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  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 34,415
    Looks like no more play at Lords!
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,951
    Incredible pictures on Sky. No more play at Lords today methinks.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 34,415

    I’m beginning to think that there must be some part of the process of signing up to be a member of a political party which leads to atrophy of any sort of critical faculty. When you give members the opportunity to elect themselves a leader, it appears that they look around and say to themselves “Hmmm! Who’s manifestly incapable of providing any sort of sensible political programme? And better still, can they be relied on to espouse ideas that many people find abhorrent? Yes! That’s the one for us!”

    I can think of no other explanation for Corbyn on the one hand, the fact that all these member polls seem to suggest that there is serious consideration being given either to Rees Mogg or Johnson, the succession of lunatics that have been through the UKIP revolving door in dizzying succession, and the only saving grace I can see for Cable is that he appears to be dead.

    Time for an update of Charles Mackay’s “Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds”, I think.

    Good Afternoon, Mr Tripper. Wecome.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,394
    Welcome back, Mr. Tripper.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 56,022
    Absolutely pouring down at Lord’s now, only 20 minutes after they were about to come out again. Draw now in to 1.71, which is crap having laid before the start yesterday at 3.7. Cashing out now for being silly enough to think I could trust a weather forecast. Grr...
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 56,022
    TOPPING said:

    Ha! For cadets there, it was gates of RMA Sandhurst to Marble Arch.
    Ooh, that’s a good one, a decent choice of routes too. So did you go M3, M4 or the shortest route bombing past all the nice houses straight up the A30?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,951
    TOPPING said:

    I think I've cracked the Stokes trial thing.

    Everyone was acting in self defence and no one wanted trouble. The two gay guys seem to have been put there to let all the defendants illustrate their exemplary diversity mindsets.

    Am I right that no one has actually called them? Seems surprising.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 34,415
    Sandpit said:

    Absolutely pouring down at Lord’s now, only 20 minutes after they were about to come out again. Draw now in to 1.71, which is crap having laid before the start yesterday at 3.7. Cashing out now for being silly enough to think I could trust a weather forecast. Grr...

    I misread the last three letters as Gin!
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,647

    I’m beginning to think that there must be some part of the process of signing up to be a member of a political party which leads to atrophy of any sort of critical faculty. When you give members the opportunity to elect themselves a leader, it appears that they look around and say to themselves “Hmmm! Who’s manifestly incapable of providing any sort of sensible political programme? And better still, can they be relied on to espouse ideas that many people find abhorrent? Yes! That’s the one for us!”

    I can think of no other explanation for Corbyn on the one hand, the fact that all these member polls seem to suggest that there is serious consideration being given either to Rees Mogg or Johnson, the succession of lunatics that have been through the UKIP revolving door in dizzying succession, and the only saving grace I can see for Cable is that he appears to be dead.

    Time for an update of Charles Mackay’s “Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds”, I think.

    Welcome. Please stay and post more.

    And you are of course right in what you say.
  • DayTripperDayTripper Posts: 138

    Welcome back, Mr. Tripper.

    Back? Hope I'm not involved in identity theft - first time of posting!
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,954
    edited August 2018
    IDS defends Boris:

    You may not agree with the tone or the jokes, but we have a thing called freedom of speech in this country,” Duncan Smith told the BBc Radio 4’s Today programme. “And I don’t believe that just because somebody takes offence that means that therefore there has to be an inquiry which means that the individual can be shut down in terms of their ability to say what they believe."

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/aug/10/former-tory-leader-iain-duncan-smith-defends-boris-johnson-over-burqa-comments

    But does anyone remember...

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/talking_point/1969465.stm
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,951

    I’m beginning to think that there must be some part of the process of signing up to be a member of a political party which leads to atrophy of any sort of critical faculty. When you give members the opportunity to elect themselves a leader, it appears that they look around and say to themselves “Hmmm! Who’s manifestly incapable of providing any sort of sensible political programme? And better still, can they be relied on to espouse ideas that many people find abhorrent? Yes! That’s the one for us!”

    I can think of no other explanation for Corbyn on the one hand, the fact that all these member polls seem to suggest that there is serious consideration being given either to Rees Mogg or Johnson, the succession of lunatics that have been through the UKIP revolving door in dizzying succession, and the only saving grace I can see for Cable is that he appears to be dead.

    Time for an update of Charles Mackay’s “Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds”, I think.

    Excellent first post. Welcome indeed.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 56,022

    I misread the last three letters as Gin!
    Now there’s a good idea! Much more fun than watching the St John’s Wood cloudburst.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 83,131
    edited August 2018
    Seems like Boris should be pillared most for plagiarizing his infamous joke...from the Guardian...

    https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2018/08/letterbox-gate-who-said-it-first-boris-or-the-guardian/
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 79,096
    Sandpit said:

    Absolutely pouring down at Lord’s now, only 20 minutes after they were about to come out again. Draw now in to 1.71, which is crap having laid before the start yesterday at 3.7. Cashing out now for being silly enough to think I could trust a weather forecast. Grr...

    Yes it's been an annoying test match for sure. How is the forecast looking for tommorow ? England might still win, given the Indian batting thus far - but yes I'm out too for the loss of a fiver also.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,394
    Mr. Tripper, ah, welcome then.

    A long time ago, on a forum far, far away, there was (I think) someone with the same name.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,951
    edited August 2018
    AndyJS said:

    I don't know how we can take GDP figures seriously when they include things like the trade in illegal drugs.
    Edit thought better of that suggestion as to how turnover in the drugs trade might be monitored. Nothing to do with HSBC turnover, nothing at all.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,647
    Sandpit said:

    Ooh, that’s a good one, a decent choice of routes too. So did you go M3, M4 or the shortest route bombing past all the nice houses straight up the A30?
    M4, A316, Hammersmith flyover, Knightsbridge, and up Park Lane.

    As I remember. Which is not very clearly.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 34,415
    Sandpit said:

    Now there’s a good idea! Much more fun than watching the St John’s Wood cloudburst.
    That’s what I thought. There’s an excellent gin shop in our small town, and my wife was given a bottle of rhubarb and ginger gin for her recent birthday.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 59,067
    MaxPB said:

    I've never done badly by being bearish on the French economy. It always finds a way to disappoint.
    That was true of the UK economy until Mrs Thatcher reformed the labour market.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,647
    edited August 2018
    DavidL said:

    Am I right that no one has actually called them? Seems surprising.
    Is "he was defending my honour" something the defence would want or be able to use if that person then went on to smack the person doing the defaming?
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,394
    King Cole, sounds like the sort of gift a wise and cultured man would give.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 56,022
    Pulpstar said:

    Yes it's been an annoying test match for sure. How is the forecast looking for tommorow ? England might still win, given the Indian batting thus far - but yes I'm out too for the loss of a fiver also.
    BBC now reckon okay tomorrow but more rain Sunday. It said yesterday that today would be fine, so you can guess how much I trust it.


  • I can think of no other explanation for Corbyn on the one hand, the fact that all these member polls seem to suggest that there is serious consideration being given either to Rees Mogg or Johnson, the succession of lunatics that have been through the UKIP revolving door in dizzying succession, and the only saving grace I can see for Cable is that he appears to be dead.

    Time for an update of Charles Mackay’s “Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds”, I think.

    If we'd been given a choice of candidates there's no way that we'd have elected Vince Cable as leader. Many of us had completely ruled him out of consideration.

  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 59,067
    stodge said:

    I'd be surprised if plumbers were ever short of work during school holidays or indeed any other time.

    As for his views on "Brexit", it just goes to show how impatient and ignorant some people are. There was and is a prescribed process - we couldn't leave on June 24th 2016 even if people thought we could and should. The earliest we could have left is June 24th this year if Cameron had invoked A50 the day after the Referendum (which I suppose he could have done if he had made any plans for a victory for LEAVE).

    We won't be leaving on March 29th 2019 either - we will be effectively members of the EU until December 31st 2020. Those who advocate this nonsensical "get on with it" approach need to have a word with Theresa May about the process and the length of time it's taking and the necessity of a transition period.
    That's not actually true. If we'd gone straight to an "off the shelf" arrangement, like EFTA/EEA, then it could have happened faster. Or, if we'd decided we wanted to leave without a deal or any preparation, we could simply have repealed the European Communities Act.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,951
    TOPPING said:

    Is "he was defending my honour" something the defence would want or be able to use if that person then went on to smack the person doing the defaming?
    Stokes has been accused of taking the piss out of them. He claims that they were being abused by the 2 he ended up punching and that his “self defence” related not only to himself but to them. It would have been interesting to hear what they thought. Them backing Stokes up right now seems to be his best chance but admitting his memory has blanks, possibly related to the amount of drink, without that support is not a good look.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,647
    DavidL said:

    Stokes has been accused of taking the piss out of them. He claims that they were being abused by the 2 he ended up punching and that his “self defence” related not only to himself but to them. It would have been interesting to hear what they thought. Them backing Stokes up right now seems to be his best chance but admitting his memory has blanks, possibly related to the amount of drink, without that support is not a good look.
    Yes his defence seems to be almost proprietorial towards them "don't you be insulting *my* gays".

    Not a great look either.
  • This is fake news. I've seen Blackadder, and the only brother ever mentioned is Prince Henry Plantagenet.
    If Theresa May could choose a brother, would it be Brian or James?
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621
    Nigelb said:


    I don't think it anywhere near as clearcut.

    The evidence for the Chicxulub impact is, of course, overwhelming - but equally, so is that of the almost unimaginably massive Deccan vulcanism around that event, which lasted several hundred thousand years.

    What is far from clear is the precise timing of the mass extinctions around the two, as it's very far from a trivial (or settled) matter to narrow parse the geological record from 65 million years ago to within a hundred years (which the Chicxulub hypothesis requires), as opposed to tens or hundreds of thousands.
    I think the evidence points to a very rapid extinction event on land and sea. I do get the point that rapid to a geologist has a very difference meaning to you or I, but my understanding is that it was sharper and more immediately global that the more gradual vulcanism of the Deccan flats. Even if we make the alternatives 5 times more likely than my original guess its still 95/5.
  • AnazinaAnazina Posts: 3,487
    TOPPING said:

    Yes his defence seems to be almost proprietorial towards them "don't you be insulting *my* gays".

    Not a great look either.
    They backed him up before the trial – I expect they will soon make a court appearance

    https://news.sky.com/story/ben-stokes-was-defending-us-from-homophobic-abuse-say-gay-men-11101889
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,314

    Seems like Boris should be pillared most for plagiarizing his infamous joke...from the Guardian...

    https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2018/08/letterbox-gate-who-said-it-first-boris-or-the-guardian/

    It's a bit ridiculous how much this story has blown up.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Anorak said:

    I think the evidence points to a very rapid extinction event on land and sea. I do get the point that rapid to a geologist has a very difference meaning to you or I, but my understanding is that it was sharper and more immediately global that the more gradual vulcanism of the Deccan flats. Even if we make the alternatives 5 times more likely than my original guess its still 95/5.
    I'd like to hear more about the near-death experience with the tiger in Belize, not least what the tiger was doing so far from home.
  • Carolus_RexCarolus_Rex Posts: 1,414

    If Theresa May could choose a brother, would it be Brian or James?
    Probably Erskine. The other two are far too interesting.
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621
    I see still Guido is still going properly mental on twitter his site over Burkas. He's talking about Islam more than SeanT, FFS!
  • AnazinaAnazina Posts: 3,487
    RobD said:

    It's a bit ridiculous how much this story has blown up.
    It is indeed ridiculous how effective Johnson has been in making it blow up
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,795
    I wonder when the left are going to realise the more they moan about Boris and Burkas the more popular they're making him.
  • AnazinaAnazina Posts: 3,487

    I wonder when the left are going to realise the more they moan about Boris and Burkas the more popular they're making him.

    There is a good deal of moaning about him from the right, which might of course be deliberate. I find the best strategy with the odious Johnson is to ignore him.
  • AnazinaAnazina Posts: 3,487
    Anorak said:

    I see still Guido is still going properly mental on twitter his site over Burkas. He's talking about Islam more than SeanT, FFS!


    That is not possible within the laws of physics.
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621
    edited August 2018

    I'd like to hear more about the near-death experience with the tiger in Belize, not least what the tiger was doing so far from home.
    I thought the boy made it all up to stop going mad when his mother was decapitated.

    [And it was deccan traps, not flats. Silly me.]
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 79,096
    Was Hale being acquitted the moment the DRS turned ?
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621
    Anazina said:


    That is not possible within the laws of physics.
    Well, admittedly it's only because "Guido" is a team of 4 or 5 people. One-on-one, you'd be quite right, of course.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 50,819

    I wonder when the left are going to realise the more they moan about Boris and Burkas the more popular they're making him.

    Most of the moaning seems to be from other Tories.

    If he wants to follow Farage into the Shock Jock business then he should carry on, but if he wants a sensible discussion of Niqab, then perhaps avoiding gratuitous insults might help.

  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,314
    Anazina said:

    It is indeed ridiculous how effective Johnson has been in making it blow up
    He's not done anything since the article. He just set the outrage bus in motion ;)
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 50,819
    RobD said:

    He's not done anything since the article. He just set the outrage bus in motion ;)
    Then scarpered. He has made a habit of that, going missing immediately after the Brexit vote, and dodging meetings after Chequers.

    Its almost as if he has no integrity.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    There were requests for a post on a vision of post Brexit Uk from a leaver.

    Here's one.

    https://dominiccummings.com/2018/08/08/on-the-referendum-28-some-interesting-stuff-on-ai-ml-with-hopefully-implications-for-post-may-hammond-decisions/


    "After the abysmal May/Hammond interlude is over, hopefully some time between October 2018 — July 2019, its replacement will need to change course on almost every front from the NHS to how SW1 pours billions into the greedy paws of corporate looters via its appallingly managed >£200 BILLION annual contracting/procurement budget "
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,647
    Anazina said:

    They backed him up before the trial – I expect they will soon make a court appearance

    https://news.sky.com/story/ben-stokes-was-defending-us-from-homophobic-abuse-say-gay-men-11101889
    Yes but is it a defence?
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,314
    Foxy said:

    Then scarpered. He has made a habit of that, going missing immediately after the Brexit vote, and dodging meetings after Chequers.

    Its almost as if he has no integrity.
    He hasn't disavowed his piece, has he?
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    "Europe Elects
    @EuropeElects
    39m39 minutes ago

    UK, YouGov poll:

    EU membership referendum

    Remain: 53% (+1)
    Leave: 47% (-1)

    No deal scenario

    Remain: 56%
    Leave: 43%

    Field work: N/A
    Sample size: 10,000+"
  • RobD said:

    He hasn't disavowed his piece, has he?

    Drop a pebble into a pool and watch the ripples.

  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    TGOHF said:

    There were requests for a post on a vision of post Brexit Uk from a leaver.

    Here's one.

    https://dominiccummings.com/2018/08/08/on-the-referendum-28-some-interesting-stuff-on-ai-ml-with-hopefully-implications-for-post-may-hammond-decisions/


    "After the abysmal May/Hammond interlude is over, hopefully some time between October 2018 — July 2019, its replacement will need to change course on almost every front from the NHS to how SW1 pours billions into the greedy paws of corporate looters via its appallingly managed >£200 BILLION annual contracting/procurement budget "

    As always, it's like reading an early draft of a Unabomber manifesto.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,394
    Mr. JS, what was the polling pre-referendum?
  • TOPPING said:

    Yes but is it a defence?

    No but it is mitigation.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,647

    As always, it's like reading an early draft of a Unabomber manifesto.
    I forgot when I talked about great TV there was a fantastic series on the Unabomber. Netflix I think. With Paul Bettany.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 34,415

    King Cole, sounds like the sort of gift a wise and cultured man would give.

    Not sure if you’re being sarcastic, but it was my son-in-law’s gift!
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,647


    No but it is mitigation.
    Interesting thanks. You see someone insult someone else and can smack them.

    Does it work with are you disrespecting my bird?
  • AndyJS said:

    "Europe Elects
    @EuropeElects
    39m39 minutes ago

    UK, YouGov poll:

    EU membership referendum

    Remain: 53% (+1)
    Leave: 47% (-1)

    No deal scenario

    Remain: 56%
    Leave: 43%

    Field work: N/A
    Sample size: 10,000+"


    Fighting the last war.
  • Of all world leaders, it's Justin Trudeau who has the spine to stand up to Saudi Arabia's evil regime.

    https://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2018/08/08/justin-trudeau-vows-to-speak-out-on-human-rights-refuses-to-back-down-in-saudi-arabia-dispute.html

    Where are May, Merkel or Macron on this? Turning a blind eye to Islamist evil again.

    Meanwhile the press is more concerned with someone mocking burkas.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340


    Fighting the last war.
    Maybe.

    https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1027945926437089282
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,514

    As always, it's like reading an early draft of a Unabomber manifesto.
    :lol:
  • Maybe.

    https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1027945926437089282
    Both May and Corbyn have made clear there won't be a second one and neither has any interest in changing that position. Only May could be replaced before Brexit and it won't be in favour of someone more Remainey.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 38,370


    No but it is mitigation.
    Only, if he is found guilty. It doesn't assist him, when it comes to denying the charges.

  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,394
    King Cole, I may have bought an extremely similar gift for someone recently.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,514

    Maybe.

    https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1027945926437089282
    The direction of travel of support for a second referendum indicates a pent-up demand to rethink that probably isn't being fully reflected in the top-line Leave/Remain figures due to the taboo about contracting the will of the people.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,514

    Both May and Corbyn have made clear there won't be a second one and neither has any interest in changing that position. Only May could be replaced before Brexit and it won't be in favour of someone more Remainey.
    May has a clear interest in creating conditions where she were compelled to call a second referendum, and her party were compelled to support it. That way she can stay in power.
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 10,015
    RobD said:

    He's not done anything since the article. He just set the outrage bus in motion ;)
    What is it with Boris and buses?
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 38,370
    edited August 2018

    May has a clear interest in creating conditions where she were compelled to call a second referendum, and her party were compelled to support it. That way she can stay in power.
    May's problem in that situation is that 76% of Conservative voters support No Deal.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,514
    Sean_F said:

    May's problem in that situation is that 76% of Conservative voters support No Deal.
    They still see No Deal as a gesture of defiance rather than a policy. They will learn.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,967

    They still see No Deal as a gesture of defiance rather than a policy. They will learn.
    It is frightening that so many Tories/Leavers are still in nose-cutting-off mode as next March inexorably approaches. Will they only acquire some realism when it is too late?
  • They still see No Deal as a gesture of defiance rather than a policy. They will learn.
    No deal isn't a policy. It's the freedom to make policy.

    Besides, it's the EU that doesn't want a deal. The only options they are prepared to accept are full freedom of movement or a customs annexation of Northern Ireland.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 98,316
    It's not hard to see Corbyn climbing down on the definition. He's more flexible now than he used to be, and his core will back him (and be angry at the moderates for him) even if he does so, and it takes away a justification for further recriminations.
  • @DayTripper The reason why JRM and Boris are being considered for the Tory leadership among Conservative members in these polls, as well as Corbyn’s election, is because these people represent the worldview/ideology of said members. And, that ‘sensible’ Third Way style centrism has lost its popularity among electorates. Cable got picked partly because the LDs don’t have many great options. The same for UKIP,
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,514

    No deal isn't a policy. It's the freedom to make policy.

    Besides, it's the EU that doesn't want a deal. The only options they are prepared to accept are full freedom of movement or a customs annexation of Northern Ireland.
    How soon after a No Deal exit would there have to be a border poll in Northern Ireland?
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,647
    IanB2 said:

    It is frightening that so many Tories/Leavers are still in nose-cutting-off mode as next March inexorably approaches. Will they only acquire some realism when it is too late?
    They adore Boris and are mimicking his vote leave to stay in with a better deal strategy. They really do think that a no deal will bring the EU contrite back to the negotiating table.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    HYUFD said:

    Scottish Labour or the LDs if they move
    SCon voters are Brexiters. they aren't going to the LDs
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395

    Mr. JS, what was the polling pre-referendum?

    I'll try to find out. I'm mainly offline at the moment,=.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,394
    Mr. JS, hope that's for good reasons, rather than ill ones.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 54,245

    Both May and Corbyn have made clear there won't be a second one and neither has any interest in changing that position. Only May could be replaced before Brexit and it won't be in favour of someone more Remainey.
    +1
This discussion has been closed.