anything else. This is absolutely mental.
    Johnson has turned the country into a giant Kursk submarine.

    The oxygen is running out and no one has a fucking clue what to do.
    I wonder if the cabinet are writing letters.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/norway/1372059/Doomed-sailors-letter-from-the-Kursk.html
    Steve Barclay seems to have been writing something according to the Telegraph.
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    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,067

    This paragraph reads sort-of low key but taking a step back it's striking how bananas the whole operation is:

    Downing Street is said to be holding daily meetings about how to delay legislation in September – a tactic designed to take away opportunities for MPs to hijack government plans with measures opposing no deal.

    Not only are they ripping up all their existing trade arrangements with nothing to replace them, they are doing it while conducting an ongoing denial-of-service attack on their own parliament. Which means they can't pass any legislation to prepare for what they're about to do, or even do anything else. This is absolutely mental.
    Johnson has turned the country into a giant Kursk submarine.

    The oxygen is running out and no one has a fucking clue what to do.
    I wonder if the cabinet are writing letters.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/norway/1372059/Doomed-sailors-letter-from-the-Kursk.html
    Steve Barclay seems to have been writing something according to the Telegraph.
    He’s signed the formal order to repeal the European Communities Act.

    That cues up his line in the bunker scene: “Das war ein Befehl!!!”
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    steve_garnersteve_garner Posts: 1,019

    This paragraph reads sort-of low key but taking a step back it's striking how bananas the whole operation is:

    Downing Street is said to be holding daily meetings about how to delay legislation in September – a tactic designed to take away opportunities for MPs to hijack government plans with measures opposing no deal.

    Not only are they ripping up all their existing trade arrangements with nothing to replace them, they are doing it while conducting an ongoing denial-of-service attack on their own parliament. Which means they can't pass any legislation to prepare for what they're about to do, or even do anything else. This is absolutely mental.
    Johnson has turned the country into a giant Kursk submarine.

    The oxygen is running out and no one has a fucking clue what to do.
    I wonder if the cabinet are writing letters.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/norway/1372059/Doomed-sailors-letter-from-the-Kursk.html
    Steve Barclay seems to have been writing something according to the Telegraph.
    He’s signed the formal order to repeal the European Communities Act.

    That cues up his line in the bunker scene: “Das war ein Befehl!!!”
    If you say so.
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    edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,150

    I thought this would happen. Boris was only gung-ho about No Deal when he thought parliament wouldn't let him do it. Now that's looking less likely by the day, Cummings has had to hastily re-brand Boris as a No Deal sceptic. The membership must be scratching their heads and wondering what they voted for.

    Has any politician before Corbyn ever deployed the strategy of being totally fucking shite to such devastating tactical effect?
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453

    Has any politician before Corbyn ever deployed the strategy of being totally fucking shite to such devastating tactical effect?

    Alex Salmond gave it a damn good go...
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    steve_garnersteve_garner Posts: 1,019

    Scott_P said:

    I wonder if they wargamed Parliament being recalled?

    Much of the plan so far seems to rely on BoZo not being asked any awkward questions during his taxpayer funded propaganda blitz...

    I spoke to a former SPAD earlier on this week, they said it is clear that Cummings nor Johnson understand the FTPA.

    Given that they also think we get a transition with No Deal we have to conclude Cummings and Johnson aren't very bright.
    Did your SPAD mate say whether Boris and Cummings understand the 1972 European Communities Act?
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    I actually disagree with with Mike’s analysis here - I think the VONC May actually succeed but the Corbyn govt attempt fail - paradoxically making a general election MORE likely in 2019 not less. My hope actually is the following.... VONC succeeds, Corbyn fails to get confidence and at the last minute Harriet Or ken gets the nod to avoid a no deal Brexit. This is all predicated in the fact that Bercow interprets the Fixed Term Parliament Act as allowing multiple attempts to form a government in the 14 day period. Any views on this?
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    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    Scott_P said:

    Has any politician before Corbyn ever deployed the strategy of being totally fucking shite to such devastating tactical effect?

    Alex Salmond gave it a damn good go...
    Bravo to you both
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    steve_garnersteve_garner Posts: 1,019

    I actually disagree with with Mike’s analysis here - I think the VONC May actually succeed but the Corbyn govt attempt fail - paradoxically making a general election MORE likely in 2019 not less. My hope actually is the following.... VONC succeeds, Corbyn fails to get confidence and at the last minute Harriet Or ken gets the nod to avoid a no deal Brexit. This is all predicated in the fact that Bercow interprets the Fixed Term Parliament Act as allowing multiple attempts to form a government in the 14 day period. Any views on this?

    Yes, it's wishful thinking.
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    Scott_P said:

    I wonder if they wargamed Parliament being recalled?

    Much of the plan so far seems to rely on BoZo not being asked any awkward questions during his taxpayer funded propaganda blitz...

    I spoke to a former SPAD earlier on this week, they said it is clear that Cummings nor Johnson understand the FTPA.

    Given that they also think we get a transition with No Deal we have to conclude Cummings and Johnson aren't very bright.
    Did your SPAD mate say whether Boris and Cummings understand the 1972 European Communities Act?
    You seem obsessed with my former SPAD mate.

    At least he knows that Stoke and Mansfield aren't in the North.
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    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,067
    Scott_P said:
    He’s a fez short of a Tommy Cooper impression.
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,443
    edited August 2019
    Got to say Jofra Archer was amazing today, not only was that the fastest bit of bowling I've ever seen from an Englishman but Archer v Smith was the most compelling bit of test cricket since Atherton v Donald at Trent Bridge 1998.
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,108
    RobD said:

    Scott_P said:
    The UK government deciding where UK taxpayer’s money is spent? It’ll never catch on.
    It's EU money, but please feel free to go through the whole 'yeah, but its still really UK money being handed back by the EU' schtick.
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    El_CapitanoEl_Capitano Posts: 3,870
    Apologies for Twitter recycling, but this one hit home and doesn’t seem to have been noticed:

    http://twitter.com/muljam23/status/1162664182359252992
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    Gabs2Gabs2 Posts: 1,268

    Scott_P said:

    I wonder if they wargamed Parliament being recalled?

    Much of the plan so far seems to rely on BoZo not being asked any awkward questions during his taxpayer funded propaganda blitz...

    I spoke to a former SPAD earlier on this week, they said it is clear that Cummings nor Johnson understand the FTPA.

    Given that they also think we get a transition with No Deal we have to conclude Cummings and Johnson aren't very bright.
    Did your SPAD mate say whether Boris and Cummings understand the 1972 European Communities Act?
    You seem obsessed with my former SPAD mate.

    At least he knows that Stoke and Mansfield aren't in the North.
    If "grass" rhymes with "lass" in the local dialect, it's the North.
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    This paragraph reads sort-of low key but taking a step back it's striking how bananas the whole operation is:

    Downing Street is said to be holding daily meetings about how to delay legislation in September – a tactic designed to take away opportunities for MPs to hijack government plans with measures opposing no deal.

    Not only are they ripping up all their existing trade arrangements with nothing to replace them, they are doing it while conducting an ongoing denial-of-service attack on their own parliament. Which means they can't pass any legislation to prepare for what they're about to do, or even do anything else. This is absolutely mental.
    Johnson has turned the country into a giant Kursk submarine.

    The oxygen is running out and no one has a fucking clue what to do.
    I wonder if the cabinet are writing letters.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/norway/1372059/Doomed-sailors-letter-from-the-Kursk.html
    Steve Barclay seems to have been writing something according to the Telegraph.
    He’s signed the formal order to repeal the European Communities Act.

    That cues up his line in the bunker scene: “Das war ein Befehl!!!”
    If you say so.
    Hmm will that document end up like the execution warrant for Charles I or the Declaration of Independence?

    Will Barclay be feted or fated?
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    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    1968 coup plotted against Harold Wilson's Labour government.

    Lord Mountbatten came dangerously close to leading a cabal of industrialists, generals and tycoons plotting a coup against an elected Labour government, a new book reveals.

    The 1968 plot was designed to replace Prime Minister Harold Wilson with a coalition government to bring the country together, during what Mountbatten and the conspirators regarded as a time of national crisis.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/08/17/revealed-full-extent-lord-mountbattens-role-68-plot-against/
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    Gabs2Gabs2 Posts: 1,268
    Scott_P said:
    I just wish everybody would compromise a little bit. But instead everyone insists on being self-righteous and demonizing of the other side.
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    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    Gabs2 said:

    Scott_P said:

    I wonder if they wargamed Parliament being recalled?

    Much of the plan so far seems to rely on BoZo not being asked any awkward questions during his taxpayer funded propaganda blitz...

    I spoke to a former SPAD earlier on this week, they said it is clear that Cummings nor Johnson understand the FTPA.

    Given that they also think we get a transition with No Deal we have to conclude Cummings and Johnson aren't very bright.
    Did your SPAD mate say whether Boris and Cummings understand the 1972 European Communities Act?
    You seem obsessed with my former SPAD mate.

    At least he knows that Stoke and Mansfield aren't in the North.
    If "grass" rhymes with "lass" in the local dialect, it's the North.
    If "lass" is in the local dialect, it's the North.
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    Charles said:

    This paragraph reads sort-of low key but taking a step back it's striking how bananas the whole operation is:

    Downing Street is said to be holding daily meetings about how to delay legislation in September – a tactic designed to take away opportunities for MPs to hijack government plans with measures opposing no deal.

    Not only are they ripping up all their existing trade arrangements with nothing to replace them, they are doing it while conducting an ongoing denial-of-service attack on their own parliament. Which means they can't pass any legislation to prepare for what they're about to do, or even do anything else. This is absolutely mental.
    Johnson has turned the country into a giant Kursk submarine.

    The oxygen is running out and no one has a fucking clue what to do.
    I wonder if the cabinet are writing letters.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/norway/1372059/Doomed-sailors-letter-from-the-Kursk.html
    Steve Barclay seems to have been writing something according to the Telegraph.
    He’s signed the formal order to repeal the European Communities Act.

    That cues up his line in the bunker scene: “Das war ein Befehl!!!”
    If you say so.
    Hmm will that document end up like the execution warrant for Charles I or the Declaration of Independence?

    Will Barclay be feted or fated?
    I believe Parliament can override Barclay's decision so it could make Barclay as impotent as a eunuch.
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Apologies for Twitter recycling, but this one hit home and doesn’t seem to have been noticed:

    http://twitter.com/muljam23/status/1162664182359252992

    How many courts usually sit in the middle of August? Before my aunt retired as a judge she had a very structured timetable
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,443
    edited August 2019
    Gabs2 said:

    Scott_P said:

    I wonder if they wargamed Parliament being recalled?

    Much of the plan so far seems to rely on BoZo not being asked any awkward questions during his taxpayer funded propaganda blitz...

    I spoke to a former SPAD earlier on this week, they said it is clear that Cummings nor Johnson understand the FTPA.

    Given that they also think we get a transition with No Deal we have to conclude Cummings and Johnson aren't very bright.
    Did your SPAD mate say whether Boris and Cummings understand the 1972 European Communities Act?
    You seem obsessed with my former SPAD mate.

    At least he knows that Stoke and Mansfield aren't in the North.
    If "grass" rhymes with "lass" in the local dialect, it's the North.
    As the only bona fide working class Northerner on PB I have my own definition of what is the North.
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,428
    edited August 2019

    Scott_P said:
    I thought this would happen. Boris was only gung-ho about No Deal when he thought parliament wouldn't let him do it. Now that's looking less likely by the day, Cummings has had to hastily re-brand Boris as a No Deal sceptic. The membership must be scratching their heads and wondering what they voted for.
    The Government position has been absolutely clear and has never wavered. Boris has always favoured a deal. He's right to point out that the EU will not reopen the matter whilst they still believe that Parliament will prevent us leaving.
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    ZephyrZephyr Posts: 438
    OllyT said:

    Scott_P said:
    Yikes, Boris, Gove and Cummings will be cowering.
    The only thing that will have Johnson and Cummings cowering is if we get close to Oct 31st and Parliament hasn't stopped them.
    I predict a riot. It’s easy to imagine tear gas on the streets and smoke and burning things. The gammon ripping up the kids future. The kids will be very angry. ☹️
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    edited August 2019

    He's right to point out that the EU will not reopen the matter whilst they still believe that Parliament will prevent us leaving.

    the EU will not reopen the matter at all (EDIT: unless BoZo moves the red lines)

    What they think Parliament will do is irrelevant
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    "PM to tell Merkel and Macron parliament cannot stop no-deal Brexit"

    https://news.sky.com/story/pm-to-tell-merkel-and-macron-parliament-cannot-stop-no-deal-brexit-11788042
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    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,306
    edited August 2019

    Scott_P said:
    Boris Johnson should call an election to crush the saboteurs
    "Soon there will be an erection, in which the Tories will increase their majority!"
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    ZephyrZephyr Posts: 438

    Scott_P said:
    Boris Johnson should call an election to crush the saboteurs
    "Soon there will be an erection, in which the Tories will increase their majority!"
    I see the error. You mean it should say enlarge their majority?
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,108

    Gabs2 said:

    Scott_P said:

    I wonder if they wargamed Parliament being recalled?

    Much of the plan so far seems to rely on BoZo not being asked any awkward questions during his taxpayer funded propaganda blitz...

    I spoke to a former SPAD earlier on this week, they said it is clear that Cummings nor Johnson understand the FTPA.

    Given that they also think we get a transition with No Deal we have to conclude Cummings and Johnson aren't very bright.
    Did your SPAD mate say whether Boris and Cummings understand the 1972 European Communities Act?
    You seem obsessed with my former SPAD mate.

    At least he knows that Stoke and Mansfield aren't in the North.
    If "grass" rhymes with "lass" in the local dialect, it's the North.
    As the only bona fide working class Northerner on PB I have my own definition of what is the North.
    Geordies get a pass for December t-shirt wearing, but the rest of ye will always be southern jessies.
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    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,966

    This paragraph reads sort-of low key but taking a step back it's striking how bananas the whole operation is:

    Downing Street is said to be holding daily meetings about how to delay legislation in September – a tactic designed to take away opportunities for MPs to hijack government plans with measures opposing no deal.

    Not only are they ripping up all their existing trade arrangements with nothing to replace them, they are doing it while conducting an ongoing denial-of-service attack on their own parliament. Which means they can't pass any legislation to prepare for what they're about to do, or even do anything else. This is absolutely mental.
    Indeed. All but your final sentence is superfluous really.
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Have there been any new polls tonight?
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    edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,150
    Scott_P said:

    He's right to point out that the EU will not reopen the matter whilst they still believe that Parliament will prevent us leaving.

    the EU will not reopen the matter at all (EDIT: unless BoZo moves the red lines)

    What they think Parliament will do is irrelevant
    And even if they wanted to Boris has ruled out the extra time that would be needed to do it, so weirdly he's created this situation where the only reason there would be any point in reopening it would be if they believe he's bluffing.
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Charles said:

    This paragraph reads sort-of low key but taking a step back it's striking how bananas the whole operation is:

    Downing Street is said to be holding daily meetings about how to delay legislation in September – a tactic designed to take away opportunities for MPs to hijack government plans with measures opposing no deal.

    Not only are they ripping up all their existing trade arrangements with nothing to replace them, they are doing it while conducting an ongoing denial-of-service attack on their own parliament. Which means they can't pass any legislation to prepare for what they're about to do, or even do anything else. This is absolutely mental.
    Johnson has turned the country into a giant Kursk submarine.

    The oxygen is running out and no one has a fucking clue what to do.
    I wonder if the cabinet are writing letters.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/norway/1372059/Doomed-sailors-letter-from-the-Kursk.html
    Steve Barclay seems to have been writing something according to the Telegraph.
    He’s signed the formal order to repeal the European Communities Act.

    That cues up his line in the bunker scene: “Das war ein Befehl!!!”
    If you say so.
    Hmm will that document end up like the execution warrant for Charles I or the Declaration of Independence?

    Will Barclay be feted or fated?
    I believe Parliament can override Barclay's decision so it could make Barclay as impotent as a eunuch.
    Technically would eunuchs be impotent? For me the word suggests failure of the possible while for a eunuch it’s just not possible.
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    StreeterStreeter Posts: 684

    Scott_P said:
    I thought this would happen. Boris was only gung-ho about No Deal when he thought parliament wouldn't let him do it. Now that's looking less likely by the day, Cummings has had to hastily re-brand Boris as a No Deal sceptic. The membership must be scratching their heads and wondering what they voted for.
    The Government position has been absolutely clear and has never wavered. Boris has always favoured a deal. He's right to point out that the EU will not reopen the matter whilst they still believe that Parliament will prevent us leaving.
    But Boris always knew Parliament will prevent us leaving without a deal and he always knew the EU always knew that. He’s not very bright, is he?
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
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    TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Zephyr said:

    OllyT said:

    Scott_P said:
    Yikes, Boris, Gove and Cummings will be cowering.
    The only thing that will have Johnson and Cummings cowering is if we get close to Oct 31st and Parliament hasn't stopped them.
    I predict a riot. It’s easy to imagine tear gas on the streets and smoke and burning things. The gammon ripping up the kids future. The kids will be very angry. ☹️
    Most people will be at work - riots are passé.
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    Zephyr said:

    Scott_P said:
    Boris Johnson should call an election to crush the saboteurs
    "Soon there will be an erection, in which the Tories will increase their majority!"
    I see the error. You mean it should say enlarge their majority?
    Extra "members", you think?
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    Gabs2 said:

    Scott_P said:

    I wonder if they wargamed Parliament being recalled?

    Much of the plan so far seems to rely on BoZo not being asked any awkward questions during his taxpayer funded propaganda blitz...

    I spoke to a former SPAD earlier on this week, they said it is clear that Cummings nor Johnson understand the FTPA.

    Given that they also think we get a transition with No Deal we have to conclude Cummings and Johnson aren't very bright.
    Did your SPAD mate say whether Boris and Cummings understand the 1972 European Communities Act?
    You seem obsessed with my former SPAD mate.

    At least he knows that Stoke and Mansfield aren't in the North.
    If "grass" rhymes with "lass" in the local dialect, it's the North.
    If "lass" is in the local dialect, it's the North.
    "Put" rhymes with "but"?
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    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,966
    AndyJS said:

    "PM to tell Merkel and Macron parliament cannot stop no-deal Brexit"

    https://news.sky.com/story/pm-to-tell-merkel-and-macron-parliament-cannot-stop-no-deal-brexit-11788042

    There has been a constant running thread through the past 3 years. The belief that the EU has no knowledge of UK politics other than that which is transmitted via the PM.
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    TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633

    Scott_P said:

    I wonder if they wargamed Parliament being recalled?

    Much of the plan so far seems to rely on BoZo not being asked any awkward questions during his taxpayer funded propaganda blitz...

    I spoke to a former SPAD earlier on this week, they said it is clear that Cummings nor Johnson understand the FTPA.

    Given that they also think we get a transition with No Deal we have to conclude Cummings and Johnson aren't very bright.

    That’s sounds like a great idea - it was obvious during the referendum that the winners would never wind because thick..

    We are leaving on 31/10 bar an intervention that will position Boris or Farage as nailed on to win a GE - losers choose your poison.
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    Boris is taking no prisoners as he takes everyone in the opposition camps on in a fight that must have a conclusion by the 31st October

    I have no idea where this ends and it is very scary

    Each and every mp bears a heavy responsibility for this disaster

    Is there anyone who can achieve a compromise.

    TM's deal is still there and was and still is the best resolution
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    ZephyrZephyr Posts: 438

    Zephyr said:

    Scott_P said:
    Boris Johnson should call an election to crush the saboteurs
    "Soon there will be an erection, in which the Tories will increase their majority!"
    I see the error. You mean it should say enlarge their majority?
    Extra "members", you think?
    The more the merrier as they say in the house of depravity
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,966

    Boris is taking no prisoners as he takes everyone in the opposition camps on in a fight that must have a conclusion by the 31st October

    I have no idea where this ends and it is very scary

    Each and every mp bears a heavy responsibility for this disaster

    Is there anyone who can achieve a compromise.

    TM's deal is still there and was and still is the best resolution

    TM's deal is not there. The government needs to bring it forward. Boris has declared it dead.
    So. It can only be alive if Boris produces a spectacular climb down. And with no guarantee it would pass.
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    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300

    1968 coup plotted against Harold Wilson's Labour government.

    Lord Mountbatten came dangerously close to leading a cabal of industrialists, generals and tycoons plotting a coup against an elected Labour government, a new book reveals.

    The 1968 plot was designed to replace Prime Minister Harold Wilson with a coalition government to bring the country together, during what Mountbatten and the conspirators regarded as a time of national crisis.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/08/17/revealed-full-extent-lord-mountbattens-role-68-plot-against/

    “It was not Solly Zuckerman who talked Mountbatten out of staging a coup and making himself President of Britain. It was the Queen herself.”
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    dixiedean said:

    Boris is taking no prisoners as he takes everyone in the opposition camps on in a fight that must have a conclusion by the 31st October

    I have no idea where this ends and it is very scary

    Each and every mp bears a heavy responsibility for this disaster

    Is there anyone who can achieve a compromise.

    TM's deal is still there and was and still is the best resolution

    TM's deal is not there. The government needs to bring it forward. Boris has declared it dead.
    So. It can only be alive if Boris produces a spectacular climb down. And with no guarantee it would pass.
    It is still there if there is a will . If all those writing a letter to Boris today had instead written an endorsement of the deal, demonstrating a cross HOC compromise, it would have a chance.

    But no, they each carry on in their entrenched positions

    Hence while I say, a plague on every mp for taking us down this idiotic road
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    ZephyrZephyr Posts: 438
    AndyJS said:

    Have there been any new polls tonight?

    I find myself playing innuendo tennis and reading obscure cricket stats, I only nipped on to laugh at this weeks hysterical electoral calculus outputs, are there no crazy holiday season polls to argue over?
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited August 2019
    Zephyr said:

    AndyJS said:

    Have there been any new polls tonight?

    I find myself playing innuendo tennis and reading obscure cricket stats, I only nipped on to laugh at this weeks hysterical electoral calculus outputs, are there no crazy holiday season polls to argue over?
    Reading obscure cricket stats is one of my hobbies. At the moment I'm trying to find out what the highest run chases at Lords have been so far, but it's proving to be surprisingly difficult to find the figures.
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    Time to go

    Lets hope someday we will wake up to calmer waters

    Good night folks
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,125

    Scott_P said:
    He’s a fez short of a Tommy Cooper impression.
    "Brexit...bottle it...bottle it...Brexit......"
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,428
    Gabs2 said:

    Scott_P said:
    I just wish everybody would compromise a little bit. But instead everyone insists on being self-righteous and demonizing of the other side.
    Personally, and I can only speak for myself, I'd have been quite satisfied with a soft Brexit. What I find utterly unacceptable is the attempt to overturn the vote.
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    StreeterStreeter Posts: 684

    Gabs2 said:

    Scott_P said:
    I just wish everybody would compromise a little bit. But instead everyone insists on being self-righteous and demonizing of the other side.
    Personally, and I can only speak for myself, I'd have been quite satisfied with a soft Brexit. What I find utterly unacceptable is the attempt to overturn the vote.
    Suck it up, winner.
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,428
    Streeter said:

    Scott_P said:
    I thought this would happen. Boris was only gung-ho about No Deal when he thought parliament wouldn't let him do it. Now that's looking less likely by the day, Cummings has had to hastily re-brand Boris as a No Deal sceptic. The membership must be scratching their heads and wondering what they voted for.
    The Government position has been absolutely clear and has never wavered. Boris has always favoured a deal. He's right to point out that the EU will not reopen the matter whilst they still believe that Parliament will prevent us leaving.
    But Boris always knew Parliament will prevent us leaving without a deal and he always knew the EU always knew that. He’s not very bright, is he?
    It won't. And the EU will realise it won't. Hopefully soon enough to do something about it. Which will be no thanks to Hammond.
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    "Hong Kong police: We don’t need Beijing’s help"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-china-49380531
This discussion has been closed.