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But of course if -as the remainers hope -we remained within the single market with all the continued EU control over the UK which that would entail, then we would be leaving only in name.Scott_P said:
Badly, very badly, catastrophically or cataclysmically...Mortimer said:We're leaving; all that is up for debate now is the manner of that leaving.
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Are those the issues you raised with voters on the doorstep as you canvassed daily for the cause? Seriously, how many (hundreds of) doors do you think you knocked on during the campaign? Don't be shy...Scott_P said:
It wasn't though.Richard_Tyndall said:If you think the substance of Brexit was not discussed enough in the referendum then you are clearly mad.
Point me to the great debate about whether we left the single market or not, and the impact leaving would have on Euratom and the Open Skies agreement.
Oh...0 -
All that stuff depends on how reasonable the EU feels like being. As it turns out not very.Scott_P said:
It wasn't though.Richard_Tyndall said:If you think the substance of Brexit was not discussed enough in the referendum then you are clearly mad.
Point me to the great debate about whether we left the single market or not, and the impact leaving would have on Euratom and the Open Skies agreement.
Oh...0 -
Euratom has a relationship with Switzerland, as well as co-operation agreements with the United States, Japan, Canada, Australia, Kazakhstan, Ukraine, Uzbekistan and South AfricaScott_P said:
It wasn't though.Richard_Tyndall said:If you think the substance of Brexit was not discussed enough in the referendum then you are clearly mad.
Point me to the great debate about whether we left the single market or not, and the impact leaving would have on Euratom and the Open Skies agreement.
Oh...0 -
The forecast assumes that the SNP loses four seats to Labour. I suspect that in reality Labour could pick up more like twenty in Scotland.MarqueeMark said:
Ungovernable.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
How would someone who is not obssessively interested in politics or policy differentiate between facts and spin? How easy was it to determine whether Turkey was on the brink of joining the EU or that the UK faced immediate recession if we voted to leave or that leaving would be easy and so on? The fact is that most voters do rely to a large extent on both politicians and media to provide them onformation and conduct debate honestly. That's not a criticism of voters, it's a criticism of those who seek their votes and who report on issues.Richard_Tyndall said:
Of course they deserve better. All politicians are dishonest. But the implication is that people are not able to differentiate between facts and spin. Of course the problem is that most of the time the elite wants people to think their spin is indeed fact.SouthamObserver said:No, I didn't say that. What I said was that the referendum campaign was an exercise in dishonesty on both sides. I think voters deserved better.
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And none with us.Sunil_Prasannan said:Euratom has a relationship with Switzerland, as well as co-operation agreements with the United States, Japan, Canada, Australia, Kazakhstan, Ukraine, Uzbekistan and South Africa
And it wasn't discussed during the campaign.0 -
What would stop them having one with us after Brexit? They already have co-operation agreements with the United States, Japan, Canada, Australia, Kazakhstan, Ukraine, Uzbekistan and South AfricaScott_P said:
And none with us.Sunil_Prasannan said:Euratom has a relationship with Switzerland, as well as co-operation agreements with the United States, Japan, Canada, Australia, Kazakhstan, Ukraine, Uzbekistan and South Africa
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It does have a relationship with the UK given that it is a member.Scott_P said:
And none with us.Sunil_Prasannan said:Euratom has a relationship with Switzerland, as well as co-operation agreements with the United States, Japan, Canada, Australia, Kazakhstan, Ukraine, Uzbekistan and South Africa
And it wasn't discussed during the campaign.0 -
You think that there is going to be no agreement with Euratom ever?Scott_P said:0 -
Well, the following non-EU members have co-operation agreements: the United States, Japan, Canada, Australia, Kazakhstan, Ukraine, Uzbekistan and South Africa.Scott_P said:0 -
https://twitter.com/skynews/status/918864709721391104RobD said:You think that there is going to be no agreement with Euratom ever?
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Of course if the council house raised son of a single mother David Davis becomes Tory leader, quite likely if May goes before April 2019, it will actually be the prep school educated and Shropshire Manor House raised Jeremy Corbyn who will be the toffier of the two party leaders.daodao said:
Good riddance to the vain blond bombshell from NY - no, I don't mean Trump.GIN1138 said:Go, Go, Go Bozo.... I mean BoJo....
The swagger and arrogance of Old Etonians and their ilk, and their presumption that they have an inherent right to rule the UK, is not in the interest of most British people. I was delighted that Cameron was humiIiated on 24/6/17 and I'd rather prefer Corbyn as PM to any Tory toff. However, I do hope that May (who, like Thatcher, is not a toff) is not forced from office before April 2019.
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Well, the following non-EU members have co-operation agreements: the United States, Japan, Canada, Australia, Kazakhstan, Ukraine, Uzbekistan and South Africa.Scott_P said:
https://twitter.com/skynews/status/918864709721391104RobD said:You think that there is going to be no agreement with Euratom ever?
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And we are still not on that list...Sunil_Prasannan said:Well, the following non-EU members have co-operation agreements: the United States, Japan, Canada, Australia, Kazakhstan, Ukraine, Uzbekistan and South Africa.
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A little breath of fetid air as a distraction from perpetual, sterile, ballaching Brexit.
https://twitter.com/ABCPolitics/status/919221080945856512
It's a mystery as to why anyone thought Gorka was a Fascist.
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EU member not on list consisting only of non-EU members shock. What is the opposite of a paradox?Scott_P said:
And we are still not on that list...Sunil_Prasannan said:Well, the following non-EU members have co-operation agreements: the United States, Japan, Canada, Australia, Kazakhstan, Ukraine, Uzbekistan and South Africa.
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Because we haven't left the EU yet, you stupid twat!!!Scott_P said:
And we are still not on that list...Sunil_Prasannan said:Well, the following non-EU members have co-operation agreements: the United States, Japan, Canada, Australia, Kazakhstan, Ukraine, Uzbekistan and South Africa.
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It is still leaving the EU, and that was all it said on the ballot paper.stevef said:
But of course if -as the remainers hope -we remained within the single market with all the continued EU control over the UK which that would entail, then we would be leaving only in name.Scott_P said:
Badly, very badly, catastrophically or cataclysmically...Mortimer said:We're leaving; all that is up for debate now is the manner of that leaving.
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Handbags on standby.0
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Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
The story on the right hand side seems sensible by MPs
https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/9192915145174097980 -
Until the actual general election campaign this is all irrelevant, before the 2015 campaign Ed Miliband was expected to lead a minority Labour government and before the 2017 campaign Theresa May to win a big Tory majorityvalleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
I am red on Boris.0
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There was a huge amount of debate about the single market. Cameron himself stated absolutely clearly that if we left the EU we would leave the single market. He did so as a means of rejecting the Norway option which others (not least people like me) were pushing as the best destination.Scott_P said:
It wasn't though.Richard_Tyndall said:If you think the substance of Brexit was not discussed enough in the referendum then you are clearly mad.
Point me to the great debate about whether we left the single market or not, and the impact leaving would have on Euratom and the Open Skies agreement.
Oh...
Claiming there was no debate about it is yet another of your outright lies.0 -
Cooperation agreements do not cover the day to day activity of Euratom. You can parrot what you've read on Wikipedia or you can listen to what those who actually work in the field say.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Well, the following non-EU members have co-operation agreements: the United States, Japan, Canada, Australia, Kazakhstan, Ukraine, Uzbekistan and South Africa.Scott_P said:
https://twitter.com/skynews/status/918864709721391104RobD said:You think that there is going to be no agreement with Euratom ever?
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May has said she will agree to a 2 year transition deal but beyond that any deal either requires either an almost decade long transition post Brexit in 2019 which even Corbyn is not committed to (given it took Canada, for example, 7 years to produce a trade deal with the EU) or the UK to stay in the single market, both of which require free movement and large payments to the EU and which most Tory MPs and a number of Labour MPs with Leave seats would not be comfortable withTheScreamingEagles said:The story on the right hand side seems sensible by MPs
https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/9192915145174097980 -
TheScreamingEagles said:
The story on the right hand side seems sensible by MPs
twitter.com/hendopolis/status/919291514517409798
If the deal with the EU meant that (e.g.) all lawyers had to be shot, would you still think that was better than no deal?
Just asking.
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But how does that work? May doesn't have to sign anything for a "no deal" brexit to happen, she just has to refrain from doing that Superman thing of making time run backwards, so that we never get to 29/3/19.TheScreamingEagles said:The story on the right hand side seems sensible by MPs
htps://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/919291514517409798
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And it was dismissed by Brexiteers as Project Fear.Richard_Tyndall said:There was a huge amount of debate about the single market. Cameron himself stated absolutely clearly that if we left the EU we would leave the single market.
And yet here we are.
To claim it was fully debated is a lie, and you know it.0 -
Another foolish idea to stop Brexit that doesn't actually work in practice.Ishmael_Z said:
But how does that work? May doesn't have to sign anything for a "no deal" brexit to happen, she just has to refrain from doing that Superman thing of making time run backwards, so that we never get to 29/3/19.TheScreamingEagles said:The story on the right hand side seems sensible by MPs
htps://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/919291514517409798
I can see how these guys were outwitted by a bus. With words on it!!!0 -
"You'll receive the Order of Lenin for this"RobD said:Handbags on standby.
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Er no it was not dismissed as project fear. It was cheered by most of the Leave movement as they agreed with it. Cameron's comments came in response to efforts by Pro-EU MPs to claim that leaving the EU did not mean leaving the Single Market.Scott_P said:
And it was dismissed by Brexiteers as Project Fear.Richard_Tyndall said:There was a huge amount of debate about the single market. Cameron himself stated absolutely clearly that if we left the EU we would leave the single market.
And yet here we are.
To claim it was fully debated is a lie, and you know it.
http://www.politico.eu/article/david-cameron-bbc-andrew-marr-ill-pull-uk-out-of-the-single-market-after-brexit-eu-referendum-vote-june-23-consequences-news/
So yet again you are either talking from ignorance or lying. I know which one I think is more likely based on your previous tactics.0 -
That's an reductio ad absurdum from yourself.MarkHopkins said:TheScreamingEagles said:The story on the right hand side seems sensible by MPs
twitter.com/hendopolis/status/919291514517409798
If the deal with the EU meant that (e.g.) all lawyers had to be shot, would you still think that was better than no deal?
Just asking.
Have a lolly.0 -
But they can't compel the EU to offer a deal, so I am not sure how it would work.TheScreamingEagles said:The story on the right hand side seems sensible by MPs
twitter.com/hendopolis/status/9192915145174097980 -
Ken Clarke is involved in it, so I'm assuming it is a rather brilliant plan.Ishmael_Z said:
But how does that work? May doesn't have to sign anything for a "no deal" brexit to happen, she just has to refrain from doing that Superman thing of making time run backwards, so that we never get to 29/3/19.TheScreamingEagles said:The story on the right hand side seems sensible by MPs
htps://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/9192915145174097980 -
We'd want an agreement like Switzerland has, I think.JonathanD said:
Cooperation agreements do not cover the day to day activity of Euratom. You can parrot what you've read on Wikipedia or you can listen to what those who actually work in the field say.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Well, the following non-EU members have co-operation agreements: the United States, Japan, Canada, Australia, Kazakhstan, Ukraine, Uzbekistan and South Africa.Scott_P said:
https://twitter.com/skynews/status/918864709721391104RobD said:You think that there is going to be no agreement with Euratom ever?
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And over 33% likelihood of St Albans turning orange.valleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
Switzerland has an even closer relationship with Euratom than the aforementioned.JonathanD said:
Cooperation agreements do not cover the day to day activity of Euratom. You can parrot what you've read on Wikipedia or you can listen to what those who actually work in the field say.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Well, the following non-EU members have co-operation agreements: the United States, Japan, Canada, Australia, Kazakhstan, Ukraine, Uzbekistan and South Africa.Scott_P said:
https://twitter.com/skynews/status/918864709721391104RobD said:You think that there is going to be no agreement with Euratom ever?
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TheScreamingEagles said:
That's an reductio ad absurdum from yourself.MarkHopkins said:TheScreamingEagles said:The story on the right hand side seems sensible by MPs
twitter.com/hendopolis/status/919291514517409798
If the deal with the EU meant that (e.g.) all lawyers had to be shot, would you still think that was better than no deal?
Just asking.
Have a lolly.
Yum. Very tasty. Thanks.
But on the substantive point, the reality is that many deals can be worse than no deal.
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It can't. If we have not accepted a deal by March 2019 we leave without a deal. At that point it is out of May's (and Parliament's) hands.RobD said:
But they can't compel the EU to offer a deal, so I am not sure how it would work.TheScreamingEagles said:The story on the right hand side seems sensible by MPs
twitter.com/hendopolis/status/9192915145174097980 -
Please, the term is Alt-Right.Theuniondivvie said:A little breath of fetid air as a distraction from perpetual, sterile, ballaching Brexit.
https://twitter.com/ABCPolitics/status/919221080945856512
It's a mystery as to why anyone thought Gorka was a Fascist.0 -
I find that amusing coming from PB's High-Priest of reductio ad absurdumTheScreamingEagles said:
That's an reductio ad absurdum from yourself.MarkHopkins said:TheScreamingEagles said:The story on the right hand side seems sensible by MPs
twitter.com/hendopolis/status/919291514517409798
If the deal with the EU meant that (e.g.) all lawyers had to be shot, would you still think that was better than no deal?
Just asking.
Have a lolly.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xGt3QmRSZYRichard_Tyndall said:It was cheered by most of the Leave movement as they agreed with it.
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I’d love to play poker against these dolts - “ let’s negociate and if you aren’t nice to us we will capitulate” -naivety writ large.Sunil_Prasannan said:0 -
TheScreamingEagles said:
Ken Clarke is involved in it, so I'm assuming it is a rather brilliant plan.Ishmael_Z said:
But how does that work? May doesn't have to sign anything for a "no deal" brexit to happen, she just has to refrain from doing that Superman thing of making time run backwards, so that we never get to 29/3/19.TheScreamingEagles said:The story on the right hand side seems sensible by MPs
htps://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/919291514517409798
The only foreseeable plan it can be is effectively to have a permanent transition period post technical Brexit in March 2019 until a full trade deal is agreed with the EU, during which we have full access to the single market and stay part of the customs union in return for keeping free movement uncontrolled, paying a large sum to the EU and accepting ECJ jurisdiction.
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Post of the yearMortimer said:Ishmael_Z said:
But how does that work? May doesn't have to sign anything for a "no deal" brexit to happen, she just has to refrain from doing that Superman thing of making time run backwards, so that we never get to 29/3/19.TheScreamingEagles said:The story on the right hand side seems sensible by MPs
htps://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/919291514517409798
I can see how these guys were outwitted by a bus.!
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This popped up under related videos:Scott_P said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xGt3QmRSZYRichard_Tyndall said:It was cheered by most of the Leave movement as they agreed with it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9dKcjfeVTs0 -
Precisely. I don't know much about being a mechanic, or medicine, and I don't expect a mechanic to know about the vagaries of international agreements and trade treaties. Not because they're thick but because it's not their area of expertise. They will not be able to trawl through impact assessments, read up on the minutiae of economic theory and international politics and come to a conclusion. That's why we live in a representative democracy. Politicians and their advisers go through the detail, and in theory put plausible plans to voters who can then choose. There's an incentive not to deliberately defraud voters as if elected to power you'll be booted out pretty sharpish if it's obvious you were fibbing in too big a way. Brexit was different in that for campaigners there was no equivalent incentive - it could be whatever you said you wanted it to be. No more immigration, a boost to the NHS, buccaneering free trade and protectionist policies for British business. The problem of course being that any government that had to implement it would have a poisoned chalice, as the risks that Brexiteers dismissed have now to be actively averted and their wilder promises dropped. We are yet to see anyone come up with a Brexit plan that satisfies even half the claims made during the referendum and that the EU would even have a remote chance of accepting. Hence why you've got an incredibly weak government. There's no way they can meet the demands of voters and their own MPs, it's just impossible. If it's a colossal failure, they'll then, like apologists for Communism, blame it on being wrong in the implementation, not because it was intellectually flawed from the start.SouthamObserver said:
How would someone who is not obssessively interested in politics or policy differentiate between facts and spin? How easy was it to determine whether Turkey was on the brink of joining the EU or that the UK faced immediate recession if we voted to leave or that leaving would be easy and so on? The fact is that most voters do rely to a large extent on both politicians and media to provide them onformation and conduct debate honestly. That's not a criticism of voters, it's a criticism of those who seek their votes and who report on issues.Richard_Tyndall said:SouthamObserver said:No, I didn't say that. What I said was that the referendum campaign was an exercise in dishonesty on both sides. I think voters deserved better.
These charlatans offered leave voters a fantasy. I don't blame leave voters for buying it for the same reason I wouldn't blame myself if I hired a mechanic and he turned out to be a fraudulent charlatan. But if and when we end up with a hard left Corbyn government he'll have been put there by Tory Brexiteers who forgot their Burke and kicked off a revolution which they had no idea how to implement.0 -
Dont be such a spoilsport!HYUFD said:
Until the actual general election campaign this is all irrelevant, before the 2015 campaign Ed Miliband was expected to lead a minority Labour government and before the 2017 campaign Theresa May to win a big Tory majorityvalleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:
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Wow!Verulamius said:
And over 33% likelihood of St Albans turning orange.valleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
LOL. Great to see Andrew Neil proving what a bunch of liars Remain were and are.RobD said:
This popped up under related videos:Scott_P said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xGt3QmRSZYRichard_Tyndall said:It was cheered by most of the Leave movement as they agreed with it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9dKcjfeVTs0 -
If you think politicians are experts on anything the you are a bigger fool than I took you for. And that is quite something I can tell you. The only charlatans are people like you who try to pretend the electorate were somehow conned just because you lost.MJW said:
Precisely. I don't know much about being a mechanic, or medicine, and I don't expect a mechanic to know about the vagaries of international agreements and trade treaties. Not because they're thick but because it's not their area of expertise. They will not be able to trawl through impact assessments, read up on the minutiae of economic theory and international politics and come to a conclusion. That's why we live in a representative democracy. Politicians and their advisers go through the detail, and in theory put plausible plans to voters who can then choose. There's an incentive not to deliberately defraud voters as if elected to power you'll be booted out pretty sharpish if it's obvious you were fibbing in too big a way. Brexit was different in that for campaigners there was no equivalent incentive - it could be whatever you said you wanted it to be. No more immigration, a boost to the NHS, buccaneering free trade and protectionist policies for British business. The problem of course being that any government that had to implement it would have a poisoned chalice, as the risks that Brexiteers dismissed have now to be actively averted and their wilder promises dropped. We are yet to see anyone come up with a Brexit plan that satisfies even half the claims made during the referendum and that the EU would even have a remote chance of accepting. Hence why you've got an incredibly weak government. There's no way they can meet the demands of voters and their own MPs, it's just impossible. If it's a colossal failure, they'll then, like apologists for Communism, blame it on being wrong in the implementation, not because it was intellectually flawed from the start.
These charlatans offered leave voters a fantasy. I don't blame leave voters for buying it for the same reason I wouldn't blame myself if I hired a mechanic and he turned out to be a fraudulent charlatan. But if and when we end up with a hard left Corbyn government he'll have been put there by Tory Brexiteers who forgot their Burke and kicked off a revolution which they had no idea how to implement.0 -
Sorry but true, unless Corbyn starts to get leads of 10 points or more Labour cannot count on anything and even then that does not guarantee they will go from opposition to government as Neil Kinnock can tell you as he had leads of at least that much against Thatcher's Tories in 1990 before they replaced her with John Majorvalleyboy said:
Dont be such a spoilsport!HYUFD said:
Until the actual general election campaign this is all irrelevant, before the 2015 campaign Ed Miliband was expected to lead a minority Labour government and before the 2017 campaign Theresa May to win a big Tory majorityvalleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
Nah, Corbyn is an awesome campaigner, he achieved around a 10% swing during the 2017 campaign, what's to say he won't do the same again in 2022.HYUFD said:
Sorry but true, unless Corbyn starts to get leads of 10 points or more Labour cannot count on anything and even then that does not guarantee they will go from opposition to government as Neil Kinnock can tell you as he had leads of at least that much against Thatcher's Tories in 1990 before they replaced her with John Majorvalleyboy said:
Dont be such a spoilsport!HYUFD said:
Until the actual general election campaign this is all irrelevant, before the 2015 campaign Ed Miliband was expected to lead a minority Labour government and before the 2017 campaign Theresa May to win a big Tory majorityvalleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:
If it can happen once, it can happen again.0 -
A 66-year old asthmatic.TheScreamingEagles said:
Rent a gob Tory MSP that STV got to give a quote has talked about the dangers of obesity and lack of fitness and yet managed to expense a £2.75 taxi journey.0 -
That will be the same St. Albans where the LibDems launched their 2017 Manifesto because they thought it was one of their best handful of win opportunities?Verulamius said:
And over 33% likelihood of St Albans turning orange.valleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
Corbyn's net gains came largely from the Greens, the LDs, UKIP and the SNP, only a minority of the votes he gained in 2017 came from Tories. Next time he will already have squeezed the minor parties as far as he can and will need to get most of his new voters from 2017 Tory voters if he is to win enough seats to form a governmentTheScreamingEagles said:
Nah, Corbyn is an awesome campaigner, he achieved around a 10% swing during the 2017 campaign, what's to say he won't do the same again in 2022.HYUFD said:
Sorry but true, unless Corbyn starts to get leads of 10 points or more Labour cannot count on anything and even then that does not guarantee they will go from opposition to government as Neil Kinnock can tell you as he had leads of at least that much against Thatcher's Tories in 1990 before they replaced her with John Majorvalleyboy said:
Dont be such a spoilsport!HYUFD said:
Until the actual general election campaign this is all irrelevant, before the 2015 campaign Ed Miliband was expected to lead a minority Labour government and before the 2017 campaign Theresa May to win a big Tory majorityvalleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:
If it can happen once, it can happen again.0 -
Such an awesome campaigner he couldn't win more seats or votes than the MayBot?TheScreamingEagles said:
Nah, Corbyn is an awesome campaigner, he achieved around a 10% swing during the 2017 campaign, what's to say he won't do the same again in 2022.HYUFD said:
Sorry but true, unless Corbyn starts to get leads of 10 points or more Labour cannot count on anything and even then that does not guarantee they will go from opposition to government as Neil Kinnock can tell you as he had leads of at least that much against Thatcher's Tories in 1990 before they replaced her with John Majorvalleyboy said:
Dont be such a spoilsport!HYUFD said:
Until the actual general election campaign this is all irrelevant, before the 2015 campaign Ed Miliband was expected to lead a minority Labour government and before the 2017 campaign Theresa May to win a big Tory majorityvalleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:
If it can happen once, it can happen again.0 -
I grew up in Haverfordwest in the 1960s and early 1970s. How confident are you of ousting Crabb in Preseli next time? For some reason there was a much bigger swing there last June than in the South Pembrokeshire & West Carmarthen seat.valleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
@MJW
Yes it wasn’t ideal but, we had no choice but to vote leave or accept staying on the way to destination ever closer union. Dave’s deal was just not believable let alone any good. Those self same representative politicians had denied us any vote at all on the direction of travel since 1975 despite having lots of opportunities ( Maastricht, Nice, Amsterdam, Lisbon) so to do in a “non nuclear “ way. Clearly, given the result, they were way out of step with the voters.
So we rolled the dice because we were not getting another chance ever to tell the buggers they’d been wrong for years. Yes in some ways it may be destructive ( because the EU seems intent on making it so), but the alternative ultimately, for many of us, was the eradication of who we believe ourselves to be.
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A step too far in terms of equality?TheScreamingEagles said:
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WASPI women are such a bunch moaning minnies, they should stop moaning and be grateful.RobD said:0 -
tittersTheScreamingEagles said:
WASPI women are such a bunch moaning minnies, they should stop moaning and be grateful.RobD said: 0 -
In 1987 too Kinnock was also said to have had the best campaign and he went into the 1992 general election campaign expecting to beat Major. However the Tories won a 4th term by hammering him on tax which is what they will have to do again to Corbyn and which they could not do last time because of May's disastrous dementia tax.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Such an awesome campaigner he couldn't win more seats or votes than the MayBot?TheScreamingEagles said:
Nah, Corbyn is an awesome campaigner, he achieved around a 10% swing during the 2017 campaign, what's to say he won't do the same again in 2022.HYUFD said:
Sorry but true, unless Corbyn starts to get leads of 10 points or more Labour cannot count on anything and even then that does not guarantee they will go from opposition to government as Neil Kinnock can tell you as he had leads of at least that much against Thatcher's Tories in 1990 before they replaced her with John Majorvalleyboy said:
Dont be such a spoilsport!HYUFD said:
Until the actual general election campaign this is all irrelevant, before the 2015 campaign Ed Miliband was expected to lead a minority Labour government and before the 2017 campaign Theresa May to win a big Tory majorityvalleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:
If it can happen once, it can happen again.
It was also hammering Labour on tax which won the Nationals last month's New Zealand election after 9 years in power despite New Zealand Labour's Jacinda Adern leading in the early part of the campaign0 -
And clean behind the fridge?TheScreamingEagles said:
WASPI women are such a bunch moaning minnies, they should stop moaning and be grateful.RobD said:0 -
Nah, I have integral fridges, there's nothing behind them to clean.SandyRentool said:
And clean behind the fridge?TheScreamingEagles said:
WASPI women are such a bunch moaning minnies, they should stop moaning and be grateful.RobD said:0 -
That plan won't work if the tories are funding the costs of hard brexit with borrowing.HYUFD said:
However the Tories won a 4th term by hammering him on tax which is what they will have to do again to Corbyn and which they could not do last time because of May's disastrous dementia tax.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Such an awesome campaigner he couldn't win more seats or votes than the MayBot?TheScreamingEagles said:
Nah, Corbyn is an awesome campaigner, he achieved around a 10% swing during the 2017 campaign, what's to say he won't do the same again in 2022.HYUFD said:
Sorry but true, unless Corbyn starts to get leads of 10 points or more Labour cannot count on anything and even then that does not guarantee they will go from opposition to government as Neil Kinnock can tell you as he had leads of at least that much against Thatcher's Tories in 1990 before they replaced her with John Majorvalleyboy said:
Dont be such a spoilsport!HYUFD said:
Until the actual general election campaign this is all irrelevant, before the 2015 campaign Ed Miliband was expected to lead a minority Labour government and before the 2017 campaign Theresa May to win a big Tory majorityvalleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:
If it can happen once, it can happen again.0 -
Had Kinnock not lost control of himself at Sheffield I suspect he would have denied Major a majority with a result close to the outcome in 2017.HYUFD said:
In 1987 too Kinnock was also said to have had the best campaign and he went into the 1992 general election campaign expecting to beat Major. However the Tories won a 4th term by hammering him on tax which is what they will have to do again to Corbyn and which they could not do last time because of May's disastrous dementia tax.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Such an awesome campaigner he couldn't win more seats or votes than the MayBot?TheScreamingEagles said:
Nah, Corbyn is an awesome campaigner, he achieved around a 10% swing during the 2017 campaign, what's to say he won't do the same again in 2022.HYUFD said:
Sorry but true, unless Corbyn starts to get leads of 10 points or more Labour cannot count on anything and even then that does not guarantee they will go from opposition to government as Neil Kinnock can tell you as he had leads of at least that much against Thatcher's Tories in 1990 before they replaced her with John Majorvalleyboy said:
Dont be such a spoilsport!HYUFD said:
Until the actual general election campaign this is all irrelevant, before the 2015 campaign Ed Miliband was expected to lead a minority Labour government and before the 2017 campaign Theresa May to win a big Tory majorityvalleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:
If it can happen once, it can happen again.
It was also hammering Labour on tax which won the Nationals last month's New Zealand election after 9 years in power despite New Zealand Labour's Jacinda Adern leading in the early part of the campaign0 -
Major would still likely have remained as PM with Unionist support even if that was the case, it was the 'Labour's tax bombshell' campaign which won the Tories that general electionjustin124 said:
Had Kinnock not lost control of himself at Sheffield I suspect he would have denied Major a majority with a result close to the outcome in 2017.HYUFD said:
In 1987 too Kinnock was also said to have had the best campaign and he went into the 1992 general election campaign expecting to beat Major. However the Tories won a 4th term by hammering him on tax which is what they will have to do again to Corbyn and which they could not do last time because of May's disastrous dementia tax.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Such an awesome campaigner he couldn't win more seats or votes than the MayBot?TheScreamingEagles said:
Nah, Corbyn is an awesome campaigner, he achieved around a 10% swing during the 2017 campaign, what's to say he won't do the same again in 2022.HYUFD said:
Sorry but true, unless Corbyn starts to get leads of 10 points or more Labour cannot count on anything and even then that does not guarantee they will go from opposition to government as Neil Kinnock can tell you as he had leads of at least that much against Thatcher's Tories in 1990 before they replaced her with John Majorvalleyboy said:
Dont be such a spoilsport!HYUFD said:
Until the actual general election campaign this is all irrelevant, before the 2015 campaign Ed Miliband was expected to lead a minority Labour government and before the 2017 campaign Theresa May to win a big Tory majorityvalleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:
If it can happen once, it can happen again.
It was also hammering Labour on tax which won the Nationals last month's New Zealand election after 9 years in power despite New Zealand Labour's Jacinda Adern leading in the early part of the campaign0 -
Given how much Corbyn wants to borrow it will and given he also ultimately backs hard BrexitPong said:
That plan won't work if the tories are funding the costs of hard brexit with borrowing.HYUFD said:
However the Tories won a 4th term by hammering him on tax which is what they will have to do again to Corbyn and which they could not do last time because of May's disastrous dementia tax.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Such an awesome campaigner he couldn't win more seats or votes than the MayBot?TheScreamingEagles said:
Nah, Corbyn is an awesome campaigner, he achieved around a 10% swing during the 2017 campaign, what's to say he won't do the same again in 2022.HYUFD said:
Sorry but true, unless Corbyn starts to get leads of 10 points or more Labour cannot count on anything and even then that does not guarantee they will go from opposition to government as Neil Kinnock can tell you as he had leads of at least that much against Thatcher's Tories in 1990 before they replaced her with John Majorvalleyboy said:
Dont be such a spoilsport!HYUFD said:
Until the actual general election campaign this is all irrelevant, before the 2015 campaign Ed Miliband was expected to lead a minority Labour government and before the 2017 campaign Theresa May to win a big Tory majorityvalleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:
If it can happen once, it can happen again.0 -
A real 'momentum' has built up against Crabb, with an alliance of groups, particularly concentrated here in the north of the county.Another week and we would have ousted him earlier this year. If it were tomorrow i would put my mortgage on it. I have lived down here 30+ years and have never seen such enthusiasm, even more than in 1997.justin124 said:
I grew up in Haverfordwest in the 1960s and early 1970s. How confident are you of ousting Crabb in Preseli next time? For some reason there was a much bigger swing there last June than in the South Pembrokeshire & West Carmarthen seat.valleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
Surely it should WASPE women against state pension equality FFSTheScreamingEagles said:
WASPI women are such a bunch moaning minnies, they should stop moaning and be grateful.RobD said:0 -
Mrs May should tell the Orangemen and women to bog off.
They are wrong on WASPI women, and wrong on this.
https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/9193079230330757140 -
Sounds like the DUP are gunning for Hammond too.
Gove to No 11?0 -
I agree that Major would have remained PM but doubt that he would have survived until 1997. We probably would have had an election in 1995. There is also the possibilty that had he managed to deny Major a majority, Kinnock would not have stepped down as leader.HYUFD said:
Major would still likely have remained as PM with Unionist support even if that was the case, it was the 'Labour's tax bombshell' campaign which won the Tories that general electionjustin124 said:
Had Kinnock not lost control of himself at Sheffield I suspect he would have denied Major a majority with a result close to the outcome in 2017.HYUFD said:
In 1987 too Kinnock was also said to have had the best campaign and he went into the 1992 general election campaign expecting to beat Major. However the Tories won a 4th term by hammering him on tax which is what they will have to do again to Corbyn and which they could not do last time because of May's disastrous dementia tax.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Such an awesome campaigner he couldn't win more seats or votes than the MayBot?TheScreamingEagles said:
Nah, Corbyn is an awesome campaigner, he achieved around a 10% swing during the 2017 campaign, what's to say he won't do the same again in 2022.HYUFD said:
Sorry but true, unless Corbyn starts to get leads of 10 points or more Labour cannot count on anything and even then that does not guarantee they will go from opposition to government as Neil Kinnock can tell you as he had leads of at least that much against Thatcher's Tories in 1990 before they replaced her with John Majorvalleyboy said:
Dont be such a spoilsport!HYUFD said:
Until the actual general election campaign this is all irrelevant, before the 2015 campaign Ed Miliband was expected to lead a minority Labour government and before the 2017 campaign Theresa May to win a big Tory majorityvalleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:
If it can happen once, it can happen again.
It was also hammering Labour on tax which won the Nationals last month's New Zealand election after 9 years in power despite New Zealand Labour's Jacinda Adern leading in the early part of the campaign0 -
OT - Dominic Sandbrook's history of the 80s on IPlayer at the moment. TRmendous sound track too.0
-
Yes, the same. The swing in St Albans was similar to Oxwab and Twickenham but the starting position had the LibDems further behind.MarqueeMark said:
That will be the same St. Albans where the LibDems launched their 2017 Manifesto because they thought it was one of their best handful of win opportunities?Verulamius said:
And over 33% likelihood of St Albans turning orange.valleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:
0 -
It's a superb part of the country. I've toyed with the idea of moving there. If they got rid of Crabb, I'd toy a bit more.valleyboy said:
A real 'momentum' has built up against Crabb, with an alliance of groups, particularly concentrated here in the north of the county.Another week and we would have ousted him earlier this year. If it were tomorrow i would put my mortgage on it. I have lived down here 30+ years and have never seen such enthusiasm, even more than in 1997.justin124 said:
I grew up in Haverfordwest in the 1960s and early 1970s. How confident are you of ousting Crabb in Preseli next time? For some reason there was a much bigger swing there last June than in the South Pembrokeshire & West Carmarthen seat.valleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:
0 -
Possibly but that would still have been 3 more years of Tory government and given Kinnock would have failed to beat the Tories twice I think he would still have ultimately stepped down as I think Corbyn would do too if the Tories beat him a second timejustin124 said:
I agree that Major would have remained PM but doubt that he would have survived until 1997. We probably would have had an election in 1995. There is also the possibilty that had he managed to deny Major a majority, Kinnock would not have stepped down as leader.HYUFD said:
Major would still likely have remained as PM with Unionist support even if that was the case, it was the 'Labour's tax bombshell' campaign which won the Tories that general electionjustin124 said:
Had Kinnock not lost control of himself at Sheffield I suspect he would have denied Major a majority with a result close to the outcome in 2017.HYUFD said:
In 1987 too Kinnock was also said to have had the best campaign and he went into the 1992 general election campaign expecting to beat Major. However the Tories won a 4th term by hammering him onSunil_Prasannan said:
Such an awesome campaigner he couldn't win more seats or votes than the MayBot?TheScreamingEagles said:
Nah, Corbyn is an awesome campaigner, he achieved around a 10% swing during the 2017 campaign, what's to say he won't do the same again in 2022.HYUFD said:
Sorry but true, unless Corbyn starts to get leads of 10 points or more Labour cannot count on anything and even then that does not guarantee they will go from opposition to government as Neil Kinnock can tell you as he had leads of at least that much against Thatcher's Tories in 1990 before they replaced her with John Majorvalleyboy said:
Dont be such a spoilsport!HYUFD said:
Until the actual general election campaign this is all irrelevant, before the 2015 campaign Ed Miliband was expected to lead a minority Labour government and before the 2017 campaign Theresa May to win a big Tory majorityvalleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:
If it can happen once, it can happen again.0 -
Why has he suddenly become so unpopular - when compared with Simon Hart in the other seat?valleyboy said:
A real 'momentum' has built up against Crabb, with an alliance of groups, particularly concentrated here in the north of the county.Another week and we would have ousted him earlier this year. If it were tomorrow i would put my mortgage on it. I have lived down here 30+ years and have never seen such enthusiasm, even more than in 1997.justin124 said:
I grew up in Haverfordwest in the 1960s and early 1970s. How confident are you of ousting Crabb in Preseli next time? For some reason there was a much bigger swing there last June than in the South Pembrokeshire & West Carmarthen seat.valleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
Blair won Preseli Pembrokeshire in 2001 as well as 1997 (indeed Crabb first stood as the Tory candidate in the 2001 election)valleyboy said:
A real 'momentum' has built up against Crabb, with an alliance of groups, particularly concentrated here in the north of the county.Another week and we would have ousted him earlier this year. If it were tomorrow i would put my mortgage on it. I have lived down here 30+ years and have never seen such enthusiasm, even more than in 1997.justin124 said:
I grew up in Haverfordwest in the 1960s and early 1970s. How confident are you of ousting Crabb in Preseli next time? For some reason there was a much bigger swing there last June than in the South Pembrokeshire & West Carmarthen seat.valleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
Labour held St Albans from 1997 to 2005 so it will be far from clear that LibDems would receive tactical voting support - particularly when Labour has national momentum.Verulamius said:
Yes, the same. The swing in St Albans was similar to Oxwab and Twickenham but the starting position had the LibDems further behind.MarqueeMark said:
That will be the same St. Albans where the LibDems launched their 2017 Manifesto because they thought it was one of their best handful of win opportunities?Verulamius said:
And over 33% likelihood of St Albans turning orange.valleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
But it would have been even more paralysed than proved to be the case anyway! However, privatisation of the Railways would have been avoided.HYUFD said:
Possibly but that would still have been 3 more years of Tory government and given Kinnock would have failed to beat the Tories twice I think he would still have ultimately stepped down as I think Corbyn would do too if the Tories beat him a second timejustin124 said:
I agree that Major would have remained PM but doubt that he would have survived until 1997. We probably would have had an election in 1995. There is also the possibilty that had he managed to deny Major a majority, Kinnock would not have stepped down as leader.HYUFD said:
Major would still likely have remained as PM with Unionist support even if that was the case, it was the 'Labour's tax bombshell' campaign which won the Tories that general electionjustin124 said:
Had Kinnock not lost control of himself at Sheffield I suspect he would have denied Major a majority with a result close to the outcome in 2017.HYUFD said:
In 1987 too Kinnock was also said to have had the best campaign and he went into the 1992 general election campaign expecting to beat Major. However the Tories won a 4th term by hammering him onSunil_Prasannan said:
Such an awesome campaigner he couldn't win more seats or votes than the MayBot?TheScreamingEagles said:
Nah, Corbyn is an awesome campaigner, he achieved around a 10% swing during the 2017 campaign, what's to say he won't do the same again in 2022.HYUFD said:
Sorry but true, unless Corbyn starts to get leads of 10 points or more Labour cannot count on anything and even then that does not guarantee they will go from opposition to government as Neil Kinnock can tell you as he had leads of at least that much against Thatcher's Tories in 1990 before they replaced her with John Majorvalleyboy said:
Dont be such a spoilsport!HYUFD said:
Until the actual general election campaign this is all irrelevant, before the 2015 campaign Ed Miliband was expected to lead a minority Labour government and before the 2017 campaign Theresa May to win a big Tory majorityvalleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:
If it can happen once, it can happen again.0 -
Sounds bloody good to me. There is logic behind that formula. If our aim is to get free trade with the EU after Brexit, then free trade with the EU should continue, first from within the EU, and then during a transition period until we get the FTA.HYUFD said:TheScreamingEagles said:
Ken Clarke is involved in it, so I'm assuming it is a rather brilliant plan.Ishmael_Z said:
But how does that work? May doesn't have to sign anything for a "no deal" brexit to happen, she just has to refrain from doing that Superman thing of making time run backwards, so that we never get to 29/3/19.TheScreamingEagles said:The story on the right hand side seems sensible by MPs
htps://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/919291514517409798
The only foreseeable plan it can be is effectively to have a permanent transition period post technical Brexit in March 2019 until a full trade deal is agreed with the EU, during which we have full access to the single market and stay part of the customs union in return for keeping free movement uncontrolled, paying a large sum to the EU and accepting ECJ jurisdiction.
Since the transition period is effectively an extension of EU membership, everything should remain the same.0 -
It would have kept Kinnock out of power and Blair would still likely have taken over after Smith's death in 1994, maybe winning in 1995 rather than 1997. Whether rail privatisation would have taken place would have depended on the Unionists and any Tory rebelsjustin124 said:
But it would have been even more paralysed than proved to be the case anyway! However, privatisation of the Railways would have been avoided.HYUFD said:
Possibly but that would still have been 3 more years of Tory govjustin124 said:
I agr.HYUFD said:
Major would still likely have remained as PM with Unionist support even if that was the case, it was the 'Labour's tax bombshell' campaign which won the Tories that general electionjustin124 said:
Had Kinnock not lost control of himself at Sheffield I suspect he would have denied Major a majority with a result close to the outcome in 2017.HYUFD said:
In 1987 too Kinnock was also said to have had the best campaign and he went into the 1992 general election campaign expecting to beat Major. However the Tories won a 4th term by hammering him onSunil_Prasannan said:
Such an awesome campaigner he couldn't win more seats or votes than the MayBot?TheScreamingEagles said:
Nah, Corbyn is an awesome campaigner, he achieved around a 10% swing during the 2017 campaign, what's to say he won't do the same again in 2022.HYUFD said:
Sorry but true, unless Corbyn starts to get leads of 10 points or more Labour cannot count on anything and even then that does not guarantee they will go from opposition to government as Neil Kinnock can tell you as he had leads of at least that much against Thatcher's Tories in 1990 before they replaced her with John Majorvalleyboy said:
Dont be such a spoilsport!HYUFD said:
Until the actual general election campaign this is all irrelevant, before the 2015 campaign Ed Miliband was expected to lead a minority Labour government and before the 2017 campaign Theresa May to win a big Tory majorityvalleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:
If it can happen once, it can happen again.0 -
-
No excuses, get yourself down to Pembrokeshire. Superb part of the world. Far nicer than Cornwall, less crowded and none of the metropilitan elite have second homes(well not many). And we might get you to join the very active local momentum group and help get rid of Crabb.Peter_the_Punter said:
It's a superb part of the country. I've toyed with the idea of moving there. If they got rid of Crabb, I'd toy a bit more.valleyboy said:
A real 'momentum' has built up against Crabb, with an alliance of groups, particularly concentrated here in the north of the county.Another week and we would have ousted him earlier this year. If it were tomorrow i would put my mortgage on it. I have lived down here 30+ years and have never seen such enthusiasm, even more than in 1997.justin124 said:
I grew up in Haverfordwest in the 1960s and early 1970s. How confident are you of ousting Crabb in Preseli next time? For some reason there was a much bigger swing there last June than in the South Pembrokeshire & West Carmarthen seat.valleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
Although I can't see most Tory MPs and Labour MPs in heavily Leave seats backing it, in a decade maybe we can return to the single market but no new controls on free movement post Brexit at all and continued large payments to the EU will be a difficult sell to Leave voters and if it did somehow get through Parliament it would inevitably be a big boost to UKIP.surbiton said:
Sounds bloody good to me. There is logic behind that formula. If our aim is to get free trade with the EU after Brexit, then free trade with the EU should continue, first from within the EU, and then during a transition period until we get the FTA.HYUFD said:TheScreamingEagles said:
Ken Clarke is involved in it, so I'm assuming it is a rather brilliant plan.Ishmael_Z said:
But how does that work? May doesn't have to sign anything for a "no deal" brexit to happen, she just has to refrain from doing that Superman thing of making time run backwards, so that we never get to 29/3/19.TheScreamingEagles said:The story on the right hand side seems sensible by MPs
htps://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/919291514517409798
The only foreseeable plan it can be is effectively to have a permanent transition period post technical Brexit in March 2019 until a full trade deal is agreed with the EU, during which we have full access to the single market and stay part of the customs union in return for keeping free movement uncontrolled, paying a large sum to the EU and accepting ECJ jurisdiction.
Since the transition period is effectively an extension of EU membership, everything should remain the same.
Farage would likely be back as UKIP leader crying 'betrayal' at the top of his voice within 5 minutes!
0 -
The LibDems were second in St Albans by 2010 but Labour had regained second place in 2015. If you look at the 2017 result, the Labour vote did not shift, probably as a result of the national campaign, which is why the Conservatives held on (but losing 3%) whilst the LibDems gained 13%.justin124 said:
Labour held St Albans from 1997 to 2005 so it will be far from clear that LibDems would receive tactical voting support - particularly when Labour has national momentum.Verulamius said:
Yes, the same. The swing in St Albans was similar to Oxwab and Twickenham but the starting position had the LibDems further behind.MarqueeMark said:
That will be the same St. Albans where the LibDems launched their 2017 Manifesto because they thought it was one of their best handful of win opportunities?Verulamius said:
And over 33% likelihood of St Albans turning orange.valleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
Another poll in Spain showing PP and PSOE losing support in the wake of the Catalan crisis. Podemos down to fourth place. Ciudadanos the gainers.
https://twitter.com/thespainreport/status/9192972305777745940 -
The question asked about leaving the European Union. Not the European Economic Area. Yet it's the people who said say in the EEA who now decry people who say stay in the EEA as traitorsRobD said:
This popped up under related videos:Scott_P said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xGt3QmRSZYRichard_Tyndall said:It was cheered by most of the Leave movement as they agreed with it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9dKcjfeVTs0 -
Quiet night on PB. The calm before the storm? Or peace at last?0
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Given Ciudadanos largely back a tough line with Catalonia that looks like a clear clash is looming between the Spanish and Catalan ParliamentsSouthamObserver said:Another poll in Spain showing PP and PSOE losing support in the wake of the Catalan crisis. Podemos down to fourth place. Ciudadanos the gainers.
https://twitter.com/thespainreport/status/919297230577774594
0 -
I'm lowering the tone in the morning, as I talk about the erogenous zones of Leavers.Jonathan said:Quiet night on PB. The calm before the storm? Or peace at last?
0 -
Becoming Work and Pensions Minister, albeit for a few months made him a target of local and national anti austerity, disability rights, WASPI groups. Added to that his personal induscretions and you have a toxic mix which has carried on since the election. Chosing a female opponent was also clever.justin124 said:
Why has he suddenly become so unpopular - when compared with Simon Hart in the other seat?valleyboy said:
A real 'momentum' has built up against Crabb, with an alliance of groups, particularly concentrated here in the north of the county.Another week and we would have ousted him earlier this year. If it were tomorrow i would put my mortgage on it. I have lived down here 30+ years and have never seen such enthusiasm, even more than in 1997.justin124 said:
I grew up in Haverfordwest in the 1960s and early 1970s. How confident are you of ousting Crabb in Preseli next time? For some reason there was a much bigger swing there last June than in the South Pembrokeshire & West Carmarthen seat.valleyboy said:
Great to see my patch, Preseli Pembs gone red on the map. Owen Jones went down a storm here today. Haverfordwest not seen anything like it since the Civil War.TheScreamingEagles said:0
This discussion has been closed.