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murali_s said:

Scott_P said:

https://twitter.com/montie/status/927592762316349442

Politics is truly broken. A people's revolution anyone?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jsCR05oKROA

MarqueeMark said:

23% other - that is hiding the next Leader.....

+1

Tykejohnno said:

murali_s said:

Scott_P said:

https://twitter.com/montie/status/927592762316349442

Politics is truly broken. A people's revolution anyone?

We had one,it was called the EU referendum and we won.

Revolutions are often followed by further revolution.

(That said I don't think the EU vote was one, nor do I think another one is necessary)

Lol, Dermot Desmond being chased by the BBC about tax avoidance. The next day he fired off a letter to the reporter beginning with 'Are you a Rangers supporter?'.

Generally the narrative seems to have moved on from 'There's nothing crooked about using tax avoidance vehicles' to 'I am not avoiding tax by using these tax avoidance vehicles'.

@DPJHodges: What does the fact Ministers can meet heads of state behind the PM's back with impunity do for her credibility in Brexit negotiations.

Scott_P said:

The stench of death surrounding this government is overwhelming, yet the zombie cabinet lurches on, necrotizing everything it touches

A description like that is the only thing that makes the government look like it is doing ok, since it is so over the top, and half the things happening at present are not even only government issues.

Scott_P said:

The stench of death surrounding this government is overwhelming, yet the zombie cabinet lurches on, necrotizing everything it touches

Necrotizing Brexititis is a fatal condition that would afflict any government attempting to leave the EU on a slim mandate based on a false prospectus.

Most likely it will be Davis v Rudd Tory MPs put to the membership, certainly if May goes before Brexit is completed.

I think Boris or JRM are more likely to take over in opposition as Tory leader than be the next PM.

Scott_P said:

https://twitter.com/stuartmillar159/status/927607312851918848

Terrible for the family, but if his remarks do lead to an increase in her sentence, with his remarks the official reason, that surely would be a resignation offence.

kle4 said:

A description like that is the only thing that makes the government look like it is doing ok, since it is so over the top, and half the things happening at present are not even only government issues.

Please give us a comprehensive list of the things this Government has done, and not monumentally fucked up, this year...

I'll wait.

kle4 said:

Scott_P said:

https://twitter.com/stuartmillar159/status/927607312851918848

Terrible for the family, but if his remarks do lead to an increase in her sentence, with his remarks the official reason, that surely would be a resignation offence.

I wonder if they're upset because Boris has inadvertently told the truth...

An interesting comparison in the US of left vs right in reaction to tragedies -

Exhibit A - a man using a pickup truck to mow people down in NYC is revealed to have been admitted on a Lottery visa, and having apparently brought a further 23 people in due to chain migration. At the first conservative mention of the need to review immigration policy, the lefties immediately opine that "this is not the time to politicize a tragedy."

Exhibit B - a man carrying an assault rifle and wearing body armor enters a church and kills over 25 people and injures many others. IMMEDIATELY the lefties invoke gun control in full cry. When questioned as to whether their suggested remedies would have stopped this particular crime they admit not. Yet they still push the same ideas at every opportunity - extended background checks etc.

The 'problem' for the lefties is that most of the US shootouts used legally obtained weapons.

Beverley_C said:

MarqueeMark said:

Beverley_C said:

MarqueeMark said:

23% other - that is hiding the next Leader.....

Maybe not. Maybe they expressed likings for 23 other candidates @ 1% each.

But someone within that 23% will be who they coalesce around. Basically, the messge is "skip a generation...."

Sorry - I edited it and added some extras.....

Noted. But there is still 65% of the membership for somebody other than Johnson or Rees-Mogg. I still think new broom will win out. But much depends upon when the job becomes vacant on the Brexit time-line.

williamglenn said:

Scott_P said:

The stench of death surrounding this government is overwhelming, yet the zombie cabinet lurches on, necrotizing everything it touches

Necrotizing Brexititis is a fatal condition that would afflict any government attempting to leave the EU on a slim mandate based on a false prospectus.

Thanks for pointing out the real issue with Scott.

Scott's number issue is brexit and how to stop it,if that means getting rid of this Tory government, so be it.

Scott_P said:

kle4 said:

A description like that is the only thing that makes the government look like it is doing ok, since it is so over the top, and half the things happening at present are not even only government issues.

Please give us a comprehensive list of the things this Government has done, and not monumentally fucked up, this year...

I'll wait.

I didn't say they were doing well, so no thanks. I said your, albeit amusing, over the top description is the only thing that makes them look like they are doing ok. Since you can read, you can presumably see that is saying they are not doing well, merely that your overdoing is the only think making it almost seem like it is.

And also that half the things happening now are not government only issues, which is true without saying the government is doing ok.

Perhaps save the indignant response for someone who is arguing the government has done great.

I'll wait.

FPT:

kle4 said:

The_Apocalypse said:

Scott_P said:

https://twitter.com/montie/status/927592762316349442

Hope we see this gain the kind of attention the ‘sex’ scandal has. How awful.

I hope it is not a real life Armando Ianucci show - as entertaining as his shows are, if there was even a 10% basis in fact in how horribly people in politics, elected or not, treat each other and underlings, it would be an absolute disgrace and I could not put up with it myself.

Agreed. I don’t know how anyone could put up with such behaviour on a frequent basis.

Tim_B said:

An interesting comparison in the US of left vs right in reaction to tragedies -

Exhibit A - a man using a pickup truck to mow people down in NYC is revealed to have been admitted on a Lottery visa, and having apparently brought a further 23 people in due to chain migration. At the first conservative mention of the need to review immigration policy, the lefties immediately opine that "this is not the time to politicize a tragedy."

Exhibit B - a man carrying an assault rifle and wearing body armor enters a church and kills over 25 people and injures many others. IMMEDIATELY the lefties invoke gun control in full cry. When questioned as to whether their suggested remedies would have stopped this particular crime they admit not. Yet they still push the same ideas at every opportunity - extended background checks etc.

The 'problem' for the lefties is that most of the US shootouts used legally obtained weapons.

What about the right? Did they have an entirely consistent stance on politicising tragedies, or were they just the inverse of the left?

Tim_B said:

The 'problem' for the lefties is that most of the US shootouts used legally obtained weapons.

Hi Tim, could you please explain how the "right to bear arms" helped the victims in that church?

Tim_B said:

An interesting comparison in the US of left vs right in reaction to tragedies -

Exhibit A - a man using a pickup truck to mow people down in NYC is revealed to have been admitted on a Lottery visa, and having apparently brought a further 23 people in due to chain migration. At the first conservative mention of the need to review immigration policy, the lefties immediately opine that "this is not the time to politicize a tragedy."

Exhibit B - a man carrying an assault rifle and wearing body armor enters a church and kills over 25 people and injures many others. IMMEDIATELY the lefties invoke gun control in full cry. When questioned as to whether their suggested remedies would have stopped this particular crime they admit not. Yet they still push the same ideas at every opportunity - extended background checks etc.

The 'problem' for the lefties is that most of the US shootouts used legally obtained weapons.

Yeah, the big deal about mass shootings is how big a 'problem' it is for lefties.

Keep prayin'..

Tykejohnno said:

williamglenn said:

Scott_P said:

The stench of death surrounding this government is overwhelming, yet the zombie cabinet lurches on, necrotizing everything it touches

Necrotizing Brexititis is a fatal condition that would afflict any government attempting to leave the EU on a slim mandate based on a false prospectus.

Thanks for pointing out the real issue with Scott.

Scott's number issue is brexit and how to stop it,if that means getting rid of this Tory government, so be it.

Except Corbyn will not stop Brexit or even commit to soft Brexit either.

His only hope on that score is the LDs holding the balance of power in a hung Parliament and perhaps with SNP support forcing Corbyn to stay in the single market in return for confidence and supply even if that means leaving free movement uncontrolled.

On current polling that is of course not impossible.

williamglenn said:

Scott_P said:

The stench of death surrounding this government is overwhelming, yet the zombie cabinet lurches on, necrotizing everything it touches

Necrotizing Brexititis is a fatal condition that would afflict any government attempting to leave the EU on a slim mandate based on a false prospectus.

The trick, William Glenn, is not minding that it hurts.

Scott_P said:

There are only 2 people in the World who think Boris shouldn't resign immediately. And Boris might be both of them.

I have 50 quid on him surviving till the end of the year

Jonathan said:

Gavin Williamson is perfectly placed as defence secretary to take over the FO.

HYUFD said:

Tykejohnno said:

williamglenn said:

Scott_P said:

The stench of death surrounding this government is overwhelming, yet the zombie cabinet lurches on, necrotizing everything it touches

Necrotizing Brexititis is a fatal condition that would afflict any government attempting to leave the EU on a slim mandate based on a false prospectus.

Thanks for pointing out the real issue with Scott.

Scott's number issue is brexit and how to stop it,if that means getting rid of this Tory government, so be it.

Except Corbyn will not stop Brexit or even commit to soft Brexit either.

His only hope on that score is the LDs holding the balance of power in a hung Parliament and perhaps with SNP support forcing Corbyn to stay in the single market in return for confidence and supply even if that means leaving free movement uncontrolled.

On current polling that is of course not impossible.

The majority of labour MP's are in the remain camp ,so is the membership, he will do what these people tell him -free movement and all.

Scott_P said:

kle4 said:

A description like that is the only thing that makes the government look like it is doing ok, since it is so over the top, and half the things happening at present are not even only government issues.

Please give us a comprehensive list of the things this Government has done, and not monumentally fucked up, this year...

I'll wait.

This government is incompetent and bereft of purpose. But, I would give it credit for cutting both unemployment and the public sector deficit.

Jonathan said:

Pulpstar said:

Scott_P said:

There are only 2 people in the World who think Boris shouldn't resign immediately. And Boris might be both of them.

I have 50 quid on him surviving till the end of the year

The fact the honourable course is to resign has no bearing on what actually happens.

Let's hope you're right

FPT:

MarkHopkins said:

rottenborough said:

Maybe something big like Nissan walking would be the moment the country wakes up from this collective madness?

But that would mean that the EU has basically blackmailed us into submission. Which would imply the end of the UK as an independent country. I cannot even imagine all the consequences of that, but I don't think it will end well for any side.

Part of the problem is that the UK government made certain assurances to Nissan (and others) to avoid adverse events like this.

This, in turn, ties the hands of the UK negotiating team.

If we go back on our assurances in Nissan, then it increases the risk of something bad happening. And I don't think you can think of this as blackmail: this would merely be Nissan protecting their shareholders against a negative outcome - something they are morally bound to do.

If we honour our assurances to Nissan, then we find ourselves in a very weak negotiating position.

There is no good outcome to this puzzle. We already have a dangerously unbalanced economy, with a current account deficit, a government deficit, and the lowest savings rates in history. The biggest threat to Brexit has always been a nasty recession between now and exit day; how do we minimise the chance of that recession in the next two years?

Jonathan said:

Gavin Williamson is perfectly placed as defence secretary to take over the FO.

He reminds me of a bond villain ;-)

Tykejohnno said:

HYUFD said:

Tykejohnno said:

williamglenn said:

Scott_P said:

The stench of death surrounding this government is overwhelming, yet the zombie cabinet lurches on, necrotizing everything it touches

Necrotizing Brexititis is a fatal condition that would afflict any government attempting to leave the EU on a slim mandate based on a false prospectus.

Thanks for pointing out the real issue with Scott.

Scott's number issue is brexit and how to stop it,if that means getting rid of this Tory government, so be it.

Except Corbyn will not stop Brexit or even commit to soft Brexit either.

His only hope on that score is the LDs holding the balance of power in a hung Parliament and perhaps with SNP support forcing Corbyn to stay in the single market in return for confidence and supply even if that means leaving free movement uncontrolled.

On current polling that is of course not impossible.

The majority of labour MP's are in the remain camp ,so is the membership, he will do what these people tell him -free movement and all.

He'll do what the majority of MPs tell him to do even though when they told him to go he told them to get stuffed. Not sure your logic is right there.

So glad I kept on laying Boris Johnson as next Tory Leader/PM.

I told you he was shite that the MPs not the membership would go for him.

Have to wonder who Lewis Hamiltons accountants were. Everyone knows you can't reclaim VAT on new vehicles for private use
Now if he'd bought a "second hand" jet from a business using them commercially...

Scott_P said:

rcs1000 said:

The biggest threat to Brexit has always been a nasty recession between now and exit day; how do we minimise the chance of that recession in the next two years?

Revoke Article 50

The economic boost would be immense

Amusing, except the question was about minimizing a recession between now and exit day, key word exit.

Beverley_C said:

It is time for us to revisit old memes and pronounce that "Theresa is cr*p" on a regular basis?

You are TSE and I claim my 5 Euros

TheWhiteRabbit said:

Jonathan said:

Pulpstar said:

Scott_P said:

There are only 2 people in the World who think Boris shouldn't resign immediately. And Boris might be both of them.

I have 50 quid on him surviving till the end of the year

The fact the honourable course is to resign has no bearing on what actually happens.

I have £40...

so hang on in there BoJo...

I think Thornberry letter is too supine to Iran for sure

kle4 said:

That would require enough people to believe the opposite to rebut it to keep it funny.

Big_G seems willing to carry that torch for now

Scott_P said:

kle4 said:

That would require enough people to believe the opposite to rebut it to keep it funny.

Big_G seems willing to carry that torch for now

Well there;s always one.

kle4 said:

Scott_P said:

rcs1000 said:

The biggest threat to Brexit has always been a nasty recession between now and exit day; how do we minimise the chance of that recession in the next two years?

Revoke Article 50

The economic boost would be immense

Amusing, except the question was about minimizing a recession between now and exit day, key word exit.

Brexit is a fantasy. The biggest threat to it is reality.

For anyone who wants to protect 'Brexit', the best solution is to let it remain a dream. Ironically it's the Brexiteers who should be most keen on revoking Article 50 as soon as possible.

Tykejohnno said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

Tykejohnno said:

HYUFD said:

Tykejohnno said:

williamglenn said:

Scott_P said:

The stench of death surrounding this government is overwhelming, yet the zombie cabinet lurches on, necrotizing everything it touches

Necrotizing Brexititis is a fatal condition that would afflict any government attempting to leave the EU on a slim mandate based on a false prospectus.

Thanks for pointing out the real issue with Scott.

Scott's number issue is brexit and how to stop it,if that means getting rid of this Tory government, so be it.

Except Corbyn will not stop Brexit or even commit to soft Brexit either.

His only hope on that score is the LDs holding the balance of power in a hung Parliament and perhaps with SNP support forcing Corbyn to stay in the single market in return for confidence and supply even if that means leaving free movement uncontrolled.

On current polling that is of course not impossible.

The majority of labour MP's are in the remain camp ,so is the membership, he will do what these people tell him -free movement and all.

He'll do what the majority of MPs tell him to do even though when they told him to go he told them to get stuffed. Not sure your logic is right there.

He won't rock the boat when the PM job is so close.

I hope he sticks to his anti EU stance that he had before the labour top job but the pressure from behind him will be immense for a very soft brexit(with freemovement )or another referendum.

He came from a different place than most leaders, but in the end, like all politicians, he will sacrifice some of what he wants, even some big parts of it, in order to get other things he wants. He will bend and compromise on his principles to secure that.

Jonathan said:

Pulpstar said:

Have to wonder who Lewis Hamiltons accountants were. Everyone knows you can't reclaim VAT on new vehicles for private use
Now if he'd bought a "second hand" jet from a business using them commercially...

Damn it. I payed the VAT on my private jet.

I went to the Isle of man once , could I reclaim the VAT ?

TheScreamingEagles said:

Jonathan said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

kle4 said:

Beverley_C said:

It is time for us to revisit old memes and pronounce that "Theresa is cr*p" on a regular basis?

That would require enough people to believe the opposite to rebut it to keep it funny.

Theresa May is not crap, she's fecking awful

But we're the worst of all. We're enablers of crap.

I remember all the abuse I used to get when I warned Mrs May was crap, a Pound Shop Gordon Brown.

It is thanks to Mrs May we had a PM after Cameron and Osborne scarpered following their referendum defeat who is finally making some progress on a FTA and Brexit deal with the EU, that is unlikely to have occurred with Boris and Davis at the helm.

Tim_B said:

An interesting comparison in the US of left vs right in reaction to tragedies -

Exhibit A - a man using a pickup truck to mow people down in NYC is revealed to have been admitted on a Lottery visa, and having apparently brought a further 23 people in due to chain migration. At the first conservative mention of the need to review immigration policy, the lefties immediately opine that "this is not the time to politicize a tragedy."

Exhibit B - a man carrying an assault rifle and wearing body armor enters a church and kills over 25 people and injures many others. IMMEDIATELY the lefties invoke gun control in full cry. When questioned as to whether their suggested remedies would have stopped this particular crime they admit not. Yet they still push the same ideas at every opportunity - extended background checks etc.

The 'problem' for the lefties is that most of the US shootouts used legally obtained weapons.

Doesn't the Right have exactly the same issue in the US:

Exhibit A: let's change the immigration system!
Exhibit B: let's not worry about guns!

HYUFD said:

Tykejohnno said:

HYUFD said:

Tykejohnno said:

williamglenn said:

Scott_P said:

The stench of death surrounding this government is overwhelming, yet the zombie cabinet lurches on, necrotizing everything it touches

Necrotizing Brexititis is a fatal condition that would afflict any government attempting to leave the EU on a slim mandate based on a false prospectus.

Thanks for pointing out the real issue with Scott.

Scott's number issue is brexit and how to stop it,if that means getting rid of this Tory government, so be it.

Except Corbyn will not stop Brexit or even commit to soft Brexit either.

His only hope on that score is the LDs holding the balance of power in a hung Parliament and perhaps with SNP support forcing Corbyn to stay in the single market in return for confidence and supply even if that means leaving free movement uncontrolled.

On current polling that is of course not impossible.

The majority of labour MP's are in the remain camp ,so is the membership, he will do what these people tell him -free movement and all.

37% of Labour voters voted Leave and a majority of Labour seats voted Leave.

If a weak Corbyn minority government is forced to leave free movement in place because of LD and SNP demands the UK stays in the single market a Tory Leaver opposition leader and UKIP will be licking their lips at all those Labour Leave voters now in play.

There's been a shake out in support for Conservatives and Labour since then. Brexit supporters increasingly back the Conservatives, Remainers increasingly back Labour.

kle4 said:

HYUFD said:

Tykejohnno said:

HYUFD said:

Tykejohnno said:

williamglenn said:

Scott_P said:

The stench of death surrounding this government is overwhelming, yet the zombie cabinet lurches on, necrotizing everything it touches

Necrotizing Brexititis is a fatal condition that would afflict any government attempting to leave the EU on a slim mandate based on a false prospectus.

Thanks for pointing out the real issue with Scott.

Scott's number issue is brexit and how to stop it,if that means getting rid of this Tory government, so be it.

Except Corbyn will not stop Brexit or even commit to soft Brexit either.

His only hope on that score is the LDs holding the balance of power in a hung Parliament and perhaps with SNP support forcing Corbyn to stay in the single market in return for confidence and supply even if that means leaving free movement uncontrolled.

On current polling that is of course not impossible.

The majority of labour MP's are in the remain camp ,so is the membership, he will do what these people tell him -free movement and all.

37% of Labour voters voted Leave and a majority of Labour seats voted Leave.

.

Some of them may have changed their minds, but I would think the not inconsiderable numbers of LD leavers get annoyed at being lumped in with some other leavers (technically I was a LD leaver at the time, though I was never a party member or guaranteed supporter)

Most Labour voters who voted Leave did so because of immigration, if Labour reverse ferret on ending free movement those voters come into play, especially for UKIP even if not the Tories.

70% of LD voters voted Remain, more than the voters for any other party bar the Greens so their Leave voters are less significant.

Bono owns a shopping centre in Lithuania. That's my main take away from today.

We know what fame and wealth gets you.

Sean_F said:

HYUFD said:

Tykejohnno said:

HYUFD said:

Tykejohnno said:

williamglenn said:

Scott_P said:

The stench of death surrounding this government is overwhelming, yet the zombie cabinet lurches on, necrotizing everything it touches

Necrotizing Brexititis is a fatal condition that would afflict any government attempting to leave the EU on a slim mandate based on a false prospectus.

Thanks for pointing out the real issue with Scott.

Scott's number issue is brexit and how to stop it,if that means getting rid of this Tory government, so be it.

Except Corbyn will not stop Brexit or even commit to soft Brexit either.

His only hope on that score is the LDs holding the balance of power in a hung Parliament and perhaps with SNP support forcing Corbyn to stay in the single market in return for confidence and supply even if that means leaving free movement uncontrolled.

On current polling that is of course not impossible.

The majority of labour MP's are in the remain camp ,so is the membership, he will do what these people tell him -free movement and all.

37% of Labour voters voted Leave and a majority of Labour seats voted Leave.

If a weak Corbyn minority government is forced to leave free movement in place because of LD and SNP demands the UK stays in the single market a Tory Leaver opposition leader and UKIP will be licking their lips at all those Labour Leave voters now in play.

There's been a shake out in support for Conservatives and Labour since then. Brexit supporters increasingly back the Conservatives, Remainers increasingly back Labour.

The general election did not really suggest that. In fact Labour made a net gain in Leave seats from the Tories precisely because Corbyn promised to end free movement.