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I think the difference was a brilliant LibD campaign,based I guess on the tried and tested formula devised by "Jones The Vote" and Lord Rennard.On fertile soil,a good LD campaign is hard to beat and then they have the habit of not being able to get rid of,like bindweed.JackW said:AndyJS said:
Sorry to interrupt, but it voted 60% Remain, one of the highest outside the big cities. And it's next to Cambridge.JackW said:
Mike do you know why South Cambs has surged to the yellow peril ?MikeSmithson said:The LDs will end up gaining
S Cambs
Three Rivers
Richmond
Kingston
All from the Tories
Clearly but whilst that explains a useful platform it would mean that the LibDems would sweep all remain areas with ease or come close to doing so, and that hasn't happened.AndyJS said:
Sorry to interrupt, but it voted 60% Remain, one of the highest outside the big cities. And it's next to Cambridge.JackW said:
Mike do you know why South Cambs has surged to the yellow peril ?MikeSmithson said:The LDs will end up gaining
S Cambs
Three Rivers
Richmond
Kingston
All from the Tories0 -
Stalemate? Sorry but given everything that has happened since GE 2017 exit polls, these results (8 years in to a tory govt) are pretty good for the Tories and bad for the main opposition in areas of the country that are not exactly tory strongholds.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:The only conclusion I'm drawing from these results is that Lib/Lab/Con all need new leaders. If any of them could crack the leadership issue, it would at least break the stalemate.
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I think it's almost certain that if the Coalition had never happened I'd still be an unenthusiastic Conservative voter rather than an enthused and active Liberal Democrat member. The Coalition taught me that I'm a liberal without me actually changing any of my existing opinions.Alistair said:
It was popular with Conservatives. It wasn't popular with Lib Dem voters.Jonathan said:
The Lib Dems have not yet managed to find a response to the reality that the coalition was not popular.
The absolute conviction of Lib Dem MPs (and obvioulsy lots of former MPs) that the Coalition was popular with its voters and that its voters were demanding, nay champing at the bit for, a coalition with the Tories is the most insane collective delusion who's power over them I cannot explain.
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Lib Dem's back within 3 of Labour for gains. Tories now -20. 7 Councils to go.
And the Lib Dems overtake Labour: 63:62. Remarkable.0 -
Does anyone know the results from Kingston Upon Thames?0
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Do we have a split of the performance showing inside and outside of London? It was certainly looking like a game of two halves and it would be good to see how it does breakdown.DavidL said:Lib Dem's back within 3 of Labour for gains. Tories now -20. 7 Councils to go.
And the Lib Dems overtake Labour: 63:62. Remarkable.0 -
https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/992430871947956224SouthamObserver said:Ha, ha, ha ...
https://twitter.com/TheRedRoar/status/992427883284004869
maybe they will learn....doubt it tho....0 -
I see the Conservatives are taking Rosemary Carroll back in Pendle.
That's not something I would applaud.0 -
Isn't there a fable about a snake and a lion fighting but neither one being able to gain the advantage?Scott_P said:0 -
Does anyone know the actual London vote %s ?
We don't need to transpose those to NEV since the entirity of London is voting.
We can check the numbers vs opinion polls.
For instance even though Labour got nowhere near in Westminster they were actually only 2% behind on the vote.0 -
I suspect the LDs relative success is split fairly evenly. Outside London, they did well in Winchester, South Cambridgeshire, and Three Rivers, as well as making a few odd gains in places like Sunderland. And they lost a little ground in Eastleigh, where they'd been dominant.oxfordsimon said:
Do we have a split of the performance showing inside and outside of London? It was certainly looking like a game of two halves and it would be good to see how it does breakdown.DavidL said:Lib Dem's back within 3 of Labour for gains. Tories now -20. 7 Councils to go.
And the Lib Dems overtake Labour: 63:62. Remarkable.
In London, they fell back sharply in Sutton, but not enough to lose the council, while they did very well in Richmond and have taken a few random seats elsewhere. I don't have any indication of the Kingston vote yet, but my guess is they'll take it.0 -
I would 100% turn up at the cinema for it, though.Casino_Royale said:
Worst Gerard Butler sequel ever.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Crouch End has fallen.SouthamObserver said:Looks like Momentum's takeover has cost Labour seats in Haringey.
I see the affluent Haringey wards are all going LD - Muswell Hill etc.0 -
LD potential comeback in Hornsey and Wood Green viable long term ?AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
I would 100% turn up at the cinema for it, though.Casino_Royale said:
Worst Gerard Butler sequel ever.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Crouch End has fallen.SouthamObserver said:Looks like Momentum's takeover has cost Labour seats in Haringey.
I see the affluent Haringey wards are all going LD - Muswell Hill etc.0 -
I've been following the Kingston (my home town) results on the council's website. The LDs are giving the Tories (and Labour) the dockside hooker treatment. LDs now on 24 councillors against 6 Conservatives. One more win will give the LDs overall control.rcs1000 said:
I suspect the LDs relative success is split fairly evenly. Outside London, they did well in Winchester, South Cambridgeshire, and Three Rivers, as well as making a few odd gains in places like Sunderland. And they lost a little ground in Eastleigh, where they'd been dominant.oxfordsimon said:
Do we have a split of the performance showing inside and outside of London? It was certainly looking like a game of two halves and it would be good to see how it does breakdown.DavidL said:Lib Dem's back within 3 of Labour for gains. Tories now -20. 7 Councils to go.
And the Lib Dems overtake Labour: 63:62. Remarkable.
In London, they fell back sharply in Sutton, but not enough to lose the council, while they did very well in Richmond and have taken a few random seats elsewhere. I don't have any indication of the Kingston vote yet, but my guess is they'll take it.
I know SW London is Remainy but has the previously Tory-controlled council cocked something up spectacularly to get these results?0 -
Yep, the collapse of UKIP has twisted the traditional swingometer well out of shape. Lead is now 5 for the Lib Dems and only 5 councils left.rcs1000 said:
It's remarkable in the context of them being the only one of the big two and a half to be down in the opinion polls from 2014.DavidL said:Lib Dem's back within 3 of Labour for gains. Tories now -20. 7 Councils to go.
And the Lib Dems overtake Labour: 63:62. Remarkable.0 -
LibDems have already won 27 seats in Kingston out of 48 so it is LibDem gain. Doesn't seem to be reported anywhere.rcs1000 said:
I suspect the LDs relative success is split fairly evenly. Outside London, they did well in Winchester, South Cambridgeshire, and Three Rivers, as well as making a few odd gains in places like Sunderland. And they lost a little ground in Eastleigh, where they'd been dominant.oxfordsimon said:
Do we have a split of the performance showing inside and outside of London? It was certainly looking like a game of two halves and it would be good to see how it does breakdown.DavidL said:Lib Dem's back within 3 of Labour for gains. Tories now -20. 7 Councils to go.
And the Lib Dems overtake Labour: 63:62. Remarkable.
In London, they fell back sharply in Sutton, but not enough to lose the council, while they did very well in Richmond and have taken a few random seats elsewhere. I don't have any indication of the Kingston vote yet, but my guess is they'll take it.
EDIT: LibDems now on 33 seats
https://moderngov.kingston.gov.uk/mgElectionResults.aspx?ID=17&RPID=15393990
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Yes Tories must not be complacent in Greater London, it's not all about winning marginals.Pulpstar said:Does anyone know the actual London vote %s ?
We don't need to transpose those to NEV since the entirity of London is voting.
We can check the numbers vs opinion polls.
For instance even though Labour got nowhere near in Westminster they were actually only 2% behind on the vote.0 -
Not up on the LondonCouncils website yet, where from the looks of it the total list of london results will be put up once all are in.rcs1000 said:Does anyone know the results from Kingston Upon Thames?
https://www.londoncouncils.gov.uk/who-runs-london/london-local-elections/past-results0 -
Now 8. I think it is now highly likely that they will be the top winners of the night. Really didn't see that coming.DavidL said:
Yep, the collapse of UKIP has twisted the traditional swingometer well out of shape. Lead is now 5 for the Lib Dems and only 5 councils left.rcs1000 said:
It's remarkable in the context of them being the only one of the big two and a half to be down in the opinion polls from 2014.DavidL said:Lib Dem's back within 3 of Labour for gains. Tories now -20. 7 Councils to go.
And the Lib Dems overtake Labour: 63:62. Remarkable.0 -
Now LD 33/6 Con with 9 seats to declare. https://moderngov.kingston.gov.uk/mgElectionResults.aspx?ID=17&RPID=15393990Barnesian said:
LibDems have already won 27 seats in Kingston out of 48 so it is LibDem gain. Doesn't seem to be reported anywhere.rcs1000 said:
I suspect the LDs relative success is split fairly evenly. Outside London, they did well in Winchester, South Cambridgeshire, and Three Rivers, as well as making a few odd gains in places like Sunderland. And they lost a little ground in Eastleigh, where they'd been dominant.oxfordsimon said:
Do we have a split of the performance showing inside and outside of London? It was certainly looking like a game of two halves and it would be good to see how it does breakdown.DavidL said:Lib Dem's back within 3 of Labour for gains. Tories now -20. 7 Councils to go.
And the Lib Dems overtake Labour: 63:62. Remarkable.
In London, they fell back sharply in Sutton, but not enough to lose the council, while they did very well in Richmond and have taken a few random seats elsewhere. I don't have any indication of the Kingston vote yet, but my guess is they'll take it.0 -
I know you didn't say it showed him as a sexist - but that was the point of the Mail story, not about his flashes of anger. He's nastier than Corbyn for instance, we already knew that.oxfordsimon said:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b0b16sfx/election-2018-part-one - watch from 2 hours 10 minutes - that shows all that happens.kle4 said:
So nothing really to back up purported sexism, just the (entirely unsurprising) point that he's an arsehole, and would act to try to prevent people saying things he doesn't like?oxfordsimon said:
It just shows what Perry was trying to say and what prompted him to get shouty and pointy. It makes it far clearly what he was trying to prevent being said live on air.kle4 said:
If the full context makes McDonnell look worse, then I do wonder why the Mail didn't include it - unable to?oxfordsimon said:
The video doesn't show the 2 minutes leading up to this incident - it does help to view it in full context.kle4 said:
He may well be a sexist, but politicians of any gender talk over each other all the time, so that is hardly evidence of it even if he is.Floater said:
and talking over her to be fairWilliam_H said:
That's impressively misleading reporting. McDonnell didn't say that, Perry complained about him making gestures.FrancisUrquhart said:Does McIRA have a problem with women?
'Get back in your box woman'
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5690493/John-McDonnell-Claire-Perry-air-election-row.html
I seemed to remember Dave saying "calm down dear" in PMQs and it being a national scandal....
I truly don't like defending John McDonnell, and he has earned plenty of justifiable attacks for things he has said and done, but talking over Perry and holding out a hand is not really the same as him saying 'get back in your box, woman'. Do we seriously think if it had been a man saying the same things as Perry he would not have tried talking over them and holding out a hand?
As I said, he might be a sexist, but even for a newspaper headline I think the Mail have stretched the presentation a bit too much there, giving the appearance of a direct, blatantly sexist quote.
I didn't say it showed him as being sexist - but you see the sudden flash of anger and that is what is unacceptable.0 -
https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/992431401994776576AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
I would 100% turn up at the cinema for it, though.Casino_Royale said:
Worst Gerard Butler sequel ever.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Crouch End has fallen.SouthamObserver said:Looks like Momentum's takeover has cost Labour seats in Haringey.
I see the affluent Haringey wards are all going LD - Muswell Hill etc.0 -
RBK now LD 36 / Con 6.0
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Looks like their best ever in the council, if I am not mistaken - a very positive result for them.Barnesian said:
LibDems have already won 27 seats in Kingston out of 48 so it is LibDem gain. Doesn't seem to be reported anywhere.rcs1000 said:
I suspect the LDs relative success is split fairly evenly. Outside London, they did well in Winchester, South Cambridgeshire, and Three Rivers, as well as making a few odd gains in places like Sunderland. And they lost a little ground in Eastleigh, where they'd been dominant.oxfordsimon said:
Do we have a split of the performance showing inside and outside of London? It was certainly looking like a game of two halves and it would be good to see how it does breakdown.DavidL said:Lib Dem's back within 3 of Labour for gains. Tories now -20. 7 Councils to go.
And the Lib Dems overtake Labour: 63:62. Remarkable.
In London, they fell back sharply in Sutton, but not enough to lose the council, while they did very well in Richmond and have taken a few random seats elsewhere. I don't have any indication of the Kingston vote yet, but my guess is they'll take it.
EDIT: LibDems now on 33 seats
https://moderngov.kingston.gov.uk/mgElectionResults.aspx?ID=17&RPID=15393990
https://www.londoncouncils.gov.uk/node/336320 -
Huge numbers of independents in Havering, I see - 8 Hornchurch Residents Association, 6 Upminster and Cranham Residents Association, and a couple more residents groups in the mix too, to prevent the Tories taking control.0
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Kingston - 36 LibDems .. 6 Con .. 6 results to come.rcs1000 said:Does anyone know the results from Kingston Upon Thames?
https://moderngov.kingston.gov.uk/mgElectionResults.aspx?ID=17&RPID=153939900 -
It'll take a long time to add up all the wards. I did it in a couple of days in 2014 but I'm not doing it again, lol.Pulpstar said:Does anyone know the actual London vote %s ?
We don't need to transpose those to NEV since the entirity of London is voting.
We can check the numbers vs opinion polls.
For instance even though Labour got nowhere near in Westminster they were actually only 2% behind on the vote.0 -
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Did Sandy ever reveal how they got on?
And the rest of the PB crowd standing yesterday of course?0 -
Hard to say, the LD vote had been on the slide since 2005, and the seat does contain wards like Noel Park, which are more solid for Lab.Pulpstar said:
LD potential comeback in Hornsey and Wood Green viable long term ?AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
I would 100% turn up at the cinema for it, though.Casino_Royale said:
Worst Gerard Butler sequel ever.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Crouch End has fallen.SouthamObserver said:Looks like Momentum's takeover has cost Labour seats in Haringey.
I see the affluent Haringey wards are all going LD - Muswell Hill etc.0 -
A tiny swing to him, but soundly beaten I beleive he said.kle4 said:Did SandyRentool ever reveal how they got on?
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The remaining two wards are Tory stronghodls so likely the final result will be LD 36 (+18), Con 12 (-15), Lab 0 (-2), Oth 0 (-1).JackW said:
Kingston - 36 LibDems .. 6 Con .. 6 results to come.rcs1000 said:Does anyone know the results from Kingston Upon Thames?
https://moderngov.kingston.gov.uk/mgElectionResults.aspx?ID=17&RPID=153939900 -
Only if the SNP and LDs prop him upbigjohnowls said:BBC LAB 283 CON 280
JEZZA is PM0 -
IndeedSlackbladder said:
A tiny swing to him, but soundly beaten I beleive he said.kle4 said:Did SandyRentool ever reveal how they got on?
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The Tories have so got away with this. Lib Dems +69, Labour +60, Tories -23. On what planet are these good results?0
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Shows what a focus on NIMBYISM and potholes can achieve!rcs1000 said:
It's remarkable in the context of them being the only one of the big two and a half to be down in the opinion polls from 2014.DavidL said:Lib Dem's back within 3 of Labour for gains. Tories now -20. 7 Councils to go.
And the Lib Dems overtake Labour: 63:62. Remarkable.0 -
I should add that there was one ward in Craven where we doubled our vote and gave the Tories a bit of a scare. Close but no cigar.0
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It amuses me watching television on the election results and peoples interpretation of the results.
6 - 8 weeks ago I had convinced myself to vote Labour.
Then Russia and Syria changed my mind, I thought I am not voting Labour after Corbyn's misguided comments and positions on these issues. The media coverage of Labour in the period before yesterdays vote indicated that Labour were likely to make sweeping gains. I therefore voted Tory despite my antipathy toward Brexit as a means of stopping Labour getting a massive boost through electoral success. I managed to persuade two more voters that I know well to cast a vote for the Tories despite Brexit reservations about the party as they too were remain supporters but wanted to make sure Corbyn did not truimph. My point being the only reason why I and two others voted Tory yesterday was to stop Corbyn. How many other Tories who voted remain in 2016 did likewise? All this nonsense about the Tories getting support for being the Brexit party seems misplaced IMO and the pundits might well be misreading the result in their attempts to form a narrative.0 -
I see Justin Hinchcliffe has been elected as a Lib Dem in Haringey. I'm not sure the Lib Dems were wise to let him join.Pulpstar said:
LD potential comeback in Hornsey and Wood Green viable long term ?AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
I would 100% turn up at the cinema for it, though.Casino_Royale said:
Worst Gerard Butler sequel ever.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Crouch End has fallen.SouthamObserver said:Looks like Momentum's takeover has cost Labour seats in Haringey.
I see the affluent Haringey wards are all going LD - Muswell Hill etc.0 -
The six pending results are for Tudor and Coombe Vale. These both had very large Tory majorities but it looks as if there are recounts for them.JackW said:
Kingston - 36 LibDems .. 6 Con .. 6 results to come.rcs1000 said:Does anyone know the results from Kingston Upon Thames?
https://moderngov.kingston.gov.uk/mgElectionResults.aspx?ID=17&RPID=153939900 -
For a government, they're pretty decent results after 8 years. Think how many seats Labour were losing in each round of local elections after 8 years in office.DavidL said:The Tories have so got away with this. Lib Dems +69, Labour +60, Tories -23. On what planet are these good results?
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Stunning result for the Lib Dems in Kingston. Zac is toast next time out.0
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Yeah, but their opponent is Jeremy Corbyn though.Sean_F said:
For a government, they're pretty decent results after 8 years. Think how many seats Labour were losing in each round of local elections after 8 years in office.DavidL said:The Tories have so got away with this. Lib Dems +69, Labour +60, Tories -23. On what planet are these good results?
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0
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Kingston now 37 LibDem .. 8 Con .. 3 to come.0
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It also gets the WHOLE (Not just thirds) of London & Birmingham out the way for another 4 years.Sean_F said:
For a government, they're pretty decent results after 8 years. Think how many seats Labour were losing in each round of local elections after 8 years in office.DavidL said:The Tories have so got away with this. Lib Dems +69, Labour +60, Tories -23. On what planet are these good results?
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Not if the LDs put up Olney again. She should be facing trial not appearing as a LD spokespersonDavidL said:Stunning result for the Lib Dems in Kingston. Zac is toast next time out.
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There is that.The_Apocalypse said:
Yeah, but their opponent is Jeremy Corbyn though.Sean_F said:
For a government, they're pretty decent results after 8 years. Think how many seats Labour were losing in each round of local elections after 8 years in office.DavidL said:The Tories have so got away with this. Lib Dems +69, Labour +60, Tories -23. On what planet are these good results?
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I really think you are overreacting. Yes, the conservative party is too, parties spin after all, but as Professor Curtice has said it is a credible performance for a party that is in government. Add in the holding of several councils that there was at least a decent chance they could have lost, and even though they also lost a couple in a big way, and it is decent.DavidL said:The Tories have so got away with this. Lib Dems +69, Labour +60, Tories -23. On what planet are these good results?
So on planet earth those are relatively good results, considering they are 8 years in power and considering the sorts of numbers seen in some london polling. What they are not is great results. Like some Corbynites so overjoyed by Corbyn's good showing in June 2017 and saying things like he won the election, which he demonstrably did not, there was a kernel of truth in that it was a relatively good night for Labour, given the expectations, which are not irrelevant. And there is a kernel of truth that these numbers are relatively good results for the Tories, given the expectations.
The context of the Tory performance means they did ok overall, and decently in several places.0 -
Emily Thornberry is trying to LabSplain voting behaviour to John Curtice on the Beeb right now.
Time to open a bottle.0 -
I think Harrow is currently Labour 34, Con 26, with these three still to declare. Close but no cigar for the Conservatives.AndyJS said:It must be very close in Kenton East:
https://twitter.com/harrow_council/status/9924370743127367700 -
Ms. Apocalypse, true, but then, the Conservative leader is hardly the reincarnation of Alexander the Great.0
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In Richmond it was the Tories who focused on dustbins and potholes. They were desperate not to talk about national issues such as Brexit or even Heaathrow 3rd runway or the chaos in Downing St.HYUFD said:
Shows what a focus on NIMBYISM and potholes can achieve!rcs1000 said:
It's remarkable in the context of them being the only one of the big two and a half to be down in the opinion polls from 2014.DavidL said:Lib Dem's back within 3 of Labour for gains. Tories now -20. 7 Councils to go.
And the Lib Dems overtake Labour: 63:62. Remarkable.
When knocking up, I was called over by one elderly gent who was in his garden. He wasn't on my supporters list. He said "I've always voted Conservative but how on earth can I vote for this Government. They're useless and falling apart. I've voted for you".0 -
Labour lost 319 seats in the 2006 local elections the year after Blair's 3rd election victory and where the same wards were up as this yearDavidL said:The Tories have so got away with this. Lib Dems +69, Labour +60, Tories -23. On what planet are these good results?
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Perfect scenario for the SNP to scupper effective Govt. unless it gets another referendum....HYUFD said:
Only if the SNP and LDs prop him upbigjohnowls said:BBC LAB 283 CON 280
JEZZA is PM0 -
A bare handful of councils left to declare, any likely to change hands? The Tories would dearly love to at least be no worse than Labour in terms of overall council losses.0
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Which Parliament would likely block but on these numbers Corbyn would need the LDs tooMarqueeMark said:
Perfect scenario for the SNP to scupper effective Govt. unless it gets another referendum....HYUFD said:
Only if the SNP and LDs prop him upbigjohnowls said:BBC LAB 283 CON 280
JEZZA is PM0 -
Is heidi Alexander stepping down tonight? overall results very much in line with the demographic shifts we've seen over recent years. Labour results in Redditch swindon Newcastle under lyme etc not good for a party aspiring to government.0
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I thought all the metropolitan boroughs (the districts of the former metropolitan counties) elected by thirds, unless there's been a re-warding, and didn't have the option of election by whole.Pulpstar said:
It also gets the WHOLE (Not just thirds) of London & Birmingham out the way for another 4 years.Sean_F said:
For a government, they're pretty decent results after 8 years. Think how many seats Labour were losing in each round of local elections after 8 years in office.DavidL said:The Tories have so got away with this. Lib Dems +69, Labour +60, Tories -23. On what planet are these good results?
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Anyone know if tissue price was standing.0
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Richmond Park though is an oasis of Remainia which voted over 70% Remain in a country which voted 52% Leave in other areas Brexit hampered the LDs. I know one voter here in Essex went up to the LD teller and told her 'Why is a so called Liberal Democrat Party unable to accept a democratic decision?' Round here it is stopping building on the greenbelt and potholes that gets LD voters out not stopping BrexitBarnesian said:
In Richmond it was the Tories who focused on dustbins and potholes. They were desperate not to talk about national issues such as Brexit or even Heaathrow 3rd runway or the chaos in Downing St.HYUFD said:
Shows what a focus on NIMBYISM and potholes can achieve!rcs1000 said:
It's remarkable in the context of them being the only one of the big two and a half to be down in the opinion polls from 2014.DavidL said:Lib Dem's back within 3 of Labour for gains. Tories now -20. 7 Councils to go.
And the Lib Dems overtake Labour: 63:62. Remarkable.
When knocking up, I was called over by one elderly gent who was in his garden. He wasn't on my supporters list. He said "I've always voted Conservative but how on earth can I vote for this Government. They're useless and falling apart. I've voted for you".-1 -
I think these elections were the reverse of last years in that people voted to stop a party getting a runaway victory. Last year I am convinced that a Tory landslide being forecast by pundits prior to polling day enraged enough Labour support to turn out to stop it. This year I suspect the Tories benefited from it due to Corbyn's toxicity and likelihood of a triumph. Voters don't trust politicians and they seem to want to stop any party dominating like Labour did from 1997 onwards or the Tories in the 1980s IMO.kle4 said:
I really think you are overreacting. Yes, the conservative party is too, parties spin after all, but as Professor Curtice has said it is a credible performance for a party that is in government. Add in the holding of several councils that there was at least a decent chance they could have lost, and even though they also lost a couple in a big way, and it is decent.DavidL said:The Tories have so got away with this. Lib Dems +69, Labour +60, Tories -23. On what planet are these good results?
So on planet earth those are relatively good results, considering they are 8 years in power and considering the sorts of numbers seen in some london polling. What they are not is great results. Like some Corbynites so overjoyed by Corbyn's good showing in June 2017 and saying things like he won the election, which he demonstrably did not, there was a kernel of truth in that it was a relatively good night for Labour, given the expectations, which are not irrelevant. And there is a kernel of truth that these numbers are relatively good results for the Tories, given the expectations.
The context of the Tory performance means they did ok overall, and decently in several places.0 -
Almost half of the LDs seats are in Scotland, they probably wouldn’t dare block it.HYUFD said:
Which Parliament would likely block but on these numbers Corbyn would need the LDs tooMarqueeMark said:
Perfect scenario for the SNP to scupper effective Govt. unless it gets another referendum....HYUFD said:
Only if the SNP and LDs prop him upbigjohnowls said:BBC LAB 283 CON 280
JEZZA is PM
Important to bear in mind that only a very slight fall in Tory vote in the next GE will see them removed from office, even if they are replaced with another minority administration0 -
It's possible, although I would have thought the impact would have been less for locals, since not all local labour parties are going to be in the Corbynite mould, if that is a concern for peopleThe_Taxman said:
I think these elections were the reverse of last years in that people voted to stop a party getting a runaway victory. Last year I am convinced that a Tory landslide being forecast by pundits prior to polling day enraged enough Labour support to turn out to stop it. This year I suspect the Tories benefited from it due to Corbyn's toxicity and likelihood of a triumph. Voters don't trust politicians and they seem to want to stop any party dominating like Labour did from 1997 onwards or the Tories in the 1980s IMO.kle4 said:
I really think you are overreacting. Yes, the conservative party is too, parties spin after all, but as Professor Curtice has said it is a credible performance for a party that is in government. Add in the holding of several councils that there was at least a decent chance they could have lost, and even though they also lost a couple in a big way, and it is decent.DavidL said:The Tories have so got away with this. Lib Dems +69, Labour +60, Tories -23. On what planet are these good results?
So on planet earth those are relatively good results, considering they are 8 years in power and considering the sorts of numbers seen in some london polling. What they are not is great results. Like some Corbynites so overjoyed by Corbyn's good showing in June 2017 and saying things like he won the election, which he demonstrably did not, there was a kernel of truth in that it was a relatively good night for Labour, given the expectations, which are not irrelevant. And there is a kernel of truth that these numbers are relatively good results for the Tories, given the expectations.
The context of the Tory performance means they did ok overall, and decently in several places.0 -
I know Birmingham is going to all up elections from now on. There seems to be a trend away from elections by thirds, although I'm not sure why. Perhaps a cost saving exercise?rpjs said:
I thought all the metropolitan boroughs (the districts of the former metropolitan counties) elected by thirds, unless there's been a re-warding, and didn't have the option of election by whole.Pulpstar said:
It also gets the WHOLE (Not just thirds) of London & Birmingham out the way for another 4 years.Sean_F said:
For a government, they're pretty decent results after 8 years. Think how many seats Labour were losing in each round of local elections after 8 years in office.DavidL said:The Tories have so got away with this. Lib Dems +69, Labour +60, Tories -23. On what planet are these good results?
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Presumably - though personally I think it’s a bad thing. Good to have some continuity in governance.RobD said:
I know Birmingham is going to all up elections from now on. There seems to be a trend away from elections by thirds, although I'm not sure why. Perhaps a cost saving exercise?rpjs said:
I thought all the metropolitan boroughs (the districts of the former metropolitan counties) elected by thirds, unless there's been a re-warding, and didn't have the option of election by whole.Pulpstar said:
It also gets the WHOLE (Not just thirds) of London & Birmingham out the way for another 4 years.Sean_F said:
For a government, they're pretty decent results after 8 years. Think how many seats Labour were losing in each round of local elections after 8 years in office.DavidL said:The Tories have so got away with this. Lib Dems +69, Labour +60, Tories -23. On what planet are these good results?
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Yes it makes sense.RobD said:
I know Birmingham is going to all up elections from now on. There seems to be a trend away from elections by thirds, although I'm not sure why. Perhaps a cost saving exercise?rpjs said:
I thought all the metropolitan boroughs (the districts of the former metropolitan counties) elected by thirds, unless there's been a re-warding, and didn't have the option of election by whole.Pulpstar said:
It also gets the WHOLE (Not just thirds) of London & Birmingham out the way for another 4 years.Sean_F said:
For a government, they're pretty decent results after 8 years. Think how many seats Labour were losing in each round of local elections after 8 years in office.DavidL said:The Tories have so got away with this. Lib Dems +69, Labour +60, Tories -23. On what planet are these good results?
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8 years in to the Blair government, Labour had lost 4000 councillors compared to 1997.DavidL said:The Tories have so got away with this. Lib Dems +69, Labour +60, Tories -23. On what planet are these good results?
8 years in to this Tory run, including the coalition, they've lost fewer than 400.
It can be dangerous to compare to expectations too much, but completely refusing to look at context is equally foolish.0 -
They do seem to forget that sometimes. Corbyn's vote might go down, but the Tories don't have much wiggle room, and after 12 years in power might be reliant on the StopCorbyn factor being just as strong as before, or even stronger, to counter the inevitably stronger 'time for a change' factor.not_on_fire said:
Almost half of the LDs seats are in Scotland, they probably wouldn’t dare block it.HYUFD said:
Which Parliament would likely block but on these numbers Corbyn would need the LDs tooMarqueeMark said:
Perfect scenario for the SNP to scupper effective Govt. unless it gets another referendum....HYUFD said:
Only if the SNP and LDs prop him upbigjohnowls said:BBC LAB 283 CON 280
JEZZA is PM
Important to bear in mind that only a very slight fall in Tory vote in the next GE will see them removed from office, even if they are replaced with another minority administration0 -
LOL at the last line of this analysis: https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/elections/2018/05/what-do-2018-local-elections-actually-tell-us-about-next-general-election?amp&__twitter_impression=true0
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Westminster CC: Con 42.8% Lab 41.1%. Seats Con 41 Lab 19. Some gerrymandering !0
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It's minus 23 out of 8,807.maaarsh said:
8 years in to the Blair government, Labour had lost 4000 councillors compared to 1997.DavidL said:The Tories have so got away with this. Lib Dems +69, Labour +60, Tories -23. On what planet are these good results?
8 years in to this Tory run, including the coalition, they've lost fewer than 400.
It can be dangerous to compare to expectations too much, but completely refusing to look at context is equally foolish.0 -
Why not? 55% of Scots opposed independence remember including all the LDs Scottish seats.not_on_fire said:
Almost half of the LDs seats are in Scotland, they probably wouldn’t dare block it.HYUFD said:
Which Parliament would likely block but on these numbers Corbyn would need the LDs tooMarqueeMark said:
Perfect scenario for the SNP to scupper effective Govt. unless it gets another referendum....HYUFD said:
Only if the SNP and LDs prop him upbigjohnowls said:BBC LAB 283 CON 280
JEZZA is PM
Important to bear in mind that only a very slight fall in Tory vote in the next GE will see them removed from office, even if they are replaced with another minority administration
Several Labour MPs would also likely vote against another independence referendum and almost all the Tories and the DUP0 -
That's the argument, but most colleagues of mine in local government find it a right hassle, particularly in closely fought councils like Swindon which means they are permanently on a war footing.not_on_fire said:
Presumably - though personally I think it’s a bad thing. Good to have some continuity in governance.RobD said:
I know Birmingham is going to all up elections from now on. There seems to be a trend away from elections by thirds, although I'm not sure why. Perhaps a cost saving exercise?rpjs said:
I thought all the metropolitan boroughs (the districts of the former metropolitan counties) elected by thirds, unless there's been a re-warding, and didn't have the option of election by whole.Pulpstar said:
It also gets the WHOLE (Not just thirds) of London & Birmingham out the way for another 4 years.Sean_F said:
For a government, they're pretty decent results after 8 years. Think how many seats Labour were losing in each round of local elections after 8 years in office.DavidL said:The Tories have so got away with this. Lib Dems +69, Labour +60, Tories -23. On what planet are these good results?
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Even the greatest of reincarnated-legends can have a crap spell you know. Corbyn is clearly Aethelred, and he's looked far too ready for anyone's liking. Mrs May will I'm sure shortly launch us upon a programme of expansion into the forsaken (Europe cut off by Brexit) territories, and Corbyn's preparedness will be seen as an utter sham when he confesses it's unlikely that he'll be able to tie his shoelaces by Xmas.Morris_Dancer said:Ms. Apocalypse, true, but then, the Conservative leader is hardly the reincarnation of Alexander the Great.
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The number of councillors are much fewer than then.maaarsh said:
8 years in to the Blair government, Labour had lost 4000 councillors compared to 1997.DavidL said:The Tories have so got away with this. Lib Dems +69, Labour +60, Tories -23. On what planet are these good results?
8 years in to this Tory run, including the coalition, they've lost fewer than 400.
It can be dangerous to compare to expectations too much, but completely refusing to look at context is equally foolish.0 -
Do we add all three party candidates' votes in multimember wards?0
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Important game in Indore, if Mumbai win it leaves the competition wide open.0
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Important game in Indore, if Mumbai win it leaves the competition wide open.0
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The Local Government Boundary Commission for England makes decisions on such things (or rather recommends them to parliament, which can only accept or reject them, not amend them), and they accept representations from everyone, and will pick and mix from the submissions they receive, and the main factor is electoral equality (though community identity and cohesion is relevant up to a point) so no, not gerrymandering.surby said:Westminster CC: Con 42.8% Lab 41.1%. Seats Con 41 Lab 19. Some gerrymandering !
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We're eight years into government, we've implemented austerity policies, we've cut local government grants quite significantly and in London we're implementing a locally very unpopular policy.DavidL said:The Tories have so got away with this. Lib Dems +69, Labour +60, Tories -23. On what planet are these good results?
Considering all that, we've held on to 98% of our councillors. In the equivalent election in 2006 (9 years into the last Labour government) Labour lost 17% of all their seats and Dave led us to over 300 gains that night vs probably about 80 for Corbyn tonight.
Overall, we've got a C grade. It's a pass, but there is huge room for improvement.0 -
LOL. Feels like a line written after a long night.The_Apocalypse said:0 -
Did we ever get a projected national share of the vote?0
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Even correcting for that, they went from ~48% down to ~22% of the number of councillors.surby said:
The number of councillors are much fewer than then.maaarsh said:
8 years in to the Blair government, Labour had lost 4000 councillors compared to 1997.DavidL said:The Tories have so got away with this. Lib Dems +69, Labour +60, Tories -23. On what planet are these good results?
8 years in to this Tory run, including the coalition, they've lost fewer than 400.
It can be dangerous to compare to expectations too much, but completely refusing to look at context is equally foolish.
https://i2.wp.com/commonslibrary.parliament.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/Party-affiliation-of-local-councillors-in-Great-Britain.png0 -
I don't live there. But is it strong Tory ? What happened in Norbiton and St. Marks ?not_on_fire said:
Edit: Just looked at the council website. It seems the LDs hammered the Tories.0 -
David Lammy is correct .Voter ID is Jim Crow writ large.0
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Looking at the historical results on the RBK website, there's only been two instances of non-LDs (both Tories) being elected in Chessington (both in Chessington North and Hook Rise ward) since 2002.not_on_fire said:0
This discussion has been closed.